Latest / The Refrigeration Mentor Podcast / Episode 209. Moving Up as a Technician and Revolutionizing HVAC Education with Holden Shamburger of HVACTIME and Chiller Academy

Transcript

Episode 209. Moving Up as a Technician and Revolutionizing HVAC Education with Holden Shamburger of HVACTIME and Chiller Academy · The Refrigeration Mentor Podcast

• 0:00
  Trevor: So excited. You're here again, taking the time to listen to me and my guests just really trying to share some technical knowledge, personal development knowledge, as well as people's journey in refrigeration HVAC. And this is super important because you may resonate with many of the guests that That come on.
• 0:01
  And, and a lot of them talk about their journey and how it, there was struggles and how it was Vic, they were victorious. And the times that they failed and the times that they grow. 'cause this is our industry. You know, we, we work really hard. There's a lot of things that go on out there that we do and see by ourselves.
• 0:02
  And it, it, you know, there's a lot on our mind all the time as a technician 'cause we are a highly technical skill. And you're out there today crushing it. And my next guest, Holden Shaer. From HVAC I'm willing to come on and chat about his journey in the HVAC and chiller industry to the point where now he's running his own business.
• 0:03
  There's so much that I want to learn from him because I've been watching his videos for years pop up and I've been checking them out and he's a great instructor, a great educator. Holden, welcome to the Refrigeration Mentor Podcast. How are you doing? Well, I bet you so. Doing so good today. Doing so good today.
• 0:04
  I'd love to, we had a conversation a few weeks back. You were talking about, you know, starting your new, your new journey being an entrepreneur in the HVAC and refrigeration industry. And it's called Chiller Academy, I believe, which I'm super excited for. We're going to dive into that, but I'd love to get a little bit about your background, have the audience kind of get a feel for who you are and where you came from.
• 0:05
  Holden. Thank you
• 0:06
  Holden: Yeah, so I'm just the way I say it, I'm just an East Texas boy who kind of found his way. So, you know, East Texas as a whole is it's a pretty, I guess, slow income kind of region of Texas. There's not a whole lot there. There used to be a lot more industrial side, which in my grandfather's generation, that's, that's really where he thrives, right?
• 0:07
  So he was a heavy equipment mechanic for a DAR doing like front end loaders and stuff, and that's what he specialized in as a career. My dad took a little bit of a different path and got into the truck and more, but. Overall, you know, that's, that's my foundations and being able to come up in that and come up in a very trades focused community, you know, was, was very beneficial because I got to learn a lot of really fundamental skills from, from the very beginning.
• 0:08
  You know, from time I was eight, 10 years old, I was very actively involved in the trades. And it, it's just kind of scaled from there. So fast forward you know, getting into the residential side. So when I got into HVAC, it, it wasn't because HVAC spoke to me or it was just the, the thing I wanted to do necessarily.
• 0:09
  It was just a better opportunity than I had. And the, the, the employer that I was working with, We had made a bunch of promises, but wasn't really falling through on much. And then somebody offered me a apprenticeship to come do some residential service with them. So I mean, they paid, I think, what, two, 2 more an hour, something like that, which meant what I think I hired on at 8 an hour.
• 0:10
  And within six months, I made it to 10. That was my first year was doing that residential side of the service. And then going into my second year, I had an opportunity to transition out of that and get into more of a light commercial and did a lot of low temp style work. So I was specialized in ice machines specifically.
• 0:11
  I just, the whole thing, I absolutely loved it. Ice machines were just, they were fascinating to me. I love studying about them and nobody else in my area really took the time to, to get to know them. And so. That's how I picked up a lot of accounts. Me and my wife would go out to dinner and I learned all the different ice patterns.
• 0:12
  And so when we went somewhere that the, they had really dirty ice or it was say kind of milky when clear or you could tell there was a lot of scaling on the freeze plate. I had showed the waitress, I'd pull a piece of ice out of my cup and show it to her and started explaining it all. That turned into a conversation with a manager.
• 0:13
  Next thing we knew we, we had a service agreement service in their ice machine. So I changed that at Ace Texas for, for a while. And that was, that led into me getting into school. You know, me getting started, I, I, I was raised up by very old school beer can cold kind of guys, that's all I knew for, for quite some time.
• 0:14
  And as I got more technical, I, I realized that the things I was working on, those practices just didn't work, you know, and I kept wondering why I was struggling so much and why so many things just didn't make sense. And a lot of, a lot of the, the people I had surrounded myself with at the time did not value trade school whatsoever.
• 0:15
  They just thought it was a waste of time, and so that was just my environment. Eventually, I, I got in front of a couple of people I highly valued who had actually some decent education in the industry. And they, working with them, Help me realize where I wanted to go, but what I needed to do. And it was right about that time that I began to, to see that I actually kind of liked this industry.
• 0:16
  I love the fact that, you know, I came up, we didn't have a specific trade necessarily, you know, growing up in East Texas, you just, you learned it all. You had to, and coming into HVAC, it showed me an opportunity where quite literally every single trade. That I got to learn growing up is involved here and getting to dive into that and really Really utilize all of those skills would just it the picture became very clear at that point of i've got something worthwhile here So I went through the process to just, you know, chasing that down, got into school, school led me into a opportunity to get into some industrial side equipment.
• 0:17
  That's where I got to learn centrifugal and I got into some early model mag bearing machines that were still kind of in the prototype phase of the, one of the sites I was working, I had four of those chillers. There was a considered an early edition kind of test site for it. So. Which at the time, I had no idea what that meant.
• 0:18
  Now it's one of my specialties. I didn't, I didn't realize the scale of what I was learning at the time. I was just learning because it was fun. And getting into centrifugals. And I hadn't even seen an air cooled yet. That's the other thing that's kind of weird about it. Most guys getting into the chiller world, you know, they, they come up through the air cooled side and work their way into centrifugals.
• 0:19
  I kind of had this obscure path that I got into centrifugals first and mag bearings at that, you know, doing service on 000 ton machines. Then later in my career, after I had a couple of years into that, started seeing more of the smaller side with the air cools and things. And at that point it was less intimidating because I'd already kind of seen the other end of it.
• 0:20
  Anyway, it just, it's a weird stepping stone for compared to most, most technicians.
• 0:21
  Trevor: No, no, I love that. And I think that's how a lot of first gen technicians get into the industry. They're looking for a better opportunity. They're looking for something that they can, they can build on. For me, it was the same thing.
• 0:22
  I was looking to make more money and travel. And refrigeration fell in there, HVAC and refrigeration. And then I wasn't in love with it at first. It was, it was tough, but it grew on me. It was like as I continued to make more money and I could work all the time and then I traveled and I get to work where, you know, all over the world.
• 0:23
  Because of our industry and I love to see and hear your growth. You started off, you were doing, you're doing residential, which is great. You know, that was your stepping stone. Then you like, you got paid a little bit more money. Then you got another opportunity. And then you were like, man, education is valuable.
• 0:24
  You take some education and more opportunities fell in front of you. But one of the things that you said that was that I really liked is that you were at a, you're at a restaurant. You look at the ice. You can tell that the ice is not good. Yeah. It's bad ice and picking up work from there. That's an entrepreneur.
• 0:25
  And that's someone who cares and shows, thinks about value of that store owner. Had nothing to do. You didn't have to tell them anything. You could have just dealt with it, drank the Coke or whatever it was, you know, the water and then get on your way. But you took the time to share some valuable expert knowledge with this that drummed up business for yourself and your organization.
• 0:26
  I keep talking to technicians. This is an opportunity to make more money. Imagine pulling in an account and then all of a sudden you get every subway across the country. I'm just making that up because of that one conversation. You know what I mean? That's a huge opportunity. So good on you for putting yourself out there and continuing to learn.
• 0:27
  And that's, I think, Another thing is that huge jump. It had to be scary going from, you know, working on residential units. Now you're working on industrial centrifugal chillers. Let's talk about that a little bit, that, that transformation, because that could not have been easy at first when you went, when that, let's talk about that little shift.
• 0:28
  Cause I know a lot of technicians out there want to make that shift and just don't know how.
• 0:29
  Holden: Yeah. Yeah. You know, I, I love the the, the lens there. I never, in terms of just a foresight into the entrepreneur side, I hadn't thought of it that way. I appreciate that. Anyway, no, it's it's a tough transition because
• 0:30
  it's big and it does all kinds of stuff that you're not, in traditional education paths, you're taught absolutely nothing about at all. In addition to, now you're dealing with water and one of the, the number one things I know, I began to realize it early on. And I started building my own framework on how I began to understand things.
• 0:31
  And it's translating being able to translate between applications. And what I mean by that is if you could remove the size, right? If you could somehow in your mind make the size Irrelevant, but make the principles of what we are doing the leading factor. So what I mean by that is with regular air conditioning, we're dealing with an air over system.
• 0:32
  We're passing air over a tube and fan typically, or microchannel, whatever. We are, we're, we're, we're moving air and we're processing air. And when you get into the chiller world, you've now walked into hydronics. Now, if you have any kind of a heating and boiler background, that's maybe a little less scary to you.
• 0:33
  In Texas, we have very little. We have some hot water and boilers, don't get me wrong, but it's minimal because of our climate. And so I had no experience to hydronics at all coming into the chiller world, but I began as I'm, I remember standing and just staring at these machines and just trying to put the puzzle together in my head of, okay, I know what an evaporator is.
• 0:34
  I know what a condenser is. I know what a compressor is. And I understand somewhere in this process, there's some oil, but how does this translate? And as it began to solidify to me that That water is the air is our, it's just a different type of medium, right? And it doesn't matter if it's a water cooled, condenser or air cooled, the evaporator, it's just the same exact principles that apply to us using.
• 0:35
  Air to condition it. We are now just doing that inside of a water medium and our saturation, our superheats, all of those things remain the same. We just, we. Only make slight adjustments to the, to the, to the parameters that we're functioning at in order to achieve that very specific condition. It was one reason why, like with to, to bridge that gap further with a with a a regular air evaporator, we shoot for say a 40 to 45 degree saturation on the evap, right?
• 0:36
  Well, that's all for the same reasons. We do that for dehumidification and processing. The heat is the exact same reasons. We have a 42 to 45 degree chill water set point for our chillers is the exact same fundamentals and having to get that, that cooling source cold enough that by the time it gets to the indoor coil or the evaporator, we're able to still.
• 0:37
  Apply all the same exact psychometric principles to it, to dehumidify and to, to, to get the BTUs into that water or into that refrigerant either way. And so from a, from a getting started as a framework, those were some of the, the early things I did that helped kind of start to bridge that gap and it started making these things make sense.
• 0:38
  A lot faster than I think a lot of people struggle bridging that, that gap between there and connecting those theories together granted me at that stage, I was, I was a pretty big go getter and you know, I, I didn't intimidate easy. Even though I may not have a clue of what I was standing in front of, I just, I felt confident in my ability to just, we'll figure it out, whatever that looks like.
• 0:39
  And so many times I got myself into trouble with that. So I, so I think it's a combination of those things that helped me just get a stranglehold of that. Of that work and then just not let go.
• 0:40
  Trevor: And some of the things that you said there, I think it's really, really important. The big thing is, is that if you're going to make a shift like that, like you, you did a lot of people, like, I don't know.
• 0:41
  So it's, I'm scared, you know, I I'm nervous or I don't know what to do. Well, the first step today is a lot easier to get information. So if you want to transition into say chillers or centrifugal or in commercial refrigeration, commercial HVAC. Start learning it today when you're working in your residential job.
• 0:42
  Start learning it today when you're whatever job you're doing. To get to that point, if you keep saying, Oh, I wish I could get there. You're just dreaming. But if you put the work in like Holden did get, get in and started learning and then actually went and found a job where they're actually doing this work.
• 0:43
  And so then he was actually thrown out there to go and figure it out. And this is sometimes if you want a career shift and change a path, this is sometimes you want to, you need to do take a chance on yourself as well as take some risks. You know, uncomfort will get in your uncomfort zone because I know for sure when you made that, you had to be a bit uncomfortable making that shift because you're going up to these 2000 ton units where you're working on a two ton or a one ton ice machine to 2000 ton system.
• 0:44
  That is a big shift and it's a mindset shift as well. Like you had the confidence that you can do it, but every technician out there that's listened to this. I know you can do it as well. Absolutely.
• 0:45
  Holden: You know, I genuinely know that there's, there's not anything I've done. You know, I did not have any kind of special Special anything really, you know that other than I I had some really good people in my life I came up in a very Difficult circumstances, right?
• 0:46
  We didn't have a lot of money. We had a lot of family issues The area I came up in was very heavy with drugs it was it was a it's a lot of the same reasons why I don't live there now You know, I took my family away from there because I wasn't going to put my kids through that same thing but
• 0:47
  the actual path to get from a to b was just purely Putting your head down and just not stopping You know, you just, you just can't stop. You just have to keep going and being able to have the the tenacity to see that through is part of the challenge. But you also have to think if you truly want to operate at that level, you have to think about the the conditions you're working within, you know, your residential system, you make a mistake.
• 0:48
  It's. Pops a couple of grand, you know, you make a mistake inside of the industrial side of the world. I mean, a simple mistake is 10, 20, 30, 50, 000. And that quickly, you know, you do something bad enough to lock up a centrifugal. That's a hundred, 150 grand right there on a small one, you know, and so you've got to, you've got to have the, the, the, the right Is where we'll fall internally to be able to stand inside of that environment and still thrive.
• 0:49
  And I think everybody can do it. It's a matter of making the decision to, I am this, you
• 0:50
  Trevor: know, I think the big thing is, is spending the time putting the work in educating yourself, learning, you know, all of us, all of us, anyone who's listening, who's even driving, when you first started out driving, you weren't a perfect driver.
• 0:51
  You know, whatever age it was, you know, cause I know where I was from. We were driving really young before we got our license. But the thing is, is that you weren't good at riding a bike. You weren't good. But the more you practice, you got better at it. This is what I talk about in my communities and all the people around me is like, put the work in.
• 0:52
  When you're not because I know I could just from this conversation where I haven't I know you would go home and you would study Some of the manuals you would do some research on the equipment You would put the work in Outside of the work hours where you're not getting paid and a lot of people can't do that and I'll be honest when I first Started out I wasn't in that position either I was around people who said that, you know you don't go to, you don't go to training unless you get paid, which was the wrong atmosphere.
• 0:53
  And I was, I was the fault of that as well. So I, I could have been like, and I kind of, I, I should, I blame myself a bit for not being a bit ahead of myself being like, man, I should be going out and doing this training. So I am better. So I'm not stressed out as much because I, the same as you, I've, there was lots of times I the field, I didn't know how to fix something and I was stressed or on call or, you know, and that happens, but if we, you prepare yourself before you get in that situation, it doesn't matter if you work in a residential, commercial, industrial.
• 0:54
  Then you'll feel you'll have that. I've read this before. Now, where do I start? And where do I go from here? And I think when you get, get to that point where you keep investing in yourself, education, like you do, you're going to get better, but it's putting that work in outside work hours. And that's why you're so good at what you do the same as me.
• 0:55
  So you were, you were doing technician, you did residential, you got into the commercial industrial and I see that you became a supervisor. So you started working your way up inside these organizations. How was that? Like, going from, you know, field work into now, or supervisor and senior roles, what was that transition like?
• 0:56
  You know,
• 0:57
  Holden: it's a lot of it is very still field based until I did not officially become a non field role, even though I held a few different supervisory positions until, I don't know, I'd say a couple of years ago. But even then, because of my technical background and where we are in the industry even though I wasn't supposed to be in the field, I was still extremely engaged in the field, you know, just, just out of necessity, but it's, it can be a challenge because as you're coming up in the industry and your things start to get easier, sure, but the, the vast array of what we work on.
• 0:58
  Cause I wasn't strictly chillers only. You know, I, I, I, some people get to have that luxury. A lot of us don't. Now we, we, you still have to work on absolutely everything, including this. And so having to go through that plus then learn the management side operations, understand what a PNL is, understand how to quote, how to do markup, how to keep up with labor hours.
• 0:59
  And then. Guide and lead a team through that and being able to hold whole discipline where it needs to, or, or work with customers when we have to, I guess it's a lot and it making that transition is
• 1:00
  it can be challenging, especially if you've not put time into try to take ownership. I think that's probably the biggest thing is how. Effective and how willing are you to have ownership of what you're doing and how you're doing it. And I think I was taught to just always have ownership. The buck stops with you as I was coming up.
• 1:01
  So I would say that was the much more natural thing for me. But when I say I say natural, I natural. I, I, I think maybe a an improper way of saying that as much as. I think that was taught into me early, right? So I was just, I knew to do that from my upbringing. And so having taken ownership and everything, and even if I was the lower man on a job, I was the junior technician at the time knowing how to look at the job and be that senior technicians, best assistant he's ever had and to work my way into being.
• 1:02
  You know, I want this guy to want me for everything because of just the work that I'm doing. And that naturally translates because then those, especially, you know, you get into those harder, gruffer, more aged and experienced guys who just have a real rough shell to them. Well, a lot of that rough shell is because.
• 1:03
  They've put a lot of of hours into just just grit through this industry and you haven't and they a lot of them have a perception that you're just you're just another one of the young guys coming through doesn't know nothing came and wipe his own butt went behind the year just a whole bit and You've not proven yourself.
• 1:04
  My point where I'm going with that is by doing that kind of work and getting in there, being that involved, you can begin to show your worth to them. And then they will start to open. themselves to you in ways that they might not otherwise. So my point being in, in taking that ownership and developing those skills, I think that did a lot to prepare me prematurely for moving into supervisory roles, moving into more management roles, because I had just brute forced my way into getting involved with the people who were already involved in that.
• 1:05
  And then I got to see kind of a glimpse behind the, the, the curtain, if you will, on how a lot of stuff was happening, which piqued my interest in me wanting to, to do more. And I just kind of naturally or. I ended up working my way into that direction. So the very first supervisor role I actually carried, I was a senior technician in that team and my role in that team had matured to a point with me, just taking on mentorship of the junior technicians and leading our projects and jobs, I finally just went to upper management and told him like, listen, I'm doing all this.
• 1:06
  I I'm functioning as a filter group. A field supervisor. We currently don't have one. I deserve this role. I give him fun doing all this. I'm doing all this work. Like I don't have the title to go with it. I don't have the pay scale to go with it. I want to do this work. I love the mentorship. I want to be a part of this process.
• 1:07
  I deserve this. And they agreed. And so
• 1:08
  Trevor: you imagine asking, putting the work, doing the work and just asking because you're doing it, it's not like you went to them first and say, you just, you know, before you did all the work and say, Oh, I deserve this because I worked 3000 hours this year. You actually put the work in.
• 1:09
  They seen it. They seen the value of bringing the company and then you ask for it. Cause sometimes it's hard to go and do that. Ask. But if you know you put the work in, you have it proven, they see it, you communicate with them often about what you're doing, and you see the growth in the the technicians and in the business, that is something that you want to go talk about.
• 1:10
  This is why I tell every technician. Every year you should be meeting even a couple of times a year. What's my progress? How am I doing? Where should, where do I need to get better at? You know, so you get the feedback. Sometimes it's hard to take all your troubleshooting takes a long time. You take a lot longer than that.
• 1:11
  The average guy will say it's hard to choke when someone tells you that. Are they, are they true? Is it true? That's the question. Cause maybe you can't take it because you are actually not that good at troubleshooting yet. Doesn't mean you can't get better that and that's the thing like I talked to a lot of people Maybe the feedback is not gonna be that great But listen to what they say because it was hard for me to take feedback for a long time But when I start really listening and looking at myself, they're they're right not all the time Don't get me wrong Sometimes they're not but a lot of the times is like they see something that I'm they're looking from outside in And then when you dive in deeper, it's like, man, I am not performing in this area.
• 1:12
  So how do I get better? I go out and take courses. I go out and do the work. I put more work in and all of a sudden, man, do you know, in the last six months, you're crushing it, like everything is way better, and then they start to notice that stuff. And then that's where you get some more leverage in it because you're putting the work in.
• 1:13
  So I love that whole, and once again, it comes to the work that you put in. The work that you put in. So, so you get into the supervisor role. That that's a skill again, all the stuff that we're talking about is all learnable, all the stuff that Holden knows. And I know it's learnable. We just spend time and years and talk to different people to grow it.
• 1:14
  And even a supervisor role, like what would be one or two pieces of advice? You could give a technician now who would like to get into more of a supervisor role, senior role, or a, like a service manager role,
• 1:15
  Holden: learn how to be a mentor first and foremost. If you're going to do anything, have a heart for people.
• 1:16
  Like genuinely what's best for other people, not yourself, not the company. You know, I've always had a stance. My first priority was to my team. My second priority was to my company. And I've been very transparent with that through every position I've ever held. And while it wasn't always popular, it always has taken care of me.
• 1:17
  And my team is taking care of me. And so if you can learn to mentor and teach, so that's the other side of it is you want to really test your ability, your, your own skills in the industry, learn to teach, and you'll quickly realize your, what you lack. But that's a good thing, you know, because then you can fill that void.
• 1:18
  Then when you go to teach it, the second time, you'll teach it a little bit better, and the third time you'll teach it a little bit better. And the 20th time you'll teach it even better. Yeah. You know, it's a progression progress. You know, all of us that teach, we're not standing up for our first time. You know, before I left East Texas, I, I actually was invited to come teach at the, the college I graduated from for the tech school.
• 1:19
  And, you know, I spent a semester teaching those students funny enough. Several of those students ended up following me when I relocated to central Texas and came and signed on and you know, and they're, they're now working in the heavy commercial market now. And so it's just like learn how to mentor.
• 1:20
  And, and part of that is just, you don't have to necessarily be friends to be a good mentor, but you, you do have to have their best interest at heart, not your own. And I think that's the hard part is it's hard to separate. You from the equation. It's not about you. It's about what's best for them.
• 1:21
  Trevor: I Agree with that too, because how do you help build them up?
• 1:22
  I that's the same thing that we do in all are you doing your trainings? I do in my trainings like how do I make them better than I was grow faster get smarter Do it better. Like this is what it's about. This is how you help the industry out. And then the more value you bring to other people, just like that, the more value that comes back to you, hands down 10 times, the value is going to come back to you, the more you bring value to other people.
• 1:23
  So got into the supervisor role. You, you did that. I love that, that answer there on, on understanding and be a mentor now. In the last two to three months, I don't know how many months you started your own business. So congratulations on that. But before, actually, before we get into the HVAC business, how did you get into HVAC time?
• 1:24
  Let's talk about that before you got into your business. So when did HVAC time start? Cause I know on YouTube, you have over 40, 000 subscribers, you know, 6, 000 subscribers on Instagram, 5, 000 on LinkedIn. So you got a huge following. How did HVAC time start?
• 1:25
  Holden: So I love the community aspect and I just, I love people in general.
• 1:26
  You know, I just, so that led me to finding some of the communities out there. The very early community I got involved with was AK HVAC with Andrew Griefs. And I was, I was, I was, yeah, a fantastic person. I was a big follower of his though. And, you know, when he had to stop it, it left a void because he was the voice for us, for the industrial guys, the commercial guys on the, you know, he was.
• 1:27
  Who spoke for us from the, from the chiller and hydronics side. And yeah, he was just, it was great. He was great. He now, and he, he did a lot of education stuff, but you know, he, so yeah. So after a while, probably a year or two, it began to really sink in that we didn't know what happened. He wasn't coming back and we, I knew he had gotten on with Mavic.
• 1:28
  So it was, I think. obvious that something transpired there that led to that, but it also helped me to understand that, well, somebody did it and I recognize how much he spoke into myself. Like there was a lot of his early videos and, and talking about, you know, learning your way through and, and you know, building yourself in the industry that just really resonated with me and that I, I appreciated seeing his field content as well.
• 1:29
  And skimming through some of the chat feeds and stuff that around his community, you know, just, I could see where his him not being there just made a lot of people ask questions and I was like, you know what, I knew how much his voice Spoken to my life as I was Making my way and I see the community that got left behind.
• 1:30
  I don't mean that in a negative way, but I see the community and somebody has got to do this. I mean, most every other sector of the industry has somebody speaking for them, except us. Somebody has got to do this. So I did I started an Instagram spend some time kind of thinking on it. I'm cautious to say it nowadays just because of you know, copyright stuff and trademarks, but I'm a big Tim Allen fan.
• 1:31
  And so some people get the reference, some people don't. But you know, home improvement was, was a big thing for me growing up. And so it's Yeah, I just it made sense. And so anyway, I coined HVAC time and just I started posting on instagram. That was where it all started My first year into this was strictly instagram and I was just taking pictures of my day and I was explaining What it was what was in the photos?
• 1:32
  Was not into any kind of video as I went through that we started doing more live streams. The live streams then got recorded and I ended up posting a few of them to YouTube just to see what would happen. And as I started getting more and more into video content and filming more of what I was doing, more than just taking pictures and typing up a description I, I started getting traction on YouTube pretty heavily.
• 1:33
  And then YouTube just kind of took off really it's the best way I could describe it. It was was growing much faster than Instagram, but also Instagram started going into that transitionary period where they weren't was not friendly for the creator, I would say. So I ended up actually just, it was just too much to try to work inside of Instagram's rules.
• 1:34
  So I ended up taking a break from Instagram and just dedicated to YouTube for a long time. I've come back to Instagram and now I've got a Facebook and LinkedIn. Those are the two newest, but either way. Yeah, that's, that's where it all started. It started with just. Andrew inspired me with what he did and realizing the impact he had in my life and, and realizing how many more people were still seeking that.
• 1:35
  And, and they just needed somewhere to turn. Nobody else is doing it. So I just said, why not me?
• 1:36
  Trevor: Awesome. Awesome. And that's it. It's just, you got to start right somewhere. And that's what you do. You start somewhere. That's great. I know, I know Andrew met him many times, such a great standup guy which is, awesome to hear a story that he inspired you to start making videos, to educate others, to share that knowledge.
• 1:37
  But a lot of people want to do that, you know, help, help the industry and share knowledge. They just don't know how, and it was good that he sparked that, that fire on you. And so, so you've been doing these videos, you, you, you got thousands, millions of views, and now you know, You decide to start your own business your own Chiller Academy.
• 1:38
  Let's talk about that transition because that's another big pivotal moment in your life. You had a lot of them, right? So this is, this is now all, this is a big decision, a big risk outside the comfort zone. Let's talk a little bit about Chiller Academy and how did that come about?
• 1:39
  Holden: I've, so I always knew that I would retire in education.
• 1:40
  That was always my plan to get as far as I could in the field. And then when, when the time was right, retire and go into education full time. As I was walking that road, I,
• 1:41
  I began to realize that my personal development in the industry and learning how like all the years spent mentoring and learning how people actually learn in our industry and realizing that most of the trade schools and the teaching models. Still forced us into, I would say traditional learning methods.
• 1:42
  I just, I've got a different opinion. I'll say it that way. And you know, that, that opinion was built on just teaching dozens of people and mentoring and bringing them up at this point, just on a professional level in the field and so yeah, I became clear that going into the traditional methods of education wasn't going to be a good environment for me and the way that I've formed my opinions.
• 1:43
  So I also recognize that. So one of the number one questions I've gotten from day one, how do I, or how do I become, you know, get into industrial and chiller work? How do I, what books can I read? Where can I turn for this? Where can I go for that? Like, What do I do to get started? And up until now, quite literally, my only answer was, I'm sorry, but there's not any good resources, especially if you're not in the union world.
• 1:44
  If you're in the union world and you're a part of those that go through their apprenticeship, it's, it is, there is a much easier path, but you have to choose to, you know, Commit to that life, you know, and be a part of the union, which I, I'm in a very non union area, you know, they exist, but they're not, they're not what they are in other places.
• 1:45
  Like I've heard unions in California, for example, for the, for HVAC are phenomenal. I've heard amazing things about what they have out there and they're also very dominant. It's not that case here in Texas. So not, I just never had anything to give them. And I had this concept of doing some sort of formal education myself for people.
• 1:46
  Anyway, that concept slowly evolved into. As I just learned and grown in terms of entrepreneurship, I saw the value in online courses. And so then the, and this took a couple of years to kind of form the picture. And then as each stage of it, I really, so I finally formed the model of, okay, do an online academy.
• 1:47
  All right. So, but how do you implement that? And so then having to go through the stage of, you know, what does that actually look like and is there actually an interest for that? And it was a very grueling, slow progression of having this idea mature into a workable model. And that model has turned into a Chiller Academy.
• 1:48
  And for me, you know, I. What I like about it is I don't think it replaces in person or traditional education at all. And I don't think those things will be replaced. But what I do think it does is it gives a, it gives an actual option to learn. legitimate in depth chiller education. And it's at the student's pace.
• 1:49
  They can learn it in whatever format fits them best. So, like for me, for example, I've got a video format. I've got an audio feed. There's a, a introduction quiz to each lesson to get their mind geared towards that lesson. And, and To test their knowledge gaps intentionally so that you go into it realizing you couldn't get the quiz right so you better pay attention and then Everything has a written summary as well So my point is there's several mediums that somebody could choose to where do you learn best you learn best by reading?
• 1:50
  Okay, a written summary. Do you learn best by listening or watching? I've just got that plus You can take that into the field with you And you can have that lesson right there with you. And that's where the hands on, in my opinion, comes in. It's not that I'm literally there doing a hands on with you, but you have that entire lesson in front of you.
• 1:51
  And you can go through that and review that on site at the equipment. And if you're trying to do a troubleshoot and say you've got this economizer thing, you have no freaking idea what it's trying to do. And it's just this. You've got these, Conditions you're trying to understand that the chiller, well, part of understanding what that's happening is understanding what each component does and how it influences the whole machine.
• 1:52
  Now you have this organized lesson plan that you can go through at the job site to help give you the, the fill in the gaps that you're struggling with to then address that machine that you're in front of that, that was the inevitable That has come together for Chiller Academy. And that's one reason why I started.
• 1:53
  So I did a centrifugal course as a pilot. It was pretty popular. Now I'm in the process. I've, I've launched the introduction to Chiller's course. And if, if now's a good time where we can get into this kind of the, the, now the, the next phase of the idea of the bigger vision I don't want to go too far here, but
• 1:54
  Trevor: yeah, no, you know, I think this is great.
• 1:55
  I think you're right on, on the online portion is very important. It doesn't replace the field. The field work, the, that is something that like, cause I, this, my business is built on online training, mentorship, and education. And the biggest thing is, is that in my programs as well as a, there's field assignments, you've got to go out and do the work when you're training, teaching someone who already knows how to use the tools and meters and know how to be out there safely, we can really train anybody.
• 1:56
  As long as they follow the steps and they have a little confidence in themselves, they can go fix anything. And that's a lot of stuff that we, we put, it sounds like you put in your online program. So you go out and you can do these things. These are the steps of two. You start here. Here's the sequence of operations.
• 1:57
  This is a component and you go through it. And I think there's a huge value in online learning. The thing is, once again, It doesn't replace the on site learning. You still need that. You know, you still need that, that mentorship from within the team. Cause I, I, I work in different programs as well. So this is a supplement to help fast track people.
• 1:58
  How do you fast track people? Just like he said, some people like learning at 10 o'clock at night. You know what I mean? Laying in bed, listening to someone or sitting up in a Friday and writing out notes. Some people like to do it on Sunday morning. Some people like to do it at lunchtime. And so this is where online learning can really help other people out.
• 1:59
  So that's good. That's great that the concept came out. And you did this, you know, that was a big, you know, another big. Getting outside of your comfort zone, another big risk and another big chance. So you've been doing this for a few months now. How, how you feel right now? I feel great.
• 2:00
  Holden: You know I, things have gone well.
• 2:01
  It just, it is, it is moving a mountain, you know, to, to make these things happen, you know, and I did launch the, introduction course, you know, granted for me to make this possible, I had to but I launched it before it was completed so that those who wanted to get in early and be a part of the, the journey could, and it allowed me to go full time and actually put this 25 modules Of October.
• 2:02
  So of course we'll be 100 percent completed by October. That is my guarantee. I will make that happen.
• 2:03
  Trevor: Yeah.
• 2:04
  Holden: Putting the work in, right. It's a tall order though.
• 2:05
  Trevor: Yeah. Oh yeah. I know. I've been doing it for three years. I've had lots of courses and classes, but it takes a lot of work. It's put evenings, weekends, days, nights.
• 2:06
  I know. And it's a, it's putting the work in. It's, is it, if it was easy and really everybody would be doing something similar, it's hard and then But it's no different than starting up as a technician, you know, your first day in the job, you know, maybe carrying someone's tools or maybe going to a site to wash out a case for the first time and you don't know how to take it apart.
• 2:07
  So this takes time and then you do it again and again, you get a little bit more experience. Kind of like you said earlier is like after you do it 20 times, it's, you know, it's like, it's super easy. Hopefully you still can learn something from it, even the 20th time. So you continue to grow. Cause that's when you get bored and you want to do something else.
• 2:08
  When it gets too repetitive. But I think, I think you're on a good path here. What, one of the things you said earlier, it's like the education path there is for industrial. There's nothing out there really. There are some groups out there for industrial refrigeration and stuff, but there's, it's really going into the manufacturers themselves under specific proprietary product and that type of training where I know what you're doing is you look at the bigger picture, it doesn't matter whose equipment you're working on.
• 2:09
  You want to. You want to teach them the fundamentals where you can take someone that's living in Central Texas and you just fly them all the way out to Australia and drop them in there and work on a chiller there and don't even know the brand name. That's the whole goal of, I can, I know for your business, just like mine.
• 2:10
  It's like I can take and teach someone to be able to work anywhere in the world. You might have to learn a little bit of the code, maybe a little bit about how they wire. But if you understand how to use a meter, how to use gauges it gets a lot easier. I love, I love this and I'm super excited for you.
• 2:11
  So your next steps is to finish, finish on this on demand course. And what else, what else do you have on to go? That's probably the biggest step.
• 2:12
  Holden: From there is continuing building, you know I've got troubleshooting guides that I've produced and published and those will have their place. And I'm, I'm thinking through creative ideas on how to.
• 2:13
  Work those into the academy as well. I just haven't quite nailed that down yet and I do consulting as well So that right now that kind of helps I guess bridge the gap until the academy is kind of off the ground a little further but The the long term, so once the introduction course is finished, I have plans to build a six course curriculum to come out the other side with a a Chiller Academy certification.
• 2:14
  And so right now, the, the current plan, you'll complete each course, so like you'll finish the introduction to Chiller's course. And you'll take a final exam to do shows like a knowledge test, right? And that'll get you a knowledge a knowledge certification saying that you have shown that you have adequate knowledge of this concept.
• 2:15
  Right. Now, to scale that, the second course that'll get worked on is a air cooled course, which that's where I get into the actual service procedures. So that'll be for your more advanced guys getting into the air cooled. Third will be a water cooled course, where we do the same thing, but centrifugal perspective.
• 2:16
  Then we'll, I expect to do an entire course just on hydronics because there's so much there and by itself that that could deserve its own. Then the number five would be a overhaul course where I take you through and talk through how to do overhauls on various centrifugals. And then to final it up would be on mag bearing.
• 2:17
  Mag bearing technology is. Becoming very prevalent in the industry and it's only going to continue to to do so because it's no longer just in the high end markets anymore. It's, it's pushing into the standard, you know, consumer or seller markets, if you can say it that way. So that's the technology that's going to be really critical for people to understand.
• 2:18
  So once all that's built, All six are completed and I plan to have smaller courses along the way kind of like the YK centrifugal course. I'll do some of those as we go, but the once all six are finished and you've taken all six as a prerequisite and you've passed, There'll be a two part step. One, I intend to build a facility where we have air cooled and water cooled equipment and it'll be a hands on practical application.
• 2:19
  Now I'm not talking about making you come out and prove you can do an overhaul. It is. Not what's in my head currently. What I do expect is that you can come out and by the time you've finished all six modules doing system charging, system recovery, system evacuation, basic troubleshooting of essential components, component identification, all of that being hands on should be second nature to you.
• 2:20
  By the time you've gone through all of that material and passed all that testing, That stuff should be just second nature. You shouldn't even have to hardly think about it. So come prove that you can, hands on, in my facility, and then take a final exam, and it'll cover basically all six courses. You pass both of those, and you come out the other side with a chiller academy.
• 2:21
  Certification, not even just a knowledge base. Like I, I'm willing to put my name behind you at that point that you could go out there and get in front of equipment and actually get something done and be of value to the industry. Hands on. And it's not just something you watched online and you might be able to do at some point.
• 2:22
  Like it's, that's, that's the, Really big picture as, as to where the, the main course structure is going to go. And then there'll be a variety of small courses that are smaller, cheaper, shorter that can be more pinpointed in specific. Gary, that's all you really need.
• 2:23
  Trevor: Oh, I love it. You know, and this is it.
• 2:24
  Sharing it all. Bringing value to others. Helping them grow. Holden, how can people get a hold of you? Get a hold of the Chiller Academy? Find out a little bit more about what you do and all these, all this great online Products that you'll have coming out and you have out.
• 2:25
  Holden: Yeah. So chilleracademy. com is the is the website you could also go to hvactime.
• 2:26
  shop And i've got some products there as well including the troubleshooting guides if you're interested in those other than that if you need to reach out you need Consulting or any kind of support anything of that nature HVACTime at HVACTimeTX. com will be email gets you straight to me and we can go from there and, and say you're dealing with a chiller or some kind of hydronics issue, reach out, let me know what you got going on.
• 2:27
  We'll see if we can get figured out.
• 2:28
  Trevor: Yeah. We'll have all this stuff in the show notes, how you can connect with Holden. Because once again, this is more great knowledge, people who care about getting you to that next level. Growing. growing your knowledge technically, personally, I love it. Holden, make sure you go and check out his YouTube channel and check out some of these videos that he has on there, you know, and, and reach out, you know, if you're working on some of this equipment and you need some help that, you know, he's an expert in his field.
• 2:29
  Love it all. Thank you so much for taking the time to come on the refrigeration mentor podcast, and we'll see you again. Thank you.