Latest / Cultural Wars | America Out Loud News / Vaccines: Mythology, ideology, and reality

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Vaccines: Mythology, ideology, and reality · Cultural Wars | America Out Loud News

• 0:27
  Well, hello, everyone.
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  Welcome to the 10 Penny Files.
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  I'm your host, Dr.
• 0:31
  Sherry Tenpenny.
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• 2:02
  So now let's get started.
• 2:03
  Today's conversation is with nonfiction author who has a lifelong interest in medical history and forensic medicine, John Leake, to talk about his book, co-authored with Dr.
• 2:15
  Peter McCullough, Vaccines, Mythology, Ideology, and Reality that tells the story of this technology, the cell in the celebrated men who were biased by religious faith, wishful thinking, ideology, and a desire for recognition and money.
• 2:33
  John, welcome so much to the Tenpenny Files.
• 2:36
  It is my absolute honor to have you here with me today.
• 2:39
  Thank you, Doctor.
• 2:40
  Thanks for having me.
• 2:41
  You know, in writing the courage to face COVID-19, and as time has gone on since the pandemic, what interested you in writing about the story of early vaccine developers?
• 2:56
  Well, my co-author, Dr.
• 2:58
  Peter McCullough and I, we didn't really know much, if anything.
• 3:02
  I mean, you've been doing this, you've been in this game for a long, long time.
• 3:06
  We were both kind of naive about what exactly this history of vaccines, you know, what is it?
• 3:14
  You know, what where did man fall in love with this technology and how did it develop over time?
• 3:20
  It was really only with the rollout of the COVID-19 vaccines.
• 3:26
  That prompted us to ask, well, I mean, all of this weird bizarre uh uh assertions that are being made about this this new generation of messenger RNA COVID-19 vaccines, like what else have these guys uh you know, not been telling us, or rather what what distorted um assertions have we been told about the vaccine enterprise all together.
• 3:52
  And it was really, you know, that prompted us to go and you look at authors like you, look at authors, uh Roman, um, how do you pronounce his name?
• 4:02
  Bistria Nick, I believe is and um uh yeah, um, Sherry, I I've kind of lost your audio again.
• 4:11
  Can you hear me?
• 4:12
  Yeah, I can hear you.
• 4:13
  Can you hear me?
• 4:14
  Okay, yeah, you you've you cut out there.
• 4:16
  You know, some of these um previous authors who who had looked at the entirety of the vaccine enterprise going back to the 18th century.
• 4:26
  And so we got curious about it.
• 4:29
  And we we we read a lot of this this literature, and um I I am a nonfiction author.
• 4:37
  I I'm kind of uh a practitioner of what we call narrative nonfiction, um, where you you look at all of the facts of a story, uh in this case a long historical um series of episodes going back for 300 years, you look at the key characters in it, and then you try to tell the story of this.
• 5:01
  So our book is uh it's a critical evaluation of of the entire vaccine enterprise, but it told in a what what we hope is is a gripping narrative with character development and an exposition of of the motives and the hopes and the aspirations, you know, going all the way back to the 18th century.
• 5:24
  I think it's a grand intellectual adventure with a lot of the foibles and shortcomings of the human mind.
• 5:35
  I mean, there are elements of of great insight and genius, but there are also a lot of elements of vanity and fraud and hubris and and all of the other stuff that we're we're stuck with uh with our human nature and our human condition.
• 5:51
  But what I found really interesting was was your research of where you found a lot of the of the um character of these characters, you know, and where you found what they really did, who they reported to, you know, how much they got paid.
• 6:07
  You know, I just felt like you the um in-depth research into the character development of true persons.
• 6:13
  This isn't fiction, you know, real persons was was really interesting.
• 6:17
  Uh, because years ago I used to do a um uh a short presentation uh that was called Vaccine Developers Heroes or Villains, and mine was barely skimming across the surface compared to what you've uncovered in your book.
• 6:31
  Where did you do most of your research to find that information?
• 6:35
  Well, you know, if if it had been 20 years ago, it would have been very difficult because I would have had to have gone and grubbed around in archives at Harvard University or uh the Royal Society in London.
• 6:49
  But now there's so much literature going back hundreds of years, um, you know, that is has been digitally reproduced and is available online.
• 7:00
  I mean, you know, I could find so many writings, you know, Jenner's pamphlets, um, what other guys said about Jenner's Jenner's original biography in 1820, I believe it was published.
• 7:13
  You can you can find it all digitally now.
• 7:16
  It's it's remarkable.
• 7:17
  I mean, the internet is so full of garbage, and a lot of it is distracting, but for scholarship, it's it's it's just astonishing.
• 7:27
  It really is.
• 7:28
  You can find so much historic literature digitally available now.
• 7:33
  There's you know, a lot of that, if you go to archive.org for the listeners, you know, they have whole books from the 1800s.
• 7:40
  Yeah.
• 7:43
  There what were some of the most surprising things?
• 7:45
  You know, I know that this is a relatively new industry to you.
• 7:49
  You know, I met when you and Peter were first working on your first book, and you know, it was kind of at the beginning of COVID and had a lot of conversations with Peter, some with you, but more with Peter.
• 8:00
  And this is like you said at the beginning, kind of a kind of a new venture in terms of digging into it.
• 8:06
  As you were digging through these historical characters, what were some of the most surprising things that you found?
• 8:13
  Well, just how much of it, um, the evaluation is starting with smallpox inoculation in the 18th century, and then getting into Jenner's smallpox vaccine, and then particularly the character of Louis Pasteur.
• 8:29
  You know, I grew up reading liter uh um medical history and Pasteur was kind of a childhood hero.
• 8:36
  I mean, I I read all of the laudatory literature on Pasteur when I was a boy.
• 8:43
  I I didn't know at the time that there's there's a whole critical literature on Pasteur.
• 8:50
  And he was a man of great ambition.
• 8:54
  And if something or someone got in the way of his ambition, he was pretty darned ruthless about um borrowing ideas that weren't hurt his and not giving credit, you know, overstating um the the the efficacy and his and his results.
• 9:13
  I didn't realize until I read a book published in 1995 by a Princeton University um medical historian that Pasteur had never made his lab notebooks available.
• 9:27
  He would go to the French Academy of Science and just proclaim I have found a vaccine to foul cholera.
• 9:34
  It works.
• 9:35
  And they'd say, Oh bravo, Professor Pasteur.
• 9:40
  It's like, well, can you show that it works?
• 9:43
  And then, you know, he he he then would be off to his anthrax vaccine, which he also concealed a very key element in how exactly he made the anthrax vaccine.
• 9:58
  Um, and then when it came to
• 10:00
  To mass produce the anthrax vaccine, I'm speaking about for livestock.
• 10:07
  He didn't, he didn't file a patent in order to present to the world his manufacturing technique.
• 10:15
  He just claimed only the Institute Pasteur possesses the understanding.
• 10:23
  So only the Institute Pasteur is in a position to make it.
• 10:27
  So it's just kind of like, I know how to do this, you know, we'll deliver the product to farmers and jurisdictions all over the world, but we're not going to tell you how we're making it.
• 10:39
  So a lot of the vaccine enterprise going back to the 18th century, then going through Pasteur, and then coming up to the late 19th century, a lot of it is just not transparent.
• 10:54
  And a lot of the evaluations that are being done are really not do not meet high scientific standards.
• 11:02
  Now, the other thing that you observed long ago is that mankind fell in love with the idea of inoculation in the 18th century long before living standards really started to improve.
• 11:18
  So there was this lag between the Royal Society, Cotton Mather, and Massachusetts Bay Colony falling in love with smallpox inoculation in the early 18th century.
• 11:32
  You don't really get this rapid and um dramatic elevation of living standards till 150 years later.
• 11:43
  I'm talking about proper sewage, clean water, um abundant um food, even for the urban poor, proper housing with proper ventilation and winter heating for the energy for the winter, excuse me, winter heating for the urban poor.
• 12:03
  I mean, these elevations of the standard of living, they really come on at the end of the 19th century, right?
• 12:12
  As the whole scientific crowd is deepening its love affair with vaccines and trying to introduce vaccines for everything on earth.
• 12:21
  We have this radical elevation of living standards.
• 12:25
  I believe the evidence shows clearly that it's the elevation of living standards that is reducing infectious disease mortality, but it's the vaccines that get the credit for it.
• 12:38
  It's classic misattribution.
• 12:41
  Yeah, 100%.
• 12:42
  You know, there was an article that was published in 2004.
• 12:46
  I've quoted it a lot over the years, and the article came out of two researchers from Harvard.
• 12:51
  It was about a 14-page paper, and they concluded unequivocally that it was clean water, sanitary water that reduced typhoid cholera, measles, smallpox, all these other things, and it really had little to nothing to do with the vaccines.
• 13:07
  And, you know, so that was in 2004 when that paper was published.
• 13:11
  So roll that forward 20 years.
• 13:14
  Why is it still that we credit all of this, you know, the saving grace, so savior of the unit of the American of the population to it poisoning people with poison?
• 13:28
  Because, you know, I stopped John about, I don't know, maybe six months ago.
• 13:32
  I decided I was going to quit calling it the P quit talking about the pediatric uh vaccination schedule and call it what it was, which is the PZ pediatric poisoning program and the adult uh the adult assault agenda, because that's exactly what we are, you know, with clean water sanitation, uh better food, organic food.
• 13:52
  Now with with Secretary Kennedy, all the big focus that he has on, you know, eat real food and clean, you know, the water's been clean, we're trying to clean up the air.
• 14:00
  Um, do you think, you know, because we run in the same circles, we know a lot of the same people.
• 14:06
  Um, do you think that the truth is coming out about kind of the scam of vaccines, the way that it's been a 200-year multi-generational indoctrination, and like Aaron Seary says in his book, a religion more than science.
• 14:22
  Are people really going to grasp on this?
• 14:24
  And are we going to get away from this poisoning program?
• 14:29
  I think I think it's hard for people to grasp this.
• 14:34
  I mean, I agree with Aaron Seary.
• 14:36
  In fact, we just recorded an interview.
• 14:38
  I too or we two talk about the religious elements of this.
• 14:42
  This is actually a Vatican coin, uh, 20 euro silver coin commemorating the COVID-19 vaccine.
• 14:51
  And it's presented in this very religious iconography.
• 14:54
  And, you know, the the numista catalog, the Vatican um uh meant, it says, you know, a boy is preparing to receive the vaccine.
• 15:06
  Yeah, kind of like a boy preparing to receive the Eucharist.
• 15:09
  So there's this reverence and almost worship of vaccines as a savior and a liberator of mankind.
• 15:17
  That's very powerful archetypal propaganda.
• 15:21
  And I think it it's now very, very deep, particularly in the minds of the medical profession.
• 15:27
  I think the conversation that we're having right now, if you were to record it and to present it to students in medical school right now who have been indoctrinated in the religion of vaccines, I think they'd think we were crazy.
• 15:43
  So it's I think it's an it's an incremental awakening in the public, but I I think it could take a long time.
• 15:51
  I mean, the the key points that I would point out.
• 15:53
  So I I agree with the analysis that clean water, proper sewage channelization away from the city, clean water supplies.
• 16:03
  I mean, that was huge for typhoid and and um and uh uh um typhoid was one of the big waterborne, and then cholera.
• 16:14
  But you know, he even maybe even more importantly um is cleaning up the air.
• 16:22
  Remember, London used to be, they called it London fog.
• 16:26
  There was so much coal smoke in the air in London that you could scarcely see down the street.
• 16:31
  So so many people had uh a low grade case of of bronchitis just going all the time, and then um amongst the urban poor, these these tenement buildings in which the urban working poor, remember, this is the industrial revolution when you have this urbanization.
• 16:52
  I mean, you just wouldn't believe the conditions in which the urban poor lived.
• 16:57
  It's just stunning.
• 16:58
  And then they didn't have proper heating in the winter, but then perhaps even the biggest one of all is nutrition.
• 17:09
  I mean, you know, we we re we read Charles Dickens and we see that Tiny Tim had rickets, you know, extreme vitamin D deficiency.
• 17:19
  And so, you know, one thing that we see that we look at closely in our book is that a well-nourished body is pretty robust.
• 17:29
  But if you have an undernourished body or a malnourished body without the proper vitamin profile, particularly vitamin D and vitamin C and vitamin A for uh for smallpox, um, and uh actually vitamin A is important for a number of uh measles as well.
• 17:52
  Umce that vitamin nutrition profile generally improves, you you see people becoming way, way more robust, way less susceptible to infectious diseases.
• 18:06
  So I think that's what people you know need to understand.
• 18:10
  But again, vaccines get all the credit, and I I think it's because the their high tech, they're these sort of miracles of scientific and technological um uh you know, ingenuity.
• 18:24
  You know, people went to school and and and studied all of this stuff for years.
• 18:29
  So, you know, to say, well, you know, clean water and good food.
• 18:33
  Well, there's no real industry around that.
• 18:36
  I mean, maybe there's a better industry around better food, but or let's have sewers.
• 18:42
  It's like, well, we've although you see in Washington, DC, that they can't maintain their sewer, which I I think is just stunning.
• 18:51
  But anyway, there's no real lobby, there's no real interest group, there's no real industry between these generalized uh standard of living improvements.
• 19:01
  There are things that we all take for granted now.
• 19:04
  You know, another thing that I don't think that most people realize, you know, you talk about all of the stuff that happened in the UK, you know, the honey bucket pots, the really poor sanitation, the fog, the all these different things.
• 19:17
  But even right here in the United States, because I wrote about it in my book, Zero Accountability, is that it even as as late as the late 1800s here in the US, which was not that long ago, that uh in there was a uh a public health report that I quoted out of New York City that they dragged you know almost two tons of dead animal carcasses out of the streets in an annual year because of the dead and putrid things and the people living in the tenement houses were eating food full of maggots and didn't have any sanitation.
• 19:51
  There was no such thing as running water in flush toilets, just a mere 200 years ago in this country, and they started putting chlorine in the water in about the 19th century.
• 20:00
  1940s, which stopped typhoid and cholera in its in its tracks.
• 20:05
  And then, you know, they still they diminish that amount.
• 20:07
  So it's it's it's everywhere that sanitation all over the world and and plumbing.
• 20:13
  And I've often said that one of the the wonders of humanity of moving us forward, yes, clean water, better food, better hygiene, but electricity where people could could store their food and their food that they had wouldn't be, you know, turned into maggots, you know.
• 20:29
  And I think that that is an element that's kind of underplayed.
• 20:32
  You know, we don't talk for sure.
• 20:34
  Absolutely.
• 20:34
  Yeah.
• 20:35
  And Cherry, you know, um, in terms of um infant and early childhood death, um, this is really, although it's interesting because Pasteur, um, what we call pasteurization.
• 20:47
  Um, you know, Pasteur had originally come up with the technique for preserving beer and wine.
• 20:53
  It was it was uh uh a tailored approach to um uh beer and wine preservation.
• 21:00
  It was actually a German agriculturalist, probably 30 years later, um, Franz von Soxlet was his name, who said, Well, no, wait a minute, like like we we could do the Professor Pasteur's procedure with beer and wine, we could do it with milk, and it will make milk safer to drink.
• 21:23
  Now, I know that we have in our era of uh far higher technology, we have people that like raw milk, and it's great.
• 21:31
  But remember back in the end of the 19th, beginning of the 20th century, you had these swill milk dairies like in the cities with just absolutely appalling hygiene.
• 21:46
  And you know, mothers that were not producing enough milk to nurse their infants, and I'm speaking of the urban poor, they'd go to these swill milk dairies, and they would purchase this incredibly filthy milk.
• 22:00
  And there have been studies done on it.
• 22:02
  I mean, just you bovine to work tuberculosis, um, brucelosis.
• 22:07
  I mean, just every nasty thing.
• 22:10
  Um various, you know, forms of staphylococcal and uh um strap streptococcus bacteria.
• 22:19
  And so, you know, the so-called diarrhea of infancy um was was just rampant.
• 22:26
  So many children died of this.
• 22:28
  And um, proper pasteurization, again, just a hygienic measure was enormously uh successful in reducing that.
• 22:39
  So, you know, we get to 1948 when the child when the American Academy of Pediatrics recommends this childhood vaccine schedule with diphtheria tetanus and pertussis.
• 22:51
  I mean, already by 48, you've seen childhood mortality from all of these infectious diseases.
• 22:59
  You know, it's already down 90%, even before the schedule was introduced.
• 23:06
  So I think that what the world really needs to consider now is that could it be in our era of hyper vaccination of kids, particularly after the passage of the 1986 Childhood Vaccine Entry Act granting liability protection to the manufacturers, not only you know this, not only for this handful of vaccines that were on the market then, but it granted them in perpetuity for all additional vaccines that were produced, you know, going forward.
• 23:40
  So we have this era of hyper vaccination.
• 23:43
  The thing that I'm concerned about is that with the exception of small populations like like the the Amish, we don't have a proper control group to understand like, well, what would happen to American children if they all weren't getting you know a gazillion shots?
• 24:05
  What would their health be like in the in our current ecological environment of clean, you know, clean um water and better hygiene and and and better food.
• 24:17
  We don't know what American children would be like in our more wholesome era without vaccines.
• 24:30
  It's like this mass experimentation on all of humanity, or at least all of American humanity.
• 24:39
  And you see things like this terrifying spike of autism, and it's just not enough for our federal health agency officials to say, well, we don't know what's causing the rapid rise of autism.
• 24:56
  We just know it's not vaccines.
• 24:58
  Well, that's not going to cut it.
• 25:01
  Well, it's not this day and age when people are questioning, you know, to me, it's like we don't know what it's causing it, but we're not going to talk about the pink elephant in the living room that ignore that whole thing.
• 25:13
  You know, we're not just gonna, we're not gonna look at that at all.
• 25:16
  And I do believe that there are, you know, there are studies out there that look at completely unvaccinated uh people.
• 25:22
  Uh Brian Hooker's book, Vax Unvax, Let the Science Speak, they looked at 62 studies that look that had a control group of completely unvaccinated kids.
• 25:32
  You know, the bet the backstory behind that is that Bobby Kennedy, when Bobby was still at children's health defense, had called Brian and said, you know, there's got to be a couple studies out there that have a unvaccinated population as a control group.
• 25:46
  Why don't you see if you can find any?
• 25:48
  And Brian told me personally, he snickered and kind of laughed.
• 25:52
  He said, Well, that ought to be a Saturday afternoon, because he didn't think he'd find anything.
• 25:56
  And the further they looked and the further they dug, they found I believe it's 64 studies.
• 26:01
  And that book has compiled into uh it's a series of graphs that compares the health of vaccinated to unvaccinated children on things like ear infections, asthma, guilla-boret, uh, epilepsy, and things like that.
• 26:14
  And unequivocally, in every single graph, the unvaccinated children's health far supersedes the vaccinated children, every single one.
• 26:23
  And when I had Brian on the show, and we talked about his book, the book's name is Vax Unvax, Let the Science Speak.
• 26:29
  I said, uh, he said this the book was created as a manual that parents could take it into the doctor's office and just flip by pages at a time and show when a yellow and a green graph side by side and showing the health of uh of unvaccinated children.
• 26:44
  So we do have at least smaller studies of that beyond people in autism that show that unhealthy children are far healthier than vaccinated children.
• 26:54
  Yes, yes, and indeed, and you know, Del Big Tree's got his new film out, uh an inconvenient truth, in which um a um a um uh you know a very distinguished doctorate at Henry Ford in Michigan does just such a study, but you know, we're always told, well, it was kind of a small control group, you know, it wasn't, you know, we're always sort of led to believe that the the you know, this the population study is too small.
• 27:24
  And and I, you know, that's that's obviously by by design.
• 27:27
  It it's I mean, we saw it during the COVID-19, you know, the the most terrifying thing, it would seem for the guys that were rolling this out with such reckless abandon, was a large control group.
• 27:41
  It was almost like, you know, we want to get everybody vaccinated as soon as we possibly can, exerting uh, you know, all the pressure in the world to achieve that.
• 27:51
  And it kind of feels like, well, you guys don't really want a control group, do you?
• 27:56
  Exactly.
• 27:56
  Well, John, hold that thought right there.
• 27:59
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• 28:01
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  We'll be right back with John Leake to talk more about his book, Vaccines, Mythology, Ideology, and reality, the story that tells the story of the technology and the celebrated men who were biased behind it.
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  We will be right back.
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• 35:33
  Well, welcome back, everyone.
• 35:35
  Our conversation today is with nonfiction author who has a lifelong interest in medical history and forensic medicine, John Leake.
• 35:43
  Let me tell you a little bit more about today's guest.
• 35:45
  John studied history and philosophy with Sir Roger Scruton at Boston University.
• 35:51
  He then went to Vienna, Austria on a graduate school scholarship and ended up living there for over a decade, working as a freelance writer and a translator.
• 36:00
  In March of 2020, when SARS-CoV-2 started to spread to the United States, he perceived that the pandemic response was illogical at best and possibly criminal.
• 36:10
  In November of that year, he watched a video by Dr.
• 36:12
  Peter McCullough and saw his U.S.
• 36:15
  Senate testimony about early treatment.
• 36:17
  He made contact with Dr.
• 36:19
  Peter and Texas, where they both live, and together they wrote The Courage to Face COVID-19, their first book.
• 36:26
  Now, John, welcome back to the show.
• 36:29
  The subtitle of your book is Vaccines, Mythology, Ideology, and Reality.
• 36:34
  What are the mythologies, ideologies, and realities of vaccines?
• 36:39
  Well, the mythology is that is that the vaccine enterprise has always been strictly scientific.
• 36:46
  And, you know, proper methods of evaluating efficacy and safety.
• 36:51
  And that's just not true.
• 36:53
  I mean, if you go back to the early smallpox inoculation of the early 18th century, it was extremely crude.
• 37:02
  Um, the there was no no real methods for controlling the procedure.
• 37:08
  And there was no real real proper methods for ascertaining, you know, did it really work?
• 37:14
  I mean, in other words, you make an incision on someone's arm, you then a healthy person's arm, you then take pus from the pustule of a sick person, you rub the pus and the eye and the and and and the the it the wound on the healthy person's arm.
• 37:35
  The idea in theory is they will get a mild case of smallpox on the arm at the wound site, and then that will then forever protect them from smallpox should they ever be exposed.
• 37:49
  But if if you read the literature on this, the only thing you can conclude is this may have worked with some people, it may have conferred some protection with some people.
• 38:00
  Other people died from the procedure.
• 38:03
  And then, of course, the question is those who did get a mild illness from the inoculation and lived to tell the tale.
• 38:12
  We don't know if they were ever really exposed to the virulent, you know, smallpox again.
• 38:19
  We don't, they there was no re-challenge, so to speak, that that could enable us to evaluate this scientifically.
• 38:27
  So from the very beginning, we see there's a kind of charm in the idea, which is which is um, you know, a charming idea.
• 38:38
  Without a doubt.
• 38:41
  Just a little bit of poison will protect you from more severe illness.
• 38:46
  But this this lack of proper scientific evaluation, there's there's wishful thinking, there's commercial motives, doctors who perform the early smallpox inoculation procedure.
• 38:59
  In the American colonies, they were charging about the equivalent of a full year's income for the average colonist.
• 39:10
  So there's a huge fortune behind becoming an inoculator.
• 39:15
  And of course, that creates an incentive to claim that it works and to ignore, sweep under the rug, um, overlook incidences in which it didn't.
• 39:26
  And you know, one very poignant case.
• 39:30
  King George III and his wife Charlotta, they had a huge mess of kids, I think 15.
• 39:36
  And their last two children were these very pretty little boys.
• 39:40
  So their royal portraits of them, you know, they survived early infancy.
• 39:45
  Um I think both reached the age of four or five years old.
• 39:51
  And in those days, if you got to four or five, you know, you you were looking pretty good.
• 39:56
  George decided to get the inoculator.
• 40:00
  Procedure for both children.
• 40:03
  Both of them developed severe smallpox illness from the inoculation and both died.
• 40:10
  This was devastating for the parents.
• 40:13
  Apparently, as King George III slipped into madness, he kept having these recurring visions of these little boys that would visit him in his dreams.
• 40:23
  And it was just a horrifying thing.
• 40:27
  So from the very beginning of the vaccine enterprise, there is this mythology that it was a strictly scientific enterprise, and it just wasn't.
• 40:41
  So that's the mythology.
• 40:44
  The ideology is the way in which any pro any other product, you know, we have no problem with someone saying, well, you know, can we evaluate it?
• 40:56
  Could we make it safer?
• 40:58
  Is it possible that in some instances it's not the best thing?
• 41:05
  If you ask those questions with vaccines, it's almost like you're committing an act of heresy.
• 41:11
  You know, how dare you question the efficacy and the safety of this miraculous product that has saved millions of children from dying.
• 41:20
  And were it not for this product, measles would come roaring back in like a dragon, and we would have cemeteries overflowing with children.
• 41:33
  This is not a scientific way of thinking.
• 41:36
  This is an ideological adherence, an ideological way of thinking.
• 41:52
  Provided that they're properly manufactured and tested and the whole thing, do confer some protection.
• 42:01
  Particularly when you look at the measles, I didn't get measles.
• 42:05
  Um, prior to 1963, all children got measles.
• 42:10
  I didn't.
• 42:11
  So measles morbidity was definitely reduced from the introduction of the measles vaccine.
• 42:20
  The question is now that's on the table is measles combined with mumps, rubella, you know, tetanus, uh, you know, all these other vaccines, and we've seen this the proliferation of the schedule.
• 42:34
  The question now, the reality now is well, okay, there's there's certain rewards and vaccines, but what are the risks?
• 42:43
  Are there risks?
• 42:45
  Can we do a risk reward evaluation or a risk benefit evaluation?
• 42:52
  And now we're back into the frying pan of ideology.
• 42:56
  No, we're not going to talk about it.
• 42:58
  It's already been established.
• 42:59
  There's no scientific grounds for any any skepticism.
• 43:03
  Well, so it's like, again, if it were any other product, we'd say, well, you know, can we evaluate it critically?
• 43:13
  And no one would have a problem with that.
• 43:15
  It's only with vaccines.
• 43:17
  I think it's the only product where you're not allowed to question the safety and the efficacy.
• 43:24
  You know, it's interesting because um Aaron Seary's book, Vaccines Amen.
• 43:28
  I I really loved that book.
• 43:30
  And he knows it's um knowing what I know, and I've been doing this for 25 years, you know, reading that book just solidified everything that I've known, but put it into a perspective of everything about the vaccine industry is just myth.
• 43:45
  It's all a belief.
• 43:46
  You know, that's why he named the book Vaccines Amen.
• 43:49
  You know, it's a belief.
• 43:50
  And you got the high priest, and you've got all of the, you know, the apostles and the people that are following this based on literally nothing.
• 43:59
  And actually, I will say something to you when you said about the measles, you know, the me, the death from measles, the population-based death from measles was two in two million.
• 44:09
  Oh, I Sherry, I I I know, I just meant I didn't, I never got it.
• 44:13
  I'm uh I'm not doubting um that the mortality um I'm just saying that, you know, the uh we could argue these points forever because I just don't see any value in any of them anywhere.
• 44:26
  And you actually actually say in your introduction that I'm a dangerous person for saying that, you know, not me personally, but you say in your the introduction of your book um that you are not anti-vaccine, and the anti-vaccine fanatics regard all vaccines equally dangerous and fraudulent without considering the possibility for certain people under certain circumstances that they may have a benefit that outweighs the risk.
• 44:51
  Therefore, both sides are fanatical.
• 44:54
  The pro-vaccine kinds are not.
• 44:56
  And um, you know, I could kind of debate that with you, which I won't, but I would like to understand why you said that.
• 45:02
  Well, I mean, I'm generally speaking, when you have any complex phenomenon, you know, with any element of of uh of a touching on a complex system, you know, I'm always just hesitant to um to take an extreme on either side.
• 45:25
  There seems to have been in some vaccines, and I specifically mentioned the fact that I just never got measles.
• 45:35
  I don't think anyone of my generation got measles.
• 45:39
  So, and I'm not saying that suffering, you know, a week of you know, a measles rash would have been a big deal.
• 45:47
  I did get chickenpox, and it wasn't a big deal.
• 45:52
  So for me, I think there's great utility in considering um, you know, not how to put it, like having one's mind to open to at least the possibility there's some utility in something.
• 46:09
  And I also that was partly a record a rhetorical device as well, because I don't think we're gonna get anywhere in terms of bringing this whole thing back down to reason.
• 46:23
  If we just take the categorical dismissive idea that under no circumstances could any vaccine be of any utility.
• 46:33
  Uh I I don't think we're going to be very persuasive with that.
• 46:38
  I think that what we need to be talking about doing is, well, let's take a hard look at it.
• 46:43
  Let's have a conversation about it rather than uh a categorical out, you know, ipso, or what do I trying to say?
• 46:52
  Uh uh a categorical dismissal of the whole thing.
• 46:57
  Uh, it just doesn't seem in terms of public discourse a very um like we're gonna get very far with that.
• 47:05
  I think where we would win hearts and minds is if we could persuade people, let's just critically evaluate it.
• 47:12
  Well, I think a lot of that is going on.
• 47:14
  You know, there's a lot more studies, and you know, Erin Seary uh, you know, did this thing with on Highwire with Del Big Tree showing none of the vaccines actually has a placebo-controlled trial anywhere.
• 47:26
  It's always a vaccine against a vaccine.
• 47:30
  And so um, you know, he there was a big uh chart that he put together.
• 47:34
  So there's that kind of data that we're looking at.
• 47:37
  We're looking at, you know, vaccinated versus unvaccinated populations who are healthier, you know.
• 47:42
  It will appear so far of what is available, the unvaccinated people, you know, and when we look at like the COVID shots, which is what your first book was about, and we look at all the tragic uh outcomes from from that, you know, all of the illness, the neurological problems, the turbo cancers, the cardiovascular things that Peter delves into, Dr.
• 48:01
  Bacala delves into a lot, all the kidney disorders and the kidney diseases, you know, of how what kind of tragedy that caused by you know a rushing out the gate.
• 48:11
  Um, so I think that we are really are getting to the place of maybe for the first time ever, John, really doing a critical evaluation about the ideology, like you point on your book.
• 48:23
  And I think the way you explained it was brilliant.
• 48:25
  I mean, it really does explain it very, very well about the myths and the ideologies and uh the problems that we and the realities of what that what's really facing that.
• 48:36
  Let's just we've only let's switch over a little bit to talk about the COVID shots, because that was what your first book with uh what Dr.
• 48:43
  McCullough was about, is um, you know, that uh why do you characterize the creators of the SARS-CoV-2 and the MRNA vaccines as organized crime as an organized crime synagogue syndicate that you talk about that in your book?
• 48:58
  I I think it the evidence is clear that with the passage of the PrEP Act in 2005, which granted liability protection and also couched within the the act was not only granting liability protection to people producing manufacturing so-called countermeasures, and those countermeasures, that's a term from military parlance.
• 49:24
  The PrEP Act was passed within the context of this idea of bioterrorism, you know, that we'd had September the 11th.
• 49:32
  There was this anthrax letter attack a week later, which, you know, seems to have been carried out by some somebody within US biodefense.
• 49:45
  It wasn't Saddam Hussein, it was someone probably at Fort Dettrick, um, our biodefense lab.
• 49:52
  Um, but you know, it didn't matter the reality of the anthrax letter attack, that it was actually a homegrown thing.
• 50:00
  Congress passed the PrEP Act.
• 50:03
  And in essence, what it states is another infectious disease pandemic is coming, or a bioterrorism attack, like the anthrax letter attack.
• 50:17
  That's coming.
• 50:18
  And when it comes, anyone who is in the business of making so-called countermeasures, which includes vaccines, shall receive liability protection if anyone is harmed or killed from their product.
• 50:34
  And also if it happens, it's clear that the U.S.
• 50:38
  government is going to provide virtually unlimited funds pre-purchasing the countermeasure.
• 50:47
  So if you're a clever guy, an enterprising guy, and you hear that, wow, liability protection.
• 50:54
  And then Uncle Sam's going to come in with his checkbook and he's going to pre-purchase a gazillion dollars of the stuff.
• 51:03
  Well, let's get going and making another pandemic.
• 51:06
  I mean, like what, you know, we can't wait.
• 51:09
  Like, when's it coming?
• 51:11
  Um, you know, when's the next uh anthrax attack or whatever?
• 51:15
  And so, you know, already you see this gain of function with influenza viruses.
• 51:20
  Kawa Oka and Ron Fouchier, they start trying to figure out a way to make H5N1, which is an avian flu.
• 51:27
  You know, how do we make it transmissible amongst humans?
• 51:31
  And you know, the implied is well, then we can make vaccines against it, should God forbid this virus ever circulate.
• 51:41
  Uh I see this as is being a criminal enterprise.
• 51:45
  And and then the paper trail that SARS-CoV-2 was made in a lab with American biotechnology, primarily from Ralph Barrick at the University of North North Carolina, Court North Carolina.
• 51:58
  That paper trail is so huge that you know, I I joke in the book, you know, it would take a New York Times reporter or a member of Congress not to see it.
• 52:10
  I mean, it's it's it's just enormous.
• 52:13
  So it's clear that they made the agent.
• 52:17
  It's basically a biowarfare agent.
• 52:20
  Not so lethal that it will just kill huge percentages of the population, but it's a bioweapon in the sense that it will it will create chaos, uncertainty, that it will have the effect of um debilitating the economy of debilitation and disruption.
• 52:40
  And the idea is create the um the agent of biowarfare at the same time that you create a vaccine countermeasure against it.
• 52:51
  Should this bio um agent ever get out of a lab, god forbid we would never want that to happen.
• 52:59
  Well, we've got the vaccine that we can then use to vaccinate the entire public against it.
• 53:06
  So I think your audience you know can catch the drift of where this is headed.
• 53:13
  And so that that was my intuition.
• 53:16
  And then we come to the year 2022, and it was published in Frontiers and Virology, uh a Dutch group of molecular biologists, and they do a blast search, uh genomic sequence search of this 19 nucleotide genetic sequence that's including the code that that produces the spike protein in the in the so-called furin cleavage site of SARS-CoV-2, which is the key feature of the virus that makes it very, very infectious and transmissible amongst humans.
• 53:58
  They do a blast search for that 19 nucleotide sequence coding for the fur and cleavage site, and they get a perfect match with a patented sequence patented by Stephon Boncel at the Moderna Corporation in 2016.
• 54:18
  Perfect match.
• 54:19
  Perfect match.
• 54:20
  So doing standard you know, biostatistical analysis, the chance of that happening randomly in nature, is about one in 320 billion.
• 54:32
  So the question is, why did Bal Cell, why did Moderna, why did they have that sequence?
• 54:40
  Why did they patent it?
• 54:42
  It's the key sequence that makes our SARS-CoV-2 infectious to humans.
• 54:47
  So just these like glaring things.
• 54:50
  I mean, remember, I'm coming out of a true crime background.
• 54:54
  It's like that needs to be investigated, but there is no investigation.
• 55:00
  There's none.
• 55:00
  Maria Barra Torra Toroma at Fox did an interview with Stephon Bossel, and she said, uh uh, Stephon, can you uh explain like what is going on here?
• 55:11
  And he says, uh, well, um uh I will uh he has this French accent.
• 55:17
  Uh it's kind of charming.
• 55:18
  Uh I will ask my scientist to look into it.
• 55:23
  I'll ask them to look into it.
• 55:24
  And then no follow-up, no attempt to pursue this.
• 55:30
  About one minute left on the show here with us today.
• 55:33
  We could talk about this for hours and hours.
• 55:36
  Any closing thoughts that you want to add to our audience in just like about 30 seconds.
• 55:42
  The American people need to awaken to the reality of where we stand today with our living standards in terms of our vulnerability to infectious diseases.
• 55:54
  And we need to recognize that a vast industry has been created out of keeping us afraid and getting us in line for vaccines, not only for our children for endemic diseases, but also for the entire public with these so-called pandemic diseases, most of which I think are actually being made in biosecurity labs.
• 56:20
  Amen to that.
• 56:21
  Well, listen, everybody, we got to cut this short today because we've got so much to talk about, John and I, you and I could talk for another couple of hours, I know.
• 56:28
  But John's book, their most recent lookout, Vaccines Mythology, Ideology, Reality.
• 56:33
  Uh that's the book.
• 56:34
  You can find it at bookstore.drtempenny.com.
• 56:38
  And uh I'm so grateful to have him here today.
• 56:40
  I'm grateful for all of your listeners who are here.
• 56:42
  We will see you again on the 10penny files tomorrow or the next time at 3 p.m.
• 56:48
  Eastern, right here on AmericaOutloud.news, iHeartRadio, or on our website at dr10penny.com.
• 56:53
  Please follow me on X at Busy Dr T.
• 56:56
  Have a great rest of your day, everybody.
• 56:57
  We'll see you the next time on the 10penny files.
• 57:00
  Goodbye, and God bless.