Latest / Ministry Minded / Faith in the Fast Lane and Using Social Media Thoughtfully with Eric Attinger

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Faith in the Fast Lane and Using Social Media Thoughtfully with Eric Attinger · Ministry Minded

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SPEAKER_01: Hello and welcome to a brand new episode of the Ministry-Minded Podcast,
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a show that seeks to marvel at the mercy of God that meets us
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in our messy ministries.
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SPEAKER_01: I'm, of course, your host, Pastor Brad Gray.
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I'm the senior pastor of Stonington Baptist Church here in Paxinus,
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Pennsylvania.
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I'm joined by my brother and friend and companion in ministry,
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Eric Adinger.
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SPEAKER_01: Eric, how are you doing?
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SPEAKER_00: Good, good.
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SPEAKER_00: Thank you for having me.
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SPEAKER_01: I'll enjoy it.
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SPEAKER_01: Oh, man.
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SPEAKER_01: I always love when we can sit down because,
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SPEAKER_01: as we've shared before,
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SPEAKER_01: we don't often do a lot of planning.
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SPEAKER_01: And I just kind of like that.
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SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
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SPEAKER_00: It's kind of good to go to talk about the seat of our pants.
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SPEAKER_00: Where the Lord leads.
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SPEAKER_00: Wherever the Lord leads.
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SPEAKER_00: It's dangerous but fun at the same time.
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SPEAKER_00: It is.
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And I wanted to just sort of share right at the top of this
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particular episode.
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SPEAKER_01: Only because I've been podcasting for a while.
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SPEAKER_01: Ministry Minded has gone through a couple of iterations.
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SPEAKER_01: Originally, it was strictly an interview show.
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SPEAKER_01: And I was interviewing authors and preachers and so on and so forth.
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SPEAKER_01: And then it went during the COVID era.
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Ministry Minded was just me sort of doing a very poor man's
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impression of Rush
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SPEAKER_01: Limbaugh where I was just talking about stuff.
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SPEAKER_01: And that got kind of lonely.
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And so what I want to do is kind of just talk about the way in
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which I want this
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SPEAKER_01: sort of new iteration of the show to go.
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I'm still going to be doing some interviews with some people
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that I have lined up
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SPEAKER_01: that I'm excited for.
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SPEAKER_01: But I really want,
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SPEAKER_01: like,
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SPEAKER_01: especially you and I,
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SPEAKER_01: as now we are sort of have our,
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SPEAKER_01: we're sort of knee deep in ministry here in central Pennsylvania.
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I want us to be able to think about things that are happening
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in our quote unquote
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SPEAKER_01: present moment.
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SPEAKER_01: And think about it theologically.
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Think about it from not just a ministry's perspective,
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but a Christian perspective.
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SPEAKER_01: And be able to interact with what's going on.
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SPEAKER_01: I don't want it just to be about theories of preaching,
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SPEAKER_01: which I will always want to talk about that.
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SPEAKER_01: And I think we can always get back to that.
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But I want us to be able to engage and interact with either
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some relevant stories
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SPEAKER_01: or some recent stories,
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either even also some local stories that are really pertinent
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to people that are in
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SPEAKER_01: our area.
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SPEAKER_01: and just be able to think theologically about that.
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SPEAKER_01: Does that make sense?
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I love that.
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SPEAKER_00: I love that.
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And it's really good to do rather than just kind of allow these
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things to drift on by.
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SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of lessons,
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SPEAKER_00: a lot of things we can take from things and just kind of opening up,
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SPEAKER_00: especially I think a lot of times we get so stuck in,
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SPEAKER_00: I don't know,
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SPEAKER_00: you and I talked about this before,
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you get so stuck in Scripture when you're in ministry that
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we're always preparing
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SPEAKER_00: the next sermon,
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SPEAKER_00: the next lesson.
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SPEAKER_00: One,
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SPEAKER_00: you've got to take time to get into the Bible your own way,
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SPEAKER_00: but also you've got to stop to look around and be present
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SPEAKER_00: about what's going on because there's a lot going on.
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SPEAKER_00: And if we just kind of go to the whims of staying in our lane,
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there's a lot of things that people need more insight on
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because it's hard being a
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SPEAKER_00: Christian today in this world and staying the course,
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especially if you don't have your eyes on God and you don't
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know how to interact
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SPEAKER_00: with all these other things.
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SPEAKER_01: Well, there's so much news happening all the time.
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SPEAKER_01: It's crazy to think about.
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SPEAKER_01: I don't know the stats on this, so this is going to be totally made up.
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SPEAKER_01: And this is one of the problems when we are just riven.
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SPEAKER_01: But isn't it true that,
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SPEAKER_01: I don't know,
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SPEAKER_01: a billion gigabytes of data is produced every few minutes or so?
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SPEAKER_01: I don't know what the stat is,
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SPEAKER_01: but it's unheard of,
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SPEAKER_01: the amount of gigabytes of data that's being...
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SPEAKER_01: either uploaded or downloaded or shared at any given second.
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SPEAKER_01: And it's truly mind-boggling,
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SPEAKER_01: especially when you compare,
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SPEAKER_01: like,
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the computer that launched the rocket to land on the moon was
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filled with a room,
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SPEAKER_01: but it was,
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SPEAKER_01: like,
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SPEAKER_01: less than what's in your pocket right now.
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SPEAKER_00: It's such a crazy concept, and that's, like, it's weird.
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SPEAKER_00: We are exponentially – I think society is exponentially getting faster.
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And what's really wild is I can actually remember this turning
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point in my –
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Like my viewpoint,
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I was actually – a lot of people don't even know this.
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SPEAKER_00: I was a journalism major.
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I was a sports journalism major at Penn State before I ended up
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going to full kinesiology,
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SPEAKER_00: and I made the shift over.
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SPEAKER_00: But I'll never forget.
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I was in a news writing class,
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and we ended up having to go to some seminar with –
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Pretty big,
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prominent writer who had broken the story about the Amish shooting.
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SPEAKER_00: It was like a really big thing,
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SPEAKER_00: but he was talking about how,
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SPEAKER_00: hey,
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SPEAKER_00: we're already starting to see changes now where before,
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SPEAKER_00: if you're a beat writer and you're a writer,
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you've got to get it out fast now because things are so fast
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and the way the
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internet is utilizing things and now everybody's moving from a
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newspaper to online.
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It's going to move fast and you've got to be fast,
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and they said the problem with this…
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SPEAKER_00: is society's going to be moving so fast,
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nobody's going to stop to be able to check their facts because
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you don't have the time.
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SPEAKER_00: And it was crazy.
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SPEAKER_00: He said this in, I want to say, the year 2007, by the way.
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SPEAKER_01: That was very prophetic.
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, very prophetic.
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SPEAKER_00: And I was like, I understood what he was saying.
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SPEAKER_00: Like, oh, I get it because I could start to see it in my own life.
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SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, the computer is very prominent.
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You didn't go home from college without getting on your
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computer at some point,
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SPEAKER_00: which in turn led you to some news or some whatever it may be,
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SPEAKER_00: whether it was sports or whatever.
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SPEAKER_00: So and then and then once it got,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: once how competition works,
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SPEAKER_00: he kind of even talked about this.
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It's so cutthroat where people want to get the edge and they
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want to get a new
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SPEAKER_00: story or a new way.
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SPEAKER_00: And people are going to start taking angles on this just to get seen.
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SPEAKER_00: And like, it's so crazy.
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SPEAKER_00: That was just news.
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But now you see it now,
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not only in the news,
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but everything is so much faster.
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And even with phones,
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because I'm you know,
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we're both really busy people.
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SPEAKER_00: But it's sometimes so hard.
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SPEAKER_00: I have to tell people, like, it's crazy if you're not careful.
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SPEAKER_00: You can get caught up in messages because messages will pour in.
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SPEAKER_00: So you've got the news.
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SPEAKER_00: You've got text messages, memes, reels, GIFs.
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SPEAKER_00: You've got your own stuff to do.
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SPEAKER_00: You've got your own families.
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So you're almost,
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like,
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biting this,
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taking this,
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taking this,
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taking this.
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SPEAKER_00: You don't slow down,
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and you almost feel like you can't slow down because we're on a merry-go-round.
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SPEAKER_00: Or else you're, like, living in 1950, and you're behind.
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SPEAKER_00: Everyone's like, what do you mean you don't know this is going on?
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SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, it seems to be exponentially increasing, increasing.
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And I think that that brings up a really relevant point only
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because there's no
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SPEAKER_01: time or there's seemingly no time to really stop and process.
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SPEAKER_01: We are,
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SPEAKER_01: and I don't mean this anecdotally,
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SPEAKER_01: but in a way,
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SPEAKER_01: we are people that are becoming steered by the news cycle.
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Just wait a couple days and there's going to be some new thing
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that everyone's
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SPEAKER_01: going to be talking about.
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SPEAKER_01: And there's really been no time to process stuff.
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SPEAKER_01: I'm thinking...
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there's still some people that are devastated and hurting over
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the hurricane that
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SPEAKER_01: went through and tore up Asheville.
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SPEAKER_01: And that's not even a blip on people's radar here in March of 2025.
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And it's crazy to think that what might have been a longer
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story that allowed
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SPEAKER_01: people to process,
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SPEAKER_01: but also to engage with
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relief efforts or whatever it was a blip and then it's gone um
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and i don't mean
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that from a sense of like a humanitarian perspective i just
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mean it from a sense of
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just like news and our engagement with social media it's so
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fast that we don't
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really have time to process there's not a lot of deep thinking
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and i don't want to
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like get into the weeds on that necessarily because there's a
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lot of data on that
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SPEAKER_01: like our ability to process stuff is not
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SPEAKER_01: Not very high.
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There's actually this one pretty wise guy that I actually knew,
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a Christian man.
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SPEAKER_00: He was an elder at a church,
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and he was pointing out how Satan or the enemy or whatever you
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want to say attacks
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SPEAKER_00: our bandwidth on purpose,
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which really is an attack of the enemy because our bandwidth
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can only take so much.
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SPEAKER_00: We can only focus on so much.
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SPEAKER_00: Because you talk about the California wildfires.
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SPEAKER_00: People were all up in arms about that, but now I forgot about that too.
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And you can just keep going month by month a week or a month
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back at a time and be like,
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I –
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SPEAKER_00: I forgot how major that was.
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SPEAKER_00: And the other thing, it's like our minds can't handle it.
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SPEAKER_00: And you feel now,
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SPEAKER_00: especially on social media,
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SPEAKER_00: like you have to have an opinion,
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SPEAKER_00: a stance,
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SPEAKER_00: and a response.
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SPEAKER_00: So you feel like I got to read this.
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SPEAKER_00: So if somebody approaches me, I already know where I stand on this.
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SPEAKER_00: And it's like so overwhelming.
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And you're trying to care about what's going on in your world,
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but what's going on in the macro.
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SPEAKER_00: And it does seem sometimes to be like a satanic attack.
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SPEAKER_00: By the end of the day,
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SPEAKER_00: I'm just like,
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SPEAKER_00: man,
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SPEAKER_00: I was responding to a lot of messages and a lot of people.
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SPEAKER_00: And it was all about –
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SPEAKER_00: these other things.
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SPEAKER_00: And I kept trying to steer them to God,
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but there was still a lot of conversation going on about like
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stuff that's current that,
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SPEAKER_00: like you said,
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SPEAKER_00: will be gone from our minds even in two weeks.
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We'll be able to reflect on it if somebody brings it up like
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we're doing now,
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SPEAKER_00: but I don't,
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SPEAKER_00: we probably didn't even think about the California wildfires.
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I haven't thought about it for weeks until we just,
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you said the hurricane.
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SPEAKER_00: I was like, oh yeah, and the wildfires.
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SPEAKER_00: And then,
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SPEAKER_00: Who knows,
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SPEAKER_00: like you said,
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SPEAKER_00: what's going to come next month,
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SPEAKER_00: and then somebody's going to be up in arms,
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SPEAKER_00: and there's going to be somebody complaining about what's going on,
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SPEAKER_00: somebody excited about what's going on.
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SPEAKER_00: It's like never-ending,
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SPEAKER_00: and like you said,
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SPEAKER_00: to keep up and be relevant,
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SPEAKER_00: and especially in ministry because I don't know if you know how it is.
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SPEAKER_00: People,
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SPEAKER_00: especially during election season,
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SPEAKER_00: which I hated,
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SPEAKER_00: but they'll come up with,
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SPEAKER_00: what about this?
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SPEAKER_00: Is this Christian?
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SPEAKER_00: What about this?
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SPEAKER_00: Is in vitro?
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SPEAKER_00: What is this?
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SPEAKER_00: And it's like, oh, my goodness.
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SPEAKER_00: I just – come on.
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SPEAKER_00: Let's just sift through the important stuff.
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SPEAKER_00: Let's not get caught in the weeds.
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And I think it's really important to not get caught in the
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weeds because that's
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what Satan wants us to do is go down these bad rabbit holes of
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spending three hours
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SPEAKER_00: debating somebody of in vitro is whatever.
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SPEAKER_00: And it's like, wait a minute.
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SPEAKER_00: What am I doing here?
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I don't know if this is the best three hours of my time when
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we're swimming,
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SPEAKER_00: just swimming through all this stuff.
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SPEAKER_01: We're swimming through –
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companies and corporations that are really vying for our
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attention um and i think
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there's been a lot of really good um essays that i've read
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recently that talk about
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that they talk about the idea that we are in the age of like
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attention wars there's
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so many things that are warring for your attention and doing
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pretty much anything
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SPEAKER_01: that they can to get it and then also not only get it but keep it
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SPEAKER_01: I was watching a really funny YouTube video essay of this guy.
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SPEAKER_01: He usually talks about how he just riffs on funny stuff.
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But this time he was talking about the idea that all of our
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apps are turning into
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SPEAKER_01: social media apps.
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SPEAKER_01: There was one,
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SPEAKER_01: I think,
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SPEAKER_01: and I'll have to find it,
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SPEAKER_01: so this is not entirely accurate per se,
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SPEAKER_01: but...
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It was almost like one of those apps that you can use to
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control the lights that
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SPEAKER_01: you put on the back of your TV.
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SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
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So it's like an LED thing,
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and you can control the lights,
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and that's pretty cool.
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SPEAKER_01: It's a pretty cool feature.
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SPEAKER_01: It's awesome.
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SPEAKER_01: Even that app had a social media feature.
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SPEAKER_00: Had a comment section?
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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It had like a feed,
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like a Twitter feed,
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and it's like,
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what are we doing?
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it's why do i want to stay in this app that controls the color
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of my led lights it
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is kind of insane and it's funny you say that because i started
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to notice that even
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in some like i'm even noticing some of the ai programs i'll
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just try to keep my ear
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to the ground what's going on there and you go in there and
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there's like same thing
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what you're saying there's like it's almost like a whole new
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social media thing
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like even on the some of the music programs if you go on there
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and create music why
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SPEAKER_01: is there a social media thing on apple music on apple
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music like why is exactly why are we doing why do we need that
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and it is they're
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just like all trying to capitalize on like well everybody's
11:01
gonna get in the game
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now it's not just gonna be facebook and tiktok it's gonna be
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everybody walmart is
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gonna have a comment feed that would actually be kind of a fun
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one i'm not gonna
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SPEAKER_00: lie i might i might check that one out every once in a while
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But it is kind of a crazy thing where it's like – and I don't
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see any end in it.
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SPEAKER_00: And what makes it worse is just add AI into it.
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SPEAKER_00: And,
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SPEAKER_00: like,
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I already see people trying to figure out how they can be the
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loudest voice and how
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SPEAKER_00: will AI make me stand out.
11:23
SPEAKER_00: And it's like, oh, no.
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SPEAKER_00: Oh, no.
11:24
SPEAKER_00: It's only going to get worse.
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SPEAKER_00: It's going to get worse.
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And so I want to be careful because I don't want to say that
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like all the social
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SPEAKER_01: media stuff is satanic or sinful.
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SPEAKER_01: But I think there is this notion of, well, I'll interrupt myself.
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SPEAKER_01: One of the, I'll be careful.
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One of the only things that I've ever really thoughtfully and
11:50
for an extended
11:51
SPEAKER_01: length of time considered that John Piper has said,
11:54
SPEAKER_01: and I'll just leave it at that.
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SPEAKER_01: is that one time where he was talking about how,
11:58
SPEAKER_01: and I forget the exact quote,
11:59
SPEAKER_01: but he mentioned something about the fact that when we get to heaven,
12:02
there will be no ability for us to have the excuse that we
12:05
didn't have enough time
12:07
SPEAKER_01: for prayer and reading the Bible.
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SPEAKER_01: And I think that is enormously true.
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SPEAKER_01: I think he said this back when he was in his Desiring God days.
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SPEAKER_01: But I think the point is, it was a very prescient point, only because
12:23
SPEAKER_01: There is not a lack of time for us.
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SPEAKER_01: And granted, what do we hear all the time as people in ministry?
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SPEAKER_01: Oh, man, I'm just so busy.
12:30
SPEAKER_01: So busy.
12:31
And there is the sense that our world,
12:33
like you said earlier,
12:34
our world is moving faster.
12:36
But there's also this sense in which some of the things that
12:39
we're busy with are
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SPEAKER_01: kind of,
12:42
SPEAKER_01: can I say,
12:43
SPEAKER_01: manufactured?
12:43
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
12:44
SPEAKER_01: Or flimsy?
12:46
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
12:46
The idea that we're busy about all these social media things,
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what does that really even mean?
12:51
SPEAKER_00: Right.
12:52
SPEAKER_00: And it's interesting,
12:52
SPEAKER_00: too,
12:53
SPEAKER_00: because if you really look down and consider it,
12:55
SPEAKER_00: so the world is moving so fast,
12:57
SPEAKER_00: and we're inundated nonstop.
12:59
SPEAKER_00: And like I said,
12:59
SPEAKER_00: at some point,
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SPEAKER_00: when you get so many things,
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SPEAKER_00: you have to start realizing,
13:02
SPEAKER_00: I can't watch every reel.
13:03
SPEAKER_00: I can't watch everything that somebody sends me.
13:05
SPEAKER_00: I can't watch.
13:05
SPEAKER_00: I just got one the other day.
13:06
SPEAKER_00: It was a three-hour podcast.
13:08
SPEAKER_00: Oh, my God.
13:09
SPEAKER_00: But it had pertinent information.
13:10
SPEAKER_00: But I had to take days to listen to it.
13:11
SPEAKER_00: I could listen in chunks.
13:11
Like,
13:12
I can't do too many more three-hour podcast recommendations
13:14
from people.
13:15
SPEAKER_00: Like, I can take them a little bit as I go, but I can't.
13:17
SPEAKER_00: Like, hey, give me a response tomorrow what you think.
13:19
SPEAKER_01: I can't do it.
13:20
SPEAKER_01: That's when I'm like, man, sometimes AI is okay.
13:23
SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
13:24
SPEAKER_00: I just want the cliff notes.
13:25
SPEAKER_00: I just want the cliff notes so I can analyze it.
13:27
SPEAKER_01: I ain't got no time for three hours.
13:29
SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
13:30
SPEAKER_00: And it's kind of wild.
13:31
SPEAKER_00: But at the same time,
13:31
SPEAKER_00: it's so it's like,
13:32
SPEAKER_00: man,
13:32
SPEAKER_00: I got to sift through because I'm swimming through all this stuff.
13:34
SPEAKER_00: And I got my family to take care of.
13:35
SPEAKER_00: I got my other music stuff.
13:36
SPEAKER_00: I got all my projects and all these things.
13:39
SPEAKER_00: And I got to keep up with stuff.
13:40
But at the same time,
13:41
like you said,
13:41
I think it becomes a self-priority issue.
13:45
And we hide behind this thing of we're so busy that we just
13:50
give up on prioritizing.
13:51
SPEAKER_00: Like we're like,
13:52
SPEAKER_00: well,
13:52
prioritizing doesn't matter because I just have to keep up
13:54
what's in front of me.
13:54
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
13:55
SPEAKER_00: And it's like,
13:55
SPEAKER_00: well,
13:55
SPEAKER_00: maybe we should say,
13:56
SPEAKER_00: hey,
13:57
SPEAKER_00: I know all this stuff's going on,
13:59
SPEAKER_00: and I know all these things are flying around.
14:01
SPEAKER_00: I'll catch up on it later because I haven't read Scripture today.
14:06
Because when I woke up,
14:07
the kid wanted this or whatever,
14:08
and that's what my prayer time is.
14:09
SPEAKER_00: It's been obliterated,
14:10
SPEAKER_00: and it's not going to matter if I get on social media,
14:13
SPEAKER_00: which social media can be good.
14:15
SPEAKER_00: It can be used as a neutral thing,
14:16
but it's not going to be helpful for me to get on social media
14:18
and combat these
14:19
SPEAKER_00: political things or this topic of this.
14:22
when i didn't pray and i didn't read my bible and that's really
14:26
what i think john
14:26
piper is getting at and i agree or you know the ones that what
14:29
happens is this can
14:30
be real it's like somebody sends you a reel and says hey i know
14:32
you don't have a
14:33
lot of time check this out and it's like you know 30 seconds i
14:34
can do it but next
14:35
thing you know now i'm now you're scrolling now you're now i'm
14:39
scrolling and then
14:39
SPEAKER_00: i'm like oh here and then i see one like here watch this one it's
14:43
like oh no i'm him i'm me but it is we're all the same because
14:46
it is the same way
14:47
we all have these things we want to share and i don't want to
14:49
overwhelm people with
14:50
what i see and what i share but then i it's like this crazy
14:52
thing and you want to
14:53
SPEAKER_00: be in the know and you want to be part of and there are like good social
14:56
connections you make out of it and a lot of people yeah i still
14:58
keep in touch with
14:59
through all these things but it is one of those things when you
15:02
stop and i loved
15:03
actually what um when the ipads and the iphone started doing
15:06
screen time it was one
15:06
SPEAKER_00: of the greatest things i thought because it kind of wasn't that a scary
15:10
SPEAKER_01: notification it's terrifying
15:12
SPEAKER_00: When I first saw it, I was like, oh my goodness.
15:13
And then I was like,
15:14
all right,
15:14
I'm only going to get my iPad or phone out.
15:15
SPEAKER_00: And it's like, you dropped by 73% this week.
15:17
SPEAKER_00: I was like, oh my goodness.
15:19
SPEAKER_00: And I was still on it for hours.
15:20
SPEAKER_00: It's really bad.
15:21
SPEAKER_00: But it's one of those things.
15:23
SPEAKER_00: By the way, if you're listening, just check your screen time.
15:25
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, for real.
15:26
SPEAKER_00: It'll be a reality check for all of us.
15:27
SPEAKER_00: It always is.
15:28
SPEAKER_01: We're not going to be fair sake about that.
15:30
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but I'm telling you.
15:32
it's you i'm talking to you right now whoever's listening you
15:35
need to cut down your
15:35
screen time that's just true for everybody yeah it's just true
15:39
for everybody but
15:40
yeah it's one of those things it's a good thing it can be but
15:42
it can be a bad thing
15:43
like anything else and if we get caught up in the fastness of
15:45
life we got to make
15:46
sure like we got to prioritize because god's not going to say
15:49
hey i know you guys
15:50
had a lot of social media to keep up with so i'll forgive you
15:52
for not taking care
15:54
SPEAKER_00: of the poor and the needy and praying for those in need
15:56
SPEAKER_01: Oh man,
15:57
SPEAKER_01: that's such,
15:58
SPEAKER_01: we're kind of really deep in the weeds here,
16:00
SPEAKER_01: but I love it because I think,
16:03
SPEAKER_01: and this is exactly what I wanted to talk about today,
16:05
SPEAKER_01: which is how can we think critically,
16:11
SPEAKER_01: think biblically,
16:12
SPEAKER_01: think theologically,
16:13
SPEAKER_01: think ministerially about a Christian's engagement with social media?
16:19
SPEAKER_01: And
16:20
there's a man there's so many ways we can go about thinking
16:23
about this only because
16:25
social media is kind of like one of those things that's just
16:29
ubiquitous with our
16:30
moment right like it's almost like not even questions like we
16:33
just mentioned
16:34
SPEAKER_01: there's an led app that has a social media feature like
16:37
It's ingrained in our society that we're going to have this
16:42
ability to connect but
16:44
also to quote unquote perform to virtue signal to do all of
16:49
these things that sort
16:50
SPEAKER_01: of speak to us in our present moment.
16:53
I was thinking about this,
16:54
and so this will be a little bit of a tangible comeback.
16:56
I was thinking about this recently because I came across this
16:59
article on Substack
17:01
SPEAKER_01: that was written by this guy named Peter James.
17:04
SPEAKER_01: The title of the article is The Best Part of Quitting Comedy,
17:08
SPEAKER_01: which right off the bat is a very provocative title,
17:10
SPEAKER_01: but if you read this guy's story,
17:12
SPEAKER_01: Peter James,
17:13
SPEAKER_01: I've never watched one of his stand-up shows before,
17:15
SPEAKER_01: but...
17:16
SPEAKER_01: I've loved engaging with some of his Substack essays.
17:20
SPEAKER_01: And what you find is that Peter James,
17:22
SPEAKER_01: whoever he might have been,
17:23
SPEAKER_01: was a guy who was struggling to get through,
17:28
SPEAKER_01: to sort of break through on the stand-up comedy scene.
17:33
SPEAKER_01: I know you're familiar with stand-up comedy and all that kind of stuff.
17:36
SPEAKER_01: It's a very tough gig to break into.
17:39
SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah, yeah.
17:39
And he's describing this idea only from the perspective that
17:43
he's since quit this.
17:44
SPEAKER_01: He's given up on his dream of having a comedy career.
17:49
In one of the essays,
17:50
a different one,
17:52
which I'll link to,
17:53
he describes...
17:56
SPEAKER_01: the backstory of why he was pursuing this so earnestly.
18:01
SPEAKER_01: And especially this one phrase stood out.
18:05
He says,
18:05
quote,
18:06
I was searching for something spiritual rather than material,
18:10
end quote.
18:11
So this guy,
18:13
Peter,
18:13
was this idea of making it in comedy was not just this
18:18
aspirational thing.
18:19
SPEAKER_01: He kind of equates it with this spiritual goal that he had to
18:25
SPEAKER_01: So it's a goal of fulfillment.
18:27
SPEAKER_01: It's a goal of actually putting all the pieces together.
18:30
And then he talks in this one essay called The Best Part of
18:34
Quitting Comedy,
18:35
SPEAKER_01: this almost relief,
18:38
SPEAKER_01: he calls it,
18:40
SPEAKER_01: if we want to use Christian terminology,
18:42
SPEAKER_01: it's almost the grace of
18:43
SPEAKER_01: of being able to say, I can't make it in this, and that's okay.
18:49
SPEAKER_01: This idea of giving up.
18:51
I'm going to read a couple of excerpts from this essay because
18:54
I think it's fantastic.
18:55
SPEAKER_01: So Peter says,
18:57
SPEAKER_01: quote,
18:58
SPEAKER_01: well,
18:58
SPEAKER_01: in this particular passage,
19:00
SPEAKER_01: he's talking about this idea that comedians use
19:06
SPEAKER_01: all of their personal lives as material.
19:11
SPEAKER_01: He says, "...comedians love to say that everything is material.
19:16
To them,
19:17
anything that happens in life is fair game to joke about on
19:20
stage."
19:21
SPEAKER_01: They'll usually point to someone like Richard Pryor,
19:24
who mined his very real substance abuse issues and turned them
19:28
into legendary bits.
19:29
SPEAKER_01: The problem is most comedians are not Richard Pryor.
19:32
They don't have the ability to deftly and thoughtfully navigate
19:35
their personal
19:36
demons and come out the other end with a remarkable insight
19:39
that also happens to be funny.
19:41
SPEAKER_01: They'll call their comedy therapeutic,
19:43
but what they're really doing is using comedy to avoid their
19:47
issues by taking them
19:48
SPEAKER_01: too lightly.
19:49
SPEAKER_01: If comedy is supposed to be therapeutic,
19:51
SPEAKER_01: why are so many comedians struggling to function as normal human beings?
20:01
SPEAKER_01: Insight to make.
20:02
SPEAKER_01: But here's the real quote I wanted to get to.
20:05
He says,
20:05
quote,
20:07
reflecting,
20:08
he says here,
20:09
about the idea that he's left the comedy scene.
20:11
SPEAKER_01: He's not in the stand-up comedy world anymore.
20:13
SPEAKER_01: He says,
20:14
SPEAKER_01: quote,
20:14
it's a relief to have this burden off of me now that I'm not
20:18
doing stand-up anymore.
20:19
SPEAKER_01: It's a relief that I don't have to tell these jokes.
20:22
SPEAKER_01: And it's also a relief that I don't have to go searching for them.
20:26
SPEAKER_01: When you're a comedian, your material is your life force.
20:29
SPEAKER_01: It's what makes the entire thing go.
20:32
SPEAKER_01: Because of this, you're constantly on the lookout for new jokes.
20:35
Whenever something remotely interesting happened to me or any
20:38
little insight
20:39
SPEAKER_01: flitted across my mind,
20:41
SPEAKER_01: I would stop and ask,
20:42
SPEAKER_01: should I write about that?
20:43
It's a process that always kept me one level removed from the
20:47
present moment.
20:48
I would think about an experience in terms of potential
20:50
material rather than take
20:52
SPEAKER_01: it in for what it was.
20:54
SPEAKER_01: End quote.
20:56
number one he's describing this incredible way in which his
21:00
occupation this we he's
21:02
we've already established this very spiritual aspirational goal
21:06
was driving quite
21:08
literally every part of him but it was also removing him from
21:13
actually enjoying
21:15
what was going on right in front of him because instead of this
21:19
is not what he
21:20
SPEAKER_01: talks about but just make up a scenario instead of
21:23
sitting in a park on a bench and then watching his kids play on
21:27
slides or swings or
21:28
SPEAKER_01: monkey bars or whatever.
21:30
He's almost analyzing that for potential anecdote that he can
21:34
share in his next,
21:35
SPEAKER_01: you know,
21:35
SPEAKER_01: 50 minute comedy special.
21:37
SPEAKER_01: And that sort of mindset really just takes you out of the present moment.
21:42
SPEAKER_01: And then,
21:43
so what I was thinking about is thinking about what he's
21:46
talking about here in
21:47
SPEAKER_01: terms of quitting comedy is,
21:50
SPEAKER_01: And relating that to the world of social media,
21:52
SPEAKER_01: because what he describes about seeing everything as potential content,
21:57
SPEAKER_01: everything as quote unquote material,
21:59
everything as something that we can share or post or video or
22:03
write about and so on
22:04
SPEAKER_01: and so forth.
22:06
SPEAKER_01: Isn't that exactly what social media does?
22:08
SPEAKER_01: It takes you out of whatever that moment is.
22:12
SPEAKER_00: No, absolutely.
22:13
SPEAKER_00: And that's what's really interesting about it.
22:15
SPEAKER_00: And the best thing I can explain or kind of relate this to,
22:18
SPEAKER_00: and I think it's probably even happened even before social media,
22:20
SPEAKER_00: it's just a little bit more...
22:21
SPEAKER_00: clear now that everybody has a camera on them.
22:23
SPEAKER_00: Because I remember back in the day,
22:25
there was always one family member who has had the camcorder
22:27
out recording the
22:27
SPEAKER_00: birthday party.
22:28
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's right.
22:28
SPEAKER_00: Hey, you just want to eat a piece of cake?
22:30
SPEAKER_00: You can sit down.
22:30
SPEAKER_00: No, no, I want to record this so I'll never forget this.
22:32
And I'm actually thankful for a lot of those because we sat
22:34
around actually a couple months ago.
22:36
SPEAKER_00: We actually sat around as a family and watched it.
22:37
SPEAKER_00: That's great and all.
22:38
SPEAKER_00: But now it feels like,
22:39
SPEAKER_00: you know,
22:40
SPEAKER_00: you ever got a phone,
22:40
SPEAKER_00: like,
22:41
SPEAKER_00: you know the people that's like,
22:42
SPEAKER_00: oh,
22:42
SPEAKER_00: just little,
22:43
SPEAKER_00: you know,
22:43
SPEAKER_00: photo bombs here coming up.
22:45
And it's photo dropped and it's like 385 photos from a birthday
22:48
party of a five.
22:49
SPEAKER_00: It's like, did you think we needed to see all those?
22:51
SPEAKER_00: You couldn't just post one.
22:53
and say like a normal person and say thanks for coming there's
22:56
40 pictures
22:57
everything has to be documented it's crazy and then if you get
23:00
into like that you
23:01
want to have content creation it's almost like the whole other
23:03
thing when you're
23:04
these content creators probably run into the same issue of like
23:07
and that's how i
23:07
think individuals even feel like i gotta put posts out i gotta
23:09
post that i gotta
23:10
show people my life and we already know from social media uh
23:14
because it's a
23:15
SPEAKER_00: It's not a private thing.
23:16
SPEAKER_00: It's a more public thing.
23:17
SPEAKER_00: Everybody wants their – everybody's like this.
23:19
SPEAKER_00: They want their public appearance to be the best.
23:21
SPEAKER_00: So that's the problem with almost probably like – exactly like comedians.
23:25
SPEAKER_00: Comedians ironically are the most suicidal people in society.
23:28
SPEAKER_00: They say they're the saddest, most suicidal.
23:30
SPEAKER_00: And usually – it's so crazy.
23:31
You go on social media,
23:33
and you find the people that are dolled up,
23:34
and they have this thing.
23:35
SPEAKER_00: It looks like the perfect life.
23:37
SPEAKER_00: The odds they say,
23:37
SPEAKER_00: psychologically say,
23:39
are that they might be the more sad people and they're putting
23:41
out this front.
23:42
SPEAKER_00: They're getting the right angle.
23:43
SPEAKER_00: They're moving this out of the background.
23:44
SPEAKER_00: They're cleaning up the room when they take the picture.
23:46
SPEAKER_00: So it's like seriously, it's so crazy to think it's so inauthentic.
23:50
SPEAKER_00: And then what he's getting at is you lose authenticity.
23:54
SPEAKER_00: And nothing can be authentic anymore.
23:56
SPEAKER_00: And you have this driving force.
23:57
And that becomes your new thing that you're looking for is how
24:01
am I going to do this?
24:02
SPEAKER_00: So everything becomes inauthentic.
24:03
SPEAKER_00: You're just constantly searching for it.
24:05
SPEAKER_00: You're not taking the moment in.
24:06
SPEAKER_00: You're not being present.
24:07
SPEAKER_00: And that can happen to anybody.
24:09
SPEAKER_00: But social media, definitely a big one.
24:12
And it's it's fascinating because this thing that was supposed
24:15
to and this is not
24:17
SPEAKER_01: like a new observation,
24:19
but this technology that was meant to connect us has actually
24:22
driven us further
24:23
apart to where now people I think they've done studies on this
24:26
idea where people
24:28
have it's like changing language because we're thinking in
24:32
terms of 280 characters
24:34
SPEAKER_01: or we're thinking in terms of shorter bits of information.
24:38
SPEAKER_01: that long-form conversations are just altered now.
24:43
SPEAKER_01: They're a little bit different than how they used to be.
24:47
And I think this brings up a really important point for
24:50
Christians to think
24:51
SPEAKER_01: critically about social media.
24:53
SPEAKER_01: And I want to be careful because,
24:55
SPEAKER_01: you know,
24:55
SPEAKER_01: as we mentioned at the top of this,
24:57
SPEAKER_01: or even before we started recording,
24:59
I think it's really disingenuous for churches and ministries to
25:05
sort of blanketly say,
25:07
SPEAKER_01: oh,
25:07
you should get off social media or be careful or like any type
25:10
of wisdom that they
25:11
SPEAKER_01: share that's like,
25:13
SPEAKER_01: hey,
25:13
SPEAKER_01: you should probably think about quitting Twitter or whatever.
25:17
It's always disingenuous to me only because many of those
25:19
churches are like so
25:20
SPEAKER_01: active on like Instagram.
25:21
SPEAKER_01: Right.
25:22
SPEAKER_01: They're making all these stories and stuff.
25:26
SPEAKER_01: But also,
25:26
just from the standpoint of it's almost a given that a church
25:31
is going to have a
25:32
SPEAKER_01: Facebook live stream now,
25:34
SPEAKER_01: thanks to COVID.
25:38
SPEAKER_01: So a church can't genuinely say that people can't be on social media.
25:44
SPEAKER_01: But it also brings up this point.
25:45
SPEAKER_01: So how do we how do we think critically about our engagement with it?
25:48
SPEAKER_01: So we're not,
25:50
SPEAKER_01: you know,
25:50
SPEAKER_01: taken out of the moment so that we're not,
25:53
SPEAKER_01: you know,
25:53
SPEAKER_01: taken out of the enjoyment of where we are right now and not have,
25:59
SPEAKER_01: you know,
25:59
SPEAKER_01: that that drive to,
26:01
SPEAKER_01: quote unquote,
26:02
SPEAKER_01: perform,
26:03
SPEAKER_01: to achieve,
26:04
SPEAKER_01: to achieve whatever empty,
26:07
SPEAKER_01: you know,
26:07
joy we get out of having more likes or more followers than
26:11
another person.
26:12
SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
26:12
SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
26:12
SPEAKER_00: and that is really hard,
26:13
SPEAKER_00: especially because the psychological aspect of the dopamine hits,
26:15
SPEAKER_00: they say.
26:16
SPEAKER_00: When you get likes and hearts, a human mind can't help but get a thrill.
26:19
Even if you turn it off,
26:21
it immediately spikes,
26:21
and you're like,
26:22
oh,
26:22
no,
26:22
that's stupid.
26:22
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't matter.
26:23
SPEAKER_00: I don't care about who liked or hearted it.
26:25
But you'll still get that thing,
26:26
and so that's what people are always chasing.
26:28
SPEAKER_00: And I agree with you.
26:29
SPEAKER_00: The churches that say,
26:30
SPEAKER_00: hey,
26:30
SPEAKER_00: stay on social media,
26:31
SPEAKER_00: if you have a Facebook or a Twitter or whatever,
26:33
SPEAKER_00: you're playing in the devil's playground.
26:36
And it could be true probably for a lot of people,
26:38
and that's the problem.
26:39
SPEAKER_00: The broad strokes are always the problem for me.
26:41
When you broad stroke,
26:43
you got to stay like – I'm going to end this like music.
26:45
SPEAKER_00: Stay away from all secular music.
26:46
SPEAKER_00: Is that a safe thing to do?
26:47
SPEAKER_00: Probably, but I mean do I have to stay away from all of it?
26:49
SPEAKER_00: Not all of it is evil,
26:51
and actually it led to a maturity level for me where you start
26:53
to go and analyze
26:54
SPEAKER_00: these things like,
26:54
SPEAKER_00: hey,
26:55
SPEAKER_00: you can go in these with an open approach.
26:56
If it's evil or something God wouldn't want you to do,
26:58
you move on from it.
26:59
SPEAKER_00: If not –
27:00
And it actually allows you rather than to hinder yourself from
27:02
like even social
27:03
media and telling people that now you still have the
27:05
self-righteous thing like,
27:05
SPEAKER_00: oh,
27:06
SPEAKER_00: I'm not on social media.
27:06
SPEAKER_00: You're social media.
27:07
SPEAKER_00: You're a little bit more lower and not as more spiritually mature.
27:11
But the reality is I think what they're getting at when they
27:13
say this stuff is like –
27:15
SPEAKER_00: Mentally prioritize this stuff.
27:17
SPEAKER_00: What they're saying to the people who quit social media,
27:19
SPEAKER_00: get off it,
27:20
SPEAKER_00: is they're saying it to the people who are probably,
27:22
SPEAKER_00: and they're broad-stroking again,
27:23
SPEAKER_00: people who are spending most of their day on social media,
27:26
doom-scrolling or posting nonsense because they want to have 10
27:29
posts a day because
27:30
SPEAKER_00: they want those likes and stuff.
27:32
That is – you should probably take a break or at least mentally
27:35
reprioritize that,
27:37
right?
27:37
SPEAKER_00: And that's the thing.
27:38
Or if they're trying to get – there's ways that you need to get
27:40
it under control.
27:42
It doesn't mean eliminate because I've – this is a big thing
27:45
for me years ago is
27:45
SPEAKER_00: realizing that technology,
27:47
only going to even nuclear energy is what it was pointed out to
27:49
me first time.
27:50
SPEAKER_00: Nuclear energy is not a good or a bad thing.
27:52
SPEAKER_00: Nuclear energy we use for a lot of good stuff.
27:54
SPEAKER_00: Like actually we're going to use more of it in the future.
27:56
SPEAKER_00: But it's also a bad thing when you drop bombs on people, right?
27:59
SPEAKER_00: So it's all based on the user, right?
28:03
SPEAKER_00: So the social media is the same way.
28:05
If you're going to take time to post encouraging Bible verses
28:08
here and there or whatever,
28:09
SPEAKER_00: that's,
28:10
SPEAKER_00: I would say,
28:10
SPEAKER_00: a good use of it.
28:11
And I do – I have friends on my social media who are
28:15
straight-up atheists or agnostics,
28:17
SPEAKER_00: but we get along,
28:18
SPEAKER_00: and I post these things.
28:19
SPEAKER_00: They allow them.
28:19
SPEAKER_00: They don't – some of them probably unfriend me, but –
28:22
SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
28:23
SPEAKER_00: I realize they're watching.
28:24
SPEAKER_00: I'm going to try to act like a Christian.
28:25
I'm not going to get on here and get in a mouth battle with all
28:27
these people who,
28:28
SPEAKER_00: first off,
28:28
SPEAKER_00: probably don't even believe what I believe.
28:29
SPEAKER_00: So it's going to be hard.
28:30
SPEAKER_00: If they don't believe in the Bible,
28:31
SPEAKER_00: it's going to be really – we're on a whole different subject here.
28:33
SPEAKER_00: And the other thing is like I don't want to add to negativity here.
28:36
SPEAKER_00: So I try to make sure all the things are positive,
28:37
SPEAKER_00: even on disagreements,
28:38
but really not to just jump into these – what I see most on
28:42
social media anymore is
28:42
SPEAKER_00: people – I don't take time to read them,
28:44
SPEAKER_00: but I see it like I scroll something that says 76 comments,
28:46
SPEAKER_00: and I go,
28:46
and it's like this person – these people had 25 to 30 posts
28:50
against each other nonstop,
28:51
SPEAKER_00: and it went on for –
28:52
SPEAKER_00: It's crazy.
28:53
SPEAKER_00: And it's like nobody changed their mind.
28:55
I can tell you I've never seen somebody at the end of one of
28:56
those threads say,
28:57
you know what?
28:58
SPEAKER_00: You're right.
28:59
SPEAKER_00: I have actually 0% so far.
29:01
SPEAKER_01: What is the data on people switching viewpoints in a Facebook comment?
29:07
SPEAKER_00: I don't think it's very high.
29:08
SPEAKER_00: It's not very good.
29:08
SPEAKER_00: I always tell people,
29:09
even if I would ever talk to somebody on social media or
29:12
whatever in a positive,
29:13
SPEAKER_00: try to do a godly way and a loving way or whatever,
29:15
I always say it's for the people watching because you're never
29:17
going to switch
29:19
SPEAKER_00: people's minds.
29:19
SPEAKER_00: But going back to, again,
29:21
Social media,
29:21
there is a healthy way to approach it if you're keeping in touch.
29:25
Like I keep in touch with,
29:25
like I said,
29:26
a lot of people who I wouldn't get to talk to about God.
29:28
SPEAKER_00: I still keep these social connections there.
29:30
SPEAKER_00: But if it's taking over your life and you're waking up in the morning,
29:33
SPEAKER_00: the first thing you got to do is get on social media before you pray,
29:36
SPEAKER_00: before you see your family and talk to your kids or whatever.
29:39
SPEAKER_00: It could be getting out of control.
29:41
SPEAKER_00: So there are good hindrances on it.
29:42
SPEAKER_00: But like you said,
29:43
SPEAKER_00: churches almost need to,
29:45
SPEAKER_00: like we know,
29:45
SPEAKER_00: you almost need to have an online presence if you want to have,
29:48
SPEAKER_00: like,
29:49
SPEAKER_00: you know,
29:49
SPEAKER_00: for today's,
29:50
SPEAKER_00: to reach more people,
29:51
I think it's a good thing to have a live stream for the people
29:53
who are sick or shut
29:54
SPEAKER_00: in or traveling.
29:54
SPEAKER_00: They can still stay connected.
29:56
SPEAKER_00: You obviously want them to get into the church.
29:57
SPEAKER_00: You don't want that substitute.
29:58
SPEAKER_00: Just like social media.
29:59
SPEAKER_00: You don't want social media to be your real social life.
30:01
SPEAKER_00: You want to actually have real physical connection.
30:03
SPEAKER_00: It's the same way with the church.
30:05
But you can't shut off social media completely for the same way
30:07
you can't shut off live stream.
30:09
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
30:09
SPEAKER_01: And I think that's a really good point.
30:12
SPEAKER_01: And there's a lot of ways that we as the church should,
30:16
SPEAKER_01: we could say,
30:17
SPEAKER_01: not only reevaluate,
30:21
but sort of reintegrate the way we think about social media in
30:24
our just normal conversations.
30:27
SPEAKER_01: And I think it's healthy to take a step back.
30:29
SPEAKER_01: Maybe, yeah, we should do a social media cleanse.
30:33
SPEAKER_01: I don't know if you're a church,
30:34
SPEAKER_01: if you're a person that practices Lent,
30:36
SPEAKER_01: maybe give that up for Lent.
30:37
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
30:38
SPEAKER_01: But just reevaluate the way that you're using it.
30:42
SPEAKER_01: Are you using it in a way to really share derogatory material?
30:48
SPEAKER_01: Are you using it to,
30:50
SPEAKER_01: like you said,
30:51
SPEAKER_01: to sort of boost your own ego,
30:53
SPEAKER_01: to get those dopamine hits of satisfaction,
30:56
SPEAKER_01: of achievement,
30:58
SPEAKER_01: of some sort of fulfillment?
30:59
SPEAKER_01: If you're looking for all those things...
31:01
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you're going to be soon very empty.
31:04
You're going to be a vapid person that has not a lot of
31:07
substance because social
31:10
SPEAKER_01: media in and of itself is this very empty construct of connection.
31:14
SPEAKER_01: And it can be used in good ways and it should be used in good ways.
31:19
SPEAKER_01: And so I think when we think about this,
31:22
so if we want to translate what Peter James is talking about in
31:25
terms of quitting
31:26
SPEAKER_01: comedy and translating it into a Christian perspective of social media,
31:31
I think it's this notion of quitting social media as somewhat
31:38
of an idol for our
31:40
SPEAKER_01: sense of fulfillment and purpose.
31:44
SPEAKER_01: I think social media,
31:45
SPEAKER_01: like anything,
31:46
SPEAKER_01: ought to be rendered as a tool,
31:49
as sort of this ancillary thing that we can use or not use at
31:55
any given moment.
31:57
I think self-discipline in terms of Christian engagement with
32:01
social media is not
32:02
SPEAKER_01: letting social media,
32:04
SPEAKER_01: not letting Facebook,
32:04
SPEAKER_01: not letting Instagram,
32:05
SPEAKER_01: any one of those things...
32:07
SPEAKER_01: sort of gain control over you.
32:11
SPEAKER_01: This again is a very Christian standpoint, a very biblical perspective.
32:15
SPEAKER_01: The only thing that should have overriding control,
32:18
SPEAKER_01: I think this comes out of Ephesians 5,
32:20
SPEAKER_01: would be the Holy Spirit,
32:21
SPEAKER_01: right?
32:22
SPEAKER_01: Like we are supposed to be, what does Paul say?
32:23
SPEAKER_01: We're supposed to be drunk on the Spirit, that's what he says.
32:26
SPEAKER_01: And I think that that's sort of the same notion.
32:29
Anything that sort of is inching its way,
32:32
wedging its way into our lives,
32:34
that is
32:36
SPEAKER_01: gaining more control than it should,
32:40
that's when the discernment needs to kick in and realize that
32:45
this thing needs to
32:45
SPEAKER_01: be excised.
32:46
SPEAKER_01: This thing needs to probably be cut out, at least for a period of time.
32:51
And I think the other thing that you were mentioning is using
32:55
social media as a
32:56
SPEAKER_01: tool for encouragement.
32:58
I think Philippians 4 is a great passage on that when Paul is
33:02
talking about these
33:03
SPEAKER_01: things are lovely,
33:04
SPEAKER_01: true,
33:04
SPEAKER_01: good reports,
33:05
SPEAKER_01: so on and so forth.
33:07
There's so much negativity on social media and I'm not breaking
33:12
news on that.
33:14
SPEAKER_01: And I think a Christian perspective is using it as a platform to share
33:19
SPEAKER_01: encouragement and then,
33:21
SPEAKER_01: like you said,
33:22
SPEAKER_01: not get sucked into debate,
33:23
SPEAKER_01: which is really easy to do.
33:25
SPEAKER_01: I found myself doing the same thing,
33:27
realizing I'm just going back and forth with this person for no
33:31
good reason.
33:32
SPEAKER_01: So let's just end the conversation.
33:34
SPEAKER_01: I don't have to have the last word.
33:35
Right,
33:36
and it's sometimes hard,
33:37
especially when the person's so far off base.
33:40
SPEAKER_00: We've all been there, and it's like, oh, whatever.
33:42
SPEAKER_00: I just got to kind of let it go.
33:43
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
33:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it is.
33:45
SPEAKER_00: It's one of those things,
33:46
SPEAKER_00: again,
33:46
SPEAKER_00: like social media,
33:47
SPEAKER_00: it can,
33:47
SPEAKER_00: because even when you're trying to do good there,
33:49
SPEAKER_00: it can turn negative.
33:50
SPEAKER_00: Like,
33:51
SPEAKER_00: you know,
33:51
SPEAKER_00: everybody started out,
33:52
SPEAKER_00: like,
33:52
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
33:52
SPEAKER_00: even when I was younger and stuff,
33:53
SPEAKER_00: you start name calling,
33:54
SPEAKER_00: like,
33:54
SPEAKER_00: well,
33:54
SPEAKER_00: I guess if you're not,
33:55
SPEAKER_00: if you're too uneducated or not smart enough to understand this,
33:58
SPEAKER_00: I guess I won't even explain this.
34:00
SPEAKER_00: And it's like, oh, it's going to go well.
34:02
SPEAKER_00: It's going to go great.
34:03
SPEAKER_00: But it's funny because – it's not funny, but it's ironic.
34:07
SPEAKER_00: It's like social media is really like the news if you think about it.
34:11
So there's another psychology thing that I learned is the news
34:14
– the funny line.
34:15
SPEAKER_00: I don't know if you ever heard this line.
34:16
It says the news is the only thing that starts out with a good
34:20
evening and then
34:20
SPEAKER_00: follows to tell you why it's not.
34:22
Yeah.
34:23
SPEAKER_00: That's true.
34:24
SPEAKER_00: That's such a good point.
34:25
SPEAKER_00: It's because news is you'll have,
34:27
SPEAKER_00: you know,
34:27
SPEAKER_00: the good stories are like,
34:29
SPEAKER_00: you know,
34:29
SPEAKER_00: Fluffy the dog is turning 10 this day and here's her biscuit.
34:32
SPEAKER_00: Like those are the good stories.
34:33
SPEAKER_00: And then it's homicide and fire and bank robbery in town.
34:37
SPEAKER_00: It's like, whoa.
34:38
SPEAKER_00: And it's like the reason it's like shifted like that,
34:40
SPEAKER_00: they said,
34:41
SPEAKER_00: is because to get viewership,
34:42
SPEAKER_00: they're entertainment,
34:43
SPEAKER_00: unfortunately.
34:44
SPEAKER_00: And the human mind is geared towards negativity.
34:46
that's right it's so crazy is is that do you think that we
34:49
could relate that to
34:51
where john says men love darkness rather than light absolutely
34:54
yeah and i think i
34:55
think it all comes into that sinful nature yep the darkness and
34:58
loving there is
34:59
something about it we don't we don't know why but it's like
35:01
entertainment to our
35:02
brain and the negativity and then it breeds negativity and it
35:05
breeds activity but a
35:06
negative at that's why like oh all any of us you listening or
35:09
me or pastor brad
35:10
here all i have to do is go on one of our social media accounts
35:12
scroll for maybe a
35:13
SPEAKER_00: second and
35:14
And see some either negative post slamming somebody who
35:18
disagrees with them without
35:20
SPEAKER_00: any target in general,
35:21
SPEAKER_00: just slamming a general population or in this thread being negative.
35:26
SPEAKER_00: You know, everyone saw you get the, oh, beautiful pic.
35:28
You know,
35:28
somebody posts a picture with their husband or the wife or
35:30
their kids.
35:30
SPEAKER_00: You'll get that.
35:31
SPEAKER_00: That's typical.
35:32
SPEAKER_00: But that's the fluffy, you know, turning 10 years old.
35:34
SPEAKER_00: Wow, she got a biscuit.
35:35
SPEAKER_00: Give her a biscuit.
35:36
SPEAKER_00: She's 10 years old now.
35:37
it's like these these little these almost funny silly positive
35:41
things and i know
35:42
family's not but like the negativity just breeds out there so
35:45
if you can go into
35:45
this because i know journalists say this all the time i'm gonna
35:47
go there and put
35:48
positive news stories like well in the news system you almost
35:51
can't so sorry to
35:52
tell you good luck start your own thing that'd be great oh
35:54
you'd love it i know i
35:55
think uh john krasinski or whatever tried that over covet
35:57
actually yeah what was
35:58
that like good news for good people i forget what it was good
36:01
news for something
36:03
But it did really well because all he did is do nothing but
36:05
positive news.
36:06
SPEAKER_00: And if you take that,
36:08
SPEAKER_00: you take that approach of doing positive news on your social media,
36:10
SPEAKER_00: which you are fully capable of,
36:11
SPEAKER_00: you are your news writer.
36:12
SPEAKER_00: That's really what social media is.
36:13
SPEAKER_00: Media is media.
36:15
SPEAKER_00: When you're your own social writer,
36:17
SPEAKER_00: make all of your stories positive like John Krasinski did over COVID.
36:21
SPEAKER_00: And if you can do that with a Christian mindset.
36:23
SPEAKER_00: And knowing,
36:24
SPEAKER_00: just like when somebody opposes you or says something ignorant or over,
36:27
SPEAKER_00: that you can just overlook it.
36:29
SPEAKER_00: You can overlook that and just love them out of it.
36:31
SPEAKER_00: Love covers a multitude of sins.
36:32
SPEAKER_00: Just love, ignore it.
36:34
SPEAKER_00: They're, you know, they're a debased mind.
36:35
SPEAKER_00: Who knows?
36:36
SPEAKER_00: But this is not the place to breed negativity.
36:38
SPEAKER_00: You can just do it positively.
36:39
SPEAKER_00: But I think another big thing.
36:41
SPEAKER_00: that I really noticed,
36:41
SPEAKER_00: again,
36:42
SPEAKER_00: I alluded to it earlier on social media,
36:43
but I think actually ties in with the comedian and the article
36:46
we're talking about
36:47
SPEAKER_00: is authenticity.
36:49
And I think what he's getting at is life becomes inauthentic if
36:53
you're nonstop
36:54
SPEAKER_00: looking for stuff.
36:55
SPEAKER_00: So like your example,
36:56
SPEAKER_00: I know it wasn't his real example,
36:57
SPEAKER_00: but at the playground,
36:58
like this playground trip is no longer an authentic daddy's
37:01
going to take you to
37:01
SPEAKER_00: the park trip.
37:02
SPEAKER_00: It's a, let's go to the park and see what I can come up with.
37:06
SPEAKER_00: And like, you know what I mean?
37:07
SPEAKER_00: But then you take it to like a social setting.
37:09
SPEAKER_00: It's even worse.
37:10
SPEAKER_00: And I think in the article,
37:10
SPEAKER_00: because I got to read it,
37:12
SPEAKER_00: he says something about he couldn't help but walk into crowded rooms.
37:16
SPEAKER_00: And the first thing people would say is, did you ever notice?
37:19
And followed by it,
37:20
everybody's just trying to joke,
37:21
joke,
37:21
joke,
37:22
joke,
37:22
joke.
37:23
SPEAKER_00: And he talks,
37:24
SPEAKER_00: I think,
37:24
about how dissatisfied he was and how he didn't even like going
37:27
to these things or whatever.
37:27
SPEAKER_00: And we've all been there.
37:28
SPEAKER_00: Actually,
37:29
it's really funny because we can all even look at social events
37:31
that we go to that
37:32
SPEAKER_00: we almost feel like we're drugging.
37:33
SPEAKER_00: We go there and we just cringe doing it.
37:35
SPEAKER_00: Why?
37:35
SPEAKER_00: Because even we're going to put on a front.
37:37
We're going to put on our public face and have to get in this
37:39
authentic mode with other people.
37:41
SPEAKER_00: And it's not really authentic.
37:42
Whereas if you want authentic community like the Bible actually
37:44
talks about in Acts
37:45
SPEAKER_00: chapter 2,
37:46
SPEAKER_00: it's authentic.
37:47
relationship it's open it's true it's sharing it's caring it's
37:50
actually truly
37:51
loving what the best it's not putting on these inauthentic
37:54
faces which is what a
37:55
lot of social gatherings in society are and it's exactly what
37:58
social media is
37:59
everybody with masks on and if we're careful that's what church
38:02
can become that's
38:04
ironically it has been for i think years and years and that's
38:06
the problem where
38:08
because it's almost unless you're you know unless you're really
38:11
aware of it and
38:12
told over and over and kind of get the idea is it still is this
38:15
concept of people
38:16
no matter how often we can say it is that people think that you
38:19
have to behave and
38:20
be on your best behavior be quiet as a church mouse you know i
38:23
mean it's like these
38:23
things where is it like it's almost like you know the parents
38:26
say to the kids hey
38:26
SPEAKER_00: you better behave in here today like hey pretend to be good right
38:30
SPEAKER_00: It's basically what you're saying.
38:31
SPEAKER_00: Pretend not to be yourself.
38:33
SPEAKER_00: And I know,
38:33
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
38:33
SPEAKER_00: we do have to behave and there is obviously like,
38:35
SPEAKER_00: you know,
38:35
SPEAKER_00: controlling or whatever.
38:36
But I'm talking about the people have to come and pretend what
38:38
they didn't do on the weekend.
38:39
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
38:40
And they don't want to tell you about it and they want to
38:41
pretend it never happened.
38:42
And then everybody else is pretending it didn't happen and
38:44
their things didn't happen.
38:46
SPEAKER_00: And that's why people are like, I just don't feel...
38:48
SPEAKER_00: Well, it's because you're not connecting with God.
38:49
SPEAKER_00: You're connecting with his false life.
38:51
SPEAKER_00: You're hiding your life, and you're like the sad comedian.
38:54
SPEAKER_00: That's why so many Christians have problems.
38:56
SPEAKER_00: It's because you're living an alternate life.
38:57
SPEAKER_00: You're sad.
38:58
SPEAKER_00: You're hiding it.
38:58
SPEAKER_00: You're trying to make light out of it.
39:00
SPEAKER_00: You're trying to pretend that it's good,
39:01
SPEAKER_00: and the reality is very different than what's happening in the open eye.
39:06
yeah that's so true and it reminds me of that i think it's a
39:10
chris rock line where
39:11
he's like you know we don't meet a person when you meet them
39:14
for the first time you
39:15
meet their representative and i think that's what kind of
39:18
social media is here's my
39:20
representative this is the type of person that i am when maybe
39:23
that's not even true
39:24
right number one but also it's this very glossy sort of
39:30
everything has a sheen to
39:31
SPEAKER_01: it or a filter or
39:32
filter right right literally that's if that becomes your
39:36
driving daily reality then
39:40
no wonder when you come to church there's this like fake facade
39:42
put up like
39:43
everything's okay it's like i i think you know that anthem from
39:47
the lego movie
39:47
everything is awesome has become sort of the driving mantra of
39:53
of churches to its
39:54
SPEAKER_01: detriment by the way
39:56
SPEAKER_01: Maybe not everything is awesome all the time.
39:59
SPEAKER_01: And only is that like,
40:01
SPEAKER_01: OK,
40:02
but that's sort of part of what the church is supposed to speak
40:05
into the not
40:07
SPEAKER_01: awesome moments.
40:09
SPEAKER_01: And I think precisely in the times in which,
40:13
SPEAKER_01: you know,
40:13
SPEAKER_01: we would rather put our mask up,
40:15
SPEAKER_01: but we can't.
40:16
The church is supposed to be there to be like,
40:20
yeah,
40:20
this is where the grace of God finds you.
40:22
SPEAKER_01: In those moments where it's not okay.
40:25
In those times of life when things aren't funny and you should
40:29
probably think
40:29
deeper about this crisis or whatever you might be enduring or
40:34
going through.
40:35
SPEAKER_01: So that idea of putting up masks,
40:38
putting up some sort of representative to try and make everyone
40:43
think that
40:43
SPEAKER_01: everything's okay,
40:44
SPEAKER_01: that in and of itself is kind of driving a wedge between people.
40:52
people who should be gathering and discipling one another right
40:55
am i thinking about
40:55
that right no absolutely and i think that's what it is again
40:58
it's just that
40:58
authenticity yeah um we are kind of what you were saying there
41:01
is we are our own pr
41:02
directors we're our own pr spokespeople yeah when we get on
41:05
social media because
41:06
SPEAKER_00: it's like you know even when you watch you know it doesn't matter the
41:08
administration the white house things those presses there's
41:11
always like these
41:12
answers that like even even i don't let's let's get away from
41:14
politics let's talk
41:15
about sports like how's the game good really great the o-line
41:18
did a great job
41:19
SPEAKER_00: blocking uh couldn't have done better we put a lot of effort in all
41:21
SPEAKER_00: All right,
41:22
and you're never going to get like these really – every once in
41:24
a while you get a
41:25
SPEAKER_00: sincere answer,
41:25
SPEAKER_00: and it's like,
41:25
SPEAKER_00: wow,
41:26
SPEAKER_00: the guy was being real.
41:27
But there's always the coaches are always going to give this
41:28
polished thing.
41:29
SPEAKER_00: We did this, right?
41:30
SPEAKER_00: Didn't do that, right?
41:31
SPEAKER_00: The offense has got to move the ball.
41:33
SPEAKER_00: Hey, what's going on between you and them?
41:35
SPEAKER_00: We saw this on the sideline.
41:36
SPEAKER_00: Oh, you know, they're teammates.
41:37
SPEAKER_00: It gets heated in the moment, yada, yada, yada.
41:38
SPEAKER_00: PR answer.
41:39
SPEAKER_00: When there's really under things going on there.
41:41
SPEAKER_00: And it ties into – I think the one big thing I've realized –
41:45
is if you're just authentic with people and you're just real
41:48
and just unabashedly
41:49
real about who you are and accepting your flaws and
41:52
understanding that this isn't
41:53
SPEAKER_00: always good,
41:55
SPEAKER_00: people actually are drawn to that and appreciate it.
41:58
SPEAKER_00: I think so.
41:58
And what's really interesting is the job I had before I
42:00
actually got back into
42:01
SPEAKER_00: ministry was,
42:02
SPEAKER_00: again,
42:02
SPEAKER_00: I worked for a financial literacy group.
42:04
SPEAKER_00: And we'd go around,
42:05
and what was really interesting is that wasn't even a Christian organization.
42:07
SPEAKER_00: Now, there's Christian people that worked in it.
42:09
But the one woman in our organization said she had found this
42:12
thing in the banking
42:13
SPEAKER_00: world a long time ago.
42:13
SPEAKER_00: She goes, you know what, Eric?
42:15
SPEAKER_00: Nobody tells the truth anymore.
42:18
SPEAKER_00: Nobody tells you.
42:18
SPEAKER_00: She goes, all you have to do is just tell the truth.
42:20
SPEAKER_00: So we had a mantra.
42:21
SPEAKER_00: Just tell the truth.
42:23
SPEAKER_00: Wow.
42:23
When you go into meetings,
42:24
when you go and you had conversations,
42:25
don't hide it.
42:26
SPEAKER_00: Don't pretend.
42:27
SPEAKER_00: Don't dance it around.
42:28
SPEAKER_00: Don't polish it.
42:29
SPEAKER_00: Just tell the truth.
42:30
SPEAKER_00: I love that.
42:31
SPEAKER_00: It was so true.
42:31
SPEAKER_00: She said, people don't know what to do with it when you do it.
42:34
so out in public when you just tell the truth and you don't
42:36
like hey how's it going
42:36
like well you know i haven't had the best day and you know my
42:39
dog's actually
42:40
probably gonna be put down and stuff but you know god's gonna
42:42
get me through it
42:42
wouldn't that startle you yeah they're like uh i was just
42:45
hoping like good thanks
42:46
and you i was hoping for a three-word transaction yeah i don't
42:50
know what to do and
42:51
it's funny she was right she's like people don't know what to
42:52
do because we
42:53
actually go into autopilot it's just it's just fake like hey
42:56
are you good how are
42:56
SPEAKER_00: you all right have a good day yep you too you
42:59
robot robot robot and it's like there's no thought it's why
43:02
when you go to the
43:02
movies they say hey enjoy your movie and say you too because
43:06
because it's just
43:08
you're expecting to say have a good day and they said have a
43:10
movie and it threw you
43:11
off but your brain went into autopilot oh I've done that before
43:13
yeah we've all done
43:14
SPEAKER_00: some autopilot we're like um you think about all I sound like an idiot
43:17
SPEAKER_00: But it's this inauthentic PR move, just keep things polished.
43:21
SPEAKER_00: And I think it's a real truth and the biblical truth.
43:24
SPEAKER_00: It's like, don't hide anything, just bring it to light.
43:27
SPEAKER_00: And that actually helps the healing process.
43:28
And I learned that even to heal something,
43:31
you actually have to talk about it.
43:33
SPEAKER_00: You have to bring it up.
43:34
You can't hide it and hide it in a corner and put a rug over
43:37
whatever to say,
43:38
SPEAKER_00: you know,
43:38
SPEAKER_00: I'll be better.
43:39
You can say that,
43:40
but that doesn't go away,
43:41
and that feeling stays and usually grows.
43:42
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't usually stay as the size.
43:44
SPEAKER_00: It's like a cancer, and it grows and grows and grows.
43:46
SPEAKER_00: It's very much like a spiritual cancer.
43:49
SPEAKER_00: If you don't deal with it,
43:49
SPEAKER_00: it will just take over your life,
43:52
SPEAKER_00: and a lot of people,
43:53
SPEAKER_00: I think,
43:53
SPEAKER_00: who are –
43:54
SPEAKER_00: Christians and might be living in depression.
43:55
SPEAKER_00: It's a real thing.
43:56
SPEAKER_00: There's our mental health things.
43:57
SPEAKER_00: There's chemical things that can go into it too.
43:58
SPEAKER_00: But I think a lot of it is inauthenticity,
44:01
SPEAKER_00: moving too fast,
44:02
SPEAKER_00: wrong priorities,
44:03
SPEAKER_00: not praying,
44:04
SPEAKER_00: not reading the Bible,
44:04
SPEAKER_00: and not being authentic the way God wants us to.
44:07
SPEAKER_00: Because if we were all authentic with each other as believers—
44:10
We wouldn't feel so bad about ourselves because I think a lot
44:12
of people are hiding things,
44:13
SPEAKER_00: and they feel bad about hiding these things.
44:15
SPEAKER_00: They don't realize Joe and Timmy and Sally,
44:17
SPEAKER_00: they're all hiding things,
44:18
SPEAKER_00: and we just got to be authentic about our hurts.
44:20
SPEAKER_00: What's really bothering you?
44:21
SPEAKER_00: How can I help you?
44:21
Because a lot of times I think we'd be able to help each other
44:24
out in that
44:24
community that you see in Acts Chapter 2 if we didn't hide the
44:27
social media.
44:27
I'm going to be my own PR director while I'm here and go home
44:30
and be sad for real
44:31
SPEAKER_00: when I'm not around you guys.
44:33
SPEAKER_01: I think, man, I think you really hit the nail on the head.
44:35
And I think thinking critically and theologically about this
44:41
should drive us to the
44:42
SPEAKER_01: point where seeing social media as an ancillary thing in our lives,
44:48
SPEAKER_01: not the main point,
44:49
SPEAKER_01: right?
44:50
SPEAKER_01: And I think also this thought popped in my head while you were,
44:54
SPEAKER_01: while you were talking is just like,
44:55
isn't it ironic that one of the most famous Bible apps has a
44:59
social media feature?
45:02
SPEAKER_01: Like the idea, like, and I get it.
45:04
And I think it's great because you can start these like groups
45:07
where you're reading
45:08
SPEAKER_01: similar things.
45:09
SPEAKER_01: But then,
45:10
SPEAKER_01: on the other hand,
45:12
SPEAKER_01: it can get a little performative,
45:16
SPEAKER_01: only because if you open up,
45:18
SPEAKER_01: and everyone knows probably which Bible app I'm talking about,
45:20
SPEAKER_01: but when you open it up and you actually read,
45:23
SPEAKER_01: you can get a streak going.
45:25
SPEAKER_01: And so now it's like, hey, I'm on day 138 of opening my Bible app.
45:30
SPEAKER_01: And now it becomes performative.
45:33
SPEAKER_01: And that is that disingenuous.
45:35
SPEAKER_01: That comes back to that point of authenticity.
45:37
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
45:39
SPEAKER_01: Are we opening it up to keep our streak alive?
45:42
SPEAKER_01: Or are we going to it to commune with the living God?
45:47
SPEAKER_01: What are we using these things for?
45:49
SPEAKER_01: Why are we resorting to them?
45:56
SPEAKER_01: Are we using them for some very flimsy, arbitrary sense of fulfillment?
46:04
SPEAKER_01: Because I think,
46:06
SPEAKER_01: again,
46:07
SPEAKER_01: we can't just,
46:07
SPEAKER_01: quote-unquote,
46:08
SPEAKER_01: throw the baby out with the bathwater,
46:09
SPEAKER_01: which I don't know why that saying exists,
46:11
SPEAKER_01: but we can't just toss everything away with social media.
46:15
SPEAKER_01: But neither should we let it control us.
46:19
SPEAKER_01: Neither should we let it have mastery over us.
46:23
SPEAKER_01: And I think coming back to the sense of how does the gospel inform this,
46:29
I think there is this inherent notion of humility that belief
46:35
and faith in the
46:35
SPEAKER_01: gospel of Jesus Christ imbues us with,
46:38
SPEAKER_01: which should also then inform what we're posting,
46:42
SPEAKER_01: what we're sharing,
46:43
SPEAKER_01: how we're communicating that.
46:46
SPEAKER_01: It's been on my mind because I've been studying it a little bit,
46:49
SPEAKER_01: but Philippians 2 where Paul says,
46:51
SPEAKER_01: let this mind be in you,
46:53
SPEAKER_01: which was also in Christ Jesus.
46:54
SPEAKER_01: And he talks about the humility of the one true God,
46:58
SPEAKER_01: the Son of God,
47:00
SPEAKER_01: taking on a human body and then being obedient to the point of death.
47:05
SPEAKER_01: That...
47:06
epitome of humility he says that's what should also be in you
47:10
or as peter says in
47:12
first peter five he says clothe yourself with humility which is
47:17
just a fantastic
47:18
image um and i think that's the the driving we could say
47:24
impetus of christian
47:26
SPEAKER_01: engagement with social media is
47:28
a humble we could say a humble engagement a humble and gracious
47:34
interaction with
47:36
people who would probably rather you know all these keyboard
47:39
warriors right yeah
47:41
you can you can essentially boil it down to if you really want
47:43
to simplify it um
47:45
are you going to use you know social media from a standpoint of
47:48
pride or humility
47:49
yeah basically that's what it is and that's honestly where the
47:51
all root of all sin
47:52
comes from is pride so when you boil it down to that and just
47:54
look at what is this
47:55
doing why are you even acting inauthentic was it to make
47:57
yourself look better
47:58
probably and that's probably what it is it's some kind of boost
48:01
again for your ego
48:02
or yourself or to shield judgment and things like that maybe
48:05
coping mechanisms or
48:06
SPEAKER_00: things or whatever but
48:07
SPEAKER_00: That's really what it ends up coming down to,
48:09
SPEAKER_00: I think,
48:10
SPEAKER_00: again,
48:10
SPEAKER_00: is just being – if you just be authentic,
48:13
SPEAKER_00: be full of humility.
48:14
It doesn't mean you can't always – you can engage with people
48:16
in certain ways.
48:17
SPEAKER_00: You don't always have to say, woe is me.
48:18
SPEAKER_00: I'm the worst ever or ever.
48:19
SPEAKER_00: But be authentic about it when it comes up.
48:21
SPEAKER_00: You don't have to force these things.
48:23
And going back to – I love what you said about the Bible app
48:26
because I've even been in there.
48:27
SPEAKER_00: It's like, oh, I'm at 103.
48:27
SPEAKER_00: I've got to make sure because it would be stupid if I missed this.
48:31
SPEAKER_00: It's like you can read your Bible in your book when you get the chance.
48:33
SPEAKER_00: You don't have to do it on the app.
48:34
SPEAKER_00: And it's like – it's interesting because you can say, well –
48:37
SPEAKER_00: They're doing it for a good reason,
48:39
SPEAKER_00: but – because if you get people in the reading habit,
48:42
SPEAKER_00: they'll read their Bible.
48:43
SPEAKER_00: That's true.
48:44
But is it a game – are people reading because it's a game and
48:47
they want to get
48:47
SPEAKER_00: their score higher because that's what seems to be the case?
48:49
SPEAKER_00: Or do they really care about the Bible?
48:51
SPEAKER_00: We have to ask, like, is manipulation – it's like lies and white lies.
48:55
SPEAKER_00: Well, they're all lies.
48:56
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
48:56
SPEAKER_00: same thing with manipulation like manipulation good or bad you can try to
49:00
manipulate people into good things but if you use the tool
49:03
manipulation that's kind
49:04
of what it stands on yeah so I'm sure there's people that it
49:08
got in the streak I'm
49:09
not doubting that if you got into the bible because it got in
49:11
the bible app and you
49:12
got in the streak that is awesome and it worked but I'm saying
49:14
there are people
49:15
SPEAKER_00: that might just be reading their bible to get their stat
49:17
tire because that's because they play video games all day and
49:19
that's how they think
49:19
about always just getting stats and achievements and if it's
49:22
for that it's going to
49:23
fall apart when they have a bad day or they lose the app or
49:25
they whatever and it
49:26
really wasn't they weren't really reading the bible for
49:28
themselves they were doing
49:29
it to get another star yeah yeah and at that point what are we
49:33
even doing it for um
49:35
i think if we wanted to summarize this i think you've you've
49:38
done a good really
49:39
good job but like i think what you said is really on the on
49:42
point which is
49:43
SPEAKER_01: Are you using it for pride?
49:44
SPEAKER_01: Are you using it for humility?
49:46
SPEAKER_01: It kind of comes back again to Luke chapter 18.
49:50
SPEAKER_01: Are you the Pharisee who's saying, look at all the things that I've done?
49:54
Or are you the publican who is saying,
49:57
I am the worst of sinners and I just need grace?
50:00
SPEAKER_01: And again,
50:01
that sense of authenticity that I think using social media as
50:07
sort of a channel to
50:10
SPEAKER_01: connect with people,
50:11
SPEAKER_01: not as the end of it,
50:12
SPEAKER_01: but we could say as the starting point of connection.
50:15
SPEAKER_01: Because like you were kind of saying,
50:18
if you're using social media as the end all for your
50:21
connectivity with people,
50:23
SPEAKER_01: it's going to be very loose and very flimsy.
50:27
SPEAKER_01: But we can use it to engage with people and then,
50:30
SPEAKER_01: you know,
50:30
SPEAKER_01: prayerfully maybe connect with them further face to face.
50:34
SPEAKER_01: And that's where real discipleship happens.
50:37
SPEAKER_01: Before we end,
50:38
SPEAKER_01: I want you to kind of share,
50:39
SPEAKER_01: if you can,
50:40
some like really pragmatic or practical ways that you've either
50:44
changed or like
50:45
things that you've been able to implement in your own life that
50:49
have helped you
50:50
SPEAKER_01: engage with social media.
50:51
SPEAKER_01: And while you're thinking about that, I wanted to give a shout out to
50:54
SPEAKER_01: One of my friends who I met, by the way, on social media via Substack.
50:59
SPEAKER_01: His name is Griffin Gooch.
51:01
SPEAKER_01: He's a great writer.
51:03
But you were talking about John Krasinski's good news little
51:07
project that he did during COVID.
51:09
SPEAKER_01: And thinking about, you know, all we hear is bad news.
51:12
SPEAKER_01: What about a way to hear good news?
51:14
SPEAKER_01: So Griffin Gooch has a subset called The Remarkable Ordinary,
51:18
SPEAKER_01: in which he kind of subtitles it this.
51:21
SPEAKER_01: We publish ordinary stories of Christian kindness,
51:23
SPEAKER_01: hospitality,
51:24
SPEAKER_01: and integrity,
51:25
SPEAKER_01: which is sort of like this newsletter that I think comes out on Fridays.
51:31
SPEAKER_01: But anyways,
51:32
SPEAKER_01: it shares encouraging,
51:34
uplifting stories that are happening within different realms of
51:38
Christianity and
51:38
SPEAKER_01: Christian ministry.
51:40
SPEAKER_01: And so if you want to do that, I'm going to link it in the show notes.
51:43
But if you're looking for an outlet that shares uplifting,
51:47
encouraging stories,
51:48
check that out.
51:49
SPEAKER_01: Because again, we are sometimes inundated with bad news.
51:53
SPEAKER_01: Sometimes it's good to have stories.
51:55
sort of an injection of good news um but uh in light of all
51:59
that what's some ways
52:00
that you've practically changed your engagement with social
52:05
media that might be
52:06
helpful to others sure yeah um so one of the big things uh like
52:10
i kind of hinted at
52:11
avoid those deep debates uh yeah definitely build an anger if
52:15
you want to debate
52:15
SPEAKER_00: like
52:16
If you see something egregious,
52:17
I don't debate near as much as I used to.
52:19
SPEAKER_00: And if I debate, it's not even a debate.
52:20
SPEAKER_00: It's what I call a calm conversation.
52:23
I now go with the mindset,
52:24
I'm probably not going to change this person's point of view.
52:26
SPEAKER_00: I'm going to do this from the grace of the stance of Jesus,
52:29
SPEAKER_00: how he would do it in grace and humility.
52:31
SPEAKER_00: Don't use fighting words.
52:32
Don't use name calling and present biblical facts and then
52:37
leave your peace.
52:38
Don't waste your time and days and days when the Lord might
52:40
have other things for you to do.
52:42
SPEAKER_00: Other things,
52:43
SPEAKER_00: if you have things in your life that speak to you during the day,
52:45
SPEAKER_00: it doesn't have to be something great that happens,
52:48
SPEAKER_00: something bad that happened,
52:49
SPEAKER_00: and just tying it to Scripture.
52:51
You'll be surprised how many people get motivated or encouraged
52:53
that had reached
52:54
out to me just if I post a verse and just a little blurb or
52:56
maybe even a little—
52:58
SPEAKER_00: So try to keep things positive.
52:59
SPEAKER_00: Keep the negative posts away.
53:01
SPEAKER_00: If you have to type it out, type it out and delete it.
53:03
SPEAKER_00: Or don't post it, but type it out, erase it.
53:05
SPEAKER_00: But really just keep it positive.
53:06
SPEAKER_00: Also, limit the time.
53:08
If you find yourself getting caught up or you're angry,
53:10
because that can still happen.
53:11
You see posts that—I'll still see posts that,
53:13
you know,
53:13
it gets to you or whatever.
53:15
SPEAKER_00: If you try to get under your skin, you just ignore it.
53:17
Pray to the Lord to remove that and just kind of remove
53:19
yourself from social media
53:20
SPEAKER_00: when you need to,
53:21
SPEAKER_00: especially around political season.
53:23
SPEAKER_00: And my final tidbit, try to avoid the political wars at all costs.
53:26
SPEAKER_00: It does not help Christianity one bit.
53:28
SPEAKER_01: No, that's very true.
53:31
SPEAKER_01: Really good.
53:31
I think one of the ways that I've changed the way I interact is
53:37
trying to be very
53:39
SPEAKER_01: like separate my times when I'm opening the app as much as possible.
53:44
I don't let notifications come from all those different social
53:47
media apps.
53:48
SPEAKER_01: So it's like I'm not getting the constant buzzes.
53:51
um which i've had to that's brought up its own self-discipline
53:55
because if you don't
53:56
have that you're sometimes you're more tempted to open it more
53:58
often um but i've
54:00
tried to really separate the time so i'm not like opening up
54:04
every hour um so try
54:06
and separate the times of opening it and then um you can go and
54:10
engage and do what
54:11
SPEAKER_01: you need to do or whatever but then
54:13
I think that allows for it to not become this controlling thing,
54:17
this driving thing.
54:18
SPEAKER_01: And again,
54:19
SPEAKER_01: we can use,
54:20
SPEAKER_01: the church should,
54:22
and those within the church should be able to use social media
54:26
in a positive and an encouraging,
54:27
SPEAKER_01: and we could even say it in an evangelistic sort of way.
54:31
SPEAKER_01: And that's part of our present moment.
54:33
SPEAKER_01: Let's kind of use it accordingly.
54:36
So thanks so much for listening to this episode of the ministry
54:38
minded podcast.
54:39
SPEAKER_01: I hope you've been blessed by this one.
54:41
SPEAKER_01: Please subscribe.
54:42
SPEAKER_01: We're over on Apple and Spotify, wherever you get your podcasts.
54:46
SPEAKER_01: Appreciate all your encouragement and support.
54:48
SPEAKER_01: Thanks for listening and I'll see you on the next episode.
54:52
SPEAKER_01: Blessings.