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Inside Out: A Commentary · Why We Do What We Do

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: You're listening to Why we do what we do? Welcome
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: to Why we do what we do. I am your
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: host whose mind is being controlled by tiny homunculi, Abraham,
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: and I'm your.
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  Speaker 2: Host who's all of those whom unculi are exactly the
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  Speaker 2: same with long hair and a big beard and a
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  Speaker 2: flaming headtop.
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: And your name is Oh, my name is Shane.
• 0:34
  Speaker 3: I'm Shane.
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  Speaker 1: We are a psychology podcast. We talk about the things
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: that humans and non human animals do, and sometimes we
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  Speaker 1: talk about fictional things, which is going to be our
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: topic to jore. And so if you're joining us for
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: the first time, welcome. We hope that you enjoy what
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: you hear in this podcast today. There are several ways
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  Speaker 1: you can support us financially or otherwise. You can join
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  Speaker 1: us on patre on, leave us a rating and review,
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: like subscribe, tell a friend. I'll talk about those more
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: at the end of this discussion. But we're doing something
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: kind of new, something different from what we have done
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: in the past in today's discussion, which is that we're
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: going to be talking about film and then we're going
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: to be talking about the sequel to that film. Because
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  Speaker 1: these are films that decided to concern themselves with behavior
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  Speaker 1: and human behavior, and that is sort of where we
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  Speaker 1: uh would cut our teeth, you know what I mean?
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  Speaker 1: Like those that's our yes, jam.
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  Speaker 3: That's like our thing. Yeah, that's like the thing that
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  Speaker 3: we're known for here.
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  Speaker 1: So it's the whole thing. If you are listening to
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: this on the day that it publishes, then I'd like
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: to wish you a happy Inconvenience yourself day.
• 1:41
  Speaker 3: Sure. It's also let's all eat right day.
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  Speaker 1: I'm trying to think of different ways to pun that
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  Speaker 1: and I came up with too many, So moving on.
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  Speaker 1: It is National Chocolate covered.
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  Speaker 2: Nuts Day, sure, yes it is. It is National Pistol
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  Speaker 2: Patent Day.
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  Speaker 1: Oh my, It is pink shirt Day.
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  Speaker 3: And it's also quiet Day.
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  Speaker 1: It is a rubber ducky day. Cute.
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  Speaker 3: It's the American Council on Education.
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: And Bird Health Awareness Week. It's fun.
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  Speaker 3: It is National Chip Week in the UK.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, happy chip Week over there. I think that means yeah,
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: I think we call them fries here.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, we call them freedom fries. Thank you.
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: Maybe they mean computer chips or ice chips or chippindale's.
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  Speaker 1: It is National Eating Disorders Awareness Week.
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  Speaker 2: It is and it's also National Invasive Species Awareness Week.
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  Speaker 1: Good to know, but those are just holidays, that's what
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  Speaker 1: we have to say about those. We actually are going
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  Speaker 1: to be talking about this movie. We'll get more into
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  Speaker 1: that in just a moment. And why, and I are
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: sort of already mentioned the why, but we'll explain as
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  Speaker 1: we go. I think I said, if you're new to
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: the show, then welcome, I hope you enjoy. And then
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: if you're a returning person, welcome back.
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  Speaker 3: I don't know.
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  Speaker 1: Those are the things I usually say. Hopefully I said them,
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  Speaker 1: and if not, then now I have Because this releases
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: in February, we do want to take a moment to
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  Speaker 1: acknowledge Black history a month by profiling a important person
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: that is the figure that stands out for this month.
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  Speaker 2: Yes, so for today's episode, we are talking about Shirley Chisholm.
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  Speaker 2: Chisholm Chisholm. She is a former US congresswoman and the
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  Speaker 2: first black woman to be elected to Congress in nineteen
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  Speaker 2: sixty eight.
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  Speaker 3: Huge deal.
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  Speaker 2: Her district was focused in Brooklyn and she served seven terms,
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  Speaker 2: so she was around for quite some time. She was
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  Speaker 2: also the first black candidate for a major party nomination
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  Speaker 2: for She was nominated by the Democratic Party for presidential nomination,
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  Speaker 2: so she was the first black candidate for any major
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  Speaker 2: party nomination, which is super super powerful. She's well known
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  Speaker 2: for her work and being a strong advocate against economic, social,
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  Speaker 2: and political injustices, especially at the time.
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  Speaker 3: So she was somebody who was very vocal and very
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  Speaker 3: forward in the way that she was.
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  Speaker 2: Approaching some of the concerns that were going on at
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  Speaker 2: the time and just really kind of like a torchbearer
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  Speaker 2: type of person in this in this space.
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  Speaker 3: So we want to make sure she celebrated.
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  Speaker 1: Wow, you did a phenomenal job with these profiles. I
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  Speaker 1: love that you picked like vary in time periods for
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  Speaker 1: them and totally different like professions and everything like this.
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  Speaker 1: This is really good.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you. I appreciate that. I was really I
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  Speaker 3: was really happy to do that.
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  Speaker 2: And you know, it's it's uh, I think it's so
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  Speaker 2: it's so valuable to like, when you know, we have
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  Speaker 2: something like Black History Month to take time to like
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  Speaker 2: really dive into like more specific histories than just going okay,
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  Speaker 2: well it's you know, here's Martin Luther King, and here's
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  Speaker 2: you know, Malcolm Ax, and here's these folks who were speakers,
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  Speaker 2: but there's so many other folks that were doing incredible, incredible,
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  Speaker 2: powerful work that people don't talk about enough.
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  Speaker 3: So I was I was happy to do that.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, and including outside of directly and direct involvement in
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  Speaker 1: things like those social activism things. And not to say
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  Speaker 1: that there's anything wrong with that, like we appreciate those,
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  Speaker 1: but the fact that, like we've had someone on here
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  Speaker 1: who is a doctor, and someone who is a politician,
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  Speaker 1: and someone who was a civil rights advocate, and like
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  Speaker 1: all of these are they're just people doing cool things,
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  Speaker 1: and it's worth acknowledging who they were and what they
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  Speaker 1: country did.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, and what they were doing too, like even just.
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  Speaker 2: Their existence was resistance, right, so like resistance to social injustice.
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  Speaker 2: So like even if they weren't actively doing something towards
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  Speaker 2: social justice, they were doing something and really paved the
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  Speaker 2: way for a lot of folks. I always kind of say,
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  Speaker 2: it's like it's like when there's a news research line,
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  Speaker 2: you know a lot of so much of it is
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  Speaker 2: not that you're adding a brick to the wall. You're
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  Speaker 2: taking a machete to the area to like clear out
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  Speaker 2: the excess foliage to be able to even start building
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  Speaker 2: and so of these folks were doing that. They were
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  Speaker 2: taking a machete to the brush in the jungle to
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  Speaker 2: really blaze that trail.
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  Speaker 1: You know, it's a fun metaphor. Yeah, I thought so.
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  Speaker 1: Speaking of fun metaphors, was that kind of a way
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  Speaker 1: to segue to our topic today.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: So we have actually referenced on this show the movies
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: Inside Out and Inside Out to before and previous conversations,
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  Speaker 1: but we never really considered taking this on or talking
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  Speaker 1: about it from a psychological and specifically behavior analytic personective
• 6:01
  Speaker 1: and so just sort of thinking about and even though
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: these have been out for several years now, thinking about
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  Speaker 1: the fact that these these try to say something about
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  Speaker 1: human behavior, and I think wanting to look at that
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  Speaker 1: and have a commentary about that through sort of our
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  Speaker 1: professional lens, and you know, just just have something to say.
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  Speaker 1: And I also think it's like it's fun to talk
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  Speaker 1: about movies, you know, I enjoy doing that. I think
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: people a lot of times like hearing about movies, particularly
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  Speaker 1: movies that they like or at least are familiar with.
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  Speaker 1: That's sort of what we're up to today is we
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  Speaker 1: wanted to break down inside Out for this episode and
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  Speaker 1: then for the next one. We'll talk about Inside Out too,
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  Speaker 1: the sequel.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, and we're gonna talk about the way
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  Speaker 2: that the film depicts psychology and what they got wrong
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  Speaker 2: and what they got right, and you know, it's I
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  Speaker 2: don't think it'll take away from the magic of the movie.
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  Speaker 2: I think the movie is still fun. Yeah, and we're
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  Speaker 2: not gonna we're certainly not gonna go in and theyre
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  Speaker 2: be like, well that's just at accurate.
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  Speaker 3: Da da da dada.
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  Speaker 2: Like you know, when we get into the abstract thought space,
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  Speaker 2: it's like, Okay, well they actually went abstract art versus
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: abstract thought, and that's a different thing.
• 6:58
  Speaker 3: So but we we're not going to talk about that.
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  Speaker 2: There are going to be spoilers if you haven't seen
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  Speaker 2: the movie, and we're gonna describe kind of important plot
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: points and characters and beginning events from the beginning to
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  Speaker 2: the end. But mostly we're just going to talk about
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  Speaker 2: this movie and how the psychology of it is like
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  Speaker 2: really fascinating, and how it will always make you cry.
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  Speaker 1: It certainly will try, yeah, and usually succeeds. Yeah, it is.
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  Speaker 1: I want to be clear, because like we are going
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  Speaker 1: to criticize aspects of this movie, we are going to
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  Speaker 1: point to certain things and say, like, this doesn't really
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  Speaker 1: make a lot of sense conceptually, but I actually want
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: to start by pointing out, like I love this. I
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  Speaker 1: love these movies. I really do. Yeah, they're incredible, even
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  Speaker 1: if I think like the psychology is not spot on,
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  Speaker 1: like I don't think that it needed to be, and
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  Speaker 1: I am perfectly happy to enjoy these movies for what
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  Speaker 1: they are. I think they're very well done. I've watched
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  Speaker 1: them multiple times. It was fun to rewatch them for this, like,
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  Speaker 1: I really enjoy these And the other thing too that
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  Speaker 1: we'll get to this towards the end, is that even
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  Speaker 1: if they're not technically recise, the metaphor in the way
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  Speaker 1: that they depict things is so wonderful and so beautifully
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  Speaker 1: done that there's a lot to latch on too, even
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  Speaker 1: if you don't necessarily subscribe to some of the underlying
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  Speaker 1: philosophy that guided some of the points and parts of
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  Speaker 1: the way that things are depicted in the film.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah. Absolutely, I think I think you're absolutely right.
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  Speaker 1: All right. So the way that we're going to try
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: to approach this is we're going to give some just
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: a breakdown of things to know about the movie. Then
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  Speaker 1: we'll talk, we'll do a plot summary of the movie,
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: then we'll sort of dig into our criticisms and then
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  Speaker 1: really the metaphors that we think work really well and
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: how to interpret this metaphorically in a way that I
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: think makes a lot of sense. Yeah, I think that
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: sounds good to be perfect. All right, Well, let's go
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  Speaker 1: ahead and get into it then. If you have never
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: seen this, Inside Out is a twenty fifteen Disney Pixar
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  Speaker 1: animated movie that is written and directed by Pete Doctor.
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  Speaker 1: His major credits are also largely Disney movies, including Monsters, Inc. Soul,
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: and Up Sure Sure Yeah, And it was co directed
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: by Ronnie del Carmen, who has largely been involved in
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: writing an art direction and has done a lot of
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: work at Disney, including on Wally Up and Finding Nemo.
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: And then there was a third writer, meg lefav I
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: think is how I would say that, Yeah, who's largely
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: known for and done work on storyboards and writing for
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: stories including The Good Dinosaur Captain Marvel, the first one,
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: My Father's Dragon, and As We Will See and the
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: sequel Inside Out too.
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: So the film is a tidy hour and thirty five minutes,
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: so it's actually like not one of those movies that
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: you have to worry about sitting and you know, planning
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: bathroom breaks four. You can just kind of like sit
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: and enjoy it in one sitting. And it tells a
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: story of an eleven year old girl named Riley. The
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: movie largely takes place inside her mind, which is seemingly
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: populated and controlled by characters portraying her emotions. I will say,
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: when this movie first came out, so my daughter's name
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: is Riley, and she is blondehaired and green eyed and
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: did not like broccol and so like it was one
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: of those things where we were watching it like oh, okay, yeah,
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: sure this is And especially when Inside Out two comes up,
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: which we'll talk about, I was like, oh, yeah, yeah,
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  Speaker 2: I know the story. So it was really fun to
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: have that and see that a little bit as cool.
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: Yes, that definitely occurred to me. I haven't met your daughter,
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: but you've talked about her quite a bit obviously.
• 10:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: Anyway, although the story is about Riley, the main characters
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  Speaker 1: of the story and the film really are her emotions.
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  Speaker 1: The sort of primary main character is named Joy, the
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  Speaker 1: emotion of Joy, who is voiced by Amy Poehler. Then
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: there is the emotion fear voiced by Bill Hayter, anger
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  Speaker 1: voiced by Lewis Black, sadness voiced by Phillis Smith, who
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: people might remember from the Office Discussed, voiced by Mindy Kayling,
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: who's been on a ton of things but also the Office.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
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  Speaker 2: Some other notable characters are, of course Riley, who's voiced
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  Speaker 2: by Catherine Diaz, Riley's mom voiced by Diane Lane, Riley's
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  Speaker 2: dad voiced by Kyle McLaughlan, a wonderful imaginary friend character
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: named Bingbong voiced by Richard Kind.
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: Get some tissues for that one.
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, seriously.
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: There are other voice actors including Poundstone, Bobby moynihan, Paula Pel,
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: Dave Goles, Frank Oz, Josh Cooley, John Ratzenberger, He's been
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: all of them, yeah, Carlos Ali's Rocky, and Flea of
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: the Redout Chili Peppers.
• 11:24
  Speaker 3: So lots of people in these movies.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, And I think some people did sort of
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: double duty on different characters, but that mostly wraps up
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: a lot of the characters that we do here from
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: at some point in the film.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah.
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: The nice thing about movies is they're not usually interspersed
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: with ads. All Right, we're back. So we just sort
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: of were primarily highlighting the various people who sort of
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: were involved in this film. So for this next part,
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: we're going to do a quick sort of plot breakdown.
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: We are going to get into some specific details here though,
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: So as we mentioned major major spoiler morning, we will
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: talk about everything that happens in This movie. Is an
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: eleven year old movie, so if you haven't seen it,
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: go check it out, I guess. But anyway, things to
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: know before we get into it.
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, if you haven't seen it, I recommend going
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: and watching it before you finish listening to this because
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: I think you'll still appreciate it, Like I think, I
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: think either way you'll appreciate it.
• 12:26
  Speaker 3: But go watch it.
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean, this really is not meant only
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: for people who have seen it, but it's just we
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: really enjoy it and it's a strong recommend.
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: So yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure.
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: All right, So we'll give an overview of the plot
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: of this movie and then we'll break down the components
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: of it.
• 12:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: So the general overview follows a montage of so at
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: the beginning of the movie, there's a montage of Riley
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: growing up until she turns eleven, and we see sort
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: of the moment she's born and her emotions start to
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: exist up to sort of the point where we get
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: to where she is in the story. And what happens
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: is her family suddenly moves across the country from the
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: Midwest to San Francisco, and the move proves very challenging
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: for Riley and her emotional turmoil surrounding the move and
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: adjusting to the new city and in her new life
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: in that city. And that's like the context in which
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: the story is situated.
• 13:18
  Speaker 3: Yep, absolutely, So.
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  Speaker 2: The story opens with baby Riley just opening her eyes
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  Speaker 2: and seeing your parents, and we are we are zoomed
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: into Riley's head, where a blue haired yellow character materializes
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: out of nothing and approaches a small pedestal with a
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: single button, seeming to represent the reaction or a reaction
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: pressed by joy, which results in baby Riley giggling afterward
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: for additional emotions appear at various opportunities to respond to
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: a montage of childhood events like being fed broccoli, running
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: around the house, playing and getting good at hockey. One
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: of my favorite little details about the broccoli, by the way,
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: is like in different countries they replaced it with different vegetables.
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: Oh fun.
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: So like in I believe it might have been Japan,
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: it was like it was green peppers, and like some
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: other places, it was a different vegetable on the pizza.
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: It was not always broccoli to like be more culturally
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: like responsive to that, which I thought was cool.
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: That is super interesting. I did not know that.
• 14:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so a lot of opportunities, like when they're trying
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: to feed her broccoli and then Anger gets involved and
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: his head like turns into a flame, a tower of flame,
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: and he's like, get that away from me, and then
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: you know, baby Riley is screaming all red in the face.
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: Uh huh.
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's very fun depiction of that. Okay, throughout the story,
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: the emotion characters, because all the characters represent the emotions, right,
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: so we sometimes will call them emotions sometimes characters. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: their understanding of what Riley's experiencing is depicted sort of
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: that as then like looking through a giant screen, which
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: I think is too sort of meant to be like
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: Riley's point of view. It seems to be Riley's vision,
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: and also they seem to have access to all of
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: her other senses at the same time, like what she smells,
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: what she hears, what she feels, et cetera. And their
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: control panel grows from that single button and into a
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: larger panel with tons of buttons, and they use those
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: to respond to situations with their own unique personalities associated
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: with their role as a particular emotion. They don't really
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: highlight what any particular button is supposed to do. There's
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: just so many buttons. They go around tapping things and
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: moving levers and reacting to stuff in that way. But
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: as you might imagine joy, the emotion Joy reacts with
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: happy enthusiasm, which makes Riley react with happy enthusiasm. Sadness
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: reacts with sadness.
• 15:30
  Speaker 3: Sure you get.
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  Speaker 1: That's essentially what they do is there's a particular situation
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  Speaker 1: and one emotion sort of immediately hops over and starts
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  Speaker 1: pressing buttons in that then shows up as Riley's experience
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: in the situation. She depicts whatever that emotion is doing.
• 15:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure.
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: We also see that when Riley has an experience, that
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: emotion is recorded as like a bowling ball size glowing
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: glass like ball memory type of thing, like a Polanthior.
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: It's particularly important memories that are saved as special. These
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: are called core memories, and they form the foundation of
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: Riley's personality.
• 16:01
  Speaker 3: So these core.
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: Memories will eventually like they're kind of like how's it
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: a certain little thing, and that creates like the islands
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: of personality that are Riley's personality in the in the movie.
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: Yea, and the core memories have like a particular glowing characteristic.
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: Did you make a Lord of the Rings reference there?
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: With the I just did? Yes, I did?
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: That? Is that is a very apt description for those
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: of you who are familiar with the Lord of the Rings.
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah, the palt.
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: Here I thought they felt good. Yeah, yeah, no, that
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: was very good. So in in addition to that, Riley's
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: personality as represented as these sort of floating islands. There's
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: they're attached to the headquarters with kind of these cable
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: like things, but the islands themselves look like they're on
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: land that's basically just floating in air, radiating out from
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: the sort of main headquarters, the central control tower. They
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: depict a friendship island, a family island, a goofball island,
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: an honesty island, and a hockey islands. Those are the
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: core personality traits of Riley.
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: Yes, that's an important part of this discussions. We go
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: forward now once the major conflict begins, we get to
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: see a lot more opportunities to observe how things in
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: her mind re react to environmental situations and see how
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: various entities in her mind cause her to react to things.
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So, on her first day of school when she
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: gets to her new schools, because like most of those
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: movie takes place after the move, she is afraid of
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: things going poorly, and immediately her teacher calls on her
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: to introduce herself to the class. At first, she starts
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: talking about her life in Minnesota. She seems happy, but
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: then sadness emotion touches a memory that she was using
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: to tell her story, and she starts crying as she's
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: now thinking about how much she misses her hometown and
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: her friend's there. And because of this, for the first
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: time ever that we've seen and that Riley's experience, the
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: memory that she forms of this classroom experiences is sad.
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: It forms a core memory that is one that is sadness,
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: where all of her other core memories have been ones
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: of joy.
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and so the emotions desperately try to prevent Sadness
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: from touching other memories and also try to like bring
• 18:14
  Speaker 2: Joy back to Riley. So they're trying to stop her
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: from crying, prevent the core memory from becoming an establishes
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: a piece of her personality, and purge it from the headquarters,
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: and in doing so, Joy, Sadness, and a bunch of
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: core memories are accidentally launched out of the headquarters and
• 18:28
  Speaker 2: all the personality islands fall dormant during this time. It's
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: kind of like and you actually see the change in
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: rather kind of like she kind of like stops and
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: just goes oh and like becomes like very like neutral
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: almost when this happens. Yeah, so that's that's kind of
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: an interesting thing to see the inside in the outside
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: world of it, you know.
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, so sort of gets this sort of stoic,
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: numbish look and then kind of just stops reacting to things.
• 18:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: But yeah, so this this sort of kicks off the
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: main conflict of the story that is to be resolved
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: and all the sort of adventure that happens. And during
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: the scene we get introduced to a depiction of something
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: called the train of thought, which is a literal train,
• 19:05
  Speaker 1: because if you're making an animated movie, why wouldn't you
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: take advantage of that, right. We also get introduced to dreams,
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: which we'll later learn are created by a separate department
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: that like manufactures dreams, and we also watch Joy disable
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: the dream sequence and instead play a fond memory instead.
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: I also like when they are in the space where
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: they're trying to find their way out and there's all
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: the shelves of all the memories that are there. It's
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: kind of like they kind of like EBB and flow
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: and they kind of sneak around almost like the folds
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: of a brain, like.
• 19:38
  Speaker 3: The press of the brain, Like it looks like that.
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's very circuitous, and it does look like they
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: intentionally made it look like the sort of soulcy and
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: fissures of a cortex.
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's very very cool. We also get a hilarious
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: scene in which Riley is home from school. Only three
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: of the five emotions are present, and Riley is only
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: responding to our parents with anger, nervousness, and sarcasm, which
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: is really fun zoom into their into her parents' heads
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: with their own control panels and emotions, and when we
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: zoom into our dad's head. They're all watching a football
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: game and not paying attend to the situation at all.
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: And also all of our emotions, all of his emotions,
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: are shaped like anger, which I thought was really, I
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: think really important to note too, is like they went
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: into the dad's head and all of them, even though
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: they were different emotions, they looked exactly alike. They were
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: just different colors and they were all shaped like anger. Yeah,
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: and I'm almost positive, if I remember correctly, moms was
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: shaped like fear or moms were shaped a little bit
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: different too, but they were all the same shape as.
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: I recall, and I would have to go back and check,
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: but I thought hers were actually all shaped like sadness.
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: And actually it has helmed the panel for the most part.
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: For yes, you're right, You're right, it is yes, it's yes.
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: Which I think was also sort of a meta commentary
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: that wasn't I think it was meant to be subtle
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: and like you might sort of catch it if you
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: were paining close attention. Yeah, but it's very funny because yeah,
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: they basically having a conversation and dad sitting there and
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: the watching football, and then all of a sudden they
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: realize that there the mom is looking at him, and
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: so they turn off the football game and he just
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: repeats whatever the last he's like, so, how was your
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: day when that was like already a discussion they'd had. Yeah,
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: and this is this is funny, the really funny scene.
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: I don't think that we mentioned this any other time,
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: but really funny scene where they're like that one Brazilian guy,
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: we should have him, and they like play a memory
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: of him in her mind and they all sort of
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: sigh looking at this this handsome man. Anyway, So funny,
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: it's so funny. It's so good. And then like I remember,
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: like there's the dad does something he's like nailed it
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: in the they zoom into the mom's head and they're
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: just like.
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: Uh, yeah, it's it's really great. It's a it's a
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: really great commentary on like you know, when two people
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: are trying to like solve a problem and they're just
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: not on the same page.
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, there's completely on different on different wavelengths of
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: the thing. Yeah, for sure, we are on on on
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: different wavelengths with ads where we're just left off two
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: of Oroiley's emotions, joy and sadness, are out on their adventure.
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: The other three are back at the tower trying to
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: figure out what to do. Riley's having very unpleasant interactions
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: with her parents. So anyway, while that's all happening, joy
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: and sadness have to navigate the long term storage memories.
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: That was what you were describing, where was the sort
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: of snaking, winding storage. While these memories are these palanteer
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: balls of different colors and whatnot, and the workers are
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: going through and there are a lot of memories that
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: are grade out because they're basically fading with time, and
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: so the workers are purging the old memories, particularly if
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: they think they aren't important. So they're like they have
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: like all the presidents, and they're like keep Lincoln, keep Washington,
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: get rid of the rest, is like that sort of thing. Yeah,
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: And they also reveal at this point that the workers
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: will grab this one commercial jingle and they'll just randomly
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: send it to her mind where it'll play the jingle
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: on a loop. And so that's the sort of the
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: commentary that's really fun. It's like, why do you sometimes
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: have like a song that pops in your head and
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: it just won't leave ye? And it's like in this
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: in this depiction. It is because the workers who know
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: are responsible for purging memories, like messing with the people
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: at HQ and setting up there. And then we see
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: Riley who's kind of like humming the song under her breath.
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: It's a really funny moment.
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's pretty great.
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a recurring gag too, Like it shows up
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: a couple of times, which is really fun.
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: Yes, exactly, matter of fact, even makes a brief appearance
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: in the sequel.
• 23:36
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: But anyway, they're out here and they're the dormant personality
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: islands though we saw go dormant earlier. Because of the
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: whole situation, they're starting to like crumble and fall apart,
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: and they're falling into this giant pit that is the
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: memory dump. So when they purge the memories, they also
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: fall into this pit, and the memories eventually crumble away
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: to dust like a fanos snap.
• 23:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: Spoiler for Infinity War, I guess.
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: Anyway, so that's where all the Islands are sort of
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: crumbling into this place as well.
• 24:06
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: Now in the Memories, as they're kind of running through
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: long term memory, they run into Riley's old imaginary friend Bingbong,
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: who's voiced by Richard Kind. He is a pink creature that,
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: as he describes, part elephant, part cat, part dolphin, mostly
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: made of cotton candy. He's wearing a patched up tweet
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: jacket and fingerless gloves and cries candy like.
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: He's pretty pretty wonderful.
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: He's very funny, and Richard Kine's performance is outstanding. It's
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: so good, yeah on this. Yeah, it's great, wonderful, wonderfully
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: designed character, wonderfully written sequence, the whole thing. But anyway, yeah,
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: so they have to traverse Riley's mind because they're trying
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: to get back to the headquarters here with the core memory,
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: and that brings them through this mental space. It looks
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: like a giant warehouse and it's got like those giant
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: vault door on it, and it's called abstract thought. And
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: when we go in here, the motions are turned into
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: versions of abstract art, following four stages. So there's non
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: objective fragmentation, deconstruction where their body parts literally fall to
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: pieces on the floor, flattening where they become two dimensional shapes,
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: and then non figurative representations where they become squiggles and
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: like basically random squiggles that are two dimensional.
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a fun sequence, but the irony is not
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: lost on me that it's abstract thought and they took
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: it literally.
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: Yes, like yes, yes, very good.
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: That was probably an intentional decision, I do think, yeah, yeah, yeah,
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: it would have to be right, Like it's just it's
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: given all the other things.
• 25:46
  Speaker 3: But it was a lot of fun.
• 25:47
  Speaker 4: It was.
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: So they get through this and they end up in
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: imagulation imagination Land, which is mostly being demolished, although there's
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: now an imaginary boyfriend making machine, which is fun and
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: this makes.
• 25:57
  Speaker 3: It, which is really good.
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: This all so, you know, it makes sense given that,
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: like you know, you're talking about this person's age and
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: they're starting to mature, and like this is so like
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: the metaphor of like somebody losing their imagination and creativity
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: as they age makes sense, right, Like if you're following that,
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: you know, which, well, I'm sure we'll talk about you.
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: Although there's now an imaginary there's that imaginary boyfriend making machine.
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: Bing Bong finds his rocket, which is a wagon powered
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: by song and shoots rainbows, but it is taken and
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: dumped into the memory dump, and we get another gag
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: where they board the train of thought, find bins of
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: facts and opinions, but can't tell the difference between them,
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: so they just put them all in the fax box.
• 26:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, which is a lot of fun, especially for like
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: that age.
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: You know. Yes, they're like they actually spill them and
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: they're like, I can't they look exactly the same, Like
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: I just put them all the fax box. I was like,
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: that's almost a political commentary right there.
• 26:48
  Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, yeah, it's very subtle.
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: It's great and I didn't mention here, but the wagon
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: is like the rockets on the wagon are brooms, yes,
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: and the brooms out of the bristles of the brooms
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: at fire the rainbow and that propels the reocting forward.
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: It's very absurd and really fun.
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's cute.
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: Okay, So they're they're traveling back. The train is headed
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: toward HQ. Things seem to be going well, and then
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: Riley goes to sleep and so the train stops. They
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: happen to be stopped on the train near the Dream
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: production studios, which are basically set up in this film.
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: They're depicted as like a movie studio lot, and so
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: they decide that they're going to use this as an
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: opportunity to infiltrate the dream and wake Riley up by
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: creating a super absurd dream sequence.
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: So Security catches them and throws them into the subconscious,
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: which is fun, but they unleash one of Riley's greatest fears,
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: a birthday clown, and she wakes up. This kick starts
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: the train of thought, which they are able to board
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: and start heading toward the head quarters. But Honesty Island
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: collapses due to the other motions decisions to have Riley
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: run away from home, which is intense. Yeah, the collapsing
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: island breaks the train rails and they fall back into
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: the back to the long term storage.
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: Now we sort of glossed over this, but essentially what
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: happened was all the personality islands are dormant. The three
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: emotions that are left, fear, anger, and disgust, are essentially
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: reasoning that the personality islands are formed from core memories.
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: So what they should do is have Riley go back
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: to Minnesota because that's where all of her core memories
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: were formed, and that will kickstart her personality islands again
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: and everything will be back to normal. That's sort of
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: the decision making here. So she's decided to run away
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: from home, very intense, very like, do god, why are
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: you doing this? Yeah, terrible decision thing because she's doing
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: that that's also further crumbling the islands. But of course
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: it seems to them like a good idea, and they
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: depict the idea as a light bulb which makes sense,
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: which they screw into the control panel and then once
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: it's screwed in, it lights up, and that's Riley's ideas
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: to run away, and then they can't get it unlodged.
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: It's like stuck in there, right right, Okay, So at
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: this point the train has collapsed, it's falling into the
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: bits of dumped memories, and Joy falls in there with
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: bing bong. It kind of looks like the way they
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: show this, it's like this gray there's just endless hills
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: of gray memories that are sort of fitting to dust.
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: It really kind of looked like the way they depict
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: Hell from the movie What Dreams May Come with Robin Williams. Yes, yes,
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: which was I mean, it was way darker and scarier
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: in that, but yeah, but you kind of had this
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: similar like vast open space where you also can't see
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: very far because the hills and everything's dark and gloomy.
• 29:33
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that was that.
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: Anyway, while they're down there, they have some important epiphanies
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: about while they're in the pit, about the importance of
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: all the experiences Riley has had and that Joy is
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: always just pushing for everything to be joy, but it's
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: actually important whether the experience was good or bad. They
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: all like play a role in forming who Riley is.
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: And while they're down there, they happen to find being
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: Bong's rocket, which was previously dumped into the bit of
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: the Abyss, and they're like, essentially, we can use this
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: to escape the Abyss because it's a rocket, we can
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: fly out of here.
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: After several failed attempts to launch out of the pit,
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: bing Bong sacrifices himself by throwing himself out of the
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: rocket so Joy can escape, and he fades away as
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: a purged memory, which is just devastating. Is one of
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: the It is one of the hardest scenes in a
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: movie to watch.
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: It seriously, like for a silly cotton candy cat elephant creature,
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: who is this imaginary friend. It is one of the
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: most gut wrenching things to watch. Yes, yeah, it's right, Yeah,
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: it's that special. Brand of Pixar sad that like it
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: just like it just hits you in a way. You're like,
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: good lord, yeah, this is just feels cruel. Yeah. They
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: specialize in the heart stabbing sort of. Yeah, emotional crippling scenes.
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: So that's that one. Okay, So they have escaped the pit,
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: I think we I don't think mentioned this, but at
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: some point in Imagination Land, Sadness runs off and they
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: can't find her. Joy has now escaped the pit. She
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: finds Sadness, who has left a trail of blue sad
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: memories because they're back in the memory storage and like,
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: Sadness just been walking around with her hand on the
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: memories and they're all just turning blue because they're they're
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: turning sad. So Joy follows those and through a series
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: of events, including a flying cloud of tears a giant
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: tower of imaginary boyfriends that Joy used from the Imagination Land.
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: It allows Joy to catapult off of a trampoline on
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: one of the islands and land at h Q, where
• 31:39
  Speaker 1: they're sort of clinging to the outside of the window
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: and Disgust uses Anger's firehead as a torch to torch
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: the windows of Headquarters, where they arrive back at headquarters.
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: Joy asks Sadness to take the reins of the control panel,
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: which has been shutting down, and that essentially kick starts
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: the panel back to life.
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, yeah.
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: At this point, Riley gets on the bus and runs
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: home and cries to her parents about missing home. And
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: Riley gets a new core memory that is a mix
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: of joy and sadness, and that's going to be I think,
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: really valuable here In the next scene, we discovered that
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: Riley has now has all core memories that are a
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: mix of different emotions, and that emotions get a gigantic
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: upgraded control panel with a scary red button labeled puberty.
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: Yes and like a like a red alarm alarm sort
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: of thing. You'd said. She gets on the bucks, we
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: actually didn't mention. She gets on a bus to run
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: away from home. She like buys a bus ticket, like
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: steals money from Rom's purse, buys a bus ticket when
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: she's on the bus. She has that's when they get
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: back to HQ, she has this epiphany when Sadness takes
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: over and is like, no, this is a terrible idea,
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: And then she gets off the bus and runs back
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: home right maybe to make that clear. There's also like
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: she's ignoring phone calls from her parents at this point,
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: which makes that sort of a further crumbling family onland
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: and whatnot. Yeah, for sure, Okay, that's essentially the end
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: of the movie. What happens here is she's not back
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: with her family, she's joining a hockey thing. She's getting
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: back into hockey in San Francisco. And then we get arguably,
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: in my opinion, one of the funniest scenes in the movie,
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: where Riley meets a boy and the camera zooms into
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: his head and there all these warning screens flashing red.
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: There's an alert and of voices announcing girl, girl, girl,
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: and like warnings. The emotions and this boys head are
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: running around screaming, the emotion fear is on the ground,
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: cradling his legs, rocking back and forth, just sobbing and
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: sort of sob laughing and just like and just sheer terror.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: It's just so so funny.
• 33:42
  Speaker 3: It's really it's really fantastic.
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: It's one of those things where you just go, yeah, like,
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: as somebody who struggle talking to girls when I was younger, Yeah,
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: that was like what I'm like, I get it.
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: That's that is also very relatable.
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, Like Riley hands them something and he just
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: stands there silent and says nothing, and she's like, hey bye, Yeah,
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: it's pretty great. Oh my god, it brought me so
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: much joy. That's such a good scene.
• 34:06
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but yeah, that's essentially that summarizes the plot. That's
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: everything that happens in the movie. So good time for
• 34:11
  Speaker 1: a headbreak. Okay, so we just finished summarizing the entire
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: plot of the movie through the majority of this discussion
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: so far, Let's get into some of the things that
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: I would criticize about how things are depicted in the movie.
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: And partially because it's you know, why we're here is
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: to do commentary on how we feel like this job
• 34:37
  Speaker 1: does and depicting psychological things, and I think also because
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: there are things in this that don't work super well
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: from that perspective. Now, to start with, this movie largely
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: espouses a psychodynamic which you might also call a Freudian
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: approach to psychology, and so just we're gonna disagree with
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: something and how they choose to do that.
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: Sure, sure, Sure. One of the things that we have
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: to point out is that emotions are not discrete, compartmentalized
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: individual entities, and of course, like anybody listened to this
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: knows that, like that's not going to be like that's
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: not going to be a surprise to anybody, you know,
• 35:14
  Speaker 2: I'd be concerned if it was. Yes, there also aren't
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: only five, although trying to enumerate them is really a
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: false errand they did consider other characters, but decided to
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: on Justify for the movie, likely to streamline and consolidate
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: the plot. The point being is that there are lots
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: of varieties and intensity of emotions that we can feel
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: in our complex nuance in dynamic, which I think is
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: also eliminated in the core memories. Having multiple emotions color
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: that experience, you know, so like they kind of undo
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: that like separate entities by having that mixture in the
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: core memories as we talk about it.
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, And I mean I think they the criticism
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: stands that like there it's not like there are you
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: just have this one emotion that's joy and sadness, and
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: you can have a little bit of those two things together.
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's just like there's so much complexity in
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: how those things can interact in reality as we're talking about,
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: and the way they show it. But just I think
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: to make sure that that's clear that people don't feel
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: like we just have these discrete emotions that exist, and
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: even eleven year olds are going to have very complex,
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: nuanced types of emotions of a wide variety across many,
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: many different things. So yeah, yeah, just the thing. Also,
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: I want to consider the homunculous nature of her emotions
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: as they're depicted and just like again understanding the liberties
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: that they take to tell the story, and that's fine,
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: but her emotions have their own personalities, minds, thoughts, motivations.
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: Then you then ask the question with a monculi, like
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: what controls those emotions, minds and memories?
• 36:43
  Speaker 3: Do?
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: We zoom into their heads and they have an arsenal
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: of emotions inside their heads and inside of the homunculi
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: inside their heads. The zoom of their heads, and there's
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: more homunculi heads like controlling their minds going on and
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: on down, just for an infinite regression that like in
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: side of every head there is more homunculi, and inside
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: of those homunculi, there's more homunculi. Like that's you kind
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: of have to interpret that if there is some mover
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: inside of her that like there's something inside of that
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: mover and like that's we would subscribe to the fact that,
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: like past your own skin, you have a single mind
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: that does not have entities that control that mind. The
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: mind is also just part of you, like you only
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: get one layer deep basically.
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: Right right, right, Yeah, it's just homunculi all the way down.
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah exactly.
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: The emotions actually react and cause Riley to react, but
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: they react to her actions and behaviors as well. So
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: what is the direction of the relation here, Like this
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: is just isn't how things work. We don't have emotions
• 37:46
  Speaker 2: puppetting us. Our emotions are behaviors. Our actions and emotions
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: are part of the same fabric of who we are.
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: They aren't different, They aren't divided just because they are
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: easy to observe or difficult to observe. They are still
• 37:57
  Speaker 2: part of our unique perspective and interaction with the world.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: So like it's the directionality of this is a little
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: bit off.
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and just to the way that it picked it,
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: like it's very strange. And then like it doesn't really
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: make sense that our emotions could just stop existing or
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: that our personalities could just crumble into pieces, Like right,
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: what if, Like let's just imagine in this whole scenario,
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: like Riley's going through this traumatic event, and like in
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: the story, sadness and joy have been launched out of
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: her head, so presumably they're never at the control panel.
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: She's not gonna feel sadness or joy during any part
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: of this. She just gets fear discussed and anger. That
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: are possible emotions that she could actually feel. But like,
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: what if something awesome, just really great happened all of
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: the sudden and she was happy, Like, would joy just
• 38:45
  Speaker 1: manifest back at the headquarters? Would she like be would
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: she not feel joy even though she's actually joyful. It
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: just doesn't really make conceptual sense that like that's how
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: it could possibly work, you know what I mean?
• 38:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, yeah, absolutely, yeah one percent.
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: Also, I think another point of this is like our
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: memories aren't really stored, at least not in the way
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: and depict that there's depicted in the movie. We discussed
• 39:09
  Speaker 2: memories before, But memories are effectively the context cues technically
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: is stimulus control. And what we understand of memory, that is,
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: we remember when cues present features in which we have
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: some history. When we remember, we recreate that memory, don't
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: just play it over and over and over again. It's
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: not like we can take it and go, Okay, here's
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: the file for this, and I can repeat watch this.
• 39:29
  Speaker 3: It's like we play.
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: It over and over and over again, and the act
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: you probably add new flavor and details and you know,
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: variations of it as we as we think about it,
• 39:36
  Speaker 2: and then we recreate it with a new context that
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: experience in those filters, and it makes it so that
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: memory is not the same as it was the first
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: time you recall it.
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So without really knowing how language and communication might
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: work instead of on the other species, they certainly don't
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: do it the way that humans do it. R Like,
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: we have a very very unique form of communication that nobody,
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: no other animals seems to be able to do to
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: the degree or the way at least that we do it.
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: But because of that, with humans, we know that that
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: affords a particular thing with us, which is that things
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: can form cues for our memories that are not even
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: just things that we observe, Like we can experience a
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: queue that you can't even observe that can then essentially
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: trigger a memory, and those memories are as you said, like,
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: we essentially are like these cues all of a sudden
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: like fabricate that memory again out of our experience with
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: those cues. But it's a little bit altered every time, Yeah,
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: because they're not stored in this way and the way
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: they sort of depict them as like you pull up
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: this movie clip and it plays the scene, which interestingly
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: is not even always from Riley's perspective. So like also
• 40:47
  Speaker 1: that that's not how memories work anyway, just like a
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: thing to as we're going through criticisms, that's just not
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: really how those things are through the process where our
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: memories are essentially hell than the stimulus control they exist
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: in cues and contacts in our environments. We can recall
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: memories that were seemingly lost forever. Like this whole idea
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: of like purging a memory, it's not really a thing, right,
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: because if you do create the stimulus conditions well enough,
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: you can recall a memory that like only a very
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: specific set of cues could have possibly recalled. So for
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: all intents and purposes for you, that memory is gone.
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: But if you do create the right stimulus cues, you
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: can cause them, like evoke that memory to come back
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: and do that thing again. And the other thing that
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: can happen is like we can have memories that are
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: seemingly locked in and like super important and are there,
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: and then they're gone because we just never have the
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: cues again to get them back. And the other thing
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: that can happen too is like when we have we
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: can engage in memories that we never had before. Like
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: that's a very unique thing about with human language, is
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: that we can completely fabricate memories of things that never
• 41:57
  Speaker 1: took place out of whole cloth. There's a whole thing
• 42:01
  Speaker 1: that we need to talk about at some point about
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: repressed memories, where they're not actually repressed memories, they're fabricated memories.
• 42:09
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: It's convincing someone to believe that something happened that never
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: happened and then they experience it as if it were
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: a memory. It's a remarkable thing that we can do
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: that sort of thing. But that is a thing that
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: can happen. So this whole idea of like storing and
• 42:22
  Speaker 1: playing memories and like moving them to long term storage
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: and all of that, I'm like, that's just not even
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: kind of how they.
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: Work, right, right, right, absolutely, Also, and probably you know,
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: our biggest throw on our side here is there's little
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: or no explicit time given to the fact that we
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: learn from our experiences that the outcomes of our actions
• 42:42
  Speaker 2: shape our future decision making. There is little recognition to
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: the factors in the world that motivate us to do
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: things context create the setting events that make certain outcomes
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: and behaviors more or less appealing. You know, I think
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: that the closest they get is maybe personality island, which
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: would like explain, like, this is somebody's interests, and like
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: these are like expected behaviors underneath those personalities, Like there's
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: probably a little bit of that, Like we expect Riley
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: to be honest and do things, and we expect Riley
• 43:10
  Speaker 2: to play hockey, and like we like that's the closest
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: I think it gets, but it doesn't explain it like that.
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: It explains it as if they are like static personality
• 43:17
  Speaker 2: traits rather than and they start by kind of explaining
• 43:21
  Speaker 2: that they are they feel like static personality traits. Yeah,
• 43:24
  Speaker 2: and then by the end of the movie there are
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: brand new personalities.
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, very much. So. Yeah, like you could loosely
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: interpret some of the things they do as depicting that
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: process a little bit, but like you'd have to be
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: fairly generous with that interpretation. It's certainly not explicit, and
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: they never really show things that are like there is
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: a clear motivation that's happening here that could be biological hunger, sleep, Paine,
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: like extreme temperatures. That mean, now we have behaviors that
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: are engaged in seeking out an outcome that is like
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: attenuate or alter this this setting event that I find
• 43:57
  Speaker 1: myself in. That is a lot of how we experience
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: the world, Like how much of our behavior is just
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: around finding food too much? Like so much behavior, so
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: much behavior get food, and not that they needed to
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: depict that, Like obviously there is food in here, like
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: we do see it play a role, but there's very
• 44:14
  Speaker 1: little in terms of how our behavior is organized around that.
• 44:17
  Speaker 1: And again that probably would have been kind of boring
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: to watch, so I don't fault them for it, but
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: it is like a thing that is a realistic feature
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: of human behavior. Yeah, absolutely, there's almost nothing that really
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: depicts accurately how behavior sort of functions, and like getting
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: at that function piece. But this is a great opportunity
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: to segue to what I think is the beautiful metaphorical
• 44:41
  Speaker 1: depiction of how they show I guess psychology and behavior
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: in this movie, which has nothing to do with ads.
• 44:50
  Speaker 3: Nope, not that at this time.
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: Okay, we're back. We've been sort of unpacking many of
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: the criticisms we have, but I do want to actually
• 45:05
  Speaker 1: leave on the fact that, as we started with, this
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: is such a good movie. And I am even though
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: like the philosophy that supports our profession underlies my entire
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: way of thinking about how the world and like human
• 45:21
  Speaker 1: behavior works because it, like the philosophy is rock solid,
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: like it works every time, and it's pragmatic, it is effective,
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: it is correct. I've never seen it fail and I've
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: only ever seen it work right. Anyway, inside of that,
• 45:35
  Speaker 1: I think there is such a there's so many beautiful
• 45:39
  Speaker 1: metaphorical ways to think about behavior depicted in this movie.
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: And the art is gorgeous, the writing is fabulous, and
• 45:46
  Speaker 1: the metaphorical nature of the movie is beautiful and so
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: well done. And even though we criticize emotions as being
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: represented as distinct entities that cause behavior, we can look
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: at them through a lens of the interactive nature of
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: actual behavior, which is to say, our behaviors have an
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: effect on the environment around us, and that has a
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: sort of reciprocal effect on us, part of which are
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: our emotions. Our emotions are part of our behaviors, and
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: our behaviors are part of our emotions. Like those they're
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: all sort of running that circle, so like showing them
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: as like if you metaphorically think of our emotions as
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: these behaviors, and those characters are just sort of manifest
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: representations of that, then it's kind of a cool way
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: to think about the fact that our internal world is
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: part of our external behaviors as well.
• 46:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know, the arc of learning to accept
• 46:38
  Speaker 2: that some non traumatic adverse experiences can be important parts
• 46:41
  Speaker 2: of our lives and help us to learn and overcome
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: them is another interestingly constructed metaphorical depiction. I think that
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: that is such a great depiction of how circumstances can
• 46:52
  Speaker 2: be unique. I mean, like when people talk about, like
• 46:54
  Speaker 2: is something being bittersweet? Right, Like if that is not
• 46:57
  Speaker 2: the combination of joy and sadness together in some situations,
• 47:01
  Speaker 2: I don't.
• 47:01
  Speaker 3: Know what is right.
• 47:02
  Speaker 2: So, like you know, like or like you know, the
• 47:05
  Speaker 2: amount of times you've probably seen some like horrific event
• 47:08
  Speaker 2: that like you bonded with your friends and had some
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: joy over like that, there's fear and joy, right, Like
• 47:13
  Speaker 2: I think of all the times I was running away
• 47:15
  Speaker 2: from security guards and on the beach when we would
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: get kicked out of pools with my friends and like
• 47:20
  Speaker 2: we're you know, we're afraid to get arrested, but we
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: were having a good time. So like there is like
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: a mixture of fear and joy there together, right, Like
• 47:26
  Speaker 2: I think that, like there is such a beautiful that's
• 47:28
  Speaker 2: so beautiful to be able to say, hey, this thing, Like, yes,
• 47:32
  Speaker 2: there are times where you just feel pure joy, yeah,
• 47:34
  Speaker 2: but there are sometimes where that situation can also be
• 47:37
  Speaker 2: colored by new evidence later. Like I think of all
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: the times I had a great time with my best
• 47:42
  Speaker 2: friends and then one I lost one of my best friends,
• 47:44
  Speaker 2: Like now that's that comes with like a little bit
• 47:46
  Speaker 2: of sadness. So like even memories that you already have
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: can be painted with this like these different emotions later too,
• 47:51
  Speaker 2: which is really fascinating.
• 47:52
  Speaker 3: I think they did such a great job with that.
• 47:54
  Speaker 3: That was like probably my favorite part of the entire depiction.
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I actually do think that was really good because yeah,
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: it's like the memory itself you look at and it
• 48:01
  Speaker 1: seems like a joyful one, but like as in reflecting
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: on that memory, the new lens is like, this is
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: sad because it's a thing that's gone. And there's a
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: related way that like big epiphany moment, aha moment for
• 48:14
  Speaker 1: joy when she's clutching that core memory and she plays
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: it back and realized that parts of the memory are
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: already sad. Like the reason that it was joyful is
• 48:23
  Speaker 1: because out of the sadness came support from her parents,
• 48:27
  Speaker 1: which like resulted in her like overcoming that and making
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: a decision that helped her move along. And so the
• 48:33
  Speaker 1: memory is ultimately joyful, but it was because it was
• 48:36
  Speaker 1: a sad event to begin with, and she sort of
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: learned and group from it. But you had to have
• 48:40
  Speaker 1: that piece and so that whole just that's like just
• 48:43
  Speaker 1: it's not necessarily related to behavior explicitly, but it's the
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: metaphor of like being a human and experiencing human things
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: and acknowledging that like these were things that happened to
• 48:54
  Speaker 1: her that were they weren't traumatic, they were just sad,
• 48:56
  Speaker 1: And like I think there would be a whole nother
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: discussion to have having to be fair about like the
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: people who do go through actual trauma, and like that
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: also shapes who they are coming out on the other
• 49:07
  Speaker 1: side of that, right anyway, I do. I did really
• 49:10
  Speaker 1: love that and the way that they just show moving
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: on the growth of the emotions that are the characters,
• 49:15
  Speaker 1: the emotions, the self sacrifice of our imaginary friend to
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: fade to obscurity so that they can they can continue
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: to grow up. It's not like literally accurate, It's not
• 49:25
  Speaker 1: like we actually have to purge those parts of ourselves
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: or that they have to fade away in that way,
• 49:31
  Speaker 1: Like all of that stuff we take with us from
• 49:33
  Speaker 1: childhood become part of who we are as adults, even
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: if it's not very obvious, like they were stepping stones
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: that got us to where we needed to be, and
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: so they don't become purged, you know what I mean,
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: Like right sort of there, and presumably she would be
• 49:48
  Speaker 1: able to remember her imagine her friend at some point
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: in the future like a lot of people can, right.
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: It's just a nice way to show that aspect of learning.
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: I think, yeah, most definitely.
• 49:58
  Speaker 2: And also despite the video like quality that my the
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: way that the memories become colored with different aspects of
• 50:02
  Speaker 2: emotions is a fun way to depict the complexity of
• 50:05
  Speaker 2: memories and how they aren't one thing, and I love that.
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: Like one of the things they do inside of that too,
• 50:11
  Speaker 2: is like when they rewind the memory. If you rewind
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: it back a little further, it starts to change color too.
• 50:16
  Speaker 2: So even though that it was static to begin with,
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: you start to kind of see them as you move
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: through it, like, oh, like, if I spend a little
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: bit more time in this, it's actually a.
• 50:23
  Speaker 3: Little bit more complicated than that, which was a lot
• 50:25
  Speaker 3: of fun.
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: And it makes a lot of sense because most scenes
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: we see all or most of the emotions have the
• 50:30
  Speaker 1: control panel at some point when Relly's going through any experience,
• 50:33
  Speaker 1: so presumably she'd have all of those emotions as part
• 50:35
  Speaker 1: of that experience in one way or another, right, and
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: the various stages of it. But yeah, I love the
• 50:41
  Speaker 1: depiction of the relationship between the characters. I love their
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: willingness to forgive one another. I think it just shows
• 50:47
  Speaker 1: how well communication can help improve relationships and help the
• 50:50
  Speaker 1: characters work together when they're collaborating and being communicative and everything. Yeah,
• 50:56
  Speaker 1: so I think that if we let the characters in
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: her head the emotion and be sort of a stand
• 51:01
  Speaker 1: in for those experiences, then and for like her character growth.
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: Like that's that's a cool way to show that in
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: just a very unique interpretation.
• 51:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think so too.
• 51:12
  Speaker 2: And the idea of significant event experiences shaping our personalities
• 51:15
  Speaker 2: is another really lovely metaphor. Like it's I mean, people
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: especially now, like some of the language of people are
• 51:20
  Speaker 2: using online is like what radicalized you? And that's like
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: another way to kind of think about this too, is
• 51:25
  Speaker 2: like what brought you here?
• 51:27
  Speaker 3: Like what made you who you are?
• 51:28
  Speaker 2: And you know, like we know it's all behaviors, but
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: like it's a nice way to think about like how
• 51:32
  Speaker 2: certain events led to you certain personalities and like, you know,
• 51:35
  Speaker 2: like if I had like you know, I think about
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: my personality Islands, I'm like, well, music would be one
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: of my personality itel Islands, Yeah, And I think about
• 51:41
  Speaker 2: all the things that led me there, right, like like
• 51:43
  Speaker 2: growing up listening to music and listening to the radio
• 51:45
  Speaker 2: and like having it at my house and playing music
• 51:47
  Speaker 2: and then my friends that are related to it, so
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: like all those things are there, but like it's a
• 51:51
  Speaker 2: fun way to think about it. But you know, I
• 51:53
  Speaker 2: think it's also important to like kind of say, like
• 51:55
  Speaker 2: it's a nice way to think about this and represent them,
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: but they aren't distinct, kind of like separate islands that
• 52:01
  Speaker 2: crumble away or simply spring into existence. Like there are
• 52:04
  Speaker 2: ways to visualize our actions and our personalities and all
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: that are guided by those important experiences that we have,
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: but they're not like separate things like they're like, you know,
• 52:12
  Speaker 2: personality is such an amalgamation of so many things together,
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: you know.
• 52:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And it's just like a description of what you
• 52:19
  Speaker 1: might expect someone to do in certain circumstances based off
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: of like your experiences with them, or like their report
• 52:25
  Speaker 1: of things that they think that they would do. Yeah,
• 52:27
  Speaker 1: And that's like how people have sort of taxonomized personality,
• 52:31
  Speaker 1: even though I take a lot of issue with the
• 52:34
  Speaker 1: idea that your personality can just crumble to dust. The
• 52:37
  Speaker 1: part of the film where that happens, I sort of
• 52:40
  Speaker 1: I could liberal I could talk myself into liberally interpreting
• 52:43
  Speaker 1: this as what it would be like for someone who's
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: in a super novel situation that like it's a context
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: they've never been in, in a situation they can't even fathom,
• 52:54
  Speaker 1: and because there it's so new, they kind of have
• 52:57
  Speaker 1: no repertoire to even bring to that situation, and they're
• 53:02
  Speaker 1: abandoning their values because they don't know what to do,
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: like they have no they have nothing to guide it here,
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: Like that would create a very new and somewhat unpredictable
• 53:11
  Speaker 1: range of behaviors that might look like very little of
• 53:16
  Speaker 1: their personality, like the repertoire that they have, the repertoires
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: that they have that would reflect that personality, Like they
• 53:22
  Speaker 1: might be engaging in so many new behaviors in this
• 53:24
  Speaker 1: situation where they just don't have a lot to draw
• 53:26
  Speaker 1: from that it looks like very different from how you've
• 53:29
  Speaker 1: otherwise thought about their personality, and so like you could
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: think of it as liberally representing that kind of metaphor.
• 53:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's fair, it's reasonable.
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: So I don't know, I think there are a lot
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: of things in here that sort of worked for me.
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: I mean, the train idea like is silly, Like I
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: get why they throw it in there, and it's a
• 53:48
  Speaker 1: fun part, Like that's not how thoughts actually work, but
• 53:51
  Speaker 1: you know whatever, I don't know what are some other
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: parts or were there other parts that sort of stid
• 53:55
  Speaker 1: out to you that you like thought that way it
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: didn't really touch on yet that are worth addressing.
• 53:59
  Speaker 2: You know, I really loved the like outside of the
• 54:05
  Speaker 2: emotions part. I really loved the depiction of like the
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: family together, Like I thought that was really valuable. It
• 54:11
  Speaker 2: wasn't like a perfect family. Like it wasn't like mom
• 54:14
  Speaker 2: and dad were lined up and they were together and
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: they knew how to talk. Like they made mistakes and
• 54:18
  Speaker 2: they and then they like owned them and then they
• 54:20
  Speaker 2: came together and they tried to sort it out right, Like,
• 54:22
  Speaker 2: you know, I really loved that depiction of that families
• 54:26
  Speaker 2: aren't perfect even when they are good to each other.
• 54:29
  Speaker 2: And I thought that was really I think that's really important. Yeah,
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: because I think that you can see that, like parents
• 54:34
  Speaker 2: are human beings that mess up, and I think that
• 54:36
  Speaker 2: that was really I think that that's really a really
• 54:39
  Speaker 2: valuable message for kids to see, is that parents can
• 54:42
  Speaker 2: mess up and that's okay. That doesn't mean that it's
• 54:44
  Speaker 2: the end of the world.
• 54:44
  Speaker 3: You know.
• 54:45
  Speaker 1: That's a great catch. Yeah, because the fact that it
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: allows it a few brief moments to zoom into their
• 54:51
  Speaker 1: head and sort of get the perspective, I think helps
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: show that like everybody's kind of doing the best that
• 54:58
  Speaker 1: they can in the current situation. You know, sometimes they
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: zone out, or sometimes they don't say the right thing,
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: or they can't figure out or understand what's going on
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: with the other person. But they're all doing their best,
• 55:10
  Speaker 1: and like even doing their best, they make mistakes, and
• 55:14
  Speaker 1: so they they sort of I guess, navigate that in
• 55:17
  Speaker 1: the way that they that they do. But that's a
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: really good point that I think that it does show
• 55:22
  Speaker 1: like a dynamic that is I think pretty healthy, Like
• 55:25
  Speaker 1: it's it's people who are really working together even when
• 55:28
  Speaker 1: they are sort of butting heads. Awesome. I think that's
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: all I really have to say to reflection on this.
• 55:35
  Speaker 1: Any other parts that stand out to you'd like to
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: sort of comment on here.
• 55:38
  Speaker 2: I think, you know, to me, if I had anything else,
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: it would probably be related to like the second one
• 55:43
  Speaker 2: and how they blend together really well. I think I
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: would say just I recommend it, Like I think at
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: the end of the day, like, yeah, we have criticisms
• 55:50
  Speaker 2: about it from a psychology like anceptual standpoint, but like
• 55:53
  Speaker 2: also at the end of day, doesn't really matter, Like
• 55:55
  Speaker 2: it's a great movie and it's a lot of fun,
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: and I think it's worth Like it's not it's the
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: kind of movie that you would share with a psychology class.
• 56:02
  Speaker 3: And be like this is how it works. Yeah, but
• 56:04
  Speaker 3: like I think that.
• 56:05
  Speaker 2: You go back and say, like, these metaphors are important
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: and we should like have a conversation about how these
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: metaphors work and what this means for people. You know,
• 56:11
  Speaker 2: Like I think there's something valuable about that interpretation rather
• 56:14
  Speaker 2: than accepting it as like a factual conceptualization.
• 56:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you're right, Like I do. I do kind of
• 56:20
  Speaker 1: enjoy the idea the exercise of interpreting the metaphor is
• 56:24
  Speaker 1: is probably useful one from like a psychological perspective, particularly, Yeah,
• 56:27
  Speaker 1: if you're learning about it, we're thinking about like this
• 56:30
  Speaker 1: is not how it works, but that you can interpret
• 56:33
  Speaker 1: how things work by like zooming out and looking at
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: this from sort of a broader picture. Yeah, absolutely awesome.
• 56:39
  Speaker 1: All right, cool. I think that's what we have to
• 56:41
  Speaker 1: say about Inside Out our first time ever reviewing, like reviewing,
• 56:44
  Speaker 1: I don't know if I was reviewing. We were discussing
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: and sort of interpreting a movie. Yeah, it's just one
• 56:49
  Speaker 1: that like it really felt so close to home for
• 56:52
  Speaker 1: us because like we're psychology podcast, and this is like
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: a movie about what makes people tick, if you will, So, like,
• 57:01
  Speaker 1: you know, this feels in our wheelhouse and like there,
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: I've always thought, like there are things that would criticize
• 57:07
  Speaker 1: about how psychology is depicted, but I also like want
• 57:11
  Speaker 1: to point out that like it works very well as
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: a metaphor. Yeah, so I'm happy to discuss those things.
• 57:16
  Speaker 3: But agreed, agreed, All.
• 57:18
  Speaker 1: Right, Well that's a we're man. I think we're a
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: great making great time here. We are going to come
• 57:22
  Speaker 1: back in the next episode and discuss inside out to
• 57:25
  Speaker 1: the sequel to this because it continues to expand on
• 57:27
  Speaker 1: these and I think that'll be a fun time as well.
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: But before we wrap this one up, we will play
• 57:33
  Speaker 1: it boom. Okay, we're back. The way we like to
• 57:42
  Speaker 1: end these is by closing out with some recommendations. They're
• 57:46
  Speaker 1: not related to our movie right now. They're just some
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: things that we are going to recommend we found joy in,
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: or are their thoughts that we had that we just
• 57:54
  Speaker 1: wanted to share. Whatever it is, we recommend some stuff,
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: and we're going to do that thing. Before we get
• 57:58
  Speaker 1: to that, though, we are going to listen to credits.
• 58:00
  Speaker 1: I would like to say thank you to everyone who
• 58:02
  Speaker 1: joined us in this and for listening through. I hope
• 58:04
  Speaker 1: that you enjoyed this discussion. If you'd like to tell
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: us your thoughts on the movie or anything that we
• 58:08
  Speaker 1: commented on inside the movie, or anything that we missed,
• 58:11
  Speaker 1: you should email us. You can write to us directly
• 58:13
  Speaker 1: info awwdwwdpodcast dot com, or reach out to us on
• 58:17
  Speaker 1: the social media platforms and we do look forward to
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: hearing from you there. And if you'd like to support us,
• 58:22
  Speaker 1: you can do that by leaving a rating and a review.
• 58:24
  Speaker 1: That really helps get the algorithm out there, meaning that
• 58:26
  Speaker 1: more people will find us and listen to us, and
• 58:28
  Speaker 1: that makes our ad revenue look better and that's great,
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: really appreciate it. You can also help us by joining
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: us on Patreon if you go over there to get
• 58:37
  Speaker 1: a free content, early episodes and bonus staff. All that,
• 58:40
  Speaker 1: and probably the reason everyone is really here is that
• 58:42
  Speaker 1: at the end of our full length discussions, I will
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: read the names of the people who have taken the
• 58:47
  Speaker 1: plunge and joined us and supported us on Patreon. So
• 58:50
  Speaker 1: a giant, huge thank you too, Mike m Megan, Mike T, Justin,
• 58:54
  Speaker 1: Kim Brad, Stephanie, Brian, Ashley, Kiara and Charlie. Really appreciate
• 58:59
  Speaker 1: you all continue to support us through this y'all are beautiful.
• 59:02
  Speaker 1: If you didn't know, if you're joining us for the
• 59:03
  Speaker 1: very first time. We also put out many episodes on
• 59:06
  Speaker 1: Mondays or just a quick dive into a topic. They're
• 59:08
  Speaker 1: like fifteen minutes or so, hopefully less sometimes it's ten
• 59:11
  Speaker 1: to fifteen. I think we're usually writing that spot. Yeah,
• 59:14
  Speaker 1: but these full length discussions come out on Wednesdays and
• 59:16
  Speaker 1: they're usually unrelated, but sometimes they're related. But that's that's
• 59:20
  Speaker 1: where we're are with that. Thank you so much to
• 59:21
  Speaker 1: my team of people, without whom I could not make
• 59:23
  Speaker 1: this podcast, so writing and fact checking from Shane and myself.
• 59:26
  Speaker 1: Thank you for recording with me today, Shane.
• 59:28
  Speaker 3: Thank you for making me watch these movies.
• 59:30
  Speaker 1: Hey yeah yeah. Thanks for taking on the extra homework
• 59:32
  Speaker 1: scientist time.
• 59:33
  Speaker 3: Yeah yeah.
• 59:34
  Speaker 1: Thank you all for listening. Our social media coordinators Emma
• 59:37
  Speaker 1: Wilson and the person who stitched together a very tired
• 59:40
  Speaker 1: Abraham to make this episode sound like a podcast is
• 59:43
  Speaker 1: our executive producer, Justin.
• 59:46
  Speaker 3: And master of ceremonies and all around fun guy.
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's all around mushroom. So that is the
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: thank yous. I think is there anything that I'm missing
• 59:56
  Speaker 1: or you would like to add before we transition to recommendations.
• 59:59
  Speaker 3: Nope, I think that covers it all.
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: Right, Let's get to one of the most fun parts
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 1: of any discussion, which is recommending some fun things.
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 3: Recommendations. I'm gonna recommend a book.
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 2: It's a short book, so if you are interested in
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 2: something quick and easy, and it's a collection of short stories.
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: It is a book by an author named J. D. Salinger,
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 2: never read. The book is called Yeah nobody never heard him,
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 2: and the book is called nine Stories. If you if
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 2: the name sounds familiar, you're not sure why, it's because
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 2: he's the writer of Catcher in the Rye.
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 1: Oh good rhyme. I was like some slam passion.
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 2: It does completely by accident too. It's it's almost as
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 2: if I read all the time and I just I
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 2: just can't help but write in poems and rhymes.
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 3: So okay.
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 2: I think that people are either enamored or soured by
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 2: the by having to read being forced to read Catcher
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 2: in the Rye. I think early on we can kind
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 2: of put Holden caw Field up and go like, well, yeah,
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: you know, he's like he's a rebel. But then later
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 2: as adults were like, he's just whining so much, and
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 2: you know, and he's a little bit of a phony.
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 2: So I would say this, if you have been soured
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 2: by JD. Salinger having to Recatch on the Rye, please
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 2: go read Nine Stories. I think it's an excellent read
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 2: on just very human experiences, you know, like people who
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 2: that are like they've run off with a boyfriend, you know,
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 2: and like kind of having experiencing that, having to raise
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 2: a child as a single parent, like and having to
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 2: experience that, or being in like a loveless marriage. Like
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 2: there's they're real stories that like, on the surface sound
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 2: like they're kind of like, I don't want to say
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 2: mediocre like events, but they're very just like normal events
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 2: that happen to people, and he's writing about them in
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 2: this really beautiful way. I think he's an incredible writer,
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 2: and I think he doesn't get enough credit. I think
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 2: he gets all the credit for Catching the Rye. I
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 2: don't think he gets enough credit for his other works,
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 2: and this is one of those ones to give you
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 2: that experience if you want to kind of get outside
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 2: of that.
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 3: Wow.
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, JD. Salinger nine Stories. I've actually never even
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: heard of this, So this is like nine short stories
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: I'm assuming like a whole a book of nine short stories.
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, it's a book of nine short stories. I've
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 2: had this book for twenty years now. Cool, and it's
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 2: the first time I read it. I have there's a
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 2: couple books that I have that I've had for some
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 2: time because I borrowed them forever.
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 3: Fair.
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, lovely. I am recommending a local restaurant, so
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 1: you can only find these in Reno, Nevada. Should you
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 1: find yourself in Reno, sure, yeah. It's a small, locally
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 1: owned chain, but it is one of my favorite restaurants
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 1: in the city. It's actually not like the most upscale place,
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 1: but it's it's also not run down like it's. It's
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 1: if you were to put it on the like how
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 1: much are you spending, it's on the slightly higher end
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 1: of average for like like a dine in restaurant. The
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: reason I like it so much is, first of all,
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 1: they have a vast, vast menu. They have so many options,
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 1: and they cater to a lot of different terry preferences,
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 1: so they have vegan, vegetarian, gluten free keto just like
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: standard no preferences. The owner actually got his start making soups,
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 1: and so they always have a soup of the day
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 1: and then a tomato soup, and they are fabulous. I
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 1: like every single one of the soups that I have try.
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 1: They're so very good. My favorite one is this mushroom
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 1: barley soup that he makes that is really really fantastic.
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 1: They do actually ship a lot of at least the
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 1: soups I know that they ship nationally, I think, and
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 1: so you can check those out. The soups are really good.
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 1: They have like freeze dried one and which I haven't tried,
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 1: but the frozen ones are very good. Yeah, but if
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 1: you ever find yourself in Reno checking them out, They've
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 1: got just such such good options. I'm a huge fan,
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 1: so grateful gardens than Reno if you find yourself there.
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 3: That sounds delicious. I love that.
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 1: Cool. All right, Well, I think that that is what
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 1: we have to say about restaurants and books by JD. Salinger.
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 1: Uh huh, definitely all we have to say about inside
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 1: Out this movie. Well, we probably could come up with
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 1: more things to say it, but I'm okay with where
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 1: we landed right now.
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I feel good with that.
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 1: Perfect All right. Well, then I think We're ready to
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 1: close this one out and thank you everyone for listening.
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 1: I think that is is that it? Am I missing anything? No?
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 1: I think we covered it all right, Well check out
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 1: the next one. These are really not meant to be
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: like a part one and part two. These are entirely
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 1: meant to stand on their own. Like when we cover
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 1: part two, it's going to be just for part two.
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 1: So yeah, for Inside Out too, it's not a second
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 1: part episode, but sure when I record them back to back,
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 1: because why not. Yeah, check us out next time for
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 1: Inside Out two. That's it. So this is Abraham, this
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 1: is Shane. We're out.
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 4: So yeah, you've been listening to Why We do what
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 4: We do. You can learn more about this and other
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 4: episodes by going to WWD WWD.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 1: Podcast dot com.
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 4: Thanks for listening, and we hope you have an awesome day.