Latest / Crosstabs / Rep. Paul Evans - Plan B

Transcript

Rep. Paul Evans - Plan B · Crosstabs

• 0:01
  SPEAKER_00: I just didn't want to blow you up.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_01: Nah, no, that's it.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_01: I was just doing a little sound check there, but yeah.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so you do have an opponent.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_01: I haven't really looked.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't seem like it's as aggressive as maybe it was,
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_01: four years ago when we were running,
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: Dan against you,
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_01: who now is going to be a state representative,
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_01: which is kind of an interesting change of events.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, it is.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_00: That's it.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: I may or may not have been pulling him.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, when you can't win, move.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_00: again, off record, we have a federally elected official who did the same thing.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: No, no, no.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: I'm very aware.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_01: I think we all are inside the baseball world of politics.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_01: It's understandable.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_01: There's a little bit of some sandbagging that's happening there,
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_01: but that's just part of the political game, sandbagging.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's been done since the dawn of, I think, politics in America.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_01: You know, people moving here, people moving to congressional districts or people moving around.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's kind of normal,
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: but in Oregon, it's,
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's frowned on,
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_01: but at the same time, we just know what happens and you just let it go.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, and you just move on, but yeah.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think that's right.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_00: I think a lot of times the system has actually done a disservice
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: when somebody carpetbags in who doesn't actually understand the system.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_00: That's it?
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: I think it does make you susceptible to being primary at a later date because
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_01: if you don't really have the community connections, the deep kind of butt.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_01: So within your party, it's a lot harder usually to win cross party.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: But within the party, there's usually some opportunity to do that.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_01: You know,
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_01: the one thing that I really wanted to kind of start with is,
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_01: everybody loves it because it seems like these legislative races,
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_01: the fact that I don't even know you have an opponent tells me
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_01: that it's pretty boring on the legislative front.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_01: This cycle, it feels pretty boring to me.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody seems to be focused on the Kotech, Drazen thing.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, there's going to be a couple of key races, but it seems like that's the big race, right?
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_01: Is that kind of what you guys are hearing too on your side?
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: I think the Democratic,
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: in the House anyway,
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: I think the perspective is that the governor's race is taking all the energy and
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: the oxygen.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: There are congressional races of interest because of the effects we see,
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: but ultimately, most of the legislative races, I think, are on the back part.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't mean people aren't working hard, it doesn't mean people are trying.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_00: But in many people's minds,
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_00: everybody in Oregon is just waiting to get over with the elected officials.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: It's wild because I think I was talking to Senator Starr yesterday.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_00: We were chatting about ledge days and he's like, you know,
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_01: Of course,
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_01: he's optimistic,
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_01: which is fine,
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_01: but he's like,
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_01: it really doesn't matter because if Drazen wins,
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_01: like throw everything out the window, right?
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_01: It just changes the entire game.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_01: Legislatively, I mean,
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_01: I feel legislatively we're either 13 or 11 in the Senate for Republicans,
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_01: depending on what happens.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_01: I think,
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: and then I think on the House side,
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_01: we're probably,
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_01: you guys are probably somewhere from 37 to 39, depending on what happens.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_01: I just don't see a lot of movement.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_00: I think you're right.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_00: I actually think we're going to be at 37.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think,
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: I think there'll be some seats that come and go,
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: but I think the total numbers are going to be right around 37.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_00: It is possible we get to 39 as a Radical centrist, I would prefer.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_00: Closer to the strong majority, not perhaps the majority.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: I think the closer we get to 40, the more our Worcester Angels come out, and I'm nervous.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think it would be really hard to get to 40,
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_01: because that means you're beating Kim Wallen.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, Shelly, Bosard, Davis, like you start getting into these.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_01: I just think at 21, you really can't go much on the Republican side.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: It's pretty, it's pretty difficult to go much lower than that.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_01: I think from our standpoint, you're right.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_01: You get to 39 and all we have is walkout and then,
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_01: and then who knows what,
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_01: and then I think they're usually what happens is then as a,
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_01: being a radical centrist that you are,
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: um, I think you all now, all of a sudden you just start fighting your own party.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's pretty, that's pretty great.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_01: What's your perspective on, like, it doesn't seem like Kotech really wants to debate Drazen.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: I think there seems to be a pushback on that with this whole canceling the KGW thing.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_01: And like, is there just this idea that she doesn't want to talk issues with her?
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_01: Or, I mean, I don't think she's afraid.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, Tina's a very smart person.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_00: So, It's a weird situation.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: For a long time, I believe that Tina Kotech and I were friends in addition to being called.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_00: I believe that Tina I believe in,
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_00: she'd be out there advocating and arguing for a vision for Oregon.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: She'd be advocating and explaining her vision for how we build
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: a working-class economy and continuing to fight for the values that she's spent
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_00: on her fighting.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_00: I, as a As a rhetorician and as a speech teacher,
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_00: as a guy who used to speak to debate,
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: I do not understand giving up an opportunity to debate.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm probably the least prepared person to give you an answer on why
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_00: a sitting governor would not debate because I think it's an opportunity to clarify
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: a lot of things that some people out there have perceptions about that
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_00: in many ways just aren't as simple as some people think.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_00: I am on the side of advocating our governor to step up and debate more, not less.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because she's not even doing, like, really any interviews.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like, there's...
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_01: There's podcasts on the Democrat side that she could be doing.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_01: She'll probably do one on OPB,
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_01: I bet at some point, talking out loud or thinking out loud, whatever.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_01: I haven't even heard her on that.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_01: I don't even know.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_01: It just feels like she's very...
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_01: I saw her at the Pendleton Roundup this last weekend.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_01: Vicki and I were over there.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_01: She wasn't in the Roundup, but we saw her right before the parade started and said hi.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_01: She's like, I just don't want to be...
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_01: Well, how'd she put it, which I thought was fair.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_01: She's like,
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's inauthentic for me to,
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_01: try to fake,
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: fake that she's,
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_01: cowboy or all that,
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_01: which I appreciated,
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_01: but I was like,
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_01: well, but you're here, like you should kind of be seen, you
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: know, I don't know.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like if you're going to go all the way to Pendleton,
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like instead of, you know, you should at least get out.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_01: And it's no big deal to walk through the parade.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_01: Like, that's not a big deal.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_01: Like, walk and say hi.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, I just think that there's, and that could be her downfall.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, if she doesn't win, I mean, I don't, you know, I don't know the ins and outs of it.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_01: We're probably going to do a poll on Crosstabs here pretty soon.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_01: And we'll release the whole thing.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_01: Like we did in the Republican primary where we released the Crosstabs and everything.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_01: But I just feel like if she loses, I think it's because she's not...
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_01: Trying to be who she is.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_01: And like you said, defending her record, whatever that may be.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you know,
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_01: and I think talking about housing, I mean,
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_01: she's done,
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_01: if I were to be on the protein aside,
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_01: I would say the stuff that's been done through the legislature with her team on
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_01: the governor's office has been dramatic changes to our housing policies.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_01: We're not seeing the units,
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_01: but we're setting ourselves up for future success when the market turns around.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'm hearing from the builders, it gets way better.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_01: But that would be a pro thing I think she could talk about.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_01: She could still always weave in,
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_01: the Trump cuts, the Medicaid are going to be a problem for Oregon.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_01: We've got a lot of people on Medicaid.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_01: She can still talk the national stuff,
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_01: but I just think defending the record is,
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_01: because we all, I mean, you guys have to do it.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we have to do it.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_01: I have to do it for my boss when You vote a certain way.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, you have to go out there and defend your record.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_01: And I think you can stand up for that.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_00: Tina Kotick,
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_00: I believe in,
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_00: is a person who is far more earnest than most people would believe of a politician.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_00: I believe she got in this for the right reason.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_00: I believe she served for the right reason.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_00: I believe that if you get to know her personally,
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: it's very different than the public persona that is out there.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a believer that the more people Tina actually talks to,
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_00: The better off she is, which is not the case for some candidates.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_00: I would say you point blank.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: There are certain candidates that we purposely send to doors in the other district
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_00: so they don't lose them.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_00: But in this particular case,
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: I actually think the Tina I know and the Tina I respect and the Tina I used
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_00: to consider a close friend is there for the right reasons and I want
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_00: to help her continue that mission.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_00: That said,
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_00: I do believe,
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_00: and that is not something I have not said publicly,
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_00: I do believe,
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_00: yes, sir, she has some aides around her That are very Portland-centric.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_00: They're very focused on only two or three things and they have a mistaken belief
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_00: that you can only do two or three things while being governor.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: And unless it is on those two or three things, they don't take it.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: And that's fine for policy advice.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: That's not fine for governor.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I happen to believe the governor can walk through bubble gum at the same time
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_00: and I happen to believe he actually does.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_00: I just wish some of her staff would get the hell out of the way and let her actually show her.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, I put a fork.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_01: I put a formal request into her press team and her campaign
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_00: team to have her on
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_01: the podcast.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_01: So I doubt she'll come.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_01: I've talked to her about it personally, and she's like, well, my team won't let me.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, well, maybe Amy should come on.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_01: But I'm with you.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_01: I think all of them, you know, and a lot of Democrats, you're one of the few.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, some of we've had some on the podcast that will come on,
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_01: but like the leaders don't tend to want to come on.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_01: They don't do anything.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: Rob Wagner won't come on.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_01: I haven't asked.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'll come on anytime.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: I'll come on anytime you ask.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_00: Because ultimately,
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: the worst that happens is we have a disagreement and people
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_00: that are listening go research and they get smarter.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a win-win.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_01: I think so.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I think that there's, and that's the same, like, I just want to hear...
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_01: Because I also have some challenges with some of Drazen's policies that she's put
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_01: on her plan moving forward.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_01: I have some bonus.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_01: And I also disagree with a lot of stuff that Tina pushes as well,
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_01: especially the Portland-centric stuff.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_01: Just in my world, right?
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_01: My worldview is more rural.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_01: But I would love to just hear, because I'm a wonky guy.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_01: You're wonky.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like, we kind of want to hear them.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_01: I don't want to hear the spewing debate kind of stuff.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: What I want to hear is like substance.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_01: Like, okay, let's talk housing.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_01: Like, Say this and then Drazen, like show us, like, what is your plan?
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how are you, what would your plan look like differently than Tina's plan?
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: Or homelessness.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like homelessness.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how are you going to solve the problem?
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: Because I only solve homelessness by,
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_01: I say we solve it with bus tickets, but people don't seem to like that idea.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: Well, my plan was to,
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: and I had to introduce this back to people,
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_00: Governor Woodson, effectively find communities of thousands and more.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_00: We have a three-hour system where we get people out of the weather.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_00: We get them from start to finish assessment of whether they just put for job homeless.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: That's one issue.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_00: But for medication, and then the third category, they just don't want to play well.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_00: Well, if they don't want to play well, I'm not opposed to the buses.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: The folks who need help,
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: let's get them help and let's rethink how we provide care,
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_00: but not so much on a voluntary basis.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_00: Some people need help.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_00: And some folks, it's really just the economic situation.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_00: And my goal was,
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_00: after an 18-month intensive period,
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_00: every community would have a facility that would be used for emergencies
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_00: if they needed.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_00: National Guard could build them because they're pretty simple to build.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_00: They've built bus lines around the state for years on some programs.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_00: But that should make it a community effort.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_00: So far, it was too simple.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_00: And people wouldn't want to follow it.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_00: You're right.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_00: I want to hear a plan.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: It may not be a good plan,
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_00: but I want to hear both candidates say,
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_00: all right, how are we going to build a middle class?
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: I want to hear those answers.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm with you.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't really have an answer really for both.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I could read their websites, but it's not.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: Having you go back and forth and have that policy discussion is really how you get
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_01: to finding consensus.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's really important.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: The difference there.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_01: And speaking of that, I mean, let's kind of transition maybe just a little bit into policy.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like, so I watched with bainted breath,
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_01: the transportation talk,
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_01: because I think that's really, and you're on transportation.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_01: So it's something that's pretty important to your district too,
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_01: because getting people over the bridge and back in for Salem and over
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_01: to independence and West Salem, like that's, you know, it's a challenge.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_01: Like if you're talking transportation, it's a challenge.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_01: And I didn't realize this, but I was, you know, 79,000 miles of roads we have and 8,300 bridges.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_01: And watching that from ledge days,
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_01: the takeaway that I really had,
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_01: the big takeaway I really had was like,
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_01: and I drove to Pendleton and back,
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_01: you know, and we drove these rural roads and I'm sitting there going, you know what?
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_01: Vicki and I were talking all the way back.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: I go, you know what?
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think we've really changed our transportation system.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_00: In like 80 years
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_01: since it was built.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, the road, 395, still 395.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, they're relatively unchanged.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe we've added what,
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know, what is that, 212 or something coming up on the east side of Portland.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_01: But outside of that, I mean, it feels like we have been relatively unchanged, right?
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: So we really haven't built anything new, have we, in 60 years, 70 years?
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: Not really since the cloud administration.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_01: Isn't that crazy?
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_00: It is.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: And that's why,
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_00: I have a reputation in the building,
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: as you know, for someone who is not terribly comfortable with the status quo.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_00: And I want reasonable, rational, responsible change when agencies are no longer fit for the top.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: I do not believe ODOT can and should exist the way it does right now
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_00: because it cannot, by definition, design, cannot meet the new system.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: I want to split it into at least two, if not three different categories.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: Because I think you have,
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_00: I put it this analogy,
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: when you have two catches, three catches in a bag, there's fighting each other.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: And when you have a mission that is too big,
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: you have internal pressures and external stakeholders effectively pressuring
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: an agency to do nothing.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_00: Because nothing is less painful than doing something that anchors one side or the other.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: And it basically is a situation where inertia, Yeah, I hate that the truth.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_00: Because I liked what you said.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_00: You said, what is your plan B?
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_00: And...
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_01: I thought that was a good response because you were just like,
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_01: clearly,
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_01: if you just come back with another gas increase and this and that and another thing,
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_01: the public isn't going to have it.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_01: They're going to show up and,
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_01: the Republicans clearly have a path and people know
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_01: that they'll just vote it down again.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: And then we're just going to waste another two years of not solving the problem.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_01: I think ultimately Republicans, we like roads.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_01: We like commerce.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_01: We like things that happen.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_01: We like investing in infrastructure.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_01: I think we see that as a critical part of the economy.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_01: We see it as something, an essential form of government that should be done as infrastructure.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_01: So we like pipes in the roads.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_01: We like roads.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: We like new roads.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_01: We like increased capacity.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_01: I think all those sort of things are really great,
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_01: but their response was I thought, and you didn't say anything.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_01: I was waiting for you.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_01: I thought maybe you were going to pop off on one, but they go, we'll just shut it down.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, we're going to start shutting down bridges?
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_01: Like, oh, that's going to work well.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know,
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_00: a mutual friend of ours, Rip Ann Sharp, says, Republicans don't mind paying for tax.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_00: And that's why I think sometimes government is important in terms of it does the thing to do.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_01: So you've been in the building 12 years now, and you were there in 2017, right?
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_01: And you came to a consensus.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, Cliff Benz,
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_01: I think,
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_01: led that for the Senate at the time,
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_01: I believe, for the Republicans, like the transportation plan.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_01: I think he was part of that.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_01: But we got a lot of Republican votes.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know,
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_01: it was like $6 billion or something at the time, which was a lot of money back then.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like that's not as much money as it was.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_01: But, I mean,
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_01: has the building changed so much that we don't think we can find
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_01: a consensus like you guys did in 2017?
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_01: What's kind of your thought there?
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't always sound like it, but I try to be an option.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_00: I do believe it is still possible.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: But I can lay out four factors that make it far more difficult.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_00: The first is expectations of the Republicans in office and expectations of
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_00: the Democrats in office.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_00: The expectations of the Democrats are to be able to do anything because we have a supermajority.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_00: Expectations on the Republicans are to be able to walk out.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: And if anything that is painful to do, they're not walking out, you're wrong.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't think it's fair to anybody involved.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: That said, so the dynamics of that has changed.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: The second thing has changed,
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: and this is kind of a pox bow house,
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: we don't elect people with government experience in it.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_00: We elect people who are either two believers ideologically,
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_00: or we elect the people who come out of non-profit and political apps.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you make a good point.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_01: I think, like,
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_01: Republicans need to show up and say,
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_01: hey, we're not going to walk out, but here's our line.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: Here's what we're willing to do.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_01: We also have to do our part, which is to say we'll be players, but here's the three things.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_01: Here's the cap and trade stuff.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_01: I know that Bruce and those guys are all trying to figure out how
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_01: to maybe not remove cap and trade,
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_01: but just change where the money goes and make sure that if we're going to pull
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_01: in dollars from this
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: Cap and trade thing.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_01: It shouldn't go to these crazy far left groups, nonprofits.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_01: It should go to roads and bridges.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_01: Those are fair arguments to make, I think, on our end.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_01: But we also have to be fair negotiators and say we're willing to go down this path
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_01: if you guys are willing to go down this path.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_01: And then We have to be willing to do big things.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_01: I think in 2017, you had people who are willing to do big things.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I think sometimes you've got to have the right players in the room.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's a big part of it.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_01: You've got to have people that are willing to stick their necks out there.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_01: And even to your point, kind of not be...
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_01: The most liked in your party because you're going to have to make some decisions
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_01: that maybe some people don't like.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_01: But if the mission is better roads and bridges,
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_01: if that's truly what the mission is,
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like Republicans or I know my boss would be at the table.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_01: I know that many other Republicans will be at the table.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_01: If that's if that's going to be the core mission of ODOT is to do roads and bridges,
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_01: increase capacity and get commerce going and move people from point A to point B
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_01: as fast as we can.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_01: I just feel,
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_01: but if you,
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_01: to your point you were talking about,
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_01: you have this mission creep going off where they're in spaces
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_01: where they don't even have any business really doing,
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_01: like you said, if it's a grant or something, let Business Oregon do that stuff.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_01: They're so caught up in the weeds,
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_01: but I think it's about protecting jobs all the time from SEIU and they come in
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_01: and they're just bam, bam, bam.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_01: From my perspective, I mean, I just think there's a lot of that that happens.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_01: And I know they're trying, but I don't think we're losing jobs.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_01: We're just going to be redirecting where they go.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_01: I don't see us losing jobs in state government that much.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_01: I just see if we're smart about stuff, we're just going to be redirecting the effort.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean,
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_00: for ODOT purposes,
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_00: we made a very different Decision in the 90s and early 2000s and basically decided
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_00: that a lot of the folks that were in ODOT wouldn't be in ODOT anymore.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_00: The engineers and the designers and that
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: kind of
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_00: stuff.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_00: Again, different times.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: I try not to look back and say, boy,
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: they messed up there because they were under different circumstances
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_00: and expectations.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_00: I think we're here right now.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_00: And to the point of how do we build a system that can maintain is going to require
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_00: a lot of folks that are state employees and in some cases,
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_00: Some other ways of doing business.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: To your point about the cap and trade thing,
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_00: I actually think,
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: you know,
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: the governor's executive order and the climate protection program,
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: I would like to see that eventually transition into a cap and invest program
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_00: that actually made sense, most likely possible.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_00: I also believe we need a concurrent effort to plant a billion trees.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_00: I want us to become even more of a carbon plant, play towards plants.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_00: Get more people in the woods, managing the force.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_00: Having a vision of how we can compete in the 21st century.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_00: My perspective,
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_00: businesses that I respect,
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_00: they know things need to change and for them it's just a matter of cost.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_00: But it's also making sure that that cost goes into something that is some kind of investment.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_00: Instead of simply just spending it on things that really don't move the mingling.
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_00: So I think we have to have those kinds of conversations.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_00: Unfortunately, I'm just going to lay it out.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_00: Some of us old hands aren't necessarily involved in some of those conversations
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_00: because the advocacy groups don't actually want a solution.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_00: They want to have a reason to go raise money and
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_01: beat their
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_00: cat.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_00: And that's great.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_00: God bless them.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_00: We need people out there, but we also have to go.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_00: And if I do not sign up to be the most liked, I'm not the most handsome.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_00: I'll never be the most handsome.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I, well,
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_01: I hope we come to a,
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_01: because I mean, one, I mean,
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_01: who really wants to talk about transportation for like four straight years in a row?
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, let's just get it done.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_01: There's lots of other issues to worry about.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I mean,
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's also part of it is like,
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_01: we just got to,
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: come up with a plan and even,
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_01: and then have a straight, I mean, I don't know how, why wouldn't it be too hard?
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_01: Just like, here's what Democrats want.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_01: Here's what Republicans want.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_01: Here's what we agree on.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_01: Here's the sticking point, sit in a room and figure it out.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_01: I don't, I mean, be adults and figure it out.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I've talked to Senator Lieber about this.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_01: I've talked to a lot of people who on your side of the aisle, as well as on the Republican side.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's what we just have to do is I think we just got to put
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_01: the right people in the room to come up with a plan.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_01: And I just think if you put the same people from 25 in the same room in 27,
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_01: I think
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_00: All I'm saying is right.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: And he's doing the same thing over and over again.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_01: And the same with our people.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I'll say the same thing too.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_01: I'll get shit as well.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_01: But, you know, I mean, I love Shelly Bosar Davis, but she can be a lightning rod.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_01: And you need those people in your caucus.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_01: Those people play a role, right?
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we all know the game.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_01: And she knows transportation.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_01: It's not that she doesn't.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_01: But there's also clearly personality conflicts that are hard to overcome.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_01: And I think,
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_01: especially when you dive into an issue like this with somebody who cares so deeply,
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_01: who has a business invested in it, like all the things, right?
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_01: She's passionate about it.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_01: But it also makes you a little bit blind.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_01: And you have to understand that.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_01: I'm a little blind when it comes to data centers because I You know what?
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_01: In Primeville here, we like Meta.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_01: They've done really well for our community.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_01: They've been great.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm friends with those guys up there.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_01: I was the chair of economic development when we brought Meta here.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_01: I signed the documents.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_01: I had dinner with Mark Zuckerberg.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm clearly a little blind to the fact of all the other things, right?
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_01: The problems that might be with data centers.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: But I'm also,
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: I think, I hope I'm smart enough to recognize that as well, that I'm a little blind.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe I should be the one negotiating a data center deal.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_00: I think data centers are a good example.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm always nervous about moratorium.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_00: To me, a moratorium can be surgical.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_00: So for a short time to let tempers get down, I can see it.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_00: But I don't think the answer for data centers is a long-term border.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_00: And here's what I mean.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_00: Before Tom McCall, I don't think we need to be suckers.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think we need to be throwing ourselves at every business.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: But we do need jobs.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_00: And we do need economics to be able to pay for the services we need.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_00: So here's my theory.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_00: I'm working with Mark Owens and Pam Mars and a bunch of other folks on.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_00: Look, get rid of some of the taxes.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_00: Tax incentives, because ultimately now we know data centers want to come.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, fine.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_00: Come up with a requirement that says,
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_00: all right,
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_00: for water and for energy,
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_00: you have to have a plan to make sure it's safe and sustainable.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_00: And then give local communities the ability to negotiate what they want.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_00: For some communities, like Pineville, it is absolutely a smart answer.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_00: For other communities, maybe they don't want that.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_00: That's fine.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_00: But just a blanket say to an industry, we don't want you.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_00: And again,
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not naive to how some people,
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_00: some businesses take advantage just as some individuals take advantage.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: That said,
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_00: as a state,
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_00: I think we need to have a statewide policy of,
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_00: hey, you have an idea to do something?
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_00: We're not going to say no out of the box.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: We're going to say,
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_00: show me how it actually makes the community better and how we can be good partners.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_00: If you can use those requirements, I think that's a good thing.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_00: And to me,
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_00: it's a matter of having a business philosophy that says we can't We can't say no
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_00: to agriculture.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_00: We can't say no to high taxes.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: We can't say no to forests.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_00: We can't say no to fishing.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_00: At some point, what kind of economy do you want?
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I believe that an economy that's built on rewarding work as opposed
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_00: to wealth is more sustainable and ecstatic.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to be a Democrat that helps bring about some of those conversations.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: Understanding fully that we can't just give everything away.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_00: I don't want that.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: I want Oregon to be the place people have to fight.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_00: But eventually, if they want to be a good partner, they can become a good partner.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm with you.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_01: I think a lot of it is, well, labor, big labor, right?
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_01: And the guys building the dang things.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, they want to see more tax centers and they give all their money to Democrats.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_01: So, I mean, that's a really an oddball scenario.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_01: I'm with you on the moratoriums.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's silly to put a moratorium in place.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_01: Let's just come up with, like you said, a little bit more transparency.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of these guys, they did the non-disclosure agreements early on.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_01: And by the way, they do them with solar fields as well.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's not just data centers that are trying to pull the wool over people's eyes.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's just these guys,
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_01: these site selectors,
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_01: they love to just kind of keep things quiet
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_01: because their biggest fear is you go negotiate with Klamath Falls in your meta.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_01: And you're negotiating,
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_01: and then you just get to a point to where,
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_01: you know what, it's just not going to work.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that gets leaked.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody in Klamath Falls now hates Meta because,
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_01: you know, they didn't come to Klamath Falls, and people there get pissed at Meta.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_01: And Meta's like, well...
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_01: Don't get mad at us.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_01: It was my site selector.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's why they want the NDAs.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_01: And I think there's got to be.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_01: So when you're having your discussion,
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_01: I would just ask you to like, I'm fine with full disclosure.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's important,
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: but there's got to be a point at which you move to disclosure versus NDA,
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_01: because if I'm a site selector and I'm just looking at the locations and I think is
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_01: that, but that's just a normal course of business, right?
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, if.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_00: And.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_00: I'll give you an example.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_00: So when I used to sell goods overseas, there was not a conversation.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_00: There was not an initial conversation we ever had, didn't have at least once.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_01: we'll see what the discussions happen in 27 because I think there's going to be
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_01: a few different proposals out there.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it should be interesting.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_01: Well, let's wind up with 27.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_01: What do you, I mean, hopefully we'll talk again before 27 or we'll definitely talk in 27.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_01: But do you,
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_01: what's your,
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_01: besides,
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_01: you know, right,
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_01: data centers, transportation, what I mean, her education is going to be a big thing.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_01: Because you see like these universities,
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_01: like what kind of drives me crazy about Oregon State, right?
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_01: Probably the two bigger ones.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, they have,
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_01: Oregon as they're paying these football players and basketball players
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_01: and they're paying them millions and millions of dollars.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_01: And all they do is come to the legislature with their handout all the time.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just...
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_01: I think the public is growing really, really tired of that.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_01: And I think universities got to kind of take a little look in the mirror.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, they got an endowment of, what,
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_01: $4 billion at U of O.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, Phil Knight keeps giving his money away like water right now.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I think his health must not be good because he's given all of his money away
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_01: to make sure he's got buildings left behind.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_01: Which is great.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_01: I'm glad that he's given that money with OHSU.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_01: That's awesome, right?
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, that's what you're supposed to do with philanthropy.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_01: That's what they did back in the day.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: They built libraries and they built these buildings.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's awesome.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_01: But the parents and the education,
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_01: I looked at the cost of sending,
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_01: my kids both go to Grand Canyon University in Arizona, out-of-state private school.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_01: For both of them, it is cheaper than one of them to go to Oregon State.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and here's the thing.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_00: On the philanthropy aspect,
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_00: I would really appreciate it if folks who want to give,
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_00: Would work with us in terms of knowing where to go instead
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_00: of just giving what they think will get them a legacy.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_00: So, for example,
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_00: the billion dollars that Bill and I just promised for an engineering program at U
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_00: of O to now compete with Oregon State University.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_00: Imagine what we could do with a billion dollars on tuition assistance.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_00: We could literally send an entire generation of goods to public schools for free.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_01: That's a good point.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, definitely.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, a billion, people don't realize like how much money really a billion dollars is.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, a billion dollars is a lot of money.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_00: It's a thousand million.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_00: Keep going.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_01: It's a, it's a lot of money.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_01: It really is.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_01: So I think, and yes, you're right.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_01: Giving it to the school, which is great.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_01: But to your point,
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_01: now you're,
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_01: now they're just competing against each other and,
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_01: you know, and that doesn't, that didn't really help the solution.
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_01: It's just, And maybe his goal is to make U of O, you know, preeminent university.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_01: Well, if that's the game and that's U of O's goal,
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_01: then OSU should probably know that because then they need to probably figure out
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_01: where, how they're going to go get money.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_00: So literally rewrite the world in Oregon,
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_00: like getting a generation of folks,
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_00: the ability to get out of school, defend the class, be able to buy their homes.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it really would.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_01: And transform Oregon.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_00: And, I mean,
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_00: what's funny is if you actually look at it,
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_00: if we can get those guys to agree, give us $500 million apiece for scholarship.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to transform everything.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_01: Well, Representative, I'll let you get out of here.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sure you got other things to do and talk to me.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_01: So, but I do appreciate the time and let's do it again.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_01: And next time, maybe we'll even drag Reagan, you know, and said he's up there at Wolf.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_01: He's up at Wolf Creek Lodge with his kids or he's on his way.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_01: So we'll let him have the weekend, but then we'll, we'll drag him in and we'll do it again.
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_00: That sounds great.
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_00: And thanks again.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_00: I missed him.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't have an opportunity.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'll let him know he was missed.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_01: Take care.