Latest / The Gill Athletics Track and Field Connections Podcast / BONUS: Alabama State Meet featuring Ben Dake from Locust Fork HS

Transcript

BONUS: Alabama State Meet featuring Ben Dake from Locust Fork HS · The Gill Athletics Track and Field Connections Podcast

• 0:00
  It's bonus time here on the Gill Connections podcast.
• 0:03
  In an effort to increase communication, empathy and
• 0:06
  understanding around the country, we're going to be
• 0:08
  running a new. Episode every day interviewing a
• 0:11
  coach, a high school coach from every state and yes, even you
• 0:15
  Washington DC with explaining how the state qualifying system
• 0:20
  works in their state. We'll be talking with a local
• 0:23
  state expert on how many classes, private versus public
• 0:27
  schools, what events and what is the process?
• 0:30
  Is it areas? Districts, regionals, state
• 0:33
  meet? Is it a descending order list?
• 0:36
  Are there fun things that you do a little differently?
• 0:39
  Like maybe you, I don't know, maybe you do double points for
• 0:42
  relays looking at you. Texas.
• 0:45
  And then we're also going to get to the bottom of is it the state
• 0:48
  meet or do you qualify for states?
• 0:50
  So check us out. Every day here in April and May
• 0:52
  of 2020. Four as we run through each
• 0:55
  state with a local state expert. So let's get started right now.
• 1:10
  Well, let's head down to really one of the best states there is
• 1:13
  because it's the home of your humble host, Mike Cunningham.
• 1:16
  I went to high school and College in this great state.
• 1:18
  So let's go South and let's talk to Alabama.
• 1:21
  Ben, thanks for joining us. Thanks for representing Alabama.
• 1:24
  Why don't you start us off with a kind of a 30,000 foot level of
• 1:28
  you, how long you've coached in the state, what school,
• 1:32
  etcetera? Well, first Mike, thank you for
• 1:35
  for having me. I love the podcast.
• 1:38
  I've even got my my track throwing daughter listening to
• 1:42
  it now. So you know, I'm honored to be
• 1:45
  on this podcast, but I am Coach Ben Dake.
• 1:48
  I am at Locust Fort High School just a little bit north of
• 1:51
  Birmingham. If you're familiar with the
• 1:53
  area, this will be my 4th season.
• 1:57
  As the outdoor head coach, second year is indoor because we
• 2:01
  just started it last year and my 7th year overall coaching track
• 2:07
  and they've all been in the state.
• 2:08
  Great state, I should say, of Alabama.
• 2:11
  That's right. Awesome.
• 2:11
  We'll appreciate that again, you know these this series to, you
• 2:15
  know, create conversation and empathy and understanding for
• 2:18
  other States and while we have a high school coach from each
• 2:21
  state. They're not necessarily the
• 2:23
  experts of each state, but they are representing the state.
• 2:25
  And so, Ben, I really do appreciate you stepping up and
• 2:28
  showing the leadership that I know you had.
• 2:29
  You know, you and I've done a few activities together with
• 2:31
  your team. So just so grateful for you to
• 2:34
  be with us here for Alabama. So let's get into it with
• 2:37
  Alabama. Let's start with some states.
• 2:40
  I know do a separate private school league, state meet in a
• 2:46
  separate public school. What are we do in Alabama?
• 2:48
  Are we all together? Are we separate?
• 2:50
  What are we doing public versus private school?
• 2:52
  Well, there's actually two major sport governing bodies in
• 2:56
  Alabama. There's the AISA, which is 100%
• 3:00
  private schools. And then there is the larger
• 3:04
  body, the Alabama High School Athletic Association, the HSAA.
• 3:08
  And that's all of the public schools.
• 3:09
  And private schools do have the option to become a member of the
• 3:13
  AHSAA, but besides that, there's not really any.
• 3:20
  Separation between public and private.
• 3:22
  We compete shoulder to shoulder. The HSA does what they call a
• 3:27
  little bit of competitive balancing with the private
• 3:30
  schools and for listeners, when I was in high school, that just
• 3:35
  meant if your student body would have made you, say, a 3A high
• 3:38
  school. In a public school, if you were
• 3:41
  private, you competed at 4A. So you competed against bigger
• 3:45
  public schools? I'm not exactly sure what the
• 3:48
  math formula is right now that is above my pay grade.
• 3:51
  I can't really worry about it so.
• 3:53
  You're in a public school. You don't have to worry about
• 3:55
  it. That's right.
• 3:57
  So does the IASA. Do they conduct a state?
• 4:00
  Meet themselves. I believe they do, to be
• 4:04
  perfectly honest, because I haven't been at an AISA school,
• 4:07
  I haven't really paid any attention to how or what they
• 4:11
  do. But I have seen on Alabama
• 4:14
  runners on Mile Split that they do have their meats on there for
• 4:19
  people to register for. And I believe they had a state
• 4:21
  meet listed there last year because I saw it and I saw whoa,
• 4:25
  wait wait wait, hold on, Why is this in Anyana?
• 4:27
  And I'm not going to it. Perfect.
• 4:31
  Well, let's focus on the AHSAA, which I ran in and competed for
• 4:35
  the state meet for. I ran for three years, so I'm a
• 4:38
  little bit familiar at least back in the 90s when I ran
• 4:41
  there. So let's start with how many
• 4:43
  classes or what do you call it divisions?
• 4:45
  How many classes do you have there in Alabama?
• 4:49
  Compared to other states that I've seen that are a little bit
• 4:54
  more complicated, Alabama is fairly straightforward in their
• 4:56
  classification system. We have 7 classifications going
• 5:01
  from 7A all the way down to 1A. The biggest 32 schools in the
• 5:06
  state based on student body. Those are your 7A's and then for
• 5:12
  6543 and two. Each of those is the next
• 5:15
  biggest 64 and then one A being. The smallest classification is
• 5:20
  just everybody who's left. That's interesting.
• 5:24
  So it's not necessarily by population, it is the.
• 5:27
  Top the biggest 32 and then the biggest 60 fours knocked your
• 5:31
  way down. Interesting.
• 5:33
  When I was there it was it was 6 divisions and I thought it was
• 5:37
  you know, the high schooler. So it could have been wrong
• 5:39
  here. I thought it was based on, you
• 5:41
  know, 1000 and above or 6 A's. We were five A's where we were
• 5:45
  and we were always, you know, we were small air quotes there, but
• 5:48
  you know everybody tries to justify, right?
• 5:50
  We were small 5A, OK. When I was in high school, we
• 5:53
  were at Auburn High School. We were a quote UN quote small
• 5:56
  6A because we were. Right on the line and that we
• 5:59
  only had six classifications then too so.
• 6:02
  Perfect, Okay. So we got 7 classes.
• 6:05
  How do we get to state? What's the first?
• 6:08
  You know, everybody calls them a little differently.
• 6:10
  Area districts, regional sectionals, what what's our
• 6:12
  first one in Alabama? In Alabama, we only have one
• 6:16
  qualifying meet for the state meet.
• 6:19
  I know our friends in Texas, it feels like the NCAA tournament
• 6:23
  to get to the state meet sometimes.
• 6:25
  But in Alabama, we just have a sectional meet and each
• 6:28
  classification has four locations throughout the state,
• 6:32
  usually two in the northern half and two in the southern half.
• 6:35
  And each school is assigned their own sectional like which
• 6:40
  location they're going to. And usually those sectional
• 6:42
  locations will have multiple classifications there, just so
• 6:48
  more well. Just so kind of keep the numbers
• 6:51
  down of who has to host because that's an ordeal.
• 6:55
  And also just so you don't have the same places hosting the same
• 6:59
  people all the time, but. You'll have a sectional meet and
• 7:04
  there's some criteria on how you can qualify from sectionals to
• 7:08
  state. Do you want me to go ahead and
• 7:09
  go into that? Before you go there, that'll be
• 7:11
  the next step I think. But first, how do you qualify
• 7:14
  for sectional? So assuming there's a conference
• 7:17
  meet, maybe for some or most, how do you actually say OK, this
• 7:21
  many 4 by 8 teams or this many 100 meter runners are qualified
• 7:24
  for sectionals? We actually don't have
• 7:28
  qualifications for sectionals. The way we run sectionals is
• 7:33
  every team is limited to three individual entries in an event
• 7:37
  and one relay team. Now I have kind of pseudo
• 7:42
  qualifications on my team. I just tell them from the
• 7:44
  beginning, if you're not in my top three times, you're not
• 7:47
  going to go to sectionals. And so they've got a whole
• 7:50
  season to quote, UN quote qualify for Sectionals.
• 7:53
  So it's and this isn't supposed to be a insult, but the
• 8:00
  sectional meet is an allcomer, so there's no qualifying time.
• 8:03
  There's no you have to win confidence.
• 8:05
  It's if you if your team enters you, then you're you're in
• 8:09
  sectionals, meaning you have for the next meet, which is state.
• 8:12
  We go straight from sectionals to the state meet.
• 8:15
  Yes, absolutely. Okay.
• 8:16
  Now and then make sure we understand this.
• 8:19
  There's four sectionals for each class.
• 8:22
  So A has four sectionals, 2A has four sectionals.
• 8:26
  And sometimes because of facilities and etcetera, there
• 8:29
  may be an A and a 2A meet held at the same location, but they
• 8:33
  would still be separate meets or do they run together?
• 8:37
  They're, they're. They're run synchronously, but
• 8:41
  they're scored and everything separately.
• 8:43
  So like for us, we've we've run meets with and we're a 2A
• 8:47
  school, we've run meets again with six A schools being there,
• 8:52
  5A schools being there, but we just cared about the 2A results.
• 8:56
  Did 2IN that. Sectional did a 2A run against
• 9:00
  the 6A or all the all the 100 meter heats were two 100 meter
• 9:04
  heats and then the six yeah okay got it.
• 9:06
  So the meat were all going to one place, but it was split to
• 9:09
  your your your classification, yes.
• 9:11
  Yes, absolutely. Perfect.
• 9:13
  Now how many per event go from sectionals?
• 9:18
  How many kids in the 100 or the four by eight, etcetera, qualify
• 9:21
  onto the state meet? Okay, this is where it gets a
• 9:24
  little cloudy in my kids. Okay.
• 9:27
  The new kids have some problems to processing this at sectionals
• 9:34
  in the let's say, distances less than 400 meters.
• 9:40
  Except for the 300 meter hurdles, it's the top five
• 9:44
  finishers. They're automatically qualified
• 9:47
  for state. So in the hundred once we get to
• 9:51
  a finals, the top five. Are going to go to state and
• 9:54
  because there's four section, yeah, 4 sectionals, you're
• 9:57
  saying that they're 2000 meter runners go to state. 24 because
• 10:02
  you have 5 automatic qualifiers from every sectional and then
• 10:06
  the next four fastest times qualify as what we call a wild
• 10:09
  card. Out of all those?
• 10:11
  Out of those. All four sectionals.
• 10:13
  Cool. I like that.
• 10:14
  That's kind of that's interesting.
• 10:15
  I like that, yeah. And then and that's including
• 10:19
  the four by 100 relay. But your 300 hurdles and your
• 10:24
  your your runs 400 meters and above, your 4 by 400 relays,
• 10:29
  your field events, your vertical and horizontal jumps, they all
• 10:34
  have a minimum qualifying standard as well.
• 10:37
  So you have to finish in the individual events in the top
• 10:41
  five and meet the qualifying standard to qualify for state.
• 10:45
  For relays. It's top three are automatic
• 10:47
  qualifiers, so. Someone could finish fifth in
• 10:52
  the mile and not make the qualifying center, therefore not
• 10:55
  go to state. I had a girl do that this year.
• 10:59
  She met the placement part to qualify for state in the 3200,
• 11:04
  but her time was like 20 seconds slower than the qualifying time.
• 11:09
  And how does that qualifying time get calculated?
• 11:14
  The. State sets that every year in.
• 11:18
  What they call our sports book, which is just our big
• 11:20
  information packet for the season.
• 11:23
  And generally speaking, you know, over the last few years I
• 11:26
  haven't seen a huge change in qualifying times like the girls
• 11:30
  4x4 as long as I've been coaching has always been 450 for
• 11:33
  two, eight. Now they do change the
• 11:34
  qualifying times for different classifications, like the bigger
• 11:40
  classifications. Have faster qualifying times
• 11:43
  than smaller schools because theoretically they should have a
• 11:46
  deeper athlete pool and be able to find more kids that can meet
• 11:49
  that time. Theoretically, I assume that
• 11:54
  qualification time comes from an aggregate average of some past
• 11:59
  five years in that division alone.
• 12:02
  That's a safe position. I would think so.
• 12:06
  That would make sense to me. Right.
• 12:08
  But again, that's one of those, they just send it out and I say
• 12:11
  okay. Yeah, that's what I gotta do.
• 12:14
  They don't. They don't send it out and ask
• 12:15
  you for your opinion. They send it out.
• 12:16
  No. I don't.
• 12:17
  They don't ask me to fill out a Google form or anything and.
• 12:21
  All right, what? Do you think about this?
• 12:23
  So our top five in a few specific specific events are
• 12:27
  going to the state meet and others it's top five with a
• 12:30
  little asterisk of. They have to be faster than
• 12:33
  qualifying time. And if you're sectional and
• 12:36
  we've this has benefited us before, if you're sectionals top
• 12:40
  five like let's say the top three meet in the 400 met the
• 12:43
  qualifying time but four and five didn't, well now instead of
• 12:48
  having four statewide wild cards, now you've got 6.
• 12:52
  OK. I was going to ask you about the
• 12:53
  wild cards, so you would go to six, but.
• 12:56
  That six that are meeting the qualifying time as well.
• 12:59
  So one sectional could have a in that scenario where there's now
• 13:02
  six could have their 10th place person.
• 13:06
  I I guess technically I mean that person didn't make finals,
• 13:09
  but a 10th place person if that, if it's that deep of a
• 13:12
  sectional, that 10th person could still go to to state if
• 13:15
  they met if they beat the the the time.
• 13:19
  And I've had a javelin thrower do that finished 9th and
• 13:21
  sectionals, but there were a few that just they only had one or
• 13:25
  two kids entered. So that.
• 13:27
  Automatically opened up more qualifiers and then they were
• 13:31
  just in that next group that qualified for state.
• 13:35
  Did that 9th place person, How do they do it for sectionals?
• 13:39
  Did they that 9th place person make finals or were they the
• 13:41
  first one out of finals? Because I'm curious, if you
• 13:43
  didn't make the actual final, are you still eligible?
• 13:47
  You are still eligible. They do it based on overall
• 13:50
  finish within the field. Of sectionals, so your prelims
• 13:53
  would count and your prelim running times perfect.
• 13:56
  Anything else to know about sectionals before we ask about
• 13:58
  the state meet itself? They are my favorite time of
• 14:02
  year. I love sectionals.
• 14:05
  I love them. That's what we compete for it at
• 14:07
  locust work. My kids love them.
• 14:09
  Love it, love it. All right, we go to state.
• 14:11
  Is state meet here in Alabama. First of all, how many locations
• 14:16
  are we got 7 classes. That's a lot.
• 14:18
  So are we doing 7 different venues?
• 14:20
  Are we doing 2-3? And then also talk to us about
• 14:24
  is it a one day meet, two day meet, three day meet.
• 14:26
  How are we doing that? I've been on both sides of this,
• 14:30
  the bigger school side and now the smaller school side.
• 14:33
  You're 1-2 and three A's. They go to Coleman High School.
• 14:39
  For their state meet or I say they're our state meet, it's a
• 14:43
  it's a two day meet and sectionals are actually run on
• 14:47
  the same schedule as the one through 3A state meet.
• 14:51
  So I tell my parents at the beginning of the year I'm
• 14:55
  sending you the state schedule, but just know this will be our
• 14:58
  sectional schedule too as far as times go, right?
• 15:03
  And that location. It's been fantastic for us
• 15:06
  because it's like 30 minutes from our school get to sleep.
• 15:08
  In our bed. It's fantastic.
• 15:11
  For a through 7A they have a three day meet in Gulf Shores,
• 15:17
  AL. They get to go to the beach,
• 15:23
  which the kids get really outrated about, but as the
• 15:25
  person that would have to plan that trip, I'm really OK with
• 15:28
  not going to the beach. You know, I went to school and
• 15:32
  coached at Troy University. We used to host the 1-2 and
• 15:35
  three state meet. In fact, my regionals when I ran
• 15:39
  was that Troy. So they're, you know?
• 15:41
  And you know, Troy is heaven on earth for me.
• 15:42
  So that's way better than the beach Okay.
• 15:46
  So you mentioned, let's talk about unique events possibly
• 15:50
  happening here in Alabama. You mentioned one, you know, you
• 15:53
  mentioned the javelin, which I'm super proud of and you know, be
• 15:57
  in my home state. I'm so happy that, you know,
• 16:00
  Alabama stepped up and included the javelin about.
• 16:03
  I don't know. A little over 10 years ago, I'd
• 16:05
  probably say it's probably pushing close to 15 at this
• 16:07
  point. I think it happened since I've
• 16:09
  been here at Gill, which has been 17 years.
• 16:11
  We do do the rubber tip in Alabama, so that's kind of
• 16:14
  unique to that sense. But I I think within year two or
• 16:16
  three after Alabama, this is what I implore other states who
• 16:19
  don't have the javelin to add it within either the second or
• 16:22
  third year. So really, really soon after it
• 16:25
  became an official event, an Alabama high school athlete was
• 16:29
  the leading thrower in the country out of high school.
• 16:32
  And so that just tells me like. There are kids sitting in Texas
• 16:35
  right now who does not have javelin that is a 200 plus
• 16:39
  thrower and should be getting an opportunity to compete in the
• 16:41
  next level at college. And because they don't have
• 16:43
  javelin, he or she just sits there and plays basketball or
• 16:47
  you know runs the 400 or something.
• 16:49
  So we need more states. Have Javelin any other
• 16:51
  uniqueness as far as events are concerned there in Alabama?
• 16:55
  I didn't see it listed on your standard events, but in Alabama
• 16:59
  we do have a 4 by 800 relay. Did I not put?
• 17:02
  That on there. Yeah, you know, because some
• 17:04
  states don't. I'm surprised.
• 17:06
  You know what? Here's shame on me.
• 17:07
  That's how I qualified for state.
• 17:09
  Three years is in the 4 by 8 and I didn't even put that down.
• 17:12
  Yeah, 4 by 8, But no, no DMR and Sprint medley.
• 17:16
  Yeah, Okay. Every now and then we'll have a
• 17:19
  meat that will have a DMR or a throwers relay, which is always
• 17:24
  entertaining but. Other than that, the the state
• 17:29
  and sectional meets are pretty standard.
• 17:31
  We don't have the hammer throw right or the weight throw.
• 17:36
  We don't. You know, I know some states do
• 17:38
  a 4 by 200. We don't do that.
• 17:41
  But. We're pretty straightforward.
• 17:45
  We've got the 12481632, the short, the Sprint hurdles, the
• 17:51
  300 hurdles. 4 by 1, 4x4, 4 by 8 all your jumps shot disc pole
• 17:58
  vault. We don't pole vault, but other
• 18:01
  schools do. Right.
• 18:03
  Any anything unique after the state meet.
• 18:06
  After the state meet, you can we do have a separate meet for your
• 18:11
  multis for those kids that and actually you qualify for that
• 18:16
  state meet based on results throughout the season.
• 18:20
  Oh, is that right? They just kind of take your mark
• 18:24
  in this event and say, well you met the qualifying standard here
• 18:27
  so check that a mark off. I was officiating a meet last
• 18:32
  season and a kid like he was trying to not.
• 18:36
  He was trying to qualify or get his decathlon qualifying marks
• 18:40
  in the 16 in the shot put that meet and that was it because
• 18:46
  that was his goal, he said. I I'm a Maltese guy.
• 18:50
  I know I'm not going to win shot put, but I need to get this
• 18:53
  mark. I love that.
• 18:56
  You know, again my state of Alabama leading.
• 18:59
  We've done this up and deck for quite a while.
• 19:01
  In fact, Bo Jackson was a decathlon champion in the great
• 19:04
  state of Alabama. Excuse me.
• 19:06
  So, so happy that you know Alabama includes that as part of
• 19:12
  their state series. I know it's not the state meet,
• 19:13
  but has that opportunity available.
• 19:15
  OK, help us. Help us dispel, give us the the
• 19:19
  answer here. Are we qualifying?
• 19:22
  Do we, when you say the culture there is it, do we qualify for
• 19:25
  the state meat or do we qualify for states?
• 19:28
  I and our kids say it. We say qualify for state.
• 19:34
  Qualify for state? No.
• 19:35
  No S. No S.
• 19:37
  Not the state meat. Not states, States.
• 19:40
  Qualify for State. Make it to state.
• 19:42
  Make it to state. Make it to state.
• 19:45
  That's the goal, and once you make it, to state all where they
• 19:49
  may. I love it.
• 19:50
  All right. And I'll give you one chance,
• 19:52
  Ben, here as we wrap up. If you can change one thing
• 19:56
  about the state qualifying series, whether it's how you
• 19:58
  qualify, whether it's an event that's missing or an event you
• 20:02
  don't like, maybe you don't like javelin, what's one thing that
• 20:05
  you might get The magic wand. You might change there in
• 20:07
  Alabama? Okay, this is an easy question
• 20:10
  and it's not going to be a rant. I promise.
• 20:14
  I am all for qualifying standards.
• 20:17
  I understand why we have them, why we need them, but what I
• 20:21
  would like to see happen, because I have been at state
• 20:26
  meets and this is usually more of a small school problem than a
• 20:29
  big school problem. But I have seen events run with
• 20:36
  only three kids in it, and they're all from the same school
• 20:39
  because nobody else in the state met the standard at.
• 20:42
  The state meet right at the state meet or I've seen a 4 by 8
• 20:48
  relay run with only one team because nobody else met the
• 20:53
  time. What I would like to see changed
• 20:56
  is okay. After you do your automatics and
• 21:00
  apply the qualifying standard, fill out the field with the best
• 21:04
  of the rest have. Some kind of field of descending
• 21:08
  order list for that, right? Have a full field of 16 relay
• 21:13
  teams or 24 individuals because that's that.
• 21:16
  Many more kids that get the state meet experience.
• 21:18
  Yeah. And for me personally, the year
• 21:21
  we once stayed in the four by four, we shaved 6 seconds off in
• 21:26
  three days of practice between sectionals and state.
• 21:30
  Like, you never know, those kids could be under the qualifying
• 21:33
  time by the time they get to state.
• 21:34
  Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that'd be a good way.
• 21:38
  I I do agree there's something that actually is kind of removed
• 21:41
  when there's only when there's not a full field, when there's
• 21:44
  not a full aid or whatnot. That's that's points that are
• 21:46
  just not getting, you know, they're they're there.
• 21:48
  They should be given to someone. Someone should earn them.
• 21:51
  Change that. All right.
• 21:52
  I love it. Ben, thank you so much.
• 21:53
  Ben, thank you again for stepping up and being a great
• 21:56
  leader and representing the state of Alabama.
• 21:58
  We're doing these in alphabetical order.
• 22:00
  So you're the first one everybody's going to hear in our
• 22:04
  51. Many episodes here that we're
• 22:07
  going to do in the months of April and May.
• 22:09
  So Ben, thank you so much. Appreciate you.
• 22:11
  And you know everybody's going to ask are you Roll Tide or War
• 22:14
  Eagle? That's how we'll end it,
• 22:16
  Actually, both. I went, I did my undergraduate
• 22:19
  at Bama and I got my master's at Auburn.
• 22:22
  I make everybody mad. As I say, no one's going to
• 22:24
  believe it. No one's going to like it.
• 22:26
  Ben, thank you so much. Appreciate you.
• 22:27
  Thank you, Mike.