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Embracing Inner Liberation and Conscious Change with Kim Gross · The One Small Change Podcast

0:00
Hello, everybody. It's that time again. Welcome
0:04
to the one small change. And I'm thrilled that you took time
0:07
out of your schedule to spend time with us on this journey of
0:11
exploration and transformation. I'm Yvonne McCoy. I'm your host,
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and I bring almost 30 years of entrepreneurial experience and a passion
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for discovering growth through the power of seemingly small
0:23
change. So I really wanna thank you for joining me this
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week. And, I have somebody
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that is gonna rock your socks, somebody who's gonna really change
0:34
your world. In a very short conversation, she gave me so much to
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think about that I know that you're gonna leave here with some
0:41
amazing insights. And that person is
0:45
Kim Gross. Kim, thank you so much for taking time
0:49
to do this with us today. So,
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what what was the small change? What what do you do, and how
0:56
did that small change help you to do that? Okay. So
1:00
first of all, I'll start with what I do. I'm the
1:04
podcast host of Masks Off for People
1:08
Pleasers and Perfectionists, and I am
1:11
an author for my new book, Free to be
1:15
a Pathway to Inner Liberation.
1:19
Now masks I said masks offer people pleasers and perfectionists, and that
1:23
is because I am a recovering people pleaser
1:26
and perfectionist. And I've spent years
1:31
wearing those masks. And through
1:34
doing the inner work, personal development work, I
1:38
have transformed myself
1:41
into feeling more powerful.
1:45
One small change, one small event. That was a
1:49
pivotal defining moment for me
1:53
happened about 14 years ago.
1:57
And I went to a conference
2:01
in New York City. And my background is
2:05
that I'm an educator. So this particular conference
2:09
was on mindfulness in schools. I
2:13
had just become interested in learning about mindfulness. I was implementing it in
2:16
my own life, and I thought to myself, let's
2:20
learn about this mindfulness meditation in schools sounded
2:24
interesting. So I took the train
2:28
from Albany, New York all the way down to New York City,
2:32
and I did not
2:35
expect this person to
2:39
be the keynote speaker and that she would
2:44
be a life changing person in my life,
2:48
and she is she wrote the forward for my book.
2:52
Her name is doctor Shefali. I don't know if your listeners have heard of her.
2:56
She wrote the conscious parents. She's written many books
3:00
since then. And from the moment, Yvanda,
3:04
she started to speak, like, within 5 minutes,
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I just started sobbing. Mhmm.
3:11
I just started sobbing. She was speaking
3:15
to the wounded
3:19
child inside of me. She was speaking to,
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let me stop for a minute. At this time, my kids were probably
3:26
about 13 and 10. So she was speaking to
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the wounded child in me. She was speaking
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to the mom that
3:37
was disappointed in the way she was showing up.
3:41
She was speaking to the mom or the part of me that
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felt like I was a failure as a mom.
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So, again, going back to what she teaches and talks about
3:52
is conscious parenting. After that conference
3:57
well, first of all, I was shook into the core at the end of her
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speech and the whole train ride home. I'm like, oh my god. I'm the
4:04
worst mom ever. And just had all these thoughts and feelings
4:08
going on. And, oh my goodness. Oh my goodness. So I went
4:12
and looked her up. And at the time, her first
4:15
book, the conscious parent, was that maybe it wasn't her first. My maybe her
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second. I read the entire book, and then
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I took every course she offered. I read all of her
4:27
books. And what was so pivotable pivotal
4:31
about that one small change that had such big
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impact is that it wasn't about me being a
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different mom. It wasn't about me changing my kids.
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It was about me changing me, and it was
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about me looking at my patterns in the way I was
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showing up and how I was projecting so many
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of my insecurities, so many generational
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patterns onto my kids, the way my mom
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parented me, All of a sudden, I'm sounding like my mom,
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which I thought I would never sound like her. I and how many
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time I mean, I I I think all of us that have parents
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at some point have the words come out of your mouth and go, oh my
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god. I'm my mom. Do you know? Yes. You
5:19
know? And and I think the thing that that we don't realize
5:23
is that many of the behaviors that we have,
5:27
we got in childhood, and we got them from our parents
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mainly to keep us safe or to keep us from getting
5:35
hurt. Right? And they may have worked
5:39
then Yeah. But they don't work now. And I have to
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tell you that in the short conversation that we had about
5:46
a week or so ago, you you hit some chords
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with me that I was like, oh my god. I and and
5:54
I put them to work right away. So tell tell me more. Tell me more.
5:57
I don't Yeah. Absolutely. Well and you're so right.
6:00
We developed these patterns in childhood to protect
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ourselves. These masks that I talk about on my podcast,
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wearing a mask is a way of protection. It's
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okay. It's realizing first of all,
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let me preface to the listeners by saying that this is
6:19
all on a subconscious level. When we're kids, we don't know that we're
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doing this, but this is what we do. We
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learn whether it's from our mom or dad or who
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caregivers, coaches, teachers, society. We learn
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at some point that when we have tried to show up as our true
6:38
self, it backfired.
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It stung. It burned. It hurt
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us. We felt shamed. We felt our needs
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were unmet. We felt insecure, embarrassed,
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ridiculed, afraid. What a shame that I say shame, shame,
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shame. Right? Because that's a lot of what we feel is shame.
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And so then in order to avoid
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that kind of painful feeling, we find
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ways to protect ourselves.
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So for me, it was people pleasing and it was perfection.
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If I just learned how to please my mom and do what she
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wanted me to do, say what she wanted me to say, think what
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she wanted me to think, acquiesce to everything. Then
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in my little girl mind, I could control
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the situation. I thought I could keep her happy.
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And then I started to do the same with friends. If I wanted to
7:39
be fitting in or be liked or be popular, I
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did all the things that I thought I needed to do in order to
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be accepted. So we developed
7:50
these patterns, these masks, these skills, coping mechanisms,
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whatever you wanna call them. But as you just said, and
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it's so true, as adults, they don't
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work very well. And that's yeah. No. I'm sorry.
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But I I think the thing that that is so I mean, I think I
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know this, but when you hear it out loud, it it's stunning,
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is that this these are things that are so unconscious to
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us. Yes. That you know, because when you say it, it almost sounds like
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we're manipulating people that we are, you know, I'm gonna be this way so
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that but but that's not the case. The case is I mean and
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I said to you when I first started doing my webinars and I had one
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of my clients, you know, back me up, you know, I was going to be
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the professional. I was gonna be you know? And she said to me
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afterwards, I don't know who that person was at that webinar, but that's not
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the person that I love that coaches me. Mhmm.
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And I was a totally different person. It was like, you know, it it was
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kind of what I was taught in terms of that you always have to be
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the best, and then you go into corporate and and you repeat that it
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you know, you're climbing the ladder, you know. So you've got
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you're in that I gotcha kind of situation. So
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it's amazing. And we're taught to read the room. Right? Like,
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as a child, if you are,
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again, trying to protect yourself from getting in trouble,
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you read the room and you kind of you
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adapt from there. You camouflage from there. Again,
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you're a 100% right. We aren't doing this on a conscious level. We are
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just subconsciously learning. If I don't want my dad
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who's, you know, just had 10
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beers and is not in a good mood, I'm gonna be
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careful what I say. I'm gonna tiptoe around.
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And what that is called is an eggshell environment,
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which is trauma. Living in an eggshell environment
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is traumatic, and we don't think of that because we just
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think about trauma as being someone who's been in
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a horrific accident, somebody who went to war, something
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extreme sexual abuse, like big, big traumas,
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but there are little traumas. And that is one when you are walking around
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trying to censor all the time. Should I say this? Can
10:12
I can I cry? Can I cry as a kid? Can I
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feel my emotions? Can I be angry? We're
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not allowed to we were not allowed to, many of us.
10:23
Mhmm. And that is let me just say too, that is
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not to blame our parents. Right? At the time,
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were there times when I was a teenager and I hated my mom? Yeah. I
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did. I'm not gonna lie. Sometimes I hated her for how she made me
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feel. But in hindsight, now she's passed
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4 years ago. In hindsight, I know she
10:45
was doing the best she could with what she had. I know my
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mom had her own trauma, her own pain. She
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had a mother who was cold and uncaring and
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didn't nurture her. Her dad died when she was 10. Her
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sister died when she was 19 in a fire. And then she
11:03
started to help my grandmother take care of my 3 cousins. She
11:07
had so much trauma of her own, and she wasn't
11:11
taught how to feel her feelings and manage her emotions.
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So, yeah, when she got upset, did she rage?
11:18
Yeah. So she just didn't know any better. Right?
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When we know better, we do better. I and I think
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that the thing is that that kind of
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behavior was very acceptable because they didn't
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have a better role model. And you said almost the exact same thing that I
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say to my kids. I mean, as I started to be
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able to, delve into, you know, my childhood
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and look at different things that were happening, I would come home and say to
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my kids, did I do this to you? And they would go, yes.
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And I would go, oh my god. Did you know? And and so, you
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know, one of the things that I say to my kids is, I did the
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best that I could with what I had and what I know. Right?
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I'm trying to get better, and I'm sharing that with you. But guess what?
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You're an adult. You're gonna have to do your part too. You
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know? But but I think the other part to that is we're talking,
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you know, we're talking about family relationships, but this affects your
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relationships in business as well. I think
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that when you put on that mask, do
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you know I think alright. So as a child, I think you get to be
12:29
hyper vigilant. And what I know about stress
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is it's the small ongoing stress
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that wears you down more than a big
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major stress because you know that there's an end to it. Do you know?
12:44
You but the the ongoing that goes on for years and you and that's the
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kind of trauma that you have in in what you call the eggshell
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environment. And it's true because you're, like, just waiting for something you're waiting for
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the other shoe to drop, and you become almost hypervigilant,
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you know, to to you know, I I kind of explain it as if you
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ever saw a pack of, you know, feral dogs or something on the street, and
13:08
you come near them, they you know, I mean, any, you know
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and that's what it's like. You're living your life kinda like that. You know?
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And I I would just add in if I could. Yes. We're talking about
13:20
families and the home life, but if that is how you
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if that's how it was for you growing up and you didn't do anything
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to change it, and you're like that now in your own family, it's
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not like you're gonna compartmentalize that and just put it here. It
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can spill over into
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your professional life. It does. Yes.
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It does. It does. It's unconscious. You don't have the switch. Right. Say
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You don't have the most of us don't have the awareness that we're
13:51
wearing these masks and that we're carrying out these
13:54
patterns, and we do it in every facet of our
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lives. So it will impact your ability to
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be productive in business because you're
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having these subconscious under under the line of consciousness
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is what I say. This undercurrent always going on, and it's just
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gonna keep playing out. So so can you give us
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some examples of the way that shows up in business?
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Well, I think if a person is dealing with some
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perfectionistic tendencies, one of the things for a perfectionist
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and there's so many of us. So many of and we don't
14:32
even always recognize. That's the first problem is we're not aware,
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and you said, I know you're gonna ask me at some point for some steps,
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and maybe I'll just add the first one right now because it pertains
14:44
to the question you just asked. Is that we
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can't change that which we don't acknowledge.
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If we aren't aware of our patterns and
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how they're playing out, we're not gonna be able to change the behaviors. It's just
14:58
gonna keep running on that unconscious level. So let's
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say I have perfectionistic tendencies. Well, if I
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can't do all the things, let's say I have a
15:09
new project that I'm gonna work on and I can't do all
15:13
the things perfectly all at
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once. Cause that's what a perfectionist will wanna do.
15:21
I've gotta get all, like, I gotta figure it all out right away. Let's say
15:24
I'm learning something new on, like a new
15:28
platform. I'm trying to think of an example.
15:32
Let's just say I'm learning from my podcast. I'm learning how to use Descript. It's
15:36
an editing software, and that's gonna improve the
15:39
quality of my podcast. There's an example. Well, I've never used
15:43
Descript before. As a as a perfectionist, recovering
15:46
perfectionist. I start to figure it out. Oh my god. This is too hard. I
15:50
can't figure it out. It's not coming to me quickly enough, or I'm expecting
15:54
myself to be able to get it all at once without
15:58
a learning curve. Right? I'm just supposed to know all this stuff
16:01
and what can happen. And this is what
16:05
does happen is that if we can't do it all and do it
16:09
perfectly, we swing the pendulum to the other way
16:12
of I'm not gonna do it at all. Or we'll
16:16
procrastinate. Procrastination is huge, a
16:19
huge sign that you have perfectionistic tendencies
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because you keep putting off of that, which you
16:27
feel you are not good at and you can't be perfect at it.
16:30
So you just might as well avoid it. I'll just keep avoiding it because I'm
16:34
not good at it. I can't do it perfectly. So think about if you're in
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business, your own business, or you work for a corporation and there
16:41
are parts of the job or business that are hard for
16:45
you and you're not getting it right away or naturally or
16:49
easily, there's this tendency to want to give up
16:53
and just procrastinate and then not do it at all. And so you're not putting
16:56
forth your best effort. I call that the rubber band
17:00
effect. It's like you're you're learning something new and you're stretching and you're
17:04
stretching and you're stretching and finally go you know? And then
17:07
you're back to where you kinda where you where you start.
17:11
I think the other thing is and I could be
17:15
wrong, but I think the other thing is because we've got this mask and
17:19
we're profession, it's really hard for us to ask for help.
17:23
It's really hard for us to say to say, I don't
17:26
wanna do that. Okay. So now you just named
17:30
people pleasing as well. Right? Because people pleaser has such a hard time
17:34
speaking up and asserting herself or oneself and
17:37
say instead of boundary, like, no. I'm
17:41
sorry. I don't want to do this project, or this is not for
17:45
me. I I can't do this. Can you give to someone else? That's a 100%
17:48
true. And then going back to the perfectionist asking
17:52
for help, well, if I ask you for help, Yvonne,
17:56
that must mean that on some way, I'm not good enough or I'm not
18:00
capable or I'm less than. And so for me to ask you for
18:03
help shows weakness. Mhmm. And I can't I can't show
18:07
weakness. Mhmm. I have to show you that I can
18:11
do everything all on my own without help. And you know
18:15
Which is just so backwards. Right. And, you know, one of the ways that this
18:18
shows up, I think, is with delegation.
18:24
It's like one of the things that that the the way that it shows up
18:27
is that people tend to micromanage. And I see this so
18:31
much in entrepreneurs, where they pick somebody that has a great
18:34
skill set, and then they micromanage them in the mediocrity.
18:38
I mean, I actually saw an executive director
18:44
jump on an assistant because she didn't like the folders that
18:48
she had bought for a meeting to the point she
18:52
was in tears. And then she complained that the
18:56
person never showed any initiative again.
19:00
Right? Yes. I hear what you're saying. So
19:04
and that can we can even trace that back to childhood. So
19:08
imagine, right, when we were children that we were trying to do something new or
19:11
we were asserting ourselves, we were stretching our comfort zone. And
19:15
if we had a teacher or our parents say
19:19
something derogatory, something judgmental or critical,
19:23
we might have said, oh, okay. I'm not gonna do that again. So to your
19:26
example right there, if a were an employee or
19:30
worker business tries to take initiative to do something
19:34
and then is either ridiculed, reprimanded, criticized, or judged,
19:39
they're not gonna wanna put themselves out there. Who wants to keep putting themselves out
19:43
there and taking the risk of exposure
19:47
if you're going to be judged or criticized. But okay. So I'll
19:51
stop there for a second. Well, so because you and
19:55
I, when we talked before, we we just, you know, kept going.
19:58
So, so there are 2 things that I wanna make sure that we have time
20:02
for. So we already did step 1. So let's can you give us, like, 2
20:06
other steps? And then we need to talk about the freebie that you've got. Absolutely.
20:10
So first of all, I have my 5 step power pathway. So I really have
20:14
5 steps. And I wanna preface by saying that to do
20:17
this, the work that I talk about and that I teach about
20:21
is not simple and quick.
20:25
Right? It because what I'm talking about is doing personal development work.
20:29
I'm talking about doing the inner work, and I'm talking about peeling
20:32
back one layer at a time. So the work is hard and
20:36
the work takes time. But here's the here's the thing that
20:40
for your listeners to know about that is that when you do
20:43
this kind of work, it is long
20:47
lasting, deep healing work. It's not
20:50
like just go 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, do these 5 steps, check them off
20:54
your list, and then you maybe do it for a short period of time. And
20:58
then you go back to old patterns when you really do the
21:01
work, the inner work, it is deep and long lasting. However,
21:05
or, and that being said, so the first step is awareness. You
21:09
have to first be able to be aware of your patterns.
21:13
The second thing is once you're aware, if you are that
21:17
person, who's a perfectionist at your job or in business, and now
21:21
you're like, okay, I see it. You have to take ownership and
21:24
responsibility for making the changes because no one
21:28
out there is going to come and change it for you. And then
21:32
the 3rd step really is about doing the inner
21:35
healing work, which takes time. It takes
21:39
effort. You might even need help with a coach or a therapist to
21:43
really heal those wounds from childhood. And then
21:46
lastly, then you're able to start taking
21:50
some action. Right? Because in order to have real change in our lives,
21:53
we need to take action. And that's can include something like
21:57
boundary setting, learning to assert yourself, learning
22:01
to speak directly, and have
22:04
really good clear communication. So I know I just kinda
22:09
rambled that all together and try to do it concisely because I know we're short
22:13
on time and you wanted 3 steps. But that is, the
22:17
basis of my 5 step power pathway, which really
22:20
does allow for a person to have
22:24
true transformation. So before
22:28
we run out of time, you gotta tell us about the freebie because it's fabulous.
22:31
Okay. So the freebie is my 5 step power pathway. Okay.
22:35
Right? Which is beautiful. So then for someone who's like, oh, what is she talking
22:39
about? What is she talking about? My 5 step power pathway is a
22:42
PDF framework where it gives you questions that you
22:46
can answer and journal about, and it takes you more
22:49
into detail and depth through those 5 steps.
22:53
So the link will be
22:57
in the notes. Yep. And you definitely need to grab this because
23:00
it will make a huge difference. And if we had time, I would tell you
23:04
what happened to me this week after our conversation.
23:07
So I'm gonna ask you the magic question. When was the last time you did
23:11
something for the first time? Okay. So I'm gonna put a
23:15
little if it's okay, I'm gonna put a little caveat on the question
23:19
because it's the first time I did this in
23:23
over 40 years. So it feels first for me, which
23:27
is that this weekend, I took a ride
23:31
to the lake that I grew up on spending every
23:34
single summer from the age of 5 to 17, where I
23:38
knew my true self. I was connected to my true self. So
23:42
what I did for the first time this weekend in a very long
23:46
time is reconnect with that child
23:50
part of me, and it was amazing.
23:54
And I stopped on the way home, and this was a first. I stopped
23:57
and got ice cream that was soft
24:01
serve, and it was made with, I think, a custard.
24:05
And I never had that before, and it was the creamiest,
24:08
most delectable is that the word? Delightful
24:12
ice cream I've ever had in my life. So that's fabulous.
24:16
That was. Fantastic ice cream is definitely something.
24:20
And and, Kim, I wanna thank you because, like I said, in the
24:23
conversation that we had when we first met, I got so many
24:27
nuggets to to work with. And I wish we had more time,
24:31
but we don't. So you gotta listen to her podcast. You gotta download
24:34
her thing, and, we need to call it quits.
24:38
And so, you know, I have to say to you, the first step is for
24:41
you to subscribe and to share and to engage this podcast on social
24:45
media so that you can supercharge your business. And this is
24:49
my way of giving back to the community and helping you fuel your quest for
24:53
growth and an impact. So I wanna make sure that you join me on the
24:56
one small change and go on this journey with me that where even the
24:59
tiniest shift can yield a monumental
25:03
transformation. And if you haven't listened to the first episode to
25:06
see what we're about, you should do that, and there's some other great people
25:10
there. So, Kim, what would be the last words that we you would give
25:14
us? It's we live
25:18
one life, Take off your mask and be your true
25:21
self. That's great. So I'm
25:25
gonna say something that she said that changes can be simple, but
25:29
it's not always easy. It requires courage,
25:32
resilience, and a willingness to step out of your comfort zone.
25:36
So I hope you will join me for another episode of the One Small Change
25:40
as we embark on this on this, you know, this journey of
25:43
innovative possibilities. Until the next time,
25:47
I will see you, and I wanna make sure you stay curious. Kim,
25:51
thank you so much for giving us this great insight and this
25:55
great gift. Thank you so much, Yvonne, for having me.