Latest / Your Money, Your Rules | Financial Mastery, Wealth Mindset, Leadership Principles, Intuitive Decision-Making, Human Design / 96 | Avoiding Money Conversations with Your Spouse? 3 Simple Ways to Open the Conversation
Transcript
- 0:00Erin Gray: I'm curious do you and your spouse avoid talking about money together?
- 0:04Erin Gray: Does every financial discussion, or many of the financial discussions that you have, turn into stress, avoidance or sometimes even arguments?
- 0:13Erin Gray: I know that this is the way that it used to be for me in my relationship, and so I really am excited to talk to you about this in this podcast episode, because I think a lot of people experience this and, like everything else, we're probably not talking about it.
- 0:28Erin Gray: So today I'm going to share three simple ways to start the money conversation with your partner and to make it without turning into a fight.
- 0:37Erin Gray: If you're new around here, I want to say welcome, and if you've been here and listening for a while, I want to say thank you.
- 0:45Erin Gray: I want to offer come join me in my Facebook community Money Mindset Tips for Women in Business.
- 0:51Erin Gray: I really wanted to build a community of women that I created a safe space for to share what you were going through, to share my practical tips and advice that I've used to work through my money mindset and blocks that I've used with clients, and really create a community and a safe space where women can go and talk about money in a way that isn't triggering and if we are feeling triggered, that you know that you have people that are here for you, that have either been where you have been or have worked through it and can help you.
- 1:28Erin Gray: You can search for the group on Facebook.
- 1:31Erin Gray: It's just called Money Mindset Tips for Women in Business, and I'll also include it in the show notes where you can just click and join.
- 1:37Erin Gray: But I would love to see you inside the community.
- 1:40Erin Gray: Do you want to create a system to stop avoiding your money?
- 1:43Erin Gray: Maybe you're feeling guilt and shame when it comes to finances.
- 1:46Erin Gray: Welcome to your Money, your Rules.
- 1:49Erin Gray: I'm Erin, a former certified financial planner and CFO, and yet I used to avoid my money and had fear, no matter how much we had.
- 1:57Erin Gray: I can't wait to teach you how I overcame my money avoidance and started consistently managing my finances in a really simple way it's time to get comfortable with money.
- 2:07Erin Gray: Okay, so let's talk about why couples why I think couples avoid money conversations.
- 2:17Erin Gray: I'm going to kind of share my experience over the last probably 10 years, like the first 10 years of our relationship, and I was the one that was probably more what I say volatile when it comes to money, and when I say volatile, probably just more stress.
- 2:32Erin Gray: Right, I was the one that was always feeling stressed, creating the stress, creating the tension, always thinking not enough, not good enough, not enough, not saving enough, not having enough, like it was all around.
- 2:45Erin Gray: Inadequacy, stress, fear, shame, guilt, like all those lower vibration emotions.
- 2:51Erin Gray: So I think that it boils down to several things actually.
- 2:58Erin Gray: You know what, what type of experience you had growing up with money, our emotional baggage and our past experiences.
- 3:08Erin Gray: You know many of us bring all those childhood money beliefs into our relationship.
- 3:14Erin Gray: I know, I did, and unless we're aware of it, unless we are conscious of this and we are actively taking steps to change this, we're just going to recreate it in our relationship.
- 3:26Erin Gray: A lot of times, people have a fear of conflict, right?
- 3:30Erin Gray: So if past money conversations, either within your relationship, within previous relationships, even in your childhood, they've led to stress or disagreements or arguments or even fights, avoidance feels a lot easier, right?
- 3:48Erin Gray: I think we also have different types of money personalities.
- 3:52Erin Gray: I mean, if you were to my husband has definitely changed over the last, you know, 15, 17 years.
- 3:58Erin Gray: We got married on the same day we met, so I know I should know how many years we've been married.
- 4:02Erin Gray: I don't, um, we got married in 2009.
- 4:05Erin Gray: So you know, over the last and we were, we met on 2007.
- 4:09Erin Gray: So what are we at?
- 4:11Erin Gray: Almost 18 years now, I think.
- 4:12Erin Gray: So, being together for 18 years, he has changed a lot.
- 4:17Erin Gray: I have changed a lot.
- 4:18Erin Gray: I know I'm not the same person that I was and I definitely came to the table originally being the saver more I should probably say order.
- 4:27Erin Gray: I wouldn't even say saver, I would say order, um.
- 4:30Erin Gray: And he was probably more of a spender and he kind of had a a thought process of it's okay, I'll just go make more money.
- 4:39Erin Gray: And I was like, how can we save more money?
- 4:42Erin Gray: And so, if you have different types of personalities, if you have someone who's constantly trying to save and you have someone who's kind of more on the side of spending, that can create some tension within the relationship, right.
- 4:55Erin Gray: So, recognizing what type of personality that you are, that will be helpful.
- 5:00Erin Gray: And I always try to, you know, in the moment when we're in that fight, flight, freeze, bond response it can be difficult, right, because our, our prefrontal cortex has gone offline and we're just in the moment.
- 5:13Erin Gray: But if we can come at it with some curiosity and we can start to have more compassion for ourselves, for sure, and our partner, and not make it look like he's just trying to do this because X, y, z, but like really getting curious, and why did he make this decision?
- 5:33Erin Gray: We can kind of step into their shoes.
- 5:36Erin Gray: It helps diffuse these conversations.
- 5:42Erin Gray: I also have seen and this has probably been true in my relationship too like the power dynamic right If one person there's been times where my husband has earned more than I have.
- 5:51Erin Gray: Dynamic right If one person there's been times where my husband has earned more than I have, I've earned more than he has.
- 5:59Erin Gray: So if one person earns more or handles most of the financial decisions which I have typically been the person that's handled most of the financial decisions I always make him aware.
- 6:05Erin Gray: But there was a time where there was a lot of frustration that I felt in our relationship because I it felt like I was the one carrying all the weight right, like I was the one making all of the financial decisions.
- 6:16Erin Gray: I was the one talking to our financial planner, I was the one doing all the things and it led to me feeling I was feeling a little of resentment, like I want a partner that participates and so you might have this imbalance and it can create, like I said, that resentment and so really catching yourself of like.
- 6:36Erin Gray: Do I feel like I'm always the one that's having to?
- 6:40Erin Gray: You know, bring things up, am I?
- 6:43Erin Gray: Is it like a slow simmer, and do you need to address it versus suppress it and push it away?
- 6:50Erin Gray: To address it versus suppress it and push it away?
- 6:56Erin Gray: The other thing that might play into account is within your human design chart.
- 6:58Erin Gray: I don't have a full blown study on this, but what I have noticed from the clients that I have coached, the other women I've talked to and like looking at different charts, most of the time I wouldn't say all, but a lot of the times you have one spouse who is defined in their solar plexus and one that isn't.
- 7:18Erin Gray: And the person in my situation I have a defined solar plexus, he does not, and so that center because I feel I mean we all feel our emotions, but he, the way that he has described it with me is that he can feel what I am feeling when I am upset or tense, right, he feels that in his body.
- 7:44Erin Gray: And so what I have recognized for people that do not have a defined solar plexus is sometimes they are more so avoidant of money, because that intensity, that energy in the body is so intense it's almost just like I don't want to address it because it's so intense in the body.
- 8:06Erin Gray: I'll just avoid it.
- 8:08Erin Gray: And then you put that with someone like me, who is defined, who has all of these money stories, all of this baggage when it comes to money, and I come at it with like stress and tension and why can't we do better?
- 8:24Erin Gray: And all of this like it, it it could feel, I could see how for him it could feel very intense and like I don't like that's scary right.
- 8:32Erin Gray: Like, of course, as a 40 or 35, 45 year old man, like that's not what he's thinking, but the body subconsciously, that is right.
- 8:42Erin Gray: And so really just kind of getting clear on where are you defined in your solar plexus?
- 8:48Erin Gray: Is your spouse defined?
- 8:49Erin Gray: And and like kind of just using that as a guide and this is something that I can help with, you know, if we work one-on-one together but like really understanding, do you have an emotional wave and are you trying to talk about finances when you are heightened or have you been able to feel your emotions and then come to it with a very calm conversation?
- 9:11Erin Gray: So, three simple ways I think that we can start to open the money conversation is, first and foremost is to change the approach, right?
- 9:21Erin Gray: So instead of starting with stress which is what I used to always do like I would never come out and be like, like, look at how well we're doing it was always like doom and gloom.
- 9:31Erin Gray: So, instead of starting with the stress of the debt and the bills and the expenses right, because what you focus on you're going to get more of start with dreams and goals and wants.
- 9:42Erin Gray: Right, start with what's already working.
- 9:45Erin Gray: Who wants to have a conversation when you know it's going to be all about what we're doing wrong?
- 9:51Erin Gray: Like, of course, I mean, if for my spouse, I would totally be like, yeah, I mean, if I had to deal with Aaron back then of course I would avoid it.
- 9:59Erin Gray: Like, why do I want to have a conversation where it feels like I'm doing everything wrong and I can't do anything good enough, and it's always the stressful conversation, like, of course.
- 10:09Erin Gray: So start with what's already working.
- 10:12Erin Gray: Something like you can say you know, like I would love for us to if you want, like I always go to travel, like I would love for us to take a vacation next year, how can we start planning for that now, you know, really get into using future focused, team oriented language, cause you really are a team, right?
- 10:30Erin Gray: Like at some point you decided that they were amazing and you wanted to be together and so really starting to use that we language versus you did this, or I think very rarely we say we did something wrong, right.
- 10:45Erin Gray: So really starting to get into we right, you know.
- 10:50Erin Gray: Another example could be like I want us to feel financially secure together.
- 10:54Erin Gray: So how can we create a money plan that works for both of us, setting that more, higher frequency, higher vibrational tone instead of one that's more like critical and blame in the shame game?
- 11:11Erin Gray: Okay, so the next suggestion is I think I don't think that there's ever a right time right and setting, but I do think that there are better times right, when, if he's just come home from work or you've just had a fight, might not be the best time to talk about money, right.
- 11:31Erin Gray: So avoid bringing up money during those stressful moments, like right after a bill arrives, like if you are triggered by something.
- 11:39Erin Gray: You get a bill in the mail and then you're triggered and then this was me so often I would want to have a conversation about right now, and the reason why we want to have a conversation about that is because we want the feeling to go away.
- 11:50Erin Gray: Conversation about that is because we want the feeling to go away.
- 11:55Erin Gray: But the moment that we recognize we can feel the feeling, not have the conversation and we can allow the feeling to pass and then we can have a conversation.
- 12:02Erin Gray: Everything changes.
- 12:04Erin Gray: So, recognizing, am I trying to get rid of a feeling because of how I'm feeling in my body?
- 12:11Erin Gray: Let me get to neutrality.
- 12:13Erin Gray: Let me call my nervous system a little bit before I have this conversation.
- 12:19Erin Gray: Um, also choosing, you know, a more relaxed, a neutral time.
- 12:24Erin Gray: Maybe it's over coffee, maybe it's on a walk with the two of you, like, what I've noticed with my spouse is like, if we get in a car together, I'm golden for like an hour and a half, right, he?
- 12:35Erin Gray: He loves to drive and talk, he loves to walk and talk, and so I know that those are ways that I can, that I can have an hour with him to talk about, not that we have to talk about money for an hour, but it allows me that time to have these conversations, versus me expecting him to sit down and sit at the table for an hour hour and a half and frame it more like a check-in versus confrontation, right, like hey, I was thinking how do you feel about our finances right now?
- 13:08Erin Gray: And just let them speak like and ask a question, and just allow them to like, put your thoughts, put your feelings just over to the side for a hot second and just let them tell you how they feel without you interrupting, without you, you know, piping in and giving what you think, like so often.
- 13:28Erin Gray: I think we want our spouses to participate, but if we're constantly telling them and interrupting them, it can sometimes make it difficult for them to open up to us and feel safe to do so.
- 13:39Erin Gray: So keep it short, keep it.
- 13:42Erin Gray: I don't even want to say non-intimidating.
- 13:43Erin Gray: What's the opposite of that?
- 13:44Erin Gray: Just keep it open and keep it short, keep it.
- 13:44Erin Gray: I don't even say non-intimidating.
- 13:44Erin Gray: What's the opposite of that?
- 13:45Erin Gray: Just keep it open and keep it.
- 13:46Erin Gray: Curious, right, money conversations they don't have to be long, like I said.
- 13:50Erin Gray: I mean I don't talk money for an hour, like after a while his eyeballs roll in the back of his head.
- 13:55Erin Gray: So keep it short and don't and make it light, right, and I would say in the beginning, short.
- 14:06Erin Gray: Sometimes the energy might feel too much if you haven't been discussing money or if it's always been a bone and contention, right?
- 14:12Erin Gray: So it's almost like you're going to have to, in a way, retrain the nervous system, for you and also probably your partner as well.
- 14:19Erin Gray: Right, because the expected conversation and what has been expected to happen is to be either an argument or a blame game.
- 14:27Erin Gray: And so keeping it short, keeping it uh, we language versus criticism can really help.
- 14:35Erin Gray: And, like I mentioned already, I think using I statements and really active listening.
- 14:41Erin Gray: And when I say active listening, what I mean is not ready to have your comment after he has said what he wants to say, I mean letting him just talk.
- 14:54Erin Gray: Right, instead of blaming or accusing, expressing how you feel, right, make it.
- 14:59Erin Gray: This is the way I feel.
- 15:00Erin Gray: When we don't do X, y, z, I feel like this.
- 15:03Erin Gray: Not you make me feel this way, but I feel this way.
- 15:06Erin Gray: I don't feel safe when we don't, when we don't talk about our money on a consistent basis, right?
- 15:12Erin Gray: Um, so using either that we language or I want to, instead of more like you, pointing the finger.
- 15:19Erin Gray: That feels very accusational.
- 15:21Erin Gray: So, instead of saying you never save money or you never helped me sit down and look at the money, say I feel anxious when we don't look at our money together on a consistent basis, right?
- 15:34Erin Gray: Or I feel anxious when we overspend.
- 15:37Erin Gray: Or I feel X, y, z, like what is it that you feel?
- 15:41Erin Gray: And not that it's his job to make you feel any certain way, but just expressing it from like that more little, in a way a little child, right?
- 15:51Erin Gray: If a little child were to come to you and say I feel scared when you don't tell me what's going on, how much is that more received than someone yelling at you?
- 16:02Erin Gray: Maybe this doesn't happen overnight which it's for sure didn't with me but like, listen with curiosity, listen with openness, not defensiveness, right?
- 16:12Erin Gray: Your partner probably has their own money story, their own money fears, their own stress, and if they're anything like my partner, like our partners, really just want to make us happy, and a lot of times they don't know how and it's not their job to make us happy.
- 16:29Erin Gray: And also, I think, part of that masculine, feminine energy of sharing with your spouse, because if they don't know how you feel, how can they do their part to start changing their relationship with money, or the two of you together as a couple's relationship with money.
- 16:52Erin Gray: And so really being clear on how you feel, listening to what they are saying, and asking open-ended questions, like I always like to start with.
- 17:07Erin Gray: Like what's going well, like, what do you think is working well for us financially already?
- 17:12Erin Gray: What did we do well this month on?
- 17:16Erin Gray: What would we like to change or do differently?
- 17:19Erin Gray: Like really starting to put because the mind is already going to think of all the things it's going to go immediately to all of the air quotes, negative things.
- 17:28Erin Gray: So start with what's going well, what is working, what would you like to do more of that you're already doing, that you really enjoyed.
- 17:36Erin Gray: And then, if you do have concerns cause I don't think we should Pollyanna it right, like if there are concerns, bring them up, but bring it up in a way that is open and inviting and not defensive.
- 17:49Erin Gray: Okay, so those are my three tips.
- 17:51Erin Gray: One, change your approach right.
- 17:53Erin Gray: Make it about shared goals, the two of you, your team, together.
- 17:57Erin Gray: Choose a better time and setting that's more conducive to having these conversations that can support both of you.
- 18:03Erin Gray: And then, using I statements or how you feel, and actively listening and, like I always say on the podcast, listening to this is excellent, great first step, but what actually changes, what actually creates change in your life, is when you take action.
- 18:20Erin Gray: So this week I want you to pick one of those approaches and start a small money conversation with your partner.
- 18:28Erin Gray: I also want you to leave expectations at the door.
- 18:31Erin Gray: So don't go in with I'm going to do this and it's going to be a certain way.
- 18:36Erin Gray: Just go in with one of these suggestions and see how it turns out, and see how it's different than in the past.
- 18:43Erin Gray: And if you want support and a community, come join my Facebook group Money Mindset Tips for Women in Business.
- 18:50Erin Gray: Join the community so that you can get support, help, a community of other women entrepreneurs just like you that are working through some of the things that you're going through, and so it feels a little less scary and a lot more safe.
- 19:07Erin Gray: You can go to the Facebook group.
- 19:09Erin Gray: You could just click on search groups under Facebook and search money mindset tips for women in business, or you can click on the link in the show notes and find us there.
- 19:18Erin Gray: Okay, until next time.
- 19:19Erin Gray: Thank you for listening, for being here, for spending your time with me.
- 19:23Erin Gray: I'll see you in the next episode.
- 19:24Erin Gray: Did you learn something today?
- 19:26Erin Gray: Do you know another female entrepreneur who might be avoiding her money.
- 19:30Erin Gray: Will you send this episode over to her for me and, if you have it in you, please leave me a review for this podcast.
- 19:38Erin Gray: It helps the show grow and I love hearing from you.
- 19:41Erin Gray: See you next week.