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From Farmland to Future Plans: Navigating Real Estate and Rural Shifts with Evan Stone · Conservation Stories

• 0:00
  Speaker A: Foreign.
• 0:18
  Speaker B: Welcome back again to another episode of Conservation Stories. Conservation Stories is the podcast brought to you by the Sand Hill Area Research Association. I'm your host, Hillary Tibman Sims, and I'm excited today to have a good friend with me. So, Evan, I was trying to think the other day how we even met, and I really don't even know, but I am sure grateful that we did. Evan is a realtor here in Lubbock and has been very graciously helping my parents above and beyond just the normal. Like it's kind of a. Holistically what you're doing for my parents. It's really exciting. So I appreciate you being here.
• 0:58
  Speaker A: Yeah. Well, thanks for having me. I think I can fill in a couple of gaps on how we met.
• 1:03
  Speaker B: Was it a gorilla? It was a gorilla.
• 1:05
  Speaker A: Well, I think it goes back before that. I think you and my wife Celie got to know each other through her endeavors at tech.
• 1:13
  Speaker B: I think that's right.
• 1:15
  Speaker A: And she came home one day and she said, I met the coolest lady ever. You need to get on the phone with her. So I think that's right. I called you one evening and middle of the evening and I looked up and I had been sitting on my front porch for two and a half hours and we had uncovered all that was wrong with the world.
• 1:34
  Speaker B: We had probably. That's probably. Unfortunately, we didn't fix it, I guess.
• 1:38
  Speaker A: Because we gave it a good, good old college drive, so.
• 1:42
  Speaker B: That's right. I forgot about that.
• 1:44
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 1:44
  Speaker B: Yeah. Celie works at Texas Tech. She works for the Davis College.
• 1:48
  Speaker A: That's correct.
• 1:49
  Speaker B: She helps them with all things fundraising and development and that kind of stuff. You guys recently went to Dubai?
• 1:56
  Speaker A: Yeah, that's right. We went to Dubai late last year, actually. No, it was early this year, early 2025. She had an opportunity to. To kind of check out some new agriculture technologies that, that are going on out there. And it made a lot of sense for, for me, I'm. I'm kind of a geek when it comes to irrigation and farms. So I thought, man, I'm going to take on this opportunity too. So we spent about a week out there. We got to see some of the most interesting farms out that I could ever dream of. Farming in the Middle east isn't easy. And we think we are in a desert. We are not in a desert, comparatively speaking. So. So yeah, some of their irrigation technologies that they've come up with are really ingenious. We're actually Texas Tech and Seeley's endeavors are in conversation with those Guys, right now thinking about bringing some of that stuff over to figure out if it would work in the high plains, in the Cotton belt. I'm also kind of talking with them in the event that we can make some of this stuff work and retrofit to our practices here. We may be seeing some commercialization opportunities out of it, and so we'll be doing that, too.
• 3:17
  Speaker B: That's great. That's great. Well, I need to. I need to get Sealy on the. On the podcast and talk about what she's doing over there at the college and all the stuff that. There's a lot of things happening over there.
• 3:28
  Speaker A: There are. She's. She'll be happy to. First of all, a lot going on, and there's more being added to the plate every day. I think, you know, outside looking in, you know, a little background. Celie. We operated. We own and operated a farm for a lot of years, and we had the opportunity to exit out of the livestock portion of our. Our business, and that was really what Sealy managed on a daily. So when we made that deal, we. It had been done for, I don't know, five minutes, and she came in the house one day and she said, I want to go back to school and get my doctorate. I had never considered that before, and I. I guess she hadn't considered it much, but I said, well, you know, let's go, you know, look into this. And five minutes later, she was in school getting her doctorate. But I say all that to say from, you know, the farm perspective. We think about, you know, Texas Tech University being an agriculture school, so on and so forth, but we kind of, at least in my mind, I always viewed it as a pretty static endeavor, you know, and, well, kids just go there to get their agriculture degree, then they go do X, Y or Z. Right. And it's really been enlightening over the last four or five years to see their growth, to see their. Their goals. You know, Dr. Crabill is not. He's not afraid to set some pretty big goals. And I think we're going to be surprised to see, you know, in a decade where that's where that school sits, as far as, you know, the national rankings or however you want to want to look at that.
• 5:05
  Speaker B: Right.
• 5:05
  Speaker A: But. But I believe all the agriculture teams are striding forward. You know, I think they. If I'm not the authority here. But I do hear they've started an NIL fund for all the judging kids. So now all of a sudden, you know, we've. We've got the means to, to bring in national spotlight type of kids. And I think it's already starting to show, you know, in their, in their accolades.
• 5:30
  Speaker B: So yeah, it's, it has been really. I mean, I remember the first time I met Dr. Crabel and was like, something good's about to happen here.
• 5:37
  Speaker A: Absolutely.
• 5:38
  Speaker B: Yeah, something good's about to happen here. He just, I mean, he just fits us.
• 5:43
  Speaker A: I think that that is the best statement about him is he fits us. He might as well be in Lubbock, Texas for the last 50 years.
• 5:51
  Speaker B: Exactly, exactly.
• 5:53
  Speaker A: He understands all the players. He, you know, so often I see other schools and other endeavors getting really pigeonholed into we're livestock or we're row crop farming or we're regenerative or this or that. The other. And he really sees, seems to understand the entire scope of, of agriculture in today's world and where it needs to go and what things need to happen in order to get it there.
• 6:23
  Speaker B: I really appreciate, you know, that he recognizes the problem and opportunities we have with water.
• 6:28
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 6:29
  Speaker B: I mean, you know, I see him really giving some really great leadership at tech the room to really bring in some good people, you know, and I've just, I've been super impressed with what's going on there. But we didn't actually come here to talk about Texas.
• 6:45
  Speaker A: I don't sit here going like, man, all those things are great.
• 6:51
  Speaker B: So let's, let's go back to how Evan got on this winding road to real estate because you mentioned farming. So where'd you grow up? Give us a little bit of your background.
• 7:02
  Speaker A: Yeah. So I claim Seminole, Texas to be home.
• 7:05
  Speaker B: Okay.
• 7:06
  Speaker A: My grandparents were there my whole entire life. I lived the early years of my life in Lubbock. At 7, I moved to Roswell, New Mexico and was out there with my parents until just the start of high school and my parents moved to Seminole. It was one of those deals. My, my children now are the same way with our grand or with their grandparents, my parents. But you know, come weekend school holiday, summer, you know, summertime, they're headed to grandma and grandpa's house. Right. And so I spent the majority of all of my summers growing up in Seminole. Was introduced to agriculture there through my granddad. I did come up here to tech for a minute before I left, before they asked me to leave. But I, yeah, I made my way back down to Seminole and that was my first professional job down there. Was, was in sales at the John Deere house. Spent a few years there. And at the time that that organization was growing really Rapidly So they kind of took the young single salesman and tossed them around all the different locations as they were, as they were growing just to kind of have a homebody, you know, there. And so I spent five or six years just kind of traveling around selling out of each location. I'll fast forward a couple chapters and Celie and I met and that's when I started farming was, was with her. And so that's, that is finally you.
• 8:46
  Speaker B: Had a family to take care of so you decided to farm.
• 8:48
  Speaker A: Yeah, it makes sense, doesn't it? Right. So we were a little bit more of a diversified, you know, business than most farms. So we, we raised shows show sheep. We also raised lots of forage crops and cotton on top of that.
• 9:04
  Speaker B: Were you on Gaines County?
• 9:05
  Speaker A: No, we actually, we were in Rawls in, in Crosby county. And then I later on moved most of our row crop operation into Lubbock County. So yeah, we, we did that for, for some years and in doing so I really started figuring out that buying farms and rehabbing farms and improving them was a lot more profitable than trying to farm them for the long haul. So, so did that for numerous years and just buy and sell farms here and there and, and through that I, I, that's really where I, I found the passion for real estate that I have. And so we did that again for, for I don't know, 10 years. I kind of, I don't know, looked up, we retired from farming and said, hey, let's go pursue, let's go pursue real estate and full time journey. So today kind of have, I guess what I would consider, you know, numerous different levels of that. I help like you said, your mom and dad. I really love to help, you know, retiring farmers.
• 10:13
  Speaker B: Right. You know, yeah, that's what I've seen. You're really gifted at the people that are walking through that transition.
• 10:20
  Speaker A: Yeah. So that, that to me is the most rewarding thing. I mean, yes, I do work with more your hard nose investors that are just looking to, you know, turn profit and run businesses. But what's fun for me is to sit down with somebody who's retiring. Maybe they're you know, needing to also, you know, move homes, you know, like, like your parents. And I think that gives me the ability to kind of half of it is business. Right. And the other half is that, you know, comfort level of we've got to find them four walls that they can, you know, live, live the rest of their life in a secure, rewarding place.
• 11:16
  Speaker B: Today's episode is brought to you by Evan Stone. With Clear Rock Farm and Ranch, part of the Clear Rock Realty Group in Lubbock, Texas, Evan understands West Texas land, agriculture and what it takes to buy and sell farms and ranches in our unique region. If you're ready to make your next move, trust someone who knows the lay of the land. Visit Evan at clearrockrealty.com serving Lubbock and the surrounding communities, Clear Rock Farms and Ranch, your partner on the plains.
• 11:49
  Speaker A: So, yeah, that's, that's kind of one level of, of my real estate endeavors. Another one. We're, we're big in the short term rental world. Okay. I, I say we're big. We want to be big in, in the short term rental world. So Celia and I bought our first house last year that we're, we're doing with that. I'm, I'm also kind of a data geek, so it took us about three years to find that place. Lubbock, you know, known as the Hub City, brings in a lot of people from, you know, the Plainview area that just want to get out of town for two days and come, come to the big city.
• 12:32
  Speaker B: Yeah. And the place you guys have this is, is absolutely perfect because it has a pool.
• 12:36
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 12:37
  Speaker B: So that when I saw that come up on like my Facebook that, that you guys had got, had bought that house for a bnb, I was like. Because I remember my parents bringing us and we would cram into like a. Well, it was the Embassy Suites, I think that, you know, right there everybody went to the, everybody went there. Everybody went there, you know, and, but because they had a pool.
• 12:57
  Speaker A: Yeah. And so that was, that was definitely higher list. Back to the, you know, data driven deal is is there's numerous tools out there today that can kind of help us help direct where that demand really is. So pool is one on our list. Much harder to find. Beyond pool was every bedroom in our Airbnb today has in suite bathrooms. So we're, it's a four bed, five bath. Our thinking behind that was there's, you know, all sorts of sports teams where you, you kind of know your son's teammates, parents, but you really don't.
• 13:35
  Speaker B: Right.
• 13:36
  Speaker A: And this would give you the ability to share that space because ultimate it is really like four hotel rooms with a lot of common area. And so it really is flexible for, you know, we have a lot of professional people that come in. Maybe it's a, it's a team meeting, maybe it's a team training. You know, now we aren't, you know, stepping over people in the middle of the night trying to get to the.
• 13:59
  Speaker B: Restroom or what have you and you're awkwardly sharing that.
• 14:02
  Speaker A: Exactly.
• 14:03
  Speaker B: Somebody you don't really know.
• 14:05
  Speaker A: Yeah, so. So that was really our goals behind that to date. It's proven out to be exactly what we expected it to be. So really last year was. Was focused around, hey, let's figure out all the things that we've done wrong and do them better. Okay. So. So I'm proud to say that today we don't have any stays that are not five star rated. I think we're over 80 different clients at this point in a year that have done that. So we feel like we did pretty good there. So. So now it is just a function of. Let's scale this. We're right now actively looking in one size class smaller. So when that. Right. Property comes up, we've got a ton of people that inquire, inquire about that property that we currently have, but it's just a little too big. Right, right. And so the price of it just gets a little bit out of reach. So we feel like one smaller is the next step. And then the step preceding that one would be one larger. So we'd like to find maybe a five or six bedroom on some acreage again with a pool. And that would give your team ropers a great opportunity to bring in their horse trailers, have a place to park.
• 15:16
  Speaker B: Right.
• 15:17
  Speaker A: Three or four families could share it, you know, and have that kind of.
• 15:21
  Speaker B: Well, and you know, I think that while ago you flippantly referred to our lovely neurodivergent add lifestyles that we live. And you know, that is like a strength and a curse. You know what I mean? It is what you make it. And what I hear you saying is like, you have had so many interests, so many broad interests that you understand what people that are involved in all of these broad interests, what they need.
• 15:55
  Speaker A: Yeah. So I really. Not to toot my own horn, but where my focus has been with most everything I've done in life, and definitely everyone that's been successful is to really be the empathetic one in the room. I mean, if. If I can't hop into your shoes and understand where you're coming from, it's going to be really difficult for me to be successful in helping you achieve whatever goals those might be, whether that be Airbnb for the weekend or whether that might be an $8 million farm purchase.
• 16:31
  Speaker B: Right.
• 16:31
  Speaker A: For me, it's really important to be able to see it from that side of the well.
• 16:34
  Speaker B: And you know something, I think My mom, she put. She said that I think is so telling. She said I didn't realize how important a real estate agent was.
• 16:45
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 16:46
  Speaker B: You know, in partly because we've just always bought and sold without. You know what I mean? And just farms or you know, like my parents have moved, you know, once and they bought the house that their wedding shower was in. You know what I'm saying? Like, you know, so there's just never been that, you know, recognition of the value.
• 17:07
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 17:08
  Speaker B: That agents bring. And I've. I recently been studying for my license. We won't talk about for how long. I had no idea either. Until I started. I'm like, okay, there's a lot this goes into this as far as the education goes and the value that, that you bring. And I've seen it personally and with, with your, with your help with my parents and we've had a couple of different lawyers on and one particular talking about secession plans. And there's. There's a lot of people at that stage that are moving into that stage of life and you know, we're going to see those people need to move into. Love it. They're. They're going to be doing what my parents are doing.
• 17:49
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 17:50
  Speaker B: And it's a huge. You're in such a unique place because you understand it all.
• 17:57
  Speaker A: I wouldn't go that far.
• 17:59
  Speaker B: But when you're like everybody with add, you know enough about all of it.
• 18:04
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 18:05
  Speaker B: To be helpful in. And not only maybe what you don't know, you know, the person who does know.
• 18:10
  Speaker A: Yeah. So a couple things to. To flesh out there. First of all, I appreciate the kind words. I look at every real estate transaction again, whether it's moving, you know, retirees to Lubbock off the farm and you know, ensuring that they are in a. Maybe they need some additional cash flow. So maybe we're talking about. Maybe they're sitting on a ton of equity. What happens to that equity? Are we going to talk about maybe an owner finance situation that happens a lot in farm ground. Maybe we're talking about rolling that equity into a commercial endeavor that can produce that. Either that or working with an investor that's just trying to grab up some more land and increase their portfolio size. I look at every one of these transactions literally like a minefield. My job, my job is to drag my clients from one side of that minefield to the next. What mines are going to blow up between here and there and yonder. I had better find them before they do and keep ahead of that curve.
• 19:09
  Speaker B: And I think you Know, maybe people that are listening that have been in just, they've, they've had a 9 to 5 job or you know, they are the ones that are serving us in businesses here in town might not understand the complexity that goes into these situations that my parents are in.
• 19:25
  Speaker A: Sure. So your parents are a really interesting case study. They had a very diverse property that we're, we're currently under contract and about to get closed. But yeah, we had to get fairly creative to one market it just in general to, to find the right buyers that would maximize their return, their, their return that they deserved. They've put a lifetime of effort into this property and, and the way they had it set up worked well for them. Is there that many people else out there that, that it works well for? Probably not. So we had to get, you know, a little bit creative. We did chop the property up into different pieces. You know, we were able to, to market one and sell one and use that cash to, to take care of all sorts of mortgage issues and things.
• 20:21
  Speaker B: Like that, things that farmers have.
• 20:23
  Speaker A: Right. And then leave the second property that sits free and clear. And we were able to negotiate a wonderful owner finance situation for them that not only is going to get them moved to Lubbock, they'll have plenty of opportunity with the cash in hand to put a down payment on house if they want to or whatnot. But the largest thing is that annualized cash flow that now all of a sudden they can hang out and they've got plenty of running around money. That note should supersede their lifetime and so they can really sit back and enjoy the relaxed lifestyle that they deserve this point in their life.
• 21:03
  Speaker B: And I think, I think the thing that I'm, I'm, I'm certain that my mom just thought it couldn't be done, you know, and I can remember being like, no one's going to buy this land. No one's going to want to buy. I'm like, I promise you, people want to buy land.
• 21:14
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 21:15
  Speaker B: You know what I mean? And people understand the long term investment that's in land and that's a good, you know, something for us to talk about that is, you know, when you have those people that are looking at the, the long term value of buying farmland. Yeah, it really does. It's really worth it.
• 21:37
  Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. The, the first rule of thumb I operate under, in, in this regard, there's always more buyers than there are sellers. Land values wouldn't be what they are today without more people wanting it than wanting to get rid of it. So, so I think that does drive value. Secondly, I think we got to look at where we sit, you know, geographically within the United States, every acre will be used for some purpose every single year. So, you know, if we swapped hats real quick and talked about commercial and we wanted to build a gas station, let's just use that, for instance, you know, if you have a high traffic area today and build a gas station and get knee deep in it, you know, there's nothing that says that a new road's not going to be built next year and going to divert that traffic around it. Right. So that's part of the risk in that. What we enjoy in the agriculture sector is it doesn't really matter where that cotton is geographically sitting for many purposes. It doesn't matter. The same thing with all the rest of your crops. Same thing with grassland for cattle or grazing in general. You know, so we, we know that we've got a use for it 365 days a year. And in doing that now it just becomes a game of what's the highest and best use of that. Right. And that's really what's going to drive, drive value. It's, it's really interesting to me. In today's world, we're not sitting in a positive cotton market.
• 23:15
  Speaker B: Right. Right.
• 23:17
  Speaker A: There's, there's lots to unpack over there. But, you know, I think we're looking at, at a potential to see a lot more grassland come in here over the next decade.
• 23:31
  Speaker B: Yes.
• 23:32
  Speaker A: Cattle market is up.
• 23:34
  Speaker B: It's really the only thing we're not overproducing. I mean, we, we need more, more cattle.
• 23:39
  Speaker A: So, so that's a direction I think it's going to go and it's going to go that way for numerous different reasons. One of which we talked about earlier, before we started, I think on air was, was water. You know, we can, we can establish grass. We can leave the pivot standing.
• 23:56
  Speaker B: Right.
• 23:56
  Speaker A: I mean, right. You know, we, we have those terrible August that, you know, no rain is going to fall.
• 24:02
  Speaker B: Right.
• 24:03
  Speaker A: And you see a cotton crop melt apart and you're asking the, your irrigation capacity, you're asking 1,000% of it at that point in time just to keep the wheels bolte. Well, wouldn't it be nice, you know, if we could move some cows off of it and let that land rest for a minute? I, I foresee a, a shift in that. The other derivative in there that I use in my brain is we see a lot of investment for recreational use in ranch land.
• 24:33
  Speaker B: So see that really picking up where we are.
• 24:36
  Speaker A: Yeah. So the effect of that has driven the value of raw ranch land, in a lot of cases up to, if not above what irrigated farm ground is worth. So I put myself in a cattle producer's shoes and I go, okay, I need to grow. Right. We've got decent cattle market right now. My, my business needs to grow. Am I going to go off the cap and pay 2,800 bucks an acre on something?
• 25:06
  Speaker B: Right.
• 25:06
  Speaker A: Or am I going to stay on top and pay 2,500 for something that's irrigated? It's kind of a no brainer for me. And so I do see where we see lots of cotton strippers running around today. I think we're going to replace that with feed, you know, a feed truck in the coming years.
• 25:26
  Speaker B: Yeah. Especially as we see, you know, more animal nutritionists looking at sorghum as a replacement for corn even. And sorghum is less, you know, it's definitely more water efficient.
• 25:38
  Speaker A: Absolutely.
• 25:39
  Speaker B: And so, you know, and, and sorghum has done such a great job expanding their markets into food and all kinds of other things. I say sometimes sorghum is the darling of the commodity crops these, this year, these years, these days.
• 25:54
  Speaker A: Yeah. And not to over generalize on this, but really we are not in corn country. If, if we just want to really get out and say it, you know, let's let the, the States do what they do.
• 26:07
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 26:08
  Speaker A: But sorghum is, is a picture perfect crop for this part of the world. We have more mouths to feed with cattle out here. It's just, it is a marriage made in heaven.
• 26:19
  Speaker B: Well, and I think it's interesting, I have not seen any, any research, but I am certain it's out there on sorghum fed, you know, and finished cattle. Because I know people don't want corn. It's corn that they don't. It's like they want grass fed. But I think what they really are saying is they don't want that corn fed, you know, and so I know that Lacey's cattle go to a finishing lot in Oklahoma and he uses all kinds of different grains and forage crops around there to finish those. And they go. Then it goes to Whole Foods because it's grass finished.
• 26:54
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 26:54
  Speaker B: And I didn't realize until she. We were looking at in depth that what he's feeding them is really. It's a corn issue. Not to, not to diminish the importance of corn people.
• 27:04
  Speaker A: There's good reason for it, but I do believe feed technologies are coming around to back it up a little bit. I think all agriculture is, is a test of, well, agriculture science. I feel this is me, I don't have a piece of paper hanging with PhD on it saying it, but for me, we are consistently doing 90% of the things wrong. And just that 1 or 2% that we learn about and we go, hey, now we took that 90 to 88, you know, and so I see feed technologies coming along.
• 27:39
  Speaker B: Well, you know, I, I cannot for the life of me remember who I was having this conversation with that they were telling me that there is a new technology that they're trialing right now that is like some kind of like X ray technology where they can actually look at a cow and judge the meat.
• 27:59
  Speaker A: Oh my. I, I believe it.
• 28:02
  Speaker B: I mean the kind of things I'm like. And, and so they can be like, okay, this cow is completely finished. This is optimized. It's time to, you know, it's time for them to go process.
• 28:10
  Speaker A: Yeah. So I sit back to round this all the way back to land investment, Right?
• 28:15
  Speaker B: Yes.
• 28:16
  Speaker A: If we know what that end result is going to be and we can reduce that amount of things doing wrong, you know, whatever that number might be right now, today, we can tighten up our predictions of where we're going to be, you know, in nine months if we're a cattle producer.
• 28:33
  Speaker B: Right.
• 28:34
  Speaker A: In 12 months if we're, you know, the row crop got, that will just reduce your, your risk in investing in that property you're going to have to have in order to conduct that, that business. So, you know, once everybody has that at their disposal, I can see land prices continuing to climb. Yeah, so.
• 28:59
  Speaker B: Exactly, exactly.
• 29:00
  Speaker A: It's a little bit of a chicken and an egg thing. So, you know, I kind of look at it and you can accept today's values and grow, procure what you can and continue to do things on the, on the level we're playing today or, you know, is there some sort of technology out there that's going to exponentially lower the risk of the producer? If so it would be logical that land prices would mirror that because I always fall back to every acre will be used for some sort of production.
• 29:39
  Speaker B: Right. Well, and I know, I'm not sure if I, if you know this or not, but we have a partnership with NASA Acres. They are the agricultural wing of our Space Organization Agency. Our space agency.
• 29:52
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 29:53
  Speaker B: So NASA Ag and they are, you know, taking their like realizing that, that their data has not been accessible really to agriculture and to farmers. And so we're helping them look at Ways that they can make that more user friendly.
• 30:11
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 30:12
  Speaker B: And farmers can pull up. We've been discussing an app that would just be free. Yeah, farmers can just pull that app up and they'll have, you know, at their fingertips, like, hey, here's how to access this data and here's what you can learn from it. And, and, and here it is on this app. Now go. And because they're the satellites they're launching this year will be able to read moisture, root moisture.
• 30:35
  Speaker A: It is the things you come up with, Hillary, just blow me away.
• 30:39
  Speaker B: I, I, it's add.
• 30:41
  Speaker A: Yeah, it's add. Sponsored by, Sponsored by add. No, I, I sat down with your parents, I don't know, months, six weeks ago or something. And, and, and Janice was just, you know, beside herself. Tillery is in Houston sitting at NASA, and I'm like, of course she is. Where else would she be? So thank you and kudos, you know, for getting that all off the ground.
• 31:07
  Speaker B: It's an amazing, you know, and a lot, a lot of that goes to, you know, Lacey and I have done a lot of traveling and she's invested a lot in getting us places. And, you know, it was relationships, you know, it's the relationship that we had at a conference and they said, hey, get up and talk about garb and be honest.
• 31:26
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 31:26
  Speaker B: And, you know, after that, the NASA, the leader of this, you know, director of this work, came up and said, I've been looking for you, you know, and I mean, and literally they're like, get up and tell the honest truth, you know, about where we are on carbon markets, you know.
• 31:43
  Speaker A: Well, and I think you did hit on something earlier. I'd like to like to discuss a little bit as you talked about the data availability to the producer. And I think you guys are right on the right track. I think we've got two issues that are going on here when we start talking about data and farming. Issue one is accessibility. That's always been something we've got to kind of some hurdles we've got to climb. Right, to get to that data. The second hurdle that I don't feel like the industry is, is serving the producer as best as they could today is making sense of the data. When I was farming, I felt like I was asking everything I could out of my irrigation systems. And that was right about the era of the moisture probe. Right. And I had every moisture probe salesman in the world calling all day, every day. And honestly, my sentiment was like, why do I need to know how much water I don't have now? We have learned a little bit more since then, and we have learned that there are some good uses for it.
• 32:53
  Speaker B: Yes.
• 32:54
  Speaker A: But I say all that to say that a producer that has numerous hands running around and has equipment running all directions, he's worried about, you know, sitting down with the banker and making sure we can keep the wheels on. The last person in the world that needs to sit down with some CSV file in the middle of the night to try and figure out what all this stuff is, is the producer.
• 33:17
  Speaker B: Yes, that's right.
• 33:19
  Speaker A: We've got to solve a problem as an industry where we can serve up this data into actionable.
• 33:37
  Speaker B: Out here on the Texas plains, water is everything. And there's a resource that's as vital as it is fragile. Our Playa Lakes. These lakes are nature's reservoir, catching rainwater to recharge our aquifer and provide lifelines for wildlife. But now they need our help. In collaboration with the Texas Playa Lakes Conservation Initiative and the Cargill Global Water Challenge, Sarah has started the Our Legacy is Tomorrow's Water initiative to inspire and work with landowners to restore and protect our Playa Lakes. Each playa we save helps secure a sustainable water future for the generations that will be coming after us. Whether it's improving soil health, restoring habitats, or recharging groundwater, we are committed to making a difference. Together, we can build a legacy that we can all be proud of. To learn how you can join in, visit the Playa Lakes Restoration Initiative page on the SARA website. Let's keep Texas water flowing strong for the future. Visit sara-conservation.com Lacey and I recently were at a sustainable farming conference. And the funny thing about going to these things is generally we're the only ag people there.
• 34:57
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 34:58
  Speaker B: You know, and so it puts us in a really great place for our, Our, our region because we're there representing and, you know, because we were there at the opportunity with NASA.
• 35:10
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 35:10
  Speaker B: You know what I mean? And so that is. Is bringing these opportunities to our. Our area. One of the recent places that we were, Lacy made the comment. I feel like there is a new commodity and it's the farmer. And I feel like all of you here are farming the farmer.
• 35:26
  Speaker A: I don't.
• 35:28
  Speaker B: So.
• 35:28
  Speaker A: So from my background, I disagree a little bit with Lacy.
• 35:31
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 35:32
  Speaker A: In her labeling it as new.
• 35:35
  Speaker B: Oh, that's exactly right.
• 35:37
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 35:37
  Speaker B: Yes. It's true. Yes. Yes. And she. Yeah. I wasn't there when she said it, but everyone was repeating it to me.
• 35:44
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 35:44
  Speaker B: Do you know that redhead who said, blah, blah, blah? And I was like, I Know the redhead. But I wasn't there when she said it, but it sounds like something she would say. Yes, I'm a commodity.
• 35:51
  Speaker A: Yeah. Not to get too conspiratorial on you, but it's odd to me that in my career I can take my budgets and when I add all the layers back onto it with, you know, land prices, with equipment prices, with labor prices, with fertilizer and inputs and all the things, I still wind up year after year at about the same profit margin.
• 36:19
  Speaker B: Exactly. I had this conversation with my dad yesterday. It doesn't matter how much you make. It doesn't matter what your yields are.
• 36:25
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 36:25
  Speaker B: If your bottom line doesn't change.
• 36:27
  Speaker A: So. So markets move, prices move everything else, but there's still that little bitty sliver that's just enough to keep the producer as a whole. I'm sorry to say it like this, but nobody cares about the one producer named Bob because again, back to the. The theory, the concept. And I feel like the law that says that every acre is going to be farmed. The industry understands that somebody else is going to backfill that gap when that bankruptcy happens right now. And so I do feel like, yes, the producer is always been. And I don't know how the. What the fix is. I don't either, but they have always been a commodity.
• 37:07
  Speaker B: Well, maybe we need a T shirt that says a farmer's not a commodity.
• 37:10
  Speaker A: Yeah, that would be. I'd wear it.
• 37:12
  Speaker B: Go.
• 37:13
  Speaker A: Give me a bumper sticker.
• 37:14
  Speaker B: Okay.
• 37:15
  Speaker A: I see some pretty.
• 37:16
  Speaker B: That's a great idea.
• 37:17
  Speaker A: Place that could come up with some art for that.
• 37:19
  Speaker B: Yeah. So I think so. I think I know some folks.
• 37:22
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 37:23
  Speaker B: That can do that. But maybe our jackalope friends. Jackalope creative friends.
• 37:28
  Speaker A: I like it.
• 37:28
  Speaker B: They're the best. So I. I'm sure grateful that you're here and we've talked some about real estate and people. For people that don't know, you have done quite a bit of work through the years in data. So you do have that experience and expertise to talk about that. And I'm glad that that has come up some because it's continual. It's a continual thing that's evolving. And if there's a way for us to figure out how to make it. Where farmers are able to access data that they've already paid for with your.
• 38:02
  Speaker A: Tax dollars and be able to do something with it.
• 38:05
  Speaker B: And do something with it.
• 38:07
  Speaker A: Something actionable.
• 38:08
  Speaker B: Yes. And that's the nice thing. This NASA Acres project is really trying to develop relationships between farmers and researchers to get that research actually impactful make an impact. So farmer can say, this is the research I want. We connect them with that researcher and then anything that NASA provides as far as their data goes and their research goes is free, you know. And so you're working to figure out how to get that researcher on ground, some, some monies to get his research done. But you know, there's a, probably 20 or so of these projects going on. They're all talking to each other and it's a co created project.
• 38:51
  Speaker A: That's how it should be. Like, like I'm just sitting back reflecting on all the, you know, we just talked about farmer being a commodity. You know, that's how it really should be. And I, I'm just sitting here again. Add I had 900 things going through my head while you were talking there. But a lot of these farm families are, are not having the next generation come back to the farm. You know, I, I, I know a tremendous amount of producers that are actually encouraging their kids, hey, go, go be a dentist, go, go do whatever you're going to do, but don't do it on the farm. We've got to, to insulate our, our farm profitability to where we do have qualified individuals that, that can farm in the coming years.
• 39:39
  Speaker B: Right.
• 39:40
  Speaker A: Without that, and this is going to go a little political here, but without that we're going to have the mega farm that the consumer is afraid not, they're not afraid of.
• 39:52
  Speaker B: Right? Yeah. They don't like, they don't like to think about that. Right. Mm.
• 39:56
  Speaker A: But so many acres are going to be farmed. We've talked about this five times.
• 40:00
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 40:01
  Speaker A: Is it going to be farmed by three guys or is it going to be farmed by 300,000?
• 40:04
  Speaker B: Right.
• 40:05
  Speaker A: And so without your, your non commercial farmer, without them being able to be profitable, then we're making that own. We're making the decision making.
• 40:17
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And an interesting thing maybe to pursue is like how can consumers, consumers, how can we recognize like you have a whole society that's created around shoving us all towards everything that's efficient.
• 40:34
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 40:35
  Speaker B: And efficiency is, is, is great, but it comes with consequences and we have to recognize what the consequences are. And for a lot of it, for all of our efficiency, we have very little time.
• 40:47
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 40:47
  Speaker B: How many of us have time to think about where our food is coming from and not going through the local drive through?
• 40:55
  Speaker A: I think it starts with this, I think it starts with honest conversations. I think we as an agriculture industry have got to be a little bit louder and risk challenge or challenging the narrative.
• 41:12
  Speaker B: Right. Well, you know, what I, what I have seen is we have a lot of people that are in that ag advocate space and they, you know, so often you wind up just preaching to the choir.
• 41:23
  Speaker A: That's 100% correct.
• 41:24
  Speaker B: Like, there's very few people that are crossing over to the consumer side because we are passionate about the things we're passionate about and maybe don't understand what other people are passionate about. And we're, we are a very political group of people. And so it kind of always just. And if you want people to engage, you gotta, you gotta scare them, you gotta make them mad, or you gotta make them sad. You know, I agree with that. You know, and so if there's a way to kind of rise above that type of narrative and that type of engagement, that's what we're trying to do is say, hey, here's information. Mostly on a no emotional level. Sometimes it does get emotional in here, but generally, here's this information. Sure, do with it what you will, make decisions that you will. But now you know, now you're informed.
• 42:16
  Speaker A: Right. And I think, you know, I would love to see if I could just wiggle my nose and change it. I think it really does start at the elementary school level. Adults in today's world do not understand where their food comes from or how it's been treated. That's not a new statement. But when you have uneducated people being fed slanted information, they're pretty gullible. Okay. I've got my views on traditional farming, on, on pesticide usage, on synthetic fertilizer usage, on all the things that the rest of the world says are terrible. I, as a producer, I'm not interested in overly using those things to turn this world into a terrible place.
• 43:09
  Speaker B: Right.
• 43:09
  Speaker A: Well, I feel, I feel like the media has done a great job at making me and everybody else in this industry look like that.
• 43:18
  Speaker B: Well, and you know, it's interesting. I'm taking a certification right now on sustainable food supply chains. And it has been such an interesting experience. There's, I'm the only one. I think maybe there's one other person in the class. It's all remote from the US And I have not known what to expect. Well, today I was up this morning, 5:30, doing homework and reading In Defense of Beef. And this guy is an environmentalist, environmental justice guy who was saying, we need meat, we need beef. You know how much we would have to produce if we all were vegetarians? And do you know what that would do to the planet and also everything you've heard about how much water cattle use, that's not true. Also everything you've heard about methane, guess what, it's gone in 10 years. I mean this guy is saying, and I guess, you know, we had the week before a guy who is, you know, promoting being a, he's a vegetarian. So I've loved this because you have these two sides of this and you get to really see and that's something that you don't always, you know, see. I know. Remember there's a Bible versus the, the first side. You think the first side's right until you hear the other one.
• 44:34
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right. So, but no, I think where, where I get a little upset about it is there the general consensus, it seems like in society is that agriculturalists do not mind ruining the land or ruining food production or bringing unsafe things to the market. Frankly, we, we're dying to do better. Okay. It's a two step process though. Or there's two things going on here. We're dying to do better. One, but we have to be profitable from the beginning to the end to get there.
• 45:15
  Speaker B: This is why it's a process. We are a triple bottom line economics organization. We believe people, planet profits.
• 45:22
  Speaker A: There you go.
• 45:23
  Speaker B: Because if you don't have those three, those three things can be imbalanced. Is it always easy? No, no. But if you get them out of balance, it's not sustainable. It can't last. Well, you know, whatever you're demanding of people in terms of standards or policy or you know, that kind of thing, if, if, if it cannot be something that is sustainable, it can't happen. When I was in Brussels at the EU and we learned that, that from now on, food policies, anything that's going to impact, anything that's going to impact farming and food and ag has to go through a whole like process, a risk assessment of how it would hurt their food, food supply.
• 46:04
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 46:04
  Speaker B: So because they're like, oh, we want to eat.
• 46:07
  Speaker A: Right. Here's my question around that process. Who's gonna pay for it?
• 46:12
  Speaker B: Oh, the EU will pay for it. They have all the money in the world. I don't know where you've been but, but it's where it comes from.
• 46:19
  Speaker A: It's an honest question if we'll back up the last 50 years in American agriculture. We haven't gone to those stretches, but we have created checks and balances to make sure that our food production is safer, is better.
• 46:33
  Speaker B: Right.
• 46:33
  Speaker A: More often than not it winds up being the producer. That's Paying for that.
• 46:37
  Speaker B: Well, and that to that point, which we're running out of time. But I want to just say one thing to that point is that we have had that same frustration with all the certifications. You know, you get this one, this one, this one and this one, you pay for it, the farmer pays for it and the other companies. But like, who's making money? Right, right. It's the people that are doing the certifying. And so we have some pretty exciting conversations going on now where back to.
• 47:00
  Speaker A: That farmer buyers commodity thing.
• 47:02
  Speaker B: Yes, exactly, exactly. We are having these conversations with end buyers who are coming directly and saying, do we have to do it the way we've been doing it?
• 47:11
  Speaker A: And we're like, no, I love question.
• 47:13
  Speaker B: We don't have to keep doing it this way.
• 47:15
  Speaker A: Let's figure out how to do it and let's do it better.
• 47:17
  Speaker B: Exactly. Well, we've talked some about everything, including real estate. So give me, give me a 30 second pitch on Evanstone and where Clear Rock Realty is going on.
• 47:31
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 47:32
  Speaker B: On farm and Rancho.
• 47:34
  Speaker A: So real quick, we are currently getting ready to launch Clear Rock Farm and Ranch, a division of Clear Rock Realty. Myself and a few other more agriculture focused, rural focused agents will be running underneath that name. So our goals with that is to really give our clients 100% malleability, if you will, where maybe you need to move your equities that are sitting on farm ground, you need to move that into commercial, we can house that and we can handle that whole entire transaction chain that will put that client in the best scenario possible. Maybe it's inverse from that and you want to roll out of a portfolio of residential properties and you want to roll into some sort of farm operation, we can go that direction too. So we just feel like if we'll start with our customers, our clients at the very top level in our mind and serve them 100% of what fits them in their life best, then we're going to be, we'll be rewarded for doing it that way.
• 48:45
  Speaker B: Well, and you know, it's probably an opportunity for people in these rural communities that may have thought about doing real estate to get with you.
• 48:50
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 48:51
  Speaker B: Because it'd be a great brokerage to work under because y' all could bring in more of those buyers from outside of the community to, you know, increase the opportunities for people that are selling 100%.
• 49:04
  Speaker A: And, and so, so yeah, we, we feel like we're just a group of really low key kind of guys that are just interested in serving our clients. So whatever that means we feel like we've got the toolbox, the tool in our toolbox to help them with that.
• 49:22
  Speaker B: Well, Evan, thanks for being here. I appreciate it.
• 49:24
  Speaker A: Thanks for the invite. And it's been fun.
• 49:26
  Speaker B: It has been great. And I'm excited because we're bringing you guys on as a sponsor. And so people will be listening every time to your ad. So that would be really fun. So, friends, thanks again for joining us for another conversation that goes down many rabbit holes, as kind of usual around here on the conservation stories. And I look forward to being with you again next time.
• 49:52
  Speaker A: Sam.