Latest / Curiously Guided Podcast / Ep.44 | Buyer Beware: Making Empowered Decisions When Investing in Yourself & Business

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Ep.44 | Buyer Beware: Making Empowered Decisions When Investing in Yourself & Business · Curiously Guided Podcast

• 0:06
  SPEAKER_01: All right, welcome back to the Curiously Guided Podcast, the place for intuitive business owners and curious minds.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_01: We're your hosts, Shaya Mariah.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: And today we are talking all about how to invest in yourself specifically.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um, in the online space, the idea that, you know, you should always have a coach.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_01: And it's true, you know, like all famous people always have coaches.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: And you hear a lot of rhetoric online about you need to always be investing in your skill set and your mentorship and your coaching.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what you need to take it to the next level.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and all of that, I do believe is true, but to a certain extent.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that that message can get um a little twisted and sometimes maybe even used in a way that's uh perhaps a little manipulating.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_01: So one thing Mariah and I noticed there's a constant theme that keeps popping up in a lot of our episodes all around this idea of investing in online education, investing in coaches, you know, what is an ethical way to um be not only making our offers, but responding to other people's offers.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_01: And there's a lot of good stuff and bad stuff that happens in the online world.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: And Mariah and I often refer to it as the wild, wild west.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_01: So we wanted to shoot an episode about what we've learned.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, Mariah and I are both buyers.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_01: We are the type of people that are always investing in ourselves and trying to level up our skill set.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I think that we've learned quite a few things.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we have a few red flags, I think, that turn both of us off and uh a few green lights that are always a good sign.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_01: So, our hope with today's episode is just to be able to share some real experiences that we've had in investing in ourselves and our businesses, um, what we've learned perhaps from past mistakes.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: So you could maybe avoid some future mistakes.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_01: And also, you know, the wins that we've had and all the wonderful stuff that's come out of when we have invested in ourselves in a really aligned way.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: So, with that, you know, let's dive in.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think that the idea of um we we had this idea for an episode because we just interviewed Melinda Livsey, and this will probably come out before Melinda's episode comes out.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_01: But in that episode, we got into the um conversation around like info hoarding and course hoarding and how many of us are just like buying courses on repeat and then just putting them on a shelf and never doing anything with them.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I certainly am an info hoarder myself.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um, Mariah and I often laugh if like um an offer is under a couple hundred dollars, it's basically free.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't I don't necessarily think that's healthy, but you know, the idea of um what's too much?
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_01: What is hoarding versus what is like an appropriate amount of investing in education in yourself, especially for lifelong learners?
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_01: So I don't know, Mariah, like what's popped up for you around the idea of info hoarding?
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_00: I think that it's interesting, and it's it's fun for me to invest in different things because just like this podcast, the name of it, Curiously Guided, we truly embody that.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: And like I can't help it, I'm fucking curious.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a curious bitch.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_00: When it comes to like people putting cool things out in the world, and I'm just like, that's cool.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_00: I want to learn how you did that, I want to learn this.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: And like, you're right, we're not saying that truly everything under$100 is free.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: But like, I even made a joke, I was like, listen, those like um digital offers under$100, it's like the cost of doing business for me over here.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just like, oh, Facebook ad, that looks cool.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: Look at that template.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_00: Cha-ching, cha-ching.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's like I end up accumulating so many of these.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not saying that they're not helpful either.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_00: I think that the magic comes in when you check in with yourself before purchasing, whether that's a program, whether that's a digital download, whether it's a certification.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: I think that this is a big thing too.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, well, especially in the coaching world, but it's like to get certified or not get certified.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: And I've had, I've gone back and forth in different ways, depending on where I was in my business, how confident I was in my skill set.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_00: I'll say, like, the we recorded an episode yesterday with Topsy, and I gave an example of the story of like I was in a group program, and they were, and the leader of the program was talking about like leading a meditation.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, oh yeah, that sounds cool.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_00: I want to do it.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_00: And then she was like, okay, like you can do it.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, no, I need to be certified in it.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_00: And it's just interesting reflecting back that like I didn't think that I could do something unless I was certified in it, which I just think is an interesting mindset.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not saying that like all certifications are bad and like we need them or we don't need them.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_00: There's nuances to everything.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: But for me personally, I find that like if I'm not careful, getting certified or buying a program, investing in coaching even in a course, it doesn't really matter.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: If I'm not careful, I can purchase very easily to try to fill a hole that's deeper than just the lack of knowledge, right?
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_00: Like if you really feel like, hey, I really want to learn this skill, like I feel like I have a gap in my knowledge, then by all means have at it.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_00: But I was noticing that I was tending to purchase more when I felt like I wasn't good enough, or I felt that I had to prove myself.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_00: And that I mean, that's just something that I kind of noticed from my own perspective of being a consumer.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I that conversation about um being certified.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_01: Melinda has a really cool like uh philosophy and manifesto all around the power of being uncertified.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, um Mariah brought up in that episode like these days, I'm seeing a lot of certification programs, and she bought one for$11 on Udemy.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_01: And at some point it comes back to like, who are these people that are certifying us?
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it the certification in and of itself is starting to feel a little meaningless if it's everywhere.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, I think Mariah brings up a really good point that we, this is what it I've done a bit of reflecting on, you know, my own buying behavior.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_01: I've certainly purchased things that I like felt really great about and purchased things that I didn't feel really great about.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_01: And like dissecting that now, I really think it comes back to this idea of like, did I have a growth mindset going into the situation where, you know, I was genuinely trying to learn, I was trying to build my muscles, I, you know, I had kind of that like positive worlds, my oyster mentality.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, or did I make my decision from more of what I would call a fixed mindset, which is what Mariah said of like, I am lacking in something.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_01: There is a big hole that I need to hire some guru to give me a step-by-step instruction how to fix, because in some way I am insufficient.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_01: And I have found that when I am making decisions from that more like fear-based place or like a fixed mindset place, a lot of times I either I'll buy the program and I won't use it, it'll sit on the shelf, or I'll buy it um and then get frustrated about why I'm not getting results.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_01: And it I I can't see this ahead of the fact, but afterwards I can be like, oh, well, obviously you kind of got wrapped up in a launch, or I got wrapped up in like um honestly, it really is I'm getting wrapped up in this person.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_01: It's usually this person is making a certain amount of money and they have this skill set.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_01: Let's say it's email marketing that I don't have.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_01: So I need to now pay this person X thousands of dollars so they can teach me that skill set.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_01: And really, when I get in there, I realize, hey, I never wanted to do email marketing in the first place.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_01: You know, so like I have walked down that road myself, and I I think that kind of stems from a lack of self-reflection and a lack of awareness in me uh being a buyer myself, it it and getting honestly just kind of caught up in like what I don't have and more of that scarcity mindset.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's interesting because when you're talking, I guess I kind of see, and just from my own perspective, I see me still being in the growth mindset because it's like I'm willing to grow my mindset.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: I'm willing to, I'm willing to grow as a human and to evolve as a human, but I feel like it's like the shadow side of the growth mindset.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's like I won't stop growing type thing.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's like I'm never okay where I'm at.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: And that's interesting.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_00: I do, I do think that for me personally, I know that a lot of the time I have to touch the hot stove to know for a fact that it's hot.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_00: So I know that I had to make these business decisions, these investing decisions.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: Some of them, to be honest, I I kind of have an optimistic viewpoint with them all.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, I fucking learned something and like it's collecting data points.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_00: And like I think I had to learn the lesson to be more aware of these things.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_00: Like, first thing in business, I thought that I had to invest in all of these different things.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_00: Then the next stage in business, it's like, well, I'm not growing or I'm not a true entrepreneur if I don't have a coach or if I don't invest in a mastermind, or if I'm not constantly supported by other business owners and I'm not like, how can clients invest in me if I'm never investing in myself?
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_00: And like that was my reasoning behind some of these decisions.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_00: And truly, I don't think that I would have seen the shadow side of it unless I did it.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I really do have to have to touch the stove to see if it's hot.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think that's such a good point.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I like what you said about like that feeling of I'm not a true entrepreneur or I must not be taking myself seriously if I'm not investing, because that's what this person online said.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_01: And I think there is some power to um, again, like we talk about every episode, being aware of the internal narrative and the stories that are going on in your head, and also tracing back, like where did you pick up those stories?
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_01: You weren't born as a baby believing that like you couldn't be so successful unless you did X, Y, and Z.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_01: So like having some awareness around where all of this is coming from in the first place.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_01: And is it coming from you in a place that you trust, or is it coming from somebody's really well-crafted copywriting that they probably paid thousands of dollars to like laser target into your head?
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, one thing I wanted to share on this episode, um, as I've been diving deeper into like sales training and marketing, uh it's becoming really obvious to me a lot of the stuff that we are experiencing when we get in somebody's funnel is very well designed to honestly trigger us in some way.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_01: You know, these people have spent a lot of time and a lot of money researching our problems and not only like our surface level problems, but like a deep emotional level and subconscious level, they get a really, really good understanding of where we're at.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_01: And that's a fantastic thing.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I want the person that's serving me to really understand me well.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_01: But you have to be aware that, like, I mean, to be quite frank, salespeople and marketing people are taught.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_01: I told Mariah before we got on this podcast, there's a phrase called twist the knife.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_01: Like, they are really taught to stick a knife in your pain points and turn.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: And if you're not aware of how you get triggered and the things that trigger you, perhaps some like more traumatic responses for you.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_01: For me, I'm a people pleaser and I've caught myself several times.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_01: I'll be in a sales cycle with somebody, I'll have calls with them, and I'm about to pay them$6,000 just because I'm afraid of disappointing them.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: And they've said all the right things to make me not want to disappoint them, and they know what they're doing.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_01: Some people do to a certain extent.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_01: And I think none of this is bad.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_01: I obviously love sales.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: I think sales is like one of the most sacred acts.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I, a lot of the salespeople I know are acting with integrity, but I think there's some power in being aware of like we are smart, we have really reverse-engineered the human mind and buying behavior.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_01: And these people know what they're doing and they know how to push the right buttons at the right time.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_01: And if you don't have a really strong sense of self and you're not really grounded in, you know, your vision and your goals and what's right for you, it can be very, very easy to kind of like get caught in the the tides and in the marketing waves.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I am I have fallen victim to that myself, to be quite honest.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_01: And to Mariah's point, I try to take a lot of personal responsibility.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: I would say that all investments I've made, I feel great about.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: There's been some that I've got a lot more ROI or return on investment from than others.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: But at the end of the day, I'm always like, well, this is a networking opportunity.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like I can get in here and meet people, you know, surely I'm gonna learn one fact or I'm gonna meet one person.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_01: And that could honestly be what I needed to get to the next step.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_01: At the very least, I'm gonna learn that I don't really like email marketing and should continue to run down this road, right?
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_01: So I think it goes both ways.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_01: There's for me, it comes back to personal responsibility.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like it comes back to are you checking in with yourself?
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_01: Are you aware with what your goals are, what the right vehicle is for you to get to those goals?
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um or are you perhaps like more in that like lax, scared place, and you're looking for that person that's got all the right answers that can kind of come in and be this missing puzzle piece?
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_01: Because as we found, that doesn't really exist.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, shit.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_00: For the first five years of my business, I was the person that was like, everybody else has the answers and I'm missing something.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so it was very easy for me to slide into that.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: And I think I think that sometimes we have to.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: We got to slide into it to see that we don't want to slide into it anymore.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: And that's how we become more mature and aware of these things is, you know, it's it's like the the elder, right?
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_00: The elder can give us wisdom and give us advice because like they've been through fucking life before.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: And there is wisdom that kind of comes through walking through the fire yourself and being able to figure it out.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_00: And like you said, at the very end of the day, you either can gain relationships or a better understanding of yourself if you don't gain a little piece of knowledge or a little piece of something.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I do think, truthfully, in this age of entrepreneurship, I look around and I'm on social media and I'm checking out other people and I'm fucking looking at courses and programs every week.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I am blown away at how much us entrepreneurs are fucking changing the game.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: Truly, like we are starting to maybe it's in smaller increments compared to like the worldwide sales, but it's like we are starting to sell in a way, like you said, that's a little bit more sacred, like that is a little bit more um human, human, yeah.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: Fucking a little bit more, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: Truly, truly.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: And like the the way that people are explaining things, like you said, I think that the pain point, it's not that the pain points are bad, it's the way that they're using the pain points against you versus like allowing us to use these pain points as a way to be like, wow, you really fucking know that this is my problem.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: Also, if people didn't give examples or like give pain points or like uh explanations of like how their program, framework, certification, whatever help solve a problem, I might not be able to know that that is a really good solution for me.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: And that's actually the next step that I do want.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that there's like everything is fucking nuanced.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: Everything is.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I think being able to maybe have some tools in your tool belt to be able to help figure out where you're coming from.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_00: I think that that is a really good way to kind of navigate this.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: So, like over the past couple of years, I've kind of realized some ways that I help myself make decisions.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the one of the first ones is like, I'll leave it up to the universe.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_00: I'll literally be like, hey, show me a zebra if I'm meant to join this, or show me an elephant if I'm not.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_00: And then it works like clockwork.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like the the investments that I absolutely love are the ones that like told me yes.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: And I waited for that.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: And like I've seen, well, what do I say?
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_00: Elephant is no or an elephant, whatever.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_00: I've seen like the universe basically was like, no, don't do this, don't do this.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: I have used that in so many different ways of being like, listen, human me doesn't know shit.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: Higher self, universe, God, can you step in here and help me make an aligned decision?
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_00: Because I feel cloudy right now and I can talk myself into anything.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_00: So sometimes I'll just leave it up to God, leave it up to the universe and see what comes back.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: And then the other way that I kind of help myself make decisions is verbalize to rationalize.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm really lucky that I have a partner who is very grounded and he loves having these conversations with me about what I'm investing in because he just sees it so differently.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: And he always plays devil's advocate.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_00: And he'll end it with, are you justifying this to yourself?
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_00: Are you talking yourself into this?
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_00: Or is this something that you truly want?
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_00: And he's starting to be able to notice like the energy in which I'm showing up and explaining and talking about it, if it's coming from a place of like true deep excitement, or if it's coming from a place of like, oh fuck, I think that I need this.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think that those are just my two examples of how I've kind of learned to come back to myself because it's fucking hard.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_00: We can't see the label from inside the jar.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: So, do you have any ways that you kind of help yourself make aligned or empowered decisions?
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I really like how you're helping me like pull some pieces together in my head around um one thing we've talked quite a bit on the podcast is like we're all raised in the school system to be little factory workers who you know, you don't know, you need to ask the supervisor or the teacher.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_01: They're the ones that have the answers and you don't have what you need.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so it can be really easy when you jump into business for yourself or whatever to keep that mentality.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know, that's the boss mindset, the typical corporate mindset.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_01: And I think there's some I'm realizing that my initial investments were all with the goal of I wanted someone to see me and tell me I was good enough.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like I was attracted to coaches who were just like telling me how special I was.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like I wanted a program to like just be like, you are so special and you can do this because I couldn't tell myself or see it in myself.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like I needed the external validation.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_01: And so now that I have grown as a person, that that's kind of what I'm checking in with these days of like, am I doing this because I want someone to come in and like tell me that I can and I don't see it in myself?
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_01: Or am I doing this from a place of like, I think I'm gonna fucking kill it at this?
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_01: And this is the vehicle that like is laser targeted, designed for me where I'm at right now to get to where I want to go.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um, that that idea of like self-validating has been really crucial for me to like start making better decisions and to figure out like what's kind of pushing me here.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_01: Am I trying to find someone to tell me like how smart I am and I can do it and I can, or do I really believe that in myself and I am lacking a skill that I need to get from point A to point B?
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_01: So to be honest with y'all, you know, I just actually I made the biggest investment I've ever made in um a coaching program.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_01: And the reason being, honestly, I am like, it's been the best investment I've ever made.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_01: I still feel that way.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_01: And the program was insane.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like it, it's really um well designed.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_01: They really understand the pain points that I'm going through, and they've put together something that's like on a level I haven't seen, quite frankly, in the online space.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, what put it over the top was, and this is what I'm looking for these days, it it's all about um they they want you to figure it out for yourself.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_01: Like they're like, yes, we're gonna teach you a framework, but at the end of the day, this is about you figuring out how this works for you, and we're gonna help you get there.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_01: We're gonna figure out how you take this and how you make it work for you.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, if that element is there in the program of like, yes, there is something, I'm gonna give you a framework to get you started, give you some peace of mind.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_01: But at the end of the day, this is about you and how this works for you, and we're here to support you in figuring that out.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_01: That is what I'm looking for, as opposed to, hi, I'm a guru that's earned a million billion dollars, and I've developed a 10 step process that is mine only.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_01: And if you follow it exactly, you're gonna get these same results, you know, and you don't have it.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_01: You need me.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_01: And that you you can't go with anybody else, you have to go with me.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_01: And in and then in those types of programs, I'm a questioner, I'm a curious bitch, as Mariah.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: I said, you can't ask questions, you can't question the guru.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_01: It's all set in stone.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_01: And we've gotten into past episodes like what's wrong with those kind of like feed me little birdie type situations, and the fact that they're all dated and they worked for that person, but they may not work for you.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_01: But for me these days, I think it comes back to checking in with myself.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_01: Am I looking for external validation or internal validation?
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_01: And then the second piece is how is the program designed?
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_01: Is it really designed with me as a human and how this works for me?
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_01: Or is it designed as like there's this one master on top of the mountain and we're all just like bowing at his or her feet?
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um, because for me, that makes a big difference in my success.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: I've noticed.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I just want to congratulate you on the way that you made that decision to be able to move forward in that program.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: Because, like, yeah, Shay came to me and was like, hey, do you have space to just like allow me to verbalize to rationalize with this?
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, Yeah, for sure.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I noticed in the way that she was saying it, she was playing devil's advocate with herself.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_00: And she kind of was like verbalizing a pros and a cons list for both of them.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_00: And she was like, This is a reason why I think it's a stupid fucking idea.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_00: And she was like, and this is the reasons why I think it's really fucking smart.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_00: And so it was interesting and it was cool as me being somebody who knows her very well, and especially in the business space, it was cool for me to be able to ask her questions about it, give my perspective.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_00: But at the end of the day, I was like, what is holding you back?
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_00: Because I I could tell that she wanted to do it, but sometimes it's like, well, fuck.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_00: Like there's there's like some shame that could come from it.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_00: Like, oh fuck, I really can't figure this out on my own.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_00: What am I, some big idiot?
• 23:45
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I really can't figure this out.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, I have that sometimes, like I've had that before making an investment.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_00: And even honestly, like my own process, you said, like, your green flags, it's a my, I know when I'm ready to invest, when I have spent time researching that myself, and I feel like I keep hitting a brick wall and I'm starting to crave a more specialized approach or somebody to just show me the ropes because the information that I'm trying to piece together on the internet isn't working.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_00: If I haven't done, if I haven't been interested in this idea enough to be able to research it on my own, that's when I start to question myself of, yo, am I getting caught up in this launch?
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_00: Am I coming from a place of like, oh fuck, oh, this is what I need to make the next step?
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's kind of like, where is this decision that I need to learn or invest in this?
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_00: Is it coming from me or did it come from an outside source?
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_00: And how long have I been sitting with it?
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_00: These are kind of the questions that I ask myself.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_00: And honestly, I also don't give a fuck about anybody's timeline.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like if the doors are opening, closing, like I understand as a business owner, if you got to open a closed cart, by all means, like have at it.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_00: Me as a buyer, I don't care.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_00: If I come to a place to make an empowered decision and I feel really good and the cart is still open, I will by all means pull the trigger.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_00: If I miss that open cart, maybe I'll run the program again, or I trust that it just wasn't the right time for me.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_00: And even I have been on sales calls.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_00: I think I've on to be honest, I think I've only been on like one or two like live sales calls where people are like, oh, let's hop on a call and talk about this.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: And every single time it's like, it's like uh don't kiss on the first date for me.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_00: It's kind of like I never make decisions on the call itself.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, listen, I need to marinate.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_00: I need to come back into my own energy, see how I feel.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: And it might take a couple days.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_00: And I've heard horror stories of people being on sales calls and they try to rush them into a decision.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: And me coming from like also a business owner perspective, that doesn't feel good as a business owner.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_00: Let's say that I was running the course of the program.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_00: Like I hop on consult calls all the time for SEO.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_00: And people will literally be like, Yeah, Mariah, I would like to do the done for you.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_00: I would like to pay in full.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_00: My response is like, Do you want to marinate with it?
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like when we hop off this call, do you want to marinate?
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_00: I want you to marinate if you want to marinate.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I want you to feel good about this decision and be able to ask me any questions before moving forward.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that just being able to take that time to verbalize to a friend like Shay did, or to be able to just sit with it.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, are you waking up in three days and you're still fucking excited about it?
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_00: Or has the excitement kind of diminished?
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_01: That's so good.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_00: I just wanted to slide in here mid-episode and fill you in on some cool things quick.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_00: So we are in our third season of Curiously Guided, and there's nothing that fires us up more than making this podcast and hearing all the positive impacts it's having on our listeners.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_00: Up until this point, this has been a pure passion project.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_00: But we've got bills and expenses for this podcast, y'all.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_00: If you have the means and would love to support us in creating new episodes, feel free to head over to curiouslyguided.com slash support to buy us a coffee.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_01: And if you want even a deeper dive, we're excited to offer.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_01: We're gonna now um start doing some strategy sessions where you get both Mariah and I's brains on your business.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_01: And um, there's nowhere else in the world where you can we Mariah and I both don't work with people in such micro ways.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_01: So this is kind of a cool thing to get both of us looking at your business in kind of like a one-off strategy session.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_01: Just imagine us two and you together diving deeper on your business, marketing sales, and everything in between, um, all while filtering it through the lens of strategy energetics and energetics, which you know is our style.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_01: So if you want to learn more about what working with Mariah and I could look like, head on over to our website, curiouslyguided.com slash session, to get the details.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you guys so much for hanging out with us.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_01: We appreciate you so, so much.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_01: Now let's get back into the episode.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_01: You know, and you saying like you giving people the opportunity to marinate with it is an example of this kind of like new wave of sales that we're talking about, that more human approach.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_01: And and the thing about that, Maria, you don't realize, but like when you give people that empowered position, like a buyer where you're empowering your buyer, they are they're gonna be a better client for you.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_01: You know, they're less likely to ask for refunds, they're more likely to communicate well and to say what they need.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's it's it's treating people with respect that will then pay dividends down the line.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_01: And I hate, you know, the typical sales stuff is trying to like, to me, it always feels like we're trying to like strong arm people.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_01: We want them to say yes as quick as possible and not let anything come in and change their minds.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_01: It's weird to me.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_01: But that creates buyer, that creates buyers remorse.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_01: And the the programs that really hit on the one call closes and the high pressure situation have really high refund rates because people are making a decision from that panicked fight or flight place instead of from that kind of like front-of-the-brain, more empowered place.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_01: And so there's a lot of power in that, but it's the opposite of what's being taught.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_01: And to your point, you know, in sales stuff, um I am very leery of time-based things.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um, to be honest with you guys, I've seen the backside of a lot of sales.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of the time stuff is just um a tactic.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_01: They psychologically know that it works.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_01: And it does work and to a certain extent, right?
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_01: Because our brains, it's kind of like that thing we need.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not saying it's good or bad, but know that when I see a countdown timer or if I'm on a sales call and someone's telling me if I get off the call, I'm gonna miss out on this$2,000 discount.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_01: Those are always big red, not necessarily red flags, maybe yellow, yellow light, yellow flag of like something like, oh, this is a this is a tactic that people can use.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm just what I still buy if this tactic wasn't here.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_01: That's no a lot of times it's BS.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_01: That timeline, if you push back on it, all of a sudden they're gonna have a little bit more space for you.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_01: And the same is true.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_01: I've heard um, you mentioned like shame.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_01: One tactic I've noticed in high-ticket programs is they'll say, like, well, typically our clients pay in full, but if you can't afford that, we can maybe put together something special for you.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_01: People say that it's taught, Mariah.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_01: And so, like, oh my and and I can tell you that if you look at the percentages, most people are not paying in full.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_01: So know that, like, um people are very careful about their language and and know that what they're saying to you in the way it may feel is meant to kind of get you a little like, ah, ah, you know, time is running out or whatever, because they know psychologically that's what makes you buy.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_01: But for me, just knowing that this is going on has been so empowering.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_01: So, just so you guys know, the the last training I invested in that I talked to Mariah about, which I do think is important to have a friend that you can have that kind of devil's advocate conversation with.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um it was, I don't know, like um I it was a sales program.
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_01: So I actually interviewed three different programs.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_01: So I and my goal with this was I'm I'm in the sales world and I want to sharpen my sword, to be quite honest.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I want to be around the A players, I want to know what they're learning, and that way I can take it and put my lens through it, you know.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_01: So it's kind of like almost it helped me come from a greater sense of integrity.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_01: I I don't know how to say this, but like sometimes it's okay to get the certification and invest in yourself.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm feeling like I want to write a book about sales.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_01: And for some reason, like going and learning with the best is helping me now show up in a place of much more confidence and much more integrity.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_01: So I want to say that like that has been the effect for me.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_01: And I've also noticed when I invest at a higher level, it's a lot easier for it's a lot easier for me to raise my own rates and see my own value.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I know that's not true for everybody, but that has been true for me.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_01: So, like Mariah and I said, like it's not you don't always need the certification, but like if you're really holding yourself back because you don't feel like you have what you need, or for me, I just like want to sharpen that sword and this was the right decision, do it, right?
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_01: It makes total sense in the world.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_01: But and the reason I went on this rant is I took sales calls with the best of the best in the industry.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_01: And on every single call, I put my hand up with them and I said, I will not be making a decision on today's call.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_01: And that was like weird for them because normally people don't go into these calls with boundaries, but me, I know what they're trying to do, right?
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_00: Know what you're doing here, fools.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_01: And even like I can call I called out on the call, you know, like I know that payment plans are normal and I know that that's what you're gonna be.
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_01: Know that your salesperson or marketing person is always withholding information.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I didn't realize this until recently, and they only want to release information at the last possible minute because in their minds that means they're losing power.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_01: So, like, I think it's helpful to just understand how this is all being taught, how it's all being used on us.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_01: You know, Mariah and I have fortunately been blessed that I think we're just like researchers and we were around good people.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_01: We haven't been burned, but like I have heard some horror stories and like I have heard it on both sides, a salesperson and the buyer, you know.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_01: So my goal this episode is like honestly, I've always just felt really fucking empowered when I've invested in myself.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_01: It makes me feel like I'm coming from that like CEO mindset where, like, hey, I don't have time to watch a million YouTube videos.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_01: I want to hire the best of the best to teach me.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that is a really strong, empowered place to be.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_01: But I think you got to be really honest with like how the industry is, what people are being taught to do, and how your brain works and how you could potentially be being manipulated.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_01: And then that way you can kind of go in with some armor and you can like have some boundaries and you can tell people like, no, no, no, no, no.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, this is how this is gonna happen.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_01: Because I promise you have more power in this situation than you realize.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and also take note if you're hopping on a call with the person that created the course, the program, the framework, like me, for example, like when you hop on an SEO consult, you're hopping on the call with me.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_00: I don't have any salespeople.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_00: There's nobody that I have to train.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_00: They don't, I don't have like a full document of like how I talk people into booking SEO packages.
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_00: Like, it's just, it's not how my business is run.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_00: So I think just having the awareness of what kind of business model does this person have, I think that that can make you a little bit more well aware.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not that isn't to go and say that like every single person that has like a huge program that has salespeople is like manipulating you.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like that's that's not what we're saying at all.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_00: But I think just being able to go in there, knowing like, hey, I'm probably gonna talk to somebody on a sales team versus I'm gonna talk to the service provider or the coach specifically that I'm gonna be working with.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_00: I think just knowing that you can show up to the call a little bit differently.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_00: Because now that I'm reflecting a little bit, uh the well, we I kind of talked about the one certification that I have.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_00: So if anybody's wondering, I paid$12 on Udemy to be a certified meditation teacher.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_00: So if anybody needs me, I'm here and I'm certified.
• 35:52
  SPEAKER_00: Which, like the fact that it was like$12 for a certification is hilarious.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I also did a hypnotherapy program.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_00: And so I am a certified hypnotherapist.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember hopping on that sales call, and I think it might have actually been like the first time that I was on a sales call with like a sales team because this program that I went through uh was very large.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_00: There was a fuck ton of people, the the biggest program I've ever been a part of.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember this dude seemed really cool.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_00: And maybe, maybe it's just my personality and how I show up.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I swear, I'm just like say things that kind of just come out of my mouth.
• 36:31
  SPEAKER_00: And I feel like I kind of got his human a little bit more to interact with me on like a human-to-human level.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_00: And it was a really nice conversation, but then I could tell that parts of it, he was just reading the script.
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_00: And like the last thing, he was like, Well, we have to take your application and we have to think about it.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_01: And I wanted to be like, Yeah, and that's a tactic because they want you to have FOMO and like, oh, please let me in the cool club.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I'm and I'm sitting here and I was like, bitch, I'm the coolest person for this core.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_00: What do you there couldn't be a better fit than me?
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_00: What do you mean?
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_00: And then, you know, two days later, they're like, Hi, Mariah, exciting news.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_00: We've decided to accept you into the program.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, no shit, you'd be idiots.
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_00: Not like there was no, there was no reality where I wasn't in the program.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_00: What do you mean?
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that's really like I'm a little naive to this whole process because I really think that that's the only experience that I've ever had on a sales call with somebody in the team.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_00: And I like ended up, I don't, we were like talking about like what he ate for dinner or some like just like straight up human shit.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_00: And so I feel like I haven't really had as much experience.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, especially with you, you see like the back end of people getting trained to be on a sales team.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_00: And that's just like a whole new fucking level.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_01: It is, and I'll tell you, like, even that human connection you're remembering was in the script.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's how you start.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_01: And like they know what we need.
• 37:59
  SPEAKER_01: We need the human connection.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_01: We need then we need to go more into they're the expert, and they've got us, you know.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_01: And and then they need to go into the oh, but maybe not you're not a quite a right fit, and you need to prove to us what, and that kind of sparks that FOMO, you know.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_01: So sales teams are funky, it it's a it's a weird world, you know.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I really enjoy it.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_01: I'm enjoying learning more about it.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_01: But like Mariah said, there's certainly different ways to skin the cat.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_01: And sometimes it can feel more manipulative than others.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_01: And sometimes if you're not in a sales call every day, you have no idea, right?
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_01: And so um I think that that for me, I just think there's so much power in being aware, uh, especially in how you work in your brain and how you make buying decisions.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, like if I start to notice like my people pleasing and I, oh, I don't want to tell them no because I'm afraid they'll be mad at me.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's like a pattern for me, you know, in in many areas of my life.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_01: And so for me, that if that stuff starts to pop up in the process, um, it's probably not a great sign.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_01: I always say, like, I have an um an ejector button.
• 39:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like, if I'm ever starting to feel myself get more into that fight or flight, I'll just get off the call, whether I'm the salesperson or the client.
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_01: And then and know that your salesperson, like no matter how pushy.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_00: What line would you say?
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_00: Would you like, I'm about to faint, I'm gonna throw up, I have to go.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how would you just like eject that before?
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_01: Usually I'll say something along the lines of like, you know, I've gotten a lot of information and I really need to sit down and like process all of this and like get my thoughts together.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's a good time for us to like um get off the call now and let's follow up and schedule something later or something.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_00: What a great example.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_01: I'm glad that I asked.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_01: Well, a lot of I work with creatives in sales, and they can get bullied.
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_01: I've noticed that I think the the common thing for us, if you're not a salesperson, you're getting into business for the first time, you're selling your thing, and you, if you're in the B2B space and you're working with other business owners, you're working with people that like are doing this all the time.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_01: And it can be hard to hold your boundaries.
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_01: And if you have someone telling you, like, well, why is your price like that?
• 40:05
  SPEAKER_01: That's way too high.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_01: What did this person say?
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_01: It can be really easy to get flustered and get into fight or flight.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_01: And in my opinion, the worst thing you can do is be in fight or flight in either chair, if you're selling or buying.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_01: And so if I start to feel that escape button, I get out right away.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_01: I don't care.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_01: I gotta get out because I know I'm not making my best, I'm making survival decisions, I'm not making empowered decisions.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think that um whether you're coming in as the salesperson or the buyer, being clear around your boundaries, what specifically are you looking for?
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_01: What are you not looking for?
• 40:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, it's it's an empower, it's just a bit more of an empowered place to be.
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and also know that like I get swept up in launches, and it's not always sales calls.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_01: Like, honestly, I would say like the quote unquote worst investment I made, there was no sales call.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_01: It was all a really well-designed sales page, you know, and like a really good ad funnel.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_01: And like um and again, radical responsibility, I'm still getting stuff.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_01: I always take responsibility over what I've invested in.
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_01: I'm always gonna win.
• 41:15
  SPEAKER_01: Like I go into it the mindset of like, no matter what, I'm gonna win.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I think honestly, if you have that, that's really empowering.
• 41:22
  SPEAKER_01: And then you can get a little stronger with every decision you make about like yes or no, and you can check in with a friend.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, honestly, like just talking with Mariah about it really helped me.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_01: She was she said to me, What I remember was like, this isn't new.
• 41:37
  SPEAKER_01: This isn't something that you just like came up with in the last 24 hours.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_01: This is something you've been saying to me on repeat for months.
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_01: So it's kind of like you need that person that's like, no, this is who you are, and this is really aligned with what you've been saying.
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_01: You've wanted.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_01: And I will say the flip side is this is actually something I've started to do.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_01: Uh Mariah and I are big internet creepers.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_01: So, like, do your due diligence, go through the sales process, have all the calls, do all the research, get all the data points.
• 42:04
  SPEAKER_01: And honestly, with this last program, I was on Reddit messaging strangers.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_01: Like, literally, I was finding hey Billy.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_00: How did you like that program?
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_01: No, I there's like, and of course, I read the trust pilot reviews and I read everything I could find, but I even like I was like, I got on LinkedIn, I found people that had tagged that program, I got on Reddit, I found people talking about that program, I found a guy on Reddit who said, like, here's my Instagram handle, DM me and I'll tell you everything.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_01: So, like, I really did it all to like almost a creepy level, but like at the end of the day, it's on you, right?
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_01: And it for me, like I needed to be aware of like where am I maybe getting manipulated, where am I getting swept up, you know, and then like what's the real data and facts?
• 42:47
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, like it's almost like I went into research mode and I just collected all these data points.
• 42:52
  SPEAKER_01: In the program I actually went with, the sales call was like the worst sales call of all the three that I had, but it didn't really end up being about that because I knew that like they were the A players, they had been around, like they had the most social proof, they had the most dynamic program that had what I needed.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_01: So it was like, let your little researcher, your curious mind come out and just like dig deep and get weird with it because like at the end of the day, it's on you.
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I think like doing your due diligence can give you some nice peace of mind, um, like on a deeper level about the investment you're about to make.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm glad that you brought in that example because I do think that that's really powerful.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, even if you're investing in like a service provider, ask them to chat with like one of their past clients.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_00: I have had I've had people that I have hired, they were like, hey Mariah, um, I have a client that is looking to work with me.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_00: They're wondering if a past client would mind DMing them.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yo, I sent voice notes on voice notes.
• 43:51
  SPEAKER_00: I'm deadass honest.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, this is what I loved about working with them.
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_00: This is what they could do better, but we already chatted about it, or maybe we didn't chat about it.
• 43:59
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just honest.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_00: About the situation in a respectful and a responsible way.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_00: Of just like, hey, if I had a big sister or a big brother and they did this thing, like what would they tell me about it?
• 44:12
  SPEAKER_00: Basically, is kind of how I go into it.
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_00: But another piece that I want to talk about is the fact that like a lot, like we when we own our own business, our business evolves as we evolve.
• 44:28
  SPEAKER_00: So it's easy, like I mentioned shame before.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_00: And it's easy to slip into regret or guilt or shame about investing in something that was maybe a little pricey.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like maybe I pivoted too quickly in my business.
• 44:44
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe I don't know, made a rash decision in my business.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_00: And like that actual purchase wasn't bad.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_00: It was just, it's just not the direction that I'm going in my business.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_00: And like the examples for that for me is hypnotherapy.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_00: Like I paid eight grand for to be like a certified hypnotherapist.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_00: And honestly, the program was fucking fantastic.
• 45:07
  SPEAKER_00: When I was in the program, it was amazing.
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_00: The way that they created community and how we had like these live virtual sessions and had we had to do home train or uh virtual training sessions and we had to test things out and we had to teach each other and like the actual program was fucking phenomenal.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_00: But I'm looking at that from a business perspective, and I was like, yo, you spent eight grand on a certification that ain't got nothing to do with where you're going or what you're doing in your business.
• 45:39
  SPEAKER_00: I'm still paying on that payment plan.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_00: And part of me could be like, yo, what a fucking waste of part of me could be like, yo, what a fucking waste of money.
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I spent all of that money and like I thought that I was gonna go in this direction and I'm not going in that direction.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_00: And like I could easily beat myself up about it.
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_00: Or how I choose to look at it is like, what a fucking cool skill that I have.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_00: And honestly, it just built my understanding of the subconscious mind and how it works.
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_00: And I noticed that I just I interact with people differently after that, and like I'm understanding where things are coming from.
• 46:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I got like, it's not that I was ever bad at asking questions because I'm pretty sure it's a superpower of mine, but like it made me even better at being able to ask questions.
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_00: And on top of that, in that program, since it was so big, there were people from all walks of life from all different experiences, and it truly allowed me to see how many skills I already have being a business owner.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's been helpful for me.
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_01: It's like I almost need to get in the room and be like, hey, I have these skills, I'm good at this.
• 46:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like it was people asking, like, how do I send invoices?
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_00: How do I send a form to a client?
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, What do you mean?
• 47:01
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you send it like a Google form, it's fucking free.
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_00: You don't got to pay.
• 47:04
  SPEAKER_00: Do not send a PDF because, like, how am I printing?
• 47:07
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I ain't printing that shit out.
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, I already know how to invoice people.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_00: I have a like, some people were on the free Zoom plan.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_00: I already pay for Zoom, so I don't have to worry about how many people are on my call or how long this call is.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_00: And it just made me realize wow, I do have a really fucking cool, stable business foundation that I've built for myself.
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_00: So I kind of just wanted to share these things because even if the certification, the tool, the resource, the program, the course didn't work out in a way that you thought that it would, whether it's it was a flop knowledge-wise, or maybe you just decided to go in a different direction for your business, there usually is still some kind of value in it.
• 47:56
  SPEAKER_00: And like for me, there's so many different things that worked out really well, even though it wasn't how I thought it was gonna work out.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's like you're adding tools to your tool belt that come in and help you in a multitude of ways, you know, like you having that background has now helped you be a stronger business owner.
• 48:16
  SPEAKER_01: But to your other point, I've certainly had that happen before too.
• 48:20
  SPEAKER_01: It was like I had all of this impostery feeling around like, who am I to teach sales?
• 48:26
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 48:26
  SPEAKER_01: I've never had any formal training.
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_01: I just kind of like fell into this world.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_01: I kind of like it, but like, who am I?
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_01: And then when I got into this big room with all these people, this is gonna sound arrogant as hell, but like it just would like a big boost to my confidence because I was over here like in an isolated chamber, just like really beating myself up.
• 48:44
  SPEAKER_01: And then I got around other people and there was a practical element.
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm practicing with other people, we're getting our calls reviewed, and I'm like, holy moly, I'm pretty good at this.
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like it was like it really helped me build my confidence.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, I'm someone that I struggle to see myself.
• 48:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I can get in a room around other people trying to do what I'm doing, and I'm getting I'm told, hey, you're pretty good, you know, like that that helps me.
• 49:08
  SPEAKER_01: It helps me anchor into my genius.
• 49:10
  SPEAKER_01: It helps me get really clear around like this is what you're good at, and you can be confident here.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_01: And and I know that that like may not be like the greatest way to handle things, but I'll tell you, like, it's worked for me.
• 49:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I just like need to get in a room and I need to practice with other people, and I need to like, you know, experience it for myself.
• 49:29
  SPEAKER_01: And what you brought up, I think, is cool about the hypnotherapy program for you and the sales program for me, both have practical elements.
• 49:38
  SPEAKER_01: And that's one thing I wanted to mention.
• 49:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um, there's the online education industry is huge, and I really would encourage you to, you know, there's different situations, but just like pre-recorded video lectures, a lot of times, as we talked about in our episode with Taylor, a lot of this online education is not put together by educators.
• 49:59
  SPEAKER_01: And some of these programs are created a little bit better than others when it comes to like how people actually learn.
• 50:06
  SPEAKER_01: So, one thing that I really look for these days is a program that is not just recorded video lectures, that's not expecting me to sit in front of a screen by myself and just retain information because again, we're coming back to self-awareness.
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_01: I know that's not how I learn.
• 50:22
  SPEAKER_01: I know that I need to practice with other people.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_01: I need to have coaches review my work.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_01: I need more of that.
• 50:27
  SPEAKER_01: Like, yes, I can learn, but I need real life examples to practice, almost like we're back in school, right?
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's one piece that's missing in a lot of online education.
• 50:37
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, yeah, someone can lecture at me for 20 hours, but like I'm not gonna really retain or be able to integrate all of that without some hands-on help.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_01: So I think for me, that's like another thing I'm looking for.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 50:49
  SPEAKER_00: I was just gonna say, like, how are we integrating this?
• 50:53
  SPEAKER_00: Because like it's one thing to have to invest in knowledge, right?
• 50:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean, like, we can invest in knowledge by buying a book, we can invest our time into finding knowledge on Google.
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_00: But I've I find that the programs, the courses and stuff that I've gotten the biggest bang for my buck is like when they have included some kind of integration, especially when when you're trying to learn a skill, right?
• 51:19
  SPEAKER_00: And also human me doesn't know what's coming in the future.
• 51:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so it's like even like I have invested in hypnotherapy right now.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not utilizing it in my business.
• 51:33
  SPEAKER_00: That is not to say that like I don't catch another itch in six months, in a year, in three years, and I start offering like group hypnotherapy sessions, which to me that still sounds fucking fun.
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_00: And honestly, if me and you ever wanted to host a retreat or do something like that, it's like, how fucking cool would that be to integrate this skill that I have in my tool belt, being able to support people through it?
• 51:57
  SPEAKER_00: So another thing is like we never know how things are going to play out.
• 52:02
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, if I didn't invest in myself in a mastermind, I never would have met Shay.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like all of these things tend to add up together and we can't really see it until it's in hindsight, which isn't to say that that should be the only excuse why you're investing in anything.
• 52:17
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, fuck it.
• 52:18
  SPEAKER_00: I can't, we it can it can not not work out.
• 52:21
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 52:22
  SPEAKER_00: Like that's not the only reason to go ahead and invest in things, which comes back to no, the$27 digital product is not just the cost of doing business, Mariah.
• 52:32
  SPEAKER_00: But at this point, I guess I think that it's it's just funny.
• 52:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, to your point, like I've never been the type, the zebra or the giraffe type.
• 52:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um, that doesn't like stick with me as well.
• 52:44
  SPEAKER_01: But I will say, like, so we had Natasha on Natasha Mack on the first season of the podcast.
• 52:51
  SPEAKER_01: And that woman, like, she she'll come out with these programs.
• 52:58
  SPEAKER_01: And the way she's talking about it is like she was sitting in my house yesterday and she is like saying things that I said.
• 53:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like sometimes there's like just this uncanny like magnetism that I have.
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_01: So, for example, I've actually been working on a lot of like we've talked about like externally validating versus self-validating and like um worthiness in inner child work.
• 53:20
  SPEAKER_01: I've been doing a lot of work around that.
• 53:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yesterday, Natasha comes out with this new workshop she's doing.
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_01: It's wild, like literally, it was almost like she was in my brain listening to me.
• 53:31
  SPEAKER_01: And so for me, those are the I will make intuitive decisions.
• 53:34
  SPEAKER_01: And usually her stuff is like a little bit lower of a price point, and it is a bit more of just like, I'm not getting on Reddit.
• 53:39
  SPEAKER_01: I what my point is like there are some times where like let your intuition, if there is something for you that where you're like, holy shit, this feels like weird, go go for it.
• 53:51
  SPEAKER_01: Cause honestly, in those cases for me, those have often been like some of the most powerful stuff.
• 53:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and you can't always logically think through those decisions.
• 54:00
  SPEAKER_01: So I do think this is a bit of like, I've probably stuck a little bit more on like logical tips, but there is certainly like an intuitive piece of this of like sit with yourself.
• 54:08
  SPEAKER_01: How does it feel?
• 54:10
  SPEAKER_01: What do you use to give and get intuitive guidance and like lean on that as well?
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_01: Because I've gotten like probably some of the coolest results from some of those just like split-second decisions that just felt really right.
• 54:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, Natasha has a beautiful way of putting together programs.
• 54:26
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, when I first I hired her as my intuitive development coach, and she like taught me how to channel and shit, which is like another certification tool that like I don't really use in my business in my day-to-day, but like, holy shit, did I learn some valuable shit from that?
• 54:43
  SPEAKER_00: And like that was a, it allowed me to meet somebody, like working with her as a coach, she's a just a phenomenal human being altogether.
• 54:52
  SPEAKER_00: And like, yeah, so sometimes you kind of just gotta follow that intuitive hit.
• 54:57
  SPEAKER_00: And also, like, I can't believe I didn't say this before, but like, does it feel fun for you?
• 55:04
  SPEAKER_00: Does it feel fucking fun?
• 55:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like the um, the latest program that I invested in has been learning how to get brand sponsorships and like brand partnerships and like collaborations and basically like getting paid to create content.
• 55:23
  SPEAKER_00: That's basically what I want.
• 55:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I have a fucking YouTube channel.
• 55:26
  SPEAKER_00: I am amazing at breaking down complex things into like approachable, easy to understand ways.
• 55:34
  SPEAKER_00: My YouTube videos are good.
• 55:36
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I'm I'm good at fucking tips.
• 55:38
  SPEAKER_00: I'm good at it.
• 55:39
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm just like, wait a minute.
• 55:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I've been thinking about this for a few months.
• 55:43
  SPEAKER_00: I was toying around with it back in like October, and I found myself in the rabbit hole of trying to explore things, found myself watching YouTube videos.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_00: I'm searching shit on Google, come across this Instagram account.
• 55:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and they have a program that helps creatives get paid for their content and they help influencers pitch to get paid.
• 56:04
  SPEAKER_00: And so, like, they have worked on both sides of the spectrum, on the brand side, and they've worked on the creative side and like the influencer side, which I thought was super cool.
• 56:16
  SPEAKER_00: It wasn't just somebody being like, oh, this is what you do, do it this way.
• 56:19
  SPEAKER_00: It's like they not only like they're not just operating from a PR perspective, they have worked with the brands hand in hand and have chosen creators, have chosen influencers.
• 56:31
  SPEAKER_00: And I basically am like, yo, this program is so fucking cool.
• 56:36
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, if I can learn how to pitch myself to like get a YouTube video sponsored and make like X amount of money creating content, which I love creating content, anyways, I'm like, that just feels so fun for me.
• 56:50
  SPEAKER_00: And I find myself even finding chunks of time after dinner to work, which like hilarious was a huge no, no, no, no.
• 57:01
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely not.
• 57:03
  SPEAKER_00: This is my time type thing.
• 57:04
  SPEAKER_00: But my sacral is so lit up by this that I'm like, okay, Andrew, you're gonna watch what are you gonna watch?
• 57:10
  SPEAKER_00: Something I don't give a shit about.
• 57:11
  SPEAKER_00: Cool.
• 57:12
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna go um look at examples of media kits and like put together a media kit.
• 57:17
  SPEAKER_00: And it's funny because two years ago I was like, media kits, those are what are those?
• 57:22
  SPEAKER_00: Those are stupid.
• 57:23
  SPEAKER_00: And now I'm over here like, hmm, what can I put in my media kit?
• 57:26
  SPEAKER_00: But it's like the other thing was that that program included four calls, four group calls of just like show up, there's straight up QA's of like, show me your fucking thing, let me look at it, I'll give you advice on it.
• 57:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, uh yeah, yeah, thank you very much.
• 57:44
  SPEAKER_00: Because especially I'm noticing that in this program, there's not a lot of people like me.
• 57:51
  SPEAKER_00: There's not a lot of people that already have a business.
• 57:54
  SPEAKER_00: It's like this new thing, apparently, that's it's like a business influencer.
• 57:58
  SPEAKER_00: Most of these people are like, I want to work with Target and I want to work with urban outfitters, and I want to work with bye-bye baby.
• 58:06
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm just like, yo, I'm trying to work with Shopify or Squarespace or just like upwork the platforms and softwares and like even just talk.
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like I could talk about it forever.
• 58:16
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just so excited about it.
• 58:18
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like worst case scenario, I can pitch brands to maybe sponsor our podcasts.
• 58:24
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 58:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like, there's just so many different skills and so many different things that I can learn doing this that it was just an easy yes.
• 58:31
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I like what you're saying there.
• 58:32
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's a better way to say it than I said earlier of like when you get around others, it really highlights what your uniqueness is and where your zone of genius is in relation to like what's perhaps already like saturated or what there's a whole bunch of people doing.
• 58:48
  SPEAKER_01: And we know in business where you lean, lean into your uniqueness, lean into that like thing that makes you different.
• 58:54
  SPEAKER_01: And that's really where the magic happens.
• 58:56
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that's super cool.
• 58:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I love what you said about yes, is it fun?
• 59:02
  SPEAKER_01: I'm noticing myself, I don't want to watch Netflix, I don't want to watch anything.
• 59:06
  SPEAKER_01: I want to watch recorded calls from this group.
• 59:08
  SPEAKER_01: I'm spending my nights.
• 59:09
  SPEAKER_01: That's what in my weekends.
• 59:10
  SPEAKER_01: I love it.
• 59:11
  SPEAKER_01: I'm loving the course material.
• 59:13
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so into it and lit up by it.
• 59:16
  SPEAKER_01: It's what I want to spend my free time doing.
• 59:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I I think that that is a really cool data point.
• 59:21
  SPEAKER_01: Where are you wanting to spend your free time?
• 59:24
  SPEAKER_01: Because for me, if if it's like a thing like this, like I know I know that that's like a logical next step for me.
• 59:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it's kind of like that's where your intuition is leading.
• 59:33
  SPEAKER_01: We talk about curiously guided.
• 59:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what a great example.
• 59:37
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I think that this has been a really um powerful episode.
• 59:43
  SPEAKER_01: What I'm realizing here that we're at the end is like, I feel like this is the lesson of all of our episodes, but there's a lot of power and self-awareness and giving yourself space.
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_01: So um I would encourage people, you know, as you're thinking about investing in yourself.
• 1:00:01
  SPEAKER_01: I hope your takeaway from this episode is we are big fans.
• 1:00:05
  SPEAKER_01: We have had like so many wins and successes, even if we didn't understand at the time how it would come in to like work in our tool belt to be a win for us, it always did in one way or another.
• 1:00:16
  SPEAKER_01: But Mariah and I have both, I think, strengthened the muscle of like how to invest to get the highest return on investment for yourself.
• 1:00:24
  SPEAKER_01: And it comes back to self-awareness.
• 1:00:26
  SPEAKER_01: You know, are you sitting with yourself?
• 1:00:28
  SPEAKER_01: Is this decision really coming from an empowered place of self-awareness?
• 1:00:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um, have I spent time reflecting on, you know, like what are my patterns?
• 1:00:37
  SPEAKER_01: How have I bought in the past?
• 1:00:38
  SPEAKER_01: What are ways that I didn't feel so great about and I do feel great about?
• 1:00:42
  SPEAKER_01: And then the flip side is not letting yourself get bullied and pressured and caught up in being aware of like the stories that you are influenced by and how that is impacting you.
• 1:00:53
  SPEAKER_01: So I think like if I could leave people with any lesson, it's even if you don't feel like you have it, you have space.
• 1:00:59
  SPEAKER_01: Take the space, take some time to sit with this.
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_01: Don't get yourself rushed.
• 1:01:03
  SPEAKER_01: Don't get into if you've noticed spider flight, hit your eject button.
• 1:01:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know, like um, you have more power in the buying process, I think, than a lot of us realize.
• 1:01:12
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and if you can learn about what's going on here about yourself and on the outside, it can make the decisions start to happen a little bit just better, honestly.
• 1:01:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:01:25
  SPEAKER_00: I'm glad, I'm glad that you worded it like that.
• 1:01:28
  SPEAKER_00: And it's also the question of asking when you're looking to invest, like, would you be okay if your expectations aren't met?
• 1:01:40
  SPEAKER_00: Like, are you still okay with investing in this if it doesn't work out like you're assuming that it will?
• 1:01:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that that's a good question to kind of sit with too.
• 1:01:51
  SPEAKER_00: And I I think that, you know, just from my experience in the past, I feel like going through that question could have probably helped me not make some and some investments.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_00: And then the other thing is like I would still probably invest in this brand thing that I'm super curious about.
• 1:02:10
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, um, I hope that this episode just leaves you feeling, like Shay said, just like more empowered when it comes to investing in yourself, being a buyer, being a consumer.
• 1:02:23
  SPEAKER_00: Also, you're probably learning some stuff if you're a business owner, like, oh, from the business perspective, what to be aware of as a business owner?
• 1:02:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like, do you have a sales team?
• 1:02:32
  SPEAKER_00: Like, how is that?
• 1:02:33
  SPEAKER_00: How's the scripts?
• 1:02:35
  SPEAKER_00: How's how is the energy in which you are showing up as a buyer or a consumer?
• 1:02:41
  SPEAKER_00: I just think that that is truly important.
• 1:02:43
  SPEAKER_00: But I think we're gonna close this episode down.
• 1:02:46
  SPEAKER_00: I had a lot of fun with this episode.
• 1:02:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I hope that you guys enjoyed it.
• 1:02:51
  SPEAKER_00: And if something popped out to you guys, totally let us know.
• 1:02:56
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, let us know like how you make decisions.
• 1:02:59
  SPEAKER_00: How are what are you investing in now?
• 1:03:01
  SPEAKER_00: We're totally curious about this stuff.
• 1:03:03
  SPEAKER_00: So reach out to us over on Instagram at Curiously Guided.
• 1:03:08
  SPEAKER_00: And we'd love to chat with you.
• 1:03:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I think Mariah just hit the nail on the head of like, when you are getting ready to invest in something, ask yourself why.
• 1:03:17
  SPEAKER_01: Am I am I doing this because there's a countdown timer that ends at midnight and I'm feeling rushed?
• 1:03:23
  SPEAKER_01: Or would I join this program in a year if I had to wait that long?
• 1:03:26
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it why, why, why?
• 1:03:29
  SPEAKER_01: It all comes back to why.
• 1:03:31
  SPEAKER_01: So if you can kind of give yourself some space to sit with the why and get real honest about it, I think that's really the magic here.
• 1:03:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um, thank you guys if you've made it this far in the episode.
• 1:03:39
  SPEAKER_01: You can tell this is a topic that really lights us up.
• 1:03:41
  SPEAKER_01: Like Mariah said, um, I would love to know, you know, I'm fascinated with sales and buying.
• 1:03:47
  SPEAKER_01: How does this play out for you?
• 1:03:48
  SPEAKER_01: You know, what are some of have you been manipulated before?
• 1:03:51
  SPEAKER_01: What are the some of the red lights and green flags or whatever that you look out for?
• 1:03:56
  SPEAKER_01: You know, please hit us up, DM us.
• 1:03:59
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, I am perpetually curious and I would love to get a little market research on this as well.
• 1:04:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, in the meantime, thank you so much for listening and for your support.
• 1:04:07
  SPEAKER_01: If you haven't yet, please um get on Apple or Spotify or whatever your player of choice is and leave us a review so we can all continue to grow together.
• 1:04:18
  SPEAKER_01: Um until next time, I hope that you guys remember that you have the power to create whatever the fuck you want.
• 1:04:25
  SPEAKER_01: Follow the nudge, ask questions, and let curiosity guide the way.
• 1:04:29
  SPEAKER_01: We'll see you in the next episode.