Latest / How To Protect The Ocean / The Ocean Is Visible Now, What Happens Next Is Up to Us

Transcript

The Ocean Is Visible Now, What Happens Next Is Up to Us · How To Protect The Ocean

• 0:00
  Satellite
• 0:00
  monitoring is
• 0:01
  changing ocean
• 0:02
  protection.
• 0:03
  You can turn off
• 0:04
  your transponder.
• 0:05
  You can change
• 0:06
  your flag.
• 0:07
  You can even move
• 0:08
  at night, but you
• 0:09
  cannot hide from
• 0:11
  space any longer.
• 0:13
  This is the How
• 0:13
  to Protect the
• 0:14
  Ocean podcast,
• 0:15
  your weekly ocean
• 0:15
  news update.
• 0:16
  If you care about
• 0:17
  staying informed
• 0:18
  about the ocean
• 0:19
  every weekday,
• 0:20
  hit that
• 0:20
  follow button
• 0:21
  right now so you
• 0:22
  don't miss
• 0:23
  tomorrow's story.
• 0:24
  Let's start off
• 0:25
  with satellite
• 0:26
  tracking.
• 0:27
  So satellite
• 0:27
  tracking, AIS
• 0:28
  systems and
• 0:29
  machine learning
• 0:30
  are
• 0:30
  transforming the
• 0:32
  way we do ocean
• 0:33
  enforcement for
• 0:34
  the first time in
• 0:34
  history.
• 0:35
  Large scale
• 0:36
  fishing effort
• 0:37
  can be observed
• 0:37
  globally near and
• 0:39
  near real time.
• 0:40
  Enforcement is no
• 0:41
  longer limited to
• 0:43
  patrol boats,
• 0:43
  which we talked
• 0:44
  about in
• 0:44
  yesterday's
• 0:45
  episode.
• 0:46
  So the key
• 0:46
  question here is
• 0:47
  can technology
• 0:47
  close the
• 0:48
  enforcement gap
• 0:49
  in marine
• 0:50
  protection? Let's
• 0:51
  talk about the
• 0:52
  evolution of
• 0:53
  monitoring or
• 0:54
  even the
• 0:54
  revolution of
• 0:55
  monitoring.
• 0:56
  Automatic
• 0:57
  identification
• 0:57
  systems, AIS,
• 0:59
  were originally
• 0:59
  designed to avoid
• 1:01
  collision.
• 1:02
  So large ships
• 1:03
  move at night or
• 1:04
  move around.
• 1:04
  And sometimes it's difficult to
• 1:06
  see where
• 1:06
  they are.
• 1:07
  They don't want
• 1:07
  to collide
• 1:08
  mid trip.
• 1:10
  And so that could
• 1:11
  be a big help to
• 1:12
  make sure that
• 1:12
  they know where
• 1:13
  everybody is.
• 1:14
  Large vessels are
• 1:15
  required to
• 1:16
  broadcast
• 1:16
  location, speed
• 1:18
  and course.
• 1:18
  So these signals
• 1:19
  can be captured
• 1:20
  by satellites and
• 1:22
  organizations now
• 1:23
  aggregate
• 1:23
  AIS data
• 1:24
  globally.
• 1:26
  So global fishing
• 1:26
  watch, which I'll
• 1:27
  put the website
• 1:28
  in the show notes
• 1:29
  so that you can
• 1:29
  get access to
• 1:30
  what they do
• 1:31
  because they're a
• 1:31
  great
• 1:31
  organization.
• 1:32
  They have made
• 1:32
  much of this data
• 1:34
  globally
• 1:35
  accessible.
• 1:36
  So for the first
• 1:36
  time, fishing
• 1:37
  effort is visible
• 1:38
  at a planetary
• 1:39
  scale and
• 1:40
  visibility
• 1:41
  changes
• 1:42
  incentives.
• 1:43
  Just a quick
• 1:43
  story about AIS.
• 1:46
  I did a project
• 1:47
  for the
• 1:47
  government of
• 1:48
  Canada for DFO
• 1:49
  Department of
• 1:50
  Fisheries oceans
• 1:50
  in the way on the
• 1:51
  east coast
• 1:51
  of Canada.
• 1:52
  When I was a
• 1:53
  contractor and
• 1:54
  the biggest thing
• 1:55
  that they wanted
• 1:55
  to do is find out
• 1:56
  where vessels go
• 1:57
  along the east
• 1:58
  coast of Canada.
• 1:59
  And we used AIS
• 2:00
  data that we got
• 2:01
  from coast, the
• 2:02
  coast guard, the
• 2:03
  Canadian
• 2:04
  coast guard.
• 2:05
  And we were able
• 2:05
  to use and make
• 2:06
  tracks and look
• 2:07
  at heat maps of
• 2:08
  where the most
• 2:09
  popular areas and
• 2:10
  shipping lanes
• 2:10
  were for
• 2:11
  the ships.
• 2:13
  It was great
• 2:13
  data, but it was
• 2:14
  always
• 2:14
  behind a wall.
• 2:16
  It was very difficult even
• 2:17
  for the
• 2:17
  Department of
• 2:18
  Fisheries and
• 2:18
  Oceans to get
• 2:19
  access to this
• 2:19
  data because they
• 2:20
  wanted to make
• 2:20
  sure that not
• 2:21
  everybody had
• 2:22
  access to it
• 2:22
  because, you
• 2:22
  know, you got to
• 2:23
  worry about
• 2:23
  safety and
• 2:24
  everything
• 2:24
  like that.
• 2:25
  Global fishing
• 2:25
  watch is making
• 2:26
  it accessible
• 2:27
  publicly so that
• 2:28
  you have access
• 2:29
  to this AIS data.
• 2:30
  Now, I don't know
• 2:30
  how old the AIS
• 2:31
  data is.
• 2:32
  I'm sure it's
• 2:32
  fairly recent,
• 2:34
  but this is going
• 2:34
  to help
• 2:35
  conservationists
• 2:35
  and fisheries
• 2:36
  managers enjoy
• 2:37
  making maps of
• 2:39
  the shipping
• 2:39
  lanes and even
• 2:40
  for fisheries to
• 2:41
  make sure they
• 2:42
  know where
• 2:43
  everybody is at
• 2:43
  all times in
• 2:44
  terms of fishing.
• 2:45
  Now, there is
• 2:46
  also a study that
• 2:47
  came out that 75%
• 2:48
  of fishing
• 2:49
  vessels do not
• 2:49
  have their AIS
• 2:50
  turned on, which
• 2:51
  is a problem and
• 2:52
  that needs
• 2:53
  to be solved.
• 2:54
  But satellite
• 2:54
  imagery can come
• 2:55
  in and help out.
• 2:57
  So research using
• 2:59
  tracking has
• 2:59
  shown that
• 3:00
  industrial
• 3:00
  fishing activity
• 3:01
  covers more than
• 3:02
  55% of the ocean
• 3:03
  surface.
• 3:04
  That's like
• 3:05
  that's that's
• 3:07
  half of the ocean
• 3:08
  surface, right?
• 3:09
  And the ocean
• 3:09
  covers 71%
• 3:10
  of the planet.
• 3:11
  Think about how
• 3:13
  often these ships
• 3:14
  are around and
• 3:15
  how much it
• 3:15
  actually covers.
• 3:17
  Fishing effort
• 3:17
  concentrates
• 3:18
  around productive
• 3:18
  regions and MPa
• 3:20
  boundaries.
• 3:20
  Why MPa
• 3:21
  boundaries? We've
• 3:22
  talked about this
• 3:22
  in the past over
• 3:23
  the past couple
• 3:24
  of weeks.
• 3:24
  It's because
• 3:25
  they're
• 3:25
  productive
• 3:25
  because they
• 3:26
  allow for the
• 3:27
  biomass and
• 3:28
  numbers of
• 3:28
  animals, a fish
• 3:30
  to and all
• 3:31
  different types
• 3:32
  of seafood to be
• 3:33
  able to spill
• 3:33
  over those
• 3:34
  boundaries.
• 3:34
  So they're always
• 3:35
  around those
• 3:36
  boundaries.
• 3:36
  Now, some vessels
• 3:37
  deliberately turn
• 3:38
  off their AIS
• 3:39
  near
• 3:39
  protected areas.
• 3:41
  So patterns of
• 3:42
  dark activity can
• 3:44
  be detected using
• 3:47
  radar satellite.
• 3:48
  So that means you
• 3:49
  don't have to
• 3:50
  have a satellite
• 3:50
  just looks at the
• 3:51
  visual spectrum.
• 3:52
  Radar satellite
• 3:53
  looks at a
• 3:53
  spectrum that you
• 3:54
  cannot normally
• 3:55
  detect when you
• 3:56
  are looking out
• 3:57
  at the night.
• 3:58
  So you're able to
• 3:59
  see ships at
• 4:00
  night where they
• 4:00
  are and
• 4:01
  how they do.
• 4:01
  That's why we say
• 4:02
  they cannot hide
• 4:03
  anymore.
• 4:04
  So synthetic
• 4:05
  aperture radar,
• 4:06
  which is SAR,
• 4:07
  which is what the
• 4:08
  radar is, can
• 4:10
  detect vessels
• 4:11
  even if the AIS
• 4:12
  is turned off.
• 4:13
  So whether
• 4:14
  they're at night
• 4:14
  or the GPS is
• 4:15
  turned off, they
• 4:16
  can actually
• 4:16
  detect them where
• 4:17
  they are and what
• 4:18
  they're doing.
• 4:19
  Non-compliance
• 4:19
  leaves digital
• 4:20
  fingerprints.
• 4:21
  This is an
• 4:22
  important fact.
• 4:23
  You know, we need
• 4:24
  to make sure that
• 4:25
  we can account
• 4:25
  for these fishing
• 4:26
  vessels,
• 4:26
  especially if
• 4:27
  they're near
• 4:28
  productive or
• 4:29
  protected areas,
• 4:30
  because that's
• 4:30
  where the
• 4:30
  fish are.
• 4:31
  And that's where
• 4:32
  a lot of the
• 4:32
  illegal activity
• 4:33
  is happening. And
• 4:34
  that's where a
• 4:34
  lot of the
• 4:35
  illegal activity
• 4:35
  is happening.
• 4:37
  Now let's talk
• 4:37
  about illegal,
• 4:38
  unreported and
• 4:38
  unregulated
• 4:39
  fishing, IU
• 4:40
  fishing.
• 4:41
  So I you fishing
• 4:42
  cost the global
• 4:43
  economy and
• 4:44
  estimated 10 to
• 4:45
  23 billion US
• 4:47
  dollars annually.
• 4:48
  That's a
• 4:48
  huge amount.
• 4:49
  It
• 4:49
  disproportionately
• 4:50
  affects
• 4:51
  developing
• 4:51
  coastal nations
• 4:52
  and weak
• 4:53
  enforcement
• 4:54
  regions are
• 4:55
  especially
• 4:55
  vulnerable.
• 4:56
  So areas like of
• 4:57
  like say
• 4:58
  countries that
• 4:59
  cannot afford to
• 5:00
  do enforcement,
• 5:00
  that do not have
• 5:01
  the funding and
• 5:01
  we talked about
• 5:02
  yesterday to do
• 5:03
  enforcement.
• 5:03
  That's where
• 5:04
  illegal fishing
• 5:05
  happens. That's
• 5:05
  where the IU
• 5:06
  fishing actually
• 5:07
  happens.
• 5:08
  So the high seas
• 5:09
  fleets often
• 5:10
  operate far from
• 5:11
  national
• 5:11
  oversight. So
• 5:13
  satellite
• 5:13
  monitoring
• 5:13
  increases
• 5:14
  detection
• 5:14
  probability. They
• 5:15
  can go anywhere.
• 5:16
  Doesn't matter if
• 5:17
  they're out of
• 5:17
  the reach of a
• 5:18
  lot of the patrol
• 5:19
  boats. It doesn't
• 5:20
  matter if they're
• 5:20
  in areas that are
• 5:21
  fully remote.
• 5:22
  These are areas
• 5:23
  that can be
• 5:23
  accessible
• 5:24
  through satellite
• 5:26
  imagery. Now with
• 5:26
  satellite
• 5:27
  imagery, SARS can
• 5:28
  look through
• 5:28
  clouds,
• 5:28
  which is great.
• 5:29
  Other satellite
• 5:29
  imagery that's
• 5:30
  not SARS like
• 5:31
  this, not radar
• 5:31
  is something that
• 5:33
  you have to be
• 5:33
  concerned about
• 5:34
  because you'll
• 5:34
  get like, you
• 5:35
  know, clouds on a
• 5:35
  cloudy day. You
• 5:36
  know, these
• 5:37
  fishers might get
• 5:37
  a little smart. I don't know.
• 5:38
  But you know, you
• 5:39
  have to be
• 5:40
  careful with
• 5:40
  that. But with
• 5:41
  this radar
• 5:41
  detection, it
• 5:42
  actually helps.
• 5:43
  All right. The
• 5:44
  detection
• 5:44
  probably
• 5:44
  increases the
• 5:46
  deterrence,
• 5:47
  right? The fact
• 5:48
  that that fishers
• 5:49
  know that they
• 5:49
  can be detected
• 5:50
  by satellite,
• 5:51
  that actually
• 5:51
  probably helps
• 5:52
  with the turn. So
• 5:53
  deterrence will
• 5:53
  change the way
• 5:54
  people behave
• 5:55
  around MPAs,
• 5:57
  around
• 5:57
  productive sites.
• 5:59
  Now, global
• 5:59
  fishing watch as
• 6:00
  an example, shows
• 6:02
  that technology
• 6:03
  in action. So,
• 6:05
  you know, it
• 6:05
  provides open
• 6:06
  access maps of
• 6:07
  global fishing
• 6:08
  effort, which
• 6:08
  always helps.
• 6:09
  This data is used
• 6:10
  by journalists,
• 6:11
  scientists and
• 6:12
  governments, and
• 6:13
  it helps identify
• 6:14
  suspicious
• 6:14
  activity inside
• 6:16
  MPAs, especially
• 6:17
  when you have
• 6:17
  boats that are,
• 6:18
  you know,
• 6:19
  skirting around
• 6:19
  the boundaries.
• 6:20
  These boundaries
• 6:21
  are not visible
• 6:22
  when you're
• 6:23
  out at sea.
• 6:24
  You know, you
• 6:24
  know it from a
• 6:24
  GPS and they
• 6:25
  probably have the
• 6:26
  boundaries on
• 6:26
  their navigation
• 6:27
  maps, but you
• 6:28
  don't really see
• 6:28
  it on the ocean.
• 6:29
  So they can
• 6:29
  always say that
• 6:30
  they didn't know
• 6:30
  they were inside
• 6:31
  or out. But now
• 6:32
  with satellite,
• 6:32
  you can tell if
• 6:33
  they're inside
• 6:33
  now. And the fact
• 6:34
  that satellite
• 6:35
  imagery can come
• 6:36
  in faster than
• 6:37
  ever, you know,
• 6:38
  there's some
• 6:38
  sites back in the
• 6:39
  day, back in the
• 6:40
  day in the early
• 6:41
  2000s, when I was
• 6:42
  using satellite,
• 6:43
  you had to wait
• 6:44
  like a day or you
• 6:45
  had to wake up.
• 6:45
  So it's very
• 6:46
  difficult for
• 6:46
  detection of
• 6:47
  illegal fishing.
• 6:48
  But once you
• 6:49
  actually are able
• 6:49
  to get it almost
• 6:50
  near real time,
• 6:51
  that actually
• 6:51
  helps. So it
• 6:52
  increases
• 6:53
  transparency for
• 6:55
  distant water
• 6:55
  fleets, right?
• 6:57
  This is that's
• 6:57
  what that's what
• 6:58
  it really it
• 6:58
  really does. In
• 7:00
  some regions,
• 7:00
  governments now
• 7:01
  use satellite
• 7:02
  alerts to trigger
• 7:03
  patrol
• 7:03
  deployment.
• 7:04
  So if someone's
• 7:05
  near a marine
• 7:05
  protected area,
• 7:07
  boom, it sends a
• 7:08
  trigger that
• 7:09
  trigger goes to
• 7:10
  the patrol unit.
• 7:11
  The patrol unit
• 7:11
  goes out to make
• 7:12
  sure that they
• 7:12
  can get there in
• 7:13
  time in case
• 7:14
  there's any
• 7:14
  illegal activity.
• 7:16
  So enforcement is
• 7:16
  actually becoming
• 7:17
  data driven,
• 7:18
  which for
• 7:18
  scientists, that
• 7:20
  is where it's at.
• 7:21
  Now, studies show
• 7:22
  that fishing
• 7:22
  effort often
• 7:23
  clusters just
• 7:24
  outside of MP
• 7:24
  boundaries. Like
• 7:25
  I mentioned,
• 7:26
  fishing the line
• 7:27
  is a common
• 7:27
  practice of
• 7:28
  fishing that
• 7:28
  boundary line.
• 7:30
  Some incursions
• 7:30
  occur inside
• 7:31
  weekly enforced
• 7:32
  MPAs. And then
• 7:33
  the satellite
• 7:34
  helps document
• 7:35
  these violations
• 7:35
  in well
• 7:36
  enforced MPAs.
• 7:37
  Visible vessel
• 7:38
  traffic inside
• 7:38
  boundaries is
• 7:39
  actually minimal
• 7:40
  because we know
• 7:41
  one satellites is
• 7:42
  monitoring these
• 7:43
  areas and the
• 7:43
  patrol boats can
• 7:44
  go out. So
• 7:45
  technology
• 7:45
  strengthens the
• 7:46
  accountability
• 7:47
  within MPAs. Now,
• 7:49
  of course,
• 7:49
  there's
• 7:49
  always gaps.
• 7:50
  When we talk
• 7:51
  about any kind of
• 7:52
  data driven
• 7:52
  technology. So
• 7:54
  the technology is
• 7:54
  not a silver
• 7:55
  bullet. So
• 7:56
  smaller vessels
• 7:57
  often do not
• 7:58
  carry a is so we
• 8:00
  get difficult to
• 8:01
  tell if there's a
• 8:01
  smaller vessel in
• 8:02
  there. Some
• 8:02
  vessels spoof
• 8:03
  location data.
• 8:04
  They're got,
• 8:05
  they're getting
• 8:05
  smart and we have
• 8:06
  to be smarter.
• 8:07
  And enforcement
• 8:08
  still requires
• 8:08
  legal authority
• 8:09
  and prosecution.
• 8:10
  So you still once
• 8:11
  you get
• 8:11
  enforcement, you
• 8:12
  can catch the
• 8:12
  people, but you
• 8:13
  have to bring
• 8:14
  them back and
• 8:14
  particular to
• 8:15
  court. And of
• 8:15
  course, sometimes
• 8:16
  like I know in
• 8:17
  Canada, a lot of
• 8:17
  times the
• 8:18
  punishment doesn't fit in.
• 8:19
  The punishment
• 8:19
  doesn't fit the
• 8:20
  crime. You know,
• 8:21
  so a lot of times
• 8:21
  they'll get off
• 8:22
  with a lot more,
• 8:23
  maybe a small
• 8:23
  fine and that
• 8:24
  might be worth
• 8:25
  getting, you
• 8:26
  know, a small
• 8:26
  fine as you know,
• 8:28
  if the payment is
• 8:30
  worth it.
• 8:30
  However, if you
• 8:32
  could get
• 8:33
  continued found,
• 8:34
  if you're
• 8:34
  continually found
• 8:35
  guilty in court,
• 8:36
  then maybe that
• 8:36
  will affect what
• 8:38
  you're going to
• 8:38
  do later on
• 8:39
  because the
• 8:39
  punishment is
• 8:39
  going to get
• 8:40
  stronger and
• 8:40
  stronger and
• 8:41
  stronger. Right.
• 8:42
  So many countries
• 8:43
  lack capacity to
• 8:45
  respond to
• 8:45
  satellite alerts.
• 8:46
  So that's a
• 8:46
  problem. You can
• 8:47
  detect as much as
• 8:48
  you want, but if
• 8:49
  you can't catch
• 8:49
  them, that's a
• 8:50
  difficulty. So
• 8:51
  technology
• 8:52
  creates
• 8:52
  visibility, but
• 8:53
  visibility must
• 8:54
  translate into
• 8:55
  action. We still
• 8:56
  need that
• 8:57
  enforcement like
• 8:57
  we talked about yesterday.
• 8:59
  Now, satellite
• 9:01
  monitoring shifts
• 9:02
  the balance of
• 9:02
  power back to the
• 9:04
  government, let's
• 9:05
  say, or the
• 9:06
  monitoring
• 9:06
  agencies. It
• 9:07
  reduces plausible
• 9:08
  deniability. It
• 9:09
  exposes
• 9:10
  inconsistencies
• 9:10
  between policy
• 9:12
  and practice. It
• 9:13
  allows NGOs and
• 9:14
  civil society to
• 9:15
  hold governments
• 9:16
  accountable.
• 9:18
  Ocean governments
• 9:18
  is becoming
• 9:19
  transparent, but
• 9:20
  transparency only
• 9:21
  matters if
• 9:21
  consequences
• 9:22
  follow, just like
• 9:23
  I
• 9:23
  mentioned before.
• 9:24
  Now, if you enjoy
• 9:25
  this type of
• 9:25
  evidence based
• 9:26
  ocean reporting
• 9:27
  that goes beyond
• 9:28
  the headlines,
• 9:29
  follow the show
• 9:30
  and hit that
• 9:30
  follow button and
• 9:32
  don't miss
• 9:32
  tomorrow's
• 9:33
  episode. Now
• 9:34
  let's just frame
• 9:35
  it up here and
• 9:36
  the final part.
• 9:37
  Now technology
• 9:38
  has changed the
• 9:39
  equation. We've
• 9:40
  gotten better for
• 9:41
  decades. The
• 9:42
  ocean was too
• 9:42
  vast to monitor.
• 9:43
  It was hard to be
• 9:44
  everywhere at
• 9:45
  once. Now it is
• 9:46
  visible. Illegal
• 9:47
  fishing leaves a
• 9:48
  digital trace
• 9:49
  boundary
• 9:50
  violations can be
• 9:51
  mapped effort can
• 9:53
  be quantified.
• 9:54
  The era of
• 9:55
  invisible
• 9:55
  exploitation is
• 9:56
  actually ending.
• 9:58
  But here is the critical point.
• 10:00
  Data does not
• 10:02
  enforce itself.
• 10:04
  Satellites can
• 10:04
  detect
• 10:04
  violations.
• 10:06
  Governments must
• 10:06
  still act and
• 10:08
  technology. It's
• 10:09
  just a tool.
• 10:10
  Enforcement is
• 10:11
  the actual
• 10:11
  decision and
• 10:12
  protection still
• 10:13
  depends on that political will.
• 10:14
  So I'd love to
• 10:17
  hear your
• 10:17
  thoughts on this
• 10:18
  episode on
• 10:19
  satellite
• 10:19
  detection. Have
• 10:20
  you been working
• 10:21
  with satellite
• 10:22
  imagery before?
• 10:23
  What is your
• 10:23
  experience? What
• 10:24
  have you done? If
• 10:25
  you were
• 10:25
  especially in the
• 10:26
  fisheries area?
• 10:27
  If you're just
• 10:27
  listening to this
• 10:28
  for the first
• 10:28
  time, love to
• 10:29
  hear your
• 10:29
  thoughts. Do you
• 10:29
  think this will
• 10:30
  work? If we'd
• 10:31
  like to hear more
• 10:31
  examples, we can
• 10:32
  talk about more
• 10:33
  examples, let me
• 10:34
  know how you feel
• 10:35
  by going to
• 10:35
  SpeakUpForBlue.com
• 10:37
  forward slash
• 10:38
  feedback that
• 10:39
  SpeakUpForBlue.com
• 10:41
  forward slash
• 10:41
  feedback. I would
• 10:42
  love to hear your
• 10:43
  thoughts. And of course, I'd love to hear your thoughts.
• 10:44
  of information
• 10:47
  about the ocean,
• 10:48
  hit that follow
• 10:49
  button and share
• 10:50
  it with a friend.
• 10:51
  The best way that
• 10:51
  we can get in
• 10:52
  front of more
• 10:52
  people and teach
• 10:53
  people more about
• 10:54
  the ocean and
• 10:55
  conservation
• 10:55
  that's hitting
• 10:56
  the ocean and the
• 10:56
  issues that are
• 10:57
  hitting the ocean
• 10:57
  is really to
• 10:58
  refer a friend.
• 10:59
  So refer this to
• 11:00
  a friend and you
• 11:01
  get brownie
• 11:01
  points from me.
• 11:02
  I want to thank
• 11:03
  you so much for
• 11:03
  joining me on
• 11:04
  today's episode
• 11:04
  of the How to
• 11:05
  Protect the Ocean
• 11:05
  podcast.
• 11:06
  I'm your host,
• 11:06
  Andrew Lewin.
• 11:07
  Have a great day.
• 11:08
  We'll talk to you
• 11:08
  next time and
• 11:09
  happy
• 11:09
  conservation.