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Transcript

Why Are They Called Crows and Ravens? · Wildly Curious

• 0:42
  SPEAKER_00: Hello listeners, it's Laura back again, alone without Katie, and I'm feeling like a piece of me is gone.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_00: No, but it really is weird to be doing anything with the podcast without Katie.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: But we both have we're both very busy.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: As you guys know, I've I'm a mom of a baby.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's hard to find the time to do anything, especially scheduling things together.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_00: So we're doing a few of these mini things alone, and then we're gonna jump into our next season.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_00: Hopefully, you'll be hearing from us both next week.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: But until then, let's do another how did that bird get its name?
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: Today I'm gonna be talking about crows and ravens, which are some of my most favorite birds.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: So last time I talked to you all, it was chickadees and titmice.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_00: Chickadees are probably my favorite bird.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_00: But very close behind that are crows, which is what we're gonna talk about today.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_00: So these are some of the most famous birds in the world.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_00: You go anywhere, and most people are pretty cool with crows and ravens just because they're not just famous, but also infamous.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: They're seen in literature, they're very tied with our culture and folklore and things like that.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_00: They show up everywhere: mythology, spooky stories, things like that.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: And because of the nature of their infamy and the stories that they're involved in, they're often treated like some mysterious or ominous birds.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: But the actual names crow and raven are pretty simple in their etymology, where they came from.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: Both came from very old attempts to imitate the sounds that the birds make.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: So again, it's very similar to where Chickadee came from, but in a little bit different ways.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: And here's how.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_00: First, natural history.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_00: Crows belong to the Corvidé family, which also includes ravens, jays, and magpies.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_00: And Corvids are widely considered some of the most intelligent birds on earth.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: If you haven't looked up videos of crow solving puzzles, you totally should, because it's awesome.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: Plus, they can also speak and imitate human-like noises and talk.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: They're awesome.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: And they're really big into family.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: I could go on and on about how awesome crows are.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I it's one of my most it's one of my life goals to become a crow princess, which is one of those people that can leave food out for crows and then crows will bring them trinkets to show their thanks.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_00: I want to be a friend of a crow and have them bring me cool stuff.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: Not there yet, but I'm working on it.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_00: So crows are known for tool use problem solving, remembering human faces, which we've definitely talked about on the podcast before, and complex social structures.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: They live on every continent except Antarctica.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: And the name crow is used for more than 30 species in the genus Corvus.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_00: So where did the name come from?
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's very, very old.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: One of the earliest printed appearances of the word dates back to around 700 CE or Common Era, in a Latin old English glossary.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: So old English forms of the word were kra, C-R-A-W-E, or Kre or actually no, I'm not even gonna try that one.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's got a long A.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_00: So kra krewe, maybe.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_00: High old German was kra wa with a K-R-A-W-A.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: So no matter the w how you say it, whether it's krawe, kra-wah, it it sounds just like what a crow says.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: So and if you've ever heard a crow making a noise, that's what they sound like.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: Which is actually a really good segue for a joke.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_00: Really nerdy bird joke.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so there are two species of crows that you can find here on the East Coast.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: There is the American crow and there is the fish crow.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: And if you don't, it's very hard to tell them apart.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: They look almost exactly the same.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_00: They just sound different.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: And so one of the best ways to be able to st see who's who is to go up to a crow and you ask it, are you an American crow?
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: And if they go, nuh-uh, nuh-uh, then they're not an American crow, they're a fish crow.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_00: And for anybody who's nerdy enough to be laughing right now, it's because fish crows actually say that.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_00: They go, nuh-uh, nuh-uh, that's their noise, whereas an American crow is more of like a call-call sound.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: So that the humans just heard the bird saying call and the name of old match that noise.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_00: Ravens also have a very similar reputation.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_00: Their name actually has a different linguistic origin, even though it's still just trying to imitate their sound.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_00: So ravens are also members of the Corvidae family.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: And the name Raven originally referred to the common raven, although there are more than 10 species that use that name, the name of raven today.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_00: Ravens are generally larger than crows, have thicker bills, and have a more deep, throaty croaking noise.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: But again, they're really hard to tell apart, especially like at least around here.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_00: Size is very relative when you're just looking at one bird and not two birds beside each other.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_00: But the wedge-shaped tail is a little bit of a tail in the thicker bills.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: Everything a crow is known for, ravens are also known for.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_00: Being smart, complex play behaviors, strong pair bonds, being referenced in a ton of literature.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_00: But the name comes from very old English, some recorded sometime before 900 CE.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_00: So again, crow was 700 CE first time it showed up.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_00: Raven is at least before 900 CE.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_00: Now I did attempt to look up the pronunciations of these old English because the way they're spelled, I was like, hmm, how is this actually said?
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's spelled H-R-E-F-N or H-R-A-E-F-N, which that H is more like a just like a throaty noise.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_00: And then so it's Craffen with a little bit of a trill R again, you know.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: And and the F is supposed to be kind of like a V, Craffen.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_00: So take her to leave my pronunciation.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: But old English was Craffen or Rheffen.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: Most likely came from Proto-Germanic root chrabnas and the it that's H-R-A-B-N-A-Z.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: The B in there is supposed to just be like a touch of a B, not really like a hard B.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: So chrabnas or hnas, not really a Z, more of an S.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: Over time that word was shortened and simplified into the modern Raven.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: But again, if you just say that word chrabnas, chrabnas, chaffen, it's it's a lot of like the ch it's that throaty noise of their harsh croaking call, just like the krawe, krawa sounded.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_00: So the bird the bird name is just the noise that they make.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_00: Although if you've ever heard there, if you look up in the dictionary raven, there's raven the bird, but there's also the verb raven, which means to plunder or devour greedily.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_00: They have different origins, they have different pronunciations historically, and they have completely different meanings.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_00: So although the bird, the bird name and that verb are the same, the bird did not get its name from the verb.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's just because it's greedy and destructive.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_00: Like that's a terrible thing to tie them together with.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: They have, like I said, completely different etymolog etymological originations.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_00: So crows and ravens may feel mysterious because of the myths surrounding them, but their names actually come from something super simple, which is just ancient peoples trying to imitate bird calls.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: And as you can see from my own imitations, I mean, it's probably the best way to tell somebody, especially if you didn't know them very well, hey, I saw that bird over there, it was black.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there's a lot of black birds.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: What are you gonna call that one?
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_00: You're just gonna use the way that it sounds to describe it, and eventually that's gonna be the name of a bird.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: So even though the birds became symbols of things like death, battle, prophecy, things like that, their names are just super simple in the fact that they came from the way they sound.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_00: So that is the origination of where the names Crow and Raven came from.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_00: Again, not super complicated, but I kind of like that.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: And still really cool birds.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_00: That's all I have for you for this episode, but don't forget, tune in next week.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_00: Hopefully, it'll be next week, or at least the week after, we're gonna be starting season 14, which I again we say this all the time.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_00: I can't believe we're here already.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: We took our short break, we both had to take care of life stuff.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: Now, hopefully, we're gonna get back in the groove and bring you lots of more great content.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: So be sure to keep listening.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_00: Find us on any on podcast platform you can, and if you really like what you're hearing, please help us out on Patreon.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_00: All right, we'll talk to you all soon.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_00: Bye.