Latest / Two Girls, One TBR / Stephanie Storm: Paranormal & Urban Fantasy

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Stephanie Storm: Paranormal & Urban Fantasy · Two Girls, One TBR

• 0:10
  Welcome back, book babes. Look, they said you should never
• 0:13
  meet your heroes, but we think that is boring.
• 0:17
  Tonight we are proving that authors aren't these
• 0:21
  untouchable, perfect creatures on a pedestal.
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  They are just humans with a dark side and a story that refuses to
• 0:29
  stay buried. Exactly.
• 0:32
  So tonight we have the incredible Stephanie Storm.
• 0:36
  She's a urban fantasy author. She's joining us from Amsterdam
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  today, and we're going to talk about her newest book, the is it
• 0:44
  Legion? Legion.
• 0:45
  Am I saying that right? Legend.
• 0:46
  It's not legend. It's Legion of pride.
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  I think it's Legion. Why?
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  Every time I come on here I just like start rambling.
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  We never pronounce. We never pronounce anything like
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  I. Know how to say this in my head
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  but when it comes out of my mouth it's I was like Oh my
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  gosh, I said it wrong. You know, anyways.
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  Legion of prat people. Have to be accepting of us at
• 1:12
  this point to know that we never pronounce anything right.
• 1:15
  It's going to happen, but continue on them.
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  Yeah, so Legion of Pride is her newest book coming out, and
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  mostly we're going to just really talk to her about our
• 1:26
  fucked up TBRS and our rating systems too.
• 1:31
  And she's got some fun little tidbits that she wants to holler
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  at us about, so I'm excited to talk to her.
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  And of course, remember, I am Rebecca.
• 1:39
  And I am Heather and this is 2 girls, 1 TBR.
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  So let's get yeah, the. Now one other thing, before we
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  bring Stephanie in, we have to talk about the mood.
• 1:51
  Now if you follow us on Instagram, you saw the blood
• 1:55
  float yesterday that we posted. It's our in our sip section.
• 2:00
  If you go into on our Instagram under the highlights, that's
• 2:04
  where it's listed. It's a tequila, orange juice and
• 2:08
  a Cabernet float that looks like a monster hiding in plain sight.
• 2:11
  That's interesting. Some wine and tequila together.
• 2:15
  I've. Never done that before.
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  That's brave. I don't know if that would taste
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  good. Myself myself personally, I do
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  not like tequila. The.
• 2:28
  Good stuff. Well, probably because I was
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  drinking those, those little bomb things, whatever they are,
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  those little round bottles that you can get there and it was
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  tequila and I didn't like it. I was like, that was the face I
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  was doing while I was drinking it.
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  I did drink the whole thing, but the whole time I kept doing that
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  face. So, so now if you guys are like,
• 2:48
  you know, if you're listening along while you're driving or
• 2:50
  you're doing chores, but check out the recipe and, you know,
• 2:53
  try out one of our fancy drinks. Yeah, let's know how you like
• 2:57
  it. So now what are you?
• 3:00
  What are you reading over there? OK so I got in advance listening
• 3:04
  copy to a book that I've already read but I love my audio book so
• 3:09
  I had to grab this from the author.
• 3:12
  She's an indie author. Her name is A A Dasalvia.
• 3:18
  I'm so bad with things. Anyway, it'll be up on my
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  Instagram soon. It's called Periphery.
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  And it is so cool how she writes it like it's like the FMC gets
• 3:32
  in a car crash with her husband. Her husband ends up dying.
• 3:36
  I almost spoiled that. He ends up dying and she lives
• 3:41
  but has to be resuscitated. So she kind of comes back with
• 3:46
  like a savant syndrome kind of superpower, she calls it.
• 3:51
  So she cut her brain kind of gets like rewired and we find
• 3:56
  out later on how that happened. And this new person she meets in
• 4:00
  her life is part of that. And she talks about, you know,
• 4:05
  how there's like 7. This actually kind of goes with
• 4:08
  Stephanie's book actually, because she in Stephanie's book,
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  she's talking about the levels of hell, you know, there's seven
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  and then the apocalypse and stuff.
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  And so, so think of that, but like different linear areas you
• 4:28
  live in. I forget how they describe it in
• 4:30
  the book. I'm getting to that part again.
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  So interesting. Like you have 7 lives.
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  I think they could do like 7 or 9 and there's like these
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  different, what do they call it? So it's like different
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  experiences of life. Yes, yes, OK, So like
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  reincarnation, right, So like if you.
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  Say I see what you're saying. I am living in this life here
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  today in my reality, right? But there's actually like 8
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  other realities that I'm a part of that I have no idea about.
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  So then they figure out how to travel people there and people
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  are now paying to live in that better tier.
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  So like some lives, let's say you know, you're a homeless
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  person on the street, maybe alcoholic.
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  And you're like, I don't want to go live in that.
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  Like I don't want to die and become that person.
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  And then let's say you're over here in this linear universe.
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  You are like the rich celebrity so.
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  Living in fact kind of hills. So would it be like timelines?
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  It's the same timeline, but you're on a different linear,
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  different world. What did?
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  What did they call that? When they say it's you're
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  different because it's different timelines, it's different.
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  I can't think of the word right now.
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  It reminds me of The Avengers, Yeah, like the multiverse.
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  OK, That's what it kind of reminds me of cause like when
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  the Avenger, like Marvel Movies Now are starting to do that
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  where they're like. They're on a different plane.
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  Yes. Thank you.
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  There we go. Yeah, it was.
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  So what a really. Cool.
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  Oh, that is a sand concept. She makes it twisty because then
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  like doing a reread, actually, I'm like, oh, that's a clue.
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  That's a clue. That's a.
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  Now you're picking. Up on things that.
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  You get so. Interesting.
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  Yes, I like that now. Yeah, it's so different.
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  That is very different now. How spicy is it?
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  There's definitely spice, but it's not fade to black, but it's
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  not like very descriptive, that's all.
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  Descriptive, but it's still there's.
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  Relationships. I think it's book 2 because this
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  is number one. Book 2 is called I don't
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  remember. I'll remember later on and I'll
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  it'll pop in my head, but she I think goes into more spice in
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  that one if I remember right because I read these last year.
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  Would you consider this one that you're reading right now more of
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  a slow burn kind of kind of OK? Because she's interesting about
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  planes, so there's different kind of relationships with the
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  people she. Knows.
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  Depends what. She.
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  OK, now do the people like in these different planes and that
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  does she see them in the other planes but in different aspects
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  of life? Kinda yeah, I like that.
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  Okay, that sounds interesting. That would be a good.
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  Fun, right? Yes.
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  Or a good I love show. Like.
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  Yeah, that would be awesome. Cuz yeah, maybe one day Hulu or
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  something will pick her up. Cuz I have to say Hulu has or
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  Netflix and they have been really picking up a lot of
• 7:35
  different books and different things or even video games that
• 7:38
  we have played and have made them into, you know, live things
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  like Prime has Fallout. I don't know if you've watched
• 7:45
  that yet. If you're ever played the game
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  or anything. I've never played Fallout.
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  I've watched my, you've seen it. I've watched my husband play it
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  because it's a very, it has a very interesting story line.
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  And if you get a chance to watch it on Prime, watch it because it
• 8:00
  is very good. But warning, it is gory.
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  OK. There's it.
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  It's not for little kids. It's.
• 8:07
  So late at night when Mom? Yes, yes.
• 8:12
  But it's very again, very good. Now I finished stock price.
• 8:20
  I had to think for a second stock by Seduction Shadows by
• 8:23
  Maggie Sincere. I finished it and now I am on to
• 8:27
  the second book in the duet, Taken by Touch and Torment.
• 8:31
  Do you like it more? And it's, well, it's, it's,
• 8:34
  it's, it still has the same vibe.
• 8:36
  I'm only at the beginning of it, but it's very good.
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  I like how she writes because you know how sometimes you'll
• 8:44
  read a book and it's a little harder.
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  It's like a lot it really, it's just a little bit more harder to
• 8:49
  comprehend or whatever how you want to put it.
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  This is a very easy read for me. I really like it.
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  The part like I'm at the beginning because something
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  happens at the end of book 1 that thank God that this is out
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  so I don't have to to wait. And so now I'm seeing the
• 9:05
  repercussions from what happened at the end.
• 9:08
  Nice. But it's good, I'm excited to
• 9:10
  see where it goes and what happens with my rune.
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  I'm having a pattern I've noticed here lately.
• 9:21
  Like I like men with rune, that's their name, like a lot of
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  them. And I've been digging a vampire
• 9:26
  stuff here lately. Yeah, like the stocked, not
• 9:30
  stocked sorrow. What's our book?
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  I was going to show you my book with sorrow.
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  Kingdom of Silent Sorrows. Yeah.
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  I haven't got that because I plan.
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  I think I'm going to. I might be that one next.
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  Oh, you. Oh you God.
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  I haven't I I only opened it to this part because my kids wanted
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  to see what was inside but like look how cute it is.
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  I don't want to show like my address and stuff.
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  But she is so. She did.
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  She is so sweet. Well this came from a book, not
• 10:01
  from her directly came from Nina Love Nina website.
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  She's a book boutique. Oh OK, but she did a really
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  cute. Job look at this.
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  Oh that is very cute. Oh, I like that.
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  So let's see. Let's see what it looks like.
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  So oh look how pretty. I love it when they wrap them
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  pretty like that. Oh wow.
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  Oh, look. Oh, you've got all kinds of cute
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  little things. There.
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  How cute. See see this is.
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  What satin ribbon you? Oh, how pretty.
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  This is what makes it nice. Oh, eucalyptus isn't that.
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  Eucalyptus isn't appetite. Yeah, see boutiques and stuff.
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  It's so nice to be able to have this hand touch.
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  Indeed, and everything like factors, book authors,
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  bookstores. Look how pretty her book is.
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  Oh, there's. Something else in the front
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  there. Is Oh my gosh, that's not
• 11:01
  expecting that bookmarks. Bookmarks.
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  Oh, and AJ Harris, she is going to be on the podcast here,
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  hopefully here one of these days soon so we can talk about her
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  book as well. Oh, there's more stuff inside.
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  I got art. Look at that and.
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  Remember, she did all the artwork for her book as well,
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  Yeah. That's why I bought it.
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  So I'm on like a kick right now with authors who do their own
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  work. OK it is not signed though, so
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  unless I'm going to the wrong page.
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  But I don't see a signature. So I got goodies is just I'm
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  going to have to meet her in person.
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  She lives, if I remember right, she's in California.
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  But you never, OK. And you go out to California.
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  Yeah, I do. I'm a regular.
• 11:53
  I think next year I'm definitely going to go to room and to see
• 11:55
  Con. I just need.
• 11:57
  To you and Chelsea should go because Chelsea's planning on
• 12:00
  going again too. See, I love that.
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  Yeah. It's very also if you look at
• 12:06
  the cover, I believe on the hardcover, yeah, it has that
• 12:09
  different artwork than the the. And it's in color, right?
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  Because yours is on the inside, but it's black and white.
• 12:15
  Yeah, mine's black and white on the inside.
• 12:16
  Yeah, because I got the paperback right.
• 12:19
  Oh, yeah. But isn't it?
• 12:21
  She's it? What she does is beautiful.
• 12:23
  Love it. I like I can't draw people for
• 12:26
  the life of me. She is like the picture right in
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  front of me and I'm like. Oh, I can't do.
• 12:32
  Trying to like get it just right.
• 12:35
  But she's hilarious too, so if you ever see her on Instagram
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  and stuff, she does hilarious videos.
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  She's just, she's a very bubbly, very, very sweet yes lady.
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  I like her, but this is a vampire book.
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  And I'm excited to read this with you, Rebecca.
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  I have. This.
• 12:52
  I'm excited to read it because when I talk to her, I think, I
• 12:57
  think it was her that I was talking to.
• 13:00
  She was working on the next book writing because she has, I think
• 13:03
  she has book 2 done and I think it's the third book she's
• 13:06
  working on if I remember correct.
• 13:09
  I could be wrong. But now what are you drinking
• 13:12
  over there? Because now we know what we're
• 13:13
  all reading. A buttery Chardonnay from
• 13:16
  Costco. Now I have I have my cherry
• 13:20
  Coke, but then I also have my go to a Jamaican me happy because
• 13:28
  it's 80 some degrees here. What is that?
• 13:32
  I don't think it's a wine cooler.
• 13:35
  I don't know what's in it to touch with.
• 13:36
  And I'm at the age now when I look at things with my contacts,
• 13:40
  I can't read half of the stuff that's on it.
• 13:42
  But it's it's fruity, though. It's got watermelon, it's lemon,
• 13:46
  strawberry and maybe oranges in it.
• 13:49
  I don't know. I'll have to look at it.
• 13:50
  But they are really good. If no one, if you've ever never
• 13:53
  have tried one to make me happy's are good.
• 13:55
  They make them in several like the the wine coolers.
• 13:58
  They make different ones. There's like there's Jamaican me
• 14:01
  happy, Jamaican me, It's like different versions, but the
• 14:06
  Jamaican me happy is my favorite.
• 14:08
  I will drink the strawberry daiquiri one.
• 14:10
  I like that one. I like, I like sweet.
• 14:14
  That's my thing. If I'm going to drink alcohol, I
• 14:17
  like sweet. I like that.
• 14:19
  And I know Arbor Mist, you know, people go poo poo on it and
• 14:22
  they're like, I like their BlackBerry 1 and I like their
• 14:27
  Strawberry one. It's good.
• 14:28
  And you can buy giant things of it for like, yeah, and it tastes
• 14:33
  good. And I and I like to drink those
• 14:35
  out of a champagne flute. I need to get my wine glasses
• 14:39
  out of my. I haven't had you have all this
• 14:41
  nice China you talk about. You gotta start having some tea
• 14:45
  dates with our teacher. Oh, yeah.
• 14:47
  Oh, because I have the bone China.
• 14:50
  Yeah. Shin plates with the tea cups.
• 14:52
  I have them in that they're really old.
• 14:55
  They're pretty like from like maybe the 50s or something like
• 14:58
  that, 40s fifties. That's amazing.
• 15:00
  I have, I like those, but my kids were really little and I
• 15:04
  didn't trust them around all my glass stuff because I have
• 15:07
  depression glass and, and things like that.
• 15:10
  And so I'm hoping to to move some of my cabinets and stuff
• 15:15
  around. And now that I don't think
• 15:17
  they're going to be running through the house as much,
• 15:19
  jumping, trying to break my things.
• 15:21
  So I'm going to try and put some of my things out and then I'll
• 15:25
  show you my fancy things. But now, so we're going to take
• 15:29
  a little pause here for a second and we're going to go grab
• 15:32
  Stephanie. She will be joining us.
• 15:36
  So OK, so we will be back. Stephanie, welcome.
• 15:41
  So excited to have you here. Heather and I have been so
• 15:44
  excited to have you here with us.
• 15:46
  How are you doing? You know what?
• 15:49
  It has been an incredible day chilling with my my boy Kylie
• 15:52
  and I'm just glad to be here. I mean to find podcasts where as
• 15:57
  a non romanticity author where I can just come on, I can yap shit
• 16:00
  about books with you guys. It is actually surprisingly
• 16:03
  rare. So I'm just not stoked to be
• 16:05
  here. Yeah, sweet.
• 16:07
  Yeah, excited to have you here. I know Heather's excited there
• 16:10
  as well. We've known each other since I
• 16:13
  started Books Graham, so I am Stephanie's fan over here.
• 16:17
  Well, no, no, you're my friend. So for a little little bit of a
• 16:20
  distinction that I think I like to make as an author, I don't
• 16:24
  like to do fans and readers. You're like, you guys are my
• 16:28
  friends saying the only difference is I write a book,
• 16:31
  but otherwise I read books too. And I want to just talk books
• 16:34
  with you guys and sometimes we'll talk about mine, but it's
• 16:37
  also not a requirement. So that distinction is important
• 16:40
  to me. Love it.
• 16:42
  But now you do have next week, you do have your book coming
• 16:45
  out. Are you excited?
• 16:47
  You know what? I have so many emotions with
• 16:51
  this book and I'll tell you why. So yes, I am excited, obviously,
• 16:54
  but I knew when I wrote that book, it was super niche and I
• 17:00
  knew that finding my reader for that kind of book was going to
• 17:03
  be much, much harder than any other book I'd written before.
• 17:06
  And I was like, I'm still going to write it.
• 17:09
  Like I'm not going to change anything I'm doing because it's
• 17:11
  just the story that I needed to tell.
• 17:13
  And I have actually had to stop reading reviews.
• 17:17
  I used to read reviews before this book because there has been
• 17:21
  a bit of a mixed response to it. Now is it partially my fault?
• 17:25
  Yes, because I cost the net far too wide.
• 17:28
  I should have been a little bit more selective.
• 17:31
  So like for example, there is a goal that gave me a two star,
• 17:36
  which is fine. Like that's not the end of the
• 17:37
  world. But then I got check her
• 17:39
  Goodreads average is 2.86. And I was like, I, I don't think
• 17:42
  I'm the problem anymore. I I don't think fantasy is your
• 17:45
  genre so that's what I mean. Like I cost the net too wide and
• 17:50
  hung percent that is on me. I have since hired a PA and she
• 17:54
  will be handling these things going forward because she can
• 17:57
  pay better attention to it instead of me splitting myself.
• 18:00
  Yeah, too thinly. You know, it's very odd to me
• 18:04
  when if somebody now I understand, now I'm very focused
• 18:08
  in my wheelhouse, you know, I don't expand out as much and
• 18:12
  stuff. I don't know why someone would
• 18:16
  do that pick up thing. Yeah, pick up that they know
• 18:19
  that's not their thing. Like me, you know, and we're
• 18:21
  talking about a dark romance that someone was like, this is
• 18:25
  horrible. It has all this trigger warning
• 18:28
  stuff and it's like, well, did you not read the synopsis?
• 18:32
  Did you not read the trigger warnings?
• 18:34
  Like that's on you, babe. That's not a one star because
• 18:38
  you didn't like the the triggers in there.
• 18:40
  OK, see I don't, I don't understand like why people do
• 18:45
  that. I mean if that is not your
• 18:46
  thing. Then.
• 18:48
  Why are you reading that particular book and then going
• 18:52
  back and complaining about it or writing a nasty?
• 18:55
  I think Goodreads, you know, I mean, it is good in some ways
• 18:59
  for reviews, but people seem to be very vicious.
• 19:03
  Very. They can be very verbal blind.
• 19:06
  Goodreads. I yeah, I don't understand it.
• 19:11
  I have thoughts about this. I have a lot of thoughts.
• 19:13
  OK, and I'm going to pop off for a second now.
• 19:17
  It is your right to not enjoy a book and I want you to exercise
• 19:21
  your God-given right to go. I fucking hate that book.
• 19:24
  OK, that's fine, you do you. But to actively tear an author
• 19:30
  apart because you've had a bad day and now you need to take it
• 19:35
  out on some faithless entity on the Internet because that will
• 19:38
  somehow make you feel better about your shitty life or
• 19:40
  whatever. First of all, fuck you, OK?
• 19:43
  Second of all, OK. And this, this is where I, I can
• 19:48
  go for those if my husband walks into the house and he's going to
• 19:51
  be like, what is going on? OK, Second of all, we briefly
• 19:55
  spoke about this on on Instagram.
• 19:57
  Now I have a review somewhere where someone has flagged my
• 20:01
  woman on Woman Sexy as a content warning.
• 20:05
  Again, fuck you because someones existence does not does not
• 20:10
  necessary. I can't even speak I'm getting
• 20:12
  so worked up. Does not equal a content warning
• 20:16
  because you are uncomfortable with it.
• 20:18
  They put the book down. Stop fucking reading the book
• 20:21
  and move on because it's clearly not for you.
• 20:24
  Because you know what? The lesbians of the world, they
• 20:26
  deserve more representation. And I'm straightened in a
• 20:29
  married relationship and I feel strongly about that.
• 20:32
  Part Why can't you read that if you're reading open sex scenes,
• 20:35
  especially explicit sex scenes in stories, and you can't handle
• 20:40
  a little girl, girl, guy, guy, orgy, whatever it is?
• 20:46
  I mean in my. Morals are weird there.
• 20:48
  I mean, love is love. So I don't understand why people
• 20:52
  get up on their high horse and and decide those kind of things.
• 20:56
  In my mind in, in my opinion, I think that's just, that's just
• 21:00
  stupid. So I don't.
• 21:01
  Care. I'm there for all the spice, so
• 21:03
  it doesn't matter to me. Yeah, so.
• 21:05
  And if I don't, I mean, like, I'm a straight lady, but I, you
• 21:10
  know, I find it very interesting to read about other
• 21:13
  relationships. So that's me.
• 21:15
  But if it's getting a little too like this isn't my wheelhouse,
• 21:18
  I'll just kind of, you know, skip a little bit till the
• 21:21
  dialogue starts again. My, are you coming here with a
• 21:25
  bit of common sense? I mean, how dare you bring some
• 21:28
  common sense to the party? You skipped a few pages.
• 21:31
  You're supposed to read that. It's very weird to me that
• 21:34
  people are like that. And then I was following like a
• 21:37
  different Instagrammer or books to grammar and she had listened
• 21:41
  or would read spice scenes. And then she said, I'm no longer
• 21:45
  reading spice. I'm only going to read clean
• 21:48
  books. I'm like, I said goodbye.
• 21:51
  I unfollowed yeah, because I mean, I like spice and stuff
• 21:56
  like that. You're not going to try to push
• 21:58
  your that you only want clean on to be.
• 22:00
  I mean, like I'm a straight woman too, you know what I mean?
• 22:03
  But I like I'm there for all of it.
• 22:05
  I'd like to We have a. Good time.
• 22:07
  Relationships are in our everyday life, though.
• 22:09
  Yeah. I mean, does it have to be?
• 22:11
  Does it have to be explicit? No.
• 22:12
  You could definitely go and find a relationship in a book that
• 22:16
  isn't doesn't absolutely that. And that's totally fine.
• 22:19
  Yeah, go find those. They don't.
• 22:21
  Need to be clean. So absolutely.
• 22:24
  So we agree with you. And and I will say just on that
• 22:27
  cruelty front, my favorite example and the Zodiac Academy
• 22:30
  authors, I forget their names. Yeah, the twisted sisters.
• 22:35
  So I'll go with my favorite they got Zodiac Academy was not my
• 22:38
  favorite series and I was quite sad about that because it has
• 22:42
  all the things I like. So I should have liked it.
• 22:46
  And I hear common complaints, people saying is that it was
• 22:48
  poorly written. And I was like, again, if you're
• 22:51
  reading fantasy for a well written book, I I think you're
• 22:53
  in the wrong genre. So that was not my issue.
• 22:56
  I just felt that the series was unnecessarily drawn out when it
• 22:59
  could have been a six book instead of a nine book series
• 23:01
  for argument's sake. And that's where I started.
• 23:04
  I was starting to get very frustrated with that and that
• 23:07
  was inherently my issue. They still put out a series that
• 23:11
  has a cult like following. So of course I'm not going to
• 23:13
  RIP them to charades. Your books aren't for me and
• 23:16
  that's OK. That's not the end of the world.
• 23:19
  How? Many books.
• 23:19
  Did you make it into it? Because a lot of people.
• 23:22
  I did the whole series. Oh, you read the entire you read
• 23:24
  the whole thing now see I I started with book 1 and it just
• 23:28
  was not my vibe. I.
• 23:30
  Haven't read it. It.
• 23:32
  Just wasn't for me. So I I didn't continue on.
• 23:36
  I have book one. It's still sitting on my shelf.
• 23:38
  Maybe someday I'll pick it up again and maybe I'll see it in
• 23:40
  different eyes. But a lot of people that are in
• 23:43
  our group like because we have a book group and stuff on
• 23:45
  Bookstagram and they have loved it now.
• 23:48
  But I have heard like a lot of people, they'll get to about
• 23:50
  Book 4 and that's where then they can't go anymore.
• 23:54
  It's just. It's just too.
• 23:56
  That's how I felt about Jennifer L Armentrout, who is a big name
• 24:01
  and has big following and I loved her series the first
• 24:05
  couple books, but then I felt like this has gone on way too
• 24:09
  long and this is just like a lot of mental turmoil in her head
• 24:14
  over and over and over again. I was getting like, didn't we
• 24:18
  just talk about this? Didn't I just read this part?
• 24:21
  See, I haven't read those. Let's move on.
• 24:22
  Let's move on. What's going on?
• 24:24
  Like, and I hate that one. There's like a lot of fluff kind
• 24:27
  of stuff going on and then all the actions at the end with a
• 24:30
  cliffhanger. I need more throughout.
• 24:33
  Let's. See, it's different.
• 24:35
  You're you're not going to go on her like like what happened to
• 24:39
  for Stephanie. You're talking to shrimps.
• 24:41
  You're not going to go on there at Saint Paul, Jennifer, I did
• 24:44
  like this or you know, or I wouldn't go on the twisters
• 24:46
  twisted sisters thing and and say, well, I didn't care for
• 24:50
  this. I don't understand the people
• 24:52
  that feel that I'm not. Going to reach out to JLA and be
• 24:55
  like dude exchange your writing. This is horrible.
• 24:59
  It's very weird to me that. Because it's not horrible, it's
• 25:02
  just not my storytelling. That's it.
• 25:05
  Like Briar Bowen, I just I cannot get into her books.
• 25:09
  She doesn't write the storytelling that I like.
• 25:13
  So I gave it a three star, which is my suggestion.
• 25:17
  And I was like, not for me, I'm not going to continue, but I'm
• 25:20
  not going to be like 01 star. Awful, horribly written.
• 25:25
  I don't know if it's horribly written.
• 25:26
  I just didn't like how I was reading my my favorite example.
• 25:32
  So Greenwich and Lennox, the ascended authors, Yes, it was
• 25:38
  actually Parker of the duo. She posted her stories earlier
• 25:42
  this year where a reader had come into her DMS and she
• 25:45
  actually started clapping back because she was like, not in my
• 25:47
  DMS, dude. And this reader was basically
• 25:50
  telling her how insufferable your, your male main character
• 25:54
  is. And it's ruined the whole story.
• 25:55
  And she's like, OK, that's your opinion.
• 25:58
  Like keep it to yourself kind of thing.
• 26:00
  And anyway, she's like, oh, I mean, I'm following you.
• 26:03
  And I'm like, OK, But they don't follow her.
• 26:05
  She's still laughing to the bank with her 26 figure deals with
• 26:08
  the trap house. Yeah.
• 26:11
  Because that story is up for you, doesn't mean it's not for
• 26:14
  somebody else. Well, I'm telling you, I think.
• 26:16
  Like good. I mean, Goodreads is nice to
• 26:19
  have or whatever. You can look whatever, but it's
• 26:21
  kind of like the asshole of the world.
• 26:23
  It's it's like if you go on Reddit, because Reddit's kind of
• 26:26
  the asshole of the world. If people don't like what you're
• 26:28
  saying, they'll downvote you. Even if you might say something
• 26:31
  that's perfectly nice and they'll downvote you.
• 26:34
  It's the same vibe. It's those same kind of people.
• 26:38
  I don't know, I just, I just, I couldn't do that if if I there
• 26:44
  was like just, we'll just take that as example Zodiac Canon
• 26:47
  because like I like I couldn't get through it.
• 26:49
  I'm not going to go on Goodreads and even raid it or say anything
• 26:53
  about it. I just said it on my book
• 26:56
  bookshelf and that's where it is.
• 26:58
  But I'm not going to put anything out because I know
• 27:00
  there's so many people that absolutely love it just because
• 27:04
  it wasn't something that I love that doesn't.
• 27:07
  But why would I just be like, this is, you know, it could be
• 27:10
  one of those angry people with a keyboard.
• 27:12
  I think that's why I don't like. 1-2 star reviews because why did
• 27:18
  you read the book all the way through exactly?
• 27:22
  Like, hope you did read it. All the way through because then
• 27:24
  why are you even rating it? I'm I'm kind of like, why write
• 27:27
  ADNF? You didn't finish the book.
• 27:30
  Like you don't know how it ends. You don't know if it's good or
• 27:32
  not, so I don't look at a lot of that.
• 27:36
  And if people do that, I'm like, if it was that bad, why did you
• 27:40
  finish it? Why did you continue too short?
• 27:43
  What do we Well? What do we think though?
• 27:45
  Because Goodreads is adding a DNF section.
• 27:49
  What do we think on that? That is.
• 27:51
  That going to. Affect other books?
• 27:54
  Or is that just for your own thing and it just shows people
• 27:57
  what you've DNF? Maybe that'll judge.
• 28:00
  People's character. And you can see what they've
• 28:01
  DNF. I think it's going to take
• 28:03
  people. Away from the one and two stars,
• 28:05
  because now they could just go, OK, I didn't finish that and
• 28:08
  then write their little blurb of why.
• 28:10
  And I think that's appropriate. Like tell us why, But why give
• 28:14
  it a negative review with 1*2* and you didn't finish it?
• 28:19
  I don't know, I think. That.
• 28:19
  Affects the stars, you know, because you have those people,
• 28:23
  the ones that did not finish it or whatever.
• 28:25
  Those shouldn't even be like, let's say like Daggermouth.
• 28:28
  Because we've read Daggermouth, Yeah.
• 28:30
  And that book is not going to be for everyone.
• 28:32
  So, you know, and it's starting to get hyped.
• 28:34
  Yeah. Now that it's hyped, other
• 28:36
  people are going to be like, oh, what is this book?
• 28:38
  What is this book about? And so the popular book is going
• 28:42
  to be nitpicked. And she her ratings might go
• 28:45
  down because it's not hitting that genre of readers anymore.
• 28:48
  And then and they're like DNF ING and 1 starring and it
• 28:52
  happens all the time. So, Heather?
• 28:54
  And I spoke a little bit about this on Instagram.
• 28:57
  I've literally got my editor to buy an indie copy of Dagmouth in
• 29:01
  the States to ship a tear to me in Amsterdam because I was so
• 29:04
  desperate to own a copy of that book.
• 29:06
  OK, so when I say when I say Dagmouth is like one of my God
• 29:10
  here books like I am not joking. Now log on to TikTok the other
• 29:14
  day and I see a creator like ripping dagger mouth apart.
• 29:20
  And I'm like, OK, fine. Your larger opinion, like that's
• 29:23
  not the end of the rule, but she is.
• 29:26
  She is pulling apart the mechanics of one of the the
• 29:29
  violent scenes. And I'm like, first of all, and
• 29:32
  I was like, first of all, just say you don't like the book and
• 29:34
  move on. OK.
• 29:36
  Second of all, this is rage bait.
• 29:37
  I'm telling you that right now because you're you're trying to
• 29:40
  use for views. Yeah, correct.
• 29:42
  Yes, made of all one of. The first rules that we learn as
• 29:46
  authors and our editors have to remind kindness of this as well.
• 29:50
  Trust your reader to know where to go with the story because we
• 29:55
  do have this tendency to over explain instant desires.
• 30:00
  Exactly. And that's why we have editors,
• 30:02
  OK? This is why we love our editors.
• 30:04
  We pay them the big bucks because they keep us on track.
• 30:08
  So now you're in a fight scene in Dagmouth, She's shooting.
• 30:11
  Now you're getting upset because the direction of the trajectory
• 30:14
  of the bullet isn't really explained to you.
• 30:17
  Yeah. Do you need the?
• 30:19
  Use your imagination of it. Anyway, that's how I feel.
• 30:23
  About that, yeah. See again, that's.
• 30:25
  Weird. I mean, what are these people
• 30:27
  doing? These people either just have a
• 30:29
  tremendous amount of time on their hands, yes, or they're
• 30:32
  just stupid. I don't know.
• 30:34
  But then I agree. I think, I think a lot of it
• 30:36
  though is it is for like clicks and stuff because Oh yeah, they
• 30:41
  want that longer view. The controversy get that so they
• 30:45
  can make. Some more money, whatever you
• 30:47
  can say. It's like, why didn't you?
• 30:49
  Like this popular book. Oh my gosh, I need to find out
• 30:52
  why. And then some people be like, Oh
• 30:55
  yeah, yeah, that's right. Oh, you're right.
• 30:57
  I might not like this book anymore either.
• 31:00
  That's yeah. And I've.
• 31:01
  Seen that it's. Such bullshit anyway.
• 31:04
  Well, that's. A mob of mentality yes, you know
• 31:07
  what I mean because then if you see someone in there like well
• 31:10
  just even though this isn't a book this is a video game
• 31:12
  Crimson desert just came out now it.
• 31:15
  Came out on Thursday. My husband was considering going
• 31:18
  with PlayStation and telling him that he was going to cancel his
• 31:20
  pre-order but he couldn't do it because he already had pre
• 31:22
  loaded it but because one guy on IGN came out and said that it
• 31:27
  was a horrible game and he didn't like it.
• 31:30
  One person and I said, well, just because he didn't like it,
• 31:33
  that doesn't mean anything. Then when my husband and my son
• 31:36
  both got to play it, they absolutely love it.
• 31:38
  I said, So if you would have went based upon that one
• 31:40
  person's, yeah, random story or decision to make a story, right,
• 31:44
  he would have missed out on something amazing.
• 31:47
  Yeah. So I mean, that's the same thing
• 31:48
  that maybe listen to us. It's weird how our brains
• 31:51
  gravitate towards negativity and our brains are negative so you
• 31:56
  have to go to the positive. So instead of going what's so
• 31:59
  negative about this, maybe try reading the positive parts of a
• 32:02
  review and then forget about the SO.
• 32:06
  I love that you mentioned that because it is especially true
• 32:09
  for an orphan. Now, if I look at the response
• 32:12
  to my work overall, it has been, I would definitely stay heavier
• 32:16
  on the positive side, OK? But the more readers you tap
• 32:20
  into, the more you're going to get the negative stuff as well,
• 32:23
  right? And I have seen some reviews
• 32:25
  coming from Legion of Pride that actually start with I am
• 32:29
  obsessed, OK? Which for me, I think is a
• 32:31
  fucking phenomenal compliment, like 10 and 10.
• 32:35
  But then I keep scanning and then they start listing the
• 32:37
  things that they maybe didn't get or whatever.
• 32:40
  So I forget about the I'm obsessed part of the review.
• 32:43
  And I tend to fixate on the things that they maybe didn't
• 32:47
  gel with, which is fine. Like that's not the end of the
• 32:49
  world. And then I start beating myself
• 32:51
  up because why wasn't I good enough to do this and this and
• 32:54
  this and this? Why didn't I catch that?
• 32:55
  Or yeah. Or would I have done it
• 32:58
  differently or? Explained it differently.
• 32:59
  It's this whole fucking spiral which I'm so over.
• 33:01
  That's why I don't drink reviews.
• 33:03
  Yeah, I don't. Blame it, but you know what, I
• 33:06
  watched your your podcast with PED Cole and she made the
• 33:11
  observation of like, you know that one little detail on the
• 33:13
  one star and you go and change it for that one Dang person.
• 33:17
  Well, now all these people that are 5 star, it's a vice versa.
• 33:21
  So then they'll go, they're going to complain about what
• 33:24
  wasn't there and who if you can't, if I.
• 33:27
  Ever meet her again? If I ever meet her again, I will
• 33:30
  say you're allowed to say I told you so because it was from that
• 33:33
  episode where she kind of put it into my head.
• 33:36
  Yeah. And I was like, no, I have a
• 33:38
  thick skin. I can read reviews.
• 33:41
  You know, because you know better.
• 33:44
  Never mind this like seasoned author who's like sold over
• 33:47
  1,000,000 copies giving you the chin and pies.
• 33:50
  So I will say to you if I ever meet her again, you're allowed
• 33:53
  to say I told you so because she was so right.
• 33:56
  So I was what they shutting to the to another author about this
• 34:00
  and she also runs her own podcast.
• 34:02
  We were chatting about authenticity and with me.
• 34:05
  I think the only unauthentic thing about me is my pay name
• 34:10
  because this is a pay name and I write under that for for safety
• 34:13
  reasons. Of course, yes, most do, but fun
• 34:16
  fact, my middle name is actually legally storm.
• 34:19
  My husband calls up my stripper name.
• 34:20
  It's the first name that's changed and I so I did that
• 34:24
  because if you Google my legal name and like you can find me in
• 34:27
  Amsterdam, it's not that hard. And I'm just like, that's crazy
• 34:30
  people in the Internet. I'm good, thanks.
• 34:31
  But being authentic is now more important.
• 34:36
  It's more important than ever. And if we're not doing the
• 34:39
  things that make us happy and if we're not doing the things that
• 34:42
  speak to our soul, which looks different for everyone, then
• 34:45
  yes, this is how burnout. I am seeing more burnout science
• 34:49
  from authors and content creators, not just authors.
• 34:52
  Because let me write a popular romanticy and Chuck every famous
• 34:58
  trope in there. And, you know, like, push that
• 35:01
  out and turn, turn, turn, turn, turn.
• 35:03
  And then six months down the line, I'm burned out.
• 35:06
  I can't continue at that pace. So yeah, Normal's ever rated.
• 35:10
  You do you, Boo. There's there's something for
• 35:12
  everyone. Oh yeah.
• 35:14
  Absolutely, absolutely. I agree 100%.
• 35:17
  I see that in the book Instagram world because like people think
• 35:21
  that they have to post every day, every day, My gosh.
• 35:24
  And you know, I was trying to do that when I first started
• 35:27
  because that seemed to be a good thing to do because if you
• 35:29
  wanted the algorithm to find you and all of that kind of stuff.
• 35:34
  And I'm like, I can't do this. I don't have enough time devoted
• 35:39
  in my life. Now, mind you, with that time,
• 35:40
  I, you know, I homeschool my kids.
• 35:43
  I, I do that whole thing. And then I was doing this
• 35:46
  because this was what brought my joy, you know, back to reading
• 35:49
  that kind of thing. And then then last year, last
• 35:53
  April, I, you know, I decided to do this, you know, to make a
• 35:56
  podcast, But I can't, I mean, I still do my books to Graham.
• 36:00
  I will put up my reviews or anything I'm doing like that or
• 36:03
  tropes that I like or anything like that.
• 36:05
  But I don't even have 100% time doing that when I'm doing this,
• 36:11
  because I have this, I have all our clips I have to do.
• 36:14
  I do all of those kind of things.
• 36:16
  Yeah. I don't know how these people
• 36:19
  are producing things that every day and every day and every day.
• 36:24
  And I can't do that. If you look at.
• 36:25
  What a lot of people are posting, it is fluffy stuff,
• 36:28
  like it's not quality things, it's for the quantity and it
• 36:33
  shows. And that's why I think we have
• 36:36
  all these like play. I've even joined some of them,
• 36:38
  like the groups where you're supposed to like comment for
• 36:42
  comment and like the like and stuff like that.
• 36:45
  But when you're like actually watching somebody's stuff and
• 36:48
  like engaging in it and making a comment saying like, wow, this
• 36:52
  is a really good real, I really liked this.
• 36:56
  This book looks interesting. That is a comment not oh, I like
• 36:59
  this. And I'm like, that's not a
• 37:02
  comment. Obviously you don't give a shit.
• 37:05
  You're just getting it through because you have to.
• 37:08
  And I don't like that kind of engagement.
• 37:10
  And to me it's not authentic so. So hey, that I think you've seen
• 37:15
  this with me and that I try my best.
• 37:17
  Like sometimes there's a delay of when I can get to it, but
• 37:20
  when I have comments on my Instagram, I always go and try
• 37:23
  and return it and engage in some kind of meaningful discussion
• 37:26
  with the people that are commenting on my thing.
• 37:29
  I mean, first of all, it's just fucking courtesy because why
• 37:31
  would I not? But second of all, I'm going to
• 37:35
  try and find minimum one of your posts to engage with.
• 37:39
  And in your case, it's book reviews a lot of the time, which
• 37:41
  I absolutely love. We've.
• 37:43
  But I'm just all things together.
• 37:44
  Yeah, yeah, we do. And I'm just like, it's the
• 37:48
  least I can do because if these people are spending their time
• 37:51
  to engage with my content, I am going to return the favor.
• 37:54
  Like I said, I might take a bit longer to get there.
• 37:56
  So, for example, last week, my husband and I got home from
• 37:59
  dinner, set for 15 minutes on the cash, and I went, bam.
• 38:02
  I went through all of my comments and I got up to date.
• 38:04
  But that was the block of time that I had.
• 38:07
  And I will tell you, not giving a fuck about the algorithm is
• 38:11
  the most freeing thing you can do.
• 38:14
  Yeah. Best thing I ever did.
• 38:16
  Yeah. And I.
• 38:18
  Love that authors are seeing too that you don't have to be this
• 38:23
  like 25 K following to be a books, a grammar and date, you
• 38:30
  know, like here's this great book I found because you do have
• 38:34
  your people that do look at your stuff and like your stuff
• 38:38
  because they read what you read. And it doesn't matter like if
• 38:42
  only like 100 people look at that, that's a lot of views in a
• 38:46
  sense where if one out of 100 grab the same book as you,
• 38:50
  that's a sale and then it goes another person, that's another
• 38:54
  sale. So, Rebecca, sorry.
• 38:56
  To interrupt you, I want to just put an example onto what
• 38:59
  Heather's saying there. This might not be like a big
• 39:03
  deal, but to me it's a big deal. I had two R creators ordered 2
• 39:06
  sprayed ages of my legion of pride this week.
• 39:09
  Okay, like that has never fucking happened to me.
• 39:12
  OK, but to your point, sure, it's only two arc readers, but
• 39:16
  it's two people that were like, hey, I like this book.
• 39:20
  I need a special copy of it and you guys sign it and I do the
• 39:23
  swag and I do the special stuff and whatnot.
• 39:25
  But I'm like, those are two people that thought, hey, I was
• 39:29
  with their time and I was with their money.
• 39:31
  And that for me, I actually messaged my mom to like let her
• 39:34
  know because it was it was such a cool moment.
• 39:38
  Yeah. And, and you know, it's for
• 39:41
  shelf trophies because our, and I think that's important too is
• 39:45
  like we, I think as an ARC reader, if you are an arc
• 39:48
  reader, not all of them are like this, but we are doing it to see
• 39:53
  if there's new things coming out that are interesting.
• 39:56
  And then if we like it, we support that author because
• 39:59
  they're indie and not through a big publisher.
• 40:01
  So you buy their books. You.
• 40:05
  Other post you reach out to other people who might like the
• 40:08
  genre and that's how word of mouth gets going and you need
• 40:12
  that. So I think more arc readers, arc
• 40:15
  teens, St. teens, all that kind of stuff.
• 40:17
  Like if you're engaging with your readers too, it really like
• 40:21
  makes a difference and people will be like, Oh my gosh, I
• 40:24
  can't wait for the special edition.
• 40:26
  Please make one. Yes, I need 1.
• 40:28
  So see, I don't read, see. I don't read Arcs I I'm after
• 40:34
  the fact kind of thing, you know, like that you have
• 40:36
  published. That's OK, but that's.
• 40:38
  But see, but This is why I love Heather and I love Chelsea and
• 40:40
  that because you both do that and then I hear like about
• 40:44
  things that are upcoming or things that you read and then it
• 40:46
  then I add to my TBR list. Yes, you know, and I love being
• 40:50
  able from I guess the other side of it, being a person like I am,
• 40:54
  is to see her reviews to see those things or you know, it's
• 40:58
  you know, it helps me. You know what I want, what path
• 41:02
  I want to go on. There's a lot of books where.
• 41:04
  I'm like Rebecca, like you have to read this, like stop what
• 41:08
  you're doing so. I need to say something perhaps
• 41:11
  a little bit controversial for an author.
• 41:14
  I very rarely read Ox anymore, and I'll tell you why.
• 41:19
  I'll tell you why because I have the time.
• 41:21
  I don't have kids, I only have a dog, and as you can see, she's
• 41:23
  been relatively well behaved. I've probably just jinxed it.
• 41:27
  You don't like the rules that come with Arcs anymore?
• 41:29
  They fuck me off. Yeah, and I'll tell.
• 41:33
  I'll give you an example. If I don't like your book, what?
• 41:37
  I must wait a month to review your book, which I've moved on.
• 41:40
  OK, if I could review your book now.
• 41:41
  You don't make a review. At that point, yeah, OK.
• 41:44
  Now and even this, this author, a reader that was in my DMV this
• 41:49
  week, I said to her, please review how you normally would
• 41:52
  because I was like me as the author, I do not have the right
• 41:56
  to dictate to you how to craft your review.
• 41:58
  Do you think it should go and say it should?
• 42:00
  Like that is your God-given right?
• 42:02
  Yeah. I mean, I don't need to know
• 42:03
  about it, but that's a different topic.
• 42:04
  Yes. But then I had other authors
• 42:07
  saying I had to finish the book within two weeks.
• 42:10
  That is what I think. OK, yeah, some will do.
• 42:14
  That and be like, hey, this is a quick turn around art, can you
• 42:17
  do it? And they give you like a week
• 42:20
  after the the date it's released or something like that.
• 42:23
  So then. Then I've had some trying to
• 42:26
  make me sign Ndas. I was like, why would I steal
• 42:28
  your ideas? I have enough of my own, thank
• 42:30
  you very much. OK, because you're an author.
• 42:32
  Interesting. Like like.
• 42:33
  That's different, yeah. OK.
• 42:35
  And then? The cherry on the cake for me
• 42:38
  was there's really fucking. Cool concept where I was.
• 42:41
  Like, and I was like, OK, I'm breaking a rule signing up for
• 42:44
  the arc immediately because this is my jam.
• 42:46
  She would not and let me download it onto Kindle.
• 42:49
  I had to read it through the book final app.
• 42:50
  And I was like, I was like, cool, I can't I can't complete
• 42:53
  your arc then No, yeah. And then they weird.
• 42:57
  I think I. Think This is why I can't do
• 42:59
  arcs because again, I'm to the age that I am and I'm going to
• 43:03
  do what I want to do and I don't like people dictating to me what
• 43:06
  I have. That's my issue.
• 43:08
  See now, now I rather have my trusted influences, for lack of
• 43:13
  a better word. So like yesterday, Heather, you
• 43:15
  were posting about flames of fat disease, OK, where you were
• 43:18
  like, it's better than 4th grade.
• 43:20
  I was like adds to TBR immediately.
• 43:22
  I was like, that's all you needed to say.
• 43:24
  So I have, I have these trusted people that I follow where I
• 43:29
  know if they give that recommendation, chances are I'm
• 43:33
  probably going to like the book. Yeah.
• 43:34
  I mean, that's kind of how I get my fix now.
• 43:36
  Exactly. And other.
• 43:38
  People out there that are the bigger people, I have book
• 43:42
  friends that aren't on books of Graham, but they're like, I
• 43:45
  love, like the girl in Cary, NC. We talk about Jamie.
• 43:50
  Jamie. Yep, she she has good.
• 43:52
  Like dark romance and she does. And so my friends are always
• 43:56
  like, she recommended that. I know I'm going to like it.
• 43:59
  I'm like, yeah, because you follow her for her
• 44:01
  recommendation like that as your person.
• 44:03
  You don't have to follow all the books of grammars.
• 44:05
  Go for the ones that you relate with their reading style.
• 44:10
  You have to find your. Wheelhouse.
• 44:12
  Yeah. You know of what you like now I
• 44:14
  I have a very specific of course that's spicy.
• 44:17
  I like it is romanticy, dark fantasy, dark romance.
• 44:21
  That's that's where I'm at right now now will I ever venture out
• 44:24
  on other things? Yes, it's very possible I mean,
• 44:26
  I have read other things, but right now I'm in my villain era.
• 44:29
  This is what I'm this is my big thing right now.
• 44:32
  OK, I have. To tell you this, OK, so we
• 44:35
  spoke about this on Instagram. So I don't price a lot of spice.
• 44:40
  I only kind of like if the character dictates it.
• 44:42
  And that's truly because I'm in my own head about it.
• 44:45
  And I'm just like, what if my mother reads it and I need to
• 44:47
  just get over myself at some point, which I think I'm there
• 44:50
  finally. So I'm busy drafting The Fall of
• 44:53
  the Damp. It's the final in my mafia
• 44:55
  series, and I've introduced a new POV.
• 44:57
  OK so with a new POV comes a completely differentiated
• 45:02
  character and it ends up the 1 scene is twisted for me.
• 45:07
  Everything. The other one ends up in this
• 45:09
  weird ass 3 SIM and I'm like where the fuck did that come
• 45:13
  from? I'm here for it.
• 45:17
  If it if. It flows, it flows.
• 45:19
  OK, can can can I tell you the? Worst part is so my editor she's
• 45:23
  female and my proofreader she's also female.
• 45:26
  Do you know how weird it is discussing editing feedback like
• 45:30
  in a spy scene with other females?
• 45:33
  It is like again, I'm sorry my only hate about it I'm going to
• 45:36
  own that part. But like to the point of where
• 45:38
  my proofreader was like she's like girl, we're all
• 45:40
  professionals you need to calm the fuck down.
• 45:42
  I'm like, OK fine, good point, right?
• 45:46
  Does it give? You a feeling like when you're
• 45:48
  discussing it with them, Does it almost feel like an embarrassing
• 45:51
  feeling to you or is it more too personal?
• 45:54
  Just like a yeah. Or what we.
• 45:58
  OK, so I'll give you the context.
• 46:00
  This is actually the woman on woman scene that I was
• 46:03
  discussing at the proofreader. I need to.
• 46:05
  Discuss the. Angle of which one chick is
• 46:08
  going down on an other with you and if logistically it makes
• 46:11
  sense, can I at least have a drink first?
• 46:14
  If we're going to like talk about I'm just like, it's weird
• 46:17
  for me. Like I didn't OK, so I did write
• 46:20
  that scene, but at the time I had a beta reader who I actually
• 46:23
  didn't know was lesbian at the time.
• 46:25
  So it actually just worked out really, really well.
• 46:27
  And she helped me craft the specifics of that scene because
• 46:31
  I was like, I've I've never slept with.
• 46:34
  Her. Yeah, exactly.
• 46:35
  Yeah, exactly. And I was like, I've never slept
• 46:37
  with a chick before. I mean, I know how it works with
• 46:39
  a guy, but like, that's where it is.
• 46:42
  And I'm just like, it's, it's weird because I'm fucking
• 46:46
  immature. OK, It, that's really it.
• 46:50
  Aren't we all, though? Well, you know I.
• 46:52
  Think a. Lot of it though is like when as
• 46:55
  we were raised in the time period frame, we were raised and
• 46:58
  there was a lot of stigmata with a lot of things.
• 47:01
  Nobody talked about things and it, it didn't get, it wasn't as
• 47:06
  open in discussion, you know, Yeah, like, like myself growing
• 47:10
  up, my, my mom was very conservative in that respect.
• 47:14
  She didn't want to explain anything to me.
• 47:17
  Now I have my 3 kids, you know, my boys are getting older and
• 47:21
  stuff like that. And they have asked me
• 47:23
  questions. I have a relationship with them
• 47:25
  that I told them that. Anything you want to ask me, I'm
• 47:28
  an open book. I will explain things to the
• 47:30
  best of my ability, even though it is traumatizing to me what I
• 47:35
  have to do. But I'd rather have them ask the
• 47:38
  question than not know the answer.
• 47:39
  So yeah, I would. Do you think it that plays into
• 47:42
  it? It's, you know, part of like of
• 47:45
  how we were all raised generation?
• 47:47
  Yeah, I do. Think that is a part yes because
• 47:49
  like to my mom's credit, so I went to an all girls boarding
• 47:53
  school. So you do the best there of how
• 47:54
  weird that was. And to my mom's credit, she was
• 47:58
  really open about these things as well.
• 48:00
  She was like, I am so we can talk about whatever you want.
• 48:03
  And I was like, I don't want to talk about sex to you.
• 48:05
  That is weird. So I was just like, I can talk
• 48:08
  to you about anything else. I have friends for the sex part,
• 48:11
  like let's let's separate them. I think there's a, it's a part
• 48:16
  of me that is like, it's still that cultural appropriation.
• 48:20
  Well, not appropriation like appropriateness.
• 48:22
  I don't even know the right way to use their.
• 48:24
  Like, you don't go talk about sex with random strangers on the
• 48:28
  Internet. Like, look at me, I'm talking
• 48:29
  about sex right now. And it's like, you need to
• 48:32
  unlearn that. And it's not that easy.
• 48:35
  And I think living in Amsterdam has made me far more progressive
• 48:39
  than I ever was. So like like I'm wearing this
• 48:43
  practically see through top here by the.
• 48:47
  Way. Thank you.
• 48:48
  That is. The.
• 48:49
  Great thing about having. Implants is that you can weigh
• 48:52
  whatever the fuck you want now and they don't move right at
• 48:55
  all. Anyway, That's the point.
• 48:58
  If I were to weigh something like this in Cape Town, where
• 49:01
  I'm from in South Africa, it'll be like, how can you wear that?
• 49:04
  That's inappropriate, yeah. So.
• 49:08
  I do think there's a bit of that at play, yeah.
• 49:10
  So it's it's. It's ingrained into us that
• 49:14
  certain things are quote UN quote inappropriate to talk
• 49:17
  about and stuff. I think like again, again, as I
• 49:20
  get older, I don't want to be told what to do, you know?
• 49:23
  And and I think it's I'm at a point at I will say whatever I
• 49:27
  want to say. This is again why I don't do
• 49:29
  Arcs and I don't do that kind of thing because like I had a
• 49:34
  friend that she was in an on an ARC team, St. team and she
• 49:38
  wasn't allowed to do certain things with her bookstagram.
• 49:41
  And I'm like, are they paying you money?
• 49:44
  No, I said, then why do they get to tell you and dictate what you
• 49:48
  do? I said, I don't like that.
• 49:51
  Again, This is why I don't do it, because I would say.
• 49:53
  Something. And then I would be removed from
• 49:55
  the team and that part would be good.
• 49:57
  Well This is why I can never go trad and I've never had a desire
• 50:01
  to go try. And to all the girls and guys
• 50:03
  that are going that way, love that for you.
• 50:05
  You do you. Why would I swap one boss after
• 50:08
  another? And for me like.
• 50:11
  The whole point of this journey is to retain the rights to my
• 50:16
  work, number one. Because if I want to blow shit
• 50:18
  up in a story, watch me, OK? I don't do this happy endings
• 50:22
  thing. I do closure.
• 50:25
  That's really important. OK.
• 50:27
  And I know happy endings is a distinction in the romance
• 50:30
  category, which is why I don't write romance.
• 50:33
  It's more of a thing for me. But I'm just like, imagine I go
• 50:36
  tried. They're going to tell me how I
• 50:38
  what I can and Cartwright and I'm going to be like, well, then
• 50:41
  I'm done. Then I may as well go back to my
• 50:43
  day job. Like that's that's how I feel
• 50:45
  about it. Yeah, after the question.
• 50:49
  Yes, so. After listening.
• 50:50
  To Penn Cole and your conversation about going trad
• 50:54
  and the numbers and how more beneficial it is for Indies
• 51:00
  versus going trad because you have to pay more people to
• 51:03
  promote your books, sell them, all that stuff.
• 51:06
  Which totally makes sense. But I mean, people are still
• 51:10
  really trying to go the track route.
• 51:12
  And after listening to her, I was like, why?
• 51:14
  Why are people so into becoming like big authors with bosses
• 51:19
  that tell them like, like, think about like Rebecca Yarrows.
• 51:23
  She can't work on her Imperium series because she has to knock
• 51:27
  out a few contemporary romances before she could do her fantasy
• 51:30
  series because that's in her contract.
• 51:33
  So, you know, and what's making her more money?
• 51:35
  4th Ring right now? Like she could be making so much
• 51:38
  money if she was independently doing that one.
• 51:41
  Yeah. Well, so crazy.
• 51:43
  Well, they made the comment. When we were watching Sarah J
• 51:46
  Maas there, I don't know. Is it Moss?
• 51:48
  Is it mass? I think it's mass.
• 51:51
  It might be Matt I. Would you all know tomato talk?
• 51:53
  Yeah, Tomato talk. They were talking like how she
• 51:57
  was saying different things. They think it's very possible
• 52:00
  once she gets these three books out that maybe she's going to be
• 52:03
  leaving her publisher because it seems like she's kind of beefing
• 52:07
  with them a little bit, they said.
• 52:09
  So, you know, maybe she'll do her her own thing.
• 52:12
  I mean she probably has enough money from you know, Acatar or
• 52:15
  stuff. I want to jump to another try
• 52:18
  also for a second before I come back to him.
• 52:20
  Rochelle Meade. OK, we all know who from Vampire
• 52:22
  Academy now. One of.
• 52:25
  My absolute favorite series of all time.
• 52:27
  But she also wrote another lesson knowing series.
• 52:30
  It's called Game Board of the Gods.
• 52:32
  It's a trilogy. Please don't start it because
• 52:34
  she hasn't finished it because her publisher won't let her
• 52:38
  finish it. And let me tell you, the first
• 52:40
  two books are fucking phenomenal.
• 52:43
  With the with the rise of the dystopian era, it's perfect for
• 52:47
  disturbing it. Is so good.
• 52:50
  Like I cannot even begin to explain it to you and it ends on
• 52:53
  a cliffhanger and we even know the third book title, but her
• 52:56
  publishers won't let her finish writing it.
• 52:59
  And she said she was like, she's like, I have enough St. create
• 53:03
  to self publish the third book. But she's like, the fact is I
• 53:06
  have contracts that I have to fulfill first before I can even
• 53:10
  look at that, which is why it's it's been like 5 years.
• 53:13
  So I do love that trade authors are starting to get to the point
• 53:17
  of where like, hey, if you're not going to let me do what I
• 53:20
  want, I've now built up enough credibility to go and self
• 53:23
  publish and do what I want because 100% if SJM decides to
• 53:27
  self publish. I think that from a.
• 53:30
  Strategy, perspective, that is the best thing she could ever do
• 53:34
  because she can write what she wants.
• 53:36
  Did you know the story about CC-3?
• 53:38
  Right? What happened there?
• 53:40
  So there's this rumor that is a shame.
• 53:44
  She had written CC 3 completely. I forget the full title, but you
• 53:48
  know which one I'm talking about the Black and Gold 1.
• 53:50
  And she had to change editors mid drafting.
• 53:55
  Now let me tell you as an author that is a fucking catastrophic
• 54:00
  move because when you with your editor, there's certain amount
• 54:03
  of chemistry that you need to have as well.
• 54:06
  I find my first editor because it just wasn't working like the
• 54:10
  one I'm with now. We get each other and like she
• 54:12
  can tell me this is shit, redo it and I'm not going to get
• 54:15
  offended because I know what she means and that makes sense.
• 54:18
  How you write and can write correct correct?
• 54:21
  Now it's JM who's one of the most arguably the most notable
• 54:25
  writers in the world has to change an editor mid book.
• 54:29
  OK, My mind is like, what is happening?
• 54:33
  And it's. And remember, she has more than
• 54:34
  one editor as well. So I'm just like, that alone for
• 54:37
  me was like, there's something's up there.
• 54:39
  Yeah. Red flag.
• 54:41
  Yeah. Dang, but it was weird.
• 54:43
  When she was. Talking and I, I was picking up
• 54:46
  on a little bit of it when I was listening, but then I seen a
• 54:48
  couple other people talking about.
• 54:49
  Then I was like, oh, that wasn't my imagination.
• 54:51
  She, it seems like there's like some type of beef or whatever
• 54:55
  you want to say something she's not happy with.
• 54:57
  Is it Bloomsbury? Isn't that?
• 54:58
  Yes, it is Bloomsbury, yeah. Yeah.
• 55:00
  And let me, let me ask you this. It's a rhetorical question.
• 55:03
  Let's say she does go India, OK. And we know most Indies struggle
• 55:05
  to get into bookstores. Tell me which bookstore will
• 55:09
  turn away SJM? None.
• 55:12
  Exactly. Exactly.
• 55:13
  You'd be dumb. Yep.
• 55:17
  It's, you know, now this is. Something else, yes, since we're
• 55:19
  talking trad versus indie now, Heather and I talked about this
• 55:23
  several episodes episodes ago in that I don't like it that when
• 55:28
  books go traditional, they completely change the look on
• 55:31
  the outside of the book. One of the things that sells me
• 55:34
  on a book is the first impression, and when I see a
• 55:37
  beautiful cover on a book, I hate it.
• 55:41
  That like when when they go, a lot of different authors go
• 55:44
  traditional, they lose that beauty of that indie cover and
• 55:47
  it goes something blunt. We'll just do case in point,
• 55:50
  like Kelly Hart's there with Quicksilver.
• 55:52
  I absolutely loved her indie cover.
• 55:55
  That's the one. It's distinctive, it's
• 55:56
  memorable. It was.
• 55:57
  It was, you know, it just had that.
• 55:59
  Look, and then I just loved it. And then when she went
• 56:02
  traditional and of course she said people you know, were, were
• 56:05
  being nasty about it and whatever, and then and then it
• 56:09
  went completely plain so. I just I don't it's.
• 56:13
  Not that they're ugly books, I don't want to say that because I
• 56:16
  don't think they're ugly, but it lost that spark that it had.
• 56:21
  Brimstone doesn't have anything, so it's just if you.
• 56:25
  And look at this right now. This is a traditionally
• 56:29
  romanticy type cover knows is an older copy, but like you get the
• 56:32
  gist with the bold kind of designed with the big font and
• 56:37
  everything. And I got a lot of shit because
• 56:40
  every fantasy would be the illustrated character, you know,
• 56:44
  like on the rooftop. And I was like, course, I'm not
• 56:46
  doing that. And everyone's like, oh, I
• 56:48
  thought it was a romanticy. And I'm like, the only way us as
• 56:52
  authors are going to start like changing trains and moving the
• 56:55
  needle, as we say, incorporate is that if we take these chances
• 56:59
  on covers, that is maybe against what the industry is saying to
• 57:03
  us. Sure.
• 57:03
  Did I make it a little bit harder for myself?
• 57:05
  Of course. But you know what?
• 57:06
  Two years later, I'm still not sick of that cover.
• 57:09
  I think it's beautiful and. It's distinctive and every time
• 57:13
  it comes up, I'm like, that's Stephanie's book.
• 57:14
  Like I know that book. So I agree.
• 57:18
  I just I just. Don't like when they go
• 57:21
  traditional and it just, I don't know, it becomes that corporate
• 57:24
  feel and it loses its glimmer. Like take Chrysa Broadband's
• 57:29
  Daughter of no World Series. Take that because that's what
• 57:32
  complete. It's a complete different.
• 57:35
  But. You look at.
• 57:36
  Her Indies, they were beautiful, the girl and she.
• 57:40
  I wish, I wish I would have gotten them when they were the
• 57:45
  indie covers and with the girl and and her dress and it's
• 57:48
  flowing and she's got the sword. It's beautiful.
• 57:51
  Now my husband bought me last year so I can have him.
• 57:53
  He got me the new ones and I actually just got the third one
• 57:56
  here this past week. It came.
• 57:58
  I mean, I'm not saying they're not pretty.
• 58:00
  It's not no, they're great. But in my.
• 58:03
  Mind. In my mind, they just, they're
• 58:06
  just don't have the same vibe. This is book.
• 58:09
  I mean, again, it's beautiful. It's, it's beautiful.
• 58:13
  And I mean the inside, you know, but the, the inside, it's
• 58:16
  pretty. That's pretty.
• 58:18
  But to. Me, I think a lot of times when
• 58:20
  books go traditional, they lose that whatever that specialness
• 58:26
  that they had being in. I can't because remember what my
• 58:29
  books are. There is an author.
• 58:31
  Who maybe she was indie, I can't remember.
• 58:33
  And she either went trad or was thinking of it and her or maybe
• 58:38
  it was her agent was saying like, you need to have this kind
• 58:42
  of cover because this kind of cover is selling right now.
• 58:45
  And it was like, you know, like a guy with wings or something.
• 58:48
  And she's like, no, that doesn't really go with my book.
• 58:52
  Like that is not what my story is really about.
• 58:55
  That's like maybe this part of it.
• 58:57
  And so she's like, I don't want that.
• 58:59
  That's not for me. And I think she ended up going
• 59:03
  her route and it was 10 times better and she sold things and
• 59:07
  it was marketed. Better because.
• 59:10
  She didn't follow along to what the publishers were doing and
• 59:14
  what the what was selling. And, and I think that too is why
• 59:18
  Indy is so cool to me, is because there are stories that
• 59:23
  no one else is writing right now because their publishers are
• 59:28
  telling them like, this isn't going to sell because you put
• 59:32
  this in, this is controversial. So you see.
• 59:35
  You know when I. Joined the books to Graham
• 59:37
  world. I had no idea like Indies
• 59:39
  existed or anything. Me too, we had no idea.
• 59:43
  I mean, I was reading them. On KU and had no idea until Pen
• 59:46
  Cole and I read her her page and then I was like, what's an indie
• 59:50
  author? And I like joined her newsletter
• 59:53
  and all this stuff and I was like, oh, I need to make a
• 59:55
  bookstagram, sign up for Arcs, all this stuff.
• 59:59
  We'll see when I joined. You know, I just I started my
• 1:00:02
  world that I dipped back into was Akator.
• 1:00:04
  That's a traditional publish. But then I went into and I got
• 1:00:08
  Raven Kennedy's The Plated Prisoner series and she was
• 1:00:11
  indie and I had, I didn't know and I found out that from
• 1:00:14
  Bookstagram because that's because I, I started reading
• 1:00:17
  again the end of August and the beginning of October, I made a
• 1:00:20
  book Instagram. I'm like I said to my husband,
• 1:00:22
  I'm going to make this. He's like, what is what are you
• 1:00:24
  making? Still doesn't 100% understand
• 1:00:26
  what I'm doing, but but I got that.
• 1:00:30
  And then that's when, you know, I started and, you know, I saw
• 1:00:33
  that girl that reads Jamie, and she was recommending some
• 1:00:36
  different books and stuff, and they were indie.
• 1:00:38
  And that's when I started learning that terminology and
• 1:00:42
  stuff. Majority of the books that are
• 1:00:44
  here on my bookcase right here, they're all indie authors.
• 1:00:48
  Yeah. And again, if any of them go
• 1:00:50
  traditional, I hurry up and I get their indie covers because
• 1:00:53
  it's always, they're never as pretty.
• 1:00:55
  Heather, I said this to you. In DM I'm going to say it on
• 1:00:57
  this episode I read Sheila Masterson's latest e-mail before
• 1:01:03
  this episode get it now I'm telling you she's hinting.
• 1:01:07
  She is hinting and I got my probably.
• 1:01:09
  It's right there. It's right there.
• 1:01:11
  All of my. Like things about her and like
• 1:01:15
  reviewing and stuff. I'm like, how is this not
• 1:01:17
  published? Like being picked up to be
• 1:01:19
  published. This book is so good.
• 1:01:22
  And yes, there were parts where I was like, oh, like she yeah,
• 1:01:26
  I, I don't want to like yuck the Yum.
• 1:01:29
  But she kind of over explained some things where there was like
• 1:01:32
  repetition. And I remember telling Rebecca
• 1:01:35
  that and I was like, but it's really good.
• 1:01:37
  Like it's very different. And then it it gets wild.
• 1:01:40
  And I love how it's like that throughout the whole stinking
• 1:01:43
  book. It's the pace, the flow, the
• 1:01:46
  tense, the intensity of everything.
• 1:01:49
  That's the poison dollar. But that's OK.
• 1:01:53
  That's like 600 some pages. But it is like, I wish it was
• 1:01:58
  more like I need more. I mean, I mean we.
• 1:02:02
  Spoke about I was like, I would love a spin off novel about the
• 1:02:05
  drain and how that happened because it feels like there was
• 1:02:07
  so much we could unpack. Then I understand it wasn't part
• 1:02:10
  of the main story she was telling was Hannah and Henry.
• 1:02:13
  I would love I would love to see an actual like spin off of what
• 1:02:17
  happened those 10 years ago with the fall of the wall.
• 1:02:20
  I mean, it's been a while since I've read it, but like and how I
• 1:02:23
  can't like go into more detail because then I'm going to.
• 1:02:25
  I know. Yeah, but.
• 1:02:27
  Like I'm. Fortunately, I could come.
• 1:02:29
  Up with at. Least three spin of novels I
• 1:02:31
  want to see from that world because yeah, and it's a really
• 1:02:34
  cool. Idea of like humans with
• 1:02:37
  vampires involved, but they're called, they're not by empires.
• 1:02:41
  They're called the drain in a sense, right?
• 1:02:44
  But it's it's not like your typical vampires and it's not
• 1:02:47
  your typical kind of werewolves either.
• 1:02:49
  Like I would even say the werewolf kind of people.
• 1:02:54
  Yeah, they're see, I'm excited to read it.
• 1:02:57
  So I. I have two points to add, OK?
• 1:03:00
  So number one is it's almost 9:00, yeah.
• 1:03:04
  And I have like 30% battery lift because I have the ring light on
• 1:03:08
  next to me. So just keep that in mind.
• 1:03:10
  OK, so another thing, I want to just really pop up a bar for a
• 1:03:16
  second. You don't have to like my
• 1:03:17
  storytelling or any author. It doesn't have to be me
• 1:03:19
  specifically. But if you don't like it, stop
• 1:03:22
  reading the book. Example one of the review is she
• 1:03:26
  had an issue with how I name my characters.
• 1:03:28
  Like, it's a fucking fantasy. What do you want me to do?
• 1:03:30
  Call her Brad and Janet? Like, like, OK, you don't like
• 1:03:34
  the character's name, Like, fine, thanks.
• 1:03:36
  I guess. Yeah.
• 1:03:38
  And. Then.
• 1:03:39
  I took a few liberties, so I've taken well known law.
• 1:03:42
  Like it's not my unique concept, but I've flipped it a little
• 1:03:45
  bit. So like my vampires are called
• 1:03:48
  the undate, OK, my assassin characters.
• 1:03:52
  And by the way, this I got from Diablo because I was watching my
• 1:03:54
  husband play that around drafting this.
• 1:03:57
  So my assassin is called the rogues.
• 1:03:59
  Now I know normally Diablo like there's a little bit of magic
• 1:04:02
  there and whatnot. And she's like, I don't
• 1:04:05
  understand what you just can't call her an assassin and you
• 1:04:08
  can't call her a vampire. And I was like, because I can
• 1:04:12
  like it's that simple. Like, it's fine if you don't
• 1:04:15
  like it, but then go read another book.
• 1:04:18
  And that is my liberty as the author.
• 1:04:21
  I can say whatever the fuck I want to say, Yeah.
• 1:04:25
  Absolutely. Again, my gosh.
• 1:04:28
  And. I it's, I like when authors make
• 1:04:31
  different names for things because it's imaginative.
• 1:04:35
  And like when you say, like when you write a review and you say a
• 1:04:39
  unique perspective or unique magic system, that's what I'm
• 1:04:43
  talking about is like, you're not talking like this is a
• 1:04:45
  vampire. They have fangs and they suck
• 1:04:48
  blood. That's we already know that
• 1:04:51
  story. OK, give me a little bit more to
• 1:04:54
  it and then I'll be like, yes, this is so great.
• 1:04:57
  On Legion of Pride, but on Legion of Pride, and obviously
• 1:05:01
  for the sake of this episode, I cannot say how it ends and where
• 1:05:05
  I'm going with it, but I put a flip on it and he knows what I'm
• 1:05:08
  talking about, OK. And for me, that was really
• 1:05:12
  important. But then one of the pieces of
• 1:05:13
  feedback that I saw, and This is why I had to stop reading the
• 1:05:16
  reviews as well as everyone's going, I'm surprised how
• 1:05:19
  religious it is. And I'm like, religious way.
• 1:05:22
  OK. I was like, it's a story about
• 1:05:24
  demons. Like what did you think?
• 1:05:26
  What did you think was was going to happen?
• 1:05:28
  Like, did you not think religion was going to come into play at
• 1:05:31
  some point? That's why I.
• 1:05:33
  I would say it's like Dexter meets Lucifer TV show because it
• 1:05:39
  it has to do with like your apocalypse and your hell in
• 1:05:43
  heaven and demons and spiritual Alice, you know, like planes and
• 1:05:49
  stuff like that. And I'm excited to see kind of
• 1:05:52
  where you spend this because I feel a little super to tell you.
• 1:05:57
  I would love to tell you. All I will say is, oh, maybe do
• 1:06:03
  me after this. I have the whole of book 2
• 1:06:07
  drafted, but one of my strategy is, well, not drafted.
• 1:06:10
  It's more like offline. One of my strategies as a
• 1:06:14
  fantasy author is I'm trying to create variety in my book
• 1:06:19
  worlds. OK, so I have some readers that
• 1:06:23
  have been with me from the beginning and they read all my
• 1:06:25
  books and they love it. Great, we love those readers.
• 1:06:26
  But there are then other readers.
• 1:06:28
  Like I was chatting to one last night where she started Legion
• 1:06:31
  of Pride and now she wants to work back into my backlist.
• 1:06:33
  And I was like, knowing that and knowing what you like, stick to
• 1:06:37
  this, this and this. Don't read this because I don't
• 1:06:39
  think it will suit you as a reader.
• 1:06:43
  And I think now. I have to kind of stick to my
• 1:06:46
  strategy of finishing the Supernatural Mafia series.
• 1:06:49
  I'm going to put out my standalone later this year and
• 1:06:52
  then I'm going to come back to the series.
• 1:06:53
  Because I also know that logically, the break from this
• 1:06:56
  world will do me well. And I know that I will write a
• 1:07:00
  stronger story because I'm not so close to it anymore.
• 1:07:03
  I see see the obvious plot points, like just as I was about
• 1:07:06
  to submit Legion of Pride, there was a little subplot that, and
• 1:07:12
  this is a little bit spoilery, but a major character dies.
• 1:07:16
  There was a subplot with one of the major characters where I was
• 1:07:19
  like, Oh no, like it just came to me.
• 1:07:22
  And I was like, no, did that just happen?
• 1:07:24
  I was like, that is fucking unbelievable.
• 1:07:27
  Whether it ends up like that or not is a different story.
• 1:07:29
  Like I have to write it, but I'm like, that's why I have to take
• 1:07:33
  breaks from the world because if I don't, then it becomes a bit
• 1:07:36
  stale and boring. Yeah.
• 1:07:38
  And I. Met another indie author who was
• 1:07:41
  doing romantic suspense and she did a phenomenal job on her
• 1:07:45
  first book and I beta read her second one and a lot of us were
• 1:07:50
  feedbacking that the ending was just not what we wanted and she
• 1:07:55
  stopped it. And I think that's beautiful.
• 1:07:57
  Beautiful job. Like, don't put it out because
• 1:08:00
  you think you have to, because readers want more.
• 1:08:02
  Make it quality, please. I want to see a better ending so
• 1:08:06
  I could be like, yes, yes, this book.
• 1:08:10
  And she's like, you know what, My passion right now, I'm going
• 1:08:13
  to go write some kind of fae pirate fantasy.
• 1:08:18
  And I'm like, get it girl, I want to read.
• 1:08:20
  That too. I'm I'm in, I'm not.
• 1:08:24
  And she's like, thank you for. Helping me like I just think
• 1:08:27
  like people want me to stay in this like genre and like push
• 1:08:31
  out the books like no, no, no, no, we like your writing bring.
• 1:08:34
  Us fresh bring us please bring us what you're.
• 1:08:36
  Passionate about because we will love it.
• 1:08:38
  It's quality. You mentioned the beta reader,
• 1:08:41
  one of the readers that has been with me since the rules are
• 1:08:44
  damned and she just reads all of my work done.
• 1:08:47
  I love her and we sometimes chat in the in the DMS and she's
• 1:08:51
  become a bit of a friend, like she's Dutch.
• 1:08:53
  She comes to and I actually said to her like, hey, there's a
• 1:08:57
  couple of events I'm at later this year.
• 1:08:58
  I'd love to see you there. So anyway, I am trying some
• 1:09:03
  things with The Fall of the Damned and I say to her, I was
• 1:09:05
  like, listen, I've seen you beta read for other authors.
• 1:09:08
  I know you're my type of reader because like I've seen her
• 1:09:11
  reviews. I was like, I would be honored
• 1:09:14
  if you would beta read The Fall of the Damned for me.
• 1:09:16
  Like knowing you're Dutch, it means you're direct tick.
• 1:09:19
  OK, knowing you're my reader, tick.
• 1:09:21
  And I'm just like, I need someone to tell me, hey, this is
• 1:09:25
  shit, fix it, Yes, give me more of this.
• 1:09:30
  And I'm like, obviously I have dividers, I have editors and
• 1:09:32
  everything, but I'm like, I want the readers feedback and I trust
• 1:09:35
  your feedback. In this case, I was like, if I
• 1:09:38
  use that one star chicky from earlier this week, giving a
• 1:09:43
  author feedback at a publishing point is irrelevant because
• 1:09:46
  they're not going to go back and change it, right?
• 1:09:48
  But the beta reading phase, that is where I can change it.
• 1:09:52
  And that's why I'm asking my ideal reader type in this case.
• 1:09:55
  Shout out the Rosso if you're listening.
• 1:09:57
  I'm asking her for her feedback because I know if she gives me
• 1:10:01
  feedback, it is legit and it is something I will most likely end
• 1:10:05
  up doing. Yeah, I think that's important
• 1:10:08
  and. I think that's why I like beta
• 1:10:09
  reading because you feel involved in the process and you
• 1:10:12
  could be like the first. Well, first you get the story
• 1:10:15
  and the plot, which is awesome cuz if it's a sequel, you're
• 1:10:18
  like, yes, I know what's going to happen.
• 1:10:21
  But you can also be like, you know, I wasn't really feeling
• 1:10:23
  the intensity here. Like as a reader and I know this
• 1:10:27
  character, I feel like they wouldn't do this and take it or
• 1:10:32
  leave it. I'm not going to get bent out of
• 1:10:34
  shape about it. I'm just telling you how I feel
• 1:10:36
  about it because that's what you wanted me to do.
• 1:10:39
  And I have beta read a few people where I'm like, OK, this
• 1:10:43
  isn't, you know, going give them some ideas, things like that.
• 1:10:48
  And I don't want them to take it the wrong way, but sometimes I
• 1:10:51
  feel like I'm the only beta reader, beta reader in the group
• 1:10:55
  that's doing that. Other people are like, damn and
• 1:10:58
  whoa, spies, you know, an emoji and stuff like that.
• 1:11:01
  I'm like, should I? Because people I.
• 1:11:03
  Don't know. People are afraid that they'll
• 1:11:05
  hurt their feelings, I guess in a lot of ways, yeah.
• 1:11:08
  That's probably why I. Sign up to give opinions.
• 1:11:10
  I want to give you the straight answer and if you're a beta.
• 1:11:14
  Reader, you're signed up for that purpose that you're there
• 1:11:16
  to help. Yeah.
• 1:11:18
  You're not there to just. I mean, it's wonderful to have a
• 1:11:21
  cheerleader and all that kind of stuff, but you.
• 1:11:23
  Know. You have to have that.
• 1:11:27
  Like when we changed here this a few months ago here, we changed
• 1:11:31
  our logo and everything like that.
• 1:11:33
  But as I was making things, I was sending them to Heather and
• 1:11:37
  I'm sending them to Chelsea and I'm like, what do you think of
• 1:11:39
  this? I want opinions, you know, I
• 1:11:42
  want people to tell me, no, that doesn't look good.
• 1:11:46
  Yes, this looks good. You know, So I, I mean, I can
• 1:11:48
  see how that would play as a beta reader going to an author.
• 1:11:53
  But I mean, I'm sure there's some authors that don't, that
• 1:11:56
  aren't like how you are and you take it, you know, as positive
• 1:12:00
  information. Some might be like, but I'm
• 1:12:02
  like, why do you have beta readers then?
• 1:12:04
  So. I'll, I'll flip that around for
• 1:12:07
  a little bit. It's taken me, I've had very
• 1:12:09
  mixed experiences based reading. Sometimes I end up with the not
• 1:12:12
  the right for me. So for example, I've had someone
• 1:12:16
  so in the opening of the rules of them, we talk about
• 1:12:18
  cobblestones in Europe. Now I understand not everyone
• 1:12:20
  has travelled, but cobblestones are like literally in every
• 1:12:23
  European city. So that is a fact.
• 1:12:26
  I did not make that up. And she starts critiquing that
• 1:12:29
  and I was like, the next one. I'm talking about sex work.
• 1:12:32
  And I'm like, and she's like, I don't understand what this is.
• 1:12:34
  Also babes. It's literally in the title.
• 1:12:36
  So and I was like people. I've taken a few tries.
• 1:12:40
  To find the right plates, I do use a combination of a paid beta
• 1:12:43
  reader versus like trusted people.
• 1:12:46
  And in the racist case, when I reached out to and I have
• 1:12:49
  another author frame, I told them to RIP it apart.
• 1:12:52
  Like that was the my literal attraction.
• 1:12:54
  I was like, obviously I'm a human being.
• 1:12:55
  I want to know what I've done right as well.
• 1:12:57
  Like that would be helpful, but it's not required.
• 1:13:00
  Because if I want someone to strike my ego, I can go back to
• 1:13:04
  therapy. Because you don't get into
• 1:13:06
  writing books because you want to pat on the back for doing a
• 1:13:08
  good job because because that is like not the way to do it.
• 1:13:10
  But when I basically read for authors, because I do that as
• 1:13:13
  well, I very much ask the author upfront, how what type of
• 1:13:18
  feedback style do you like? OK, so I kind of set that
• 1:13:21
  boundary with him from the beginning.
• 1:13:23
  It's also a very quick way for me to judge if this is going to
• 1:13:26
  work out or not because I have actually pulled out of some
• 1:13:31
  cases where I've actually sits and all that.
• 1:13:32
  You know what? I don't think this is going to
• 1:13:33
  work for either of us. I am not the right fit for you.
• 1:13:36
  Sounds like you're looking for more of an editor.
• 1:13:38
  In this case, she has a couple of people you can talk to.
• 1:13:41
  Yeah, Like, I'm not going to send do your grammar for you.
• 1:13:42
  Like, no, I'm not doing that. Yeah.
• 1:13:45
  I've also recently learned that some authors put bases in a
• 1:13:48
  group. We all reading the.
• 1:13:50
  Same document I've done that. No, I would never do that again.
• 1:13:54
  I don't like. I like having my own Google doc
• 1:13:57
  with my name on top like this is mine.
• 1:14:00
  I did do one that had other people's, which was interesting.
• 1:14:04
  But again, like, that's where I was like I, I feel like I'm the
• 1:14:08
  only one like actually putting in like kind of more like, hey,
• 1:14:12
  this needs to be fixed. This doesn't make sense
• 1:14:15
  criticism and yeah and heck yeah.
• 1:14:17
  There are some funny parts where I'm like, that is fucking
• 1:14:20
  hilarious. I love this part.
• 1:14:22
  Of course, I'm saying like yeses and Nos and stuff like that, but
• 1:14:25
  I always felt like I was the one that was like, this needs to
• 1:14:29
  change. Do you know what?
• 1:14:30
  Do you know what? Posts me off the most is when
• 1:14:32
  other beta readers started disagreeing with my opinion in
• 1:14:34
  the doc. I was like I didn't ask you.
• 1:14:36
  Weird. That is.
• 1:14:38
  Weird, yeah. So.
• 1:14:40
  Listen. Listen, learned for me because I
• 1:14:42
  was like, if I'm giving up my time to do this for you at no
• 1:14:46
  cost, you don't have to. You can, as far as I'm
• 1:14:49
  concerned, delete the entire document with me in it.
• 1:14:51
  Like, that's fine. But I'm not going to enter into
• 1:14:53
  a debate with you about my feedback.
• 1:14:55
  Like, sure, if you need clarity, like that's a different topic,
• 1:14:59
  but take it or leave it. I have my own books to write.
• 1:15:02
  I have my own blogs to do. Like I I'm doing my own things.
• 1:15:06
  Yeah, yeah. Anyway.
• 1:15:08
  That's it, I agree. It's interesting.
• 1:15:10
  It's it's again, the Internet is an interesting place.
• 1:15:14
  Yeah. And you?
• 1:15:15
  Meet a lot of people and you do meet some people where you're
• 1:15:18
  like, yeah, that's not my vibe, let's not be friends.
• 1:15:22
  I have a great time, but this has been.
• 1:15:23
  Super fun. Thank you for being our our
• 1:15:26
  first author and thank you for having me.
• 1:15:29
  And yeah, I guess I told you I'm a terrible saleswoman and I just
• 1:15:33
  want to talk shit the whole time.
• 1:15:35
  That's fine. That's why we're here.
• 1:15:37
  We just want to talk books. Thank you.
• 1:15:39
  Ladies, I really appreciate it. And then you're having these
• 1:15:42
  out. On March Thursday.
• 1:15:44
  Thursday Thursday the 26th of March 26th OK.
• 1:15:48
  I haven't announced it yet. Heather knows it's gonna be my
• 1:15:51
  first audio book, yes. I know because I like my rereads
• 1:15:56
  as audiobooks. They're so good, and I will.
• 1:16:00
  Tell you this is this is a little bit of an exclusive one
• 1:16:03
  for you guys. I haven't even put this on my
• 1:16:05
  newsletter. The Rule of the Damned will also
• 1:16:07
  be put into audiobook. I am slowly but surely working
• 1:16:11
  through my backlist. Obviously it's a huge financial
• 1:16:15
  investment. So there we go.
• 1:16:16
  I did some sales stuff. There we go.
• 1:16:19
  I'm excited. It's fantastic.
• 1:16:23
  Cool but awesome. Thanks so much for that.
• 1:16:26
  Up for you. Thank you though.
• 1:16:28
  Thank you for being here with us.
• 1:16:30
  Yeah, OK. We'll.
• 1:16:31
  Chat again another day. Cool, Andy.
• 1:16:34
  Bye, bye. OK.
• 1:16:38
  All right. Everyone, so I hope you you
• 1:16:41
  enjoyed our interview and our chat with Stephanie Storm.
• 1:16:45
  Please remember her book comes out on the 26th of March.
• 1:16:48
  I do know that the Kindle version is up on Amazon right
• 1:16:53
  now, that you can pre-order it. And I think I'm assuming the
• 1:16:57
  book will probably probably be able to be ordered on Amazon
• 1:16:59
  probably the day of it released. But I do know you can go on her
• 1:17:03
  website and order it right now. You can do that kind of fun
• 1:17:06
  stuff. So I'm just very thankful that
• 1:17:08
  she came and she talked with us and she smashed the pedestal.
• 1:17:13
  She showed us that authors are, you know, they're not, they're
• 1:17:15
  just untouchable. They're readers like us.
• 1:17:18
  Yeah, and go follow her at Stephanie Storm on Instagram.
• 1:17:22
  I don't think she has another platform and then pre-order
• 1:17:26
  Legion of Pride and then she has another series out, her Mafia
• 1:17:31
  series. We'll link it.
• 1:17:33
  Below in our yeah starts with our.
• 1:17:35
  Catch of the stand. Yeah.
• 1:17:37
  That one's good too. So yeah, I have to.
• 1:17:40
  She was super. Fun I enjoyed that I look
• 1:17:43
  forward to over the next few months we have multiple authors
• 1:17:48
  so so be prepared for that and hopefully they'll be super fun
• 1:17:52
  exactly like like Stephanie. Yeah, I I absolutely, absolutely
• 1:17:56
  enjoyed it with her. So that was super fun.
• 1:17:58
  And so again, everybody go follow us on all the platforms.
• 1:18:02
  We're still chasing that 100 followers on YouTube.
• 1:18:07
  OK, so so please go over you can find us all at 2 girls 1 TBR and
• 1:18:12
  also go and check at the after this, go to our sips and check
• 1:18:17
  out our cocktail. That would be special for the
• 1:18:20
  storm. So good night babes.
• 1:18:23
  Good night.