Latest / The YMyHealth Podcast | Wellness and Healthcare Insights for Millennials / CRC Caregiving as a LGBTQ+ Expecting Mother: Jennifer French's Story
Transcript
- 00:02 Melissa Schenkman Welcome to the YMyHealth podcast, a healthcare podcast created by millennials for millennials. I'm Melissa Schenkman. 00:08 Julie Woon And I'm Julie Woon. We're two members of Gen Y on a mission to tackle the health challenges unique to people in their 20s, 30s, and 40s. 00:16 Melissa Schenkman With inspiring Survivor stories, plus insights and practical advice from experts across the country. We've got you covered. 00:22 Julie Woon Whether you're navigating a chronic condition, cancer, or challenges to your mental health, or. 00:27 Melissa Schenkman You're trying to manage our complicated healthcare system and your preventive or just want to make smarter healthcare choices, this is the podcast for you. 00:37 Julie Woon Let's get started. Welcome to the YMyHealth Podcast. I'm Julie Woon. I'm one of the co hosts. And today we are here with Jen French as part of the Fight CRC initiative on Capitol Hill. And, Jen, you were a caregiver, your wife, who is diagnosed with colorectal cancer. And so I wanted to start with just a little bit of background on that and also just, you know, what your understanding or knowledge was of colorectal cancer before this all happened. 01:03 Jennifer French Yeah. So, hi. Thank you for having me. I'm here because my wife was diagnosed at the age of 32, passed away at the age of 35, and to be honest, in terms of knowledge of colorectal cancer, prior to her diagnosis was 0%. There was no knowledge on my end, and on my wife's end, there's just not enough awareness for people in our age group, which I think is scary. But I think as time has gone on, it seems to be that more people are opening their eyes to what's actually happening. 01:33 Julie Woon But, yeah, I'm sorry about your wife. And it's. You're in a very unique situation. I think, as a caregiver. We've talked to a few different caregivers, and everybody's situation is always going to be unique to them. But you all were also expecting at the same time. And so I think your perspective is. Is very interesting. But can you walk us through the moment you all found out that she was diagnosed? 01:57 Jennifer French Yeah. We had gotten married in 2019, and we knew we wanted to have a child. And right after we got married, Covid happened, and so everything was put on pause because fertility was considered elective. And so we ended up holding off for the pretty much the year of 2020 and trying to start the process, but we had gone through about six to eight months of infertility and trying to get pregnant, and it just wasn't happening. And she wasn't allowed to go to any of my appointments. I was just going by myself. And we ended up going to an appointment where she was allowed to finally come. And that's the appointment that our retrieval worked. And were really excited. But I actually. It's funny because we. I think it was. 02:40 Jennifer French You're supposed to test, like, to see if you're pregnant two weeks after you do your iui. And I was like, no, I can't wait that long. That's just like, crazy. So I tested on day nine, and that was on a Monday. And I tested in the morning while she was at work, and it came back positive. And I was shocked. Like, I have a video I recorded of myself because I thought I would just be making these videos of, you know, how it's just not working for us. But it worked. And so I was like, okay, I need to put a box together to surprise her. And prior to that, we had gone on a trip and she was just saying, like, I think she loved Starbucks coffee. 03:13 Jennifer French And she's like, I think the coffee is just messing with my stomach, like, just not feeling great. And so we ended up. I gave her the box, surprised her and was like, oh, my God, we're pregnant. And then within two hours, I was rushing her to the ER because she was in debilitating pain and couldn't stand up straight. And I was like, we just have to go. And so were in the ER waiting, and she had gone to get an ultrasound and basically said that I could just tell the look on the girl's face, like, something isn't okay. And so that's where they found a great beard sized tumor on her right ovary. And, you know, they were hopeful at that point. It was a fibroid. But then they did cancer marker testing and that's when the doctor. 03:52 Jennifer French There was an ob GYN doctor that came in and said, likely dealing with cancer, we just don't know what. And so between telling her I was pregnant and then like within five hours, finding out she has cancer but not knowing what, how, when, or like, what type or anything was terrifying. 04:08 Julie Woon Yeah. 04:09 Jennifer French Because I thought, like, there's no way this baby's gonna survive with what I just heard, like, it is just like the emotional toll that's gonna put on my body. So, yeah, it was tough. 04:19 Julie Woon Yeah. 04:19 Julie Woon In five hours is almost unbelievable. 04:22 Jennifer French Yeah. At how quick. 04:23 Julie Woon And also we hear people say they had some level of symptoms that they were ignoring, but it sounds like for her it was very kind of quick. 04:32 Jennifer French Yeah. So we had gone on that trip before were in the er. We had a trip gifted to us for Christmas, and so we finally decided to take it, and we're like, oh, well, we just did our fertility treatment, so let's just get away for a little bit. Maybe that'll help. And while were there, she had some stomach pains. And it's like, well, where is it? And she said, it's on my right side. And were in San Luis Obisco, and there's not a lot of, like, hospitals in the area. And I. I told her, I said, well, why don't we just head home? I feel better us being closer to, like, one of our hospitals. So we just got in the car and went home. And at that point, she was peeing blood. And so she said, maybe it's just a uti. 05:05 Jennifer French Like, we really didn't know. And so we had luckily had a doctor friends that we had called, and she's like, yeah, you guys should go into urgent care. So the next morning, the pain had gone away. So the next morning, went into urgent care. And. But outside of, like, the two weeks prior of her getting diagnosed, there was. She had serial symptoms. We could look back and say, like, oh, on Thanksgiving, that prior year, she ate, and then she was, like, doubled over in pain. And were like, that's weird. And now looking back, you're like, okay, that was probably a sign, but how would you know? Like, oh, I didn't just eat. Eat too much on Thanksgiving day. 05:39 Julie Woon Like, yeah, out of contact. 05:40 Jennifer French Right, right. And so there was really. Honestly, like, she was tired a lot, but we thought, you know, she has a really tough job. Like, it's in the midst of us doing fertility and fourth quarter with her job, and. But outside of that, like, there was nothing that would have been jarring. 05:56 Julie Woon Yeah. 05:56 Jennifer French Like, alerting to us that she had cancer. Yeah. 05:59 Julie Woon And obviously hard for her to get that news also. So shortly after finding out you both are pregnant, but for you, how did you process receiving all of this as well? 06:10 Jennifer French I was freaking out. I am somebody that always thinks worst case scenario. And my first thought was, oh, my God, I'm about to have a baby, and I'm about to have it alone. What does this mean? But my wife is so positive. She's like, we got this. Like, we're gonna figure this out. Like, you know, she had her moments in the beginning where it was terrifying, but I think I couldn't be the person that I naturally wanted to be, which is like, oh, my God, what's gonna happen next? Like, you're not going to be here. Like, I need to think through, like, all the things that are going to happen because you start thinking of your worst fears. And I just had to put those feelings aside and say, like, okay, we're going to do this. Like, even though internally, like, my body was. 06:49 Jennifer French I was terrified every day, but I just kept trying to put on a strong face for her and, like, doing everything in my power to, like, not be so stressed that, like, the baby wouldn't survive. So, yeah, I was. I was terrified. 07:01 Julie Woon Yeah. 07:01 Julie Woon It's interesting dynamic because on the one hand, you're being a caregiver to your wife while simultaneously essentially caregiving for your child. And it's, I guess, how did your perception slash, like, role as a caregiver? How did that play out, knowing that you were sort of doing both together? 07:19 Jennifer French I think you're just. You go into fight or flight, and you just are pushing through each day. You know, I was just talking to my dad this morning, and he's like, you know, I saw what you went through, and having to put one foot in front of the other while simultaneously being terrified. You just do what you have to do because you love this person so much. And I don't know, like, part of me was like, please let this baby survive so that she has hope. That was, like, the reason I truly feel like she was able to get to Ned. And she fought so hard for, like, our child because she wanted that so badly. And caregiving is. I would never change anything. It was one of the hardest things I've ever had to do in my life from start to finish. 08:00 Jennifer French And I don't know, like, I think what. Where life brought me was, like, I was meant to do that for her, and I wouldn't change a thing. And now doing it for my daughter, even though it's really hard doing it alone, I try to, like, you know, take the energy that my wife would've had and been like, okay, we're gonna think positive about this. Like. 08:18 Julie Woon But, yeah, it's kind of the perfect segue, because I was curious about how you're balancing fear, hope, resiliency all at the same time. 08:27 Jennifer French Really. 08:27 Julie Woon I have to imagine that it would be difficult. 08:30 Jennifer French Yeah. I don't know if I would be here today if it weren't for my daughter. I don't know. She's the reason I got up every day, and I had to get up after she passed away. It's hard because when you're dealing with your own grief, you think at times, like, you're the Only one that's feeling it or emotionally in it. But then randomly, my daughter will be like, mommy, roll my window down. And then she just yells out the window, like, I love you, Mommy care. And. And it's those moments that, like, as much as I want to suppress and, like, just live in, like, the moment I'm in now, like, she reminds me, like, no, like, we very much, like, are honoring her. We're in it. It's a wave of emotions. 09:05 Jennifer French And when you think, like, you've made it through one stage, it's, like, another thing comes up that you're like, wait, how is this happening? And I think for me, like, where I'm feeling right now is like, was that even real? And then I'm like, I know I have a child, so I know it was real. But, like, it's like, what was my life these last, like, seven years? Like, what actually happened? Because I see videos and I see pictures of us, and I'm like, it just all happened so fast. And on top of that, with COVID and it just was like, life just over the last, like, several years. It's confusing, to be honest. 09:36 Julie Woon I mean, it's got to be something where it takes years to process everything that would have happened during that time period. 09:42 Jennifer French Yeah. Because I think a lot of it is I put 100% of myself to the side to be there to have a baby and then also be there for my wife. And luckily, I had a job at the time that was so incredible and flexible and allowed me to take her to every appointment while also going to my appointments. She had gone through surgery to get all of the masses removed. And while she was recovering in the hospital, I had to go get my ultrasound to confirm that the pregnancy was still going okay. And were fa. While she was in the hospital room, she had an incision, like, all the way down her stomach, and so she couldn't really get up. And I'm FaceTiming her to say, like, hopefully this is, like, going okay. 10:21 Jennifer French But I didn't want her to know that, like, if the baby didn't survive, I didn't want her to know. So I waited until we found out that there was a heartbeat, and then we FaceTimed her. And the doctor was a part of the whole process, but it. Yeah, the whole journey in itself was a lot. 10:34 Julie Woon Yeah. 10:35 Julie Woon And can you share how you and Kirsten maintained your relationship during these moments? Because obviously, she's going through treatment. That's very tough, I think, both physically and mentally. And so I'm curious How you guys maintained that together. 10:49 Jennifer French Yeah, that was hard. Like, you go from being like, oh, we're newlyweds. Like, we're about to start a family. This is everything we've ever hoped for to, like, now we have cancer. We have this third person that we don't like that is constantly a part of our conversation in our everyday. And I became a caretaker, and she was the patient. And learning to date again after a diagnosis or learning to love each other through this new challenge is really hard because deep down inside, you're both thinking things and feeling emotions, but you don't want to put that burden on them or scare them or run through all your feelings. So that's where you have to lean on other people. And then you feel like you're somewhat hiding, like, your true self. Like, I told her everything and vice versa. 11:33 Jennifer French And it was really hard, even up until the day that she passed. Like, were really honest with each other, but I think there was a lot both of us held back because we just were trying to protect each other. But I know when she went into remission, were like, okay, this is our time to live. Like, let's go live our life like, this is it. And the simple arguments were, like, null and void. We were like, what's the point? Like, there's literally so much more we could be dealing with. And so in one end, it was really hard, but on the other, it gave us perspective. And even to this day, there's things that happen in my life where I'm like, this is so trivial compared to, like, we're all alive, we're all breathing. We're all here today. 12:10 Jennifer French So as crappy as it is, that's the gift it gave, is being able to, like, enjoy, really enjoy the small moments. 12:17 Julie Woon Yeah. 12:17 Jennifer French But, yeah, it's not easy going through that and navigating a relationship on top of everything else because your dates become your appointments. Like, and you're like, how can we make this cute? In, like, the weirdest way? Because we're walking into a hospital room. But it's like a different love language that you have to show. 12:33 Julie Woon Yes. 12:34 Jennifer French Like, through it all. So. 12:35 Julie Woon And you mentioned a little bit about support, and I was curious about just accessing resources. What was helpful? Because I think part of it would being soon to be parent, going through this, which is a unique situation. Also, being part of the LGBTQ community, did you find that there were any resources or. I'm curious, just if there was anywhere. 12:54 Jennifer French That you turned to for support. There was nothing. There's still Limited resources. And I. It's getting better. Like, we have Cheeky Charity now, which is an amazing organization, but I feel like I was the only lesbian in going through colon cancer and. Or cancer at our age. And now I've seen that there's more people that have experienced it. I think it also comes with, like, the vulnerability of sharing your story. And more people will say, like, oh, I. I've gone through this. And so that's. I am a little bit more open with our story because if I can be a person that can help somebody in a time like that, where I wish I would have had it, then great. But no, there's nothing in it. 13:32 Jennifer French Even if there was, it was all people who were so much older and couldn't relate to, like, having a young kid or navigating through having, like, we would sit in the doctor's office and we would look around like, how are we the youngest people here? Like, it just. Yeah, the resources were. There was none. Like, we literally just had to figure it out ourselves. And you're putting in hashtags on Instagram and, like, hoping that you could find someone to just relate to. But, no, we didn't really have anything. 13:57 Julie Woon Yeah. 13:58 Jennifer French Which is a bummer. 13:59 Julie Woon Yeah. 13:59 Julie Woon I think maybe my biggest takeaway from today and all the people that we've spoken to with so far is just that's a very common thread and this representative piece of having somebody who in some way mirrors your own experience and just being able to relate in that way is so important, I think. And, yeah, it sounds like slowly people are trying to advocate for this more, put more resources out there. But it is, I think, still a work in progress, I guess, as well. 14:27 Jennifer French What I would say. Yeah. And I knew about fight seriously a little bit prior to my wife's passing. But we also found a balance of, like, what do we need to. How much do you want to lean into, like, seeing all these things because it's hard, but also how much do you want to follow and continue to see, like, that stories don't go as planned or someone passes away. And so I try my best to, like, stay away from it. Whereas my wife was, like, leaning onto that because she wanted to see positive stories. But after she had passed away, that's where I was like, I need to find a community. I need to find something. And I had followed Fighter C. I saw that they were doing call on Congress. And so it was three months after she passed away. 15:00 Jennifer French I was like, you know what? I'm just gonna go. I wanna. And I Didn't know anyone. I didn't know anything. I didn't know where I was supposed to go, what I was supposed to do. But I just showed up last year, and it was three months after she passed away, and I just remember walking in a room, and, like, people would just come up to me, like, hi, what's your name? Like, and you just don't even have to explain yourself. And so that's my biggest regret is, like, I. This community with Fight crc and just the people I've met here, being able to have. Outside of the LGBTQ community, like, being able to have, like, a human that can just say, like, you don't have to explain yourself. I see it, like, in your eyes, like, let me just give you a hug. 15:35 Jennifer French And it's just, like, I just remember leaving here feeling like, oh, my God, this is what I craved, like, all of these years. And I wish my wife would have had that experience. And so I think that's something that, like, as hard as it can be to, like, open yourself and be vulnerable and accepting what's really happening, it was the best decision I could have made. 15:52 Julie Woon Yeah. 15:52 Jennifer French And so that's why I'm. I'm back here again. Yeah. 15:55 Julie Woon Back here being an ambassador. That's awesome. And I think I'm curious, Stu, you and your wife ever experience or receive at any point, like, different treatment because you were part of the LGBT plus community? 16:07 Jennifer French That was always a slippery slope. Like, we would gauge the physician, you would gauge the audience and say, like, how do we want to go about this? Because are we going to be treated differently? I remember up until her oncologist was great. He was always very sweet, very respectful to our relationship. But it was always hard because anytime we'd walk into a room together, the first thing people would say is that your sister? And she was just like, oh, no. Then you gotta explain it and go through the whole thing. And even up until she was put on hospice, when the nurses would walk in and be like, okay. Like, they would immediately go and talk to her parents instead of, like, me as her wife. And that was hard. 16:44 Jennifer French It's hard because, you know, if I was a man and I was married to her, they would know, like, okay, I'm gonna go to that person and talk. There was always, like, this assumption that I was a friend or a sister, and then you'd have to run through that whole thing again. And even for her, I know one of her biggest pet peeves outside of being in the gay community was she'd go into Scans, and they're like, but you're too young for this. And she's like, I know. I remember it irked her to her core. Like, she just was so frustrated when people would say that. It's like, well, thank you for that. Like, I appreciate it. But, like, what do you want me to do with that information? Like, and I think, like, bringing more awareness in the medical community. 17:20 Jennifer French Like, yeah, she is young and, yeah, this doesn't need to happen. Is, like, very important. But I remember that being something that was, like, always big, like, trigger point for her. 17:30 Julie Woon Yeah, for sure. Yeah. 17:31 Julie Woon Makes sense. Kirsten went on underwent biomarker testing. 17:35 Jennifer French Correct. 17:35 Julie Woon Is what advice would you give to other people about understanding their potentially cancer genetics? 17:41 Jennifer French Yeah. So initially went through biomarker testing. Everything's coming at, like, such a fast pace. 17:45 Julie Woon Yeah. 17:46 Jennifer French That when they were like, oh, let's go through your genetic testing and see if any of this is genetics, which hers wasn't. But we had a call with a genetic counselor, and honestly, like, remembering that call, I was like, I don't even know what you're telling me right now. Like, what does any of this mean? And you kind of just move on from that appointment and just like, okay, I guess that means they don't have to, like, worry about that. But one thing to have that mindset when things are going as planned, but then when things start to not go as planned and there aren't answers or solutions, then you're like, oh, shoot, like, we need to know more information on this. And. 18:19 Jennifer French And then until they basically said, like, we have no other options in terms of chemotherapy for you, we need to look at clinical trials. That's when they did additional biomarker testing to see what she would qualify for. And there's so much information that I just wish I would have known to be, like, when she was in remission, like, research. Look at everything you possibly can. Like, take the time to, like, dig in and find out more information on, like, clinical trials that are out there, because you don't realize, like, it's not. Clinical trials could be six months from now, and it's just not something that we ever knew. And I feel like you're in such the fight or flight and you're pushing through and trying to just take all the information as it comes. 19:01 Jennifer French But when you get to that point where they're like, we have no other options. Here's a clinical trial. You're like, well, where do I begin with this? And then it's like, you're on crunch time, and I Wish that's something that I would have researched and known more about. But, you know, I try not to be hard on myself. Like, you know, you're doing the best that you can, but. Right. 19:18 Julie Woon Yeah. 19:18 Jennifer French It wasn't something that were like. To this day, I'm still like, what are, like, biomarkers? Like? And there's so many different kinds and what works and what doesn't. And they explain it throughout the process. But it's like you're sometimes in one ear and out the other because so much information being thrown at you. Right. 19:33 Julie Woon Yeah. And you had so much going on. I mean, it's dreaming through a fire hose, essentially. It's impossible to keep up. 19:39 Jennifer French Yeah. 19:39 Julie Woon And so. Yeah, I feel like that's extremely valid. Just how you're supposed to keep track of it all. It's seemingly impossible. 19:46 Jennifer French Yeah. It's like, almost like you have to record every conversation and listen to it five times over. And then it's just. I don't know, maybe having, like, a third person in the room that, like, is like, can you interpret for you? Like, okay, so here's what went over today. Because it's. It is a lot of information overload. 19:59 Julie Woon Yeah. 19:59 Jennifer French And you're just trying to process, like, how long is she gonna live? Is she gonna live? And what do we have to do, like, in the now? Because you don't wanna overwhelm yourself with, like, all the possibilities. But at the same time, you can never let your guard down, even when you are in remission, because you're like, your body's still fighting, like. And so, yeah, the biomarkers is something I wish I would have. Yeah. Knowing more about. 20:20 Julie Woon (Commercial) Now we’d like to take a minute to talk about today’s sponsor. Diekman Dysautonomia. Have you or a loved one been struggling with symptoms like fainting, a racing heart or crushing fatigue only to feel dismissed or unheard by doctors? You may be experiencing dysautonomia POTS or long COVID. Dr. Sarah Diekman understands because she has been there. 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If you get a no from a physician, go try another one. Like, keep trying until you get your yes. Because she was told three days before she got diagnosed that, oh, you have a uti. Just go home and take at home Azo. And she had a stool test, and it came back clear. Everything came back clear on it. So for me, I'm like, no, you have to keep pushing. And sometimes it's so uncomfortable to challenge the status quo of, like, a physician. And you feel like, oh, God, like, I don't want to, like, make them feel like, they're not credentialed well enough. I'm challenging them. 22:04 Jennifer French But if you feel something's wrong with your body, don't just accept like, oh, it's probably just irritable bowel syndrome. Like, no, like, in today's world, like, you have to keep going until you can get a colonoscopy or you can get a scan or you can get testing. Like, whatever it is, I tell anybody my age, like, you are never too young. Because they say that she's diagnosed at 32 and is probably in her body for 10 years prior to her getting diagnosed. And there is no way we would have found out unless she had a colonoscopy. Absolutely no way. And it didn't run in her family. 22:32 Julie Woon Yeah. 22:33 Jennifer French So how would we have ever known when people say, like, oh, I'm afraid to get a colonoscopy? I'm like, well, if you would have seen what she had to go through for two and a half years, then you wouldn't be afraid of it. Right. A colonoscopy is much easier than what she had to go through. And absolutely the people surrounding her and her support system had to go through to try and get her through all of that too. 22:50 Julie Woon Yeah. 22:51 Julie Woon And how has becoming a mother during this journey shaped your perspective on life and love? 22:58 Jennifer French Yeah, it's bittersweet. I feel like a lot of times when you go through such a tragic event, you black out a lot of things. And part of me is like, I don't even remember my pregnancy. Do I even remember this last year of my daughter's life? Like, while I'm grieving, I feel guilty that I maybe am not the mother that I could have been for her because of what we've been through. And I saw a video last night of she's a seven year old girl, just talking about how, like, at two years old, she lost her parent and how she feels robbed because she doesn't remember, she doesn't know. I think of my little girl's heart and it breaks me. Like, it breaks me to know that she will never know who her mom was. 23:37 Jennifer French And all I can give her is videos and pictures. But every day, as hard as it is being a solo parent, it's like I was given this gift. But it's also, at the same time, I'm terrified to lose her too. Every day I'm like, if she gets sick, like, what's going to happen to her? Does she have cancer? Does she have this? It's in this constant state of fear. And I know that'll eventually improve over time. But I think it's. If someone says, you want to come on this trip? I said, hell, yeah, let's go. There's no reason to wait because we don't know what tomorrow's gonna bring. And I'm gonna show her the best life I can and navigate through it all and just hope that we can just work through the. 24:14 Jennifer French The really challenging part of, like, losing her, but also, like, remembering her. We buy her flowers every week and we put em in her urn where her ashes are. And she's like, mommy, I want to get flowers for mommy cure. And anytime they see butterflies or balloons, because we send off balloons to her for her birthday. And the kids all, like, we've tried to make it as just as much a part of our family's life. Like, she's still here and she's really big on celebrations and just going all out. And so as hard as it is to do those things, like, I still try my best to say, like, okay, this is what Kira would want. And so I feel like our family has really been able to, like, embrace her and, like, where she is and send her balloons and flowers and. 24:52 Julie Woon Yeah, that's really lovely. 23:54 Julie Woon Yeah. 23:55 Julie Woon Because it's not fair. And so I just think, yeah, it's one of those things where, like you said, there's not a lot of resources and you kind of just have to pave your own way, I guess, so to speak, and figure out what works best, you know, for you and your family. 25:07 Jennifer French Yeah. 25:08 Jennifer French And it's also knowing that, like, although I was her wife and Addie is her daughter, like, there are so many people that loved her. She made everyone feel they were the most important person to her. And even when she was on her hospice bed, didn't know how much time she had, every person left that room crying because she made them feel better about themselves when they thought they were going to walk into the room to make her feel better. Like, that's just the person that she was. And I know there's like, she has left a massive hole in a lot of people's hearts, but I also think that she changed so many people's lives because she truly lived life like she truly gave everything she had. And part of me wonders sometimes, like, did her body just know that this was gonna happen? 25:48 Jennifer French Because how does someone live life so freely and so just unapologetically themselves, just like carefree, you know, I'm like, how do you not have stress? I don't even. In her diagnosis, like, she always just found like, the positives in life. And sometimes it would be so mad at her, I'm like, how are you able to do this? And now I'm like, okay, I'm. I'm channeling her. Her energy, because if she can do it, I guess any of us can. 26:11 Julie Woon But, yeah, she sounds like an incredible person. 26:12 Jennifer French Oh, she's. She is. She's an incredible human. And her parents did an amazing job raising her and her friends, her family, everybody has just been so supportive of us. And it's just been as hard as it is to have gone through something like this, I wouldn't change it. I'd do it all over again. She was, and is the love of my life, and I was lucky to have the time that I did with her. 26:32 Julie Woon Is there anything that you, or behalf of Kiersten. 26:34 Jennifer French Yeah. 26:36 Julie Woon Want as a tidbit of wisdom or just a suggestion? Want to leave the listeners with something. 26:41 Jennifer French Something her and my dad would always say because he would take her to some of her appointments, is like, go live your life. Like, don't wait. Take the trip. Take the time. You just. You never know. And I think you always think you're going to have time, but then it just. You may not. And, yeah, just go and do it. Say, yes, there's. What's holding us back is ourselves. And I think sometimes it's the fear of whatever it may be, or, oh, this job, or they filled her desk the day after she died, and she had given everything to the company, and she loved what she did, but it's a business and it moves on. And I think sometimes you have to take a step back and say, like, let's see the bigger picture and embrace that. 27:18 Jennifer French Like, we have everything where we've hoped for and just do all the things and let the little things go. Sometimes we can make them big things. 27:26 Julie Woon Thank you so much for coming on the podcast and for sharing your story and Kirsten's story, and I'd like to think that this episode is just another way of you and her continuing to advocate and spread the word. And so, yeah, just. Thank you so much. We really appreciate it. 27:40 Jennifer French Thank you for having me. And I know she's somewhere up there proud. Yes, I appreciate it. 27:45 Julie Woon Thanks for tuning in to the YMyHealth podcast. We hope you're leaving inspired and informed. 27:49 Melissa Schenkman Be sure to follow us on your favorite podcast platform so you never miss an episode and share YMyHealth with your friends. 27:57 Julie Woon Have a story to share or a question for us? Connect with us at YMyHealth on social media or visit our website@ymyhealth.com until. 27:05 Melissa Schenkman Next time, Remember, your health journey starts with the right information. Stay healthy.