Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Paul Arthur about his choice of Timelash (1/2)

Transcript

Talks to Paul Arthur about his choice of Timelash (1/2) · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

• 0:37
  It's called treason and Paul Arthur is the traitor.
• 0:43
  Execute him. Hello, Paul.
• 0:46
  Oh, good evening, Joe. Have you prepared the Time lash
• 0:48
  for me? You gave me your words, you
• 0:51
  microcephalic after states, all right?
• 0:56
  How you doing? You OK?
• 0:58
  I'm doing fine. Now, listen, I've been having a
• 1:01
  bit of trouble lately. You see, I've got this sort of
• 1:03
  remaining tinsel leftover from Christmas.
• 1:08
  I don't have this sort of fabulous sort of triangular IKEA
• 1:13
  cabinet, so I thought I'd dangle the tinsel over it to give it a
• 1:17
  sort of a bit of bling, you know, a gay man, you know, gotta
• 1:20
  have a bit of bling, yeah. Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
• 1:22
  Who doesn't love a bit of tinsel?
• 1:23
  I mean, even even at straight fellas, we'd like a bit of the
• 1:26
  bling too. So absolutely, yeah.
• 1:28
  The next thing I knew, I had a Contron tunnel zooming out of
• 1:33
  this cabinet. I was sucked in.
• 1:36
  Back to the 18th century, hanging out with HG Wills in
• 1:39
  Inverness. Did you have, did you have did
• 1:43
  you have an Irish lady zoom through your your room there
• 1:45
  like? That's an Irish lesbian.
• 1:47
  I think you're. Yeah, I was getting more on that
• 1:49
  like. I thought better ever Joe,
• 1:54
  Sorry. Have you ever had a sort of
• 1:56
  night out so spectacularly alcoholic that you've seen Gina
• 2:01
  and Crowley sort of floating through the room?
• 2:06
  No, no, never quite that, Never quite that.
• 2:09
  I might, might have seen Paul Darrow turn up and down again.
• 2:11
  And oh, and yes, I might seen skeletons fall to the ground
• 2:16
  spectacularly, sounding quite plasticky.
• 2:18
  That happened in your life. Oh yeah.
• 2:22
  Is that the sort of the torture implements used when you don't
• 2:26
  meet your quota at the end of the month?
• 2:28
  Yeah, that's right. Yeah.
• 2:29
  When? Well if it is just anybody, it
• 2:30
  always me at work I'll just shout idiots and flick a switch
• 2:33
  on my chair and you know, does that my colleagues.
• 2:36
  I mean, I will say it, please. And let me say I am making you
• 2:39
  utterly exempt from this when I say it, all right?
• 2:42
  I mean, look at your beautiful face.
• 2:44
  But I mean, I've done some podcasts with people that look a
• 2:46
  bit like that about that accident with Mexico 990 and
• 2:50
  become 1/2 Morlocks hybrid as well in my time.
• 2:55
  Yeah. And actually, do, you know,
• 2:56
  there was 1 moment in the story where I was truly, really, no
• 3:01
  one has ever said this about Time Lash, really sort of
• 3:04
  thinking, wow, this is so relatable to my real life.
• 3:07
  The bit where Perry was manacled in a dark space and a glistening
• 3:14
  phallus came roaring at her out of the dark.
• 3:17
  I was like, my God, there's my 20s flashing before my eyes.
• 3:22
  I'm gonna assume you didn't scream quite hard.
• 3:24
  It's quite as hard as Perry did, because yeah, she would not stop
• 3:28
  screaming and that thing couldn't get anywhere near her.
• 3:31
  It was like struggling at the time.
• 3:33
  I only scream when there's two or three Morlocks is coming at
• 3:35
  me, if I'm honest, you know? Yeah, yeah, 11.
• 3:38
  One's fine. Fine, Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 3:40
  I think most of them have got pretty scary teeth.
• 3:42
  You know, Paul, what I'm talking about there.
• 3:44
  I'll take it a word. This is a bit of a clue, perhaps
• 3:48
  as to the story that we're talking about today.
• 3:51
  I mean, how do you feel about talking about the two doctors?
• 3:55
  I get away. Oh, spend weeks watching Time
• 3:58
  Lash, Yeah. I've been gnawing rats, you
• 4:01
  know, licking blood off the floor, that sort of thing.
• 4:05
  Now listen, now, look, I, you and me, right?
• 4:08
  Get that boxing gloves on, all right?
• 4:09
  Or slap yourself. In oil or something.
• 4:11
  Smackdown. Joe Ford.
• 4:13
  About to happen in the red corner is Paul Arthur Heights
• 4:19
  out of season 22 and Eric's award is this award.
• 4:24
  Did I get that right? Well, you always say sword and I
• 4:26
  think it's only right that you carry on saying sword, but it's.
• 4:29
  A say word. I've always said say word but
• 4:31
  then. Just stupid fucking name.
• 4:34
  I mean name like this so you can pronounce it so many ways.
• 4:38
  You don't say Joe Fart and Joe Ford, you just say Joe Ford.
• 4:43
  You don't say Paul Arthur and Paul Arthur.
• 4:45
  You know you say, Paul Arthur. Exactly.
• 4:48
  Yeah, Yeah. As as as it should be.
• 4:51
  Yeah, totally. Yeah.
• 4:52
  I mean, maybe he's he's a bit Farage Farage, isn't it?
• 4:55
  And he's a bit of a kind of Nigel Farage type of figure.
• 4:59
  I think. In my personal opinion, you.
• 5:02
  Think he's a Nigel Farage? Sort of.
• 5:03
  Well. I mean not.
• 5:05
  He's divisive. Should we say not?
• 5:07
  I'm not gonna. I don't know.
• 5:08
  He's always see you have to be very specific, you know, when
• 5:11
  you're making comparisons. Like that?
• 5:14
  Well, they're both of them are quite.
• 5:17
  I don't want to get personal and Eric or Nigel, if you are
• 5:21
  listening, I do apologise, but I find them both.
• 5:24
  They give me the ick a little bit, as the kids would say,
• 5:27
  yeah. You're getting the ick factor
• 5:29
  from. Eric, yeah, they're both kind of
• 5:32
  quite slimy, aren't they? I think.
• 5:34
  And Eric I, the way he, whenever he's interviewed and he's
• 5:39
  interviewed about the violence in Doctor Who, the violence he
• 5:42
  put there, he's always like, so he always seems to be enjoying
• 5:46
  himself a bit too much. I'm kind of imagining it.
• 5:48
  Like look at what he put on the screen.
• 5:50
  Exactly. I can imagine him writing his
• 5:52
  scripts with one hand on the typewriter and the other hand's.
• 5:55
  No. Oh, please don't make us think
• 5:57
  about that. Eric playing with little Eric
• 6:01
  Come. On now.
• 6:02
  But this is This is why he gives me.
• 6:04
  This is the vision I have in my head.
• 6:06
  Oh God, then you add in all the ick with Perry, you know, being
• 6:09
  lusted after by everybody. I mean, in this story, Manacle
• 6:13
  called up, dragged around. You know, I'm going to make her
• 6:16
  my bride, but first of all, I'm going to turn her into a
• 6:19
  horrible mutant. Yeah, exactly.
• 6:21
  I mean, you know, one of the reasons I quite like time
• 6:25
  lashes. I think it doesn't have too much
• 6:27
  of Eric's touch on it, if you like.
• 6:29
  Obviously he's clearly had a good go at bashing away at the
• 6:32
  script. But it doesn't have like the the
• 6:36
  Violet, it doesn't have the kind of grotesque violence.
• 6:39
  I don't mind a bit of bit of action, but it doesn't have the
• 6:41
  kind of over the top gore of a lot of other stories of his era.
• 6:46
  But it does have that unfortunate Perry stuff, doesn't
• 6:50
  it? Like, you know, he can't help
• 6:52
  but stick that in there. And I think that is a Saywood
• 6:55
  introduction to the script. I don't think that was in the
• 6:57
  original. So yeah, the.
• 7:00
  Staunchest of Saywood? Oh my God, I think I've got it
• 7:04
  right. But you've got it.
• 7:06
  Thank you. He can be taught even I can't in
• 7:10
  any way defends the atrocious character of the Paul Perry goes
• 7:15
  on. All I'll say is God bless Big
• 7:18
  Finish, who gave her a life after that life where she was
• 7:22
  competent and smart and had a great rapport with Colin.
• 7:26
  And she put out, they put out, you know, they've got loads and
• 7:29
  loads of stories now where that's how it kind of should
• 7:32
  have been for her on TV. What I will say is in the blue
• 7:37
  corner we've got Ford, lover of camp, cheap, violent trash that
• 7:47
  comes out of season 22. Because it's a bit like me, you
• 7:50
  know, it's brash, it's colourful, it's.
• 7:54
  Unapologetic. Yeah.
• 7:56
  Yeah, it will stab you and throw you in acid.
• 7:59
  Bath. Yeah, throw you in manacles as
• 8:02
  well if you're lucky. Oh my goodness, that.
• 8:04
  Will definitely be psych phallic coming out of the dark.
• 8:07
  Oh, I was. Just for the listener, he, Joe,
• 8:10
  is wearing a a fishnet mask this evening, like one of the
• 8:14
  godaliers in the Time Lash. Yeah, I can't see that's.
• 8:20
  Right leering. Excuse me.
• 8:23
  What I mean, what I will say is I've recently done a lot of
• 8:27
  chatter about say would not just for strictly, but also I've done
• 8:32
  a couple of commentaries as well.
• 8:34
  And I think all of the things you could possibly say about him
• 8:38
  are probably true, But I think his dialogue is occasionally
• 8:42
  very bland. I think he doubts turn to
• 8:44
  violence more than he should and like, it's hit and miss his era,
• 8:51
  but I also think he takes bigger risks than people think because
• 8:55
  his era has Kinder and snake dance and Enlightenment and the
• 8:58
  Awakening and Mark Irani and all sorts of really interesting
• 9:02
  things going on. I think he's the first era where
• 9:05
  he gave a woman a shot at writing for Doctor Who, and that
• 9:08
  should be lauded. I think when he gets it right,
• 9:12
  and that is stuff like Earth Shock and Revelation of the
• 9:14
  Daleks, it's some of the best Doctor Who we've ever had.
• 9:18
  When he gets it wrong, it's dismal.
• 9:19
  When he gets it right, it's magic.
• 9:22
  So I, I just, I just don't think it's all bad.
• 9:25
  And I think a lot of people will say it's all bad and everything
• 9:28
  Bid Me did was wonderful and everything Cartmel did was
• 9:31
  wonderful. But I actually think their eras
• 9:33
  are as flawed, just in different ways to how Eric's era is
• 9:38
  flawed. And I think it's where your
• 9:40
  taste falls rather than one era is bad and one era is good.
• 9:45
  Yeah. Is that fairly?
• 9:46
  I think that's 100% fair. I heard your impassioned defence
• 9:50
  on the Earth shock commentary with Luke.
• 9:53
  Where? I've had a few death threats
• 9:55
  since then, you know. But you're right though, I mean,
• 9:58
  because you're right and I'm totally guilty of this, where
• 10:02
  I've got this opinion of what his errors like and it is all of
• 10:07
  what you just said is that that that highly stylized violence
• 10:11
  that he seems to really have a lot of Glee about.
• 10:14
  That's that's what I think of the era.
• 10:16
  But you're totally right. There's whole there is a lot of
• 10:18
  variety in in his, you know, the stories that he script edited
• 10:23
  you right. He did Commission kinder and
• 10:26
  snake dance. He commissioned Glenn McCoy to
• 10:28
  write Time Lash and I think this, but no, you might laugh.
• 10:33
  You're the only person that would use that as.
• 10:36
  No, but I do. Favour in this cap.
• 10:38
  I didn't mean that there is something, I mean there's
• 10:41
  something in this story that is doing things a little bit
• 10:44
  different. I think that or stuff that
• 10:47
  hasn't been done in a long time and actually stuff that points
• 10:50
  to the future. I mean, it might sound like a
• 10:53
  I'm talking about my ass, but I do think in many ways this is
• 10:57
  the blueprint for 21st century Doctor Who Joe Ford.
• 11:00
  What time lash? Yeah, I think this.
• 11:03
  I still can't back that up, but that's a bold claim.
• 11:07
  I need some evidence now. Well, I mean, you've got like is
• 11:10
  a celebrity historical? I mean, we haven't done that
• 11:14
  since the 60s where you've got a famous figure from history, it
• 11:17
  being integral to the plot. I mean, and that's something
• 11:20
  that the new series grasped from the beginning of 2005 with
• 11:24
  Charles Darwin turning up. Just don't.
• 11:27
  Even still haven't bested her. But though, have they?
• 11:29
  I mean, no, come on. Yeah, I mean.
• 11:32
  Face to face Paul in the face of the enemy.
• 11:35
  Oh, it's wonderful. Yeah.
• 11:37
  So yeah, he's fantastic. And we're definitely going into
• 11:39
  into her. But that, yeah, he's.
• 11:41
  Excuse me. What I'm going to do what now?
• 11:43
  Thank God every time our podcast.
• 11:48
  Was saying they're listening so I'm sorry.
• 11:50
  Wow, I did. Yeah, Intel, but OK.
• 11:53
  But but there's things like the the whole time Nash concept that
• 11:56
  like for a time travel show, Glenn Mccoy's written a story
• 12:00
  that involves time travel. I mean, how?
• 12:02
  How bloody revolutionary is that?
• 12:04
  And that Android appearing out of nowhere is the most non
• 12:08
  moffit moffit thing I've ever seen in my life.
• 12:10
  The go, the go exactly and no explanation for like I've no
• 12:14
  quite significant chunk of story, so watching.
• 12:17
  The behind the sofa takes some jumps out and see it goes.
• 12:20
  What the hell was that? It has exactly the effect it's
• 12:25
  supposed to have. Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally.
• 12:27
  So I do think there's this is doing stuff that you won't see
• 12:30
  again you haven't seen before or haven't seen for a long time and
• 12:34
  you won't see again for a long time.
• 12:35
  So, you know, it's, it's, there's some good stuff in here.
• 12:38
  I think it also it has a sense of adventure about it, which I
• 12:44
  don't think we see a lot of in 2222.
• 12:47
  Sort of got this mission, isn't it to it?
• 12:50
  Well, they're on missions for most story in Avengers of our
• 12:54
  Cyton 7 in the two Doctors. It's to go and see what's his
• 12:59
  name, Dastari and and then to investigate the Time Lords and
• 13:03
  their thing in the state and all of that.
• 13:05
  You know, every story seems to have like a drive to it, whereas
• 13:07
  this is just the Doctor turns up and we have a great adventure
• 13:11
  and there's loads of crazy ideas thrown into the mix and a
• 13:15
  monster and a robot and rebels and all of those sort of
• 13:18
  traditional Doctor Who things thrown in as well.
• 13:22
  The bad side to it is it's also fucking up the cooks, all of it.
• 13:27
  Like no one, no character is actually given much
• 13:31
  consideration beyond their bio, you know, their one line bio.
• 13:37
  And I think the actors do fill in a lot of the gaps and
• 13:40
  sometimes they don't. And that's even funnier.
• 13:45
  And of course, it's directed by Pennant Roberts.
• 13:48
  So language, theatrical and turgid are the order of the day.
• 13:57
  But I mean, he has a go, right? He does have a go, He.
• 14:00
  Does have a go and he got it in on time and under budget I
• 14:03
  imagine. It's kind of light, isn't it?
• 14:05
  It's weird. I can't disagree with it.
• 14:07
  There's there's a for a for A to have no energy to him
• 14:11
  whatsoever. It's sort of got a light energy
• 14:15
  to it. It's a bit like the mysterious
• 14:18
  Planet and a bit like Battlefield, you know what I
• 14:21
  mean? They're like, they ain't great
• 14:23
  stories, but they've got a likeness to them that makes them
• 14:26
  really enjoyable to watch. Yeah, 100%.
• 14:28
  And you know, for all of me saying that it's
• 14:32
  forward-looking, it's got new ideas in there.
• 14:34
  It is a very trad story and and Penny Roberts brings like, you
• 14:38
  know, pretty sort of, as you say, language, pretty bog
• 14:41
  standard, solid directions. Some of the blocking is where
• 14:44
  used to be like an interesting screenshot where actually where
• 14:48
  the characters were all laid out really, really well.
• 14:50
  But a lot of the the block in the in the main.
• 14:53
  Don't shoot like that anymore Paul.
• 14:55
  The picture I sent to him, it had about 9 characters in it and
• 14:59
  various layers across the set. Going back.
• 15:02
  They're all sort of acting in different shows.
• 15:05
  You've got Herbert over here looking thoughtful, Colin Baker
• 15:08
  looking really angry every year, Paul Darrow looking smug as ass.
• 15:12
  I was over there. I don't know what Gene and
• 15:14
  Crowley's doing. She's watching the ceilings or
• 15:17
  something and I'm like, I mean we just don't.
• 15:19
  I mean it's theatre, right? That's theatre that's putting
• 15:22
  everybody on the stage and making sure everyone's seen.
• 15:25
  And that's Pennon that he is an old.
• 15:27
  School, I mean, that was that was a good looking shot.
• 15:30
  But there's plenty where he has them all lined up in a row.
• 15:32
  They're all literally kind of standing in line and it's like,
• 15:36
  it's odd. Yeah, it's really stagey, really
• 15:38
  odd. I'm really poor.
• 15:39
  I'm looking forward to seeing this very cut Warriors of the
• 15:42
  Deep, which I'm assured is like a Tarantino movie now or stuff
• 15:46
  like that. Somehow I can't see it, but I
• 15:49
  look forward to seeing it. Well, look now and hamster eager
• 15:56
  hamster listeners will know that this is the third airing that
• 16:01
  time Lash has had now. Now, I've always said that every
• 16:03
  single conversation about every single story is very different
• 16:07
  when it's with a different participant, and that will
• 16:09
  absolutely be the case. The sort of the MVP here is you,
• 16:13
  Paul. Well, you know, well, I'll try
• 16:15
  and bring some excitement and yeah, yeah, we'll, we'll see
• 16:19
  what we can we can dig up in the in the time lash.
• 16:22
  I mean, I'll die. I've been thinking, Oh my God, I
• 16:25
  get to spend the evening with Colin Baker, Paul Darrow and
• 16:28
  Paul Arthur. I mean, I've just been so
• 16:30
  excited all day. Yeah, along with the beach
• 16:33
  earlier. But what I have done is just to
• 16:36
  add something new on my part rather than me just making the
• 16:40
  same camp jokes, which I will, is that I and looked at the info
• 16:45
  text and pulled out any sort of moments of interest where I was
• 16:50
  like, oh, I didn't know that. And, and rewrites and some bits
• 16:53
  about the actors and just little bits and bobs.
• 16:55
  So I'll, I'll scatter throughout the conversation.
• 16:58
  It's the most prep up there for a hamster in about four years.
• 17:03
  So let's see how it goes, surely?
• 17:05
  Yeah. Oh, absolutely.
• 17:05
  I'm honored. Yeah.
• 17:06
  Yeah. You've done your homework.
• 17:08
  That's really good. Should.
• 17:09
  I come in like the woman on the Blu-ray, you know.
• 17:11
  To select info text from Joe Ford, press Enter now.
• 17:16
  I mean, you're going to have to at the very least explain why,
• 17:18
  why we're referring to Gina and Crowley as an Irish lesbian.
• 17:23
  So we'll win that. Well, I was shocked to learn it,
• 17:25
  if I'm honest. But we will reveal all, don't
• 17:28
  you worry. It's gender swapping going on.
• 17:31
  I mean, oh, some of the lines they took out.
• 17:33
  I mean, I've written them down, some of them or absolute
• 17:35
  bangers. I'll tell you what.
• 17:37
  Should we go in and watch Episode 1?
• 17:39
  How do you feel about it? Yeah, I I definitely, I'm
• 17:42
  afraid. Let's do it.
• 17:43
  You want. To go darts and I'll break
• 17:44
  before we go in. Now let's let's put a little
• 17:46
  time stamp on where we are recording this today because I
• 17:50
  know you know, you try to generate a little bit of
• 17:52
  excitement with your family about the recent discovery of
• 17:56
  two episodes of the Daleks master plant.
• 17:58
  Now I know how sad you are that now you're a Levine AI
• 18:02
  reconstructions are now defunct. But well, I feel about all this.
• 18:08
  Well, I'm excited to see how close he got it, you know, and
• 18:12
  Oh my God, Joe, I mean, this is going to date this episode,
• 18:15
  obviously, because, yeah, the, the announcement, this is Monday
• 18:19
  and the announcement was Friday. But I know you said you had a
• 18:22
  fun story and I'll let you share that about how you found in the
• 18:25
  found out in the middle of the night.
• 18:27
  But I woke up to it Friday morning, hadn't any kind of
• 18:31
  advance notice. And and I don't always do this,
• 18:34
  but I grabbed my phone that morning.
• 18:36
  I had a bit of extra time before I your phone.
• 18:38
  You said you grabbed your phone. I grabbed a phone.
• 18:41
  Yes, second be. Clear at this audience.
• 18:44
  Yeah, I grabbed my phone, turned it on, went to Blue Sky and it
• 18:49
  was the top. Just the first story was the
• 18:53
  announcement from film was fabulous and Oh my God, what a
• 18:57
  way to start your day. And then you grab something else
• 19:00
  after that. Well, I yeah, the wife came
• 19:03
  running back into the room from the bathroom because she was she
• 19:06
  thought something was up because I obviously made some kind of
• 19:10
  noise, I guess. Yeah.
• 19:12
  Just amazing news. Just incredible.
• 19:15
  She didn't share my enthusiasm quite so much.
• 19:18
  You know, try to stress how important this is and and how
• 19:21
  would unusual an event this. Is I've told you to get rid of
• 19:24
  your family before of an hour. Mate, Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 19:28
  Maybe this is the this is the tipping point.
• 19:30
  You put a lot of work into it now, you know, I think it's
• 19:33
  probably I'm going to start again, dear.
• 19:37
  Yeah, I think that's yeah. I mean, it's 20 years.
• 19:40
  It's our 20th anniversary, this coming.
• 19:41
  Yeah, 20 years, yeah, yeah, a long time coming for the other
• 19:45
  20th if you start again now, you know I.
• 19:48
  Don't. Yeah, exactly.
• 19:49
  I'll be an old man by then. Besides which, you know if
• 19:52
  you're with a Doctor Who fan, you're always mad.
• 19:54
  Opinions coming at you all day that utterly contradict your
• 19:58
  own. You know your world through has
• 19:59
  been shattered on a on a minute by minute basis.
• 20:02
  This is this is true. I don't have to worry about what
• 20:04
  she thinks about Time Lash. I assume you didn't make her
• 20:08
  your family watch. This one, oh shame he didn't
• 20:11
  shame. Well no.
• 20:14
  All my story is is I went to bed.
• 20:17
  I've been given a nod by the usual perpetual bullshitter.
• 20:22
  The two episodes were coming back after midnight.
• 20:25
  I messaged hey doke right and said are there 2 episodes coming
• 20:28
  back after midnight and he lied for his teeth to me.
• 20:32
  It signed an NDA lying. Bugger he's.
• 20:34
  So lied for his teeth, he went, no, he goes.
• 20:37
  He says that sounds highly unlikely.
• 20:39
  So I went straight back to Dylan and went, oh, you, oh, someone
• 20:42
  named him. Now all this bullshit that you
• 20:45
  keep spreading for God's sakes. Anyway, we all stayed up till
• 20:48
  12:00. No, no news at all.
• 20:50
  I went, oh Dylan, race strikes again.
• 20:53
  Went to bed at 3:00 in the morning.
• 20:56
  I'm shaken awake, my mother off very dramatically.
• 20:59
  I was in a nice deep sleep somewhere.
• 21:02
  I was there with Paul Darrow and Colin Baker.
• 21:04
  We were dancing through the Time Lash or something, and suddenly
• 21:08
  I was in the real world being shaken awake.
• 21:11
  They found two episodes of Doctor Off.
• 21:12
  Can you leave it on a fucking morning?
• 21:14
  All right? I was quite happy to learn that
• 21:16
  in four hours time I was up for half the night then listening to
• 21:19
  the bloody soundtrack with him. Well, well, yeah, of course.
• 21:22
  You're you're awake now. It's 3:00 in the morning.
• 21:24
  Yeah. Absolutely.
• 21:25
  Yeah, Yeah. Right.
• 21:26
  And then I woke up to a message on my phone from Denham Reese
• 21:30
  saying I shall await your apology, Joe Ford.
• 21:35
  There we go. So I must say, you know, Toby, a
• 21:38
  man of honour, and, you know, doing absolutely what you should
• 21:42
  have been done. Whoever told Dylan, All right,
• 21:44
  they're looking for you, OK? Yeah.
• 21:46
  They are looking for you now. In fact, Toby messaged me that
• 21:50
  night he went out, guys. I wonder how it was you said so.
• 21:53
  He's trying to get the information out of it.
• 21:56
  Dylan will never reveal his sources.
• 21:58
  All right, It's it's mostly Jack Daniels.
• 22:03
  Well, sure. Now we've on the high of getting
• 22:06
  the Daleks master plan back. And yeah, aren't you shocked to
• 22:11
  learn that the First Doctor wasn't exterminated when he
• 22:14
  shouted out the Daleks when they were just a foot away from him?
• 22:19
  But the Hartnell's face, Oh my God, in that shirt, Daleks,
• 22:23
  that's just, oh, mint got. It's rare I've got a face like
• 22:28
  that, you know, but it does happen occasionally.
• 22:30
  I mean, I've got no, no idea how good the rest of the episode is,
• 22:34
  but they, they knew how to pick that clip, didn't they?
• 22:37
  I mean, they knew that people were going to get excited by
• 22:39
  that. Was she impressed by Katarina's
• 22:42
  enormous sponge? That's what we wanted to see all
• 22:50
  these years. I'll tell you what, I'll work in
• 22:51
  the shop. They don't spell sell sponges
• 22:53
  that big anymore. Oh God, she's given him a proper
• 22:56
  bed bath and pick up his nipples as well, I mean.
• 23:01
  I mean, yeah. Toby tells me that shirt is off
• 23:03
  for the whole first episode, you know?
• 23:05
  Oh, my goodness. Well, I mean, if I wasn't
• 23:07
  excited before. Oh.
• 23:10
  My God, well shall we head down the time lash together?
• 23:16
  Yes, let's do it. Absolutely no, Paul.
• 23:19
  Most people depart with a school.
• 23:21
  Scream. Counters it.
• 23:23
  Come on. OK, prepare the time.
• 23:27
  Lash 321. You truly have worked on that
• 23:32
  artistically. You work on the camper pit
• 23:34
  actually. That was, well, brilliant,
• 23:37
  absolutely brilliant. I'll bet you in the panto, just
• 23:40
  like Colin and Nicola, and sort of.
• 23:41
  Rehearsing. Well, like Nicola, I'm refusing
• 23:43
  to do the panto. You can't force me to do it.
• 23:46
  I work hard enough. Joe Ford.
• 23:49
  Can I tell you my first fascinating fact before we even
• 23:51
  go in? Yeah, go for it.
• 23:52
  The. Apparently Pennant Roberts read
• 23:56
  scripts and was absolutely appalled.
• 23:59
  He wanted the character sharper. He wanted less spikiness between
• 24:04
  the doctor and Perry. He wanted the motivations of the
• 24:09
  various characters explained more so even he knew it was a
• 24:12
  dog. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 24:14
  And did he did I read in the info text he wanted less.
• 24:17
  He wanted more sci-fi E type dialogue as well, which I
• 24:20
  thought was. Yeah.
• 24:21
  And this. Is like everyone was talking in
• 24:23
  sort of modern cadence. But I, but I would prefer that.
• 24:27
  I think, I mean, one of the one of the the hallmarks of this era
• 24:32
  is the fact nobody talks like a bleeding human being.
• 24:35
  Like, you know, they're all they're always like even someone
• 24:37
  like Perry's talking in a kind of really are official way, like
• 24:41
  where she's talking here in this scene, this first scene here
• 24:44
  about purposeful travel and it's like, who the fuck talks like
• 24:47
  that? That's what I say to you when we
• 24:49
  do these commentaries. There's not some purposeful
• 24:51
  travel, Paul, you know, and I shall say to you at the end of
• 24:54
  this, and and where would the first lady suggest this is all
• 25:00
  padded? And look, I'm just hanging
• 25:02
  around and don't suggest the eye of Orion, for God's sakes.
• 25:06
  Dr. Now, Oh my God, could we talk about Paris costume?
• 25:11
  Because I did learn something about that that really shocked
• 25:14
  me. Have you got that written down?
• 25:15
  I know, I don't think I I noticed that.
• 25:17
  She was supposed to be wearing the usual fucking sexist leotard
• 25:22
  and shorts in this story, right? But it was supposed to be this
• 25:25
  horrible sickly yellow colour. That's how they describe it.
• 25:29
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the one she wears for the
• 25:32
  slip back photo shoot. So she does end up 1.
• 25:35
  Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I did the.
• 25:36
  Only reason she's wearing this this beautiful costume which
• 25:40
  covers her up is that in Revelation of the Daleks, which
• 25:44
  was the filming was being done at this point, she but he J&T
• 25:50
  said no, she's wearing her shorts.
• 25:52
  She's that's her look she's wearing and she it's fucking the
• 25:55
  middle of winter and it's snowing.
• 25:57
  Yeah, right. And so she goes to J&T.
• 25:59
  Well, you know, I'm going from the filming to the panto in the
• 26:02
  evening, right? I don't have time to change.
• 26:05
  And he thinks to himself, Oh my God, I don't want like a
• 26:08
  frostbitten, you know, actress in my beautiful panto in the
• 26:12
  evening. I don't want her looking
• 26:14
  terrible. Fine, cover her up.
• 26:16
  That's the only reason he let them cover them cover her up was
• 26:20
  because of his fucking panto, which shows you where his
• 26:23
  priorities are at this. Oh, 100% that it was totally the
• 26:27
  priorities were the well, I mean, I suppose from his point
• 26:30
  of view, he's selling the show, but he's selling the show to the
• 26:34
  detriment of the show. You know, he's taking away from
• 26:36
  me like Nicola was moaning the well, not moaning.
• 26:39
  Like we had a legitimate complaint that the hours were
• 26:43
  too much, you know, having to fit a Panther in and and all
• 26:47
  this filming at the same time. So she, I mean that is detailed
• 26:51
  elsewhere on the Blu-ray interview with Matthew Sweet.
• 26:54
  Well, she. Isn't that insightful?
• 26:55
  Wasn't it? She insisted she didn't want to
• 26:57
  do it. Yeah.
• 26:58
  And then he started taking privilege away from her.
• 27:00
  Yeah. Until she caved, basically.
• 27:02
  What was it she wasn't allowed to do the well?
• 27:04
  I mean, she dodged a bullet. She's not.
• 27:05
  Laughable. The fix of the Sontarans.
• 27:08
  Yeah, indeed, yeah, I mean, I'd be I'd be quite happy with that
• 27:11
  dodging that bullet. But yeah, he's you can just
• 27:14
  imagine JNT getting all pissy and like and giving her that
• 27:17
  kind of punishment and that kind of silent treatment not talking
• 27:21
  to her on set, just just making life slightly miserable.
• 27:24
  That seems really you know not wanting to already am being a
• 27:27
  character Assassin's like first Erica go for.
• 27:30
  It Yeah. You can imagine him being a bit
• 27:34
  like funny. You can imagine like if if he
• 27:37
  was pissed off with you, you knew about it definitely well.
• 27:40
  Look at Paul Grimwade. He didn't work again on the show
• 27:43
  exactly, you know, And it just took him out to lunch, took him.
• 27:45
  Right. The lots of stories, right?
• 27:47
  You didn't invite me. Well, I've lost friendships over
• 27:51
  worse, you know. You know.
• 27:54
  I'm going back to Perry's costume though.
• 27:55
  I mean, I must say 12 year old me probably was a bit
• 27:58
  disappointed that this wasn't the continuation of the leotard.
• 28:02
  Oh, really? We'll grow up a little bit,
• 28:04
  don't we? A bit.
• 28:05
  Of a pervert of 12, were you? Oh God.
• 28:07
  When weren't we all? Oh God, I mean that bit there,
• 28:15
  poor Colin. And that was they said on the
• 28:17
  info text that the bit where he goes bad, bad, bad, that was
• 28:21
  his. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 28:25
  But then he did. He makes it all.
• 28:27
  You know, I'd never noticed that before, but that it does become
• 28:29
  a bit of a hallmark of his, his like later on this story, he
• 28:32
  goes men, men, men to to her. But so, you know, I think it's a
• 28:37
  it's a thing. It's an attempt to give him a
• 28:39
  bit of a catch phrase in it. I think they should keep doing
• 28:42
  the bit where he picks Perry up and she's kicking her legs like
• 28:45
  a cartoon character. That was brilliant.
• 28:48
  Now I was learning in the behind the sofas, you know, these
• 28:51
  actors playing the rebels, they're sort of famous actors
• 28:55
  now. They turned out to be pretty
• 28:56
  famous, didn't they? Yeah, yeah.
• 28:58
  Yeah, and they've got time lash on their CV as well.
• 29:01
  Right, yes, bit of the Martin Cloons effect, isn't it?
• 29:05
  Yeah. Ah, now listen.
• 29:06
  Sorry, this is gonna get tedious.
• 29:08
  Now, these facts, but apparently the reason why, you know, this
• 29:13
  sort of got this green effect in here and that sort of smoky
• 29:16
  screen there, it's supposed to be surrounded by swamps.
• 29:20
  Yeah. So you don't don't really get
• 29:22
  that feeling. No, you don't don't get.
• 29:24
  I mean, you can just about in the in the, in the kind of blue
• 29:27
  screen, you can just about make out that it's supposed to be
• 29:29
  war. Maybe it looks like it's moving
• 29:31
  in a little bit. But yeah, you don't really get.
• 29:34
  And but that doesn't pay off because like the very end of the
• 29:37
  story, we find out that he's supposed to end up being the
• 29:40
  this monster, but we don't get a sense of him swimming anywhere.
• 29:43
  We don't see the Moloch swimming anywhere in The Cave, so.
• 29:46
  Maybe maybe you should have been more like Seal, you know, at a
• 29:49
  sort of tail at the end, and then that would have made a bit
• 29:51
  more sense. That was.
• 29:52
  Yeah, just a man in makeup. Oh, boy.
• 29:54
  Look, all the fabulous guest characters were.
• 29:56
  Kendron is there in the background and here is Alvina.
• 30:00
  Oh, boy. But now I, you know, I figured
• 30:02
  up my own back story for Vina. Is that?
• 30:06
  She had a personality transplant.
• 30:08
  Yeah, well, no, I mean in her life she's, she's gone through
• 30:10
  such shocking things, you know, that she's closed off all of her
• 30:13
  emotions. Oh, become a bit of a tragic.
• 30:16
  Oh my God. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 30:18
  It's a tragedy really, you know? And now look what happens to her
• 30:21
  now straight up the time lash. But but she gets to meet her,
• 30:25
  but and I, I, I kind of I'm shipping those two.
• 30:28
  I think they've got a. Bit of a thing going on.
• 30:31
  She wants to get into mid crosses.
• 30:34
  Well, they're, they're obvious, but you what you watch like she
• 30:38
  does seem to kind of latch onto her a little bit.
• 30:40
  And so each time you see a smile when she's talking to him later
• 30:43
  on in the story. So I can't, I don't know, I'm
• 30:45
  kind of seeing it, but. Wasn't just being rude.
• 30:47
  And when I said bed sheets, I mean they all look like they're
• 30:50
  wearing bed sheets, don't they? I quite like the costumes in
• 30:52
  this. I think that I mean, they're a
• 30:54
  step up from like your normal trad sci-fi onesie that you, you
• 30:59
  know, you would often get I've. Noticed.
• 31:01
  It's so funny though. Look how they sit on these cheap
• 31:04
  old IKEA chairs at the back of a room.
• 31:07
  I mean, imagine Star Wars trying to pull this off.
• 31:09
  You know when they've got that great sort of Senate in Star.
• 31:12
  Wars. Oh, Oh my God.
• 31:13
  That's. Different.
• 31:14
  That's what they're going for here.
• 31:15
  Yeah, sure. Doctor, it's a load of IKEA
• 31:19
  chairs in a row. OK, it looks cheap.
• 31:22
  But then this story was commissioned because the script
• 31:26
  looked cheap, right? So they they went for it because
• 31:29
  it's like, oh, yeah, we could do this easily in the studio.
• 31:33
  And the script talks about the fact that the sets that the
• 31:36
  whole of the place is meant to be kind of a bit boring.
• 31:39
  And featureless. And yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 31:42
  Well, may I say those designers hit their brief.
• 31:44
  Exactly. They did exactly what was.
• 31:46
  On they've sort of put in lots of triangles about the place to
• 31:51
  make it still look very science fictiony.
• 31:53
  And make you think of the Time Lash as well.
• 31:55
  It's quite a clever design, you know.
• 31:56
  Oh, I've got to say, I'm getting a bit hot on the collar now.
• 31:59
  I would love to have one of those manacles he's got around
• 32:01
  his neck. Oh, the things I would use that
• 32:04
  for. Good grief.
• 32:06
  I mean, Doctor Who does have this sort of side to it, doesn't
• 32:09
  it? Regards sort of gimpy guards and
• 32:11
  their manacles. I suppose if you want to see
• 32:13
  it's their Joe then. Oh.
• 32:15
  Please. You see Grid for the pit?
• 32:16
  Have you seen that? What they're wearing?
• 32:19
  It's not. They've come from a kid party.
• 32:22
  Come on. It's quite cool costume.
• 32:25
  I'll do like the kind of face thing in the big bowl hats, I
• 32:27
  think. I think it looks good.
• 32:29
  My God, I don't think tinsel has ever looked so terrifying.
• 32:33
  Look at that man giving it some when it turns on.
• 32:35
  Oh my God, it's the time lash. But it is a cool idea though,
• 32:40
  isn't it? Like a corridor in time, you
• 32:42
  just fling in anybody you don't want to.
• 32:44
  Fabulous. Yeah, I think any of the ideas
• 32:46
  are actually, Well, there's a couple.
• 32:48
  I do think what happens to parrot in episode 2.
• 32:50
  But yeah, yeah, most of the ideas are fun though, aren't
• 32:53
  they? Right, right.
• 32:55
  Like I was saying, it's the time time travelling and time travel
• 32:58
  show. And how often do we get that
• 33:00
  answer? Not very much.
• 33:02
  So yeah, it's. Cool.
• 33:04
  I mean, the irony that that passage ends up sort of ejecting
• 33:09
  people right into the lapse of HG Wells.
• 33:12
  I mean, you wouldn't believe it, would you?
• 33:13
  Oh, it's staggering coincidence. I mean, hey, yeah, good.
• 33:18
  I've. Already just noticed how
• 33:19
  colorful that Android is. He's wearing pink.
• 33:21
  He's got a sort of tie dye, hasn't he?
• 33:24
  You see? Yeah.
• 33:25
  You know, I don't notice that before.
• 33:27
  Yellows and pinks and all sorts on his T-shirt.
• 33:29
  I tell you what, that is such a look, isn't it?
• 33:32
  And I'm glad that the music makes you realise and the way
• 33:35
  your movies makes you realise. Yeah.
• 33:37
  I mean, because looking at that for the first time, you'd have
• 33:40
  no idea that that's actually a robot.
• 33:42
  It's it's like a bloke with massive shoulder pads and a blue
• 33:45
  face and yellow hair. Good grief, it's Professor
• 33:48
  Cronotes. What's he doing here?
• 33:50
  Indeed, yeah. Now this is very 1984, isn't it?
• 33:55
  I'm working for the benefit of all that is.
• 33:57
  All right, yes. And there's cameras everywhere.
• 34:00
  Do you notice? Yeah.
• 34:01
  Every time the doctor walks into the room, he spies the camera
• 34:04
  straight away. Yeah, totally.
• 34:06
  It is a big part of the the story in it like that.
• 34:08
  And I think that's why the guards are faceless and you've
• 34:11
  got the Android. It's all telling you that the
• 34:14
  everybody's watching you. We're all kind of you.
• 34:17
  You, we're seeing everything that you do.
• 34:21
  I've got that blue face just look fabulous like Android,
• 34:24
  doesn't he? It's a brilliant design and it's
• 34:27
  like it's so different from like the other androids of this era,
• 34:31
  you know, like we used to that kind of the sleek, you know, the
• 34:35
  leotarded Raston warrior robot type dude.
• 34:39
  And then they got this mad mad idea of a blue faced guy with
• 34:43
  massive shoulder pads. This dialogue, it's practically
• 34:45
  Shakespeare, he goes. You must take care of my
• 34:48
  daughter. He goes well.
• 34:50
  Yes, she is to be my wife. Thank you for informing us of
• 34:56
  everything we needed to know about your relationships.
• 34:59
  And, and the casual sexism here is like we're talking about like
• 35:03
  young women have such ideas and stuff.
• 35:05
  It's like, yeah, it totally throws you out.
• 35:08
  I mean, you meant you meant to take away, I think from this
• 35:11
  scene that they're talking in a deliberate way because they know
• 35:14
  they're being being watched. But you don't get that.
• 35:16
  All you get is like this dialogue shit and and the blogs
• 35:19
  recesses. I think there is some sexism
• 35:23
  within the Eric Saywood era, but I actually think Time Lash does
• 35:28
  pretty well. Not Perry.
• 35:30
  Perry does terribly and it's and is a damsel in distress.
• 35:34
  But Vino's the one who grabs the thing, jumps down the Time Lash
• 35:37
  makes friends with her, but and in all those scenes, it ain't
• 35:40
  Vino we're taking the piss out of it's her.
• 35:42
  But the whole time he he's the useless one and he got.
• 35:47
  What's the face? Cats?
• 35:48
  Is it she's? Great.
• 35:49
  The rebel leader. I mean, she's a Baroness or
• 35:51
  something now. Wonderful.
• 35:53
  Right, Right. She's, yeah.
• 35:54
  Cut from the same kind of lala wood cloth.
• 35:56
  And she. Yeah, she's very much that type.
• 35:58
  Colin says on the behind the sofa, right.
• 36:00
  Was that he? He knew she was meant for power
• 36:03
  in the future because she sat there in the rehearsal room sort
• 36:06
  of in a regal pose, not really engaging with everybody and
• 36:09
  like, oh, you need me to come and do some acting now, OK, I'm
• 36:13
  coming. She knew.
• 36:16
  Oh, this fella, Mick Ross, Jesus Christ, he has got the most
• 36:20
  delicious hairy chest I've ever seen.
• 36:23
  I don't know. I mean, I do quite well in this
• 36:25
  story. You know, he's pretty handsome.
• 36:26
  Well, I mean all the as you say, just annoyingly, all the women
• 36:29
  are very covered up. So I mean you can enjoy micros,
• 36:32
  but it's. Unusual, you say?
• 36:34
  The men's chess, isn't it? What's a boy image?
• 36:36
  Dude? You've got the rest of fucking
• 36:38
  classic home, all right? Women are never wearing clothes.
• 36:41
  Let me up this moment. OK, fair enough.
• 36:46
  Oh, this bit in a minute where it pops a bit off the console
• 36:49
  and realises. I mean, he's a real pro, this
• 36:54
  guy, isn't he? He really covers up for that.
• 36:56
  I wouldn't have not noticed that had he not been kind of
• 36:59
  something that's pulling out in the info text.
• 37:01
  But what I will say about this scene is 1, I think it's really
• 37:04
  well lit. Like it's there's some Moody
• 37:07
  light in here. I did just see a boom like,
• 37:10
  sorry pendant, I just can't have to point out your mistakes.
• 37:13
  I think you cannot undervalue these axes because this dialogue
• 37:18
  is so functional and it is so informative.
• 37:22
  It's full of exposition about. His wife.
• 37:24
  And the hospital and all of that.
• 37:26
  Especially the guy playing Mick Ross, he gives it some emotional
• 37:29
  Willy. I'm far more invested in that
• 37:32
  character because of how he's delivering those lines.
• 37:34
  Right. Yeah, they did do a good job.
• 37:36
  We talked over it, but there's that the scene just just a
• 37:39
  little a little while ago where Vena and Mccross are literally
• 37:42
  whispering the exposition to each other, they're like, and
• 37:46
  yeah, it is a lot of that. The best one is the fella, the
• 37:51
  Kendron. All 500 of us are going to die.
• 37:55
  Well, thank you for letting us know how many people are in the
• 37:57
  city. That's very useful.
• 37:59
  I'll, I'll always, I'll always enjoy stuff like that.
• 38:01
  I, I, you know, I don't need the dialogue to be, to sparkle it.
• 38:06
  You know, it can be functional. It does.
• 38:07
  Help. It will it.
• 38:09
  Oh wait. And and and undeniably does.
• 38:11
  Imagine if Carnival of Monsters was written by Glenn McCoy.
• 38:17
  Did you say those sort of colourful crystals there that
• 38:20
  are powering the whole city? Yeah.
• 38:21
  It's about to divert the the power from.
• 38:24
  Yeah, I went to a gay club once, you know, look just like that.
• 38:28
  Yeah. And yeah.
• 38:30
  Did they have the triangles on the wall as well?
• 38:33
  Usually there was prior triangles about the place.
• 38:35
  Yes, I mean. Would that make sense?
• 38:36
  The gayest thing in this story by a country mile is that flag
• 38:40
  coloured Pride flag coloured Time Lash.
• 38:43
  You know if you go to Pride now, this is a bit of an education
• 38:46
  for you. They do like the parade of the
• 38:48
  assholes, right Where there's about 5 or 6 men in a in a row
• 38:53
  with their asses in the air and the sort of colours of the pride
• 38:56
  flag sort of coming out of their bum holes.
• 38:59
  Yeah, it looks really like the time lash.
• 39:03
  I'm making it up. I'm just trying.
• 39:05
  I'm just trying to shock you. I'm.
• 39:07
  Sorry. There is no such figures.
• 39:10
  Afraid of the bum holes? All right, anyone going to pride
• 39:12
  expecting that you're going to be?
• 39:14
  I was shocked that the council would allow it, but you know, I
• 39:16
  was willing to go with that joke.
• 39:18
  Yeah, this is a total sidebar and totally away from Time Lash.
• 39:21
  But the very, very first time I went abroad was with a group of
• 39:24
  Doctor Who fans and we went to Amsterdam to to check out the
• 39:29
  Arc of Infinity locations and stuff.
• 39:32
  Yeah, but we managed to time our arrival with some.
• 39:36
  I guess it must have been a pride event over the over the
• 39:39
  weekend and I was a very young lad, very, very unwieldy, you
• 39:42
  know, I hadn't travelled or done anything, had a quite shallow
• 39:46
  life. And I tell you my eyes were
• 39:47
  opened that weekend. Joe, let me.
• 39:49
  Tell you. Oh, really?
• 39:50
  Yeah. Did you go down that?
• 39:52
  There's a sort of very thin alleyway which has got windows
• 39:55
  on the side. I didn't realize till I was
• 39:58
  halfway down the alley. I'll turn right.
• 39:59
  Oh, my God, There's women off and so.
• 40:02
  Damn this alleyway. Try to entice me in.
• 40:05
  Oh, Paul. Quick, take hold of these
• 40:07
  seatbelts. Hang on.
• 40:09
  Oh yeah, yes, yeah, used belts before.
• 40:13
  What the hell is I mean Jesus, I was watching this thinking what
• 40:16
  did I smoke earlier for God sakes.
• 40:20
  It's fun though. It's fun.
• 40:22
  It's fun. Well, I will say that was like,
• 40:24
  come on, Eric, can we not have the Doctor in the story before
• 40:27
  like 25 minutes in? Like we got a Fanny around with
• 40:30
  with belts and the TARDIS and stuff.
• 40:32
  Well, I think that's the big problem with this season is,
• 40:36
  well, no, it's not so much that the Doctor doesn't turn up till
• 40:39
  late is that they feel like because they've got the extra
• 40:42
  time that they want to establish the setting, the guest
• 40:45
  characters and all of that before he comes along.
• 40:48
  Normally when it's 25 minutes, you just have to get in there.
• 40:51
  You can't have a 25 minute episode where he comes in at 25
• 40:55
  minutes in. So usually you arrive straight
• 40:58
  away. So I feel like they've got the
• 40:59
  luxury of doing more world building, the irony being that
• 41:03
  the world building this year is generally terrible.
• 41:06
  Everybody really bad, but we see.
• 41:08
  Revelation, my God, I think that's great world building.
• 41:11
  Oh God, you look pale, Paul. Oh yeah, perhaps, but I have 100
• 41:17
  times your intellect. Oh, that's very true, yes.
• 41:20
  I mean, absolutely, it's Vena's lovely father now going to turn
• 41:24
  into a skeleton and fall to his knees a.
• 41:26
  Very plastic skeleton. Yeah, yeah.
• 41:29
  It's very funny. Oh my God, he's brilliant.
• 41:33
  He is. This is the fact that they
• 41:35
  thought that this would pass off.
• 41:37
  Just incredible. And they're like, yeah, yeah,
• 41:39
  great. Deliriously bad, but very funny.
• 41:42
  Oh. Highly enjoyable.
• 41:45
  Oh, no, I look, the Android man, he's up.
• 41:47
  Here he goes. Oh, that's a great line, though.
• 41:50
  Time for another election. Yeah.
• 41:53
  Terrific. Oh, dear.
• 41:56
  Oh, dear. Do you know?
• 41:57
  I mean, it's the only time I can give you this fascinating fact.
• 42:00
  But the fellow who plays Maelyn Rennis, who just turned into a
• 42:03
  plastic skeleton, he appeared in the movie.
• 42:07
  Can you keep it up for a week? Question mark.
• 42:11
  Oh, OK. What that movie is about, But it
• 42:14
  promises an awful lot. It really does, doesn't it?
• 42:17
  I mean, I'm guessing this is a 70s comedy.
• 42:22
  Not when I'm familiar with and I thought I'd seen most of those.
• 42:25
  Oh my God, did you see that enormous leaf that Vena just
• 42:28
  dropped there? It's on the floor now.
• 42:32
  Yeah, no, I don't think I did notice.
• 42:34
  She had a massive leaf in Iran. I think it was supposed to be a
• 42:38
  fan and she just dropped it on the floor.
• 42:41
  Wow, where's the Infotex? I've never noticed that before.
• 42:46
  Ah, now I would like to say that there was more tension between
• 42:49
  Mick Ross and Tekka because apparently the line was omitted
• 42:53
  where he goes. You thought I would never make
• 42:55
  mailing in a million light years.
• 42:59
  So apparently he's been sort of taking a piss out of Tekka in
• 43:01
  the past, saying that he never mounts to anything, you know?
• 43:04
  That's a delicious line. They should have kept that and
• 43:06
  you could. I can imagine Darrow enjoying
• 43:08
  that. There's some.
• 43:08
  Great ones. You had a bit in a minute.
• 43:10
  Where V enough comes whooshing through the console room.
• 43:13
  Apparently they took out the line.
• 43:15
  She could only manage a flying visit.
• 43:17
  I want to keep that one in as well.
• 43:23
  Oh, look at Dara. I mean, he's having the best
• 43:25
  time in this, isn't he? Get rid of the rebel.
• 43:29
  Stop her. Oh my God.
• 43:33
  Oh, down you go, Vena. Oh.
• 43:35
  The clutching the neck there. Oh my God, look at.
• 43:39
  These two on there with their belts, what's going on?
• 43:41
  She was. Head first, straight down that
• 43:43
  time blash, wouldn't she? Oh yeah?
• 43:46
  Well, you know, she's committed to the bit she.
• 43:48
  Dives straight. In I think she's better, does
• 43:51
  that better than some of the fellas doing it.
• 43:52
  So yeah. I wish they use Oh, there she
• 43:56
  goes, wee I. Love that.
• 44:00
  Yeah, actually that's come quite simply, isn't it in studio that
• 44:04
  effect because I can bring her in via another monitor.
• 44:07
  So yeah, it's quite. It works.
• 44:09
  I mean, it works brilliantly and and it's kind of like a ghost.
• 44:12
  I mean, how often do we have ghost stories in in who we get a
• 44:15
  little flavour of that when we when we get Herbert doing the
• 44:18
  kind of Ouija board, it's only there for a little bit.
• 44:21
  But I mean, that's, again, it's another little side of this
• 44:24
  story that you know. It's at the same chest that the
• 44:27
  Doctor had out in the Abominable Snowman.
• 44:29
  You know where he had the the Holy Ganter in it.
• 44:31
  Well, you think I would know this?
• 44:33
  I don't know that I. Mean I very much do.
• 44:36
  Why is this bizarre special effect when they go through the
• 44:39
  time lash like wibbly wobbly effects?
• 44:43
  But this is cool again, this again, this is something for
• 44:45
  doing something this story, say visions of the future.
• 44:49
  You got the try an attempt to try and get the TARDIS coming
• 44:52
  out the time lashing into the into the set, right.
• 44:55
  I don't really achieve it, but but that's what they're kind of
• 44:58
  aiming for and that's the kind of thing you where you see the
• 45:02
  the TARDIS actually moving physically in in space.
• 45:06
  Yeah, they're being ambitious, aren't they?
• 45:08
  They're not just resting on their laurels.
• 45:11
  Yeah, I do wonder if it's because Glenn McCoy probably
• 45:14
  wasn't that familiar with Doctor Who, so he's doing things that
• 45:17
  he expects the show to do, but it doesn't normally do.
• 45:20
  You can sort of see it spinning out in the new series, can't
• 45:22
  you? Coming towards.
• 45:24
  You and stuff against the wall. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 45:27
  But of course, you have to go through these in order to get to
• 45:30
  where we get to. Yeah, exactly.
• 45:32
  But I mean. It's a great idea.
• 45:34
  And I think, yeah, like in past, if they were doing the past,
• 45:38
  they might have had it on CSO kind of growing small or like a
• 45:42
  Pyramids of Mars kind of thing coming through the gate.
• 45:45
  But I think this is doing it really, really well.
• 45:48
  It works perfectly fine, yeah. I mean, I just I don't knock
• 45:51
  Classico for special effects. I couldn't pull off what they do
• 45:54
  with the money they add. All you'd get is a paper plate
• 45:57
  on a string from me for that budget.
• 45:59
  Oh totally. And when we get?
• 46:01
  To the time lash in the in the next episode.
• 46:03
  I mean, no, you know, we talked about it last night the the
• 46:07
  updated time lash effects. I think they're absolutely
• 46:09
  shite. Well, I mean, I feel as if
• 46:12
  they're just the. Right thing.
• 46:13
  By just blurring them up. Exactly.
• 46:15
  You can't see any of it. Bravo, you know, But I get it.
• 46:19
  It's taking away all the detail, though.
• 46:21
  You don't see any of it. Yeah.
• 46:23
  Yeah, can't see any like, fabulous tinsel.
• 46:25
  Flying about, the hexagon sticking out, you know?
• 46:27
  Yeah, totally. And this is what I want from
• 46:29
  Time Rash. Don't you love the idea of this?
• 46:31
  Great battle between J&T and Paul Darrow.
• 46:34
  Darrow wanting to play Teca like Richard the Third with a hump
• 46:38
  and everything and JNT coming down on the set and going, you
• 46:42
  are taking the piss, aren't you? Out of my show.
• 46:45
  And he's like, no, I think he's yeah.
• 46:47
  He actually read the script and realised that Teca is a slimy
• 46:50
  bastard. Yeah, that would.
• 46:53
  It's that it's the sort of DS Nykai win thing of everything's
• 46:56
  done with a smile. Even when he's threatening you,
• 46:59
  you know, that sort of passive aggressive.
• 47:01
  He's he's the Karen of Karl Fell, you know?
• 47:04
  Well, I know you. I know you.
• 47:04
  Think of the 80s. You think of the the Saywood era
• 47:07
  has been quite camp, but I think it is one of the the things
• 47:10
  that's missing from this era is somebody chewing the scenery
• 47:14
  like this, you know? And so the fact that Darrow's,
• 47:17
  you know, trying to get away with it, I think it's just that
• 47:20
  he's one of those highlights of the story.
• 47:22
  It really is. Dean Hollingsworth, you deserve.
• 47:24
  An extra pay. He was holding those cups, so
• 47:26
  still we could have been a statue.
• 47:29
  He's good. Value as well.
• 47:30
  I love every choice he makes like that.
• 47:32
  The voice is just just bizarre. You know, there's sort of the
• 47:36
  rumour about. The 2000 and one thing you know
• 47:38
  yes indeed you was I hear it every time Oh my God it's that
• 47:46
  so far it's the sofa it is the. Sofa.
• 47:50
  Yeah, but it's been painted green.
• 47:52
  Well, I mean, I don't know how. Many of the BBC had, but they've
• 47:55
  obviously got more than more than one year or it's kind of
• 47:58
  changed the funny colour since, since there's Blake seven days.
• 48:00
  I don't know, but you see that light behind them.
• 48:04
  There, Yeah, it looks like the sort of like sticks that you get
• 48:07
  a rage, isn't it? With a couple of light bulbs on
• 48:09
  the top. Very much so.
• 48:10
  Yeah. Oh God, do you know the?
• 48:13
  Amount of times I've had an acidic juice squirted in my
• 48:16
  face. I understand Perry's fear right
• 48:19
  now. Well, I mean, yeah.
• 48:23
  You've been in so many jungles like.
• 48:25
  Me like. No.
• 48:27
  Oh, I wouldn't read. Borneo, man, it's dangerous
• 48:30
  place. Good grief.
• 48:36
  Oh, boy. Oh, boy.
• 48:38
  When's the Bandra ambassador going to turn up?
• 48:40
  Come on. It's my favorite.
• 48:42
  Here he is. Here he is.
• 48:45
  Oh, it seems we are at war. Oh, this is what I've come for
• 48:49
  tonight is. The band rule impersonation.
• 48:51
  Oh yes? Well, he's after.
• 48:53
  His grain isn't he? You know you cannot withhold our
• 48:56
  grain now did. You know he was supposed to.
• 49:01
  Be a smartly dressed human crocodile.
• 49:03
  It was envisaged as a person. Yes, I read that in the script.
• 49:07
  That he's meant to be sharply dressed, which sounds kind of
• 49:10
  cool. How the hell do you make that
• 49:12
  sharply? Dressed.
• 49:13
  Look at the state of him. Well, you know what I will
• 49:15
  defend. I will defend the band rule.
• 49:17
  I think it's really good. I love the fact that the other
• 49:21
  thing in the info text is the name was going to be Girdle,
• 49:23
  which I think is hysterical. Girdle.
• 49:25
  Girdle. Boy.
• 49:27
  Boy. But I will defend it.
• 49:29
  I think it's I think it's really good and I think it's again
• 49:32
  doing something like a new a new approach to to to doing a
• 49:39
  monster. I mean, it's it seems like
• 49:42
  something that that you should have been doing all the time
• 49:44
  doing puppets seems like AI love puppets as well.
• 49:47
  Yeah. And I have no.
• 49:48
  Objection that I've been about the actual the head looks quite
• 49:50
  good. It's that fucking voice that's
• 49:53
  come from CBBC. It sort of sounds very
• 49:57
  apologetic about everything. I'm so sorry.
• 50:01
  I've already fired my missile, I can't stop it from exploding
• 50:06
  now. Oh my God.
• 50:12
  Oh God, we. Forgot to put her what's it
• 50:16
  called? Self destruct in it.
• 50:18
  So please take her. Send all my apologies to your
• 50:22
  people tell them their lives were not in vain.
• 50:26
  We'll do grain deals with the survivors.
• 50:32
  Oh, Joe, that's. That's genius.
• 50:36
  Big Finish. I'm ready all.
• 50:37
  Right. Have they done the band rules?
• 50:40
  If they haven't, they're missing out.
• 50:41
  They really ought to. Yeah, yes.
• 50:43
  Saison at the. Falchon rocks, Paul.
• 50:46
  Yeah, but yes indeed. Yeah, in about I was reading
• 50:51
  about time, the entry on this. Apparently people thought it was
• 50:54
  felching rocks. Felching, that's what that's.
• 50:57
  What people heard. Felching well.
• 51:01
  You. Tell me, Joe, I had.
• 51:02
  I didn't look it up. Yeah, I didn't know I had to
• 51:05
  look it up. Well, maybe you'd care to loose.
• 51:08
  Dave, for the hamster audience, well, you know, if you were at
• 51:11
  the. The gay pride and they weren't
• 51:13
  doing the assholes of the flag or whatever you thought that's
• 51:16
  right then you. Might.
• 51:19
  You might be a bit bulging to finish the show, potentially.
• 51:24
  Well, yes, yeah. It's sort of like imagine what
• 51:27
  those plants do over the pride flag parade and then ingesting
• 51:34
  it. That's all you need to know.
• 51:35
  Let's move on quickly. At least he's not.
• 51:38
  Going to be happy I got into trouble after the water sports
• 51:40
  thing in the On the Tear of the Old Ones can come through.
• 51:42
  That's spreading rumours about Caroline.
• 51:44
  Ford like that God, you know. Although you know, she did say
• 51:49
  she nearly pitched her knickers when watching Jurassic Park with
• 51:52
  her nephew. You know, it wasn't Sophie
• 51:54
  Aldrin's podcast. I was so scared.
• 51:57
  I needed to go. To the loo every six minutes.
• 52:00
  We were on the money then, yeah. We you're here first, folks.
• 52:03
  Well, yeah, there's difference between needing a piece.
• 52:05
  And wanting to be covered in piece.
• 52:06
  So yeah, I guess. We care.
• 52:11
  Oh boy, Oh boy. You know those terrible cheap
• 52:15
  sets that Perry ends up in a minute of tunnel sets?
• 52:18
  Yeah, they look OK. Yeah.
• 52:20
  Cheap. Did you know that they were not
• 52:21
  designed for time? Lash Oh, I did read that they
• 52:24
  were just. Taken out of stock.
• 52:26
  Yeah, yeah, but you know it. But that's what game, why I
• 52:30
  imagine this script appealed to the production team is like,
• 52:33
  yeah, we could, you know, we've got box standard sci-fi
• 52:37
  corridors. We've got, you know, got an
• 52:39
  easily achievable cave. You know, we've only got limited
• 52:43
  monsters you don't have to have on screen a huge amount.
• 52:46
  So yeah, I can see what totally why you would do this as a chi
• 52:49
  limited monsters. You wait till we see that.
• 52:51
  Morlocks at the end of the episode.
• 52:53
  Well, again, is there quite a bit.
• 52:56
  What the hell does he want to do to Perry with that manacle?
• 52:59
  Yeah, Nicola. Run.
• 53:01
  Get out. He's like, oh, here we go again.
• 53:04
  Oh. She's going to use the sticky.
• 53:05
  Acidic juice on him, in your face.
• 53:08
  There you go. In another Saywood story you'd
• 53:10
  see. Him RIP his his helmet off and
• 53:12
  he'd be all kind of like gory underneath.
• 53:14
  So like, you know, all the music here.
• 53:17
  Done, done. Done, done, done.
• 53:21
  And he sort of turns the corner very staccato, doesn't he?
• 53:24
  Like a robot, but I love the fact you can go through a.
• 53:26
  Door in in your clean space corridor, go for a door and then
• 53:30
  suddenly you're in the in The Cave set.
• 53:32
  But that seems like a a weird, but oh, here's the access to the
• 53:35
  caves just through this door that yeah, that would never.
• 53:39
  Happen on any planet in any existence.
• 53:42
  But it is very refreshing to have a different aesthetic after
• 53:45
  all of these matte sets. It's nice for to be somewhere a
• 53:48
  bit more atmospheric. Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally.
• 53:50
  Because you do. Get that kind of juxtaposition
• 53:52
  of the of the dark caves of borads kind of shadowy officey
• 53:56
  area and and the kind of white car fell corridors.
• 54:00
  So yeah, what's all of that sort of line?
• 54:02
  Is that with the? Strata in the rocks, everything
• 54:05
  that they've mined out. Isn't there a OH?
• 54:08
  Did I read that somewhere there was meant to be something?
• 54:11
  I think I'm OK. Maybe I'm maybe she goes what?
• 54:14
  A beautiful fragrance. I've not smelled anything like
• 54:17
  this since I was at the Debenhams perfume counter.
• 54:21
  Oh, Berry. Come on, it's right.
• 54:22
  In front of you, for fuck's sake.
• 54:25
  It's shaped like a huge penis. With Dave, well, you know,
• 54:29
  Doctor Who's. Got a form for people shake
• 54:31
  monsters and in the caves isn't it?
• 54:33
  So yes, I mean that one is very special.
• 54:36
  I mean, I feel like there's something Freudian going on
• 54:39
  here, right When she's manacled up and that great penis is
• 54:42
  attacking her. Is there something?
• 54:43
  Yeah. Is there, like, a visual
• 54:44
  metaphor going on here? They could well be, I feel like.
• 54:48
  The Morlocks could be. Eric Saywood.
• 54:51
  You know, I mean, I think Eric's probably.
• 54:54
  A little bit more dribbly than the Morlocks, but.
• 54:59
  Oh. Here we go, here we go but the.
• 55:02
  Moment. The man of the hour.
• 55:05
  Now can I tell you some facts? Immediately.
• 55:07
  You ready? Yeah.
• 55:08
  Go. Herbert was 18 in 1885.
• 55:10
  Now, does David Chandler there look 18?
• 55:14
  No. Well, no, but that's common.
• 55:16
  For like, you know, like dramas. Isn't it like they always have
• 55:20
  like 35 year olds playing school kids Now it's more specifically.
• 55:24
  He was an atheist. He never dabbled in spiritualism
• 55:28
  and he was skeptical with supernatural phenomena.
• 55:31
  So to have that introduction shows you the level of research
• 55:35
  that Glenn Glenn which he. Did is because he got his A Big
• 55:38
  book of HG Wells facts out of the library and yeah, got it
• 55:42
  all. But who cares, because the
• 55:43
  comedy is. So great, you know he's doing a
• 55:47
  bloody Ouija board. It spells out Vena and then she
• 55:51
  appears right in front of him. Good God, yes, we've just had
• 55:55
  the amazing. Appearing Android on fire right?
• 55:59
  Does not look good. I don't get to sell out.
• 56:01
  Very often in this it does. I love that line from the.
• 56:04
  Borad saying calling Perry a plucky creature who who like he
• 56:08
  says like she can stand up for herself.
• 56:10
  She literally just stood there and screamed at the Morlocks.
• 56:13
  All she does in this story. All.
• 56:14
  She does. Yeah.
• 56:16
  Even when Herbert rescues her later, right.
• 56:18
  She stands there screaming and he has to drag her away.
• 56:20
  She's so stupid. Poor Nicola.
• 56:23
  I mean, she's such a great actress.
• 56:25
  Why are we not giving her better feats to do?
• 56:27
  Yeah, I think there are. It can be.
• 56:29
  There can't be many people who've had a worse ride during
• 56:32
  the the TV years of of Doctor Who, I don't think, but I think
• 56:35
  she delivers it. Though that's the thing, is that
• 56:38
  she goes through hell, Perry. But Nicola's so convincing.
• 56:41
  I think that's why it's as shocking as it is, because I
• 56:45
  think if it was a bad actor, we'd just go, oh, well, But
• 56:49
  because Nicholas, you know all that stuff in Andrews, aren't
• 56:52
  you? Where she's been dragged around
• 56:55
  by Sharon? Yeah.
• 56:56
  Leered over and stuff in two Doctors with shock eye and
• 56:59
  stuff. Like she plays it, the fear so
• 57:02
  well. Yeah.
• 57:03
  Kate Caves is is her. Absolute masterpiece.
• 57:05
  I think I do. I genuinely think she's
• 57:07
  incredible in that. I don't know.
• 57:10
  I think. I do think.
• 57:12
  Her two in trial of a Time Lord, she's pretty great in those two
• 57:15
  as well. Oh, yeah.
• 57:16
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Mindwarp.
• 57:18
  Yeah, She's, she's always, she's playing, Yeah.
• 57:23
  She's very. Good, she's the only person that
• 57:25
  can get some room. In that scene, honestly, yeah,
• 57:27
  that's my shouting at him a lot. I don't know if she's
• 57:30
  necessarily. Brilliant in this story, and I
• 57:32
  think a lot of it is that that back story of fly, the panto
• 57:36
  business and and all of that shit that was going on.
• 57:39
  So, you know, I don't know if she necessarily gives it
• 57:41
  everything here, but I remember Colin.
• 57:44
  In the 6th Doctor Handbook, there was an interview about
• 57:47
  Time Lash. He was asked about every story
• 57:50
  and he said because they were doing the panto at the same
• 57:52
  time, because he didn't like the script, he didn't think he gave
• 57:56
  100%. I actually think he's great in
• 57:59
  this. I, I, I I don't think you can
• 58:02
  fault him. You can fault the material as
• 58:04
  much as you want, but man, oh, man.
• 58:06
  I mean, he's got that hero pose down pad.
• 58:09
  Oh yeah. Yeah.
• 58:10
  But yeah. Again, you sent me that that
• 58:12
  screen grab. Oh boy.
• 58:15
  Yeah, in the in the great. Action scene Yeah, he's really
• 58:17
  good. I also think as well he's I
• 58:19
  think I said he he's got a bit of a more of a lightness of
• 58:23
  touching this one. You know, you said that pendant
• 58:25
  Roberts, one of them to tone down the abrasiveness and stuff.
• 58:28
  And I think it, it really does show it.
• 58:29
  It works. Yeah, well, the bit.
• 58:31
  In a minute where he comes in here was attacking him with the
• 58:34
  Bible and everything, and he's just sidestepping out of the
• 58:36
  war. It's very funny.
• 58:40
  Oh, it's your. Ship Look, Wagner and Herbert,
• 58:43
  Yeah, he's gonna. Be he's obviously keen.
• 58:45
  Look at him, I know he feels well, lucky he would.
• 58:48
  Just come up to the Highlands to get away from everything and
• 58:50
  this beautiful lady appeared in front.
• 58:52
  Well, exactly. It's every, every boy.
• 58:53
  'S dream. And that's, that's why you go to
• 58:55
  the Ouija board, you know? Yeah.
• 58:58
  Oh, bless her, She's she's really trying to not a MO, isn't
• 59:01
  she? She's trying, Herbert.
• 59:03
  They must not get. This.
• 59:07
  It's weird because nobody else is doing.
• 59:09
  It no, I don't know why she's she seems quite, quite petrified
• 59:15
  all the time, so that. Bit we saw a moment ago, you
• 59:19
  know, when the the girls came into The Cave and started
• 59:23
  shooting at the rebels tenant. Roberts wanted to change the
• 59:25
  cliffhanger, didn't it? He wanted that to be the
• 59:27
  cliffhanger. Yeah.
• 59:28
  Yeah. I, I Yeah.
• 59:30
  Because Part 2 is so underwritten, and I kind of
• 59:33
  think that might have helped, you know, I mean, we'll get to
• 59:36
  Part 2. There's some great, great stuff
• 59:38
  in there. J&T again when he didn't.
• 59:40
  He said he didn't. J&T didn't want to lose the
• 59:42
  Doctor cliffhanger, right? Yeah.
• 59:45
  And that's the. Trademark of this era, isn't it?
• 59:47
  Like the, the, the Colin cliffhanger.
• 59:50
  Yeah, but I've been Colin cliffhanger.
• 59:52
  Colin, Cliff, you. Mean the nostril shot, I assume.
• 59:54
  Yeah. Oh, wait, let's watch the comedy
• 59:57
  now. Ah, hello.
• 59:58
  For you know, I've come to take you back.
• 1:00:01
  Was that why not was that you in the time lash.
• 1:00:06
  I love them. It's like.
• 1:00:07
  Back from where you came. Spirits of the glass.
• 1:00:09
  Look at him with that Bible. Oh.
• 1:00:11
  Please. So funny.
• 1:00:14
  Oh, no. Oh, sorry, I preempted.
• 1:00:15
  It hasn't happened yet with the guards coming in.
• 1:00:17
  I'm so sorry. Oh, no, no.
• 1:00:19
  Yeah, but yeah. Well.
• 1:00:21
  We were getting there when we were getting to that point.
• 1:00:23
  Yeah, I do like the. Fact as well.
• 1:00:25
  Another little thing I gleamed was, you know, he's got that
• 1:00:28
  little notebook that wasn't in the script.
• 1:00:31
  You know he's. Taking notes throughout the
• 1:00:32
  story that they worked it out in rehearsal that no, it would make
• 1:00:37
  sense that if he's writing down notes and he can use it later to
• 1:00:40
  write his books right, right. It's just a shame, you know, to
• 1:00:42
  know that all those fabulous HG Wells books were all inspired by
• 1:00:46
  Time Lash Oh dear, oh, dear, Oh dear.
• 1:00:52
  Oh, what a brilliant idea. And it's.
• 1:00:53
  So weird that Doctor Who so really did it back in the day
• 1:00:58
  that you would have. And.
• 1:01:00
  And you know what, the brilliant choice, you know, absolutely.
• 1:01:03
  Having HG Wells, the father of time travel fiction, be a guest
• 1:01:08
  star on your time travel show. Yeah.
• 1:01:11
  That mean that makes perfect sense.
• 1:01:13
  And it's the kind of idea that only somebody who's not familiar
• 1:01:16
  with Doctor Who would come up with.
• 1:01:17
  I think you know. I think you're right, you know?
• 1:01:20
  I think there might be an area down Brighton front called
• 1:01:23
  Felcham Rocks. There's.
• 1:01:27
  Been a few saisons there as. Well, actually I like, I like
• 1:01:30
  the fact he's got a graph sort of accent, isn't he that season?
• 1:01:34
  I don't know. It's where he feels more.
• 1:01:36
  He feels like. A standard, say a bride.
• 1:01:39
  Oh, I don't know. Good question.
• 1:01:41
  But he feels like that kind of macho, he say would type
• 1:01:44
  character he could he could have been one of the gang in the
• 1:01:46
  attack of the Cyberman or something like that, you know?
• 1:01:48
  So yeah, props to Penance for. All for often gender swapping
• 1:01:54
  roles and giving women more opportunities.
• 1:01:56
  Now I think cats was always supposed to be a woman wasn't
• 1:01:59
  it? So I don't know who he's
• 1:02:01
  switched around here. Or was she not?
• 1:02:04
  No I I might be wrong but. I maybe she's the 1 then.
• 1:02:07
  This one, but Vena was obviously.
• 1:02:09
  Meant to be female but I think Cats was the swapped character.
• 1:02:12
  Yeah, I can't imagine. Yeah, Mick Ross wasn't.
• 1:02:14
  Going to say yes, he was going to be my husband.
• 1:02:16
  You know that wouldn't work with.
• 1:02:18
  It would have been very. Progressive back in the day,
• 1:02:20
  yeah. Yeah.
• 1:02:23
  Did you know that? Veena is named after Weena from
• 1:02:26
  The Time Machine. Indeed.
• 1:02:28
  Yeah, one of the. Gentle dwellers.
• 1:02:30
  Above ground, who oppressed by their subterranean neighbors,
• 1:02:33
  the Morlocks? Oh, are you doing you?
• 1:02:36
  Doing The Time Machine for the book club.
• 1:02:38
  Oh no, I probably should. Should.
• 1:02:41
  Not but. You know, it's one of those
• 1:02:43
  things, I've just, I'm not a big reader of science fiction, but,
• 1:02:47
  you know, you think that's the sort of book I would have read,
• 1:02:49
  but I've never picked up a single one of his books, know
• 1:02:52
  nothing about them whatsoever other than the Morlocks.
• 1:02:54
  I know that's an obvious reference.
• 1:02:56
  It's a great name, isn't it? That's a quite steal.
• 1:02:59
  For this and actually I think. The things that they put in this
• 1:03:02
  the Invisible Man with the Contron crystal, What's the
• 1:03:08
  Borat? Supposed to be from the.
• 1:03:09
  Time Machine is there 1/2. Man half beast in the.
• 1:03:14
  Time Machine? I'm not sure anyway, but the
• 1:03:17
  steels are are pretty good. You know that bit with Colin
• 1:03:20
  there, right? He was so charming with Vina.
• 1:03:22
  Did you notice? Really lovely and funny.
• 1:03:27
  So rude to her, but at the same time but they're so good.
• 1:03:31
  Together. That's why everybody works.
• 1:03:33
  I've always said I've. Always said 22 needed a bloke in
• 1:03:37
  the Tardis and I wish McNally had stayed from The Twin
• 1:03:41
  Dilemma. That would have been good.
• 1:03:43
  You wouldn't have had. It as.
• 1:03:44
  Abusive or as abrasive, If McNally was there because he
• 1:03:48
  would step in the way I reckon, and protect Perry and I think
• 1:03:51
  the dynamic would be a lot gentler it potentially.
• 1:03:55
  Yeah, I mean, I guess, I guess that type of character is the
• 1:03:58
  sort of Butch, say Woody character I was just talking
• 1:04:02
  about. So I mean, it could have, it
• 1:04:05
  could have gone a bit too macho for me, but but you're right, it
• 1:04:08
  would have certainly changed. See what he was wearing in the.
• 1:04:11
  Twin Dilemma, even like he'd. Come out of heaven.
• 1:04:16
  You know you. Know what I mean?
• 1:04:18
  You know what I mean? That line Vena just had to
• 1:04:20
  deliver. Gene and Crowley must be like,
• 1:04:22
  how the fuck am I going to say this?
• 1:04:23
  She goes and now Mick Ross, the man I was to marry, it's
• 1:04:28
  floating in the time Lash. She gets some crackers and.
• 1:04:35
  He's dangling. At the edge of oblivion, that's
• 1:04:38
  the one. Oh boy, Jesus Christ, this is
• 1:04:43
  definitely one of those ones that's better to watch with a
• 1:04:46
  mate in it. Oh, 100% hundred.
• 1:04:49
  Percent look, but she's smiling here.
• 1:04:51
  She's smiling. She's Oh no.
• 1:04:53
  What's? Happening doctor, get the belts
• 1:04:57
  out. Guys, oh boy, the unfortunate.
• 1:05:00
  Thing maybe about that weird special effect and the comical
• 1:05:04
  voices and the comical voices for the band rule and the
• 1:05:07
  general overall cheapness of the production is that
• 1:05:11
  unfortunately, at the end of the two doctors, we all have it
• 1:05:15
  announced that Doctor Who has been cancelled.
• 1:05:18
  And so this is the first episode they get to see as a, Oh my God,
• 1:05:22
  our great institution Doctor Who has come to an end.
• 1:05:26
  Let's see what they're delivering.
• 1:05:27
  And then they see the band. Then we realise, you know, yeah,
• 1:05:31
  I mean, he gave it did. Give a little bump in the reins,
• 1:05:33
  didn't it? But yeah, I mean, yeah, you can.
• 1:05:37
  You can see why, you know, he could see why he was on borrowed
• 1:05:42
  time at this time, at this .0 Darrow I should.
• 1:05:44
  Hate to have to kill. Oh yeah, delicious.
• 1:05:47
  Oh, here we go. Here's.
• 1:05:49
  That shot I sent you? Yeah, even the androids in the
• 1:05:52
  back there look at off. Oh yeah.
• 1:05:55
  Poor Kendron and his mate. Look, they've got.
• 1:05:57
  Nothing to do at all in this scene.
• 1:05:59
  There's even more people coming in.
• 1:06:01
  Fucking hell, it's the whole cast.
• 1:06:06
  Oh, we have a cliffhanger already.
• 1:06:10
  Oh. It's going over too fast.
• 1:06:13
  Yeah, it's fine by you. Oh, and there we go.
• 1:06:18
  Classic. Dialogue.
• 1:06:19
  That's right. Microcephalic apostate.
• 1:06:21
  What does that mean? Well, again, something like
• 1:06:23
  felching I. Had to look this up as well.
• 1:06:25
  OK, have a similar. Sort of a meaning.
• 1:06:29
  Well, I mean, did you? Not assume the microcephalic it
• 1:06:32
  meant small knob that's like where when I first that sounds
• 1:06:36
  quite rude. Yeah, it.
• 1:06:38
  Sounds very rude, just. Means small minded.
• 1:06:40
  Oh small minded. OK.
• 1:06:42
  Dumbo is basically what he's saying.
• 1:06:44
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's.
• 1:06:47
  Giving a bit of Pip and Jane Baker style dialogue.
• 1:06:50
  Save your breath. Well, the time lash, most people
• 1:06:54
  depart with a scream. That's what I'll say to people.
• 1:06:58
  Quite big they do these commentaries.
• 1:07:03
  Oh, Colin does do pain. Well, look at oh oh please, a
• 1:07:08
  bit lower. Goodbye, Doctor.
• 1:07:11
  Unpleasant journey. Unpleasant.
• 1:07:14
  Journey. It's not even a pound for oh
• 1:07:21
  blissful heaven. Amazing.
• 1:07:24
  I mean 10 out of. 10 for effort, 3 out of 10 for execution.
• 1:07:31
  No, I'll tell you what I don't think there's ever been a time
• 1:07:35
  when I haven't enjoyed time lash like I absolutely can see it's
• 1:07:40
  def all the things to show shouldn't have been doing at the
• 1:07:43
  time. We should have probably had a
• 1:07:45
  contemporary, more slick, better written, better acted Doctor Who
• 1:07:50
  on at the time. But oh, it's just, it has a
• 1:07:53
  sense of whimsy about it. You just, it's just delirious.
• 1:07:57
  You know what it is is that. That's the whimsy that is
• 1:08:01
  missing for me for much of 22. And I know you said that
• 1:08:04
  obviously is is quite campus, quite gaudy and and the but it I
• 1:08:11
  don't know, a lot of it misses that kind of whimsy or or like,
• 1:08:15
  or maybe it's just a different type of whimsy.
• 1:08:17
  You're like, you know, you get like yeah, I think so.
• 1:08:20
  Yeah. Where?
• 1:08:21
  It's. It's kind of always tinged with
• 1:08:23
  that kind of gruesome say what interest in in violence?
• 1:08:29
  So I don't know, just yeah, this is kind of just more light hide,
• 1:08:33
  I think. And that's what why it appeals
• 1:08:35
  to me the I mean, I think. There's a lot of humour in 22,
• 1:08:41
  but it's different types of humour.
• 1:08:45
  I think that there's like some great character humour in the
• 1:08:49
  Two Doctors and they have a brilliant cast that can deliver
• 1:08:53
  it as well. And it may not be to your taste,
• 1:08:56
  but the sort of the whole the Oscar in in the restaurant with
• 1:09:00
  shock Eye and this, I just love all that.
• 1:09:02
  It's so dark. It's crazy dark.
• 1:09:05
  Or how that poor fucking Sontaran goes from being, you
• 1:09:09
  know, military leader to covered in blood to just a leg.
• 1:09:15
  I mean, it's the emasculation of that poor man.
• 1:09:18
  I just think it's so funny and that attack is quite funny.
• 1:09:22
  I. Think that's Revelation is
• 1:09:24
  hilarious? In places like yeah, very dark
• 1:09:27
  rose red. Ruby lips were made.
• 1:09:29
  For kissing, but not by you. I love a woman who plays hard to
• 1:09:33
  get. Well, you love me to death.
• 1:09:35
  You know it is. I mean, when I saw that on on
• 1:09:38
  the big screen at the BFI, people were in absolute fits.
• 1:09:41
  You know, Eleanor Braun going about, oh, look at that
• 1:09:44
  spaceship. What a delicious sight.
• 1:09:47
  You know, like all that stuff. So I.
• 1:09:51
  Think, but you are right. It's a different sort of there
• 1:09:54
  is a it's almost like, and I don't mean this in a derogatory
• 1:09:58
  rate. It is almost like a panto.
• 1:10:00
  This it feels like on every level.
• 1:10:02
  And oh, I fucking love a panto. Well, we talked about this
• 1:10:05
  before. Yeah, we do.
• 1:10:06
  I love the staginess of it. I love.
• 1:10:08
  The operatic nature of the performances of a panto.
• 1:10:12
  You know the dialogue in a panto is both very clever and utterly
• 1:10:16
  cringe, right? You're supposed to go Boo, who
• 1:10:18
  is you know, and of course you can do that with Tekka.
• 1:10:21
  He's loathsome, for God's sake, in episode 2 when he sells,
• 1:10:24
  sells out his best mate Kendron. I mean, you're going he's you
• 1:10:28
  know, you rotter, but like the best pantos.
• 1:10:33
  It is. I mean, it's cheap, but it's
• 1:10:36
  it's gorgeous. It's it's it's it's almost like
• 1:10:40
  British television in a nutshell.
• 1:10:42
  In it, in the, it's kind of tatty, but there's a bit of
• 1:10:46
  magic to it. Yeah, 100% A. 100% that it is
• 1:10:50
  that funnily enough, looking through the the 22 Blu-ray
• 1:10:56
  stuff, just going back over that this weekend and and they had
• 1:11:01
  the Michael Grade talking to Matthew Sweet on there talking
• 1:11:04
  about, yeah, talking about that kind of how TV's at this time is
• 1:11:09
  transitioning away from stuff like this until like the more
• 1:11:14
  filming drama and stuff like that.
• 1:11:17
  And I think you do lose something when it's not like
• 1:11:20
  this, you know, you lose something when it's kind of not,
• 1:11:23
  you know, the multicam studio setup.
• 1:11:26
  I don't know. It's just it is theatrical.
• 1:11:31
  It is a bit like a panto. Like you say when the when the
• 1:11:34
  the moorlocks comes out this tunnel that it can't be more
• 1:11:36
  theatrical. It feels like that's what you'd
• 1:11:38
  see on stage at a panto. Like, you know, just like on
• 1:11:41
  half a monster coming out at you.
• 1:11:43
  This style of performance, it doesn't exist on television.
• 1:11:46
  Now everyone talks in sort of hushed voices.
• 1:11:49
  They're really naturalistic. You know, nobody's big anymore.
• 1:11:54
  You know, everyone's sort of containing themselves so we can
• 1:11:57
  so nobody's embarrassed by any thing and everyone could go wars
• 1:12:01
  and that's so worthy. What a worthy bit of drama that
• 1:12:04
  was, you know. Oh God, I can really see myself
• 1:12:07
  in those people. No, I can see myself and Colin
• 1:12:10
  in this especially. We're running about the place
• 1:12:12
  for his stupid clothes being loud and brash and.
• 1:12:16
  Toby said. It he said, he said about and he
• 1:12:20
  would know, you know, right. He's something that has worked
• 1:12:22
  on television. He's done soaps and things.
• 1:12:24
  The it's a style of making television and certainly a style
• 1:12:29
  of acting that has been completely abandoned.
• 1:12:34
  But it means it means you get something that everybody can
• 1:12:38
  sort of buy into, but you get far less TV that I think you can
• 1:12:43
  enjoy and, and, and laugh at. Like, what's wrong?
• 1:12:46
  What's wrong with laughing at telly sometimes, you know,
• 1:12:50
  what's wrong with it being a bit shit?
• 1:12:53
  I've gone back and watched Buffy recently.
• 1:12:55
  So much special effects are so bad.
• 1:12:58
  I had the best time watching it. Yeah.
• 1:13:02
  It's sad, isn't it? It's sad.
• 1:13:04
  I think, you know, it's that whole rehearsal period, I think
• 1:13:09
  where the actors really get to bring their personality to it.
• 1:13:13
  And nowadays I think I just don't think that's the case
• 1:13:16
  anymore unless it's extremely well written.
• 1:13:19
  I think a lot of TV these days is kind of all the same.
• 1:13:24
  Well, you talked about. Herbert having, you know, that
• 1:13:27
  little bit of business writing in the diary that's come out of
• 1:13:30
  that rehearsal process and having spent time with with with
• 1:13:34
  the script, you know, going through that rehearsal process
• 1:13:36
  for a whole week before you film whatever you film.
• 1:13:40
  And yeah, you're right, now less, less spikiness between
• 1:13:42
  the. Doctor and Perry, if they'd have
• 1:13:44
  gone in and done it single camera, they would have just
• 1:13:47
  done the script as written. And it would have, you know,
• 1:13:49
  there would have been no chance to iron out any of those kinks,
• 1:13:52
  which is what happens now. You know, they just, the script
• 1:13:55
  goes through endless rewrites, then the actors get it.
• 1:13:58
  They just have to learn it and say it.
• 1:14:01
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:14:02
  Well, now. We've executed modern day
• 1:14:05
  television and it sounded like a pair of a couple of fabulous
• 1:14:09
  old. Farts and a Jacuzzi.
• 1:14:12
  Should we go watch Episode 2? I mean, I'm sure we'll have even
• 1:14:15
  more fun with episode 2. Oh, we yeah, absolutely.
• 1:14:18
  Because we've got a bit of robot dancing at the beginning of this
• 1:14:21
  next episode. Was that with the mirror?
• 1:14:24
  Oh my God. Oh yes.
• 1:14:25
  And you know I've. Still got?
• 1:14:27
  I've got a whole list of facts for episode 2 as well.
• 1:14:30
  Oh come on, stay yourself.