Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / DENIED! Sicko Jodi Arias appeals conviction for stabbing naked lover dead in shower.

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DENIED! Sicko Jodi Arias appeals conviction for stabbing naked lover dead in shower. · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:00
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace is coming to Fox Nation. I Want justice.
0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace premieres March ninth, only on
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Speaker 1: Fox Nation. He had a whole future in front of him.
0:21
Speaker 1: Why was this young guy at devout Mormon scrubbed in sunshine,
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Speaker 1: hard worker, sparkling blue eyes, beautiful smile, the apple of
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Speaker 1: his family's eyes found dead, his body stabbed nearly thirty times,
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Speaker 1: throat slit, ear to ear, capped off with a gunshot
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Speaker 1: wound to the head. Why Why did Travis Alexander have
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Speaker 1: to die? In the last hours Breaking news and the
0:55
Speaker 1: Jodi Arias criminal case, Joe the Aria is convicted of
1:01
Speaker 1: Travis's murderer, allegedly stabbing, shooting, slicing Travis Alexander dead when
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Speaker 1: she finds out he's going to go on a trip
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Speaker 1: with another woman. Will Jody Arius walk free over my
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Speaker 1: cold dead body? I Nancy Grace, this is Crime Stories.
1:24
Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
1:41
Speaker 1: What's going on? Um? Our friend of ours is dead
1:44
Speaker 1: in his bedroom. We hadn't heard from for a while.
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Speaker 1: His roommates some blood. I didn't know when, but I
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Speaker 1: can give you the song to someone who went in
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Speaker 1: there can Yes, please, Hi, So what's going on? He's dead?
2:04
Speaker 1: He's in his bedroom Okay, in the shower. Okay, how
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Speaker 1: did this happen? Do you have any idea? Well, we
2:09
Speaker 1: have no idea. Everyone's been wondering about him for She
2:13
Speaker 1: says that there's blood, So is it coming from his head?
2:15
Speaker 1: Did he? It's all over the place? Hold on just
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Speaker 1: a moment. Okay, you're a good friend of of Travis's
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Speaker 1: trest Sam. Okay, Hassi had been depressed it all, thinking
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Speaker 1: about hating, suicide, anything like that. I don't think he's
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Speaker 1: been in tua. He's been really depressed because he broke
2:36
Speaker 1: up with this girl and he was upset about that.
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Speaker 1: But I don't think he would actually kill himself over that.
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Speaker 1: Has he been threatened by anyone recently? Has he hasn't?
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Speaker 1: He has an ex girlfriend that's been bothering him and
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Speaker 1: following him in, flashing tires and things like that. And
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Speaker 1: do you know the ex girlfriend, sam Um, her name
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Speaker 1: is Jody. In the last hours, breaking news in the
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Speaker 1: case of convicted killer Jodi Arius. I mean, see, Grace,
3:04
Speaker 1: this is crime Stories. Thank you for being with us.
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Speaker 1: You were just hearing the nine one one call May
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Speaker 1: when Travis Alexander's friends found him dead in the shower
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Speaker 1: twenty eight to twenty nine stab wounds and a bullet
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Speaker 1: to the head. But first take a listen to more
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Speaker 1: of that nine one one call. No roommate, when was
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Speaker 1: the last time he saw Travis? Was it three days ago? Um?
3:26
Speaker 1: That do you guys? When we was lasting yourself that
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Speaker 1: I'm Travis. They want to know what's from room? Last
3:32
Speaker 1: time I saw him? Was what part of the last
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Speaker 1: I remember seeing him? The last third day? Was him
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Speaker 1: food me me some last Tuesday? On our last Monday.
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Speaker 1: She talked to him last Monday. Okay, and everyone is
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Speaker 1: out of the house. There's no one else in the house. No,
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Speaker 1: no one's in the house. And what is your name?
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Speaker 1: My name is Michelle. I need to ask a friend.
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Speaker 1: I'm being here. I'm getting fun to me. Okay, good Hia,
4:06
Speaker 1: And this is okay. That's hub is in his bedroom. Yeah,
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Speaker 1: you're hearing more of the nine one one call from
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Speaker 1: the friends of Travis Alexander that find his dead body
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Speaker 1: in the shower stall, decomposing in the last hours. The
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Speaker 1: appeal file by convicted killer his lover Jodi Arius, has
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Speaker 1: been rejected is at the end, I guarantee The answer
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Speaker 1: is no. The Arizona Appeals Court upholding the Jodi Arias
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Speaker 1: and murder conviction, Arius arguing about the quote circus atmosphere
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Speaker 1: of her trial and attacking the prosecutor. While no love
4:51
Speaker 1: is lost between the defense and the prosecution, was there
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Speaker 1: really an appealable error guarding the trial at the time
5:02
Speaker 1: was renowned defense attorney Kirk Nurmi for Jodi Arius, author
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Speaker 1: I've trapped with miss Arius that fought tooth and nail
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Speaker 1: to guarantee her affair trial with me an all star
5:13
Speaker 1: panel joining me. That lawyer Kirk Nurmi, former special Asian
5:19
Speaker 1: FBI start a Facebook series Curse of Aka Court. Bobby Chicone,
5:24
Speaker 1: professor forensics, Jackson State University, author Blood Beneath My Feet
5:28
Speaker 1: on Amazon, Joseph Scott Morgan, renowned forensics psychiatrist on Instagram,
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Speaker 1: doctor Daniel Bober. But right now, to Crime online dot
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Speaker 1: Com investigative reporter Alexis Terres Chuck, Alexis, let's just start
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Speaker 1: with the breaking news. The court has rejected Jodi Arius's appeal.
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Speaker 1: Tell me what happened? So, Jody ten no, I'm sorry.
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Speaker 1: Twelve years after she killed Travis Alexander filed an appeal
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Speaker 1: to the court in Arizona, and she cleaned that she
6:00
Speaker 1: deserved to have her conviction thrown out talked out completely,
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Speaker 1: because she said that one the prosecutor was mean to her,
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Speaker 1: he was bullying her, and two that the media it
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Speaker 1: became a media circus in the court because of all
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Speaker 1: the coverage on the case, including specifically you, Nancy Grace,
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Speaker 1: you are one of the reasons why it was such
6:25
Speaker 1: a crazy trial, and that the media influenced the jurors,
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Speaker 1: and that she deserved a new trial because one the
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Speaker 1: prosecutor was mean to her and to the media cared
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Speaker 1: about her. Did you say the prosecutor was quote mean
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Speaker 1: to her and is that what the appeal said. Yes,
6:40
Speaker 1: she said that he was aggressive with her. Man, I
6:44
Speaker 1: would feel like the jury would hate my guts if
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Speaker 1: I didn't come out guns a blazing, take no prisoners
6:51
Speaker 1: in every martyr trial. Now, I wouldn't be hateful or
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Speaker 1: quote mean to use her words, not mine to witnesses
7:02
Speaker 1: unless they started lying. But when you have a murder,
7:07
Speaker 1: the jury wants avengement. They don't want a pushover in
7:13
Speaker 1: the courtroom. I just don't understand how I play into
7:16
Speaker 1: the whole scenario. But take a listen to ABC reporter
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Speaker 1: Paula Ferris, three years into serving that life sentence, Areas
7:25
Speaker 1: is appealing to have the conviction overturned, alleging, among other things,
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Speaker 1: prosecutorial misconduct and that the court's failure to control news
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Speaker 1: coverage created a circus like atmosphere, which deprived her of
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Speaker 1: the right to a fair trial. The appeal also alleges
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Speaker 1: that certain TV personalities, like Nancy Grace, gave the trial
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Speaker 1: a reality TV flavor. Grace, reacting to that accusation on
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Speaker 1: her Serious XM podcast Crime Stories on Friday, how can
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Speaker 1: you get away from the fact that her own admission
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Speaker 1: and her camera can victed her, not me or anybody else,
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Speaker 1: And just days after her conviction, a defiant Arius speaking
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Speaker 1: to ABC News, So you really are never going to
8:09
Speaker 1: tell the truth about what went down in the bathroom.
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Speaker 1: I don't know what you mean by that, because I've
8:14
Speaker 1: told the truth, Okay. I didn't know that you were
8:18
Speaker 1: a hater when you came to interview me. Oh, everybody's
8:20
Speaker 1: a hater. It's everybody else's fault. But hers, I, you're
8:24
Speaker 1: jogging my memory now. Alexis tres check. I think I
8:26
Speaker 1: do remember Jody Arius shooting a bird at me in
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Speaker 1: the courtroom. I'm pretty pretty sure it was a sly bird,
8:31
Speaker 1: like up against her head kind of. Anyway, that's a
8:34
Speaker 1: whole nother can of worms. But I'll just split her
8:37
Speaker 1: finger under her throat like she wanted to cut your throat.
8:40
Speaker 1: Don't forget that part. Oh I forgot that part. You know,
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Speaker 1: Alexis is so great spending time with you. To your
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Speaker 1: special guest right now, renowned defense attorney Kirk Nermy, the
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Speaker 1: defense lawyer at trial, and oh what a trial. It
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Speaker 1: was not one, not two, but three trials. As I recall,
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Speaker 1: you've got the guilt innocence face, you've got the death
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Speaker 1: penalty face, which had to be redone. Maybe I'm forgetting
9:02
Speaker 1: one of them. But Kurt Nermi is with me. Author
9:05
Speaker 1: I've trapped with miss Arias. You can find it on Amazon.
9:10
Speaker 1: Kurt Nermy, Let's see, does she blame you two? I can't.
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Speaker 1: I can't recall everything in her appeal. Actually the appeal
9:17
Speaker 1: doesn't blame me. That'll come next. After her appeals denied.
9:21
Speaker 1: Under Arizona law, miss Arias has a chance to claim
9:24
Speaker 1: my ineffective assistance the counsel was the reason for the conviction.
9:27
Speaker 1: So I don't know when I saw you in court,
9:30
Speaker 1: you were fighting like a hell cat. Go ahead, well
9:35
Speaker 1: I'll use that maybe perhaps Nancy, but yeah, I mean
9:39
Speaker 1: so that's gonna be next, those those challenges. So she's
9:42
Speaker 1: gone after one of Martinez, she's gone after everybody else,
9:45
Speaker 1: and you know she's obviously sued me, and now she's
9:49
Speaker 1: going to go after me again. And to that, I say,
9:52
Speaker 1: bring it on. I look forward to responding, ooh, you're
9:55
Speaker 1: stolen my phrases. I love saying that right before a
9:58
Speaker 1: trial started, Kurt Nermy what a lot of people don't know.
10:02
Speaker 1: If they're not in the legal business, God bless them,
10:05
Speaker 1: they've probably done the right thing. But defense attorneys get it.
10:11
Speaker 1: Every time there's a conviction. You've got a defendant sitting
10:15
Speaker 1: in jail looking at four walls, going I think they
10:18
Speaker 1: convinced themselves they didn't really didn't do it. And once
10:20
Speaker 1: in a while you do have one that didn't do it.
10:23
Speaker 1: Very rarely, but they're sitting there and you're on the outside.
10:27
Speaker 1: You were their lawyer, they made, had a bond with
10:30
Speaker 1: you at trial, But then suddenly that all changes after
10:32
Speaker 1: a few weeks behind bars, and they're like rats on
10:36
Speaker 1: a sinking ship. They'll grab onto anything. Imagine a rat
10:40
Speaker 1: grabbing onto you, because that's what it's like, and they
10:43
Speaker 1: look at you. I don't have to imagine, Nancy. My
10:47
Speaker 1: point is people think, oh, my stars, he was in effective.
10:50
Speaker 1: He was a bad lawyer. This happens with practically every conviction.
10:55
Speaker 1: The defendant and their new fleet of a pillot lawyers
10:59
Speaker 1: come up with anything saying. They come the trial record,
11:01
Speaker 1: they find any objection that was overruled, anything that happened
11:05
Speaker 1: at trial, any turmoil in the jury, was a juror replaced,
11:10
Speaker 1: blah blah, goes on and on and on, and they
11:13
Speaker 1: get onto the defense attorney because that may be the
11:15
Speaker 1: only hope they have of getting a reversal, and they
11:17
Speaker 1: will pick through every word you said at trial, everything
11:21
Speaker 1: you did, and try to find something that they can
11:25
Speaker 1: claim reversible error, and defense attorneys take it. You know,
11:30
Speaker 1: this light water off a duck's back, because it happens
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Speaker 1: every single time there's a conviction. Kirk, You're right, there's
11:35
Speaker 1: no doubt about it. But I think with miss Arius
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Speaker 1: it will be particularly thorough and given her penchant for vengeance.
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Speaker 1: I think we're going to see a lot of attacks
11:46
Speaker 1: on me, both in terms of what I did in
11:48
Speaker 1: both on a personal level as well. Just keep one
11:52
Speaker 1: eye open when you're taking a shower. Kirk NERMI will
11:56
Speaker 1: do time stories with Nancy Grace. Um. I didn't go in,
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Speaker 1: but from what I heard, his droommate went in the
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Speaker 1: flood in his bedroom behind the door. Uh. And and
12:21
Speaker 1: then he said it's all over. And then they went
12:24
Speaker 1: in the bathroom and heath in his shower. Oh and
12:28
Speaker 1: you know his his Um, his bedroom is where in
12:32
Speaker 1: the house. It's upstairs. Um. And if you go up
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Speaker 1: the stairs, it's on the left. It's the first door
12:39
Speaker 1: on your left. It's the only door on your left.
12:42
Speaker 1: And um, and it's just a big master, sweet bedroom.
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Speaker 1: That day and he's talking to his friend right now.
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Speaker 1: And there's a girl that spends stocking him and she's
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Speaker 1: changed and he's changed to h right now some information.
13:08
Speaker 1: I hope my phone doesn't dim on like one baro battery. Okay, Well,
13:12
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna keep you on the phone until officers
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Speaker 1: are right either officers are premas arrival. Okay, okay, I
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Speaker 1: think I can hear the same guys, you're hearing the
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Speaker 1: nine one one call made by friends of murder victim
13:23
Speaker 1: Travis Alexander to Justice Scott Morgan and forensics expert Professor
13:27
Speaker 1: jacksonvill State University author Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon
13:31
Speaker 1: just got described the wounds, the mortal wounds to Travis Alexander,
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Speaker 1: just thirty years old at the time he was murdered.
13:39
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, Nancy, how long do we have he
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Speaker 1: He was stabbed in the back multiple times. Uh, he
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Speaker 1: was stabbed on the front of his body, in his chest. Uh.
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Speaker 1: And he had his throat cut H and H. In
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Speaker 1: my opinion, at least and I've stated this on the
14:00
Speaker 1: air openly multiple times, he sustained what I believe is
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Speaker 1: a post mortem gunshot wound to his head. There was
14:08
Speaker 1: no hemorrhage in that track, in that wound track, but
14:11
Speaker 1: she did get over the top of him and literally
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Speaker 1: cut his throat in the middle of the hallway and
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Speaker 1: then dragged his body back to the shower where she
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Speaker 1: stored him. You know, there was always a controversy, Joseph
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Speaker 1: Scott Morgan about how many stab wounds he had, and
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Speaker 1: I believe that's because some of the stab wounds were
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Speaker 1: on top of other stab wounds. I agree, and what
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Speaker 1: do you make of it? To doctor Daniel Bober forensic
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Speaker 1: psychiatrists to joining us. You can find him on Instagram,
14:38
Speaker 1: doctor Daniel Bober, Doctor Bober why shot him in the
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Speaker 1: head after twenty eight stab wounds? Yancy? I think there
14:46
Speaker 1: was It goes back to what people say about you know,
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Speaker 1: how well you know someone and how personal a crime is.
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Speaker 1: I think there was a level of rage and viciousness
14:56
Speaker 1: that was over the top, and I think that it
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Speaker 1: was sort of like how any times can you kill
15:00
Speaker 1: the same person? I think she was completely berserk and
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Speaker 1: out of control when she did this, and filled with rage,
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Speaker 1: berserk and out of control. To kurtnermy joining me former
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Speaker 1: Jodi Arius lawyer, author, I've trapped with miss Arius and
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Speaker 1: it is quite a read on Amazon. Kurt Nermie, was
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Speaker 1: there anything in the appeal that surprised you? No, I
15:22
Speaker 1: expect you to go after one and go after the media.
15:25
Speaker 1: I think what was interesting about the appeal is how
15:28
Speaker 1: much the court illustrated the idea that the conviction was
15:34
Speaker 1: obtained based on the facts and not the prosecutor, and
15:39
Speaker 1: so there was a certainly a lot of I guess
15:44
Speaker 1: I would say derision put towards what mister Martinez did
15:48
Speaker 1: during the court room, So that was a bit surprising,
15:50
Speaker 1: But other than that, no, it was it was a
15:54
Speaker 1: sound decision in my opinion. And you know, to Bobby Chicone,
15:58
Speaker 1: how would you, for those of you just joining us,
16:02
Speaker 1: Bobby chaka former special agent FBI star a Facebook series
16:06
Speaker 1: Curse of Acacre, how would you decipher that crime scene? Well,
16:11
Speaker 1: you know, I agree that there's a certain level of
16:14
Speaker 1: rage in the crime scene, particularly when as doctor Morgan
16:17
Speaker 1: mentioned that that he believes that shot was postmortem. Whenever
16:20
Speaker 1: you have a shot, particularly to the face, and it's postmortem,
16:24
Speaker 1: that indicates such a hatred, in such a rage, in
16:27
Speaker 1: such a personal relationship to this crime that it certainly
16:32
Speaker 1: wouldn't be perpetrated by two ninja like people coming into
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Speaker 1: rob the place or something like that, or drug debt
16:38
Speaker 1: or anything like that. It would be very personal. It
16:40
Speaker 1: would be someone that perceived this person, the victim, as
16:44
Speaker 1: dronging them in some way. And so that's a very
16:48
Speaker 1: very A postmortem gunshot to the face is a very
16:52
Speaker 1: very specific act and it very it narrows the amount
16:57
Speaker 1: of people that you're going to look at of course,
16:59
Speaker 1: in this case, we have her admitting it was in
17:01
Speaker 1: self defense. Well, if you have a postmortem a gunshot
17:04
Speaker 1: into the face, there's nothing in that that indicates self defense.
17:09
Speaker 1: Stab wounds to the back does not indicate self defense.
17:12
Speaker 1: There were indications that Travis had defensive wounds on him. Again,
17:17
Speaker 1: that's not self defendicative of self defense. So the crime
17:21
Speaker 1: scene here just goes against anything that Jody Airis has
17:25
Speaker 1: ever said happened in that room. You know, you just
17:29
Speaker 1: heard Bobby Chicone refer to ninjas attacking them. As you
17:35
Speaker 1: all recall Alexis terres Shut Crime online dot Com investigative
17:39
Speaker 1: reporter Alexis that was one And I hate to even say,
17:44
Speaker 1: this is a curtain ERMI listening because you're stuck with
17:46
Speaker 1: all these the statements that she made when you go
17:48
Speaker 1: to trial. That's why I we have the Fifth Amendment.
17:51
Speaker 1: So Jody Arris wouldn't say all this, but she knew
17:53
Speaker 1: that when she blabbed Alexas terres Shut. Where were her
17:56
Speaker 1: many stories to police about the death of her lover,
18:00
Speaker 1: Travis Alexander, including masked ninjas. First, she said she didn't
18:05
Speaker 1: do it at all, and she kept calling the police
18:07
Speaker 1: and asking on if they do what had happened and
18:10
Speaker 1: get details. Then, when she was finally arrested, she came
18:14
Speaker 1: up with this crazy story that masked intruders they looked
18:17
Speaker 1: like ninjas, had broken in and had tied them all
18:21
Speaker 1: up and then had killed Travis. But then she miraculously
18:25
Speaker 1: escaped from the ninjas after having seen them and made
18:29
Speaker 1: it and was able to thrive, yet still lied about
18:32
Speaker 1: it for weeks on it. Well, you're right, Alexis Terres.
18:35
Speaker 1: Listen to our friend at ABC, This is Ryan Owens.
18:38
Speaker 1: The jury also saw a second interrogation from the next day.
18:41
Speaker 1: Arius is back with a new outfit, a jail jumpsuit,
18:45
Speaker 1: and a very new story. Now she admits she was
18:50
Speaker 1: at his house that day, but says two masked intruders
18:54
Speaker 1: broke in. She even acts out how she cowered in
18:57
Speaker 1: the corner as the duo slaughtered Alley Lexander and threatened
19:01
Speaker 1: her family mafia style. Arius again tells the detective if
19:07
Speaker 1: she were going to kill Alexander, she would definitely do
19:10
Speaker 1: it differently. I don't think I could stab him. I
19:14
Speaker 1: think I would have to shoot him continuously until he
19:18
Speaker 1: was only years later, did Arius finally admit she was
19:23
Speaker 1: the killer. Her attorneys are trying to convince this jury
19:27
Speaker 1: she did it in self defense. After the couple fought
19:30
Speaker 1: in just those two minutes, Jody had to make a choice.
19:36
Speaker 1: She would either live or she would die. Wow, Okay,
19:41
Speaker 1: Kurt Narmy, that wasn't you speaking? Who was that, Jennifer Wilkes.
19:44
Speaker 1: That was Jennifer Wilmot, I believe in the opening statement
19:47
Speaker 1: of the trial. Yes, right, Wilmot, thank you for correcting
19:50
Speaker 1: me with me, Kurt Narmi, lawyer for Jodi Arius, author
19:54
Speaker 1: of Trapped with miss Arius. You were hearing a tiny,
19:57
Speaker 1: tiny taste of what the jury got to say. Ample.
20:00
Speaker 1: Every day, the various stories areas put forward and then
20:03
Speaker 1: her lawyers are stuck with conflicting state was to explain
20:06
Speaker 1: away to the jury now, Alexis Torreschuk, investigative reporter with
20:11
Speaker 1: Crime Online, Alexis, we know that a bulk of the
20:14
Speaker 1: appeal was about one Martinez. Take a listen to this,
20:20
Speaker 1: Mike Pelton, ABC. The state argues Arius did get a
20:23
Speaker 1: fair trial and any missteps by prosecutor one Martinez didn't
20:27
Speaker 1: impact the jury. But Presiding Judge Jennifer Campbell, pressing on
20:32
Speaker 1: this point, I'm going to pin you down on this.
20:35
Speaker 1: You agree that improper conduct was engaged in on the
20:38
Speaker 1: part of the prosecutor in this case. There are some instances, yes,
20:42
Speaker 1: not as many as the defense argues, and none that
20:44
Speaker 1: resulted injury prejudice. Each side with thirty minutes to argue
20:48
Speaker 1: whether Jodiarius will have her conviction overturned, a decision these
20:52
Speaker 1: three will make but unclear when Hi, guys, Nancy Grace here,
21:07
Speaker 1: I have investigated and prosecuted literally thousands of felony cases.
21:14
Speaker 1: I have covered literally thousands of cases of missing people,
21:19
Speaker 1: adults and children, unsolved homicides, violent crimes. My question is
21:25
Speaker 1: what can we do about it? I don't want to
21:29
Speaker 1: just sit back and report on it. I want to
21:32
Speaker 1: take action, and I know you must feel the same way.
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Speaker 1: for Yonder brace a new and glorious morn. Bye on
23:21
Speaker 1: your knees. Oh he angel baresis, Oh night dee bye
23:36
Speaker 1: now when Christ was born, ohne dee bye night, Oh
23:49
Speaker 1: night de bye. Yes. I had to play the whole
23:54
Speaker 1: thing so you could hear Jody Arius wait for it,
23:58
Speaker 1: hit the high note, satellly that it's not the way
24:00
Speaker 1: her testimony turned out at trial. For those of you
24:03
Speaker 1: just joining us in the last hours, the Arizona Court
24:07
Speaker 1: of Appeals upholls Jodi Arius says conviction and life sentence
24:13
Speaker 1: for the brutal murder of her lover, her boyfriend, Travis Alexander.
24:19
Speaker 1: It also mentioned an aside claiming the prosecutor had bullying
24:23
Speaker 1: behavior at their words, not mine. Well, he's a prosecutor,
24:27
Speaker 1: for Pete's sake. What do you how do you expect
24:30
Speaker 1: him to act in the face of a woman he
24:33
Speaker 1: knows stabbed an unarmed demand nearly thirty times and then
24:38
Speaker 1: capped him in the head. What do you think Travis's
24:41
Speaker 1: family wanted a pussycat that just laid down in the
24:44
Speaker 1: middle of the courtroom and let the defense roll right
24:46
Speaker 1: over him. Well, kirknrmi is with us, the Jodi Arias
24:51
Speaker 1: trial lawyer, author of Trapped with miss Arius to kirk nrmi,
24:56
Speaker 1: and then I'll circle back to Alexis Treschuk. What were
25:00
Speaker 1: the claims against one Martinez, the lead prosecutor on appeal? Now,
25:08
Speaker 1: I know he's been there's been a lot of claims
25:11
Speaker 1: of sex harassment, that he would come on to everything
25:15
Speaker 1: that won't buy in a skirt. To put it mildly,
25:18
Speaker 1: that aside, what were the claims against Martinez that could
25:23
Speaker 1: have affected the outcome of the trial? Sure, it's not
25:27
Speaker 1: just what the court characterized his bullying behavior with Massius,
25:31
Speaker 1: but I think it's also the bullying behavior. And you
25:34
Speaker 1: won't catch me defending one Martinez's behavior in the court room.
25:37
Speaker 1: I've worked with many a professional prosecutor that wouldn't go
25:40
Speaker 1: to this extreme, and mister Martinez making insinuations about doctor
25:45
Speaker 1: Samuel's having an untoward interest in miss Arius and some
25:51
Speaker 1: of the Kirk Kurt Narmy, do you believe it's true?
25:56
Speaker 1: I don't know if she's tried it with you, that
25:59
Speaker 1: Joe Arius approaches many many men with sexual undertones and
26:10
Speaker 1: her just natural way she deals with guys. I wouldn't
26:15
Speaker 1: dispute that. But that does not mean and I've known
26:17
Speaker 1: doctor Samuels for a long time. I knew him a
26:19
Speaker 1: long time before he got in that courtroom, that does
26:22
Speaker 1: not mean his professional ethics would be compromised. I consider
26:26
Speaker 1: a man him a man of great integrity. Well, actually
26:29
Speaker 1: I do too, Kurt Narmy, I do too. I guess though,
26:33
Speaker 1: when you see Arias being flirtatious with the doctor who's
26:38
Speaker 1: analyzing her, it opens up the avenue of suggesting flirtation
26:45
Speaker 1: between the two of them. But now doctor Samuels is
26:49
Speaker 1: a shrink, correct he is? Well? I doubt pretty seriously.
26:53
Speaker 1: Samuels as as well respected to see as Annie's a shrink,
26:57
Speaker 1: would have he wouldn't touch Arias with a ten football.
27:00
Speaker 1: I can guarantee you that because there are snakes in
27:02
Speaker 1: that woman's head. I hate to use that phrase, but
27:04
Speaker 1: it's just so appropriate. No way, Okay, what else did
27:07
Speaker 1: he do? According to you? Well, not according to me,
27:11
Speaker 1: not according to me. According to the Appellet court, they
27:13
Speaker 1: talked about mister Martinez's behavior with miss La Violette and
27:18
Speaker 1: the bullying behavior and the confusing questioning. It was Violette
27:21
Speaker 1: the one that wrote that paper about snow White and
27:24
Speaker 1: the Seven Dwarfs about how I was at misogynist or
27:26
Speaker 1: something like that. Was that her? Well that there was
27:30
Speaker 1: a lot of discussion about the title of that. Yes,
27:32
Speaker 1: that was she had written something. And I never read
27:35
Speaker 1: that article, so I can't speak to the contents of
27:37
Speaker 1: that article. But I do remember this massive argument between
27:40
Speaker 1: her and Martinez about the seven Dwarves and naming the
27:44
Speaker 1: seven Dwarves, and like I say, you know, like the
27:47
Speaker 1: Appellet Court found, I think there was a lot of
27:49
Speaker 1: bombastic behavior in that. And that's what the Court of
27:52
Speaker 1: Appeals called out and basically said Arrius was convicted not
27:56
Speaker 1: because of mister Martinez, but in spite of him. Now
28:00
Speaker 1: kurtin Army's referring to I guess I would say a
28:06
Speaker 1: battered women's expert, a shrink of sorts and an article
28:13
Speaker 1: that she had written regarding snow White and the Seven Dwarfs,
28:19
Speaker 1: and Juan Martinez seized upon it as he has a
28:26
Speaker 1: right to do. In cross examination. You put up an expert,
28:30
Speaker 1: and a good prosecutor will look up every article, every
28:33
Speaker 1: thesis that they can, every book that they can find
28:36
Speaker 1: by that expert and pick it apart. And that's exactly
28:41
Speaker 1: what he did. Do you remember that, Alexis to Reschuk,
28:44
Speaker 1: I do I remember? The court was stunned as Jua
28:48
Speaker 1: Martinez attacked this woman, this Alice Lavelette. She's I want
28:51
Speaker 1: to say she looks like a blonde grandma, but that
28:53
Speaker 1: might be making her too old, but anyway, she is.
28:56
Speaker 1: She attacked her, so he was yelling at her and
29:00
Speaker 1: she wasn't even the defendant, and he just kept hammering her.
29:03
Speaker 1: And she thought back very hard. But you know, she
29:05
Speaker 1: started getting death threats after the way. That's not right,
29:11
Speaker 1: that's horrible. What we do know about the expert, Miss Violette.
29:16
Speaker 1: When the domestic abuse specialist Alice La Violette gave a
29:21
Speaker 1: talk once called was snow White a battered woman. Little
29:27
Speaker 1: did she think that eight years later that would come
29:32
Speaker 1: back to haunt her. But with her testimony that Jody
29:36
Speaker 1: Arius was an abused woman at the hands of her
29:40
Speaker 1: murder victim, Travis Alexander, I guess he did bring it
29:45
Speaker 1: up on cross exam. A lot of claims have been
29:48
Speaker 1: made about Juan Martinez, the lead prosecutor in the case
29:52
Speaker 1: against Arius, but I know this much. While the appellate
29:55
Speaker 1: court called him a bully, they did not reverse the case.
30:00
Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friends at ABC justin Pazzera.
30:04
Speaker 1: This is the complaint right here, eighteen pages detailing years
30:07
Speaker 1: of what's being described as unwanted sexual advance as even
30:11
Speaker 1: leaking information about the Jodiarius trial. But although what's being
30:15
Speaker 1: alleged in this report is surprising to most of us,
30:17
Speaker 1: for some people, they're really surprised it's taken this long
30:21
Speaker 1: to get here. It's one of Miracopa County's top prosecutors,
30:25
Speaker 1: Juan Martinez, his name making national headlines during the Jodiarius trial.
30:30
Speaker 1: Today his name front page on this formal complaint filed
30:34
Speaker 1: by the State barb of Arizona. It is just appalling
30:37
Speaker 1: and shocking. Tammy Rose was a reporter assigned to the
30:40
Speaker 1: Jodiarius trial. She says she was interviewed three times by
30:44
Speaker 1: the state bar as part of this investigation, looking into
30:47
Speaker 1: if Martinez violated rules of professional conduct. It's alleged during
30:52
Speaker 1: the Arias trial, Martinez was having an affair with a
30:55
Speaker 1: blogger who was also covering the trial. Rose says she
30:59
Speaker 1: was friends with that blogger. She was the one that
31:02
Speaker 1: told me that she was having an affair with one Martinez.
31:05
Speaker 1: And you know, I knew he had a living her friend.
31:08
Speaker 1: I knew she was married. The complaints continue to detail
31:11
Speaker 1: accusations of unwanted sexual advances. Thirty females working inside the
31:16
Speaker 1: County Attorney's office were interviewed for the investigation. In twenty fifteen,
31:20
Speaker 1: Martinez allegedly told the law clerk he wanted to climb
31:24
Speaker 1: her like a statue, and on another occasion, he allegedly
31:28
Speaker 1: asked a woman to leave her husband for him to
31:31
Speaker 1: Alexis Tourezcha climb online dot Com investigative reporter, I hear
31:35
Speaker 1: what the claims are. My question is what did any
31:40
Speaker 1: of that have to do with the trial. Did it
31:44
Speaker 1: effect that your oars in any way, none of his
31:48
Speaker 1: actions with the blogger and that other woman or the
31:51
Speaker 1: women in his office. What did happen in court was
31:55
Speaker 1: that Jennifer Wilmot and mister Martinez one Martinez had a
32:00
Speaker 1: argument in front of the judge and she said something
32:03
Speaker 1: like this isn't this wouldn't be how you would treat
32:05
Speaker 1: a spouse. And he said, oh, I would hate to
32:07
Speaker 1: be ever married to you. And it was a really
32:11
Speaker 1: cruel comment and totally unnecessarily and totally uncalled for it.
32:15
Speaker 1: So the judge said, cut it out. Did the jury
32:18
Speaker 1: hear it? Repeat? Did the jury hear it? Okay, then
32:20
Speaker 1: what do I care? Not? Sorry, I mean I don't
32:23
Speaker 1: approve of his comment, but I mean she started it.
32:26
Speaker 1: Wilmot started it by saying you wouldn't put your spouse
32:28
Speaker 1: this way. Well, I gotta say she started that. But
32:33
Speaker 1: that aside, it didn't happen in front of the jury.
32:38
Speaker 1: It means nothing to the area's trial or murder conviction
32:57
Speaker 1: crime stories with Nancy Grace stated Arizona versus Jody an
33:02
Speaker 1: Arius verdict Count one, we the jury Duian paneled and sworn,
33:06
Speaker 1: and the above and titled action upon our ohs do
33:09
Speaker 1: finally defendant as to count one, first degree murder guilty.
33:14
Speaker 1: Five jurs find premeditated zero fine, felony murder seven fine
33:21
Speaker 1: both premated, hated and felony signed a four person. Is
33:26
Speaker 1: this your true verdict? So say you one and all
33:30
Speaker 1: guilty guilty of murder and the death of Travis Alexander,
33:35
Speaker 1: stabbed nearly thirty times, his throat, slashed ear to ear,
33:39
Speaker 1: and shot in the head. Why because her lover, Travis Alexander,
33:44
Speaker 1: who had broken up with her, was taking another woman
33:48
Speaker 1: on a Caribbean vacation. Jodiarius comes over. They have a
33:53
Speaker 1: marathon sec session all day long. At the end of it,
33:56
Speaker 1: he's still going to go on the trip with the
33:58
Speaker 1: other girlfriend. Bam, she killed him. M okay. Joe Scott Morgan,
34:03
Speaker 1: forensics expert, Professor Forensics, Jacksonville State University, author of Blood
34:07
Speaker 1: Beneath My Feet, tell me what you deciphered from the
34:11
Speaker 1: crime scene and why there was no way this Court
34:14
Speaker 1: of Appeals was going to reverse this case. Absolutely no way,
34:17
Speaker 1: you know, Nancy, I think probably you know. I covered
34:19
Speaker 1: this case for a long time on the air, and
34:22
Speaker 1: one of the most striking things I remember we had
34:24
Speaker 1: recreated the crime scene. Was looking at the pictures from
34:29
Speaker 1: the crime scene and seeing what we had recreated in
34:32
Speaker 1: the studio. When you look at the vanity in the bathroom,
34:37
Speaker 1: one of the just it's a gut punch. He actually
34:41
Speaker 1: sprayed blood onto the surface of the sink. He looked
34:46
Speaker 1: at himself in the mirror for at least a moment.
34:49
Speaker 1: He had an awareness when he came out of that shower.
34:52
Speaker 1: I think she backed off for a second. We had
34:55
Speaker 1: what's referred to as fine aspirate spray, which means she
35:00
Speaker 1: clipped along and as he's coughing up blood, it's spraying
35:03
Speaker 1: all over the sink, all over the mirror. And then
35:06
Speaker 1: he begins to try to get away from her. He
35:09
Speaker 1: moves down the hallway, his body finally gives out. She
35:13
Speaker 1: gets on top of this guy. Nancy and I have
35:15
Speaker 1: these visions of her just putting her knee in his back,
35:18
Speaker 1: lifting his chin up and taking that knife and cutting
35:22
Speaker 1: his throat. And then, as we had mentioned earlier, she
35:24
Speaker 1: took that pistol and she shot him right in the
35:26
Speaker 1: top of the head. Well, you know what, there are
35:29
Speaker 1: other guys out there that are lucky that they made
35:32
Speaker 1: it out of their relationship with Jody Arius alive. Take
35:37
Speaker 1: a listen to ABC's Ryan Owens, Sir, could you introduce
35:40
Speaker 1: yourself to the jury police. On day one of her
35:42
Speaker 1: defense Tuesday, Arius's attorneys called an ex boyfriend she dated before,
35:47
Speaker 1: Travis Alexander, the man she now admits she stabbed and
35:50
Speaker 1: shot in June of two thousand and eight. Arius says
35:53
Speaker 1: she killed the thirty year old Mormon businessmen in self defense.
35:56
Speaker 1: I because we were in love. He didn't want his
36:01
Speaker 1: face shown publicly. But Daryl Brewer told the jurors he
36:05
Speaker 1: dated the much younger Arius for four years. They even
36:08
Speaker 1: bought a house together, and the divorce dad says she
36:11
Speaker 1: was great with his son. Jody was a very responsible, caring,
36:17
Speaker 1: loving person. Did you ever see y at jealous towards
36:22
Speaker 1: women that you came into contact with? No, But on
36:26
Speaker 1: cross examination, Brewer may have done damage to his ex
36:29
Speaker 1: girlfriend's case. He told the prosecutor Arius took a nude
36:33
Speaker 1: picture of him in the shower. Remember she snapped these
36:36
Speaker 1: photos of Travis Alexander in the shower seconds before prosecutors
36:40
Speaker 1: say she started stabbing him, as I tell Kurt Nurmi,
36:44
Speaker 1: former defense lawyer for Jodi Arius at trial, an author
36:47
Speaker 1: of Trapped with miss Arius on Amazon. Better keep one
36:52
Speaker 1: eye open on the door when you're taking a shower,
36:55
Speaker 1: Take a listen again to Ryan Owen's ABC. But prosecutors
36:59
Speaker 1: alleged is a stalker who brutally attacked her x in
37:03
Speaker 1: a jealous rage when she found out he was seeing
37:05
Speaker 1: other women. Arius's defense, which is expected to start next week,
37:09
Speaker 1: will have to overcome a mountain of forensic evidence, including
37:13
Speaker 1: pictures taken on this camera found in Alexander's washing machine.
37:18
Speaker 1: Prosecutors say Arias literally tried to wash that evidence away,
37:22
Speaker 1: but on its memory card, detectives discovered not just those
37:25
Speaker 1: racy photos from the couple's sexual encounter the day of
37:28
Speaker 1: the murder, but a series of twenty shots of Alexander
37:32
Speaker 1: posing in the shower minutes before his death. Prosecutors say
37:36
Speaker 1: Arius put down the camera and picked up a knife,
37:39
Speaker 1: stabbing her unsuspecting victim. The most damning picture comes after
37:44
Speaker 1: the camera was dropped. It's too graphic for us to show,
37:48
Speaker 1: but the jury saw a shot of what appears to
37:50
Speaker 1: be Arius actually moving the bloody body. Prosecutors say she
37:54
Speaker 1: was especially cold blooded after the crime. He played this
38:00
Speaker 1: voicemail areas left on Alexander's phone a few hours after
38:04
Speaker 1: she killed him. Morbidly enough, she invited a man she
38:07
Speaker 1: knew was dead to come visit her. Okay, that's just freaky,
38:14
Speaker 1: you know, Kurt Rmy, renowned defense attorney and author of
38:18
Speaker 1: Trapped with miss Arius on Amazon. Don't you just hate
38:22
Speaker 1: it when you're murder defendant your client snaps photos at
38:28
Speaker 1: the murder saying then leaves it and the victim's washing machine.
38:33
Speaker 1: It's certainly not a dream for any defense attorney, And
38:36
Speaker 1: particularly when she was also making the assurgence of self
38:40
Speaker 1: defense she was making him. It was just another you know,
38:44
Speaker 1: nail in her coffin that unfortunately I had to be
38:48
Speaker 1: a part of her her defense. You know. So, Kurt Rmy,
38:53
Speaker 1: what was the biggest obstacle that you faced trying to
38:57
Speaker 1: defend her? The see evidence. We've talked about some of
39:02
Speaker 1: the forensic evidence, and doctor Morgan and Bobby has chimed
39:05
Speaker 1: in on the realities there, and those were the biggest,
39:09
Speaker 1: biggest obstacles. But as you know, Nancy, the sixth Amendment
39:12
Speaker 1: allows miss Arius to tell her story if it can't
39:15
Speaker 1: be proven untrue, and so she had that opportunity, and
39:19
Speaker 1: she was given that opportunity, which will be a good
39:23
Speaker 1: thing when her postconviction relief petition comes around. When what
39:27
Speaker 1: comes around when her postconviction really claiming that I was
39:30
Speaker 1: in effective assistance of counsel. Oh yeah, it's coming Bryce yourself,
39:34
Speaker 1: you know, to Bobby Chicon, former special agent FBI. When
39:40
Speaker 1: you decipher this crime scene, what do you see? Well,
39:45
Speaker 1: we see obviously anger and rage and personal animists in
39:49
Speaker 1: the most extreme sense, personal animists against this victim. And
39:54
Speaker 1: so you start looking at who had an ax to grind. Right,
39:56
Speaker 1: This wasn't robbery, it wasn't a dead collection, it wasn't
40:00
Speaker 1: any of the other things that sometimes act as a
40:03
Speaker 1: motive for murder. This was anger and rage. This was
40:06
Speaker 1: personal animists towards this victim. So we start looking at
40:09
Speaker 1: who could have had that level of anger and rage
40:13
Speaker 1: and animus towards Travis. And there's a very small people.
40:18
Speaker 1: Hopefully we none of us have that kind of person
40:20
Speaker 1: in our lives, but you know, if you do, it's
40:23
Speaker 1: probably a very small circle of people who hate you
40:26
Speaker 1: that much, and what could make them hate you? And
40:29
Speaker 1: when someone has pre incident behavior like she did in
40:32
Speaker 1: renting a car, indicating premeditation, and they have incident behavior,
40:36
Speaker 1: which is the rage and the overkill at the scene.
40:38
Speaker 1: And then they have post incident behavior, which is lying
40:41
Speaker 1: about what happened. In all three phases, everything works against
40:47
Speaker 1: Jodi Arius in this case, none of her behavior before
40:50
Speaker 1: the incident, during the incident, or after the incident helps
40:52
Speaker 1: her try to establish any sense of innocence in this crime.
40:56
Speaker 1: And do you, dud Jar Daniel Bober or your forensic psychiatrist,
41:00
Speaker 1: you've seen it all. I hate to invite you into
41:03
Speaker 1: the mind of Jody Haaris, but what is going on
41:06
Speaker 1: in there? Nancy? You see this a lot in people
41:08
Speaker 1: who have either what we call antisocial personality or borderline
41:12
Speaker 1: personality disorders. They are all people in our lives that
41:15
Speaker 1: we know, maybe there's not a lot of them that
41:17
Speaker 1: they're people that react so disproportionately. They go from zero
41:21
Speaker 1: to one thousand and a second, and they you know,
41:23
Speaker 1: they have an ax to grind against you, and they
41:26
Speaker 1: just do it in a way that is not at
41:28
Speaker 1: all congruent with you know, what you've done to them.
41:31
Speaker 1: They just feel slighted, and in this particular case, you know,
41:34
Speaker 1: she was just like a volcano of rage, a volcano
41:37
Speaker 1: of rage to Joseph Scott Morgan, Jacksonville State University forensics
41:45
Speaker 1: professor and author, why in you know, Nancy, back to
41:50
Speaker 1: what Bobby was talking about, this this idea of rage,
41:55
Speaker 1: and I hate that Travis Alexander had to go through
41:59
Speaker 1: the I'm thankful that this woman is off of the
42:03
Speaker 1: streets now. I think one of the one of the
42:05
Speaker 1: potentially most dangerous things that could happen is that she
42:09
Speaker 1: has released at a very young age back onto society
42:13
Speaker 1: because she has got some serious, serious mental problems. And
42:17
Speaker 1: I'm just looking at the forensic evidence, Nancy, to put
42:20
Speaker 1: it very bluntly, she absolutely ripped this guy to shreds.
42:26
Speaker 1: And I can't tell you how much energy, how much anger,
42:30
Speaker 1: how much rage is involved in this in order to
42:33
Speaker 1: perpetrate this kind of physical violence, this level of physical violence.
42:37
Speaker 1: I've worked organized organized crime hits before that were not
42:42
Speaker 1: this violent. It is absolutely abhorrent with us. The defense
42:48
Speaker 1: attorney for Jody Arius Kurt Narmy. When will it end? Well,
42:54
Speaker 1: that's a good question, Nancy. She has a chance to
42:57
Speaker 1: appeal to the Supreme Court to have her decision and reviewed.
43:00
Speaker 1: The state Arizona State Supreme Court. Unfortunately it can end
43:03
Speaker 1: there because she wasn't sentenced to death. That's I know
43:06
Speaker 1: a lot of people want a death sentence, but it
43:08
Speaker 1: certainly makes the appeals less tent plentiful, and she will
43:11
Speaker 1: have her petition for postconviction relief. She will claim that
43:15
Speaker 1: I was ineffective, that I didn't do certain things, like
43:17
Speaker 1: you said earlier combing over that record. But like I
43:21
Speaker 1: said a moment ago, I didn't hope her story got
43:25
Speaker 1: to be told, her descense got to be actualized in
43:28
Speaker 1: that court room. However contrary it was to the forensic evidence.
43:32
Speaker 1: So she's going to have a lot less to complain
43:35
Speaker 1: about because her defense was actualized. And like I said,
43:37
Speaker 1: that's something I look forward to because of what miss
43:41
Speaker 1: Arius's defense and everything put me through on a personal level,
43:44
Speaker 1: I'm looking forward to confronting her assertions. Very excited about it. Alexas,
43:49
Speaker 1: what is her life like behind bars? She's pretty sorry
43:52
Speaker 1: life behind bars. She is remote, sur sal but you
43:57
Speaker 1: know what, she has gosh uch cash in her commentary account,
44:01
Speaker 1: but she is able to shop too, gole Heart's content.
44:04
Speaker 1: She's buying can sardine, She's buying canned samich buying cans
44:11
Speaker 1: of beans. She also has to buy a pino to
44:13
Speaker 1: treat her stomach issues after she eats that. She is
44:17
Speaker 1: buying paint and art supply. So I guess when I
44:21
Speaker 1: said it was a little star behind bars, she's thinking
44:23
Speaker 1: the best of it. She also has a job behind bars.
44:27
Speaker 1: She's originally working cleaning toilets behind bars. Excuse me, Jackie
44:32
Speaker 1: here for some odd reason that you know, I'm gonna
44:34
Speaker 1: have to have Bober comment all that keeps up with
44:37
Speaker 1: Arias behind bars And she just posted one of her photos,
44:42
Speaker 1: her works of art, basically tracing every magazine article photos
44:48
Speaker 1: for one thousand dollars. And guess what people are buying
44:51
Speaker 1: them and men are still falling at their feet. Word
44:55
Speaker 1: to the wise, don't take a shower with Arias. Guys,
44:58
Speaker 1: if you're so into her ployees, listen to me. Okay,
45:02
Speaker 1: Round one, the state wins by what happens next. Nancy
45:08
Speaker 1: Gray's crime story, signing off Goodbye friend,