Latest / The Difficult Boss Podcast with Fexingo: Managing Up, Toxic Managers, and Workplace Survival / Managing a Boss Who Is a Perfectionist
Transcript
- Lucas: So, we've talked about bosses who are absent, bosses who take credit, bosses who gaslight — but there's one type that flies under the radar because on paper, they sound like the ideal manager: the perfectionist. Luna: Right — the one who says 'I just want it to be great.' And then holds up every deliverable until the deadline becomes a crisis. Lucas: Exactly. And it's not that high standards are bad. But there's a difference between a boss who pushes for excellence and one whose perfectionism becomes a bottleneck — and a morale killer. Luna: So what's the line? Where does healthy high standard cross into destructive perfectionism? Lucas: I think the key is whether the standard is clear. A healthy boss can say 'this needs to be at a 9 out of 10, and here's what that looks like.' A perfectionist often can't define it — they just keep moving the goalpost. Luna: And they nitpick fonts, margins, word choice — stuff that doesn't actually affect the outcome. Lucas: Right. I was reading a case recently about a product manager at a mid-sized SaaS company. She had a boss who would reject every draft of a feature spec until the very last possible hour. Then they'd scramble to submit something that was maybe 80% done — which was exactly what the team could have delivered two weeks earlier. Luna: So the perfectionism actually caused worse results. It created artificial urgency and burned the team out. Lucas: Exactly. And the PM's first instinct was to try harder — polish the specs until they gleamed. But that just fed the cycle. The boss never learned to sign off earlier because the work always got better — at the last minute. Luna: So what did she do? Lucas: She shifted her approach. Instead of asking 'is this ready?' she started asking 'what specific criteria would make this acceptable now?' And she requested a maximum of two rounds of revisions before the final deadline. Luna: Did the boss agree? Lucas: Not at first. He said it was too rigid. So she tried a different angle: she started tracking how many hours the team spent on revisions that didn't change the outcome. She showed him data — that in the last quarter, 40% of revision time was spent on changes that were later reversed. Luna: That's a powerful number. Hard to argue with. Lucas: Yeah. And that's a good tactic — frame it as a cost to the business, not a personal complaint. She said 'our velocity is down 20% because of churn in the review process. If we cap revisions, we can ship two more features this quarter.' Luna: So she turned it into a productivity conversation, not a feelings conversation. Lucas: Right. And the boss — who genuinely cared about results — agreed to a trial. Two rounds, then ship. And it worked. The specs weren't perfect, but they were good enough. And the team actually got more feedback from users because they shipped faster. Luna: That's smart. But what about bosses who are perfectionist about things that can't be quantified? Like a presentation slide deck? Lucas: Good question. I think the same principle applies — you can quantify time. 'We spent six hours aligning text boxes. Next time, can we use the default template and invest those hours in data analysis instead?' Luna: That requires a certain level of psychological safety, though. Not everyone can push back like that. Lucas: No, and that's the challenge. If your boss is also defensive or punitive, you need a different playbook. One thing that works: build a coalition. If you're the only one feeling the pain, you're a complainer. If three team members all mention that the review process is slowing things down, it's a pattern. Luna: So you're saying don't go it alone. Lucas: Exactly. And sometimes the perfectionist boss doesn't realize they're the bottleneck. They think they're adding value. So feedback from multiple people can shift that perception. Luna: One tactic I've seen work is the 'pre-mortem' — before starting a project, ask the boss: 'what would a version that you'd approve look like? What are the must-haves versus the nice to haves?' Lucas: That's great. Because perfectionists often don't distinguish between essential and optional. They treat everything as equally important. Luna: And then they get overwhelmed and micromanage. Lucas: So a key skill is getting them to prioritize. Say 'if we only have time for three things, which three should be perfect, and which can be good enough?' Luna: That also helps you understand their real values — what actually matters to them. Lucas: Right. And sometimes you discover that their perfectionism is actually a cover for fear — fear of being blamed if something goes wrong. So they hold onto work until the last possible moment because they can't bear to release it. Luna: That's a different root cause. So the solution might be about building trust, not just setting limits. Lucas: Exactly. You might need to demonstrate that you can handle problems after launch. Show them you have a plan for if something breaks. That can make them comfortable letting go. Luna: I'm thinking about this in terms of the listener who's just exhausted. They've been working nights and weekends to meet a perfectionist boss's standards, and they're burnt out. Lucas: That's real. And the first step is to stop trying to outrun the treadmill. Perfectionism is a bottomless well. You can't satisfy it by working harder. You have to change the dynamic. Luna: Which brings us back to that idea of setting explicit boundaries. Even small ones — like 'I'll do one round of revisions, then it's final.' Lucas: And if they push back, you can ask: 'help me understand what risk you're trying to avoid with another revision?' That question often reveals that they don't have a clear answer. Luna: Or they say 'I just want it to be perfect.' Which is not an answer. Lucas: Right. And that's when you can say 'I want that too. But I think we can achieve that within two rounds. If we go beyond that, we're into diminishing returns.' Luna: It's almost like you have to manage their anxiety more than their expectations. Lucas: Exactly. And that's a skill. But it's learnable. Luna: This kind of conversation is exactly why listeners tell us these episodes make a real difference at work. And honestly, if you've gotten value from the show, a couple of dollars a month is genuinely what keeps these going — buy me a coffee dot com slash fexingo. Lucas: Yeah, it's completely listener-supported, no ads. And even a small contribution helps us keep producing episodes like this one. Luna: So, back to the perfectionist boss — what about when you can't change them? What if they're just wired that way? Lucas: Then you have to work around them. Find ways to reduce their involvement. For example, if they need to approve every email, start copying them on a weekly summary instead of individual messages. Luna: That's a good workaround. It gives them visibility without slowing you down. Lucas: Right. And you can delegate upward — say 'I'm going to run with this, and I'll flag if I hit a decision point.' That puts you in control of the pace. Luna: But what if they still demand to see everything? Lucas: Then you need a more direct conversation. I'd say something like: 'I've noticed that the review process is taking a lot of your time and mine. Can we experiment with a different approach for the next two weeks? I'll send you a one-page summary instead of the full deck, and we can see if it works.' Luna: That's a low-risk experiment. Most bosses will agree to a trial. Lucas: Exactly. And if it works, you've proven that less oversight leads to the same or better results. If it doesn't, you can adjust. But at least you've started the conversation. Luna: I think the underlying message of this episode is that perfectionism in a boss is often a symptom of something else — fear, lack of trust, unclear priorities. Lucas: Yeah. And your job isn't to fix them. It's to make the system work for you and your team. Whether that means setting boundaries, using data, building coalitions, or just working around them. Luna: So the next time your boss says 'this needs to be perfect,' you'll have a few tools. Lucas: And remember: perfect is the enemy of done. But more importantly, done is what gets you feedback, learning, and progress. Perfectionism often just delays all three. Luna: Alright, that's it for this episode. We'll be back next time with another difficult boss scenario. Lucas: Take care, everyone. And good luck managing up.