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#HURDLEMOMENT: An Expert On What Is Body Liberation & How To Embrace It · Hurdle with Emily Abbate

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Speaker 1: What is one way that I can care for myself
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Speaker 1: this week? What is one thing that I can commit
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Speaker 1: to make a promise to myself to treat myself with
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Speaker 1: kindness and compassion.
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Speaker 2: Hey, everybody, Emily and Badi here, you are listening to
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Speaker 2: another installment of Hurdle Moment from Hurdle, a while NICs
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Speaker 2: focused podcast where I connect with everyone from your favorite
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Speaker 2: athletes to top experts and industry CEOs about their highest ties,
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Speaker 2: toughest moments, and everything in between. We all go through
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Speaker 2: hurdles in life, and my goal through these discussions is
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Speaker 2: to empower you to better navigate yours and move with
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Speaker 2: intention so that you can stride towards your own big
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Speaker 2: potential and of course have some fun along the way.
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Speaker 2: Today for the pod, I am chatting, I'm bringing her
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Speaker 2: back with King. She is the author of the new
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Speaker 2: book The Body Liberation Project, and that is entirely what
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Speaker 2: we are here to talk about.
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Speaker 3: For this week's episode.
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Speaker 2: Chrissy defines for us what body liberation is and how
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Speaker 2: she accomplished it herself after joining a gym at one
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Speaker 2: point with the sole goal in.
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Speaker 3: Mind to quote unquote get skinny.
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Speaker 2: It was in pursuit of that goal that she fell
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Speaker 2: into the all too common cycle of not enoughness, as
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Speaker 2: she likes to call it, and no matter what she achieved,
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Speaker 2: there was always something else that she felt like she
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Speaker 2: needed to change about her body, her appearance, and herself.
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Speaker 3: Now not the.
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Speaker 2: Case, and Chrissy shares her wisdom, her takeaways from this
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Speaker 2: beautiful journey to self acceptance and ultimately body liberation. In
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Speaker 2: our conversation today, Chrissy acknowledges that the journey toward body
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Speaker 2: liberation is examining your own privilege, acknowledge the harm you
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Speaker 2: may be causing others, and mourning your old ideas about
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Speaker 2: what a body quote unquote should look like. I'm so
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Speaker 2: happy that Christy and I were able to sit back
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Speaker 2: down in person this time after first connecting during the pandemic,
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Speaker 2: and I'm super amped for her in this new chapter.
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Speaker 2: I know that this is a conversation that will.
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Speaker 3: Resonate with many of you.
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Speaker 2: I'll make sure to link to the Body Liberation Project
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Speaker 2: in the show notes so that you can grab your
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Speaker 2: copy today. Also, if you're not yet doing so, make
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Speaker 2: sure you follow along with Hurdle over on social media.
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Speaker 2: It's at hurdle Podcast. I Am Over at Emily a
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Speaker 2: Body and the Weekly Hurdle newsletter is back this Friday.
2:39
Speaker 2: Make sure you are signed up. It is absolutely free
2:42
Speaker 2: for your subscription. So much of the same stuff you
2:45
Speaker 2: love from the show, inspiration, motivation and more directly in
2:49
Speaker 2: your inbox.
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Speaker 3: With that, let's get to hurdling today. I am sitting
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Speaker 3: down with King, She's a new author. How are we feeling.
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Speaker 1: I am feeling so so good, like amazing, amazing.
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Speaker 2: Your new book, The Body Liberation Project is out in
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Speaker 2: bookstores now. Is it totally surreal?
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Speaker 1: It is so surreal, Like every time I walk into
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Speaker 1: a bookstore and see it or people send me pictures
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Speaker 1: of it in the bookstore, I still can't believe it.
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Speaker 1: It's like my book that I wrote on a bookstore,
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Speaker 1: a bookshelf in a store.
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Speaker 3: It's wild wild.
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Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, I had you on the show. I believe
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Speaker 2: it was about maybe a year and a half ago.
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Speaker 1: Which seems like it wasn't that long. Time really flies.
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Speaker 2: This time is flying, and this time even better because
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Speaker 2: we're doing it irl. So I'm so excited to have
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Speaker 2: you in the studio. And naturally I knew with a
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Speaker 2: big book launch, you had to come in and we
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Speaker 2: had to talk about body liberation because the time is now.
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Speaker 1: Yes, I'm so excited to be here too, and I
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Speaker 1: love that we're doing it in real life. This time
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Speaker 1: is amazing.
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Speaker 3: That's so much better.
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Speaker 2: So first and foremost, let's talk about what body liberation is.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, so. I think a lot of us are
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Speaker 1: familiar with the term body positivity, which is really just
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Speaker 1: about loving and respecting your body and all of its
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Speaker 1: different sizes. And I think that body positivity is a
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Speaker 1: really good starting point for us to start to think
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Speaker 1: about our bodies differently. But how that differs, and like
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Speaker 1: what I talk about when I talk about body liberation
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Speaker 1: is really going beyond just like I love and accept
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Speaker 1: my body, but really this true understanding that at our
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Speaker 1: essence and our core, our body is just the thing
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Speaker 1: that's letting us have this human experience. It's just like
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Speaker 1: the vessel that is allowing us to do all the
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Speaker 1: incredible things that we're doing, and it doesn't make us
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Speaker 1: who we are. And so it's really about understanding that.
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Speaker 1: I think sometimes with body positivity we get this like
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Speaker 1: false sense that we're supposed to look in the mirror
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Speaker 1: every day and love everything we see, and if we
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Speaker 1: can't do that, we feel like a failure, and so
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Speaker 1: body liberation is like, no, no, no. The idea is
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Speaker 1: not that one day we're going to look in the
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Speaker 1: mirror and love everything we see. But the thing is
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Speaker 1: that we understand that our body is just the vessel, right,
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Speaker 1: and that we are inherently worthy because we exist, not
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Speaker 1: because of what we look like. And it's also about
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Speaker 1: understanding that we live in a system that is really
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Speaker 1: harmful for a lot of us in a lot of ways.
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Speaker 1: And so it's about how are we divesting from die
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Speaker 1: culture while also learning to lean into joy and appreciation
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Speaker 1: and respect with our.
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Speaker 2: Bodies harmful for us in a lot of ways. Let's
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Speaker 2: talk a little bit about that.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, So, I mean, we live in a society that
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Speaker 1: number one is hyper focused on bodies, but particularly women's bodies.
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Speaker 1: We live in a society that's hyper focused on eurostandard
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Speaker 1: extandards of beauty, right, and so for any of us
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Speaker 1: that kind of fall outside of that norm, it's really
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Speaker 1: hard for us to exist in the world and feel
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Speaker 1: like we are even capable of loving ourselves or that
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Speaker 1: we're worthy if we don't feel like we meet those standards.
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Speaker 1: And I think also when we're thinking about harmful narratives.
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Speaker 1: It's just that, like the real reality is that there
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Speaker 1: are actual privileges to living in a thinner body, Like
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Speaker 1: we have to just name that for what it is.
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Speaker 1: And so when you don't live in a body that
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Speaker 1: you feel like is what is seen as beautiful, it's
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Speaker 1: really hard to exist in the society. And I think
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Speaker 1: even when you're like, oh, die, culture is really harmful,
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Speaker 1: I don't want to participate at the same time, you're like,
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Speaker 1: but like life would feel easier maybe if I was
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Speaker 1: living in a body that looked different.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I definitely resonate with that. I mean, I
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Speaker 2: remember after losing weight back when I was in college,
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Speaker 2: I would go back to my hometown and I would
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Speaker 2: run into people and I was treated completely differently, you know,
6:17
Speaker 2: the same individuals that made me feel lesser than when
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Speaker 2: I was younger, all of a sudden wanted to get
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Speaker 2: to know me, wanted to know what was going on,
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Speaker 2: and it just made me feel really uncomfortable.
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Speaker 1: Absolutely, And I like the first major weight loss like
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Speaker 1: attempt that I did was when I was like sixteen
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Speaker 1: or seventeen and someone at school had made fun of
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Speaker 1: or made a joke about my body in front of
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Speaker 1: like my peers and made me really uncomfortable. And so
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Speaker 1: because of that, I decided to go on like a
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Speaker 1: huge diet like Adkins diet for you all who remember
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Speaker 1: that the original Kido the og and so I did
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Speaker 1: that diet. I lost a lot of weight, and then
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Speaker 1: what happened is the same thing, Like my peers were like,
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Speaker 1: oh my gosh, she looks so great, tell me how
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Speaker 1: you did it. And I was like, oh, people are
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Speaker 1: going to like me better when I have a certain
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Speaker 1: type of body. And like for me, that was like
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Speaker 1: the starting point of like yo yo dieting for like
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Speaker 1: a lot of years.
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Speaker 3: Totally, yeah, totally.
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Speaker 2: It's just like absolutely heartbreaking. Also because there are other
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Speaker 2: sides to the coin as well that we don't often
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Speaker 2: talk about. People that may be naturally thin are also
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Speaker 2: shamed for being naturally thin at times in ways that
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Speaker 2: we don't always think about. You assume that they're happy
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Speaker 2: to be that way, but maybe they do want to
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Speaker 2: put on weight, and that isn't a conversation that we're
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Speaker 2: having at all.
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Speaker 1: I mean absolutely, And one of the things I talk
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Speaker 1: about in the book is just like even the like
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Speaker 1: BBL era, right where people like this body type has
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Speaker 1: been idealized as the way to be, and then people
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Speaker 1: are like having surgery right to add more curves to
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Speaker 1: their body. And so one of the things I think
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Speaker 1: is really important about body liberation is like also this
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Speaker 1: understanding that all bodies are created differently. We look different,
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Speaker 1: we have different skin color, different hair color, different eye color,
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Speaker 1: and also our bodies are shaped and created differently intentionally.
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Speaker 1: And so it's when we have this, like I con
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Speaker 1: continually moving target of what's the end body, it really
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Speaker 1: is hard for all of us to manage those expectstions.
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Speaker 1: And no matter what size or shape you are, we
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Speaker 1: all struggle with body image issues definitely.
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Speaker 2: So why would you say it was important for you
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Speaker 2: to write this book now?
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Speaker 1: To be honest, I knew that I wanted to write
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Speaker 1: a book for a while, but I never was like
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Speaker 1: I just knew it was gonna happen when I was
8:15
Speaker 1: supposed to happen, And when this book happened, it was
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Speaker 1: really a very natural progression. People ask me all the
8:21
Speaker 1: time about publishing and how they do it, and I'm like,
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Speaker 1: I will tell you my experience, but I've been telling
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Speaker 1: you this is not the way it normally happens, and
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Speaker 1: so everything was just like lined up, Like I seriously
8:30
Speaker 1: feel like the stars are aligned. I'm like, oh, this
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Speaker 1: is happening now. I do think it like when I
8:35
Speaker 1: look at it back now, I do feel like it
8:37
Speaker 1: was the perfect time. I think I have felt like
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Speaker 1: in the past couple of years we had seen like
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Speaker 1: a resurgence of like body positivity and body acceptance, and
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Speaker 1: I felt like we were really like making progress as
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Speaker 1: a culture. And then I think like, right now we're
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Speaker 1: seeing like a resurgence of diet culture with Ecosmpic and
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Speaker 1: you know, Boogal Faber Mobile and all of these things.
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Speaker 1: I also think that that's very intentional, because again, the
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Speaker 1: diet industry needs to make us feel like we're not
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Speaker 1: okay to keep making money and profiting from our insecurities,
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Speaker 1: and so I do feel like it's the perfect time
9:03
Speaker 1: to be coming out in the midst of like so
9:05
Speaker 1: much messaging that we are in fact that we do
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Speaker 1: need to change ourselves, and we're getting that like literally
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Speaker 1: every day everywhere. So I don't know that this was
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Speaker 1: like the time I was like I decided to do it.
9:16
Speaker 1: I feel like this is very wuu, but I feel
9:18
Speaker 1: like the universe decided it was time for you to
9:20
Speaker 1: write a book, and I knew that I wanted to
9:22
Speaker 1: write the book at some point.
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Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, you know, it's one of those like
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Speaker 2: everything happens for you kind of moments, like whether it
9:28
Speaker 2: is good stuff or bad stuff. It's hard to come
9:31
Speaker 2: to that realization or understanding sometimes, but when you get
9:35
Speaker 2: into this place where you're like, wow, that thing that
9:37
Speaker 2: happened like six years ago really did happen for me.
9:39
Speaker 2: So the thing that happened three years ago and then
9:41
Speaker 2: last month, it all kind of tumbles into each other.
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Speaker 1: Absolutely. I think about it all the time, Like I
9:45
Speaker 1: think about all the nose that I got, or like
9:46
Speaker 1: things that didn't happen the way that I wanted, And
9:48
Speaker 1: then in hindsight, I was like, oh no, that was
9:50
Speaker 1: like really for my highest good. Sometimes hard to realize
9:53
Speaker 1: that in the moment.
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Speaker 3: Though you mentioned it before, the term diet culture.
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Speaker 2: How does diet culture play into the concept body liberation?
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Speaker 1: Yeah, so diet culture is really just like an ideal
10:04
Speaker 1: belief system that essentially is that like thinness is the
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Speaker 1: ideal body type and that we should be aspiring to that.
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Speaker 1: It also like demonizes food and restricts certain types of food,
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Speaker 1: and so it really puts us in this place of
10:15
Speaker 1: like chasing thinness. And that relates to body liberation, because
10:20
Speaker 1: the goal of body liberation for me and for hopefully
10:23
Speaker 1: all of the folks who read this book is that
10:26
Speaker 1: we don't spend the rest of our lives obsessing about
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Speaker 1: our bodies. And I think that's so important because I
10:31
Speaker 1: think about and one of the things that was really
10:33
Speaker 1: important for me to help people see in this book
10:36
Speaker 1: and through my own personal story, is that I spent years,
10:39
Speaker 1: literally years and years of my life obsessing about my body,
10:42
Speaker 1: obsessing about what I was eating, how my exercise schedule was,
10:45
Speaker 1: Like I would turn down social events, I didn't want
10:47
Speaker 1: to go on vacation, Like everything literally revolved around how
10:50
Speaker 1: can I keep my body small? And when you're in
10:53
Speaker 1: that place, like it is very energetically draining, like literally
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Speaker 1: all of my metical capacity was going to that. And
10:59
Speaker 1: so when I think of about when I talked about
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Speaker 1: in the book about breaking up with diet culture and
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Speaker 1: moving into liberation, it literally that word liberation means freedom,
11:06
Speaker 1: and it really truly set me free, and it like
11:09
Speaker 1: gave me back off this energy that I could go
11:11
Speaker 1: and create whatever I'm supposed to be doing in this world.
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Speaker 1: And one of the things I always say is that
11:15
Speaker 1: we all have very specific magic to add to this world,
11:17
Speaker 1: and it has nothing to do with what we look like.
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Speaker 1: And when I felt like I was liberated, I was like, Oh,
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Speaker 1: there's like so many things I want to do that
11:23
Speaker 1: have nothing to do with what I look like. And
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Speaker 1: I had that energy and that creativity back into my
11:28
Speaker 1: life to do that.
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Speaker 2: When did you feel like you achieved quote unquote body
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Speaker 2: liberation and where were you?
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Speaker 1: Yeah, So the moment I was like, oh, I've done
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Speaker 1: the thing is was in twenty eighteen or twenty nineteen.
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Speaker 1: It's a woman. I really realized it. I was on
11:45
Speaker 1: a trip in Madrid. I was in Spain, and I
11:49
Speaker 1: had been invited by a woman I had met one time,
11:52
Speaker 1: like didn't really know her well, and she invited me
11:54
Speaker 1: to go with like a group of like seven other women.
11:56
Speaker 1: So I didn't know any of these people, and past
11:59
Speaker 1: me would have been like so anxious about something like that.
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Speaker 1: Number One, I'm like, are people going to judge me?
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Speaker 1: Are they going to like be talking about what I
12:05
Speaker 1: look like. I'm gonna have to eat food for a
12:08
Speaker 1: whole week I have no control over. And I went
12:11
Speaker 1: to this trip and I first off like ended up
12:14
Speaker 1: being the most amazing group of people, people I'm still
12:16
Speaker 1: friends with today. But there was this one evening we
12:18
Speaker 1: were like sitting around like this amazing like if you've
12:21
Speaker 1: been to Spain, the food is like top notch, is amazing,
12:23
Speaker 1: and yes, so we have like this all this amazing
12:26
Speaker 1: food and we're drinking all this amazing wine and I
12:28
Speaker 1: was sitting there just like, Wow, I'm having the best time.
12:30
Speaker 1: This is just so great. And it was like almost
12:32
Speaker 1: like one of those out of body experiences because I
12:34
Speaker 1: was like I like like was out of the experience
12:36
Speaker 1: and I was like looking at myself engaging in this,
12:39
Speaker 1: and I was like, oh, like I couldn't have done
12:40
Speaker 1: this five years ago and had this beautiful experience with
12:43
Speaker 1: these people, and like, not once was I worried about
12:45
Speaker 1: what I was eating or what people are going to
12:47
Speaker 1: think about me. I was just so present and I
12:49
Speaker 1: created so many amazing memories. And in the past, my focus,
12:53
Speaker 1: even when I was in experiences was always like are
12:56
Speaker 1: people judging me? How do I look? What am I eating?
12:58
Speaker 1: And I just never was fully there and that was
13:01
Speaker 1: the moment I was like, Oh, this is what freedom
13:03
Speaker 1: feels like.
13:03
Speaker 2: Yeah, can you give us an example of like the
13:06
Speaker 2: before times?
13:07
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, let's.
13:08
Speaker 1: Talk about Yes. So I had this experience I was
13:11
Speaker 1: referred to as my rock about a moment when I
13:12
Speaker 1: was like, oh, girl, you got to fix something like quick.
13:15
Speaker 1: So I used to be married and my in laws
13:19
Speaker 1: were having like a weekend like family thing, and it
13:23
Speaker 1: was like at a water park for the weekend, and
13:25
Speaker 1: I was dreading it, like up to the moment, dreading
13:28
Speaker 1: it because I'm like, oh, great, they're not gonna they're
13:30
Speaker 1: gonna have like food that I don't want to eat.
13:32
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna be I have to be in a swimsuit.
13:34
Speaker 1: And mind you, I was in the thinnest body had
13:36
Speaker 1: ever been in as an adult at that point. So
13:39
Speaker 1: I went to the weekend. I was so self conscious
13:42
Speaker 1: of my swimsuit. Although like, this is the thing about
13:45
Speaker 1: body image, right, it like doesn't matter what other people think.
13:47
Speaker 1: It matters what you think. Because I'm literally in the
13:49
Speaker 1: water park and people are like coming up to me
13:51
Speaker 1: to like ask me what my workout plan is, and
13:53
Speaker 1: oh my god, you look so great, and like the
13:55
Speaker 1: whole time, I'm like trying to second my stomach more
13:57
Speaker 1: and I'm like obsessing about what I look like. So anyway,
14:00
Speaker 1: I packed my food for the weekend because it's like
14:02
Speaker 1: the best thing I can do to make my fee
14:04
Speaker 1: my safe, feel myself feel safe is to bring as
14:07
Speaker 1: many of my meals as I can. So we're at
14:09
Speaker 1: the water park. We're taking like a lunch break, and
14:12
Speaker 1: we go to this restaurant and I pull out my
14:14
Speaker 1: cooler and I have like this sad meal that's been
14:17
Speaker 1: sitting in the car all day, and so I tell
14:19
Speaker 1: my partner at the time, I'm like, you guys, just
14:21
Speaker 1: go ahead. I'm going to eat in the car because
14:23
Speaker 1: you know, I have to eat my meal. And my
14:25
Speaker 1: in laws are like, why isn't she coming inside, And
14:27
Speaker 1: He's like, oh, she just wants to be healthy, and
14:30
Speaker 1: like he was very supportive of wherever I was in
14:33
Speaker 1: that point in life, and so they asked the restaurant
14:35
Speaker 1: if I could bring my food in. The restaurant obliged,
14:37
Speaker 1: So I brought my meal in. I'm eating like this
14:39
Speaker 1: sad meal. It's like cold, and the sitting there all
14:41
Speaker 1: day and I'm sitting around and I'm watching everyone order
14:44
Speaker 1: whatever they want, and food's coming out and it smells
14:46
Speaker 1: so good and everyone's just eating and they're not even
14:48
Speaker 1: thinking about it, they're just joying. And I'm like, wow,
14:51
Speaker 1: this is so miserable, Like I can't even have a
14:54
Speaker 1: meal without freaking out about it, and this like is
14:57
Speaker 1: not living life, Like this is just really really sad.
15:00
Speaker 1: And that was when I was like, Okay, if I
15:01
Speaker 1: don't change something, I'm going to spend the rest of
15:03
Speaker 1: my life like this. Because I had a quote unquote
15:07
Speaker 1: achieved what I was trying to achieve, right, Like, I
15:09
Speaker 1: lost the way I changed my body, and he was
15:11
Speaker 1: probably more miserable than I had been before. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
15:14
Speaker 2: And so when you reflect on that experience, now, how
15:17
Speaker 2: does it make you feel?
15:19
Speaker 1: I mean, I just have so much compassion for that
15:21
Speaker 1: version of myself. And that's one of the things I
15:23
Speaker 1: talk about in the book too, is that, like, you know,
15:25
Speaker 1: it's when you're on the other side, it's easy to
15:27
Speaker 1: be like, oh, just like there's so much to life
15:30
Speaker 1: more than this, and it's like, but no, I was
15:32
Speaker 1: in that place for a really long time and for years,
15:35
Speaker 1: and I just have so much compassion for that version
15:37
Speaker 1: of myself, and sometimes I get upset, though not upsets myself,
15:41
Speaker 1: but like angry at the systems because I'm like I
15:43
Speaker 1: lost so much time to like die culture, and so
15:46
Speaker 1: there's like that aspect of it too. But I think
15:48
Speaker 1: for all of us, like, no matter where we are
15:50
Speaker 1: in our journey, like self, compassion is so huge, is
15:52
Speaker 1: so important.
15:53
Speaker 2: Can you share a little bit about the process of
15:56
Speaker 2: learning how to enjoy food and what that looked like
15:59
Speaker 2: for you?
16:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was actually, you know, harder than maybe I
16:03
Speaker 1: don't know, maybe it's not hard to it's it's I
16:05
Speaker 1: think for me. Like, so for all that time, I
16:08
Speaker 1: was like religiously tracking macros, Like I was really really
16:11
Speaker 1: intense about my macro counting, and so when I decided
16:14
Speaker 1: that I wanted to make a change, the first thing
16:16
Speaker 1: I did was like, Okay, I'm gonna stop counting macros. However,
16:19
Speaker 1: if you've been counting macros for like years and years
16:21
Speaker 1: on end, you know what you're eating, right, Like, it's
16:23
Speaker 1: really easy to like calculate it in your head. And
16:25
Speaker 1: so for me, it was like doing really small things
16:28
Speaker 1: at first, like, for example, like I always used to
16:31
Speaker 1: use a sugar free creamer only, and then I or
16:33
Speaker 1: no creamer, and so then I was like, Okay, I
16:36
Speaker 1: can add a little bit of cream to my coffee,
16:38
Speaker 1: Like let's just do that. That feels like something that
16:40
Speaker 1: is doable and attainable. And then I would just like
16:43
Speaker 1: slowly add another thing and slowly like really acclimate to
16:47
Speaker 1: myself to like back to this place of self trust,
16:49
Speaker 1: because I think with that culture we learn, we lose
16:52
Speaker 1: the self trust, right, Like we are looking to everyone
16:55
Speaker 1: else to tell us what to eat, how to exercise.
16:57
Speaker 1: I did meal plans for years on end that people
16:59
Speaker 1: gave me as well, Like I didn't even like the
17:01
Speaker 1: food I was eating. I was just eating it because
17:03
Speaker 1: that's what they told me. And so I was really
17:05
Speaker 1: like learning to slowly trust myself again with food and
17:07
Speaker 1: to trust my body to know that my body you
17:09
Speaker 1: will tell me what it likes and what it doesn't like,
17:11
Speaker 1: and that I am capable of that.
17:13
Speaker 3: Yeah.
17:14
Speaker 2: Wow, super challenging though, to get to that place where
17:17
Speaker 2: you feel like you can trust yourself, especially after being
17:20
Speaker 2: so regimented for so long. So after you started to
17:25
Speaker 2: slowly add things into your diet, was there a time
17:30
Speaker 2: that you recall like finally feeling a little bit more
17:32
Speaker 2: at peace.
17:34
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean slowly and surely I started to notice that.
17:36
Speaker 1: But I think what changed for me is when I
17:38
Speaker 1: started noticing what I started to feel like more at
17:41
Speaker 1: peace is like, you know, one of the things that
17:44
Speaker 1: it's also scary about, like that process is also recognizing
17:47
Speaker 1: that when you start to make changes, there is a
17:49
Speaker 1: chance that your body is going to change, and that
17:51
Speaker 1: is also something that you have to accept. So when
17:53
Speaker 1: that started to happen and I was like, Okay, these
17:57
Speaker 1: genes are a little snug known and I'm going to
17:59
Speaker 1: have to get something different to wear. And when I
18:02
Speaker 1: noticed that, it didn't bother me anymore, and I was like,
18:04
Speaker 1: oh this because I was also like enjoying my life
18:08
Speaker 1: again too, And I was like, okay, my body changed,
18:11
Speaker 1: so I got a size bigger in my jeans. I'm
18:13
Speaker 1: totally fine, Everything's okay. And also like I'm starting to
18:17
Speaker 1: feel like I'm enjoying life again, Like I'm not having
18:19
Speaker 1: anxiety about going to dinner, I'm not having anxiety about
18:22
Speaker 1: hanging out with friends. That feels really nice.
18:25
Speaker 2: Yeah, I can totally relate to that feels really nice.
18:27
Speaker 2: You know, I had a suit I wanted to wear
18:30
Speaker 2: for a big interview last year, and I had a
18:34
Speaker 2: size like medium pant and I had so much resistance
18:37
Speaker 2: over like ordering the large just to have because the
18:40
Speaker 2: medium fit. But I was like, if I sit down
18:42
Speaker 2: in this, I might not feel as stellar as I
18:44
Speaker 2: want to. And I ordered the large, and I remember
18:47
Speaker 2: feeling so confident that day walking onto the stage and
18:50
Speaker 2: feeling good in my body and in that suit, and like,
18:53
Speaker 2: thank god, I stopped worrying about I stopped letting some
18:57
Speaker 2: little tag tell me how I should feel about myself,
19:01
Speaker 2: Like there is absolutely nothing wrong with wearing the large,
19:04
Speaker 2: but we are made by society to feel as though
19:09
Speaker 2: it is.
19:09
Speaker 1: But it's so true. Everything you're saying is so true.
19:11
Speaker 1: And it's also like what you said is so important
19:13
Speaker 1: is that nothing makes you feel confident is like living,
19:16
Speaker 1: like wearing clothes that feel good on your body, Like
19:18
Speaker 1: that is the thing, regardless of the size, right, that
19:21
Speaker 1: makes you feel good and that makes you feel confident.
19:24
Speaker 1: And it's like who, Like it's easy. I'm not saying
19:26
Speaker 1: this slippingly, but like also like who cares about what
19:29
Speaker 1: that size says? It's like how you feel that is
19:32
Speaker 1: really what's important.
19:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, So there's definitely a school of thought or people
19:36
Speaker 2: that might be listening to this that here, Okay, it's
19:39
Speaker 2: good to feel liberated in your body. We want everyone
19:43
Speaker 2: to have and be able to present that level of confidence.
19:46
Speaker 2: But is there a point where it gets too far?
19:49
Speaker 2: Is there a point where we go too far and
19:51
Speaker 2: we should be concerned about just how maybe liberated we
19:54
Speaker 2: are considering some of our other habits.
19:57
Speaker 3: What do you have to say to that?
19:58
Speaker 1: Absolutely, I get this all the time, So I have
20:00
Speaker 1: a lot of thoughts on this. I think the first
20:03
Speaker 1: thing I'll start with is that when we're having that conversation,
20:06
Speaker 1: I always say, we have to like also think about
20:08
Speaker 1: our own personal biases, right, because oftentimes the conversation about like,
20:13
Speaker 1: you know, I'm just concerned about your health. We say
20:16
Speaker 1: that to people when they look a certain way. For example,
20:18
Speaker 1: so like you see someone in a larger body eating
20:20
Speaker 1: quote unquote junk food and you're like, I'm not don't care.
20:22
Speaker 1: I'm just saying it because I'm concerned about your health.
20:25
Speaker 1: But also time we see someone like in a smaller
20:26
Speaker 1: body doing that and we're like, wow, I'm so jealous.
20:28
Speaker 1: I wish I could eat everything and not lose weight too. Right,
20:30
Speaker 1: So I think we always have to like step back
20:32
Speaker 1: and just think about our own personal biases. That's number one,
20:35
Speaker 1: and number two. I think it's also really important to
20:38
Speaker 1: understand that body liberation is to me, not about like
20:42
Speaker 1: you don't care for yourself, so you just like throw
20:44
Speaker 1: all caution to the wind and you don't care about
20:46
Speaker 1: your healthy habits or any of those things, whatever those
20:48
Speaker 1: mean to you. Body liberation is about knowing that you
20:51
Speaker 1: are worthy of and deserving of respect, regardless of what
20:54
Speaker 1: your body looks like. And also when for me anyways,
20:57
Speaker 1: like body liberation also is like I do the things
21:01
Speaker 1: to take care of myself that feel good for me
21:02
Speaker 1: because I love and care for myself. So it's not
21:04
Speaker 1: about throwing caution into the wind and just saying like
21:07
Speaker 1: forget anything. It's like, actually, like what are the decisions
21:09
Speaker 1: and how am I living in a way that makes
21:11
Speaker 1: me feel healthy and nourish and energize and focusing on
21:14
Speaker 1: those habits and not weight loss is the metric, right,
21:17
Speaker 1: because when weight loss was my metric, I wasn't in.
21:20
Speaker 1: My nervous system was a mess, Like there's so many
21:22
Speaker 1: things that were actually not good, but I looked good
21:24
Speaker 1: on the outside, and so I think it's recognizing that
21:27
Speaker 1: we can't look at someone determine like what their quote
21:29
Speaker 1: unquote health is, and that being in a larger body
21:32
Speaker 1: doesn't equal unhealthy versus and likewise, being in a smaller
21:35
Speaker 1: body doesn't mean you're healthy. And so it's like, actually,
21:38
Speaker 1: just like, how are we taking care of ourselves and
21:40
Speaker 1: nourishing ourselves the best that we can personally?
21:42
Speaker 2: How are we taking care of ourselves and nourishing ourselves
21:45
Speaker 2: the best we can personally? Okay, someone's listening to this,
21:49
Speaker 2: they want to get liberated?
21:50
Speaker 3: Yeah, how do.
21:51
Speaker 1: They do it?
21:53
Speaker 3: Give me the roll?
21:54
Speaker 1: I think one. I'mill say, definitely read the book. There's
21:56
Speaker 1: a lot in there. But I think when we're thinking
21:59
Speaker 1: about how do you get liberated? I think that we
22:01
Speaker 1: The number one thing I always tell people is the
22:03
Speaker 1: number one is that it's actually truly a journey, right,
22:07
Speaker 1: And although we're talking about my journey that took me
22:09
Speaker 1: years to get there. And so I say, you know,
22:12
Speaker 1: start to understand the impact of the die culture is
22:15
Speaker 1: having on you in your life personally, and start to
22:19
Speaker 1: think about like, how is it that you really want
22:20
Speaker 1: to feel in your day to day life, and then
22:22
Speaker 1: start taking small actionable steps towards that, And I think again,
22:26
Speaker 1: body positivity sometimes is like this hyper focus on self
22:29
Speaker 1: love and this hyper you know, you see a lot
22:31
Speaker 1: of like people under the on social media with the
22:33
Speaker 1: hashtag body positivity, like just showing pictures in their swimsuit,
22:36
Speaker 1: and like those are things that are important that serves
22:39
Speaker 1: you personally. But I think thinking about it practically is
22:42
Speaker 1: a lot more than just like looking in the mirror
22:43
Speaker 1: and saying I love myself, And it's really starting to
22:45
Speaker 1: understand your relationship with yourself, understand like where are you
22:49
Speaker 1: really deriving your worthiness from and starting to have some
22:51
Speaker 1: of those like compassionately having those questions with yourself or
22:55
Speaker 1: those conversations with yourself and really interrogating that and then saying,
22:58
Speaker 1: like how what are this that I can start to
23:01
Speaker 1: take personally to break up with diet culture because that
23:03
Speaker 1: journey for all of us is going to look very different.
23:06
Speaker 1: And I think a big important part is like who
23:09
Speaker 1: you're surrounding yourself with and not just like in person, yes,
23:13
Speaker 1: but also like what you're consuming, Like there is nothing
23:15
Speaker 1: that will like mess with your body image more than
23:18
Speaker 1: scrolling through social media and seeing a bunch of like
23:21
Speaker 1: die culture talk or any of those things. So like
23:23
Speaker 1: being really mindful of what you're consuming and who you're following,
23:27
Speaker 1: and reading books about The first book I ever read
23:29
Speaker 1: on the topic of body image was The Body's Not
23:32
Speaker 1: an Apology by Sonya Renee Taylor, and like really helped
23:35
Speaker 1: me to start thinking about things differently. So reading books
23:37
Speaker 1: and like following people who are talking about these things
23:40
Speaker 1: in positive ways, and being patient and kind and passionate
23:43
Speaker 1: to yourself throughout the soul process is like so important.
23:47
Speaker 3: What helped you be patient?
23:50
Speaker 1: Well, I think I always remember that took me a
23:51
Speaker 1: long time, Like, you know, I was invested in shrinking
23:55
Speaker 1: my body for over a decade. So I can't expect
23:58
Speaker 1: myself to get out of that mindset in you know,
24:00
Speaker 1: two months, Like it's just not true, it's not And
24:03
Speaker 1: so it just takes a long time to divest from that.
24:06
Speaker 1: And we just need to show ourselves grace and compassion.
24:09
Speaker 1: And I always say, like we are so deserving of
24:12
Speaker 1: the compassion that we show other people. Like and I
24:13
Speaker 1: talk about in the book too, is like how critical
24:16
Speaker 1: we are of ourselves sometimes in terms of our bodies.
24:18
Speaker 1: Are just like in terms of wanting to fix things
24:20
Speaker 1: right away, and it's like, oh, if we treated other
24:22
Speaker 1: people like that, we wouldn't have any friends, right, And
24:25
Speaker 1: so it's like, how can we show that same kindness
24:27
Speaker 1: and compassion to ourselves every single day.
24:29
Speaker 3: Every single day?
24:29
Speaker 2: You know, this reminds me of the fact that I'm
24:32
Speaker 2: dealing with planter fasciatus right now.
24:33
Speaker 3: It's so annoying.
24:34
Speaker 2: But that was an overuse injury that didn't come overnight.
24:38
Speaker 3: And so it's not going to go away in one month, right.
24:41
Speaker 2: Like this is like years and years of running right absolutely,
24:44
Speaker 2: so just the exact same kind of timeline with like
24:47
Speaker 2: you're talking about navigating being obsessed with your weight and size.
24:52
Speaker 2: It's going to take time, it's going to take work.
24:55
Speaker 2: I also love what you said about consumption and who
24:58
Speaker 2: we are following on social media. I think that oftentime
25:01
Speaker 2: you're worried about how someone may perceive, like, oh, well,
25:04
Speaker 2: I don't want them to know that I unfollow them
25:06
Speaker 2: or I feel bad doing X or y. But like,
25:08
Speaker 2: you got to put yourself first, right, You got to
25:11
Speaker 2: start with you, because if you don't put your own
25:13
Speaker 2: oxygen mask on, then you're not going to be able
25:15
Speaker 2: to show up in so many of the other things
25:16
Speaker 2: that you have going on, whether it be for yourself personally,
25:19
Speaker 2: your friends, your family, your work, and so on.
25:22
Speaker 1: One hundred percent. I always tell people if I'm triggering
25:24
Speaker 1: you and follow me like, I'm not going to take
25:25
Speaker 1: it personally, right like, because it is about your own
25:28
Speaker 1: mental health as the priority, and like that has to
25:30
Speaker 1: be the thing that matters. Who cares for someone thing
25:32
Speaker 1: and else you can always mute if you really feel
25:34
Speaker 1: like so strongly about it, but literally, like, take care
25:37
Speaker 1: of your mental health is a priority, and that's the
25:39
Speaker 1: most important thing.
25:40
Speaker 2: We all just have to own our own narrative, right Like,
25:42
Speaker 2: your perspective is your reality, so shape it. Do whatever
25:46
Speaker 2: you can to make yourself feel good because you're the
25:49
Speaker 2: one that's living your every single day. Right You're the
25:52
Speaker 2: person that you're talking to the most every single day.
25:54
Speaker 2: So what is that conversation? Like, how does it sound?
25:57
Speaker 2: How can it be more positive? These are all things
25:59
Speaker 2: that you have the opportunit unity to take ownership over.
26:02
Speaker 1: I literally say that in the book, like, your relationship
26:04
Speaker 1: with yourself is the most important relationship because you are
26:06
Speaker 1: with yourself every minute of every day, and we have
26:10
Speaker 1: to prioritize that relationship with ourselves more than any other ones.
26:13
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I have really worked hard to love myself.
26:16
Speaker 2: But sometimes I'm like, yo, can we just take a
26:17
Speaker 2: beat today?
26:18
Speaker 1: Yeah?
26:18
Speaker 2: And that's and that's how you don't want to overthink
26:21
Speaker 2: I think that we get into this. I'm definitely like
26:23
Speaker 2: an overthinker. And so some days I'm like, how can
26:26
Speaker 2: Emily rest for Emily today? Like how can we me myself?
26:30
Speaker 2: And I take a break to get back into my body,
26:34
Speaker 2: to get back into these these positive affirmations, talking to
26:37
Speaker 2: myself kindly, Like there is not a single person that
26:40
Speaker 2: goes through a span of time without at one point
26:43
Speaker 2: or another. I believe the statistic is something like eighty
26:46
Speaker 2: to eighty five percent of our thoughts every day are negative.
26:49
Speaker 2: It's like insane, right, So, like, you get to choose
26:51
Speaker 2: how you're greeting the world, and by doing that, you
26:53
Speaker 2: choose how the world greets you. Energy attracts like energy, etcetera, etcetera.
26:58
Speaker 1: I totally agree for that.
27:00
Speaker 2: Okay, So, as we are hopefully moving toward liberation, we
27:05
Speaker 2: talked about working on the way that we speak to
27:07
Speaker 2: ourselves and really coming to a place that is with
27:11
Speaker 2: Karen concern for our body. What other any other tips
27:15
Speaker 2: or tricks or tools that you would recommend someone to
27:17
Speaker 2: use on their journey toward body liberation.
27:20
Speaker 1: You know, one of the things I talk about. I
27:22
Speaker 1: have a whole chapter dedicated to its boundaries, because when
27:26
Speaker 1: we start to work on a relationship with body image
27:28
Speaker 1: and we start to heal that and repair that, the
27:30
Speaker 1: reality is we still exist in the world in which
27:32
Speaker 1: a lot of people haven't done that work. And so like,
27:35
Speaker 1: setting boundaries from a place of love is really important
27:39
Speaker 1: in our friend circles and relationships with our families. I
27:42
Speaker 1: think a lot of people make comments about our bodies,
27:44
Speaker 1: oftentimes well intentioned, but I think just really being honest
27:47
Speaker 1: and vulnerable people like this is something I'm working on,
27:49
Speaker 1: and like, I thank you for your concern, but I
27:51
Speaker 1: don't want to discuss my body or I don't want
27:54
Speaker 1: to talk about dieting when we're together, and like, really
27:57
Speaker 1: being intentional with conversations about people about that beefully people
28:00
Speaker 1: can respect our boundaries. I think it's really helpful because again,
28:03
Speaker 1: when we're living in a world and we see dike
28:04
Speaker 1: culture everywhere. We see it in the media, we see
28:07
Speaker 1: it on billboards, we see it on TV, the last
28:09
Speaker 1: thing we need is to like have it in our
28:10
Speaker 1: personal space as well. And so I think really talking
28:13
Speaker 1: to people about that and just like having that conversation
28:16
Speaker 1: is really important. So I think that's part of it.
28:18
Speaker 1: When you're working on this relationship with body image, Like
28:22
Speaker 1: instead of saying, like I need to fix all of
28:24
Speaker 1: the I need to do, like, what is one way
28:26
Speaker 1: that I can care for myself this week? What is
28:27
Speaker 1: one thing that I can commit to make a promise
28:29
Speaker 1: to myself to treat myself with myself with kindness and compassion.
28:33
Speaker 1: What is you know, when I hear myself make a
28:36
Speaker 1: disparaging mark about myself, how can I change that in
28:38
Speaker 1: the moment and like make small actional steps versus like
28:41
Speaker 1: I'm going to overhaul everything and repair everything, because as
28:44
Speaker 1: we already stated, it takes time. And also show yourself
28:47
Speaker 1: compassion when like you know, you'll have weeks when you're
28:50
Speaker 1: like I'm flying, Hi, I love myself, this is great,
28:53
Speaker 1: and then the next week you're like, oh, I hate
28:54
Speaker 1: this thing about myself. Recognize that that's also part of
28:57
Speaker 1: the journey. It's not heal. The process to healing your relationship,
29:00
Speaker 1: it's not linear, and so in those moments recognize again,
29:03
Speaker 1: I'm doing the best I can today, And how can
29:05
Speaker 1: I love myself a little bit harder today because I
29:07
Speaker 1: need a little extra love and care.
29:08
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love that idea of like choosing one thing
29:11
Speaker 2: and being realistic about like what actually feels possible for
29:15
Speaker 2: you And the coaching certification I'm finishing up right now.
29:18
Speaker 2: We do we set aim smart goals, and we are
29:21
Speaker 2: many of us are familiar with the term smart justific measurable, attainable, realistic,
29:26
Speaker 2: and time bound. But aim is setting goals that are
29:28
Speaker 2: either like what is let's say like acceptable, so the
29:32
Speaker 2: lowest form of that goal, what is inspirational, so like
29:35
Speaker 2: maybe the max amount of that goal, and what's the medium?
29:37
Speaker 2: Where can you meet yourself in the middle so that
29:39
Speaker 2: you can be realistic about where your bandwidth is right?
29:42
Speaker 2: And so to be honest with yourself can be really challenging,
29:45
Speaker 2: especially when you do have such like inspirational aspirational goals
29:48
Speaker 2: in your life. But that is where compassion really begins, right,
29:52
Speaker 2: is being honest with where you're at. Because until you
29:55
Speaker 2: get honest with how you feel, what thoughts you're having,
29:59
Speaker 2: you be able to do any more that work.
30:01
Speaker 1: No, absolutely not. And for me, when I was like
30:05
Speaker 1: over exercising, I was literally spending eighteen hours a week
30:08
Speaker 1: in the gym, three hours, six days a week. Right,
30:10
Speaker 1: So when I was like, oh, okay, I need to
30:12
Speaker 1: change something, I wasn't like I'm gonna cut out to
30:15
Speaker 1: three days a week because that wasn't realistic. I'm like, okay,
30:18
Speaker 1: can I cut from six to five days? Can I
30:20
Speaker 1: start there? Will I feel okay with that? And that
30:22
Speaker 1: was my starting point, right, And then I was like, okay,
30:24
Speaker 1: well maybe instead of three hours a day, how does
30:27
Speaker 1: two and a half hours feel? Right? And so like
30:29
Speaker 1: really making like you're saying what feels attainable that I
30:33
Speaker 1: will still feel like safe, also feel doable, and that
30:36
Speaker 1: I can actually commit to doing yeah.
30:38
Speaker 3: And I think a lot of the time.
30:40
Speaker 2: Something else that can be challenging is that you probably
30:43
Speaker 2: had really good relationships with people or friends at the gym, right,
30:46
Speaker 2: and you are scared about leaving an environment that you've
30:49
Speaker 2: cultivated because you don't want to become suddenly like an outsider, rightly,
30:53
Speaker 2: how would you navigate that?
30:54
Speaker 1: That was hard though, because the culture of the gym
30:56
Speaker 1: that I was in also is like everything on my behavior,
31:00
Speaker 1: like my diet, dieting behaviors, my X raise behaviors were
31:03
Speaker 1: like celebrated and praised within the gym. It wasn't seen
31:05
Speaker 1: as like a problem. And so when I started to
31:08
Speaker 1: like kind of try to change my mindset, that was
31:11
Speaker 1: really difficult to navigate, actually, because I'm like, oh, these
31:13
Speaker 1: are my people, though, this is like my community. I
31:15
Speaker 1: don't want to lose that. I don't want to feel
31:18
Speaker 1: I don't want them to like judge me for not
31:20
Speaker 1: being as committed as I was before. And I think
31:24
Speaker 1: because I like slowly progressed, like degress, I get regressed,
31:28
Speaker 1: I slowly regress from that, it didn't feel as hard.
31:31
Speaker 1: But eventually I did stop going to the gym, and
31:33
Speaker 1: not because they did anything wrong. It just didn't feel
31:35
Speaker 1: like a fit for me anymore. And I that was
31:38
Speaker 1: when I was living in Wisconsin, was before I moved
31:40
Speaker 1: to Brooklyn. I still like casually keep in touch with
31:42
Speaker 1: some of those folks, but definitely the relationships aren't like
31:44
Speaker 1: they were before.
31:45
Speaker 2: Right, And you have to be honest with yourself about
31:48
Speaker 2: how that makes you feel, right, because true or false,
31:50
Speaker 2: you have other relationships in your life right now that
31:52
Speaker 2: are very fulfilling and that's like the you know, the
31:55
Speaker 2: silver lining on the other side is like when you're
31:57
Speaker 2: in the moment, when you're in the middle of it,
31:59
Speaker 2: it's hard to see what else will happen for you.
32:02
Speaker 2: But for you to take that ownership over what you
32:04
Speaker 2: needed and then slowly walk away from something knowing that
32:07
Speaker 2: maybe it wasn't serving you anymore, that's really impressive and
32:10
Speaker 2: super empowering.
32:11
Speaker 1: And honestly, like, that's all of life, right, not just
32:14
Speaker 1: in like that's in all areas of our lives. But
32:17
Speaker 1: you're right, it's so hard we're in those moments of transition.
32:19
Speaker 1: It's so difficult. Like I can look at so many
32:22
Speaker 1: areas of my life and I didn't really know it
32:24
Speaker 1: was on the other side. But now that I'm here,
32:26
Speaker 1: I'm like, Okay, that was all worth it, But it's
32:28
Speaker 1: so hard to navigate when you're in it.
32:30
Speaker 3: What other exciting stuff do you have coming up, Chrissy.
32:33
Speaker 1: Honestly, so I don't know really what I was telling
32:36
Speaker 1: you before this. I'm like, I'm trying to, like, literally,
32:39
Speaker 1: the book came out a week ago, so I'm doing
32:41
Speaker 1: a bunch of like speaking engagements and stuff like that
32:42
Speaker 1: related to the book. That's all super exciting. But I
32:45
Speaker 1: was telling you before we started the interview, that's been
32:47
Speaker 1: one week and I'm really trying to like not start
32:49
Speaker 1: asking what's next yet, just give myself a little bit
32:53
Speaker 1: of time. And I'm sure you know how that is. Right,
32:55
Speaker 1: you do this big thing, You're like, Okay, what's the
32:57
Speaker 1: next thing? So right now I'm just like, all right,
33:00
Speaker 1: take a beat doing stuff related to the book, and
33:02
Speaker 1: then we'll see what happens after that. I know that
33:04
Speaker 1: I do want to write another book, but but we're
33:07
Speaker 1: not We're not there yet, so take a beat.
33:09
Speaker 2: So my trick to the problem where I'm like, oh,
33:11
Speaker 2: you should celebrate is just stack them right on top
33:13
Speaker 2: of each other, right.
33:15
Speaker 1: You know that's how do you even stop?
33:17
Speaker 3: Right? Just keep going like completely crash. Trust me.
33:20
Speaker 2: I have like after all of these work trips that
33:23
Speaker 2: I have back to back, I literally might leave my
33:25
Speaker 2: phone in Brooklyn. I booked a trip to Miami for
33:27
Speaker 2: seventy two hours debating.
33:30
Speaker 3: Leaving the phone. Don't know how safe that is.
33:32
Speaker 2: I think I'm anxious about leaving my phone in New York,
33:34
Speaker 2: but it will definitely stay in the hotel room.
33:36
Speaker 3: Absolutely heard that, Damn sure. Chrissy.
33:39
Speaker 2: For those people that don't follow you yet on social,
33:41
Speaker 2: give us the info. Where can they buy The Body
33:43
Speaker 2: Liberation Project?
33:44
Speaker 1: Fill me in absolutely so on social, on Instagram, TikTok
33:47
Speaker 1: and Twitter. It's I am Christie King. The book, The
33:50
Speaker 1: By Libration Project is available anywhere books are sold.
33:53
Speaker 3: We love it.
33:53
Speaker 2: We'll link to it in the show notes as well.
33:55
Speaker 2: You know how to find Hurdle. It's over at Hurdle Podcast.
33:57
Speaker 2: I am over at Emily a body Hurdle conquered. Catch
34:01
Speaker 2: you guys next time.
34:16
Speaker 3: M