Latest / Discovering Bitcoin / Discovering Bitcoin with Asanoha

Transcript

Discovering Bitcoin with Asanoha · Discovering Bitcoin

• 0:01
  Yeah, I see the world through an entirely different lens.
• 0:06
  It doesn't just give you confidence, but it gives you
• 0:08
  hope. Take like we're.
• 0:11
  Squandering our energy, our life force.
• 0:14
  So Bitcoin is changing that. For me, it's like it's healing
• 0:18
  energy. It gives you a kind of of a
• 0:23
  stand feeling, right? Deep and deep and deep in the
• 0:30
  immortal works of the doors, the time.
• 0:33
  To hesitate us through discovering.
• 1:00
  Arsenal, what's going on, man? How are you?
• 1:05
  I'm good, I'm good. I'm stoked to have you on, man.
• 1:08
  You've been busy, you've been spinning plates, you've been
• 1:11
  getting a very cool thing happening.
• 1:15
  And I got to say straight off the bat here, I noticed on Nosta
• 1:20
  the other day, you got some proofs out, like some actual
• 1:24
  pages printed, stacked, ready to, ready to inspect, ready to,
• 1:30
  to combine and put together. And having worked in that
• 1:34
  industry for a little while, I can, I can feel the excitement.
• 1:39
  There's nothing better than holding the thing that you've
• 1:42
  been working on for such a long time in your hands, looking at
• 1:45
  it with your own eyes. It's pretty.
• 1:47
  It's pretty cool. Yeah, it was very, very exciting
• 1:53
  to get some photographs from the printers and some some
• 1:58
  photograph evidence that we're actually doing this.
• 2:02
  You know, overall, everybody's been, you know, amazingly
• 2:05
  supportive. And I've sold a whole lot of
• 2:09
  magazines and books here on a proof of not even proof of
• 2:14
  concept. I guess I just just word of
• 2:17
  trust. So it's been really it's it's
• 2:21
  been actually pretty magical and miraculous the the amount of pre
• 2:27
  sales that people have have made on just an idea.
• 2:33
  And so it was very it did. It did feel like comforting and,
• 2:38
  and was very exciting for me to be able to post some photographs
• 2:42
  and be like, look, we're, we're actually printing a magazine.
• 2:45
  Like, you know, 'cause I feel, I feel like I've been saying it's
• 2:48
  going to the printers. It's going to the printers for,
• 2:51
  for a couple months now and it's coming soon and for a while now.
• 2:56
  So yeah. Yeah.
• 2:58
  Well, so for anyone listening, we're we're talking about the
• 3:01
  forthcoming first edition, the Genesis edition of the Bitcoin
• 3:05
  Art Magazine, which was basically your little baby, your
• 3:10
  idea, right? And I don't know if anyone's
• 3:12
  been in the space long enough, they would have seen your
• 3:15
  artwork around with those Satoshi masks is probably the
• 3:19
  most recognizable of your artworks.
• 3:23
  But yeah, it's, it's like one thing to have the idea, it's a
• 3:27
  whole other ball game to actually execute and deliver,
• 3:32
  you know, and that's, that's what you're in the middle of
• 3:34
  doing. And it's, it's exciting, man.
• 3:37
  You've got some incredible artists featured in this first,
• 3:43
  in this first magazine. I mean, Marcus, what's his name?
• 3:48
  Marcus. Connor, Marcus.
• 3:50
  Marcus Connor. Marcus Connor, I mean his, his,
• 3:55
  his, his, his artwork, his Bitcoin depictions are kind of
• 3:58
  pretty iconic in space. I'm a huge fan of Kanuto or I
• 4:04
  don't know how to pronounce that, but those sort of weaved
• 4:08
  mental space sort of transaction looking things.
• 4:11
  Yeah, he does the the coin visual, visual, laser cut visual
• 4:16
  representations, mental representations of coin.
• 4:19
  Joints. Coin joints, yeah, it's.
• 4:21
  Pretty, pretty, pretty amazing. They're beautiful.
• 4:24
  Yeah. So congratulations on that, man.
• 4:26
  It's, it's, it's, it's another quality thing that's coming out
• 4:31
  of this Bitcoin ecosystem that's emerging from the ground up and
• 4:35
  it's, it's a beautiful thing. It is, it's been a, it, it's
• 4:42
  been, it's been a really amazing process.
• 4:45
  I definitely did not think it was going to be as much work as
• 4:49
  it was, you know, let's make a, let's make a magazine, he said.
• 4:54
  And I kind of, I kind of was like, I'll, I'll do this, you
• 4:57
  know, this will be a side project and it's absolutely
• 5:00
  consumed me. But I, I couldn't be happier
• 5:03
  about it. And I had the, the turn up from
• 5:06
  the artists. You know, I'm, I, I, it kind of
• 5:10
  feels like it was all meant to be.
• 5:11
  I think I would been around just long enough making Bitcoin art
• 5:15
  that I built, you know, just just the right amount of trust
• 5:19
  and connections and was able to, it was actually crazy.
• 5:25
  I, I made a post, hey, who wants to be in, in the world's first
• 5:29
  Bitcoin art magazine? And I, I had, I think it was
• 5:33
  within like two or three days, I had about 100 artists.
• 5:36
  So that was. You know.
• 5:38
  Super, super cool and, and super bullish and, and, and I got a
• 5:44
  bunch of the top artists in there.
• 5:45
  So I've got, you know, fractal and crib Brecky von Bitcoin.
• 5:51
  You mentioned Marcus Connor, who's one of the most OG Bitcoin
• 5:55
  artists I had Marcus was Marcus Connor.
• 5:59
  Actually, I believe he he helped Bitcoin magazine with their like
• 6:04
  logo back in the day. So he, he, he's been around
• 6:07
  since a long time Bitcoin coaster guy many people are
• 6:11
  familiar with in one form or another.
• 6:14
  And Canuto, we've got Bitcoin Apex, we've got Cypherpunk, now
• 6:20
  we've got who else? Huh, Chief Monkey.
• 6:24
  Just Chief. Monkey.
• 6:26
  Very colorful and pretty. I love those little.
• 6:30
  Yeah, so Chief Monkey, big shout out to Chief Monkey.
• 6:33
  He actually, he actually donated some.
• 6:38
  He donated a a a very a very modest and handsome sum of
• 6:46
  funding to help make this happen.
• 6:48
  Legend so a huge. Shout out to Chief Monkey and he
• 6:52
  was, you know, if anybody doesn't know, he's the creator
• 6:54
  of Plebeian Market, Plebeian Market, Plebeian Market.
• 6:58
  And he was around for the 1st. I believe his art art piece was
• 7:05
  the first piece that Scarce City, the Bitcoin art auction
• 7:08
  house, ever auctioned. So he was there for the
• 7:10
  inception of Scarce City and there's like an honorary
• 7:13
  founding member of that. And so he's also a honorary
• 7:18
  founding member of Bitcoin Art magazine.
• 7:20
  And so, yeah. And we've got, we've got a bunch
• 7:24
  of other people. I won't list them all right now,
• 7:26
  but we have over 36 artists and we have over 150 pages in the
• 7:32
  magazine and we have over 60 pages of old page art.
• 7:36
  Damn. And so I really tried to
• 7:40
  maximize the artwork and, and emphasize the artwork.
• 7:44
  And I want this, you know, to be an art, you know, more of a,
• 7:48
  more of a art journal or an art book than a magazine.
• 7:51
  I just, I just called it a magazine, but very gonna be
• 7:55
  very, very exciting. Yeah, yeah.
• 7:58
  It's very exciting. It's got a bit of a bit of high
• 8:01
  end sort of that premium aspect to it.
• 8:04
  I being in the, in, in the old publishing game, there's levels
• 8:11
  and scales to, you know, certain publications and the dream was
• 8:16
  always to get published in one of the, one of the finer
• 8:20
  journals, which it did once, which was cool.
• 8:23
  But like, that's the, that's the tippy top.
• 8:27
  That's the stuff where like 'cause magazines, no one buys a
• 8:30
  fucking magazine nowadays. I mean, I maybe they do.
• 8:32
  Maybe there's, there's people out there that still like new
• 8:35
  idea in Woman's Day. I don't suppose you know what
• 8:38
  those magazines are, but the, the ones that are actual are
• 8:43
  pieces of art and like for the long term, you know, you can
• 8:46
  stack them on your shelf and, and refer back to them in
• 8:50
  10/15/20 years time. And the content that's in there
• 8:53
  is still super relevant. It's not just chip paper by the
• 8:57
  next day. Yeah, yeah, I, you know, I, I
• 9:04
  haven't. Well, I, I got, yeah, we, we,
• 9:08
  what we've done, what we did was we did 4 different tiers.
• 9:12
  So we're doing a base magazine that's unnumbered and then we're
• 9:15
  doing a parallel magazine that's got like a gold oil cover, hand
• 9:19
  numbered and sign situation. And then we're doing actually a
• 9:24
  fine art book hardcover. And then we're doing 2
• 9:28
  variations of that, one super high end limited edition of 21
• 9:32
  and then one that'll still be very nice, a little bit less
• 9:36
  fancy. And those will be a limited
• 9:38
  edition of 121. So the goal is, you know, to,
• 9:43
  you know, we're making a collectible along with the
• 9:46
  magazine. And I have a feeling that even
• 9:49
  the, the base magazine that will become quite collectible.
• 9:52
  As you know, at least especially here in the beginning, we're,
• 9:56
  we're only going to be printing so many.
• 9:58
  So although the base magazine's not numbered, we're going to cap
• 10:03
  the print amount at some point and we will announce how many
• 10:06
  were printed. And so I think it will, I think
• 10:10
  it will be, I think it'll be quite, quite the collectible
• 10:13
  item, you know, putting it really into that category of art
• 10:17
  in and of itself. And it's not just a magazine.
• 10:21
  You know, we're going with premium materials for everything
• 10:23
  from the base magazine up to the patrons edition fine art book.
• 10:27
  And I actually, it's really exciting.
• 10:32
  I got Annabelle Baza, who is the former creative director and
• 10:37
  direct design director of Bitcoin magazine.
• 10:42
  She's no longer working with them, I don't think, but she
• 10:48
  hand built the last about 20 issues of Bitcoin magazine.
• 10:54
  So she she came on to help me out a little more towards the
• 10:58
  end. And and we actually, you know,
• 10:59
  revamp the whole magazine and book all over again for the, you
• 11:06
  know, third or fourth time over this last six months.
• 11:09
  But so it's, it's it's going to be pretty, it's pretty darn
• 11:12
  polished. And it's been, you know, it's
• 11:15
  had final, final touches from an extremely talented and
• 11:20
  professional, you know, publication designer.
• 11:25
  So I think it's I think we're going to knock it out the park.
• 11:29
  Fingers crossed. Knock on wood.
• 11:32
  I just I dig the ambition like you got to you got to aim super
• 11:37
  high. And I think even just having
• 11:39
  going for a hardcover, and I know you limited them up, but I
• 11:42
  mean, that is a, a, a, a, a lift in and of itself just to try.
• 11:47
  And it's one thing to produce, you know, the magazine, the
• 11:52
  journal, but then to amplify it a little bit more, you've got
• 11:56
  the hardcover as you were talking about the patron
• 11:59
  edition. And then you've even got like a
• 12:02
  gold foil cover, which I guess stands to reason given your
• 12:06
  artwork with the Satoshi mag. But like it's, it's just like
• 12:10
  the extra value adds that. It's kind of seem simple, but
• 12:15
  yeah, no. Yeah, it's it's where where we
• 12:20
  had the magazine is at print right now, which will be the
• 12:24
  base on numbered magazine, the art or the the art journal,
• 12:28
  Bitcoin art magazine. And then we have the gold foil
• 12:31
  magazine is there that print and we're currently working on the
• 12:34
  final finishing, you know, touches and finished choices for
• 12:39
  the two book options. And the books have all of the
• 12:42
  same content, artistic content as the magazine.
• 12:47
  So it has all the words and photographs of art, but we've
• 12:50
  we've omitted the advertisement and a little bit of the more
• 12:54
  magaziney, I would say content from the books, so that the two
• 12:59
  book options really will be a fine art book, you know, fine
• 13:03
  art coffee table book. And then the magazine will be in
• 13:08
  all reality, much more, I would say, of an art journal and
• 13:12
  which, you know, as far as the naming of it.
• 13:16
  I, I went with Bitcoin art magazine because it just seemed
• 13:21
  obvious and nobody had done it. But, you know, and, and I could
• 13:26
  have gone with something more along the lines of the Bitcoin
• 13:29
  art journal. But you know, magazine, I feel
• 13:34
  like everybody, everybody, it, it, it just, I don't know.
• 13:39
  It just said is. What it is real clear.
• 13:42
  And it was pretty crazy. The domain was available.
• 13:44
  So Bitcoin artmagazine.com was I, I got that which I was, you
• 13:50
  know, the fact that that was available at the domain address
• 13:54
  was pretty amazing. So I, I just, I just took it and
• 13:57
  we ran with it. So the the hardcover books will
• 14:00
  be, you know, the title will be Bitcoin Art Genesis Edition as
• 14:05
  opposed to Bitcoin Art Magazine Genesis Edition.
• 14:09
  No, I like, I like Bitcoin Art magazine and then you know, it,
• 14:14
  it, it, it just rolls off the tongue a lot better.
• 14:17
  Plus you can shorten it to an acronym of BAM, which is cool.
• 14:21
  So we wouldn't be here. We wouldn't have gotten this
• 14:24
  far. You certainly wouldn't have had
• 14:27
  you not discovered Bitcoin. So I got to ask the question,
• 14:31
  how did you discover Bitcoin? So I discovered Bitcoin first in
• 14:40
  2017, and I was working on a hemp farm.
• 14:46
  I was working on a cannabis farm in the Pacific Northwest of the
• 14:51
  United States, and a friend of mine paid me for some work in
• 14:55
  Bitcoin. And I'm not going to say how
• 14:58
  much it was, but it was enough that I deeply regret having sold
• 15:02
  any of it. Of course, I, I did, I did, I
• 15:07
  did unfortunately sell the everybody has that one story.
• 15:14
  I, I definitely sold most of it. You know, I, if I, if I had have
• 15:20
  kept it, I, I wouldn't, you know, I wouldn't be retired or
• 15:23
  anything right now. It wasn't that much, but it, it
• 15:25
  was, it was enough that it, you know, it definitely stings a
• 15:29
  little every time I think about it, but I, I just, you know, it,
• 15:33
  it's interesting. On the one hand, I think it was
• 15:36
  kind of it, it was all right. I got, I guess there's a lot of
• 15:40
  people who come to Bitcoin and the concepts, ideas, the rabbit
• 15:44
  holes you go down are all new. And then there's a lot of people
• 15:47
  who come to Bitcoin who, you know, for more or less have
• 15:51
  always been Bitcoiners, and I feel like I kind of fall into
• 15:55
  that category. So, you know, IA lot of the the
• 15:59
  rabbit holes I I had already been down.
• 16:02
  Unfortunately, I had never never found Bitcoin, but when I did,
• 16:07
  you know, find out about it, I was I, I kind of, you know, I
• 16:11
  was like, oh, here, this is the answer to like all these
• 16:13
  questions that I've been asking and that I you know, how do you
• 16:18
  say tinfoil subject that I've been aware of and, you know,
• 16:23
  studying to different degrees for years now.
• 16:26
  And so I just, I, I, I treated the Bitcoin as money and I spent
• 16:32
  it. And then from 2017 to 2021, I
• 16:37
  was, I was in and out and, and I don't think I really grokked it
• 16:40
  yet or had that aha moment, you know, I definitely had a bag or
• 16:44
  two of shit coins and kind of was in and out.
• 16:50
  I, I, you know, had I, I bought some more Bitcoin a couple times
• 16:55
  and then I sold it or I spent it, I should say.
• 17:01
  And, and I didn't, I didn't fully understand what it was.
• 17:04
  And, you know, I don't know why that was.
• 17:07
  I think I just didn't do enough. I just didn't, I like I had, I
• 17:10
  didn't really fall down the Bitcoin rabbit hole, which would
• 17:15
  have been to my advantage if I had of.
• 17:17
  But it all takes us, you know, the time we get, it takes to get
• 17:20
  it. And it was in the 2020-2021 bull
• 17:25
  run. A good friend of mine said you,
• 17:27
  you know, she was, she had been gone, like got deeper into
• 17:32
  Bitcoin Twitter and had gone further down the rabbit hole.
• 17:35
  Originally, I had actually introduced her to it back in
• 17:38
  2017, but it was 2021. She was like, hey, man, you've
• 17:43
  really got to like, you got to check this.
• 17:46
  Like, you know, you got to like, yeah, like you got to like, like
• 17:49
  watch some of these videos. Here's some like YouTube videos,
• 17:52
  kind of you know, like like check this out and I kind of got
• 17:58
  like I would say, I don't, I don't want to say back into
• 18:01
  Bitcoin, but I, I, I had this aha moment and I don't, I don't
• 18:05
  remember the exact time or the exact reason or point, but
• 18:09
  suddenly it just clicked and, and she had been on Bitcoin
• 18:13
  Twitter and said, hey, there's, there's this kind of like whole
• 18:16
  little art scene, Bitcoin art scene and you should make some
• 18:19
  Bitcoin art. And I had been doing a geometric
• 18:23
  artwork, which is a was kind of the passion of mine and reason I
• 18:28
  started making art work for the kind of art I wanted to make
• 18:31
  when I started making art. And so I, I, I made some Bitcoin
• 18:36
  art and it's, it's kind of funny.
• 18:37
  I actually, I hand drew a guy my own rendition of a Guy Fawkes
• 18:41
  mask that is like my most recognized popular design.
• 18:48
  And it was pretty basic as far as like conceptual or intricate
• 18:53
  Bitcoin art goes. But you know, everybody loves
• 18:56
  the guy Fox mask. And I found out about scarcity
• 19:01
  and I submitted some art and I sold it.
• 19:04
  And so that was, you know, super exciting and fun and inspiring.
• 19:10
  And I made it out to the, I believe it was the 2022, this is
• 19:14
  in 20/21. It was the 2022 Miami conference
• 19:18
  and somehow, you know, got in touch with through Scarce City
• 19:25
  through Bitcoin Twitter. Dennis, who curates the gallery
• 19:28
  over there or curates the gallery every year for the
• 19:31
  Bitcoin conferences. And, and I went out there and I
• 19:35
  had a little booth and you know, I've been making Bitcoin art and
• 19:39
  involved in Bitcoin art every day since.
• 19:42
  So good. Unbelievable.
• 19:45
  I'm looking through. I mean, I think Merrick used to,
• 19:51
  I don't know if he still does the pod dabbling path, but he
• 19:54
  brought a bunch of actually, no, he think he tried to bring a
• 19:57
  bunch of your artworks to Bush bash and they they got delayed
• 20:03
  in the post or something like that, which was a pain in the
• 20:06
  ass. So I was looking forward to
• 20:07
  seeing seeing some up close. But that whole notion of getting
• 20:15
  paid in Bitcoin, I mean, when you when you got paid in Bitcoin
• 20:18
  by that guy on that hemp farm. Were you like, Oh no, can I just
• 20:22
  take dollars? Like what?
• 20:24
  What was that conversation like? You know, did you, did he have
• 20:27
  to convince you to accept the Bitcoin?
• 20:31
  No, no, not, not at all. You know, I, I think, you know,
• 20:35
  I, I was, I was well aware of, I guess a lot of the just problems
• 20:43
  with the financial system. But I, I, you know, I don't, I'm
• 20:48
  like, I'm from like a tree hugging hippie kid background
• 20:51
  surfer. And you know, so I, I not like
• 20:56
  any like, you know, economic, academic kind of really
• 21:01
  background for the most part. But so I, but, but I knew, you
• 21:04
  know, I, I, you know, I, I, I'd seen a bunch of, you know, I've
• 21:08
  been down the conspiracy rabbit holes and you know, you could
• 21:11
  just tell there's, there's, if you're, you know, if you're 1/2
• 21:14
  perceptive person, you can tell that there's something wrong
• 21:16
  with the way the world works and things are not as they seem and,
• 21:20
  and there's something wrong broken with them.
• 21:22
  You know, there's something wrong with money.
• 21:24
  And, you know, and, and being a rebellious, a little more on the
• 21:29
  rebellious side of things, counterculture, surfing,
• 21:34
  skating, hemp industry, you know, anti big government, anti
• 21:40
  big pharma, like all, all, all of the, the good stuff.
• 21:45
  I, I think I just, you know, I, my friend just said, Hey, this
• 21:49
  is like this is Internet money. I I probably heard of Bitcoin
• 21:53
  before that, but I hadn't really put, you know, like I didn't see
• 21:57
  anything that like, you know, I don't know.
• 22:00
  It was even then it was still pretty like nobody, nobody
• 22:04
  talked about it or knew about it really until you meet that
• 22:07
  person who's a bit pointer. And they were like, hey, check
• 22:09
  it out. This is Internet money.
• 22:10
  This is how it works. This is how much it's worth.
• 22:13
  And you can just like send it back and forth on your phone.
• 22:15
  And I was like, OK, and I can, you know, like spend it or sell
• 22:19
  it. And they were, they were like,
• 22:22
  yeah. And they like showed me it was,
• 22:25
  they were like here, like download my Celium wallet.
• 22:29
  Shout out to anybody who used Mycelium wallet.
• 22:32
  And it's like a self custody 1 of it's one of the older self
• 22:34
  custody wallets. You could just get on your phone
• 22:39
  and he was like, here, download this.
• 22:40
  And I'm going to, I'll send it to you right now.
• 22:42
  And I was like, OK. And then, you know, I, I
• 22:45
  probably was like, this is like, you know, I probably googled it
• 22:48
  or, or searched it a little bit for a minute online just to make
• 22:51
  sure he wasn't trying to pulling over on me or whatever.
• 22:53
  But you know, I, but at that point there, there was enough,
• 22:57
  you know, people knew enough about it that it wasn't it, it,
• 23:00
  you know, I wasn't like nervous or it wasn't like scary or
• 23:03
  something. I, you know, so, so I, I, yeah,
• 23:07
  I just, I was like, cool, OK, it's Internet money, I'll take
• 23:09
  it, OK. And I, I definitely didn't
• 23:13
  understand the concept of huddling it or, or that it was,
• 23:17
  you know, the going up forever. So I think I, I think I thought
• 23:24
  of it more. I think I, you know, I feel like
• 23:26
  it was kind of big. It was actually kind of based in
• 23:28
  Bitcoin or of me. I, I really just thought of it
• 23:30
  as money. I was like, this is a, for this
• 23:32
  is a form of money. And and, you know, then I went
• 23:38
  forward and spent it. Or it's, you know, peer-to-peer,
• 23:41
  sold it, spent it says it in the white paper.
• 23:44
  It's literally the first sentence other people forget
• 23:49
  but. But spend and replace it, you
• 23:51
  know, kind of well. Yeah, for sure.
• 23:53
  I mean. There's.
• 23:54
  There's adoption cycles that we've got to overcome, you know,
• 23:57
  the collectible, the store value, blah, blah, blah.
• 24:00
  It's it's yeah. But I mean, you were using it
• 24:03
  for what it is and it's permissionless peer-to-peer
• 24:06
  digital cash. That's, that's what it is.
• 24:09
  That's it. I'm curious though, like so in
• 24:13
  that counterculture sort of mindset, I suppose.
• 24:18
  And within that, within that community that, that culture,
• 24:23
  I'm surprised because I knew a lot of those people up to sort
• 24:26
  of 2020-2021 and then they all just shifted into like they
• 24:32
  turned into retards and, and now they're all like state loving
• 24:35
  cocks or something. It's weird.
• 24:38
  I I, I kind of count myself in that cult, in that cult, No, in
• 24:42
  that culture of like, you know, always, always been suspicious.
• 24:47
  And, but I was kind of centre left more than than centre
• 24:51
  right. And as everything just unfolded,
• 24:56
  I found myself drifting. And I remember like, like
• 24:59
  reading or listening to what I would consider to be relatively
• 25:03
  conservative kind of opinions. I mean, like, well, hang on, I
• 25:06
  kind of agree with that. And then all my couple of close
• 25:09
  friends were kind of drifting the other way and I was like,
• 25:11
  how does this align with all the shit we used to do as kids?
• 25:15
  What? Anyway, so you, you're one of
• 25:18
  the ones that actually had a brain and kept kept thinking for
• 25:23
  yourself. So cool.
• 25:24
  God bless. Yeah, no, I, you know, I was
• 25:28
  also, I would say, well, I don't know about Centre, you know,
• 25:33
  it's so hard. Everything became so the over
• 25:35
  the last eight years, everything became so convoluted.
• 25:38
  I mean for sure. You know, it was, I, I, I would
• 25:41
  say that I came from classic liberals with a libertarian
• 25:46
  emphasis. And, and so, you know, I, it's
• 25:51
  interesting 'cause it's like, you know, center left then, but
• 25:54
  like what we were then wasn't center left the day.
• 25:59
  What you know, if you, if you said center left the day it, it,
• 26:03
  it, you know, it, it was very different just 8 and just 10
• 26:07
  years ago, you know, so and yeah, I mean, the same thing,
• 26:12
  you know, that it, it was, there was a huge rift throughout,
• 26:14
  through, throughout the entire world.
• 26:17
  And I mean, there was, you know, there was I, I got, I don't know
• 26:21
  how how much you want to get into it, but I mean, there was,
• 26:23
  you know, it was crimes against humanity that were committed and
• 26:28
  there was, you know, you know what, who knows?
• 26:32
  We'll see in 30 years what the results.
• 26:34
  Yeah, well, I mean the. Whole thing were like how how
• 26:37
  much of A genocide it was, but there was like a mass
• 26:41
  extermination, you know, infertilize it deep in
• 26:45
  infertilization kind of, you know, the the whole thing was
• 26:48
  crazy like it. Was insane.
• 26:50
  It was insane and and it and it's absolutely split, you know,
• 26:54
  the entire community that it sounds like we were both from
• 26:58
  right down the middle. And yeah, a lot of people fell
• 27:01
  on on the state. You know what, what I would now
• 27:05
  call the state love and cut side of things.
• 27:08
  And that was pretty shocking. But I, I was lucky enough or I'm
• 27:13
  lucky enough to have a lot of friends and family that were
• 27:16
  smart enough to not fall on that side of it.
• 27:20
  And so I mean, yeah, as far as you know, as far as the Yeah, it
• 27:28
  it was, it was shocking seeing people that I've known since I
• 27:31
  was very young who I thought were, you know, and like who I
• 27:37
  thought were anti big pharma or anti government mandates like,
• 27:43
  you know, be. Capitulate pro capitulate in the
• 27:46
  knee like. Yeah, so it's it's just fucking
• 27:50
  traumatizing. And and so, you know, but no,
• 27:54
  there was a there was AII know a good amount of people that that,
• 27:56
  you know, kind of held strong and we shifted course and, you
• 27:59
  know, now I would consider myself very conservative, right
• 28:01
  leaning libertarian, center center right to, you know,
• 28:05
  centre libertarian or, you know, anarcho capitalist or Bitcoiner.
• 28:12
  So. I've done away with all of those
• 28:14
  terms anyways, like left and right.
• 28:18
  It's coercivists of all interest in my opinion.
• 28:20
  You know, you are the coerce to do something or you voluntarily
• 28:25
  do something. And that's that's that's the
• 28:28
  paradigm I work with now. Yeah, as as a, as a term to
• 28:33
  convey to people, you know, in normies or just in, in general.
• 28:38
  I really do. I do like libertarian.
• 28:41
  I think it's very, very simple really, you know, and that's
• 28:45
  just everybody's has a sovereign right to do whatever they want
• 28:49
  as long as they do not infringe upon the rights of others, you
• 28:53
  know, or force or defraud or fraud other people, you know, So
• 28:59
  it's, it's pretty basic. It, you know, you can do
• 29:01
  whatever you want. Just don't tell me what to do.
• 29:03
  And I think that that's nice And, and you know, so, but you
• 29:08
  know, in the in that industry and in, in counter cultures, I
• 29:12
  think as far as like accepting Bitcoin as money, probably part
• 29:16
  of the reason that I so readily accepted it as money is I would
• 29:21
  say that you know it and it's not, it's not just in the, you
• 29:26
  know, hemp industry, but it's in, in a lot of places in the
• 29:31
  world and a lot of cultures in the world.
• 29:34
  You accept anything as money. You know, I people, you know, in
• 29:38
  the hemp industry specifically, you know, you would take a car
• 29:41
  as payment, You'll take a, you know, medals, bullion, whatever,
• 29:45
  you know, you'll, you know, you'll take take anything that's
• 29:49
  pay. I'll take surfboards.
• 29:49
  You can pay me in surfboards like, you know, there's, there's
• 29:53
  very much a, you know, out there in the world and the in the Gray
• 29:57
  markets and the black markets and in the pleb plebian plebian
• 30:01
  class of existence, you know, barter is still very alive and
• 30:07
  well. So I think that was probably
• 30:09
  part of my, you know, very easy willingness to take Bitcoin as
• 30:15
  payment. This is I was like, OK, this is
• 30:17
  worth X amount and somebody, there's other people out there
• 30:21
  who will, you know, accept it. OK, cool.
• 30:23
  Let's go. You know, so I, I would have
• 30:25
  taken gold, I would have taken, you know, like I said, because
• 30:29
  taking surfboards. So definitely that's probably,
• 30:35
  yeah, I would say that's probably probably part of the
• 30:38
  reason that it that it was easily, I like understood it
• 30:42
  easily at least the fact that it was a form of a valid form of
• 30:46
  payment. Break just to say, if you're
• 30:49
  enjoying the show and digging what you hear, please consider
• 30:52
  supporting discovering Bitcoin by shooting boost and sending or
• 30:55
  zapping the show. Some stats.
• 30:58
  If you're listening via a podcasting 2 point O app such as
• 31:01
  Fountain Pod, Verse or Breeze, it's easier done than said.
• 31:05
  All you got to do is tap the boost button or set an amount of
• 31:08
  stats to stream per minute while you're listening.
• 31:11
  Alternatively, if you want to ZAP me direct via lightning
• 31:15
  address, please send zaps and sats or zaps of sats in support
• 31:20
  of the show to Discovering Bitcoin at primal.net.
• 31:25
  Thank you for listening and thank you for your support.
• 31:30
  How has discovering Bitcoin changed you?
• 31:42
  Well, I'm probably about three years for the most part sober.
• 31:48
  So that I would say is a very, you know, material physical
• 31:54
  change. You know, it, it didn't.
• 31:58
  I, I, I feel coming from a lot of the belief systems and you
• 32:03
  know, the culture that I came from, I grew up eating organic
• 32:08
  food and surfing and, you know, understanding health was
• 32:13
  important and I've been blessed with a pretty balanced right,
• 32:17
  left brain perspective on the world.
• 32:20
  I, I wouldn't, I don't feel as though Bitcoins necessarily
• 32:24
  changed me so much as I know it has for many people where it's
• 32:28
  been quite a, quite a, a large shift.
• 32:31
  I mean, I definitely experienced like a very cathartic process as
• 32:35
  I understood Bitcoin more and more and like it truly for the
• 32:40
  like in totality and finality tore down the a lot of the veils
• 32:47
  and and, you know, preconceived beliefs and pre Bitcoin belief
• 32:52
  systems, but I had already been working on those since, you
• 32:55
  know, pretty young teenage years.
• 32:58
  So, but it definitely like obliterated any laughed like,
• 33:04
  you know, trust and authority or government or you know, it, it
• 33:09
  just it really, you know, once you understand that it really
• 33:12
  like any last like remaining, you know, trust in a lot of the
• 33:18
  institutions in this world. Just it's just it's just big.
• 33:23
  It's just gone, you know, and it's, it's kind of a, it's a
• 33:25
  humbling experience realizing how much you've been lied to by
• 33:31
  society, by conditioning, by, you know, people and how little
• 33:36
  it's humbling, how little you realize that you knew and that
• 33:40
  you know about how the world works.
• 33:42
  So like that was a very, you know, there was a, there was
• 33:44
  some intense, you know, part processing there that happened.
• 33:49
  But I think like ultimately reinforced a lot of the things
• 33:53
  that I had suspected or that I knew to certain degrees.
• 33:56
  And it like reinforced them with finality.
• 33:58
  And, and so I would say it changed me in being much more
• 34:04
  stronger in, in my beliefs of both things that I already knew
• 34:09
  and, and, and new things that I learned.
• 34:12
  And, you know, the whole COVID pandemic, definitely, you know,
• 34:18
  it went hand in hand with that for me, as I think it did a lot
• 34:21
  of people that really got on boarded at that time, they went
• 34:25
  hand in hand with that, you know, like it was, it was, you
• 34:29
  know, not only. Yeah, just on all fronts.
• 34:31
  So yeah. It's one of the cool things
• 34:36
  actually that I think or the the better things it it kind of
• 34:41
  happens all the time. There's there's plenty of
• 34:43
  examples, but the notion that a lot of people were on boarded to
• 34:48
  Bitcoin because of like the actions and the the mandates and
• 34:54
  a few of the bad intentions of of these bad state actors.
• 35:01
  You know, that sort of foisted this thing on to the world, like
• 35:06
  the fucking world is is really cool like that.
• 35:11
  It just birthed a whole bunch of bitcoiners.
• 35:13
  And it's actually one of the things that baffles me a little
• 35:15
  bit when you still see like people that are still stuck up,
• 35:20
  hung up on like, if only we could vote harder next time or
• 35:25
  we just got to get the right person in to, you know, address
• 35:29
  the particular concerns that I have as a, as an in Group or an
• 35:32
  out group or whatever it is. And it's like, no, just like
• 35:37
  walk away and use better money and, and, and you'll be 9/10 of
• 35:43
  the way. Absolutely.
• 35:46
  You know, the only thing that explains it without just calling
• 35:51
  everybody retards is it's that that that remnant piece, that
• 35:57
  piece of writing the remnant. Yeah, it's, it's in the
• 36:00
  original, the original pieces, I believe by Albert J Hawk.
• 36:05
  And that's, that's published on meses.org.
• 36:08
  But you know, Spetsky with his article Bitcoiners are the
• 36:12
  remnant. And, and that that like, if
• 36:17
  anybody hasn't read that, just look it up.
• 36:19
  Bitcoiners are the remnant. I think it's mass adoption,
• 36:23
  doesn't matter, something like that.
• 36:25
  But basically Bitcoiners are the remnant.
• 36:27
  Alexander Svetsky article And then there's a essay written by
• 36:31
  this guy, Albert Jayhawk talking about the remnant and who they
• 36:33
  are. And that's the only thing.
• 36:35
  And, and, and they're the, they're the, you know, they're
• 36:39
  the outliers or the, the, you know, the select few who like go
• 36:43
  out there and, and, you know, yell on the shoe box.
• 36:48
  And then those select few who like eat the call, but they
• 36:51
  plant the seed and, and there's some people who listen, you
• 36:54
  know, and that's the only explanation I have for it
• 36:56
  because it's the level of insanity still every single day
• 37:00
  is it's appalling. And it's kind of funny being on,
• 37:04
  on Bitcoin Twitter. And on the one hand, it's like
• 37:07
  super great having this, you know, and this global community
• 37:11
  of bit pointers, But on the other hand, you see all of this
• 37:15
  like this absolute clown world insanity.
• 37:20
  And so that's just happening every single day and nearly
• 37:25
  makes you really makes you wonder what, what, what the fuck
• 37:29
  all of this means, you know, but it's a lot more bearable having
• 37:34
  Bitcoin, that's for sure. And and a nostril account, but I
• 37:39
  do wonder if. And a nostril account.
• 37:42
  If like retreating and opting out is one thing and it's and
• 37:46
  it's, you know, it's great, but you have to build, you know,
• 37:51
  parallel systems in, in, in that space.
• 37:56
  Otherwise you're kind of just cutting your nose off to spite
• 37:59
  your own face. And I think the cool thing is,
• 38:02
  as you've proven out with the Bitcoin Art Magazine and a
• 38:06
  number of other, you know, projects that happen in this
• 38:08
  space, there's the Free Cities and obviously what's going down
• 38:12
  on on Bitcoin Beach and El Salvador and a whole bunch of
• 38:17
  things that that Bitcoiners are just bringing their skill set
• 38:21
  to. And you're almost like you can
• 38:24
  see it happening in real time, this sort of emergent parallel
• 38:28
  system where we've got all, we've, it's all based on the
• 38:33
  best money. We've got cool artwork, we've
• 38:35
  got great writing. We've got excellent spaces,
• 38:40
  cities, towns, communities that are popping up that are sort of
• 38:46
  incepting the, I guess intrinsic ethos of Bitcoin, if I can say
• 38:53
  that into whatever that is. I just like plugging it in and
• 39:00
  it's just making it that much better.
• 39:02
  And so, you know, it's not about just opting out and going off
• 39:08
  and living in the Bush somewhere and just being a complete
• 39:11
  curmudgeon. It's doing the things in a
• 39:16
  different way. And then notionally, someone
• 39:21
  who's still in the sort of the Fiat world, say, will be exposed
• 39:26
  to it in some capacity, and then they'll be exposed to a little
• 39:29
  bit more. And then they'll be like, oh,
• 39:30
  shit, this is actually you. Yeah, this is happening.
• 39:33
  Oh, cool. You've got like, you've got all
• 39:35
  the things that I want. This is great.
• 39:37
  And then, you know, they'll kind of cross the bridge, I suppose.
• 39:40
  I don't know. Yeah, I, yeah, it's, it's, it's
• 39:46
  interesting. It's, I think it's, I think it's
• 39:50
  like there's definitely some beauty of the, the, the, how do
• 39:56
  I say that? The, the Bitcoin algorithm and,
• 39:59
  and, you know, the goal is to be able to opt out and go live.
• 40:04
  You know, for me, it's on a, on a nice beach with some good
• 40:07
  waves somewhere and just have enough money basically to be
• 40:12
  able to ignore the world if you want.
• 40:15
  And it seems like Bitcoin has its cycles and every cycle
• 40:19
  there's a a number of people that.
• 40:22
  Reach that level of well, and that they're able to, you know,
• 40:28
  dip out or really live 1 foot out if they want to.
• 40:33
  And, you know, there's a whole new cycle of people who find out
• 40:37
  about it and who come and who contribute and who grind and
• 40:41
  help spread the word and you know, it's, it's pretty cool.
• 40:46
  And then at some point they, they too will reach, you know,
• 40:51
  the level of, of personal financial abundance to be able
• 40:55
  to opt out if they want to. And then, you know, you can have
• 40:58
  that choice. And I mean, at the end of the
• 41:00
  day, that's what freedom's all about, right?
• 41:01
  It's the choice. And so I mean, the, the, the
• 41:04
  beauty of the mechanics of that are so, are so cool.
• 41:08
  And it's, it's cool when you realize that like, you know, the
• 41:11
  people who are like, you know, like, or, you know, recently
• 41:14
  they're saying, well, there's all these Ogs selling right now.
• 41:17
  And it's like, that's awesome. Like they should sell and buy a
• 41:20
  freaking island, you know? And like, that's so cool that
• 41:24
  like a bunch of people, like, you know, are able to buy
• 41:27
  islands right now from Bitcoin. And there's, you know, in a few
• 41:34
  more years, there'll be a whole nother bunch of people who can,
• 41:37
  if they want to opt out of fucking clown world.
• 41:41
  So, yeah, and the whole time and, and the like, the I think
• 41:45
  the most magical part is that and it kind of comes into like
• 41:49
  why money tends towards 1 and like shit coins will never
• 41:52
  succeed. And everything is like is like,
• 41:56
  you know, Bitcoin, it, it, it's like, I don't know, there's like
• 42:03
  there's not, there's not anything else that can do that.
• 42:05
  There's there's and and it's there's nothing else That's a
• 42:09
  because Bitcoin is money, because it has characteristics
• 42:12
  that no other anything in the world has, but no other shit
• 42:15
  coins or Fiat have like anything and everything that anybody does
• 42:20
  for Bitcoin is good for all of the bit pointers and it's good
• 42:23
  for all of us and good for Bitcoin and like the, the the
• 42:26
  beauty of that is so good. This is just it's just it's
• 42:30
  like, you know, from people buying Bitcoin to people selling
• 42:33
  Bitcoin and lowering the price for other people to buy Bitcoin
• 42:37
  lower like in every single way possible and imaginable.
• 42:42
  The game theory and the incentive structure of it is
• 42:45
  just absolutely flawless and that gets me super fired up.
• 42:50
  I I wanted to mention something real quick about this my, my
• 42:54
  discovering Bitcoin. It's something that I just
• 42:56
  thought of and that was it was something you that you, you, you
• 43:02
  had said that made me think of it.
• 43:03
  And I had started making art when I was, I only started
• 43:11
  making artwork. I'm trying to think like when it
• 43:15
  was only in like it was, it was. It's interesting when I started
• 43:18
  like intentionally, very intentionally making art,
• 43:22
  geometric artwork, sacred geometry specifically, but it
• 43:27
  was it was around. It wasn't long after that I had
• 43:30
  the truly aha moment of Bitcoin. And I wonder how much the time I
• 43:38
  spent drawing like geometric shapes that are based on
• 43:42
  mathematical precision and striving to create art that was
• 43:46
  mathematically precise, how much that influenced my understanding
• 43:50
  and fully grokking Bitcoin and the wonder of the mathematical
• 43:54
  precision of Bitcoin. And that kind of ties into the
• 43:58
  whole Bitcoin is a like a cult or a religion thing where it's
• 44:03
  not obviously right. It's, it's, it's Bitcoin has
• 44:06
  many, many different things. But this like fervor and like,
• 44:12
  you know, this, you know, almost level of worship that people
• 44:16
  have for it. It's very interesting.
• 44:18
  It's fascinating like, from like an anthropological, like
• 44:20
  religious perspective. And I, I, I think for myself,
• 44:25
  like it was, you know, you've got this anonymous creator that
• 44:31
  nobody knows who he is, but he like brought this thing to
• 44:33
  mankind or created this thing. And so there's like an idol
• 44:37
  worship there that's super common in any field in any, any
• 44:40
  area of life, you know, in sports, whatever it is, people,
• 44:44
  you know, culturally we worship idols.
• 44:48
  So like there's that. But then like what he brought
• 44:53
  was not it was it was so undogmatic.
• 44:57
  It was like the most anti dogmatic thing possible.
• 45:00
  So there's this like crazy polar juxtapose of like, of like
• 45:04
  belief and like worship of Bitcoin where it's like
• 45:08
  completely idolized and worship and at the same worship and at
• 45:12
  the same time like it's completely anti dogmatic and
• 45:18
  it's just based on mathematical precision and mathematical truth
• 45:22
  and mathematical purity. And so I wonder how much the art
• 45:25
  that I was making that's based on all the same things, precise
• 45:29
  mathematical like truth. And you know, helped me, really
• 45:34
  helped me truly understand Bitcoin.
• 45:37
  And it's interesting because, you know, I, I like sacred
• 45:40
  geometry because I feel like it's one of the most pure
• 45:44
  conceptualizations of God. And I didn't grow up in a mono
• 45:49
  mono religious household. I grew up, you know, hippie kid,
• 45:52
  very like all religions are cool.
• 45:55
  All paths lead to one, but like with a very strong faith and a
• 45:59
  strong sense of God or great spirit, as I called it growing
• 46:04
  up. And Bitcoin does tie into that
• 46:10
  in, in or has or reflect some of that in the sense of like sacred
• 46:14
  geometry and geometric art is, is very anti dogmatic.
• 46:19
  It's not there's there's no like idol worship happening there.
• 46:24
  It's just creating art that represents mathematical truth,
• 46:28
  which is what nature represents and, and precision, mathematical
• 46:33
  precision. And, but, but that is a
• 46:36
  conceptualization of like all of creation, which is, you know,
• 46:41
  for a lot of people what God is, right?
• 46:43
  And like who is the creator and who created this human
• 46:45
  experience and mathematical precision created it.
• 46:48
  And, and that, you know, is what Bitcoin is.
• 46:52
  It's money that's based on mathematical precision.
• 46:55
  So I mean, that kind of relation there, maybe it was a big, a big
• 46:59
  part of finally understanding Bitcoin, even though I'd known
• 47:03
  about it since for four years, you know, so 2017 and then 2021
• 47:09
  fully rocked it. I don't know.
• 47:12
  Yeah, there's like what you're touching on with the with the
• 47:15
  sake of geometry stuff. It's a rabbit hole been going
• 47:17
  down maybe in the last couple of years, I suppose, in relation to
• 47:23
  someone who I speak to and reference quite a bit on this
• 47:26
  podcast, which is Rudolf Steiner.
• 47:28
  Sounds like you might have had a little bit of a walled off
• 47:30
  education back in the day. But I noticed a couple of
• 47:33
  things. So, you know, he he was talking
• 47:37
  about how a lot of people like to to do a lot of a great deal
• 47:42
  of philosophizing without sort of understanding mathematical
• 47:47
  thinking basically. And one of the one of his quotes
• 47:51
  is like, philosophy is fundamentally impossible without
• 47:53
  a grasp of at least the spirit of mathematical thinking.
• 47:57
  And that's like pretty wild when you can, when you sort of view
• 48:02
  it or think about that through a, through a Bitcoin frame.
• 48:06
  And then I noticed about a week ago, I think if I go back
• 48:10
  through your timeline, here it is you posted what it's like.
• 48:15
  It's it's, it's a geometric pattern, but it kind of looks
• 48:18
  like a Merkabah. I don't know if you know what
• 48:22
  that is, but it's basically like those those inverted triangles
• 48:27
  within that circle you've got there.
• 48:28
  It's a one of one you posted a week ago.
• 48:32
  And that's that's when you start talking about cheats.
• 48:35
  Take a geometry. I just was scrolling through
• 48:37
  your Twitter feed, so your Gnostic feed to try and find
• 48:39
  that is that what that is? Is that's a marker bar.
• 48:43
  Yeah, is is that it's, it's got colour, like different colours
• 48:46
  on it. It's kind of shaded.
• 48:48
  It's it's what is it? Number 921850 hand drawn, one of
• 48:53
  one framed in museum grade. Any glad UV acrylic It's for
• 48:58
  sale too. Interesting.
• 49:00
  Yeah, it's I was looking at. I'm trying to, I'm trying to
• 49:04
  think which piece, which piece, which piece of art that is.
• 49:09
  But yeah, I, I, I loved the, yeah, I think the, the Merkabah
• 49:16
  is such a cool, it's just a really cool shape.
• 49:19
  And so I did, I, I've done a good handful of them.
• 49:22
  I was, did a handful, you know, a good handful of them.
• 49:25
  It's probably also, you know, it's like one of those things,
• 49:27
  you know, if you get into sacred geometry and then you get into
• 49:30
  geometric artwork, you kind of go through and you know, you do
• 49:34
  a Flower of life, you draw a Metatron's cube, you do a
• 49:36
  Merkabah and so forth. So, but it's interesting that
• 49:42
  actually the first painting that I ever did, and I'm trying to,
• 49:45
  I, I thought maybe that's what you were looking at, but I don't
• 49:47
  know if that's the one. What What's the piece called
• 49:48
  that you're looking at right now?
• 49:51
  Let me have a look, I've flicked, I'll flick it in the
• 49:53
  chat and you can pull it up. OK, but the first painting I
• 49:57
  ever did was the awesome Noah pattern, kind of colored in in a
• 50:02
  way that I like to do it. And then it had a Merkle in the
• 50:05
  middle and a friend of mine bought it and he has it.
• 50:09
  And it's funny. Just the other day he was like,
• 50:12
  he mentioned it and I was like, you know, it's funny.
• 50:14
  That's probably like worth probably sell that for like a
• 50:17
  couple $1000 now, maybe a few $1000, which was interesting.
• 50:21
  So I sold it to him for like, you know, like 300 bucks or
• 50:23
  whatever. So it's, it was, you know, it's
• 50:25
  a, it's a, it's a, I'm happy that my, a good friend of mine
• 50:28
  has it. And it's fun kind of seeing
• 50:30
  like, you know, when you put proof of work into something,
• 50:33
  something even as wild and starving, you know, as a pipe
• 50:38
  dream of being an artist. And, and it's like looking back,
• 50:41
  you know, years later, now I'm like, oh, like I've actually
• 50:43
  made, I've, I've become an artist and I've made progress as
• 50:46
  an artist. It's so funny.
• 50:47
  I still don't often think of myself as like, Oh, I'm an
• 50:50
  artist and but but that, you know, when, when I noticed
• 50:56
  something like that, I'm like, oh, like I'm, I'm like, I'm like
• 50:59
  made, you know, somewhat of a career and you know of this,
• 51:04
  I've progressed as an artist. Even that like 'cause I mean, I,
• 51:07
  I get what you're saying. Like it's like, well, are you
• 51:10
  have you got a massive studio and you, you just kind of like
• 51:13
  while away the hours throwing ideas at a canvas or whatever.
• 51:17
  Like there's that kind of like romanticized artist where like
• 51:22
  they full on they that's like what they do and their their
• 51:27
  entire universe exists around that.
• 51:29
  And then there's like you, you're doing it.
• 51:32
  I mean, the fact that your art is hanging in people's homes,
• 51:35
  like not even your friends like that.
• 51:37
  You've sold a bunch of pieces and people have got them on
• 51:40
  their walls, in their office, in their lounge room, wherever it
• 51:43
  is. And they look at it and they
• 51:46
  admire it. And The thing is like, they do
• 51:48
  that without letting you know. You know, it's not like they're,
• 51:50
  they're, they're kind of tweeting every time.
• 51:52
  But the the point is that The thing is out there in the world
• 51:57
  and it's had an effect on someone for good, for positive.
• 52:01
  And like that's enough. It's like, that's a really cool
• 52:05
  thing. Yeah, it's, it's been, the
• 52:12
  reception that I've got in has been phenomenal.
• 52:15
  It's just been really amazing. It's it's awesome.
• 52:19
  I wish I had kept track, but I do.
• 52:21
  I have probably probably like, I don't know, 20 countries or so,
• 52:28
  maybe a little less, maybe a little bit more.
• 52:30
  I wish I had to kept track, but I've, I've sent pieces print
• 52:32
  specifically just all over the world and paintings too.
• 52:36
  And sometime I, I need a, we were on the episode 1 of the
• 52:40
  Bitcoin art podcast the other day and there was a guy on there
• 52:43
  talking about cataloging your art.
• 52:45
  And I was like, I really need to do that.
• 52:46
  And I, I really should because I think I would, it would feel
• 52:49
  good and be nice to like look at an actual, you know, list of
• 52:53
  spreadsheet of like art pieces that I've made, how many I've
• 52:56
  made. And then like, you know, kind of
• 52:58
  get an idea of like how much art I've sold.
• 53:01
  And it's actually like out there in the world in people's homes,
• 53:04
  as you say, because it is interesting.
• 53:06
  Like, and once you get kind of into the grind and the flow of
• 53:09
  it, it's like, oh, cool, I sold a print.
• 53:10
  I ship it out and it's, you know, on to the next keep
• 53:12
  moving. And it becomes, you know, much
• 53:14
  more kind of methodical and business like of an experience
• 53:18
  then in the beginning when you're like, oh, wow, you want
• 53:20
  to, you want to you, you actually want to put this in
• 53:22
  your house, like, but and then, yeah, like you said, you don't,
• 53:27
  I don't, you know, I'm not notified when people see it or
• 53:31
  think of it or have a conversation about it here and
• 53:33
  there. I am.
• 53:34
  Occasionally someone will be like, I saw your art in the
• 53:36
  office in Miami. And I'm like, that's so cool.
• 53:38
  And it's like, you know, but most of the time I don't, I
• 53:42
  don't know, it's just out there and, you know, living on the
• 53:45
  wall somewhere. The oh, this, yeah, this piece
• 53:47
  the other day. I, I'm looking at the link you
• 53:49
  sent me. So I, yeah, it, this is, this
• 53:52
  isn't really a Merkabah. I mean, this is just like a kind
• 53:54
  of, I mean, it's, it's got a Merkabah in there and it's got a
• 53:58
  flower of life in there and a hexagon.
• 54:01
  And, but I just, I the other day I was thinking, I want to start
• 54:05
  making some more geometric artworks.
• 54:07
  And so I, I actually just did it two years.
• 54:11
  So actually just did two years of an apprenticeship with a
• 54:19
  gentleman named Dylan Forte, good friend of mine now.
• 54:23
  But he's probably the most prolific or the most well known
• 54:28
  sacred geometry tattoo artist in the world.
• 54:32
  So he's, he's been tattooing his whole life.
• 54:34
  He's been tattooing over 20 years and he started doing
• 54:37
  sacred geometry specifically as tattoos back probably and well,
• 54:44
  maybe 14 years ago. And he had a really big part
• 54:48
  popularizing sacred geometry tattoos.
• 54:51
  You know, the kind you see at music festivals or just, I mean
• 54:55
  all kinds of people have them, but the kind that got popular
• 54:58
  like what? The music festivals and so
• 55:00
  forth. Yeah, I love Red Tail.
• 55:03
  Hulk mentioned Wookie Foot the other week and I've been
• 55:08
  listening to them a little bit. I can just imagine the kind of
• 55:10
  festivals that they would play out.
• 55:12
  Yeah, yeah, you know, whole whole whole very, very
• 55:17
  psychedelic friendly and a lot of sacred geometry.
• 55:20
  But, but it's interesting, Dylan actually, you know, he he's from
• 55:24
  the Bay Area, Oakland, and he actually like him.
• 55:29
  And I got along really well because he also went, you know,
• 55:33
  coming from a centre left. He he he went pretty, pretty
• 55:38
  far, you know, libertarian right, going to use this word
• 55:43
  right and left, but, you know, much more conservative over the,
• 55:47
  you know, I think through the same experience that it sounds
• 55:49
  like both of us had over the last eight years or so.
• 55:53
  And but he still does like a ton of sacred geometry.
• 55:55
  But it's pretty funny. He was out in Texas and I was
• 55:59
  that is, you know, apprenticing for two years every day at
• 56:02
  tattoo studio. And we would he has people
• 56:05
  flying from all over the world and he's got like top level bank
• 56:08
  executives who come in and they're like, OK, I want like a
• 56:10
  full metatronics cube and like mandala on my back, full back
• 56:15
  piece like crazy. Like just like wow, you know,
• 56:19
  kind of artwork and tattoo, but they're like, but it can't like,
• 56:22
  you know, like they're, they're they're like, you know, OK, but
• 56:25
  like not, not above the neckline, you know.
• 56:27
  Yeah, I don't want like. Putting on the steps, yeah.
• 56:30
  Fucking hippie. I'm working in this banking
• 56:32
  sector and I've got to be serious.
• 56:34
  Yeah, yeah, You know, and they're like not past the hands,
• 56:38
  you know, the suit's got to cover it.
• 56:40
  And these guys are like, you know, the, you know, top guy at
• 56:43
  the country's, you know, the second largest mortgage broker
• 56:48
  office in the in the US. That's and, and you know, but
• 56:53
  Dylan's blasting this freaking just crazy psychedelic, super
• 56:57
  citic geometric Metatron's cube or whatever, Merkava, you know,
• 57:01
  full sacred geometry. Sure, you cross their whole
• 57:04
  back. So awesome.
• 57:05
  And it's it was cool. You know, you realize, and you
• 57:08
  know, he's in the, the, you know, upper echelon of
• 57:11
  clientele, upper echelon of tattoo artists and stuff.
• 57:14
  So his, you know, a lot of high net worth kind of clientele.
• 57:16
  And you realize like, wow, there's like so many people that
• 57:19
  are that are, you know, with it out there in the world that you
• 57:24
  just would never guess. And I feel like it's the same
• 57:27
  with Bitcoin. You know, there's like all of
• 57:29
  these, you know? Yeah, just.
• 57:32
  Pro freedom, libertarian bitcoiner, you know, anarchist,
• 57:35
  anarcho, capitalist, you know, just so many people out there
• 57:39
  like we we always say, you know, I don't know any bitcoiners in
• 57:42
  real life. How many do you know in real
• 57:43
  life? But I you know, I wonder how
• 57:45
  many you actually encounter when you go out on a day out on town.
• 57:50
  How many bitcoiners do you actually encounter that you just
• 57:52
  didn't know they were bitcoiners?
• 57:54
  How many people have a sacred geometry back, you know, full
• 57:59
  back piece or sleeve under their, you know, under their
• 58:03
  suit or their button down shirt? I just love going to like
• 58:08
  Bitcoin events and I don't get to too many at the moment.
• 58:12
  But of the ones that I've gone to, what I love the most is that
• 58:15
  you can't pick a Bitcoiner out of it unless they're wearing
• 58:17
  like a particular T-shirt or or something like that.
• 58:20
  But notionally like it's just a complete diverse.
• 58:24
  It's like anyone and like, I think of, yeah, walking down the
• 58:28
  street and just how many, how many bitcoins am I walking past
• 58:32
  right now? Like because, because we all
• 58:34
  kind of want to find each other just, you know, to have that
• 58:37
  connection and that chat. But at the same time, we don't
• 58:40
  want to, we don't want to let anybody know, you know, unless,
• 58:43
  unless and that they're just, you can't pick them out like
• 58:47
  they're just everyone. And it sounds like that banker
• 58:50
  guy probably should discover Bitcoin so he could be a little
• 58:54
  bit more authentic to, to himself and get some, some
• 58:59
  alignment there. I don't know that's up for him,
• 59:02
  but yeah, it's got to be. Yeah, it was a white man.
• 59:07
  Yeah, it was interesting. We would talk about Bitcoin all
• 59:09
  the time and talk to people about it and you know, there
• 59:13
  there would be, you know, tattoo clients that would come in that
• 59:16
  would that were bit pointers or, you know, crypto people.
• 59:22
  And then sometimes it was, it was interesting though, seeing
• 59:25
  like different, you know, just talking to different people
• 59:27
  about it. And, and yeah, some people just
• 59:29
  like man, like some of them didn't, you know, obviously,
• 59:34
  like at all, just just absolutely do not understand it
• 59:38
  at all. Heads from tails.
• 59:40
  And you're and it was totally just mind blowing being like,
• 59:44
  wow, you're like really high up in the finance world or whatever
• 59:48
  the tech world or whatever it was.
• 59:50
  And like, don't you don't like you don't understand Bitcoin
• 59:53
  like at all. It's pretty crazy how some
• 59:58
  people just get it and some don't.
• 1:00:00
  Which is interesting and you know, in regards to your podcast
• 1:00:05
  discovering Bitcoin, I you know, the different amount of
• 1:00:08
  different ways people have it in the and, and to what level they
• 1:00:12
  understand it. But let me ask you a question.
• 1:00:14
  Do you, have you been able to track down any sort of, I
• 1:00:19
  imagine some but like characteristics are things that
• 1:00:22
  are like commonalities between people discovering Bitcoin?
• 1:00:25
  And if so, are there any that like, or if there are any that
• 1:00:29
  like really stand out 'cause I can't wrap my head around like,
• 1:00:32
  why do some people get it and other people just don't, you
• 1:00:35
  know, I mean, everybody has those friends.
• 1:00:36
  They've tried the orange peel for four years and they still
• 1:00:39
  don't get it. And then at least a lot of us
• 1:00:41
  have a friend or two who you're like, hey, check this thing out.
• 1:00:44
  Like this is XYZ. Watch this YouTube video and
• 1:00:47
  their friends like, oh hell yeah, cool.
• 1:00:49
  I'm on Bitcoin Twitter a week later and just like, yeah, I'm
• 1:00:51
  buying Bitcoin now. And just like that's it
• 1:00:53
  immediately. Like why do some people get it
• 1:00:55
  so easily and some can't seem to?
• 1:00:58
  No matter what you show them or how hard you try or where they
• 1:01:02
  are in life, cannot understand Bitcoin.
• 1:01:05
  Yeah, it's a, it's a question that I've been thinking about a
• 1:01:09
  little bit lately because we're, you know, coming up to 150
• 1:01:13
  episodes and there's got to be some sort of, I don't know,
• 1:01:17
  pattern emerging at some point. But I was talking to Brandon
• 1:01:20
  Quiddam, had him on the pod and he exposed me to the Myers
• 1:01:25
  Briggs stuff, which to be honest, I hadn't really
• 1:01:28
  considered before. But according to like with
• 1:01:35
  Brandon, because he's done a bunch of surveys, or at least
• 1:01:37
  he's put them out on Twitter, and I think maybe Noster as
• 1:01:40
  well, and a lot of the personality traits that Bitcoin
• 1:01:44
  has tend to embody is an INTJ, which is what is it?
• 1:01:50
  Let's see. It's intuitive, sorry,
• 1:01:53
  introverted, intuitive thinking and judging.
• 1:01:57
  And they're basically thoughtful tacticians that love perfecting
• 1:02:00
  details of life, applying creativity and rationality to
• 1:02:04
  everything that they do. The inner world is often private
• 1:02:07
  and complex. And I think, I mean, that kind
• 1:02:11
  of summarizes a lot of Bitcoiners that I know.
• 1:02:16
  I got AINFJ, which is like, I think it's INFJI, can't
• 1:02:23
  remember, which is more of like a feeling kind of emotional
• 1:02:28
  advocacy kind of thing. And I don't know, whatever this
• 1:02:32
  means that we had Hazer on as well.
• 1:02:35
  He reached out because he was the same.
• 1:02:38
  And it's like a bit of a rare personality trait or something.
• 1:02:42
  But this notion of of basically introverts, I think, and I think
• 1:02:47
  that's where some of the extroverts that are within the
• 1:02:50
  Bitcoin space, like if I think of Anthony Pompliano now, I
• 1:02:53
  don't know if that's like a performative act on his part,
• 1:02:58
  you know? And I don't know the guy, but I
• 1:03:01
  find him a little cringe. But I think maybe if I met him
• 1:03:03
  in real life and had an actual conversation with him, he might
• 1:03:07
  be a little bit more chill or he might actually have that super
• 1:03:11
  hyper extroverted kind of personality trait.
• 1:03:15
  And you know, but it just kind of that kind of irks me a little
• 1:03:19
  bit. Like, I don't dig a lot of ego,
• 1:03:25
  you know, amongst from anyone really, but particularly amongst
• 1:03:29
  the Bitcoin, because it's like, you know, Satoshi is the most
• 1:03:33
  egoless being I think we could ever we could ever draw up.
• 1:03:41
  But in terms of like a pattern, I, I don't really see one really
• 1:03:46
  in, in these amount of episodes other than maybe deep thinking,
• 1:03:51
  introverted personality that that kind of is, is just looking
• 1:03:56
  for some coherence in their life, you know?
• 1:04:02
  Yeah, I do you the Are you a INTJ?
• 1:04:07
  No, I'm trying to remember what the thing was.
• 1:04:11
  It was INFJ or or something like that.
• 1:04:14
  It was. It was a little different to the
• 1:04:17
  INT. J but one of the ones, but
• 1:04:20
  you're still one of the ones that fits in the, like the I NS
• 1:04:24
  or something. Yeah, yeah.
• 1:04:25
  For the chart right now. Yeah, I'm trying to find the.
• 1:04:30
  I should really just look this up because.
• 1:04:32
  I I did, I did it. Yeah, I did it recently and I am
• 1:04:37
  AII. Did you know, I guess no
• 1:04:40
  surprise fall into it was it wasn't the INTJP, it was the I'm
• 1:04:47
  looking at the chart and I was like the INT.
• 1:04:54
  I mean, it's kind of, it's kind of like it's kind of silly.
• 1:04:56
  I. Was like, it was like INTP or
• 1:04:58
  something. Well, it but it's interesting
• 1:05:00
  that that the the relation to bit pointers, it being so high.
• 1:05:04
  I mean, I guess that yeah, I hadn't, I didn't think about
• 1:05:07
  that things for bringing for, you know, bringing that up.
• 1:05:09
  But the the as far as like a some kind of thing, I mean, at
• 1:05:14
  least that's some sort of mapping out of why that's
• 1:05:18
  probably the best, the best explanation like the best chart
• 1:05:22
  of like a characteristic of humans that get Bitcoin versus
• 1:05:26
  ones that don't. Yeah, INTP, introverted,
• 1:05:30
  intuitive thinking and prospecting.
• 1:05:33
  You take an unconventional approach to many aspects of
• 1:05:36
  their life. I mean, I, I, I sort of, I feel
• 1:05:39
  like these are nice framing, but they're not the be all and end
• 1:05:45
  all. Like I'm almost certain that,
• 1:05:47
  you know, there's plenty of Bitcoiners out there that have
• 1:05:50
  like a feeling trait. So they might fall into an
• 1:05:52
  INTGINTJ character personality trait or whatever.
• 1:05:58
  And it's the same with the INFJS&INTPS.
• 1:06:02
  And I think it's, it's not, it's not about just boxing that into
• 1:06:07
  that one category. It's we're all one man.
• 1:06:11
  We're all just one We're. All one man from one to the.
• 1:06:15
  Money. Follow the Dow.
• 1:06:17
  That's all good. Yeah.
• 1:06:19
  I wonder also how the data for that was collected and if that
• 1:06:23
  was mostly from like people who are on Twitter, Which?
• 1:06:27
  Yeah, exactly. Maybe it was like, OK, a lot of
• 1:06:30
  Bitcoiners who are on Twitter are INTJ, but there's like a
• 1:06:35
  whole lot of bitcoiners out there who just, you know, like
• 1:06:38
  all of the ISFJS&ESFJS&ISTJS there there that are bit
• 1:06:44
  pointers like just none of them are on Twitter.
• 1:06:46
  And actually it's just about people who go on Twitter or
• 1:06:49
  something. I don't, you know, I, I.
• 1:06:51
  Some of my closest friends like Bitcoiners, but they don't give
• 1:06:55
  a fuck about the culture or anything like that.
• 1:06:58
  They're not on Twitter, they're not on roster, they're not like
• 1:07:01
  they just don't even really talk about it that much.
• 1:07:04
  They just Yep, cool, got it moving on, you know, and I dig
• 1:07:09
  that a little bit. I sort of, you know, I'm the
• 1:07:12
  irritating 1 amongst them. And even though they're all
• 1:07:14
  Bitcoiners, I'm like the one that's kind of the one that
• 1:07:16
  brings it up the most. And sometimes I get a little bit
• 1:07:20
  self self-conscious about it, but it's like, I dig the fact
• 1:07:26
  that that you get a cool, got it, got the Bitcoin thing moving
• 1:07:29
  on, focusing on my craft. Like that's what they literally
• 1:07:31
  are doing. It's it's kind of cool.
• 1:07:35
  They talk about sport a lot. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:07:43
  I wonder maybe we should start getting those like anybody that
• 1:07:50
  we know that's a bit pointer that like doesn't, you know,
• 1:07:53
  engage with the other bit pointers on a regular basis.
• 1:07:57
  Get them to do the do the personality type test and see if
• 1:08:02
  we can get like a sampling of, of are they also INTJS and ENT
• 1:08:07
  JS and and the the ENS and the INS?
• 1:08:13
  Or are they like the ES and the ISS and and actually the Meyer
• 1:08:19
  Briggs thing doesn't mean shit other than some of us like to
• 1:08:23
  hang out on Twitter and Oscar or whatever it is.
• 1:08:27
  What do you wish more people knew about Bitcoin?
• 1:08:31
  That's an interesting question. I, I don't know, I wish that
• 1:08:40
  more people just knew about Bitcoin.
• 1:08:46
  I guess maybe maybe I wish that more people, you know, I don't,
• 1:08:55
  I don't know though, because I feel like, I feel like it's kind
• 1:08:58
  of the, the, you know, like if everybody, I feel like it's kind
• 1:09:07
  of, I feel like kind of perfect the way it is honestly in a lot
• 1:09:11
  of ways and that it needs to grow slow.
• 1:09:16
  And so I, I, you know, I, I would say off the bat, I just
• 1:09:19
  wish that I knew more people who knew about Bitcoin so that, you
• 1:09:24
  know, we could all, we could all opt out and disappear faster.
• 1:09:30
  But no, I, and so that we can make the world a better place
• 1:09:33
  faster. But I, you know, that's the
• 1:09:35
  whole, I think that, you know, I don't know, it kind of comes
• 1:09:37
  into the whole thing of like, you know, we want the price to
• 1:09:41
  stay as low as possible for as long as possible so as many
• 1:09:44
  plugs can get in as possible. Yeah.
• 1:09:46
  And, you know, so right now with all the suit pointers and the,
• 1:09:50
  you know, Wall Street adoption and governmental kind of
• 1:09:53
  regulatory. Clair.
• 1:09:56
  Adoption or whatever you call it, it re clarity and
• 1:09:59
  everything, friendliness to it all.
• 1:10:01
  It's interesting time. And, you know, so I mean, yeah,
• 1:10:09
  I don't know. I like the the fact that going
• 1:10:12
  back to what we were talking about earlier, I kind of wish
• 1:10:16
  more people knew that Bitcoin was for anyone.
• 1:10:21
  And if you go through part of the the not to shield my own
• 1:10:26
  bags here, but I mean, you can listen to all of these different
• 1:10:30
  episodes. There's no repeats 149 episodes
• 1:10:34
  of this podcast from people all around the world who have all
• 1:10:39
  discovered Bitcoin in their own way.
• 1:10:40
  And they're all genuine human beings.
• 1:10:43
  I mean, not to say that anyone that hasn't discovered Bitcoin
• 1:10:45
  isn't genuine, but point being you can pass a lot of the FUD
• 1:10:50
  very quickly if you just listen to like a couple of episodes and
• 1:10:54
  are like, these are like just people trying to do better.
• 1:11:00
  I think it's not hard. Yeah, yeah.
• 1:11:15
  Yeah, just just. Just just no, no, no, I, I'm,
• 1:11:20
  you know, I'm just people who want the world to be a better
• 1:11:23
  place. Yeah, well, it's like instead of
• 1:11:26
  spinning up the Bitcoin art magazine, you know, the impulse
• 1:11:29
  there. You know, I can't speak for you,
• 1:11:31
  but the thing I get from it is demonstrating that there's an
• 1:11:36
  enormous amount of creativity and talent and skill and thought
• 1:11:42
  and mindfulness within the space that that that is getting
• 1:11:47
  channelled through these, these hands and these hearts and these
• 1:11:51
  minds that are applying their creativity through various
• 1:11:56
  mediums to express some aspect of Bitcoin that they find
• 1:12:01
  fascinating. And you're collating those
• 1:12:04
  together in a, in a way that is visually stunning and digestible
• 1:12:11
  and like a real monument or a testament to kind of this, this
• 1:12:16
  era. I mean, the genesis block will
• 1:12:18
  go down in, in time as as the space evolves and there'll be
• 1:12:22
  people out there that, you know, will discover Bitcoin and be
• 1:12:26
  compelled, feel that impulse to create their own art and to
• 1:12:30
  contribute. And fuck, who knows, we might
• 1:12:33
  wake up one day and there's a, there's a Banksy artwork with a
• 1:12:38
  Bitcoin B in it somewhere. Who knows?
• 1:12:41
  I don't know. A boy can dream.
• 1:12:43
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think the there's a lot of you
• 1:12:53
  know, it's attempts or you know, it's a, it's attempts at
• 1:12:59
  conceptualizing Bitcoin in a way and that Bitcoin being digital
• 1:13:05
  and not something that you can touch.
• 1:13:08
  I was talking to the coin dad the other day and he's got the
• 1:13:12
  Bitcoin mining museum and like Bitcoin mining hardware and
• 1:13:15
  equipment is really the only tangible part of Bitcoin on the,
• 1:13:22
  you know, on the technical, scientific side of things in a
• 1:13:27
  sense. And like this is like a hot,
• 1:13:29
  this is like a physical object that you can touch.
• 1:13:32
  That's part of Bitcoin. That's a Bitcoin miner.
• 1:13:35
  You know, there's also, of course, like hardware wallets
• 1:13:39
  and and you know, stuff, but there's not, there's not like a
• 1:13:41
  whole, you know, ultimately bitcoins digital, you can't like
• 1:13:44
  touch it or see it. And then you've got, you know,
• 1:13:47
  mining equipment, hardware wallets, you've got like
• 1:13:49
  technical, technological, scientific, tangible objects,
• 1:13:55
  machines, pools that are part of Bitcoin, I guess like a seed
• 1:14:00
  plate could even be a part of it is a is is Bitcoin, you know,
• 1:14:04
  that's like a touchable thing. Then you got a bunch of like
• 1:14:07
  bare assets incident, but then it starts to go over as far as
• 1:14:10
  like other than like audio and visual stuff that people create
• 1:14:16
  or books they write. I mean, but that's, you know,
• 1:14:18
  other than the hardware used for mining or for securing Bitcoin,
• 1:14:22
  I'm trying to think of what else there is and I can't think of
• 1:14:25
  anything right now. I can't think of anything.
• 1:14:26
  Let me know. But like mining hardware and
• 1:14:29
  custody hardware, then it immediately goes into like the
• 1:14:33
  arts. So you've got like books that
• 1:14:35
  people wrote about Bitcoin. So that's like you can touch
• 1:14:38
  part of Bitcoin and about Bitcoin and then you've got, I
• 1:14:44
  mean, and that pictures that people have thrown about Bitcoin
• 1:14:48
  and so they're, you know, trying to conceptualize Bitcoin.
• 1:14:51
  What does a Bitcoin look like and what does the Bitcoin
• 1:14:54
  network look like? And no, because other than that,
• 1:14:57
  I, if there's anything I'm not thinking of physical, let me
• 1:15:00
  know. But other than that, it's all
• 1:15:01
  digital. So you've got all kinds of like,
• 1:15:03
  you know, mem pool, you know, time chain calendar, block
• 1:15:07
  explorers and dashboards like Moody dashboard, so forth that
• 1:15:11
  that are digital visualizations and representations and
• 1:15:15
  conceptualizations of Bitcoin. But like in the physical realm,
• 1:15:20
  what are the physical, you know, items of Bitcoin, objects of
• 1:15:24
  Bitcoin And yeah, the magazine. I hope to, you know, I hope for
• 1:15:29
  it to be an archive and a catalog of of sorts.
• 1:15:34
  I want to shout out all the artists that made it possible to
• 1:15:37
  create, shout out all of our patrons and collectors who have
• 1:15:43
  made it possible to print and also shout out all of our
• 1:15:46
  advertisers who have also made it possible to print and our
• 1:15:50
  patrons of the arts themselves. And so shout out to all the all
• 1:15:55
  the companies that are in the magazine.
• 1:15:57
  We've got some really awesome companies advertising with us
• 1:16:02
  and supporting us. And I hope that this can be a
• 1:16:07
  catalog, you know, a timestamp and you know, it's decentralized
• 1:16:12
  in the sense of I've got pre-orders from all over the
• 1:16:16
  world. So similar, similar physical
• 1:16:21
  object to what Bitcoin trading cards is doing, which I've had
• 1:16:25
  the honor of getting to work with Aladdin and help build a
• 1:16:27
  lot of Bitcoin trading cards. Super cool project.
• 1:16:31
  And these cards, you know, and, and packs of physical trading
• 1:16:35
  cards get sent out all over the world and there's little Bitcoin
• 1:16:38
  objects, art pieces spread all over the world.
• 1:16:42
  And so, you know, my vision with the magazine is to, you know,
• 1:16:47
  catalog, archive and promote the artists and the artwork that's
• 1:16:50
  in it and just spread it all over the world in a physical,
• 1:16:53
  tangible form. And, you know, hopefully these
• 1:16:57
  magazines will sit and, you know, Bitcoin storage or spaces
• 1:17:03
  or meet up places and people's homes and you know, I, you know,
• 1:17:07
  hopefully I can only imagine, you know, there will be some
• 1:17:11
  amount of people that get orange pulled or at the least the seed
• 1:17:15
  gets planted when they walk into a friend's house and there's a
• 1:17:17
  copy of Bitcoin art magazine sitting on their coffee table.
• 1:17:22
  You know, or maybe the the fine art book is on the coffee table.
• 1:17:26
  Fine art, coffee table book on the coffee table and they're
• 1:17:30
  having a dinner party and, and you know, it's another, another
• 1:17:33
  opener to open up the Bitcoin conversation, which I think all
• 1:17:37
  the artwork is a is a great tool for that.
• 1:17:39
  You know, having a piece of Bitcoin art on your wall and
• 1:17:45
  having a friend come over and, and it's saying like what, what
• 1:17:47
  you know, what's that art? What is that, you know, and then
• 1:17:51
  you can start talking about Bitcoin and stuff.
• 1:17:54
  And I think all great movements have had art created around
• 1:17:58
  them. So I think that the artwork is a
• 1:18:01
  like a sign of, of the potency and the importance and the power
• 1:18:05
  maybe of the Bitcoin movement in that there's like this genuine
• 1:18:10
  thriving art scene. And I really hope to, you know,
• 1:18:15
  my intention is to provide a platform for better
• 1:18:17
  representation for the physical artist in the space.
• 1:18:20
  Because I feel like most people out there, when they hear the
• 1:18:24
  phrase Bitcoin art, they immediately think of NFTS and
• 1:18:28
  just super. In a lot of ways, I feel like
• 1:18:31
  NFTS are just an outright attack on Bitcoin because they're so
• 1:18:37
  absolutely riddled with scams. And even if it's not
• 1:18:42
  intentionally a scam, we don't need to get super deep into the
• 1:18:45
  NFT thing. But like even if an NFT is
• 1:18:47
  created and it's not intentionally a scam, like it's
• 1:18:50
  not some like AI generated 10,000 profile pic.
• 1:18:53
  Like, you know, fucking retarded and pushed by slimy scammer VCs
• 1:19:01
  buying influencers to pump this like worthless token, even if
• 1:19:05
  it's done like by an artist who is, has genuinely good
• 1:19:09
  intentions and a, and a genuine patron of their artwork.
• 1:19:14
  Purchasing this digital COA, you know, digital signature that's
• 1:19:20
  attached to a piece of art, whether that's digital or
• 1:19:23
  physical. There, there's unfortunately,
• 1:19:27
  you know, some, some kind of, I don't know, there's, there's
• 1:19:31
  some deception in, in, in NFTS and a lot of deception in it.
• 1:19:36
  And so I, you know, I hope that this magazine helps elevate
• 1:19:39
  physical Bitcoin art, just good old fashioned.
• 1:19:42
  There's just an all artwork in the space helps elevate that.
• 1:19:47
  And you know, I, you know, I would like when people think of
• 1:19:52
  Bitcoin art and when someone says Bitcoin art, it would be
• 1:19:54
  cool. And I do believe and hope that
• 1:19:56
  someday when you say that to someone, they'll they'll know
• 1:19:59
  what you're talking about and or they'll think of like a painting
• 1:20:04
  that has some subject matter relative to Bitcoin.
• 1:20:08
  Totally. Physical painting on a on a wall
• 1:20:11
  and meet space. Well, I mean, think about, you
• 1:20:14
  know, there was dudes back in the Renaissance.
• 1:20:17
  It's not like they, I'm pretty sure that they didn't
• 1:20:22
  conceptualize the fact that we would be talking about them, you
• 1:20:28
  know, 3-4 hundred years later, you know, with such a reverence
• 1:20:34
  that they wouldn't have entered in their mind, I dare say.
• 1:20:37
  Well, at least I hope that most of it was done for, for
• 1:20:42
  pleasure. And.
• 1:20:42
  And obviously, yeah, you know, they had patrons, not patrons.
• 1:20:49
  Patrons. What the fuck?
• 1:20:51
  Yeah, patrons. They had patrons, you know, like
• 1:20:53
  the Medici and stuff to like Commission these artworks.
• 1:20:58
  But I don't know if they had that thought that, you know, it
• 1:21:02
  would just be so everlasting. And it's the same kind of vibe
• 1:21:05
  here. Like Fractal Encrypt stuff is
• 1:21:07
  just bananas. Like you've got that on the
• 1:21:09
  front cover. We had a him on on episode 113.
• 1:21:14
  And like that, that shit is timeless.
• 1:21:17
  That just looking at it, it's complex, it's elegant, it's just
• 1:21:20
  stunning. You can unpick it.
• 1:21:23
  You can see new things every time you look at it.
• 1:21:26
  It's, you know, that's, that's a happening thing that's exists in
• 1:21:30
  the world right now and you know it, it'll probably be around in,
• 1:21:35
  you know, 34500 years is like one of the master artworks of
• 1:21:39
  this, this epoch, this era. And that's that's a good thing.
• 1:21:45
  Yeah, yeah. There's something special about,
• 1:21:50
  you know that. What's that book?
• 1:21:52
  It's a children's book and it's about the might face.
• 1:21:55
  It's about the artist who's a poet, He's an art, but it's a
• 1:21:59
  mouse that's an artist. And the, the mice are collecting
• 1:22:04
  grain for winter. And there's the one mouse that's
• 1:22:08
  an artist and he's like painting pictures.
• 1:22:11
  And the other mice are like, why don't you help us collect grain
• 1:22:14
  for the winter? The winter's coming.
• 1:22:16
  We need to, you know, have a store of food And and he's like,
• 1:22:21
  he's like, I need to work on from this art.
• 1:22:24
  And then like the winter happens and then like they get to the,
• 1:22:29
  you know, get it, the the food runs out.
• 1:22:32
  And then the mouse like has these like pictures he's painted
• 1:22:37
  that they like, you know, get to look at and like it helps to
• 1:22:41
  like bold, dreary winter, be like more beautiful in their
• 1:22:44
  little little mouths home or whatever.
• 1:22:47
  That's is that Frederick isn't. Yeah.
• 1:22:52
  Yeah, that sounds. Yeah, I think.
• 1:22:53
  That might be you're right, something like that.
• 1:22:55
  No, that sounds right. Fred Frederick.
• 1:22:57
  Yeah, Yeah, I mean that. But that's the eternal struggle
• 1:23:01
  of the artist, too. It's.
• 1:23:03
  Like and I'm. Sorry, I'm not contributing
• 1:23:05
  anything tangible, I'm just trying to make it look a.
• 1:23:08
  Mouse who gathers sunshine, colours and words instead of
• 1:23:11
  food, providing warmth and inspiration to his fellow mice
• 1:23:15
  during the winter. It's Frederick I there, you know
• 1:23:19
  there's it. Art and Bitcoin are very
• 1:23:22
  interesting in convection or conjunction with one of another.
• 1:23:27
  I don't know what the word is, but the you know, Bitcoin
• 1:23:31
  teaches you like proof of work and Bitcoin's like very
• 1:23:33
  distilling, like the distillation process, like what
• 1:23:36
  are like the necessities you know of life on earth.
• 1:23:41
  And Bitcoin is, you know, it's like what it's like a lesson in
• 1:23:45
  simplicity and intrinsic needs and values and what's the
• 1:23:50
  hierarchy of the needs thing? But you know, like there's just
• 1:23:57
  so much, yeah, there's so much junk that's created in this
• 1:24:01
  world and that we own and collect and have or, or somehow
• 1:24:05
  end up with in our, you know, homes and cars and stuff.
• 1:24:09
  And it's so much worthless crap. And it's I think it's all
• 1:24:12
  created because we live in a Fiat society that's a continual
• 1:24:17
  race to the bottom. And when the money is constantly
• 1:24:19
  being devalued and everybody's works to increase their profit
• 1:24:24
  margin perpetually into Infinity, right.
• 1:24:27
  So if, if, if everything, if the money is always becoming worth
• 1:24:31
  less and then things are always becoming more expensive.
• 1:24:33
  I mean, you know, really basic economics, but like, then you're
• 1:24:38
  always trying to make your thing cheaper.
• 1:24:40
  And then that's how we end up with like a bunch of like
• 1:24:42
  Chinese plastic in our freaking you.
• 1:24:45
  Know. Plastics in US, but you know,
• 1:24:48
  yeah, exactly. You know, you have like, it's
• 1:24:51
  like disposable, just trash everywhere and like Knick
• 1:24:55
  knacks, you know, and stores like, you know, Walmart or
• 1:24:59
  whatever that just like the shelves are just lined with
• 1:25:02
  absolute utter garbage. And like, why is that?
• 1:25:06
  And it's like, well, cuz it's a race to the fucking bottom.
• 1:25:08
  And, and so it's always a, a, you know, trying to increase the
• 1:25:11
  profit margin because you, you have to, you know, and, and you
• 1:25:16
  see it through architecture and through art and it's just
• 1:25:19
  ripples out through all of society and bitcoins really.
• 1:25:23
  Like what do you need? Like good food, shelter, you
• 1:25:26
  know, transportation you don't really need like a whole lot,
• 1:25:30
  you know, and there's a lot of memes obviously about this.
• 1:25:32
  Like this is, you know, fine for a man or whatever.
• 1:25:36
  And, you know, computer on the ground and a bed mat, no chairs
• 1:25:40
  and sell your chairs and all. So the way that like, where does
• 1:25:44
  art fit into that? And yeah, I mean, on the one
• 1:25:47
  hand, you know, anything that's not Bitcoin is a shit coin and
• 1:25:51
  you should you should buy, you know, should only buy Bitcoin
• 1:25:56
  and and I sell prints and my paper prints that I print
• 1:26:02
  printer gober with art on them are, you know, are a shit coin.
• 1:26:06
  And it's like, you know, everything is everything that's
• 1:26:09
  not a necessity is a shit coin. But art has some special magic
• 1:26:15
  that it is inspiration and, and, and positivity and it's identity
• 1:26:24
  and it's, you know, it's it. What are you going to decorate
• 1:26:28
  the walls of your home with? You know, if you just started
• 1:26:32
  stacking, then you should have bare walls.
• 1:26:34
  But you know, you reach a point with Bitcoin, ultimately
• 1:26:38
  Bitcoins about having the abundance to have, you know,
• 1:26:40
  nice things and and then, you know, you decorate your home
• 1:26:45
  with, with kinds of art that are meaningful and important.
• 1:26:49
  And so like, I think Bitcoin art is as as a, you know, a strong
• 1:26:54
  purpose there. And maybe even if you just
• 1:26:55
  started stacking, you should, you know, get a Bitcoin print
• 1:26:58
  from me to put on your bedroom wall.
• 1:26:59
  So when you wake up, you look at it and it's a reminder why
• 1:27:02
  you're going to your, you know, terrible Fiat mining job that
• 1:27:06
  day. And it's to go and stack more
• 1:27:08
  Bitcoin. But it's really interesting, you
• 1:27:11
  know, just kind of contemplating and pondering the relation of
• 1:27:14
  art and Bitcoin and, and then brings into question, you know,
• 1:27:19
  and art does this in itself and has been doing it for a long
• 1:27:22
  time. But like what is value and the
• 1:27:24
  subjectivity of value and a lot of interesting conversations
• 1:27:27
  there that kind of lead into what is art and stuff.
• 1:27:29
  So Bitcoin art, physical Bitcoin art and, you know, digital art
• 1:27:35
  too. I you know, there's a lot of
• 1:27:40
  great digital art out there. Not NFTS.
• 1:27:44
  Not NFTS. What does Bitcoin mean to you?
• 1:27:55
  Bitcoin means hope and Bitcoin means freedom and Bitcoin means
• 1:28:08
  simplicity. It it?
• 1:28:11
  Yeah, that distillation distilling all the bullshit
• 1:28:16
  down. What is what is necessary and
• 1:28:19
  Bitcoin means true and mathematical purity that
• 1:28:27
  represents honesty, integrity and morality.
• 1:28:31
  How can how can we have more of that in our lives?
• 1:28:34
  And how can we more and thoroughly embody that and live
• 1:28:37
  that and how and humanity as a whole live in a symbiotic and
• 1:28:44
  harmonious way with the natural world around us.
• 1:28:50
  And I think that mathematical or just, you know, mathematical
• 1:28:56
  truth being a representation of truth, of actual truth, what is
• 1:29:01
  the truth? And how can we each live in more
• 1:29:06
  truth? How can we as a collective live
• 1:29:11
  a more truthful, honest way of life on this earth so that
• 1:29:15
  hopefully the rivers are still clean for our children's
• 1:29:18
  children? Precisely.
• 1:29:22
  And it does all of that at scale.
• 1:29:27
  You know, we can do that worldwide, globally.
• 1:29:30
  We just need, yeah, need to cross that, cross that bridge,
• 1:29:34
  get more people across the bridge and look, projects like
• 1:29:38
  Bitcoin, the art magazine and you know, all the artists.
• 1:29:43
  That's the thing, people, you, you never know what a touch
• 1:29:45
  point is going to hit what, what's going to resonate with a
• 1:29:48
  particular person. And that's, that's the beauty of
• 1:29:52
  this thing. It's a neutral protocol just
• 1:29:54
  transmitting transacting value across time and space and people
• 1:30:01
  can be interested in all manner of different things and you
• 1:30:05
  never know what that touch point is.
• 1:30:06
  And I think your work over the years has certainly must have
• 1:30:12
  orange peeled a few people. It has to have.
• 1:30:15
  And then this this new project with the Bitcoin Out magazine
• 1:30:18
  and just presence on nostril and conversations.
• 1:30:22
  And you know, The thing is, you just never know what's going to
• 1:30:30
  resonate at a particular time. And the fact that it's out there
• 1:30:33
  in the world and you're creating these things is like the world
• 1:30:36
  is a better place for it. And dude, I just wanted to say
• 1:30:40
  thank you for spending some scarce time, fun and energy
• 1:30:43
  telling us the tale of how you discovered Bitcoin.
• 1:30:47
  I thank you for doing what you do and thank you for having me,
• 1:30:52
  having me chatting with me and giving me a platform to chill my
• 1:30:59
  wares. Light chilling.
• 1:31:04
  Light chilling. Yeah, light chilling, light
• 1:31:06
  chilling. Thank you for giving me a
• 1:31:07
  platform to, you know, I don't know, talk about my story and
• 1:31:13
  talk about my journey and discovering Bitcoin and what I'm
• 1:31:18
  working on, how I'm interacting with Bitcoin and giving it all
• 1:31:22
  the people you've given a platform to and taking your
• 1:31:25
  scare time to do so. It's it's just freaking awesome.
• 1:31:33
  How how you know it's it's exciting and you know, I will
• 1:31:39
  say that. How does Bitcoin change you?
• 1:31:42
  You asked earlier. It has given me it has
• 1:31:47
  definitely. I feel like I may be under.
• 1:31:50
  I answered that a little underwhelmingly, but it has
• 1:31:53
  given me a fucking new lease on life and it's given me hope for
• 1:31:56
  humanity in this planet. And I've, you know, I'm very
• 1:31:59
  been very black pilled and you know, have at times still do a
• 1:32:06
  very nihilistic, nihilistic nihilistic, I don't know how to
• 1:32:09
  say that word perspective on the world.
• 1:32:11
  And Bitcoin gives me like has given me such, such a large
• 1:32:18
  amount of just hope and optimism for the future or not just
• 1:32:23
  myself, but for like everybody in the whole world and it and I
• 1:32:27
  think that's, you know, possibly the most special thing about it.