Latest / Hardly Artifical Podcast / Pilot

Transcript

Pilot · Hardly Artifical Podcast

• Derek Major: Welcome to Hardly Artificial. We explore tech and the human experience. Sit back, relax, and let's dive in. All right, welcome to our pilot episode of Hardly Official. I'm Derek Major and this is We're already failing. Mike, this is your cue, buddy. This is har hardly artificial, right? Like this is this. This is the pilot. We're here. This is the pilot. So it took us a few weeks, you know? Like but we're here. So yeah, so listeners, this is like our first kickoff today. And if you're listening to this, you're probably one of a handful that are actually listening to this, but that's cool. finally what hardly artificial is all about is just AI and technology and whatever else Mike and I can come up with. So Mike, give quick background on yourself. Yeah, you know, I it's funny. Derek when Derek and I met a couple of years ago, I had come from a vast variety of things and I I have a tendency to want to do everything all at once. And Derek knows that and that's a also a weakness of mine. But at the same time coming from a background of, you know, in the field construction, project management, all the way into technology and things of that nature, you know, it it it has really given me perspective around the human element and how we're going to adapt in this world that's constant changing technology. So my passion here is really to share my experiences. I know I get to see this daily. Not a lot of people get to do that, have that privilege or, you know, whatever that feeling of, hey, it's sc it's a scary world out there, but it doesn't need to be that scary. And I you know, I'd I'd love to share those experiences. But Derek, I think your background's even more interesting just based on we have similar trajectories, but you're kind of a little farther down the path. So we'd love to hear more about kind of What kind of made you wanna do this? Like what talk about this stuff? Well, I I'm like semi retired, Mike, as you know. So joking aside, so I spent eighteen years running a company called Eligio. so entrepreneur by heart. and you know, earlier this year I handed over the reins, which of course, Mike, you're you're still there, right? So the This is just really my passion, is technology. I love I love talking about these things and have conversations around it. So I'm I'm r really, really excited and privileged that you're willing to jump on this thing with me and thank you. Give it a go. So yeah. So so yeah, so you know, listeners, I guess this is the format of how we're it's probably gonna change every couple of weeks as we kind of work through this. the goal is to record this every week or so. once we get into cadence, you know, we'll we'll we'll you know, it should be a little more predictable. But really we want to share stories with you. We want to share these things that we're learning because we're kind of deep in it every week. So you'll hear some stories from Mike, from myself. We'll probably have different segments and things that we're doing as we're going along. so hopefully you enjoy this and find it interesting. And you know, tune back in again next time and make sure you subscribe too to hear more about this. So, Mike, I'm gonna jump right into it. yeah and get into our stories. Let's let you know, I g I'm gonna throw you on the spot. To kind of kick it off with our first story. What's something you've kind of learned in the last week or something that's kind of cool that's that's kind of come up for you in this AI world? Yeah, you know, it's and it's from personal experience. So this isn't something that I'm pulling from the network necessarily. I mean, it is a theme and it's something that I've been struggling with, but also kind of interested in more is the human interaction with AI right now is evolving, right? Like we're constantly looking at different models coming out. You know, the it's the fear of missing out is happening a lot recently where it's like, should I move to the next model? Should I move to the next platform? I I think the biggest thing that we're missing right now, and I'd love to hear your take on this, Derek, is why is it so hard for us to talk to AI? And that's something something that keeps happening over and over is I keep running into this, is like people freeze and they go, Whoa, what do I say? It's like I I I'd love to hear your take on this because it's interesting of how why this is happening right now. Man, you know, that makes me think like driving into the office today, I was listening to a podcast, Diary of a CEO and he the I can't remember her name right now. I'll I'll put it in the show notes on this, the link to it. But they're talking about how to actually have conversations with people. And they started talking about that what was the some of the statistics is that I think three out of ten people actually talk to another human being every day. And she thinks that that's going to change even more so over the coming years where it's going to be more so, you know, one out of ten, right? Because people are talking to computers. And she phrased it perfectly. She's like, we've always talked to talked through computers, like, you know, send an email and all that. But now we're talking to computers. And how how is that going to affect our speech? How we talk to people on a daily basis. But then again, if we're not talking to anybody, like it's how robotic are we gonna get? So I I I thought I was and I haven't finished the the episode on that one, but that it's funny you you mentioned that. That's exactly what I was listening to this morning. Is how does that affect our conversations and how do we actually prompt things? man, like it's isn't it trial and error really? Like I think it's like trial and error. Like you have to find a good thing that works for you. Yeah, I mean that's kinda what I'm discovering is and even in my own experiences over the ninety days we've evolved Eolisio in terms of the AI push that we did is it had nothing to do with knowing what to say. It had everything to do with trying, seeing where it goes, going, No, that's not quite it. I've also even found it's interesting, the evolution of the models within Cloud and A OpenAI's chat GPT has caused me to shift the way I talk to it, where it basically it's not that rigid, you are a this and you are going to do this. It's more like, hey, we have a theme here, right? We have a context. And it just it's fascinating that we're still there like we're, you know, obviously you and I are kind of on the more of the adoption end, right? We're the early adopters trying like get ahead of the curve. But the folks that are on the other side that I've been training and trying to help with. They're even struggling with the basics of what do I even ask it? Right. I think that's another thing that you just brought up is a great point. People don't know even know how to ask questions in real life. They're not gonna know how to ask questions to technology either. And and if you don't know how to ask questions, you're not gonna get the answers you're looking for. Yeah. Right? It's nobody cares about spelling anymore. It's like L O L I don't know, maybe it is. I don't know it is a like Webster Dictionary. You're dating yourself there. Yeah, L you're dating yourself. Well I know, but yeah, I guess that's all it's emojis now, isn't it? So yeah. Yeah. But really it's like all of these shorthanded texts now, whether it's emojis or whatnot. I think I can't remember who did like a a whole series of jokes around the whole idea. I'm just gonna talk to a person with emojis and see what happens. Just sends emojis out all the time. But yeah. Yeah, I I I think I don't know how you make a good prompt. Like I think it's one thing, I mean, this could almost be a story on its own, but I I've been using Obsidian for tracking all my notes. But I have Claude or ChatGPT tied right into the obsidian project folder. So it's updating the files automatically. It doesn't put the whole conversations in there. It just does a nice little summary. And I find that that's really useful because then I can go in and edit the note and all that. But when I pick up the conversation again, it just reads the note. versus the entire context of the free use conversation. And then I I don't have to prompt as much as, you know, to kind of set things up. But like it's already ready to go. And I think that's the one thing people need to do. It's like it's I think it's obvious, but when you set up a project in either of those platforms, it gives you the opportunity to put instructions in there. Like put those instructions in there. Like you are a chief marketing officer of a mining company or whatever it might be. And just give it some instructions and clear direction to who who the i who who you want the AI to be, then I think that's a good way of doing it. So Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, I and you know what it's funny, you you brought up the I know you're interested and excited to talk a little bit more about the external hardware too. And it's interesting you bring up emojis, right? So just tell me a little bit more about you you were you were telling me before the show about the iPhone, right, that came out and how is that gonna change the way in which maybe the conversations will change? 'Cause In my eyes, right, and this is me talking back from the Nokia bricks that came out when I was in high school, right? I was thinking about those the other day, going, it was basically you either called somebody or you took about twenty five minutes to text him within those like T T nine texting? yeah. Yeah, exactly. Right. Speaking of dating ourselves. Yeah. Right. Right. Yeah. But it but I'd be curious to know like what what is this w this release is big. It is. Like it's it's it's huge. And like the fold has been something that's been a Technology that has been hard to chase because there's so many variables to it. What is so big deal about the iPhone though? Like why why do you think it's going to change the way people perceive it? I think it's because of the massive influence Apple has on the economy when it comes like not sorry, the industry rather. I Samsung's been doing foldables, Huawei, OnePlus, all those companies have been doing it for years. I think the biggest difference is when Apple comes in. They have that reputation of we wait a long time to do something and then we try to do it as the best way that Apple can. And yeah, it's it's so those that don't know, like this week Apple announced their regular iPhone cycles, but then they announced the the iPhone duo, which is something I've been waiting for for years. Like I've always had foldables here and there, but I've always been an iPhone guy. And and I s you know, I've Flip over to Android for a few weeks and you know, I always miss my iOS stuff. It's just really smooth and just a great software experience. And that's the only thing Apple can do is that's hardware to software services. It's all packaged together really tightly. So now they've released this thing. It's I think what did I say? I I think it was like 1.6% of s of global smartphone sales are foldables. Yeah. So the question is like. Is Apple gonna move the needle on that? And I think they're going to just because of the people that just really love to use iPhones. they're not cheap though. That's the only problem with $2,000 US starting point. A lot of that has to do with the semiconductor crisis we're going through as far as RAM prices and things and you know the whole AI data center thing. But I think once y people start getting these things, these tools, I think this is kind of the next evolution of have you have you seen the rabbit? Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah, so like A AI rabbits, like this is for those that don't know, I guess for our listeners, that this is look it up, it's rabbits, they have these little companion AI tools. I don't know why they built these things, honestly, because Samsung Google and every iPhone, sorry, not iPhone, every smartphone maker out there is gonna come along and build out all of these things on their own and start baking into their phones. And I think what we're gonna see is Apple's argument is the iPhone's not going anywhere. I would agree with that. And I and I think what's gonna end up happening is we're gonna start seeing these new form factors to get to the point where rabbits at, but they're way too early and they just don't have the influence. Because if I can take something like a rabbit, which is actually an iPhone with a screen, maybe, because I don't think the rabbit has a screen. Or maybe something small or like whatever it Yeah, it's tiny. Yeah, I like indicate light indicators or something. Yeah. I think I I Apple's gonna keep shrinking this thing. 'Cause I mean, we call it a phone, but is it really a phone? Like again, if we have three out of ten people having conversations every day, the other seven, they're probably just I mean, they're swiping through Instagram all day and TikTok. It it's a P C. Come on, that's a pocket PC. Remember those? Pocket PC. Pocket PC. Younger folks on here are gonna think we're crazy. If my kids ever listen to it, they'll think we're crazy. It's true. But I I I think that You're just gonna see this is like that evolution of the smaller and smaller, smaller, because this thing is the size of your passport, fits in your pocket perfectly. Like I have the full date right now, and that's awesome to hold. software experience is but I I feel like with Android every time, I think it's something you have to get used to with Android. Whereas iPhone's so smooth, and then when you see again, I haven't had my hands on the iPhone duo yet, but you see like the animations opening up the screen. It's just so inviting and you want to use it. And then you pair in, like, they're releasing their new iOS next week, which has the new Siri AI on it. And I've been I've had the beta on my phone for the last six months or s not six months, but maybe four or five since there were the beta releases or yeah, the beta developer beta releases came out. It's awesome, dude. Like you can do so much with it. So imagine if I have this little duo phone and popping open. I'm like, hey, can you go and add like take a look at actually that's a perfect example. I saw a poster that I think was one of the demos that might have been on the demo on the the keynote for Apple. But if you have like a poster with all these dates on it, like concert dates or events or whatever it is, you just take a picture of it when you're at your whatever, at school or at your university and say, Hey, put all these dates in my calendar. It'll just pick the dates out, it'll go throw them in your calendar for you. And it'll do them seconds. It's amazing, right? I'm pretty sure Gemini could do that on the Android side. I was gonna say it's it's a little it's a little bit more manual, obviously, because you have to prompt it to do it or whatever, talk to it. But yeah, I Yeah, you still have to talk to it, but yeah, you still take the picture and say, please add these in. But just use your voice. It's so cool. Like that I mean first world problems. You have to go and add an AI to add to your calendar. But man, isn't that cool? I think that's that that and that's the kind of stuff that we want an assistant to help. And I think by having that pocketable thing, I can slide in there, I have the supercomputer in my pocket, which we already have today, but it's getting smaller and smaller, but I can open it up. Like, do you really need to buy an iPad anymore? I was just going to ask you that. And this is something I've been struggling with too, right? Is the current technology offerings on on phones in general, right? Smartphones in general are not supportive of the heavy users, right? Like they they don't they don't cater to the need of, you know, hey, I need to run a dual screen right now, one of which is gonna be my database, the other one's gonna be the chat window. And I wanna watch as it makes the changes, but then be able to interact with it as it goes. It's not, it's not feasible right now. It's too slow, it's too clunky. So everybody's migrating too. I I was l I was actually watching Lenovo's coming out with another version of their Legion handheld iPad, you know, like the actual like path. Yeah, I've seen those, yeah. Yeah. And it's interesting. I was reading about it because I was like, what is this thing? Like I I'm not a mobile gamer, so I don't know anything about this world, but When I was reading about, was like, that'd be interesting because then it's small enough but powerful enough to be able to run like a cloud agent on the side of maybe you're checking your email or your phone. And I always think about traveling. You know, I travel quite a bit for work and you know, I'm always on the road sometimes. I want something that I can pull out and work on something and then put it back in, not all right, I gotta pull out the computer, open it up. So I guess in your perspective, does this change maybe the competition of Apple? bringing this product into the market, do you think that's going to change the way people think about the software behind the support or even the hardware chips to then change the way that people perceive the mobile working experience? Because that's really where we're headed, right? That's if people want accessibility and it's continually getting more advanced. Yeah. I mean everybody's trying to copy Apple, right? Like it's funny, Sam Slung will I remember what was it when they took away the the headphone jack off of the iPhone years ago? And then Samsung comes out, look at that, we still have a headphone jacket. What do they do the next year? They took it out. They take it out. So and this year, like like I said, I had the fold eight at home. Why did they they changed the complete form factor of their foldables right before Apple released theirs in the same form factor? Like they've gone from copying to predicting. So It's and you go online, like people are criticizing even that. Like the the it's like Samsung, why did you rush this? 'Cause Apple comes out and everyone's like, there's Samsung displays inside of an Apple duo, the iPhone duo, which is true. But there's like ten layers to that, those screens. And so Samsung no knew about the form factor for sure, because obviously Apple's ordering these, you know, the passport style sized glass, right? So but now Apple's like put their own technology on it. So my point is that everyone's always trying to copy and try to be like Apple, but the one thing that they cannot seem to figure out is Apple controls everything. Everyone jokes about the walled garden. but man, like it's it's slick. It's slick, right? I forgot my AirPods today, so that's why I don't have my AirPods in. So hopefully this isn't picking up as we're doing this. But I am recording this off my iPhone. Right? It's synced to my Mac. Automatically recording. And it was easy. So easy. I just turn it on. It's all connected. everyone's like, well you're stuck in the Apple ecosystem. It's funny when people say you're stuck in an ecosystem because they're like, I'm leaving the Apple ecosystem. And what do they do? They go by Samsung Galaxy, they buy Samsung Buds, they buy a Samsung tablet and a Samsung laptop. I'm like You're doing the same thing. First of all, you have that much disposable income to just switch. Yeah. Right. so I think that's that's always funny. But they're always tr they're always trying to copy Apple, and the reality is that until you have a seamless ecosystem that's on the same hardware, the same software, there's a reason the apps look great on the iPhone is because an Android app developer has to make sure that that app works on how many models out there? Yeah. Right. There's so many form factors. There's so many different types of phones, so many different processors. I don't know the numbers off top of my head, but the reality is that Android adoption is significantly lagging. Whereas when a new version iOS comes out, like their adoption hits like eighties and nineties, I think. So, whereas I think you're maybe ten percent of the people are on the most recent Android version and a lot of those older phones are still sitting on older versions of Android. So I I think that's the biggest problem. So anyways, that's enough on our Apple Apple fanboy talk, but I'll turn it back to you. What what else you got for us this week? You know, I was I was actually going back to just the the market switches that have been going on, especially with, you know, the volatile stocks that have been happening around the AI world and the fears that have been kind of just, you know, illuminating the, you know, the excess of hey, did the job losses actually tie to the actual AI sector? the US sectors, things of that nature. And like I keep looking at these these numbers and I'm questioning them a little bit because I'm going, are you trying to find a way to tie it to the numbers to make sense of the volatile market? Or is it truly that we're getting reports that this is actually happening? And the more I the more I dig in dig in, the more I can't figure out what's real, what's not. So I I wanted to see like what is your perspective, especially myself being in the US, you being in Canada, we're seeing different storylines, right? Obviously. What do you think is the real push to try to figure out this debate? 'Cause I I I just it's getting messier and messier every day. And you just we just don't know what to believe at this point. Yeah, I job job numbers are interesting, isn't it? Like and politicians like to run with it whatever angle they can play. So it's it's always it's it's both sides both sides do that, right? So both countries rather. buying both parties too, depending what flavor of the day they got going on. but I I think it really listen jobs will be affected. I I was having this conversation with someone the other day where yeah AI is going to displace. It's going to create new opportunities, I have no doubt. I mean I'm not sold on how many jobs I think it's going to create. And when I say jobs, not like the number of people working but the actual number of jobs like an AI engineer or the end of these different roles. Yeah, like you and I talked about this before, where it's like a hundred years ago, what's a physiotherapist? A psychologist? That farmer would probably look at us like we're nuts. Yeah. so yeah, physi physi physical? Like Yeah. So I I think that I think the numbers are reflective of the economy of itself. I think I don't think you can actually take the like in up in Canada, stats can. Statistics Canada is the one that reports on all the job numbers up here back in July, like, hey, look, we got all this growth going on. and then I saw the report last week. August was bad. We lost jobs. and so all of a sudden you don't hear politicians talking about those as much. Or they do and they say, Well, actually, if you look into it. private jobs did increase or something like that, right? So they always get into these defined but it doesn't say what. So I don't know if you can actually rely on job numbers. I think you need to actually talk to people on the ground to really understand. another and just to wrap that up, another another business I was talking to yesterday talked about we want to scale. We want to grow the business. I said, Yeah, you probably want to scale, you're probably not going to add as many people as you would have before and you shouldn't. 'Cause if you should if you are adding more the same amount of people as you would like five years ago, then you've missed the whole idea around what AI and automation can do. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah, I mean it it's funny. you know, they had a job report in the US, I think was the August one, and they're like, it's, you know, increasing hundred and sixty thousand jobs or whatever. You and you always look at that numbers, you're like, There's so many variables to that, like you can't take it to, you know, take it. Are they summer jobs? That's the other thing I would ask too. It's like are these all Again, devil. We don't even know where the numbers come from anymore. Like it's it's probably just AI generated at this point. Let's be honest. But but like the the thing I keep looking back at is there is a commonality, right? And the graduation to junior roles is impacted big time. I know that for a fact. And that that is something that's real. And I think that is something that I keep looking at, going, what you said is true. It's the evolution that's going on. It's not necessarily that they're losing jobs or not as many out there. It's They don't know where to look because they're unfortunately caught in the crosshairs of we don't even know where to look. We have no idea what the next evolution is. Like a matter of fact, we're evolving as we sit right now, where it's like, do we really need people to be monitoring agents? They monitor themselves. So what are we what are we doing next? Right. So I I I just wanted to bring that up because I think that impacts a lot of people out there right now. Is there's folks out there trying to figure out what is their next move in their career, right? Right. They're in a job that they know might take over. AI AI might take it over. And when I say take over, I'm not saying they're gonna displace them. I'm saying that you are going to be interacting with the tool much more often and much more frequently to do your job. But I guess how do we help people navigate that? Because that's the thing that I think everybody's scared of right now. And that's the sphere n of numbers. You know, when they say lost job report, they just go, Well, that's AI. It's like it's like the commonality of what was it like back when the dot com boom happened where it's like, They just blamed everything, right? They just blamed everything they could get their hands on. So I just you know, it's just interesting. These numbers really don't say much, but they do impact people quite a bit, which is interesting. I I what pops in my head right away, I have an answer to that, but something else that pops in my head is how every time anthropic or open AI says of a a doomsday snare like so that'll be my next story, but a hack has occurred. or like the hugging face incident a few months ago. Where OpenAI's agent got loose somehow and hacked Hugging Face. Hugging Face knew they got hacked. They didn't know why or who. until days later, OpenAI is like, sorry, that was actually us. I wonder how much of that is actually like we gotta pump up the IPO. Right? I I feel like there's a lot of that. So it's really hard to I don't know, I don't trust a lot of the messaging that goes on out out on the internet now because it's like I in social media is brutal. Like I don't really respond to a lot of comments because I think a lot of them are bot generated. Heaven forbid you comment on anything political. It doesn't matter what side you're on. It doesn't matter if you're right, just deep center. Just doesn't matter. It just goes wild. You're like, what are these people like sitting here just staring? No, they're probably a bot. Yeah. So but it baits you into this conversation. So anyway, that that's one thing that pops in my head is how much people are trying to influence by spinning things. Now back to that, what do young folks do? I I honestly think that we talked about different jobs being created. I have no doubt that there's going to be a a non tech companies, which is what I'm doing a lot more work with now. I don't really want to work with tech companies. I think I've done enough of that for the last twenty some years. No. Come on. Work. But not non tech's interesting. I I've told several business owners, Like I'm an entrepreneur organization, EO. So I I talk to a lot of them on a regular basis. And one of the things that pops up is I think you're going to be hiring an internal IT AI workflow. I don't know what you're going to call them yet, but they're going to be part of your staff just as is it's been normal to have like an office assistant or office manager, like that type of admin role is just basically going to be an upgraded person that's like, Doing a lot more complex stuff, solving workflows, solving, you know, running things like make dot com, N8N, and all these tools. They are overseeing your CRM. They are overseeing your AI tools and deploying the AI tools. Like I think that's going to be one of the new roles that come out. And who better than someone that's fresh out of university that's eager, excited, wants to learn and figure out all this stuff? I feel like those are going to be great roles for people coming out of school. And that one of the one of the fri one a buddy of mine in his business, that's exactly what they did, they hired an intern. And they said, Yeah, here you go. Go figure it out. And they're in like they're not they're non tech. So and it's an intern role, but I said to them, You're probably gonna keep this person just because look look how much value they're gonna bring to you. And you're gonna need it. Well, this goes I I think I'm just gonna wrap back to what we started with, right? This goes back to they don't know where AI came from necessarily. They they know the history behind it. I will I'll give them that. But they don't know that like, when we were working with the LLMs, the early stage LLMs, or we were working with even the machine learning, we had to do very s constrictive, like, hey, this is how you do it, or you're not going to get the results you're looking for. They're free for me. And I think that's a advantage. I really do, especially with the agentic models we have out there now is like they can just talk to it naturally and they're gonna figure it out, which is fantastic. So I I want to I I just wanna bring that up because that's encouraging to me. I don't think that should be something people are discouraged by. I think it's just gotta be patient. That's the problem right now. You have to be patient, which none of us have patience ever since Amazon came along and started delivering things in twenty four hours. There is no patience. I still remember waiting on shoes from Nike for two weeks because I really wanted this type of basketball shoes in high school. And I was patient enough to say, Well, at least it took only took two weeks. Like That's funny. Yeah. No, there there is no patience anymore. Everyone wants everyone wants their I mean, that's going back to having that pocket PC, right? Like you everything is readily available now. It's like why why would you want to wait and but I think that's that generation is is great for that because this stuff's changing so quickly. Yeah. That you kind of want someone that can actually get in there and and and really just try things out. you still need to put guardrails in. So those of you listening are business owners. Or managers and you're bringing people in, don't just hire that person. All right, good luck. Let me know how it goes. Like you still gotta give direction, okay? You are hiring an intern. You won't be part of the one percent. You'll be part of the ninety nine percent that's failing right now. Let's just be honest. Totally. Totally. Yeah. So you still need to give clear direction. You need it's it's even how we've described talking about building out an agent, it's like creating a really detailed job description, probably the most detailed job description you will ever make. But you still have to give them the direction. But give them that flexibility to be creative, to go outside the box, give them some some some sandboxes to play in. I think that's really a great way of you know unlocking new value in a business that you might not have even thought about before. So yeah. So I think, yeah, wrapping up that piece, your job number thing, like I don't know if it's a long winded way of saying I don't know. I don't know what those politicians and bureaucrats are coming up with or why they're coming up with these numbers, but those are And these are all things that I think it's hard to measure because this is data we've been collecting for decades. And when it comes to like job numbers too, Canada and US, their numbers are based on people actively seeking employment. So it's like I so I s some people will be like, Well, how did we lose job no jobs? But the unemployment rate didn't change. It's 'cause less people start you know, people stopped looking for jobs or more people started looking for jobs. Vice versa, right? Yeah. So it's Yeah. Cool. All right. Well let's let's wrap it up with a last last story, which is I kind of alluded to it already, is that Anthropic this week. The headline, if you haven't read about it, is an a former anthropic employee left the company, gave up all of his equity. As you can imagine, these AI employees the multi million dollar stocks sitting in their pocket, right? So yeah. And and he left because he felt like the world is in trouble. he thinks that, you know, and one of the big quotes, again, this is like the headline grabbing thing, is that there's like a seventy percent chance in three years that, you know, we're gonna be abolished as a as humanity. extinct is I think is the word he used. So that's kind of the headline thing. and then to add on to that, anthropic also came out. I believe it was yesterday with a very detailed report on different things they've seen people trying to do on their platform using Claude, where the big one is like trying to create biochemical weapons. And they've had to stop that. That is that just a ploy to pump up the IPO again? Or is it also a way to encourage governments to kind of clamp down on open weight models. Because they're not regulated, right? They're not as exactly. Yeah. So that goes there. Or third, Maybe it is real. So what do you think? I I agree with you on the first part. I think that there's a no lose situation here for anthropic on this statement, right? Is it's playing into the fear that's already there, right? It's already out there. Matter of fact, my the head of a of AI here at Delegio called me and I love this. And I'm I'm actually nicknamed my fantasy team after this too now. He said, You are so into AI that you're like the safe food that AI will eat first and you're called white rice. And I was laughing so hard when I heard that that now my fantasy team is called White Rice. But what was what's hilarious about it though is it's it's real, right? Like, yes, there is that threat, right? Yes, of course there's always a threat. But think back to like we were talking about the accessibility in the dark web or accessibility on online, things of that nature. We're dealing with the same exact issues that we've been dealing with for how many years now? And it's just evolving into more of an accessible rate, right? Like I I feel like it's just faster. So I don't know what of three that I would believe in necessarily. I think all three are plausible. What I don't believe is it's not going to impact the big names. I think it's actually going to pump them up to say they have the capacity and the and the know how to be able to regulate. And then they're trying to partner to be able to monopolize what's already there. Right. That's kind of where my head goes with this statement. But again, it I mean Shoot, there's a lot of ways you could take this, honestly. I mean, what about you? I mean, what where where did your head go when you hear about this stuff? You know what I immediately thought of? I don't know if you remember this. late 90s, early 2000s. Again, people are getting on the internet and all that. one of the things people freaked out about, which I'm sure it's still in the dark web, is the I'm trying to remember the name. It was like the Pirates Cookbook or something. I'm probably completely wrong. But th this cookbook was an online guide on like how to create a bomb, for instance. So everyone was up in arms about this saying, whoa. Anybody can go online, find this guide and build it, right? Mm-hmm. So now I think, well here we are today, twenty twenty six. Anybody can use an AI to ask the same questions 'cause you you can bet that, you know, those AIs have trained on all this stuff, right? Yeah. And I I immediately my head goes, Wow, it's fast now. It can happen fast. So I don't disagree on the regulation side. I think there needs to be some kind of regulation around this. I just don't know how you control it. and I don't think to your point, like I don't think these problems are any different than they were before. I think the biggest difference is that it happens so fast. The job losses and the job changes are happening fast. The threats are happening fast, the hacking into systems are happening fast. Mm-hmm. There is a whole thing around like open AI has their cyber security model for companies to play defense. Right. How many of them are actually doing that is a different question. I'm sure insurance companies are gonna be rigged requiring that soon. So it's I think it's the speed. Speed is where I I get the messaging around it. I just always wonder about like and yeah again, social media I I posted s can't remember who I was posting this with, but the one comment I said was, Can I just unplug this thing? Which you know, kill switch is probably the terminology a lot of people use. Like I feel like we're still at a point where I can unplug this. if it gets bad. But that that that's in the situation where systems can actually attack, say, national defense systems, for instance, right? I think you can unplug it there, but that doesn't stop the open weight stuff. Like, it's here. And I think you'd be crazy not to think that some bad actor out there isn't trying to use open weight models. Yeah. It's just so many different directions it can head. I think that's I think that's what people are scared of is the unknown. And that's something that I you know, even on a simplistic level, right, of going back to just humans interacting with AI and going back to what you stated around, you know, w we were gonna lose the ability to talk to each other because we're talking to computers and the structure of the conversations are biased to what we do. So it's only going to exacerbate what we do poorly, right? And I think it just And I think that's kind of where we're headed, right? Is it's that same mentality where you're seeing the exact evolution of hey, these guys are, you know, they're using it for bad. They're not using it for, they're not using it to benefit humanity. There's always gonna be that. Yes, it's terrifying how fast it's happening. my gosh, it's terrifying. And it's you know, I was even talking to somebody recently around what I do for a living. And they like, Wow, that you know, aren't you terrified of like how fast it's moving? And I'm I honestly said no. Because I know that there is a pace that people have to go at. And yes, is the technology moving fast? Sure. But like tying tying a knot on kind of what you talked about with the iPhone, right? Everything moves fast. The thing is that we're almost we're almost at a point where regulation even can't keep up because, you know, as you know, government's not going to do anything fast. Like it takes forever to make a decision anymore. So how how do we how do we practice better practices, right? It's kind of like our own sanity, our own security that we play. And I I I think that's where this is all going is it's still benefiting the big names, Anthropic, OpenAI, all the other, and I'm not going to call them small players because they're not, but it's perplexity, things of that nature that are still in play right now. They're all playing the same game is we're going to give you the tools. How you use it is not our fault. That that's always going to be the messaging. And it's the same thing like and I I I don't want to go political on this, but like you give somebody something. They do something bad with it. Like w that's a decision on p on behalf of that person. Right. It's not something that you can say, that that is our fault, and here's how we're gonna manage it, right? It's been a commonality of humanity since dawn of time. Yeah. No, and that's it's that's that same thing that one person ruins it for everybody all the time. Right? This is why we can't have nice things, by the way. So true. So true. Kills me. But yeah, I I think I think that we're entering a you're right, we're th entering a very fast pace. And I think if you kinda have to get on get on the r on the train, I guess. Is the bullet train maybe? Get on the bullet train. 'cause the reality is that this stuff is moving fast, the world is changing. And if you don't adapt to it, and every business I talk to, they are mostly aware, mostly using AI. Mostly conversation though. They're not actually deploying agents and things like that, which to be fair, not all of them need to do that yet, but they are starting to. Yeah. But I think the interesting thing is actually it's kinda like COVID where it it increased the amount of video calls and remote working. I feel like AI's spurring people to get serious about tech. And it might be just implementing workflow tools or a C R It's sometimes as basic as that. And then we'll get to the other stuff too by you know, sheer force of nature and the economy forcing them to. it's it is all happening fast. It's yeah, it's a little scary. And I'm sure by tomorrow you and I'll have a different conversation about the impact because something else is going to happen. and I do think I I I I can something else I've told someone just recently. I have no doubt we are going to read a lot about different companies getting hacked over the next six, twelve months. I think that's like the step one of the red flag is we hear about these breaches like Hugging Face and you know, these I I think that there's was it TELUS, I think recently up in Canada had a recent issue too. so a few of them have actually run into things. not all of them say it's AI, but I have no doubt like if you're hacking you're a bad hacker if you're not using AI. Not seeing an endorse hacking at all, but That's kind of the reality. Yeah. But the reality is that they are using these tools. The bad actors are using them. You're it completely ignorant if you if you think otherwise. So I think that there's gonna be a lot of hacking going on. And I think that first step is gonna be, you know, s I mean, it would shock me if a bank gets hit. Right. So just working with banks in the past, I've seen what infrastructure they have in place and Yeah, it's especially smaller banks. I can see that being a big problem. so it's gonna be very interesting to see how that kind of plays out. cool. All right, man. Well normally we jump into a segment, but of course, you know, pilot episode, I don't really have anything prepared. We'll get one. I got one. I one for you. You got one? Okay. Well let's do it. From your perspective, and you're talking to a lot of businesses right now, and same same with me. What do you think your hot take is on the number one step to take right now to get on board, even if it's the first step? Like what what could somebody do coming out of this call, hearing about the tech, hearing about the fears, but also the human out the humanistic way we have to interact with AI? What is that first step to you look like for somebody to get on board? First step for AI. Just subscribe to Claud or Chat GPT, honestly. if you're on an iPhone, get going. Series the new series like iOS twenty seven comes out on Monday. Get on that. Monday being September 14th, depending when this gets released. So yeah, just play with it. Try it. Just talk to it. Ask it some complex stuff, ask it ridiculous stuff. And I think the one of the more interesting things that I've done with these tools is just having Is using the audio feature and just talking to it. It's open chat GPT is really intuitive. It's it feels like you're actually talking to a person. So you can actually do a great brainstorming exercise with that. So actually there you go, brainstorming. Do you have an idea that you're thinking about? Go brainstorm that with with the audio version of you know either Chat GPT or Claude, depending what you have. Yeah. How about you? What what what would be your what would be your hot take? You know, my my mine is one I actually did when I got started with. the early stages of Gemini was I designed a business. And I just I just did it upon a dream I had of something that was funny initially and now it's actually real. Right. And it's not something you have to go take action on. That's not what I'm saying. I'm not saying hey go take a risk, start a business, whatever. It's more just you have it just everybody has an idea of something. Right. Yes. You know you said brainstorming. There's also these ideas where people are like, that would be really interesting. In the past, it would be like, well, I don't have time to explore that. But now you can basically build a business. You should you should try that sometime. Just be like, hey, I want to design a logo for this business just because it would be funny. It's it's it's incredible now the technology and what it does. Like I'm blown away. It's fun. That's a good one. I like that. Yeah. Cool, man. All right. Well this has been awesome. And Yeah, no, I think I think the f I think we obviously we'll work on format and all that too and get through that. But I do have one last thing. Love But I think will go well with our podcast and for our guinea pig listeners. So thank you for listening. If you've been listening through all this. I I and I got this from another podcast that I really enjoy listening to called Acquired. And they do they they finish it off the call off with like cool things that have been happening for them. Maybe not even to do with AI. Like something you might have picked up in the last week, something that was kinda cool for you. So I'm gonna turn it to you. Like it could be like sports related, it can be family related, it can be whatever it is, something unique, something neat that's just kinda popped up for you in the last week. What do you what do you what do you what would you say to that? Like what's happened for you? You know, I I I've spent a lot of time with my son and we do a lot of stuff outside. And one of the things that happened in the last it was two weeks ago, but you know, relatively relatively in the same timeline was he stood up on a surfboard. And that was a big milestone. Like it was he's been fighting the battle of trying to balance and then all of a sudden he did it and I was I think I was more excited about that than I was about the whole trip. I just basically had a moment and the whole trip was awesome, but like that moment has stuck in my mind. So yeah, I would say that was the one thing that happened. I was like, that was awesome. I like that. Yeah. That's great. Anything else? you know, I I I think in the tech side I will say something about that since it's in translation. I figured out why agent to agent exists. I had the moment. I had the aha. And that's hard to have sometimes with these kind of things because they are complex. And I realize it's crazy how fast you can go once you have it. I I didn't had no idea until I implemented it, just a very simple one. And I was like, Whoa. Okay. Now it opened up a whole nother doors going, What you know, what else can I do? You know. So I like that. for me, well, my kids are back in sch well, at least one of my kids is back in school this week. She's in grade three. so she's super pumped about that. Nice. but so that's that's the big thing this week. But you know, other other little cool things too. man, I I again I'll give a techie one too. Like I'm I'm really into Linux right now. So my I remember buying Red Hat dating myself again in nineteen ninety six from a little bookstore in Calgary, Alberta, Canada. And went home installed lots of building computers and this stuff too. I was terrible at it, but I I loved the I just loved it. So I've been kinda getting back into it again too. so I've been running Fedora on one of the ThinkPads we have in the office 'cause I mean we're Mac Shop at Eligio now, so I there's a ThinkPad and I just threw it on there. I've been playing with it a bit and I'm blown away how far that stuff's gone. so I I could see a lot of it's because people are a little pissed off at Microsoft right now and Windows, so they're kind of moving over to Linux, a lot of these people, more techie people. I'm sure Windows is not gonna be impacted that much. But it's kind of cool. It's pretty neat to see how far this stuff's come. yeah, so that's that's my my thing for this week. But so yeah, listeners, thanks for joining us today. And again subscribe if you found this interesting this conversation. we'll be working on our next episode pretty soon here, probably with the r the proper format, but probably not too far from what we did today. But you know, would love to hear feedback if you want to share some ideas around that. But for Mike and I, thanks again and we'll see you again soon. Talk to you later.