Latest / ChangeMakers with Katie Goar / Episode 155: Mike Gerber, CEO, Austin Housing Authority

Transcript

Episode 155: Mike Gerber, CEO, Austin Housing Authority · ChangeMakers with Katie Goar

0:05
Speaker 1: This is change Makers, with Katie Gore finding the right
0:09
Speaker 1: solutions for the affordable housing community.
0:13
Speaker 2: Today's change maker is Mike Gerber, the CEO of the
0:17
Speaker 2: Austin Housing Authority, where he has been leading for numerous
0:21
Speaker 2: years and expanding affordable housing the city of Austin. And
0:25
Speaker 2: with this I want to talk about your leadership, how
0:28
Speaker 2: you've grown the housing portfolio and all things Austin. So
0:32
Speaker 2: it is a pleasure to have you here.
0:35
Speaker 3: Great to be with you, Katie of mired and respect
0:37
Speaker 3: you over so many years. Thanks for having me, of.
0:39
Speaker 2: Course, and you guys have hosted so many conferences down there.
0:43
Speaker 2: Austin's a lovely place to be and I appreciate you
0:47
Speaker 2: bringing another side of the housing demands. And you guys
0:51
Speaker 2: are doing some impressive development deals. But before we get
0:56
Speaker 2: started talking about all of those things, I usually like
1:00
Speaker 2: to ask our guests just a little bit about yourself
1:03
Speaker 2: and how you got started into housing. So would you
1:06
Speaker 2: mind sharing your on ramp to housing first?
1:10
Speaker 3: Sure? I probably like everybody else, I think where you
1:13
Speaker 3: you know you start is so different from where you
1:15
Speaker 3: end up. I went to a had the good fortune
1:18
Speaker 3: being able to go to college in Washington, d C.
1:19
Speaker 3: And kind of had the political bug hit me early.
1:22
Speaker 3: And so I went after college when and worked on
1:25
Speaker 3: Capitol Hill for a couple for fifteen years for two
1:29
Speaker 3: Texas US senators and had great experiences. And one of
1:33
Speaker 3: the many sets of issues that I got to deal
1:35
Speaker 3: with was housing. I got to approach it actually from
1:38
Speaker 3: an appropriation standpoint, so at that time it was the
1:41
Speaker 3: VA Hut Appropriations bill. Personally, our colleagues noticed the Tea
1:46
Speaker 3: Hut Bill, but at that time I was dealing with
1:49
Speaker 3: veterans issues and I was dealing with FEMA was in
1:51
Speaker 3: that bill. Most most coolly I thought was NASA was
1:55
Speaker 3: in that bill. So I got to do all things
1:57
Speaker 3: around space shuttles and you know, exploration of of of
2:01
Speaker 3: of of the heavens, and that was a neat thing.
2:04
Speaker 3: And of course HUD was there, and UH I really
2:06
Speaker 3: came to appreciate the work that HUD did and the
2:08
Speaker 3: difference that it could make for very LOWCOD people. I
2:11
Speaker 3: saw firsthand the experience that you know, the difference CDBG
2:15
Speaker 3: was making UH in everything from disaster recovery in our
2:18
Speaker 3: state to UH dealing with needing just unmet needs that
2:23
Speaker 3: were you know, gaps that existed in helping folks, and
2:26
Speaker 3: so you could really see the difference home funds were
2:29
Speaker 3: coming to the four you know, other types of tools.
2:32
Speaker 3: And so many years later in the Bush administration, I
2:36
Speaker 3: had the chance to go work at HUD and got
2:39
Speaker 3: the opportunity to work in public and Indian housing and
2:42
Speaker 3: uh PD and R as well and on the policy
2:45
Speaker 3: development side, and had about two years there. I met
2:48
Speaker 3: some of the most extraordinary professionals, and I think that
2:50
Speaker 3: was where I think my you know, where I was
2:52
Speaker 3: fully fully bit by the bug of housing and got
2:56
Speaker 3: the chance to come back move back to Texas. We
2:58
Speaker 3: had kids and had the chance to move back to Texas.
3:01
Speaker 3: And and when I was here, I worked for the
3:03
Speaker 3: governor and I had a chance to uh work very
3:05
Speaker 3: closely with our Housing Finance Agency, and then I got
3:08
Speaker 3: to got asked to lead our Housing Finance Agency for
3:11
Speaker 3: for five years. And heading up to HCA was an
3:14
Speaker 3: incredible experience to see housing production and to see the
3:17
Speaker 3: difference that affordable housing can make in communities you know,
3:21
Speaker 3: big and small, uh you know, across a range of need.
3:27
Speaker 3: And then came the opportunity to work here at the
3:29
Speaker 3: Austin Housing Authority newly renamed Austin Housing Authority. The uh,
3:35
Speaker 3: you know, this is a really special agency. And the
3:37
Speaker 3: thing that's so different from the other things that I
3:39
Speaker 3: did was that here is actually where we meet people
3:42
Speaker 3: where they are, and we actually work daily with you know,
3:46
Speaker 3: so many thousands of residents trying to provide a array
3:49
Speaker 3: of services in addition to you know, keeping keeping them
3:53
Speaker 3: stably housed. And at first I wasn't sure if I'd
3:56
Speaker 3: like the the engagement with the with the resident piece
3:59
Speaker 3: of it, because it wasn't true that I would be
4:01
Speaker 3: particularly good at it. And now I've realized that it's
4:03
Speaker 3: really that's the thing that's that's where the passion comes from,
4:07
Speaker 3: and that's where the joy in this work comes from.
4:10
Speaker 3: And I and you see that, of course in so
4:12
Speaker 3: many of our colleagues around the country as well. So
4:14
Speaker 3: I've been fortunate to be here for fourteen years. I hope,
4:17
Speaker 3: I hope, you know, to be here for a while longer.
4:20
Speaker 3: And there's some things I'd like to do to continue
4:23
Speaker 3: writing the next chapter of our agency. But it's a
4:26
Speaker 3: joy to work with the professionals that are here, some
4:28
Speaker 3: of the most amazing housers and skilled people. I've ever
4:31
Speaker 3: had the chance to work with.
4:33
Speaker 2: So you've done finance, you've done policy, you've done programs,
4:38
Speaker 2: You've seen it from the legislation side quite a wide variety,
4:44
Speaker 2: and now you're in the implementation and execution side of this.
4:47
Speaker 2: What do you think people get wrong about housing? Like,
4:51
Speaker 2: can you speak to something that you've as you've gone
4:54
Speaker 2: through all of these different genres of implementing housing programs,
4:59
Speaker 2: what are people say still getting wrong about housing?
5:02
Speaker 3: I think most folks continue not to understand how challenging
5:07
Speaker 3: well income housing is to do. I think that you
5:09
Speaker 3: know only when you can explain to policy makers and
5:12
Speaker 3: two and to policy leaders who do research in this space,
5:17
Speaker 3: you know how we go about building capital stacks and
5:20
Speaker 3: how we do all use all these very complex tools
5:25
Speaker 3: that don't always align. Do they realize, you know, wow,
5:29
Speaker 3: this is this is something different, This is an entirely
5:33
Speaker 3: different ecosystem when they realize just how hard it is
5:36
Speaker 3: and how much planning and intentionality go into building, you know,
5:39
Speaker 3: an affordable housing community that's different than what's in the
5:42
Speaker 3: in the in the market, generally, we've made it harder.
5:46
Speaker 3: We've made it harder. The needs of the lowest income
5:49
Speaker 3: people in our society, and in my mind, that's just wrong.
5:52
Speaker 3: We need simplicity, we need uh, you know, we need consistency.
5:57
Speaker 3: That's one of the things that you know, legislators. Uh,
6:00
Speaker 3: you know, when I think about you the other side
6:02
Speaker 3: of your question, you know what I wish folks knew.
6:05
Speaker 3: You know, the more inconsistency, the more the more challenges,
6:10
Speaker 3: the more upset, the more volatility, the more risk there is,
6:15
Speaker 3: and the more difficult all of this is to do.
6:17
Speaker 3: The more consistency we have in policies, the more clarity
6:21
Speaker 3: we have, you know, the better we all are in
6:24
Speaker 3: meeting in meeting needs. And I think, you know, expanding
6:27
Speaker 3: our expanding our work in the difference we we can mix.
6:29
Speaker 3: So I guess you know, those are those are the
6:32
Speaker 3: things I wish people knew more plexus system is and
6:35
Speaker 3: how important it is to you know, make sure that
6:38
Speaker 3: we have you know, smoother waters to ouperate. And of course,
6:42
Speaker 3: in all the years you and I have been working
6:43
Speaker 3: in the space, we've we've never really had waters, have
6:46
Speaker 3: we No, we have it.
6:48
Speaker 2: There's been shirks in the water, and uh, you know,
6:51
Speaker 2: I don't know if you can swim uphill both ways.
6:53
Speaker 2: But that's what we've been doing. Absolutely, So tell us
6:57
Speaker 2: about Austin, because you know, everybody, for years and years
7:02
Speaker 2: and years, everybody was moving to Austin. I mean it
7:05
Speaker 2: was the place to be, which was great from a
7:09
Speaker 2: market and an attraction, amenities, all the things people like
7:12
Speaker 2: to build within a community. And but with that came
7:17
Speaker 2: the pressures on affordability. So tell us what is Just
7:22
Speaker 2: tell us what's been happening as far as just that
7:25
Speaker 2: demand that you've seen in the city. And then naturally,
7:28
Speaker 2: I think that goes into what you guys are able
7:31
Speaker 2: to do with development. Give us a picture from an
7:35
Speaker 2: insider's view and what's been happening in Austin.
7:38
Speaker 3: Sure, you know we're Austin's a wonderful city. We want
7:42
Speaker 3: people to come and visit, bring lots of money, and
7:48
Speaker 3: we hope uh and we hope you have a wonderful time.
7:51
Speaker 3: And uh, we're always thrilling people come to sort of
7:53
Speaker 3: see the Austin model because it's it's an imperfect model,
7:57
Speaker 3: like so many of our colleagues around the country. It's
8:01
Speaker 3: a fantastic community, but it's a community that seem such
8:05
Speaker 3: dramatic growth that we've hit all the challenges that come
8:08
Speaker 3: with that. Yeah, really, we've we've grown by about fifty
8:11
Speaker 3: thousand people a year. And of course, you know, when
8:14
Speaker 3: you're skyrot and you see growth going up like this,
8:17
Speaker 3: and then when you see the number of low income
8:19
Speaker 3: people also going up like this, it becomes very hard
8:22
Speaker 3: to sort of meet general housing demand, but certainly to
8:25
Speaker 3: meet affordable housing demand. You know, we're really you know,
8:30
Speaker 3: a community that you know also has you know, had
8:34
Speaker 3: to deal with the legacy of segregation. You know, our
8:37
Speaker 3: city's nineteen twenty eight housing plant, you know, and tried
8:41
Speaker 3: that if you're a person of color, you need to
8:43
Speaker 3: live east of where now it's Interstate thirty five. It
8:46
Speaker 3: used to be East an it, but you needed to
8:48
Speaker 3: live east of East Avenue, especially if you want to
8:51
Speaker 3: if you want to have housing, if you wanted healthcare,
8:53
Speaker 3: if you want services for your schools. That legacy of
8:57
Speaker 3: segregation continues to endure. So, you know, we're one of
8:59
Speaker 3: the coolest cities, you know, the weirdest city, the best
9:02
Speaker 3: music city, the invest this and that's that and those things,
9:06
Speaker 3: that tech city, you know, and all those things are true,
9:09
Speaker 3: but we're also consistently at the top of the list
9:11
Speaker 3: of most segregated cities and that and that indoors all
9:14
Speaker 3: those are a lot of active work happening to try
9:16
Speaker 3: to to try to improve that and to create a
9:18
Speaker 3: more inclusive, uh holistic community where all can all can thrive.
9:24
Speaker 3: You know, Austin, because of those high rates of growth
9:27
Speaker 3: over so many years, you know, really needed to create
9:31
Speaker 3: a community where new development was really structured around all
9:35
Speaker 3: types of housing for all types of people, you know,
9:37
Speaker 3: all parts of our city, not just people in areas
9:39
Speaker 3: where you know, had historically been where lower income people
9:43
Speaker 3: lived along Interstate thirty five or east of East Avenue
9:46
Speaker 3: in this what's kind of considered the historic sort of
9:49
Speaker 3: crescent of poverty that exists here. You know. Now we
9:52
Speaker 3: want you know to see you know, opportunity housing built,
9:56
Speaker 3: workforce housing built everywhere in our city. And I think
9:59
Speaker 3: that's really come to fruition. So as our city you know,
10:02
Speaker 3: kind of alternates between being the top largest city in
10:05
Speaker 3: the country, eleventh largest city in the country, you know, twelve,
10:07
Speaker 3: it's you know, it hops around, it continues to see
10:11
Speaker 3: you know, great growth, and it's interesting in the last
10:15
Speaker 3: several years we had drifted, you know, we have some
10:18
Speaker 3: dramatic price spikes in our red spikes. But you know,
10:23
Speaker 3: we've actually now hit where you know, supply seem to
10:27
Speaker 3: get closer to the demand, and rents have actually stabilized
10:31
Speaker 3: in some cases actually dipped a little bit. That was
10:34
Speaker 3: a good thing. The concern is that we're not seeing
10:36
Speaker 3: the supply keep up with the demand, and so what
10:40
Speaker 3: we're anticipating in you know, we're not seeing the new
10:43
Speaker 3: construction starts that we would expect to see. So we're
10:45
Speaker 3: anticipating come twenty twenty seven that there could very well
10:49
Speaker 3: be more price spikes, rental red spikes, and that's going
10:52
Speaker 3: to create a you know, that's going to create more challenges,
10:55
Speaker 3: you know, for for lower income people here and so
10:59
Speaker 3: where they've had choice before, we're going to see in
11:02
Speaker 3: more landlords sticking Section eight for example, and were rents
11:05
Speaker 3: were fairly stable and consistent for people for the last
11:08
Speaker 3: couple of years. We're worried about about about that picture
11:12
Speaker 3: you almost certainly changing in come twenty twenty seven. So
11:15
Speaker 3: a lot of efforts to try to think about how
11:17
Speaker 3: do we how do we prevent that from happening again,
11:21
Speaker 3: But I'm not sure that we're going to be able
11:22
Speaker 3: to avoid that.
11:23
Speaker 2: Speak though, so, what do you think is the most
11:28
Speaker 2: exciting development that you have been able to be a
11:32
Speaker 2: part of with the Austin Housing Authority. Is there something
11:36
Speaker 2: that you want to brag about that you specifically done
11:40
Speaker 2: And you know, when you think about that, it's like
11:42
Speaker 2: if you could do that ten times over right, but
11:46
Speaker 2: share what that particular project was or what it was like.
11:51
Speaker 3: Well, for a couple of primes, if I do them
11:52
Speaker 3: ten times, I don't have I don't have ten times
11:54
Speaker 3: the hair to fall out again over the.
12:00
Speaker 2: Pressure pup cup doesn't go that high anymore.
12:04
Speaker 3: But so so I think some some you know, we've
12:07
Speaker 3: been fortunate to have a number of colleagues come to
12:09
Speaker 3: visit Austin and it's been wonderful to show them, you know,
12:15
Speaker 3: three properties in particular that are really historic, two of
12:19
Speaker 3: which are on the National Register of Historic Places. So
12:22
Speaker 3: you know, it's no secret that Linda Johnson was a
12:24
Speaker 3: congressman from Austin for you know, in the in the thirties.
12:27
Speaker 3: Coming to Congress in nineteen thirty step helped you know,
12:31
Speaker 3: Franklin Roosevelt pass the nineteen thirty seven Housing Act. The
12:35
Speaker 3: first three projects that you know, among the first three
12:38
Speaker 3: first projects that were funded by the Federal Housing Administration,
12:43
Speaker 3: you know, through loan guarantees were Santa Rita Courts, which
12:46
Speaker 3: was intended for for Mexican Americans, Roose were courts for
12:50
Speaker 3: African Americans, and then Chalmers Courts, which was intended for
12:53
Speaker 3: for for white folks. And you know, those three properties
12:59
Speaker 3: you know, were constructed in linking started in thirty seven
13:01
Speaker 3: and thirty eight. Most opened up in thirty nine, you know,
13:04
Speaker 3: and Santa Rita Court's actually opened first, and it's the
13:07
Speaker 3: first project listed on the net. It's actually on the
13:11
Speaker 3: National RoCE Restore Presurre National Register of Historic Places, in
13:15
Speaker 3: the same category as the Alamo. It's a you know,
13:18
Speaker 3: for for you know, places for the architecture and for
13:21
Speaker 3: the people involved. So it's a it's a it's a
13:24
Speaker 3: pretty special property. Our folks lived at those properties for
13:29
Speaker 3: you know, the better part of eighty years, and you
13:31
Speaker 3: know they were you know, sort of that typical bowhouse
13:33
Speaker 3: cinder block construction, but they were over time, you know,
13:37
Speaker 3: they proved to be pretty hard places to live. You know,
13:40
Speaker 3: there was no central air, there were no washer dryer,
13:43
Speaker 3: limited washer dryer connections. Uh, they were the outside uh
13:48
Speaker 3: you know, drying clotheslines and and drying racks, and you know,
13:53
Speaker 3: it was you can imagine on days when it was
13:55
Speaker 3: one hundred degrees and in Austin it's you know, about
13:57
Speaker 3: one hundred degrees for you know, sixty days of the
14:00
Speaker 3: of the year. You know, it's it's it's pretty uncomfortable.
14:03
Speaker 3: And so we knew we could do better and we
14:05
Speaker 3: needed to create more modern places where you know, we
14:08
Speaker 3: can also provide a richer array of services. Those three
14:12
Speaker 3: properties were properties also that were pretty isolated. That was
14:16
Speaker 3: where the poor people lived and they weren't really embraced
14:20
Speaker 3: by community. We wanted a place that would be a
14:22
Speaker 3: source of pride to the broader community, and as those
14:25
Speaker 3: communities were changing, we also wanted to be a place
14:27
Speaker 3: where you know, we could support the broader community with
14:30
Speaker 3: services as well. And so we've been really fortunate that
14:34
Speaker 3: So the three projects we've worked on that I've worked
14:37
Speaker 3: on that have been the most joyful to me and
14:40
Speaker 3: sort of the transformation, you know, we started off with
14:42
Speaker 3: Chalmers Courts. Chalmers was we did that in three phases.
14:46
Speaker 3: We had an old office building and we took down
14:49
Speaker 3: that office building because we no longer needed it. We
14:53
Speaker 3: were able to build eighty six units of housing there,
14:56
Speaker 3: and we were able to relocate the folks who lived
14:58
Speaker 3: at the existing Garmer Courts just across the street. So
15:01
Speaker 3: nobody was was you know, you faced, you know, being
15:05
Speaker 3: dissocated or you know, didn't have a new home to
15:10
Speaker 3: move to that was you know, wasn't better than what
15:12
Speaker 3: they were currently living at. So new modern spaces that
15:17
Speaker 3: were just right across the street, and that was you know,
15:19
Speaker 3: a wonderful day to see that property open. Then we
15:22
Speaker 3: took down the existing nineteen thirty seven you know east
15:25
Speaker 3: side of Chalmers Courts, rebuilt that with a one hundred
15:29
Speaker 3: and fifty units, moved the residents from Chalmers West over
15:33
Speaker 3: to Chalmers East, you know, so that again nobody was
15:36
Speaker 3: you know, it was removed from their community and they
15:39
Speaker 3: just had to go across the street to bigger, better units,
15:41
Speaker 3: while modern units with services. And then we finally completed
15:45
Speaker 3: Chalmers West with another one hundred and fifty units or
15:48
Speaker 3: so one hundred and fifty eight units just three years ago.
15:53
Speaker 3: And so those three properties you know, gave us you know,
15:56
Speaker 3: we went from one hundred and you know fifty eight
15:58
Speaker 3: units total at that site to more than to nearly
16:02
Speaker 3: four hundred units, and that's and that included a boys
16:05
Speaker 3: and girls club, our largest boys and girls club is there.
16:09
Speaker 3: We also were able to put on site healthcare there
16:11
Speaker 3: through a partnership with our federally qualified health center Community Care,
16:15
Speaker 3: and that was a really joyful, exciting day when that
16:18
Speaker 3: healthcare clinic opened because we could provide both health care
16:22
Speaker 3: and dental care at that site. My board chair, Carl Richie,
16:26
Speaker 3: who has horrible eyesight and did as a kid growing
16:30
Speaker 3: up public housing and didn't get glasses coke bottle glasses
16:34
Speaker 3: until he was sixteen years old. Oh wow, we really
16:37
Speaker 3: wanted vision care. We're still fighting for Karl to get
16:39
Speaker 3: vision care in it at Chalmers. But we were glad
16:42
Speaker 3: that we could get at least healthcare and dental care
16:45
Speaker 3: and right there and chronic care management, which has been
16:48
Speaker 3: just transformative for the residents there at that site. So
16:51
Speaker 3: that was the first role we completed. Then we moved
16:54
Speaker 3: on to Rosewood Courts, the second property, which was for
16:56
Speaker 3: you know, which had historically been tied to so strongly
16:59
Speaker 3: to the African America community, and we really had to
17:02
Speaker 3: work in community with lots and lots of folks to
17:04
Speaker 3: make sure that we we were you know, creating a
17:08
Speaker 3: design that was going to be uh, you know, appropriate
17:12
Speaker 3: for the site and the history on which it on
17:15
Speaker 3: which on which uh uh you know, the new property
17:17
Speaker 3: was going to stand. So when we took down the
17:21
Speaker 3: existing buildings, it was important for us to leave some
17:25
Speaker 3: of them, uh and preserve them. And so we left
17:27
Speaker 3: actually eight buildings, nearly a third of the site are
17:31
Speaker 3: are the original historic buildings. We took those eight buildings,
17:35
Speaker 3: those eight buildings, and we returned them to the way
17:39
Speaker 3: they looked in nineteen thirty seven with the flat steel
17:41
Speaker 3: case of windows on the outside. You know, Lyndon Johnson
17:44
Speaker 3: would recognize that if you walk rose of courts today,
17:47
Speaker 3: which I hope we won't, but the inside, uh, you know,
17:52
Speaker 3: the insides are are brand new, conformed to the size requirement,
17:55
Speaker 3: room size requirements that you'd expect, have all the modern
17:58
Speaker 3: amenities that that folks would, you know, the modern families need.
18:01
Speaker 3: And so you know, it's been that's been an exciting
18:04
Speaker 3: historic preservation element. At Roads with Courts, we were able
18:07
Speaker 3: to go from one hundred and twenty four units, we
18:09
Speaker 3: added another one hundred and sixty four units at Roads
18:13
Speaker 3: with Courts, you know, and and so in total, you know,
18:17
Speaker 3: we're you know, over two hundred units of new multi
18:21
Speaker 3: family housing at that site. In addition to that, we
18:24
Speaker 3: were able to partner with Habitat for Humanity on one
18:27
Speaker 3: edge of the site and create home ownership because we
18:30
Speaker 3: heard from a lot of folks about the need for
18:32
Speaker 3: you know, there's no story, there's no reasonably priced place
18:35
Speaker 3: for people to live. You know, the kids of longtime
18:38
Speaker 3: residents in the community didn't have a place to go,
18:40
Speaker 3: there's no affordable housing there. And our public housing residents
18:44
Speaker 3: who might be ready for the challenge of home ourship,
18:46
Speaker 3: you know, that just it just wasn't something we offered.
18:50
Speaker 3: So we partnered with with Habitat, which I know colleagues
18:53
Speaker 3: around the country, you know, partner with Habitat. It was
18:56
Speaker 3: one of our we've always had partnered with them, but
18:59
Speaker 3: it was just such an incredible experience and rewarding experience,
19:03
Speaker 3: and they fought tooth and nail with us to make
19:06
Speaker 3: sure that we not only got great down payment assistance
19:09
Speaker 3: for those residents, but also worked with us to make
19:11
Speaker 3: sure that every one of the twelve families that was
19:13
Speaker 3: getting a new home came from either our public housing
19:17
Speaker 3: program or from our voucher program, and so it was
19:20
Speaker 3: wonderful that we really were helping those most in need
19:23
Speaker 3: in our community to take advantage of that. So twelve
19:28
Speaker 3: new habitat homes that are opening up. And then lastly,
19:31
Speaker 3: because there's such history there the cities and Nanctivation Park
19:35
Speaker 3: celebrating you know, the sight of so many June teen
19:38
Speaker 3: celebrations and other subunit things in that community, you know,
19:42
Speaker 3: happened right there at rose with Courts. We've created a
19:45
Speaker 3: commemorative park and a visitor center there, so that important
19:51
Speaker 3: things happened at Rosewood, and so a lot of room
19:55
Speaker 3: to create and a lot of room to celebrate history there.
19:57
Speaker 3: And that's that's where I think most of the hurricane.
20:01
Speaker 3: That was a really complex, challenging project, and now we're
20:03
Speaker 3: on to Santa Rita, which was really the first project
20:07
Speaker 3: to be completed. But you know, we're now working through
20:11
Speaker 3: the challenges in the market that I think folks who
20:13
Speaker 3: are experiencing to try to get the funding together to
20:16
Speaker 3: make the transformation of that last of our historic properties happen.
20:19
Speaker 3: That's gonna take a little time, but we're looking forward
20:22
Speaker 3: to the grand opening of Rows with Quarts which will
20:24
Speaker 3: happen in September early October, and you're invited, as you
20:28
Speaker 3: will earlier viewers.
20:29
Speaker 2: Thank you. You know, I always want a reason to
20:32
Speaker 2: come down and see a new ribbon cutting for affordable housing.
20:36
Speaker 2: You know, this is part of what you are doing
20:38
Speaker 2: so well in Austin is that you're being able to
20:42
Speaker 2: package the complexity layer the funding, probably having to put
20:47
Speaker 2: all the fingers in the gaps in funding and figure
20:50
Speaker 2: out a way to make that happen, but you're incorporating
20:52
Speaker 2: some of that flavor of Austin that everybody loves so
20:56
Speaker 2: well with those historic preservation features. Was there specifically something
21:00
Speaker 2: in the community aspect of this that, you know, maybe
21:05
Speaker 2: you looked at the obstacle and said, I don't know
21:08
Speaker 2: how we're going to be able to make this happen,
21:09
Speaker 2: but you did something like real specific, you know, was
21:13
Speaker 2: it a you know, sometimes you see the historic you know,
21:18
Speaker 2: incorporating that historic footprint as being that. But I'm thinking of, like,
21:22
Speaker 2: you know, something the community said that we absolutely must have.
21:27
Speaker 2: Was it the vision center? Was that the the obstacle
21:31
Speaker 2: piece that you're you're sorting out?
21:33
Speaker 3: Sure well, I mean so, so not to go into
21:36
Speaker 3: too long a story. But you know, when I when
21:39
Speaker 3: I got here fourteen years ago, we actually intended to
21:42
Speaker 3: go first with Rosa Quartz to start that redevelopment first.
21:46
Speaker 3: I've been here for a couple of weeks. We got
21:48
Speaker 3: a choice Neighborhood Planning grant, and we worked through that
21:51
Speaker 3: grant and and and at the end of it, we
21:53
Speaker 3: determined that we really had had a false start. We
21:56
Speaker 3: didn't have the trust build with the community that we
21:59
Speaker 3: needed in order to make that work. We didn't have
22:01
Speaker 3: the trust of the residents to make them feel confident
22:05
Speaker 3: in partnering with us, to know that we're determined to
22:08
Speaker 3: get everybody across the finish line. And so it you know,
22:12
Speaker 3: then we really moved over to Chalmers to in the
22:15
Speaker 3: hopes of showing folks what we could do and that
22:17
Speaker 3: we would be good custodians of both the public trust
22:21
Speaker 3: of our of our you know, the expectations of residents,
22:24
Speaker 3: and the historic character and and and significance of of
22:28
Speaker 3: what Rose Courts is and was, And so we we
22:32
Speaker 3: had our work cut out for us. We spent many years,
22:36
Speaker 3: you know, while we were working on Chalmers Courts, you know,
22:38
Speaker 3: really trying to figure out you know, how to create
22:42
Speaker 3: that covenant with our with our residents. And it really
22:46
Speaker 3: centered around a couple of different concepts. One was that,
22:48
Speaker 3: you know, we fully converted our portfolio to to the
22:52
Speaker 3: realm as systems demonstration, but no one knew what RAD was.
22:57
Speaker 3: You know, we barely knew what it was. And we
22:58
Speaker 3: were the housing professionals. You know, we know it, you know,
23:02
Speaker 3: transformed every aspect of our business, but very few of
23:05
Speaker 3: us who went into it Philly had our eyes wide
23:08
Speaker 3: enough open to realize what it was going to hell.
23:12
Speaker 3: But it was interesting to move into, you know, uh,
23:17
Speaker 3: the RAD world. And and we, for a residence purposes
23:21
Speaker 3: used a simple phrase. RAD equals pick. Now, I know
23:24
Speaker 3: pick has other meanings, and but for a residence, they
23:28
Speaker 3: didn't know what RAD was, but pick meant protections, improvements,
23:32
Speaker 3: and choice.
23:33
Speaker 2: Oh I like it.
23:34
Speaker 3: Every resident was going to be protected, they got they
23:37
Speaker 3: got to stay, you know, at their property. They weren't
23:40
Speaker 3: going to be displaced. The rent was going to stay
23:42
Speaker 3: the same. They were going to be improvements. All those
23:45
Speaker 3: unit sizes were going to be bigger, The kitchens were
23:47
Speaker 3: going to be better, the bathrooms were going to be
23:49
Speaker 3: modernized and improved. All the systems will better and they're
23:52
Speaker 3: gonna be more services. And then they had choice when
23:55
Speaker 3: they moved into the new unit. If they still didn't
23:56
Speaker 3: like it, they got to move within two years. And so,
24:00
Speaker 3: you know, so so radicals pick became kind of our mantra.
24:04
Speaker 3: The other the other thing that I think was sort
24:06
Speaker 3: of the secret sauce of Austin was that, you know,
24:09
Speaker 3: we love our residence and talking to them and getting
24:11
Speaker 3: their take on, you know, on what really mattered. You know,
24:15
Speaker 3: the walls are the same, you know, there's very you know,
24:18
Speaker 3: we all we all know what you know, a podium
24:21
Speaker 3: and you know four floors, you know, you know is
24:23
Speaker 3: and what the construction has to be, wall colors, cabinets,
24:28
Speaker 3: carpet flooring. You know, we can give residents choice, we
24:31
Speaker 3: can get we can give residence agency. It's their agency too.
24:35
Speaker 3: Our agency is their agency, and and we're accountable to
24:38
Speaker 3: one another. And so getting their perspective on what mattered
24:43
Speaker 3: to them, you know, was really important. And so we
24:47
Speaker 3: worked very closely on some of those amenities and and
24:50
Speaker 3: and you know, balconies were hugely important because in the
24:56
Speaker 3: courts concept, you know, Rosewood courts, Chalmers courts, Santa Rita courts.
25:00
Speaker 3: People would sit on their stoop and they talked to
25:01
Speaker 3: one another. That was that was where community and neighborhood
25:04
Speaker 3: got built. That was something that a lot of you know,
25:07
Speaker 3: our older, longer tenured residents felt was going to be lost.
25:11
Speaker 3: The ability to have balconies, to see one another, and
25:13
Speaker 3: to draw people outside, even if it was just right
25:16
Speaker 3: there in their own unit's really important. So every unit
25:19
Speaker 3: has a balcony. That was factored in making sure that
25:24
Speaker 3: people didn't fall through the cracks in a relocation, because
25:27
Speaker 3: when you relocate people, you know you're doing harm no
25:29
Speaker 3: matter what you do. You're asking people to take a
25:31
Speaker 3: chance on me. We're over here, and then in two years,
25:35
Speaker 3: three years, you're going to come back and you know
25:37
Speaker 3: you can trust me, you know you know the housing
25:40
Speaker 3: authority where so what could go wrong? And so we
25:44
Speaker 3: created We obviously hired excellent folks to do the case
25:48
Speaker 3: work associated with the relocation. CVR did a masterful job
25:53
Speaker 3: for us and so much of that work, but beyond TVR,
25:57
Speaker 3: we wanted to have a team internal that was of
26:01
Speaker 3: professionals who would make sure that when people inevitably fell
26:04
Speaker 3: through the cracks, and they did that, we had a
26:06
Speaker 3: team sort of pick up the ball, and so we
26:09
Speaker 3: they were called the name was the former name was
26:11
Speaker 3: the Tenant Protection Team, but the thing we gave them
26:14
Speaker 3: was the they were the give Haka Hell Department. So
26:17
Speaker 3: in something that screwed up, their job was to be
26:20
Speaker 3: internal on budsmen, to give hawka hell what wasn't going
26:25
Speaker 3: right and to and to make sure that we fixed it.
26:28
Speaker 3: And I'm really proud to say that we I don't
26:31
Speaker 3: I don't think there's a single person. There are people
26:33
Speaker 3: who would say that was really hard and that was
26:35
Speaker 3: really difficult, but I don't think there was a single
26:38
Speaker 3: person who refused to move or or have felt through
26:42
Speaker 3: the cracks and and and it took folks at every agency,
26:47
Speaker 3: at every level of the agency, you know, to step in.
26:50
Speaker 3: There were some hard cases where you know where I
26:52
Speaker 3: jumped in, you know, to try to you know, see
26:54
Speaker 3: you for the work with the school district, or work
26:56
Speaker 3: with the you know, work with the you know, the
26:58
Speaker 3: the you know, the electric company, or to wherever the
27:01
Speaker 3: wherever the sticking point was. We had the partnerships to
27:04
Speaker 3: really work in community because it did take a village
27:08
Speaker 3: to bring about this transformation. And and now we're seeing
27:13
Speaker 3: the we're seeing the fruits that but that was a
27:15
Speaker 3: that was a secret sauce kind of kind of thing.
27:18
Speaker 2: Relocations are so incredibly complex, And I did a relocation
27:24
Speaker 2: back way back in the day when Hope six was
27:27
Speaker 2: on the platform of funding, and I swore, I was like, man,
27:31
Speaker 2: if I never do another relocation, I'll be fine with it.
27:36
Speaker 2: They're so hard. So I'm glad it went well with you.
27:39
Speaker 4: You had the right partners, the right success you know,
27:42
Speaker 4: you had the right feedback loop to kind of give
27:45
Speaker 4: that haka hell. You know, give yourselves, the housing authority
27:48
Speaker 4: of the City of Austin, give yourselves, you know, just.
27:51
Speaker 2: A real scolding if needed, or just that feedback loop
27:55
Speaker 2: to make sure it works, because you know, you're you're
27:58
Speaker 2: dealing with people's lives, utility, school systems, school schedules, like
28:02
Speaker 2: things that all of a sudden, you know, construction schedules,
28:05
Speaker 2: prices of things that are out of your control, like
28:08
Speaker 2: I mean just the weather, the weather delays everything, like
28:11
Speaker 2: just weird things that you are just constantly up against
28:15
Speaker 2: on a relocation. So being able to live on the
28:18
Speaker 2: other side of that and now moving people in and
28:23
Speaker 2: getting people settled and getting back, getting them back to
28:25
Speaker 2: the business of living their life and excelling. So that's
28:30
Speaker 2: that is an absolute best best story that you guys are,
28:36
Speaker 2: like you said, living the fruits of that now.
28:39
Speaker 3: Fruits we we had, you know, we I'm amazed how
28:42
Speaker 3: many gardeners we have among our residents, and you know
28:45
Speaker 3: how many gardens we moved and you know, new community
28:48
Speaker 3: gardens that we had to but people were very attached
28:50
Speaker 3: to things that they have, you know, built with their
28:53
Speaker 3: own hands and there they're piece of earth. And you
28:57
Speaker 3: the thing that's so wonderful about about you are as
29:00
Speaker 3: you know, while we want folks to move, you know,
29:03
Speaker 3: when they're able to and become self sufficient. You know,
29:07
Speaker 3: we know that there's a lot of seniors who are
29:08
Speaker 3: aging in place, persons with cognitive and physical disabilities, and
29:12
Speaker 3: folks who come from a variety of backgrounds and you know,
29:15
Speaker 3: and live with us longer, and you know, don't move
29:17
Speaker 3: to what many people would think is think of as
29:20
Speaker 3: you know, true self sufficiency. But we try to keep
29:23
Speaker 3: everybody on that path and and those gardens, those services,
29:27
Speaker 3: those are a huge part of it. And so making
29:30
Speaker 3: sure that people didn't didn't lose, that didn't move access
29:33
Speaker 3: to it that we could meet people where they were.
29:36
Speaker 3: We take our jobs not to fix people, but we
29:39
Speaker 3: are charged and feel a call to to to partner
29:44
Speaker 3: with folks and to help make folks, help folks be
29:47
Speaker 3: as successful as as as they can, and we have
29:50
Speaker 3: can remove after being some place for ten or twenty years.
29:54
Speaker 3: That's that's that's a tall order.
29:56
Speaker 2: So it's a tall order. Yeah, it's a major life disruption.
30:00
Speaker 2: And so you know, even though the hood REGs say
30:03
Speaker 2: you're required to do X, y Z, there's a whole
30:05
Speaker 2: list of other things that you have to do way
30:08
Speaker 2: beyond that.
30:09
Speaker 3: So the hundreds don't say you have to be a
30:11
Speaker 3: good human, right, And I think that's the thing that Yeah,
30:16
Speaker 3: I think anyone who goes into the space, either it's
30:20
Speaker 3: in redevelopment, or even anyone who works in our in
30:22
Speaker 3: our business, if you're if you're fundamentally not committed to,
30:26
Speaker 3: if you don't love people, and you you you don't
30:29
Speaker 3: feel called to, you know, to try to figure out
30:32
Speaker 3: how you can lift up, you know, others. You know,
30:36
Speaker 3: I think I think I think that's sort of the
30:37
Speaker 3: great the great call of our work, and and and
30:41
Speaker 3: and oftentimes and here in Austin. You we're correcting things
30:44
Speaker 3: that then you know, societal lungs and challenge challenges faced
30:48
Speaker 3: by generations, and we want our agency to help transform
30:51
Speaker 3: some of that. So so getting Rosewood and Santa Rita
30:54
Speaker 3: and Chalmers White was was really was really key. And
30:58
Speaker 3: I know so many folks around the country you're are
31:00
Speaker 3: working in that same same space. We're seeing in credible
31:02
Speaker 3: transformations happening that when I go to an Narrow conference,
31:05
Speaker 3: or I go to a Classic conference, or I go
31:07
Speaker 3: to you know, you know other things. You know, it's
31:10
Speaker 3: amazing to see the work that we were all in
31:12
Speaker 3: Nashville recently, incredible work there is and not so recently,
31:15
Speaker 3: incredible work having there was in LA recently and what
31:19
Speaker 3: our team, the team there at hop was doing is
31:22
Speaker 3: is phenomenal. So it's we learned a lot from our colleagues,
31:25
Speaker 3: and I think that's also one of the joys of
31:27
Speaker 3: our of our industry associations that you're so active in
31:30
Speaker 3: that I'm so active in, is that we get to
31:33
Speaker 3: sort of learn some of the lessons and we love
31:35
Speaker 3: folks coming here to do calls with folks to share
31:39
Speaker 3: you know, uh, their experience, but also where we're able
31:43
Speaker 3: to say, you know, for goodness sakes, don't don't do that.
31:45
Speaker 3: Whatever you do, let me let me save you a
31:49
Speaker 3: half a million dollars, don't.
31:52
Speaker 2: Right, let me tell you what the fine print really means.
31:57
Speaker 2: Speaking of another thing that you guys are doing so well,
32:01
Speaker 2: is I read about your digital literacy efforts that you
32:05
Speaker 2: guys have done. You guys were at early adopters of that,
32:08
Speaker 2: and I believe you've shared that on the naruro platform
32:11
Speaker 2: as well. But for our listeners who aren't in the
32:14
Speaker 2: hallways at some of those events, tell us what you
32:18
Speaker 2: guys did to recognize the importance of technology access and
32:23
Speaker 2: how that is impacting housing and how you guys are
32:26
Speaker 2: delivering housing.
32:28
Speaker 3: Yeah, so, you know, we we knew that digital inclusion
32:32
Speaker 3: was you know, the it was was the way of
32:36
Speaker 3: the future back you know, this was yeah, ten years ago.
32:41
Speaker 3: It was even before puline Castro became a hut sepretary
32:46
Speaker 3: very surgery. Donovan's tenure and I think was starting to
32:50
Speaker 3: recognize some of the need that was, you know, president
32:54
Speaker 3: among public housing residents and yeah, we're a project based
32:58
Speaker 3: for All Assistants agency now under RAT and we we
33:02
Speaker 3: just knew that that that that residence who didn't have access,
33:07
Speaker 3: we're going to need it. And and and we thought
33:10
Speaker 3: that it was a real key to self sufficiency for again,
33:13
Speaker 3: even those folks who were not going to move to
33:16
Speaker 3: true complete self sufficiency and leave our programs, but you know,
33:20
Speaker 3: seniors aging and plays connecting with their healthcare excuse me,
33:23
Speaker 3: healthcare providers, or with their grandkids, or with other services
33:28
Speaker 3: in community, those were really important things to us. And
33:33
Speaker 3: uh so we were uh uh you know, intrigued by
33:38
Speaker 3: Google Fiver was was coming to town, and and we
33:42
Speaker 3: were intrigued by what a partnership with with them, with
33:45
Speaker 3: what that would look like. And uh, wonderful folks who
33:50
Speaker 3: were willing to take a chance on us and made
33:53
Speaker 3: the commitment early on to provide high speed internet service
33:59
Speaker 3: connectivity to to all of our to all of our properties.
34:04
Speaker 3: But it wasn't just enough to sort of create the
34:06
Speaker 3: connection and unlocking the connection. It was really also unlocking
34:11
Speaker 3: the access to the devices, making sure that everybody had
34:15
Speaker 3: the type of device that they needed, and then also
34:17
Speaker 3: make sure that people had to use it. So we
34:19
Speaker 3: it ended up with us not just creating the you know,
34:22
Speaker 3: create the connection with Google Fiber, but It ended with
34:25
Speaker 3: a you know, with an incredible partnership with Austin Community College,
34:29
Speaker 3: with the City of Austin and the Ford Foundation. The
34:33
Speaker 3: Open Societies Foundation, UH pitched in as well, you have
34:37
Speaker 3: to really launch an expansive program. In fact, just last
34:42
Speaker 3: week we celebrated ten years of interns from Austin Community
34:46
Speaker 3: College who have come and spent you know, semester semester
34:50
Speaker 3: with us refurbishing donated computers and going out and actually
34:55
Speaker 3: teaching residents how to use those computers. And we want,
34:58
Speaker 3: you know, everyone in the household needs the device it's
35:01
Speaker 3: appropriate for them. Sometimes it's a mobile device, sometimes it's
35:04
Speaker 3: a pad, sometimes it's a laptop that they can that
35:07
Speaker 3: they can have. We we try to get the device
35:09
Speaker 3: that they need available to them and and give them
35:13
Speaker 3: the tools that they need to do classes and and
35:16
Speaker 3: and online support and uh you know, call centers and
35:20
Speaker 3: other types of of of resources. Thank goodness, we we
35:25
Speaker 3: had that, you know, several years before the pandemic. That
35:29
Speaker 3: really brought to home just how connected or disconnected we
35:34
Speaker 3: really were. Even in an agency that was as connected
35:37
Speaker 3: as we thought we were, We didn't, you know, we
35:40
Speaker 3: we you know, we we struggle Luckily we had the
35:43
Speaker 3: partnerships that we were able to play on that got
35:46
Speaker 3: folks the access and and the and the and the
35:49
Speaker 3: and the equipment that they needed, and so we were
35:51
Speaker 3: very proud of that. But that program has been truly
35:55
Speaker 3: transformational one. That's you know, I think it's been hugely
36:01
Speaker 3: helpful in ways that I think will we'll learn as
36:03
Speaker 3: we kind of follow, you know, the kids who had
36:06
Speaker 3: the access and how they performed in school and how
36:10
Speaker 3: they're performing in college, the college of their choice. We've
36:14
Speaker 3: had scholarships here every year, and it's amazing how many
36:17
Speaker 3: of the kiddos who you know, got the scholarships were
36:20
Speaker 3: also some of the you know, some of the adopters
36:23
Speaker 3: and most enthusiastic adopters of the technology and h and
36:28
Speaker 3: our scholarships are we give people a refurbished computer, and
36:32
Speaker 3: it's so interesting to see how many kids say, you know,
36:34
Speaker 3: I've already got one through unlocking the connection. I don't
36:36
Speaker 3: even I don't need another computer when I go to
36:38
Speaker 3: college and I've got what I need. And but we
36:41
Speaker 3: support even those kids when they go go off. It's
36:44
Speaker 3: again it's about it, hopefully, it's it's all about giving
36:47
Speaker 3: people you know, community and for us looks like certainly
36:52
Speaker 3: digital inclusion. It's also the job training and healthcare and
36:56
Speaker 3: the after school programs that we all value. It's also
37:00
Speaker 3: transportation and people can get from, can get around this
37:03
Speaker 3: very very busy, active place. And so you know, those
37:07
Speaker 3: five things are kind of our you know, are sort
37:10
Speaker 3: of our pillars of what we think. You know, we
37:13
Speaker 3: can provide housing, but the joy to the joy and
37:17
Speaker 3: lifting upcoming in those things that sow services and connection
37:22
Speaker 3: to them that breathe life to it all.
37:23
Speaker 2: Yeah, I've actually been on a panel with a couple
37:27
Speaker 2: of your people and you at NARO talking about this
37:31
Speaker 2: specific initiative, and you guys really were years ahead of
37:35
Speaker 2: where the industry was going. But for somebody who is
37:39
Speaker 2: more like I'm a houser, I'm not really a tech person.
37:44
Speaker 2: They see the value of what you're doing, but maybe
37:47
Speaker 2: they need a little nudge in the industry to kind
37:50
Speaker 2: of do that best practice modeling that you guys have
37:54
Speaker 2: done in this digital literacy space. What is so way
38:00
Speaker 2: that you would nudge them along to get started, like
38:05
Speaker 2: what we're what should they do? Like what value proposition
38:09
Speaker 2: should they consider or where should they start? I mean
38:13
Speaker 2: that's those are two loaded questions here. But how would
38:16
Speaker 2: you nudge a colleague to go down that path making
38:20
Speaker 2: digital literacy a value set for them?
38:25
Speaker 3: Well, I think I think all of our colleagues know
38:27
Speaker 3: the value of having a device in their pocket. We're
38:30
Speaker 3: all connected to you know, to you know, to one
38:33
Speaker 3: another through uh and technology. And then you can imagine
38:37
Speaker 3: how you know, challenging it is if folks aren't connected
38:41
Speaker 3: through it or don't have access to it, you know, amazingly,
38:44
Speaker 3: even in so many parts of rural Texas and rural
38:47
Speaker 3: parts of this country, you know, uh, too many small
38:51
Speaker 3: towns don't have access to broad that uh, you know,
38:55
Speaker 3: to to and so it becomes a it becomes a challenge,
39:00
Speaker 3: and I can understand why it's so overwhelming, you know,
39:03
Speaker 3: for so many of our colleagues who are just caring
39:05
Speaker 3: for the properties and meeting all the high requirements. You know,
39:10
Speaker 3: they got there, they got their play pretty fall. But
39:14
Speaker 3: it is important to to to connect where you can.
39:17
Speaker 3: And I would say, you know, working with your city
39:19
Speaker 3: can be helpful because almost every city has had to
39:21
Speaker 3: deal with you know, changes of technology and technology adoption.
39:26
Speaker 3: I would also say the community college system in this country,
39:29
Speaker 3: particularly in my part of the country. You know, I
39:31
Speaker 3: think it is a is a blessing and so being
39:34
Speaker 3: able to work, you know, and they're really charged with
39:36
Speaker 3: trying to work with folks who don't storically think about
39:40
Speaker 3: you know, it's higher educational opportunity right for them. And
39:43
Speaker 3: they've been a wonderful partner here at Osseecunity College to
39:46
Speaker 3: help us meet our residents where they are and so
39:49
Speaker 3: you know, seeing if there's maybe some avenues there, we'd
39:52
Speaker 3: be glad and have connected folks. I know you've done
39:54
Speaker 3: great work in this space too, Katie, you know, trying
39:57
Speaker 3: to you know, connect people to partners that we've worked with.
40:01
Speaker 3: You know, we love to share. I think I think
40:03
Speaker 3: it's one thing that distinguishes our industry. We're all love
40:06
Speaker 3: to share and and and and talk and you know,
40:09
Speaker 3: with each other and network. And you know, we'd be
40:12
Speaker 3: delighted to to connect folks because unlock that connection and
40:18
Speaker 3: help your folks get digitally connected. Yeah, we'd we'd be
40:22
Speaker 3: glad to to uh get to work with folks. One
40:25
Speaker 3: of the irida is less so for you than for me,
40:28
Speaker 3: but because any of you're you're a techie. But for me,
40:31
Speaker 3: the it's amazing how we have this great advanced program,
40:34
Speaker 3: but I'm probably the person most of in the we
40:37
Speaker 3: probably could really use some technology training and struggle with it,
40:41
Speaker 3: you know, even just getting on even on just getting
40:43
Speaker 3: on this podcast.
40:45
Speaker 2: Well you've got it now, you're now you're pro at it.
40:49
Speaker 2: But you know, I do think that if we can
40:51
Speaker 2: go you know, we can learn and talk about this
40:54
Speaker 2: stuff openly, then everybody says, okay, you know what in
40:58
Speaker 2: order for me to go to a little further faster.
41:01
Speaker 2: You know, if you've already built the model, then they
41:03
Speaker 2: just have to say, okay, now here is the model
41:07
Speaker 2: that we can incorporate to do a little better. You know,
41:11
Speaker 2: I want to also talk about two other points here.
41:14
Speaker 2: You are a board member of the Housing Works Austin,
41:18
Speaker 2: and you're also very very active and narrow and I
41:21
Speaker 2: want to get your take on both of those. And
41:25
Speaker 2: you know, it's sort of a broader public conversation when
41:28
Speaker 2: you think about it about like having to tell the story,
41:32
Speaker 2: having to tell when housing works, how to say what's
41:35
Speaker 2: still needed with housing? Why is it so crucial to
41:40
Speaker 2: be involved in Housing Works Austin or a narrow when
41:46
Speaker 2: so many of us can just keep our heads down
41:48
Speaker 2: and just keep working and not leave the office, so
41:52
Speaker 2: to speak. Tell us why these types of roles are crucial.
41:56
Speaker 3: Yeah, I've so enjoyed association work over any years. You know,
42:01
Speaker 3: the ability first for us to just learn from colleagues
42:04
Speaker 3: around the country and then to see be able to
42:06
Speaker 3: go see the work that they do. You know, it's
42:09
Speaker 3: been so inspiring and it's inspired us in the things
42:14
Speaker 3: that we can accomplish. You know, I can't have any
42:15
Speaker 3: things we look at and say, you know, I think
42:17
Speaker 3: we saw that in Seattle, or I think we looked
42:19
Speaker 3: at that and saw that over in uh, you know,
42:21
Speaker 3: in in the you know, out in Denver, and you know,
42:25
Speaker 3: that's that's that's helpful. We've been having partners that you
42:28
Speaker 3: worked with others, keeping away from folks that you know
42:33
Speaker 3: there because there are some folks that you don't want
42:35
Speaker 3: to work with, and and and hearing about the experiences
42:37
Speaker 3: of others with some things didn't go so well. And
42:40
Speaker 3: you know, we all know some some of those folks
42:43
Speaker 3: as well. And that's been you know, helpful to you know,
42:46
Speaker 3: through those partnerships, to to avoid mistakes and to into
42:50
Speaker 3: because because none of us can really afford too many
42:53
Speaker 3: of those, unfortunately, But I think that you know, for me,
42:58
Speaker 3: so Housing Works is the little bit different than than
43:01
Speaker 3: than what NARA does. FORCE is very focused on the
43:04
Speaker 3: public housing and the community development industry. Housing Works of Austin,
43:08
Speaker 3: you know, really is a is a broad spectrum of
43:11
Speaker 3: of of housers here in our city. So it includes,
43:13
Speaker 3: you know, the head of you know, the Austin home Builders,
43:17
Speaker 3: it's uh, you know, it's the reeltors, it's you know,
43:20
Speaker 3: the real Estate Council, it's you know, the Housing Authority,
43:24
Speaker 3: it's the UH you know, the city, the the you know,
43:28
Speaker 3: the variety of UH city players that you know are
43:31
Speaker 3: involved in real estate here. And and what we're trying
43:35
Speaker 3: to do is is is helped to think about what
43:37
Speaker 3: good housing policy in the City of Austin, you know,
43:40
Speaker 3: can look like. And you know, it's some of the
43:45
Speaker 3: issues that we've dealt with in recent years has been
43:47
Speaker 3: you know, the need for we have an unbelievably complex,
43:50
Speaker 3: you know, land use code, and so forming that land
43:53
Speaker 3: use code, you know, we're creating you know, some pretty
43:56
Speaker 3: exciting zoning reform has been key cutting some of the
44:00
Speaker 3: red tape around things like parking mandates and stingle, single
44:03
Speaker 3: stare issues and uh, you know, trying to get deeper
44:07
Speaker 3: affordability in Texas, there's no you know, there's no h
44:11
Speaker 3: inclusive zoning and so you know, those types of those
44:15
Speaker 3: types of things, you know, become more important infrastructure investments,
44:20
Speaker 3: development patterns, confronting you know, the scourge of segregation, and
44:24
Speaker 3: how we you know, how big infrastructure projects helped to
44:28
Speaker 3: like right now outside the window there rebuilding Interstate thirty
44:32
Speaker 3: five and that's that main corridor where you know that
44:35
Speaker 3: really has been sort of a wall between you know,
44:39
Speaker 3: so many you know, marginalized communities, you know, our downtown
44:44
Speaker 3: uh central business district between you know, rich and poor, black,
44:48
Speaker 3: Hispanic and white, you know, and and and so that
44:51
Speaker 3: that infrastructure project was an important conversation for Housing Works
44:56
Speaker 3: because we were very interested in how do we how
44:58
Speaker 3: do we make it less a barrier, and how do
45:01
Speaker 3: we try to stitch both sides of the city together
45:04
Speaker 3: and as a way you know, to heal some of
45:08
Speaker 3: that of that of that divide. And so we've have
45:11
Speaker 3: an important cap and stitch initiative that's going on at
45:13
Speaker 3: the you know, along along you know, through that infrastructure project,
45:17
Speaker 3: we want I think the idea is we want to
45:19
Speaker 3: have a you know of housing works is something that
45:23
Speaker 3: I think in many cities could really benefit from and
45:25
Speaker 3: in many cities have emulated the Housing Works model. Really
45:29
Speaker 3: thinking about that again, that concept of all types of
45:32
Speaker 3: housing for all types of people and all types of
45:34
Speaker 3: all parts of town and what that really needs to
45:36
Speaker 3: look like to accomplish that. One other thing that I
45:39
Speaker 3: would just brag on Housing Works about. I was chair
45:42
Speaker 3: of Housing Works for a number of years. They did
45:44
Speaker 3: come up with you know, uh, council district by council
45:49
Speaker 3: district affordability goals that we're in trine in a city
45:53
Speaker 3: of Austin housing blueprints, so we could look in by
45:58
Speaker 3: district by district, who oose district have how many affordable
46:02
Speaker 3: housing units and what they comfortable they were serving and
46:05
Speaker 3: progress that was being made to achieve those goals or
46:08
Speaker 3: how far behind were we and so you know, again
46:11
Speaker 3: that effort at an inclusive community and Works has been
46:14
Speaker 3: kind of a tracker of of that, and so it's
46:18
Speaker 3: been it's been interesting to work with people in community
46:21
Speaker 3: that you wouldn't necessarily work with. So it's been an
46:23
Speaker 3: important convening space where you know, at least in our community.
46:29
Speaker 3: It's the most important discussions around housing or happening you
46:32
Speaker 3: know there a few times a year, which has been
46:33
Speaker 3: really really, really wonderful. So going to to Narrow real quick,
46:39
Speaker 3: did you look at.
46:40
Speaker 2: What I know? You know, I was going to ask
46:42
Speaker 2: you a question about the tracker though, to do is
46:47
Speaker 2: there a master plan that if somebody goes in and
46:51
Speaker 2: do they have like development points or anything if they
46:54
Speaker 2: go into one of those areas that are identified in
46:56
Speaker 2: the tracker that either were just portionately not representative affordable
47:03
Speaker 2: with affordable housing or is that just kind of more
47:06
Speaker 2: it's a priority document that shows the need.
47:10
Speaker 3: More so a priority document that has been has been
47:14
Speaker 3: blessed with more. Voters have proved several rounds of general
47:19
Speaker 3: obligation bonds, so we've had available cash for meeting gap
47:24
Speaker 3: financing here in our city as well as other you know,
47:28
Speaker 3: tools that we can use as well as part of
47:32
Speaker 3: a we're putting in a light rail program. They're called
47:36
Speaker 3: Project Connect, and there's about three hundred million dollars the
47:39
Speaker 3: voters have approved for displacement. So between that three hundred
47:43
Speaker 3: million dollars for Project Connect funds coupled with the yeah,
47:49
Speaker 3: many many. Yeah, the last time, voters approved more than
47:53
Speaker 3: three hundred million dollars for the last round of general
47:56
Speaker 3: obligation bond hours for our rental housing assistance program to
48:02
Speaker 3: get you have to meet those those gaps. And that
48:05
Speaker 3: was built on top of you know, a two hundred
48:08
Speaker 3: and fifty million dollars one from five years earlier, which
48:10
Speaker 3: was built on a seventy five million hours one from
48:12
Speaker 3: a few years before that, and a fifty five million hours,
48:14
Speaker 3: so whatever that totals up to be. You know, our cities,
48:18
Speaker 3: Ye put channel close to a billion dollars into sort
48:23
Speaker 3: of meeting you know, gap needs. As those dollars have
48:26
Speaker 3: got tight a titan absolutely our cities looking at Yeah,
48:30
Speaker 3: it has been prioritizing, Yeah, where those limited resources you
48:35
Speaker 3: get used. And we probably should have gone out this
48:38
Speaker 3: year for another round of financing. We're kind of at
48:42
Speaker 3: the end of the Geo Vaughn letters approved from some
48:47
Speaker 3: years ago, but I think the intent is to go
48:50
Speaker 3: out in two years, so to make them stretch out.
48:52
Speaker 3: Our city was pretty pretty careful and making those decisions
48:56
Speaker 3: about cler how we prioritize nice.
49:00
Speaker 2: That strategic approach is amazing because you know, then you're
49:03
Speaker 2: not repeating some of the infrastructure problems or the divides,
49:07
Speaker 2: and you're being a little more conscious about some of
49:11
Speaker 2: those plans. So great job on that.
49:14
Speaker 3: It's amazing where developers choose to get when the money.
49:18
Speaker 3: It's a remarkable thing, it really is.
49:20
Speaker 2: Yeah, all right, let's talk about NARO. You and I
49:23
Speaker 2: love NARO and wait, I know all things all points
49:27
Speaker 2: back to NARROW. So yeah, tell us what you know.
49:31
Speaker 2: For most people who are listeners are aware of the
49:35
Speaker 2: National Association of Housing and Redevelopment Officials NARO. But we
49:39
Speaker 2: do have you know, ironically, we have a lot of
49:41
Speaker 2: people who are getting into housing for the first time
49:44
Speaker 2: and they find the podcast. We even have a couple
49:47
Speaker 2: of housing authorities who require their new employees to listen
49:51
Speaker 2: to the podcasts and report out. So we can't assume
49:55
Speaker 2: everybody knows about NARROW. But let's tell us what the
50:00
Speaker 2: because you've been involved in NARROW for a long time.
50:04
Speaker 2: But give us some marching orders as it comes to NARROW, advocacy,
50:09
Speaker 2: effectiveness or just whatever you want to say about Narrow.
50:14
Speaker 3: We will say about NARROW. I mean, you know, the largest,
50:18
Speaker 3: the biggest tent, you know a place where you know
50:21
Speaker 3: twenty two thousand housers and communitivelpment professionals come together, you know,
50:27
Speaker 3: to really you know, do an incredible professional development work,
50:31
Speaker 3: to build their skills, to come together to network and
50:34
Speaker 3: to you know, some of the most extraordinary people and
50:38
Speaker 3: how and housers and service providers that I've ever met,
50:43
Speaker 3: you know, are come together and of course you know,
50:46
Speaker 3: all collectively using our voices to advocate for the things
50:50
Speaker 3: we need to make our chief and communities strong and
50:54
Speaker 3: to hopefully lift up our families, you know, the residents
50:58
Speaker 3: and families that we that we serve. And so you know,
51:01
Speaker 3: I I've come to love and narrow and respect the
51:05
Speaker 3: difference that that collective power can can make. You know,
51:10
Speaker 3: this is a really vital time when we need to
51:13
Speaker 3: be close to one another. There's more rules and regulations
51:17
Speaker 3: coming out of HUD than ever before, and and some
51:21
Speaker 3: of those things really UH try at the way we
51:24
Speaker 3: do our work in our in our in our business
51:26
Speaker 3: and who we serve and how we confirm and so
51:30
Speaker 3: staying in close coordination through UH narrow is is really
51:34
Speaker 3: is really vital. I've also privileged to be on the
51:38
Speaker 3: board of the Council's large public housing agency, a little
51:42
Speaker 3: slightly different focus, you know, with really sort of look
51:45
Speaker 3: at we're kind of small among the big where I
51:47
Speaker 3: think we're like the one hundred and twenty fifth largest
51:50
Speaker 3: houses are in the country or something like that. But yeah,
51:53
Speaker 3: you look at Chicago and your and and I you know,
51:58
Speaker 3: Seattle and so the Puerto Rico and Miami and some
52:01
Speaker 3: of those folks, and it's like you know that, you know,
52:06
Speaker 3: I'm in awe of what of what those leaders can do.
52:09
Speaker 3: But you know also in awe of uh you know,
52:11
Speaker 3: the folks in Munday, Texas, or in uh Athens, Georgia,
52:16
Speaker 3: or uh you know in uh you know, rural upstate
52:19
Speaker 3: New York, or in you know, uh, you know twin Falls, Idaho.
52:24
Speaker 3: You know, who are doing incredible things, you know, with
52:29
Speaker 3: vastly limited resources, including managing an unbelievable set of rules
52:34
Speaker 3: and view guidance that they're getting from from from hut
52:38
Speaker 3: that have. You know, really, I think unsettled the industry
52:42
Speaker 3: is I've talked about was we talked about the beginning.
52:44
Speaker 3: You know, when things can be consistent and you're able
52:47
Speaker 3: to run your business, you know, and you know the path,
52:51
Speaker 3: but when the path is always changing, there are folks
52:53
Speaker 3: are throwing obstacles in your path. It becomes very, very difficult.
52:57
Speaker 3: You know, I'm blessed to have a team around me
52:58
Speaker 3: that that you know, for of great professionals that support
53:02
Speaker 3: support me here. And it's amazing how many of us
53:06
Speaker 3: depend on the team and professionals that we have working
53:10
Speaker 3: with to row and participate from other agencies in in arrow.
53:14
Speaker 3: Those gatherings, uh, you know, are vital. And if you
53:17
Speaker 3: don't get a chance to you if you if you
53:19
Speaker 3: don't get the opportunity to come to Denver, uh, you
53:22
Speaker 3: know in October, you'll really be missing something. It's it's
53:25
Speaker 3: it's not a it's not a jucket. I mean, it's
53:27
Speaker 3: a working trip. Yea. Folks you know who attend the
53:31
Speaker 3: sessions learn a lot and and are inspired are odd
53:36
Speaker 3: you know oftentimes you know you're just slack jaw it
53:40
Speaker 3: just you know, you do what and how do you
53:41
Speaker 3: do that? And how could I do that? Here? You
53:43
Speaker 3: know here it's also a little bit of nerving. I mean,
53:46
Speaker 3: you hear you know the you know, the latest trends
53:50
Speaker 3: and some of our trends are you know, can be
53:52
Speaker 3: can be really can be really unsettling, and so formed
53:56
Speaker 3: leaders need to you know, need to need to stick
53:59
Speaker 3: to the I think. And and so Naro's have been
54:02
Speaker 3: for me just a you know, a real professional home
54:05
Speaker 3: and under for giving you in so many ways as
54:07
Speaker 3: as well and wherever there's an opportunity to connect Texas
54:12
Speaker 3: narrow here work not just dealing with you know, big
54:16
Speaker 3: fights at the at the at the federal level. You're
54:20
Speaker 3: in Texas, we're also dealing public housing authorities are under siege.
54:23
Speaker 3: You know here my colleagues in Massachusetts, my colleagues in California,
54:27
Speaker 3: you are also facing uh you know, situations where they're
54:30
Speaker 3: under siege, uh you know too from their legislature. And
54:35
Speaker 3: if we're not, if we don't stick together, really you know,
54:38
Speaker 3: we really are doing our residents and our communities this service.
54:42
Speaker 3: M hm. And so I'm a big I'm a big
54:45
Speaker 3: proponent of game collective action. And you know, NARRO is
54:49
Speaker 3: for me again been uh you know, my primary professional home.
54:53
Speaker 2: I mean, the the NARO pieces, the sticking together also
54:58
Speaker 2: to see what headwinds around out there to get in
55:00
Speaker 2: front of and then interpreting what's been handed to you,
55:04
Speaker 2: whether it's a funding or a reg change. I mean,
55:06
Speaker 2: it's kind of like you're not able to just it's
55:09
Speaker 2: so multi dimensional here on what you were learning and
55:13
Speaker 2: absorbing and gathering and trying to mobilize in these hallways
55:17
Speaker 2: of NARRO. But you mentioned something that reminded me of
55:21
Speaker 2: the state chapters like that is that is equally as
55:25
Speaker 2: port important. And the Texas State Chapter of NARO is
55:30
Speaker 2: really really active, and you guys always do a great
55:33
Speaker 2: job of putting on your events. But I think you
55:36
Speaker 2: guys were also like the first ones to do some
55:38
Speaker 2: real impressive committee work on AI, and you guys in
55:43
Speaker 2: that Texas chapter, you guys seem to tackle all the
55:47
Speaker 2: hard ones and try to get all those details sorted
55:50
Speaker 2: out to bring it back to the national platform as well.
55:54
Speaker 2: So you know, you've got this national landscape that you described,
55:58
Speaker 2: and you've also got the eight landscape here, and that's
56:02
Speaker 2: that is the beauty of narrow, isn't it It is?
56:06
Speaker 3: And the and the regions as well. You know there
56:08
Speaker 3: there's these eight regions. So we're proud to be in
56:10
Speaker 3: the Southwest region. Uh. You know, my colleagues in circ
56:14
Speaker 3: or the biggest region and do just extraordinary training and
56:17
Speaker 3: and work and exchange you know there, you know, in
56:21
Speaker 3: that region that runs from you know, Virginia down to
56:23
Speaker 3: down to Mississippi and over to Florida and up to
56:26
Speaker 3: you know, you know, up to uh, you know, Tennessee
56:30
Speaker 3: and it's uh, you know, it's it's an incredible group
56:32
Speaker 3: of of you know, of skilled houses and professionals in
56:35
Speaker 3: a region where public housing you know, isn't necessarily warmly embraced.
56:42
Speaker 3: I know that, you know, the California narrow uh. You know,
56:46
Speaker 3: folks have been working together to try to you know,
56:49
Speaker 3: really deal with you know issues. Word. We're doing that
56:51
Speaker 3: here at the state level as well, but at a
56:53
Speaker 3: regional level, you know, the opportunities for training and for
56:56
Speaker 3: professional development and and for networking really you know, been wonderful.
57:01
Speaker 3: I was recently up saw Mark gillette Let's agency in
57:05
Speaker 3: uh in Oklahoma City, took a tour with him an
57:08
Speaker 3: incredible program that he just built. He took it was
57:11
Speaker 3: a senior property, a senior living center that has now
57:17
Speaker 3: been converted using VASH vouchers for for for you know,
57:20
Speaker 3: chronically homeless vets and the services and partnerships that he's doing.
57:24
Speaker 3: It was a it was a beautiful property and looking
57:27
Speaker 3: to do more of those types of types of things
57:29
Speaker 3: and some of the things he's got just got a
57:31
Speaker 3: choice neighborhoods, grant and some of the things that he's
57:33
Speaker 3: doing there. So it's you know, it's really important to
57:36
Speaker 3: see what others are doing and to celebrate each other's successes.
57:40
Speaker 3: So the other part, I'd say, when you go to
57:41
Speaker 3: a conference, uh, and my friend Mark and your friend
57:44
Speaker 3: Mark Feeley are are are esteemed CEO of Narrow you know,
57:49
Speaker 3: whenever he travels somewhere, he goes to see another you see,
57:53
Speaker 3: you know, go sees the home agency and wants to
57:55
Speaker 3: see what they're doing and take a tour with them.
57:57
Speaker 3: And so I've taken to doing some of that too,
58:00
Speaker 3: and it's, uh, it's wonderful to see and learn from
58:04
Speaker 3: from those colleagues. But even if you can't get on
58:06
Speaker 3: the bus, they're the top for the bus stour. Go
58:09
Speaker 3: to the conference because you can you hear a lot,
58:12
Speaker 3: you learn a lot, and you know, there's a lot
58:13
Speaker 3: of best practices in it. At a Nashville you will
58:17
Speaker 3: roll out the awards for best best practices and that's
58:22
Speaker 3: that's always an exciting thing. And then you really see
58:24
Speaker 3: who did the cool stuff last last year, and that's
58:27
Speaker 3: God of a unique thing tomorrow and giving out those
58:30
Speaker 3: awards and celebrating that at a different, a different kind
58:33
Speaker 3: of way.
58:34
Speaker 2: I love reading every single one of those awards about
58:37
Speaker 2: what they did. And when you read that in mass
58:41
Speaker 2: you're like, Okay, I need to be reminded of when
58:44
Speaker 2: it works, because so many times we hear when it
58:47
Speaker 2: doesn't work. And so that is those merit awards are
58:51
Speaker 2: fantastic for refocusing us on how it can work and
58:56
Speaker 2: the potential of, uh, what housing can do.
59:00
Speaker 3: You know what else strikes me about though, as you know,
59:03
Speaker 3: I make the shameless plug. You know, I we've had
59:06
Speaker 3: we've had great success, but there's so little that we
59:09
Speaker 3: do just ourselves. We had to sort of open up
59:12
Speaker 3: the doors and and and it basically made a general
59:15
Speaker 3: call for partnerships. We partner with everybody, agencies of every
59:20
Speaker 3: shavement size. You know, we want to be the best housers,
59:23
Speaker 3: but we want, uh, you know, really skilled partners who
59:25
Speaker 3: help us pull together everything from the capital stacks to
59:28
Speaker 3: the capital sets, to the that that we need for
59:32
Speaker 3: financing different deals, to you know, providing after school services
59:37
Speaker 3: like you know, our partnerships with boys and girls clubs
59:39
Speaker 3: and communities and schools and other educational and the school
59:42
Speaker 3: district to be sure. But I'm amazing how many you know,
59:46
Speaker 3: you know, we know, we use it. We've used a
59:48
Speaker 3: variety of consultants and you know, and and you've been
59:50
Speaker 3: in that space a long a long time, you know,
59:54
Speaker 3: and bring really unique skills. You know. Quintels, you know,
59:57
Speaker 3: one of the premier consultancies in the country. And I
1:00:00
Speaker 3: think it's important for you know, folks to get you
1:00:03
Speaker 3: want you want to work with the best, and you
1:00:05
Speaker 3: want to sure that you're going to get across the
1:00:08
Speaker 3: finish line. And our colleagues should have exacting standards because
1:00:12
Speaker 3: we do important work right and our partners, when you
1:00:15
Speaker 3: get the right ones, they you know, they they help
1:00:18
Speaker 3: they help you deliver for community and includes a lot
1:00:21
Speaker 3: of those folks. Oh yeah, ecosystem. And that's the thing
1:00:24
Speaker 3: that's really special I think about Narro is that everyone
1:00:27
Speaker 3: who is in that world.
1:00:29
Speaker 2: Is there absolutely and you know, and it just I mean,
1:00:33
Speaker 2: it is encouraging to hear, you know, how the Boys
1:00:37
Speaker 2: and Girls Club's programs go, how somebody helped subsidy layering,
1:00:42
Speaker 2: how somebody asked for a headwaiver, whatever those things are,
1:00:46
Speaker 2: and naru's the platform to be able to have those conversations.
1:00:50
Speaker 2: So again I've been talking with Mike Gerber, the CEO
1:00:53
Speaker 2: of the Austin Housing Authority.
1:00:55
Speaker 1: Thank you so much, great to see it, Take care,
1:00:59
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to change makers with Katie Gore. To
1:01:03
Speaker 1: find out more about Katie, go to quadel dot com,
1:01:06
Speaker 1: do's q U A D E l dot com. This
1:01:10
Speaker 1: has been a production of Forbes Books Radio