Latest / Daxko Fitness Forward / The Rise of Adaptive Training with The Perfect Step | Fitness Forward Ep. 04
Transcript
- Daxko: Yeah. This is Fitness Forward, conversations shaping the future of fitness. Hey, welcome everyone to ⁓ Fitness Forward. ⁓ in this ⁓ episode of Fitness Forward, I am privileged ⁓ to be joined today by Hal Hargrave. ⁓ Hal Hargrave is the CEO president of the Perfect Step and Be Perfect Foundation. ⁓ Hal's also someone that I've gotten to know over the years. ⁓ just through industry events and someone that's really inspired me. ⁓ I I just got to see you a couple weeks ago, Hal, at HFA, and I have to say ⁓ it always ⁓ makes my show to get a chance to talk to you. And as I said to you there, ⁓ I feel like we're in the wrong roles here because ⁓ you're the best question ask I've ever met. ⁓ and even as we were kind of getting ready today and and chatting behind, you know, off stage, ⁓ you're asking me such good questions. And so I I hope I can do ⁓ justice ⁓ to your to your question ask asking skills. But ⁓ welcome how how glad to have you on today. Thank you. I will try not to hijack the podcast today because I have a ton of questions for you. too just ⁓ you've always somebody that I'd look up to in the industry as somebody that started kind of in the club operations scene and I know that that's still in large part kind of your life behind the scenes as like a software executive, but moving from club operations to entrepreneur to software object ⁓ executive is also something that I've looked up to because of your knowledge and acumen. So I'm fully engaged and present in this conversation today and just thrilled to share this space with you. Yeah, no, I appreciate it. It it's interesting as we were talking about, you know, I I saw your facility I think it was maybe ten, eight, ten years ago. Little did I know that we would be on this podcast together someday. I think I was visiting the Claremont Club and was just blown away ⁓ by what what you what you were doing at the perfect step. So ⁓ but yeah, I I'd love to go back and and and how maybe talk about ⁓ you know, I obviously you had a an an accident and a a life changing event when you were, you know, younger. I think you're around 17, but maybe just talk about that and what happened and then and then from that, what led you to, you know, founding the perfect step, ⁓ and then again, be perfect foundation. Everyone has this kind of aha moment in their life. And I think we've kind of used these terms of like, if I could talk to the seventeen year old version of myself, I would have a lot to say to that individual. But the aha moment kind of inserted those questions unbenounced. And unforeseenly into a space in my literal life and into my heart and into my mindset of questions around life presenting itself challenges to me, the fork in the road, a lot of the cliche sayings that became very true through my accident. And I was forced to make ⁓ decisions and act upon certain things that ⁓ if my accident taught me anything, it was that life was giving me an opportunity and a blessing, not a curse. And if we were to re rewind time even prior to the accident, that life for me looked very active. I was ⁓ a sports buff. ⁓ I was somebody that was dedicated to my gym of the Claremont Club growing up in the city of Claremont. It was a place that I was just this indoctrinated community member and club member that just loved every aspect of fitness and community and integration. And it was a way to elevate my prowess out on the baseball field and in my action sports life. And at the age of 17, my senior year of high school, ⁓ much like most 17-year-olds, you there's a sense of invincibility to how you live. And certainly when you're a jock, you maybe ⁓ withhold too much of a I guess you could say, trying to assert an external perspective of being big man on campus and Again, I wish I could have a conversation with that individual. Nonetheless, there was a trajectory of wanting to go into business with my father in the general contracting space, a kind of ⁓ a tale of a very different story. And also there was a tale of wanting to pursue professional wakeboarding as kind of a career path and something I was very passionate in. And at the very least there was a trajectory of going off to college. after graduation, going to get my business degree, and also playing baseball at Cal State University Long Beach. So life seemed as if it was clear. ⁓ it seemed as if how could anything possibly be derailed? I have everything figured out. And of course, at the age of 17, who knows better than you? Your parents certainly don't, right? What what could they possibly know? and life had a different plan for me. And as a person of faith. God didn't reject me. He redirected me towards a different path of impact, stewardship, community support, love. And it was July twenty-sixth, two thousand and seven. I was actually working at the time for ⁓ my family's ⁓ general contracting company. It was a month and a half review removed from graduation from high school at Claremont High School. And there was debris in the road as I was driving a truck making a delivery. Ironically, it was a delivery of handicap accessible bathroom equipment to a Home Depot in Las Vegas. We were converting their restrooms to be handicapped and eighty eight accessible. So there's irony in this story. And as I was driving up the fifteen freeway towards Las Vegas, there was debris in the road. ⁓ I I use the figurative language here to kind of reinforce the analogy of life that ⁓ we have a tendency as people, ⁓ in the midst of our own stories to swerve and miss during difficult times, obstacles, people, things, challenges. And we try to find a different course of action to avoid resistance. And in most times, that puts us in a worse place where we don't learn what we should be learning about ourselves or about something. Or I have a real keen belief that a lesson is repeated until learned. And this was no different with my accident. I tried to swerve and miss. It rolled a vehicle four times to an upright halt, crushing the cab on my neck and my back and leaving me as a cervical level quadriplegic. and the immediate diagnosis was grim. ⁓ they did not give me much, if any, of a chance to ever walk again, let alone recover and move my upper body and to be independent ⁓ and really be self sufficient. And I refused to accept that narrative. And fortunately I had an unbelievable community around me, people in the city of Claremont and the ownership and leadership at the Claremont Club that embraced me and said, You're gonna come home and we're gonna treat you here. So ⁓ needless to say, that was kind of the launch point and the essence of kind of how the Claremont Club really indoctrinated me as member to family member. Yeah. So What a journey, Hal. I mean, obviously, you know, ⁓ after the accident there was a long road of recovery, I would imagine, for you, right, in in ⁓ you know, going through clinical rehab and then recovering and all of those things. And so how did how did that then lead to your life's work now, which is, you know, the perfect step in, you know, ⁓ what you're doing now? Yeah, at inception point of my accident. You get fully immersed into the continuum of care life cycle and what we know as kind of the medical continuum in the medical field. And I I want to pay homage to the great care I did receive. Just I was blown away by love and support from community and then all the way trickling through ⁓ the practitioning, the doctors, the specialists that put me in the best position to succeed. I am a part of the 1% of people that had the good fortune of resources, of finances, of just access that others don't. And I think it was that visibility of the awareness of my story. And I hate comparatives, but I I'm using it to create perspective of humbleness and also to recognize my blessings was I looked around to my left and right and I'm like, why aren't these people living a similar story to me of access and ⁓ financial support and reimbursement. And I I was having an unsettling feeling even at the age of 17 and 18. And I felt like I I can't just sit here as somebody that's been called to duty by God to serve and pay it forward and look around to my left and right and see the people struggling and do nothing about it. And so there became a very obvious call to action there for me to get engaged and to get involved. And at the age of 17, time of my accident, and just a few weeks later turning 18, light bulb moment goes off. And it's like, all right, I now I've gotten my physical recovery under me after eight days in ICU, 63 days in intensive rehab, transitioning to outpatient therapy and also the Claremont Club, opening their arms, getting their trainers ⁓ trained in their facility adapted for my care. And I started to have these conversations. With my peers in the paralysis community, like, hey, what are you doing at the Claremont Club? How do we get involved and get engaged? And it's like, ⁓ well, maybe we need to bul build a full-blown bricks and mortar to service this community that not only wants to get high intensity, high quality care to achieve their dreams, their goals of recovery and walking again, but also this integrative model of working out alongside the able-body population perpetuates an environment. Of tenacity, of hope, of resiliency. And we're looking outside these glass doors figuratively at the able-body population and the other parts of the club and the gym and thinking like, I want to be them. And they're looking transversely at us and saying, ⁓ wow, they're struggling and they're still grinding. I've got to be doing the same. So there was this sense of this synergistic movement within the club that was a palpable cultural reform. And so it was evident that going the route of building the bricks and mortar. the perfect step, build it and they will come was ⁓ certain. And then also the exposure to the shortcomings of financial affordability of things like medical supplies, wheelchairs, home and car adaptations, ⁓ medical equipment, participation in therapy programs. And I remember going to my parents one day after therapy, after I was speaking to ⁓ somebody that I greatly looked up to. His name was Brian O'Neill, also newly injured. ⁓ Married had his own electrical contracting business and it was right around the holidays. So mind you, I get injured in July. I'm getting into intensive therapy around mid- October. And this is right before Christmas in 2007. And Brian says, Hey man, well, I'm not gonna see you after the holidays. This really comes down to making ends meet and putting food on the table for my family. I'm not gonna be back at therapy. I can't afford This because my insurance isn't covering it. And I just was like, This this doesn't seem right. So I went over to my parents that were with me that day at therapy and I'm like, telling them the story. And my dad's like, Well, what are you gonna do about it? And so I turned around, wheeled right back up to the front desk, and I just said, The Hargrave family will sponsor Brian O'Neill after the holidays. Don't take them off the schedule. And so I don't really know what I did in that moment or what I got myself into. And certainly this was going to be a ⁓ personally driven thing by our family. And by the time we got home, ⁓ the commute home, it was determined, okay, we're gonna start a nonprofit organization. ⁓ we're gonna file for our five ⁓ one C three status and we're gonna try to go out and fundraise and support people that are in need. And Here we are now in 2026, 18, 19 years removed after the inception of our nonprofit. And we're going into on April 18th, ⁓ our 11th annual scholarship, Gala, to really just culminate and celebrate just the success and impact we've been able to make on the paralysis community for nearly two decades, to the tune of raising over $10 million for that community with zero paid staff. And so we've been able to pay it forward and put the money into our program services and ensure that that dollars and cents is not going to paid staff. It's a hundred percent volunteer base and we can impact the people that really need it. Yeah, that's amazing. So talk a little bit about how ⁓ the perfect step ⁓ in in the model that is that a non profit, is that a for profit? And in and the follow up to that question, ⁓ I'm you you've got an audience here of thousands of gym owners that, you know, ⁓ we broadcast this out to. And so I'd love for you to talk about that model and what you built there, how that business runs. ⁓ we'll talk a little bit about the Be Perfect Foundation, I think is obviously where you raised the money, you know, kind of for financial assistance. But ⁓ and then I want to lead this into ⁓ how do we inspire more gym owners, you know, ⁓ to be aware of what you're doing, how could they incorporate that this into their gyms, ⁓ or even just making accessibility ⁓ more effective at their gyms. But ⁓ sorry, that was a lot. I'll I'll let you ⁓ take it from here. Jeff, you're well really well versed because a lot of people, it takes them months, if not years, to recognize ⁓ the intellectual property distinction between the Be Perfect Foundation being the 501c3 not for profit and the perfect step being the bricks and mortar paralysis recovery center. So you're exactly right. Yeah. So the perfect step is a bricks and mortar paralysis recovery center that was adopted as stated by the Claremont Club. And the reason ⁓ for that origin story was of course the Claremont Club and their CEO, Mike Alpert at the time and the leadership over there, really wanting to pay it forward to the community that served them so well. And if you met Mike Alpert, anybody in this industry, yeah, he's amazing. ⁓ he just has a heart that just continuously gives. He made money by accident by doing the right thing the right way. And ⁓ he was somebody that his daughter at the time of my accident, Justine, is one of my dearest friends. In fact, yeah, we were going to Cal State Long Beach, you know, kind of as two counterparts, and ⁓ just one of my dearest friends. And so she was in large part kind of the lure to Mike to say, Hey, we've gotta serve Hal here at the club. Like this is all he knows in terms of his home gym. Like we've got to keep him here. And so this adoption by the club and I This the story is true. It goes like this. Mike went to the club owners and operators because at the time, mind you, in two thousand two seven and two thousand eight, that's the middle of the housing crisis. Like most were underwater and struggling to stay afloat. And Mike later came clean about this and he would tell this story himself. He actually made a little bit of a fib and a lie to the club ownership, saying that he wanted to ⁓ expand. ⁓ the Pilates studio upstairs for the Claremont Club, but at the same time was going to build down below a recovery sanctuary for me by converting an existing racquetball court and basically making a lower and upper part of the facility to expand their services of Pilates. And so by kind of conjunction of that, the downstairs part of facility and the accessible part of the facility became my recovery domain. And here's what happened was obviously this was a city that I I was born and raised in, still live in to this day. I had so many people engaged in the club. And at the time, mind you, the club was anywhere between 8,000 to 10,000 members. It was a size private club on 19 acres. ⁓ you know, a full service club with spa, ⁓ swimming, racquetball courts, tennis courts, just everything. You name it, they have it. And The club members who are many community members that were very aware of my situation and my recovery were really engaged by coming by this racquetball core, people, members of the community, dignitaries coming in and watching me grind to just find my state of health again. And then there was this traction point of like, this isn't just affecting me in a positive way to take me from debilitation to recovery to independence. This is really changing the entire culture ⁓ confront of the club where people are motivated, inspired. And here's what happened because this happened by accident was that program built legs. And needless to say, we outgrew that racquetball court. We had to move to a different part of the club and do a tenant improvement. And we grew that facility from one client, one space of 700 square feet. To then moving over to 3,200 square feet with 17 clients at a different part of the club. We outgrew that space and grew to 54 clients and over 5,000 square feet. And then we outgrew that space of over 70 clients and moved to 7,000 square feet of tenant improvement. And it was just basically this snowball effect. And we started to recognize this because in the year 2013, when we officially put a namesake on it of ⁓ the perfect stat. And it became a more formalized institution of care with continued education, ⁓ intellectual property, like ⁓ basically domestic visibility and credibility at this point. The club's trajectory really changed. And it started to impact the club in positive ways. Mind you, this was a year in 2013 that had been implemented, and kind of the older generation was like, I'm out, I'm not going through a time of change. And what ended up happening was Our membership attw attrition rate actually skyrocketed and we went from ⁓ a membership attrition rate of around twenty-two percent to an industry low of thirteen percent. And so it fell by nine percent. And you can imagine under thirty four hundred units of billable units of family and single memberships to recoup an additional nearly 300 members. We're like, what are we doing here? What is working? So we go to the members and we say, What's changed? Because this this is not adding up to us. And by way of survey feedback, it was almost a universal consensus across the board. They said it's been integrative programming, like the perfect step, the living well after cancer program, the diabetes program, the peddling for Parkinson's program that has me feeling so good about what's going on at the club. That I want to raise my kids around this empathetic environment. Yes, mind you, at the same exact time, our employees at the club, we had ⁓ employee retention rate that year fall from twelve point eight percent down to eight percent, a five percent change under two hundred and eighty employees, and so we recouped an additional twenty to twenty five employees. Same thing, we go back to the employees. This is again the year two thousand thirteen. We say, Yeah, why are you staying? Like we haven't changed our wages. We're fair wages, but what's changed? They said created a sense of meaning and purpose in my work through creative programming that it really makes me feel good, like I'm servicing the community. So all that to be said, we were able to recoup five hundred thousand dollars of non-dues paying revenue and an additional five hundred thousand dollars on dues paying revenue on our members. So in that year alone it was proof in the pudding that we made money by accident. by nearly a recouping of a million dollars simply by putting these integrated programs in that made people feel good like we were stewarding the community. Yeah. Yeah, so I'd love to I'd love for you to build off that a little bit, Hal. And so again, ⁓ you have an audience here of a lot of gym owners, right? And talk talk a little bit about ⁓ what can a a an owner of facilities or an organization do to integrate ⁓ a program like the perfect step into their facility. ⁓ you know, is it you have to have a separate space and, you know, kind of dedicate the three to five thousand square feet? You know, is there a way to integrate that into your, you know, your your course of your business without that dedicated space? Just talk about what are the opportunities you because clearly you just shared the the positive impacts. Well, no you're bringing up a r a real big touch point, I think for us, ⁓ everybody's driven by numbers. So if you're a club owner, an operator on this ⁓ and you have a fiduciary responsibility to your business, like your very first question is gonna be this sounds great in theory. I want to know more about the concept of the deliverable of what integrated programming is, and in this case, a paralysis recovery program. And even if it is great in theory and it services well and it gets results, are the population markets really there? Well, here are the numbers. According to the CDC, more than 61 million US adults, so roughly One in four adults live with some form of disability. And about 12% of those adults, so around 31 to 32 million, report a mobility disability. But here's where it gets even more crazy. Data from the US Census Bureau further indicates that approximately six to seven million people use mobility and assistive devices, including around two million are just shy of that. That are wheelchair or scooter users. So, mind you, that is self-reported data to the US Census Bureau. So that's very conservative. ⁓ it's probably and likely something much more. They're say on average there's around 5.4 million individuals living with some form of paralysis. But here's the more stark number, and one that most everybody can understand and get behind is for the current 330 million Americans, give or take, that are living here in the domestic United States. They say that roughly 80 million of us at some point in our life are going to have some mobility debilitation. Yeah. And so why the rise of chronic disease and chronic illness is very prevalent. There is trajections right now that say that by 2035, the number of individuals living with paralysis will exceed over 7 million. That's due to a growing aging population. There's higher stroke rates. ⁓ so that's an increase in 30% of where we are right now. They're saying by 2040, even there's gonna be a major surge in chronic disease for things like diabetes, obesity, which are projected to rise between now and then by over 40 percent. So the financial impact of this is going to be very vast. ⁓ they're saying that healthcare costs are expected to exceed $50 billion annually by 2040. So this is not just a fragmented industry. This isn't a niche industry. This is a broad scale industry that is coming. It is on the rise. And the precipice now should be to invest into integrated programming to service these local communities. And what could that look like in practice? Some people say, well, I don't want to bite off more than I can chew. Like this is great. I I believe in these programs. I do want to pay it forward, but the realistic nature is If I'm an owner-operator, that's a difficult decision to wonder where my return on investment is. Is it four years? Is it five years? Is it 15 years? Or I'm a general manager reporting to a club ownership group. And how do I sell them on the fact that I need to cut out, you know, X amount of square feet of valuable bricks and mortar space that's already bringing in tried and true revenue. So where is the lucrativeness to even consider something like this? Well, let me just start with this and let's just work in baby steps because. No, you don't need to bite off more than you can chew. I think that there's an opportunity here to slowly insert yourself into this space and to really get involved at this capacity. And I put it together in 10 very simple steps that I think people can take. So, number one, you can start with education, not even equipment. So train your leadership staff and your key staff and reduce the fear and liability concerns. Around working with vulnerable and chronically ill populations, simply by making an educational mindset set shift amongst your staff, amongst even your clients and your members, can really create the sense of integrated and inclusive adoption of these programs before they even set foot inside of your facility. Number two, appoint an adaptive champion. So designate a senior internal leader, somebody that can possibly go out and pursue training. Go get more education. Do this before you even change your floor plan. And then step three, and start by ensuring basic accessibility measures. So, yes, we know that there's the American with Disabilities Act, and that's going to force all of us to remain ADA compliant with entryways, restroom spacing. But look at the construct of your gym, your existing equipment, because this isn't necessarily ADA. Is there enough room in between each equipment for somebody to go and transfer on it? ⁓ and to utilize your existing equipment and maybe making a more inclusive and integrative space that is welcoming and that truly is accessible in the confines of your gym can welcome people into that shared space already. Step four, introduce maybe one adaptive friendly zone. So carve out a small portion of your gym, not with four walls. But maybe in your existing space with a few adaptive pieces of equipment, if you have recommendations, I have them of high impact pieces that are multi-use, that are going to be used, and that could really create an environment of working out alongside both similar types of populations, challenged and able. Step five, offer respectable membership structures. So if you're an owner operator, a GM, and you're like, I want to invite these people into here, but I recognize that they have transportation limitations. They might have limitations of the need of having a family member there. Maybe ⁓ a secondary loved one gets a free membership or they get a reduced membership. And so now you've really opened your arms to say, we're not just gonna create space, we're gonna bring you into it at any expense possible. At that point, step six, maybe host an adaptive open house where you can have people in the community come in that have these types of mobility challenges and they don't know if this is a space for them. Listen to them, get their feedback. What amenities could you provide for them to make this a place for them to call home? And then step seven, build referral and community partnerships. Talk to hospitals, talk to rehab centers, talk to local providers and ask them, hey, if we provided a space, would you refer to us? Can we partner with you? Step eight, pilot one integrative adaptive program. So adaptive strength training, ⁓ selected types of populations. ⁓ service the diabetes population, the cancer population. ⁓ there's so many different things, and there's so many different types of certifications out there. ⁓ through the perfect step, through NASM, through Lionel University, through ⁓ the Adaptive Training Foundation. There is opportunities to go get that education for you to pilot these programs. And then step nine, invest in staff education and certification yourself. So don't just challenge them to go find them. Say, I will invest into you to go get them. And then the very last step. Maybe become a full-blown licensed facility. And that still may not require you to build out four walls, but maybe taking on the intellectual property of a shared partnership with somebody else and using their continued education platform to reinforce your education over time, to support you with referrals. And then there's this co-collaboration that creates synergy that makes you a high impact institution anywhere you are in the country. So there is a blueprint and a model that you don't just have to go. from nothing to everything of like four walls and two thousand square feet and you're wondering, okay, is my ROI three years? Is it five years? No, just like baby steps. You can do it and the populations are there. They're waiting for you. Yeah. Yeah. I mean it's your it's your story exactly. It was, you know, it started with yourself at the Claremont Club and then there you said, you know, there was two people, there was ten people, there was twenty people, there were seventy people. I I think in in in business that's kind of how it happens, right? There's a need, this y you know, you're addressing it and then it just kind of builds on it on itself and organically and ⁓ so Hal, ⁓ and not to put you on the spot, but ⁓ if someone ⁓ that's listening wanted to get more information, like, okay, yeah, I'm interested. I heard the ten steps, but like, gosh, where where do I go to get a little more information? Like where where can they go? Certainly, well this isn't intended to be self promoting and I I hate to be self promoting, go for it. I'm a subject matter expert if anything. I'm gonna guide you and I can guide you in the right direction of resources, whether it's something I can offer you or other people that I know that can do the same. So you can reach out to me on LinkedIn or on my Instagram by searching my name or reaching out to me at my email at Halhargrave at the perfect step dot com. And I can tell you that I speak from just both love, care, and experience because mind you, I am also the client myself. ⁓ I'm a consumer of our own service here at the perfect step, much like I was at the Claremont Club. I'm looking at all the nooks and crannies and the gaps in our model of care, ⁓ both from a fiduciary sense, from a practical sense, from a methodological deliverance sense. I'm looking at staff education, training, and nothing is going overlooked because there is no such thing as too high quality of care. And I can tell you that my role has shifted shifted in my company. I've gone from an operator to entrusting a team of two great ladies in-house that are running my day-to-day operations and have amassed us to a new level of revenues and client impact. And I've been able to focus on things like partnership, education, and advocacy work. So I'm totally and I've made myself completely available ⁓ to anybody that wants to engage in conversation on best practice on business startup. And I am not the business guru. I'm talking to the guy that is and somebody that's built ⁓ clubs, somebody that's built ⁓ platforms and entrepreneurship and also amassed DAX code to over nineteen thousand locations and millions of members worldwide. So I think between both Jeff and I, we can partner with you to find the right solution and the right avenue to make a successful launch for your integrated program. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, it it was interesting when you were talking about, you know, ⁓ you you're a customer and you're running the business, you know what it feels like. It it's it's similar, somewhat similar to my situation, you know, you know, working in technology and services, but I'm a club owner still, right? So I I ha have a deep appreciation and respect for what happens at the club. Just like obviously you have a deep appreciation, understanding and respect, ⁓ and admiration for the people that are working through, you know, these types of situations. Well Jeff, that makes me curious for you. How what have you learned on your journey as somebody that you're in the midst of operating your own clubs, but you know the other side of the equation, the back end of the equation. How have you used those transverse experiences to shape your operations as an owner operator? And also to kind of reform your service delivery model ⁓ and your product delivery through your software? Like what how have you learned from both to make them both better? Yeah. All right, I love this because now everyone's getting a picture for what a good question asker you are. So ⁓ yeah. Hal, I I think it's ⁓ for me, and this is kind of, you know, the the the direction that we're really heading in Daxco is ⁓ we exist for the benefit of our customers. And I think for me, you know, as a technology and service provider, you know, we we have an amazingly talented group of ⁓ a team members here. ⁓ a lot most are much smarter than me. ⁓ but most importantly, ⁓ we need to understand where we fit in the ecosystem. You know, we're not out on the front lines. you know, delivering services or supporting inspiring people that do, you know, like yourself. And so, you know, it's important for us to make sure that we're leveraging technology and now AI, right? ⁓ which is I could not be more excited about. Like how are we embedding all these tools like into our products and and things that we deliver so that, you know, the the customers, the clubs that we serve can, you know, grow their business, serve their members better. reduce automated ⁓ reduce manual tasks by automating like all of these things. ⁓ yeah, it inspires me, I think, because I I lived it and I work day to day in the clubs. I I'm not anymore. I have a great ⁓ management team that runs my club business, but I have this deep respect and appreciation for the level of effort. And so just inspires me and and drives me to deliver for our customers. Well Jeff, I you know, you bring up the world of AI and I've even been approached you know, of how we're using AI and mind you, we're in a very hands-on type deliverance model of our methodology because what we practically provide here at the perfect step is a methodology that's rooted in load bearing exercise and neurological repair. And so a lot of our predication of our methodology and practice is rooted in trying to provide input signals into the body as a specialist that's providing sensory and proprioceptive input. For the body to try to produce motor function output. So all of that is fully hands-on. And so the incorporation of AI in that sense, not really there. It could be in kind of the automated sense of how we run our business. But for you, I'm I want to bring this up because it's important for all of us, I think, to maintain something that is human-centered solutions that still have a human element. So with kind of the rise of AI. And the incorporation maybe into your operations for your clubs and for your softwares at Daxco, how have you still remaintained the perspective and the census of being human centered? Yeah, absolutely. I love it. So so so how the the software company I founded eighteen years ago is is named Club Automation. It's one of the Daxco portfolio companies. And it's just that. Think about, you know, the automation and and we would get this question all the time, like, ⁓ you know, but we don't We want to have human interaction. And the whole idea is like, no more human interaction, right? If you can if you can automate tasks that are very manual, like it frees your people up to have more human interaction. And and ultimately, I think no matter what happens with AI, if you think in the fitness industry, there's in essence, what has not changed is, you know, clubs want to get more members, you want to get more customers. You want to retain those members and customers. You want to upsell them and understand what they like and you know what they might participate in that they're not participating in and how do you communicate with them, right? And then also just automate the the mundane tasks that you can be, you know, ⁓ more proficient and then also spend more time with people. So I think fundamentally at the the club itself, things haven't changed. And what I'm just excited about more than ever is like we now have the tools to deliver even more of what's always been our mission to kind of to kind of hit those four pillars. ⁓ and we can do it really effectively. Well, I I always love hearing from other just mentors, leaders in the space, and somebody like yourself that is an entrepreneur and owner that I look up to because obviously all of us are in the midst of kind of that next wave of change. And we all have, you know, as biz owners business owners and operators, kind of that five year trajectory plan and we certainly do too. But wondering where the next, you know, kind of domino is to fall in the field of kind of the adoption of AI and how we stay as pioneers and cutting edge and on the forefront to make sure that through our practical deliverance, we're incorporating technologies and things that don't become foundational but very supplemental that amplify us, we've got to be doing that and stewarding that as well. So hearing about those shared experiences gives me the perspective of where to focus on next. Yeah, it I you literally hit the nail on the head when you said practical, right? So it it's like, ⁓ technology can be interesting for technology, but does it have practical application that really benefits our customers and and and there's a ton of it with AIs. I f I feel like you you you did the master class of of flipping the interview and like I said at the beginning, thank you for joining me today. ⁓ you are one of the most inspiring people I've ever met. And ⁓ I always enjoy seeing you. ⁓ it's an honor. ⁓ to have you ⁓ with me today. ⁓ thank you for just setting a great example for all of us on just a a well lived life of of serving and, you know, being a resource and all of those things. And I would just encourage anyone that, you know, ⁓ is is listening to this podcast, reach out to Hal. ⁓ you can get a lot of information. You can also just get inspired, you know, and and I know ⁓ you've done that for me. ⁓ today's another day ⁓ where ⁓ I'm a little more motivated after talking to you and and I I I can tell you do that to a lot of people. So thanks for joining. Absolutely overwhelmed with gratitude and thank you for keeping that human-centered approach with me. I I felt it a couple weeks ago at HFA that you just make things so personable, so real, to talk life with you, to learn from you as somebody that's a new parent myself and you've been around the block there with being a great father, a great provider. ⁓ it's fair to say that there's mutual admiration on this call. And I really hope that the the listeners take forth a mentality that we all have an opportunity to pay it forward, to get involved, to leave a lasting impact and to create change. And I know that through Jeff's amplification of key stories in this very industry that we all call home, the health and fitness industry, that more people are going to be exposed on how they can do exactly that. So thanks for having me. Yeah, absolutely. Thanks, Al.