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Reaction: What we learned from Scott Harris' postmortem presser · Tiger Territory: A Detroit Tigers Podcast

• 0:09
  Speaker 1: And welcome in to another episode of Tiger Territory, part
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: of the Foul Territory Network, Detroit Tigers podcast. I'm Kieran Steckley.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: With me, as always, is a man that knows salt
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: and pepper goes a long way when you got some beef.
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: He is Cody Stavenhagen. How we doing?
• 0:23
  Speaker 3: Gotta season your food, guys. Too many of y'all are
• 0:25
  Speaker 3: out there eating unseasoned food, poorly seasoned, under-seasoned food. Come on, I'm...
• 0:30
  Speaker 3: I'm in Houston right now where they season the food well.
• 0:33
  Speaker 3: I'll be covering the White Sox to start the postseason.
• 0:37
  Speaker 3: But don't worry, we are still bringing you all sorts
• 0:39
  Speaker 3: of Tigers updates here on Tiger Territory. And yes, I
• 0:42
  Speaker 3: was in Detroit this morning for the Scott.
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: Harris press conference.
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: I was about to say, hard working Big J journo
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: over there, Cody. And I'll put you on the spot
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: here to begin this episode. Do you think Sky Harris
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: today was under-seasoned, properly seasoned, or over-seasoned?
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: I don't even know how to answer that. Depends on
• 1:06
  Speaker 3: your perspective, right? Look, at these things, especially when people
• 1:11
  Speaker 3: are mad because the Tigers didn't make the playoffs, I
• 1:13
  Speaker 3: think everyone wants that pound of flesh we talk about.
• 1:16
  Speaker 3: Everyone wants the reporters to embarrass Scott when he's up
• 1:21
  Speaker 3: on the podium, and that's not really how these things work.
• 1:24
  Speaker 3: I actually thought he was asked plenty of tough questions.
• 1:26
  Speaker 3: I think he was kind of pressed on free agency
• 1:28
  Speaker 3: and pitching multiple times. I thought all the right issues
• 1:31
  Speaker 3: were hit. And I actually think Scott's gotten a lot
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: better at these over the years. His answers were very
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: long and very in-depth, almost kind of too in-depth, because
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: everything's just kind of 30,000 feet. And, you know, well,
• 1:44
  Speaker 3: it was great except for this, but also there's this number,
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: but also the reality is we didn't play well enough.
• 1:49
  Speaker 3: I think you could have probably predicted a lot of
• 1:51
  Speaker 3: what he said, a lot of what people actually want
• 1:54
  Speaker 3: to know, Who's coming back? Who are you going to add?
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: They can't really say. And especially at this point in
• 1:59
  Speaker 3: the offseason, they probably don't have the answers to all
• 2:03
  Speaker 3: of those questions. So I don't know. I thought it
• 2:05
  Speaker 3: was fine. I'm actually curious as someone who wasn't in
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: the room, Kieran, what did you think of it? Did
• 2:11
  Speaker 3: you get what you would want to get out of
• 2:13
  Speaker 3: something like that?
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: Again, I got what I would reasonably expect from having
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: watched basically every Scott Harris press conference since he took
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: the job.
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: I do agree with you.
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: He has gotten better at contextualizing and.
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: Taking these two.
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: He's getting a lot of two- and three-part questions, and
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: he's breaking them down in, I would say, an adequate fashion.
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: My biggest takeaway was.
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: I think Scott Harris, in his mind, accepted reality of
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: 2026 pretty quickly and obviously more so than probably a
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: lot of people and immediately did a mental pivot to
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: what it could mean 2027 and forward. And I think
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: there's going to be an extra Scott Harris. It's going
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: to be Scott Harris squared from here on out As
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: long as he is in charge of Detroit Tigers baseball,
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: because with all these young cats that he drafted and
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: has brought in and either in the major leagues or
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: like on the cusp of the major leagues, like he
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: is going to be like feeling this is like, holy,
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: my process, not just like my team, holy, my process.
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: And I don't even mean this to be critical. I
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: don't think he's really hiding that.
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: I think he is legitimately happy to have a team
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: made up almost completely in his image. Obviously, there's still
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: guys that he inherited that are on the team or
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: key parts of the team that will be on the
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: team moving forward.
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: It's obviously not 100% his guys, quote unquote. But I
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: think he....
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: Really looks forward to a new brand of Tigers baseball
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: that's going to be more reflective in the kind of
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: talent that he has aimed to bring in. I mean,
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: how many times did he talk about athleticism or something
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: related to athleticism today? How many times did he just
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: kind of go back to the whole youth thing and
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: its benefits?
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: To the extent, Cody, that like, he could say like, yeah, it's.
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: My fault that we didn't have enough depth than may
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: to overcome all these injuries.
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: But the next sentence is going to be how happy
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: it was. All these young guys got to play.
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: And if he's going to do this thing where, you know,
• 4:46
  Speaker 1: we don't want to block young players.
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: Well, guess what?
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: Young players are only ready when they're ready.
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: We saw that this year. Right.
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: And you're not going to have the depth to overcome
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: the injuries that, that we saw this past year. If
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: you're not going to block young players, like those two
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: things just like cannot be in concert, in my opinion.
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: And if you want to say like, hey, the injuries
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: were just so out of control, there's no way we
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: could have like anticipate all this stuff.
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: OK, fine, whatever. But but it's one of those things
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: that like if.
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: You're going to do it this way, you can't kind
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: of cry foul when it's more of a feature, not
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: a bug.
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: Does that make sense?
• 5:29
  Speaker 3: I actually think that's a really good point, Kieran, and
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: that gets probably to the heart of his press conference. Yeah,
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: the future's bright. You have a lot of young talent.
• 5:37
  Speaker 3: I don't think anyone can reasonably dispute that. I've said before,
• 5:40
  Speaker 3: we're going to show up to spring training, whenever that
• 5:42
  Speaker 3: may be, and vibes are going to be pretty good.
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: They should have a pretty good team next year. Now
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: they have to get a lot of things right to
• 5:49
  Speaker 3: better supplement this young talent they have, and that's where
• 5:52
  Speaker 3: I think the jury is very much out on Harris'
• 5:55
  Speaker 3: ability to do that, And probably judging from his words,
• 5:59
  Speaker 3: there's not going to be any grand change in philosophy
• 6:01
  Speaker 3: this year. I think that's what it comes down to.
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: He said, we're not building through free agency, and we
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: never have been. Now, to his credit, he didn't say
• 6:09
  Speaker 3: we're not going to sign free agents. He said, if
• 6:11
  Speaker 3: there's a position that we don't think we can address internally,
• 6:14
  Speaker 3: we're going to go out and get someone. So it's
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: maybe a little too easy to take his words and
• 6:18
  Speaker 3: run too far with it. When we look at this offseason, again,
• 6:22
  Speaker 3: this is a bad free agent class, man. And we're
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: going to get into... late November and some other teams
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: are going to be doing stuff and maybe the Tigers
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: aren't going to be and people are going to be
• 6:31
  Speaker 3: losing their minds and this year more than most years
• 6:35
  Speaker 3: I think that's going to be the wrong reaction I
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: mean there are not many players in this class I
• 6:40
  Speaker 3: would want to touch there you could talk yourself into
• 6:44
  Speaker 3: say a Suzuki or Brandon Lau or a couple of
• 6:47
  Speaker 3: the guys maybe coming from overseas but the price tag
• 6:51
  Speaker 3: on them might be even higher than normal through the supply,
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: lack of supply and demand in this year's free agent class.
• 6:57
  Speaker 3: And like, are the Tigers going to be wrong to
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: not give Brandon Lau like a lucrative five-year deal? I'm
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: not sure that's the play. So I almost, that's kind
• 7:07
  Speaker 3: of getting maybe beside the point. The Tigers have to
• 7:10
  Speaker 3: better supplement things. I think they need to supplement things
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: through trade. All right. And it's, it's, I don't have
• 7:15
  Speaker 3: three trades drawn up right now that they can go do.
• 7:18
  Speaker 3: I think trading, especially with where they are at in
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: their roster with some pieces that don't quite fit with
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: a weak free agent class, I think they need to
• 7:26
  Speaker 3: go make some trades. And that wasn't talked about a lot.
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: It does seem very clear Harris is just dead set
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: and in love with this core. And you know what?
• 7:34
  Speaker 3: It's a pretty good core. If I were to try
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: to criticize that, I would be like, I don't know.
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: Did the Cleveland guardians still have a better rookie class?
• 7:42
  Speaker 3: They had Parker Messick, Chase DeLotter, Travis Bazzana, and some
• 7:45
  Speaker 3: others like the white Sox had some rookie of the
• 7:48
  Speaker 3: year candidates as well. Like there are other teams that,
• 7:51
  Speaker 3: that also have good young talent. So I don't think
• 7:54
  Speaker 3: that is enough. That is my fear coming out of
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: this is like, your development's doing a really good job.
• 8:03
  Speaker 3: And that goes back to like the Harris front office
• 8:05
  Speaker 3: has clearly done a really good job drafting and developing.
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: This 2023 draft class looks pretty damn good. And especially
• 8:15
  Speaker 3: if we just go to the last two years, the
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: Harris front office has not done a very good job
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: through free agency or through trade. So how is that
• 8:23
  Speaker 3: going to change? I don't think we necessarily got answers
• 8:25
  Speaker 3: to that. I kind of asked him about the pitching,
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: you know, was there a common thread in so many
• 8:30
  Speaker 3: of the misses? He didn't really say that. He kind
• 8:33
  Speaker 3: of pointed to like, well, a lot of the other
• 8:35
  Speaker 3: relievers who were on the market didn't have good years either.
• 8:38
  Speaker 3: He did say their evaluations have to be better without
• 8:41
  Speaker 3: going to any specifics. So I don't know that that's
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: a very long answer. I don't know if you have any,
• 8:45
  Speaker 3: any takeaways from that, Karen.
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: Well, I think we can just put to bed any
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: sort of free agency.
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: High expectations.
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: So that's the second part of what I said about
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: the excitement with the core, the young talent. Even though
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: he says we've never built through free agency, which is true,
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: I don't even expect anything... splashy here moving forward. Like,
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: I honestly think Scott Harris, if you gave him true serum,
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: he would say, look, if I ever have to make
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: another splashy free agent signing, it's because I failed like
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: with the development and you know, this, that, the other thing.
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: I think that's how he's going to look at it
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: from here on out because he now in his mind,
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: he finally has the ability to do that because he's
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: had so many of these guys kind of come through
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: the system with his, you know, with his, you know,
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: baseball ethos and development and all that stuff. And like
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: the common, the common language all these guys have kind
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: of gone through, you know, from rookie ball all the
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: way up. And then, like, I would even point out
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: the whole, like, they played together thing. How many times
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: did he say that? He is clearly valuing this above
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: everything else. As I go back to my notes, I
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: would say he's more convicted than he's ever been. If
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: you like Scott Harris, then you like that. If you're lukewarm,
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: you're lukewarm on it. If you're anti-Scott Harris, buckle up.
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: Like I said, Scott Harris is going to Scott Harris.
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: All right, Cody, it is time for a new segment
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: we're doing. It is called On Deck and it's presented
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: by Fox One.
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: All right, Fox One.
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: Everybody's want to remind you that the NLDS, the NLCS
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: and the World Series are streaming on Fox One. And
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: so speaking of young players, Cody, we got. a lot
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: of guys are going to be metaphorically on deck, uh,
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: you know, here, here pretty soon for the tigers. And,
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: and so I thought, all right, like I, I think
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: we see a role for Kevin McGonigal.
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: I think, I think we see a role for Kevin McGonigal.
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: So we don't have to talk about that.
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: I feel pretty safe about Max Clark's role moving forward. So, so,
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: you know, take them out of the equation. I just
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: jot down three guys. I want you to kind of
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: stake your claim is like, who's the most on deck.
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: And what I mean by that is like, uh, you know,
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: obviously opportunity, uh, and sort of the reliance on them
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: that's going to come with said opportunity. So my three
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: candidates are Ha-Yoo Lee, Drew Summers, and Eduardo Valencia. Three
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: guys that got shout-outs in the presser today as well.
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: So of those guys, and, you know, how Scott Harris
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: feels about this question is going to dictate offseason moves.
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: Of those three guys, or fourth if you want to
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: add somebody, who is the most, quote, on deck?
• 11:45
  Speaker 3: Hmm. Well, I like this question because I think it
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: goes back to what I've said. I don't know if
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: every organization does this, but at least a couple that
• 11:52
  Speaker 3: I know, they have their scouts. You fill your report.
• 11:56
  Speaker 3: Let's say you give a guy a 45. You think
• 11:58
  Speaker 3: he's okay. But at the end, you have to pick, basically,
• 12:03
  Speaker 3: is he going to go over or under your own evaluation?
• 12:06
  Speaker 3: If you really had to pick, you think this guy's
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: good or you think this guy's bad? So that's a
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: little bit of what we're doing here. I don't think
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: any of these guys are bad, but if you're going
• 12:15
  Speaker 3: to ask me to pick one to maybe, to maybe
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: kind of exceed this. I'm, I think I got to
• 12:22
  Speaker 3: go with one Drew Summers, man. Uh, trying to, yeah,
• 12:26
  Speaker 3: I mean, and I think it's, it's pretty simple. I
• 12:29
  Speaker 3: don't know if our dashboard's working here, but we've showed the, uh,
• 12:32
  Speaker 3: the stat cast page before, man. And it is decked
• 12:36
  Speaker 3: out in red. There are so many metrics and so
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: many markers to suggest that Drew Summers should be a
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: really good major league pitcher. He's already had bits of success,
• 12:47
  Speaker 3: and he has all the traits, including a sky-high whiff
• 12:50
  Speaker 3: rate that Scott Harris referenced on Monday to continue to
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: have that. Now, what does that mean? Is he a closer?
• 12:57
  Speaker 3: Is he an ain't-thinning guy? I'm not sure that he's
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: going to be that, but he can be a really,
• 13:03
  Speaker 3: really good lefty reliever. He's already shown what I need
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: to see to be like, no, there's a really high
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: ceiling here. Whereas with Howie Lee, could be pretty good.
• 13:14
  Speaker 3: That stat cast play age is also a lot of blue,
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: so that scares me a little bit. And so that's
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: kind of what it comes down to. Valencia, oof, there's
• 13:24
  Speaker 3: some red there. The 1,000 OPS, almost so good it's scary,
• 13:29
  Speaker 3: but he's always going to be behind Dylan Dingler. We'll
• 13:33
  Speaker 3: see how much they end up using him at DAH.
• 13:35
  Speaker 3: We'll see if first base is ever in the tool bag.
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: You know for a fact, I think, Summers is going
• 13:39
  Speaker 3: to get a lot of opportunity, and there's a lot
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: of data to suggest he should continue to have success.
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I like Summers being somebody who gets, like, who
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: will be relied upon in those leverage endings that, you know,
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: obviously Scott Harris talked about a lot today that didn't
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: go well for the Tigers this season. If I were
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: to answer this question, my heart, wants to say how
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: you leave because, again, he kind of like immediately goes
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: into that right-handed infield bat that, you know, obviously that's
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: going to be vacated by Gleyber Torres. There is still
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: some variance with him and, of course, the metrics he said.
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: But I'll go with Valencia, man, because, like, he could
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: be on deck as, like, a semi-regular DH, especially against
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: lefty starters. Obviously the backup catcher element is there. I
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: said a couple weeks ago that he was maybe the
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: key in keeping Dingler fresh. If he can be good
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: behind the plate, good enough that Dingler doesn't have to
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: be in there as much as he was. And there
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: is a first base element to this that is always
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: going to be hanging over people and trying to find
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: ways to get Valencia into the lineup. So if what
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: we saw is.
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: Remotely true this year, Cody.
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: then he's very much on deck because there are certain
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: things that you just can't, that just swing games. And
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: I would say OPS over 1,000 is one of those
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: things that can swing games. Hot take. So Valencia would
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: be my answer. So that was brought to you by
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: Fox One. I want to remind you guys that MLB
• 15:24
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• 15:27
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• 15:30
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• 15:40
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• 15:45
  Speaker 2: Never miss a moment.
• 15:46
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• 15:51
  Speaker 1: at foxone.com. All right, well, actually, speaking of first base, Cody,
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: that was another... Another element to this presser that was interesting,
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: Scott Harris was asked about Spencer Torkelson.
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: Again, forever the lightning rod of this, I guess, this
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: older core, you could call it.
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: And I'll just remind everybody some of his final numbers.
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: He was a. 230 hitter, OPS plus of. 113,. 766 OPS.
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: He had 26 home runs, had a stolen base, and
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: had a triple. Don't forget about that triple that he
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: had last weekend.
• 16:31
  Speaker 3: That's one triple every year.
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: One triple every year. You can take it to the bank.
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: Five career triples.
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: Look at that.
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: And....
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: Scott Harris, looking at my notes right here, he said
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: he expects Tork to be somebody that, I'm going to
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: paraphrase here, is part of helping us get back to
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: the playoffs. So, it seems to me that at least
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: right now, Scott Harris is not, he gave zero indications
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: of a emphasis on first base, at least external options
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: and all that stuff. But he also, in a different
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: part of the press conference, mentioned Colt Keith could be
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: someone that plays into the first base piece of this. So,
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: did we learn anything about Spencer Torkelson's future with the Tigers?
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: No, we did not.
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: But, you know, that he's, it seems like he's not
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: going to be that quote pound of flesh either.
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: So he's part of getting us back to the playoffs.
• 17:33
  Speaker 3: Sounds like he's, sounds like he's coming back. Um, I
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: didn't hurt that he had over a thousand OPS in September,
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: as we've said, like the most Spencer Torkelson thing ever. And,
• 17:44
  Speaker 3: you know, I, I don't know. I actually don't think
• 17:46
  Speaker 3: it's wrong. Um, as I've mentioned, like I'd like to
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: see this roster somehow reshaped, but Until you can show
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: me another guy who can play first base every day
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: and hit you 25-plus homers, I'm not as eager to
• 18:03
  Speaker 3: move on from Spencer Torkelson now. I wouldn't be shocked
• 18:06
  Speaker 3: if we see a little more of a Tork Keith platoon,
• 18:10
  Speaker 3: which is interesting because they talked about moving on from
• 18:14
  Speaker 3: some of the pinch hitting and the matchups. But yet,
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: I don't know. I could see a platoon at first.
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: I can see a platoon in right field. You're probably
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: going to play how you lead a lot, you know,
• 18:24
  Speaker 3: or you're going to– I can still see a lot
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: of areas where that strategy might come into effect. I
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: guess it doesn't mean everything. Think of a couple years ago,
• 18:34
  Speaker 3: you know, Harris said, well, Spencer Turnbull's going to come
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: to camp and compete as a starter, and then they
• 18:39
  Speaker 3: non-tendered him a few weeks later. That was a little
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: bit of a different situation, I guess. It seemed to me,
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: but I even asked, Harris about Torkelson, I think after
• 18:49
  Speaker 3: the 2024 season and whatever his answer was basically like, yeah,
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: we need to look at this. Like, yeah, you know,
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: we'd like to see more production or something. And this
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: felt more like a vote of confidence. And it might
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: be for that simple reason for as, as frustrating as
• 19:04
  Speaker 3: the ups and downs of torque can be as much
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: as I hate talking about it. Cause it's really hard
• 19:09
  Speaker 3: to land the plane until you can really show me
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: a better option. I, they're worse things than just a lot,
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: a lot of natural power from your first baseman. And
• 19:19
  Speaker 3: maybe if someone else is playing there more, whether it's
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: Keith Valencia, eventually Bersenio, maybe that can take some load
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: off where you're not as dependent on him because he
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: probably is now a bottom half of your order hitter
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: rather than a top half of your order hitter.
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: So if we're talking about things that are, it's going
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: to talk is going to be the ultimate, like things
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: have changed, but also the same, uh, Because I, because,
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: because we're not like we, I think we all understand
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: the torque thing.
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: I think we all get it. I think we all
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: like see what it is.
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: I don't think anybody's hanging on to any sort of
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: like extended hope here, but I think if you're just
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: like completely out on him, I also think that that's,
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: that's kind of missing the forest from the trees as well.
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: So like you could, You could do a lot worse
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: to have that piece of your lineup be somebody that
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: can hit 26 home runs. And then the defense part
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: of it, as much as the numbers don't like him,
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: we all have eyes. We all see the good stuff
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: that he does. And it's not like we've seen some
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: stellar first base play when he's not there, playing there either.
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: So I just think those elements are important.
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: That does bring up one of the things I didn't
• 20:33
  Speaker 3: love about this press conference that I don't like. The
• 20:35
  Speaker 3: Tigers are always trying to do everything, and they're always
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: kind of trying to have their cake and eat it too.
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: So now they're trying to get away from matchups, but
• 20:42
  Speaker 3: they also, you know, I kind of asked Harris about,
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: you have these young guys coming, you're changing your play style,
• 20:51
  Speaker 3: you know, does that mean some harder decisions when existing players, Torkelson, Keith, Meadows, Vierling, Winslow, McKinstry,
• 21:00
  Speaker 3: there are more. And what he seemed to say, what
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: I took from his answer is like, well, especially if
• 21:07
  Speaker 3: you have options, they're valuable. That's obviously paraphrasing his answer.
• 21:11
  Speaker 3: But he did mention the importance of having options. He
• 21:14
  Speaker 3: actually mentioned that as a way to build the depth
• 21:16
  Speaker 3: that they did not have this year. If some of
• 21:19
  Speaker 3: these guys are in the minor leagues, that's okay. You
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: then have depth and quality depth in the minors, which
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: they really did not have for the bulk of the season. So, okay,
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: so you're going to keep everybody, you know, even Colt Keith,
• 21:33
  Speaker 3: he talked about maintaining the positional versatility, and he said
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: we want to keep that as long as we can,
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: talking about both Keith and McGonigal playing multiple positions. It's like,
• 21:44
  Speaker 3: all right, so you're keeping Twerk, and you're keeping Keith,
• 21:48
  Speaker 3: and you're going to keep moving McGonagall all around, and
• 21:51
  Speaker 3: we know you love how you lead, and maybe shortstop's
• 21:54
  Speaker 3: a little bit of a question, but, oh, that kind
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: of looks like the same infield. Riley Green's obviously really good.
• 22:00
  Speaker 3: Max Clark is really good. You love your young players
• 22:04
  Speaker 3: like Malgeri, and Karp can hit 30 homers, man. I
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: think he's got to come back. Oh, that looks a
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: lot like the same outfield. So how is this team
• 22:15
  Speaker 3: going to be better? We are right back at that question,
• 22:19
  Speaker 3: and that worries me.
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: I mean, I could see a case where this team
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: looks relatively the same in March or whatever the equivalent
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: of March will be. And then by May, then it's
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: a complete shift into something more clear to what we're
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: anticipating change-wise. And I would even say it is worth
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: repeating that Max Anderson, Zaire Hope, and Josue Brasenio expected
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: to contribute in 2027 per Scott Harris. And then the
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: play style thing. We probably have done a bad job
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: of not focusing on that sooner. That was one of
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: the things that definitely raised an eyebrow as soon as
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: Scott Harris was talking about it. Even the way he
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: was talking about the way the team was managed. I
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: don't mean managed in an A.J. Hinch sense, so just
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: to be clear. But just the way that the team
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: was managed throughout, it seemed like he had thoughts on
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: that being different moving forward. But stealing bases was mentioned unprompted.
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: Like you said, the platoon thing was mentioned unprompted. Maybe
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: it's the case instead of like 2.0 of same players,
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: different team is actually same players, different team style. And
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: that's how they kind of, you know, evolve from what
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: we saw in.
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: 2026 into 2027 and beyond, if that makes sense. Yeah.
• 23:43
  Speaker 3: Well, the amount of times he mentioned defense was really interesting.
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: He even mentioned that as one way that improved their
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: pitching decisions to put a better, a better defense behind
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: the pitchers. We've already seen hints of that, especially with Clark.
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: We know McGonigal is a pretty good defender that the
• 23:59
  Speaker 3: Tigers are built up the middle better than they were.
• 24:03
  Speaker 3: But I don't know, based on the metrics, like Lee
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: was not a very good infielder and, I am like
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: eventually when Rainer gets up here, he's a good infielder.
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: I don't know how good his hope in the corners.
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: I haven't seen him with my own eyes to tell you.
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: So I'm also curious. Okay. Like you've already done some
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: things to improve the athleticism and defense, but how exactly
• 24:24
  Speaker 3: is this defense going to get better? Again, I'm looking
• 24:27
  Speaker 3: at shortstop because it sure seems like they don't want
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: McGonigal to be the everyday shortstop. Javier Baez's name was
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: not mentioned once during this whole thing. I don't know
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: what that means. If there's a place to somehow add,
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: I think it might be shortstop. I'm not sure exactly
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: who that guy is, but is there a chance they
• 24:45
  Speaker 3: want to go get someone who can really pick it,
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: to use a Ryan Gardenhier phrase, at short? I hope
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: they're not banking on John Peck playing 162 games at shortstop,
• 24:56
  Speaker 3: but I don't know.
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the up the middle piece is going to be
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: interesting because, again, the Peck piece, the Sweeney piece, like
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: all these guys.
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: Trey Sweeney, man.
• 25:06
  Speaker 3: Talk about the forgotten. He will be back. He will
• 25:08
  Speaker 3: be back in the mix. Left-handed. Left-hander can play shortstop.
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah. All right. Real quick.
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: Green extension question was asked. Scott Harris was noncommittal. Obviously,
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: maybe more of just a... he seemed to make it a,
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: like a, a policy. We're not going to talk about
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: hypotheticals like that. Obviously I'm paraphrasing here.
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: And then he.
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: Did mention the school thing. He didn't want to get
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: into negotiation stuff, but he did say quotes, uh, about
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: all the things that are out there that have been leaked.
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: They are not all true. So that's, uh, that's what
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: Scott Harris has to say about all that.
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: I see. I'm trying to go through some of my
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: notes here, Cody.
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: Uh, he did have a good, a good answer about
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: Kyle Finnegan and sort of like, they're going to have
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: to kind of figure out a best way to, to get,
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: He said he was surprised based on what happened at
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: the end of 25 to what we saw in 2026.
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: So whether it's shape, whether it's usage, whether it's health
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: or something, whatever, just spitballing. I'm going to have to
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: get him right because, again, he is under contract. And
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: also he said he does not regret the trade deadline.
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: Speaking of Scooble, he said, would I rather have two
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: months of Scooble and Mize versus a decade of Hope
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: and Ryan? And Cash and Brady, I can't remember his
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: last name.
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: Ray Smith. You know, no, basically, is what he said.
• 26:37
  Speaker 3: I agree with him, right?
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: It's your team now, Scott.
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: Now that this year is over, you're glad you would
• 26:46
  Speaker 3: rather have that talent than not have it. I thought
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: his comments on Kenley Jansen were interesting. He said, you know...
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: just talking about kind of the oddities of Kinley's performance,
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: which he's not wrong, but he actually said the Tigers
• 27:01
  Speaker 3: projected him to have a worse ERA than he ended
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: up having. It's almost easy to forget. Kinley Jansen finished
• 27:06
  Speaker 3: this year with a 3.20 ERA, which it didn't feel
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: that good, and he did have some nice outings in
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: September to help get that down, but it does make me,
• 27:16
  Speaker 3: I mean, he had a 2.59 ERA the year before, Kieran,
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: and of course his metrics didn't align with that, but like,
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: so what did they project What did they project him
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: to have, like a 3-8-0 ERA or something? That's something
• 27:27
  Speaker 3: to shake your head at, but, like, was it really a–
• 27:31
  Speaker 3: why were you pumped about this signing if you expected
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: him to be, like, kind of mediocre? I thought that
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: was somewhat telling. But overall, now that I say that,
• 27:42
  Speaker 3: I don't know. Kinley had a 3-2 ERA. He just
• 27:44
  Speaker 3: really struggled kind of when it counted.
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and remind me. I guess I should have looked
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: this up. They essentially have.
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: A $ 10 million decision to make on Kenley.
• 27:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like a $ 12 million option, but the buyout.
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: Is $ 2 million. They pay him $ 2 million to go
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: away or $ 12.
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: Million to stay. I believe... Let.
• 28:13
  Speaker 3: Me make sure we get this accurate. Yes, while you're.
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: Looking that up, make sure that's correct.
• 28:18
  Speaker 3: $ 12 million with a $ 2 million buyout. There you go. Yeah.
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: So, uh, so yeah.
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: And then Drew Anderson, they also have a decision to
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: make on Drew Anderson. I, it's, I felt like it
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: seems like, yeah, it felt like a.
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: Raved about Drew Anderson and then said, I'm not going
• 28:34
  Speaker 3: to forecast what we're going to do with the option.
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah. It was like, I'm so glad. Yeah.
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: Like, I know you can't, he's not going to give
• 28:42
  Speaker 3: a yes or no, but like the way he threw in, Oh,
• 28:45
  Speaker 3: but I'm actually not going to tell that. It sounds
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: like they're picking up Drew Anderson.
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: Kenley.
• 28:50
  Speaker 3: I don't know. It's, I like to think they just
• 28:54
  Speaker 3: got to move on there, right? But, hell, maybe they won't.
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know.
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: I think it's hard to feel.
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: If he can agree to a lesser role, then it
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: might not be the worst idea. He's like, you're not
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: always going to be a ninth inning guy.
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: I'm not for it. I really like Kinley as a person.
• 29:15
  Speaker 3: He was a fun guy to cover. He's going to
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: be 39. Let's stop paying $ 30. Stop paying aging pitchers
• 29:24
  Speaker 3: a lot of money. I just think you could do
• 29:26
  Speaker 3: better with that $ 10 million.
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: That's probably true.
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: And again, maybe that just goes back to the fact
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: that Scott Harris is looking internally and externally at the
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: fact that like this these rois on these like relievers
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: just is not great including what i've done and uh
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: and so that's why basically they're going to make everybody
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: a starter until they need them to be a.
• 29:48
  Speaker 3: Reliever that was kind of the one thing he said
• 29:51
  Speaker 3: about like his actual approach about his actual philosophy he
• 29:55
  Speaker 3: kind of said they wanted to support the bullpen through
• 29:59
  Speaker 3: basically starters pitching in relief. So that probably meant more
• 30:02
  Speaker 3: of Cater Montero in relief and drew some drew Anderson
• 30:05
  Speaker 3: and relief and probably some other guys in the minor
• 30:08
  Speaker 3: league level. And instead they had so many injuries. They
• 30:11
  Speaker 3: had guys kind of more going from relief to starting,
• 30:15
  Speaker 3: but it sounds like that's kind of still the strategy
• 30:17
  Speaker 3: build so much starting depth that some of the guys get,
• 30:20
  Speaker 3: get pushed to the bullpen. And I'm not, I'm actually
• 30:24
  Speaker 3: not a huge like spend money on relievers type of guy.
• 30:26
  Speaker 3: I mean, Quite honestly, you can look at the Dodgers.
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: They can afford to spend money on relievers. It has
• 30:34
  Speaker 3: not really worked out for them. Tanner Scott, Edwin Diaz
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: have not been very good. I don't know, man. If
• 30:39
  Speaker 3: you could bring in like an Adrian Morajon, like a
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: guy who can really throw and who can miss a
• 30:44
  Speaker 3: lot of bats, it kind of feels like one of
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: the real missing pieces for this team. So although they're
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: not going to do a lot in free agency, I
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: think they should look long and hard at– giving a
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: decent contract to, to a real lockdown reliever. Yeah.
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: And, uh, and I guess, and according to, you know,
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: what he's saying, whether that's true or not, what he's saying,
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: he being Scott doesn't feel like the timeline's going to
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: accelerate just because of this impending lockout. Uh, so we
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: could be in for a lot of, uh, speculative talks
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: about what the tigers may or may not do and
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: what this roster is going to look like.
• 31:23
  Speaker 3: Uh, We know they like to wait things out. So,
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: I mean, they're going to be hoping someone didn't sign
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: before the lockout.
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: All of us.
• 31:32
  Speaker 3: We get a little desperate coming back.
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, all of us are going to be waiting it
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: out along with them.
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: All right, Cody, that was good. Good little talks there.
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: Again, like Scott Harris, I always feel like When he
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: first started, I felt like I learned something, like another
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: kind of baseball philosophy thing. Now I'm learning things about
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: him every time he does these press conferences. So I
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: enjoy watching him. I enjoy talking about our observations with
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: you and sharing it with everybody here. Is there anything
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: else you want to get into before we jet out?
• 32:11
  Speaker 3: No, we got all offseason to dive a little deeper
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: into some of this. I think... I do think that's
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: one of the takeaways, you know, I do kind of
• 32:18
  Speaker 3: view it as like both Scott and AJ are, are
• 32:21
  Speaker 3: under the microscope. I'm going to phrase it that way.
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: And during next season, there is going to be a
• 32:26
  Speaker 3: lot of pressure on them to, to deliver more than
• 32:29
  Speaker 3: they did this year. But Scott Harris didn't really talk
• 32:32
  Speaker 3: like a guy who's, who's feeling the heat. I don't think,
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: I think you're right. I think he feels more convicted
• 32:37
  Speaker 3: than ever. It's not necessarily wrong, right? A lot of
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: the good things he has done is all kind of
• 32:42
  Speaker 3: coming to fruition. Um, And so that's just kind of interesting,
• 32:48
  Speaker 3: especially coming off a year that is disappointing as this
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: one was.
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: So you guys can interpret that and feel about that
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: however you want. And I'm not going to sit here
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: and tell you you're wrong. The results will kind of
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: dictate whether this approach and this mindset is all the
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: way correct. So You guys can follow us on ex-Romeo
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: Nolan's Twitter, at Cody Stabenhagen. I am at Kieran underscore Steckley.
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: Pod page at TigerTerritory underscore.
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: YouTube, Apple, Spotify. You guys know what to do.
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: We appreciate all of you. So, for Cody Stabenhagen, I'm
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: Kieran Steckley. Everybody have a great day.