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Katie spoke with Senator Sam McMahon about her resignation from the CLP · 360 with Katie Woolf

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  Speaker 1: Now we learned over the weekend that Senator Sam McMahon
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  Speaker 1: has made the decision to quit the COLP. Yesterday I
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  Speaker 1: spoke to the CLP President, Jamie de Breney, who claimed
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  Speaker 1: the resignation would not impact the CLP in terms of
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  Speaker 1: being able to continue to be a political party, telling
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  Speaker 1: us the CLP was legally allowed to run under its
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  Speaker 1: own name in the next election despite losing its only
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  Speaker 1: federal seat. Now joining me in the studio is the
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  Speaker 1: Senator for the Northern Territory, Sam McMahon.
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  Speaker 2: Good morning to you.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, good morning Katy.
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  Speaker 2: Now, Senator, why did you decide to resign from the party?
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  Speaker 4: Look, Katy, there's a couple of reasons. It's not just
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  Speaker 4: one thing. It's quite a few things, as you know,
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  Speaker 4: as usually the case, you know, I feel that there's
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  Speaker 4: a disconnect between myself and the party management. I don't
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  Speaker 4: feel that I can any longer put my hand on
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  Speaker 4: my heart and say to Territorians that I'm representing the
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  Speaker 4: CLP or that I'm a CLP representative, because I just
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  Speaker 4: don't feel there's that connection between myself and the party.
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  Speaker 4: And as I have detailed in recent days, probably all
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  Speaker 4: brought to a head due to the fact that, yes,
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  Speaker 4: I did put several issues or complaints to the CLP
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  Speaker 4: management back in November last year and have received no
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  Speaker 4: response to those.
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  Speaker 2: What were those issues?
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  Speaker 4: Look, Katie, you know, I don't want to go into
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  Speaker 4: any great detail. It's a you know, it's a private
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  Speaker 4: matter between myself and the management of the CLP. But
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  Speaker 4: it did involve, you know, some of the things that
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  Speaker 4: came out of the Jenkins Report into the Parliamentary Safety
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  Speaker 4: for women, and you know, I didn't feel that my
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  Speaker 4: safety was being ensured in part in party meetings, in
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  Speaker 4: CLPA party meetings.
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  Speaker 2: So you didn't feel safe in the workplace.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, it was an issue of not feeling safe in
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  Speaker 4: People need to understand that as a politician, part of
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  Speaker 4: my workplace is party meetings. I'm required to attend to them.
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  Speaker 4: And no, I did not feel safe in the CLP
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  Speaker 4: Central Council.
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  Speaker 1: So it wasn't a situation where you were not feeling
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  Speaker 1: safe in Parliament in Canberra or as part of the
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  Speaker 1: coalition team. What you're saying is that you did not
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  Speaker 1: feel safe in those central council meetings.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's correct.
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  Speaker 4: No problem at all in Canberra, no problem at all
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  Speaker 4: down there it was an issue that was very specific
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  Speaker 4: to the CLP Central Council and that's something that I'm
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  Speaker 4: required to attend. So, you know, as I said, that
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  Speaker 4: is my workplace.
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  Speaker 1: Look, there'll be people listening right now who are feeling
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  Speaker 1: quite perplexed hearing what you are saying, and you know, and.
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  Speaker 2: Maybe a little bit confused.
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  Speaker 1: I guess, you know, some people may may not even
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  Speaker 1: understand what that Central Party sort of or that Central
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  Speaker 1: Council meeting is. I mean, it is a meeting where
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  Speaker 1: there's several people.
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  Speaker 2: There isn't there.
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  Speaker 4: It's a meeting where there's a large number of people.
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  Speaker 4: I mean normally I think that's sort of around the
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  Speaker 4: sixty to eighty people. It's a meeting that the party
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  Speaker 4: has several times a year that's attended by delegates from
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  Speaker 4: right across the Northern Territory from all the different branches.
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  Speaker 4: So it's a reasonably large meeting, but also quite intimate.
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  Speaker 4: You know, it's everyone's in a small sort of closed
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  Speaker 4: space and if you're if you're not feeling safe and
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  Speaker 4: secure in that environment, it makes it very very hard
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  Speaker 4: to do your job.
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  Speaker 1: So you put these, you know, these concerns to the
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  Speaker 1: COLP President Jamie de Brenny.
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  Speaker 2: Were they taken seriously?
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  Speaker 3: Look, I mentioned them to Jamie.
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  Speaker 4: You know, I said to him, I was, I was
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  Speaker 4: actually in quite a distressed state. And I said to
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  Speaker 4: him at the Central Council this, you know, this.
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  Speaker 3: Is not right.
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  Speaker 4: He said, well, look, what you need to do is
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  Speaker 4: put your concerns in writing, then we can deal with it.
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  Speaker 3: And I did that.
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  Speaker 4: And you know, as I said, I did that in
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  Speaker 4: November and in early November, and I've not had a response.
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  Speaker 1: So nothing since November. I spoke to the CLP president yesterday.
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  Speaker 1: He spoke very positively about you, and and you know,
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  Speaker 1: I spoke highly of the work that you have conducted
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  Speaker 1: as the CLP senator will no longer but when you
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  Speaker 1: were obviously and as your work.
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  Speaker 2: As a senator.
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  Speaker 1: I mean, some people listening might think that this is
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  Speaker 1: maybe a bit of muck raking towards the CLP.
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  Speaker 2: Is that the case, No, not not.
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  Speaker 4: At all, Katie and look off had people say, oh,
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  Speaker 4: you know, this is just sour grapes and this is
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  Speaker 4: just you trying to extract revenge on the CLP for
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  Speaker 4: you know, not not gaining pre selection. And that's absolutely
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  Speaker 4: not true. I mean if I if I was you know,
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  Speaker 4: if I was doing that, I would have done that
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  Speaker 4: a long, long time ago. This is a timing issue.
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  Speaker 4: The CLP has their next Central Council coming up in
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  Speaker 4: two weeks time, and I just felt enormous distress and
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  Speaker 4: anxiety at having to face that situation again where I'm
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  Speaker 4: made to sit in a room and not feel, not
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  Speaker 4: feel physically or mentally safe.
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  Speaker 2: Do you still believe in the CLP? Yeah, yeah, I do.
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  Speaker 4: I do, Katie, And look, I've got a lot of
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  Speaker 4: friends in the CLP. I have respect for everyone that's
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  Speaker 4: on Management Committee, including Jamie. I have no problem with Jamie.
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  Speaker 4: He's a great guy. I still believe in the party
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  Speaker 4: philosophy and the platform. It's just a personal issue for
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  Speaker 4: me that I can't put up any longer with not
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  Speaker 4: feeling safe and secure in the workplace.
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  Speaker 1: Now, Senator, I know that over the last year or so,
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  Speaker 1: there's been some pretty serious accusations made about you as well,
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  Speaker 1: some staff members saying that they didn't feel safe in
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  Speaker 1: the workplace. Do you feel as though you've provided your
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  Speaker 1: staff over the years the same, you know, the same
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  Speaker 1: protection and the same respect as what you would hope
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  Speaker 1: the c orp is given to you.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, Look, I absolutely do.
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  Speaker 4: I've only ever received one complaint from one staff member.
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  Speaker 4: I dealt with that as I'm required to do and
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  Speaker 4: as per the workplace requirements. That resulted in, you know,
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  Speaker 4: one staff member leaving and another staff member being sacked.
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  Speaker 4: So you know, yes, I do feel like I've done
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  Speaker 4: everything as I'm required as an employer.
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  Speaker 1: There were also some pretty serious allegations made about you
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  Speaker 1: behaving badly, accusations of drinking and throwing a punch at
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  Speaker 1: the National Federal Director. Did you throw a punch at
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  Speaker 1: the National Federal Director Jonathan Hawk?
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  Speaker 4: Look, kat I'm not going to go into details of
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  Speaker 4: what what may or may not have been said or
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  Speaker 4: what may or may not have been done by people
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  Speaker 4: that were at a private function out of out of
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  Speaker 4: work hours. I'm not going to go into details about that.
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  Speaker 4: I'm not going to respond to those allegations. I mean,
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  Speaker 4: I've heard about six or seven different versions of allegations
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  Speaker 4: of what supposedly happened, So I'm not going to go
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  Speaker 4: into details about that.
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  Speaker 2: Do you regret your behavior? Though?
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  Speaker 3: No, No, Katie, I don't.
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  Speaker 4: I don't have any great regrets about anything that I've done.
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  Speaker 4: I've always tried to do the absolute best job that
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  Speaker 4: I can as a CLP representative and the best job
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  Speaker 4: that I can representing the people of the Northern Territory.
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  Speaker 4: And I hope I'll be judged on my achievements and
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  Speaker 4: what I've brought to Federal Parliament.
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  Speaker 2: What are your plans?
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  Speaker 1: I know that you have said that that you know
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  Speaker 1: that you're going to be really putting, you know, putting
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  Speaker 1: your intentions forward, maybe over the next couple of days
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  Speaker 1: or over the next couple of weeks, But I mean,
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  Speaker 1: are you going to stay sitting with the NATS at
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  Speaker 1: this point?
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  Speaker 4: Look, Katie, my hope, in my desire is that I
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  Speaker 4: will stay sitting with the NATS. That that's a matter
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  Speaker 4: and that's an ultimate decision for the NATS, but that
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  Speaker 4: is what I would would like to do.
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  Speaker 2: Do they want you to sit with them?
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  Speaker 4: Well, look, I mean that's you know, that's a discussion
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  Speaker 4: that I'll have. I mean, we're in We're at Parliament
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  Speaker 4: next week, so I'm you know, I have ongoing discussions
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  Speaker 4: with the Deputy Prime Minister Barnaby Joyce. You know, we
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  Speaker 4: talk pretty much every day, but you know, ultimately that'll
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  Speaker 4: be a decision for the GNATS to make next week.
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  Speaker 1: Would you run for the Nationals Party at the federal
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  Speaker 1: election at the upcoming federal election if they asked you to.
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  Speaker 4: That would be something that I would have to consider
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  Speaker 4: if they asked. I can categorically tell you at the moment,
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  Speaker 4: I have no intention of running in the next federal election.
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  Speaker 3: But you know, a day, a minute is a long time.
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  Speaker 4: In politics, and it would have to be something i'd
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  Speaker 4: consider if I was asked.
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  Speaker 1: I think the really big question at this point is
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  Speaker 1: going to be, you know, in the lead into the election,
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  Speaker 1: a lot of people are going to be wondering how
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  Speaker 1: you're planning to vote.
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  Speaker 2: Are you going to vote against the coalition?
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  Speaker 4: I have no plans to vote against the coalition I
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  Speaker 4: have you know, I have plans to support the coalition. Obviously,
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  Speaker 4: if an issue comes up as it did last year
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  Speaker 4: where I crossed the floor with a few of my
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  Speaker 4: colleagues and voted against the government on an issue that's
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  Speaker 4: passionate to Territorians. Obviously, if that crops up, I'll do,
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  Speaker 4: you know, what's right by Territorians. But there's nothing coming
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  Speaker 4: up that I'm aware of that I would vote against.
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  Speaker 1: Senator taking into account what I've told me this morning,
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  Speaker 1: that you didn't feel safe in those in those Central
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  Speaker 1: Council meetings. Do you think that the CLP has got
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  Speaker 1: an issue with women.
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  Speaker 4: Look, that's been an accusation that's been been leveled at
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  Speaker 4: the CLP quite a few times.
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  Speaker 3: I'm aware over the years.
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  Speaker 4: And you know, apart from apart from this particular issue,
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  Speaker 4: I haven't had issues with any of the you know,
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  Speaker 4: the MLAs or the management or you know, the people
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  Speaker 4: in the CLP. But you know, I think the Jenkins
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  Speaker 4: Report certainly opened up a lot of people's eyes to
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  Speaker 4: the issue of women in politics, and it probably would
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  Speaker 4: be a very good idea for the CLP to have
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  Speaker 4: a look at that report.
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  Speaker 1: Some listening will be again asking are you just sour
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  Speaker 1: that you weren't pre selected?
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  Speaker 3: Not at all?
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  Speaker 4: And you know, as I've stated, if I was, I
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  Speaker 4: would have done this a long time ago. This is
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  Speaker 4: purely a timing issue to do with the Central Council.
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  Speaker 4: It's coming up in two weeks.
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  Speaker 2: Well what's next for you, Senator?
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  Speaker 4: Well, look, a lot of people have asked that and
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  Speaker 4: saying why aren't you considering what you're going to do?
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  Speaker 4: I mean, you know, Katie, the fact is I'm in
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  Speaker 4: a lucky position and probably a fairly unique position in
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  Speaker 4: that I have a profession and I still have a
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  Speaker 4: very successful business as a veterinarian. So you know, at
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  Speaker 4: the end of the day, I can just walk straight
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  Speaker 4: back into my profession and run my businesses.
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  Speaker 1: Well, Senator Sam Man, we will leave it there, no doubt,
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  Speaker 1: though we'll continue to talk over the next few weeks,
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  Speaker 1: very keen as well to see how the bill that
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  Speaker 1: you've got at the moment to try and get the
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  Speaker 1: territories rights, you know, and allow those over the next
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  Speaker 1: I'm not sure when does Parliament even sit again.
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  Speaker 2: When are you going to get the chance?
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, so Parliament sits next week.
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  Speaker 4: So Katie, that is one thing that I am focusing
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  Speaker 4: on is my bill for ensuring Northern territory rights.
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  Speaker 3: So that's obviously I've.
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  Speaker 4: Introduced that into the Senate and that debate has started
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  Speaker 4: on that bill, so I will be working really hard
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  Speaker 4: to vigorously try and get that bill across the line.
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  Speaker 1: Well, no doubt, we'll talk to you as that progresses.
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  Speaker 1: Thank you very much for your time this morning, Senator
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  Speaker 1: Sam McMahon, No worries.
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  Speaker 3: Thanks gant you