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AI Will Replace 90% of Accounting — But Not Humans · 10X AI with Julius Neil

• Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Good day everyone. I'm here again with another episode of 10xAI with Julius Neil. I have here Hugh Massey. He is ⁓ founder of a company who focuses on financial aspect using AI models. Okay, so Hugh, can you introduce yourself to our listeners and viewers and tell them about your company in layman's terms? Hugh Massie: ⁓ well great to be with you today, Julius, and for me to be sitting as an Australian in Atlanta and to be talking to a Filipino living in ⁓ Iceland, it's it's ⁓ you know great to to be here and to be talking about AI and how we can 10x businesses. So I think the that the simplest way to explain me is that I'm a reformed accountant. So I started life as a CPA or chartered accountant in Australia and I did that for about ten years working in Sydney, Singapore and Thailand. And then I had ⁓ some awakening moments and said that I ⁓ which said to me to go and leave being a a a chartered accountant and set up a wealth management business with a goal of helping provide personalized wealth management experiences. For families. And I didn't I didn't really know what ⁓ how I would do that. I didn't have tools or systems. But I I did have the understanding that humans are unique and can't be s it can't be served on a one-size-fits-all basis. And in my journey of of doing that, and I think even my own personal self-discoveries. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay. Hugh Massie: Somebody asked me one day, what are you really passionate about? Well, I said, I want to help people all over the world become financially self-empowered. And what what that did, Julius, was it got me to think, okay, what does that mean and how would I do it? And I realized that if I was going to help people become financially self-empowered, but also provide personalized experiences, it was all about human behavior. And I had been writing about it for a few years in my day journal. I but it was not conscious to me. I'd just been playing around with these ideas and this thinking. And then it all the the penny dropped and I connected all the dots for myself. And and then I realized that okay, what are we really talking about here? I can see when I have a meeting with a client, they behave a certain way when they're in a social setting or when they're comfortable. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: But when they're under pressure, they behave differently. And that's what what what then I had a chance meeting with a ⁓ psychologist from England, and she's and she explained it to me and she said that that well when people are are under pressure, they revert to their hard wiring to their instinctive self. And that is more the true core behavior as opposed to The more masked learn behavior, the the general way you show up in social settings when you're comfortable, you've learned to adapt and be a particular way. That gives way to this hardwired behavior. And so I realized that what I was seeing with clients under pressure was a behavioral flip. I was seeing husbands and wives, business partners. operate differently, behave differently, under pressure. And I realized that if I was to succeed in putting a tailor-made suit on every person, which is the personalization, it needed to start with understanding the hardwired behavior. And that would be that behaviour is predictive and it would be the it would give me it was giving me the insight on how that person would behave over the long term. And when they're making highly emotional decisions, and often money, is very emotional. So that's the story of how I got to human behavior. And then I said to the psychologist, Well, I need you to help me build a system. And it can't be a system that people can just go and fake or choose who they want to be or anything like that. And it needs to be very deep and cover a you know, not just a risk profile, but Everything about the person, starting with how they communicate. And she gave me an outline of a model and said, You need to meet these people in the United States, and they can help you build it. So I've I the next week got on an aeroplane and went from Sydney to Atlanta, and they said, Yeah, we can help you. And and then the journey went from probably 40 times in four years of flying across, getting it built, then then we get it. Proven. Build the technology and you know, another go at at refining the system, you know, more tech upgrades. And hey Presto, today I'm talking to you twenty years or more later. But that's if that gives you the idea. So we are very ⁓ we're not trying to just guess behavior, we're using science to understand a person. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah. Hugh Massie: at a very deep level and then we know how they're going to make decisions. And and you know, I've been doing this long enough now it re it it proves itself every time we do this with somebody. ⁓ So it's what we do is very accurate. It's not ⁓ well, gee, here's a person with who's male 40 years older than a million dollars working as an engineer. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay, okay. Hugh Massie: And got a wife and two kids, okay, they'll just make an assumption that they're like there's some kind of accumulator person. ⁓ and then the person next door happens to be lives next door to them happens to be similar, well the they're the same too. That's not that's not true, right? Everyone's unique and and and I'm all about uncovering uniqueness. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah, yeah. So in the in Hugh Massie: And that and that's the whole basis, if that's maybe a yeah. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah, in this, in this, in your model, for example, this platform that you created, is it already based on AI? When you started artificial intelligence or some, some machine learning type? Hugh Massie: No. No. It it it was very much based on when we started the the individual, let's say it would would be you, right? Would would go into our website, click on a link, and spend well at it twenty twenty years ago it took thirty minutes to to complete forty six questions. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: and you would, you know, rate do the rating in the particular way that we have and now with improvements in technology, we've got that process down to ten minutes. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Hmm. ⁓ Hugh Massie: But it's still the human having to do it because the only the most accurate result comes from the human responding to the questionnaire, but it's very uniquely structured, so it can't be faked, gamed, or monkeyed with in any way. Now, what we do with that, then AI can be used with the with the results, right? But the but that part ⁓ there is no AI. But when AI Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Open. Hugh Massie: came to you know in twenty twenty three and or twenty twenty two and three large language models started to appear, like OpenAI and now Anthropic Claude. We changed the mo we we we changed the game for ourselves where we said, okay, what if AI could answer the questionnaire for the person? W what would be the result? Right? And and so we built a system to do that. And that also has enabled us to scale our business at a much gr at a much greater rate because we don't have to wait for somebody to complete a profile. It can just be done. If you said to me at the pharmaceutical company you're doing a project with, that there was a hundred thousand people that you wanted to know more about sitting in a database. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay. Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: We could use AI to create a profile for every one of those people and we would know how every one of those people buys, ⁓ works, sells, communicates, decides what financial plan they build. We we know that. But we could we could run that overnight. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Wow. Nice. That's good. That's Hugh Massie: As opposed to a hundred thousand people having to get on a computer and go and complete an exercise, right? Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay, so how did you do that? How did you do this, your system, and then AI answers for the person? Hugh Massie: So our system had already, when we designed this, already been used by a few million people, right? So we have underneath our system a lot of benchmarks, a lot of data points, and we're able to say that if we if we know certain things about the person. And and then we look at, you know, from open intelligence, from public data sources, nothing private, like where they work, some of the things they said and done on online, varying activities. That we can make well at the moment it's an eighty five percent prediction. of who they are. We had thought it was only seventy to seventy five, but now we've done measurement of it. It's actually eighty five percent, which is pretty accurate. And I think we can probably get it a little stronger yet. And so that's how we did it. So but but I had worked on that privately for a few years, right? In an offline ⁓ mode to figure out what to do. But open but but with open AI ⁓ coming, you know Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah. Hugh Massie: Claude, Microsoft, you know, building platforms that make it easier to do on scale, that scale. Then we implemented it. So in actually in two thousand and seventeen we'd figured out what to do. But it was too clunky to do it at that time with the technology. So I I mothballed it. But then when AI, you know, in terms of ChatGPT and Claude are invented, then it became easier. And as they as their models strengthen, they you know, every every month there's something, you know, more power in it. This gets easier to do and to do it better. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: and and for us to do more things with an analysis with the behaviour. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay, so... Hugh Massie: So so we're you know, now like for example, we're able to analyse companies, the leadership teams of companies, and predict how they're able to generate profits, right, and financial value, right? ⁓ I could I could tell which company is gonna innovate, which ones won't, right, by looking at the leadership teams. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay. Okay, okay, so. Hugh Massie: It's and and it's proven to be true. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: So based on the questionnaires that you have, ⁓ what are the type of variables without disclosing your proprietary system or structure? What are the basic variables that you are, for example, for the 46 questions before that you had, there are certain variables that you're looking for. So in a general sense. Hugh Massie: Yeah, so Yeah, in a so so there's not a lot that's that secret about it. It's probably the secrecy is more how we what we do with it, but but to score it. But we're getting people to cho is very deliberate to choose between three words, most and least like. So let's say one word is aspiring, the next word is detailed, and then the next word is patient. You have to choose which one are you most like and which one are you least like. So for me, I would choose aspiring and then I would choose least like on patient. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: Now that means something in the system. Now that when that's done forty six times across a hundred and thirty eight items. That now allocates to what in in in ⁓ behavioural science terms is behavioural factors, subfactors, and a whole lot of analytics spits off that, that we've then benchmarked against varying behaviours activities. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: ⁓ okay. So when the when so when come? Hugh Massie: So that's so that's what so that's all people are answering, and it's very it's done very specifically like that, with very simple words. One because it's more understandable, but we also wanted to remove situational bias. Because if you if you took the typical question that gets asked, you know, that that ⁓ there's been a negative financial event that's happened and would you react this way, rate it one to five, someone's answer to that would probably change every time they did it. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: Right. Whereas with ours, the consistency in the way in which people answer the most and least like on those three words I gave you is extremely consistent. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay, so for example, if your company wanted to use your platform for their company, so what is the end goal usually by the company? ⁓ After knowing, for example, all of the profile of their leadership team or the whole company as a one culture company, so what do they do with that data? Hugh Massie: So what what w so one of the biggest uses, I think probably the biggest use is in marketing and sales. So that's why I use the example with a pharmaceutical company, right? If you're a pharmaceutical company and you've got a ⁓ a database of a million people that you want to sell a drug to or sell products to, right? And you want to s you you want to provide a more personalized sales experience for that. you could run the profile, what we call the digital scan, over all of those a million people and now know how to segment your marketing, what to say to each person. in emails, communications, how you set up meetings, you know, run the buying process for them based ⁓ based on who they are. That that's the biggest use. So we've got banks that are doing this now with with you know selling loans, wealth management products, insurance, annuities, whatever the the financial product or solution is, they are personalizing the experience. Based on knowing the financial information that I mentioned before, plus what we have. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: okay okay okay so that Hugh Massie: So that's that would be the biggest use. Now it could be used in HR for hiring people. ⁓ our system is often used for that. But I think the the biggest use is in sales and marketing. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Hmm, that's okay. That's why that's why you know it because they wanted to make sure that all of the Clientele or client base will be able to have a you know, different experience You know that from end to end from you know, the farm one boarding, you know all this Profiling. ⁓ yeah, so all these things so it just it makes sense Hugh Massie: Right. In and in today's personalised world, that's what everybody wants to know. Even, you know, I was dealing yesterday with a furniture company, right? Even they want to know who's my client when they walk through the door to buy a new table and and bed. How do I deal with that person? Everybody wants to know that, right? Because what it does is you've got a better chance of building engagement more quickly and making the person comfortable and ⁓ you know, getting them to make a buying decision. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah, that's one thing is the data that you are generating. There's another thing is how do you train now the people? For example, I'm the CEO of the company. So I know that the sales team have these gaps. They have these weaknesses. These are the strengths and these are the profile of our customers. So in terms of the training, how do you help them translate the data into actionable steps or training for each of the personnels? Hugh Massie: So AI AI can do that, right? That that we've built the AI modules in our system. So if you're a salesperson, ⁓ we've got one, we've got videos and all of that type of thing, but if you're the salesperson and you want to know how to deal with Mary tomorrow, right? Or in one hour's time, you're going to a sales meeting. How do I sell her alone? You can build a meeting script. using our system and the behavioural insight to do to to ⁓ to do that. All you all the only training you need to do is to know that people are different, right? And and and that the bat that behaviour is important and in the way just trust the system that if you know who you are. So I'm an initiator style that's more direct, forthright, to the point, ⁓ goal driven. That's good if I'm dealing with people like me. But the moment I'm dealing with someone different, I've got to immediately know I've got to slow it down and maybe I've got to sit them down, give them a cup of tea, take a bit more time, use more empathetic words. That's an adaptation for me. But the system will soon tell me, okay, I'm meeting somebody different, and Hugh, this is how you need to handle that meeting. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hmm, that's nice. Hugh Massie: That's the only training people need. The only training people really need is to recognise is to is to have it in your mind, okay, every human's different and then I can use DNA behaviour to to help me work to help me navigate what to do with each person. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay, that's very interesting. Hugh Massie: That's that's that's all it needs and and and we're not talking about complicated words or anything here, but that's all you need to know. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay, okay. So I don't want that. Hugh Massie: Now, if you are if you are talking about making, you know, ⁓ using the system that's if you're in sales and marketing in and and in a lot of roles, if you're talking about very niche, high end, high stakes decision making situations, you might need a little bit more training and guidance. But even then, you ask a question in our system. And it's the the the the AI app is called Gene, G-E-N-E. Well Jean, hey, Gene is related to DNA, right? ⁓ Gene also happens to be a name that a male or female can have, right? Yep, go and ask Jean. Gene will tell you what to do. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm, yeah, Yeah, it's a new and a sex name. It's when all of this is inside your platform. It's good. Hugh Massie: Yep. Yep. And and if you are if you just want a simple so we have a couple of levels of it. If you want to use this as an enterprise and you know and do the mass scale data enrichment for a million people, we've got our main system for doing that. But if you're just a s let's say you are a salesperson listening to this podcast and you want to be better at at at with your client meetings, be able to re you know ⁓ know what to do when you can sense that somebody's different to you or know who's the buyer behind the the gatekeeper, you know, all of that. We've got an app called GoDNA and it's goDNA.ai. You can see that on our website, or just go to goDNA.ai and use it. Complete your profile and then you can digitally scan everybody that you want to, including your babysitter, ⁓ your kids, ⁓ whoever you deal with. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Wow, it's really nice you have this foundation of all all sweets that anybody can use when it comes when they want it to. Hugh Massie: Yeah, i i i i i it and it's it's there at a price point that that that it shouldn't be it's not expensive if you are serious about wanting to understand how people are different. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah. Then another thing was, for example, I'm the, I'm already a user, I'm the CEO of company. So I have a thousand employees and then I use your profile. I use that for my sales. Now, if I wanted to use that in HR, for example, how is your system going to help me? Hugh Massie: So for HR would would would and the CEO, I think the CEOs should all be the first person of a business to use it, ⁓ because this should start from the top down. ⁓ that human behavior or the how people tick and building a people central culture centric culture is important. That should start with the CEO. So the CEO would use it and then he or she would want to get their ⁓ C-suite to complete the profile and understand how they're all making decisions and how to interact. And there'll always be some differences with some people. It should always be differences because you should have different, you know, different styles of people ⁓ working in in key roles. You know, the CFO in financial area is different to a marketing person or a salesperson should be. ⁓ Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: So so you want to do it there, and then if you go to the HR, then they're going to want to use it for building the people culture, who we hire. So looking at what's the matching a person to a role, how people get onboarded, how do teams fit and work? Or in today's AI world, we need people who are much more ⁓ creative and flexible. to deal with all the change because job roles are changing all the time and what's expected as outcomes is changing all the time. and and we you know if you need that kind of person in your business, who are they? Because today in today's world, businesses are going to have to develop products, new products, far more regularly I think, to survive and and what what worked in the past won't work in the future. And and and and you're going to need ⁓ more people, not everyone, but you're going to need more people that are flexible and creative and can, you know, ⁓ you know, make things happen. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay, so since you're also handling a lot of data, know, private data from companies, so how do you now handle the governance side, the AI governance, the data, you know, data privacy, data integrity, when it comes to that? How do you use, for example, if I'm, yeah, you know, this data? Hugh Massie: Very quickly. Yeah. Yeah. So so one is, you know, we've got long standing policies about none of our data is ever shared outside of our business. ⁓ the only we only look at data ourselves if we are ⁓ for research purposes. ⁓ even I as the founder of the business I don't see every person's profile and I don't have access to it. I only have access to who I deal with and who's given who's given me permission to look at their data. ⁓ so internally as well, it's it's private. ⁓ and and then in some of the bigger exercises that we're doing, like where we are, let's say I use the example of enriching the data of a million people in a bank's database. That's going to be done in their bank in their environment using our system. And we don't have to see the results. So it's it can be i the data can be kept 100% private, but data clean rooms can be used. There's all sorts of ways for for this to be done. We have an API. So clients can do use our system themselves and it's anonymous on our side. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay. Okay. That's Hugh Massie: So, so, and we are never accessing ourselves private data from somewhere else. Even when we run the digital scan, it is only what is known out there in the world. But what I would say is, and I think this is where the walls are coming down, there isn't much that's private anymore. Unfortunately, there isn't much. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah, yeah. So I do believe that because a lot of our information is out there. It's really, you know, it's very public now. And especially with AI, when people are sharing a lot of different, know, especially these open models that we have right now, a lot of people are sharing their information, you know, asking questions. So these are all being, you know, being processed by you know, by open AI or cloud and eventually use that. Hugh Massie: Yeah, and and and I I ⁓ right. I mean I think that, you know, in America once you provide your social security number somewhere, ⁓ or your or or your you know if you're a company you provide your your tax tax ID number pretty much anything can be found even from your phone number. So so you know while we're all sensitive to privacy and it is important the reality is it's it's out there and and and even as I've found in a particular situation we've dealt with recently that ⁓ you know we can use our forty six question profile Julius, to understand somebody and that's a profile they complete. And we keep that private. But if I decide to go and run our digital scan on that same person from open intelligence sources, I basically get the same answer. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: Right. It's eighty it's eighty five to ninety percent correct. So ⁓ While there's what I call technical privacy, is it private? I mean, if you can already get the answer, does that does that make sense? Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it makes sense. Hugh Massie: That's the that's the thing. ⁓ and I think that's what we're in a world of ⁓ you know, right now. Right? And and and you can't stop a company analyzing the data it's got, right? Or what's out in the public domain. You can't you can't stop that. But what you can stop is how it's used and and you know how people are treated, how it's used, whether it's privately or publicly, ⁓ that can all be stopped. You know, it shouldn't be misused, you shouldn't be defaming people, all those types of things. But the truth is the truth as well. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Hmm. Yeah, yeah, I understand. Hugh Massie: So it's a it it it is a very interesting world. I think you're raising you know, you've raised a big question. ⁓ whether you're meant to or not, it's a big question. But I think we're we're we're in a world now where the walls are broken down. ⁓ That's the way you know, that's the way it is. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah. So from being, you know, a CPA when you started the CPA reform CPA, and then your vision is to be able to, you know, to educate the more millions of people when it comes to financial planning or financial literacy. And now you have your platform now is going into B2B, B2B2C, which is a totally different one. How did you evolve from that from being okay from financial aspect only of people now from financial aspect of businesses? How did you evolve from that? Hugh Massie: Yeah, I i i i i it's interesting, I ⁓ you know, and I think it sort of applies to your ten X that you've got there in the in the in the branding. And, you know, when I started the business and and and and it was getting ⁓ born out of the wealth management business, you know, I said to myself, sitting there in Sydney, Australia, if I could get a hundred thousand people to go through this anywhere in the world, that'd be great. And and Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah. Hugh Massie: And I knew even to get a hundred thousand, I had to get other financial advisors and wealth managers to use the system. It couldn't just be me ⁓ individually going around and getting a hundred thousand people. I mean it could have been perhaps if I look back on it, but I knew I had to get other people involved. So I went to financial advisory practices. Anybody that would talk to me, you know, that breathed and would talk to me and would pay one dollar, I sort of went to. ⁓ because at twenty twenty-five years ago or two thousand and two when I first first did it, I and I really was doing it in our own firm, but in the next few years, this wasn't this is something that'd never been done before. And it's and and and even now we're still pretty much the leader in the marketplace of doing this. You know, it's not an approach that people are used to. But so I took that as a goal. But as I went to those advisory practices, the smarter ones started saying to me, Well, Hugh, if I'm going to use this, I need to know I need to know who I am. I need to n I need to be hiring the right team. Have I got the people in the right slot? So I need to work on my own business first. Before I can go to my clients. And I said, well, you know, we can also can use this for that, for hire, you know, here's how to use it for hiring, building a team. And so business DNA got born out of the same system. So then I'm running financial DNA, which is really understanding client behavior and behavioral biases and risk taking and whatnot. And we basically built a brother business DNA. And Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. you Hugh Massie: That led to, because of some of the people that I had helping me build that, that then led to more business coaches using the system, trainers, consultants that set business DNA on its own path as well into organizations. You know, we've we've had from the US military to Intel Fortune 500 companies using the system, 150. Other Fortune 500 companies or more have have have been in there doing something. ⁓ and then we've had this wealth management track all all the way along. So you get to, but then I get to a hundred thousand and I'm thinking, well, what should the goal be? So I just said, Well, I I want a million people. What does it look like? What do I need to do? And then you get past a million people, or we're around that, and well, okay, I need ten. And then and we never reached ten million people completing the actual profile. We were at about three million and I said an AI came along. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: And I said, what does this look like if we've got a billion people in our database? Because I I sort of think in human impact. What what what does this what does our business look like? And I knew the answer. We had to go to an AI solution. And so that's when we birthed the digital scan product, rather than the full scan was the one where everyone's got to complete the profile, the digital scan, which I've talked about, you know, in this conversation. And I ru so that's at the end of two thousand and twenty three was the digital scan, ⁓ the idea, and I'd already built a model, psychometric model for it. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: In 2017. So I took all of that and then we improved it a bit. And then I said to my tech technology team, well, we need to build it. So they did that during 2024 and early 25. And we really got launched on it last year. But we did an exercise, we've done some exercises now that that with clients that mean we've got 275 million or more. In fact, it's more than 300 million. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: people in our database, right? So I think we could get a billion. ⁓ but it means it means we've got to work with the right clients. But it changes our business because now we can do particularly if you think about sales and marketing, there are databases everywhere. Everybody wants to personalize. But that should lead to more activity in the rest of our business. You know, leadership training, ⁓ helping the salespeople become better Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: ⁓ you know and and and so that's the shift. But it's not I think the th the mindset in there, Julius, was that we never really wanted to be a training company, which is what most people associate with behavioral companies. We wanted to be the behavioral intelligence infrastructure. But technology had to cap catch up to allow us to be that. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah, correct. ⁓ Mm-mm. Hugh Massie: And and and and of course it can be done far more easily and cheaper now, but you can't build what we have by just saying, ⁓ gee, AI's here, I want to understand people. It takes it's you know we can do it quickly because we've had the foundation over a long a long time of all the psychometric data, building benchmarks, you know, doing tests and things. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: So. Yeah. Hugh Massie: So you can't just 10x from with no infrastructure in place. You've got to Julius Neil Buenconsejo: I believe it. Hugh Massie: you you've got to take some you've got to have a foundation. But I think there's a lot of businesses there now that ⁓ that are existing businesses that if they're prepared to examine their business model and challenge their own model. So you know that's for us is okay we could sell one by one assessments at $100 or more plus training or coaching fees. Or do you want to sell mass scale to a hundred thousand people at a dollar a or two dollars a head, what's going to make you more money? But you have to be prepared to change your business model. And I think that's where a lot of people also in this world of AI and you know want into ten X are not ready. I think that or prepared to do it. Because it challenges the status quo too much. And so they're just looking at AI as a way to optimise what they're doing, but not to fundamentally change what they're doing. Because you fundament the only way you're fundamentally changing your business is if you change what you sell or how you sell. What you you know, the the product, it's new products. Everybody can use AI to become more efficient, but you can only that can only go so far. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Correct. Correct. Hugh Massie: It's a so so I think that's part of how I think about it. So it's a matter of I ⁓ the mindset for Ten X and AI is you've got to change your goals and then you've got to be prepared with that to change the business model and how you do things. And there's a risk in that. That's why some smaller businesses coming into play with AI may make a quantum leap jump on some of the existing players or take some firms out of out of business. But they're probably going to need to be heavily capitalised to do it. ⁓ so someone's got to take the risk. But they could do it with twenty people, could knock out some Titans of the past. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah. Hugh Massie: But there will be a lot of people who will try to do it and are trying to build some kind of AI system on nothing, and that will fall apart too. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: So. Hugh Massie: And and and where I think it this is all important is around data because AI works on data. And that's why I look at the behavioural data as the liquid gold. No one's running their AI yet with behaviouralized data. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah, so for example, now that this AI, everybody's talking about AI replacing the job. So let's start with the CPA. So there are people who are talking about that CPA, the accountants will be first one of the first people who will get displaced by AI. What's your take on that? Hugh Massie: I think it's I think it's ⁓ I think that's true. I think and I think it's the same with legal. I think for basic basic services, a lot of it can be done by AI. There's a lot of ways that you could take a bank your bank accounts, it could be fed into an accounting system and the accounts produced, you know. I think that sort of thing can be set up even for a business, even like ours. It's gotta be set up. in some ways to to get that done. But once you set up the ⁓ the platform, AI can do can do a lot of that. ⁓ you want tax advice. Well it doesn't take a lot to go to Claude and get tax advice or legal advice, right? And that's just getting better and better and there's specialized models in there for doing that, right? ⁓ you know, I've I I've talked about that with because I was a tax advisor I can absolutely see how ninety percent of it can easily be done by AI or someone gets the the advice you know wants to get advice, they can go to AI first and get all the instructions set up, which is what the problem is, and and you cut down the role of the advisor to really get to cut to the point. But here's where AI doesn't replace the human, is in human judgment. You know. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: in in making judgment calls and and experience and humans also need a human touch. So it's like in wealth management. There's already a plethora of tools that do all the adding up and figuring out when you should sell a stock and how you tax optimise and all of that stuff. That's already been there for a long time. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-mm. Hugh Massie: But people still need help when it gets to the moment of I'm gonna sell my business or somebody in the family's sick, they need a human involved to help them guide them through that major what I call high stakes situation. That's where AI doesn't replace that. But AI can help that be better too, because you could use the AI to know how to ⁓ you know really understand what that person's needs are, what their journey's been, how to communicate and relate to them. So AI would, if you're a wealth manager, I think be able to you should be able to produce or deliver a better service for more people. ⁓ I think I think that the professional advisors, whatever, whether you're an accountant, lawyer, doctor, wealth manager, you will have to be better at what you do though as well. You can't just go to the golf course and expect AI to be doing it while you're out while you're out there. ⁓ that you'll get crushed if you do that. Right. So so The human needs to be involved, but I think AI will make the human better. But it won't it won't completely end the accounting industry, but there will be roles or aspects of it that get get get very ⁓ cut down. But ⁓ is the way I look at it. But but but what you want is AI to help the the the accountant prepare better cash flow analysis or more analytics. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay. Hugh Massie: get behind the numbers better, you know, to really know what's going on. And that's how AI can be embraced. ⁓ so a better service can be provided. And so maybe the accounting numbers of people don't completely go down, but what they have to do has to change. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay, okay. So in the age of AI, for example, you're saying that all of the information is already there. Anybody who uses Claude, who uses ChatGPT or Gemini, they can get all the information that some professionals have. So what's the human advantage now? How do I make myself more valuable in this very tough competition right now? Hugh Massie: Yeah, well I think I think it's about I think that that that in a way it starts off with you've got to be a better human. ⁓ and that's that's where understanding the y you know, your own behavior, ⁓ style, ⁓ being able to manage yourself better with a with a with a broader range of people, ⁓ being able to have insight into what people really need, ⁓ you know, listening properly for their problems. All those things are still important, right? Because to do that in t that that that intake is going to drive what you put into the AI. The AI doesn't just do stuff it's not it's it's becoming more magical, but it's not complete magic. a and and and so I think that the humans the human has got to be better and they've got to be very ⁓ attuned to what their what their strengths are, what areas do they really know about, ⁓ understand what might be coming back from AI, whether it's right or wrong, ⁓ what questions to ask the AI. I think I think that's that's what's in that's what's going to be i important. But ⁓ I I think the complete replacement of humans, no. I think it's more the humans being able to ⁓ you know, the role definitions for the humans might become different. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay, do you think there will be more jobs because of AI or there will be less jobs because of AI? Hugh Massie: In you know in I'm more of an abundant thinker. I think there will be more jobs, but in different areas. And and and and and you know, I think that when, you know, in the in the nineties and early two thousands we we you know we started to see proliferation of technology, everybody said, Well, all the jobs will go. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Ha Hugh Massie: But did they? No. But what people but what people w where the jobs are in what industries that will that will be ⁓ that will that there will be a shift in that. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah. Hugh Massie: So, you know, you could be a business with let's say with a hundred people and AI ⁓ you know, you start adopting AI, what each per you what each person does in the business may change, but it doesn't mean the head count will change, right? For the business. But I would expect the business to be able to produce a lot more. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: If that i with the AI being there. Or if it's going to produce the same, then there would be a headcount reduction. Right? So it's it's it's it's it's a shift. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: you Hugh Massie: ⁓ there. But I think AI opens up the opportunity for some businesses to create more pro new products, service lines, market channels that are somewhere going to need people. So it's just going to be are the people prepared to adapt and go and do something different? Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Looking deeper into the organizational, know, organizational culture. So thus, can your system detect, for example, we have the Gallup surveys, right? Then they will have this, they will have these questions and then the employees will answer and then we will have this, you know, data coming from Gallup. So that, can your system do that as well or can you correlate whatever you have? Yeah. Hugh Massie: So so so our system at a fundamental level would be a competitor to the Gallup Strength Finder ⁓ profile. What we measure and tell you about the person. might be i it would be i we tell you more about the person than the gallup strengths finder tells you because the gallup strengths finder is very strengths focused. Okay, what are your top five strengths out of the thirty five or six strengths that it's got ⁓ and I know there's some other other probably other tools sit behind it, but that's in essence what it's telling you. That's important, right? But we tell you other insights about the person, not just the strengths. We tell you your strengths too. ⁓ in fact it happens to be five. But ⁓ and that's not saying strength finder is a bad product, I think it's a very good product. ⁓ but we measure all those things and do all of that too. I think it's then about how is the information used inside the inside the organization. So, you know, one of the things, you know, if you talk about engagement, psychological safety. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: And you and you start to look at who's interacting with who, what's that saying? You know, w is it is it you've got a boss that's very heavy handed versus staff going home every night crying and with mental health issues. You know, you've got to pick that kind of stuff up. Or if you've got an accounting department that's not collaborat collaborating properly with the rest of the business, why is that happening? That's that's because of styles. I think the way we measure and show the behaviour makes it easier to spot that problem. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay. Hugh Massie: And and we've been and and and we've been building with with some of our business partners tools to to address that. ⁓ so we've got one of our partners has a platform called People Transformation AI. They're all about they use our system but they've built an overlay that helps you ⁓ identify what's going on with all the people in the business. We've got somebody that's doing that in schools, right? Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: ⁓ so Julius Neil Buenconsejo: They're doing that for the teachers or for the students? Both, Hugh Massie: Both. Parents, teachers and students. So you think about it. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Wow. Wow. Hugh Massie: Yep. Yep. So so so that's the that's the thing. And I think that's partly because I think about the behav I look at the world through people and relationships, right? Even though I'm an accountant, I look at money through people, right? Not just how much is it accumulating in the bank account. And I think that's where what I've also realized that for us to succeed in the market we have to we have to feed into products or solutions like that that can flourish because that becomes a specialist business in its own right. It's not just the behavioural measurements is one thing, it's how it's used is input. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Okay. A personal question, did you use this system for yourself? Did you analyze yourself also using this system? Hugh Massie: Yep. And that's on that's on and that's a really important point. ⁓ my profile's on our website. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: okay. Hugh Massie: So if you go to Hugh if you go to dnabehaviour.com and you look up the executive team, you will see all of our profiles there. Part of our culture is everybody's profiles known and shared across the team, and we share it with the clients. And we say to our clients, you ought to be sharing this with your own teams. And in fact, we generally won't let a financial advisor, for example, use the profiles. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: our system with their client with their clients if they haven't gone through it. We're not going to deal with a business where the CEO doesn't go through it. If if you just think that this is to be used to figure out others and you're not prepared to share, there's a problem in the business. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Are there situations like that before? When you were... ⁓ okay. Hugh Massie: Yep. But I always said that you're a better leader if you're prepared to be s the everything starts with the leader goes first. It's about being authentic. So if if I wanna know how to interact with my team, they should know how to interact with me, right? And it should be that should be a ⁓ equal exchange. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: I I agree. Okay, so I thought this is, you know, I thought this ⁓ having this platform will be easier for the leadership team to, especially the founders to know about their companies. I'm so surprised that there are CEOs or founders or entrepreneurs who doesn't want to undergo the same. What's the reason? What's the reason? Hugh Massie: There are ⁓ I think that they are ⁓ you've got leaders that that are narcissistic. ⁓ you've got leaders that are high on ⁓ control and they're very guarded. They don't want to be manipulated, right? And and that's ⁓ I I I can understand that because I I would be I'm not I don't consider myself narcissistic, but I would say that I'm high on control. I'm more introverted and guarded or withdrawn. ⁓ but I happen to believe that you've got to step out beyond yourself if you're going to grow and you want others to flourish and you want other people to believe you. And if I think this is important that people should be doing it, I've got to lead from the front. But I think there's a lot of leaders out there that live in, you know, have a lot of personal fears. And there has been, you know, there has been historically some bad behavior around profiling of manipulation. So some people are. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: conscious of that. But, you know, the reality is is we all have a set of strengths and struggles. It's about embracing your str your strengths. And if you're someone that's just worried or okay, someone's gonna see my struggles and won't hire me or won't work with me because of that, that's That's a problem. What you the the struggles are only a problem if you don't if you don't monitor them, right? And I think that's that that's where we have a problem with some of the wealth managers. They they want to c they think they've got to come across as this perfect human being to work with a new client. The client's not expecting you to be a perfect human being. Yes, they want strong character and you to be honest and all of that. But they know you're not good at everything. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: ⁓ Yeah, correct, Hugh Massie: Right. What what you should be presenting to them is this is my this is my strength, this is where I can do an A plus job for you. And hey, I've got team members to address the other areas. That's the that's really the point. And when you get that mindset. then it would be different. But what we've got is some corporations and some of them are big and some of them are smaller where they're essentially badly lit. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay. In your history of data that you gathered from your experience with clients, what is the one metric or one variable that predicts success of the company? Hugh Massie: Of the company? Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah, have the company. Hugh Massie: Yeah. We've done that research and that we know that that the if you said the number one indicator. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: is what we call the financial goal drive. So so so that's that if you think about it, that is what powers sales people. So it's a it's a i i i that you know, so so it's p a business that's got enough people in the right positions with financial gold drive, it's not everybody. You don't need your customer support people to have it, but the sales teams and the leadership team need to have enough of that. The c it's a competitive spirit, essentially, to drive the business forward and build sales pipelines. That's the number one thing. But that falls down if you don't have enough ⁓ innovation in the business. So innov you know the focus on innovation if that is not enough. So that and that's not just being creative, that's also the preparedness to invest in it. Because in today's day and age, as I've said, you've got to be building new products. Otherwise that sales pipeline won't be full, right? Because you because products are not going to last as long as they did once upon a time in many businesses. And then there's the third one is fiscal control. So the leadership team needs to be good at looking after the money. And and and when you have financial goal drive, the innovation and the fiscal control all strong. in the right parts of the business, it will outperform everybody else by a long shot. And there are a lot of businesses that are very lazy with their money. Yeah, they have budgets and whatnot, but there's a lot of art on the wall, people flying around in in in ⁓ private jets and ⁓ not just business class, but there's that too, but private jets and goodness knows what else, right? Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Business class. Wow. Hugh Massie: I I could I can see a need for certain people to do it in a very large company or sit certain situations, but what I'm getting at is a lot of wasted money. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay. Hugh Massie: And and that's ⁓ you know that's the issue and they spend a lot of money on innovation, which you maybe don't need to. ⁓ so so there if you start with a financial goal drive, then the innovation and then the fiscal control, they're the three things. And we've done the study on it of every listed company in the United States, we we absolutely could tell the companies that have those three behaviours Stronger. their profits relative to their competitors are much higher. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: For example, apple. Apple. Hugh Massie: Apple Apple would be up there. ⁓ Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Amazon. Hugh Massie: Yep. And and and the other the other yes, Amazon's in there. The other one is ⁓ founder led companies. So businesses that are led by still led by the founder or the founder is still in an influential role. They do better by twenty times everybody else. So take those three metrics I gave you, but if the founder's got those metrics and they are still involved in the business, it does even better and it's because the founder brings the culture. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah, I believe that. this is just based on my observation. Remember Starbucks when they were starting. Howard Schultz was giving all these benefits to their barista. Barista becomes partners, spend instead of employees. And Starbucks grew way, way better. It's like... fast and then he he he you know he was sidelined was old you know he was he wanted to still retire and give that give that give the leadership to other CEO and then it goes down and then remember he came back again and then the company you know Hugh Massie: Yeah. So so I think that's stu so I think that story is absolutely spot on. I think that you could say that with other companies where you see a major leadership change happen, particularly if it's a founder exiting, you need to have a very careful look at who's coming in because two years later you're probably gonna see or three years later you're gonna see problems. And there's a lot of there's a lot of that kind of ⁓ destruction there with big companies and smaller companies and it's all the same thing. It all happened whether it's a smaller company or a very large company, the same the same things happen. So the founder is key and and of course, you know, at the end of the day a founder has got to probably leave the business or retire or ⁓ you know dies, you know, things happen. So it's then comes about, okay, who's the successor and how have they ⁓ been brought up in the culture. But company but the but but it is a fact that that the company performance is not as strong when the founder's not in there. And a lot of private equity businesses make the mistake, I think, of getting rid of founders or making it so hard for them. ⁓ or the the structure of the private equity particularly the you know, doesn't work. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah. Hugh Massie: And and and I don't think necessarily a founder always has to be the CEO. They could be a ver I I I I think a a a key role for a founder is the head of product. If they can if they look because the product is really where the culture of particularly in today's day and age, a lot of the business lives through the c lives through the company product. The found whatever the product of the business is. that's an area where where where the the the founder could be heavily involved. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: So you've been talking about this is the pipeline of products that you need to have a lot of products now to survive. So it means if I'm a founder right now and I wanted to have, I wanted to be successful in the marketplace, to be in high competitive advantage, I have to be able to have a pipeline, like 10 year pipeline, of which products I to launch in every phase of my business. Hugh Massie: Yeah. Yep. Yep. And I think the and that's where the culture of the business resides in is is in the product. I think no one should forget that. and then how it's delivered. And so I think that's that's a key thing for CEOs, if they're the founder, to concentrate on, but also if they're not going to be the CEO, 'cause there's a there's a lot of things CEOs do in terms of, you know, if there's private equity managing the board meetings and the funders and whatnot and, you know, key strategic decisions that some founders perhaps are not great at. They weren't they they're not made for that. ⁓ there's people management issues. Not all of them are good at that. ⁓ you know, again we've got metrics on that. You know, founders are visionaries, they're not they're not good with they're not good at execution and they're not good at the relationship side. So, you know, get people doing what they're good at and and that doesn't mean the founder shouldn't have a g still keep their shares and have a good equity and growth situation, right? ⁓ it's just about who's doing what. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay, all right. So before we go to the to my final round the rapid 10x I would like to ask you one more question So your moonshot is helping one billion people make better decisions. So if one founder Yeah, so if one founder is listening today could only one thing differently tomorrow. What is it? Hugh Massie: Informing one billion people, yep. I I I think reframe your goals and you can do far more than you think you can do. And you know, like I I I did, I started off with a big with a big dream and but start small and finish big. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: nice. Okay we're going to the final punch the rapid 10x round so my first question what's one tool you actually use every day? AI tool? Hugh Massie: Claude anthropic. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: So what's one task AI has already 10x or improved tremendously exponentially in your life using AI? Hugh Massie: ⁓ I I I think it's still it it it's it's still the people analysis that it's enabled us to to do to analyze, you know, multiples of people or, you know, huge databases of people very quickly. I think that's what AI's allowed us to do. I I I think, you know but other other stuff in terms of being able to do due diligence on on a company and and and all of its people and find out things that would not ⁓ While the broad sets of information are out there in public sources, how it's assimilated. And understood for AI can help you pull that together in nanoseconds. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: you Hugh Massie: That's that's a big shift. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay, so what's one human skill AI can ever replace? Hugh Massie: I I well I think I think it can't really replace your intuition or your you know, for me, if I if I said my third eye, I don't think it can completely replace that. It could get me to use it better, but it can't replace it can't replace that. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: If you could automate one annoying thing forever, what would it be? Hugh Massie: ⁓ Yeah, I I I I well I it that's it I haven't I haven't th I haven't thought of that. ⁓ but I think I still think the whole how you manage yourself with calendaring, all the emails, ⁓ the flow of information could be better done. And I know that there are people out there who say that they've got an agent or a a copilot that's doing it for them, but there's still a lot of hand holding. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: You Yeah, they have this. Yeah. Hugh Massie: And I think that that part could all get better. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay, so what's the biggest misconception about AI right now? Hugh Massie: ⁓ I think that that that that AI is a magic bullet and it's gonna solve all problems. And I I think that people are building AI solutions, you know, to improve workflows or to to do something better when even that was flawed from the start or not properly documented. So people expecting it to do things that that are are from the on building it on the wrong foundations. I think that's the big that's the big mis that's the big thing. Because and and at the end of the day, going below that is working with the wrong data. And a lot of organizations have problems with their data. ⁓ making it consistent, is it is it real what what is what is reliable, what is strong? That's a big problem. And but then the processes and workflows over the top of that If they're wrong and you try to build AI, then then we're gonna have you're gonna perpetually have the wrong answers. ⁓ and and and so that's that's a problem. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah. So what advice would you give someone who wants to become 10x starting today? Hugh Massie: Well the first thing is going back to what I said before, you know, just before the lightning round, you know, of of you know, dream big. ⁓ start small and finish big. But don't ha don't allow anything to get in the way of of the dream or to think it's not possible, 'cause absolutely in this environment today, Julius, I think everything is possible. But then you need to plan it you know, well, you need to then plan out the mission fairly carefully, I think. And and and and that's part of going slower and really looking at what are you executing on, who's doing it, what tools are being used and being very deliberate with that. And I think if one's careful with that you don't have to throw as much money at things as maybe as you think you might. I think that there are a lot of businesses out there that are throwing tens and hundreds of millions of dollars at at at initiatives that it probably don't need to. You know, and but I think stuff can get I think there's an opportunity to to plan things out better. I think that with AI the whole workforce optimization needs to be looked at far more closely. And and it needs to start at the top, not just a CEO saying, okay, we need to cut some costs and looks over at the CFO and says, you know, Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah. Hugh Massie: Let's spend some money on AI and see what happens and and and it's all done working CFO and the CTO, allowing everybody to use tools and you never had a conversation with the marketing people, certainly the HR people, culture people, who's the management who are actually leading the people. And that's where then now there's a lot of AI wastage, right? Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Hugh Massie: And so I think that's ⁓ that's something that needs to be thought of. I think that's where organisations could do a lot better for themselves. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: What would you tell your younger self about the future? Hugh Massie: I I I think it's a great future. ⁓ if you're prepared to embrace all of this and you've got a positive mindset. But if you are inflexible and you well, I think everybody should have a if if everybody has a big dream, that's great, but you have to be flexible on how you might get there. And I'll even look at my own life. I I could have mapped out and said, well I went to school, I was good at these subjects, I became an accountant, I did well at that. But if I just stayed on that journey, I wouldn't be what I am today. And I think that's got to be more so in the future. But I would say you've wherever you're at in life, whether you're 20 years old or 60 or 70, 80, you've got to be continuously honing your skills and keep yourself relevant. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Hmm. Hugh Massie: Right. You so you've got to be open and curious t to learning and to doing different stuff to fit in the environment. But you can still reach that goal. It just you just may climb the mountain a different way than you thought you would. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah. nice. So what's one book, podcast or resource that shaped your thinking about AI or innovation? Hugh Massie: There's there's there's probably a number, you know, there's Peter Diamandis with, you know, ⁓ exponential that that's that that that's one I think it's you know if it's exponential thinking, if it's along those lines, you know, it's a b sort of building in an abundant world. I think that some of my views of ⁓ of his and mine might be different about what abundance is, but but I think that we we we can with technology create more for everybody. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Hugh Massie: ⁓ but that's opened my mind you know, I think there's varying books by Dan Sullivan about, you know, ten X is better than two X. And if you put it I think if you apply that kind of thinking to how can I ten X my goals rather than just two X optimization, which is more linear, once you figure out what you've got to do, then AI is the only thing that can help you bridge that gap. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah. Hugh Massie: So to me it's a number of pieces. I I still think that it's important, you're coming back to the human piece, to understand your identity. And I think if you if you don't understand your identity as a human, then then then you're going to get lost in all of this because your identity is very tied to achieving the goals and how you're going to make your business work. Whether you're an employee, hired gun CEO or the founder of something, ⁓ knowing your identity is really important. And there's a book that I I I did a podcast just on this same platform Riverside of of a professor in London London ⁓ business school on Monday. I I interviewed him in our behavioral economics podcast and he's written a book called Unique You. I I I think it's incumbent on everybody to understand your unique you, which is your unique individuality, which is really what we're about at DNA behaviour. But in then helping it be applied. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. yeah. So if you had to bet one AI trend that will be massive in three years, what is it? Hugh Massie: ⁓ That that yeah, that that I haven't ⁓ Maybe I have I have I haven't I haven't thought about it. I think that it it's I suppose where my brain is with all of that is still it's on data. ⁓ 'Cause data is the key is the key to me, data's the key to the whole thing. So that's a trend in a within the AI world that is going to have to be mastered and it's, you know, getting the right data, interpreting it, knowing how to use it, I think that's the ⁓ that's probably the that's probably the big thing. But you know, I could see how AI will change healthcare, being able to do operations, discover diseases and solutions to diseases that far more quickly than ⁓ than may have ever been possible, but we've been on that trend already. ⁓ can AI be used to help stop bushfires out there in the world or or ⁓ that type of thing? Probably. ⁓ you know, so but is it gonna s is AI gonna stop the tectonic plates causing tsunamis and earthquakes? No. You know, so so but yeah, so so I think it's gonna it's There isn't going to really be any industry untouched. We're we're all going to be better, but it's how we deal with the data will be the will be the key thing to how good we get with it. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: So in one sentence, what does 10x mean to you personally? Hugh Massie: Well, to me ten X means exponential. It it i i it's it's making a huge quantum leap. If you're gonna ten X something ten times, is way bigger and more and and well I'm not gonna say more difficult, more strategic than two X. Ten X actually maybe easier to pull off in the end than just two X. It's far more fun. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: you Hugh Massie: to try it out and even if you know if you go on the ten X path and you only get halfway there then would you've done better than than two X, haven't you? Julius Neil Buenconsejo: yeah it's still better too you know it's still better you know what you said 10x is better than 2x so if you go moonshot 10x then you you fell short at 6x is still better than 2x 2x yeah Hugh Massie: Correct. Yep. Yeah. Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Yeah, you're right. Thank you very much for that very insightful conversation with you. A different take on AI, a different take on organizational management and organizational behavior. I really enjoyed our conversation. I learned a lot from you and me myself ⁓ as a business owner. I think it helped a lot. ⁓ on my side of perspective when it comes how do we really you know manage our ourselves like what you said you need to be you who are you you need to be yourself for us to be able to be successful in this field so if some people wanted to connect with you how do they connect with you through website or yet again Hugh Massie: So you can find me in LinkedIn at Hugh Massey in Atlanta, DNA Behavior in LinkedIn. ⁓ So the spelling of my name's right there on the screen. You can go to our website at dnabehavior.com. And if you want to try out DNA behavior and just see learn something about yourself and start learning about others, go to gna.ai. ⁓ Julius Neil Buenconsejo: Okay. All right. For the listeners and viewers of our podcast right now, they have different types of suites depending on the usage that you wanted to do for your company. I assure you, whatever we have discussed here, all of those can be used in your company to be able to be successful, especially understanding the identity and the culture of your company. So for everyone, thanks for watching 10xAI. Remember the future doesn't belong to AI. It belongs to the people who use it. See you next episode. Alright. Dang. Hugh Massie: Thank you.