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77: The Unfiltered Truth About Overcoming Adversity w/ Mo Hassoun · Harder Than Life

• 0:00
  This episode is sponsored by National Technology Management. Visit TrustNTM.com for more information. I'm Kelly Siegel, and this is Harder Than Life, a podcast about self-love, self-awareness, business, and health. We tell outrageous stories and boil everything down to simple, practical advice you can start using today.
• 0:19
  Let's get living. Hello, Siegel supporters. Today's guest, Mo, is authentic and genuine, but there is some strong language. I didn't choose to bleep it because I wanted his authenticity and genuinity to reign supreme.
• 0:34
  Welcome back, my loves at Harder Than Life podcast. I'm introducing Moe Hassoun, born in war-torn Lebanon. Moe's journey from adversity to resilience is awe-inspiring. Raised by grandparents due to illness, he battled fear and rejection, turned to substance abuse for solace. But in the face of challenges, he's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who's a man who
• 0:56
  He found purpose in personal growth. Overcoming ego and pride, he now champions addiction recovery, offering hope and guidance to others. Mo's story is a testament to the transformative power of resilience and redemption, inspiring us all to rise above life's crises and trials. Thank you, Brad. Welcome, my brother. Thank you, Kelly. Thank you.
• 1:21
  Bro, this has been a long time coming. We sat down and had a cigar, and we're going to get deep. So, people, this is going to be a master class. And I'm going to tell you, Mo is brilliant in depth, but going to hit you right in the mouth.
• 1:41
  he's not going to tell you what you want to hear. He's going to tell you what you need to hear. So I love directness. I think once you heal, directness is where you gravitate. So we're going to jump right into it, my brother. If you could give back, if you could go back and give your younger self one piece of advice, what would it be? Do the same fucking things you did. It was all necessary. Every single piece of advice.
• 2:11
  And every single moment, Kelly, every certain deal and transaction that happened served its purpose. It all had to happen. It all had to happen. I don't believe preparation is key when someone has no awareness. When you have awareness, you inherit responsibility. But when you don't have awareness, you need to fuck up.
• 2:35
  That's where your awareness is built. It's in the fuck up itself. Those of you that aren't on YouTube and you're listening to this, if you can look over, go see how fricking stylish this guy is, how beautiful he is. At the end of the day, he tells you what you need to hear.
• 2:52
  But he's also just said with so much love and conviction. So keep in mind, follow him on Instagram, Mo the Counselor. And he runs an addiction recovery program that is for the stars. You obviously can't say who he represents, but this dude knows his stuff. You can look him up at PremierCounselingLLC.com. So PremierCounselingLLC.com.
• 3:18
  We're going to keep going because one question in, and it's already a microphone drop moment. People, I've said this before over and over, but Mo's going to freaking reiterate it in depth. What's the most unexpected hobby or interest you've picked up along your journey? Cigar smoking.
• 3:42
  Dude, you know, this is my only vice. And I got to tell you, everybody, it's the only people think that people, well, people make fun of me for alleged steroids, which I don't do, but nobody listens to the podcast. All they do is throw stones in the glass house because they're not aware. They don't want, they're not, they're the victims and don't take control of their life.
• 4:01
  That was a little no effect. That's where we met. We met through social media. We went and had we broke bread with a cigar. And dude, I was like I was sitting across from my brother. So you know what, I didn't actually ask this, but why don't you give your backstory a little bit deeper about how you got into this recovery process, because it's remarkable.
• 4:24
  I appreciate you, Kelly. So none of this stuff was planned with relation to what I do currently for work. And I actually don't want to call it work. I call it my purpose. If I don't do this, if I'm not giving back, I actually feel very unfulfilled. So let's go to the backstory in the beginning as well. So part of the prerequisites to this is there was a lot of instability. There was a lot of chaos.
• 4:48
  inside the house and outside the house. So there was a war zone going on when I was born. I had a medical condition and I couldn't leave with my parents. They were very hard working people. And they basically had to figure out a way to make ends meet. And I was left behind with my grandparents during the war. So in and out of the hospital, treating, treating this issue that I was born with. And obviously an abandonment happened, right? The separation, the initial separation happened from the parents that left a mark
• 5:18
  Not to mention the war, not knowing how to find safety, basically. There's no way you can control your insides when the outside is so overwhelming. So a lot of my egotistic traits and a lot of my defense mechanisms started very, very young.
• 5:37
  And I completely connect to a lot of my clients that are defensive, whether it's conscious, whether it's subconscious, as it's a coping mechanism. And so none of my guys get judged for it, but they definitely get compressed for it. They get questioned on how they operate and why they operate the way that they do. Because again, like I stated earlier, there's a state of unawareness that's happening. People don't intentionally wake up and say,
• 6:01
  Here's what I'm going to do to destroy my life today. Here's my plan for self-sabotage today. None of this stuff is intentionally planned, but it's definitely subconscious. And a lot of it is blind spots. So when I studied my story and I went back in time and I did my inventory and the list of moments or defining moments that created this person, the gatekeeper, we call him. The guy that has to protect the kid because there's definitely an inner child wound.
• 6:31
  There's a lot of neglect in his story. There's a lot of abandonment in his story. There's a lot of pain. And the experience of pleasure was very limited. So I developed a person over time, subconsciously, that had a high tolerance for pain and a very low tolerance for pleasure. So as soon as I had a good moment, I would sabotage it. It's unfamiliar. As soon as I had a good relationship, I would ruin the shit out of it. I didn't know how to sit in it.
• 6:59
  Because chaos was the familiar state. It wasn't pleasure. It wasn't serenity. It wasn't peace. It wasn't contentment. So I basically blocked my blessings because I didn't have the capacity and the awareness and the tools to welcome that experience. And that took time to arrive at understanding this as a person, not as a professional. That took time. So
• 7:22
  You know, you fast forward, I reconnect with the family, they take me back. I rejected my mom and my dad. I'm like, who the fuck are these people, right? Trying to play parents. And so I struggled a lot and we had a really rough dynamic. For 35 plus years, I never told my mom I loved her. October 10th of last year was the first time I told my mother that I loved her because I completely made peace with it. It was such an overwhelming transaction.
• 7:50
  You know, it was very, very, very difficult because there was the inner kid that wasn't ready to give that love and unlimited, you know, compassion and the unconditional positive regard because, you know, we hold on to some element of victimization. So I confused my mom's, you know, inability with unwillingness, if that makes any sense with relation to, you know, connection and deep and a deep foundation for us to basically work off. So as a result,
• 8:20
  I got involved in so many, so many experiences that I wanted to validate this inner void. And along the way, I basically started to secure relationships with women that were unavailable and hoping that I make them available.
• 8:38
  And as a result of this, you know, there's spikes in the dopamine that happen when you secure something that's not yours and you get into a relationship and you make someone that's unavailable become available for you. There's a beautiful high in it. And then the regression starts and the toxicity shows up. And I did this for years. And then the cycle, when the relationships would end...
• 8:58
  I would go and reach for a substance to numb and sabotage and basically punish myself for failing at aiming to secure this external, you know, validation from this unavailable person. So addiction in a way was a process for me that led to a substance. And every case is different.
• 9:19
  I don't believe everybody's an addict. Everybody is dependent. I believe people can go through stages, substance use, substance misuse, substance abuse, you have addiction and then you have dependence. And every case is different.
• 9:32
  And the initiation of every transaction is different. So I don't generalize. Usually people call me and ask me, hey, am I an addict? Am I an alcoholic? Like this is not just, it's not that simple. It's not about intensity and frequency of use. There's a lot of like subconscious elements that we need to explore. So I'm sharing my story and my background with relation to drugs, women, and basically violence because
• 9:58
  aggression was an outlet as well for me. So over time, when I didn't get my way, I would put my hands on people. I would basically rough people up. I would basically get really aggressive. And I acquired a few assault charges with deadly weapon. And they were dropped. Luckily, they didn't affect my career, but
• 10:22
  These are the things that I've done when I moved to the country. I came here. I was illegal. I walked I worked as a dishwasher and I wasn't allowed to basically say that I was earning any money when I was trying to go to school. It was a really difficult, difficult transaction because you hustled out. If you get hustled out of things, you get manipulated, you get fooled. And, you know, as a young man, you came to the US and you want to make a success out of yourself and it's not happening fast enough.
• 10:49
  You know, tolerance muscles weren't there. Patience wasn't there. Virtues weren't there. There was definitely values, but they got violated. So you're thinking about a person with a lot of trauma, abuse, neglect, right? A lot of needs that were not available, resources that were not available. So you have a threat to fucking society, literally. Literally.
• 11:12
  And if his needs are not being met, what do you think he's going to happen? What do you think he's going to do? What's going to happen? He's got two options. He's either going to sabotage himself or he's going to sabotage someone else. And that happened for years. So when you tell me if there's one thing you would tell your older self, man, I would tell you I'd leave it the same fucking way it was. The same exact way. Because I wouldn't trade this man for anything right now.
• 11:42
  I wouldn't. But all the things that happened in his life needed to take place. What was the breaking point then, Mo? When did you say enough is enough? And then what did you do to make the change? It came in multiple waves. It came in multiple waves. It didn't happen once. It happened several times. And every time I gained an inch of awareness.
• 12:05
  So I know a lot of people would say, oh, I had a one specific moment or I hit rock bottom. I call it bullshit because there's no such thing as a rock bottom. Rock bottom is complete fucking death. And everybody here has to know, whoever is listening and watching, you think you're cursed, but you're actually blessed. And you won't understand that angle unless you accumulate and integrate all versions of yourself.
• 12:32
  Every breakup I had, every loss I took enhanced my awareness. Every moment. I don't want to get picky and choose one and give full credit to that specific experience because let me tell you, every single moment sent the same message. I just wasn't ready to receive it. Every attempt...
• 12:53
  figuring out a way to validate this void, this defect base, this powerless man, every element that he secured reached a breaking point on its own and sent the same message over and over again. And at some point, you sit and you look back and say, damn, I'm the fucking common denominator in all those things.
• 13:16
  It wasn't so-and-so. It wasn't this moment. It wasn't this experience. It wasn't that story. It wasn't this, this, this. It was this. That's the moment of clarity. And everybody's journey is different. Some people don't even get to have that moment, brother. You were just describing my life. Everybody has gone through this. You think you're cursed, but you are actually blessed. I think that's the name of this podcast. That's great. You think you were cursed, but you're actually blessed.
• 13:45
  You said so many things here. Addiction is a symptom, not a disease. You keep using the word transaction. Did you notice that? Yes. Life is a journey and an experience. You keep using transaction. Why is that? Because there's a delivery and there's a receipt in the moments of life. So you're either receiving a message or you're delivering a message. In every experience we have, there's a transaction going on.
• 14:15
  I'm a person that observes things. I don't evaluate them. And that's what separates this current self from the old self. There's no emotional connection between me and moments anymore, unless it strikes the heart, unless it's heavily frequency and vibrational based. And that's what I aim for. I want authenticity. I want raw shit. I'm no longer interested in a politically correct statement
• 14:40
  or a specific way to accommodate someone's shortcomings. I really don't give two fucks how I'm perceived because the person that's perceiving you is actually projecting an element within self that hasn't been addressed yet. So in my world, my job is to be the trigger or the training variable. You pick. You know, I tell my guys all the time. You say I triggered you and I disagree with it, but we'll go with that term for a minute.
• 15:10
  Because a trigger simply signals you have a low tolerance for the thing that triggered you. The trigger is what needs to be worked on. It's not the trigger. It's what was triggered. That's to me, if I'm working out and one of my muscles isn't as strong as the others, that would be the trigger that says, hey, you need to work on this. If my bench press isn't as good as my low rows or my backs or my biceps, I know that's where I got to work. So the trigger...
• 15:37
  is the identifier of what needs work. I have to tell you, and I haven't talked to you in a minute, and I just had forgotten your brilliance. And I really appreciate your delivery with no emotion. It says here in the notes that there is a masterclass, a personal development course called the masterclass.
• 15:58
  individual holistic mindset, nutrition and fitness program. How do people, if people are resonating with what you're saying, and I hope you are because literally you are describing the harder than life book, what I went through. And I actually going to deviate for one second and remind people those signs that he was talking about, man, God is sending you signs. And you need to receive those. And if you're keep seeing things,
• 16:23
  Screw ups. Pay attention. That's the only thing you keep saying you wouldn't change a thing. I wish I would have paid attention and started doing the work on myself a little sooner. I don't want to change the man I am today. I love who I am. I'm at peace.
• 16:38
  And I don't think I can get any more happy, but I'm trying. I just wish I would have started a little sooner so I can help more people. Having said that, how do they get to this masterclass? I don't have any notes on that. So the only way to access that is going to be through Instagram. I've done work, Kelly, behind closed doors for over 10 years now.
• 16:58
  I started my professional experience in corrections. Okay. I did three years. I interviewed about 3000 guys because I wanted to understand their reasoning and justifications behind their actions. And what I found was very profound as well. And as a result, I started building something.
• 17:15
  I wanted to figure out a way to unlearn and help people uncondition their thinking style. How do you refine your thinking system? So there's a mindset piece which is going to basically be added on top of the nutrition and the personal development plan. So if I see someone that's out of shape, automatically I know their mindset is very compromised. There's no way you're going to have a strong mindset and you're going to have a body or you're going to be presented. You're presenting a very compromised form.
• 17:45
  So over time, over the years, I figured a way to basically connect all these dots together, a holistic system that allows any male or any female to basically say, I'm going to be the most refined physically. I'm going to be the most refined mentally. I'm going to basically be the most refined socially. And that would open the doors for me to be a spiritual entity, meaning.
• 18:07
  The program that I created, and I'll talk about how to have access to it. I'm very picky with the candidates that I take. I'm not a transactional guy. I'm a relational guy. So I don't want your fucking money. If you show up and you have an attitude with how you approached my ass, I'm automatically not going to work with you because you need to know the position you're in. I don't need you. You fucking need me. That's my attitude.
• 18:30
  And again, it's not egotistic. It's just from the beginning, you're dealing with an ego that's unregulated. You can't give somebody compassion that needs compression in the beginning. So there's a prerequisite. So a lot of guys in my business give a lot of love for a fee. They give a lot of unconditional positive regard for a fee. That is unethical.
• 18:55
  So the concept behind the program was, well, what happened that got your attention, Mo? How did you start your journey? Who the hell helped you? Because I had an egotistic problem and I wanted to do it myself. I wasn't willing to surrender my own resistance, my own pride, my own ego to receive anything, brother. I didn't want to do that. I was so ashamed. I was so guilty. I was so humiliated, not humbled. And I didn't want anybody to see that.
• 19:25
  so i created a program that actually triggers an individual's egotistic traits they have to basically surrender resistance they follow a specific program i weigh my guys they come to my office i got a machine i checked their body fat percentage i checked their bmis they're held accountable from the physical realm all the way to the mental realm so the program basically is very individualistic i don't do groups
• 19:52
  i feel like the ego hides better amongst other egos and you really need to take that person one on one um and i usually see about three or four people a day only it's heavily quality based every plan is individualized this is only for serious people so i consult with people in the beginning that are interested we talk see what their goals are see what they're aiming for and i do my own questioning
• 20:17
  as well. I consult with them because I'm interviewing them to see if they're good candidates for the program. And if they do pass, we sign the commitment contract and then we begin. And so this process is about six months to a year. And I tell people most of the time they come in and say, I want to be in a position you're in or I want to basically be like you're like never idealize a fucking person made out of flesh like you. That's the start. You have to become
• 20:45
  the man you needed the most at your worst, and then learn how to give that fucking guy back to the world.
• 20:52
  First of all, let me interrupt. I want to tell you, I idolize you. I think that because we're cut from the same cloth. I mean, if you see us together, we're both in tremendous physical and mental shape because we've done the work. We've been through hell and back again. So I'm going to say kudos to you and I'm going to congratulate you for doing the work. And I am intentionally leaving all the swear words. We're not bleeding, bleeping them out because I want you to see I want the audience to.
• 21:17
  To see who they're dealing with because he's the real deal, people. He's setting the standard and setting the boundaries. If you're going to work with this gentleman, A, there's no bullshit. B, you will get to your goal or he's going to freaking throw you out. So I really appreciate it. And you said something too. Surrender to receive. So many people think they need to do more to be more. No, no, no, no.
• 21:47
  Do less, do less, because what you're doing is that ego is trying to protect you. And it's what you've always known. It's gonna absolutely create the exact environment that you're so used to, the familiar misery. So do less, and he's gonna tell you, I like what you just said, you're gonna trigger them. And boom, then you know exactly where to help them. So I have a long list of questions, cause I adore you and what you're teaching
• 22:15
  I wish I had when I went through this shit. I did it alone. And it was a bitch, man. If I had to do it all over again and you told me that what I was going to go through, I probably wouldn't do it. Even though I know what the end result is this and you and me breaking bread, smoking cigars and loving life and living the dream. It still was a mother stretch. It's not easy, but it's worth it.
• 22:39
  I'm going to blaze through a bunch of questions because I want the people to know who you are. I'm introducing you to the world. We are a top 100 podcast on Apple Podcasts in the personal development space. We've reached 38. We're going to get to the number one spot, so this is going to get some great coverage. I want you to get out and follow Moe.TheCounselor.com.
• 23:01
  on Instagram so you can get access to this masterclass. Not for everybody. And he's going to weed you out real quick too, just so we don't have pretenders. What's the range of price? You don't think of the exact price, but what's the price of the program so we're not getting clowns reaching out to you that want to do it for 50 bucks? They can reach out. And if they reach out with a price question, I tell them to go fuck themselves.
• 23:24
  Because if you're going to question, brother, listen to this piece, because this is the same thing I asked when I tried to go through my mentorship and I was rejected. The idea here was this, and a lot of guys don't have awareness on this. When you negotiate a price or discuss a price on personal development with someone that has something you fucking need, that's a bad sign. That's a bad starting point.
• 23:50
  So as a person of authority that's trying to hold you accountable, you should not negotiate your worth with that person because that person's job is to give you the blueprint for you to establish this high-level piece of work. So that is a starting point on the transaction. It's not good to start that way. And the prices, if anybody is still interested, they're actually listed on the site. But I don't negotiate them. I don't discuss them. I tell the person,
• 24:19
  Here's the criteria that I have. The payment is simply a financial incentive. You can't be incentivized. And even a lot of research has proved this. When someone's financially invested, they actually are more likely to comply with a program than if it was free. So you basically have to pay to pay attention. Right.
• 24:40
  Because if it's free, they don't take it for granted. I always say to you, if I gave it to you for free and it didn't meet your needs, you paid too much, but people don't take it for, they take it for granted. I will tell you one more is I've spent well in the six figures on my personal development that you are the best investment you'll ever make. Because if I can clear this up, then I can create content and I can create a real estate
• 25:05
  love for other people to make more money all day twice on Sunday. Kelly, you're thinking about it this way. You're talking about a person that has personal experience and overcoming that. Then you have a person that actually went and did the real work. I'm a licensed professional counselor. I'm a master addiction counselor on a national level. And I'm certified as an advanced counselor.
• 25:29
  drug counselor as well in the state of Michigan. I've done the fucking work. I've spent over $200,000 on me. The last thing I want is someone that is in a desperate, compromised state coming in.
• 25:43
  inquiring about a fee. No, no, this is lifelong. This working with Mo is a transactional stage of your life because you're going to have to continue for the rest of your life. You see? Love it. I love it. If you were a superhero, what would your superpower be and why? Because I think you're amazing. My superhero is just being raw and direct and just activating discomfort in the person that's ready to receive.
• 26:09
  I believe that's primarily it. I wanted it so bad and I found it in someone. And I decided to bring that piece out of myself legitimately and give it right back. And that's why I operate the way that I do. I'm the same with my kids, man. I'm the same with my partner. I'm the same with my friends.
• 26:29
  They say we know that when we want to be validated not to call you, and when we know we need some insight on something, you're going to give it to us raw. Because there's no emotional, there's no manipulation, there's no aim, there's no end result. You know, there isn't a specific desire for me. I fulfill and validate myself. There's nothing that you're going to give me that I haven't given myself. So I'm the safest guy to talk to. I'm the safest guy to come clean with.
• 26:57
  It's selfless, but you have to get work. You have to do the work to get through your initial directness. And you may have picked this up about me, but when we were smoking cigars, I asked you the same question several times differently to make sure that you would answer it the same way. I was quizzing you because at first I'm like, is this guy for real? Yeah.
• 27:21
  He is. I can be 110% the real deal. He answered the question. I was quizzing him because there's only 52 spots to get on this podcast, and we are growing. So I don't give them out lightly. I brought him on because he has a message that's going to help people. That's the heart of life mantra. So we're going to keep rolling because I want people to understand there is more than you than this podcast.
• 27:49
  this badass that you show. So tell us about a hilarious or memorable moment from your experiences in addiction recovery. So addiction to me, again, is being hustled by a stripper. That was, yeah, I mean, you know, it's a funny story.
• 28:15
  I used to spend a lot of time when I would break up with one of my girls, I would literally go and in my head, I'm thinking I'm causing them pain and suffering by going to a titty bar, right, and getting attention from chicks. But in reality, it was the exact opposite. I was at a titty bar one time and there's this chick, we're just having a conversation and she's sitting there talking about all these like...
• 28:39
  what do you call these, like a political thing that was going on in her head. Imagine she's butt naked and she's sitting there talking about some political shit. Like, I'm so confused, right? Like, I got this issue that I'm dealing with. I did a few lines. And I'm sitting here listening to this bullshit, right? And from this naked chick on some political agenda, right? And as soon as she's done, she's like, do you want to dance? And I'm like, fuck it, let's go. And bro, it turned out that it was a dude.
• 29:11
  It was a fucking man. You know, the rage that I got in in like seconds. If you didn't think that he was a genuine, authentic, right there, dude. I freaking love you, man. That's great. That's great. We're going to keep going. I want to know more, but I'm going to keep going. He got a dude.
• 29:35
  Was that here in Michigan or were you in Florida? No, no. That was in Europe, man. Oh, I figured that was some Miami stuff. What's your guilty pleasure TV show or movie that you love to binge watch? Anything Sylvester Stallone.
• 29:53
  Yeah, that's a good one, man. He's got some great... The new one, the recent one, I'm not sure if they're going to do another episode of it. It's pretty profound because he's a dad that was absent. He's got a daughter that he's trying to make peace with. So there's an emotional element in that that attracted me to the series. Wait, what movie is that? I don't remember. I don't know what that one is. It's not a movie. It's a series. It's about two years old. It's on Prime. Prime.
• 30:20
  Is it that... He's an ex-mobster, does some time, comes out. Yeah, dude, I'm addicted to this. He's making his daughter's life. What is the name of that? Oklahoma boss or something? You know, Tucson, something Tucson. Tucson Kings or something like this. Oklahoma Kings. King, Tuscaloosa King. Yeah, I know. What's your favorite body part on yourself? Because you are shredded, bro. You know, I believe my shoulders.
• 30:51
  Really? It's not the size. It's just the refinement. I feel like the shoulder piece speaks volumes because it speaks a story as well. I believe that these shoulders for a man, the width of a shoulders and the size of the shoulders and the refinement of the shoulders says a lot. You know, I boxed throughout my life, not professionally, but I boxed throughout my life. And that was something I've always monitored. Yeah.
• 31:17
  There's a lot of pain that's expressed when you're hitting a bag. There's a lot of pain that's expressed when you're shadow boxing because it's a very individualistic, very personal sport. You're one on one with you. And I feel like I spent so much time doing that in my head with my pain in my with my stories that the shoulders speak a story because of the constant.
• 31:40
  You're not stopping. You're constantly throwing. You're constantly hitting back. You're constantly telling life, back off, back off, back off. You're jabbing all day long. And that's what's happening mentally. So physically speaking, I feel like it's a representation of the mental battle.
• 31:57
  What do they say? I got a lot of stress on my shoulders. I got a lot of weight on my shoulders right now, metaphorically speaking. So that's pretty funny when you say that. So I don't know if I told you this, but a little known fact is when I was deep into my
• 32:11
  let's call it dirt bagness of drinking and drugs and women, like, like what you're talking about. I justified it because I worked out every day. I was like, well, I'm still working and working out as long as I went to work and I worked out. I was like, I don't have a problem. Oh, Jesus. But I had that wrong. The rationalization and justification we have of our own bullshit. And if you're listening to this, you're doing the same thing. And it may not be drinking and drugs and women, but,
• 32:37
  It could be porn. It could be scrolling. It could be eating. It could be anything. So just insert not feeling feelings here. And that's an issue. So if you could have dinner with with any historical figure, who would it be and why? Historical figure.
• 32:58
  You know, I don't I don't have a specific person. I'll tell you this, Kelly, and I hope I don't sound fucking arrogant, but I feel like I'm the biggest deal out here. I feel like I'm the fucking man and I'd rather spend time with me. It's solitude, not isolation. I never want any other person on this planet.
• 33:16
  to feel like I am seeking any form of validation or I'm amplifying their presence. I really don't give two shits. And that's what I make my guys learn. You have to become your source of validation fully. And you have to fall in love with you, fall in love with your fucking self. Do that. And so for me, quite a question like this,
• 33:40
  I don't know. I feel like anyone in history that has accomplished something still has the element of human in them. And we're all fragile, weak fucking creatures, no matter what we display out here, no matter what kind of message I promote and the toughness that I display. I'm still a defective, fragile entity still in me. So there's the balance between the strength and the powerlessness in one person at the same time.
• 34:09
  No, man, I'd rather spend that fucking time with myself. Well, you've got to die laughing. I was just on the Dr. Rob Kelly's live podcast. He's an addiction doctor. And he asked me a question that was similar. He just said, if you could be a celebrity for one day, who would it be? I'm sorry.
• 34:26
  Look at this. I go, dude, there's nobody I want to be. I want to be me. So, hey, call it arrogant. Call it whatever you want. Call it. This is what I would tell people. And it may not be coming through, but this is what I pick up from you. You're peaceful.
• 34:42
  and your joy, and your content, but you're going to continue to drive forward. And that's me. So that's loving yourself right there. Love yourself. And when you do that, you're a dangerous level and your creativity and your giving back to the world is limitless. That's my word for the year too, is limitless.
• 35:05
  You know, let me share this with you since we're talking on the concept of self-love and it's very crucial. A lot of times people display self-love, but they don't actually vibrate on it. And so in order for you to find out if someone is displaying it or vibrating on it on a frequency scale, you see where they spend their time. If you're in a toxic relationship, okay, you don't fucking love yourself. If you are actively using a substance, you don't fucking love yourself.
• 35:32
  and it's going to be a difficult pill to swallow for some because you said the justification it's a legitimate thing that's one of the brain superpowers how do i minimize the impact of something i'm engaging in because it feeds my dopamine and pleasure chemicals how do i protect this thing that i find in a way to serve a purpose of soothing the little in me and that's all it is it's a reliance piece
• 35:56
  So in my view, there's a lot of self-talk and self-love out here. And there's a lot of people that display it. But very few actually vibrate on that wavelength. Very few. And how do you tell the difference? Look where they spend their time. And that would reveal everything you need to know about that person. Wow, that was good. So right on that same token, describe your perfect day off. What would you do from morning till night?
• 36:27
  when the cameras aren't on, when there's nobody watching? The work instills the worth is something I inherited from one of my mentors. My days, there is no such thing as a day off. Everything is premeditated, everything is calculated. So there's a balance between purpose and pleasure in my day. The way I live my life currently, a day off for me is actually a moment off. And that moment is a reward moment for the hard work or the adversity that I endured in that day.
• 36:56
  So currently I'm at a 90, 10, 90% purpose, 10% pleasure. So 90% of my day is doing things, attempting things, facing some form of adversity and discomfort, whether it's personal, whether it's professional, whether it's recovery oriented. And there's a 10%, 10% reward. And that would be my time off or moments off instead of a whole day off. You know, you, you can't,
• 37:21
  Rely on old victories, right? Like you'll notice a lot of times people would watch sports, for example, and say with their beer bellies and shitty fucking form, and they're sitting there saying, we won. I was at a cigar shop the other day watching a bunch of guys looking at a football team and their team won. And they're saying, we won. I mean, you're taking the glory of another grown ass man wearing that man's name, his name on your back.
• 37:51
  What about your fucking wins? What about your glories? What about your efforts to actually do something that allows the state of overcoming? This is the issue. People don't mind enjoying or abusing moments of enjoyment without earning the discomfort first. So for me, Kelly, I wouldn't take a whole day off. I'll take a moment or two off. And they have to be reward-based. And that's where cigar time, for example, that's an example of a reward.
• 38:19
  Just was going to say that, dude. I call it my victory cigar. And I think that's my moment when I think of what I did to move the ball forward to help people. And usually I post it. I put it in my store and I say, here's my Segal victory cigar. And this is what I freaking – this is how I move the thing forward. So it's the little things. And then I get – and then the people that don't allow themselves to –
• 38:43
  Cigar smoke is like steroids. Save it. Until you can win like I'm winning, I don't want to hear it anymore.
• 38:53
  What would you say to that? What would you say to somebody? Because I get it all over. You can go in my comments. You can see. Yeah. Cigar smoke is just as bad as alcohol. Yeah. What would you say to that? So when I receive comments, because I get them too, I'm big and I post my my cigar wins and I always say I'm sober and I'm winning and I get critiqued on that because cigar smoking is seen as a vice. It's seen as a chemical. It's seen as a stimulant. And I agree fully, fully agree.
• 39:20
  And am I going to justify and say, well, compared to this, I'm not going to play that game. It's all premeditated. It's all intentional. At some point, severing ties with cigar smoking is going to happen. Everything has a phase in life. I'm enjoying this fucking phase. And you may not have the capacity as a viewer to understand the concept of expiration dates on shit.
• 39:41
  But that's how life works. Everything has a moment. It has a peak. Peak and then it has a dip and then it fades and something new is introduced. So time will tell. For now, I'm going to maximize on it. It's the enjoyable piece. It's not something I rely on. If I don't have it, I don't have it. But I intentionally use it as a reward currently. I actually look at food.
• 40:02
  You know, dark chocolate, peanut butter, certain elements that have a specific taste and an enjoyment piece. I intentionally tell my brain, this is your reward for meeting this. The brain is neuroplastic. It loves to make connections. And if you're premeditating the connections, that's an element of winning. So if the aim is to avoid and distract.
• 40:24
  That's a problem. If the aim is to reward after enduring some form of completion of a difficult task, that's a reward. That's healthy. That's good. So for people that comment, actually, I don't engage. I go on their profile and I click on their name and I block their fucking ass because that energy. That energy requires my energy. And if I entertain it and engage, you can't reach people that are difficult to teach Kelly.
• 40:53
  And that's something I realized. The hardest ones to teach are the hardest ones to reach. So if I have to take time out of my day to explain to someone something, that's actually a disservice for me. So I eliminate that energy right away. I'm giving you worth. I'm sharing content. I'm putting my life on the line. And you want to focus on an element and judge it out. Check them out. Block. Gone.
• 41:20
  I love your boundaries, man. I flip it the other way and I just say, hey, maybe they're not available to receive now, but maybe another time. I don't block anybody. I let them watch. No, my block is bigger than my following. I'll show you. I know. You showed me that. I admire your boundaries, man. That's freaking good. So we're going to dig into that a little bit. What's the most inspiring success story you've encountered in your work with an addiction recovery?
• 41:48
  Success story is seeing a family come back together. You know, a compromised man is not only affecting himself, he's affecting his babies, he's affecting his spouse, he's affecting his business. You know, seeing a young man get it,
• 42:05
  and make a decision to come back and fulfill his purpose correctly, you know, provide, protect and serve and actually feel fulfilled by it. And I feel obligated by it because a lot of guys think they're obligated to do these things. You see, you don't have to do shit. You get to do shit. It's an attitude thing, you know. So I saw I saw this young man change his life around.
• 42:28
  I didn't do it. I participated in it. I played a part, you know. I called him a little bitch a few times. I asked him to close his legs because I can fucking smell his pussy. And so when that happened, he was like, you know what, motherfucker? Nobody's ever talked to me like that. I say, well, that's the only way I'm going to get your fucking attention, right?
• 42:45
  That's the only way, bro. You're dying slowly. You're killing yourself. Someone needs to tell you you're a little bitch right now. If your wife was here, if your daughters were here and they see you, how you operate, how would you respond? I touched on the soft spots to get them moving. And man, within two years, this man has got his own business. He does pipe fitting. So he got certified in it, started his own business. He's doing really well. Back in church, right? Goes every Sunday with his family. I mean, there's nothing more. And I see his posts.
• 43:15
  Because he's one of my guys on my page. So when I see them, automatically I vibrate with that. Like there's a kid that has her dad back right now. You see, there's a wife that has her man back right now. That's the biggest reward. That's the biggest, biggest checkpoint in this type of setting. See, people, he's not all...
• 43:37
  Rough and gruff. He actually does have a big heart. So I really appreciate that story more than you know. We're going to keep deep diving in what you are. It's fantastic because everybody needs to hear this. So Mo, for those struggling with addiction, what advice would you offer to take the first step towards recovery? Well, it depends on the addiction. It's a substance or a process. So process addictions could be a form of codependency, for example. You know, I'm helping a young lady right now. Um,
• 44:07
  She's in a very toxic relationship, domestic violence case, etc. That's an addiction, right? And she's struggling to take the first step. Well, what is the first step? First step is always seeking some form of support, some form of communication. You have to be willing to start saying and expressing that you have a problem. You can't treat what you don't locate, right? So the addict is actually in a state of denial.
• 44:34
  And they have caution with who they're going to be sharing the information with, because there's a lot of shame associated with addiction. There's a lot of guilt associated with addiction. You can't share with people that are going to have an opinion. So it can be an intimate person. That's where the fellowship circles come in. That's where these types of communities come in. The idea behind going, for example, to a narcotics anonymous meeting or an alcoholic synonymous meetings is you're going in with a desire to change. Desire to change, not a commitment.
• 45:03
  And so there's a big difference. You could still be actively using. Just go attend the meeting, sit around, listen to the stories. We're not saying you're going to get the answer, but you're going to start noticing that the first step in a setting like that and any successful program that treats any form of addiction, process or substance, it begins with surrender and it ends with service. If you really dissect any program offered out here, they all do the same thing. They just do it differently.
• 45:31
  The essence of their program is admit you're powerless, surrender some shit, and then become an asset to the fucking world. This is it. Be of service. And if these two pieces don't meet, forget about it.
• 45:47
  Most simplicity. Again, I would tell people that you're not addicted to the substance, you're addicted to the feeling and the outcome that comes and really the familiar, I'll say it again, the familiarity of whatever that is, probably misery. That's what you're addicted to, not the booze, not the sex.
• 46:03
  not the scrolling, not the food. It's the feeling after of, unfortunately it's feeling like shit. Literally what it is. The dopamine, there's two types of dopamine, Kelly. There's that instant rush that I get from the experience that is familiar. And there's a refined dopamine. People think in recovery, you don't actually have enjoyment.
• 46:25
  in reality our dopamine is so refined that it feels way better than your shit and if you just had the willingness to listen and follow the plan and and become a good disciple for a while follow the recommendation you'll actually see your dopamine hits are more refined in time you're actually abusing your dopamine levels taking those short fixes
• 46:49
  pursuing the short-term comfort piece. Chemically speaking, it's going to compromise you because when you build tolerance to the quick fix, you're not going to find enjoyment in the little things anymore. You're not going to be able to.
• 47:03
  So I'm going to let the cat out of the bag and understand that when you do the work on yourself, you can actually take that dopamine hit and make it long lasting. My dopamine runs all freaking day long now. So that's what's waiting for you. Instead of your little hit, I'm freaking so high right now being on this call with you. I just got up another one. I got to do another one after that.
• 47:28
  How better can I feel than to be freaking exchanging energies with your brilliance? And that's going to go on all freaking day instead of, oh, let me just take this food and let me have this sex. Let me take this line. No, no, no, no. I'm going to be freaking vibrating high all day, which...
• 47:46
  is because I addressed the big T trauma. So can you discuss the importance of addressing said underlying trauma in addiction recovery? And then how can individuals begin the healing journey? So with relation to trauma, it has a bad rap, especially with males. They're so afraid of even using the term many times. And they end up learning how to suppress it.
• 48:11
  When you suppress something consciously, over time, you repress it subconsciously. You no longer even have to do any suppression. It's just your brain does it for you because you've trained it to do that. Why am I saying this? Traumatized individuals are very difficult to reach because they found a safe space to hide something unsafe. Trauma is simply a loss of control.
• 48:34
  at some point in life and it could be chronic, it could be progressive, it could be acute, it could be a moment, it could be lifelong. We don't know. So it varies from case to case, but the theme is the same. There's an element of avoidance and escapism that was established because of the trauma. Okay. How you escape
• 48:53
  is the reaction to it so that's why i say addiction is a symptom of something else so addiction is actually a an escaping transaction an ex an escaping form it's an escaping mechanism that was established at some point through trauma so the original escape artist was created because of the trauma and then the mechanisms of escapism was addiction so when we want to go back we have to explain to the individual that we're working with your reliance on this
• 49:22
  is actually masking something else. And it may take time for that thing to come up. When you're sober, you start to notice. A lot of guys say, oh, I'm having using dreams, or I'm having really awkward dreams, or I'm having memories about so-and-so. What's happening is when the substance that was
• 49:40
  from a prefrontal cortex is removed and it's no longer blocking your ability to make decisions or suppress memories, everything that you're sleeping and your subconsciously experiencing starts to come up because it needs attention. And so when you even decide not to go back without your permission, that whatever it is that you suppress is going to be activated, it's going to come up. My recommendation to people is make a timeline of defining moments in your life.
• 50:08
  List your avoidance moments. This is how you could actually be more intentional about your journey. If anybody's serious, that's what you got to do. That's a starting point. Make a list of defining moments or what we call avoidance moments. And obviously, these are the moments that have an element of trauma associated with them. So the brain creates this concept. Remember this, fight or flight is usually the response to any form of threat.
• 50:36
  So when you're experiencing a trauma, your brain picks up a threat and automatically the perceived threat or real threat triggers run or fight. And most people run. And how do they run? Cognitively, they run. And so when they run cognitively, what do they do? And they're avoiding sitting with their avoiding experiencing something that took place. And so if you don't treat the trauma, you're always going to find an avenue to escape, whether it's through a person, whether it's through it's a substance,
• 51:06
  whether even success kelly even success i've seen highly successful people um reach supreme heights and then when we meet and when we meet and we discuss things they're sitting there talking to me about their childhood like brother you're like 70 some years old you're a you're a top of your game you're like a billionaire and you're sitting here talking to me about how your relationship with your dad was compromised
• 51:32
  What happened is this person compensated for something for so long and reached a specific point and still had to face what he avoided. At some point, you still have to face everything you escape.
• 51:45
  Well, they just keep pushing it down, pushing it down until it boils over. And who knows when that's going to happen. So that's why listing the avoidant moments is cathartic. I'm going to steal your thunder. I'm not a doctor. I'm not a counselor. I'm not any of this stuff, but I've done the work and I read a ton. I've interviewed a ton. So just listing it and then feeling is healing.
• 52:06
  You just list, what are you feeling? What's the moment? And then here's the funny thing about it. And people will realize there will be a commonality. So if you list the avoidant moments, you're going to see a commonality. And then there's going to be a feeling. And you just said it, your patient or whoever that was that had this, or maybe it was whatever it was. It was just, it all boils down to one traumatic feeling in your childhood or several, but it's the same feeling. And once you address that,
• 52:36
  The need to sabotage ends. It's like a freaking light switch. And what you just described is EMDR. And that's the actual part of reprogramming it is the EMDR therapy. So in your experience, what are some common misconceptions about addiction recovery and then dispel them? You've done it literally. What's the most common one in your opinion?
• 53:00
  It's inherited or it's biological. There's not even one fucking study that has shown this causes this, you know, but you're taught this in school because this is a business scheme. You know, you want to make sure you focus on prevention, relapse prevention. How the fuck can you prevent something that hasn't happened yet? I mean, let's be let's let's stick to the basics for a minute.
• 53:23
  You know, you send guys into rehabs, you teach them how to get clean, but you never spend time talking to them about why they got in this position in the first place.
• 53:31
  Number two, you tell them addiction is a disease. Sure. Addiction is compared to cancer. Sure. They see the difference between addiction as a disease and cancer as a disease is addiction can be placed in remission based on decisions that you make and surrender of an egotistic system. Cancer has nothing to do with an egotistic system. Addiction is a spiritual condition.
• 53:55
  So if you have an inflated sense of self, you're not going to fucking heal. No matter where you go, what rehab you attend, what kind of books you read, it's not going to get you anywhere. You are spiritually fucking poor. And when that happens, you spend your time talking about these. Oh, science study so-and-so revealed so-and-so.
• 54:18
  This is a spiritual transaction, guys. There is a physical element. There is a chemical element. But it's not the cause. That's why there's not even one study till this day that came out and says, gene so-and-so and human so-and-so is responsible for so-and-so. What do they say? The probability of you developing this condition increases if these conditions are met. And a lot of it is environmental as well. Not just because daddy had it or mommy had it.
• 54:48
  home environment, external setting, you know, resilience muscles, perseverance, personality traits. What about all that? So that's the misconception. No, sorry. Keep going. That's the misconception I see all the time because it becomes another avenue for the ego to deflect. So patient comes out of rehab 14, 15 days later, says, my wife,
• 55:16
  does not understand the condition and she's still struggling. Well, Mr. Victimizer, your absence created a victim now. There's a victim in your home. And you want to say the term disease and get away with it? You played a part. You have an obligation to create a living amends and honor her victimhood and let her go through her stages of her recovery and you go through yours instead of saying, hey, she doesn't know that this is a disease. I want to hire you so you could educate her on it.
• 55:46
  I mean, that's pretty hilarious. Very manipulative of you, sir. That's not going to fucking work. You just explained to me what it means by this stuff is taught, not caught. That's literally what it means. I didn't, I've never, I never understood that, but now I get it. It's taught. You didn't, it's not hereditary. You just, like, I became an alcoholic because my parents, that's what, that's what we did. It's what you learned. It's how you dealt with everything. That's all we saw.
• 56:15
  So naturally I became a frigginal. And it was the funniest thing. It's exactly what I despised in my, my parents. So we are up against it. And I want to get through a couple more questions. What gets you out of bed in the morning? Meeting the next level, meeting the next version of this guy. You think you're going to know this guy in a year? I'm leaving his ass behind.
• 56:37
  I'm working on the next self. Can't wait to meet that guy. 1% better every day, man. There is so, there's a tremendous amount of depth to you. I, this is immediate share and, and five star rating. This is good. This was very, very good. What's your biggest fear? I don't fucking fear shit. I know a lot of guys answer that way, but the biggest things that I was afraid of were loss based. And I'll share this with the audience because it was game changer for me and my relationship with fear. Um,
• 57:07
  We start this life with loss. The first lesson in life, they cut you. They cut mommy's womb. You come out and you fucking cry. First lesson in life, we all start the same. Last lesson in life, you leave your body. You have an expiration date. If I'm starting this thing with loss and I'm ending it with loss, why the fuck should I sit here and worry about another loss? So...
• 57:33
  That's not how I operate. It's all going to expire anyways. Why am I worried about the inevitable truth? That's silly. That was great, dude. Is there something I haven't asked you today that you feel compelled to share? Yes. Love. You never asked me about love, Kelly. Love for others. And I'll tell you this, brother. Becoming a parent, and I know you're a parent, and you adore your baby girl. I see your posts all the time.
• 58:02
  That is the ultimate reward, to be honest with you, for me. The biggest reward is to get to participate in their life. That element is the ultimate fucking high in my day. Having that opportunity is my high, brother.
• 58:19
  I'll share with you because we've talked about this, but I just want everybody to know that my biggest accomplishment, she is my wife, my daughter is my wife, but breaking the addiction chain and giving my daughter love and support and safety that I never have is amazing.
• 58:38
  that's what it's all about for me. So my daughter knows she's loved and she knows she's safe all the time. She knows I'm going to be there. There is no betrayal. There is no abandonment. This kid believes she can fly and probably will. That's my greatest accomplishment. Not any money that I donate, not any company that I build, not anything that I own. It's making her happy.
• 59:05
  Worthy, not worthy, understanding of emotional intelligence to be able to battle this world head on. She's equipped. She's ready to go. So, and I know yours are too. So if you could leave the listeners, or no, no, no, me with one piece of advice, what would it be? Advice? Yes. Pay attention to your inattention. Catch your blind spots because if you don't, someone else is going to fucking capitalize on them.
• 59:34
  What if you don't have any blind spots? That's the blind spot. And I'm asking you that because I do that. That's the blind spot. I know you're not surprised. I do that. I go, where am I exposed? Where am I exposed? I do it all the time. Where am I exposed? Go ahead, use me as a, you know me. Only you would know. Only you would know because there's depth to us. There's levels to us. And our aim is to integrate all of them. We have to bring in all the versions
• 1:00:04
  to meet the current one. Every motherfucker that had engaged in something has to report to the next self. And that's my angle on it. So when I report and I share, like on the social media platform, it's mainly blind spots of conversations I've had with a version of the self. I'm trying to encourage people to go within.
• 1:00:25
  I'm trying to get people to go and tap inside and see, pay attention to your inattention. I love that. Pay attention to your inattention. So, premiercounselingllc.com, www.premiercounselingllc.com, or mo.thecounselor on Instagram. Reach out to this channel.
• 1:00:45
  magnificent Mo is what I'll call you and work with him. If you have any questions, I personally know people that do work with him and praise him. And it was just no coincidence that we met on Instagram and that's, what's beauty about this word. Mo, I love you. There's some love. Thank you for coming on. And we're owed a cigar very, very soon. Message me. We'll make it happen. Hell yeah.
• 1:01:18
  Please rate and share this podcast. I'm active on all social platforms and love to hear from my Segal supporters. Each and every episode is sponsored by my company, National Technology Management, the easiest and best IT company to do business with, delivering peace of mind with technology every day, even simplifying cybersecurity. Visit TrustNTM.com for more info. Until next week, be harder than life.