Latest / CrossPolitic Show / On Christian Marketing w/ Chris Stadler (CrossPolitic One on One)
Transcript
- Hey y'all welcome to Cross Pond Tick 101 with the Water Boy. It's good to be with you. These are, this show is about guests that I like. People I like to interview and Toby Knox can't tell me what to do. So if you listen to Cross Pond Tick because you care about seeing Christ's Lordship over area of life, don't you? Including the Civil Room. But establishing righteousness and righteous laws and it just society requires resources. That's where Dominion wealth strategies comes in. They're not just here to help you survive in a broken system. They're here to help you reform it. Dominion wealth mission is to equip Christians with financial strategies that align with biblical principles so that Christian wealth can be built protected and used in the furthering of the kingdom of God. Budgeting saving debt, management, insurance, legacy planning and more Dominion wealth is about giving Christians the tools to take Dominion mandate seriously. The push to establish righteous laws doesn't just need voices. It requires money, resources, businesses and families committed to active multi generational faithfulness and empowering of individuals like you to give generously from a position of security and strength. Too many people are trying to pour from an empty cup, but Dominion will ensure yours run at the over. Ooh, little Psalm 23 there. Christ will reign and every knee will bow. Let's prepare for the future together and build one of the one that means, excuse me, and build one of the means to make it happen. Book your free consultation at reform.money. Man that URL alone is awesome. Reform.money today from baptism to burial. Dominions got you covered. So book your free consultation at reform.money today and make sure of course you tell them cross politics sent you. If giving is important to you, here's a workplace where your heart will fill at home story real estate. They aren't just about selling and buying homes. It's about abundant giving building legacy and doing things together. Fill a connection. Trust me, you're not alone. Find your place on the story real estate team. Go to story real estate, click menu and then join our team to apply. Go to story real estate.com story real estate.com. Click menu, join our team and apply. They would love to talk to you and hire you. All right. So my guest today is Chris Stadler. Chris Stadler, the goal of marketing is to win hearts and minds. The problem, nobody has a creative strategy process that gives reliable results. Kind of a shotgun approach, huh? Chris Stadler first noticed this problem 25 years ago as a copywriter. He studied the creative process with some of the best writing a thesis on creativity. Interesting. I'd like to read that. Tought the process for four years at the University of Oregon. So I lived in Eugene, Oregon for one year. My parents lived there for 10 years, but that's the hometown of University, Oregon. So Chris is there, actually taught school there. Then used it in his career as a brand manager, director of marketing and then CEO of a brand agency. Stadler's goals help design beautiful campaigns and beautiful teams for beautiful businesses. A lot of beauty there. Sounds like you almost sound like Trump. It's beautiful. It's just beautiful. Through teaching, consulting and executing. So Chris, welcome to cross-political 101. Thanks so much for having me, man. First I have to make a correction. I put CEO in there. I was the COO, which I actually think is cooler. So we're gonna make that correction. COO. Who was that company? Was that what? That was with resound. Resoundcreative.com. They're awesome. Yeah. Yeah. Thanks. But you're awesome. Tempe. Well, actually, they move their offices, but solid Christian, bunch of Christians, they're doing it right. Super. Yeah. Well, thanks for coming on the show. And you're actually located in Southern Idaho, which is actually a different state from Northern Idaho. We're actually two different states. Yeah. Yeah. People are always like, hey, did you go to Moscow? And I'm like, yeah, that's like seven and a half hours away. I'm looking for an excuse. There's no straight drive there because there's mountains between me and Chris. If there's a straight drive, it'd probably be what like a three hour where I would drive. Yeah. Yeah. Some like that. Yeah, but you gotta get to where Chris is at. I gotta go all the way down to Boise and then kind of around over here. You're like almost to Montana the other way and go up top. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I was just talking to I met a guest visiting our church last Sunday. And he was from Nebraska. Him and his family. They came out here for one of our graduations and everything. And he, him and his family on the way out here. They drove out here and they went to Yellowstone and it's so funny. You're closer than I am, but well, I'm about five hours from Yellowstone. I've never taken my family there. Yeah. I'm like four hours. Okay. Yeah. Have you ever taken your family there? My family has been there. Okay. But I have. Oh, you haven't your family has but you have it. Oh, I know. We got to we got to make up. Yeah. All right. Mother. So you're, you started your own creative agency. Let me just kind of start with, you know, what is your company do, who you are? And I'm just kind of introduce yourself and your company to our audience. Yeah. So some ideas that, you know, businesses and churches, as we apply this to the bigger dominion mandate should use a creative strategy process like this one, like the one I, the one I teach and the one that's the backbone of my business. Because it gives you an organized discipline way to change hearts and minds. You know, everybody thinks this is a black box. I don't know at a higher marketers, you know, marketers don't have a process a lot of times. They may be good at something and they're just, they're just not thinking about, you know, what do we sell and who's it for? Why doesn't matter to them? And they're not digging deep into that process to really find the good stuff. Yeah. And so your company is your website, just a Chris Dabler.com. Is that Chris Dabler.com? Yep. Yeah. And now you taught at University of Oregon. Did you graduate from University of Oregon? I'm such a duck, man. Yeah. So I did undergrad there. Went to University of Iowa for a year as an employee at the engineering school came back for grad school, taught for four years after grad school. But yeah, I wrote my thesis on the creative process because I saw the same, the same problem solving you do in engineering. It's exactly the same process as creative. It's just yeah, it's really interesting. Yeah. Did you, I'm just trying to figure out when I was, I moved there in 97. I was there for one year. My parents in the believe in I think in 2007. Did we overlap at all? See you were there in 97? Yeah. But my parents left in 2007. Did you overlap at that time? So I was in probably Roseburg in 97. Also like an hour south of you. Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. No way. Did you grow up in the area? No. So I was an army brat. So I was like Arizona, Panama, graduated high school in Panama and then little southern cow, little Georgia. And then back to Oregon for where I, where God had my wife waiting for me. Yeah. Yeah. Well, let's kind of talk about what's important or listen instead of me trying to figure out our history and overlap there. But so what is your, you did a thesis on the creative process. You taught at University of Oregon. What years were you teaching at University of Oregon on this process? 20 was it 2011 to 2015? I think something like that. Okay. And then the creative process you developed, let's walk through that. I assume there's you know, it's a step process. I'm assuming it's kind of a logical process that you developed in that we can kind of outline what that process is like. Yeah. Yeah. So, so maybe I'll start with the why again, you know, because the, um, I have this quote from Seth Godin, which I shared with the B.M.N. Call on the quarterly call. Yeah. That was awesome. So the, uh, the quote is the reason it seems that price is all your customers care about is that you haven't given them anything else to care about. Yeah. And so you end up with when you don't differentiate when people don't know why you're different, um, which is by the way, huge privilege, right, to be able to stand for something, to have a company that where you develop this culture that actually means something and serves people in a, in a particularly useful way. Man, that's amazing. That's a gift from God. And so, but we don't develop that and where we don't have faith in it, uh, we end up getting clients who are just, they don't, they don't care, man, they're, they're price, they're price shoppers. They're late to pay if they pay at all. Uh, they're, they treat you like a commodity. They're going to jump ship as soon as, you know, some better looking comes along and then they want all your time and energy. And so what we're looking for is a way, you know, big companies have that same, that same issue, the same problem, these small companies are facing. It's the same problem. And so, um, you know, it's different budgets, a bigger budget. Nike has a bigger budget, you know, than your company, probably, but if nobody knows why they should be paying more, um, they're, they're just going to go with the lowest. Uh, so what happens if you, if you really think about this and if you, if you decide you want to mean something, then your leads come through a lot cleaner because they know why they're, they know where they're calling you. Yeah. Um, the sales cycle shortened, which is cool because something you can measure. Um, but, and it also brings in cash quicker, um, and better relationships and you can charge more. Yeah. Because you start to notice your best, your best clients are not questioning their invoices. Right. And so you're saying start off with understanding your own product, your own services, what you do and as it relates to differentiation in the market. Yeah. Yeah. So, so if you want to talk about what's the process to get there is, um, is the first thing you do is you, you do a positioning analysis. Um, because what you're saying is how do we match up? Right? I mean, everybody should want to know that. How do I match up as a company? Once you understand that, you start, you start, just start coming up with some interesting things like here, like EOS, right? They're not entrepreneurial operating systems. They have their three unique, this is kind of like that, right? You're starting to, you're starting there. What's real about us? What's the truth? And then you say, okay, well, who cares? And that's the second step and that's your persona or ICP is they're calling it nowadays, so you're developing that person that I see me. Yeah. Um, ideal client persona, yeah, they call it now. So that's kind of the new way of saying it, but it's been around forever. Yeah. Right. And then the third thing you want to say is, well, why the heck do they care, man? What do they care about what we do? But if you can answer those questions, um, now you're poised. Now you have, what are we selling? Who's it for? And why the heck do they care? And now you can talk about that. And you don't have to guess at the message, you don't want to follow everyone else. Oh, we've been in business for 20 years or whatever. Nobody, unless that solves a problem, they don't care, right? And so you're figuring that out and most people skip that and they jump straight to, well, let's go on social media. And what do we say? I'm a plumber. I don't know. I'm reliable. I already serve as some price, you know, whatever. Nobody believes that because they hear it all the time. There you go. And so after you kind of understand like your differentiations, like what, what's next? What are you, what are you thinking from there? So that's where it gets really fun. Because if you know, you know, part of that audience persona that I see, P process develops your understanding of what's the problem? Like what are they really dealing with? I mean, it shows a real, um, it's that servant's heart coming out, right? Uh, you're saying, okay, here's who we are. Here's why we're different. But then who, man, who can we help? You develop that understanding of who they are sometimes through research, sometimes you just start with a working hypothesis based on what the team knows, you know, things right now. But you're just saying like, hey, their problems are these. These are the things that are keeping them up at night. These are the issues they're facing. And then and now you just mash that up with your with your three unique, so your strengths. And now you have something that a promise you can make that's going to be real and this really going to help. Yeah. Where have you, where have you seen this like, um, you know, it's so funny to me that I mean, I see the temptations like you develop product, you develop a, um, a strategy, you develop a consulting process, whatever. And and then, but you never, and you just go full speed ahead and you never really get that customer feedback loop. So it might work for a little bit, the product, the consulting, whatever, it might work for a little bit. But then it's always going to crash and burn because you don't, you really aren't doing this. You really aren't trying to figure out what the, what the market needs or what they want. Yeah. Where have you seen some disasters like this unfold? Yeah, I mean, what so, so first of all, let me tell you why I got really inspired, uh, or the latest inspiration was the business makers network conference down in Dallas. And so I remember that guy, Brett Craig. Yeah, he was fantastic. He was all right. Yeah. Yeah. His talk will be in our Fight Life East Club portal, hopefully by the end of today or by the end of next week. Next week, sometime next week. So it'll be in there for club members to see and in, in our business makers network portal too. Man, I hope you link that from from this. It's possible. So, so what happened there was, you know, Brett showed a bunch of stuff he did for Taco Bell, XXXY athletics, Red Balloon. Yeah. And a couple other ones, right? There are a couple other ones. Call it a doctor pepper fanville. He's the guy who created Dr. Pepper Fanville. And I believe Dr. Pepper, maybe this last year, I think, um, topped Coke this last year. I think, don't call me on that. But I mean, I he developed the fanville, which is huge for Dr. Pepper. Yeah. Well, what happened was it was cool because we saw all those things. And now I'm like, I don't, I don't have to like convince people to differentiate. They just saw it at the conference. And I'm talking to all these guys and I'm like, Hey, you want to read some books? Like, I taught this at the University of Oregon. Our students went off to work for, I'd be shocked if Brett doesn't know some of my former students, you know, somewhere along the line. Because they all went to work for these agencies. And so I'm just like, Hey, you know, this, this process is the same for that, you know, uh, for those, those pieces as they are for a small business, right? We're just forgetting to go through the whole process and organize. And what happens is that business owners, a lot of times they don't know, they don't know that this process can be logical. And so they don't know there's a process at the middle of it that is this meeting point between them and their marketer or their agency. And so they, they're like, well, you're the marketer. I'll just take your word for it, I guess, right? And then results don't come in. And now there's fast enough. And now there's not even a way to say, okay, well, why did you make this decision? Because then the marketer gets all defensive because they just don't have a process. It's unfair to them. It's unfair to the company. And so this gives you a place for all those things. So now if the CFO, the CFO should be able to understand the marketing strategy and be able to ask questions about it. The arch enemy of the marketer. Right? So and so, yeah. Right. Right. And so, but if they can see the logic and if they can say, well, why did you choose this audience? And then that marketer can say, hey, great question. You know, let's look at how we arrived at that. And I can show you my work. Because there's a place for that. There's a place for all this work. Right? So now there's a lot more faith in that organization. And here's what else it does. Normally companies focus on, they don't know what's focused on. So they're like, well, you know, let's just look at the number. Is how many visits our website had? But but what's more important, whether they like you and trust you and whether you're winning hearts and minds or whether you're getting those those visits to the website, sometimes a lot of visits doesn't help you because you're focused on a particular audience. So, and so if you're focused on that, you're never going to you're never going to really understand, like, yeah, but what do we stand for? And what do we really want to be? What makes me proud of our company? Yeah. So this process gives you that justification to think about what is it who's it for? Why does it matter? Where are we going to put it? What message is going to help them to think and feel the way they need to think and feel in order to engage with us? And how do you measure it? And that's the whole process right there. I think your original question is what happens when this doesn't. Yeah. Yeah. Go south. Well, I mean, you end up how it goes south is that you end up looking just like everyone else and you spend a whole bunch of money on media. And as soon as you stop spending money on media, your your marketing results go back down to zero because you're not building meaning, you're not building brand. But when you when you do this process, you're you're winning hearts and minds. And so you're spending money, you're getting visibility, you stop spending money, but it doesn't go down to zero anymore because you're building, you know. And so you start spending money again and it goes, it's a little more like a like this rather than just like all the way down to the bottom. Yeah. I should I should make a curve like that. Just show you know, what's going to say to you? So walk walk us through this process. You have a name for the process. You know what? And I bet I'm sure you have some graphs that we could maybe um, we could link to for our show notes afterwards. Yeah. I'll send you some pictures. I'm prone to drop pictures for people. So yeah. But it really comes down to planning execution and measurement. And so the the taking it from the top, you know, once again, how do we match it? Right? How do we match it? That's that's what are we selling? How do we match it? This is on the planning side. On the planning side. Yeah. And so, um, you know, and that's your positioning, you know, fear positioning. And I do want to talk about the process briefly or do you want me to just go through that? Okay. So the process for that position and now and I'm teaching a class right now on online. Um, if anybody wants to sign up for it, but we're already into it. Where do they go? Where do they go? Sign up for that class? Uh, so I sent you a link and then I sent a coupon code as well. Uh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, so we're into the class, but it's cool because this, um, you know, a bunch of, a bunch of people get together and we get to do a live, right? The desk questions, off-sourced and everything. So it's a lot of fun. Great group. Um, so positioning, positioning, analysis, what you're doing is you take your top five to seven competitors and you look at their website and like two, two social media platforms and you look at their messaging and you say, okay, how are they convincing? Are they very convincing about their claims? What's their strategy? Who does it look like they're, they're going, going after? And then what's the quality of their work? And so I did one positioning analysis, uh, for a, um, it's a BPO. It's like a big call center outsourcing. So like they had Nike, but when Nike overrun, you know, their call center gets too many calls, then they outsource to this BPO. Okay. And so, but they also wanted to be in Pharma and, and healthcare. And so I did a, um, I went through and I looked at a bunch of their competitors and I was like, hey, you know, Pharma, there are these two competitors who are super sophisticated in Pharma. And I would not spend the money to go up against them right now. It's just, you know, unless you want to spend a whole bunch of money to catch up and then start, you know, competing, they're so sophisticated, they're, they're showing their thought leadership. Um, just don't, right? Um, and so that, that was a really good example of, of how, how do you, how do you match up? And I said, here's where you do match up, right? And I, and I pointed out some things, uh, predictive analytics is one of the ways they really match up well. And their feedback from their clients, like Nike and these other, um, back that up as well. And so now what I'm saying is, how do you, it's like the art of war, how do you concentrate your resources and where do you put them? Right? So that's the first step you go through those, those competitors. And then you come out with recommendations from each one, you summarize, you end up with your top three, you're three unique and then a little executive summary at the top. And now you have your, your report, you can show your work. Right. Right. That's the positioning analysis. Now step two, step two target audience recommendations. So what you want to do is internally, you want to talk with your internal team and create that working hypothesis and say, okay, here's who we think our audience is. Now you can do a bunch of research, but I'm going to pretend like we don't have that budget right now. Yeah. So you create that internal hypothesis, uh, working hypothesis. And then you, um, so demographics, psychographics, um, you want to know their problems. And then you want to write a profile like a meat Maria, which is like, uh, you know, Joe is a, um, IT professional and he's running into these probably, he, here's his life, right? So the copyrighter knows who they're talking to. That does two things. Um, demographics is the language of media buying, right? So when you do your media planning, you want those demographics, uh, your copy artist and creatives are going to want to know that profile. They're going to want to know who that person is. Oh, yeah, that's like my uncle's so and so, right? Right. And so now they can, they're writing to their uncle and that's going to be some fresh, good writing. So that's why you want that. The next thing you do with that is you go through and you say, okay, what assumptions are we not so sure about? Like we'll go with it for now, but what are we not so sure about? And then you take those top three and then you say, okay, we're either going to test that with media, like we're just going to go ahead and make the campaign and put it out there and then we're going to see who responds, like what age group demographic will make split tested between two age groups, for instance, right? So you can do it that way or and or you can go out and start talking to people and just say, survey, uh, qualitative, where you, you know, lines some people up, you talk to them, you read a little report on it. Yeah, you know, the thing I like about this is, you know, you want to keep, um, how you, how you make decisions kind of as objective as possible. Nothing wrong. There's good gut decisions. There's good instincts. You don't want to discount any that, you know, we have, um, so for cross-politik, we went through this exercise a number of years ago with a friend, um, and we call our, our guy Sam. Who's our, who's our Sam? Um, and basically, we kind of define Sam. This is our, our, the, the bell curve of our audience, you know, Sam is kind of the, the bulk of the Belkler of our audience. He's 25 to 45 years old, you know, married, just kind of waking up to the condition of America, um, you know, waking up to how important it is to be a father and to be a husband and to raise his kids and all the way to the Lord, you know, so that, that was Sam. Uh, and we still, we still refer to Sam on our set to this day, but what it does is kind of a, it makes things objective of who you're serving, um, versus just based off gut and filling, which I don't want to discount because the instincts in the business world are very important, but, um, making these objectives really good. Well, that, you know, the, the, the cool thing about the instincts is you do your work, you know, you do it methodologically like this. Everybody gets to understand it. And then, uh, if we're going to jump down steps to the measurement, let's say you're running the campaign, the measurement comes in and you're like, hey, it's not performing how we want or, um, what opportunities do we have, right? Um, and so, uh, and so a good marketer with experience is going to say, okay, a lot of times when this happens in this kind of industry, it's because of this. Let's tune this up or let's get together and brainstorm a little bit how we're going to solve this problem. Cause I think it's right here. And so that's where the instinct comes in, but the instinct is not like, it's not like Bud Light where you show up and you're like, uh, yeah, I don't know, I don't be insulting about this lady, but, you know, she shows up and it sounds like she hates her customers, right? So she comes in with all kinds of baggage. And then, uh, Bud Light ends up losing a lot of money because she didn't go through this process, work with the leadership of the company and say, hey, is this sane? Or is it, am I just like fresh out of college and like, you know, thinking crazy, you're referring to the Mulvaney, uh, campaign. I assume with Bud Light. Maybe Jaguar. I don't know. Yeah. They're all, they're all the same. Yeah. All right. So kind of, um, uh, what's the, it sounds like there's a three step process. What's the last step here? Okay. So the last step is, um, well, then why do they care? And what that really is is a, it's a one to two page creative brief. And the creative brief just solidifies everything. And it becomes usable by the creatives, the media planners. And what it does says, um, what is it we're selling? Who's it for? Why doesn't matter? And then there's a single most important idea that's at the top. There might even be a why should they believe it? Like, if it's a special kind of thing where it's like we're making some kind of offer that they haven't heard before. And they're like, yeah, I'm not sure about that. If we anticipate that, we'll also have that why should they believe it there? Yeah. Um, the cool thing about that though, the really important thing is that, um, 20 pages, there's a lot of ambiguity that can hide in a, in a detailed, you know, well research, creative brief. But what it does is it forces you to be brief and direct. And a copyrighter coming in, you know, coming into it, they're not going to want to read 20 pages. And I can remember it. Nobody is. It's a cop out. So if you can get that down, you're looking for one to two pages of creative brief. And so that you can see contradictions, you can see things that are unclear. And other copyrighter or the creatives can now ask that strategist or that marketing person, hey, I don't quite understand this or I'm not quite buying this. Is this really true? And then that, that strategist, you know, comes, you know, goes back to the drawing boards just a little bit, makes some fixes, brings it back to the creatives and says, hey, is this, is this makes sense? The client can, the client can review it. The company leadership can review it. Everybody can review it. It's in English. It's not fancy. Right? Yeah. Again, like keeping everything as objective as possible also allows you to bring, um, your sales team and get behind the marketing and direction you're going, your, your sweet, sweet team, get behind the direction that you're trying to go, you know, I've done various consulting with a broad, um, um, a broad base of companies over the last 10 years. Yeah. And um, I can't remember if I've told you this before, but like, I almost always walk out of those companies, you know, because I have to look at the leadership structure. I have to look, because you know, whether I'm doing whatever kind of consulting I'm doing, I'm always, I need to understand the whole company and dynamics and what's going on. So always look at the leadership structure, look at the staff, look at the team, look at who's doing what. And I almost always walk out of those companies thinking, um, you need to fire your HR department and you need to fire your marketing department. Almost, it's almost a universal, um, problem. Uh, you, the HR department, usually you got to fire them because they're hiring dumb people or, that's how woke policies get into a company or that's how it kind of loses its Christianity through HR. Um, but the, the marketing department, usually, um, I walk out and say you need to fire the marketing department is because they don't take risk. They don't, um, no one understands the vision of why they're doing what they're doing yet. Um, and, uh, and it's, if anything, any department in your company that should be taking risk, it should be the marketing department. That's the whole, the whole goal is to define a market. The whole goal is to, um, uh, sift through. That's not our market. This is our market. That's not our market. This is our, so all your messaging is actually, um, the kind of messaging that's going to get to the target market of your audience, you know, like Dr. Pepper Fanville, you know, or, um, uh, you know, uh, uh, uh, uh, Brett Craig walked us through, um, uh, Taco Bell. Yep. Um, and trying to get into the breakfast market and compete against McDonald's. And they went right at McDonald's. It was very risky what they did. Um, they went right at McDonald's and said, basically, they're creating a better breakfast. It's not a communist style socialistic breakfast. Right. It was their funny messaging with, with McDonald's. Great concept. Yeah. Really good concept. So all that to say is like, um, being able to, um, objectively lay out, how you're thinking about your brain, your products, your services from the marketing department, is, um, super healthy for the rest of the company to be able to get behind and understand what's going on. Yeah. Especially for the CFO. Yeah. And, you know, you talk about risk and it's like, it's way less risky when you've done the, it done your homework. You know, when you've lined up these things that everybody else, you know, they're like, whoa, how did you come up with this? And it's like, well, we have a, we have a whole process. And so when the creatives actually got the brief, now they know who they're talking to and they know the exact message. Now they can have some fun with it. Right. And that gets us into the creative process, but we don't have time for that. Yeah. Yeah. No, no. So who have you kind of, uh, names of companies that you've worked with over the years? Um, I mean, one that you worked for. Um, who have you worked with over the years? Yeah. Um, so, uh, uh, as a contractor on my own, Disney parks, um, that was fun. We did some stuff for, um, I did some research on, uh, on Hispanic, you know, connecting with Hispanic, uh, getting, you know, getting more families, the very family oriented, so getting them, making that appeal into them. Um, GE, um, we, we did, uh, uh, so we're with GE on some innovation projects. Uh, it's called GE Fuse. And that was with local motors. Um, and then, uh, Cannondale, I wrote a, I wrote a brief for Cannondale, which was super interesting. I'm almost using it as a case study of what not to do. But, um, yeah, I have a whole little case study on that. And then, um, yeah, I think those are some of the bigger ones. Uh, I've worked, um, I worked on a few things, doing different things like research, um, for, uh, Quora, the online, um, you know, online, yeah, Quora. And so, um, yeah, I think those are most of the big ones. Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. Very good. Uh, your website is Chris Stadler, STAD, LER, Chris Stadler, com, Chris Stadler, com. And you're also part of Businessmakers Network. Uh, yeah. I'm thinking being part of that. Um, and if you guys haven't joined, you should join. Um, and then, um, uh, you live down in Southern Idaho, uh, wife and kids. I can't remember what you got going on. Yeah. Um, my beautiful wife, Shana, we have, uh, two kids adopted awesome kids and, uh, a couple of dogs. Nice. Well, yeah. Thank you, Chris, for joining Cross-Politik Man. If you guys want to reach out, how can people reach out to you? Uh, go to the website. Um, uh, yeah, you can go to the website. You can email me at seestadler at christadler.com. All right. Chris Stadler, com. Thank you for joining us. You guys make sure you guys come and go to fightlaphease.com to send it for a conference that's happening. This October 1st through the 3rd and Franklin, Tennessee, we're very excited about it. It's developing. We got, um, I mean, we're almost halfway sold out. So make sure you guys sign up now. You got, we got months, months left to sign up. Plenty of time. Don't freak out, but early bird pricing ends to life first. So make sure you go to fightlaphease.com to sign up. Uh, we'll have a pre-business maker summit out there. We'll have a leadership church leadership luncheon, business luncheon, other stuff coming around. So make sure you guys pay attention to fightlaphease.com until next week. Love God, Dr. Hartzel, minus strength, love your neighbor to self, go fightlaphease. This is 101 with the water boy.