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Ben And Ashley's Thoughts on Taylor Frankie Paul's Ex-Fiancé · The Ben and Ashley I Almost Famous Podcast

0:00
Speaker 1: This is the Ben and Ashley I Almost Famous Podcast
0:03
Speaker 1: with iHeartRadio.
0:06
Speaker 2: Hey, guys. Welcome to the Almost Famous Podcast. It's Ben
0:09
Speaker 2: and Ashley. And this week, we are dedicating this episode
0:15
Speaker 2: to another podcast episode. And that was Doug Mason on
0:19
Speaker 2: Bachelor Happy Hour with Charity and Rachel. It was a two-part,
0:24
Speaker 2: like an hour and a half interview. And it was good. Ben,
0:30
Speaker 2: did you feel as captivated as I did?
0:33
Speaker 3: Oh my, yes. 100% I felt as captivated as you did.
0:38
Speaker 3: I have, I think, I have a lot of confusing feelings.
0:42
Speaker 3: I don't know how I feel about it, but I
0:44
Speaker 3: was captivated, Ashley. I also thought, just before we dive in,
0:49
Speaker 3: I thought Rachel and Charity, not that they wouldn't, they're
0:52
Speaker 3: great at this, and Rachel's filled in so many times
0:54
Speaker 3: for us here, they did a really good job Yeah.
0:59
Speaker 3: With this. Maybe a little too easy at times, I thought.
1:04
Speaker 3: I think we would have been the same way, though.
1:05
Speaker 3: I'm not saying, like, we would have done it differently
1:07
Speaker 3: or better. They just, like, you could tell they really...
1:10
Speaker 3: They probably know more than we do, but it felt
1:12
Speaker 3: like they really kind of, like, felt for Doug. And
1:16
Speaker 3: I don't think that's unfair.
1:17
Speaker 2: There were times where I thought, did they get to
1:20
Speaker 2: watch some episodes that we didn't?
1:23
Speaker 3: Yeah. And, like, what have they heard from the producers, right?
1:26
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:26
Speaker 3: That we haven't? Because... It felt like they were very
1:29
Speaker 3: much on Doug's side and very empathetic to his story
1:34
Speaker 3: and experience, which is great. But I'm not sold. I
1:40
Speaker 3: am sold that Taylor, Frankie, Paul messed him over. I'm
1:43
Speaker 3: just not sold that he was above reproach in all
1:48
Speaker 3: of this.
1:50
Speaker 2: Above what approach?
1:52
Speaker 3: Reproach. What's that mean? Like he wasn't at all like that.
1:56
Speaker 3: There wasn't more dialogue going on between them that he
2:01
Speaker 3: wasn't at fault. And some of like the reasons why
2:04
Speaker 3: she immediately was like, I'm out of here. It would
2:07
Speaker 3: be wild to me. I guess I say this. I'm
2:09
Speaker 3: not not on Doug's side. I think he got a
2:12
Speaker 3: really bad end of the deal. I just think I
2:15
Speaker 3: listen to this. And if it's true or not, I
2:18
Speaker 3: think they prepped him to have this interview, like some
2:21
Speaker 3: PR training so that maybe he could be the next bachelor.
2:24
Speaker 3: Like we would all be like, oh, I feel for
2:26
Speaker 3: this guy. What a screw job. And it ultimately, my
2:31
Speaker 3: concluding thought here before we dive into the details was
2:33
Speaker 3: Taylor Frankie Paul season's never going to air and she
2:36
Speaker 3: better hope it doesn't because the show no longer is
2:42
Speaker 3: lifting her up. Like they're letting hit this thing crash
2:45
Speaker 3: and burn. Right.
2:47
Speaker 2: Do you think that the season was edited to reflect that?
2:50
Speaker 2: Or do you think the season protected her?
2:53
Speaker 3: I think the season initially protected her.
2:55
Speaker 2: Yeah. Okay.
2:56
Speaker 3: This is actually fair. I think it's fair for us
2:57
Speaker 3: to start with our general thoughts before we dive into
2:59
Speaker 3: the details of the conversation. Again, I feel for Doug.
3:03
Speaker 3: This was a brutal experience for him. I don't think
3:06
Speaker 3: Taylor Frankie Paul ever had the like desire to get
3:09
Speaker 3: married from the show. I don't know. I think we
3:12
Speaker 3: can pretty much prove that by actions now. So I
3:16
Speaker 3: do feel for him. we'll dive into the details of
3:19
Speaker 3: what was said. However, my thought generally was, cause I
3:23
Speaker 3: don't know enough to pick a side here. Um, was
3:27
Speaker 3: I'm glad. I mean, if I'm the bachelor as a franchise,
3:32
Speaker 3: I'm really like kind of thankful that the show never
3:36
Speaker 3: aired because can you imagine maybe their highest rated show ever?
3:40
Speaker 3: Everybody's tuning in to watch Taylor, Frankie, Paul date men.
3:44
Speaker 3: and then this is how it ends, talk about losing
3:47
Speaker 3: more legitimacy on if this show could work or not,
3:50
Speaker 3: or if fans could get behind the idea that somebody's
3:52
Speaker 3: coming on here to find love or not. It's really
3:55
Speaker 3: good that The Bachelor, or that it never aired, because
3:58
Speaker 3: I think everybody would have been like, well, here's another example,
4:01
Speaker 3: or the biggest example, the most talked about example, of
4:04
Speaker 3: how this show is never there for the right reasons,
4:06
Speaker 3: and nobody's ever going to find love from it. And
4:09
Speaker 3: I think it ultimately... would have destroyed the show. I
4:12
Speaker 3: don't think they would have ever recovered from their highest
4:14
Speaker 3: watch season failing so quickly when it comes to the
4:18
Speaker 3: final relationship. I think it would have been a big
4:21
Speaker 3: hit on the show.
4:22
Speaker 2: Well, that's a really interesting take. I could see it
4:25
Speaker 2: definitely making the show more of a joke. I was
4:29
Speaker 2: even at Disney World this week and in the Frozen show,
4:32
Speaker 2: they make a joke about the bachelor couples never staying together.
4:35
Speaker 3: No way. Yeah. And I go, whoa.
4:39
Speaker 2: I was like making like a big like, but what
4:42
Speaker 2: about me?
4:43
Speaker 3: Yeah. We got one. We got one right here.
4:46
Speaker 2: But yeah, I mean, like, I totally understand that, Ben.
4:49
Speaker 2: But I think that what the show needed now more
4:52
Speaker 2: than ever was views and eyeballs. So I don't think
4:55
Speaker 2: it would make ruin it. But I totally understand what
4:58
Speaker 2: you're saying where it can make mockery of it more.
5:00
Speaker 3: But hold up. Hold up. Let me let me defend
5:04
Speaker 3: my point a little bit. You just said it. It
5:06
Speaker 3: might have got more eyeballs for this season. But if
5:10
Speaker 3: it makes a mockery of the show in general, then
5:13
Speaker 3: those eyeballs aren't returning for following seasons. That's what they
5:18
Speaker 3: need more. They don't need, like, one-hit wonders. They need
5:20
Speaker 3: a sustainable growth in the show.
5:22
Speaker 2: Like Joey. Joey was a one-hit wonder.
5:25
Speaker 3: Yeah, and a viewing experience. So people go, wow, we
5:29
Speaker 3: saw this person who maybe we never thought would find
5:32
Speaker 3: love or not know how to do it find love and, like,
5:35
Speaker 3: meet this guy. And even if it doesn't work out
5:37
Speaker 3: at the end, because... The Lord knows it doesn't always
5:40
Speaker 3: work out at the end. At least we could watch
5:45
Speaker 3: it and say, okay, they broke up and it hurts
5:47
Speaker 3: that they broke up because they cared. From this interview,
5:50
Speaker 3: it sounds like Taylor Frankie Paul, at least from this interview,
5:55
Speaker 3: never really cared. And I think that would turn viewers
5:57
Speaker 3: away immediately. They would lose everybody they just gained.
6:00
Speaker 2: Okay. So actually, I feel that this is maybe an
6:05
Speaker 2: isolated Taylor thing. So I think that Taylor is the
6:09
Speaker 2: one that would be like, ooh, she didn't take it seriously.
6:12
Speaker 2: She really, like, messed up here. I think listening to
6:15
Speaker 2: this interview, I feel like Doug was there for the
6:18
Speaker 2: right reasons. Like, call me Ashley Bamboozled, but, like, and
6:22
Speaker 2: I like to— I fall for it all. But listen, guys,
6:28
Speaker 2: I guess it doesn't take much to win me over.
6:30
Speaker 2: I thought he was going to be a surfer dude,
6:32
Speaker 2: got a douchey vibe. And I thought that he had—
6:36
Speaker 2: I thought that there was some substance there, and I
6:38
Speaker 2: thought he was articulate, and I didn't feel like he
6:42
Speaker 2: was being phony. Ben and Heather are both laughing at
6:46
Speaker 2: me now, guys.
6:47
Speaker 3: I'm not laughing at you.
6:48
Speaker 2: You're smiling at me as if I am just.
6:50
Speaker 3: The most naive. I like smiling at you, Ashley. I
6:52
Speaker 3: like smiling at you. You're a fun person.
6:55
Speaker 2: Okay, but then also... Heather is reminding me that there
6:59
Speaker 2: is a DM that she has with him trying to
7:02
Speaker 2: get on shows in the past before he was trying
7:04
Speaker 2: to get on Bachelor. Multiple shows. As you guys may know,
7:08
Speaker 2: our producer Heather is in casting for reality TV.
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Speaker 3: So, I mean, Ashley, I don't disagree with you. I think, Doug,
7:14
Speaker 3: if you would have stopped your sentence with Doug was
7:17
Speaker 3: there for the right reasons. I don't know what the
7:20
Speaker 3: right reasons. In fact, I would actually claim he wasn't.
7:24
Speaker 3: And I'm not a Doug hater here. You'll hear later on.
7:27
Speaker 3: I think he got messed over in this. But when
7:32
Speaker 3: anybody now, anybody, and this is just kind of like
7:36
Speaker 3: from years of talking to people. When anybody comes on
7:39
Speaker 3: here or comes on and says, I'm not going on
7:42
Speaker 3: this show for clout. I say, yes, you are. Like,
7:46
Speaker 3: what are you talking about? Why else would you do
7:48
Speaker 3: this show? If you're not, that's naive. Like, you have
7:53
Speaker 3: to say yes to going on this dating show because
7:57
Speaker 3: it's going to enhance something you're doing in your life
8:00
Speaker 3: in some way. And there's no better way to enhance
8:03
Speaker 3: your life if you're an artist and you're hoping to
8:05
Speaker 3: get discovered and this is maybe a way to do it.
8:09
Speaker 3: I would have a lot more respect for contestants. If
8:12
Speaker 3: they came off and said, 100%, I went on this
8:15
Speaker 3: show thinking it was going to enhance some opportunities I had. 100%,
8:19
Speaker 3: I was excited with the idea that Good Morning America
8:21
Speaker 3: might have me on a sit-down interview. I 100% love
8:24
Speaker 3: the idea of maybe being invited to a red carpet
8:27
Speaker 3: award show. You've always done that, Ashley, and I've always
8:30
Speaker 3: loved that about you. Because at the end of the day, yes,
8:34
Speaker 3: you have to still have the desire. We're breaking down, Ashley,
8:38
Speaker 3: a little side note. We're breaking down Bob Guinea's season
8:41
Speaker 3: of The Bachelor with Bob himself. And one of the
8:44
Speaker 3: things Bob did, Bob had a record deal when he
8:47
Speaker 3: was The Bachelor. He never shied away from the fact
8:49
Speaker 3: that this was going to be good for his career. However,
8:52
Speaker 3: he also was really wanting to find love. And so
8:56
Speaker 3: you win at all levels. You win not only enhancing
8:59
Speaker 3: the opportunities in front of you, but you also win
9:01
Speaker 3: because you desire love. Now, I think Doug did desire
9:05
Speaker 3: to find somebody. I think for that, he was there
9:08
Speaker 3: for the right reasons. However, when he says, I didn't
9:10
Speaker 3: want clout, but here's the name of my song and
9:13
Speaker 3: I wrote songs and here's, you know, I'm a good, like,
9:15
Speaker 3: then I go, okay, Doug, you weren't there for any attention?
9:19
Speaker 3: Like none of it? Like you really were just going
9:22
Speaker 3: on TV for fun?
9:24
Speaker 2: Do you think he really harped on that? enough for
9:27
Speaker 2: you to make a big deal out of it because
9:29
Speaker 2: i'm not talking right reasons here i'm talking about like
9:32
Speaker 2: just his overall demeanor seemed to come across more genuine
9:35
Speaker 2: than i thought like i honestly thought listening start like
9:38
Speaker 2: pressing play that he was going to come across more
9:41
Speaker 2: josh murray-esque and he didn't to me.
9:44
Speaker 3: Okay that's a fair like yeah okay one side like
9:47
Speaker 3: i see what you're saying like you got bob guinea
9:49
Speaker 3: on one side who's like at least authentic in and
9:53
Speaker 3: his explanation of why he did the show. And then
9:55
Speaker 3: you have like Josh Murray, you said on like the
9:57
Speaker 3: other side, who's like, I don't ever want attention. However,
10:00
Speaker 3: you know, here's a shirtless pick of me. Um, I, okay.
10:04
Speaker 3: I get what you're saying. I'm not, again, I just,
10:07
Speaker 3: I'm not against Doug in this. I just think we
10:10
Speaker 3: have to have an understanding that, um, it's not like
10:15
Speaker 3: a pit, like I don't feel super bad, uh, about,
10:20
Speaker 3: how this played out outside of the fact that he,
10:23
Speaker 3: you know, I think really generally loved Taylor, Frankie, Paul,
10:26
Speaker 3: and that's where I want to go now.
10:28
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, he, he, he doesn't even think he really
10:30
Speaker 2: loved her now in hindsight, which I get that.
10:33
Speaker 3: Yeah. I mean, I want to, I kind of want
10:34
Speaker 3: to start breaking down the details of this. So we do,
10:36
Speaker 3: you know, they did sit down and talk to Doug. Um, he,
10:39
Speaker 3: a lot of this experience for him has been kind
10:41
Speaker 3: of post what he talks about his post show. So
10:44
Speaker 3: during the filming, there isn't a lot of that explanation. Um,
10:49
Speaker 3: whatever he felt for her was a year ago. I
10:52
Speaker 3: did listen to this and I did get the sense
10:53
Speaker 3: of this guy really like thought this could work and
10:56
Speaker 3: he wanted it to work for whatever reason he wanted
10:58
Speaker 3: to work for. Like he really was invested into it. And,
11:01
Speaker 3: but it sounds like he didn't have a lot of
11:02
Speaker 3: time to sit in those feelings because it sounds like
11:07
Speaker 3: right after the show was done, she said, she pretty
11:10
Speaker 3: much gave signs to him like, This isn't real, man.
11:13
Speaker 3: And he's probably sitting there. I know, it was so sad.
11:15
Speaker 3: And I felt for that. I felt I can see
11:19
Speaker 3: and I can relate that as soon as the show
11:22
Speaker 3: gets over, you're like, wait, what was all this then?
11:24
Speaker 3: I do think he desired to love Taylor Frankie Paul.
11:28
Speaker 3: I think he desired to love her long for an
11:31
Speaker 3: extended period of time.
11:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, the whole engagement thing, like we could get to
11:35
Speaker 2: that in a second. Let's talk about that in a second.
11:38
Speaker 2: But first, let's go into how Doug met Taylor's ex-husband, Tate,
11:44
Speaker 2: off camera, which is interesting. It happened in season, but
11:48
Speaker 2: off camera. I wonder if that was in a kid
11:51
Speaker 2: exchange or something like that. Did the girls, I don't
11:54
Speaker 2: remember if the girls said anything about that because it's
11:57
Speaker 2: super untraditional.
11:59
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I just listened to
12:02
Speaker 3: the whole two-part episode i don't remember if he ever
12:05
Speaker 3: explained how this happened so.
12:06
Speaker 2: During hometowns during her hometown visit when he meets the
12:10
Speaker 2: kids and he meets his i guess i'm not sure
12:13
Speaker 2: if the mom had a scene beforehand but with the
12:16
Speaker 2: whole family he ends up meeting tate this is unprecedented
12:22
Speaker 2: and some of the um at this same appearance the
12:26
Speaker 2: same moment he also meets the uh Secret Life of
12:29
Speaker 2: Mormon Wives and Girls. And apparently the girls made fun
12:33
Speaker 2: of him a lot. They didn't... He felt like a
12:35
Speaker 2: performing monkey. He felt like they were kind of performing
12:40
Speaker 2: for TV and making fun of him and saying that
12:43
Speaker 2: he was their least favorite. He said that this seemed
12:46
Speaker 2: like a produced move, which is interesting. Of course, we
12:49
Speaker 2: didn't see it, so we can't really pass judgment on it.
12:52
Speaker 2: And Tate... I think that it's kind of nice that
12:57
Speaker 2: you're going to see the guy, that you meet the
12:59
Speaker 2: guy that you're going to have to kind of like
13:01
Speaker 2: co-parent with if you truly end up together. But it's
13:06
Speaker 2: interesting that it happened off camera. But again, at the same,
13:09
Speaker 2: Tate has never really been on Secret Lives of Mormon Wives.
13:11
Speaker 2: So he's a very surprisingly private guy.
13:15
Speaker 3: Yeah. I think it's important that Tate, like what an opportunity,
13:19
Speaker 3: I guess, for Doug is to meet the person, like
13:21
Speaker 3: you said, that you're entering into life with, or at
13:24
Speaker 3: least you hope to. Mm-hmm. the secret lives of Mormon wives,
13:29
Speaker 3: women kind of jabbing at Doug, what a brutal experience.
13:34
Speaker 3: I mean, that sounds like no matter what we think here,
13:37
Speaker 3: the fact that this guy is a cast member on
13:39
Speaker 3: a show and these women have been on TV for
13:42
Speaker 3: years and are used to cameras and they're kind of
13:46
Speaker 3: protected because they know that they're going to, that they
13:50
Speaker 3: really are above any type of criticism because they, They're
13:54
Speaker 3: a part of Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, and that's
13:55
Speaker 3: kind of all they do is, you know, bicker. How
13:58
Speaker 3: tough on him. That is tough on him.
14:03
Speaker 2: The weirdest part of it was that because he has
14:07
Speaker 2: a physical resemblance to Dakota, and to be honest, he's
14:10
Speaker 2: much more attractive than Dakota, they kind of acted as
14:15
Speaker 2: if he was Dakota inside and out. And this is
14:19
Speaker 2: when he got pretty disturbed by the fact... There was,
14:22
Speaker 2: I think, two scenes. It seemed like alluded to that
14:24
Speaker 2: there was two scenes with Secret Lives cast members, which
14:28
Speaker 2: makes sense for the Hulu-ABC crossover. And... he really didn't
14:34
Speaker 2: like this one time that Taylor just couldn't stop talking
14:39
Speaker 2: about the resemblance between him and Dakota. He's like, Hey,
14:44
Speaker 2: could you not compare me to this guy that like
14:46
Speaker 2: I know from TV sucks. Yeah.
14:48
Speaker 3: I mean, and how weird would it be if you
14:51
Speaker 3: are on a date? Um, you know, very little about
14:56
Speaker 3: the person you're dating and they're like, you are so
14:58
Speaker 3: much like my ex and I'm, I'm into you. You're like, wait,
15:02
Speaker 3: I'm getting mixed signals here. So you're like, one, you're
15:05
Speaker 3: still thinking about your ex, which is weird. Two, you're
15:07
Speaker 3: into me because I kind of like your ex. This
15:10
Speaker 3: whole thing is very confusing for me. You start to understand, too,
15:18
Speaker 3: why Doug starts to feel confused by this whole process.
15:24
Speaker 3: I think this was probably one of those moments where
15:26
Speaker 3: he was like, I'm getting hit from all sides. Her
15:29
Speaker 3: friend's don't seem to like me yet. I'm still trying
15:35
Speaker 3: to pursue this woman who has like stuff. I'm still
15:38
Speaker 3: trying to figure out. And then the show gets done
15:41
Speaker 3: and he's like, wait, she like is dropping me like
15:44
Speaker 3: a bad habit. Like I would be spiraling. And I'm
15:48
Speaker 3: wondering in all of this, like especially why the women
15:51
Speaker 3: are ripping on him. Like where are the producers at
15:53
Speaker 3: in all of this? Like why are they out to
15:55
Speaker 3: get Doug so bad? Like why are they OK with this?
15:58
Speaker 2: Well, that's what I mean. Like I feel like he
16:00
Speaker 2: was getting some sort of Josh Murray, but maybe more
16:04
Speaker 2: so Jordan Rodgers at it. Where it was like he
16:07
Speaker 2: was this suave hot guy that he wasn't supposed to
16:11
Speaker 2: get away with being the winner because he was the
16:14
Speaker 2: too obvious choice and he seemed too comfortable in the environment.
16:23
Speaker 2: Or he did remind people of her ex who's been
16:27
Speaker 2: all over TV. I don't know. It's... He was either
16:32
Speaker 2: going to get that edit or they were going to
16:33
Speaker 2: make her look bad. Like he ends up leaving this
16:36
Speaker 2: one incident where he gets compared to Dakota over and
16:40
Speaker 2: over again. He's like, I'm leaving this date. Like, I
16:42
Speaker 2: don't want to hear it anymore. And I wonder how
16:46
Speaker 2: that would have looked in the edit. Would that have
16:49
Speaker 2: made him look like.
16:50
Speaker 3: They could have made him look bad.
16:51
Speaker 2: They could have made him look either. It could have
16:53
Speaker 2: been either way.
16:53
Speaker 4: Yeah.
16:54
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't think walking away from any situation
16:57
Speaker 3: on national TV ever comes off looking good. Even if
17:00
Speaker 3: the women were super mean to him, I think it
17:04
Speaker 3: would have looked like he's trying to escape it, which
17:06
Speaker 3: is smart. He should have in real life. That's exactly
17:09
Speaker 3: what you should have done in TV. It could come
17:10
Speaker 3: off a thousand different ways, but I don't know if
17:14
Speaker 3: he cared. Cause I do think at this point in time,
17:17
Speaker 3: he was confused. Hey, Doug, sing us a song. And
17:20
Speaker 3: then they're like laughing at him as he sings. And
17:21
Speaker 3: you're like, wait, you're just bullying. Like you're just, you're
17:26
Speaker 3: picking on me. Like how, even though I'm an adult,
17:29
Speaker 3: like how bad would that feel if they're like, hey,
17:32
Speaker 3: do this. So you start doing it and they're like,
17:36
Speaker 3: and people start giggling at you for doing it. My
17:38
Speaker 3: confidence would be shot.
17:50
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18:02
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18:04
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18:12
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18:15
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18:17
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18:25
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18:29
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18:49
Speaker 2: Another unprecedented thing that happened that Doug mentioned is that
18:52
Speaker 2: this date that he left was a group date, but
18:55
Speaker 2: the day before he had a one-on-one. And this is
18:59
Speaker 2: in the same cycle. This is between rose ceremonies.
19:03
Speaker 3: Don't you think they did that because the show wanted
19:06
Speaker 3: him there with the Secret Lives of Mormon Wives for
19:09
Speaker 3: this moment to happen? Yes, absolutely.
19:11
Speaker 2: Absolutely. The question is, why did he get the one
19:14
Speaker 2: on one the day before? Did she do it? She
19:16
Speaker 2: is so compelled. She just couldn't not. Or did they
19:18
Speaker 2: want to make it like an interesting twist?
19:21
Speaker 3: I bet. I mean, goodness, even if for as much
19:25
Speaker 3: say as Taylor had probably during this whole process, I'm
19:29
Speaker 3: guessing that. I mean, why? No, the show still puts
19:34
Speaker 3: their foot down at times. This was only going to
19:37
Speaker 3: cause controversy with the other. So him coming on two
19:41
Speaker 3: dates was only going to cause conflict, which they probably
19:44
Speaker 3: sounds like from what he says about the other men,
19:46
Speaker 3: they probably needed. It doesn't sound like the men were
19:49
Speaker 3: having much drama. amongst themselves necessarily. And so they're probably like,
19:52
Speaker 3: this is a good way to do it. There's going
19:53
Speaker 3: to be a clear target on this guy's back. Everybody's
19:56
Speaker 3: going to come at him. And then they're going to
19:57
Speaker 3: go on this group date. And Doug's already going to
20:00
Speaker 3: be getting like kind of beat up by the house.
20:03
Speaker 3: And he's going to get like destroyed by these women.
20:06
Speaker 3: And we're going to see how he responds. We're going
20:07
Speaker 3: to see how he reacts.
20:08
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is a big mind game.
20:09
Speaker 3: Yeah.
20:09
Speaker 2: This is a big mind game.
20:11
Speaker 3: And like, I don't know. I just, I listened to that.
20:13
Speaker 3: I'm like this, what did the show expect? Like this,
20:16
Speaker 3: this sounds like it was going to be, it was
20:20
Speaker 3: going to crash and burn. No matter what. Like, it's
20:24
Speaker 3: not like they were, it's not like from what we
20:25
Speaker 3: know so far, they were filming this season and producing
20:28
Speaker 3: this season to be this massive win in the love category.
20:33
Speaker 3: It does sound to me like they were like, hey, let's,
20:36
Speaker 3: get the drama back out there. Let's get the headlines
20:40
Speaker 3: back out there and the show's going to succeed from it.
20:42
Speaker 3: And I, I think the bachelor listens to this. I
20:44
Speaker 3: think you're missing the mark. I don't think that's how
20:46
Speaker 3: you bring the show back. Um, because headlines happen every
20:49
Speaker 3: day and they're clickbait. Like that's not how you bring
20:52
Speaker 3: this show back to, uh, a viewing audience.
20:56
Speaker 2: That's right. Um, let's also talk now about the engagement
21:00
Speaker 2: because he said that they had multiple times off camera
21:03
Speaker 2: spoken about how they probably shouldn't get engaged. How like
21:09
Speaker 2: she didn't really seem to want it. And he was like,
21:13
Speaker 2: I've hung out with your family twice. Like I'm not
21:16
Speaker 2: trying to make this commitment when the kids are involved
21:19
Speaker 2: and we know each other so little, but then something
21:22
Speaker 2: weird happens. He meets with Neil Lane. And even when
21:26
Speaker 2: he meets with Neil Lane, he's not certain, but he
21:29
Speaker 2: picks out a ring, keeps it in his pocket. And
21:31
Speaker 2: then he said, there's just like this magical moment where like,
21:34
Speaker 2: everybody's kind of like huddled together and, Um, they're on
21:37
Speaker 2: this boat on the way to the proposal spot. And
21:40
Speaker 2: he says, he sees Jesse. He says, it looks heavenly
21:44
Speaker 2: that he, it's just like this mystical moment. And he
21:48
Speaker 2: just feels compelled to do so to get on one knee. And, um,
21:54
Speaker 2: some people, you know, they're, they're kind of like talking.
21:56
Speaker 2: They're like, do you think that you do this because
21:59
Speaker 2: she came here for a proposal? Cause that's kind of
22:02
Speaker 2: what he said. Or like, like, Oh, what are you,
22:08
Speaker 2: what are you thinking when you did this? Because you
22:09
Speaker 2: had such a clear conversation that you shouldn't do it.
22:12
Speaker 2: Is it because, is it for the sake of the show?
22:14
Speaker 2: I kind of think that he just, in that moment
22:18
Speaker 2: got in that tornado, that is the bachelor bubble. And
22:20
Speaker 2: he was like, I imagine myself proposing at the end
22:24
Speaker 2: of this, if I got here. So here I am,
22:26
Speaker 2: I'm just going to do it.
22:28
Speaker 3: Uh, yeah.
22:29
Speaker 2: You feel pressure. Do you think that there was a
22:30
Speaker 2: lot of pressure that he's not talking about?
22:32
Speaker 3: Well, I mean, I think being through this myself, um,
22:36
Speaker 3: I was listening to this and there is this beauty
22:40
Speaker 3: and this difficulty when you film the show, you forget
22:42
Speaker 3: so much of what like was said in the, like
22:46
Speaker 3: in between times. And if, if I'm guessing, if I'm
22:53
Speaker 3: guessing based on how I think this played out, I
22:55
Speaker 3: think he and Taylor had a lot of conversations about
22:58
Speaker 3: engagement and I'm assuming that Taylor was like, yes, I
23:01
Speaker 3: would love to get engaged if it's the right person.
23:02
Speaker 3: And he was like, okay, great. Um, and there was
23:06
Speaker 3: a lot of like gray area kind of in their conversation.
23:08
Speaker 3: There wasn't this direct, like, no, you know, cause you don't,
23:12
Speaker 3: you don't have that opportunity until the end anyways, like Doug,
23:14
Speaker 3: it's going to be you. And when it is you,
23:16
Speaker 3: I don't want you to propose. I just want you
23:18
Speaker 3: to offer, um, a dating experience together. You never really
23:21
Speaker 3: have that opportunity for that conversation. So, but he probably
23:24
Speaker 3: had this hint in the back of his mind that
23:27
Speaker 3: I don't know if Taylor actually wants to get engaged
23:29
Speaker 3: from this. Um, but then as he starts talking this
23:32
Speaker 3: out with his producer, um, The producer comes in and says,
23:36
Speaker 3: Taylor came here for an engagement, Doug. Taylor came here
23:40
Speaker 3: hoping to meet her Prince Charming and you are it.
23:43
Speaker 3: Like you are the guy. She came here to get engaged.
23:46
Speaker 3: And I think that's why he said she wanted an
23:48
Speaker 3: engagement or she came here for engagement. So I was
23:50
Speaker 3: going to give it to her. And it's like, I
23:52
Speaker 3: get where you got there, Doug. But I think there
23:54
Speaker 3: was multiple stories being played out. I think Taylor was
23:57
Speaker 3: probably on the side being like, I don't really know. Whatever.
24:01
Speaker 3: Like even if he proposes, we're going to break up
24:03
Speaker 3: in a week. fine. And the producer was like, no,
24:06
Speaker 3: she wants to get married to you. And he's like, okay,
24:10
Speaker 3: I'm going to do it. So I think that, so
24:13
Speaker 3: you're right. I'm not saying, I never said you're wrong.
24:15
Speaker 3: You're right. That he got sucked up in the bubble
24:18
Speaker 3: of the bachelor. That bubble though, had narratives being played
24:21
Speaker 3: into his head. And I think he wanted to do
24:24
Speaker 3: the right thing in the right moment for this person
24:28
Speaker 3: that he cared about. And the right thing in that moment,
24:30
Speaker 3: or at least what he was being advised about, was
24:32
Speaker 3: the right thing in that moment was to propose to
24:35
Speaker 3: her and so he.
24:36
Speaker 2: Did it like two quick notes i mentioned earlier that
24:41
Speaker 2: joey was a diamond in the rough and i mean
24:42
Speaker 2: joey was diamond in the rough season because he had
24:46
Speaker 2: the ratings and the long-term engagement i also just want
24:49
Speaker 2: to give props to charity who's also like about to
24:51
Speaker 2: get married now secondly this engage the um one of
24:58
Speaker 2: the things that I really respected about Doug throughout this
25:02
Speaker 2: is I think he was critical of Taylor without being mean.
25:06
Speaker 2: He seemed like he did have like love in his
25:08
Speaker 2: heart for her and that he wasn't getting on this
25:10
Speaker 2: podcast to bash her. He just kind of wanted to
25:13
Speaker 2: tell her to have the story that that's what I liked.
25:15
Speaker 2: I really like, just like the balance that was like,
25:17
Speaker 2: it was realistic. He was being real, but he wasn't
25:20
Speaker 2: at all being mean.
25:21
Speaker 3: He never was mean. I mean, I listened to this.
25:23
Speaker 3: I'm like, you could have probably been a lot meaner
25:24
Speaker 3: and made a lot of like comments. And he probably,
25:28
Speaker 3: has a lot more than he did share, but he was, you,
25:31
Speaker 3: I think Taylor could listen to this and be like, yeah,
25:34
Speaker 3: he respected me. Yeah. Even though, you know, I, I
25:39
Speaker 3: hope at this point she's probably realizing that she messed
25:43
Speaker 3: him over and maybe this was a lot realer to
25:45
Speaker 3: him than it was for her. And she brought somebody
25:48
Speaker 3: into a process that caused pain, even though according to
25:52
Speaker 3: Doug and I, I guess it's true. He's in a
25:55
Speaker 3: really good place. And so that's, that's good.
25:58
Speaker 2: Um, this happy couple weekend. So what happens is they
26:01
Speaker 2: get off the show and she didn't want to have
26:04
Speaker 2: that happy couple weekend that follows the engagement. Cause usually
26:08
Speaker 2: you stay in like a happy place for three days.
26:11
Speaker 2: She wanted to get home. And as a mom, I
26:14
Speaker 2: understand I would have been like, Hey, do you want
26:17
Speaker 2: to like, come stay somewhere by my, by my home?
26:21
Speaker 2: And like, we can do this, but like, you know,
26:24
Speaker 2: I could also see my kids like every couple hours. Um,
26:27
Speaker 2: you know, we can bounce back and forth. I could
26:29
Speaker 2: do nights there and days with the kids, something like that.
26:32
Speaker 2: That would have made my heart sink if I were him.
26:34
Speaker 2: I've been signed number one, which he said yes. And
26:36
Speaker 2: then he also said that after that night they spent together,
26:39
Speaker 2: which was like right after the engagement, there was this
26:42
Speaker 2: moment in the car where they like separate and he's
26:44
Speaker 2: still like looking at her. And then she just like
26:47
Speaker 2: had her head in the phone or like was immersed
26:48
Speaker 2: in conversation with somebody else. She just wasn't like looking
26:51
Speaker 2: at him and he just like felt like a, I
26:53
Speaker 2: guess like a lack of like love right there.
26:55
Speaker 3: How terrible of a feeling would that be?
26:57
Speaker 2: I know. I know.
26:58
Speaker 3: Awful.
26:58
Speaker 2: I felt it. It was like visceral for me when
27:00
Speaker 2: he was doing some of this storytelling. So then he
27:05
Speaker 2: said that trying to find a happy couple weekend, you know,
27:07
Speaker 2: like arranging it through the producers was such a challenge.
27:11
Speaker 2: She just like, didn't want it. Like, I swear she
27:13
Speaker 2: just went home and wanted to pretend like this whole
27:15
Speaker 2: thing never happened. She was definitely had her mind on
27:18
Speaker 2: that guy. Ben had her mind on Dakota. And then
27:21
Speaker 2: they finally get to get.
27:22
Speaker 1: Yeah.
27:23
Speaker 2: Finally, she, they, they arrange a happy couple in Utah
27:29
Speaker 2: and then he's unpacking. And she's like, what are you doing?
27:32
Speaker 2: Unpacking as if it was just like all an act.
27:35
Speaker 2: And then he goes, well, we're going to spend a
27:37
Speaker 2: few days here. And she's like, no, I'm leaving. And
27:41
Speaker 2: that was, that was, that was it. And then like,
27:43
Speaker 2: you know, they get producers involved and they're like, Hey, so, um,
27:46
Speaker 2: I guess we're leaving. I guess we're absolutely broken up.
27:50
Speaker 2: And then he says, as he's walking out, says something
27:55
Speaker 2: like you were strong or like you were tough. And
27:58
Speaker 2: I appreciate what did, what was the exact word? Do
28:01
Speaker 2: we have the exact word?
28:03
Speaker 3: Let's stop here.
28:04
Speaker 2: Yeah.
28:05
Speaker 3: Because through this whole thing.
28:06
Speaker 2: Yeah.
28:07
Speaker 3: I'm on Doug's side, not picking sides. I shouldn't say
28:11
Speaker 3: that through this whole thing. I'm feeling for Doug would
28:14
Speaker 3: be the way.
28:14
Speaker 1: Yeah.
28:15
Speaker 2: Yeah.
28:15
Speaker 3: And I do think Taylor Frankie Paul was not in
28:19
Speaker 3: a good place when she came onto this show. I
28:21
Speaker 3: think this show added on another element of responsibility and
28:25
Speaker 3: that she wasn't ready to handle or nor does any
28:28
Speaker 3: person should be handling it at this time. I think
28:32
Speaker 3: that he got played based on what we know happened post-show.
28:36
Speaker 3: And that's not just coming from his words. It's also
28:38
Speaker 3: coming from what we've seen on Secret Lives of Modern Wise.
28:42
Speaker 3: I feel for him. His story through the season of
28:45
Speaker 3: The Bachelorette is tough. I also asked the question, Ashley, again,
28:50
Speaker 3: that we so many have been asking and our listeners
28:53
Speaker 3: have been writing in is like, why did they cast her?
28:55
Speaker 3: in the first place, if they knew. The show had
28:58
Speaker 3: to have known she wasn't sold out on the idea
29:00
Speaker 3: of The Bachelorette working for her.
29:01
Speaker 2: They were being blissfully ignorant because they had such a
29:04
Speaker 2: quote star.
29:05
Speaker 1: Yeah.
29:05
Speaker 3: I mean, you knew this was how it's going to
29:08
Speaker 3: play out. So what were you doing casting her? Are
29:12
Speaker 3: you trying to lose all legitimacy with the fan base
29:15
Speaker 3: that still existed? Yeah. What are you doing? Yeah. This
29:20
Speaker 3: should have only been Taylor Frankie Paul casting. If you're
29:23
Speaker 3: the show that's almost coming in in a way to
29:26
Speaker 3: give her the opportunity that she so desired to meet
29:28
Speaker 3: somebody because you know she wants to, but she just
29:30
Speaker 3: can't slow down in life enough to meet somebody, and
29:34
Speaker 3: this is her big moment, and you know she's also
29:36
Speaker 3: sold on the idea, and that is the ethos to
29:39
Speaker 3: the season. and how we watch it as viewers is like, Hey,
29:41
Speaker 3: I know she's had her stuff. I know she's had
29:43
Speaker 3: her problems. I know she has some wild exes. I
29:46
Speaker 3: know she has a story to tell, but goodness gracious,
29:48
Speaker 3: she is a rising Phoenix as the bachelorette. She is
29:52
Speaker 3: coming out of the ashes and she is soaring into love.
29:54
Speaker 3: And we are there to celebrate love at its most
29:57
Speaker 3: fine moments. But when I hear Doug talk and we
30:02
Speaker 3: watch Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, I only can at
30:09
Speaker 3: least gain from that to think, why did you ever
30:11
Speaker 3: cast her in the first place, guys? Like she was
30:14
Speaker 3: never ready for this. She didn't want it. And it
30:16
Speaker 3: was just another thing for her to do. And how crazy.
30:20
Speaker 3: So I say all that, Ashley, my soapbox. To say
30:26
Speaker 3: this is the one moment in the interview that I
30:27
Speaker 3: was like, Doug, what are you doing? Because it makes
30:30
Speaker 3: me question so many other things he said when he goes,
30:32
Speaker 3: she came in and he goes, I'm proud of you.
30:35
Speaker 3: And it's like, Doug, why can't you just be honest
30:38
Speaker 3: with her and be like, hey, you cheat on me. Like,
30:41
Speaker 3: why are you manipulative? It almost sounded like manipulative to me.
30:44
Speaker 3: Am I wrong?
30:44
Speaker 2: I agree.
30:45
Speaker 3: No, no.
30:46
Speaker 2: Okay, so guys, he says as he's leaving, the last
30:50
Speaker 2: time he sees her in person, I'm proud of you.
30:54
Speaker 2: So that he gets a reaction from her, like of
30:58
Speaker 2: her admitting it. that she's cheating or has cheated without
31:03
Speaker 2: actually asking her the damn question. And it did. I
31:08
Speaker 2: was like, okay, woo, like great TV. Like if that
31:11
Speaker 2: was on TV, I'd be like, that was some good
31:12
Speaker 2: scripted stuff right there. And I would be curious to
31:17
Speaker 2: like see a reaction from a statement like that, but
31:20
Speaker 2: it does seem manipulative, which does make me question what
31:25
Speaker 2: her side of the story would be in certain, you know,
31:28
Speaker 2: in certain, you know, of the situations that he's explained.
31:31
Speaker 1: Yeah.
31:32
Speaker 3: How good is, I guess my question that I heard
31:34
Speaker 3: when I, when he said that, I was like, how
31:35
Speaker 3: good is this guy of playing the good guy? Like
31:38
Speaker 3: how good is he at the moment of knowing the
31:40
Speaker 3: right thing to say in the right moment, that's going
31:43
Speaker 3: to make him look caring and considerate and then bring
31:47
Speaker 3: out some, like some emotion out of somebody else. That's
31:50
Speaker 3: what I heard.
31:51
Speaker 2: Because he admits that he wanted to get like he
31:54
Speaker 2: wanted to get her reaction. And yeah, like he he
31:58
Speaker 2: agrees that this is manipulative.
31:59
Speaker 3: He calculated the words that he was going to use
32:02
Speaker 3: in that moment.
32:03
Speaker 1: Yeah.
32:03
Speaker 3: And he says, I'm proud of you knowing not just
32:07
Speaker 3: he didn't. He said that not not just out of
32:10
Speaker 3: like a genuine like care of like, hey, Taylor, I
32:12
Speaker 3: know life's been crazy and I'm proud of you. I
32:15
Speaker 3: only get to this conclusion because he admitted he did
32:17
Speaker 3: it knowing that there was somebody else.
32:19
Speaker 2: Exactly.
32:20
Speaker 3: And I'm like, okay. So that is the one moment, Ashley,
32:25
Speaker 3: during this whole interview, the clout chasing thing, I can
32:28
Speaker 3: get over. Everybody does it. I'm sure you go back
32:30
Speaker 3: into interviews when I was right off the show and
32:33
Speaker 3: I was like, I never thought I'd be famous from this.
32:35
Speaker 3: And I said it because I was like, well, That
32:39
Speaker 3: was the hope, I guess. I mean, like, at the
32:41
Speaker 3: end of the day, it was going to be kind
32:42
Speaker 3: of cool if I got paid some time for, like,
32:46
Speaker 3: being me. Like, I just think, like, we all at
32:51
Speaker 3: some point admit, like, hey, this was a cool opportunity
32:53
Speaker 3: that we thought was exciting and TV was going to
32:56
Speaker 3: enhance opportunities in life in ways that maybe none of
33:01
Speaker 3: us knew exactly how, but we were excited about the
33:03
Speaker 3: idea of it. And so that was my point there.
33:05
Speaker 3: I can get over that, though, right? That's common. This
33:07
Speaker 3: was the one moment I was like, What are you doing, dude?
33:10
Speaker 3: I agree. Come on. Don't play into that game. You
33:15
Speaker 3: should be above this, knowing all you know. You had
33:20
Speaker 3: no problem coming out of this looking like the good guy.
33:22
Speaker 3: Goodness gracious, all you had to do was sit there
33:24
Speaker 3: and quiet, and you were going to look like the
33:26
Speaker 3: good guy.
33:26
Speaker 2: I know.
33:28
Speaker 3: TFP was going on other shows admitting that she messed
33:31
Speaker 3: you over. So all you had to do was take it.
33:34
Speaker 2: Yep. Yep, yep. I still can't go over the fact
33:37
Speaker 2: that it wasn't just Dakota. It was a whole other guy.
33:40
Speaker 3: Oh, was it Dakota?
33:41
Speaker 2: No, it's not just, it seems as if he cheated
33:44
Speaker 2: on him with just, not just Dakota, but also with
33:46
Speaker 2: this Ben guy.
33:48
Speaker 3: Oh, there is a guy named Ben.
33:49
Speaker 2: Oh yeah. There is a guy named Ben. Ben, this
33:51
Speaker 2: is the guy that was on the secret lives of
33:53
Speaker 2: Mormon wives. And like the timeline matches up. He's the
33:55
Speaker 2: one that was in the bathtub with her.
33:57
Speaker 3: Oh yeah. I remember that. Oh my goodness.
33:59
Speaker 2: And he, she had met him before going on to
34:02
Speaker 2: the bachelorette.
34:03
Speaker 3: There's just so much here. It's like I have to
34:05
Speaker 3: get one of those investigative boards and draw the lines
34:08
Speaker 3: because it's getting all weird for me.
34:21
Speaker 2: So let's just end with this question that I have
34:25
Speaker 2: for you. Do you think that this interview was done... Well,
34:31
Speaker 2: it was done because it was interesting. It was done
34:33
Speaker 2: either way. Do you think The Bachelor wanted to see
34:36
Speaker 2: how this interview went because he's a possible Bachelor contestant,
34:41
Speaker 2: you know, candidate?
34:44
Speaker 3: Oh, I think he's 100% a potential Bachelor candidate. Did
34:49
Speaker 3: this interview happen? Is the question like, is the interview
34:53
Speaker 3: happening because they want to get like a, a test
34:57
Speaker 3: out there to the public to see how they respond
34:59
Speaker 3: to him.
35:00
Speaker 2: See, I responded well. And I am a woman.
35:03
Speaker 3: I am a naive.
35:06
Speaker 2: I am woman.
35:06
Speaker 3: And I was....
35:10
Speaker 2: Bedazzled by him via this. I say this as in
35:14
Speaker 2: the way I listen to it, and then I text
35:15
Speaker 2: my friend. I go, hey, did you ever DM him?
35:18
Speaker 2: Because you should try again. And I'm like, Ashley, stop
35:21
Speaker 2: being so naive.
35:23
Speaker 3: Oh, I'm not saying he's a bad dude, Ashley. I
35:24
Speaker 3: don't want that. I'm not saying he's not dateable or
35:27
Speaker 3: not a decent fellow. That was never my hope to this.
35:32
Speaker 3: I don't think you were misled or naive. I think
35:34
Speaker 3: you heard what you heard, and you believe it, and
35:36
Speaker 3: that's great. Yeah, I do.
35:37
Speaker 2: I just, I do.
35:38
Speaker 1: So.
35:40
Speaker 2: I still think it's a mistake to have him be
35:42
Speaker 2: The Bachelor because I just don't think we should do
35:46
Speaker 2: anything associated with this season.
35:47
Speaker 3: I agree with that. So your question to me, I
35:50
Speaker 3: agree with that. You answered your question.
35:53
Speaker 2: I answered the question. What's funny is that like if
35:56
Speaker 2: we were to go back like even five years ago,
35:59
Speaker 2: it wouldn't be a podcast. It also wouldn't be Bachelor
36:02
Speaker 2: Happy Hour, which is like a, you know. It's not
36:05
Speaker 2: a gigantic podcast. It's not like, you know, a top 20.
36:08
Speaker 3: It's not almost famous.
36:11
Speaker 2: So if you wouldn't have tested the waters for your
36:14
Speaker 2: bachelor on a podcast, you would have tested it on
36:19
Speaker 2: Good Morning America. You would have had him in the
36:21
Speaker 2: audience at Dancing with the Stars. You would have blah, blah, blah.
36:25
Speaker 3: You would have had Jesse sitting down with him at
36:28
Speaker 3: the bachelor mansion by the pool having this conversation. And
36:32
Speaker 3: everybody would have been tuning in. And it would have
36:34
Speaker 3: been talked about like the Jake Pavelka.
36:38
Speaker 2: Never forget Jake Pavelka and Vienna at the side of
36:41
Speaker 2: the pool.
36:42
Speaker 3: That was what this would have been.
36:44
Speaker 2: Yeah. To gauge the audience's interest in him becoming Bachelor.
36:48
Speaker 2: And now we just have such a small platform for
36:51
Speaker 2: the show. And because media has changed so majorly that
36:59
Speaker 2: we can't really tell. where they're going to go with
37:01
Speaker 2: this decision. But what is weird is that we are
37:05
Speaker 2: taping this on October 16th and there has been no
37:09
Speaker 2: filming of The Bachelor. And normally we'd be mid-season of
37:13
Speaker 2: filming right now. And that is what our next podcast
37:15
Speaker 2: episode is going to be about. Speculation over who could
37:19
Speaker 2: be the next Bachelor and why it's not currently in production.
37:23
Speaker 2: So guys, hopefully we didn't forget anything massive from this
37:27
Speaker 2: hour and a half interview that Charity and and rachel
37:30
Speaker 2: did with him it was very interesting go ahead and
37:34
Speaker 2: listen to it if you guys haven't um and uh
37:38
Speaker 2: but i also do think we recapped all the juiciest
37:40
Speaker 2: stuff so yeah if you're just loyal to ashley and
37:42
Speaker 2: ben like you know you got we got you we
37:44
Speaker 2: covered you.
37:45
Speaker 3: You know we covered you here's my final summary um
37:50
Speaker 3: i think doug got a raw end of the deal
37:52
Speaker 3: i don't think taylor frankie paul ever went on to
37:55
Speaker 3: the bachelorette thinking that she was going to get married
37:58
Speaker 3: from it. And I think that is a casting issue
38:00
Speaker 3: more than it's anybody else's issue. And I think Doug
38:04
Speaker 3: shared a lot. And along the way, there is no
38:10
Speaker 3: expectation for him to do this perfectly because goodness, at
38:14
Speaker 3: this point he was pretty confused and beat up. But
38:17
Speaker 3: I do think the one moment that stood out to
38:19
Speaker 3: me that made me go, come on, Doug was the, Hey,
38:22
Speaker 3: I'm proud of you. comment that he made to her
38:26
Speaker 3: hoping to get something out of her. I just think
38:28
Speaker 3: that felt manipulative. I think it felt calculated. But everything else,
38:36
Speaker 3: through this whole interview, I just go, what was the
38:39
Speaker 3: show doing? Like, goodness. How did they think this was
38:44
Speaker 3: going to help the franchise? I don't know.
38:46
Speaker 2: But listening to him talk about how she basically ghosted
38:51
Speaker 2: him from the day after they got engaged. Like not ghost,
38:54
Speaker 2: but like very, very detached. She, she was made me
38:59
Speaker 2: feel so like, I felt it. Like I felt it
39:02
Speaker 2: in my chest being disinterest, like somebody not having interested
39:07
Speaker 2: me after I put a ring on their finger. It
39:09
Speaker 2: was so sad.
39:10
Speaker 3: I can't imagine. Um, I really can't because you put
39:13
Speaker 3: everything into this and the show's really good at bringing
39:16
Speaker 3: out emotion. It's really good at opening you up. And
39:20
Speaker 3: when you're opened up, it's so much easier to get hurt.
39:23
Speaker 3: And then to have this like all turn back on
39:26
Speaker 3: you so quickly, it would hurt you. and it would
39:30
Speaker 3: confuse you. And then you would feel all sorts of weird.
39:35
Speaker 3: So we, but I don't know if it got to
39:39
Speaker 3: the place, this interview got us to the place where
39:41
Speaker 3: we're like, yes, that's the next guy. I'm with you.
39:44
Speaker 3: Not it's take a wet dug out of the, consideration
39:47
Speaker 3: here i just think we need to do nothing about
39:49
Speaker 3: like with taylor frankie paul season the next lead absolutely.
39:52
Speaker 2: Like i'm sorry doug completely removed out of this in
39:55
Speaker 2: every single way yeah.
39:56
Speaker 3: Like we're done with this like move on you.
39:58
Speaker 2: You won and you didn't win anything and then you
40:02
Speaker 2: uh also can't be bachelor because you're so scared with her.
40:05
Speaker 3: Bye that's my take yeah we'll see what the show
40:09
Speaker 3: does hey this has been the almost famous podcast breaking
40:11
Speaker 3: down The Doug Mason interview with Charity and Rachel, they
40:14
Speaker 3: did a great job with this interview. They got a
40:16
Speaker 3: lot out of him, and they asked the right questions
40:20
Speaker 3: that we were all intrigued and interested by. You can
40:22
Speaker 3: go listen to it, or you can just listen to
40:24
Speaker 3: our recap that we just did here at the Almost
40:26
Speaker 3: Famous Podcast. I mentioned it earlier. We are breaking down
40:29
Speaker 3: Bob Guinea's season of The Bachelor, and it's going to
40:31
Speaker 3: be a lot of fun to continue on that journey
40:33
Speaker 3: with Bob, hearing all the details, the emotions, the experience,
40:37
Speaker 3: and how it shaped him today. This is the Almost
40:41
Speaker 3: Famous Podcast, and we will be talking to you soon.
40:44
Speaker 1: Follow the Ben and Ashley Ai Almost Famous Podcast on
40:47
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio or subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts.