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Transcript

Chulin 35 · Daf Yomi with Aaron Cohen

0:00
SPEAKER_00: Alright, Khulin Daflamed Hey, we're gonna start a little bit higher from the middle of Lamedalanamid Bayz, Omar Ulah where we left off yesterday.
0:06
SPEAKER_00: So just to bring us up to speed for two minutes where we're holding in the middle of a sugi over here.
0:11
SPEAKER_00: It's uh transitional sugiya, I would say, from the beginning of today.
0:14
SPEAKER_00: But we need to have some information as uh this is one of the harder daffin, as uh along with yesterday.
0:19
SPEAKER_00: But the maya we had a Mishnah and the Mishnah said what happens when you shaft an animal and there's no dam.
0:23
SPEAKER_00: What happens?
0:23
SPEAKER_00: Kshaira.
0:24
SPEAKER_00: But we said it's we said a couple of allahas, not only is it gonna be kashra, but also now dayim is service.
0:30
SPEAKER_00: You're allowed to eat it with tomai hands.
0:32
SPEAKER_00: Why?
0:32
SPEAKER_00: Because there was no dham.
0:33
SPEAKER_00: And if there was no dham, it wasn't master at the kabutma, it wasn't mashur at the kabotum.
0:37
SPEAKER_00: So even though your daiim are tomeyim, you're gonna be able to touch it.
0:40
SPEAKER_00: Not a problem.
0:41
SPEAKER_00: What's that mashmah?
0:42
SPEAKER_00: And that this is the diok that we were dealing with yesterday.
0:44
SPEAKER_00: It's mashma that if it was, and if there was dham, then it would be mashur the food be tuma, and therefore the food would be macabre the the the buser would be macabutuma, which means you can't use the beodimusaivas.
0:57
SPEAKER_00: If your hands are tameh, you're not gonna be able to uh touch this busar.
1:02
SPEAKER_00: Why is that a problem?
1:02
SPEAKER_00: The problem is because your daimusaivas are always going to be a shenilatoma.
1:06
SPEAKER_00: It's a Xer Dirabanan and Satuma Darabanan on your hands, that your hands are considered uh sh they're considered sneam litoma.
1:12
SPEAKER_00: Now if your hands are sneem latuma, what are we talking about in the Mishnah?
1:15
SPEAKER_00: We brought four rayas in the Gemurah that the Mishnah was talking about Hulin and not Kodchim.
1:19
SPEAKER_00: The problem is that Hulin, a shayni litum is the last step.
1:23
SPEAKER_00: We know that different things have different uh it depends how cuddler something is for the different levels of uh of tumma that it's gonna get.
1:29
SPEAKER_00: And a shiny, the most a shani uh sorry, the by chulin, the most chulin can become is a shaini lituma.
1:34
SPEAKER_00: So if your hands are already a shaini litumma, we know each time it transmits to something else, it dilutes the tumma.
1:39
SPEAKER_00: So it's gonna go down from a shami to a slishi.
1:41
SPEAKER_00: Now, if you're gonna touch this buffer, what's gonna happen?
1:43
SPEAKER_00: It's gonna become a slishi.
1:44
SPEAKER_00: The problem is we're talking about hulin.
1:45
SPEAKER_00: We brought four rides that the Mishnah is talking about Hulin.
1:47
SPEAKER_00: You're gonna touch it with your shamy hands and make it into a slishi.
1:50
SPEAKER_00: What's the problem?
1:51
SPEAKER_00: Hulin doesn't become a slishi.
1:53
SPEAKER_00: And we proved that it's not talking about khacems.
1:55
SPEAKER_00: So we have an issue over here.
1:56
SPEAKER_00: So we gave a bunch of answers in the Gemara.
1:58
SPEAKER_00: Uh two days ago we had the first two answers, either we're talking about mice, or maybe, or there's actually we're actually talking about your yodayim that are considered a risha na toma, there is a chatim so for that to happen.
2:08
SPEAKER_00: Yesterday's Yusair, and that's the one we need for now, and that was the answer we gave, that we're talking about Hulin Shinaswataris a Khadesh, which we know is a special khumra that some people held.
2:17
SPEAKER_00: They ate their chulin uh bitahara, even their chulin they kept a tahara, even on the level of Kaidersh sometimes.
2:23
SPEAKER_00: We know that we were introduced to two different things altaris haqhaidesh and chulin shanasuatiras truma.
2:29
SPEAKER_00: So hulin shanasuataris kaidesh, that's on even on the level of khajin.
2:32
SPEAKER_00: Kulin Shinaswataras Truma means you ate it on the level of tahara for cut for trumah, and that's a little less Kumar.
2:39
SPEAKER_00: But the point is that over here we're talking about Khulin Shinaswatar Saqidesh, we know that there's a Gzaira Dira Bananan.
2:44
SPEAKER_00: That when you take upon yourself this khumra of Khulin Shinaswatarza Kaidesh, it actually makes a nafkimina la aloha.
2:50
SPEAKER_00: We're gonna treat it like Kaidesh, and we're gonna give it that khimer to actually give it uh Dinaituma as if it was Kaidesh, as if it was Truma because you took upon yourself this kumra.
3:00
SPEAKER_00: So, what was the answer again?
3:01
SPEAKER_00: Very simple answer.
3:01
SPEAKER_00: We're talking about what was the question?
3:03
SPEAKER_00: You're your daimer already a shani, and we're talking about being Metame Hulin.
3:07
SPEAKER_00: Hulin cannot become a slishi.
3:08
SPEAKER_00: So what are we worried about?
3:09
SPEAKER_00: You're a daimar shani, you're gonna touch it, it's gonna become a slishi.
3:12
SPEAKER_00: There's no such thing as a slishi by chulin.
3:14
SPEAKER_00: The answer is Hulin Shnasu Attaras Haqadesh.
3:16
SPEAKER_00: If it's Hulin Shinaswataris Akadesh, it takes on the din and the chimer of Kaidesh, so just like Khaidesh can become a slishi, by the way, also Rabi, so too this buster now is gonna be able to, because we're talking about Hulin Shinasu Ataras Ha Kaidesh.
3:27
SPEAKER_00: That was yesterday.
3:28
SPEAKER_00: When we answered that, at first we said, Udalike Rabishua.
3:31
SPEAKER_00: That answer is not gonna work like Rabishhua.
3:33
SPEAKER_00: Why?
3:33
SPEAKER_00: Because we saw, according to the first Sheita, that Ribish would not hold Bikla there's a Kumra of Khul and Shanasu Ataras a Kaidesh.
3:39
SPEAKER_00: He disagrees completely.
3:40
SPEAKER_00: He only holds of Khulin Shanasu Ataras a Truma.
3:42
SPEAKER_00: Taras Akhaidesh, no, it's not Shiach, but Luddaita, we saw that yesterday.
3:46
SPEAKER_00: That is according to the way Rabbi Babrachan brought it down in the name of Ruby'ichana.
3:49
SPEAKER_00: We brought a steer in Ruby's, as we saw yesterday.
3:52
SPEAKER_00: But that was the first uh Ribishwa.
3:54
SPEAKER_00: Then we had a machleikis, we because we brought a different Rabbi Akhanan that explained Pshan in Rubishhua, that it actually can be even according to Ribishwa, because even Urbishwa is gonna agree that there is such a concept of Hulinshannasu, Altaira Sakhardash.
4:06
SPEAKER_00: That was Ribishua.
4:07
SPEAKER_00: Now to explain Ribishwa, we brought the Machlekas between Urbishua and Rabelezar.
4:10
SPEAKER_00: It was Ribishwa and Rabelezar, where Ribbelezar told us how tomo works when you eat.
4:15
SPEAKER_00: What about when you eat a uh when you eat the tomo itself?
4:19
SPEAKER_00: So Rabelezzar's Sheeta was very straightforward.
4:21
SPEAKER_00: You eat a rishan, you become a Rishan.
4:22
SPEAKER_00: You eat a shani, you become a shani.
4:24
SPEAKER_00: You eat a shishi, you become a shlishi.
4:26
SPEAKER_00: Rabishwa was a little more complicated.
4:27
SPEAKER_00: We saw the reasonings for them yesterday.
4:29
SPEAKER_00: That was the main part of yesterday's dah.
4:32
SPEAKER_00: But what we need for today was pretty much everything we said so far.
4:35
SPEAKER_00: And Ribshita's Ribishwa, which we're gonna get into in a second.
4:39
SPEAKER_00: So Amr Ula.
4:40
SPEAKER_00: Ulah says now, because Ulah was bringing from back to Rabyaichan as we saw yesterday, he brought the second shita within Rabalezh, within Rabishhua that we saw, that even her shua is gonna be masking that there's such a concept of Hulin Shenasuataras Akhesh.
4:52
SPEAKER_00: But now Ulah says himself, not quoting anyone.
4:58
SPEAKER_00: Someone who eats a shlishi, now what kind of shlishi this was this?
5:02
SPEAKER_00: This was a shlishi of chulin shanasuataras truma.
5:04
SPEAKER_00: Not kholin shanasuataras ka dash.
5:07
SPEAKER_00: Nifsaw gufoy milachabruma.
5:09
SPEAKER_00: What happens is his guof becomes puzzle from eating truma.
5:12
SPEAKER_00: What does that mean in English?
5:13
SPEAKER_00: It means he becomes a shlishi.
5:14
SPEAKER_00: You eat a slishi of khun shanasuataras truma, you become a slishi.
5:18
SPEAKER_00: And ain rashi, but we're going in shita sribishwa.
5:20
SPEAKER_00: Even in shita sebishwa, he's gonna be masking when you eat it as it relates to a chilah you're gonna become a slishi.
5:25
SPEAKER_00: You are what you eat as it bec uh as it relates to a khilah for this tuma.
5:29
SPEAKER_00: So if you eat a slishi of chunch and a saltaris truma, you yourself become a shlishi.
5:33
SPEAKER_00: So that's gumarash go, yeah.
5:35
SPEAKER_00: What's the khadesh?
5:36
SPEAKER_00: Tanya, we learned it yesterday.
5:37
SPEAKER_00: Shlishi, if you eat a slishi, shaini la khadesh, vain shenila truma, you're gonna become a shani for kaidesh, right?
5:43
SPEAKER_00: That was she to surbishua.
5:44
SPEAKER_00: That what?
5:45
SPEAKER_00: If you eat a slishi, you're gonna become a shahini.
5:48
SPEAKER_00: Now, when does it work in the reverse, right?
5:49
SPEAKER_00: So you usually it dilutes itself.
5:51
SPEAKER_00: So we saw the reason yesterday.
5:52
SPEAKER_00: Shani La Kaidesh, because we saw, and we're gonna reference it again today, because as it relates to Kaidesh, Kaidesh is much more Khammer.
5:59
SPEAKER_00: So even if you had a Shmira as it relates to Truma and you kept yourself and you know it's only a Shlishi, that Shmera, you can't rely on it for the Humra of Kaidesh.
6:06
SPEAKER_00: And therefore, if you eat a Shlishi that you think is a Shlishi for Truma, when you eat it, now you are a uh now it goes back to Arishan.
6:15
SPEAKER_00: It goes back to Rishin because we have to assume the worst of the worst.
6:18
SPEAKER_00: We have to assume this was nothing.
6:19
SPEAKER_00: This was no shmeer the khlao for Kaidesh because Kaidesh is more Khammer.
6:22
SPEAKER_00: And therefore it goes back to Arisha.
6:23
SPEAKER_00: Now, when Rishan is Madama something, it becomes a shani.
6:26
SPEAKER_00: And that's why Rishin or Shlishi, if you eat a slishi, shaimi la Kaidesh.
6:30
SPEAKER_00: Become a shani as relates to Khartchin, then Shani Luma, but not for Truma.
6:34
SPEAKER_00: That wouldn't apply for Truma, because a Shlishi already can't, uh the most Truma could be is a Shlishi, and it's not gonna make Truma uh tummy over here.
6:40
SPEAKER_00: So what do we see over here?
6:41
SPEAKER_00: What's the dick?
6:41
SPEAKER_00: The dick is shaimihudal have.
6:43
SPEAKER_00: As it relates to Kaidesh, right, it becomes a shaini la Kaidesh, the ain't shaini the truma.
6:49
SPEAKER_00: But for truma, it does not become a shaini.
6:51
SPEAKER_00: Shanihudlay have it.
6:52
SPEAKER_00: Sounds like it's not gonna be a shiny, but a slishi have it, but it will be a slishi, which is the same exact thing Ula just said.
6:57
SPEAKER_00: If you eat a slishi of Hulin Shana Swatara's truma, then you become a shlishhi, right?
7:01
SPEAKER_00: And if so, goof and lachab a truma, you become a shlishhi.
7:04
SPEAKER_00: We said the same thing over here.
7:05
SPEAKER_00: We're making a deal over here, right?
7:07
SPEAKER_00: You don't that that when you eat a slishi, you become a shamey for kachin, but not a shamie for truma.
7:12
SPEAKER_00: Mashma what?
7:12
SPEAKER_00: That you don't become a shami for truma, but you become a slishi for truma.
7:15
SPEAKER_00: So that basically means when you eat a shlishi, you become a slishi for truma.
7:18
SPEAKER_00: Exactly what it was said.
7:19
SPEAKER_00: Says the gumara, my comashma and tanina, we learned it yesterday.
7:22
SPEAKER_00: And says the gimmara imeahi.
7:23
SPEAKER_00: If I only had that, havamina.
7:24
SPEAKER_00: And that was shit for the way.
7:26
SPEAKER_00: If I only had that, she to Rabishua spelled out Havamina Loy Sheni Have Slishi Have I wouldn't make that deal necessarily.
7:33
SPEAKER_00: You made a deal.
7:34
SPEAKER_00: That Shani Latru Likoidesh, the ain't sheni litruma.
7:37
SPEAKER_00: Mashma, ain't shani litruma, but shlishhi letruma.
7:40
SPEAKER_00: So the girl, no, I wouldn't have made that deal.
7:42
SPEAKER_00: I would think as it relates to truma, you're nothing.
7:43
SPEAKER_00: You're not a shani, you're not even a shlishy.
7:45
SPEAKER_00: Okay, so why did it only say the ain't shani litruma if it's not even a shlishy, you say better.
7:52
SPEAKER_00: Say better.
7:53
SPEAKER_00: Why you only say the ain't shenatruma?
7:54
SPEAKER_00: But I did it.
7:55
SPEAKER_00: Um, shani bakaidesh, amarnami, ain't shani but truma.
7:58
SPEAKER_00: Because that was uh that was the flow of the Mishnah.
8:00
SPEAKER_00: Sometimes the Tana does that, as we know.
8:01
SPEAKER_00: To keep better with the flow, he'll say something that even is a little bit misleading.
8:04
SPEAKER_00: And therefore, since we said Shani Bakaidesh, we also said ain't shenibitruma.
8:08
SPEAKER_00: But in Khanam, you're right.
8:09
SPEAKER_00: Also in Shlishibitruma, and it's not gonna be true.
8:11
SPEAKER_00: Kamash Malan, Ulah comes along to tell us that no, as it relates to a slish, you are gonna be a slish.
8:15
SPEAKER_00: For Slishi, you are going to become a Slishhi if you eat it.
8:18
SPEAKER_00: Says Gamara Acevi Ravamnunal Ullah, Rivamnuna asked the following on Ulah Rishain Shbehulen.
8:24
SPEAKER_00: As it relates to our Rishan of Hulin, Tame umitame.
8:28
SPEAKER_00: So again, we have to become familiar with these terms.
8:31
SPEAKER_00: We referenced them a little bit yesterday.
8:32
SPEAKER_00: But tame means uh there's a difference between tame and poison.
8:37
SPEAKER_00: If something's mitame something, then it means that you could be mitame that thing, and that thing can give over tamah to something else as well.
8:42
SPEAKER_00: That's mitame.
8:43
SPEAKER_00: Poison means you could be mitame something, you could give it a psul, but that's gonna be the final resting place.
8:49
SPEAKER_00: That's gonna be the final stop because uh it's either a shani lehulin, a shlishuma, revi ba kaidush.
8:54
SPEAKER_00: There's no hemshikh that it could have.
8:55
SPEAKER_00: But either way, harish and should be hulin as relates to hulin, a reason of hulin tameh.
8:59
SPEAKER_00: So it itself is tame, what does that mean?
9:01
SPEAKER_00: That it can be mitame morhulin, because a hulin can become a shani, and this is just a reason, so it could be mitame morhulin to make it a shani.
9:07
SPEAKER_00: Very good.
9:07
SPEAKER_00: Um mitame, and it also can be mitame, mitame means that not only are you making something else tameh, that thing you're making tame has the ability to be mitame something else.
9:16
SPEAKER_00: So what's that?
9:16
SPEAKER_00: What's a mitame?
9:17
SPEAKER_00: It's mitame truma.
9:18
SPEAKER_00: So that re shin of hulin is mitame truma, because if it touches truma, that truma becomes a shaini lituma, and that shani of truma can be mitame more truma that makes it into a shlishi.
9:28
SPEAKER_00: So it's mitame truma.
9:30
SPEAKER_00: To be mitame something else, right?
9:31
SPEAKER_00: To be tame more truma.
9:32
SPEAKER_00: The hasheni poisilvainimitame.
9:34
SPEAKER_00: So that was all as it relates to a rishon for chulin.
9:36
SPEAKER_00: A reishan furchulin to can make uh shayni bichulin and a shlish bathruma.
9:40
SPEAKER_00: Very good.
9:41
SPEAKER_00: But as it relates to uh the asheni, a shaini bichulin, poisil veinimatame.
9:45
SPEAKER_00: It's only gonna pasel truma.
9:47
SPEAKER_00: Why?
9:48
SPEAKER_00: Because again, poisil means it can make the other thing tameh, but it ends there.
9:51
SPEAKER_00: So it could be poison truma, because by the time the shaini makes the truma tame, it's the truma's already a shlish.
9:56
SPEAKER_00: The shlishi can't make a reveal but truma, there's no such thing.
9:58
SPEAKER_00: It's only by cutchin that you have a ravine.
10:00
SPEAKER_00: And therefore, Vasheni poisel, a sheni of chulin is gonna be pasel truma to that's gonna be the final stop.
10:05
SPEAKER_00: Any metal, but it's not metane because again, it can't transmit it further.
10:08
SPEAKER_00: Veha shlishi, and a hulin that's a slishi, you could have hulin, that's a slishi, interesting.
10:13
SPEAKER_00: But for our purposes, we're gonna see in a second, hulin that's a slishi, necha benizida demma.
10:19
SPEAKER_00: It could be eaten even with truma.
10:21
SPEAKER_00: What does this mean?
10:21
SPEAKER_00: Is it is some type of stew, dema refers to truma.
10:24
SPEAKER_00: So you can eat it even with mamash a stew that has like spices of truma.
10:27
SPEAKER_00: You could eat a shlishi of hulin, mamish with truma inside.
10:30
SPEAKER_00: What's the problem?
10:31
SPEAKER_00: The problem is that vi amrit nifsaw gufachabatruma.
10:35
SPEAKER_00: If you're gonna tell me, like you said before, that hulin shenasu altiras a truma when you eat it, and it's a slishi, you yourself become a slishi.
10:43
SPEAKER_00: Nif so guf email truma, you become a slishi, then now you're not allowed to eat truma.
10:47
SPEAKER_00: Then and by the way, what's the question?
10:49
SPEAKER_00: The question what's the question?
10:50
SPEAKER_00: If you if you you might have had this question if you noticed, we're talking about what was the what do we just bring this all back and forth?
10:55
SPEAKER_00: We're talking about regular chulin, right?
10:56
SPEAKER_00: Well didn't we say this alaqah by chulin shanasu uh altiras a truma?
11:00
SPEAKER_00: So what are you asking me from regular hulan?
11:01
SPEAKER_00: By chun shanas altera truma, maybe you have this alacha that you become a slishi, but over here, regular hulan, you don't become a slishi.
11:06
SPEAKER_00: So what's the uh difference?
11:07
SPEAKER_00: You have to say, because we're talking about a case where it's mixed in with the truma already.
11:11
SPEAKER_00: It's nechub binizid had dema.
11:13
SPEAKER_00: So over here, even if you don't take upon yourself the khumra of khun shanas ali day, altarasa truma, you're gonna have to keep it.
11:19
SPEAKER_00: Even if you're not from those machmiram over here, it's mixed in with truma mamr, so it needs the khumra of truma.
11:24
SPEAKER_00: That's Pashbshan over here, why it's uh why it's gonna be on the same level as we said before of Kulin Shana Altashuma.
11:29
SPEAKER_00: But either way, the eye amrf nip so guuf milkabruma.
11:31
SPEAKER_00: If you're gonna tell me that when you eat a shlishi, you become a shlishi, nipso guuf truma, then safina lay midi de pasle the gufe, then I don't understand.
11:39
SPEAKER_00: How can you eat a shlishi of hul in shnasa altice of truma?
11:43
SPEAKER_00: How can you eat that along with truma?
11:45
SPEAKER_00: You're you we're gonna give you something tea that's gonna pasle you, that's gonna passle your guof.
11:49
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't make any sense.
11:50
SPEAKER_00: So I'm answering the back.
11:52
SPEAKER_00: Hanachu nizira dema, the leka kazayas bikidea kila's pras.
11:55
SPEAKER_00: Answer the back, then no.
11:57
SPEAKER_00: Is different.
11:58
SPEAKER_00: Why?
11:58
SPEAKER_00: Because there's no kazayas, bikedea khilas pras, there's no kazayas of truma.
12:02
SPEAKER_00: In kedeahilas pras which you need in order to be arbitration.
12:06
SPEAKER_00: Why?
12:07
SPEAKER_00: Because it's only tavlinim, as we saw.
12:08
SPEAKER_00: This nzira dema, it's mainly gonna be chulin, and you have these uh spices of truma.
12:12
SPEAKER_00: Since you don't have a kazayas, bikideachilas pras, zakrashi do lay ihchpaslon yalchil tavli truma of the psula gof.
12:18
SPEAKER_00: We don't eat, we don't care, bikhlao.
12:19
SPEAKER_00: As long as it's less than the shear, you didn't do anything wrong, we don't care if you eat it.
12:22
SPEAKER_00: Even if you have a psula goph, we don't care if you eat the truma because it's not a kazais, big dahilaspras, and that's why it's different.
12:27
SPEAKER_00: Don't ask me to regular truma.
12:28
SPEAKER_00: Regular truma, you're right.
12:29
SPEAKER_00: You're 100% gonna be gonna be considered a shleash, you're not gonna be able to eat it.
12:32
SPEAKER_00: As it relates to tarubas, where you're not gonna have uh truma, that's that's kazais, but's pras.
12:37
SPEAKER_00: That we're not necessarily worried about.
12:40
SPEAKER_00: You don't have to be worried about truma, which means that you don't have to eat this chulin altaris at Truma, which means no problem over here, says the Gemara.
12:48
SPEAKER_00: I'm Rabionasan.
12:49
SPEAKER_00: Rabyonasan says, Am Rabi, in the name of Rebbi.
12:53
SPEAKER_00: So so far we're talking about someone who eats a slishi of uh chulin shenasu altiras truma.
12:57
SPEAKER_00: Now we're talking about slishi of trumaatma, truma itself, bona fide truma.
13:01
SPEAKER_00: So someone eats shlishi of trumaatma.
13:04
SPEAKER_00: So asur la hol ummutaliga.
13:06
SPEAKER_00: The allahu is that you have to look at him like a slishi.
13:09
SPEAKER_00: He becomes a shlishi.
13:10
SPEAKER_00: Uh kind of it's very similar to what Ula just said.
13:13
SPEAKER_00: So but Rabiakhan is talking about trumaatma, truma itself.
13:16
SPEAKER_00: Ula was talking about Hulin Shnasu altar's truma.
13:18
SPEAKER_00: So Rabbi's uh Bionisan says in the name of Rebbe that if you eat a slishi of truma itself, you become a slishi, which means that what?
13:26
SPEAKER_00: You can do the khajbin yourself without reading the next words.
13:28
SPEAKER_00: Achul Asul Lakal, you're not allowed to eat truma umutuliga.
13:32
SPEAKER_00: But you're because you're a slishi and you can't eat truma but tumasagup, of course.
13:35
SPEAKER_00: But you're allowed to touch truma.
13:36
SPEAKER_00: Why are you allowed to touch truma?
13:37
SPEAKER_00: Because you're a slishi, and if you touch something, you're you're gonna dilute the tumma, and if you're gonna be mutama anything, it's only gonna be a ravi.
13:42
SPEAKER_00: Now, truma does not become a ravi, and it's only cut shuma, and that's why you're allowed to touch the truma, but you're not allowed to eat it, because at the end of the day, you have sh your slishi butuma, you have tumasagoph and you're not allowed to eat truma with tumasagf.
13:52
SPEAKER_00: So very good.
13:52
SPEAKER_00: You become a slishi, oh salah, mutteriga, you're not allowed to eat it, but you are allowed to touch the trumah because truma does not become a ravi.
13:59
SPEAKER_00: The itzrich, says the gumara, okay.
14:00
SPEAKER_00: So I just had a aloach from Ribyanasan in the name of Rebbe, and I had a very similar alocha from Ulah, and the only difference was that Ulah was talking about Hulin Shinaswatar's Truma, and Rubyannisan was talking about Trumaatsmah.
14:10
SPEAKER_00: But what's the difference?
14:11
SPEAKER_00: Says the Gemara, why do you need both the Itstrah?
14:13
SPEAKER_00: I need both Ruby and both Ulah.
14:15
SPEAKER_00: Why?
14:16
SPEAKER_00: Its trich the Ulah, the Itsrich to Rubyanisan.
14:19
SPEAKER_00: I need Ulah's aloha about Hulin Shinaswatar Satuma, and Rubyanisan that said it about Truma itself.
14:24
SPEAKER_00: Dimitz only had Ulah.
14:30
SPEAKER_00: I would think that's only true that you're allowed to touch it as a Slishi, and you're not gonna transmit the term Lituma further by Khulin Shenas Truma.
14:37
SPEAKER_00: And then the day it's not Truma itself, so maybe it's more cal.
14:40
SPEAKER_00: Avil Truma, but Truma itself, maybe you're not even allowed to touch it.
14:44
SPEAKER_00: If you're a Shlishi, Latuma by Truma itself, maybe you're not allowed to touch it.
14:48
SPEAKER_00: Maybe it should be Asir.
14:49
SPEAKER_00: Now you're gonna ask me why.
14:50
SPEAKER_00: What's the Havamina to say it's Asir?
14:51
SPEAKER_00: Why not?
14:52
SPEAKER_00: There's no problem.
14:53
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't, it's not clutch, it doesn't become a reveal.
14:55
SPEAKER_00: Why can't you touch it even by Truma Atma?
14:57
SPEAKER_00: So it's like Toys, Toy says right here, Avagab Deina is a reveal, Havamina the Asur Liga de Gazrin non Shleyavaleho.
15:03
SPEAKER_00: I would think maybe we make a Xyra.
15:04
SPEAKER_00: You're not allowed to touch it, you're right.
15:05
SPEAKER_00: Even though touching it doesn't do anything, even by real Truma.
15:08
SPEAKER_00: I would think maybe you can't touch it because we make a Xira.
15:10
SPEAKER_00: If you touch you, might come to eat it.
15:11
SPEAKER_00: Come ashman that we don't.
15:12
SPEAKER_00: But either way, that's why I need it's trigger myasan.
15:15
SPEAKER_00: That's why I need Romanason's a lacha that says it by actual trumah.
15:17
SPEAKER_00: The imid Rabyna son, and if I only had Rabyina Sun and not Ulah, Hava Mina Hani mean the truma of a chulin bachilanami share.
15:24
SPEAKER_00: I would think the opposite.
15:25
SPEAKER_00: That this is only true, that you're not allowed to eat it by chulin.
15:28
SPEAKER_00: By truma, sorry, truma itself.
15:30
SPEAKER_00: But by hulin, bachilinamish, or maybe by tru but maybe by chulin.
15:34
SPEAKER_00: It's in the end of the day, it's only a humra of hul and shanasal target the truma.
15:37
SPEAKER_00: It's not truma itself, and therefore in Bahila Nami, maybe even Achilah Kamashmalan or Trichi, that's why I need both Ruby's son and Ulah.
15:46
SPEAKER_00: And that's the first part of today's daff.
15:47
SPEAKER_00: Viter.
15:48
SPEAKER_00: We're gonna have ten minutes left, we'll probably just turn the page.
15:51
SPEAKER_00: But anyway.
15:52
SPEAKER_00: Yotsim Ravyitzkhok Bar Shmul Barmarta.
15:56
SPEAKER_00: So Ravyitzokh Barshmuel Barmarto was sitting before Abnachman.
15:59
SPEAKER_00: He was sitting and saying over the following.
16:04
SPEAKER_00: Someone who eats a slishi of hulin, and this hulin was chulen shenasu ataras a koidash, not taris a chuma.
16:10
SPEAKER_00: Tohor lechobakesh alloch is he's allowed to eat kochim.
16:14
SPEAKER_00: Now this is very surprising, why?
16:15
SPEAKER_00: Because a koidesh takes on the din of Khotchim itself.
16:19
SPEAKER_00: How could you eat Khajchim?
16:20
SPEAKER_00: This is only a slishi.
16:21
SPEAKER_00: Kachim has a problem by Ravi as well, as we know.
16:24
SPEAKER_00: So, how are you gonna eat Khajim?
16:26
SPEAKER_00: She ein the khadovers reveal Kaidesh Ella Koidish Mekudish Bilvat.
16:30
SPEAKER_00: Because the only thing that can make Kotchim into Ravi is Kaidesh Mekodish Bilvat.
16:35
SPEAKER_00: Meaning this whole Khumra of Khulin Shinaswatara Sakhadesh is very nice for Rishan Shane Slishi.
16:40
SPEAKER_00: But it doesn't take on the din of actual Kotram that goes down to Ravi.
16:43
SPEAKER_00: By Ravi, by the way, the Ravi, the whole concept of the Iker Toma of a Ravi, but Koidesh is only uh tomadana.
16:51
SPEAKER_00: That there's even a concept of a Rav by Khajan, because there were Gaiser by Khajan.
16:55
SPEAKER_00: But it's only Dirabanan in the first place, and we're not gonna make a Dirabanan and Dirabanan to tell you that Hulin Shinaswa Tirus Kaidesh also has that maximum uh toma level of a Ravi.
17:04
SPEAKER_00: And therefore, the only thing that can be Metamita Raviv is Koidish Mekodish itself.
17:07
SPEAKER_00: What's Khadesh Mekodish like Rashi?
17:09
SPEAKER_00: Koidish Gumur.
17:10
SPEAKER_00: Shekadesh Gufa.
17:11
SPEAKER_00: It's only Koidesh, that's Kaidish Gomar, that's Kadesh Bikedush's a Guf.
17:14
SPEAKER_00: Rashi brings a few examples like Basar Karbon and Halasa Toidosh and Ishkat uh Haseva Halim and Munach Shekin Shabikli.
17:21
SPEAKER_00: Only something that's Koidesh Gomur, and it was Khadesh Bikidusha's Haguf.
17:26
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
17:28
SPEAKER_00: Only that you're going to have a Rabiba Khoidesh.
17:30
SPEAKER_00: And therefore, again, what the halacha that Rabitsubarish Mo Barmarta said in the name in front of Rabinachman, he said, overall, you have a Slish of Khulinsh and Asalatarza Khoidesh.
17:40
SPEAKER_00: It's gonna be this guy's gonna be allowed to eat khodim itself because at the end of the day it's only a humra and it's not khadesh kadashim itself.
17:46
SPEAKER_00: That's the only thing that you could have a problem of rabih.
17:48
SPEAKER_00: It says Gemara Masiv Rami Barhama, but Rami Marhama asked on this Shhlishi.
17:54
SPEAKER_00: So Ramirahama is now quoting in Rabishwa from yesterday.
17:56
SPEAKER_00: This was Sheeta's Ribishwa.
17:58
SPEAKER_00: And we pass in like Rabishua, against Rabelezar especially, Ribelezar Shamoti.
18:02
SPEAKER_00: And therefore we go with Rabishua here.
18:03
SPEAKER_00: So that's what we the assumption was since we started the da.
18:05
SPEAKER_00: So Rabishwa said what yesterday?
18:07
SPEAKER_00: Shlishi, Shani Lakadesh.
18:09
SPEAKER_00: If you eat a Shlishi, you become a Shani as it relates to Kachim.
18:13
SPEAKER_00: Why?
18:13
SPEAKER_00: Because we saw, because we're talking about Hulin Shinaswatar's Shuma.
18:16
SPEAKER_00: Hul and Shanasuatara Satruma is not counted.
18:19
SPEAKER_00: Uh we don't, it's not a shmeer for kochim.
18:21
SPEAKER_00: So for kachim, we have to assume the worst.
18:22
SPEAKER_00: It goes back to zero.
18:23
SPEAKER_00: Now, if you're a Rishan, so when it's metami, it's gonna be a shiny.
18:26
SPEAKER_00: And that's why Shlishi Shane Lakoidesh becomes a shani as relates to Kachim.
18:29
SPEAKER_00: Vain Shani Latruma, and what are we talking about?
18:31
SPEAKER_00: Like we just said, Bhunchinasu Taras Satuma.
18:33
SPEAKER_00: That's only true by Khulin Shinasu Altaira Satrum.
18:39
SPEAKER_00: Why do we say this?
18:40
SPEAKER_00: Halav Koidesh Mikudishhu.
18:42
SPEAKER_00: So you have to make a big hanacho in the question.
18:45
SPEAKER_00: The big presumption we're assuming in the question is that the same way this is true by Hulin Shinas Altara Satrum, that would be true by Hulin Shinas Altara Sakadesh.
18:53
SPEAKER_00: We're assuming it would be the same thing.
19:05
SPEAKER_00: And we're saying that it's not this guy's gonna go be able to go and eat uh Khodchim even because it's the only thing that you have a Pramuravi by is Kaidesh Mikladesh.
19:14
SPEAKER_00: Over here, Shlishhi becomes back to a shani by Khajim.
19:16
SPEAKER_00: It's not considered anything.
19:17
SPEAKER_00: You go back to ground zero by Kodchim.
19:19
SPEAKER_00: And we're assuming again, even though it's talking about Shuma Bhik, Bikun Shinasu Ataras Truma, we're assuming the same thing would be by Kun Shinasu Atarasa Kaidesh.
19:26
SPEAKER_00: So Mai, Holaf Kaidash Mikodush, like we just said.
19:28
SPEAKER_00: So I'm laying answered in back.
19:31
SPEAKER_00: That was the Ikhar difference.
19:32
SPEAKER_00: You had the wrong hanacha.
19:33
SPEAKER_00: You said this Allah Baikun Shanasu Atarasa Truma.
19:36
SPEAKER_00: But Truma is different.
19:36
SPEAKER_00: Why?
19:37
SPEAKER_00: As we saw, Shatah Ratzah, Tuma yetso kazah Kaidesh.
19:41
SPEAKER_00: Because even what's considered Tahur as it relates to Truma, and if you were you had a Shmeera for Truma and you know it's only a Shneashi but Truma, that Shmira is considered nothing as relates to Khram.
19:50
SPEAKER_00: Khajum is more Khamar, and therefore it goes back to zero.
19:53
SPEAKER_00: It goes back to being Arishan as relates to Kaidesh because Kaidesh is more Khamar like we saw yesterday.
19:57
SPEAKER_00: So this is more manatimra, and now we bring them a card to this, referenced it yesterday in Rashi.
20:02
SPEAKER_00: How do we know that there's this concept that even the tahara of Truma is considered Tuma yet?
20:07
SPEAKER_00: Kaaidesh, Mattimr, that's not.
20:08
SPEAKER_00: We have a Mishnah.
20:09
SPEAKER_00: Big day Ama Arats, Midras Leprushim.
20:11
SPEAKER_00: The bagotim of Amarats that are not necessarily tomate, they're gonna tell you it's taur.
20:15
SPEAKER_00: Still midras leprushim.
20:16
SPEAKER_00: For prushim, for tomid chahamim chaveirim, it's gonna be considered come as midras.
20:21
SPEAKER_00: Midras is a classic way of saying toma, specific type of tumma we're about to see.
20:24
SPEAKER_00: But either way, it's considered midras leprushim.
20:26
SPEAKER_00: As it relates to Pushim, you have to assume all big de ama arats are probably big deprushim.
20:30
SPEAKER_00: Even the bagotim of the chaveirim of the prushim, they're midras la eikli truma.
20:34
SPEAKER_00: For I truma, people that were uh Ichhle Truma and kept upon themselves that level of tahara, so you have to be Hajj from the bagodim of even Prushim.
20:41
SPEAKER_00: And big de Ichli Truma, and even the bagotim of Ihli Truma that's Mammishtar, Midras Lakhadesh.
20:46
SPEAKER_00: As relates to Kotchim, we have to assume it's Mammishtameh.
20:49
SPEAKER_00: And therefore we see that even we see Taharasa, even the Tahara of Truma is Tumahiatza La Khoidesh.
20:55
SPEAKER_00: It's not counted for Khadesh.
20:56
SPEAKER_00: But Rama Rava, Raba said, how could you apply that to you?
20:58
SPEAKER_00: How could that be your Mikar?
20:59
SPEAKER_00: How could you apply that to here?
21:00
SPEAKER_00: Midrasa is Kamrit.
21:02
SPEAKER_00: You're bringing a rival from Thomas Medras.
21:04
SPEAKER_00: Why?
21:04
SPEAKER_00: What's the what's the problem?
21:05
SPEAKER_00: Tomas Medras is uh more of a there's much more of a khash by Thomas Medras.
21:10
SPEAKER_00: And the point and the reason is because it's much more much more shiach.
21:13
SPEAKER_00: That's the point over here.
21:14
SPEAKER_00: Thomas Medras is a certain type of tumma that uh from any type of uh tumma that's yotzemea guf, tumma that uh comes out of the body, and then that person sits on something or lays down on something, that's Thomas Medras.
21:24
SPEAKER_00: Now you could imagine that happens all day, right?
21:26
SPEAKER_00: You have people that are telling me of Nidas and Zabis walking around and they're sitting on the bus or whatever.
21:30
SPEAKER_00: They these things happen, you know, it's nice and bhayam and it's very, very shiach.
21:33
SPEAKER_00: And therefore, Shahni Midrasi says the Gemara, since it's so Shiach, how can you bring me a rayah from Tamas Madras over here?
21:41
SPEAKER_00: What we're talking about, which is regular pairas.
21:42
SPEAKER_00: Regular pairas is not as shiach.
21:44
SPEAKER_00: You usually keep it uh, you know, you're more careful with it, you keep the trummaspa, you keep it bitahara, and therefore, how can you bring me a ray from medris?
21:51
SPEAKER_00: Shani Midrasis Shema Teshe Valen Ishta Ninda.
21:54
SPEAKER_00: Because again, we have the concept that it's much more shiach, if it's much more shiach.
21:57
SPEAKER_00: That's why we have to assume uh much more to Well, we have to assume that just because it's good for this, namoras, doesn't mean it's good for the cover.
22:04
SPEAKER_00: And so on and so forth.
22:05
SPEAKER_00: And Shamateshev, by the way, sounds like it's future tense.
22:07
SPEAKER_00: Rah, she says right here, Shema Yashva.
22:09
SPEAKER_00: We're worried Shema Yasma.
22:10
SPEAKER_00: Maybe she sat on it.
22:11
SPEAKER_00: Maybe Ishtanina, again, the wife's all over the house.
22:13
SPEAKER_00: Maybe she sat down.
22:13
SPEAKER_00: And that's why it's gonna be a problem.
22:14
SPEAKER_00: I'm a bit paid, but regular Paris.
22:16
SPEAKER_00: Loyamarin, we're not gonna say this.
22:17
SPEAKER_00: How could you bring me a ray to apply it over here?
22:20
SPEAKER_00: That uh the even the tahara of Truma is gonna be Tomoy and Sala Kadesh.
22:23
SPEAKER_00: Maybe it's different over there, it's a Ms.
22:24
SPEAKER_00: Medris.
22:24
SPEAKER_00: Over here we're talking about Peris.
22:26
SPEAKER_00: What's Rebits gonna say?
22:27
SPEAKER_00: But Pairi Nami Amri is gonna say there's no difference.
22:29
SPEAKER_00: I hear, but no, I disagree.
22:31
SPEAKER_00: That by Peris this actually also applies.
22:34
SPEAKER_00: Must have revered Miyamidifti.
22:36
SPEAKER_00: Revere Miami Difti asks the following.
22:40
SPEAKER_00: That Umi Amrina Biperi.
22:42
SPEAKER_00: Do we say this Humra even by Perus?
22:45
SPEAKER_00: That what?
22:45
SPEAKER_00: That the big day Amarets again, what's too what's considered Toma, not begun, but that's by medicine, but what's considered Tuma by uh by Truma, or what's considered Tahara by Truma is really even considered Tuma by Kaidesh.
22:57
SPEAKER_00: So it goes up a level.
22:59
SPEAKER_00: Do we say that even by Feris Vatana?
23:00
SPEAKER_00: But rem a mishnah Im Amar Hifrashti Lisa Ravis, Kaidesh Nemon Veloika Mitameleh Truma the Kaidesh.
23:08
SPEAKER_00: So this is in the context that we don't believe an Am'arets as relates to his uh his if he brings us a vat of something, whatever it is, and he says that it's uh if he brings us a vat of truma and he says that it's tar, we don't believe him.
23:20
SPEAKER_00: We don't take his word on it that it's tar.
23:21
SPEAKER_00: However, Kaidesh, Kodim, we do.
23:24
SPEAKER_00: He brings us khajim and says that he kept it a tahara, we're gonna believe him.
23:28
SPEAKER_00: And we trust him as it relates to khadchim.
23:29
SPEAKER_00: Now it's a little counterintuitive.
23:31
SPEAKER_00: You're gonna say what's going on.
23:31
SPEAKER_00: We don't trust him for truma, which is less humar, and we trust him for kudchim that's more humar.
23:35
SPEAKER_00: So the answer is yes, because special khshash by kudchim, that if you're not gonna accept his khakshim, he's gonna come to the base amygdash, you're gonna tell him to go, you don't believe everything's tar, and therefore um this guy's gonna go and build his own Bama, he's gonna wind up a lot worse.
23:49
SPEAKER_00: And that's why by Kachim, there's a there's a certain trust we put him in, even though I hear you're right, it's actually more humm than truma.
23:55
SPEAKER_00: But truma we're not gonna trust, and therefore, what's the halacha when he mixes the two?
23:59
SPEAKER_00: When he mixes Kachim and Truma together, do we trust it or not?
24:02
SPEAKER_00: Do we trust him if he says tar or not?
24:03
SPEAKER_00: So Imam, ifrash to the Sechrabi is Qadesh.
24:05
SPEAKER_00: If he brings us of that of Truma, and he says, by the way, some of it, if Frashti Lusek Rabi is Kaidesh, I it was Makdish, some of this to be Khajim, and some of it, Mamishin here is Kachim, and I'm telling you it's all tar.
24:15
SPEAKER_00: So Naaman, he's gonna be believed, and he's gonna be believed about all of it, not only the Khadchim inside, even the Truma inside is gonna be believed as tar.
24:22
SPEAKER_00: Why?
24:23
SPEAKER_00: Or rather, if you're gonna tell me that we don't believe him about the truma, then the truma we assume is tomai.
24:29
SPEAKER_00: Now it's mixed in with the kachim now that we believe him is tar.
24:33
SPEAKER_00: Says the Gemara, the laika metamele truma lakoidesh.
24:35
SPEAKER_00: The truma inside is not being metamid the koidesh inside?
24:37
SPEAKER_00: The truma we're assuming is Tame, because we don't believe him.
24:39
SPEAKER_00: The Kaidesh we do believe him, and therefore we think it's star.
24:42
SPEAKER_00: Why wouldn't the truma be metamid the kaidesh?
24:47
SPEAKER_00: Tetame truma lakhaidesh.
24:48
SPEAKER_00: If you're gonna tell me that even the tahara of truma of if you're gonna tell me even the tahara of truma is considered is considered what's up meaning I understand you want to mix the two.
24:58
SPEAKER_00: I understand.
24:59
SPEAKER_00: And since the Gamar, I I understand the the the fact that you want to believe him on the truma.
25:06
SPEAKER_00: And maybe you really want to believe him that it's tar.
25:07
SPEAKER_00: So maybe once he's not lying about the truma, maybe he's not lying also about that.
25:11
SPEAKER_00: I hear.
25:11
SPEAKER_00: But in the end of the day, if there's this real shash, that even the tahara by truma is considered tumma he ate alakhoidesh, right?
25:20
SPEAKER_00: So on any level it should be metamayat.
25:22
SPEAKER_00: Even if you believe in believe shalom 100% that the truma is tar, it's tar and it's tar and it's tar.
25:27
SPEAKER_00: But even if it's tar, it's tame legabe kachim.
25:29
SPEAKER_00: That tehara is not considered tahara legabe khotchim, because it's not the same level as shmiro.
25:33
SPEAKER_00: Even if it was a hover that brought it to us, even if it was the Tamil Khachim that brought us a vat of truma and says that it's tar, we're not it's not gonna be tar, legabe kachim.
25:40
SPEAKER_00: Because we're gonna say that shroom, even it's tahara, is not the same level as kachim, because kachim, you need a higher level of shmirah.
25:46
SPEAKER_00: That's the question, says the gemaro.
25:48
SPEAKER_00: The e amrit tahara, so tuma hi it's a kidesh.
25:50
SPEAKER_00: We're gonna tell me even the tahara of truma is considered tumma for kaidesh.
25:53
SPEAKER_00: It's a tamit truma la kaidesh, then the to then the truma should be mitami de kaidesh.
25:58
SPEAKER_00: And says the gimara, it's a little bit kara micosaver, micasov.
26:02
SPEAKER_00: You have to understand what the shakavataria here is, but we're going back and we're saying our lay, toma bichiburin, ka'amrin.
26:07
SPEAKER_00: Don't ask me a question when it's mixed in.
26:09
SPEAKER_00: When it's mixed in, again, you have a vat, some of it is truma, some of it is kaidesh.
26:12
SPEAKER_00: Don't ask me a uh question when it's tomabihi burin, because tomabi chiburin shanny, it's different.
26:17
SPEAKER_00: Why?
26:18
SPEAKER_00: Dimigu de mehemina Khaj Ma'miname Truma.
26:20
SPEAKER_00: He has a Miguel.
26:21
SPEAKER_00: Since he is believed about the Kotchim, then he's believed also about the Truma.
26:26
SPEAKER_00: Again, he's believed about the Kotchim because we don't want him to go out and go off the D and build a Boma.
26:30
SPEAKER_00: So since he's believed about the Kotchim, he's gonna be believed about the Truma as well over here.
26:36
SPEAKER_00: However, when he brings Truma alone, that he's not gonna be believed about.
26:39
SPEAKER_00: Khiburin is shiny because it's all mixed together.
26:41
SPEAKER_00: So once you're believing him, you're believing him.
26:43
SPEAKER_00: But if he brings it alone, then you're not gonna believe him.
26:45
SPEAKER_00: We'll hold it over here for today.
26:46
SPEAKER_00: Git Sham is.