Latest / Spiritual Hot Sauce / “Finding God in the Ditch : Rebuilding Faith (Part 2 of 3)” Ep#40

Transcript

“Finding God in the Ditch : Rebuilding Faith (Part 2 of 3)” Ep#40 · Spiritual Hot Sauce

• 0:07
  Chris Jones: Welcome.
• 0:08
  Chris Jones: I'm Chris Jones.
• 0:10
  Chris Jones: This is Spiritual Hot Sauce.
• 0:16
  Chris Jones: Last week we talked about staying on square one rather than continuing on our journey of faith and maturing in it.
• 0:23
  Chris Jones: That on square one, we build a religion based on merit and earning your way up to God.
• 0:30
  Chris Jones: But I'm about where we're going, not where we've been.
• 0:33
  Chris Jones: So that's what I want to talk about.
• 0:34
  Chris Jones: Let's talk about what the church should look like and what should be happening.
• 0:38
  Chris Jones: And I think that takes us to our individual paths, because we all have a different journey and none of them are alike, even though we have the same destination.
• 0:48
  Chris Jones: So instead of going to square one and building on that, we're going to find ourselves spreading out and going to other places.
• 0:56
  Chris Jones: But that's where I think the church should be, supporting and helping that journey to make sure we stay on our path, if we fall off in the ditch, get us out of the ditch and help us back on our road.
• 1:07
  Chris Jones: It's to encourage us to keep going and comfort us when it gets tough.
• 1:12
  Chris Jones: You know, and I talked about this last week.
• 1:15
  Chris Jones: I brought up James, the pastor of the Church of Jerusalem, ground zero for Christianity.
• 1:21
  Chris Jones: And though James could have put his throne at the top of the mountain and sat and looked down at everybody else, James took the posture of Jesus because he was a disciple of Jesus.
• 1:32
  Chris Jones: And he got down in the ditch and made himself a servant, helping other people along their path in their journey when they stumble and fell in the ditch.
• 1:41
  Chris Jones: He helped them out to get them back on their path and help them get to their destination.
• 1:46
  Chris Jones: I think that's the ideal pastor.
• 1:48
  Chris Jones: It's not about a hierarchy.
• 1:50
  Chris Jones: It's not about standing atop the pulpit, but it's about helping us in the ditch and helping us get to where we need to get to.
• 1:58
  Chris Jones: Now that's key and critical.
• 2:00
  Chris Jones: I think that is exactly why the community is told to come together.
• 2:04
  Chris Jones: That is the church.
• 2:05
  Chris Jones: Now, I think when we're together in community, there is an aspect of God that we all see and share that is incredibly encouraging and comforting.
• 2:13
  Chris Jones: And I absolutely believe that.
• 2:16
  Chris Jones: But there's going to be times when you are in the ditch or you're on the journey and you're going through adversity or suffering or you're discouraged that encouragement from the community isn't going to get it done.
• 2:30
  Chris Jones: But learning how we need to see God individually, I think that is so critically important.
• 2:38
  Chris Jones: And that's something you cannot get in community, but it's something you have to find in yourself.
• 2:44
  Chris Jones: And I think a lot of us struggle with that.
• 2:46
  Chris Jones: And the reason I think we struggle with that is because we have been so trained to come together in community.
• 2:52
  Chris Jones: And then what we do is we interchange the word religious and spiritual, like they're interchangeable.
• 2:59
  Chris Jones: They mean the same thing, but they don't mean the same thing.
• 3:03
  Chris Jones: It's the spiritual stuff that happens that gives us the understanding of how we need to see God that gets us through those times that the encouragement and comfort that comes from community can't help us with.
• 3:17
  Chris Jones: Now, if you heard my conversation I had with Kyle Whitaker, the second one, Kyle shared an incredible experience that he had.
• 3:24
  Chris Jones: Kyle was in a time of his life where he was seeking God.
• 3:28
  Chris Jones: He was pushing in in community and in isolation.
• 3:31
  Chris Jones: Now he says that he was with a friend, and his friend left, and he was just sitting there reading.
• 3:36
  Chris Jones: And then he had this incredible experience.
• 3:39
  Chris Jones: He explained it where he felt like something was in the room with him and beside him from this thing that he attributes to Jesus, he says, like Jesus being there, that he had such a profound and deep emotional connection with it that it felt like a very, very close friend that no matter the distance or the time, he will always have a very loving connection to it.
• 4:06
  Chris Jones: And that after this experience was done, it was so powerful he went and laid in a bathroom floor for 10 minutes crying.
• 4:14
  Chris Jones: That's that's incredible.
• 4:16
  Chris Jones: You know, when I had Rob Field on, the director from the Center of Spiritual Wisdom, he had talked about when you have a true spiritual experience with God, that it will change your DNA, that it changes how you see everything from that point on.
• 4:32
  Chris Jones: And I think that's what happened to Kyle, because Kyle said that that experience changed the background of how he sees God.
• 4:41
  Chris Jones: And he said that even if he wanted to change it, if he tried, he don't even know if he could.
• 4:48
  Chris Jones: And that's kind of how Rob Field described it as changing your DNA, just rewiring you.
• 4:55
  Chris Jones: That's so impactful and it's so transformative, that if you were to ask Kyle today, how do you see God?
• 5:02
  Chris Jones: This is what comes up.
• 5:04
  Chris Jones: It's his experience.
• 5:06
  Chris Jones: But it will serve him the rest of his life, of his path and his journey of getting to his destination.
• 5:12
  Chris Jones: I mean, he can always choose not to go to his destination.
• 5:16
  Chris Jones: But no matter what he goes through, whatever adversity, whatever struggle is ahead, Kyle will always have this to lean into and to trust, as in relationship.
• 5:29
  Chris Jones: And I do want to clarify, this is my interpretation of what Kyle shared.
• 5:35
  Chris Jones: And in no way am I trying to say that Kyle would agree with my assessment.
• 5:40
  Chris Jones: I mean, I don't know.
• 5:41
  Chris Jones: But here's kind of how I think about this is that we should all be encouraged by the experience that Kyle had.
• 5:50
  Chris Jones: Now, I don't think that we should all be trying to recreate what happened to him or think that that's what we're all supposed to be trying to aspire to.
• 6:00
  Chris Jones: But I think we should be encouraged that we too can have an experience that is just for us.
• 6:06
  Chris Jones: It will help us understand God in the way that we need to, to help us on our path, and more importantly, help us when we're in the ditch.
• 6:17
  Chris Jones: You know, I have the series Scars That Speak, and we've got more coming, some beautiful, beautiful episodes coming.
• 6:25
  Chris Jones: But that series isn't meant to just make us feel emotions or just be performative and be entertaining and give us the feel goods.
• 6:35
  Chris Jones: It's meant to be genuine, it's meant to connect us, but I want it to inspire us and show us that during our worst moments, we can have a spiritual experience and we can see God in the way we need to to help us in our worst.
• 6:53
  Chris Jones: When I think about Brent McKay being hundreds of miles away from home in a children's cancer ward with his own 10-year-old son battling cancer, stage three cancer.
• 7:06
  Chris Jones: And after a week with no sleep, Brent watches his son fight against the treatment as the treatment begins to shut his body down.
• 7:16
  Chris Jones: That Brent is there to support and help and get his son through this because it's his only chance.
• 7:21
  Chris Jones: And finally, his son is able to finally rest.
• 7:27
  Chris Jones: So Brent thinks he's going to be able to rest.
• 7:30
  Chris Jones: But that's when the reality sets in.
• 7:33
  Chris Jones: He is surrounded by other crying children, some alone and dying.
• 7:38
  Chris Jones: And in that moment of breaking, he took his religion and he threw it back to God and said, I don't want this anymore.
• 7:47
  Chris Jones: And according to Brent, even though he didn't realize it at the time, he experienced God in a pure form.
• 7:54
  Chris Jones: He experienced God devoid of religion, and he experienced peace, immediate peace.
• 8:01
  Chris Jones: That moment was so impactful that as he moved on from it, it began to form how he sees God.
• 8:10
  Chris Jones: No longer on a mountain, no longer trying to earn his way up to pleasing God.
• 8:16
  Chris Jones: It was in that experience that Brent had his DNA changed.
• 8:20
  Chris Jones: It rewired him.
• 8:22
  Chris Jones: Abby Martin also had an episode with a series of scars to speak.
• 8:27
  Chris Jones: And she described that after a horrible accident that left her in a coma and loss of memory with long-term brain damage that changed her identity forever, that instead of feeling blessed, that she was spared from an accident that should have taken her life, she began a descent into a very, very dark place.
• 8:51
  Chris Jones: She began to wish that she had have died, that she felt guilty for being alive.
• 8:57
  Chris Jones: The dark was winning, and no amount of community, no amount of encouragement, no amount of love was going to make her feel better.
• 9:06
  Chris Jones: But it was in that darkness, in the quiet and isolation, that as she prayed and she connected to God, she had an experience that in her words, she heard God speak to her.
• 9:22
  Chris Jones: See, immediately after her accident, this horrific wreck she was in, that should have taken her life, that she was rushed to a clinic, and as she lay there unconscious, that she had these moments of not being lucid, but where she would start talking.
• 9:38
  Chris Jones: Now she has no memory of this whatsoever, but witnesses have told her that in those few moments she was calling to Jesus.
• 9:48
  Chris Jones: Now in her moment of this dark where it's winning, and she pushes in with God and she says she has this experience and she hears God.
• 9:58
  Chris Jones: What she heard was this Abby, when you were calling my name, I was calling your name.
• 10:06
  Chris Jones: And it was in that moment that changed how she not only sees God, but how she is seen by God.
• 10:15
  Chris Jones: When Brent McKay left the hospital with his son, things weren't magically fixed, but it did put something into him.
• 10:23
  Chris Jones: It did start this path, this transformation, just like Abby.
• 10:29
  Chris Jones: When Abby heard from God, it didn't magically fix everything, but it did start her down a different road, a different journey.
• 10:38
  Chris Jones: Both Brent and Abby found hope where there was no hope.
• 10:44
  Chris Jones: I think that's one of the things that we've lost in these mountain religions, of building a mountain to God, of serving the religion, that we lose the spiritual side of it and we lose hope.
• 10:57
  Chris Jones: You know, it says that Jesus came that we might have life and we may have it more abundantly, not just life after we die, but life here and now.
• 11:06
  Chris Jones: And I'm not talking about the prosperity gospel.
• 11:09
  Chris Jones: I'm talking about exactly what we've been talking about, the kind of life that comes to you in the cancer ward and gives you peace, or lets you know that you're seen when you feel like there's nothing to see, and that it'd been better if you'd have just died.
• 11:24
  Chris Jones: And that kind of life isn't found on a mountain trying to earn your way to God.
• 11:30
  Chris Jones: It's found in our journey.
• 11:32
  Chris Jones: It's found in relationship.
• 11:36
  Chris Jones: Guys, thank you so much for taking this journey of discovery with me as we dive deeper into trying to figure all of this out together.
• 11:45
  Chris Jones: I would love to hear from you.
• 11:46
  Chris Jones: So email me at spiritualhotsauce at gmail.com and also follow and share.
• 11:54
  Chris Jones: Thank you so much, and I'll see you again next week.