Latest / Project Podcast / ‘The best project job in the UK’: Nick Smallwood on running the Infrastructure and Projects Authority

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‘The best project job in the UK’: Nick Smallwood on running the Infrastructure and Projects Authority · Project Podcast

0:09
Welcome to the OPM podcast. OPM is the childhood body for
0:12
the project profession. This episode is part of a series
0:15
of one-to-one conversations with senior leaders in the project
0:18
profession hosted by OPM chief executive Professor.
0:21
Adam, Boston, this time, Adam meets Nick's moored CEO of the
0:26
infrastructure and projects Authority or IPA the Opa
0:30
overseas UK's National infrastructure and construction
0:33
pipeline which contains hundreds of billions of pounds of public
0:36
and private infrastructure investment.
0:38
It. Also supports the government
0:39
major projects portfolio made up of projects of high levels of
0:43
complexity impact or risk. Also part of Nick's remit is
0:47
advancing the professionalisation of project
0:49
delivery within the UK government.
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Adam speak to Nick about his route into the project
0:54
profession including four decades at Shell.
0:57
We also hear about next decision to move into the Actor, the
1:00
implementation of a project Academy within government, and
1:04
why he believes he is in the best product job in the UK.
1:10
Welcome Nick to the APM podcast is really fabulous to have you
1:14
here. I'm very much looking forward to
1:17
this conversation. As I'm sure many people are and
1:20
I wondered if to start with today you might be able to tell
1:23
us a little bit about your journey into the project
1:25
profession. And I wonder if you could start
1:28
with maybe the education piece and particularly the early part
1:31
of your career, before you became famous in the IPA.
1:36
I can see them and great to be able to chat to you today.
1:40
Yeah, I kicked off my career. I wasn't really clear on what I
1:44
wanted to do. I knew I love to build things on
1:46
your look to work with things and had a curiosity about
1:50
equipment. So I actually did a mechanical
1:54
engineering degree and if you can remember in the days, I did
1:57
a thin sandwich course. So half a year in in University
2:02
at half a year in industry for three years, and then a full
2:04
final. In University, graduated and
2:09
applied for a number of roles focusing, really on those
2:13
Industries, who would give me an opportunity to go overseas and
2:16
see a bit of the world was fortunate enough to get
2:19
recruited by shell and join their graduate scheme, which was
2:24
basically looking to fast-track people to become chartered
2:27
engineers in their particular discipline within five years.
2:30
And to do that, they took you into a manufacturing facility
2:35
and moved you fairly quickly around different parts of that
2:38
time, a Refinery and chemical plant to give you experience in
2:43
topics such as technical advisory a bit of Maintenance
2:47
management experience and then exposure to small projects.
2:51
So I spent the first five years doing that.
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It was a chartered mechanical engineer.
2:56
By the time, I was 26 and by the time I was 28, I'd found a role
3:02
on a major project as a junior. Project engineer, which was
3:06
basically spending time in the contractors offices.
3:10
Looking over all the equipment, procurement requisitions,
3:15
looking at the design coordinating model reviews in
3:17
the days, when the models were done out of plastic, rather than
3:20
on 3D CAD systems and really enjoyed it and actually stayed
3:25
with that project right through construction, commissioning
3:28
startup, and for my sins, they made me maintenance manager of
3:32
the asset and to take it over for its first few years.
3:35
Years of running. So I learn not only how to build
3:39
a project that how to build a project that was ultimately
3:41
going to be reliable and fit for purpose.
3:43
So it was quite a baptism of fire and in the maintenance
3:46
manager role. Yeah.
3:47
I learned a lot about the importance of getting things
3:49
right in Construction and design and really understanding from a
3:53
perspective of the operator, what you've got to build in
3:57
upfront and who you need to coordinate and an interface with
4:00
and make sure you've got all the stakeholders upfront involved in
4:04
what you're going to do. Do.
4:06
Wow, that sounds fascinating and and correct me if I'm wrong.
4:10
But I think you actually with shelf or what best part of 40
4:13
years, so you will have seen some huge changes in shell and
4:17
in fact, probably were responsible for lots of those
4:20
changes in terms of how she'll delivered projects over that
4:25
time. I wonder if you might just tell
4:26
us a little bit about some of the changes that you saw Yeah,
4:30
sure. So I joined, as I say, in a
4:32
manufacturing site is one or two in the UK administered by
4:36
Shelley UK and got a bit of exposure to Shell in Europe.
4:41
When we introduced some different shared services
4:44
systems and had some sap upgrades and then became very
4:49
clear that every part of show was doing projects differently.
4:52
So my colleagues in Europe in France were doing it differently
4:54
than Germany doing it differently than the two sites
4:56
in the UK and Manufacturing was Different than chemicals, which
5:02
was different again that it which was different again to our
5:06
Upstream colleagues and progressively over the years we
5:09
went from a local organized arrangement to Regional to then
5:16
functional. So it wasn't long before we had
5:19
a single Downstream way of doing projects which included both the
5:24
refineries and chemical science. And then laterally in my career
5:28
we actually Chemicals into Downstream integrated gas into
5:34
Downstream. And then, in the latter years,
5:37
we actually combined the answering business and hand one
5:41
way of doing projects. How we do projects in Shell,
5:43
because we quickly realized that, yeah, the technology
5:46
changes and the scope changes. The fundamentals are pretty much
5:50
all the same and it took us a long time to reconcile best
5:55
practice and really get down to what was really really important
5:59
and on. That Journey we identified we
6:01
needed to train our staff. So we introduced the shell
6:03
project Academy and that's or us really focus down on leadership
6:08
skills and what it took to deliver projects.
6:11
And interestingly we spend a bit of time.
6:13
Adam really documenting everything, every time something
6:17
went wrong, we took a lot of time out to document and draft a
6:20
best practice on how to do it. And we woke up very late in my
6:24
career to realize that if we printed all the guidance off, it
6:26
stood about half a meter deep on a desk.
6:30
And people wouldn't read, it was simply just too much in there,
6:32
although it was absolutely brilliant.
6:35
It was just too much for a young graduate engineer coming new
6:38
into the company to absorb. So, we had a programmer work to
6:42
look at outcome and intent-based Leadership.
6:45
And we trim that whole piece of work down from half a meter
6:50
down, to probably an inch an inch and a half in in Imperial
6:55
terms and it really focused on what The key requirements that
7:01
you have to meet how to do, it was still kept in that half a
7:04
meter of documentation, but if people already knew how to do
7:07
it, we really wanted them to focus on the outcome and the
7:10
intent behind all the language so that was quite a radical
7:13
change from you know multiple operating companies all doing it
7:16
differently to having a single way of doing it.
7:19
To then simplifying how you accessed?
7:22
What good look like and it was quite quite telling for me to
7:26
see that. I wish I was joining the company
7:29
at the beginning of my career. Because it was just so
7:31
accessible, so simple to read and so easy to understand it
7:35
was, it was great to work in that environment.
7:37
Actually, you know, it sounds brilliant and I know that things
7:41
like you mentioned a shell project Academy there.
7:43
These things have continued I think you know long after you've
7:46
gone so you've obviously left a huge Legacy there as well.
7:50
So you know that that that's brilliant and I suppose I'm just
7:54
thinking about this, you spent all this time and she'll do you
7:56
seen all these changes? It's gone from strength to
7:58
strength. And it's, you know, One of the
8:00
one of the most successful, you know, companies in the world in
8:04
a by many different measures, but you decided then to leave
8:08
the private sector and move into the Civil Service and take on a
8:11
senior Civil Service role. Which many might be thinking,
8:14
you know, why on Earth, did you do that?
8:15
So what was it? That prompted you to make that
8:17
shift? So the last 16 years of my show
8:21
career, I was pretty much oversees all the time, the
8:24
Netherlands twice Canada, the US and then finally Landing in the
8:28
Netherlands. For the last six years, I was a
8:30
chief projects engineer, Global discipline, head vice-president,
8:33
projects and responsible for how we delivered projects and
8:37
quarterly board reporting. And after six years, I wanted to
8:39
change and I reach normal retirement age, and although
8:42
they would have been very happy for me to stay.
8:44
I decided I wanted to do something different.
8:47
I actually wasn't sure what I wanted to do at that time.
8:49
I set up my own consultancy company and worked at that for a
8:53
year and was quite relaxed about life and got a tap on the
8:56
shoulder to apply for the role running out of PA and I looked
8:59
at the role, then it's the best project job in the UK.
9:02
As far as I'm concerned, it was something that really excited
9:05
me. The fact that you could have
9:07
involvement in the sheer scale and breadth of projects that are
9:13
delivered in the public sector really interested me and I
9:16
applied for the job and was fortunate to To be offered the
9:19
role of chief executive of the IPA.
9:22
I think we're all fortunate that you're in this role, Nick, but
9:26
I'm conscious will be at, you know, you and I both mentioned
9:28
the IPA. And I think lots of people in
9:30
the profession, particularly in the government, aspect of the
9:33
project, profession will be very aware of the IPA.
9:36
They'll be some listeners who may be at the private sector or
9:39
beginning of their career. That don't really know a lot
9:42
about the IPA, what even IPA stands for and the role and
9:46
function of the of that. So, If you might tell us a bit
9:49
more about that kind of be a beginner's guide if you like to
9:53
what the IPA does. Yes.
9:55
Of course. So the infrastructure projects
9:57
Authority is really the center of excellence for major project
10:01
delivery across government. So all 19 departments, we have
10:04
oversight of and we basically administer the government major
10:07
project portfolio. So the largest most complex
10:10
difficult novel projects in government that are delivered by
10:13
the Department's we provide independent and expert advice We
10:18
Carry Out Out the Assurance reviews at the stage Gates
10:22
advising and supporting the major project review group on.
10:26
Whether we should proceed with the project to the next gate or
10:28
not, we have a standard and functions group, where we Define
10:33
the standards for project functional delivery we
10:36
administer. What is now the project Academy
10:40
across government where we doing assessment and accreditation of
10:42
individuals? We drive model methods of
10:45
delivery and performance looking at You Embrace digital in
10:50
Project delivery for example and how we dress Net Zero and I've
10:55
got a large community of project Finance professionals, who help
10:59
with looking at how you might have structured Finance deals,
11:03
how we might help and support with a center of excellence for
11:07
the private financing initiative, off-boarding of all
11:10
the contracts, we have in that space and of course, we connect
11:12
with industry. So strong connections with the
11:15
construction Council and what your client group and other
11:20
bodies to make sure that we stay connected with what happening in
11:23
the marketplace. So, it's a small tight-knit
11:26
group. We're only just over 200 people
11:30
with some deep expertise embedded, and we have a, I think
11:35
a pretty positive reputation. Not only in government, but also
11:39
outside government for the expertise and advice, we can
11:42
give Well, I'd agree with that Nick and I and, you know, in my
11:48
job, as a p.m. I've been fortunate enough to,
11:51
you know, travel to different places around the world
11:54
internationally as well. And I go as far as saying, the
11:57
IPA is the Envy of many other governments as well, who are
12:00
trying to establish some think, you know, equivalent in their
12:03
own context and and lots of other countries are actively.
12:07
Looking at the way you set things up here and wanting to
12:11
replicate that. So yeah it's absolutely a Beacon
12:14
for for this kind of setup. And I was just gonna say, I
12:18
didn't mention. I also have a small, a small
12:20
team of what we call the International Group in the IPA.
12:23
So we actually do work with overseas governments.
12:26
So we've done a lot of work in South America, we're working
12:28
currently with the Republic of South Africa and Singapore,
12:32
we've just signed an mou with the Hong Kong government.
12:36
And we've got Mo use with the regional governments in
12:39
Australia as well. So, lots of interest from
12:41
overseas, where we look to, Basically, push best practice
12:45
principles of project, delivery project management and help them
12:48
do infrastructure better than they do today.
12:51
Yeah. We're which makes sense because
12:52
actually, you know, our strap line, her, a p.m. is when
12:56
project succeed Society benefits and that kind of societal impact
13:01
that, you know, you're trying to deliver particularly through
13:03
government projects, they're often Global problems.
13:06
You know, rather than National problem sir, I suppose that kind
13:08
of joined up government level math makes really good sense.
13:12
Nick, one of the things I think is in your role is, is
13:15
overseeing the 600 billion pounds, National infrastructure
13:19
and construction pipeline. What is your role in that?
13:24
So the, the pipeline really consists of probably the largest
13:29
and most complex projects across the built environment sector.
13:33
So that's transport Road, rail, hospitals, prisons, schools, and
13:38
the like and if they are on the government major project
13:42
portfolio, which we all are Then I have oversight in terms of the
13:46
governance and Assurance role advising on whether they
13:49
proceeded where they're ready to proceed helping and supporting
13:53
them get to a final investment decision with a robust business
13:55
case and what we've typically got of the order of 200 projects
14:02
in Flight. We've now got on the government
14:04
major project portfolio about 249 which is the largest it's
14:08
ever been. And the the national
14:11
infrastructure construction pipeline gets Every year we've
14:14
held off publishing it in 2022 basis, the financial turmoil and
14:20
the impact of inflation on project.
14:23
So we're still waiting to line out what actually will be done
14:26
this year but the bulk of the, the national infrastructure
14:29
strategy of which the pipeline is represented continues.
14:34
And so we've got a really, really ambitious program of work
14:38
that runs over 10 years. And in fact, we have an update
14:42
of the national Structure assessment, which is carried out
14:45
by the national infrastructure commission from by Sir.
14:48
John arm it, who advise government where they need to
14:50
focus in the coming years and where we might have a blind spot
14:55
of where we need to focus our investments and work that will
14:58
inform us whether we have to make any adjustments to the
15:01
National infrastructure strategy in the Autumn, and then that
15:04
will be reflected in the linked, the, in the next edition of the
15:08
pipeline. So, it's a hugely ambitious
15:10
program. I think we've got over 40
15:12
hospitals, To work on. We've got 50 schools, a year
15:16
working on. We've got approaching 100
15:18
billion of rail infrastructure to invest.
15:21
And then a whole raft of major road schemes that are currently
15:26
on the books. Looking at the load times
15:28
Crossing the a303, the a 66 expansion, and then the road
15:33
infrastructure strategies, which are the five year plans, that
15:36
National highways run. So hugely ambitious programs and
15:40
I haven't even begun to talk about the work we do in defense
15:42
in the ministry of Defense. It's all transparent or
15:44
transformation or in it. So we've got several billion
15:48
pounds worth of projects in that space.
15:50
I think the overall GDP program portfolio sits at just over 800
15:55
billion right now. Wow.
15:57
And it sounds really complex because you've got many
16:01
competing priorities. They're all of these projects
16:03
are going to help different people in different ways and
16:05
impact on society in different ways.
16:08
There's obviously a kind of political over later all of this
16:10
this, you know, strategic priorities and things that need
16:13
to be done. You know, how are those
16:15
decisions made in terms of prioritizing one project over
16:18
another? So that's largely departmental
16:22
and treasury level atom. So, the IPA advice and we
16:26
support I try and keep out of the political decision-making.
16:29
A bleep don't, and you're right. It is an ambitious program and I
16:34
think sometimes external events determine how quickly a project
16:40
goes. You know, the planning regime in
16:42
the UK, is quite disciplined. It's quite Democratic.
16:46
It's open to challenge and for the Really major projects, they
16:50
take several years to go through the planning programs.
16:53
Typically taking longer than the Department's would like.
16:56
So there's a bit of a leveling out there and some of the big
16:58
projects and programs, but we doing a bit of work now or to
17:01
make sure that we understand that and that we factored that
17:03
into the overall program timelines.
17:06
But it, but it's, it is a challenge not so much in the
17:09
Departments because they know what their priorities are, and
17:11
they know what to do. It's the trust Department.
17:13
Priorities have become challenging the where the
17:15
treasury has to make a decision about which they Fund in, which
17:17
they don't, And that's, it's nothing new.
17:20
I think it's been the case for many, many years.
17:22
It gets more challenging in high inflationary environments which
17:27
we've just seen. So those tough decisions have to
17:29
be made every now and again to keep within budgetary
17:32
constraints. Yeah, absolutely.
17:34
And and it's interesting because in this kind of high inflation
17:38
kind of period that we've had, I mean I've been here in a
17:41
projects in the in the private sector, really more than
17:44
anything who have started to do things like hedging through the
17:48
supply chain. Chained to try and maintain some
17:51
control over their costs further out into the future because it's
17:54
just so impractical at the minute.
17:55
I mean, it must be a really tough operating environment.
17:58
I think, at the moment it is all over things.
18:00
Some relief on the inflationary pressures on materials that
18:02
starting to stabilize. And if we see some settlement on
18:05
some of the industrial disputes, I think we're going to see a
18:08
return to quite an optimistic picture by year end, which is, I
18:11
think, what was in the Chancellor's message only
18:14
yesterday and I think will be pleased to see that one of the
18:18
It talked about major projects, one of the things you said in a
18:21
recent blog that you did for us about the government project
18:25
profession, you said, it's that those in need to reform the
18:28
system and apply Lessons Learned From really successful major
18:32
projects. What did you mean by that?
18:35
So I've been focused very much on on reforming the system
18:38
because at the end of the day there's multiple angles and
18:40
elements to delivering world-class projects and I
18:44
focused on the people principles and performance and on 'Well, I
18:49
unashamedly stole the principal and idea of having a project
18:53
Academy from Shell and we've now built and implemented a project
18:56
ketamine government where we're going to train up our project
19:00
professionals. We have changed the Assurance
19:02
regime from five regulated system 23 looking at industry.
19:06
Best practice of saying look either project is good to go.
19:10
It needs quite specific actionable steps, to D risk it
19:15
or it's simply not going to deliver on the promise and
19:18
having those Three buckets really puts a more disciplined
19:22
lens. On the Assurance review, team to
19:24
make their minds up about what state the project in.
19:27
We've been looking at that kind of Reform.
19:29
We've actually looked also at tightening the focus across
19:33
government. So I now chair a project counsel
19:35
with Chief project delivery officers appointed in every
19:38
department, they have a dotted reporting line to me.
19:40
So, we can have an honest conversation about resources
19:44
resourcing how they're progressing with assessment and
19:47
accreditation and what the actual the outcome and delivery
19:50
performance is. So we unashamedly of focused on
19:55
what does world-class look like? We published a couple of years
19:58
ago. The government's project
20:01
principles for Success highlighting the things that are
20:05
necessary but not sufficient a prerequisite, but they're not a
20:08
guarantee of better project outcomes, but you know, if you
20:11
don't for example, focus on the outcome, you're trying to
20:13
deliver you get to that very late, you're likely going to
20:17
have the wrong scope and the Key stakeholders not aligned so some
20:22
fundamentals that you have to do.
20:23
So we've been busy working on all the elements of people
20:26
principles of performance over the last three years and you
20:31
know these are pretty economically challenging times
20:34
for the country. There are people that made to
20:37
take a view that is this the right time to to be delivering
20:41
lots of projects because they come at a cost and might not be
20:43
aware of the role that projects having stimulating growth and
20:46
prosperity. So how important do you think?
20:48
Projects are in stimulating, that kind of growth.
20:51
And what's the ipas role in that respect as well?
20:56
Well, Adam, some of these big programs especially in the built
20:59
environment are hugely important to stimulated growth.
21:02
I think the construction sector contribution to GDP is hugely
21:07
significant and it doesn't just have the economic impact.
21:12
It's obviously jobs and livelihoods for people in plays
21:15
a big part of the leveling up agenda.
21:16
So lots of focus now on What part of a project is playing in
21:22
Social and economic benefits, and we've moved away from just
21:25
looking at straight economics to social impact.
21:29
And the five case business model developed by the treasury forces
21:32
us to do that. Now, we've got to look at
21:34
leveling up, you've got to look at the whole Gambit of social
21:37
opportunity. Whether it be employing,
21:40
ex-offenders or encouraging more apprentices into a particular
21:44
location or addressing unemployment issues along the
21:48
route of the particular project. And we now have a real Focus now
21:52
about where the money is being spent in the United Kingdom to
21:55
help us. Look at the leveling up agenda
21:57
with a different perspective because even the project
21:59
executed and delivered in London, could have a very
22:03
positive impact in the leveling up agenda.
22:06
So good example, I would give you is tfl buying new Rolling
22:09
Stock, they went to the north east of England and place.
22:12
All the orders in the UK, for the next tranche of Rolling
22:15
Stock. So that's great news for
22:17
employment in the Northeast. It's the supply chains of these
22:20
projects then as well which is having that impact on growth.
22:23
Indeed, it's not just the location, it's a supply chain
22:26
and almost all the big infrastructure projects have a
22:29
supply chain. That is very white, very broad
22:31
across the United Kingdom, which is really great to see and where
22:34
we published the pipeline later. This year, you'll see that we
22:37
will have done a regional analysis of that, spend to show
22:40
the all parts of the UK are benefiting.
22:43
And it's good to know the go, you know, the government is
22:45
thinking about, you know, every part of the UK, you know, it's
22:47
obviously a big part of it. Leveling up agenda, obviously
22:51
you're uniquely placed. I think Nick to kind of provide
22:55
an insight and assessment of the maturity and professionalisation
22:59
of the project delivery Community across government
23:02
work. How would you say that we're
23:03
doing? So in terms of absolute metrics
23:09
hard to say Adam, we've introduced a maturity model for
23:14
our portfolio, delivery. And we've started to do
23:16
portfolio delivery Assessments in the different departments.
23:19
Oh, that's early days yet. I haven't got every Department
23:22
done and it's starting to inform us that we've got some good work
23:26
behind us and more work to do. The profession was actually only
23:29
established in government in 2012.
23:31
So, we're ten years down the track and looking at our
23:34
Colleagues in professions like government commercial.
23:38
We're catching them up very quickly.
23:39
We've introduced as I said that part of the academy so we've now
23:42
got a plan to a Cessna Credit individuals.
23:45
So more work to do and I won't be satisfied until we start to
23:50
see many more projects delivering on their promises
23:54
being recognized externally as being world-class in their
23:56
delivery. So work to do excellent.
23:59
Well kid keep up the good work. One of the challenges, I think
24:02
of the profession at large and I think this is Not just in the
24:06
public sector, I think extends into the private sector as well
24:09
is just trying to recruit and retain really high quality
24:15
project professionals. You know, there is a real
24:18
challenge there, right, across the profession, but what's
24:20
government doing specifically to ensure that you've got healthy
24:23
pipeline of those talented project professionals enter into
24:27
public sector. So that's a great question.
24:30
We put a lot of effort into highlighting our fast stream
24:34
which is the entry point for new graduates to join government and
24:38
we are either the second or the third most popular fast stream,
24:43
of course, across government and a huge number of people apply
24:47
each year and only a very small number are accepted and they are
24:51
top talent. They are really talented
24:52
individuals with limited exposure and career experience
24:56
of course. But that's what we intend to
24:57
give them. And now having the Project
25:00
Academy and the four levels of assessment of accreditation we
25:03
want to actually get them on that journey and on the ladder
25:06
to develop their career as a project professionals through
25:08
Foundation to practitioner senior practitioner and
25:12
ultimately Master practitioner. One of those individuals who
25:15
gets to work and run these Mega projects.
25:18
The 249 multi-billion projects. I mentioned that sit on the
25:22
government major project portfolio and if you are a
25:25
project professional I can't think of more exciting.
25:29
Rams and projects to work on not only are they big novel
25:32
difficult complex but they make huge difference to the citizens
25:35
of the United Kingdom. So I think if we get the the
25:40
case for The Talented individuals coming into
25:44
government, I think they're going to be quite excited about
25:47
the workplace and I'm very open to people coming into the public
25:51
sector doing a bit of work, maybe going and getting
25:53
experience in the private sector and then coming back and I think
25:56
it's a good blend to have of Strong both public and private
26:00
sector. If you want to deliver the best
26:02
possible outcome on our complex project.
26:05
Yeah, that makes sense. One of the things I hear about
26:08
everywhere. I go at the moment is
26:11
digitalisation data science, data analytics.
26:14
A are you all of these types of things?
26:17
Do you see those kind of challenges or opportunities for
26:20
the profession and and just what are the big challenges for the
26:24
profession over? Let's say the next 10 years.
26:26
Are you positive about the future for UK major?
26:29
G. I am very positive Adam but I
26:32
think with that positivity comes a recognition that we're going
26:35
to have to change and we're going to have to get that change
26:38
recognized across industry. And particularly in the UK
26:41
construction industry, it's a challenge because we look the
26:44
same today as we typically did 30 or 40 years ago.
26:48
So change is coming of that. I've got no doubt.
26:50
I'm optimistic that it's going to help us because I came from
26:55
the private sector from the hydrocarbon world, where we were
26:58
exploiting Technologies Another, some of the most challenging and
27:02
complex projects in deep water, or in remote locations, and we
27:07
use technology on our built environment projects to do the
27:10
most amazing things. Having now come into the public
27:13
sector, I don't see that same technology deployed when it's
27:16
mature and exist and we should be using it.
27:21
So and some of its pretty fundamental, you know, advanced
27:26
work packaging to drive productivity and construction is
27:29
a no-brainer, you do. You design, you link it to your
27:31
plan. Your plan links to material
27:33
availability and you use advanced work, packaging to put
27:36
the people to work to do what you want them to do.
27:38
In this sequence, you want them to do it in and we saw you know
27:42
fifty percent gain in productivity with those tools.
27:44
Used in UK construction, we're typically very fragmented, no
27:48
one has ownership of the design to a level of maturity that it's
27:52
done before you start construction and so we don't
27:54
exploit the technology. So in the built environment,
27:57
lots to use this face recognition, Breakfast is
28:01
construction sites. There's apps to help on safety
28:04
leadership on quality leadership.
28:06
So I'm really optimistic that we're going to see that grow
28:09
exponentially over the next few years and we're starting to see
28:12
green shoots in that space in the data science space AI.
28:17
I think we don't even know what we don't know yet.
28:19
That's base Adam. I think it's going to really
28:22
surprise some of the more mature project managers in the world.
28:26
Let me put it that way. So now, younger Engineers are
28:28
going to lap it up at What a I can do in terms of, you know,
28:33
searching your contracts or solving difficult technical
28:36
problems. It is beyond belief, and we're
28:39
about to see Quantum Computing come in, which is going to, you
28:42
know, increase computer speeds fourfold over what we have
28:45
today. And most of us have got a phone
28:48
that does more than the Mainframe computer did when I
28:52
started my graduate course. So we've got some major, major
28:57
changes are coming and Robotics will be Other area with 5G that
29:02
we haven't really begun to exploit to its fullest extent,
29:05
so huge change. It's going to need new people
29:09
with those new skills to come into the project delivery
29:12
profession to not only work with the projects, people put become
29:15
part of the profession, because they're going to be people, the
29:18
people exploiting the technology to deliver the outcomes.
29:21
And lots of, I think exciting times ahead, absolutely.
29:25
And I suspect it. I know we're all talking about
29:28
chat GPT and all of these types of things.
29:30
Now, Now but I suspect five years down the line AI is going
29:33
to be a lot more nuanced. A lot more sophisticated in a
29:37
mainstream way than it then it is even now.
29:40
Final question from me Nick you're obviously as we've heard
29:43
through this conversation today an absolutely incredible project
29:47
leader and you obviously know what a great project leader
29:50
looks like because you recruited lots of them and work with lots
29:53
of them in your time. But if I just ask you for those
29:56
people out there, trying to kind of, think about what a great
29:59
project leader. Looks like what would you say?
30:01
They're kind of key characteristics.
30:04
So I would start with confidence.
30:07
Adam. You need to be competent to know
30:09
what you don't know and be clear on your career ladder.
30:11
So you can't expect someone to know how to deliver a mega
30:14
project at the start of their career.
30:15
So be confident, you go on the journey to learn and be
30:19
competent in the elements of project delivery that you need
30:21
to know about. I think you need to have a clear
30:25
vision and focus on what needs to be achieved.
30:27
So relentless focus on outcomes, I think with the increasing
30:31
challenges that we have across society and Net Zero.
30:34
Do you need to have a diverse team and an inclusive T and make
30:38
sure that that is a fundamental and perhaps last.
30:42
But almost a more importantly, you know, project manager is
30:46
someone who integrates and brings a team together to
30:48
deliver an outcome. So you need to be inspiring, you
30:51
need to motivate and Inspire your team.
30:53
They've got to want to work for you and deliver great things and
30:57
where I've seen that done really well.
30:59
I've been blown away by what's been achieved by by the project
31:02
teams because it's not the one. Oh, that's not the project
31:05
leader, the project manager that delivers its the project team.
31:09
Well, I think that inspiring note.
31:11
That's probably a good time for us to wrap up.
31:14
Nick, thank you so much for obviously speaking to you to me
31:18
today. And thank you for all the work
31:20
that you're doing to to really help make Society a better
31:23
place, one project at a time, it really is much appreciated.
31:27
Thank you, thank you for the invitation it Thanks Nick and
31:35
Adam for taking the time out to share their conversation with
31:38
the APM podcast. If you enjoyed this episode why
31:41
not leave us a review or hit the Subscribe button if you want to
31:44
get in touch email us at a p.m. podcast at think publishing
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31:51
listeners with suggested topics for future episodes.
31:54
If there's something keeping you and your project colleagues
31:56
awake at night, we want to hear about it.
31:59
Finally, don't forget to check out.
32:01
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32:02
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32:05
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32:08
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