Latest / UK Column Radio / UK Column News - 28th January 2026

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UK Column News - 28th January 2026 · UK Column Radio

0:08
Speaker 1: Good afternoon. It's Wednesday, the twentieth of January, just after
0:11
Speaker 1: one o'clock. Welcome to UK colum News. I'm your host
0:13
Speaker 1: Marc Robinson. Joining me in the studio today is co
0:15
Speaker 1: host Charles Mallett. Welcomes the program. Charles, you right, and
0:19
Speaker 1: by video link we are joined by Fanessa Bailey. Now.
0:22
Speaker 1: Later in the program will be looking at the latest
0:24
Speaker 1: censorship of efforts by OFCOM and their international colleagues, CHARLDS,
0:28
Speaker 1: abuse in Israel and the reform of policing. But we're
0:32
Speaker 1: going to begin today with digital government. Now people across
0:37
Speaker 1: the UK could benefit from faster, safer and more reliable
0:41
Speaker 1: public services as leading British AI specialists joint government to
0:45
Speaker 1: modernize critical systems used every day, from public safety to
0:49
Speaker 1: transport maintenance.
0:50
Speaker 2: These are the.
0:51
Speaker 1: Words of care Starmer's Digital Minister, Ian Murray, so I'm
0:57
Speaker 1: sure we were all impressed by that. But anyway, the
0:59
Speaker 1: effort is going to be underpinned by one million pounds
1:03
Speaker 1: from META and we'll be run through the Alenturing Institute
1:06
Speaker 1: and the group of AI experts are going to develop
1:09
Speaker 1: open source tools to what they describe as tackle some
1:12
Speaker 1: of the biggest challenges facing public services. Now this all
1:16
Speaker 1: comes part of the new Customer Sorry I didn't show
1:19
Speaker 1: the Lenturing Institute there, but there we go. And this
1:21
Speaker 1: all comes as part of the new Customer First initiative
1:25
Speaker 1: and customer first, by the way, spelled as one word,
1:29
Speaker 1: without any gaps between customer and first, and that's going
1:32
Speaker 1: to put modern technology to work to cut out long
1:35
Speaker 1: funek cues, reduce paperwork, and make it easier and faster
1:39
Speaker 1: for people to access the services they rely on. These
1:41
Speaker 1: are all their words. It's fantastic propaganda. But anyway, right
1:46
Speaker 1: there with that quote we get an idea of what
1:48
Speaker 1: this is actually about, because, as we all know, the
1:50
Speaker 1: long way times on phones when people want to access
1:54
Speaker 1: the likes of HRC or any other so called customer
1:56
Speaker 1: facing service provided by the state are a deliberate deployd
2:00
Speaker 1: forced people to accept the digital panopticon that Shabana my
2:04
Speaker 1: mood is so keen on. So let's just remind ourselves
2:07
Speaker 1: what she said when she was speaking to Tony Blair
2:09
Speaker 1: a short while ago. AI and technology can be transformative
2:14
Speaker 1: to the whole law and order space, and she was
2:17
Speaker 1: talking about the need to use AI and technology to
2:21
Speaker 1: transform the justice system. She cited Jeremy Bentham and as Panopticon.
2:27
Speaker 1: Now we're going to come on to what that is
2:28
Speaker 1: in a second if anybody doesn't know, And she was
2:32
Speaker 1: absolutely talking about the idea of pre crime and using
2:37
Speaker 1: AI to make judgments and what people were going to
2:39
Speaker 1: do in the future. But coming back to customer first
2:43
Speaker 1: for a second. It describes itself as a new unit
2:46
Speaker 1: within the Government Digital Service and very much echoing Dominic
2:52
Speaker 1: Cummings of a few years ago. They say they've been
2:54
Speaker 1: set up to explore a fresh way of working in
2:56
Speaker 1: government and operating with the pace and secure us of
3:00
Speaker 1: a startup. This is Dominic Cummings kind of language. And
3:03
Speaker 1: they said that their work aligns directly with the Roadmap
3:06
Speaker 1: for Modern Digital Government, which has just been published. And
3:11
Speaker 1: once again we see statements from from politicians delivered with
3:15
Speaker 1: not a hint of irony, Because this is the comment
3:19
Speaker 1: from the Secretary of State for Science, Innovation and Technology,
3:22
Speaker 1: Liz Kendal saying when we came into government, the Prime
3:26
Speaker 1: Minister made a commitment to the British people that politics
3:29
Speaker 1: would tread lightly on people's lives. So I'm just going
3:32
Speaker 1: to ask, do you all feel lightly trodden on because
3:35
Speaker 1: I don't now. She went on to describe all the
3:38
Speaker 1: benefits of the new panopticon for this sleep deprived parent
3:43
Speaker 1: trying to sort childcare, the homeowner getting planning permission, the
3:47
Speaker 1: worried patient looking for booking a doctor's appointment. She said
3:51
Speaker 1: that life is busy and her role as a government
3:53
Speaker 1: should be to carry the burden in these moments, not
3:56
Speaker 1: add to it. And so this plan sets out how
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Speaker 1: we do this by embracing AI, removing out data to
4:02
Speaker 1: DI and strengthening our cyber resilience in the face of
4:06
Speaker 1: new threats. So let's just have a look at what
4:09
Speaker 1: this brave new world has in store for.
4:11
Speaker 2: You and for me.
4:13
Speaker 1: So they're talking about managing health records, appointments and prescriptions
4:17
Speaker 1: in one place through the NHS app. They're talking about
4:21
Speaker 1: using the Golf dot UK app to access personalized services
4:24
Speaker 1: and notifications, securely store and share digital versions of important
4:28
Speaker 1: documents like your driving license using the Golf dot UK wallet,
4:35
Speaker 1: quickly and securely proving your identity using the new Digital ID.
4:40
Speaker 1: Accessing simpler, faster digital services for tax, driving, vehicle and
4:45
Speaker 1: immigration using new career service. Bringing the support you need
4:50
Speaker 1: together to understand your skills and use them to find
4:53
Speaker 1: or change jobs, but also benefit from targeted support to
4:59
Speaker 1: improve digital skills and confidence, and address data and device poverty.
5:04
Speaker 1: This is incredible stuff. Access better care for children because
5:07
Speaker 1: data will be joined up across services, and if you're
5:11
Speaker 1: in business, it's good for you too, as anybody that's
5:14
Speaker 1: already in business knows. You've had to identify yourself to
5:17
Speaker 1: company's house, for example. But this will mean that you
5:20
Speaker 1: can access government services with a single secure login.
5:23
Speaker 2: For businesses.
5:25
Speaker 1: Now, we've discussed one log in before and how it's
5:28
Speaker 1: not in the least bit secure, but we can talk
5:30
Speaker 1: about that later. Manage and tax and customs obligations through
5:34
Speaker 1: a modern digital first system, sell technology and services to
5:37
Speaker 1: government through simplified procurement processes. Find talent faster using smarter
5:43
Speaker 1: candidate matching tools, quickly and securely verify your employees' right
5:46
Speaker 1: to work through a secure process.
5:49
Speaker 2: So you know we at the.
5:52
Speaker 1: UK column are warning about these kinds of things. We
5:56
Speaker 1: have also been warning, as we did last week about
5:59
Speaker 1: Palenteer and their complete access to NHS patient data and
6:05
Speaker 1: when the Electronic Frontier Foundation are warning about ICE agents
6:10
Speaker 1: in the US using pollannteer's health access to US health
6:13
Speaker 1: data to run their operations. Then we might ask ourselves
6:16
Speaker 1: what the Starmer regime is building here?
6:18
Speaker 2: Just what exactly is it?
6:20
Speaker 1: So let's just finish us by reminding ourselves what the
6:24
Speaker 1: panopticon is. It's the idea proposed by the so called
6:28
Speaker 1: philosopher Jeremy Bentham in seventeen ninety one of a theoretical
6:33
Speaker 1: circular prison design allowing a single central observer to watch
6:37
Speaker 1: all emits without being seen, based on the central inspection principle,
6:42
Speaker 1: and it aims to reform behavior through constant surveillance and
6:46
Speaker 1: the psychological and the psychological internalized feeling of being watched.
6:52
Speaker 2: He described it as.
6:53
Speaker 1: Power of mind over mind. So we're talking about a
6:56
Speaker 1: cylindrical building with a central inspector's lodge and other cell
7:00
Speaker 1: with light passing through so that there's backlighting. So the
7:05
Speaker 1: entire prison population, as I say, could be watched by
7:07
Speaker 1: a single guard. Now, he Bentham designed this for prisons,
7:10
Speaker 1: but he also intended for schools, for factories, for asylums.
7:14
Speaker 1: As he talked about it, and he was talking about
7:17
Speaker 1: maximizing utility, productivity, and order. And this is clearly now
7:23
Speaker 1: this is clearly now what is being built, what Mahmouda
7:26
Speaker 1: is talking about being absolutely desirous of, And so this
7:31
Speaker 1: goes way beyond just simple digital ID.
7:34
Speaker 3: It absolutely does, and for a roadmap, it really is
7:39
Speaker 3: attempting to join everything together. And I think really the
7:44
Speaker 3: way that this should be looked at is through the
7:48
Speaker 3: lens of considering why it is that they ainly suggest
7:52
Speaker 3: that there will be positive outcomes. There is absolutely no
7:55
Speaker 3: suggestion that this is a balance or a trade off,
7:58
Speaker 3: that there could be any die size, and I think
8:00
Speaker 3: that that should really raise a red flag to anybody
8:03
Speaker 3: hearing about this. The idea that changing something wholesale is
8:06
Speaker 3: not going to have any undesirable consequence is an absolutely
8:10
Speaker 3: extraordinary and therefore completely unlikely outcome. I think that that's
8:15
Speaker 3: a big part of it. There's no concession at all
8:18
Speaker 3: to the inherent vulnerability of putting everything in the same place.
8:23
Speaker 3: I think the idea that setting this out and using
8:28
Speaker 3: the sorts of language as you say that Dominic Cummings
8:31
Speaker 3: might have been proud to have put together is just
8:35
Speaker 3: disingenuous beyond compare, because there are example upon example of
8:42
Speaker 3: systems like this failing. And I think that you know,
8:44
Speaker 3: the greater the centralization, the greater the danger if there
8:48
Speaker 3: is a failure. And I think that's one of the
8:49
Speaker 3: things among many that absolutely are not being talked about
8:52
Speaker 3: and presumably will not get talked about unless this is
8:55
Speaker 3: raised as an issue at the local levels and has
8:58
Speaker 3: pushed effectively pushed back up hill because that there is
9:02
Speaker 3: no real debate or discussion about this, I think.
9:05
Speaker 1: I mean, we're going to be talking about China towards
9:07
Speaker 1: the end of the program, and of course what we're
9:10
Speaker 1: constantly seeing is people looking at China and making claims
9:14
Speaker 1: about social credit systems and so on, and worrying about
9:18
Speaker 1: what's going on over there, no concern generally about because
9:22
Speaker 1: they can't believe that this would be the type of
9:24
Speaker 1: infrastructure that is being built here, but it absolutely is.
9:28
Speaker 1: So you know, we've got to we've got to be
9:30
Speaker 1: aware of what's going on in our own country. Many
9:32
Speaker 1: people are but limiting it just to digital idea is
9:36
Speaker 1: not going far enough. Vanessa. I'd be interested to get
9:40
Speaker 1: an idea of what kind of experience people in the
9:43
Speaker 1: Middle East are having of this type of policy. Is
9:46
Speaker 1: there or are there attempts in Southwest as you to
9:50
Speaker 1: bring this type of thing in.
9:55
Speaker 4: Well, obviously apart from inside is really prisoned, where of
10:00
Speaker 4: course there is a huge degree of surveillance and dehumanization.
10:06
Speaker 4: I'm not sure. I mean here definitely not. We might
10:09
Speaker 4: have just got biometric in some of the passport offices,
10:15
Speaker 4: generally it doesn't work very well. UAE, of course, has
10:21
Speaker 4: just joined Pax Silica, which is the complex of all
10:28
Speaker 4: of the countries involved in basically introducing AI digital control
10:35
Speaker 4: in the future, which has very much Israel at its center.
10:39
Speaker 4: So I would say in the Zionis block, in the
10:42
Speaker 4: countries that were created by Britain to support Israel, for example,
10:46
Speaker 4: like Saudi Arabia, but particularly UAE, you might be finding it. Yeah,
10:51
Speaker 4: but not to this level.
10:52
Speaker 2: No, okay, thank you for that.
10:55
Speaker 1: But of course, related to this, Charles is policing, because
10:59
Speaker 1: obviously was very clear that one of the major applications
11:03
Speaker 1: of this would be the idea of pre crime and
11:06
Speaker 1: getting the police one on board. Are what is the
11:11
Speaker 1: star War's vision for policing in the UK, then.
11:14
Speaker 2: Well this is exactly it.
11:15
Speaker 3: And I should say if you didn't watch Monday's UK
11:18
Speaker 3: column News then you should of course, because Ben Rubin
11:21
Speaker 3: was articulating initial thoughts on the idea of police reform,
11:27
Speaker 3: because of course at that stage no documentation had actually
11:29
Speaker 3: been produced. It has now been produced, and Shabonama Mood,
11:33
Speaker 3: the Home Secretary, has had quite a lot to say
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Speaker 3: about it. Here she is tweeting that today's reforms marked
11:39
Speaker 3: the biggest shake up to policing in two hundred years.
11:41
Speaker 3: So what she's doing there, in terms of setting the
11:45
Speaker 3: scene is trying to invoke the spirit of Peel, who
11:49
Speaker 3: is credited, of course with starting the idea of a
11:53
Speaker 3: reformalized police force in the first place. Now, I would
11:58
Speaker 3: put it that she has not really read around the subject,
12:02
Speaker 3: and to qualify that, I would just make the point
12:07
Speaker 3: first of all, that in her introduction to the document
12:09
Speaker 3: she talks about the suggestion that the police is broken,
12:13
Speaker 3: but then counters that by saying that arrests are up
12:17
Speaker 3: by five percent. And I think this articulates the very
12:21
Speaker 3: center of the problem. And we'll just look at the
12:26
Speaker 3: first of the Pelian principles in order to get an
12:28
Speaker 3: idea of.
12:29
Speaker 2: What I mean by that.
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Speaker 3: Now, the first one is that the basic mission for
12:32
Speaker 3: which the police exists is to prevent crime and disorder. Now,
12:36
Speaker 3: arrests are not by nature preventative, although as much has
12:42
Speaker 3: just been alluding to, will watch this space. So the
12:45
Speaker 3: fundamental issue appears to be that Shabanamood and others are
12:49
Speaker 3: confusing the solving of crime with stopping crime, and they
12:52
Speaker 3: are two very very different things. Now, to move on
12:58
Speaker 3: from what it was set out by a Peel all
13:01
Speaker 3: those years ago, we'll look at the document itself and
13:05
Speaker 3: just put a few things out from the executive summary
13:10
Speaker 3: and indeed her opening remarks, and straight back to what
13:14
Speaker 3: Mike's been talking about, really serious and organized crime is growing.
13:17
Speaker 3: A nine in every ten crimes now has a digital component.
13:21
Speaker 3: Now that's a very significant point to make when one
13:25
Speaker 3: is suggesting that the answer to that is further and
13:28
Speaker 3: further digitization. They go on to say, and I've pulled
13:33
Speaker 3: out just sort of selective parts that I think are
13:35
Speaker 3: all merit some consideration. We will modernize legislation, such as
13:39
Speaker 3: the Public Order at nineteen eighty six to ensure that
13:43
Speaker 3: the police are clearer about where the line stands between
13:46
Speaker 3: freedom of speech and criminality. Now we've seen that line
13:52
Speaker 3: absolutely blurred and let's say very much not likely trodden
13:58
Speaker 3: over the last few years.
14:00
Speaker 2: What is it.
14:00
Speaker 3: Exactly they mean by this course? Public Order at nineteen
14:02
Speaker 3: eighty six has the more obvious offenses or at least
14:06
Speaker 3: perhaps clearer offenses of riot, violent disorder, and afray, but
14:10
Speaker 3: the controversial ones being fear or provocation of violence and
14:13
Speaker 3: the harassment offenses, but effectively turning the offense itself into
14:18
Speaker 3: a subjective affair, because of course it's for the victim
14:20
Speaker 3: to report how they felt about the particular incident in question. Now,
14:24
Speaker 3: with further digitization, it's hard to see how this is
14:26
Speaker 3: going to turn out any better for either apparent victims
14:32
Speaker 3: or suspects in those situations. Now, the document goes on
14:37
Speaker 3: to talk about rolling out artificial intelligence AI powered tools
14:41
Speaker 3: and software to automate manual processes, saving the police valuable
14:46
Speaker 3: time so that it can be redirected towards serving the public. Again,
14:51
Speaker 3: to suggest that that is simply a phata con plea
14:55
Speaker 3: because you can say that it will save time and
14:57
Speaker 3: therefore there will be an outright benefit is a claim
15:00
Speaker 3: requires again much further investigation. This is absolutely the theme
15:04
Speaker 3: of the document and very much follows Mike's report about
15:08
Speaker 3: putting out these totally unqualified positives that seem to have
15:13
Speaker 3: veered so far away from the status quo it's to
15:17
Speaker 3: be very very questionable also in terms of the control structures,
15:22
Speaker 3: and this is what Ben was surmising on Monday. The
15:26
Speaker 3: police and Crime commissioners will be abolished and they'll be
15:30
Speaker 3: replaced directly sorry, with directly elected mayors, and where mayors
15:34
Speaker 3: do not yet exist, with policing and crime boards made
15:38
Speaker 3: up of local council leaders. And this is said that
15:43
Speaker 3: the new system of police governments will reintegrate policing back
15:47
Speaker 3: into the system of local government in England and Wales,
15:50
Speaker 3: enabling greater collaboration across local services. Now again, if one
15:56
Speaker 3: assumes good faith, that could in some ways be the case.
16:00
Speaker 2: However, just to qualify it a bit.
16:02
Speaker 3: To reintegrate back into local politics cannot really be what
16:05
Speaker 3: it sounds like, because, of course, as Ben was intimating
16:08
Speaker 3: on Monday, partly this is because the nature of local
16:11
Speaker 3: politics has changed such an enormous amount in the intervening period,
16:15
Speaker 3: but also because of the capabilities in data collection and
16:19
Speaker 3: sharing between all the various agencies that will be involved
16:22
Speaker 3: in this, and of course the many many digital compromises
16:26
Speaker 3: and vulnerabilities that are inherent in doing any of that,
16:30
Speaker 3: and we return to the Pelian principles because we look
16:35
Speaker 3: at this one which says police c can preserve public
16:37
Speaker 3: favor not by catering to the public opinion, but by
16:40
Speaker 3: constantly demonstrating absolute impartial service to the law. Now involving
16:45
Speaker 3: police hierarchy with local politicians, given the state of affairs
16:50
Speaker 3: in local politics local democracy, if we can still call
16:53
Speaker 3: it that nowadays, I would say again is another significant compromise. Now,
16:59
Speaker 3: of course this document has come out. It's making great
17:02
Speaker 3: claims to turn the police over in a productive sense
17:05
Speaker 3: for more than they have been.
17:07
Speaker 2: In two hundred years.
17:08
Speaker 3: Therefore, there's been inevitable sort of commentary and response to this.
17:12
Speaker 3: As far as police bodies are concerned, there's been almost
17:15
Speaker 3: universal applause for the reforms as they're set out, with
17:19
Speaker 3: the exception of the Association of Police and Crime Commissioners. Now,
17:24
Speaker 3: given that I've just read out text saying they're going
17:26
Speaker 3: to be abolished, it would be easy to say that
17:28
Speaker 3: that's sour grapes, But in fact I think we should
17:31
Speaker 3: look at the point they make, which is there is
17:33
Speaker 3: also a risk that national police service could stifle local
17:36
Speaker 3: innovation and restrict the ability of local communities to shape
17:40
Speaker 3: how policing affects their lives, and large regional forces risk
17:44
Speaker 3: weakening local responsiveness and accountability while introducing unnecessary complexity and costs.
17:50
Speaker 3: I should have said that, which I'll come on to
17:52
Speaker 3: in a bit, but that one of the solutions to
17:54
Speaker 3: the problem is the idea of the National Police Service,
17:57
Speaker 3: which again Ben was talking about on Monday, referring to
17:59
Speaker 3: it as a of a rehashed version of the FBI. No,
18:05
Speaker 3: we're going to look at, or rather listen to what
18:09
Speaker 3: it was that shabanam Mood said in the House of
18:14
Speaker 3: Commons about one of the points that is bound to
18:16
Speaker 3: provoke whilst should certainly provoke a fair degree more debate.
18:22
Speaker 5: While some forces surge ahead with the results to show
18:26
Speaker 5: for it, others are fighting crime in a digital age
18:29
Speaker 5: with analog methods. We will ensure that every force is
18:34
Speaker 5: adopting the latest technology led out of the new National
18:37
Speaker 5: Police Service, and this will include the largest ever rollout
18:41
Speaker 5: of live facial recognition technologies across England and Wales. We
18:47
Speaker 5: know this approach works in London. In just two years,
18:51
Speaker 5: the Metropolitan Police have made seventeen hundred arrests, taking robbers
18:55
Speaker 5: domestic abuses and rapists off our streets. When the future arrives,
19:01
Speaker 5: there are always doubters. One hundred years ago, fingerprinting was
19:05
Speaker 5: decried as curtailing our civil liberties, but today we could
19:09
Speaker 5: not imagine policing without it. I have no doubt the
19:13
Speaker 5: same will prove true of facial recognition technology in the
19:16
Speaker 5: years to come. At the same time, we will launch
19:20
Speaker 5: Police dot AI, investing a record one hundred and fifteen
19:24
Speaker 5: million pounds in AI and automation to make policing more
19:28
Speaker 5: effective and efficient. Stripping admin a way to ensure officer
19:33
Speaker 5: time can be devoted to the human factor that only
19:36
Speaker 5: a police officer.
19:40
Speaker 3: So as far as she's concerned, job done. We've got computers,
19:43
Speaker 3: they can do it. We can all step back and
19:46
Speaker 3: that's that.
19:46
Speaker 4: Now.
19:47
Speaker 3: I think it's not quite that simple, And certainly in
19:50
Speaker 3: terms of the symmetry or indeed asymmetry, she's suggesting that
19:53
Speaker 3: the answer to a digital threat is a digital solution, whereas,
19:56
Speaker 3: of course, in actual fact, to pervade an analog set
20:02
Speaker 3: up with a digital invasion is impossible. And again that's
20:07
Speaker 3: absolutely being glossed over, and again relates exactly back to
20:10
Speaker 3: what Mike's been reporting on.
20:12
Speaker 6: Now.
20:13
Speaker 3: The other thing is that again exactly like Mike says,
20:16
Speaker 3: she's talking about thought crime and pre Crime's exactly where
20:19
Speaker 3: we're going with this with live facial recognition, because otherwise
20:24
Speaker 3: how would she be able to say that that has
20:27
Speaker 3: delivered the effect that it has, and again concentrating on
20:30
Speaker 3: arrests rather than actually the prevention of the crime in
20:32
Speaker 3: the first place. Now, as you've just had to talk
20:35
Speaker 3: about the announcement of the AI capability, she made a
20:38
Speaker 3: mistake of giving the website address of Police AI. And
20:43
Speaker 3: you'd think that somebody might have just popped a holding
20:46
Speaker 3: page up there, but not so. And since AI is
20:50
Speaker 3: heralded as the future, I did ask it to generate
20:52
Speaker 3: an image of the success that my Mood and the
20:55
Speaker 3: proposed National Police Service are pointing towards now as a
20:59
Speaker 3: sign of things to come. This is what was produced. No,
21:03
Speaker 3: at first glance, you may not see much wrong with that,
21:06
Speaker 3: and if you can't see it, I should point out
21:08
Speaker 3: that it's sort of two and a bit police officers
21:12
Speaker 3: wearing an extraordinary ray of kit, including masks covering their face.
21:16
Speaker 3: Shabonama Mood has been turned into a journalist. And then
21:20
Speaker 3: when you look more closely, you'll see the police countible
21:23
Speaker 3: on the left of the frame is missing his head.
21:26
Speaker 3: Now I was confused by this at first, but actually
21:29
Speaker 3: I see that it is an accurate rendition. I've taken
21:31
Speaker 3: advantage of the UK Columns Graphics Department to correct the image.
21:36
Speaker 3: So if we can just go full screen again, please Chris.
21:39
Speaker 3: This is exactly what's being suggested. We are replacing the
21:43
Speaker 3: human brain with a computer. We are surrendering the human
21:47
Speaker 3: mind to the bias of artificial intelligence. Now, the answer
21:52
Speaker 3: proposed is in terms of this reform is a national
21:57
Speaker 3: police service, and you know one should concede at least
22:01
Speaker 3: that there are some sensible points made, and they say
22:04
Speaker 3: that as one force it will be better equipped to
22:06
Speaker 3: share technology, intelligence and resources to stop the growing threat
22:09
Speaker 3: from crime that has become increasingly complex digital online and
22:12
Speaker 3: with no respect for constabulary borders. Now I can talk
22:16
Speaker 3: a bit more about this in extra but there are
22:17
Speaker 3: absolutely great frictions associated with having forty three contabularies within
22:24
Speaker 3: England alone, England and Wales, I should say, and there
22:28
Speaker 3: are absolutely efficiencies to be gained there, but that's taking
22:31
Speaker 3: it at face value and of course ignoring the very
22:33
Speaker 3: many pitfalls to centralization, which I think is what the
22:37
Speaker 3: APCC are trying to get at. But they're pointing towards
22:40
Speaker 3: the advantages of procuring technology, clothing, and general sort of
22:44
Speaker 3: cost saving. They're also saying that they can recruit another
22:47
Speaker 3: thirteen thousand more neighborhood police, and they are trying to
22:53
Speaker 3: separate those on the beat from the admin burden. Again,
22:57
Speaker 3: would be an effective mood move, but only if done correctly.
23:01
Speaker 3: No on vetting and personnel disasters. Are's a plan to
23:04
Speaker 3: introduce a license of practice to practice, which is going
23:07
Speaker 3: to be managed by the College of Policing. But again
23:11
Speaker 3: the issue with this is it's not really made clear
23:13
Speaker 3: how just having a license would actually enhance the situation.
23:18
Speaker 3: So there's more to come out on that, and we
23:22
Speaker 3: look further again to have the billion principle of maintaining
23:28
Speaker 3: the relationship with the public gives reality to the historic
23:31
Speaker 3: tradition that the police are the public and the public
23:34
Speaker 3: are the police, again, something I think that's been glossed
23:37
Speaker 3: over very much in the reforms as they're put forward now.
23:42
Speaker 2: And I don't know if we've got time to just show.
23:43
Speaker 3: A quick ahead video clip really just to get to
23:47
Speaker 3: the point of considering whether or not police are actually
23:51
Speaker 3: thinking about what they're doing. Catherine Gunn, who will be
23:54
Speaker 3: known to many of the UK column audience, was stopped
23:56
Speaker 3: whilst coming into the UK recently and this is short
24:00
Speaker 3: clip of her experiences.
24:03
Speaker 6: At the top of the metal stairway were three police
24:07
Speaker 6: officers and as soon as we stepped our foot out
24:11
Speaker 6: of the plane, we heard them say are you Catherine
24:16
Speaker 6: Gunn and my daughter's name? And I was like yes,
24:22
Speaker 6: and it was a shock to be asked by police
24:25
Speaker 6: officers as soon as we stepped off the plane. And
24:29
Speaker 6: so we went down the steps and my daughter was
24:33
Speaker 6: taken by a female police officer to one side of
24:37
Speaker 6: the stairs and I was taken by two other police
24:42
Speaker 6: officers to male officers to the other side of the steps.
24:46
Speaker 6: So we were separated and then basically the male police
24:52
Speaker 6: officers asked me. They said, we have been contacted by
24:58
Speaker 6: members of the flight crew who were concerned about child
25:06
Speaker 6: safety safeguarding. And I was like, well, what's the evidence.
25:10
Speaker 6: There is no evidence. What the hell are they talking about?
25:13
Speaker 6: And they demanded that I give them my husband's name,
25:19
Speaker 6: our address in Turkey, and I was like, why should
25:22
Speaker 6: I give you that information. What's I'm not being Are
25:25
Speaker 6: you charging me with anything? But he basically threatened me
25:30
Speaker 6: with taking me to the border force and dragging out
25:33
Speaker 6: the whole process if I didn't give him our address.
25:38
Speaker 6: They didn't ask for any evidence, they didn't ask for
25:41
Speaker 6: our passports or anything.
25:46
Speaker 3: So Katherine's experiences there which could have been over in
25:48
Speaker 3: seconds if they simply asked for passports, but the inference
25:51
Speaker 3: there was that she might have been involved in child trafficking.
25:54
Speaker 3: And again I just put it forward that there is
25:57
Speaker 3: a reduced element of thought in policing in general. And
26:00
Speaker 3: so just to finish off the last point from the
26:03
Speaker 3: Pelian principles, which is that the test of police efficiency
26:06
Speaker 3: is the absence of crime and disorder, not the visible
26:08
Speaker 3: evidence of police action in dealing with it. And it
26:11
Speaker 3: looks very much like Mamoud reforms are absolutely meant to
26:15
Speaker 3: provide the evidence of dealing with.
26:20
Speaker 2: It rather than the absence of crime and disorder. Thank you, Charles.
26:24
Speaker 1: Vanessa offered to you then, and we're going to have
26:27
Speaker 1: a look at Israel and child abuse and I take
26:30
Speaker 1: your time.
26:33
Speaker 4: Yeah, of course, child abuses we've been demonstrating for some
26:37
Speaker 4: time as really systemic in Israel, not only against Palestinians,
26:43
Speaker 4: who of course are dehumanized beyond belief and tortured in
26:48
Speaker 4: some of the most sadistic ways, but even within their
26:52
Speaker 4: own society. And coming back to the police issue, it's
26:56
Speaker 4: fascinating that the people who are being arrested by the
26:59
Speaker 4: police in the UK are the people that are literally
27:02
Speaker 4: exposing the crimes from within Israeli society. So again we
27:09
Speaker 4: have to question what exactly the police are there to
27:12
Speaker 4: do in the UK, and perhaps we can discuss that
27:15
Speaker 4: further in extra But actually this is a follow up.
27:20
Speaker 4: This is a recent case where a cyber CEO was
27:24
Speaker 4: found guilty of statutory rape assaulted children as young as
27:29
Speaker 4: four years old and multiple minor underage rape cases from him.
27:37
Speaker 4: This is Ittai Levy. We actually covered this story I
27:40
Speaker 4: think about a year ago, but now he has been
27:44
Speaker 4: found guilty and convicted, and of course he was connected.
27:48
Speaker 4: He was the CEO of Cornelius, which is a major
27:53
Speaker 4: cyber security company. And again, of course this brings us
27:56
Speaker 4: back to the fact that of course much of the cybersecurity,
28:00
Speaker 4: the data storage, the Health and Education, Ministry of Defense
28:05
Speaker 4: information is going to be stored by individuals that are
28:10
Speaker 4: certainly have their roots in the Israeli spy agencies. But
28:15
Speaker 4: seeing to what extent this sexual predator nature is prevalent
28:21
Speaker 4: in Israeli society, we also have to start raising questions
28:25
Speaker 4: about this. This was I think a few days ago
28:28
Speaker 4: an IDF SO, a military reservist convicted in large scale
28:33
Speaker 4: online child sexual abuse case. Content warning. While I am
28:38
Speaker 4: going to show the content, because there's a couple of
28:41
Speaker 4: things in there that I would really like to discuss
28:43
Speaker 4: further in extra so let's have a look at what
28:47
Speaker 4: the case actually involved. So apparently he used technology he
28:51
Speaker 4: found online that allowed him to appear and sound like
28:54
Speaker 4: a woman during video calls. During those conversations, he instructed
28:58
Speaker 4: the men to carry out some sexual acts against their
29:01
Speaker 4: minor children. This is my first question, how on earth
29:04
Speaker 4: can you persuade a father a parent to actually conduct
29:10
Speaker 4: or carry out sexual abuse against their own children. This
29:13
Speaker 4: included infants and very young children, and to document the
29:16
Speaker 4: abuse and send him the footage. It detailed a series
29:20
Speaker 4: of impersonations that led to sexual abuse within families. In
29:23
Speaker 4: one case, he posed as a woman while speaking with
29:26
Speaker 4: the father of a one and one and a half
29:29
Speaker 4: year old girl and directed him to carry out sexual
29:32
Speaker 4: acts in the child's room during a video call. In
29:36
Speaker 4: another case, using the alias Maria, he persuaded a father
29:39
Speaker 4: to sexually abuse his young son, telling him the child
29:42
Speaker 4: would not remember because of his age. Prosecutors said Alfhia
29:46
Speaker 4: also communicated under female identities with dozens of other social
29:50
Speaker 4: media users, including miners, convincing them to perform sexual acts
29:56
Speaker 4: on themselves, record the acts and send the material to him.
30:00
Speaker 4: Gate has found more than one hundred and fifty files
30:02
Speaker 4: containing child sexual abuse material in his possession. I wonder
30:08
Speaker 4: where online safety was in Israel, And then I want
30:12
Speaker 4: to come on to the latest report from an Israeli
30:16
Speaker 4: human rights organization based in the occupied territories, but Slam
30:21
Speaker 4: Living Hell. This is a follow up from their previous
30:25
Speaker 4: report which was called Welcome to Hell, published in August
30:28
Speaker 4: twenty twenty four. The Israeli prison system is a network
30:32
Speaker 4: of torture camps. So let's have a look at what
30:34
Speaker 4: they actually say. Now, they do give content warning sexual violence,
30:40
Speaker 4: and I will show a screenshot from the actual report.
30:44
Speaker 4: You can freeze frame and read it at will, or
30:46
Speaker 4: of course, the link to the report will be in
30:49
Speaker 4: the show notes. But let's have a look at the
30:51
Speaker 4: actual screenshot. Now, what this is talking about is multiple
30:56
Speaker 4: cases of rape with with sorry, it's very difficult to
31:03
Speaker 4: talk about this with objects, human beings raping women and
31:09
Speaker 4: men within the Israeli forces, by the way, conducted these
31:14
Speaker 4: rapes and appalling torture basically attacking people's genitals, bringing dogs
31:25
Speaker 4: into urinate on prisoners and so on, absolutely appalling. I mean,
31:31
Speaker 4: I wonder what on earth I'm reading when you go
31:34
Speaker 4: through that report. And this is just a very short
31:38
Speaker 4: section of one of the videos from the first report,
31:41
Speaker 4: Welcome to Hell, which as I said, was published in August.
31:45
Speaker 4: So let's just play this.
31:48
Speaker 7: Now. We bought cown Bridge home law Nijon has said
32:15
Speaker 7: what the as film Monte had.
32:36
Speaker 4: So again, as I said, you know, with Britain getting
32:39
Speaker 4: closer and closer every single political party in the U
32:42
Speaker 4: K being friends of or having a section which is
32:46
Speaker 4: friends of Israel, we need to really start wondering to
32:50
Speaker 4: what extent they are aware of and are involved in
32:53
Speaker 4: what is going on.
32:55
Speaker 1: Yes, well well done Vanessa for covering that, because this
32:59
Speaker 1: is not something that we're hearing from anybody else as
33:03
Speaker 1: far as I'm aware. In the UK at least, and
33:06
Speaker 1: so we need to have more insight into these types
33:10
Speaker 1: of problems in that part of the world. Let's move
33:14
Speaker 1: on then. UK Holme of course, only continues to operate
33:19
Speaker 1: with your assistance, So if you can possibly help us financially,
33:23
Speaker 1: that would be really appreciated. There is a section on
33:27
Speaker 1: the UK Colme website that you can find by getting
33:30
Speaker 1: to the front page and get all the details for
33:33
Speaker 1: how you can help us out that way. If you
33:35
Speaker 1: can't help us financially, please do at least share this program,
33:39
Speaker 1: any of the articles on the website, any of the
33:41
Speaker 1: podcasts that you enjoy, please share those and that helps
33:45
Speaker 1: us beat the censorship regime. Now tonight Jerem is going
33:50
Speaker 1: to be speaking to Dave Advice about flat Earth apparently,
33:53
Speaker 1: so join him at seven o'clock for that. We've got
33:56
Speaker 1: something to say about that just after the ad break
33:58
Speaker 1: here and then the Silken Steel podcast with Carls is
34:02
Speaker 1: going to be talking about Mark Karney and his comments
34:06
Speaker 1: at Davos. But I just want to briefly mention Dave
34:12
Speaker 1: Advice being on with Germ tonight. Of course, German covers
34:15
Speaker 1: a wide range of topics and he is not in
34:17
Speaker 1: any way restrictive about who he speaks to, and we
34:21
Speaker 1: wouldn't attempt to restrict who he speaks to. But Dave
34:25
Speaker 1: Advice I do have a bit of a problem with
34:27
Speaker 1: because of course he, aside from the topic itself, he
34:32
Speaker 1: pushes forward an app which is how he apparently funds
34:36
Speaker 1: his activities, and well, this is Consumer Rights Wiki, which
34:40
Speaker 1: is run by Lewis Rossman, who is a fantastic advocate
34:43
Speaker 1: for consumer rights and for right to repair and so on,
34:47
Speaker 1: and is really the man behind the Klibby campaign, if
34:50
Speaker 1: anybody's aware of that. But what this is pointing out
34:54
Speaker 1: is that basically, for the last number of years Vice
34:58
Speaker 1: has been pushing out this app which people can get
35:01
Speaker 1: access to through their various phones and so on, but
35:05
Speaker 1: that he is completely lax with his security and therefore
35:12
Speaker 1: people's personal information their email address, their password, their location
35:16
Speaker 1: on the planet and so on is easily downloadable from
35:21
Speaker 1: the app. Now he's been warned about this four years
35:25
Speaker 1: and refuses to do anything about it. So I think
35:28
Speaker 1: it's just worth mentioning that because obviously, if you do
35:31
Speaker 1: support him using this app, you are putting any personal
35:34
Speaker 1: information that you give at risk. So that's just what
35:38
Speaker 1: I wanted to say about that. Yeah, good, okay, let's
35:42
Speaker 1: let's move on to reform Charles.
35:45
Speaker 3: Yes, No, it's the weekly update which which started and
35:50
Speaker 3: has absolutely been worth continuing because there has been, yes,
35:54
Speaker 3: another defection, and it just goes to show that there
35:56
Speaker 3: is a theme that has emerged. And here we are
35:59
Speaker 3: seeing Sweller Brovman with Nahnyahu proudly showing her photograph on
36:03
Speaker 3: Twitter Admissileie that was back a couple of years ago.
36:07
Speaker 3: But she talks about strong relationships between Israel and the
36:09
Speaker 3: United Kingdom. And if you've missed previous updates on reform,
36:13
Speaker 3: you'll know that that is exactly the theme that I
36:16
Speaker 3: have been referring to. And the question is is in
36:19
Speaker 3: whose interests? We've had Nigel barrajh now going to Davos
36:22
Speaker 3: protesting of course that he's going to be pursuing the
36:25
Speaker 3: idea of national sovereignty for the United Kingdom, but in
36:29
Speaker 3: actual fact everything is pointing in the other direction. Here
36:31
Speaker 3: we have Bradman back in twenty fifteen on a sponsored
36:34
Speaker 3: visit to Israel by the Conservative Friends of Israel. And
36:37
Speaker 3: just to remind you what the Conservative Friends of Israel
36:39
Speaker 3: actually do. They say that we aim to ensure Israel's
36:43
Speaker 3: case is fairly represented in Parliament, and that means in
36:47
Speaker 3: the Parliament of the United Kingdom. Now what business Israel's
36:51
Speaker 3: case has been represented by parliamentarians who are supposed to
36:55
Speaker 3: represent their constituencies has not made quite clear.
36:59
Speaker 2: Now.
36:59
Speaker 3: Braman, you may recall, is married to Raul Brotherman, who
37:04
Speaker 3: is also involved with the Reform Party, and early last year,
37:08
Speaker 3: about a year ago, was making overtures to the Board
37:12
Speaker 3: of Deputies in effect to convince them that actually Reform
37:16
Speaker 3: was a natural home for people of Jewish faith. And again,
37:21
Speaker 3: just for context on this, it shouldn't be regarded as
37:25
Speaker 3: coincidence that Suella Brovman was Home Secretary back in twenty
37:28
Speaker 3: twenty three when the current conflict took hold, and I
37:33
Speaker 3: rate an article back then called Home Secretary picks Aside
37:36
Speaker 3: for the Police, and I would encourage you to read
37:37
Speaker 3: it because what she did to police there, first of all,
37:40
Speaker 3: was an abuse of her position as Home Secretary in
37:44
Speaker 3: that she was trampling all over police operational independence. But
37:47
Speaker 3: also she was absolutely skewing the narrative completely in favor
37:51
Speaker 3: of Israel. And this is where reform is going.
37:55
Speaker 1: Thank you for that, Charles, and I let's talk about
37:57
Speaker 1: censorship for a second because of six months since I've
38:00
Speaker 1: began enforcing age verification in the UK, and the effect
38:04
Speaker 1: on freedom of speech, of course has been chilling. Vanessa
38:07
Speaker 1: and Alex Crile have both reported on the misuse of
38:10
Speaker 1: the requirements to censor on substock and more and more
38:14
Speaker 1: people are choosing not to look at content rather than
38:17
Speaker 1: to submit to the age verification regime. Well offcom is
38:20
Speaker 1: not announced that the Global Online Safety Regulators Network just
38:24
Speaker 1: put that back on screen. Chris, which brings together online
38:28
Speaker 1: safety regulators across the world, has set out its views
38:31
Speaker 1: and expectations on what they describe as the important ROLEAGE
38:35
Speaker 1: assurance pays in the global effort to protect children. Now
38:38
Speaker 1: that's being absolutely clear about this. It plays no role
38:41
Speaker 1: in protecting children, as will come on to a second
38:43
Speaker 1: in a second. Now in the UK, age checks or
38:46
Speaker 1: they describe it as the cornerstone of the Online Safety Act,
38:50
Speaker 1: and they say that their roles, their rules sorry requiring
38:53
Speaker 1: sites and apps to have highly effective ITGE assurance have
38:56
Speaker 1: been enforced since July and that they're currently monitoring services
38:59
Speaker 1: complay and that they've opened eighty three investigations into adult
39:05
Speaker 1: websites as part of their enforcement program, and that they
39:09
Speaker 1: have recently fined one service provider AVS one million pounds
39:13
Speaker 1: for failing to have highly effective age asurant checks in place.
39:17
Speaker 1: And this is because the pornography industry is the poster
39:19
Speaker 1: child for all of this, the justification which is supposed
39:23
Speaker 1: to make it acceptable in the minds of the public,
39:26
Speaker 1: and in an effort to build opposition to the policy,
39:28
Speaker 1: then the biggest porn site, Pornhub, has decided to restrict
39:32
Speaker 1: access to its site to UK users from next week.
39:37
Speaker 1: But as we've been reporting, despite claims of plummeting viewer
39:41
Speaker 1: numbers of Pornhub here in the UK, it's clear that
39:44
Speaker 1: people have been taking to VPN use to subvert the
39:47
Speaker 1: age verification requirement and this has been recognized and so
39:52
Speaker 1: the House of Lords has decided to vote that age
39:54
Speaker 1: verification should be extended to VPN use, confirming what we
39:59
Speaker 1: suggest was going to happen at the time that VPNs
40:02
Speaker 1: would become a target for political interference. Now this comes
40:05
Speaker 1: as an amendment Amendment ninety two to the Children's well
40:08
Speaker 1: Being in School's Bill proposed and the amendments being proposed
40:11
Speaker 1: by Lord Nash. Amendment ninety two would insert a new
40:14
Speaker 1: clause titled Action to Prohibit the Provision of VPN services
40:18
Speaker 1: to Children in the United Kingdom, and it requires that
40:20
Speaker 1: within twelve months of the Act being passed, the Secretary
40:23
Speaker 1: of State must make regulations prohibiting VPN services from being
40:26
Speaker 1: provided to children, and that's described as under eighteens. VPN
40:31
Speaker 1: providers may be required to apply age assurance that is
40:34
Speaker 1: highly effective at correctly determining or not the person as
40:38
Speaker 1: a child. That ofcom would be would produce guidance for
40:41
Speaker 1: VPN providers and compliance, and the government would establish a
40:45
Speaker 1: monitoring regime with enforcement measures and penalties for non compliance.
40:49
Speaker 1: But has been pointing out time and time again, none
40:52
Speaker 1: of this does anything to protect children who.
40:55
Speaker 2: Are by far put at risk.
40:57
Speaker 1: Far and away the biggest risk online is by adults
41:00
Speaker 1: posing as children on websites like roblocks that have no
41:03
Speaker 1: age Assurance department to confirm that users are actually children.
41:07
Speaker 1: The biggest risk the children from grooming, and these are
41:11
Speaker 1: the types of platforms. Roblocks is the type of platform
41:14
Speaker 1: where that kind of thing happens is highlighted by Miller
41:17
Speaker 1: Law on screen.
41:17
Speaker 2: At the moment.
41:18
Speaker 1: All this in the show notes, so do pay attention
41:21
Speaker 1: on the UK column website to the show notes for this.
41:23
Speaker 1: But then moving on from here, of course, Australia decided
41:28
Speaker 1: that under sixteen should be banned from any social media
41:31
Speaker 1: useless use. Recently, France has now decided to do the
41:35
Speaker 1: same thing, so they've passed a bill that will ban
41:38
Speaker 1: social media use by under fifteens in their case, and
41:41
Speaker 1: this of course was championed by Macron as a way
41:44
Speaker 1: to protect children from too much screen time. So the
41:50
Speaker 1: National Assembly has adopted to that, it will go to
41:52
Speaker 1: the Senate and so on. Macron very excited about this.
41:56
Speaker 1: It's a major step apparently in dealing with this. Finally,
42:00
Speaker 1: I just want to mention that, sorry, just before we
42:04
Speaker 1: get onto the Finally, we'll just mention, of course, this
42:06
Speaker 1: is absolutely happening in the UK as well, because the
42:08
Speaker 1: proposals are in here's the House of Commons Library proposals
42:12
Speaker 1: to ban social media for children, so this is coming
42:14
Speaker 1: to the UK as well. And finally I just mentioned
42:17
Speaker 1: what's been going on with TikTok because tech talk users
42:20
Speaker 1: are saying they can't upload anti ICE videos in the
42:23
Speaker 1: United States. Tech talk themselves are saying that this is
42:27
Speaker 1: as a result of tech issues. The BBC covering this
42:31
Speaker 1: as well. Tech talk US pushes back on claims censoring content.
42:34
Speaker 1: Now they're saying that this is because of tech issues,
42:36
Speaker 1: it may well be. What I'll say is that if
42:39
Speaker 1: it's if it is genuine, then this is an example
42:44
Speaker 1: of the next step, which of course is that content
42:47
Speaker 1: gets scanned before it's uploaded, and it's prevented from being
42:50
Speaker 1: uploaded in the first place. If it's content that they
42:52
Speaker 1: don't like, what I'm going to say about purely anecdotal,
42:56
Speaker 1: I'll accept. But our personal experience with tech TikTok it is,
43:00
Speaker 1: despite its claims that it's not centering people, it is
43:04
Speaker 1: the most censorious social media platform out there. And so
43:08
Speaker 1: I'm highly skeptical about their claims that this was just
43:11
Speaker 1: sort of some kind of technical accidental thing. But so
43:15
Speaker 1: the censorship regime moves on a piers. But let's come
43:20
Speaker 1: back to Vanessa. Then, Vanessa, a lot has been going on,
43:23
Speaker 1: particularly in northeast Syria with the Kurds.
43:27
Speaker 4: Yes, I thought I swing back to Syria because there
43:31
Speaker 4: is a I mean, there has been a lot going
43:33
Speaker 4: on for the last few years right. There is a
43:36
Speaker 4: lot of plashes going on between the Kurds and the
43:42
Speaker 4: Jiolani HTS tech theory forces, and it appears that despite
43:49
Speaker 4: the fact that allegedly the Kurds fought Isis in Syria
43:53
Speaker 4: for years now, the US all I say they've been abandoned.
43:58
Speaker 4: And this is a general narrative now. Of course, from
44:03
Speaker 4: my perspective having lived in Syria, the Kurds, backed by
44:07
Speaker 4: the United States, effectively occupied north east Syria and took
44:13
Speaker 4: control of the oil resources and the agricultural resources, and
44:17
Speaker 4: in my opinion, were absolutely pivotal to the fall of
44:21
Speaker 4: Syria by energy depriving the Syrian people and also depriving
44:27
Speaker 4: them of agricultural sources from Syrian territory in the northeast
44:31
Speaker 4: on behalf of the United States. And in fact, former
44:34
Speaker 4: Syrian President Basharlesad said this in twenty nineteen in relation
44:39
Speaker 4: to the Kurds, we tell those groups who are betting
44:42
Speaker 4: on the Americans that the Americans will not protect you,
44:45
Speaker 4: They will put you in their pockets so that you
44:47
Speaker 4: can be a bargaining chip. And he was always very clear,
44:50
Speaker 4: as was a leadership of the Lebanese Resistance, that the
44:55
Speaker 4: Kurds would, as they have historically, be betrayed by the
45:00
Speaker 4: United States. Now, I just wanted to show I think
45:02
Speaker 4: this is a map from twenty nineteen which shows the
45:06
Speaker 4: territory that then was under the control even up to
45:09
Speaker 4: December twenty twenty four, that was under control of the Kurds,
45:13
Speaker 4: which is the yellow section, the green sections in the
45:16
Speaker 4: north there that are under the control of the Turkish
45:20
Speaker 4: military and their proxies. But if we look at a
45:23
Speaker 4: very recent map, this is January twenty twenty six, it's
45:26
Speaker 4: a little bit confusing, but the two red circles there
45:29
Speaker 4: are basically where the Kurdish forces and civilians have been
45:33
Speaker 4: forced to withdraw two to as they call it, Kobani
45:39
Speaker 4: and Hasseka, so Kobani in the north and Haska in
45:43
Speaker 4: the northeast, of course surrounded by the Turkish proxies and
45:48
Speaker 4: now by HTS. And of course, surprise surprise perhaps for
45:52
Speaker 4: some is the fact that isis are now being released.
45:57
Speaker 4: I'll come on too, that this is a state by
46:00
Speaker 4: Tom Barrick in the last couple of days, so he's
46:03
Speaker 4: basically now saying Syria has acknowledged the central government that
46:07
Speaker 4: has joined the Global Coalition to defeat ISIS. This shifts
46:12
Speaker 4: the rationale for the US STF partnership. The original purpose
46:16
Speaker 4: of SDF as the primary anti ISIS force on the
46:19
Speaker 4: ground has largely expired. And in fact, he goes on
46:23
Speaker 4: to say that Jolani and the HTS forces will take
46:26
Speaker 4: control of the ISIS holding camps. Meanwhile, of course, the
46:31
Speaker 4: majority of Jolani's tach Theory forces comprise ISIS members. So
46:36
Speaker 4: guess what they're actually releasing ISIS members from the prisons.
46:41
Speaker 4: I think those nine prisons in the Northeast holding up
46:46
Speaker 4: to one hundred thousand ISIS fighters and their families. But
46:50
Speaker 4: then if we look at what Lindsey Graham is saying,
46:53
Speaker 4: who's come slightly more to prominence recently under Trump? He says,
46:59
Speaker 4: it would be a design for US reputation and national
47:02
Speaker 4: security interest to abandon the Kurds. I will be introducing
47:05
Speaker 4: legislation this week designed to impose crippling sanctions on any
47:10
Speaker 4: government or group engaged in hostilities against the Kurds to
47:14
Speaker 4: save the Kurds Act. So this is getting a little
47:16
Speaker 4: bit silly now because Trump has just allegedly withdrawn the
47:19
Speaker 4: Caesar sanctions on Jolani's government, Whereas now Lindsay Graham is
47:24
Speaker 4: going to bring in an act to reimpose sanctions on
47:27
Speaker 4: the HDS government for the massacres that are now being
47:30
Speaker 4: committed against Kodesh civilians in the areas where HDS is advancing.
47:35
Speaker 4: Then let's have a look. And this is, in my opinion,
47:38
Speaker 4: entirely what this is all about. This is from US
47:42
Speaker 4: Central Command sentcom US Forces launch mission in Syria to
47:47
Speaker 4: guess what transfer isis detainees to Iraq. So what are
47:51
Speaker 4: they actually saying. They're saying the transfer mission began while
47:57
Speaker 4: US Forces successfully transported one hundred and fifty the ISIS
48:00
Speaker 4: fighters held a detention facility in Hasseka, Syria, to a
48:05
Speaker 4: secure location in Iraq. Ultimately, up to seven thousand ISIS
48:10
Speaker 4: detainees could be transferred from Syria to Iraqi controlled facilities. Now,
48:15
Speaker 4: I'm sure this has absolutely nothing to do with the
48:18
Speaker 4: upcoming potential aggression against Iran. Trump is bringing in his
48:23
Speaker 4: big beautiful armada, as he's described it, and if we
48:29
Speaker 4: just move on, Trump is saying, I'm hearing that the
48:32
Speaker 4: great country of Iraq might make a very bad choice
48:35
Speaker 4: by reinstating Noriel Malachy as Prime Minister. Last time Malachi
48:40
Speaker 4: was in power, the country descended into poverty, in total chaos.
48:43
Speaker 4: Nothing to do with the United States. Of course, that
48:45
Speaker 4: should not be allowed to happen again, because, of course
48:48
Speaker 4: how Trump perceives it, and how the region perceives that.
48:51
Speaker 4: Noriel Malachy will be very sympathetic to Iran with the
48:58
Speaker 4: upcoming aggression. Yet he also says Trump makey Rock great again.
49:03
Speaker 4: And I just wanted to include so the fact that
49:06
Speaker 4: ISIS is now being transferred from Syria to Iraq, Russia
49:10
Speaker 4: is withdrawing its troops from the Carmishli base in the northeast,
49:15
Speaker 4: and Drolani is in Moscow today to discuss the movements
49:20
Speaker 4: and the bilateral agreement with put In. I'll leave people
49:23
Speaker 4: to speculate on exactly what that means. But I wanted
49:26
Speaker 4: to do attention also to the UK involvement in the
49:30
Speaker 4: ISIS camps in the northeast, because again I'm sure people
49:33
Speaker 4: are probably saying, well, this has nothing to do with
49:35
Speaker 4: the UK. In twenty twenty one, the UK provided funding
49:39
Speaker 4: for the expansion of one of the ISIS camps in Hasseco,
49:42
Speaker 4: northeast Syria. Rather than repatriate British nationals, the UK Foreign
49:46
Speaker 4: Office condemn them to a life imprisonment in conditions that
49:50
Speaker 4: are described as inhumane by various human rights groups. According
49:54
Speaker 4: to report in Defense One, the effort will double in size.
49:57
Speaker 4: The current facility at Haseka areas of three converted school
50:01
Speaker 4: buildings that hold roughly five thousand prisoners, according to British
50:05
Speaker 4: Army Major General Kevin Propsy, the coalition's deputy commander for Strategies,
50:11
Speaker 4: so Britain very heavily involved in this. Also and a
50:14
Speaker 4: recent article I think in the last two days from
50:17
Speaker 4: kit Klarenberg where he talks about leak documents demonstrating how
50:21
Speaker 4: the six infiltrated ISIS refugee camps and were involved in
50:26
Speaker 4: the indoctrination, particularly of children, in radical ideology. So as
50:31
Speaker 4: we've talked about the radicalization of elements in the UK
50:37
Speaker 4: that would then be sent to fight alongside al Qaed
50:40
Speaker 4: or in Syria, the UK apparently appears to have been
50:42
Speaker 4: doing that within the ISIS, holding camps that they are
50:45
Speaker 4: funding in the northeast of Syria to effectively be weaponized
50:49
Speaker 4: against resistance movements in the.
50:53
Speaker 1: Region, which we have formed for Vanessa with al Qaeda
50:57
Speaker 1: as well at HTS over the years. Yes, okay, well
51:01
Speaker 1: well I'm sure you'll be talking about that an extra
51:03
Speaker 1: as well, Charles Let's and then with China, because of
51:07
Speaker 1: course Mark Carney was in China a week or two
51:10
Speaker 1: ago and nia Kiir Starmer has gone.
51:12
Speaker 3: It's Starmer's turn. He has announced on Twitter where else
51:16
Speaker 3: that he has landed in China. You'd be forgiven for
51:18
Speaker 3: thinking he's gone there in his capacity as a postman
51:20
Speaker 3: or a courier. He says, I'm here to deliver for
51:22
Speaker 3: the British people. He goes on in his press release
51:25
Speaker 3: to make a point of striking honesty, but obviously an
51:28
Speaker 3: attempt to extract political capital and take the high ground
51:32
Speaker 3: he said, or releast it was written for him. For years,
51:35
Speaker 3: our approach to China has been dogged by inconsistency, blowing
51:39
Speaker 3: hot and cold from the Golden Age to Ice Age.
51:42
Speaker 3: But like it or not, China matters for the UK,
51:45
Speaker 3: and it does seem that he has hit at the
51:48
Speaker 3: heart of the inconsistency surrounding commentary on China, which is
51:52
Speaker 3: to say that people are prepared to make damning criticism
51:55
Speaker 3: of the place whilst remaining absolutely content to rely upon
51:58
Speaker 3: all the goods which are important from there. But Sarma
52:01
Speaker 3: himself wanting to appear tough, banging the drum for national security,
52:05
Speaker 3: he says, or rather the press release says that he
52:08
Speaker 3: will be clear that we will not trade economic cooperation
52:12
Speaker 3: for our national security, and he'll raise the areas where
52:15
Speaker 3: we disagree with China. So the language sort of softened
52:19
Speaker 3: to a certain extent. Now one one has to ask
52:22
Speaker 3: is it coincidence that the BBC has chosen exactly this
52:25
Speaker 3: moment to suggest that Chinese military is in complete disarray
52:29
Speaker 3: with an article here China has purged its highest ranking
52:31
Speaker 3: military general.
52:33
Speaker 2: Why now?
52:33
Speaker 3: This is about the disappearance in fact, back in November
52:37
Speaker 3: of General Jiang, and he's the most senior figure in
52:42
Speaker 3: the Central Military Commission. And to substantiate their position, the
52:48
Speaker 3: BBC has quoted Lyle Morris from the Rockefeller Rockefeller funded
52:52
Speaker 3: Asia Society Policy Institute, who speculated that there are lots
52:58
Speaker 3: of rumors floating around. I don't know at this point
53:01
Speaker 3: what is true and what is false. And he went
53:04
Speaker 3: on to be absolutely certain in saying that it's certainly
53:08
Speaker 3: bad for Xi Jinping for his leadership and control over
53:12
Speaker 3: the People's Liberation Army. At quite how he reached out
53:15
Speaker 3: conclusion remains to be seen. They then asked associate professor
53:19
Speaker 3: from the National University of Singapore, who again speculated completely,
53:23
Speaker 3: saying that he'd heard rumors everything from leaking nuclear secrets
53:26
Speaker 3: to the United States plotting a coup and factional in fighting.
53:30
Speaker 3: There are even rumors of a gunfight in Beijing. So
53:34
Speaker 3: essentially the entire BBC article based on nothing but circumspection.
53:40
Speaker 3: The reader is obviously expected to come away with increased
53:43
Speaker 3: suspicion of the Chinese state, and indeed they're to consider
53:46
Speaker 3: that they're now very vulnerable militarily, despite the fact that
53:49
Speaker 3: People's Liberation Army still numbers over two.
53:51
Speaker 2: Million men and women.
53:53
Speaker 3: Now, whilst I'm not going to claim to have the
53:55
Speaker 3: answers that the BBC couldn't quite grasp, I can point
53:58
Speaker 3: out one or two things that they fail to collide with,
54:00
Speaker 3: the first being that the fifteenth five year Plan here
54:03
Speaker 3: shown on the State Council website, begins in March, and
54:08
Speaker 3: General Xiang has been out of the public eye since November.
54:10
Speaker 3: As I said, he's also seventy five years old, so
54:13
Speaker 3: like Starmer, perhaps it is time for a change. Despite
54:16
Speaker 3: the allegations of corruption and wrongdoing and all sorts of
54:18
Speaker 3: other things, which may indeed be the case as well.
54:23
Speaker 3: Not only that, but the military is looking to modernize.
54:26
Speaker 3: So again is this coincidence as the State Council announces
54:30
Speaker 3: that the regulations which will take effect focus on accelerating
54:33
Speaker 3: the modernization of military theory, optimizing the top level design
54:37
Speaker 3: for innovation in military theory. So is that the sort
54:42
Speaker 3: of change that one would implement with a seventy five
54:44
Speaker 3: year old at the helm. That is simply a question
54:47
Speaker 3: that I might put there now. Starmer also referenced the
54:50
Speaker 3: relationship between defense, or as he calls it, national security,
54:54
Speaker 3: and trade, and this is precisely what Trump's Board of
54:57
Speaker 3: Peace is bringing to the four And here's the news
55:01
Speaker 3: the invitation as published by the Chinese embassy in London,
55:04
Speaker 3: all of which puts the spotlight on the relevance.
55:07
Speaker 2: In the role of NATO.
55:09
Speaker 3: Now, of the many commentaries out there, had a look
55:12
Speaker 3: at The Diplomat, which has an article recently published titled
55:16
Speaker 3: the disintegration of NATO would not be in China's interests.
55:19
Speaker 3: And what they're positing, among other things, is that the
55:22
Speaker 3: Chinese experts have argued that NATO began looking for a
55:26
Speaker 3: new adversary after the Cold War to justify its existence.
55:29
Speaker 3: Not exactly a contentious position necessarily, But of course the
55:34
Speaker 3: point to be brought out of this is that the
55:35
Speaker 3: situation with NATO, which regards China as a challenge rather
55:40
Speaker 3: than a threat, is one of stalemates, so it doesn't
55:44
Speaker 3: none of those prevents NATO from posturing. And we can
55:49
Speaker 3: consider the awkward confluence of running military operations, as Luke
55:54
Speaker 3: Pollard said, to boost trade. And we're looking here at
55:57
Speaker 3: the Carrier Strike Group which set off from the Kingdom
56:00
Speaker 3: last year, touring the South Pacific region with it's occasionally
56:08
Speaker 3: just composed of United Kingdom vessels and aircraft, and occasionally
56:13
Speaker 3: with other NATO fleets. But what they did do whilst
56:17
Speaker 3: they were there was to boast that they transited the
56:20
Speaker 3: South China Sea. Of course, no actual engagement with China.
56:25
Speaker 3: But to refer back to Starmer's point, which is that
56:30
Speaker 3: one so many so determined to ignore. Of course, the
56:33
Speaker 3: United Kingdom imports more from China than any other country
56:37
Speaker 3: except for the United States and Germany. So as things stand,
56:41
Speaker 3: the United Kingdom is much more dependent upon China than
56:44
Speaker 3: China is on the United Kingdom. Now UK column is
56:48
Speaker 3: going to be doing more of what we should, which
56:50
Speaker 3: is finding out for ourselves. So we'll hope to be
56:53
Speaker 3: able to break new greater insight on this in the
56:56
Speaker 3: coming weeks, because Mike and I will be in China
56:58
Speaker 3: for the latter stages of the storm a visit and
57:01
Speaker 3: we'll be able to talk a bit more about that
57:03
Speaker 3: in extra But for now, Mike, what do you think
57:07
Speaker 3: about the UK's attitude towards I suppose, especially in Night
57:10
Speaker 3: of the comments of Mark Carney and so forth.
57:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think UKs that demonstrated absolute schizophrenia with respect
57:20
Speaker 1: to China for a number of years now.
57:23
Speaker 7: We have.
57:26
Speaker 1: Produced the China Report from the House of Lords. I
57:29
Speaker 1: believe we have decided that Huawei is not appropriate because
57:33
Speaker 1: it's a national security threat to It's not appropriate to
57:37
Speaker 1: have that on our five G networks because five G
57:39
Speaker 1: networks are used for dual use these days, and of
57:43
Speaker 1: course we don't worry about the fact that our five
57:45
Speaker 1: G networks are often heavily polluted with is really Unidity
57:51
Speaker 1: two hundred inspired hardware. So you know, if we're worried
57:55
Speaker 1: about countries stealing DITTA, which countries is that we should
57:59
Speaker 1: be most worried about it. And so yeah, there seems
58:04
Speaker 1: to be definite efforts to try to demonize China while
58:10
Speaker 1: at the same time keeping relations there. I suspect Britain
58:15
Speaker 1: and Carnie probably represents this policy as well, is very
58:19
Speaker 1: keen to do anything that it can to split China
58:22
Speaker 1: away from Russia. If if that's yeah, you know, if
58:25
Speaker 1: that's how they view the major threat.
58:27
Speaker 2: Yeah, well that was.
58:28
Speaker 3: It was actually one of the things that the article
58:29
Speaker 3: in the Diplomat went on to refer to. But of
58:32
Speaker 3: course the line that they take is that is that
58:34
Speaker 3: Russia is acting, you know, in the sort of mainstream
58:37
Speaker 3: sense in terms of the aggression and whatnot and what
58:41
Speaker 3: if anything.
58:41
Speaker 8: Do you think Starmer will come away from China with, Well,
58:44
Speaker 8: he'll come away with absolutely nothing, yeah, exactly. So hence
58:47
Speaker 8: the use of the word deliver rather than yes, break back,
58:51
Speaker 8: Yes exactly.
58:52
Speaker 2: Yes.
58:52
Speaker 3: Yeah, So we'll see what happens there. But as I say,
58:54
Speaker 3: we should have some more commentary on that by next week.
58:59
Speaker 2: So that brings us to more or less I think
59:02
Speaker 2: the end of the It does.
59:04
Speaker 1: Indeed, yes, so we do have to finish there for today, unfortunately,
59:08
Speaker 1: but with much more an extra if your UK column member,
59:11
Speaker 1: if you're not a UK Colon member, maybe you'd like
59:14
Speaker 1: to join us and that helps us do what we're doing,
59:17
Speaker 1: and you can join us for extra anytime we are
59:20
Speaker 1: hosting a news program. I want to say thank you
59:22
Speaker 1: Vanessa and Charles of course for joining me today and
59:24
Speaker 1: for everybody that's been watching.
59:26
Speaker 2: Don't forget.
59:27
Speaker 1: If you want to look at the documentation behind these
59:31
Speaker 1: stories we've covered today, have a look in the show notes.
59:34
Speaker 1: But we'll be back in a few minutes on this
59:36
Speaker 1: stream if you're a UK column member otherwise, don't forget
59:40
Speaker 1: the interviews this evening. An interview going out at one
59:42
Speaker 1: pm tomorrow, News again one pm on Friday. We will
59:45
Speaker 1: see you then, Bye bye, bye bye