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Stage Presence - Why Performance Matters · Making The Impact - A Dance Competition Podcast

0:07
SPEAKER_02: Have you ever wondered what goes on behind the table at a dance competition?
0:10
SPEAKER_02: Exactly what are the judges looking for anyway?
0:13
SPEAKER_02: This is Making the Impact, a dance competition podcast.
0:15
SPEAKER_02: Each week we'll cover a different topic related to the world of competitive dance, from the perspective of the judges behind the table.
0:22
SPEAKER_02: From pissy faces to angsty faces and all the faces in between, stage presence is an important part of your sport at dance competition.
0:29
SPEAKER_02: But how do you know if your performance quality is cutting it?
0:32
SPEAKER_02: Here today with Making the Impact are IDA judges and dance educators Jackie Belichian and Sam Quinn to chat about stage presence in the competitive dance world.
0:43
SPEAKER_03: Hey everybody, welcome to this week's episode of Making the Impact.
0:47
SPEAKER_03: I'm your host, Courtney Ortiz, and I'm here with my co-host Leslie Mueller.
0:51
SPEAKER_03: What's up, Courtney?
0:52
SPEAKER_03: Not much.
0:53
SPEAKER_03: What's up with you?
0:54
SPEAKER_03: We're just hanging out.
0:54
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, we're having it's been a great, great day of recording so far over here.
1:00
SPEAKER_03: And it's a great January as well.
1:04
SPEAKER_02: It is.
1:04
SPEAKER_02: It's 2022.
1:05
SPEAKER_02: We are having a great year so far and looking forward to comp season coming up soon.
1:09
SPEAKER_03: So pumped for comp season.
1:10
SPEAKER_03: I've been judging a little bit already this season.
1:12
SPEAKER_03: So many great dancers out there.
1:15
SPEAKER_03: And I know all of our IDA judges are so eager to get back behind the judging table.
1:21
SPEAKER_03: So I can't wait for you all, all of you listeners out there, to attend an IDA affiliated competition.
1:27
SPEAKER_03: And if you do, then you're gonna have some fabulous IDA judges judging your dances, giving you some great critiques.
1:34
SPEAKER_03: And we all just can't wait for the season to start.
1:36
SPEAKER_02: And speaking of the competition season, if you're looking for something a little sooner than actual competition, wait no more.
1:45
SPEAKER_03: Well, we are very excited to let everyone know that backed by popular demand is IDA's virtual competition.
1:57
unknown: It's back.
1:58
SPEAKER_03: It's back.
1:59
SPEAKER_03: If you were a previous contestant of ours throughout the past two years of IDA's virtual, we have decided to bring it back in a slightly new format that we will be launching and sharing on our website and social media platforms soon.
2:14
SPEAKER_03: So stay tuned for all of the details.
2:18
SPEAKER_03: Our official launch will be in February, and it will be accepting submissions for our virtual competition throughout the entire competition season until May.
2:28
SPEAKER_03: So stay tuned for more details for that.
2:30
SPEAKER_03: If you want to learn more about our virtual comp, you can visit Impact Dance Adjudicators.comslash virtual comp.
2:37
SPEAKER_02: And this season we are proud to have Arrange Us app as one of our season sponsors.
2:42
SPEAKER_02: If you're a dance teacher, choreographer, studio owner, or creative director, you need to check out the Arrange Us Dance Formations app.
2:49
SPEAKER_02: Arrange Us allows you to map out your formations for your choreography directly on their easy-to-use mobile app on iPad or iPhone.
2:55
SPEAKER_02: You can label your dancers, color coordinate, and even sync your formations with your dance music.
3:00
SPEAKER_02: You can share your finalized formations with your team with one easy click.
3:03
SPEAKER_02: This app is such a helpful tool to visualize your choreography ahead of time or keep your dancers clean and organized from the start.
3:09
SPEAKER_02: Staging couldn't be easier thanks to Arrange Us.
3:12
SPEAKER_02: Click the link in our show notes to download the app for free in the App Store.
3:15
SPEAKER_03: And another one of our season sponsors this year has been around since season one of Making an Impact, and that is Level Up Dance Supplies.
3:23
SPEAKER_03: They were founded in 2010 by a dance mom with the goal of being your one-stop shop for all of your dance gear and accessory needs.
3:29
SPEAKER_03: They have everything you need for your dancers' training, from stretching gear, turning discs, flexibility tools, and so much more.
3:36
SPEAKER_03: Level Up also offers great gear to use at competition, like rolling rack, travel bags, garment bags, dream duffels, and pop-up changing tents.
3:44
SPEAKER_03: And because quality and affordability matter, you can rest assured that you're getting what you need at the price you can afford.
3:50
SPEAKER_03: Head on over to LevelUpdanceupplies.com to view all of their products and use our exclusive podcast promo code Impact21 in all caps at checkout to receive$10 off your first order.
4:02
SPEAKER_03: Thank you to Arrange Us and Level Up Dance Supplies for sponsoring this episode.
4:06
SPEAKER_03: And something new that we've added into our podcast this season that I'm sure you've heard us talk all about is our Kofi account, where you can buy us a coffee and show your support for our podcast.
4:16
SPEAKER_03: If you love what we're doing over here at Making the Impact, then click the link in our bio to donate to our show now.
4:23
SPEAKER_03: And all of your donations will go directly back into producing future episodes of Making the Impact.
4:28
SPEAKER_03: And we've had some really great donations lately and awesome reviews from our fans that we want to give a shout out to.
4:34
SPEAKER_02: Thank you to Miss Court from Kofi.
4:36
SPEAKER_02: She says, love this podcast.
4:38
SPEAKER_02: Yes, Miss Corr.
4:39
SPEAKER_02: Showings, Ms.
4:40
SPEAKER_03: Core.
4:41
SPEAKER_03: And also shout out to Kimberly on Kofi.
4:44
SPEAKER_03: She said, as a mom of a micro mini dancer, your recent episode, Mini Mania, was awesome.
4:50
SPEAKER_03: I loved what Richard Elsie said about letting your dance journey be your own.
4:54
SPEAKER_03: Thank you for always inspiring and having amazing guests who bring new perspectives.
4:59
SPEAKER_03: Love you guys.
5:00
SPEAKER_03: I love that episode too.
5:02
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it was a good one.
5:03
SPEAKER_03: So sweet.
5:04
SPEAKER_03: So thank you to every single donator that has sent us a donation on Kofi.
5:09
SPEAKER_03: We are so grateful for all of your support and everybody who's also left us a review on Apple Podcasts.
5:15
SPEAKER_03: We love all of our fans.
5:16
SPEAKER_03: All right, everybody, it's time to meet our special guests, and we are talking about stage presence today on the podcast, which is something that we haven't talked about in an episode entirely by itself.
5:27
SPEAKER_02: We we double checked because both of us were like, surely we've talked about this.
5:31
SPEAKER_02: And no, we haven't.
5:32
SPEAKER_02: So here we are, season three, stage presence.
5:35
SPEAKER_03: Oh my gosh, it's crazy that we haven't talked about this.
5:38
SPEAKER_03: This is obviously a hot topic.
5:39
SPEAKER_03: Uh, we're talking about performance quality, stage presence, and I know we're gonna have a lot to say.
5:44
SPEAKER_03: We have two special guest IDA judges joining us on the podcast for this episode.
5:51
SPEAKER_03: Our first special guest IDA judge who is joining us today is a brand new guest to our podcast.
5:56
SPEAKER_03: She's been on the IDA roster for many years.
5:58
SPEAKER_03: I've known her for a very long time, and she has been an educator all across the East Coast and New York City.
6:05
SPEAKER_03: I'm so excited to welcome Jackie Belgian to the podcast.
6:09
SPEAKER_03: Welcome, Jackie.
6:11
SPEAKER_03: Thanks.
6:11
SPEAKER_03: Happy to be here.
6:12
SPEAKER_03: So happy to have you.
6:14
SPEAKER_03: And it's been a long time coming because we've been wanting to have you on the podcast for so long.
6:18
SPEAKER_03: And this topic, I know you're gonna have a lot to say and share since you've been judging for so many years and have seen all the performance.
6:24
SPEAKER_04: You know, it I'm so excited to be here.
6:27
SPEAKER_03: Well, if you wouldn't mind sharing with all of our listeners and fans out there a little bit more about who you are, where you're based, any career credits you'd like to share, and what you're currently working on.
6:35
SPEAKER_04: Sure.
6:36
SPEAKER_04: So I have been in New York now for about, oh, 27 years, 28 years, and I've done pretty much done it all.
6:44
SPEAKER_04: I've done choreography, I've done a lot of teaching and uh performing.
6:50
SPEAKER_04: I am currently just working on, I'm actually in a school program.
6:54
SPEAKER_04: I'm in a master's program right now.
6:56
SPEAKER_04: So I'm working, kind of focusing on school, but also teaching master classes, getting ready for the judging season.
7:02
SPEAKER_04: Can't wait.
7:03
SPEAKER_04: But I think uh Corney, I think we first met when I hired you, possibly, to do the Rachel Ray show with you as a dancer, and you were phenomenal.
7:11
SPEAKER_04: So I'm so excited.
7:13
SPEAKER_04: Yes, been a while ago, been a minute.
7:15
SPEAKER_04: So yes, that's that's who I am and what I do.
7:17
SPEAKER_03: Love it.
7:18
SPEAKER_03: Awesome.
7:19
SPEAKER_03: Well, thank you so much, Jackie, for joining us today.
7:21
SPEAKER_03: I can't wait to dive into this episode.
7:24
SPEAKER_03: But before we do, I have one more special guest to introduce to the world, and you may remember him from two of our previous QA episodes in season one and season two.
7:34
SPEAKER_03: I'm excited to welcome back my dear friend, Mr.
7:37
SPEAKER_03: Sam Quinn to the podcast.
7:39
SPEAKER_00: What up, what up?
7:42
SPEAKER_00: Sam and welcome back.
7:44
SPEAKER_00: Thanks for having me again.
7:45
SPEAKER_00: I'm so excited.
7:46
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, we have you on your first real non-QA episode.
7:49
SPEAKER_00: I know.
7:50
SPEAKER_00: I'm stoked.
7:51
SPEAKER_00: Can't wait.
7:52
SPEAKER_00: Feels legit, like I made it.
7:56
SPEAKER_03: Totally.
7:57
SPEAKER_03: Well, thank you for joining us again.
7:59
SPEAKER_03: And if you wouldn't mind reminding all of our listeners out there a little bit more about you.
8:04
SPEAKER_00: Sure.
8:04
SPEAKER_00: Grew up in Massachusetts.
8:06
SPEAKER_00: I went to school at the University of Arizona, got my BFA and dance there, done everything from cruise ships to concert work, bad boys of dance, step one dance company.
8:17
SPEAKER_00: And my favorite is I was the organizer of the viral boys dance to movement in Times Square.
8:24
SPEAKER_00: So I had that idea and kind of ran with it, and here we are now.
8:28
SPEAKER_00: And since COVID, I always say I'm a dancer first and a publicist second.
8:32
SPEAKER_00: So I work in PR.
8:34
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, loving it.
8:35
SPEAKER_00: So creative outlet on the side using the opposite side of my brain.
8:39
SPEAKER_00: But that is me, the end.
8:40
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
8:41
SPEAKER_03: Short and sweet.
8:42
SPEAKER_03: Short and sweet, I love it.
8:44
SPEAKER_03: And a fabulous judge, always out there working for IDA and always supporting us since the beginning.
8:49
SPEAKER_03: We're so grateful for your support.
8:50
SPEAKER_03: And thank you both for joining us.
8:52
SPEAKER_03: Let's talk about stage presence.
8:55
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
8:56
SPEAKER_02: Stage presence.
8:57
SPEAKER_02: Well, since this has been such a long time coming, Courtney, I think we've, you know, we've set ourselves up here.
9:02
SPEAKER_02: It's got to be an amazing episode.
9:04
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
9:04
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
9:04
SPEAKER_02: But I think we're lucky because we've got four of us who are performers, and you know, I think everybody, almost everybody who dances starts as a performer.
9:11
SPEAKER_02: I mean, you don't you don't see four-year-olds choreographing.
9:13
SPEAKER_02: You see four-year-olds on a stage, you know, pointing their feet and tapping their toes and everything.
9:18
SPEAKER_02: So, you know, we all can come from that place, even if that's not the place that we're in right now as a performer first.
9:24
SPEAKER_02: But I think I first want to ask y'all, Jackie and Sam, in your opinion, as educators and choreographers and teachers, uh, what makes a great performer?
9:33
SPEAKER_02: It's such an open-ended question.
9:35
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
9:36
SPEAKER_00: I think what makes a great performer is when you can just see that they absolutely love what they're doing and they're doing it with 100% every, you know, from head to toe.
9:48
SPEAKER_00: The smile is constant, and you can you can just as a judge, you feel their love and their joy and the genuine feeling of just being on stage is what you know wakes them up in the morning and they go to sleep dreaming about the next time they can step out on that stage, whether you're a four-year-old or you're a 19-year-old.
10:06
SPEAKER_00: And I think just feeling that sense of love and that sense of joy for me is what makes a great performer.
10:12
SPEAKER_00: Technique, yes, always, you know, gonna be number two thing, but just feeling that sense of joy and that that pride for what you do and that love and the passion oozing out of every pore of your body, I think is for me what what I I will remember that most.
10:27
SPEAKER_04: I think that's so important.
10:28
SPEAKER_04: And yes, because at the end of the day, dance is art, right?
10:31
SPEAKER_04: And art is supposed to make people feel something, whether it's visual arts, performing arts, doesn't matter, any kind of art is supposed to make someone feel something.
10:38
SPEAKER_04: So if you as a performer can step out on that stage and really reach out to the audience with how you're feeling, how you're performing, and as Sam said, make them remember you.
10:51
SPEAKER_04: Like, you know, the week after they leave that performance, if they remember, oh, that performer was so great.
10:57
SPEAKER_04: I remember how I felt watching them and and it really tapped into my soul.
11:03
SPEAKER_04: That is a great performer and it takes work.
11:05
SPEAKER_04: Sometimes I think we forget that stage presence can be a muscle that we have to work on all the time.
11:10
SPEAKER_04: It doesn't always come naturally to people.
11:12
SPEAKER_04: But for me, what makes a great performer is actually touching your audience, making them feel something for sure, whether it's joy, whether it's a contemporary, really, you know, deep peace.
11:23
SPEAKER_04: It doesn't matter.
11:23
SPEAKER_04: It just really is all about tapping into the general audience, I think.
11:28
SPEAKER_00: And also, I always this is always so funny because at the end of the weekend, you know, Sunday, four o'clock, sometimes we've judged 800, 900 dances.
11:36
SPEAKER_00: And when we're going through when we're finding those, you know, end of the weekend routines, I'm not thinking of how high your leg went.
11:43
SPEAKER_00: I'm not thinking of how many turns you did.
11:44
SPEAKER_00: If we're like, oh, number 14, me and my shadow.
11:47
SPEAKER_00: She she lit up the stage and I remembered her specifically because of how she performed and like she crushed it.
11:53
SPEAKER_00: And so we're not thinking of like like we're remembering you at the end of the weekend, and if you're sticking in our brain, you did something correct.
12:00
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
12:00
SPEAKER_02: And it's probably because of your performance quality, not because you did 15 pirouettes.
12:04
SPEAKER_02: And I love a pirouette.
12:05
SPEAKER_00: Don't get me wrong, but right.
12:07
SPEAKER_02: But you did it with a big old smile on your face.
12:08
SPEAKER_02: I sure did.
12:09
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
12:10
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
12:11
SPEAKER_03: I mean, you really have to command the stage.
12:14
SPEAKER_03: As a performer, I think, and you said Jackie, it might not be as easy for everyone.
12:21
SPEAKER_03: There might be a lot of people that were just meant to be when I see a performer, like the description you said, Sam, that just like exudes like happiness and it's just pouring out of their body.
12:32
SPEAKER_03: They love this.
12:34
SPEAKER_03: Every time I see those types of dancers, I'm like, oh, you are so meant to be on stage or in front of a camera or something.
12:40
SPEAKER_03: It's just na some people it comes natural.
12:42
SPEAKER_03: And then there's other dancers who struggle with kind of navigating how do I perform on stage?
12:48
SPEAKER_03: You might have stage fright.
12:49
SPEAKER_03: It might not be as easy as other people think it is.
12:54
SPEAKER_03: But then there's like studios that are just across the board insane performers.
12:59
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
12:59
SPEAKER_03: It's almost like they don't have those kids.
13:01
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
13:01
SPEAKER_02: It's like, where are the kids that are shy?
13:03
SPEAKER_02: Right.
13:03
SPEAKER_02: But they don't go there.
13:04
SPEAKER_02: You know, that's always what I think.
13:05
SPEAKER_02: Like, y'all, y'all just get the kids who have that it factor.
13:09
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
13:09
SPEAKER_02: And I'm that's so always so interesting to me that either either they that's just the case and they just have these kids who grow, you know, gravitate towards that one studio, or they're teaching it.
13:19
SPEAKER_02: And somehow they're teaching it to the kids who are back here in the corner at the beginning of the year, but are now front and center, you know, what what's happening between August and March for those kids who somehow have learned performance quality.
13:31
SPEAKER_00: And I think it's also really interesting when you can see there it's like a twofold.
13:35
SPEAKER_00: If you if there's an ensemble piece, and there's like a few people where it's like we're a little unclear about what the actual emotion and what the story is versus the kids who are in a full group and you can tell that they practiced their emotion, you know what I mean?
13:48
SPEAKER_00: And they talked about the feeling, they talked about the story and the characters that they're portraying, and everyone is on the same page.
13:53
SPEAKER_00: And I think it's really interesting when you can see that group and you're like, This makes sense.
13:59
SPEAKER_00: They talked about it, and that's a good teacher.
14:01
SPEAKER_00: And I remember judging, I was in Indianapolis and shout out to Car Love Expressions.
14:05
SPEAKER_00: I was walking, walking back to go to the judges' table, and they were in every single time before they went on stage for a dance, they were like in their group circle, having the same energy, breathing together.
14:15
SPEAKER_00: And I was like, That's an ensemble, that's like a group.
14:18
SPEAKER_00: And every time they were performing, every single person was giving 110%.
14:21
SPEAKER_00: But it was the same, everyone was on the same page.
14:24
SPEAKER_00: And I think kind of going back to what makes a great performer and a great performance, it's knowing exactly what you're dancing about, what you're dancing for, and what you're dancing to.
14:33
SPEAKER_00: And say that again.
14:34
SPEAKER_00: What if I remember it?
14:36
SPEAKER_00: What you're dancing for, who you're dancing for, what you're dancing to, and what you're dancing about, something like that.
14:42
SPEAKER_00: But there's three parts to it, and you have to know like who, what, where, when, why, how type thing.
14:46
SPEAKER_00: And when it's when it's all done correctly, it's like chef's kiss.
14:49
SPEAKER_04: Well, yeah, and I actually think, you know, people think dancers don't really think a lot, you know, because we use our bodies so much.
14:55
SPEAKER_04: But good dancers have to be smart.
14:58
SPEAKER_04: And I think we have to work like actors and actresses and do our homework.
15:02
SPEAKER_04: And so sometimes it really is on the dancer and the choreographer too, but the dancer to make a list of what you're dancing about, you know, make up if if you can't relate to your music, and hopefully the choreographer knows enough to pick a song the dancer can relate to.
15:17
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
15:17
SPEAKER_04: But if you can't relate to your piece of music, make up something that you can that also fits within the music.
15:24
SPEAKER_04: And so we can't just go into a studio, I think, and dance and do ball change and kicks.
15:31
SPEAKER_04: We have to take the music home.
15:32
SPEAKER_04: We have to think about what it means.
15:34
SPEAKER_04: And we have to, as dancers, put the work in and do our homework and really be cerebral about it and maybe dissect the music and dissect each line by line if you can't relate.
15:43
SPEAKER_04: Because the stronger your performance is, the more the more authentic your performance is, and you're not faking it, right?
15:49
SPEAKER_04: The stronger it's going to come across to the audience.
15:52
SPEAKER_04: So you always want to be as genuine as possible and not just fake it.
15:55
SPEAKER_04: And to do so, I think you really have to find that place within yourself that could connect to the music you're dancing to at some point, on some level.
16:03
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
16:03
SPEAKER_02: Well, and I think that leads into a really good sort of teaching moment for the teachers who are listening.
16:09
SPEAKER_02: You know, like we said, some people are born with it.
16:11
SPEAKER_02: Maybe it's Maybelline.
16:13
SPEAKER_02: Um, but if you're not born with it, you gotta teach it.
16:16
SPEAKER_02: It's gotta get taught somehow.
16:17
SPEAKER_02: Like you said, it's we are really truly past the time when taking a dance class means just learning how to do a kickball change.
16:23
SPEAKER_02: The dance teachers are responsible for so much more, including emotional connection to the music, not only for like your own personal enjoyment and growth and connecting to music and whatever, but you know, for the performance aspect of it, when we take kids to competitions or to performances, what are some things that teachers can do to help in the in the classroom?
16:43
SPEAKER_02: Like we talked about writing things down, but even more uh basic than that, I think.
16:48
SPEAKER_02: What else do y'all have any advice for teachers out there?
16:50
SPEAKER_04: Well, for me, when I teach and I do a combo with the with the students, I always just innately feel it.
16:57
SPEAKER_04: And I'm really emoting with, you know, as I'm doing it, as I'm do performing it.
17:03
SPEAKER_04: And so I think teachers do a should really emulate, or the students should emulate the teachers in that, you know, even when I'm teaching littles, I don't mind teaching littles.
17:11
SPEAKER_04: I'm really animated and my personality is really bigger than it ordinarily would be when I'm out of the classroom.
17:17
SPEAKER_04: So I think they feel that and they emulate that and they they kind of get that.
17:21
SPEAKER_04: But also when I'm teaching older kids and comp kids as I'm doing the combo and it's time to just do it in groups, I really, you know, I'm up there with them and feeling it.
17:29
SPEAKER_04: And I hope they can feel that and watch that as I'm doing it.
17:31
SPEAKER_04: And so emulation is a huge thing.
17:33
SPEAKER_04: And as teachers, we always have to know that we're always on, right, you know, in the classroom and that the kids are watching everything that we're doing.
17:40
SPEAKER_04: And so hopefully there's that.
17:41
SPEAKER_04: But secondly, as a choreographer, I understand you want to connect with the music too, because sometimes you feel more creative when you have a piece of music that you can really connect to, but you have to be mindful, I think, of dancers and and the level and the ability and the age of the dancer and if they can connect to the music as well.
18:01
SPEAKER_04: So there really has to be a balance, I think.
18:03
SPEAKER_04: But I also think that the teachers andor choreographer have to have a discussion.
18:09
SPEAKER_04: You have to have to in rehearsal talk about what this music is about and help the dancer along in that and also videotape the dancer, have them watch themselves, him, himself, herself, uh the doing the dance and seeing how they perform.
18:21
SPEAKER_04: Because sometimes you can think in your head that you're performing a certain way, but on stage it might not come across.
18:26
SPEAKER_04: So as a dancer, watching yourself um is not always comfortable and not always easy, but I think uh I think it really helps a lot.
18:34
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
18:34
SPEAKER_00: And I I remember when I was growing up and we were I was doing solos, my dance teacher Anne Marie used to always print out our lyrics for our song so that we weren't just listening to the uh, you know, the instrumental track or whatever it is, or like the backtracking of the song and just dancing to the beat, but actually listening to the words and like Jackie was saying, you have to approach it as you know that actor-actress mentality of what what are these words saying and how does it relate to my life?
19:02
SPEAKER_00: So I remember when when I was doing mine, I would like write my own lyrics next to the other the actual song lyrics.
19:08
SPEAKER_00: So I had my own story that was going through my brain, always thinking again, and maybe this is just the public system maybe but the who, what, where, when, why, how.
19:15
SPEAKER_00: But the most important is the second why.
19:17
SPEAKER_00: And always asking yourself again, why am I dancing to this?
19:20
SPEAKER_00: Why, why, why now?
19:22
SPEAKER_00: And I have a I have a playlist on Spotify of every song that I've always wanted to choreograph to.
19:28
SPEAKER_00: And I I will always listen to it over and over, like for years before I ever choreographed to it because I want it to actually really resonate with me and really understand the song.
19:39
SPEAKER_00: And I choreographed a piece for my sister to Autumn Leaves by Eva Cassidy, and it's one of the most beautiful songs, and it has the most heart-wrenching story.
19:46
SPEAKER_00: But I was like, I need to save this for when the time is right.
19:49
SPEAKER_00: So always knowing exactly what your song is about, and not just giving it away because it's the new Adele song, but like giving it to the person that can relate to it most, but making sure that that dancer can relate to it and it's not over their head, it's not something that is inappropriate as this, you know, inappropriately too hot, too, too much of a concept for them to actually genuinely understand.
20:12
SPEAKER_00: And I I remember seeing in Dance Teacher Network, I might get slack for this, but YOLO.
20:17
SPEAKER_00: There was a YOLO, there was a thread I saw, and it like really raised my eyebrows because there someone posted something about not having input from their students and they're just setting, giving them the song for their solo, and that's it, and just move on because it would make their job easier.
20:33
SPEAKER_00: And I was like, but you're doing the the dancer a disservice by not allowing them to have an artistic input and about something that they can't relate to or can or cannot relate to.
20:42
SPEAKER_00: So I just think there needs to be, you know, for teachers, have an open conversation with the dancers you're choreographing for, see what is going on and what they want to dance about.
20:51
SPEAKER_00: And if you know, if you want them to do a sad contemporary, but they're like, No, I want to smile and I want a pony and whip my hair, let them do it.
20:59
SPEAKER_00: I don't, you know, I think there just needs to be more communication and more open dialogue with the dancer who's doing the piece.
21:06
SPEAKER_03: Right.
21:07
SPEAKER_00: To just have that relationship with their music.
21:09
SPEAKER_02: I I love what you said, Sam, about that you used to write your own lyrics alongside the actual lyrics.
21:15
SPEAKER_02: Because I did the same thing and I thought I was the only one back then.
21:18
SPEAKER_02: Like I suggest that now to my students, but I back in the day I did that and I remember it's so embarrassing because you know, you look back at your life and you're like, oh, I was so melodramatic.
21:28
SPEAKER_02: In high school, I loved Sarah McLaughlin.
21:29
SPEAKER_02: I still love Sarah McLaughlin.
21:31
SPEAKER_02: But back then I was like a diehard, and I'll ever do that.
21:34
SPEAKER_00: I hope you did in the arms of an angel.
21:36
SPEAKER_00: I hope you don't know.
21:37
SPEAKER_02: That would have been super cheesy, but but I wanted to do, I can't remember which song it was from Fumbling Towards Ecstasy, but you know, I'm like 15.
21:45
SPEAKER_02: Hadn't ever had a boyfriend, hadn't ever experienced ecstasy of any sort, but wrote my own little song lyrics out to what I wanted to do my lyrical dance to, and I presented it to my teacher, who, God bless her, looked at it and was like, This is really beautiful.
21:58
SPEAKER_02: Like she's now one of my, you know, do Your friends and she would probably laugh at this too.
22:02
SPEAKER_02: But she was like, I just don't, I don't think you're you're emotionally ready to put that on stage.
22:07
SPEAKER_02: You might be feeling those things, but the transition from internally feeling something to externally putting it out there are two different things.
22:14
SPEAKER_02: And so I did not get to do my serum igualan dance, uh, which now I'm really, really, really grateful for.
22:20
SPEAKER_02: Because and I think that, like you said, Sam, you kind of do have to have that balance of, you know, allowing your student to have some artistic input, but then having sort of a come to Jesus moment, like, okay, well, here's all these emotions that you've written down and that you say you're feeling.
22:36
SPEAKER_02: Like, are you comfortable putting that vulnerability on stage while also being judged for your technique and your emotional expression?
22:44
SPEAKER_02: Like that's a that's a vulnerable place to be, you know.
22:46
SPEAKER_03: And I think you have to be at a certain level at a at a point.
22:49
SPEAKER_03: And I was not to go to some of these places.
22:53
SPEAKER_03: Not that like less advanced dancers can't emote like that, but I couldn't.
22:59
SPEAKER_03: Like I think of like life experience, like especially when we're talking about like song choice, which I think goes hand in hand with performance quality.
23:06
SPEAKER_03: I think a lot of this is come like going back to our music 2.0 that we did earlier this season and picking appropriate music, like what you were saying, Sam.
23:15
SPEAKER_03: I feel like there are so many times, and especially when I'm doing like critiques at Diva Dance Competition, where we get to like actually talk to the dancers afterwards and like see their personality a little bit.
23:25
SPEAKER_03: Or if I ever go in studio and do like live critiques at a studio, I watch a dancer go and then I see their personality afterwards, and I'm like, I don't feel like that this song choice was right for you.
23:36
SPEAKER_03: Like your energy and like your personality is so much different than an almost, it's not even like they were turning on the acting for the dance.
23:46
SPEAKER_03: It wasn't that.
23:47
SPEAKER_03: It was like they weren't ready for this emotion or this type of performance.
23:53
SPEAKER_03: And especially for their level, they should have gone in a different direction that suited them more.
23:58
SPEAKER_03: And I think that because if they would have gone in that direction, they at the end of the day, it's a competition, would be more successful.
24:05
SPEAKER_03: And I think that's the ultimate goal.
24:07
SPEAKER_03: Of course, we want to push our dancers and challenge them and have them do different things.
24:11
SPEAKER_03: And if they want, if they want sad lyrical, then let's do sad lyrical.
24:14
SPEAKER_03: But on the flip side of it, I've seen sad lyrical songs with dancers smiling the whole time.
24:19
SPEAKER_03: And again, it's like there's a miscommunication of did you guys talk about what this is about?
24:24
SPEAKER_03: Right.
24:24
SPEAKER_03: Who picked this song?
24:26
SPEAKER_03: Are they is this age appropriate?
24:27
SPEAKER_03: Are they ready for this?
24:28
SPEAKER_03: They ought the dancer obviously has no clue what this is about if you're smiling when it says something about, you know, heartbreak.
24:36
SPEAKER_03: Usually you're not happy when your heart gets broken.
24:39
SPEAKER_03: So it's a lot of things to that have to go hand in hand with performance.
24:44
SPEAKER_03: And I don't know, I feel like when I look back at like some of the dances that I did, I don't know if we always talked about intention.
24:49
SPEAKER_03: We were at a high level, but it was almost like I just had to become an actress and I had to deliver.
24:54
SPEAKER_03: You know, if it's like lyrical, I knew what kind of emotions that I needed to feel.
24:58
SPEAKER_03: If it was a fiery jazz, I knew how to turn on the jazz.
25:02
SPEAKER_03: It's hard to navigate that sometimes at studios.
25:04
SPEAKER_03: And I think that's something that a lot of studios struggle with is how do I teach my dancers that?
25:09
SPEAKER_03: How do I get that out of them?
25:11
SPEAKER_03: Which I know there's so many teachers saying that right now, listening.
25:14
SPEAKER_03: Right.
25:14
SPEAKER_04: Well, and I think you're right, Corny, in that sometimes I'll go to studios just to rehearse numbers.
25:19
SPEAKER_04: And one of the first questions I'll ask them is, what is this routine about?
25:24
SPEAKER_04: And it always surprises me, well, not really anymore, but I hear a lot, I'm not really sure.
25:29
SPEAKER_04: From the dancers will say, I'm not sure.
25:31
SPEAKER_04: We haven't really talked about it.
25:32
SPEAKER_04: And it really surprises me.
25:34
SPEAKER_04: And I think, uh, and this very well may be the case, lots of teachers or choreographers just sort of assume the kids will turn on and perform once they hit the stage.
25:43
SPEAKER_04: And that very well may be the case, but at the same time, again, it's not for me, not super authentic unless you really in your mind know what you're gonna perform, how you're gonna perform it, what you're performing about.
25:55
SPEAKER_04: And especially if it's a group routine, as Sam said earlier, you have to be on the same page performance-wise, or it's just going to look completely disjointed.
26:03
SPEAKER_04: So I think it's really important at least to have a conversation and let the students explore for sure, and you know, have them bring out their own experiences and their own stage presence and their own performance quality.
26:15
SPEAKER_04: But at the same time, I definitely think a conversation is um is important.
26:18
SPEAKER_04: And I know it's hard because sometimes there's only certain minutes in the rehearsal and you your teachers are worrying about a clean routine and and everyone being together and who's not here today and restaging and all of that.
26:29
SPEAKER_04: But having a conversation, I think, is uh initial conversation, it's very important.
26:33
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I think it's also just goes, I know we kind of just mentioned this a little bit, but not giving songs because they make us feel a certain way, but truly understanding what they're saying.
26:43
SPEAKER_00: Like for examp two two specific songs that whenever I I hear them at competition, I'm like cringing on the inside a little bit.
26:49
SPEAKER_00: Play that sax, just don't use it ever, ever.
26:53
SPEAKER_00: Inappropriate.
26:54
SPEAKER_00: And she used to be mine because I knew you were gonna say that.
26:57
SPEAKER_00: I every time I'm like, hello, because it's waitress.
27:00
SPEAKER_00: So this song is from Witch, and I'm like full, full because they're all smiling, and I'm like, this is like actually the most dark time of the musical.
27:08
SPEAKER_00: And whether you're doing it as a lyrical or just the Sarah Borella song, it has a very specific meaning.
27:14
SPEAKER_00: And she's in a very specific time and space, yeah.
27:18
SPEAKER_00: In in the show, I mean she's pregnant, so there's that too.
27:21
SPEAKER_00: But it's it's just you know, not understanding the song in the context of the world that it originally lives in, and making sure you actually understand the song in the context that it lives in and how you're bringing that context to the stage is sometimes where we're where we're misaligned.
27:35
SPEAKER_00: So just know the lyrics and know the story, and I'll love it.
27:41
SPEAKER_03: Okay, so I'm gonna kind of flip a little bit really quick because I do want to get to this at a point in time and just hear everybody's perspectives.
27:49
SPEAKER_03: So there have been a lot of times where I've seen uh because we're kind of talking about like uh how to incorporate performance and you know, ways of teaching that and stuff like that right now.
28:01
SPEAKER_03: So I've seen a lot of dancers, and usually it's it it's a studio habit, so then I know that it's being taught, where teachers must be telling the dancers to do like kissy faces to the audience as like a go-to expression, with like puckering their lips and like duck lips like sticking out, and like it goes and and like I'm specifically thinking of like many to junior jazz dances and musical theater dances.
28:30
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
28:31
SPEAKER_03: And it goes in and out of their adorable precious smile, which is all I want to see, to then like immediately jolting to like this little kissy face in between.
28:40
SPEAKER_03: And um and the entire time I'm sitting there as a judge trying to figure out like why are they doing this and who told them to do this?
28:48
SPEAKER_03: Because it's then I then I notice that it's a studio habit.
28:52
SPEAKER_03: So, what are your thoughts on on these kissy faces?
28:56
SPEAKER_03: And also, I guess are there other examples that maybe I haven't seen that might be like something that you know teachers are teaching that we don't love or or do you love it?
29:05
SPEAKER_03: Do you hate it?
29:06
SPEAKER_03: What like tell me?
29:08
SPEAKER_04: Oh my gosh, I I really don't like that at all.
29:10
SPEAKER_04: And I feel like it's very pageanty and it might come from the pageant world, I feel like it's very, very, you know, plasticky and and just over the top.
29:19
SPEAKER_04: But I think I I really feel like it might come from the pageant world.
29:23
SPEAKER_04: So some dance teachers who along the way may have had pageant training teach their kids that.
29:28
SPEAKER_04: I also feel like, you know, some, you know, so how how some habits kind of catch fire from one studio to the other, is, you know, styles and and um I think that at some competitions, you know, some teachers may have seen littles doing that and then tell their kids, hey, you know what, if you can't smile, at least do this because at least you'll have something going on.
29:47
SPEAKER_04: But I really think it's so distracting.
29:50
SPEAKER_04: And I think that I hate to say it, but if if you have to resort to that, maybe again choose a different piece of music, or maybe the little one isn't ready to perform yet.
29:59
SPEAKER_04: Or, you know, someone someone who's older really shouldn't be doing it at all, that face.
30:04
SPEAKER_04: But really think about, I don't know, have some sort of maybe maybe someone who's more trained in performance come to your studio to give an acting coach, someone come to your studio to give these kids some sort of perspective on performing because that ain't it, kid.
30:21
SPEAKER_04: Like it just it isn't, it is not that little face is not the thing.
30:25
SPEAKER_00: You know, I I find it funny and it really warms my heart sometimes.
30:31
SPEAKER_00: Like if you're like a little bite-sized nugget on stage chanting to like Barbie girl and you're just kissy face the entire time.
30:38
SPEAKER_00: I cackle and I love it personally.
30:40
SPEAKER_00: It's when we you know, if you're if you're two weeks old doing your acro solo, love it, keep it, it's cute.
30:48
SPEAKER_00: I I'm fine with it.
30:49
SPEAKER_00: It's when we get to like the eight, nine, ten year olds, and I notice it mostly, it comes after a trick or it comes after some sort of technical moment where that's like and period.
31:00
SPEAKER_02: It's like the exclamation point, yeah.
31:02
SPEAKER_00: Where like the face goes blank and then they're like, let me make up for my turn sequence with no performance with my kissy face.
31:09
SPEAKER_00: And I feel like there just needs to be more consistent performance from start to finish.
31:14
SPEAKER_00: And if that's your go-to, let's let's change it up a little bit.
31:18
SPEAKER_00: And on the flip side of that, what irks me the most is in the contemporary when kids do the the like the emotional like head shake, like you're saying no, or you're actually like saying yes, like you're responding to what the music is saying with like a really dramatic hand.
31:33
SPEAKER_03: Don't do it, like shaking hand or something.
31:36
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
31:37
SPEAKER_02: Like why are you telling me?
31:38
SPEAKER_02: I wish audience, I wish you could see Sam right now because he's giving us like life with these uh expressions.
31:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's Leslie's uh Sarah McLaughlin.
31:47
SPEAKER_04: Oh yes.
31:48
SPEAKER_04: Oh, it was gonna be so good.
31:49
SPEAKER_04: But I think it comes back to you know what the teachers are are teaching, and maybe maybe teachers didn't feel comfortable teaching stage presence.
31:57
SPEAKER_04: And so they kind of default to this little you know face.
32:00
SPEAKER_02: I also feel like for me, I remember when I was cheerleading in middle school.
32:05
SPEAKER_02: Like you've you all have all seen cheerleaders, like they make those big, outlandish, exaggerated faces.
32:10
SPEAKER_02: And that to me started getting translated into dance.
32:14
SPEAKER_02: And it's and even dance team, I think dance team does that a lot too, with just just giant faces.
32:18
SPEAKER_02: And I think it's just sort of a way to, you know, I feel like once you paste on a smile, it starts to sink and melt after a while, especially for little kids who are just being told to smile.
32:29
SPEAKER_02: So it's like, here's some options.
32:31
SPEAKER_02: The other options that I've actually seen used often are just the vowels.
32:35
SPEAKER_02: You know, give us an A.
32:37
unknown: E.
32:38
SPEAKER_02: Like it's that's how your face looks when you say these vowels.
32:41
SPEAKER_02: And so that's you get a little more variation rather than just kissy face.
32:45
SPEAKER_02: And yeah, but I do agree with you.
32:46
SPEAKER_02: I like when they start out with that sweet smile, and then all of a sudden it's like, I did a round off and here's my kissy face.
32:51
SPEAKER_02: You're like, no, just smile.
32:53
SPEAKER_03: That smile would have been.
32:54
SPEAKER_03: It's almost like a concentration face with like an added, you know, kissy face.
33:00
SPEAKER_03: It's like someone said it's like the go-to, and it's like you said, Jackie, distracting.
33:06
SPEAKER_03: I mean, I can't even enjoy what's going on because I'm confused why there's a kissy face instead of just a genuine smile, especially if it is like a high-energy jazz or like a fun, cute musical theater.
33:18
SPEAKER_03: Like, I want to see you act if it's a musical theater, but and then you're not because you're just giving me a kissy face the whole time.
33:22
SPEAKER_03: But also, like another thing that I think a lot of teachers might instruct dancers to do, which I'm curious to hear your thoughts, are looking at the judges or also like winking at the judges and making eye contact with them.
33:34
SPEAKER_03: What are your guys' thoughts on that?
33:36
SPEAKER_00: I'm probably the outlier again.
33:38
SPEAKER_00: If you're seeing I know.
33:40
SPEAKER_00: I'm just kidding.
33:41
SPEAKER_00: But again, I think it it all depends on the dancer.
33:44
SPEAKER_00: If it's like a little two-year-old and she is, she I can see that her, she's like, you look at the judge and you smile at them.
33:50
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, hi, you listen to your teacher.
33:53
SPEAKER_00: And I think of it as like, oh, you're listening to your teacher and you're doing exactly what they tell you.
33:57
SPEAKER_00: Thanks for the wink.
33:58
SPEAKER_00: Love it.
33:59
SPEAKER_00: But I I just always think, you know, don't dance to us, dance to the back row, the person in the far back.
34:06
SPEAKER_00: I want to see you projecting that energy, filling up the stage, filling up the auditorium theater, whatever you're in.
34:11
SPEAKER_00: And it's not, you know, we're not this intimate black box show where it's just three people watching you.
34:16
SPEAKER_00: You're performing to an audience, don't play to the three judges, play to every single person, especially the back row.
34:23
SPEAKER_04: I agree with that.
34:23
SPEAKER_04: I think that we have to be mindful of the fact that it's a performance.
34:27
SPEAKER_04: I mean, it's competition, but it obviously is a performance, and you do want to sell it to everyone, not just us.
34:33
SPEAKER_04: So, um, like Sam said, I don't mind every now and then them engaging us.
34:38
SPEAKER_04: And it's it's really cute.
34:39
SPEAKER_04: But at the same time, I always feel bad when they're always playing to us and I have to look down for half a second to score, or I have to and I I lose that contact with them.
34:47
SPEAKER_04: I always really feel guilty and really feel bad.
34:49
SPEAKER_04: But um, but I do think that they really should play to the audience in general.
35:01
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35:09
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35:12
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35:18
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35:26
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35:33
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35:42
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35:50
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36:00
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and I think the uh where I sort of am with Sam is to a certain extent of, you know, like you said, if you're if you're a little bitty and you're playing to us, that's cute, that's great.
36:11
SPEAKER_02: But then it's like, where is the line?
36:13
SPEAKER_02: Because I've definitely seen like middle school and up kind of ages where you're like, oh, this is now really just uncomfortable for you to be looking at me constantly or checking in, checking all the time, or just performing just to us, even with the kissy faces.
36:29
SPEAKER_02: It's like, how do you graduate from kissy face eight-year-old to non-kissy face 12-year-old?
36:36
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
36:36
SPEAKER_02: Like, where how where are we how are we growing out of that?
36:39
SPEAKER_02: Because nothing's worse than like a middle schooler making a kissy face at you as a judge, and you're like, I don't know what what do I do here?
36:45
SPEAKER_02: Like, do I give you a thumbs up?
36:47
SPEAKER_02: What do I do?
36:48
SPEAKER_03: It just feels awkward.
36:49
SPEAKER_03: Like it just it makes me uncomfortable.
36:52
SPEAKER_03: Like I and I agree.
36:53
SPEAKER_03: I think it is a competition at the end of the day, but I still to this day kind of wish the judges sat like halfway back or at the back of the house or something.
37:03
SPEAKER_03: I don't like us being at the very edge of the stage because it's almost like all eyes are on us at all times, and then the kids think that we're all that matter, which in a way we you're trying to impress us as judges, but at the same time, like it should be more about the performance.
37:18
SPEAKER_03: There is an entire audience there that is watching you that like if you just perform for the judges, why are all these people behind us watching?
37:26
SPEAKER_03: Like, that's why if the judges were further back, then they would really perform to the entire audience.
37:31
SPEAKER_03: And then I could also see the full, beautiful formations and when you're not finding center.
37:36
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I love sitting in the back.
37:38
SPEAKER_04: I love when they have us set up in the back and it's just everyone's more relaxed.
37:41
SPEAKER_04: I guess students are more relaxed because they can't see us, you know, and we're more relaxed because there's no pressure of you know, making that eye contact if they're looking at you, if they're performing to you.
37:53
SPEAKER_04: And yeah, we see everything in a wide scope instead of just sitting up close, but I definitely agree.
37:57
SPEAKER_03: It ends up being a more genuine performance for the dancers, and like you said, they can relax into it more.
38:03
SPEAKER_03: It's it's less pressure.
38:04
SPEAKER_03: I wish that more did it, honestly.
38:06
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean, I've only worked maybe for two people, two companies, and I don't even think they were normally doing it that way.
38:12
SPEAKER_02: It was just the way the room was set up.
38:13
SPEAKER_02: It was like we had to be wherever we were, you know.
38:16
SPEAKER_00: And I think it's also interesting to see how the confidence grows.
38:20
SPEAKER_00: And like what's awesome about IDA is being able to go back to these comps where you know we see they bring a lot of the same studios are, you know, loyal to these competitions.
38:29
SPEAKER_00: So we get to see these kids grow up year after year after year and really see the transformation in their confidence and their performance as they go from you know, two-year-old to 18-year-old.
38:39
SPEAKER_00: And it's always just it's so exciting to see that.
38:41
SPEAKER_00: But I think what is the most interesting is how you perform in your solo versus how you perform in a duo trio.
38:48
SPEAKER_00: Because when you're dancing with your friends and you're dancing in a duo trio, it's not two or three solos happening at once.
38:54
SPEAKER_00: And I know every judge has you know probably said this dozens and dozens of times, but you're dancing with someone again.
39:02
SPEAKER_00: Why?
39:02
SPEAKER_00: What is your connection with each other?
39:04
SPEAKER_00: What is your relationship?
39:05
SPEAKER_00: And how are you looking?
39:06
SPEAKER_00: If you are doing a duet and you don't look at each other until you're end pose, I'm sure your entire critique is gonna be about your relationship and your eye contact.
39:13
SPEAKER_00: You need to dance with your friend.
39:15
SPEAKER_00: It's weird.
39:15
SPEAKER_00: You're just dancing next to someone, you're like, I'm not gonna look at you, unless it's intentional, then sure.
39:21
SPEAKER_00: But like it's weird to me.
39:22
SPEAKER_00: So I agree.
39:23
SPEAKER_00: I just always think solo versus duo trio, and duo trios are sometimes the hardest ones because you actually have there's partnering sometimes, and right, you know, I always say, and the first thing of a duo trio starts with your eyes, and that's the connection, and that's the performance that you're telling with someone.
39:38
SPEAKER_00: You're both 50% responsible or 33.3% of the whatever, but the trio.
39:45
SPEAKER_04: Good math math.
39:48
SPEAKER_04: But I think to kind of circle back and to touch on what Sam said too, is that what teachers can can do, uh I think to help with performance in rehearsal in the studio in class is maybe some improv.
39:59
SPEAKER_04: You know, I love giving kids some scenarios and it also teaches them to react to what maybe somebody else is doing who ended up being right next to them, and you have to stay in character, but also react.
40:11
SPEAKER_04: And I think that helps in duo trios too, because you really do make that connection.
40:15
SPEAKER_04: And improv really, I think, helps with that a lot and helps with them thinking on their feet and maybe hopefully not thinking because it is improv.
40:23
SPEAKER_04: But yeah, I think that would help a lot too, is doing a little more improv and giving giving them parameters uh with what they're supposed to be pouring about or what they're supposed to be dancing about, but also give them the freedom to be able to express themselves how they want when they improv.
40:36
SPEAKER_02: And I I love that idea in terms of performance quality, not necessarily like obviously improv is helpful for movement ideas and things like that, but I just I feel like so many kids these days, because we're all at that age, the kids these days don't I don't feel like they have a lot of access to to a variety of emotions.
40:56
SPEAKER_02: Like social media just sort of gives you like everybody's perfect, everything is happy, or everything is devastatingly sad.
41:03
SPEAKER_02: Like, what is what's the in between?
41:05
SPEAKER_02: And I think improv, like you said, Jackie, with parameters of like the nuances that can be in between those two extremes.
41:13
SPEAKER_02: Because I think that's what we see at competition.
41:14
SPEAKER_02: We either see super sad, depressing, she used to be mine, which makes me cry just because of the song.
41:20
SPEAKER_02: Like your dance might be terrible, but I'm still crying, and you think it's because you're really good.
41:24
SPEAKER_02: It's it's because the song is really sad.
41:27
SPEAKER_02: So you've got to understand that song.
41:29
SPEAKER_02: Um, or it's let's get soaking wet, and everybody's out there just like, you know, going for it.
41:34
SPEAKER_02: And there's so much more in between that I don't think we see a lot of.
41:37
SPEAKER_02: And I think that's because the kids don't have the opportunity opportunity to express that in many places.
41:43
SPEAKER_02: So I think improv activities would be key for that, you know, situation.
41:47
SPEAKER_00: And I also don't think kids sometimes fully understand what it means to actually be have emotion.
41:55
SPEAKER_00: So another thing teachers can do is pull like do the dance history lesson.
42:00
SPEAKER_00: Let's go back to like the old school, you know, if it's a jazz musical theater, look at like old Tony Ward performances, look at the big production numbers and watch the ensemble people.
42:10
SPEAKER_00: Don't watch the Sutton Fosters because they're obviously giving face, but watch the ensemble, you know, two darn hot from the Tony Wards.
42:16
SPEAKER_00: That is all just like straight dance.
42:18
SPEAKER_00: Watch sing from Fosse from Broadway and how how these people are still performing without the kissy face, and they're not worried about pirouettes, but they're giving you character, they're giving you acting beats, and they're giving you a dynamic performance.
42:33
SPEAKER_00: And I think I know, especially for me, I'm a visual learner, so I I always, you know, taking notes and watching myself back to be like, oh god, that was terrible.
42:42
SPEAKER_00: Let me fix this.
42:43
SPEAKER_00: But having a visual reference and truly understanding, even if you're doing a point solo, ballet is storytelling, and you need to be able to play that character.
42:52
SPEAKER_00: And these variations come from specific moments in ballets where there's a story to it.
42:56
SPEAKER_00: You know, are you trying to impress whoever?
42:58
SPEAKER_00: Are you are you sad because the the prince left you?
43:02
SPEAKER_00: Whatever.
43:02
SPEAKER_00: But watching these variations, watching the Broadway shows, watching you know, the contemporary companies of the world, how they're incorporating their choreography and emotion together seamlessly.
43:14
SPEAKER_00: It's not one or the other, it's it's a symbiotic relationship that will take that performance and your piece to that next level.
43:20
SPEAKER_00: So do the research, do the homework, but give your students that visual tool to truly understand and digest, especially the younger ones, what it means to perform.
43:31
SPEAKER_03: Totally agree.
43:32
SPEAKER_03: And as you were giving this beautiful speech, I was thinking about like more things that I look for in performance quality.
43:39
SPEAKER_03: And something that I'm a big stickler for, and something that I preach a lot when I teach, is use of focus with your eyeballs.
43:49
SPEAKER_03: We love focus.
43:50
SPEAKER_03: I love a focus.
43:51
SPEAKER_03: I think that a lot of dancers get stuck in the mirror, and it's very clear that they're mirror dancers when they hit the stage, that they haven't practiced enough.
44:00
SPEAKER_03: Enough without the mirrors in the studio.
44:02
SPEAKER_03: So for all of the studios out there who are getting ready for competition, you have to make sure that, you know, at the very least the week before competition, you better flip those dances to face the opposite way.
44:14
SPEAKER_03: So we're not looking in the mirror.
44:16
SPEAKER_03: If there's a way to cover your mirrors up, that would be great because they're not gonna have the mirrors and then they're gonna rely on it, and then we're gonna have eyes wandering, looking out the corner of their eyes, trying to remember what comes next because they're too they're relying on the mirrors too much.
44:28
SPEAKER_03: But not even that, but making sure that the details are clear in the choreography when there's a focus change, and that needs to come down to cleaning.
44:35
SPEAKER_03: It should be taught the moment choreography is taught because I'm I'm the type of dancer that the first time you teach me something, I will remember it that way forever.
44:46
SPEAKER_03: And it's gonna be harder for me, and everybody learns differently.
44:49
SPEAKER_03: Some people, some choreographers like to just get the choreography out and then let's go back and fine-tune it and get all the details.
44:54
SPEAKER_03: But I'm the kind of I'm like really detail-oriented.
44:56
SPEAKER_03: So I want to give you, give me all of the details and I will remember those.
45:01
SPEAKER_03: And then it's gonna be harder for me to change it towards the end because you know, I have it this exact way.
45:07
SPEAKER_03: So, like, however, whatever way works for you choreographers, but I think that a lot of choreographers either tend to forget or their dancers just aren't applying the focus changes because your eyes are really gonna tell a story.
45:18
SPEAKER_03: And if you're just looking at the front the whole time, whether it's at the judges or actually to the back of the house, it's still not as believable.
45:26
SPEAKER_03: And if you're following your hand or using your focus or swiping down and looking up, like you're gonna see so much more in your performance immediately, even if there's not much going on on your face, your eyes are going to enhance that performance a million percent.
45:42
SPEAKER_03: So I'd say like run your dances and make sure, and and that is especially when it gets into groups.
45:48
SPEAKER_03: That's something that I'm really nitpicky about in in judging, where I'm like, hey, where's the focus supposed to be for that?
45:53
SPEAKER_03: There was one girl looking to the front and everyone else was to the side or whatever it's supposed to be.
45:57
SPEAKER_03: So, like, those are the details that we want to see cleaned as judges that are gonna make or break the performance score, I think.
46:03
SPEAKER_04: Well, especially in groups, as you said, Courtney, because everyone can be turning their head to the right or to the left, but some of us are looking down and some of us are looking directly aside.
46:12
SPEAKER_04: And it does change how you see the routine, does change you know the focus in the story in some ways, in very subtle ways, but it does.
46:20
SPEAKER_04: So focus is huge.
46:22
SPEAKER_04: Sam, you're on.
46:22
SPEAKER_04: Go ahead.
46:23
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I think in that same breath, Court, what sometimes we think that we have to do so much face, but sometimes the most powerful and the most impactful pieces that I still remember to this day are the dancers who are entirely still and are just letting their emotions speak for itself.
46:39
SPEAKER_00: And they don't need to do 9,000 pirouettes, but you can tell the second that this dancer came on stage, like, here we go, like this is gonna be a show.
46:47
SPEAKER_00: And then I also feel like what causes the you know, the overperforming sometimes is the lack of confidence in the technical training where they're selling their face so you're distracted by the face when they're you know the technique of their Alice Cohen turns or is just not it, and trying to oversell with the face so we we don't look at other things.
47:08
SPEAKER_00: So I'm always you know, if we're like giving a massive face, I'm almost I'm like, okay, you got the performance, I can see that.
47:14
SPEAKER_00: I'm now right my entire focus has shifted to your technique because I'm like, I want to make sure that we're we have a uh you know, really nice balanced answer here where it's not just wow then with the personality and the technique isn't where it should be or what what we could be capable of.
47:30
SPEAKER_00: So kind of twofold of like playing with the stillness and letting, you know, less is more, but then also more needs to be less to have more technique, if that makes sense.
47:40
SPEAKER_03: Yes, and I think and I have something to say, but I think this is the perfect transition to kind of talk about technique versus performance.
47:47
SPEAKER_03: But uh something that I want to say in relation to that, Sam, which is so good, and I'm so glad you brought it up, is that the example where the dancers are performing like it's nobody's business.
47:59
SPEAKER_03: They are performers, they were taught it, they're naturals, whatever it is.
48:03
SPEAKER_03: They're putting on a show.
48:04
SPEAKER_03: But that technique is a little all over the place.
48:08
SPEAKER_03: But then I've also seen the opposite where there is a dancer who has amazing performance, their technique isn't strong, but the choreographer knows that and they hid their flaws so well where it's almost to a point where it's like the performance is what makes this dance, and I don't even need all this flash and crazy tricks and technique because that's not their strong suit.
48:34
SPEAKER_03: This dancer is a performer, and that teacher was smart enough to know I don't need all this glitz and glam.
48:40
SPEAKER_03: I'm gonna showcase what they do best.
48:42
SPEAKER_03: And at the end of the day, that's all we want as a judge.
48:45
SPEAKER_03: That dancer could perform their heart out and walk around the stage and do absolutely nothing.
48:49
SPEAKER_03: And I would remember it more than the person that was overperforming with bad technique.
48:55
SPEAKER_02: I will always I will never not bring this number up because I respect it so much.
49:00
SPEAKER_02: And I we've talked about it in other podcasts.
49:02
SPEAKER_02: Caleb Dickey's pizza dance from the virtual competition.
49:06
SPEAKER_02: It was he Caleb Dickey is an idea judge.
49:10
SPEAKER_02: You judged that it was a musical creator piece to uh hopelessly devoted to you.
49:14
SPEAKER_02: And the girl comes out and you just think, okay, this is gonna be hopelessly devoted to you.
49:19
SPEAKER_02: You just sort of know what you think you're gonna expect, and then all of a sudden she whips out a pizza box and she's dancing about this pizza.
49:26
SPEAKER_02: And there is nothing crazy hard in this dance, it is not super technical.
49:31
SPEAKER_02: The choreography made use of her skills.
49:34
SPEAKER_02: She is whoever this girl is out there in I think Ohio, we love you.
49:38
SPEAKER_02: We love you, Caleb Dickey.
49:40
SPEAKER_02: Your choreography was so smart.
49:41
SPEAKER_02: And like like Sam said, like he judged that.
49:44
SPEAKER_02: I didn't judge it, I just watched it.
49:45
SPEAKER_02: But I mean, that would have done it for me.
49:47
SPEAKER_02: Like you you performed the heck out of it and the pizza and it the whole concept, it was just right.
49:52
SPEAKER_02: So, you know, sometimes if all of the pieces fit together properly, yeah, that's all you need.
49:58
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you know, for a winning, award-winning, rememberable, memorable dance.
50:02
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I think it also just goes to in that same breath, Caleb knew exactly what these this dancer's strengths were.
50:09
SPEAKER_00: And there was not one thing that was out of her skill set, and there was not one ounce of technique that was out of place.
50:17
SPEAKER_00: It was everything that she could do, she could do on the left side or on her worst day, and it wouldn't make a difference because she's selling it with her performance.
50:25
SPEAKER_00: But again, uh you know, in that same in that same breath, it's that here come my turns, I must stop my performance because I'm so worried about making sure that I do all my turns perfectly.
50:35
SPEAKER_00: Where she was like, I'm dancing about pizza.
50:37
SPEAKER_00: This is the best thing ever.
50:39
SPEAKER_02: And I remember I'm gonna go do some turns.
50:41
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know, I was judging this one solo, I'll never forget it.
50:44
SPEAKER_00: It was some song about like always dreaming about you, and it's clearly this like love song.
50:49
SPEAKER_00: And this girl was dancing about cake and had a literal cake on the middle of the stage at the end, literally runs and smashes her face into the cake and starts licking the frosting.
50:59
SPEAKER_00: And I was like, hundred done.
51:01
SPEAKER_00: You win.
51:02
SPEAKER_00: You like you you danced about a cake and then you smashed your face into the cake, and it was genius.
51:07
SPEAKER_01: Oh my god.
51:08
SPEAKER_00: So it's like sometimes the gimmicks work and that they sell, but they have to be done correctly.
51:13
SPEAKER_00: And Caleb is a perfect example of that.
51:15
SPEAKER_00: Love you, Caleb.
51:16
unknown: Love you.
51:17
SPEAKER_04: I want to dance about cake and smash my head.
51:19
SPEAKER_04: I know that's genius.
51:21
SPEAKER_04: You're winning at life, not yeah, so good.
51:24
SPEAKER_04: That's amazing.
51:25
SPEAKER_04: But yeah, I mean, it makes it really on the choreographer to make sure that if you have a really strong performer who is not as strong in technique, that they really only do what they're capable of and what's clean.
51:38
SPEAKER_04: Try to really suppress the pressure um that we put on ourselves to throw in extra turns or extra tricks.
51:44
SPEAKER_04: And and there's nothing worse um for a judge than to see a dancer who's a great performer who then does really awful fuete turns because, you know, let's face it, they're really hard and and it takes a long time to be able to do those cleanly.
51:59
SPEAKER_04: And so there's just nothing worse than seeing this performer who would have been done a wonderful job doing a single clean pirouette because they were such a strong performer and they do fuetes, and you're like, ooh, it's very cringy at that point.
52:12
SPEAKER_04: So really serve your students, serve your your dancers by focusing on their strengths and really keeping it simple, especially if they if you know they can carry it over in performance and they're gonna get us with their performance.
52:24
SPEAKER_03: Right, because we and we briefly mentioned about this before we started recording, but something that's important to remember for a lot of listeners out there is how how our score gets broken down at competition.
52:35
SPEAKER_03: And a lot of times, uh when we're judging individually, before it gets grouped into the 300 out of three judges, it's out of a hundred per judge.
52:42
SPEAKER_03: And more oftentimes than not, the two highest point brackets are technique and performance.
52:49
SPEAKER_03: And each competition is different with how many points they allot for each category.
52:53
SPEAKER_03: And sometimes competitions have broken down scores, or sometimes it's just a single number score.
52:59
SPEAKER_03: But I think that majority of the time most judges are even approaching judging with that idea in our head of technique and performance are the two the biggest factors in our score.
53:09
SPEAKER_03: And sometimes it might be like a 40 for technique and it might be a 30 for performance or something like that as an example.
53:17
SPEAKER_03: So I think that it's important to remember that let's say you're not as strong technically.
53:24
SPEAKER_03: So you're getting points off there, probably.
53:26
SPEAKER_03: And that's also depending, like we've just been talking about, if your teacher is giving you choreography that is maybe too advanced for you and you're not executing it as strong, and maybe you're showing things that you're still working on.
53:38
SPEAKER_03: But then on top of it, we have our performance that's right next to it.
53:41
SPEAKER_03: And then you're not giving me anything on the performance.
53:44
SPEAKER_03: You're that's why your score is what it is.
53:47
SPEAKER_03: And I think that a lot of people, a lot of people have the misconception of, well, I have all these tricks in my dance, so it should score higher.
53:55
SPEAKER_03: And it's actually the opposite concept.
53:57
SPEAKER_03: It's more if the more things you put are the more things we can deduct.
54:02
SPEAKER_03: So less is always more.
54:04
SPEAKER_03: And at the end of the day, you can easily get a performance, that performance score up very easily if the choreography works for the dancer.
54:14
SPEAKER_03: Like the example that you said, Sam.
54:16
SPEAKER_03: I mean, if the dancers have to turn into concentration face every time they're about to go into a skill and turning the performance off, they're not ready for that skill.
54:26
SPEAKER_03: I know they're hard.
54:28
SPEAKER_03: It's a hard skill to do, but at the end of the day, your performance matters.
54:31
SPEAKER_03: So you can't just decide when I'm gonna turn it on and when I'm gonna turn it off because your your technique score is gonna go down because you're not ready for it, and your performance score.
54:40
SPEAKER_03: Like there's a lot, there's a lot to work with when you get on stage.
54:44
SPEAKER_03: And we want you to succeed as judges.
54:47
SPEAKER_03: So I think it's important for us to kind of explain how these scores come about because a lot of people, I see so many things that dancers shouldn't be doing on stage, that it's too advanced for them or their technique isn't as strong.
54:59
SPEAKER_03: And then also their performance is lacking because it's too hard for them.
55:03
SPEAKER_00: And I think also what really has shifted my way that I approach judging now really was because of a lot of the virtual comps that I was doing and being able to feel that performance through a screen.
55:16
SPEAKER_00: And a lot of this world is going or I hate to say it, but like virtual, and Lord God only knows what's going to be happening down the road.
55:23
SPEAKER_00: But being able to translate that performance in a virtual competition through a screen to still make me cry, that is a skill, and that I can only imagine what that performer in that dance is like in person.
55:35
SPEAKER_00: And to translate that into real world, everything is virtual self-tape now.
55:39
SPEAKER_00: So the skills that you bring to the dance competition stage and how that translates into real life, where majority of auditions right now are self-tape, and you need to dance in the studio and still sell your performance to a casting director in you know a minute.
55:52
SPEAKER_00: How do you do that?
55:53
SPEAKER_00: And it starts in the competition world and in your studio and making sure that you're practicing that performance and your character and whatever you're doing with a hundred percent commitment to to that performance.
56:05
SPEAKER_00: Because if not, when you go to the real world, if you want to be a dancer, it's not about how you'll never do more than a double pirouette.
56:11
SPEAKER_00: And it's literally just about your face and your performance and the what your the energy that you're bringing in the audition room.
56:17
SPEAKER_00: So rarely will your leg ever be, you'll never do a tilt, you'll always wear two shoes, and you'll never do more than a double pirouette.
56:24
SPEAKER_00: It's about your performance and your character, and it starts with the competition stage.
56:28
SPEAKER_00: So being able to really feel that translated through these virtual comms, shout out to the teachers and the and the choreographers who push their kids in the studio to perform to the camera so we could feel it.
56:39
SPEAKER_00: And I think that's it's just one of the most tangible skills, especially right now, as to how that can translate into jobs and getting, you know, getting paid to dance.
56:49
SPEAKER_00: It's all about the performance.
56:50
SPEAKER_04: Definitely.
56:51
SPEAKER_04: And I also agree with, you know, when you are doing a great dance and all of a sudden you stop and and go into your pirouettes and the faces drop, or you do an acro skill and the faces drop.
57:02
SPEAKER_04: It also tells me, number one, you might not be ready for those skills, but also your performance is not authentic because you really have to be so focused consistently throughout your routine that really nothing should throw you as far as the performance.
57:15
SPEAKER_04: It should never just drop.
57:17
SPEAKER_04: And I see this every now and then where it drives me crazy, where dancers will perform and they're doing a great job, but all of a sudden they're distracted by something that's happening off stage.
57:26
SPEAKER_04: Like one of their friends might be back there making them laugh or something, and they'll they'll break focus and like acknowledge the dancer back there making them laugh.
57:32
SPEAKER_04: And I'm like, I see you up there acknowledging the dancer offstage laughing, and you just broke your performance.
57:38
SPEAKER_04: You can't, you really can't do that.
57:40
SPEAKER_04: And so authenticity to me means everything.
57:43
SPEAKER_04: And when they break and when they lose their focus, they drop their focus, they drop their performance.
57:47
SPEAKER_04: It says to me that you're really sort of faking it.
57:50
SPEAKER_04: And I I I'm all into authenticity.
57:52
SPEAKER_03: So I agree.
57:53
SPEAKER_03: Especially when you can tell it's like it's overperformed sometimes, too.
57:58
SPEAKER_03: Like I I feel like it doesn't feel authentic.
58:01
SPEAKER_03: I'm like, oh, you're really putting this, you're I mean, I'm grateful.
58:06
SPEAKER_03: It's I'm grateful you're performing, right?
58:08
SPEAKER_03: But I think that doing something, it's a lot of teachers always say, like, I'd rather you go full out than mark, and I'd rather like reel you back in.
58:15
SPEAKER_03: I'd rather you go too big and then we can we can adjust.
58:19
SPEAKER_03: So I will say, I'm grateful you're performing.
58:21
SPEAKER_03: That's great.
58:22
SPEAKER_03: But then sometimes it might come across as like, whoa, that's a lot.
58:26
SPEAKER_03: That's a lot to handle.
58:27
SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh.
58:28
SPEAKER_02: Or just core just choreographed.
58:30
SPEAKER_02: It's like, you know, faces being choreographed is not authentic or genuine.
58:33
SPEAKER_02: Right.
58:34
SPEAKER_02: You know, again, when you're three years old, okay, maybe you can choreograph your face, but anything past that, you know, it should be different every time.
58:41
SPEAKER_02: Your your dancing should be the same, but your faces should be genuine for the moment.
58:46
SPEAKER_02: You know?
58:46
SPEAKER_02: That's a great point.
58:47
SPEAKER_04: And just to bring up props too, I know you probably had a separate podcast in your life.
58:51
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, but we love talking about as a teacher or choreographer, props in a routine are great, but they should always enhance the routine.
58:57
SPEAKER_04: They should never distract from it.
58:59
SPEAKER_04: So if your dancer is really focused on using that prop and doing it right and and not performing, it's going to distract.
59:06
SPEAKER_04: And so I always, you know, tell the dancers and the dance teachers that using a prop is like using another limb.
59:11
SPEAKER_04: Like it should feel so natural to you that it's like using another part of your body.
59:15
SPEAKER_04: And so it's so important to rehearse stage presence with your props in the studio.
59:20
SPEAKER_00: And I think also to go back off that, so many times when dancers are dancing with the prop, or there's like a magic reveal in their in their piece, uh, you know, costume changes, color, whatever, but there's no shift in the performance as to what why did we need that?
59:36
SPEAKER_00: How did you dance differently in the beginning, and how are you dancing differently after the the magic reveal or you know, you find your your bowler hat or whatever it is?
59:44
SPEAKER_00: What is your relationship with the prop and how will it like exactly Jackie said, how will it enhance the performance?
59:50
SPEAKER_00: And is it actually doing you a disservice by having because we're just watching this prop to be like, well, what are they gonna do with it?
59:55
SPEAKER_00: Why is it just sitting there?
59:56
SPEAKER_00: This is doing nothing for the performance.
59:57
SPEAKER_00: So just always, again, if you're doing it with if you're dancing with the prop, it's a duet.
1:00:02
SPEAKER_00: You should always be a duet if you know, if it's a solo, whatever, but treat it as a partner and it you should still have a relationship and a connection to that prop.
1:00:10
SPEAKER_00: Thank you for coming to my TED Talk.
1:00:14
SPEAKER_03: Well, we kind of gave a few examples on our end to kind of round us out on the state presence discussion, but are there any other like fantastic dances that you will never forget while you've sat behind the judges' table when it came to the performance quality of a group, of a soloist?
1:00:31
SPEAKER_03: Any examples that you want to give a shout out and share?
1:00:34
SPEAKER_00: I have one, and it's not a specific one, but it's a studio as a whole.
1:00:38
SPEAKER_00: Patty Eisenhower, that studio, they rehearse their piece from stop top to bottom, and everything is so seamless in terms of every performance.
1:00:49
SPEAKER_00: You know that with the second that they walk on stage, they mean business, and no matter what piece they're in, whether it's a jazz, a musical theater, or contemporary, they are 100% committed to those characters.
1:00:58
SPEAKER_00: And they they have some choreographers come in there that are doing these really elaborate pieces.
1:01:03
SPEAKER_00: There was this one I was at NYCDA and they did this piece, it was somewhere over the rainbow, but it was like an old, like ancient recording of Judy Garland singing it live.
1:01:13
SPEAKER_00: And they had these balloons, and I was like, Oh, a balloon?
1:01:15
SPEAKER_00: Like, okay.
1:01:16
SPEAKER_00: And then the choreographer was brilliant, and they all blew up their balloons, and it's like somewhere over the rainbow, and they let the balloons go, and it's like at the very end, like the rainbows disappearing.
1:01:26
SPEAKER_00: I just I was like, this is brilliant! But they the way that these dancers portrayed like the old classic Judy style, but then having that contemporary feel, but still having a performance and an emotion on top of it, and then they can do like a Scott Fowler jazz piece, and I'm like yesing and snapping all over the place.
1:01:43
SPEAKER_00: I just think they're they're magicians at that studio, and I I always get so excited when I get to see them and judge it.
1:01:49
SPEAKER_00: I feel like I need to buy a ticket to come see the half an hour show.
1:01:53
SPEAKER_00: But the end.
1:01:54
SPEAKER_04: I had a dancer last season, and you know, dance teachers, uh, studio owners were really on the fence about masks and having to wear, have their students wear masks because they weren't sure how the performance would come across.
1:02:06
SPEAKER_04: Well, this young dancer, probably intermediate, I would say.
1:02:09
SPEAKER_04: She wasn't advanced and she wasn't super beginner either, but she did a jazz solo and she wore a mask.
1:02:15
SPEAKER_04: And let me tell you, she was the perfect example of how you can still wear a mask and get the performance across because her jazz solo, she was just living up there.
1:02:25
SPEAKER_04: And it wasn't over the top, it was just joy.
1:02:28
SPEAKER_04: And you could see it.
1:02:29
SPEAKER_04: I mean, she was smizing for Jesus.
1:02:31
SPEAKER_04: I mean, she just had those eyes lit up.
1:02:34
SPEAKER_04: But also, you can feel a person's stage presence.
1:02:37
SPEAKER_04: It's not just in the face, it's in their body and how they move and how they articulate movements.
1:02:43
SPEAKER_04: So it's really important we to understand when you are facing upstage, we can still feel that energy.
1:02:49
SPEAKER_04: When you're transitioning and moving from place to place, you can't drop the stage presence because we can still feel it.
1:02:55
SPEAKER_04: And it's also part of your story.
1:02:56
SPEAKER_04: But this young dancer did such a great job of performing.
1:03:00
SPEAKER_04: It just made me feel good as an audience member slash judge watching her.
1:03:04
SPEAKER_04: And so she was a perfect example of how to perform, do it naturally, and just have fun in a jazz piece.
1:03:12
SPEAKER_04: And then the other dancer that I remember from Canada was an advanced dancer.
1:03:16
SPEAKER_04: And her choreography was beautiful, no tricks.
1:03:19
SPEAKER_04: I don't even think a pirouette at all, but it was just so lovely and so well connected with the lyrics.
1:03:26
SPEAKER_04: But this one gesture that she did was, of course, the choreographer's choice, but she did it so well connected.
1:03:33
SPEAKER_04: She just looked out to the audience and did this as if she was like wiping away tears and like flung her hands.
1:03:39
SPEAKER_04: And she did it with such conviction and intention, as I think you mentioned earlier, Courtney, that it was like it gave me goosebumps because of the context of the routine and what she was dancing about.
1:03:50
SPEAKER_04: And it was so well connected.
1:03:52
SPEAKER_04: Just that one thing, if done with such conviction, can mean so much.
1:03:56
SPEAKER_00: And I think one more thing, sorry, I'm now my mind is turning, but I feel like a lot of the times with tap, we never were always like, you gotta use your face, you gotta use your face, because we're so worried about the sounds that our feet are making.
1:04:08
SPEAKER_00: And sometimes I feel like the tap world is it's a full body experience here.
1:04:12
SPEAKER_00: We need performance from you know, your feet are performing as well as your face.
1:04:16
SPEAKER_00: And I remember I watched this duet.
1:04:18
SPEAKER_00: Jamie's Dance Odyssey had a duet, it was a tap duet, and I believe it was called Beep Beep, and it was um it was the funniest thing, and it was a car, it was uh two two cars that were stuck in traffic, and they were just like looking at each other, tapping, and it was like you're yelling at the person looking through your window of like you're going too fast, you're going too slow, speed up.
1:04:38
SPEAKER_00: And it was the funniest thing.
1:04:39
SPEAKER_00: There were no lyrics, it just was an instrumental track, but they sold it with her performance, and it was a genius tap routine.
1:04:46
SPEAKER_00: And at the end, the dancer goes off stage and they roll a hubcap across the back of the stage like through my microphone.
1:04:54
SPEAKER_00: It was the funniest thing, but you know, and I and Caitlin Gray is is phenomenal with making sure that her dancers are telling a story, and there's a it's a full, it's a full, fully visualized concept from head to toe.
1:05:08
SPEAKER_00: Phenomenal taps, phenomenal syncopations, but there's a story going on, their face is telling you something.
1:05:13
SPEAKER_00: And I think, you know, especially just to give the tap people some love, there needs to be stronger performance with tap.
1:05:19
SPEAKER_00: And it's not just the feet, but it it's a full body experience from the waist up.
1:05:23
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, there's a dancer that, and that's a perfect example now that we're talking about tap.
1:05:27
SPEAKER_03: There's a dancer that's coming to mind that I've judged before who is an exceptional tapper, and like just based on execution and and technique alone, it was gonna get a perfect score, but has nothing going on in the face.
1:05:40
SPEAKER_03: And it's like, all right, well, that's the next level, girl.
1:05:43
SPEAKER_03: Like, come on.
1:05:44
SPEAKER_03: You're you're you've perfected your craft.
1:05:47
SPEAKER_03: You are awesome.
1:05:48
SPEAKER_03: You didn't miss a sound, your your costume looks great, choreography's great, song is great.
1:05:53
SPEAKER_03: Final layer, turn your face on.
1:05:55
SPEAKER_03: Like at the end of the day, that's it.
1:05:56
SPEAKER_03: That's really what's gonna make a total package for us as judges.
1:06:00
SPEAKER_03: I don't think that there are many dancers that will slip through the cracks and win first place at a competition that don't have any type of performance quality.
1:06:08
SPEAKER_03: Like they I mean, it r at the end of the day, it really depends on what competition is there, because maybe everybody didn't have performance quality and that's who won.
1:06:16
SPEAKER_03: But I mean, a lot of times we we want to be moved in in our behind the judges table.
1:06:21
SPEAKER_03: So just keep that in mind, everybody.
1:06:23
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, even hip-hop.
1:06:26
SPEAKER_00: They'll come out and do artistic dance and math.
1:06:28
SPEAKER_00: They'll do like contemporary hip hop, but it is some of the most emotional th like they did this one piece to Kesha's praying.
1:06:37
SPEAKER_00: And it was a contemporary piece, but it was you know, it had a very strong hip hop thread through it.
1:06:41
SPEAKER_00: And I I was like sobbing out because I was like, You are so committed to this, and you're 14, 15 years old, but you're dancing from your heart.
1:06:50
SPEAKER_00: And it, you know, when you no matter what genre you're in, if you're dancing from your heart, I'm in a hundred percent.
1:06:56
SPEAKER_00: And we can feel it within the first three seconds, if you know, which direction it's gonna go.
1:07:01
SPEAKER_00: And when it's on and it's good, it is so good.
1:07:05
SPEAKER_02: And like Jackie said, especially like in reference to this past couple years, you like people have been so up in arms about masks on stage.
1:07:14
SPEAKER_02: And but Jackie, you're right.
1:07:16
SPEAKER_02: When when somebody is dancing full out with feeling, I don't care if you have a mask on, I can see it, I can feel it, I can tell.
1:07:23
SPEAKER_02: So if it's if it's possible, it's possible.
1:07:25
SPEAKER_02: So if we happen to get back to that point, God forbid, you know, this year, just know that like if you're training the performance quality without a mask, it will still translate with the mask, but you have to be training it, period.
1:07:38
SPEAKER_02: If you're not training it, it's not there and it's gonna sorry for you.
1:07:41
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and well, it's the same thing, I think, with like theatrical masks.
1:07:44
SPEAKER_04: If you decide to do like a half mask or fancy makeup or something, you know, we can don't rely on that to help us with the performance.
1:07:52
SPEAKER_04: You still have to be it still has to come from your body, even if we can't see part of your face, we can feel it.
1:07:57
SPEAKER_04: So really, you know, make sure that you are fully committed to whatever the piece is about.
1:08:02
SPEAKER_03: All right, y'all.
1:08:03
SPEAKER_03: Well, this was so great.
1:08:05
SPEAKER_03: And to all of our listeners out there, I hope that you heard from some IDA judges about what we're really looking for when we're judging this season and making sure that we're incorporating our performance quality and stage presence and emotions and intention and acting for every dance when you step foot onto the competitive stage.
1:08:25
SPEAKER_03: So start working on that now.
1:08:26
SPEAKER_03: You got a few more weeks before the season begins if you haven't competed yet, and we're looking for it.
1:08:31
SPEAKER_03: So thank you so much to our fabulous IDA judges, Sam and Jackie, for joining us on this chat.
1:08:37
SPEAKER_03: This was so great.
1:08:38
SPEAKER_03: Loved having you both on this.
1:08:40
SPEAKER_03: And uh how we always have our guests lead us out is with a few final thoughts or any words of encouragement you'd like to tell all the dancers, the teachers out there, any final tips, anything you'd like to share with the world about stage presence.
1:08:54
SPEAKER_04: Well, I think at the end of the day, what will carry you across, even performance-wise, is confidence.
1:09:00
SPEAKER_04: So be confident in the choices that you make when you're on stage and just do it with conviction, and we will believe it.
1:09:07
SPEAKER_04: You know, it's again about all authenticity for me, and just have fun.
1:09:12
SPEAKER_04: At the end of the day, in competition, just remind yourself to have fun and to be confident, and you'll be great.
1:09:18
SPEAKER_00: I love that.
1:09:19
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, I think for me, lesson is sometimes less is more, and you don't need to do more.
1:09:26
SPEAKER_00: Let, you know, let your let your performance speak for itself, but know know who you're dancing to, know why you're dancing, and know what you're dancing for.
1:09:36
SPEAKER_00: And just committing and trusting yourself and and like Jackie said, just have fun.
1:09:41
SPEAKER_00: You know, and at the end of the day, it's three people's opinions and let it be a learning experience and take the critiques and just use them to better your your next performance.
1:09:53
SPEAKER_03: We hope you enjoyed this week's episode all about stage presents.
1:09:57
SPEAKER_03: Be sure to follow our very special guests and IDA judges on social media.
1:10:02
SPEAKER_03: You can find Jackie at Jack BeQuinn and Sam at Sam Quinn.
1:10:07
SPEAKER_02: Don't forget to follow Making the Impact on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Podcast, Google Podcasts, and pretty much everywhere you listen to podcasts.
1:10:16
SPEAKER_03: IDA's virtual competition is back and launching this February.
1:10:20
SPEAKER_03: Submit your dance to receive detailed, personalized feedback from some of the best judges in the industry and compete alongside others from around the world.
1:10:28
SPEAKER_03: Each solo entry will be eligible for special awards, overall sponsored prizes, and a chance to recompete in the Top 20 Challenge live stream event.
1:10:36
SPEAKER_03: Visit our website at Impact Dance Adjudicators.com slash virtual competition to learn more and stay tuned for official launch date coming soon.
1:10:45
SPEAKER_02: Stay tuned for our upcoming episodes in season three.
1:10:48
SPEAKER_02: Next up, a day in the life of a professional dancer, winning versus losing, and the February edition of QA with Courtney Live.