Latest / Business Roundtable / Creative Flow Meets Smart Systems: How to Scale Your Business Without Losing Your Edge

Transcript

Creative Flow Meets Smart Systems: How to Scale Your Business Without Losing Your Edge · Business Roundtable

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: Oh all right, everybody, welcome back to the Business Roundtable podcast.
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: I'm your host, David Carr, and we've got a brand
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: new guest on the podcast this week. Uh, Kat is here,
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: and you're gonna love Kat because she's just got a
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: if you got just a great background, and I'm gonna
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: jump into it because she and I were talking a
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: while ago and we realized, you know, I know how
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: much systems and processes are needed for companies to be successful.
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: And Kat works with a lot of creative have said
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: maybe not always appreciate systems and processes, and we want
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: to talk about today how we can be creative and
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: have smart systems really help grow our businesses. And Kat,
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: I'm so glad you're here. You have such an important
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: voice and folks that really need your help. So tell
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: me a little bit, just briefly, our audience get to
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: know you a little bit. Your background, what got you
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: going to doing this and why do you love doing
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: what you do as Cat and Company? Cat and Company?
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: Excuse me, well, thanks so much for having me, David.
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: I'm excited to be here so quick. Background. As you said,
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: I am the owner and operator of Cat and Co.
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: We primarily work with creative business owners. So I think
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: interior designers, fine artists, fabricators, creative studios and the like.
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: So I got my start actually in operation, a big surprise,
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: but within creative studios. I think it's been kind of
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: a blend of my natural predisposition of using my analytical
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: side with my interests of creativity the creative process. I
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: am a creative myself, and I think just my nature,
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: I enjoyed being in and working within the creative studios
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: while also falling back on my default of oh my gosh,
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: everything's crazy, let me organize it for you me just
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: let me handle this. So that's my default. That's the
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: pattern I started recognizing in myself throughout my career, and
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: when I was ready to jumpstart and start taking consulting projects,
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: that's really naturally what came to me is, Okay, I'm
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: going to stick with this vein of business operations, people management,
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: client experience, but do it for the business owners and
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: the companies that have a soft spot in my heart.
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: The creatives.
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so needed, I mean it, And you don't necessarily
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: have to be a creative. I think anybody that's growing
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: a business as an entrepreneur there's a lot of things
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: to take in and like what do I focus in
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: on what am I best at? And recognizing you know,
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: if you are a creative, your your best is doing
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: that creative work. Maybe not being focused in the nitty
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: gritty sometimes of trying to get all these streamline operations
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: or how do I build the team exactly right? They
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: can get stuck in that and then lose the spark
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: that that that creative spark that got them all going
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: to begin with, right, Okay, yeah.
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: That's exactly right. I think a lot of the business
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: owners that I work with have followed this path for
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: themselves from passion, from a passion for their Let's just
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: take an interior designer for an example. Perhaps they started
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: their career as a junior designer and kind of work
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: throughout the ranks at a firm or at multiple different firms,
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: and you know, when they're ready, I'm going to do it.
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: I'm going to follow my passion. I'm going to open
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: my own firm. And then comes all of the back
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: end stuff that comes with owning a business, and like
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: you said, can and a lot of the times take
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: away from the initial spark or passion for why they
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: started the business and it kind of almost can create
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: a resentment and some times and trickle down to their team.
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: So really it's the in between, the kind of fluid
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: tasks that you might not necessarily think of when you
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: think of a creative company, But they exist in every company,
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: and my job is to come in and really act
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: as that support system for them visionary, to integrate her
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: and allow them and their creative teams to do what
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: they do best and live in their zone of genius,
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: which is remaining creative.
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: Right. So, I think if you're listening to this podcast
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: and you're feeling a little stuck, hopefully we're going to
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: get you unstuck today and you're gonna have another resource
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: here in Kat to help you there, because I think, yeah,
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: like there's disorganized maybe workflows, how are we doing this?
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: Unclear client processes, maybe struggling with how do I what
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: do I delegate? How do I delegate? All Right? I
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: mean there's numerous things.
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: Right, and it can oh, go ahead, I'm just I
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: guess echoing that it can. It can be stressful, especially
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: I mean I've worked in interior design for a long
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: time and it is not as easy as it looks.
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: Like on TV. That is a very difficult industry to
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: be in and everything is urgent all the time. So
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: pair that with the actual business related tasks, it can
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: be hard to know what to focus on.
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: Right. Yeah, you brought just brought up an idea. Kat
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: I had a friend and colleague and she does designs
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: and and buryachts and some other stuff kind of amazing,
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: kind of unusual things I would never think of. But
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: then you're talking about, like I got to source this
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: material and there's a special wood and all this other things,
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: and I'm like that it's like a it's a big project, right,
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: And it's like all this minutia of things you've got
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: to think about, and if you don't get all that
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: stuff right, you're not going to be able to complete
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: the project. Right. You're like, why didn't think about that?
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: I just have this vision of what this could be.
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: And you're like, well, did you figure out all these
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: things you need to have in place to make it work? Yeah?
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: I mean just just think of a custom sofa for
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: a second. If you're building a custom sofa for a client,
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: you need to one design it, work with a work
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: room to design it. There are sit tests involved, there's
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: foam density, there's spring levels, there's different you know, backings
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: that are involved. Then you have the fabric, and then
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: you're dealing with fabric fabric vendors. You might have pillows
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: that are being custom made. You might need to specify
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: trim and courting and all of these things that are
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: just one item has one hundred back end things to
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: it that have their own lead times and deliverables and
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: people to deal with. So it is very complicated and
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: it can get very messy very quickly if it's not.
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: If it's not organized much a different word for organized, but.
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: Well organized, I mean like, I mean so yeah, because
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: I think some people don't. And this is probably maybe
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: you've seen this too. When you're you're small and you're
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: just getting set up. It's great, there isn't isn't too bad,
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: but you start to get some level of success, which
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: that's great. However, it also has consequences, right because now
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: you're you're you're infusing more and more people, more variables,
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: and so like we want, like I said, now we
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: want more of this, and you know I could build
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: this at this scale, but now you're asking me, you know,
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: not just one? So far? One you're asking me multiple projects,
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: and I've got to align all these at the same
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: time and have different vendors or people coming in. So
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: there's there's probably naturally there's bottlenecks that are popping up right,
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: left or right, and probably you're helping identify. I'm assuming Kat, like,
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: where are those so that we can you know, loosen
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: that up so we're not you know, uh, causing a
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: lot of stress. So now there's a stuck in the
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: minutia of it.
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, that's bringing me to a separate point or
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: a larger point there, which is technical things aside, you know,
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: technical things specific to the trade. When I know a
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: lot of my business owners might struggle with having a
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: small team, and everyone kind of intuitively knows what to do,
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: when to do it, and when they are ready to
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: grow and bring on people, it's kind of this moment
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: of oh my gosh, how are we going to explain
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: this to someone new? How are we You know, a
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: lot of the processes and the order of operations. The
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: owners know it, they know it. Creatives know their processes.
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: They know intuitively when to do something, when to respond
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: to this person, when to follow up. But it's it
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: can be difficult to itemize that and define it and
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: put it to paper so that someone else can take
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: that information and run with it too. So that is
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: a major bottleneck that I'm typically coming in and really
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: learning the process with them and through that kind of
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: uh noticing and hey, that didn't quite work with that,
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: well last time, maybe let's try something different.
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: Right, Well, they can almost like you said, I mean,
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: I think they know it so well, they're almost trapped
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: by it because like how do I how do I
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: let somebody else into this, you know? And so then
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: it's like this vicious cycle. They always know the answer.
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: There's nobody else that can get in there, and there's like,
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: oh it just you're grinding at that point. And again,
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: like I said, we talked at the beginning, you're your
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: creative spark is just evaporating. You're losing all of that
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: because you're you've now shifted from that being on that
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: creative space. Now you were dis sucked into like I
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: only know the process or nobody else knows this, like
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: you said, and because it's not their nature probably And
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: this is where your expertise comes in, right, like to
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: document all the steps I just don't I know, that's
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: not the way I think, That's not the way I
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: process information, right.
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's that's right. And I think there can also
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: be a myth of soort that because every project is different,
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: or because we do custom furniture, or because our last
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: project was a full home and this is just one room,
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: or vice versa, that I don't I can't have a
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: process because every project is different. You know, it doesn't
• 11:18
  Speaker 2: make sense to write it down or to define it,
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: and I don't I think that that could be further
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: from the.
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: Truth, right, Yeah, I mean there is. Yeah, I think,
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: like you said, there is a disconnect here because as
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: we have, we need both great processes and great leaders people,
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: and we need these combined together, not disconnected. And I
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: think that's what I hear are you doing. You're knitting
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: these together and saying, Okay, how do you do that?
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: And then I think, as one of the things I
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: love is helping the people understand this. And sometimes you're
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: going to bring other people that are different what I
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: call different voices in my framework, but of that are
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: not creatives, but you need like yourself or other people.
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: You're probably bringing other people in, like an accountant. Maybe
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: that looks at the numbers that like the creators like,
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: I don't know what your experience is. My experience of
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: creative is like I'll look at that up if I
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: have to, But that's kind of like that's not as
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: important to me. I mean, it is important, but you
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: know what I mean was driving me is to create
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: this and be in that space. And what do you
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: need in an expense process form for how to get
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: all this stuff done? All this nitty gritty stuff right
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: m Yeah.
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: What I'm hearing there is the threat of communication, which
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry not communication. Connection is what I meant connection
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: of the different verticals of you know, business, operations, people, management,
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: client experience. It's all connected. And I think that's something
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: that going back to a topic earlier, it can be
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: really difficult to dive in alone, especially when you are
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: very close to business. I'm guilty of this as well.
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: With my business. It can be really challenging to pull
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: the veil away and really look at, hey, what's actually
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: happening here and how how are these things connected? So,
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: for example, you know, creating perhaps processes that in the
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: future will promote connection with a new employee, processes that
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: will allow them to walk in the door and be like, oh,
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: I feel like I am in the right company for me.
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: Processes that enforce their values and enforce you know, who
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: they are as a company and and and provide that
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: transparency for their team so that everyone can have the autonomy, uh,
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: and confidence that they're doing their job correct. I think
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: they're all connected and strong teams and a strong people
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: management presence I think can only benefit it the outcome
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: of you know, the logistical things.
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, well, I mean so I want to expand
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: a little bit on this because you know what is
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: your You can go a little deeper here, got into
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: your kind of your approach for creating systems that fit
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: the creative mindset, Like you know, how do you observe
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: or define or refine those things? Right? What is what? What?
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: What's your unique approach here? Because, like you said, the
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: vertical and these different people that you've got going on
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: there and that really fit and work with this, this
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: creative mindset and this this this business that is very
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: creative in nature.
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: M hm. Well, I guess first off is it's not
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: one size fits all for me. I'm never going to
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: come in and say this is the one program or
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: the one way that you have to organize things or
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: do things. Everyone thinks differently, everyone communicates differently, everyone likes
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: to receive and differently. So there's a wide range of
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: options that can be proposed and implemented for depending on
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: what the business is and who the business players are,
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: I think, but the base of the process remains the same,
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: which is really getting to the root of Walk me
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: through your process from start to finish, you know, and
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: break it down. Start from here, what happens next? Then
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: who's responsible for this, who's responsible for that? My job
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: is to take that information and in lifetime I'm typing madly,
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: I'm decoding, I'm saying this is connected to that. My
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: job is to take all of that data and information
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: that the owner and teams have given me and really
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: take a step back and look at it and provide
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: my suggested solutions for how they can improve their processes,
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: and that might look like enrolling them in a design
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: management program. There are some firms that are work really
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: well with the programs that are out there specific to
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: the design industry, but those can be pretty intense to onboard,
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: so it's not the best fit for everybody. It could
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: be as simple as building out templates in Google sheets
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: and then they just have, you know, a project workbook
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: template that they can use and everyone kind of knows
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: how to use it. I don't believe that programs are
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: going to be the things that fix the problem because
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: of programs just to program. Essentially, you're trying to define
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: and write and change the behavior for the team on
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: the process. And it doesn't really matter if it's a
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: Google sheet or a program. In my opinion, it's choosing
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: the best thing for that team and implementing it and
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: educating them how to use it.
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: Man, you hit on a lot of things there, Kat,
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: I'm with you. I've become what I call I call
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: system system or program agnostic. What is what? Whatever? The
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: one whatever, the one that you use regularly consistently. Great? Yeah, right,
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: But I've also learned.
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: That.
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: And I don't know if you've experienced with the creative
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: so you could, but I'm not. I'm somewhat creative. One
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: of the dangers I found in programs or is kind
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: of shiny objects in there. So like oh, let's use
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: an egal sheet, or now let's use a SAGNA, or
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: let's use to do, or let's use notion and so
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: there's an excitement about a particular program, not a process,
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: just a program that's out there or Monday dot com
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: whatever it is. Right, there's a bunch of them, so
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: it's just like, Oh, that's going to be the one.
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: Let's do that, and that's going to solve our problems.
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: Have you run into that before?
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: Oh? Absolutely, yeah, yes, And that's I guess what I
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: was trying to reference earlier is it's not the new
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: shiny program like you said, or a different version of
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: the same thing you've been using, but it has a
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: different name that's going to solve anything. If anything, you're
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: just wasting time and paying your employees to move everything
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: over and then it still sits there. So it's really
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: about getting to the root, like I said earlier, of
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: how they prefer communication. The owner might not be inputting
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: information in this like there might be one owner of
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: whatever the program or Google Street or whatever it is,
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: who manages and inputs information, and the owner can communicate
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: to their team in a different way whatever it is.
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: It's just a matter of breaking down the source of
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: that behavior and putting in place systems that will align
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: with that and ensure that they're transparent. Because I've been
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: that employee that is just trying to read everyone's mind
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: and guess what's going on because no one's told me anything.
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: And then you just feel like what am I even doing?
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: Am I even smart? Like you know, I don't get it,
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: you know, I feel so behind and everyone seems to
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: know everything but me, And I've been there, and I
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: don't want to create systems that that make a team
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: feel like that. So it's really about ensuring that whatever
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: the deciding factor is, everyone is involved and everyone has
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: a clear path of responsibility on what they're what they own.
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: That's that's again, you've hit a lot of good points there, Kat,
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: So I hear clearly, it's not that's the system. So
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: if you're thinking that's going to be your so a
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: bullet and you're just going to go buy buy a system,
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: or we're just gonna invest in that and that's going
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: to solve our problems. As much as if we'd like
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: that to be the case, it just doesn't. It isn't.
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: And that's why somebody like yourself, Kat, like having somebody
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: come in to get at the root cause and the
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: investment in something. And that's why we have the business
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: round Table podcast is like we're helping business owners understand
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: and the best Why would I invest in hiring somebody
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: like yourself, cat or myself as a coach consultant, because
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: we're going to help speed you along so you're not
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: spending a lot of time and time is really your
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: most valuable asset or time and and money of like
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: you said, try and do all these things rearranging and
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: at the end of the day saying, well, this wasn't
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: any different than we were doing six months ago. We
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: just felt like we just moved things on the chessboard
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: and nothing really actually changed, right mm hmm.
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And I and I think another point there is
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: I'm I'm not self proclaiming I'm an expert in your business,
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: you know, like I'm coming into learn and and really
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: get a feel for how this business runs and how yeah,
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: how the owner really wants their business to run, how
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: it feels when it's operating in the correct way, what's
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: the golden star there, you know, And learning from them
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: and taking that information and helping them implement it. I
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: think it's really a collaborative process. But I want them
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: to feel that, hey, you know, you have support. I'm
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: here to help I'm not just strategy and then I leave.
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: I'm strategy as commentation. I'm going to come in and,
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: you know, help you. Let's put some targets down, let's
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: figure out what this could potentially look like, and then
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna roll up my sleeves and do it with you.
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: So that's something I feel very passionate about that. I
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: want them to feel like they have someone in their corner.
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: Mm hmm. Yeah, you and I share that same value
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: and sense. Kah, because it takes time. Even if when
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: you figure out like the whole system and the process,
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: you're like, okay, we finally defined it. That's one. Just
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: getting there is a huge step, but then you actually
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: have to, like you said, implement how do we do that.
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: I was just reading an article on project management on
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: LinkedIn this week and they had a great They wrote
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: out why you should say no to certain things, all
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: very good information. I said, that's great, But then implementing
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: it is a whole other thing. It's like, you can
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: have all the things written down, right, but talk a
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: little bit about that too. I mean, you've established we've
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: got to get these processes identified, and then there's this
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: point of like, actually implementing m.
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's a matter of getting the If
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: it's a small team, it might just be the owner.
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: Some of my clients, it's just me and the owner
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: and some clients. You know, it's a small team maybe
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: five to seven people, so the owner and the managers
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: if there are other managers. I think it's a matter
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: of going back to that transparency, really laying down that Okay,
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: we're creating these processes together and it's up to them. Essentially,
• 23:22
  Speaker 2: I'm not in the office with them, so it's up
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: to themally to to roll these out. But I think
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: transparency is the main thing there because you can't expect
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: anyone to take that information and run with it and
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: enforce it if they don't exactly know why and how
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: and uh when and all of those main main quantifier absolute.
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean one of the things I work on
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: kat And is when we work in organizations and I'm
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: looking at organizational health, looking at the roles and responsibilities
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: and where are people, where their strengths and where are
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: their weaknesses. You know, some people are better at certain
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: things than other things, and so we recognize trying to
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: position them on the team. Being combilenterated the work that
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: you're doing. Like, hey, look, we've got these systems and
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: we've got these processes dialed in. Who shows up better
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: perhaps as a as a a project manager because it's
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: something I use in my world. But a project manager,
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: if you will, versus purely maybe a designer or a
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: technical person that they're doing only certain aspects of the
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: project or an element. Sometimes we ask people to do
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: certain things it's just really not in their strength that
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: the process of the system has to be completed. It
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: has to be done, but we're like we're forcing something
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: that doesn't work well, like you said, and it's like identify,
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: like who's the best people like getting a line to
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: do this work.
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I think that's a common thing that can happen
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: in small teams. Of common friction in small teams because
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: as there is that moment before the growth happens and
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: before they're ready to hire someone that's specific for once
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: one vertical that everyone is responsible for everything and when
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: it comes time to define that. I think it's important
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: to an owner included on this as well, really take
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: a look at what are the actual tasks for this business,
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: like list them all out. What is it. There's design,
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: there's had there's drafting, there's accounting, there's reconciliation, there's vendors,
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: there's client, there's biz dev there. You know, you list
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: them all out and who's gravitating towards what almost like
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: a visual exercise like, oh, this is the area that
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: I want to be responsible for. This is the area
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: I want to be responsible for. And the owner might
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: see all of these things and realize in lifetime, you know,
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: I actually want to be designing. I don't want to
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: be doing the CEO stuff. I don't want to be
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: doing the operator stuff or vice versa. They might be, Hey,
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: I actually really enjoy doing the the COO stuff. And
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: I think it's important to enforce an enforced but in
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: power those within the company to feel okay to focus
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: on their zone of genius and not just hold on
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: to tasks because you feel like you need to hold
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: on to them.
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, Well, I think the work that you're doing
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: is really important, cat because it gets muddy, like, especially
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: when you're smaller, everybody is doing everything and that works
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: for a time, but hopefully as you're scaling and growing,
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: it should be clear like this is my I like
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: that word you know, zone of genius or where I
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: best fit and I call it kind of your seventy
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: thirty like where you should the majority of your time
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: be spent. And then there's other things we all have
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: to do, you know, minimizing the things that are out
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: of what kind of de energize us if you will,
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: And I think that's that's important. But if you're not
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: clearly identifying like what you're doing, is important that the processes,
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: the steps, all these little things then because then you
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: can define, Okay, well there's a break, there's a natural
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: break here. But if it's all muddy and it's all
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: kind of like it's a puzzle, we'll just throw all
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: the pieces on the table and like you're just picking
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: these things, and what I hear you saying, Kat is
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: you're like, okay, let's say, let's say let's segment out
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: this a little bit better so then we can streamline this.
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, when things are living in the dark and there's everyone,
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: it kind of causes resentment in a way where you're like, oh,
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: that thing is not done on time, where that person
• 27:51
  Speaker 2: was supposed to do this thing, where I feel like
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: this person was supposed to do that. Who's to say
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: what it really is. If you don't actually have defined
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: it's just going to live in that murkiness and that
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: like uncertainty of this isn't my responsibility that type of thing.
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: So you really have to bring everything to the light
• 28:12
  Speaker 2: and make it transparent and start providing that responsibility and
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: ownership of Okay, this is this is my kind of
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: area or corner over here, and I can take this
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: and run with it. Yeah.
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: I think that's important to you because have you ever
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: experienced this, kat if I've seen this in organizations where yeah,
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: like you said, some people it's not my responsibility like
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: you just said, or it's not my area, or yeah,
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: people will will pick and choose or sometimes they are like,
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: well that applies to everybody else, but not for me
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: kind of a thing. It's like okay, and and and
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: and so that. Again that can cause some friction or
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: know the word toxicity if you will, but it's like Okay,
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: what's going on here? Yeah mm hmm.
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I've definitely experienced that. And I think going back
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: to everything being connected that people. You know, we're talking
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: about kind of essentially people management, hr stuff, but at
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: the same time it's also connected to business ops because
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: you know, if and when we have these roles defined,
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: we also need to put them to paper, create the
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: job descriptions, then create the processes for how do they
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: do their job? And you know, what do you do
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: in this situation? What do you do in this situation?
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: A lot of the times it doesn't even need to
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: get that granular. I feel like, especially with small creative teams,
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: like I said earlier, they know what they're doing. They
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: can intuitively pick up what the what the right thing
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: to do and win. Sometimes it's just a matter of
• 29:56
  Speaker 2: bringing that small level of clarity to a general typical
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: process to follow, a general typical way to deal with
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: clients and what their boundaries are with clients and as
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: well as the general typical roles and what they're responsible for.
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: And I think just providing that level of clarity helps
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: a lot of teams refocus and use that as a foundation.
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, though, that's huge, just getting that written down, being
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: very clear on that. I would imagine too, Kat. You know,
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: depending because on the life cycle of the business where
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: they're at the younger business, there are probably things maybe
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: you can speak to risk or things that they just
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: don't know what they don't know, right, some things of
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: exposure if like have you thought about these things and
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: they're like, I was completely clueless, how do you come
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: and help them? Like consider that? Like is that because
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: sometimes they don't even realize and like, oh, should I
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: be spending time or energy in that? I don't even know.
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there are some things that come up specifically with
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: project agreements or contract agreements. I think that's a big
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: that's a big who knows what's going on situation. And
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: it's worked for me so far and no one sued
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: me yet, So that's that's definitely something that I'm not
• 31:17
  Speaker 2: a lawyer, you know, but I do have my my
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: kind of rolodex of terms that I like to use
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: that I know for sure it is going to help
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: enforce boundaries with their clients, and it's going to help
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: protect them down the road when scope crete starts to happen,
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: when the contractor disappears, when the clients like, wait, we're
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: over budget. All of those things that you might have
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: just learned on the fly when you're starting out, but
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: you haven't implemented those lessons into your documents to help
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: prevent it from keep happening. So I think that's something
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: I see a lot of the times that I can
• 32:03
  Speaker 2: come in and help them troubleshoot and really be like,
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: what is something that has happened to you that you
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: never want to happen again and put some rules to.
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: That, right, I mean, I think it sounds to me, Kat,
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: I mean a business as I kind of I do
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: is it's to your business. I do it from the
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: people side of the side of I'm looking at kind
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: of the audit and looking at the health. To me,
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: it seems like natural, like can you come in and
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: audit their systems or processes or just identify what are there?
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: Are there? Are they there? Right? And just it says
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: so you can, like you said, there's not one size
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: fits all. So like you know, maybe maybe their sales
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: processes now then, but maybe their their delivery and communication
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: with clients is off or whatever the contracting like you said,
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: is off. So you know, what does that look like
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: for a client to engage you as far as like
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: is that something that you do is when you first
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: engage them? Because I mean, like I said, I'm a
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: creative or we're talking to business owners, maybe entrepreneurs earlier
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: in their journey. What should they be considering or looking for.
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: When they work with somebody like yourself, kat.
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: Well, I usually I'll always start with a discovery call,
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: which is complimentary and at least thirty minutes. Sometimes I'll
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: go over if we're really having a great time, and
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: in that I will ask a whole host of questions
• 33:30
  Speaker 2: to really one define why did they start this business
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: in the first place. Are there any I guess, milestones
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: or goals that they have that they are wanting to
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: make sure that they achieve. What's keeping them up at night,
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: what are the issues that they just can't seem to
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: figure out, whatever those might be. And I have them
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: walk me through very high level or process the types
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: of projects they have, you know how many concurrent projects
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: they have, their team, who's doing what, all of that
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: fun stuff, And from that call, I'm usually able to
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: assess maybe two or three targets that I think would
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: be good for them to start with, and then we
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: go from there. I am very flexible with my services
• 34:25
  Speaker 2: and how I work, so a lot of the times
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: we might start with something and then something else will
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: come up, something else more will come up, and we'll
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: switch gears, or we might tackle one major thing in
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: the first couple of months, and then you know, I'm
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: just essentially there whenever they need me, if something else
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: comes up in the future. So it really depends on
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: what their needs are, and I try really hard to
• 34:54
  Speaker 2: adjust my pacing and my timing and my suggestion to
• 35:00
  Speaker 2: align with their business flow and what they need.
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: No, I love that, you know, I have a very
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: similar approach. I think is very complimentary in that, you know,
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: finding out what they're at. I would imagine too. You know,
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: this is for any business, but building it's about building
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: a relationship, right because you have got probably some strong
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: personalities and you have to find out is this is
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: this is a good fit for both of you? Right,
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: Is this going to be a good because I'm sure
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: there may be other people that just as as a
• 35:28
  Speaker 1: coach consultant myself, I do my best to give guidance
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: and support and ask them the questions. And some people
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: are unfortunately not as coachable as I like them to be.
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: But I can't force somebody, you know, and it's sometime,
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: you know, finding that client right and thinking that it's
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: a good match.
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm a pretty authentic, genuine person. I would say
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: I want to be able to laugh when things go wrong.
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: I think that's a big thing for me. So having
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: just a sense of humility, I think goes a long way.
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: I will say, if someone's coming to me to ask
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: for help, there's already a level there. They already know
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: they need help, and that's vulnerable. That's that's coming to
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: someone and saying, hey, I built this, this is my baby,
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: and there's something wrong with it. Please help me. So
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: already they're coming to me from a vulnerable place. So
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: I really step into the role of being supportive, being warm,
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: being friendly, making them feel comfortable with me, and I
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: never want them to feel judged. I'm never going to
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: judge them for whatever situation or stage that they're in.
• 36:38
  Speaker 2: So it's like, we're in this together. Let's roll up barsleaves,
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: let's get it done and laugh about it.
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: That no. I mean, I'm again when we connected and
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: when we were talking about coming on the podcast, because
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: I knew that we all have the same values of
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: we're advocating for our clients. We're not there. If you're
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: ever working with any kind of business, hopefully anybody is
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: listening and they're making you feel dumb or making you
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: feel like you're an idiot or something. Don't don't be
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: working with us, fathers. There's other people like cat here
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: or myself that would love to come alongside and be
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: rooting for your success. Right, yeah, you know, it's it's
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: very difficult to run a business in today's age, and
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: we're both here in southern California and it's a challenging environment.
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: So we want to go further together, right.
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: I agree. I I one hundred percent agree with that.
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: I don't believe in gatekeeping or you know it. There's
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: enough for everyone to go around and uh, you know,
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: the more we share, the more we all grow. So
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: I'm I'm definitely on that boat.
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: Oh man, we can definitely go further here, cat, but
• 37:40
  Speaker 1: maybe just you know, as we're wrapping up the episode
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: this today, you know, what would you what would you
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: have a bit of advice would you give to the
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: business owner? The person's just at this moment, they're just
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: feeling disorganized, it's a bit chaotic. You know, what would
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: you just encourage them to do? They don't you know
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: the next step we just say, hey, look, you know,
• 37:59
  Speaker 1: I know you're filling a little stressed, overwhelmed. What would
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: you what words of wisdom would you impart to them?
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: I think thoughts can get muddy and stress definitely contributes
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: to that. So I would suggest spend the next week
• 38:18
  Speaker 2: or you know, a couple of days or a couple
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: of weeks, have a post it or a notes thing
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: on their computer and just start tracking it and see
• 38:29
  Speaker 2: what patterns come up.
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I think that's I think just you know, brainstorming.
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: And then how do they read? How do they reach
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: you can? Cat? How how do folks get ahold of you?
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: Because if they've got questions they want to discovery call.
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: What's the best way to get ahold of you?
• 38:46
  Speaker 2: You can find me on my website, which is katonco
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: dot org spelled out k A t A n d
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: Coco dot org.
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: We're gonna put it. We're gonna put in the show
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: notes too, so it's all good.
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: I forgot how to spell for a second.
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: We're super glad to have you here, Cat, because what
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: you're doing is so important, putting these processes together as
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: systems and helping business owners, whether creatives or otherwise, and
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: in writing synergy together. That's why I brought Kat here
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: on here because you know, I love people processes together.
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: We need all of these things to be running successful
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: visit business, and that as you make this leadershift shift,
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: you can really be much more impactful and have greater
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: influence with your employees than the clients. I'm so grateful
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: to have you here, Kat, thanks so much for being
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: on the podcast.
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: Thank you David for the platform and the opportunity. I
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: really appreciate it.
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: My pleasure, my pleasure. Thanks everybody for listening. Until next time,
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: Take care everybody. Thanks for joining us on the Business
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: Roundtable podcast