Latest / The You Project / #1964 A Doctor Who Talks Sh*t - Dr. Sabine Hazan

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#1964 A Doctor Who Talks Sh*t - Dr. Sabine Hazan · The You Project

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: I get a team. It's a you project.
• 0:01
  Speaker 2: It's Tiffany and Cook, it's Craig Anthony Harper, and it's
• 0:04
  Speaker 2: the doc.
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: We'll introduce her in a moment tif Hi, Top of
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: the Morning, Harps, Top of the morning.
• 0:10
  Speaker 3: To you.
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  Speaker 2: It's five past seven in the thriving metropolis of Melbourne.
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: It's a Tuesday. I've got my radio voice backer. Why
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: do I do that? Shit, don't do that.
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: It's a podcast. It raises me up.
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  Speaker 4: I'll quite like it.
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  Speaker 2: Actually, just talk like a regular human. There's no station ideas.
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  Speaker 2: There's no time checks, there's no weather checks, and there's
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  Speaker 2: no upcoming announcements of what's on after the news.
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  Speaker 1: There's none of that.
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  Speaker 2: There's just you and me and clever people, cleverer people
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  Speaker 2: than you and I every day, which is not a
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  Speaker 2: high watermark to meet, is it right?
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  Speaker 1: Really? No? No, but that's all right. We're nice. Well
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  Speaker 1: you're pretty high watermark.
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  Speaker 4: You're almost a doctor. This to be No, you're almost
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  Speaker 4: a doctor.
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  Speaker 2: Now I'm a doctor. At like, even when i'm a doctor,
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: I'm not really a doctor. It's like, you know, Hi, Sabine,
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: welcome to the Youth Project.
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  Speaker 4: Thank you, thank you for having me.
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  Speaker 1: Wow, we love to have you.
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  Speaker 2: I had a look at you yesterday and I read
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  Speaker 2: about you, and I watched you on some YouTube stuff
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  Speaker 2: and I listened to you, and you're quite clever, So congratulate.
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  Speaker 2: I'm being a smarty pants.
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  Speaker 3: I just ask a lot of questions. I don't know
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  Speaker 3: if I'm clever. I'm just I like to play detective.
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  Speaker 3: I ask a lot of questions.
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  Speaker 1: And you did.
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  Speaker 2: As you and I were talking about three minutes ago.
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  Speaker 2: I wrote a book with fuck on the front cover,
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  Speaker 2: which is fine, I will say it was. It was
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  Speaker 2: before Mark Manson's fuck book. I just want to say that.
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: And you wrote a book with shit on the front cover,
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  Speaker 2: which you were sharing with us that and your book.
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  Speaker 1: Was called, of course, let's talk shit hucking. When I
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  Speaker 1: read that, when I think I like her, I think
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  Speaker 1: I like her.
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  Speaker 3: I'm in the shit business, right, so I'm trying to
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  Speaker 3: make sense of all this shit. And basically, I said,
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  Speaker 3: if I wrote it like, let's talk about it, right.
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  Speaker 3: Let's not talk micro biome because that's too nice. Let's
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  Speaker 3: just call it what it is. Let's talk shit. And
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  Speaker 3: I said, look, if I was, if I'm full of shit,
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  Speaker 3: or if I know my shit, let's talk about it
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  Speaker 3: either way, one hundred percent.
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  Speaker 2: Why do you think that we are like My background is,
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  Speaker 2: for a long time I set up the first personal
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  Speaker 2: training center in Australia. So for a long time I
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  Speaker 2: was training people humans, thousands of humans right for decades.
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  Speaker 2: And so you know, I'm talking about bums or as
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  Speaker 2: you would say, asses, and legs and calories and micros
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  Speaker 2: and macros, and menopause and perimenopause and shitting and constipation
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  Speaker 2: and andropause and physical, mental, emotional, social health and the
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  Speaker 2: myriad of variables that make us feel good.
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  Speaker 1: Or in the middle.
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  Speaker 2: And so I spent my life a lot of my
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  Speaker 2: life talking about stuff that people don't talk about too
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  Speaker 2: much publicly.
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  Speaker 1: So I'm used to talking about all this stuff.
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  Speaker 2: But it feels like as soon as out in the
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  Speaker 2: public forum you talk about pooing or shitting or having
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  Speaker 2: a bowel movement, that it's a thing that everyone in
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  Speaker 2: the world does, let's not talk about it.
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  Speaker 1: What is that about?
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  Speaker 3: And by the way, that's something everybody's obsessed about, you know.
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  Speaker 3: As a gas gentrologist, I cannot tell you how many
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  Speaker 3: people have sent me pictures of their poop, have talked
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  Speaker 3: to me about their poop? Have you know, explained to
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  Speaker 3: me all the details about it? Everybody's obsessed about it, right, so,
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  Speaker 3: you know, and it's it's an obsession that we need
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  Speaker 3: to understand.
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  Speaker 4: Maybe there's secrets in that poop.
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  Speaker 3: Maybe we all have a gut feeling that there's secrets
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  Speaker 3: in it, you know, Maybe that's our launcher. Maybe we
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  Speaker 3: need to understand it. Maybe the secret of staying living
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  Speaker 3: longer is in the poop.
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  Speaker 2: Well, if you give me your digits, I'll send you
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  Speaker 2: a nice photo after the after the show.
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  Speaker 1: Now I won't.
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  Speaker 2: I wouldn't do that, all right, So give give my
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  Speaker 2: audience a quick snapshot of rather than me read a
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  Speaker 2: bio or you know, mislead people, just tell us who
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  Speaker 2: you are, what you do, and how you got to
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  Speaker 2: be where you're at in terms of your work and
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  Speaker 2: your research and your curiosity and the education of the
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  Speaker 2: masses that you're at today.
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  Speaker 3: I'm basically the girl that started with a question when
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  Speaker 3: I was little, where do we go after we die?
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  Speaker 3: And I went into medicine to understand that simple process,
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  Speaker 3: which is not so simple medicine. Did you know I
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  Speaker 3: was obsessed with asking patients, you know, where do what
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  Speaker 3: happened when you died for about a second and then
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  Speaker 3: we resuscitated you. You know, medicine didn't really guide me
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  Speaker 3: very well into that answering that question, and somewhere along
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  Speaker 3: the line, I kind of lost interest of that question
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  Speaker 3: and started treating patients. And I was always the girl
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  Speaker 3: that was basically wanting what's on the cutting edge, Like
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  Speaker 3: you have chrons. I don't care what's in the guidelines.
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  Speaker 3: I want to know what's the newest thing for my patients.
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  Speaker 3: So I was the girl that was bringing clinical trials
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  Speaker 3: for pharma. I was, you know, one could say, in
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  Speaker 3: bed with pharmaceutical companies, you know, testing their products one
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  Speaker 3: after the other. I was known as the Queen of
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  Speaker 3: seed dip. Seed dip is a bacteria that basically people
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  Speaker 3: get from taking a lot of antibiotics and gives them diarrhea.
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  Speaker 4: And I would.
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  Speaker 3: Recruit a lot of patients with that condition with the
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  Speaker 3: intent of doing a procedure called fecal transplant in case
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  Speaker 3: those products didn't work. So I would try the newest
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  Speaker 3: product of pharma, and if it didn't work, I would
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  Speaker 3: use the money from pharma from the clinical trial to
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  Speaker 3: put my patients through fecal transplant. When fecal trans plan
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  Speaker 3: started showing a lot of other things improving, you know,
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  Speaker 3: Alzheimer's improving one case in me with me in a
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  Speaker 3: patient two cases of alopecia areata with Collin Kelly, et cetera,
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  Speaker 3: et cetera. I started asking the question, what is in
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  Speaker 3: the stools that's changing the microboma and changing the disease,
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  Speaker 3: even if it's for an end of one right, And
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  Speaker 3: then when capsules of poop came on my desk as
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  Speaker 3: a clinical trial, I went completely rogue because I said,
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  Speaker 3: wait a minute, we're in the ship business and we
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  Speaker 3: have no idea what the hell we're doing. What kind
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  Speaker 3: of research is that? What kind of science is that?
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  Speaker 3: We're just here to sell products like and what makes
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  Speaker 3: the poop of a kid from Mit the right poop
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  Speaker 3: to give to my poor little frail lady from California,
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  Speaker 3: you know? And is the microbauma of a person from
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  Speaker 3: Mexico good to give to a person from Japan?
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  Speaker 4: And all these questions.
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  Speaker 3: And then as I got into the microbiome, I had
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  Speaker 3: even more questions. And then here we are. I'm here
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  Speaker 3: to try to find answers of a you know, a huge,
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  Speaker 3: huge curiosity. So I went from being a gastr entrologist
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  Speaker 3: to CEO of a company that did clinical trials for pharma,
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  Speaker 3: where we did over three hundred clinical trials, two basically
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  Speaker 3: leading the microboom research where we found we were the
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  Speaker 3: first lab that found COVID in the stools, which got
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  Speaker 3: our government to look at the septic tanks and basically
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  Speaker 3: from there we discovered biffetobacteria, this important microbe that helps,
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  Speaker 3: you know, breakdown sugar is disappearing in a lot of diseases.
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  Speaker 3: And so from there, how do we increase it? How
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  Speaker 3: do we decrease it? You know, what decreases it? What
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  Speaker 3: increases it? What are the microbes play a role in it?
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  Speaker 3: What are the microbombs doing, What are the microbes doing
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  Speaker 3: in the gut?
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  Speaker 4: And how do we get to the level of having.
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  Speaker 3: Increase Parkinson's, Alzheimer's, cancer, autism, mental health? Is it all
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  Speaker 3: because we're messing up our guts?
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  Speaker 4: And here we are, and.
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  Speaker 2: I mean, obviously everything's still a work in progress, still
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  Speaker 2: research still a long way to go, but we know
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  Speaker 2: we know more than we did than It's like all science,
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  Speaker 2: it's evolving, And what are your and This is not
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  Speaker 2: you throwing your reputation on the line, but like, what
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  Speaker 2: do you think the Like what do you hope might
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  Speaker 2: happen in.
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  Speaker 1: The next five, ten, twenty years in this area?
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  Speaker 2: What do you what's your kind of intuition and feeling
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  Speaker 2: on top of also of course your research, Like what
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  Speaker 2: do you think we might be able to do but
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  Speaker 2: create achieve heading down this path.
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  Speaker 3: I think we're going to I think we're going to
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  Speaker 3: realize that we've been killing too much. I think the microbiome,
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  Speaker 3: you know, the idea idea of microbes causing disease is
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  Speaker 3: one path, but also the microbes that we're killing in
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  Speaker 3: order to kill those microbes that killed that start the
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  Speaker 3: disease is the second path. We're to start paying attention
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  Speaker 3: to the microbes we're killing because the microbes that we're killing.
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  Speaker 1: You know, have.
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  Speaker 4: A role.
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  Speaker 3: You know, when we're you know, breaking down sugar. When
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  Speaker 3: we're breaking down you know, when we're absorbing iron, when
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  Speaker 3: we're absorbing calcium, when we're absorbing sugar, there's microbes that
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  Speaker 3: play there.
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  Speaker 4: Which microbes How did we lose it? How do we
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  Speaker 4: gain them back? You know, when you start looking at
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  Speaker 4: the population and you start.
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  Speaker 3: Seeing there's a group of there's a group of patients
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  Speaker 3: with Alzheimer's that are lacking these microbes, and then there's
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  Speaker 3: a population that is healthy or at least deemed healthy that.
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  Speaker 4: Have those microbes.
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  Speaker 3: How do we, you know, correlate all that, you know,
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  Speaker 3: how do we put all that together? So I think
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  Speaker 3: there's gonna be a lot more people asking questions. I
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  Speaker 3: think there's gonna be you know, I think with AI,
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  Speaker 3: AI is going to help us.
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  Speaker 4: And hurt us in a way.
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  Speaker 3: But for those that are critically critical thinkers, they're going
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  Speaker 3: to know how to use AI to speed them up.
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  Speaker 4: In other words, use your brain.
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  Speaker 3: Don't do the the crap work, like the whole write.
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  Speaker 4: Up of I and D.
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  Speaker 3: In my case, you know, when I submit submissions to
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  Speaker 3: the FDA, you have to do like thirty page document
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  Speaker 3: of I and D. Have AI do it for you,
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  Speaker 3: because that's time consuming. Start using your brain more to
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  Speaker 3: go to the next level. So I think I think
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  Speaker 3: there's gonna be an increase in utilizing our brain cells
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  Speaker 3: to reach areas that are that we're not touched or
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  Speaker 3: not thought of. You know, we have the ability now
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  Speaker 3: with the technology.
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: I think it allows you to use your to put
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  Speaker 2: to make the best use of your brain, you know,
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  Speaker 2: not filling out those thirty pages. It's like you can
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  Speaker 2: do the reveal, thinking, creating, problem solving.
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  Speaker 4: That's right.
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  Speaker 3: That's our gift as humans is not to be robots.
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  Speaker 1: Right.
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  Speaker 3: So I kind of got bored of the whole GI
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  Speaker 3: field in a way because I was a robot. I
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  Speaker 3: was doing one kronoscopy after another, and then even clinical trials,
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  Speaker 3: I was doing one clinical trial after another.
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  Speaker 4: You know, we're meant to do bigger things as humans.
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  Speaker 3: I think we're meant to innovate, and I think AI
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  Speaker 3: is going to allow us to innovate, to push that
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  Speaker 3: that narrative a little bit to a different level.
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  Speaker 2: Well, in what regard facal transplants or po transplants held
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  Speaker 2: by the mainstream medical community right now, is it did?
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  Speaker 2: I think it's bullshit that I think it's emerging science today.
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  Speaker 3: So there's the community is divided, right because they understand
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  Speaker 3: it's all research. So you know, all research needs to
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  Speaker 3: be valid, verified and reproducible. So when doctor Tom Barotti
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  Speaker 3: in Australia says I've cured twenty eight patients with fecal transplant,
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  Speaker 3: the rest of the GI community is like, oh well,
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  Speaker 3: let me try doing.
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  Speaker 4: Fecal transplant for Crons disease. Wait a minute, I'm not
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  Speaker 4: improving patients with Crohn's disease.
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  Speaker 3: Right, So then that becomes what is doctor Baroti doing
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  Speaker 3: on Australia that doctor Jones in New York is not doing?
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  Speaker 3: That reaches that improvement right, and that's where they both
• 12:49
  Speaker 3: must have the same exact protocol to be reproduced.
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  Speaker 4: So unfortunately, until there is.
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  Speaker 3: You know, when we when doctor Einsman in nineteen fifty
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  Speaker 3: eight set himself out to take stools and give it
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  Speaker 3: to two patients to see this by enema, he just
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  Speaker 3: probably had a gut feeling. You know, he knew that
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  Speaker 3: if you go back to fifth century China, the Chinese
• 13:12
  Speaker 3: were giving you know, poop, you know, the yellow soup
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  Speaker 3: to the patients to improve polera.
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  Speaker 4: Right. So what probably happened with Einsman.
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  Speaker 3: Is he said, hey, why don't I these people are
• 13:25
  Speaker 3: dying because you know, we as doctors, when we have
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  Speaker 3: a patient and they're dying, we try everything.
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  Speaker 4: Right.
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  Speaker 3: That's the art of innovation, as the art of medicines.
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  Speaker 3: That gut feeling of like hmm, let me give this.
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: Let me.
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  Speaker 4: It's like that recipe.
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  Speaker 3: You're a chef in the kitchen and you're basically saying,
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: let me put some salt, let me put some cumin,
• 13:44
  Speaker 3: let me put some turmeric.
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  Speaker 4: Let me bring this meal that's going to be delicious. Right.
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  Speaker 4: So it's the same thing with medicine.
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  Speaker 3: It's kind of like figuring out how to use drugs
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  Speaker 3: off label to achieve improvement, and you don't want to
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  Speaker 3: let the patient die, so that's why you go into
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: the field, right. So innovation is a big part of medicine.
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  Speaker 3: So doctor Einsman when he started with nineteen in nineteen
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  Speaker 3: fifty eight with his two cases, it took sixty two
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  Speaker 3: years for fecal transplant to be part of the guidelines.
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: That's how long it took. So you can imagine that
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: in nineteen fifty eight, when doctor Einsman said, Hey, I'm
• 14:26
  Speaker 3: coming out with fecal transplant for see this, the community
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: was probably going, is he crazy? Who's going to play
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: with poop? Are we even mad to think about that?
• 14:39
  Speaker 3: You know, because there's a lot of questions that happen,
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: right like what poop, what's in poop? Are we risking
• 14:45
  Speaker 3: the life?
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: Et cetera.
• 14:46
  Speaker 3: So where's the GI community. Well, I think the gr
• 14:49
  Speaker 3: community wants to see this happening.
• 14:53
  Speaker 4: I just think that.
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  Speaker 3: They're cautious because there's a trillion microbes out there and
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: we barely touch the surface of the microbiome. Look, I'm
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: in the same situation right before. When I started working
• 15:06
  Speaker 3: with doctor Barotti, and he's the father of fecal transplant. Essentially,
• 15:10
  Speaker 3: he took doctor Einsman's work and decided to do it
• 15:13
  Speaker 3: on a larger scale. And when I started working with him,
• 15:18
  Speaker 3: it was because I had improved two cases of Crohn's disease.
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: And I remember doctor Neil Stolman who basically introduced that
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: at the American College of gastro and said, doctor BARROTI
• 15:30
  Speaker 3: do you know doctor Hays And she also improved Crohn's
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: disease in two of her patients. So he was just
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: delighted that somebody was reproducing his data.
• 15:39
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: But when I started talking to him, he kept saying
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: to me, you'll see fecal transplant with autism. Be ready,
• 15:45
  Speaker 3: be ready, And I was like, I'm not going to
• 15:49
  Speaker 3: see kids with autism.
• 15:50
  Speaker 4: I'm an adult gastrentrologist.
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: And then doctor Adams came out with his data, the
• 15:56
  Speaker 3: initial data that basically showed fecal transplant helped eighteen fifty
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: percent of his kids with autism that he had done
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: on the study. It was like eighteen patients and nine
• 16:06
  Speaker 3: of them improved with fecal transplant, and he showcased this
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: case of a kid that was basically verbal and back
• 16:12
  Speaker 3: to the normal.
• 16:13
  Speaker 4: Right.
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  Speaker 3: And then that moment, kids with autism started coming in
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  Speaker 3: my office. And the first thing I did was submit
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  Speaker 3: an I and D to the FDA because I wanted
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: to see the data. I didn't trust, you know, others.
• 16:31
  Speaker 3: I wanted to see it for myself. When I saw
• 16:35
  Speaker 3: a seventeen year old who then became nineteen twenty years old,
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: when I did nineteen year old, when I did him
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  Speaker 3: improve his speech with fecal transplant, become calmer with fecal transplant,
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  Speaker 3: I knew there was something to this, and I knew
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  Speaker 3: it needed to be more. And so that's how it starts.
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  Speaker 3: You get hooked on something. You see something, and you
• 17:00
  Speaker 3: want to see more and you want to know more,
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: and then you get hooked and then it takes over
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  Speaker 3: your life.
• 17:05
  Speaker 4: And here we are.
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  Speaker 1: It's bunny amazing.
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  Speaker 2: It's also I read something about some identical autistic twins
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: who are both nonverbal and aggressive and lacking is it biffitol,
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: bacterium or something at Bislin.
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: So that case has come Yeah, that case is coming
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: out at the American collegere of Gastro and publishing it.
• 17:29
  Speaker 3: And these two identical twins have the exact same microbes,
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: and those microbes disappeared, and then the good microbes started
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: climbing up exactly resuming speech. And now nine months later
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  Speaker 3: they're fully verbal, fully non aggressive. I don't even think
• 17:47
  Speaker 3: you can call them autistic anymore.
• 17:49
  Speaker 4: But the amazing thing is seeing.
• 17:52
  Speaker 3: The microbes that were the culprit of their autism at
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: the beginning in both identical you know, out of trillions
• 18:00
  Speaker 3: of microbes, to pick up in two separate stool samples,
• 18:05
  Speaker 3: taking at different times and analyze at different times, to
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: find the three identical microbes on both a DNA platform
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: which is basically looking at dead or live microbes, and
• 18:20
  Speaker 3: then reproducing that in an RNA PI platform, which is
• 18:23
  Speaker 3: just the live microbes in two identical twins is just
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: unbelievable because it puts the whole field of.
• 18:30
  Speaker 4: Autism to start.
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: We need to start paying attention to the microbiome in
• 18:37
  Speaker 3: kids with autism, and more importantly, we need to pay
• 18:40
  Speaker 3: attention to what are we doing to destroy that microbiome
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: that these kids are autistic and aggressive and nonverbal. We're
• 18:48
  Speaker 3: not talking about the spectrum that you know ADHD here,
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: we're talking about nonverbal, aggressive kids that are banging their
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: head on the wall and have to wear a hum
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: it to stay alive. That's what we're talking about.
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: Wow, that's incredible.
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: And so now both of those twins speak, they're not aggressive,
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: and they're fully fun.
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: They're doing they're doing amazing, they're reading books, they're going
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: to school.
• 19:15
  Speaker 4: The mom is above and beyond.
• 19:18
  Speaker 3: So we want to you know, obviously these cases, you know,
• 19:21
  Speaker 3: because everybody's asking me, oh, can we see So I
• 19:24
  Speaker 3: took a video and I kind of like removed the
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: face of the child to kind of showcase the speech.
• 19:30
  Speaker 4: But you know, you want to say, you don't want
• 19:32
  Speaker 4: to put these kids in the limelight. You want to
• 19:34
  Speaker 4: keep them growing nicely.
• 19:36
  Speaker 3: You don't want to make you know, there's so much
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: anger out there, there's so much corruption out there, especially
• 19:44
  Speaker 3: in the field of autism.
• 19:45
  Speaker 4: I feel because there's.
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: So many people blaming so many things with autism, and
• 19:51
  Speaker 3: there's such a business that developed with autism too that
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: unfortunately it's very hot out there and these poor kids
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: are caught in between.
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: How wide if it older, you open the door in
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: terms of nutrition and doughtry habits, because of course that
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: has an extreme impact on the micro bio So to
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: what if.
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: You don't control If you don't control the nutrition, the vitamins,
• 20:22
  Speaker 3: the quality of the vitamins there, everything, the environment, the mold, everything,
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: you might as well do a thousand fegal transplant. You're
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: never going to achieve all that. You're never going to
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: achieve improvement. Part of the reason that there's no reproducibility
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: in the field of fecal transplant is because doctors are
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: doing fecal transplant, they're using a donor that they believe
• 20:44
  Speaker 3: is the right donor for the patient. But then they
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: don't discuss what needs to be stopped at the clinic level.
• 20:52
  Speaker 3: They don't discuss all the environmental checks that you need
• 20:56
  Speaker 3: to do to make sure your house doesn't have mold,
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: to make sure sure your kid is not eating some
• 21:02
  Speaker 3: vitamins with arsenic in there. There's so much work that
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: needs to be done to restore the microbiome properly, and
• 21:10
  Speaker 3: so yes, you can put stools in there, but if
• 21:13
  Speaker 3: you go back to a diet of garbage and you're
• 21:17
  Speaker 3: killing your microbiome, what's the point. You know, it's like
• 21:20
  Speaker 3: taking antibiotics right after giving right after giving a new microbiome.
• 21:26
  Speaker 4: You know you're killing the microbiome.
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: This is probably a dumb question, but it's definitely not
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: my area. So how do we how do we identify
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: what microbes are lacking?
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: Or how do we assess somebody's microbe biome? Like what
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: is that you just take a facal examine the examine
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: their pooh, or how does that happen?
• 21:49
  Speaker 3: So I'll tell you you know what happened to me.
• 21:51
  Speaker 3: I was seeing these successes in the field of medicine,
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: these end of ones, and I wanted to see the microbiome.
• 21:58
  Speaker 3: And I started utilizing all the labs that are out
• 22:01
  Speaker 3: there consumer products right, And what I discovered was when
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: I was testing the microbiome with those labs, I would
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: always send like two samples of the same stool that
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: I mixed in and homogenized, and then I would get
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: two different results. In one I would have an overgrowth
• 22:22
  Speaker 3: of a certain microbe and another one I would have
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: an overgrowth of another microbe. And then when I looked
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: at that, I go, well, which one is it? I mean,
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: how can I put my money on one or the other?
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 22:33
  Speaker 3: So I realized early on in the field that the
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: whole genetic sequencing of stool testing was just flawed.
• 22:41
  Speaker 4: And I actually spoke about.
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: It in twenty nineteen at the Microbiome Congress in Washington, DC,
• 22:48
  Speaker 3: because I said, what are we looking at here if
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: we can't even validate and we have two different samples,
• 22:54
  Speaker 3: we're comparing apples and oranges. And here's the bigger problem.
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: Everybody's different. So the girl from Venezuela that drinks water
• 23:02
  Speaker 3: from the river and has giardia in her stools and
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: is healthy.
• 23:08
  Speaker 4: You know, she's in her environment. Giardia is healthy for her.
• 23:12
  Speaker 3: But the girl in America that goes to Mexico and
• 23:15
  Speaker 3: drinks water gets giardia and gets diarrhea. I have to
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: treat that because unfortunately, in she's not developed a resilience
• 23:23
  Speaker 3: for giardia.
• 23:25
  Speaker 4: So that's when you.
• 23:26
  Speaker 3: Start realizing there's a difference in the microbiome. So if
• 23:31
  Speaker 3: there's a difference, how do you compare? How do you
• 23:34
  Speaker 3: test if you can't even get the same stool samples
• 23:38
  Speaker 3: to match.
• 23:38
  Speaker 4: So I basically created my own lab, my own genetic lab.
• 23:42
  Speaker 3: I'm actually very fortunate to have this genetic sequencing lab
• 23:45
  Speaker 3: because I really believe it kind of saved me, saved
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: me from COVID because I was testing. You know, we
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: all have a scientist a hypothesis, right, we all.
• 23:57
  Speaker 4: You know, some.
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: People believe in this drug, and some people believe in
• 24:00
  Speaker 3: this tea cell, and I believe in the power of
• 24:03
  Speaker 3: the bifidobacteria. Right, I'm all about save the bit of biffodobacteria. Right,
• 24:08
  Speaker 3: Because during COVID, I discovered that loss of bifidobacteria was
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: linked with COVID, severe COVID, with long COVID, with autism,
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: with Alzheimer's, with line disease, with Crohn's disease, with invasive cancer.
• 24:24
  Speaker 3: So bifitdobacteria became this bug that I just like followed, right,
• 24:29
  Speaker 3: And so I was testing my stools, right, I was
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: testing my bifito bacteria throughout the pandemic. I learned a lot.
• 24:37
  Speaker 3: So what we did in our lab is we took
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: the technology that's out there, but we made it valid, verified,
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: and reproducible. In other words, if I test my stools
• 24:47
  Speaker 3: today tomorrow, if I don't, if I do the same
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: thing like I eat my you know, my malbatoast and
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: my Creatures cream cheese in the morning, and my yogurt
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: and my tuna whatever, you know, diet, same diet, same day,
• 24:59
  Speaker 3: every day days, and my microbiome doesn't change, I should
• 25:03
  Speaker 3: see the same exact poop.
• 25:05
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 25:06
  Speaker 3: The other thing is we go super deep into the microbiome.
• 25:09
  Speaker 3: So we're not looking at what you ate last night
• 25:11
  Speaker 3: for breakfast, for dinner. We're looking at what's living in
• 25:15
  Speaker 3: your gut, okay, because that really is what's telling us
• 25:19
  Speaker 3: a story. Now, could we be better? Could we be
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: improving our technology? Of course, that's why it's a research lab.
• 25:28
  Speaker 3: So we are a genetic sequencing lab that's research, and
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: we have a foundation that's a nonprofit that basically helps.
• 25:36
  Speaker 4: Us do studies.
• 25:37
  Speaker 3: When we want to analyze sixty samples of Parkinson's and
• 25:40
  Speaker 3: we have to do a bioinformatics pipeline, we have a
• 25:43
  Speaker 3: foundation that basically supports you know, these studies. So essentially
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: that's what So we do genetic sequencing, and we've seen
• 25:55
  Speaker 3: some things we've seen that vitamin C increases biffito bacteria. Yeah,
• 26:00
  Speaker 3: so we tested patients before and after and we noticed
• 26:04
  Speaker 3: vitamin C. Now, you and I know when you have
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: a call, the first thing you go to is your
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: vitamin C. Right, and we also know that vitamin C
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: has had great reviews over the years. This is not
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: something that's you know, basically of you know, it's not
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: a new thing. It's something that we've known about it. Right,
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: when you see the data that vitamin C increases bifitrobactery
• 26:32
  Speaker 3: in vitro and then you can reproduce it in humans.
• 26:36
  Speaker 4: In a clinical picture, you know you're on the right path.
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: You know your lab is validated because it's reproducing what
• 26:43
  Speaker 3: you're showing. When you are showing two identical twins with
• 26:48
  Speaker 3: the same exact microbes and you're showing that you improve
• 26:54
  Speaker 3: the microbiome of these kids and that microbe those microbes disappear,
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: that's a validated assay.
• 27:01
  Speaker 4: That's how we look at the microbiome.
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: So how do we it's basically forensic medicine of the
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: microbiome to basically say this is what you should have,
• 27:11
  Speaker 3: this is what you're lacking. Now, it's not very easy
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: because there's different genetics, different populations. So I tend to
• 27:18
  Speaker 3: look at the microbiome of families. So I'll go to
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: Venezuela and I'll say, you know, yes, you want me
• 27:25
  Speaker 3: to treat your kid with autism, but let me look
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: at the family.
• 27:29
  Speaker 4: What does the family look like?
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: Because if I look at the kid and I see
• 27:32
  Speaker 3: he's got giardia, for example, I'm going to think, well,
• 27:35
  Speaker 3: that's the giardia causing his autism, but not necessarily because
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: everybody in the family may have giardia, so that's not
• 27:41
  Speaker 3: his microbe that's out of balance. So it's really doing
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: forensics of the gut to basically understand the microbiome and
• 27:50
  Speaker 3: then from there determine what's overgrown, what's elevated, that's above
• 27:55
  Speaker 3: and beyond, and then what's lost above and beyond, and
• 28:00
  Speaker 3: then from there trying to readjust that balance, you know,
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: get back into a balance, try different things. But now
• 28:09
  Speaker 3: we have an assay that can tell us even though
• 28:12
  Speaker 3: it's a research tool, it can tell us yes, this improved,
• 28:17
  Speaker 3: this didn't improve. So it's a fascinating field. It's all research.
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: I work with a lot of doctors who practice the
• 28:25
  Speaker 3: art of medicine and who basically, you know, give a
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: lot of different things, and they'll test their patients before
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: and after and they'll say, sabbe and I'm sending you
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: a stool sample, and then we look at the tool
• 28:36
  Speaker 3: sample before and after together and if we see something interesting,
• 28:39
  Speaker 3: then we do more patients and then we get to
• 28:43
  Speaker 3: see what happens there, right, and then we get to
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: come out with a great paper, like the vitamin C
• 28:48
  Speaker 3: increases the biffito bacteria.
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: You're not excited about this stuff at all?
• 28:54
  Speaker 3: Are you?
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: Not?
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: At all?
• 28:56
  Speaker 4: It's really not.
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: It doesn't show, it doesn't show.
• 29:00
  Speaker 4: It's like, I'll tell you what I'm more. I'll tell
• 29:03
  Speaker 4: you what I'm more excited about.
• 29:05
  Speaker 3: This is all you know, this is great clinical I'm
• 29:08
  Speaker 3: more excited. I'm doing a expedition in the Amazon jungle
• 29:13
  Speaker 3: in February, and we're gonna be documenting the whole thing.
• 29:17
  Speaker 3: But I'm more excited about like collecting the stools, the soil,
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: the microbes, finding microbes, collecting the stools of the animals
• 29:26
  Speaker 3: in the Amazon jungle, collecting the soil, finding microbes.
• 29:30
  Speaker 4: That are new. That's what I'm more excited about.
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: I'm not sure how well, I'm not sure how how
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: well received the Hey, could you pooh into this bag
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: for me?
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: For the locals. You know, I'm doctor Sabine, can have
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: some shit.
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: I'm gonna collect what's already dropped in the soil.
• 29:52
  Speaker 4: I'm gonna go, you know I I do that.
• 29:55
  Speaker 3: By the way, I have I have coyotes and mountain
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: lions in my backyard, so they always.
• 29:59
  Speaker 4: Leave me these little gifts.
• 30:01
  Speaker 3: So I always collect the stools of the coyote and
• 30:04
  Speaker 3: the mountain lion. And my staff is really funny because
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: they got doctor hees. And you know, these stool samples
• 30:10
  Speaker 3: are very expensive. You're just spending like two grand on
• 30:13
  Speaker 3: a coyote poop? Is that really what you should be doing?
• 30:16
  Speaker 3: And basically, here we are, what can we do?
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: Here we are?
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: You know what's it's interesting because of many reasons, but
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: like you're at the coal face of personalized medicine. Because
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: you know, when you think about when people rock up
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: to a doctor and they go, you know, I've got
• 30:36
  Speaker 2: this pain or that pain. I say, all right, we'll
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: start you on one hundred milligrams of that and then
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: we'll see how it goes. It's all very kind of
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: well you've got arthreatic pain there so therefore, or you've
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: got high blood pressure, we'll start you on aviprob one fifty.
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: Will you know, We'll do whatever, right, And so we go,
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: what's your ailment? Right, Well, we tend to use this
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: drug for that. The dosage varies or the varies a
• 31:00
  Speaker 2: little bit, so let's try you on this drug that does.
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: Let's see what happens. Whereas with this it's like every
• 31:07
  Speaker 2: medication for every patient is personally developed based on their
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: individual physiology.
• 31:12
  Speaker 4: Right, Yes, and that's actually the future.
• 31:15
  Speaker 3: Of course, it's not going to be of my lifetime,
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: but it's definitely going to be in the future. It
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: is not It is not so far fetched to think
• 31:26
  Speaker 3: that in the future you're going to go to a
• 31:28
  Speaker 3: pharmacy that's basically going to give you microbes to adjust
• 31:33
  Speaker 3: your microbiome based on a test that you have where
• 31:36
  Speaker 3: it can see what you have too much of and
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: what you have too little of. So I think that's
• 31:41
  Speaker 3: that might be the future, truly, so we might we
• 31:45
  Speaker 3: might go back.
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: To the compounding days the apostogy here.
• 31:47
  Speaker 4: But here's the problem.
• 31:49
  Speaker 3: We're killing faster than we are building. And my biggest
• 31:54
  Speaker 3: problem is we are going to be left with disappearing microbes.
• 31:58
  Speaker 3: When you look at lacto bisillas, for example, when you
• 32:02
  Speaker 3: look at biffotobacteria, less than one percent of people out
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: there probably have lack too basillas and less than five
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: percent have biffetobacteria, those two important microbes that are important
• 32:13
  Speaker 3: in breaking down sugar and breaking down calcium. So what
• 32:17
  Speaker 3: happens when those microbes disappear. Part of the reason I'm
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: going to the Amazon jungle and then I'm going to
• 32:22
  Speaker 3: go to Baku, and then I'm going to go to
• 32:25
  Speaker 3: Greece and all these different regions is to really find
• 32:29
  Speaker 3: lost microbes.
• 32:31
  Speaker 4: And those lost microbes really could be in the animals.
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: You know, when I was in Zimbabwe, I was interested
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: in testing the microboom of the elephants and the zebra
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: and the lions, because that's where you find missing microbes.
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: You know, to find ticks in an elephant dung was
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: really impressive, you know, to basically say, Wow, the guide
• 32:57
  Speaker 3: that touches the dung of the elephant doesn't have line disease.
• 33:00
  Speaker 3: But yet my person that goes hiking in the Malibu
• 33:04
  Speaker 3: Mountains has line from a bit from a tick. What's
• 33:08
  Speaker 3: the difference between the microbiome of the guy in Zimbabwe
• 33:12
  Speaker 3: versus the person that's hiking in the Santa Monica, you
• 33:16
  Speaker 3: know mountain.
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: You know that's what Like, we don't have any well,
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: I guess we don't have a lot of historical data
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: or research. I mean, you know, I know it's kind
• 33:30
  Speaker 2: of kicked off in the fifties or whatever, but is
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: do we have an idea of how much the for
• 33:38
  Speaker 2: one of the better term, the health of our microbiome
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: is declining? Like do you think it's worse than it's
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: ever been or it's always been bad, but we just
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: didn't know because the research wasn't there. Like, do you
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: think in twenty twenty five it's in general terms worse
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: than it was for the average American or Australian say
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: twenty or thirty years ago.
• 33:59
  Speaker 3: I think COVID and you know, COVID and the whole
• 34:03
  Speaker 3: you know pandemic really damaged the microbiome of humanity in
• 34:08
  Speaker 3: my opinion, and everything we did for COVID, you know,
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: the response from treatment to prophilaxis. I think that really
• 34:17
  Speaker 3: I can tell you from analyzing those tools before COVID
• 34:21
  Speaker 3: to analyzing those tools now, there's a huge loss of
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: microbes and a huge loss of diversity.
• 34:29
  Speaker 4: If I you.
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: Know, if I, if I had a if I could
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: go back to the past and to the eighteen hundreds,
• 34:36
  Speaker 3: I would love to have stool samples of eighteen hundred
• 34:39
  Speaker 3: to compare to today. But I bet you it had
• 34:42
  Speaker 3: a lot more diversity than we have now. And I
• 34:45
  Speaker 3: think with the loss of diversity of microbes, we're having
• 34:48
  Speaker 3: a lot more diseases. And that's why there's an increase
• 34:51
  Speaker 3: in diseases. When you again, when you look at lime
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: disease in you know, it's not really a problem in Africa,
• 34:59
  Speaker 3: but it's a problem in California.
• 35:03
  Speaker 4: We have a problem. We've killed too much here. We're
• 35:05
  Speaker 4: overdoing it. We're over sterilizing. Think about the pandemic.
• 35:09
  Speaker 3: They had an alcohol bottle on every store, in every direction.
• 35:14
  Speaker 4: They sterilized the heck out of you. They put you
• 35:16
  Speaker 4: in masks. You weren't a bubble. You can't live in
• 35:19
  Speaker 4: a bubble.
• 35:20
  Speaker 3: I mean, anybody knows you need microbes to live, right,
• 35:23
  Speaker 3: And that's what we're learning with the microbiome is you
• 35:26
  Speaker 3: need microbes.
• 35:27
  Speaker 4: You need that.
• 35:28
  Speaker 3: Hugging of humans, to that contact to share microbes to
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: continue living and continue developing that resilience. I'll tell you
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: what the microbiome to me is, It is where the
• 35:41
  Speaker 3: hemoglobin was years ago. When people were bleeding in the
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: olden days, we had no idea how to fix the bleeding.
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: We would let them bleed. So what we started doing
• 35:53
  Speaker 3: was we started developing a marker called the hemoglobin. If
• 35:57
  Speaker 3: they were low below seven, we would say, hey, let's transfuse.
• 36:01
  Speaker 3: If they were high at twelve, we would say, we
• 36:03
  Speaker 3: don't need to transfuse. Right, we're not even there yet,
• 36:08
  Speaker 3: So we are people are essentially.
• 36:10
  Speaker 4: Bleeding, right.
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: They have a leaky gut, a this biosis, and we
• 36:15
  Speaker 3: don't even know what a this biosis is. There's a
• 36:18
  Speaker 3: lot of hypothetical workout there based on animal studies of
• 36:22
  Speaker 3: what a leaky gut is, but clinically there's not much.
• 36:26
  Speaker 3: There's not a real definition of what a leaky gut
• 36:29
  Speaker 3: is and what even is a normal microbiome and how
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: do you find that normal microbiome in a world where
• 36:36
  Speaker 3: everybody has this biosis of some sort or has some
• 36:40
  Speaker 3: kind of element of disease from mental health to dyspepsia
• 36:45
  Speaker 3: to bloating, to autism to Parkinson's to Alzheimer's. So where
• 36:48
  Speaker 3: do you find that needle in the haystack of health
• 36:52
  Speaker 3: fee individual that you could say, oh my god, this
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: is the golden goose and I'm going to take that
• 36:58
  Speaker 3: boo and I'm going to fix everyone. You can't really,
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: So now let's go back to the hemoglobin when you're
• 37:06
  Speaker 3: When we had the hemoglobin, we knew hemoglobin of seven,
• 37:10
  Speaker 3: We're going to do a blood transfusion.
• 37:12
  Speaker 4: We then did blood transfusions and we.
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: Realized, wait a minute, we have this thing called HIV
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: or hepatitis C. We got to be careful, slow down,
• 37:23
  Speaker 3: and we got to start testing for HIV and hepatitis
• 37:25
  Speaker 3: C because we're giving our hemophiliacs HIV and hepatitis C.
• 37:30
  Speaker 3: So it took years to get to this level. Right,
• 37:33
  Speaker 3: that's where we're at in the microbiome. We do not
• 37:36
  Speaker 3: even have a marker for this biosis. We do not
• 37:40
  Speaker 3: even have a I have some ideas, but nothing that
• 37:43
  Speaker 3: I'm going to be publishing. First of all, we can't
• 37:45
  Speaker 3: even publish right now because they're retracting all these papers,
• 37:50
  Speaker 3: So we can't even advance the science to get us
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: further down. So imagine everything I've done all my research,
• 37:57
  Speaker 3: all this, you know, these exposition his expeditions in Zimbabwe
• 38:02
  Speaker 3: and Malaysia and analyzing the store microboma of different populations.
• 38:07
  Speaker 3: I can't even publish because there's such a control.
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: Wow, that's that's tough.
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: Why so why are people or why are certain people
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: or organizations or government departments or whatever not positive or
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: not supportive of this kind of research?
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: If if it's obviously it is so important?
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: Is it because it might be they weren't because financially,
• 38:38
  Speaker 2: financially disadvantageous to some organizations.
• 38:41
  Speaker 4: Yes, it is definitely disadvantageous.
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: Now, remember I told you at the beginning, I said, well,
• 38:46
  Speaker 3: doctor burlready had twenty eight cases of Cron's disease that
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: he improved. Yeah, imagine the whole biologics industry, you know,
• 38:55
  Speaker 3: ten thousand dollars a month to these kids for biologics
• 38:59
  Speaker 3: to fix or chrones. That doesn't mean biologics is not
• 39:02
  Speaker 3: the answer to Crohn's disease. It just means that there
• 39:05
  Speaker 3: might be a new kid on the block which is
• 39:07
  Speaker 3: going to displace the biologics. Right, So what happens Those
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: people that control the biologics want to take over the
• 39:15
  Speaker 3: data and the and the creator and the work to
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: get a better product, right well, that they can phase
• 39:23
  Speaker 3: out the biologic and bring on the new product.
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so that's do you feel like ironically the obsession
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: that I'm not saying everyone, but like a lot of
• 39:36
  Speaker 2: people have a lot of people in Australia are obsessed
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: with cleanliness and avoiding germs at all costs and as
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: you said, wiping their hands every eight seconds, with alcohol
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: based whatevers and masks that like wearing a I say,
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: people still out walking wearing a mask or driving their car.
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: With a mask on. I feel like.
• 39:59
  Speaker 2: Perhaps this session with never being exposed to anything is
• 40:03
  Speaker 2: ironically perhaps making some of a sicker or more predisposed
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: to get sick because of the impact on our microbion
• 40:12
  Speaker 2: So when.
• 40:13
  Speaker 3: You're you can live in a sterile environment, and you
• 40:16
  Speaker 3: can live a long time in a sterile environment, but
• 40:19
  Speaker 3: the problem is when you go from that sterile environment
• 40:21
  Speaker 3: to an unsterile, diverse environment, you're going to have a problem. Right,
• 40:27
  Speaker 3: So that's the problem is that you can live in
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: a diverse environment, or you can live in a sterile environment,
• 40:33
  Speaker 3: but the problem is when you go from steril to diverse,
• 40:37
  Speaker 3: you get yourself into a problem, and so the aim
• 40:42
  Speaker 3: for you know, ever since Louis pasteur has been sterilization.
• 40:49
  Speaker 3: Think about the first guy that came out with washing
• 40:52
  Speaker 3: his hand, washing our hands. He ended up being put
• 40:55
  Speaker 3: in an insane asylum. Right, So because he said we
• 40:59
  Speaker 3: have to wash our hands before going to surgery, that
• 41:02
  Speaker 3: came to stay. Yeah, so he went into an insaness
• 41:05
  Speaker 3: They put him in an insane asylum. But then it
• 41:07
  Speaker 3: became standard of care. Then they came out with, oh,
• 41:10
  Speaker 3: we need to pasteurize and sterilize everything, and that became
• 41:14
  Speaker 3: again standard of care. Now here I am coming back
• 41:18
  Speaker 3: and saying, well, maybe sterilization is not we need to
• 41:21
  Speaker 3: go back. Here's the problem we overdo as humans. We
• 41:25
  Speaker 3: tend to believe it's one way or the other, but
• 41:29
  Speaker 3: it's not. Look, let's go back to hemoglobin. Hemoglobin of
• 41:32
  Speaker 3: seven and above is fine. You don't need to give
• 41:35
  Speaker 3: blood below you need a blood. So there's a point
• 41:39
  Speaker 3: in time where you're no longer in balance. So maybe
• 41:43
  Speaker 3: you need a certain amount of sterility, and maybe you
• 41:46
  Speaker 3: need a certain amount of microbes. It's that middle ground
• 41:50
  Speaker 3: which we as humans don't do very well. We don't
• 41:54
  Speaker 3: do middle grounds. We either do left or we do right.
• 41:57
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 41:58
  Speaker 3: It's either right or wrong. What if there's no right
• 42:01
  Speaker 3: or wrong? And that's what science is right away, by
• 42:04
  Speaker 3: the way, there's no right or wrong. It can all fit,
• 42:08
  Speaker 3: it can all be right, or it could all be wrong.
• 42:10
  Speaker 3: It could be middle point.
• 42:12
  Speaker 4: We don't know. You know, when you find me a human.
• 42:14
  Speaker 3: That lives forever, then I'll follow that human and I'll
• 42:17
  Speaker 3: say that human's completely right, and we'll follow what that
• 42:21
  Speaker 3: human is doing. Until then, we're all searching for some
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: truth on how to live longer and how to better
• 42:28
  Speaker 3: our lives.
• 42:28
  Speaker 4: So we got to be objective.
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: We do doc, doc. We've got to wind up in
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: a few minutes.
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: But before we do so, somebody's listening to this and
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: they're like, well, this is fascinating. The docs fast cibilians fascinating,
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: and they want to do something to improve their gut health.
• 42:48
  Speaker 2: Now I know there's no three step plan, but any
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: general advice.
• 42:54
  Speaker 3: So we they can enroll in one of our clinical
• 42:56
  Speaker 3: trials where we're testing basically the microviolement disease. They pay
• 43:00
  Speaker 3: a certain portion of the test to do that because
• 43:03
  Speaker 3: it's you know, these tests are costly, but we do
• 43:06
  Speaker 3: give them some kind of you know, we see some
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: microbes that are you know, we we give them the
• 43:12
  Speaker 3: proper nutritional guidance, you know, from what we've learned and vitamins,
• 43:17
  Speaker 3: et cetera. If you don't want to do that and
• 43:21
  Speaker 3: you're perfectly healthy, then do nothing. Keep doing what you're doing.
• 43:25
  Speaker 3: If you have a disease, you know, obviously we started
• 43:28
  Speaker 3: with Let's Talk Shit.
• 43:30
  Speaker 4: Read the book. Order the book Let's Talk Shit.
• 43:33
  Speaker 3: There's a lot in there, there's a lot of information.
• 43:35
  Speaker 3: I wrote it during COVID. Actually we published the December
• 43:38
  Speaker 3: twenty twenty. I think it helped a lot of people.
• 43:41
  Speaker 4: There's a lot of cool recipes in there that can
• 43:44
  Speaker 4: help them.
• 43:45
  Speaker 3: There's a lot of podcasts. Your podcast is going to
• 43:47
  Speaker 3: be on the projena biome dot com website, so please,
• 43:51
  Speaker 3: you know, feel free to go. I always give out
• 43:56
  Speaker 3: a pearl on all these podcasts from what I've learned
• 44:00
  Speaker 3: from research, and you know, support us, support the Microbiome
• 44:04
  Speaker 3: Research Foundation dot org because that's how we, you know,
• 44:07
  Speaker 3: continue the research, continue the science that is really a science.
• 44:12
  Speaker 3: Nobody wants to do this is I always joke and
• 44:15
  Speaker 3: say we do the research.
• 44:17
  Speaker 4: No one wants to do, but everyone wants to know.
• 44:19
  Speaker 3: Think about you know, actually I'm doing a study with
• 44:21
  Speaker 3: New Zealand right now on Manuka honey. We're testing the
• 44:24
  Speaker 3: Manuka honey before and after.
• 44:27
  Speaker 4: So who's going to test that, you.
• 44:29
  Speaker 3: Know, except the company that's sell alling the honey, or
• 44:35
  Speaker 3: you know, just a curious mind, Like I'm testing cuman.
• 44:38
  Speaker 4: What is cuman?
• 44:39
  Speaker 3: There's no patents on cuman, but I want to know
• 44:42
  Speaker 3: what cuman does to the microbiome.
• 44:44
  Speaker 4: So these are the studies I'm excited about. This is
• 44:48
  Speaker 4: what is needed to be done. There's no product behind it.
• 44:52
  Speaker 4: I think I love those studies.
• 44:54
  Speaker 3: Because it keeps me grounded, it keeps me advancing the science,
• 44:59
  Speaker 3: and it educates the public onto what are the right things?
• 45:02
  Speaker 4: Now? You know, what can the public do other.
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: Than you know, listening and reading the book and all
• 45:08
  Speaker 3: that they can decrease their stress. That's the number one stop.
• 45:15
  Speaker 3: Let's this link the things that upset you. You know,
• 45:18
  Speaker 3: when you're feeling a not in your stomach because you're
• 45:22
  Speaker 3: stressed about something or you're anxious, it's time to stop.
• 45:26
  Speaker 3: That's your body telling you you're anxious. Stop it calm
• 45:30
  Speaker 3: down because I'm.
• 45:33
  Speaker 4: You're killing me. You're killing the microbio.
• 45:37
  Speaker 3: Good food, regenerative food from the farm, good nutrients, good vitamins,
• 45:43
  Speaker 3: very important, exercise, sun.
• 45:47
  Speaker 4: The sun is extremely important.
• 45:49
  Speaker 3: We've been fearful of the sun and telling everybody puts
• 45:53
  Speaker 3: on screen and puts on screen.
• 45:54
  Speaker 4: But you know we all need some vitamin D from
• 45:57
  Speaker 4: the sun and we all need the benefits of the sun.
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: I understand.
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: So the book is called Let's Talk Shit ah best
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: title ever, Doctor Sabine Hazan.
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: Is it Hazan or Hazen Hazen Hazen. Hey, we appreciate.
• 46:13
  Speaker 2: We're going to say goodbye affair, but thank you so much,
• 46:15
  Speaker 2: like I would like to get you back one day
• 46:17
  Speaker 2: and expand.
• 46:18
  Speaker 1: But so good, so interesting.
• 46:21
  Speaker 2: I'm so glad you're doing the research you're doing and
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: opening the door on something that really needs to be
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: understood and exposed to more and more people because it's
• 46:31
  Speaker 2: I think it's such a massive contributor to overall health
• 46:36
  Speaker 2: that we don't fully understand. But for now, thanks so
• 46:39
  Speaker 2: much for and on the you project. We appreciate you.
• 46:42
  Speaker 4: Thank you so much for having me.
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: Thanks Doc, Thanks TIV, thank you