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Were The Buckeyes Robbed Of National Titles In The 1990s? · Buckeyes TomOrrow Morning

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  Speaker 1: Welcome to you Buckeyes tomorrow morning for Thursday, April twenty fourth,
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: I'm your host, Tony Gerdaman. The Texas game is in
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: one hundred and twenty eight days, the Michigan game in
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: two hundred and nineteen days. Planning your next event, make
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: it unforgettable with Grateful Griddle Clubs. His favorite food truck
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: is serving up smash burgers, gourmet sandwiches and good vibes.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: Book you're catering today at Grateful griddleoh dot com. As
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: you may have noticed, I'm not Tom Moore, Thomas out
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: of town. We're gonna try to hold things down for
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  Speaker 1: him while he's while he's out, And today I am
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  Speaker 1: joined by Mark Rodgers. You may know Mark from YouTube.
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: If you don't check him out, go go to YouTube
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  Speaker 1: dot com slash what Mark Rogers TV. I believe right,
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: Mark covers all all kinds of college football. I've been
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: on his OSHU channel with him and with Buck Nuts
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: Steve Elwag and we just started our seventh year of
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: doing a weekly show, which many many of you already
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  Speaker 1: know about. But the reason that Mark is here today
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  Speaker 1: and it's not just because I needed a guest, because
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  Speaker 1: I'm doing this for Tom No Mark wrote a buck
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  Speaker 1: called It's titled Disputed National champions College football is historical
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  Speaker 1: nineteen nineties reset, and this is right in everybody's wheelhouse.
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  Speaker 1: Of just I don't know, bickering is not the right
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  Speaker 1: word discussing the college football history. Mark, So tell us
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  Speaker 1: what the book is about, to give people an idea
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  Speaker 1: of why it's in our wheelhouse.
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  Speaker 2: Well, of course, our beloved sport of college football is
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  Speaker 2: the only sport that exists in which people's opinions have
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  Speaker 2: mattered more than almost anything else throughout the history of
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  Speaker 2: the sport. You know, it's not the super Bowl of
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  Speaker 2: the World Series. Okay, we know X, Y and Z
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  Speaker 2: has to happen, and there we go, We've got our champion.
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  Speaker 2: It's becoming a little bit more structured, of course, over
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  Speaker 2: during the course of the playoff. But I love disputing
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  Speaker 2: this sort of thing in regards to you know, who
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  Speaker 2: whose resume stacks up versus whom's and why did this
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  Speaker 2: team get ripped off? And who forgot about them and
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  Speaker 2: why and so forth and so on. So the nineteen
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  Speaker 2: nineties seemed to be the perfect decade to dissect all
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  Speaker 2: of this, because that was the one decade in which
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  Speaker 2: there was the first major change in all of this.
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  Speaker 2: So we go back to nineteen thirty six, we got
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  Speaker 2: the AP polls started, and since then going into the nineties,
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  Speaker 2: nothing ever changed. From nineteen thirty six going into the nineties,
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  Speaker 2: the AP writers and the coaches pull determined the national champion.
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  Speaker 2: And the first thing people think of when I tell
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  Speaker 2: him I wrote a book and it's called Disputed National
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  Speaker 2: champions is, oh, well, they're going to dispute all the
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  Speaker 2: ones that were split national championships. Which that's that's reasonable
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  Speaker 2: to think. I pretty much dispute all of them to
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  Speaker 2: some degree. So we go into the nineteen nineties, Tony
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  Speaker 2: is you well know, there were different influences and factions
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  Speaker 2: that started to try to determine a more legitimate way
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  Speaker 2: to do this, and the first one was the Bowl Alliance,
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  Speaker 2: the Bowl Coalition. Let's get one and two together at least,
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  Speaker 2: because you know, the two of us, well, I've got
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  Speaker 2: a few years on you. But grew up at a
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  Speaker 2: time when you had to check the newspaper the next
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  Speaker 2: day after New Year's Day. You know, you'd watched the rose,
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  Speaker 2: the sugar, into the into the into the orange. Late
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  Speaker 2: at night and it was nice. So you'd watch these
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  Speaker 2: games and just love the football on the field. But
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  Speaker 2: at the end of the night, it's like midnight and
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  Speaker 2: you're thinking, I think I know who then anful champion is,
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  Speaker 2: but we're not going to know until tomorrow morning when
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  Speaker 2: we open the paper. So we'll wait to see what
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  Speaker 2: the official cone is. I think number two beat number six,
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  Speaker 2: and since number one lost to somebody else, I think
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  Speaker 2: they're going to be number one. And so that was
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  Speaker 2: just kind of this mystery. And then we find got
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  Speaker 2: again number one in two together most of the time
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  Speaker 2: once we got into this Bowl coalition, but of course
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  Speaker 2: the Big ten and the Pac ten wanted nothing to
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  Speaker 2: do with that, so that threw a monkey wrench into it.
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  Speaker 2: So I just figured, hey, I'm gonna write this book
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  Speaker 2: and I'm gonna focus on the nineteen nineties because we
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  Speaker 2: had changed during that decade, and I'm gonna look at
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  Speaker 2: every season and basically going to go through the preseason hype,
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  Speaker 2: who were the expected championship contenders, going to focus on them,
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  Speaker 2: kind of go through the storylines, you know, in nineteen
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  Speaker 2: ninety three where Bobby Bowden finally won a national championship
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  Speaker 2: the storyline being kind of like, Okay, this guy and
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  Speaker 2: his programer dominating, continuously finishing in the top five, but
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  Speaker 2: they can't get over the hump. And so I kind
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  Speaker 2: of weave every season through the eyes of one particular
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  Speaker 2: team and how they entered the season. Let would just
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  Speaker 2: kind of give a brief synopsis of the season, the
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  Speaker 2: controversial plays, the big games, the big moments, and then
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  Speaker 2: set up the postseason to say, okay, well, these were
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  Speaker 2: the rankings prior to postseason. Therefore it set up these matchups.
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  Speaker 2: What happened in the postseason with their controversy there, here's
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  Speaker 2: the final rankings. Okay, do these final rankings make sense?
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  Speaker 2: Are they credible? Who got screwed? That's that's really the
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  Speaker 2: best part of each one of these chefs. Who got screwed?
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  Speaker 2: And then we look at kind of the implications of
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  Speaker 2: that particular season. So we go nineteen ninety through ninety nine.
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  Speaker 1: So and just so people, if they're not clear, Mark,
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  Speaker 1: you grew up an Ohio State fan. So through this
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  Speaker 1: and this is basically an Ohio State podcast. How often
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  Speaker 1: in the nineties did Ohio State get screwed? Was because
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  Speaker 1: nineteen ninety eight they lost to Michigan State, and it
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  Speaker 1: derailed them. I still think they were the best team
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  Speaker 1: in the nation, but these late season losses and they
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  Speaker 1: weren't able to overcome them. How often did other programs
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  Speaker 1: overcome those if if you notice? But like in terms
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  Speaker 1: of Ohio State, how detrimental were the nineties in terms
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  Speaker 1: of how much did how much were they screwed? Were
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  Speaker 1: they screwed?
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  Speaker 2: Well, I will say this, nineteen ninety eight, I believed
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  Speaker 2: that Ohio State was the best team in the country.
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  Speaker 2: But I did not write this book to like splatter
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  Speaker 2: my opinion all over the place and say, well, they
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  Speaker 2: were the best team, they should be in the national
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  Speaker 2: champion Tennessee finished them undefeated and even though they were
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  Speaker 2: probably not playing the right team in the BCS championship game,
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  Speaker 2: I'm not going to try to take away a national
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  Speaker 2: championship from Tennessee, and I rarely do that in what
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  Speaker 2: I do just overall and kind of dissecting all these
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  Speaker 2: national championship seasons outside of this book, but I tend
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  Speaker 2: to be adding national championships to other teams. But as
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  Speaker 2: you well know, Ohio State was right there with one
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  Speaker 2: loss with five other teams, and it was just a
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  Speaker 2: ridiculous scenario to try to fit wedge one team into it.
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  Speaker 2: And so that's a situation where I don't believe Ohio
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  Speaker 2: State's got a legitimate shot just to claim anything, even
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  Speaker 2: though they probably were the best team in the country.
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  Speaker 2: The season that gets forgotten by a lot of people
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  Speaker 2: is nineteen ninety six because if you look at it,
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  Speaker 2: Florida lost on the same weekend Ohio State lost. Florida
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  Speaker 2: got to a vengeance loss to Florida State. Ohio State,
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  Speaker 2: of course wins the Rose Bowl over number one Arizona State.
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  Speaker 2: So there were two or three people out there that
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  Speaker 2: devoted Ohio State number one in both polls. I think
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  Speaker 2: it was they got like about five votes in one
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  Speaker 2: poll and they got like a one and a half
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  Speaker 2: or two and a half votes in the ep pole.
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  Speaker 2: But if you look at resumes, if you look at
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  Speaker 2: kind of a logical breakdown, Ohio State has a claim
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  Speaker 2: for a national championship split with Florida in nineteen ninety six.
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  Speaker 2: And if you really want to go beyond that and
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  Speaker 2: not consider the Bowl games to be de facto playoff games,
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  Speaker 2: Florida State is an argument to say, you know, we
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  Speaker 2: should have a third national title sent our way because
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  Speaker 2: we split with Florida and we finished with the same
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  Speaker 2: record as the other two.
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  Speaker 1: That the ninety sixth thing. I think, correct me if
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  Speaker 1: I'm wrong. If I'm wrong. If Arizona State wins that
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  Speaker 1: Rose Bowl, they're probably national champs, right, and so Ohio
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  Speaker 1: State beating them, Well, why not Ohio State if all
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  Speaker 1: of these teams have one loss, because that was the
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  Speaker 1: year Arizona State beat Nebraska, I believe, and just watching
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  Speaker 1: that back in my apartment, I think on North Forth
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  Speaker 1: in Columbus and just being like I at that time,
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  Speaker 1: I know it's going to sound crazy to the young kids.
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  Speaker 1: I didn't know that Nebraska could be beaten. It was
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  Speaker 1: like just understood that nobody's going to beat these guys,
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  Speaker 1: and then Arizona State and Jake Plumber today shut them out.
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  Speaker 2: It was.
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  Speaker 1: And that was just one of the most shocking things.
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  Speaker 1: So then to go and beat that Arizona State team
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  Speaker 1: in the way they were able to. You know, Jake,
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  Speaker 1: Jake Snake, Jake Plumber was one of those guys you
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  Speaker 1: were just kind of afraid of because he was always
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  Speaker 1: going to do something. So yeah, I'm not gonna argue
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  Speaker 1: about your argument there, How did you see what did
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  Speaker 1: your study and your accumulation of data tell you about
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  Speaker 1: ninety seven? And as we know, Michigan was the AP
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  Speaker 1: and the AP champs in Nebraska was the coaches champs.
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  Speaker 1: What did you find out with that? What did you
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  Speaker 1: come to? What conclusion did you come to with the
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  Speaker 1: ninety seven season?
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  Speaker 2: Well, see, in a sense, he would think that the
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  Speaker 2: book would be more centered on, as I alluded to
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  Speaker 2: before the split national championships, and it is. Certainly it's
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  Speaker 2: a great debate and so forth. But because of the
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  Speaker 2: way I attack this, there's actually less controversy in those
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  Speaker 2: seasons because you've got two teams that both went undefeated
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  Speaker 2: and had really tough schedules, and the system did not
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  Speaker 2: afford us a game between the two. So the purpose
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  Speaker 2: of this book is not to say Michigan's better than
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  Speaker 2: Nebraska in nineteen nine, or Nebraska is better than Michigan
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  Speaker 2: and they would have been the national champion. I don't
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  Speaker 2: do that in any such way, although I do kind
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  Speaker 2: of I do to a certain extent because people I've
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  Speaker 2: determined that that people do want you to interject opinion,
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  Speaker 2: but I'm not trying to take away national championships from
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  Speaker 2: either one. They're both earned against really good schedules. It's
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  Speaker 2: funny they both had their claims. The claim on the
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  Speaker 2: Michigan side is that their schedule was slightly tougher. The
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  Speaker 2: claim on the end that Nebraska lucked into the shoe
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: kick in the end zone against Missouri and that that
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  Speaker 2: was about as lucky as you can get. Because of
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  Speaker 2: that ball falls to the ground, the game's over. It's
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  Speaker 2: not one of these where that was second.
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  Speaker 1: Down and we will filled happen.
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  Speaker 2: The game was over. On the other side, Nebraska, I'm sure,
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  Speaker 2: was dominant against what was probably the other best team
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  Speaker 2: in the country Tennessee and Peyton Manning and just smashed
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  Speaker 2: them in the I always get it mixed up ninety
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  Speaker 2: seven and ninety nine Fiesta Bowl, Orange Bowl and where
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  Speaker 2: Michigan kind of limped home and hung on against Ryan
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  Speaker 2: Leaf and what was a good Washington State team but
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  Speaker 2: not as good as those other teams.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think there were three split national championships
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  Speaker 1: in the nineties, starting with Colorado and Georgia Tech in
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  Speaker 1: nineteen ninety and I don't know if people are calling.
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  Speaker 1: Virginia was also in the mix for a while that season.
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  Speaker 1: That's how it's how long ago all of this was
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  Speaker 1: where Colorado, Georgia Tech Virginia like two ACC teams at
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  Speaker 1: that point where we're battling it out, and there's just
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  Speaker 1: so much history through all of this, and you know,
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  Speaker 1: you look at the national champions over the course of
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  Speaker 1: that decade. I think it's interesting that where ninety seven
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  Speaker 1: is basically not controversial for you because it's like they
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  Speaker 1: should have played. That's what the conclusion is. They should
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  Speaker 1: have played, and they would have if we had gotten
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  Speaker 1: you know, if we had the modern playoff system where
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  Speaker 1: even the final four or whatever. When you're looking at
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  Speaker 1: all this, how much how much are you bringing in
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  Speaker 1: the CFP at all? Like are you saying like, are
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  Speaker 1: you looking into you know, how many times O higher
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  Speaker 1: state would have been in the playoffs or how many
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: tis this team would have been in a playoff? Is
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  Speaker 1: there any mention of playoffs in this since that's kind
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  Speaker 1: of the overarching thing of if this would have happened,
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  Speaker 1: if these teams would have been here, been doing this
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  Speaker 1: this year, how many of them would have actually gone
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  Speaker 1: through and been able to win playoff games? Because as
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: you said, you'd go to bed and he'd wake up like,
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  Speaker 1: I wonder who won a national championship. I've seen all
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  Speaker 1: the games, but I don't know whereas now it's like
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  Speaker 1: you can't just win one game to win a title
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  Speaker 1: on it. It's like there were conferences that had conference
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  Speaker 1: championship game. It was just like Ohio State, you go
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  Speaker 1: play Miami, the winner is national champion, whereas now it's
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: Ohio State. You go play Miami. And then after that
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  Speaker 1: we got three more for you. So how much of
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  Speaker 1: you know, what kind of conclusions did you draw this project?
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  Speaker 1: And how the playoffs are like kind of just overhead.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, you're getting into the real fun of this book
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  Speaker 2: for me, because while I love the history, the history
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  Speaker 2: is amazing, I know that a lot for a lot
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  Speaker 2: of people, they would just be simply like, Okay, well
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: that already happened. It's it's dead, it's gone, it's in
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: the butt, try quick, trying to you know, be a
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: rebel rouser and question of what was decided thirty years ago.
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  Speaker 2: So I didn't want to make it just to history book.
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  Speaker 2: So we take all these seasons and first of all,
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: it's just fun, I think to see what we had.
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  Speaker 2: No conference championship games in nineteen ninety. Then we have
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: the SEC jumping in ninety two, and so forth and
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: so on, and by the end of the decade, the
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: Big Ten, still in the Pac Ten, did not have
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: conference championship game. So to simply let everyone know, based
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: on the standings in the conference, these would would have
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: been the conference championship games. Are kind of fun to
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: look at, number one, number two. Then I also, and
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: this takes a lot of conjecture speculation, but in twenty
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: twenty five, these would have been the conference championship games.
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  Speaker 2: Now the schedules would be different and all that, So
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: got to take a leap of faith there. But yeah,
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  Speaker 2: I run all of these seasons through the BCS, I
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: run them all through the fourteen playoff, I run them
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: all through the twelve team and then I run them
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: all through the fourteen team proposed playoffs. So we got
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: we got seasons where Southern miss makes the playoff. In
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: East Carolina, we got some interesting candidates.
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because they would be like what the highest rank
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: group of twelve East Carolina with the Jeff Blake perhaps
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: is that?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah?
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  Speaker 1: About right? That they went? They had had to had
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: toe to toe with Florida State in a bowl game
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: and beat them one year. I can't remember. I just
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: know like it was fun watching Jeff Blake the one
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: time I got to see him in a bowl game whatever,
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: throwing deep and then he goes to the Bengals and
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: I'm like, I know that guy. So when you run
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: these playoffs, how are you? Are you just setting them
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: up and say, like draw your own conclusion, or like,
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: are you drawing some conclusions? Are you just saying, look,
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: this is what we could have had.
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: So hey, let's just grab a season here. We got
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: the nineteen ninety seven season. Okay, So if we want
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: to parlay this forward, because Ohio State's going to be
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: included in this the fourteen team playoff, if we want
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: to go, well, we might as well stick with the
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: twelve since that's what we've got here currently. Of course,
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: what also is funny about this is because this eight
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: starts with so many independent teams.
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: Oh gosh, that are they all group of twelve or
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: the group of five? Like is this are they the
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: only only one?
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: Well, you've got to go at large bids, So you've
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: got a lot of Big ten champions with three losses
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: given higher seedings than undefeated Miami teams because it should
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: be invented, you got to win a conference. So in
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: nineteen ninety seven, Michigan's the one seed out of the
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: Big ten, Nebraska's the two seed out of the Big twelve.
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: Then you got Tennessee out of the SEC is the
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: three seed, Florida State the ACC champion four, Washington State
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: PAC ten team five, and then Syracuse won the Big
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: East even though there were number fourteen in the AP rankings,
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: they're the sixth seed. And then we got our at
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: large run of UCLA nine and two, Florida nine and two,
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: North Carolina ten and one, Ohio State the ten seed
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: at ten and two, Kansas State and Colorado State number
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  Speaker 2: eighteen in the country. Is your twelve seed is a
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: group of five rep.
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  Speaker 1: Wow, that's that's a pretty low ranking for the for
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: the UH for the twelve seeds. So what's UH in that?
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: That?
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: Where where does Ohio State? Who do they start off with?
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: Then in that playoff ninety play?
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: What a at seven to ten game at u c
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: l A the Rose Bowl.
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: That's easy.
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: Now imagine now Tony that back then we're looking at
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: nineteen ninety seven and a nine and two UCLA team
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: was ranked three spots higher than a ten and two
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: Ohio State team.
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: Man man times changed, and that was nearly thirty years ago,
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: and there's all kinds of stuff Like you just start
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: flipping through it, it's gonna be like you'll you'll, you'll
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: go back in time and then you'd be like, this
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: should have been so much better because I know Ohio
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: State was was gonna be these jokers. They would have
• 17:53
  Speaker 1: ran through Tennessee in ninety eight. They would have done
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: t Martin had no no shot to stop Ohio State,
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: and they would have been all over that. There's just
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: a lot of fun and if if you are into
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: the college football, some of it's minutia in terms of
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: just like the arguing about it, like all of the
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: things that we argue about, is that it's also just
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: a more wide ranging discussion. So I'd encourage it. And
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: you can find it at Amazon. Just go to Amazon
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: dot com type in what disputed National Champions right there,
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: or you know, type in Mark Rodgers and you will
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: find it. I promise you that it's easy to find,
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: So check that out. Mark, want to thank you for
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: stopping by. I you know, honestly, you can do another
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: show like this's just talk about nineteen ninety four, Well
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: not ninety four because O High States not in. Let's
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: just talk about ninety five, or let's just talk about
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: ninety seven. Let's talk about even you know, like two
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: thousand and two because the Ohio State run like, don't
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: change anything about two thousand and two is like, well,
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: what if they had to do three more games? What
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: was it? What would that have looked like? So actually, Mark,
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: go ahead, let's talk about two thousand and two while
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: you're here. What what the playoff bracket would have looked like?
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: Oh, off my head, Yeah, yeah. Georgia was really high
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: that year. Obviously Ohio State, Miami. I think the other
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: two spots go to Georgia and two that was the USC, right,
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: I believe maybe Iowa before.
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: Well USA, it was like before at that time because
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: they were like one of the top teams coming in.
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: So I apologize for diving off into two thousand and two,
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: but this is just the point is like, once you
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: get started with this, there are so many arguments that
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: you can make and it's a fun discussion. So check
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: that out at Amazon dot com. I just do a
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: search on disputed national champions correct.
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: And even that Ohio State team in nineteen ninety four
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: that you tried to bypass that got just set to
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: touchdown blasted by Penn State. They sneak into a fourteen
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: team playoff at number thirteen.
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: There you go, that's that would have been my freshman year.
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: I would have had to go to. Where would Ohio
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: State have gone in that first round that I would
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: have been able to road trip?
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: Oh? Shoot, I lost it? Oh number thirteen? Well, who
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: are they playing in the first round? If we've got
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: a fourteen team playoff and we've got how many buys.
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: It sent me to, like Illinois or something. I've done
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: that too much?
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: What is that? Oregon? Ohio State?
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: It's a long drive. I'd have to get on the train.
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: Again. In nineteen ninety four, that Oregon team that won
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: the Pack ten and lost to Penn State has a
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: much higher ranking than Ohio State with the same record.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: Would that have been an Achille Smith at that point?
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: No, that was before his time. In eighteen ninety four.
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: He did not quarterback that team that played Penn State
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: and Rose Bowl.
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: But I digress. It's just all kinds of it, just
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: takes you back, so check it out there. Mark, thank
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: you so much for stopping by. Do you appreciate it?
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: And of course you can always find Mark at YouTube
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: dot com slash mark Rogers TV, where he's talking all
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: kinds of college football and also your buck guys. So
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: thank you all for tuning in and we'll talk to
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: you guys tomorrow