Latest / Delulu with Ryan Lu / KINGS on Her New Single Talk Later & Stepping Into a New Era | Delulu with Ryan Lu podcast #401

Transcript

KINGS on Her New Single Talk Later & Stepping Into a New Era | Delulu with Ryan Lu podcast #401 · Delulu with Ryan Lu

• 0:00
  My parents ended up buying me a wig.
• 0:02
  This is where oh. I love a wig.
• 0:04
  Full circle, you know, a little designated Hannah Montana wig.
• 0:06
  And our backyard was on a slant at the time.
• 0:09
  So I was like, this is my stage and I would go out there with a
• 0:11
  microphone cord just like dangling.
• 0:14
  Behind me. Plugged into nothing.
• 0:15
  I love that and I would just do my entire set every single day.
• 0:19
  You. Had a very first chaotic year
• 0:20
  living in LA. Like what was chaotic for you?
• 0:22
  What happened? It was chaotic because I just
• 0:24
  was so depressed. I was just.
• 0:26
  Like. I was living alone and it's so
• 0:29
  funny because I was in this gorgeous, this apartment, and I
• 0:31
  had all these things that should have made me happy.
• 0:48
  Hello King Lulu's and welcome back to Delulu.
• 0:51
  Today's guesty is Miss Highlighter, yellow hair siren
• 0:54
  herself. So fucking iconic, really good
• 0:56
  branding. When I was telling the team here
• 0:58
  that Kings was coming in, they're like yellow hair.
• 0:59
  And I was like, that's such good branding.
• 1:01
  Oh. My God.
• 1:02
  Thank you. That's such good.
• 1:03
  I wanna get into that hero too. That was that intentional?
• 1:05
  Yeah, but I. Also just loved you.
• 1:07
  Hi Kings. Welcome.
• 1:09
  Welcome to delulu. I'm.
• 1:11
  So happy to be here. We're gonna talk about
• 1:12
  everything. We've been yapping so much prior
• 1:14
  to even filming. So I already know this is gonna
• 1:16
  be this is gonna be a deep dive. We're gonna we're gonna be
• 1:18
  yapped in America over here, Yes.
• 1:20
  I'm so. Excited before we yapped in
• 1:21
  America, we do want to start the show by reading some
• 1:24
  affirmations for you. So if you are listening, all you
• 1:27
  need to do is sit back, relax, breathe, and let kings in.
• 1:30
  Speak greatness into existence for you.
• 1:33
  We're going to take turns. Do you want to start?
• 1:35
  Sure. OK, let's do it.
• 1:37
  Yay. OK, yay.
• 1:38
  OK, you are shedding versions of yourself that no longer fit.
• 1:43
  Clock, you were discovering who you truly are, one moment at a
• 1:47
  time. Period.
• 1:49
  You are learning to trust your own voice and intuition.
• 1:53
  Claim you were allowed to evolve beyond who you used to be.
• 1:59
  You are exactly where you need to be in your journey of self
• 2:02
  discovery. Yes, you are becoming more
• 2:06
  aligned with your authentic self every day.
• 2:09
  You are uncovering your truth even in moments of the
• 2:13
  uncertainty. You were not lost, you were in
• 2:16
  the process of finding yourself. You are creating a life that
• 2:21
  reflects who you really are. You are worthy of understanding
• 2:25
  yourself deeply and honestly. Thank you so much.
• 2:29
  I was good. I'm claiming all that.
• 2:31
  I know. That felt good.
• 2:32
  Powerful. Right?
• 2:33
  That was good. Yeah, that.
• 2:34
  Was really good. Let's get into everything.
• 2:36
  Well, I want to start with the yellow hair because that that
• 2:39
  really do mean that. Like I was talking about with
• 2:40
  people about you coming on the show and they were like the
• 2:42
  yellow hair. And I was like, that's such good
• 2:43
  branding. Because actually I had a
• 2:45
  conversation with your manager Russell, a couple months ago and
• 2:49
  he had brought you up in his roster.
• 2:51
  And when I was looking up on the website, I saw Kings with the
• 2:54
  yellow hair, and that stood out to me.
• 2:56
  And I remembered it way down the line.
• 2:58
  Isn't that we met a couple months later, like, organically?
• 3:01
  Yeah, a couple months later. Yeah.
• 3:02
  So like, let's talk about the hair.
• 3:04
  It's so. Iconic.
• 3:05
  Thank you. Yeah, thank you for saying that.
• 3:07
  Also shout out Russ. Yeah, shout out Ross, 88.
• 3:10
  He's in the booth, the hair. So she is 6 years old.
• 3:15
  Oh my gosh. I dyed it when I was 19 years
• 3:17
  old. Oh my God, you're committing.
• 3:19
  Yeah, and it's funny because it's always been my favorite
• 3:21
  color. And then I read this thing, I'm
• 3:24
  sure on Instagram about how, like, the walls of your
• 3:27
  childhood bedroom can affect your favorite color.
• 3:29
  And it was yellow. And so it's kind of like a full
• 3:31
  circle moment. And then also, I'm obsessed with
• 3:34
  Hannah Montana, so I was kind of like I wanted.
• 3:35
  To talk about the Hannah Montana of it all too, because I was
• 3:37
  going to be like you really kind of Hannah Montana.
• 3:39
  Like you are Hannah Montana, but just like pop star Hannah
• 3:41
  Montana. Subconsciously I'm like, yeah.
• 3:44
  And consciously and, oh, consciously, yeah.
• 3:47
  I mean, it looks so good. It's so like you.
• 3:49
  It's good branding just in general.
• 3:51
  Like, I'm such a nerd about marketing.
• 3:53
  And it's such a nerd about like, like image and everything.
• 3:55
  And it's just like, it's so powerful and smart.
• 3:58
  Like exactly when people were like, oh, the yellow hair, yes.
• 4:01
  Yeah, yeah, that's so good. It was just like, I was like,
• 4:04
  OK, I'm a teenager, I may as well do this now.
• 4:07
  And then it kind of just stuck. My entire family was like, OK,
• 4:09
  girl. And now, like, see how it goes.
• 4:11
  And I'm like, well, yeah, I just like yellow.
• 4:13
  That favorite color theory. So interesting is my childhood
• 4:15
  bedroom was purple and I hate purple.
• 4:18
  Shit. I don't know.
• 4:19
  It wasn't my choice to me. No, I take it back.
• 4:21
  Did you choose yellow for your childhood bedroom color?
• 4:23
  No, I. Think yeah, yeah, I love yellow.
• 4:26
  Someone asked me last night they like your favorite color.
• 4:28
  And I was like, it's gold. And they're like, why?
• 4:30
  And I was like, 'cause it's like shiny yellow.
• 4:31
  I think literally 'cause I love yellow.
• 4:33
  And like, you know, Lala Land Cafe, you know, here in LA, yes,
• 4:36
  they're yellows everywhere. It just, it generally makes me
• 4:38
  feel nice and bright and good. Yeah.
• 4:40
  It's so like, it's so nice. That's why if you want to look
• 4:42
  at you. Oh, my God.
• 4:43
  And I like how like bright you are because you have like this
• 4:45
  like neon pink talk to like you were like, hey, everyone, I'm
• 4:50
  here. I'm a bomb.
• 4:51
  Star put Jeffrey over here. Oh, you named her Jeffrey?
• 4:53
  Yeah. I love, Yeah.
• 4:54
  OK. Love, love, love.
• 4:55
  Yeah. Does she already have a name?
• 4:56
  I'm sorry. No, she doesn't.
• 4:57
  It's Jeffrey now. Yeah.
• 5:00
  Or, you know. Yeah, Jeffrey.
• 5:02
  We'll take it. Yeah.
• 5:03
  They're all de Lulu to me. Right?
• 5:05
  Right. Well, the colors are good.
• 5:07
  I love it. And we wanted a pink vibe today
• 5:08
  for set. Yes, we're in this pink era.
• 5:10
  Yes, yes. And it honestly matches the
• 5:13
  music too. Yeah, I wanna go through your
• 5:15
  entire music journey and evolution, but like literally
• 5:17
  everything that you're doing right now, Oh my God, it
• 5:19
  scratches such a satisfying itch for me 'cause it's like it is
• 5:22
  literally adjacent with literally the music you're
• 5:24
  putting out, the vibes you're doing, the aesthetics you're
• 5:26
  doing, your world building. Thank you.
• 5:28
  I really do like kind of have synesthesia, which is where you
• 5:31
  like hear color and like associate different things.
• 5:33
  That's why I have this. I carry her around.
• 5:35
  She DIY too, period. We're going to talk about that
• 5:39
  later. Y'all y'all I've been, I've
• 5:45
  been. I have been referencing talk
• 5:47
  later to her all day and she's not clocking.
• 5:50
  I know. I don't know what's wrong with.
• 5:51
  Me. She's not clocked.
• 5:52
  I need it. Hold on.
• 5:52
  Let me try. Let me.
• 5:53
  Try. OK, OK, OK.
• 5:55
  We're gonna, we're gonna, we're gonna activate now.
• 5:57
  Good timing, too 'cause we want to get into all the King's lore.
• 6:00
  So yeah, we are quickly becoming besties, but I don't really know
• 6:04
  you. Like, what is going on?
• 6:05
  Where do kings come from? I know that you went you moved
• 6:08
  to Nashville to pursue songwriting when you're 1516
• 6:10
  while you're still in high school.
• 6:11
  Yeah, So what? Happened there.
• 6:13
  Where are you originally from? Let's start there.
• 6:14
  Yeah, so I'm from North Carolina.
• 6:16
  I'm from a tiny tiny town. The nearest city is called
• 6:20
  Winston Salem, but I'm from a town like 30 minutes outside of
• 6:23
  that. 2000 people. Like I grew up on tons of land.
• 6:26
  I was homeschooled, middle of nowhere. 2000 is tiny.
• 6:30
  Tiny. I just did a trip to Idlewild
• 6:32
  and it was 3000 people and it was like literally goes down.
• 6:35
  Yeah. And 2000 is like even smaller.
• 6:36
  That's crazy. Yeah, yeah, It's crazy.
• 6:38
  I don't know the exact number probably, but like, it's
• 6:40
  literally, yeah. It's so small, but I loved it.
• 6:42
  It was great. Growing up.
• 6:43
  I was super close to my sisters, homeschooled my whole life,
• 6:46
  which gave me a ton of like opportunities to just dive it on
• 6:49
  music. I was such a weirdo.
• 6:50
  I'd be like my school was done by 12 and then I would just sing
• 6:52
  and write for. 8 hours Start making music.
• 6:55
  So like, you've always wanted to be an artist, you always wanted
• 6:57
  to make music. Yeah, I was like 6 years old
• 6:59
  when I decided and my family's very musical.
• 7:01
  My grandma was a music teacher, dad was a touring artist, my
• 7:04
  sisters sing and dance, my mom's a dancer.
• 7:07
  Like it was just always around but but a lot.
• 7:09
  Of creative energy in the family.
• 7:10
  Yeah, yeah. And they're always so
• 7:11
  encouraging. And also with homeschooling, my
• 7:14
  parents could really. You know, give the flexibility
• 7:16
  for you to be able to like hone your craft and pursue things
• 7:19
  along those lines. That's great.
• 7:20
  That's super rare too. Shout out to.
• 7:22
  The King's family. I know they're amazing and also
• 7:25
  like, yeah, for real. And your dad?
• 7:27
  Yes. Yes, yes, yes.
• 7:29
  With the powerful voice. Yeah.
• 7:30
  There you go. Yeah, yeah.
• 7:32
  OK. So then you're in this small
• 7:33
  town and you've always loved music.
• 7:35
  Like, when did you? I know you mentioned before to
• 7:37
  me, and I'm the exact same boat as you.
• 7:39
  You said like you were inspired by Hannah Montana.
• 7:41
  Did you see the reunion? I meant the special.
• 7:43
  Yes. Did you?
• 7:44
  Loves it. Yeah, it was, I feel.
• 7:45
  I loved it. I think I would be as emotional
• 7:47
  as it was when I watched it and I was like.
• 7:49
  Oh no I know I wish it was 5 hours long.
• 7:51
  That's my only complaint is I also.
• 7:52
  Wish it was, there was so much more to explore there for sure.
• 7:55
  I. Know maybe they'll do another
• 7:56
  one and like. And you'll be the guest.
• 7:58
  Yeah, you know what? We're going to manifest that
• 8:00
  manifesto. So you were inspired by Hannah
• 8:03
  Montana that made you want to be like a pop *?
• 8:04
  Yeah, so I had This is really funny.
• 8:06
  I started watching it when I was with my, you know, sisters when
• 8:09
  I was like 6 years old or whenever I came out and my
• 8:12
  parents ended up buying me a wig.
• 8:14
  This is where. I love a wig.
• 8:16
  Full circle. You know, a literal designated
• 8:18
  Hannah Montana wig. And our backyard was on a slant
• 8:21
  at the time. So I was like, this is my stage.
• 8:23
  And I would go out there with a microphone cord just like
• 8:26
  dangling behind. Me.
• 8:27
  Plugged into nothing, I love that and I would just do my
• 8:30
  entire set every single day and that was my first rehearsal do.
• 8:33
  You know the song. It's like Hannah Montana songs.
• 8:34
  Oh my God, yeah. Nobody's perfect.
• 8:36
  Was like my opener, like they I had.
• 8:38
  Oh, you put on a show? I was shaking my hips at like 5
• 8:41
  years old. It was kind of ridiculous.
• 8:42
  My parents were like, OK, So what are we?
• 8:44
  What do we do with this one? I just spit.
• 8:46
  That's great. You were destined for stardom.
• 8:48
  That's why you were doing that. You know what?
• 8:50
  I just love. You just gotta own it.
• 8:52
  I just really. Yeah.
• 8:53
  I just like, love music. Like genuinely.
• 8:55
  Me too. Yeah.
• 8:56
  Yeah. I mean, I just love entertaining
• 8:57
  in general. Like that's why, like, for me,
• 8:58
  it's like we were just talking about this.
• 9:00
  Like we love being on a set. You said you love the pink.
• 9:02
  Like I love, yeah. Oh my God.
• 9:04
  Y'all. I talk about this all the time.
• 9:05
  I love being in front of a camera.
• 9:06
  I love being in front of lights. I love like you.
• 9:09
  Just get it. I love it.
• 9:10
  I live for it so much. Yeah.
• 9:12
  You know what I mean? Yeah.
• 9:13
  Oh my God, yeah. Perfect pop *.
• 9:15
  Both of us period, period, period.
• 9:17
  Also both of us inspired by Hannah Montana because that's
• 9:19
  actually like what I grew up on. And that was like me being like,
• 9:21
  I want to do that. I want to be a pop star.
• 9:22
  I want to entertain, I want to be on TV, I want to do.
• 9:24
  All of this, yeah, I think the whole era of Disney or just
• 9:27
  like. Oh, the golden.
• 9:28
  Years, yeah, like camper everybody was obsessed with like
• 9:31
  being a teenager, being famous, living.
• 9:33
  Yeah, living the dream. And then also staying true to
• 9:35
  yourself. They raised a generation of pop
• 9:37
  stars. Yeah.
• 9:38
  Isn't that crazy? They did.
• 9:40
  And staying true to yourself, literally, they did.
• 9:43
  OK. So then you coming from the
• 9:45
  small town, when did you end up deciding like you wanted to move
• 9:47
  to Nashville? How did that end up coming
• 9:48
  about? Because 1516 is really young.
• 9:50
  Was very young, yeah. So I started the writing songs
• 9:52
  when I was probably like 9 and I was so shy.
• 9:56
  I would just keep them for myself.
• 9:58
  And then at some point when I was like early teens, I played
• 10:01
  my parents my songs for the first time on piano, and they
• 10:04
  were like, yo, what? Yeah, They were like.
• 10:07
  Oh, because they knew you were singing and dancing and like,
• 10:09
  performing, but they didn't know that you were making songs.
• 10:11
  You were writing songs. You didn't tell them.
• 10:13
  Yeah, I, like, started dancing and performing.
• 10:15
  And I was 3, and my sisters are also dancers.
• 10:18
  And then I was in the worship band at church growing up.
• 10:21
  Like, I was always singing every week.
• 10:22
  And so I was in front of people a lot.
• 10:24
  But in terms of, like, songwriting, I was so like, this
• 10:26
  is so personal. And so once I played them songs,
• 10:29
  I actually started doing covers. My first cover was I was like 11
• 10:32
  and it was titanium. Oh girl, that's a big one to
• 10:35
  cover. At 11, it was.
• 10:37
  Acoustic I'll have to play it for you.
• 10:39
  It's actually I have bracelets. It's like really fun I.
• 10:40
  Bet it's really good. You're probably belting.
• 10:42
  I try you're. Probably giving everything I've
• 10:44
  got that's that is a crazy bold song to come out the gate with
• 10:47
  doing covers titanium. I know I was like, you know
• 10:50
  what, may as well go all in. Go all in.
• 10:53
  Girl. So I started doing that and then
• 10:54
  I did a cover of House of the Rising Sun a little bit later
• 10:57
  and a producer in Nashville saw it.
• 10:59
  And then I, yeah. And I also.
• 11:01
  Defined we were posting these covers.
• 11:02
  Just YouTube. Oh, shit, yeah.
• 11:04
  And I mean, they weren't going viral.
• 11:05
  Viral. There was just out there.
• 11:06
  Yeah. It was like my family and then
• 11:08
  my friends. And watching it.
• 11:10
  And yeah, and so I guess it was just kind of circulating.
• 11:12
  I had a cousin who lived in Nashville who, like, had a few
• 11:13
  friends out there anyway. And so I ended up getting a few
• 11:17
  calls from like producers and then somebody who worked at
• 11:20
  ASCAP and I got a call when I was 16 on like Christmas,
• 11:23
  literally. And I was like, why are you
• 11:25
  calling me on a holiday? But like pop off?
• 11:28
  And he was like, I want to meet with you.
• 11:29
  And then we just had like a few things in the works.
• 11:31
  So I would drag my parents out to Nashville.
• 11:34
  We drive 7 hours every single month.
• 11:36
  You drove. Yeah, well, my dad.
• 11:39
  Drove. I was they were in the admitted
• 11:41
  yeah. You're arrested.
• 11:42
  I. Be like, we're doing this
• 11:43
  meeting, we're doing this meeting where I'm going to write
• 11:45
  this day. And I'm napping on the way, yes.
• 11:48
  Yes, I was like you. Need to rest.
• 11:50
  I get it. Yeah, OK.
• 11:51
  And they also, we need to put him in the group chat.
• 11:53
  Oh my God. He earned it.
• 11:55
  Yes. Yes.
• 11:55
  Literally no. But I also just like, you know,
• 11:57
  there's a lot of stuff that could happen when you're young
• 12:00
  in the music industry. And my parents were always just
• 12:02
  like, oh, hell yeah. Not like helicopter parents, but
• 12:05
  they were also like, no. It's good that they're
• 12:06
  intentional about that because like honestly, even as adults,
• 12:09
  like you and I as adults now in the music industry, shit scared
• 12:12
  to navigate. It's a lot.
• 12:13
  It's like heartbreaking. It's so much especially being so
• 12:16
  young and wanting to pursue it. So I think that's really
• 12:18
  admirable that they were very intentional.
• 12:20
  Making sure you're good and being there with you and also
• 12:21
  taking you. That's super rare guys.
• 12:23
  Like that's very rare. I know, I know.
• 12:25
  And that was one of the main reasons why they homeschooled me
• 12:27
  and my sisters is because they wanted, you know, us to each
• 12:30
  like, camp out where our gifts are and the fact that they were
• 12:32
  so supportive. I'm also a lot younger than my
• 12:35
  sisters. So like, they were like, married
• 12:37
  doing their thing. And I was like, we're going to
• 12:38
  Nashville. Oh my gosh.
• 12:40
  OK, so they're like fully like adult adults?
• 12:42
  Yeah, yeah, they're also my best friend, so they're very
• 12:45
  supportive. But yeah, so I started working
• 12:47
  with like producers and everything and then when I was.
• 12:50
  Seen. Was that exciting?
• 12:50
  It was so exciting. I was like, I'm him.
• 12:54
  It was, yeah, I was. I was very excited.
• 12:56
  It was super fun. I was just write songs, make
• 12:59
  music, and then I would go back home and there was not many,
• 13:02
  There was not much music in my hometown.
• 13:04
  So I learned to produce, and I already played piano because I'd
• 13:07
  been taking since I was like. Yeah, you're an instrumentalist
• 13:09
  too. Thanks.
• 13:10
  Yeah, and then my dad is also a guitarist, so he would teach me
• 13:12
  a guitar. I can't.
• 13:14
  Right now, Right now, worth it. That's OK.
• 13:17
  But we we can if she needs to. Yeah, we could take them off,
• 13:20
  yeah. For sure, for sure, yeah.
• 13:22
  So I would just go back home every month, though.
• 13:24
  I'd be so excited to like. Go back and then.
• 13:27
  Back and I ended up moving there.
• 13:28
  I was going to say you moved there though, right?
• 13:30
  Yeah, I was a senior in high school, and because I
• 13:32
  homeschooled, I got so much done In my previous years.
• 13:34
  As a senior, I had like, you know, science and writing, and
• 13:37
  that was it. Yeah.
• 13:38
  So you're like, I can go. Yeah.
• 13:39
  And then I knew I was going to take a gap year for college, and
• 13:42
  that gap year is still happening.
• 13:43
  I was going to say, did you go to college?
• 13:45
  No, I was like, oh, gap year. OK, OK.
• 13:48
  Yeah, no. Wait, so you mentioned that, you
• 13:50
  know, back home you were singing in churches.
• 13:52
  Like, did this, like, how did this influence you?
• 13:54
  Like, were you, do you have a religious background?
• 13:56
  Do you have a religious upbringing?
• 13:57
  How's that like influencing your music, your artistry, like who
• 14:00
  you are as an artist? Yeah, for sure.
• 14:02
  So yeah, I grew up in the church and Christian Church, like non
• 14:07
  denominational, you know, it was great.
• 14:08
  I had a good experience. Obviously there's a lot of, I
• 14:11
  had like good and bad experiences because I feel like
• 14:15
  everybody does, but there's so many sometimes people ruin
• 14:19
  spirituality for. Everybody else, it's like the.
• 14:20
  Music industry There's so many bad people in the music
• 14:23
  industry, but you can't let it ruin the rest of the industry
• 14:26
  and the most amazing people that you could also meet you.
• 14:28
  Know what? I mean so.
• 14:31
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 14:32
  So it's like, you know, I feel like sometimes people just ruin
• 14:34
  things and miss the whole point. And for me, like spirituality
• 14:37
  and like being a Christian now is just like focusing on loving
• 14:40
  kindness, which it's like sometimes that gets lost in
• 14:43
  translation with, you know, religions.
• 14:46
  And it's, it's really sad, you know what I mean?
• 14:49
  But it's also like anytime I've gotten away from it, I feel like
• 14:53
  I haven't found my center. And every time I'm really just
• 14:56
  like. What do you find that balance
• 14:57
  then? I feel like it's, it's very
• 15:00
  difficult sometimes because I think separating, you know,
• 15:04
  experiences that have hurt you and then also what you can gain
• 15:09
  out of spirituality is a hard thing to separate.
• 15:11
  But I think as I became an adult and moved to LA and was around a
• 15:16
  lot of different opinions and everything, like I think I just
• 15:19
  grew as a person and then I found like my center and how,
• 15:22
  you know, my most creative self is like when I'm my most
• 15:25
  spiritual self as well. Interesting.
• 15:27
  I totally feel that too. You know what I always say?
• 15:29
  Like I always tell, I write this in my journal all the time, but
• 15:31
  I feel closest to God when I'm at a show.
• 15:34
  When I'm at a concert and I'm seeing an artist I love perform
• 15:36
  music I love, that's when I literally, it's a religious
• 15:38
  experience for me. I'm not even kidding.
• 15:40
  That's when I feel the closest to God.
• 15:41
  That's when I feel like I hear God.
• 15:42
  That's when I feel like God's like with me.
• 15:44
  It's crazy. Music moves me.
• 15:45
  Yeah, that is. The entire thing, you know what
• 15:48
  I mean? Like people talk about church.
• 15:49
  I'm like, churches could be anywhere.
• 15:51
  Yes, church is a club. I'm just kidding.
• 15:53
  Church is like, no, church is music to me.
• 15:55
  Yeah, 'cause like I also had like I was telling this to
• 15:57
  Grayson last night, but I was like, my experience with church
• 16:01
  was I came to church myself and I was seeking like faith and
• 16:05
  religion and then I was just so integrated in church and I just,
• 16:10
  the more I was getting into it, the more I was like, I don't
• 16:12
  know if this aligns with me, but I left with my faith still.
• 16:15
  So I wouldn't consider myself religious or like, you know,
• 16:18
  anything like that. But like I feel very much of my
• 16:21
  faith and like, you know, a believer what I believe in,
• 16:23
  etcetera. So and I feel like that was that
• 16:26
  actually, you know, what's interesting is I was asking you
• 16:27
  like how that influences you and your music.
• 16:29
  I feel like that influences a lot of my music and my lyrics
• 16:31
  and like, tropes I like to write about.
• 16:33
  Like I like tapping into religion.
• 16:35
  It's just like a really, really sacred idea.
• 16:38
  How do you think like it influences yours?
• 16:39
  I mean, so I grew up doing leading worship.
• 16:43
  That's right. Yeah.
• 16:43
  And in the worship band, I started when I was like 11, just
• 16:46
  singing background vocals. And my sister also was leading
• 16:49
  worship growing up. So I was always like, playing
• 16:51
  keys and doing that. So I think like musically, there
• 16:55
  was always just something so like powerful that would move me
• 16:57
  whenever I was listening to like good worship music.
• 17:00
  And I think that can go for any genre, any style of music, you
• 17:03
  know, if you can make. If you're connecting, you're
• 17:06
  connecting. Yeah, that's what I want.
• 17:07
  Like I want to feel something when I listen to something.
• 17:09
  That's my biggest thing. Like, I'm such a fucking freak.
• 17:13
  Actually, this is probably completely normal, but I'll be
• 17:15
  in sessions and I'll be like, listen, I can't tell you what
• 17:18
  I'm looking for, but I am looking for a vibe.
• 17:20
  So when we find the vibe, I'll let you know.
• 17:21
  Yeah, right. I'm like, can you make it sound
• 17:23
  like bubbles? Can you make it sound like
• 17:25
  glitter? I'll be like, yeah, so I need
• 17:27
  like a little sparkle here. Yeah, if you can find out what
• 17:29
  that means, Right? Absolutely.
• 17:31
  Yeah, that's the thing with like learning to produce when I was
• 17:33
  young is it did help me speak the language.
• 17:35
  I was going to say it's a language.
• 17:36
  It is a language like. Whole thing, but I'm so nerdy
• 17:39
  about it. I love that shit.
• 17:39
  I'm. Like, no, but you're right, it
• 17:40
  doesn't have to be. And that's how you also, like
• 17:42
  communicate too, especially when you're in a session working with
• 17:44
  producer. Like when I first started doing
• 17:46
  sessions, I was like, I don't know the language.
• 17:48
  So it's really difficult for me to convey what I'm looking for
• 17:50
  and what I want. But like, yeah, you, I'm
• 17:53
  learning. It's a language, guys.
• 17:54
  It's literally a language. It really is.
• 17:56
  It really is, Yeah, but you're. Also producing too.
• 17:57
  So it's like you, you're there, you're also creating the
• 18:01
  language for. Yourself 100 percent 100% yeah
• 18:04
  but like yeah, growing up in the church and doing worship music
• 18:07
  was definitely a crazy experience but again, like I was
• 18:10
  saying I feel like a lot of people have such bad experiences
• 18:12
  in church, which. That is completely valid I've
• 18:15
  had that too me too and I. And I think like if you can find
• 18:20
  the grounding sense of spirituality where?
• 18:22
  And your own spirituality and what that means to you and how
• 18:25
  it like affects you and what like.
• 18:26
  Yes, everyone's your own. Relationship with it, your own
• 18:29
  relationship with the universe, your own relationship with God.
• 18:30
  Like everyone's different. It's like exactly what you said
• 18:33
  if you had a bad experience, like valid too.
• 18:34
  But like, I think we're all on our own individual journey with.
• 18:37
  100% And now I'm like, I'm in Lai found a church that I love
• 18:41
  and the one of the main things I connect with is the music there.
• 18:44
  And so that's just like, again, it's like going to a concert,
• 18:47
  you know, you can find it anywhere.
• 18:48
  It's a grounding thing for you too.
• 18:49
  Yeah, 100%. I even, I always say like I feel
• 18:52
  like when I'm writing songs, sometimes it feels like it
• 18:54
  doesn't come for myself. It's like me too, someone else
• 18:56
  is telling me the lyrics in my ear.
• 18:58
  And that's how that's why it's so comforting to just be like,
• 19:00
  oh, I can like sit. Back, I love that cause enjoy
• 19:03
  it. I feel the exact fucking same
• 19:04
  way where I'm like also I have this like paranoia where I'm
• 19:06
  like, listen, if I don't get into studio and get this out now
• 19:08
  someone else is going to write it.
• 19:10
  Which is actually really interesting 'cause we, I, we
• 19:12
  just clocked. I have a song called Sleepwalk
• 19:14
  and like in detox, right? In detox, she was like
• 19:19
  sleepwalking back to you. And I was like, that's that's
• 19:21
  literally my hook. And I was like kings.
• 19:23
  I texted you like, bitch, I know I sent you a screen recording.
• 19:27
  I was. Like, I know I was like, I was
• 19:28
  like, why are you sending me a screen recording on my own
• 19:30
  talking? Then I was like, oh.
• 19:32
  Yes, girl clocked, clocked. I was like shut up, locked in
• 19:35
  and I thought it was like hella unique with that.
• 19:37
  So I was like. No, it is.
• 19:39
  Kind of, yeah. I mean, both of us clocked.
• 19:41
  It is yeah, No, but that song also like the my song Detox I I
• 19:45
  just wanted to use like even the word detox.
• 19:46
  I'm like that's fucking weird. Like there's so many weird like
• 19:49
  to be. Honest, like you're such an
• 19:50
  interesting, unique lyricist and songwriter and artist in
• 19:53
  general. Like even like the entire album,
• 19:54
  like food for thought. Like if you look at the titles
• 19:56
  alone, they're, they're kind of abstract.
• 19:59
  And that's interesting. Cause actually a pretentious
• 20:01
  mission of mine for my project is I wanna make sure the titles
• 20:04
  are interesting and thought evoking 'cause I'm more likely
• 20:07
  to click on it. You know what I mean?
• 20:08
  Like I'm gonna click on. I hate that for me.
• 20:11
  Like let's find out a. 100% no, I'm the same.
• 20:14
  I'm the same way. I'm like, I want the most
• 20:16
  interesting title that maybe nobody's ever used.
• 20:18
  You're. Like hella clocking it.
• 20:19
  You're hella clocking it. I'm the literally girl.
• 20:22
  I have a song. It's I played it for you.
• 20:24
  Actually, it's it's hot when boys cry.
• 20:27
  And I asked Chachi, BT and Google and I was like, is there
• 20:30
  any titles that have this? And they're like, no, I was
• 20:32
  like, OK, good, 'cause I don't, I want that.
• 20:35
  I want that title, you know what I mean?
• 20:37
  And it's like a unique thing. And it's like, it feels like
• 20:38
  person is your own artistry. Yeah, and it makes the listener
• 20:41
  feel immediately locked in with what you're saying.
• 20:44
  'Cause that's my thing. I like a fake out.
• 20:45
  I like a title where it's like, what is this song gonna be
• 20:47
  about? Yes, I like a fake out.
• 20:49
  So. Much that's the thing with hate
• 20:50
  that for me is I was like, yeah, we're gonna be like love that
• 20:53
  for me sarcastically. And I was like.
• 20:54
  Nah, 1,000,000% And then you, yeah, Oh my God, you really went
• 20:57
  in on yourself on that one. I did.
• 20:59
  We're gonna get into that song. We're gonna get into the entire
• 21:01
  album. But basically when when you
• 21:03
  moved to Nashville, like, So what was that situation like?
• 21:05
  You just started writing songs. Was it for yourself?
• 21:07
  Was it for other artists? Like what was the situation
• 21:09
  there? Yeah, it was mainly for myself
• 21:11
  and I didn't have a manager or anything.
• 21:13
  So you were just out there doing?
• 21:14
  It I was just out there doing it.
• 21:15
  I was trying to make connections.
• 21:16
  I mean, I, the first producer I met, I met a bunch of people
• 21:21
  through him. And then you meet people
• 21:23
  through, you know what I mean? Every time you get put in a new
• 21:24
  session with a new person, you realize how small the music
• 21:28
  industry is. So I was, I really do feel like
• 21:31
  I'll end up back in Nashville. It feels like more of my
• 21:33
  hometown than my actual hometown, to be honest.
• 21:35
  It just immediately felt. Like when was the last time you
• 21:37
  like? Do you visit often or?
• 21:39
  A good amount I try like 4 * a year.
• 21:40
  Yeah, 'cause you're also like, you want to go there and work
• 21:42
  too in songwrite too, yeah. Yeah, I really want to have a
• 21:44
  place there that's like a goal for this year is just to 'cause
• 21:47
  I love it. I'm like, I want to live on a
• 21:50
  farm and like cut grass at some point in my old age.
• 21:52
  Oh my gosh, I hear that so much on the show.
• 21:54
  That's so funny. You know, people really just
• 21:56
  want a peaceful life. Like, imagine that.
• 21:59
  Imagine. I can't imagine that, but that's
• 22:01
  OK. I'll visit you.
• 22:03
  Please do, it'll be a very. Peaceful visit yes you and your
• 22:06
  horses all of that I want to do a riding camp in Nashville I
• 22:09
  also want to do 1 in New York so like.
• 22:11
  That's. What I'm thinking like I'm, I
• 22:13
  don't know. We'll see.
• 22:14
  We'll see how the Europe that's back.
• 22:15
  Riding camps in New York and Nashville.
• 22:17
  Maybe. Fuck it.
• 22:18
  We'll see if my if my team allows it.
• 22:21
  Yeah, we'll see. OK, so you're in Nashville.
• 22:24
  How long were you in Nashville for?
• 22:25
  Because now you're in LA. Yeah, only three years.
• 22:27
  Three years, so I went 16 to. So I actually moved there when I
• 22:31
  was 1818. OK, 18 to freshly 21 is when I
• 22:35
  applied for my first apartment here actually.
• 22:38
  Or maybe I was 20. Wait, So what finally brought
• 22:40
  you for like saying like, OK, now I'm going to leave Nashville
• 22:42
  to go to LA? Yeah.
• 22:42
  So at the time I in 2020 I signed my first record deal and
• 22:46
  they were mainly out. Oh my God.
• 22:48
  Wait how was that? Honestly it was a good
• 22:50
  experience. I feel a lot of people have bad
• 22:52
  first experiences. People have a lot of bad.
• 22:54
  First, that's. I'm curious.
• 22:55
  Yeah, I'm so. Curious.
• 22:56
  Like basically all the creative control and it was more of an
• 22:58
  indie label. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 22:59
  And I had a lot of faster so. And it was like a mutually yeah,
• 23:03
  everybody I worked with was super chill.
• 23:06
  And then the last option I just didn't pick up because I didn't
• 23:09
  feel like it aligned really. And.
• 23:11
  That's really like, that's so intentional 'cause I feel like a
• 23:13
  lot of artists feel like that's the only way they're gonna be
• 23:16
  seen and heard. Yeah.
• 23:17
  Working over record label. Yeah.
• 23:19
  And I think honestly, I like kind of got off the hook because
• 23:22
  I wasn't signed to a major and so it wasn't.
• 23:24
  You got to go through the record label experience without being
• 23:26
  locked in and being like tightly woven into like a contract that
• 23:30
  could, like, keep you forever. We've all been there. 100% And
• 23:33
  then I also had so many friends out here.
• 23:36
  I was collaborating with a lot of different artists, writers,
• 23:39
  producers, and I just realized that like I love Nashville, but
• 23:41
  I feel like in LA there's no ceiling.
• 23:45
  And I'm like, I want to, we need to write for the future.
• 23:47
  We need to not write for what's popular now.
• 23:49
  And so my creative was fully explored by my collaborators
• 23:53
  here. And so that's why I wanted to.
• 23:55
  I also just like, I don't know, I just liked it.
• 23:58
  I was like, I may as well try. I was also living with my
• 24:00
  parents throughout the pandemic. I'd never lived alone or just
• 24:04
  like not in their house. And so I was like, I need to
• 24:06
  just. This is time move.
• 24:07
  Out, yeah, and then my. Always a big jump too.
• 24:10
  To be independent, like to live alone and like to be.
• 24:13
  Out of that. For the first.
• 24:14
  Time, yeah, and my ex-boyfriend lived here and I and then my
• 24:16
  sister was also about to move close to the area too, and.
• 24:19
  There's a lot of reason to come. There was a yeah, So that's why
• 24:22
  I was like, this is great. And then also, I'll still visit
• 24:24
  in Nashville. But yeah.
• 24:25
  So, so then when you come out to LA, like what are you doing
• 24:28
  here? When you immediately get here?
• 24:29
  You've been songwriting for yourself in Nashville.
• 24:31
  Did you still have your record deal when you came out to LA?
• 24:33
  Yes. Yes.
• 24:34
  How long were you doing the record deal for?
• 24:36
  It was about a year and a half. Okay.
• 24:38
  We probably like 2 years in total with negotiations and all
• 24:42
  of that. Yeah, since.
• 24:44
  Initially, yeah, since initially talking with them, but yeah, for
• 24:47
  about a year and a half. And I did, Oh my gosh, like 4 to
• 24:50
  6 songs with them. And yeah, it was a good
• 24:54
  experience. But I do feel like it really
• 24:56
  helped with getting connections to new producers.
• 24:59
  I think that's the important thing, too, Yeah.
• 25:01
  Like a lot of things have to open doors.
• 25:02
  You need to meet the right people who are going to
• 25:04
  introduce you to more right people.
• 25:05
  And like a. 100%. Making those connections,
• 25:07
  finding new people to collaborate with, new people to
• 25:08
  work with. We were just talking about this.
• 25:10
  Yeah, and they also, I've probably the best connection I
• 25:12
  got out of not even connection, but just like one of my best
• 25:15
  friends is my manager Russell. Oh yeah, they connected us.
• 25:18
  We met when I was like 20. And then like how?
• 25:20
  Long have you been working together.
• 25:22
  Almost two years. Oh my God.
• 25:24
  Yeah. Special for a while.
• 25:25
  Yeah, that's super special. Yeah.
• 25:27
  So like, I'm grateful for that entire experience.
• 25:30
  Yeah. Any any label that gives you
• 25:31
  creative control, I'm like. It's so rare.
• 25:34
  Like, I feel like most people who sit on this couch where
• 25:37
  you're sitting, who assigned to a record label have such horror
• 25:40
  stories about it. But I always tell people I'm
• 25:42
  like, you know, Bonnie McKee says this all the time.
• 25:44
  But like being dropped or leaving your first record label
• 25:47
  is a rite of passage. For 100% and I can 100%.
• 25:50
  So I'm ready for that label and to be dropped.
• 25:52
  I'm just kidding. You know, we'll see whatever
• 25:55
  happens, right? Right.
• 25:56
  We're only welcoming the best of chorus.
• 25:58
  So you had a very first chaotic year living in LA.
• 26:00
  Like, what was chaotic for you? What happened?
• 26:02
  It was chaotic because I just was so depressed.
• 26:05
  I was just. Like.
• 26:06
  I was living alone and it's so funny because I was in this
• 26:09
  gorgeous apartment and I had all these things that should have
• 26:11
  made me happy. I was in not a great
• 26:14
  relationship and I thought it was amazing at the time, of
• 26:16
  course, but it was very back and forth chaotic.
• 26:21
  And then and yeah, I also within that first year of living here,
• 26:25
  that's when I I dropped my label.
• 26:29
  Period. Anyway, no big deal.
• 26:31
  No, but but yeah, so it was just really hard.
• 26:33
  I feel like I was alone a lot. I would just look at my
• 26:35
  apartment. I was like, I'm the only one
• 26:36
  here, This is really weird. Then I go to sessions and the
• 26:39
  music is what really saved me and got got me out of that.
• 26:43
  And then I started Therapy Claw in like April.
• 26:46
  Hate that for you. Yes.
• 26:48
  And I, I literally, I wrote, hate that for me two days before
• 26:51
  my first day of therapy. Oh my God, how real.
• 26:54
  Yeah, so I was like, I need therapy.
• 26:56
  But you know what? You, you're self aware and you
• 26:58
  did that. Yeah, yeah.
• 27:00
  OK. Yeah.
• 27:01
  So that was your first year in LA?
• 27:02
  Yeah. I have a burning question.
• 27:04
  I was like, I have never. I don't even know this.
• 27:06
  I don't know the answer to this at all.
• 27:07
  I want to know, like, where did your artist named Kings come
• 27:10
  from? Like the Lord behind that.
• 27:12
  I don't know why I've never asked.
• 27:13
  I'm like, wait, I'm actually. So it's such a powerful, such a
• 27:16
  powerful name, such a powerful artist name.
• 27:18
  How crazy. Like very, very just it's
• 27:21
  strong. So where did that come from?
• 27:23
  Thank you. Yeah.
• 27:24
  So it was literally just like a nickname in high school.
• 27:27
  Like it was just a nickname, and it just kind of caught on.
• 27:29
  And yeah, so. Where did that nickname come
• 27:32
  from? Just like.
• 27:33
  It kind of comes from like a a spiritual background.
• 27:36
  Like whenever I'd be like down on myself, my mom would be like,
• 27:39
  remember whose you are. Like you're the kings, you're
• 27:42
  taken care of, you're the universe is like God has got
• 27:44
  you, you know what I mean? And so it's kind of like a
• 27:47
  possessive tense instead of you don't even interest ownership.
• 27:50
  Yeah. So it just kind of caught on.
• 27:53
  And then, yeah, my government name is Kaylin.
• 27:55
  But like, nobody calls me that unless they're like joking.
• 27:58
  Most they're like Kaylin. I always joke.
• 28:01
  My manager and I always talk about like Kaylin is the one who
• 28:03
  writes all my depressing songs. She's the.
• 28:06
  Serious like sad girl like kings is like.
• 28:09
  Did he? So it feels like Kings is
• 28:10
  writing like the new music. I got a little preview of them
• 28:13
  and they're. Yeah.
• 28:14
  It's actually super different. Yeah.
• 28:16
  Than your debut. Yeah.
• 28:17
  Oh my. God, it's so funny though you
• 28:18
  bring up the name 'cause I feel like to my family I'm like
• 28:21
  Auntie Kay and then like a boyfriend calls me Kay and then
• 28:23
  I have like like so many different I.
• 28:25
  Feel like you got a lot of You are Hannah Montana.
• 28:28
  You are Hannah Montana. That's crazy.
• 28:29
  Yeah, I want personalities. Don't know if it's a good thing.
• 28:32
  Well, do you introduce yourself as kings?
• 28:33
  Like, let's say, like you're just meeting someone.
• 28:35
  You're saying? Yeah.
• 28:36
  Like all my friends call me that.
• 28:37
  Yeah, yeah, because I've actually never heard anyone call
• 28:39
  you otherwise, except one time we were at a bar and then I
• 28:42
  forgot her name, but it was one of your friends.
• 28:43
  She was like Caitlin. And I was like, huh, Yeah.
• 28:47
  Like. No, yeah.
• 28:47
  Literally. Like, no one calls me that
• 28:49
  except, like, a handful of people.
• 28:52
  So. Yeah.
• 28:53
  And I feel like it was so funny too.
• 28:54
  Like names are kind of weird. Like coming from, you know, my
• 28:57
  hometown, what people knew me as and you know, and just whatever,
• 29:00
  like what is, But it's like, it's literally just a nickname
• 29:02
  and it's like. I like that story.
• 29:05
  That's really good. That's good lore.
• 29:07
  Yeah, that's good lore. Kings lore.
• 29:09
  OK, well, let's get into more Kings lore.
• 29:11
  We learned so much about you on your debut album.
• 29:14
  Food for Thought. Thank you.
• 29:15
  So tell me about this album, this process.
• 29:17
  Like what? How does album transpire?
• 29:20
  So I started writing it early 2021 without knowing it.
• 29:25
  I wrote the first song. You were just writing to write.
• 29:27
  I was just writing to write I initially.
• 29:29
  Honestly, this entire album started with my song Jacket,
• 29:31
  which was one of the first few singles, and I wrote that.
• 29:35
  I wrote it literally by myself and I remember as I was writing
• 29:37
  it, I was like, this is my all too well moment.
• 29:39
  This is going to. Be we all.
• 29:40
  We've all had that. I think every artist is exactly
• 29:42
  what you're talking. About I'm like this is going to
• 29:43
  be an accidentally an 8 minute song I just needed.
• 29:46
  I was going through an awful heartbreak and it was like a
• 29:49
  situation ship and I was like, I'm not even allowed to be this
• 29:51
  sad about this but. Girl, literally in my session
• 29:54
  yesterday, I sat down with my writers, Timothy Skyler and Sky
• 29:57
  Holiday, and I was like, guys, this needs me.
• 30:00
  And all too well. And I'm like, if I'm not crying
• 30:02
  during in the session, the song's not good enough.
• 30:04
  So we're going to take it there. We're going to twist a knife
• 30:06
  like. You have to.
• 30:08
  You have to. That's the best.
• 30:09
  I'm so happy you said that because what a fucking concept.
• 30:12
  Yeah, that's crazy. And look at that like it's.
• 30:14
  Amazing. And it's the only, or one of the
• 30:16
  only songs I have out there that's like 100% I wrote it.
• 30:19
  That's so special it. Was so special I recorded it a
• 30:22
  few months later. I wanted it to be as close to
• 30:25
  the actual writing day as possible because there's so much
• 30:27
  magic when you're in the feeling.
• 30:29
  Wait, girl, I literally just texted I'm so sorry.
• 30:33
  I want to I want to talk about this.
• 30:34
  I'm so sorry. No, I'm just so shocked because
• 30:36
  I'm like, wait, I feel so fucking seen right now.
• 30:38
  I just texted my producer and my my songwriter, my Co writer for
• 30:42
  the song. I was like, guys, we need to
• 30:43
  move quick. I'm in this right now.
• 30:46
  I need to put the key on this, this capture the feeling.
• 30:48
  I need to write about it now. We need to move quick like we
• 30:50
  need to. We need to do the song as
• 30:51
  quickly as possible. Not to rush it by any means, but
• 30:54
  to be like, this is how I'm feeling.
• 30:56
  This word is so like exactly what you're saying.
• 30:58
  I'm so sorry. Go ahead, you have to.
• 31:00
  You have to. No, you're fine.
• 31:01
  No, literally, I like unintentional.
• 31:03
  I didn't realize I was writing the album when I started it, and
• 31:07
  then I realized it just really worked for this project.
• 31:09
  But I initially started this project because every single
• 31:13
  song on the album has like a double meaning.
• 31:16
  And at the time, when I was in the thick of it, I didn't even
• 31:20
  realize what I was going through.
• 31:21
  But I was just struggling really hard with an eating disorder.
• 31:24
  Yeah. And I that developed from my
• 31:28
  childhood and then and on. Yeah.
• 31:30
  And that was one of the reasons why my first year in LA was so
• 31:32
  bad is because I didn't know really what I was going.
• 31:35
  Through something's off. Something's kind of like
• 31:36
  different. You can't pin it yet.
• 31:38
  Yeah, and it affected my behaviour so drastically in 20
• 31:41
  or 2020 and 2021 that I like go back and I'm like, I don't
• 31:45
  remember this like the brain fog crazy.
• 31:47
  It's ridiculous. It.
• 31:48
  Yeah. And.
• 31:49
  It's like I lived, but did I like?
• 31:50
  I don't, right? Yeah, yeah.
• 31:53
  And I just realized I had all these like self-destructive
• 31:56
  behaviors. And then that's around the time
• 31:59
  that I wrote. Hate that for me.
• 32:00
  Yeah, it's because I was about to go to therapy specifically
• 32:03
  for that and I needed it so bad. But it's also weird when you're
• 32:06
  going through something and you don't realize it, but then it's
• 32:08
  coming out in my art. And I remember I would be like
• 32:11
  writing stuff that I'm like, this is about my eating
• 32:14
  disorder, but I'm going to make it seem like it's a toxic
• 32:17
  relationship with my boyfriend or toxic relationship or.
• 32:19
  The there's so many layers to that.
• 32:20
  I love songs that are nuanced like that.
• 32:22
  Like those are really special when it's just really good
• 32:25
  writing. Like I was telling you, I don't
• 32:27
  know if I told you I'm telling you now, I love I self destruct
• 32:29
  for a living. I pay my rent with my damage
• 32:31
  cause like 1 super relatable. Just as an entertainer in
• 32:34
  general, yes, absolutely. But also just like how self
• 32:37
  aware I was talking about this with another artist or producer.
• 32:42
  I, I was talking to someone, but a lot of artists aren't very
• 32:46
  self aware. They have a self-awareness, but
• 32:48
  it's a lot of like I'm the victim and like I was hurt.
• 32:50
  And that's completely fair and valid in everyone's stories, But
• 32:53
  it's really rare to see an artist sit here and be like, I'm
• 32:55
  acknowledging my own behaviors and I'm acknowledging my part in
• 33:00
  what has happened. So like that's a rareness.
• 33:02
  I love shit like that. I feel like that's what I want
• 33:04
  in my music too. Like I, I never just want to be
• 33:06
  like, I'm the victim. This happened to me.
• 33:07
  I want to be like, well, maybe I, maybe I had a part of it.
• 33:10
  Maybe I did something like that. And I think that takes a little
• 33:12
  a degree of like really being introspective, you know?
• 33:15
  And I like that about your music, especially this project
• 33:17
  and the way this entire project kind of flows in everything that
• 33:20
  you're saying. It's like, like I said, we
• 33:22
  really get to know you, like every part of you, like the dark
• 33:24
  parts of you, like the parts of you that you know a lot of
• 33:27
  people don't want to say out loud. 100% yeah, thank you for
• 33:30
  saying that. I mean, I even to this day, like
• 33:33
  talking about, you know, diving into what I went through to get
• 33:36
  this project is still uncomfortable for me and that's
• 33:38
  why I need to be talking about it more.
• 33:40
  You know what I mean, 'cause people don't like talk about
• 33:45
  eating disorders. But then also if if that's not
• 33:47
  specific to whoever is listening to it, it could be a toxic
• 33:49
  relationship with a. Boyfriend, I wouldn't have like
• 33:52
  you never exactly that. I wouldn't have clocked that
• 33:54
  myself through my first listen either.
• 33:56
  And then you start talking about it with me and I look at it into
• 33:58
  new contact and that's exciting about.
• 34:00
  Like that's what detox is about. See, that's exciting.
• 34:03
  Like I didn't I wouldn't have any, you know, because it comes
• 34:06
  off like exactly you said you comply to relationships with
• 34:09
  people or like other things, right?
• 34:10
  A. 100%, yeah. And then I also was super.
• 34:13
  I'm just like the biggest Alice in Wonderland junkie.
• 34:16
  And I feel like that was a big part of my childhood.
• 34:21
  But then growing up I realized like a lot of the characters are
• 34:25
  almost like different parts of what a disorder could be.
• 34:28
  Yeah, different manifestations of that I can.
• 34:30
  Totally see that and so that like inspired the visual and.
• 34:32
  That completely makes sense and I.
• 34:34
  Want the yellow hair? The album cover, too, because,
• 34:36
  like, I'm curious. You're not you yourself, Your
• 34:40
  face is not on the cover. Like, yeah.
• 34:41
  What is the intention behind this?
• 34:43
  Like, it's just a very. It's an artsy, interesting cover
• 34:46
  art, you know? Yeah.
• 34:47
  So it's trippy, you know? Yeah.
• 34:48
  Yeah. And so I wanted that.
• 34:49
  I want it to be like very surreal feeling.
• 34:51
  Yeah. Almost like you're lucid
• 34:53
  dreaming and you know, Yeah. And so, so I wanted it to be not
• 34:57
  super on the nose. Alice inspire 'cause I feel like
• 34:59
  that's been done before. But also like I, I always say
• 35:02
  that like yellow is just like cartoon blonde.
• 35:04
  And so I feel like I'm, you know.
• 35:06
  Cartoon, Cartoon blonde. I fucking love that cartoon.
• 35:08
  Yeah, I've never heard that. Before new Instagram bio
• 35:11
  honestly. I love that.
• 35:12
  Oh my God. Hell.
• 35:14
  Yeah, like I was so inspired by this, but I wanted to show with
• 35:17
  each cover art, I'm a different size and like in a different
• 35:20
  position in the same room. That's true 'cause we see it as
• 35:23
  you're doing the rollout in the single artworks leading to the
• 35:26
  final album. Yeah.
• 35:27
  And so basically I'm in the same room and I'm, you know, upside
• 35:31
  down. I'm really tiny in the corner.
• 35:33
  It's just, you know, the first single with this rollout was
• 35:36
  just the room. And then I start to be in it and
• 35:38
  it and then the actual album is like, I'm out of it, but you
• 35:41
  just see my hand and my foot. So it's like that's you're like.
• 35:45
  That's crazy. It's also like the world
• 35:47
  building behind the project itself too.
• 35:49
  Let's talk about like the roll out for it.
• 35:51
  Like how intentional you said. Even with the very first single,
• 35:53
  you knew this was the world you wanted, the visual world you
• 35:55
  wanted. Like creating this.
• 35:57
  Yeah. This project.
• 35:59
  Like, yeah, yeah, I feel like a lot of people would kind of look
• 36:03
  at me and my personality and be like, Oh my gosh.
• 36:04
  Bubbly. Yellow hair.
• 36:06
  Sunflower. Bright, so sweet.
• 36:08
  But it's like it's, it's dark up here and.
• 36:10
  It's dark up there, yeah. So I was like, I really wanted
• 36:13
  to like, you know, there's a little what a campiness with it,
• 36:16
  but I also wanted to like tap into like the dark.
• 36:19
  I feel like I leave all of my like dark emotions for myself.
• 36:21
  And that goes back into like the self destruction and the, you
• 36:24
  know, and the whole theme of the album.
• 36:26
  And so I wanted to like portray that with the visuals as well.
• 36:29
  And so we literally, you know, no label, limited budget.
• 36:32
  And so our team, we had we shot every single visual for the
• 36:36
  entire album in one day. Yeah, ridiculous.
• 36:40
  I had a really good like photographer Photoshop, you
• 36:44
  know, Damn. Ambitious.
• 36:46
  That's crazy. I can't wait.
• 36:47
  It at like 4 PMI. Can't hear you.
• 36:50
  OK, That's kind of nice. Get it.
• 36:52
  Get it done to. Yeah, OK.
• 36:54
  Yeah, ambitious. Yeah, I had an amazing creative
• 36:56
  director and it's so great having somebody direct you
• 37:00
  because once you have it, I don't have to be overthinking
• 37:02
  she's. Like you want to be able to
• 37:03
  perform too, and then you want to trust other people's visions
• 37:06
  that we're getting the right thing.
• 37:07
  Absolutely. Having the right team around you
• 37:10
  is so game changing, especially as a creative because like I
• 37:13
  always say this, like for me, it's like, please just handle
• 37:17
  everything so I can focus on making the art great.
• 37:19
  That's what I want to do. I want to focus on the
• 37:21
  performance. I want to focus on the what I'm
• 37:23
  doing to be the best it could be.
• 37:25
  So we need the right people around you to make sure, like,
• 37:27
  everything's falling into place, right?
• 37:28
  100% yeah. And I don't think people
• 37:30
  understand how many details it is like obviously we got all the
• 37:33
  cover arts, but then you also need Instagram photos, you need
• 37:36
  updated Spotify photos. It's.
• 37:38
  Honestly, being an artist. Is press, if you know what I
• 37:40
  mean. Like I.
• 37:41
  Think Amy Allen and said like being an artist was like 10% of
• 37:44
  just being in a studio and 90% of like promoting it and like
• 37:47
  trying to get. It out.
• 37:48
  That's what I've been struggling with recently is I have been
• 37:51
  getting so caught in the logistics and I'm like, I should
• 37:52
  actually just listen to the music more and be excited.
• 37:54
  Oh my God. Yeah.
• 37:55
  But you've been doing it for a while too.
• 37:57
  And like, it's easy to get caught up in that, especially
• 37:59
  like, you know, making the art. We obviously all want to make
• 38:03
  music. That's great that we love it.
• 38:05
  It's also we want it to be heard.
• 38:05
  We genuinely want it to be heard.
• 38:07
  I think that's something that a lot of people don't like to be
• 38:08
  emit. It was like, oh, I don't care
• 38:10
  about numbers or streams. It's like, no, I, I want it to
• 38:12
  be heard. I want it to be heard.
• 38:13
  I want it to be connected. I want people to resonate.
• 38:15
  I want people to feel the type of way.
• 38:17
  That's kind of why we're doing. It like heard and also like
• 38:20
  felt. Felt so like there's a reason
• 38:21
  and a purpose and a soul in the songs and like also so much work
• 38:25
  goes into making a song. 100% and I like I literally I dropped
• 38:29
  my first couple singles when I was like 15, just put them on
• 38:32
  YouTube. And then I, I dropped my first
• 38:34
  like actual single when I was 19 and it was like 6 months after I
• 38:38
  had a crazy TikTok moment and that like totally changed my
• 38:42
  life and then led me to my first record deal.
• 38:45
  But you know, it's a lot and you just like, see behind the scenes
• 38:48
  how crazy it is, like 100. Percent, Yeah, because honestly,
• 38:51
  a lot of people don't see that and people don't see how fast
• 38:53
  things move when they move and then how you have to jump on it
• 38:56
  as quickly as possible in keeping up and then, yeah,
• 38:58
  fighting an algorithm and then also having to also create new
• 39:01
  art on top of that while you're doing all that.
• 39:03
  Yeah, it is too much like people do not give artists enough
• 39:06
  credit. Genuinely, I.
• 39:07
  Know and that's why I think like breaks are so important.
• 39:09
  I love how I'm saying that I'm like, I just dropped the six
• 39:11
  year album. And you're about to drop more
• 39:13
  stuff, yeah. I just like, can't stop.
• 39:16
  It's my brain. I'm like, I'm so excited about
• 39:18
  it. Good.
• 39:18
  You should be yeah, yeah, yeah. So like with this project and
• 39:22
  like honestly, with talk later that had recently come out, it
• 39:25
  is such a Sonic shift too. It feels more of like what you
• 39:28
  were saying, like bubbly, bright haired.
• 39:30
  No, no, no, like cuter, like a little bit more like, you know,
• 39:34
  curly, curly. Yeah, exactly.
• 39:36
  You got the Bedazza phone, the flip phone.
• 39:38
  Yes. Clock, we're going to talk to
• 39:40
  her later on this. All I got to do is get a SIM
• 39:42
  card. And then that's your phone.
• 39:45
  I'm just like, Can you imagine me being like out when we're
• 39:47
  like at Taylor's birthday party? I'm just like like only if only
• 39:51
  it worked, you know? What I mean, but you know we.
• 39:53
  It's a cute accessory it actually does turn on, but
• 39:55
  anyway. OK, well you know what, that's
• 39:57
  the phone we're we're going to get your SIM card right after
• 39:59
  this and then we can talk later on.
• 40:01
  That camera, anyway. Oh, does he?
• 40:03
  Yeah, that's cute. Should we take a picture?
• 40:05
  Is it on? Wait, is this, is this not a
• 40:07
  camera? Wait, maybe that's a camera.
• 40:08
  Maybe. Yeah, that's a camera.
• 40:10
  It's a good picture. That's a good picture.
• 40:13
  I mean, my, my new profile picture, I love that.
• 40:16
  Well, honestly, that's super cute and it honestly fits the
• 40:18
  aesthetic. But that's what I'm saying.
• 40:19
  Like it's such a Sonic shift from the debut album.
• 40:21
  Because actually I met you when you released Talk Later.
• 40:25
  So like when I when I came back to your discography, I was like,
• 40:29
  wait, bitch, what? She has some dark shit out there
• 40:31
  it. Was dark.
• 40:32
  No, it was it was sonically dark.
• 40:33
  It was lyrically dark and. Always cinematic too.
• 40:35
  Yes, and it's such a flip, you know what I mean?
• 40:37
  Like what what happened here in the Shift?
• 40:39
  And you made your album, you've dropped it recently as well.
• 40:41
  You're putting out this new music.
• 40:43
  Like what's kind of the Shift here?
• 40:44
  Like what? What brought you to talk later?
• 40:46
  I think the shift is, well, first of all, subject matter.
• 40:50
  I feel like I have a lot of new things to write about in my
• 40:52
  life. I have a boyfriend, OK clock.
• 40:56
  Crazy because I'm always so single.
• 40:58
  Like all of my exes. And your boyfriend super lovely,
• 41:00
  by the way. Oh.
• 41:00
  My God is he. So nice he's the.
• 41:03
  Cutest and sweetest, yeah. He's really sweet.
• 41:04
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I think I just had like new
• 41:08
  subjects to talk about. I was like, whoa, imagine a
• 41:10
  happy song. And I think that's what, yeah,
• 41:12
  obviously I always lean towards like the sad shit, but I need to
• 41:16
  remember my previous relationships and it's like I
• 41:18
  didn't write 1 happy thing. And for reason.
• 41:21
  There is that, like a little telling, a little.
• 41:23
  Maybe. Maybe a little bit, but I also
• 41:25
  think like with Food for Thought, I had written a lot of
• 41:28
  that in the previous years and this I'm trying to write for
• 41:30
  like 2029, you know what I mean? I'm trying to.
• 41:32
  Write. Like you said, you're writing
• 41:33
  for the future. Yeah, yeah.
• 41:35
  Oh my God. So yeah, we'll talk later.
• 41:36
  It's like cutesy. It's.
• 41:37
  Super intentional, very girly. Yeah, yeah.
• 41:40
  Yeah, I like that visual that you had for it too, with the
• 41:42
  bedroom. It's it's really cutesy, like
• 41:44
  Hotline period, all of it. That was fun.
• 41:47
  Yes, I really loved that one video you did.
• 41:50
  I don't know how much I could play around with right now, but
• 41:53
  like one thing I really connected with that you said
• 41:55
  was, you know, all press is good for us.
• 41:57
  I was like, oh clock, I feel that way.
• 41:59
  I really feel that way. Yes.
• 42:00
  I like that when you said that it was.
• 42:01
  Cool. All press is good for us.
• 42:02
  All press is good press. I've always said that because I
• 42:04
  think I've got. I've gotten annihilated on the
• 42:08
  Internet, to be honest. Yeah.
• 42:09
  And like without, and it's like, well, you're still talking about
• 42:13
  me and I still don't know names in the mouth who you are.
• 42:16
  And again, it's not even like a like a mean thing back.
• 42:20
  I don't think spreading hate is going to like stop hate, you
• 42:23
  know what I mean? But it's also like, you just
• 42:26
  have to be excited that people are talking about you.
• 42:27
  You're completely right. I feel like that's the attitude
• 42:29
  to have Like genuinely, all press is good for us because
• 42:31
  people are going to talk, so whatever, let them talk.
• 42:33
  Exactly, exactly, somebody said. I saw in an interview recently,
• 42:37
  Oh my God, who was it? I don't know, but they were
• 42:39
  saying like the opposite of love isn't hate, it's indifference.
• 42:43
  So people are hating on you. It's not that.
• 42:45
  They're feeling. Yeah, you're making them feel
• 42:47
  something. That's kind of what I want to
• 42:48
  like. I always I talk about this with
• 42:50
  my my team and my producers where I'm like, listen, at the
• 42:54
  end of the day, whatever song we Make, Love it or hate it, it
• 42:57
  needs to evoke a strong reaction.
• 42:59
  Like even stuff I make that people like, I really don't like
• 43:01
  this. Like, oh good, I like that.
• 43:03
  I don't people mediocre league warm.
• 43:04
  I want them to be like, I feel very strongly about this song or
• 43:07
  if you're strongly about this thing.
• 43:08
  Yeah, that's kind of the goal. Like we want people to feel
• 43:10
  things. Yeah, yeah.
• 43:12
  And like, at the time, even when I was like a teenager and first
• 43:15
  had like Tik Tok's blowing up out of nowhere and I was like,
• 43:18
  what's happening? Like I would have people on
• 43:20
  Twitter who I like was a fan of and like looked up to either
• 43:24
  hating on me or like talking. And I was like, yo, this is
• 43:26
  crazy, but I was. Also like, how do you react to
• 43:30
  that? I was like, I it's so funny,
• 43:32
  'cause like I would DM them and they'd be like, Oh my God, it's
• 43:34
  all love and. I would shut the hell off, yeah.
• 43:37
  But I was also just like, I was like, yo, this is cool.
• 43:39
  Like, what do you mean? And also it was such an
• 43:41
  accident, so. That's a really good concept
• 43:43
  though. Like I like that idea.
• 43:44
  That's strong. I like that this new music's
• 43:47
  like super exciting. Like you're writing for the
• 43:48
  future. Like you said, you also sent me
• 43:50
  some new songs that you've been working on.
• 43:52
  Honestly, they're they're so gritty.
• 43:54
  It's still very different from the debut.
• 43:56
  But like, what's the direction this next project is coming
• 43:59
  from? Like where is talk Later a part
• 44:01
  of where it's at Home. What home is it going to be on?
• 44:05
  Like what do you mean like on a project?
• 44:07
  Where are we putting on a an EP? We're making an album.
• 44:09
  What are we thinking? I think.
• 44:10
  EP But I'm not sure, I'm kind of just trying to I actually have
• 44:14
  like my calendar is stacked in May for.
• 44:17
  Sessions SO. I'm super excited because I'm
• 44:19
  like, whatever, I have these songs in my hands that I want
• 44:23
  the world to see, and also if I beat them in the process, then
• 44:28
  I'm going to serve the project best.
• 44:29
  I think. I know the overall concept.
• 44:31
  I think I know that it's an EP, but if I get crazy and add 10
• 44:36
  more songs and it's going to have to be an album.
• 44:37
  Then fucking it might be an album.
• 44:38
  I did that with for thought. Fuck it.
• 44:40
  Like, you never know. I mean, that's what's nice about
• 44:42
  writing, to write and just making things and seeing how
• 44:44
  things kind of fit and like how things evolve.
• 44:46
  That's so exciting. Especially moving on, like
• 44:49
  having your debut and moving on to what's next.
• 44:51
  And also the possibility of like, exactly what you said
• 44:53
  could be an EP, could be an album.
• 44:55
  Yeah, we'll. See exactly.
• 44:56
  So we do. Are we thinking like more things
• 44:58
  around the world? The Sonic direction of talk
• 45:00
  later, which is definitely brighter than food for thought.
• 45:03
  Yeah, definitely that. It's also like, I've been in a
• 45:06
  place where I'm like, sometimes I'll just be at my piano and I
• 45:11
  think music is really powerful and I'll just kind of, you know,
• 45:14
  sing like affirmations into songs and just like make it more
• 45:18
  positive. And I feel like that's what I'm
• 45:20
  doing like. Rules.
• 45:21
  That's something I want to do too.
• 45:23
  Yeah, let's talk about don't make the rules.
• 45:24
  Yeah, yeah, we can talk about it.
• 45:25
  But I just, I just want, I wrote that with like one of my best
• 45:27
  friends, Olivia. It was like a 9:00 PM session.
• 45:30
  It was not supposed to be like it wasn't, you know?
• 45:32
  That's where some of the best songs literally come from.
• 45:34
  New producer and another writer I didn't know.
• 45:38
  And we were just like, what are we gonna make today?
• 45:40
  And then it ended up being one of my favourites.
• 45:42
  My managers love it like my parents love it.
• 45:44
  Which is funny because I was like, oh, they're gonna be
• 45:46
  shitting on this one 'cause it's so not singy.
• 45:48
  I'm like chanting the whole thing.
• 45:50
  And my parents can quote it. It's very bold.
• 45:52
  They're obsessed with Oh my God. Yeah, I'm like a.
• 45:54
  Period. Yeah, yeah.
• 45:55
  But yeah, I just wanted to like manifest and.
• 45:57
  Talk about It feels like such an airy song, by the way.
• 45:59
  Oh my God. Like to me, like, I'm like, oh,
• 46:01
  my God. Thanks.
• 46:02
  Yeah. It feels very like fiery, you
• 46:03
  know what I mean? Yeah, yeah.
• 46:04
  I just wanted like something that hyped myself up.
• 46:07
  I'm so and I am like this and I mean I, I'm very hot on myself.
• 46:11
  I hate on myself more than anybody could ever.
• 46:12
  And I also very self deprecating and I am that way in music as
• 46:16
  well. Yeah, yeah, we clocked.
• 46:17
  I'm always. Just like what?
• 46:19
  Yeah, we yeah, we clocked. I think y'all can tell, yeah.
• 46:21
  We're we're moving in a different direction.
• 46:23
  Like a lot of the songs that I've heard are very like they're
• 46:25
  like owning your shit, girl. You're getting there.
• 46:27
  Like the lyrics, like you're finally like, you know, I'm
• 46:29
  actually, I'm that bitch. I'm kings.
• 46:31
  Yeah, I'm. Actually excited about life?
• 46:33
  Don't imagine that. You deserve to be excited about
• 46:35
  life and make music that reflects that.
• 46:38
  Yes, that's. The best yeah.
• 46:39
  So that's like my you know, it's so crazy because with food for
• 46:42
  thought, I was like literally, I didn't realize I did this.
• 46:44
  But with singles back-to-back it was like I released a song about
• 46:49
  being bullied, released a song about living with my
• 46:52
  ex-boyfriend while we were exes. That was a crazy era.
• 46:55
  And then I released a song about my eating disorder, like
• 46:58
  back-to-back to back-to-back. And I was like, how I was like,
• 47:00
  where do I go after this? I've.
• 47:01
  Literally like damn thing going through it, yeah.
• 47:03
  Like, yeah, right. And then it was so worth it
• 47:05
  'cause like, obviously when you see the album together and see
• 47:08
  the reaction, but this. Girl, yeah.
• 47:10
  And then it's so funny, 'cause I think I wrote Talk later a week
• 47:12
  before food for that came out. So starting to already shift and
• 47:18
  be like. Isn't it nice to see that
• 47:20
  natural evolution of things? Yeah, That's cool.
• 47:22
  Yeah. You know what I mean?
• 47:23
  And I was talking to my boyfriend at the time.
• 47:25
  We were like officially dating. But anyway, it was a whole.
• 47:28
  Exciting, just like capturing those feelings and like, that's
• 47:31
  so cute. Yeah.
• 47:32
  I'm really happy for you. That's really nice.
• 47:35
  Especially just like as you're making music in a project, like
• 47:37
  as life reflects art, it's going, you know, and like
• 47:40
  exactly the timeline. You're even saying you're like,
• 47:42
  you release this thing. It's like this, this actual
• 47:44
  release, Gun Motion release, too.
• 47:46
  Like your deepest, darkest inner thoughts, right?
• 47:49
  Put it out into the world just like that, and you're starting
• 47:51
  to shift in your own life. And now the music's reflecting
• 47:52
  it. Yeah.
• 47:53
  That's why I'm like, nothing's off limits.
• 47:55
  I'm like I'll. Talk about anything.
• 47:56
  Same, same, same. I think it's a disservice as
• 47:59
  artists and songwriters to not go there 'cause I work with, I
• 48:02
  work with artists who will be like, we can't write about this
• 48:05
  because this person's going to hear her feel this way or that.
• 48:06
  I'm like, no, that's why we should write about it.
• 48:08
  I think. I mean, obviously as the artist,
• 48:09
  whatever you want, but I'm like, if you're feeling the type of
• 48:12
  way we should write about it, 'cause you want to honor that.
• 48:14
  Yeah, exactly, 'cause there's some balance.
• 48:16
  It's not like obviously there's, you know, maybe a line with like
• 48:19
  being mean, but it's also like you have to get your authentic
• 48:22
  emotions out there else where else are they going to go?
• 48:23
  There's a line. It's like, exactly, And it's
• 48:26
  important to be able to make music art about it.
• 48:29
  Like whatever your medium is like, you're only about whatever
• 48:32
  it. Is like, you know, name dropping
• 48:33
  is a different thing. I did that though.
• 48:35
  Yeah, I was going to say, oh, I'm a big name dropper on my
• 48:37
  project. I name I name names on my album.
• 48:40
  I love Listen, if you're going to date a creative, you know
• 48:43
  what you're getting into. Like if you don't want a song
• 48:45
  written about you, you know who to not date.
• 48:47
  I just thought about that today while driving to sale for this
• 48:51
  because I was the song I was working on yesterday.
• 48:53
  I was like, damn, this is this is really one of those.
• 48:56
  And I'm like, well, you knew what you're getting into.
• 48:58
  Like, I was like, you knew. Yeah.
• 48:59
  You know, I was gonna write about it either way, good or
• 49:01
  bad. Yeah.
• 49:02
  Should've give me something good to write about, but that's OK.
• 49:04
  Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
• 49:05
  Exactly. That's that's kind of the
• 49:06
  circumstance. It is what it is.
• 49:08
  Whatever you you signed up for it, you know what I mean?
• 49:10
  Yeah. So how do you think this error
• 49:12
  like represents for you now? Because like it feels like a 180
• 49:14
  just off the what we have so far of talk later.
• 49:16
  Thank you. Like a complete 180 like from
• 49:18
  how dark and like, you know, sad.
• 49:20
  Emotional. Yeah.
• 49:21
  I wonder that I wanted that because I just wanted a song to.
• 49:26
  Period, girl. Yes.
• 49:28
  And you're actually going to give us so much more of that
• 49:29
  too. Yes.
• 49:31
  I'm really excited about the ones that you showed me because
• 49:33
  I'm like, wait, bitch, I know. I'm like girl.
• 49:36
  I'm so excited. Yes, they're so empowering.
• 49:40
  It's just so nice. Especially like knowing your
• 49:42
  journey, everything that we've talked about during the show.
• 49:44
  Also just through your music, seeing you progress into more of
• 49:48
  this earned confidence, like knowing that you can own
• 49:51
  yourself, your persona, what you want out of life and like really
• 49:54
  start embracing it. The shift is so nice 'cause then
• 49:57
  we also get both, especially as an artist and being like, you
• 50:00
  can go through this, we can relate to it or we can feel type
• 50:02
  of way, right? We know your story now.
• 50:03
  It's like, but look at where you are now.
• 50:05
  That's so inspiring. Like that journey itself and it
• 50:07
  was natural and organic and real.
• 50:08
  It's not like you, it's not like 3 years ago.
• 50:10
  You're like, I'm going to do a sad album then.
• 50:11
  I have. Yeah, yeah.
• 50:13
  It really just falls into place as it should.
• 50:15
  Yeah, thank you for saying that. It's really, you know, the
• 50:17
  content music balance is definitely very difficult
• 50:20
  sometimes, and it feels sometimes like you're really
• 50:23
  excited about art that doesn't connect on socials.
• 50:25
  But it could still save somebody'd life.
• 50:27
  But that's what's crazy. That's not.
• 50:28
  The whole point million. Percent and that's what's scary,
• 50:31
  like feeling like you're going to drop something like we don't
• 50:33
  know how it's going to do or not do right, But it's just like I
• 50:35
  still want to put it down. Like also it's it's such a thing
• 50:38
  where it's like I feel so connected to this song, but
• 50:40
  maybe it's not connecting to people or at least the right
• 50:42
  ears aren't finding it yet. That could also be discouraging.
• 50:44
  You just got to keep going. Oh my gosh, like so many songs
• 50:46
  blow up. Years later, yeah.
• 50:50
  What is it running up the hill? Yeah.
• 50:52
  By Kate Bush, right? Yeah.
• 50:54
  Like what? Like 40 years later, like, yeah,
• 50:56
  literally. That's crazy.
• 50:58
  That's it's a free for all now, especially in this day and age
• 51:00
  of social media. Yeah.
• 51:01
  It genuinely is a free for all. Yeah.
• 51:02
  It makes me so. That's exciting too, yeah.
• 51:04
  Exactly. I think anything could have a
• 51:06
  life. I think that's really cool.
• 51:07
  So that's really cool. That's really exciting and I
• 51:09
  think it also takes a little bit of the pressure off.
• 51:12
  Agreed. Yeah, just to make music.
• 51:13
  We were talking about, I think we said this like before the
• 51:15
  show or like during it. But it's like being able to be
• 51:17
  like, let's just get back to the art.
• 51:18
  Let's get rid of like, let's stop and logistics and
• 51:21
  everything because we just want to make music, you know?
• 51:23
  Yeah, I genuinely think in the past like 2 weeks, I was like
• 51:26
  really going through it a little bit ago only because I just, I
• 51:29
  just get really hard on myself about because.
• 51:32
  You just dropped the song. Yeah, I think sometimes it's
• 51:34
  hard when you like, I don't know, sometimes dropping music
• 51:37
  can feel a little a little weird and uncomfortable because you
• 51:40
  have an expectation for it. And what I.
• 51:41
  And you ever hope for it? Yes.
• 51:43
  And I think what I realized is like, but I'm also excited and
• 51:46
  like, people are loving it, and I need to lean into that.
• 51:48
  I'm just very hard on myself. But also, yeah, and it's easy to
• 51:53
  do that. But I think I just realized, you
• 51:54
  know, I have a lot of mental blocks from me being young and
• 52:01
  being like, OK, by this age, I want to accomplish this and this
• 52:03
  age, but that doesn't serve anyone.
• 52:04
  And it's such an illusion. So many people feel that way.
• 52:06
  Like, yeah, it's, it's just like a. 100% we need.
• 52:10
  To free ourselves y'all like we need to take these restraints
• 52:13
  off. We need to solve a signing tape.
• 52:14
  How old you? Are when you accomplish
• 52:16
  anything, no. One cares.
• 52:17
  No one's paying that selection either.
• 52:18
  Yeah, absolutely. Exactly.
• 52:20
  And so I think I just started to reframe.
• 52:22
  I'm like, I just want to be able to make art and live. 100%.
• 52:26
  And I think it's gotten, the art has gotten better because of
• 52:29
  that, obviously. 100% it's reflecting into the art too.
• 52:32
  Yeah, yeah, I wrote a couple songs that I really want to play
• 52:35
  with all bounces back from them, but.
• 52:36
  Oh my gosh, we just talk about that.
• 52:38
  It's they they're very in the don't make the rules world.
• 52:42
  Girl, I'm. Excited.
• 52:43
  I'm so excited when you get there, you need to send me.
• 52:45
  Yes, we're talking about it. Before we went into this episode
• 52:48
  and I was like, oh, I'm a diva. I will literally be like, OK,
• 52:50
  send me the balance of anything you have right now.
• 52:52
  Yeah. And we're gonna.
• 52:53
  I can't. I don't have the patience.
• 52:54
  I know so many artists who are like, I just did it like, they
• 52:57
  get it back like a month later. I'm like, oh.
• 52:59
  Like no, I'm very like day of send me but also.
• 53:02
  I think people like. Work on it.
• 53:04
  Oh, exactly. I also I have really bad
• 53:06
  demoitis. Yeah, I've tried to be cured but
• 53:08
  it's like hard. No, I've really bad demo.
• 53:10
  Itis like, literally, I'll be like, OK, this is the version
• 53:12
  that's gonna be released. Like it's just like Ivory.
• 53:14
  Ivory accepted every little flaw in it.
• 53:16
  Ivory accepted every little thing.
• 53:17
  Like, let's just go. It's really hard for me to see
• 53:19
  your song improve, you know what I mean?
• 53:20
  But like, it's so true. Stepping away from it helps so
• 53:22
  much. Yes, yeah, In these songs
• 53:24
  Defenses, the producer is from the UK and so he needs a second
• 53:29
  to like, you know, help with them and then.
• 53:31
  Yeah. Wait, how are you?
• 53:32
  Are you doing remote sessions or how are you doing those?
• 53:33
  No, everybody just makes trips to Lai feel like, but yeah, so
• 53:37
  he's one of my favorite collaborators.
• 53:40
  He's incredible. And he comes in from the UK and
• 53:42
  then I have another one who also was from the UK, but she just
• 53:46
  moved here, so thank God. She's one of my favorite
• 53:48
  producers. I have like 3 or 4 that are like
• 53:50
  my go to. Like I'll trust them with my
• 53:52
  life. Yeah, same ZS, same ZS.
• 53:54
  Yeah, exactly. It's a good relationship to
• 53:55
  have, especially when you're collaborating.
• 53:57
  Like you want to be able to like trust the people you're working
• 54:00
  with, especially for you. Like your, your lyric is very
• 54:02
  like, this is me. I'm opening our chest, you know.
• 54:05
  I'm so picky. I'm such a bitch.
• 54:07
  Like in sessions I'm like, yeah, chord progressions I will argue
• 54:10
  over. Girl no.
• 54:11
  I'm but I'm also like, why are you arguing?
• 54:13
  With me girl, Oh my God, can I tell you I'm that is literally
• 54:16
  me like I hate this reputation, this idea that I'm difficult,
• 54:18
  but I will literally be like it's.
• 54:19
  Not difficult. I'm like, I asked Taylor.
• 54:21
  Taylor felt Delulu alum. I was like, how do we give
• 54:24
  feedback to producers? Well, it seemed like a huge
• 54:26
  bitch. So I say this now.
• 54:28
  I'm like, hey, I think we should collaborate on this idea.
• 54:30
  Maybe we should change the synf sound.
• 54:32
  Yes, what do you think? Even though and what I'm saying
• 54:35
  is like we need to change the SIM sound and.
• 54:36
  A good producer is always down to beat what they've already.
• 54:39
  Done. Hell yeah.
• 54:39
  And like, yeah. So am I as an artist.
• 54:41
  But also, like, I'm also very open to being like, yeah, let's
• 54:43
  discuss it. Tell me what you think is best.
• 54:44
  Like, let's figure it out together, you know what I mean?
• 54:46
  And also being open to it. I think it's rare.
• 54:48
  Like when I first started doing sessions and I was meeting
• 54:51
  different producers, I was like, 'cause people tell me this all
• 54:53
  the time. They were like, you're not going
• 54:54
  to get along with every producer.
• 54:55
  And I was like, OK, yeah, that's so true.
• 54:56
  Like I've learned that that's truly magooly, you know what I
• 54:59
  mean? Yes.
• 54:59
  And there's certain producers where I feel like sometimes
• 55:03
  people in sessions, this was a while ago, either saw me as like
• 55:07
  just an artist who people, yeah, just a singer or just a tik
• 55:10
  toker or whatever. And I'm like I don't need a
• 55:12
  reference. So frustrating.
• 55:13
  I can sit next to you and produce with you and like at the
• 55:16
  end of the day, the artist is has to say whether the song.
• 55:19
  Comes out or not on their project.
• 55:20
  Yeah, absolutely. And also that's how I feel.
• 55:22
  So like when I'm writing for other people or when I do my own
• 55:25
  sessions, it's always just like at the end of the day, it's
• 55:27
  whatever the artist wants. And that's what I always say.
• 55:29
  So like if the, if I'm writing for someone and it's like, well,
• 55:32
  I don't have maybe I don't agree with that, but I'm like, I can't
• 55:34
  argue with you. If that's what you want, that's
• 55:35
  what you want. And we're gonna it's my job to
• 55:37
  help you get to your vision. That's.
• 55:39
  It. Yeah.
• 55:40
  And I'm like, so lucky that any artist I've written for already
• 55:42
  has a vision. Yeah, same knows what she wants
• 55:45
  to say. 100% And it's super, super nice, especially
• 55:48
  collaborating with it, like working with people who like are
• 55:51
  very intentional about what their art is and like what they
• 55:53
  wanna do. Like that's super nice as a
• 55:54
  writer too, 'cause it's like I'm just here to support and I'm
• 55:56
  here to like help you with that. Yeah, and get all the ideas out
• 55:59
  and maybe say stuff that like the artist might be too afraid
• 56:03
  to say or you. Don't even push it a little bit,
• 56:05
  like just see like where they want to go with it.
• 56:07
  Like I think there's a time in place for everything that's I
• 56:09
  really love about making music. I genuinely really love being in
• 56:11
  sessions in studios because I'm going to ask you this too,
• 56:14
  actually, but I always ask my artist friends, like, what do
• 56:16
  you love the most about music? Like is it performing it?
• 56:19
  Is it making? Is it writing is like, like
• 56:21
  what? What do you feel?
• 56:22
  Mine is literally being in the studio.
• 56:23
  Like I love making the song. I love making the song.
• 56:27
  The process of making the song is everything to me.
• 56:28
  Writing it, specifically writing it, is like what really throws
• 56:31
  me. Oh my God, that's such a good
• 56:33
  question. I feel like this is threefold.
• 56:35
  Yeah, you can love it all. Yeah, I love it all.
• 56:38
  I will say performing my songs, like anytime you hear your
• 56:42
  lyrics song back to you, I'm like, that's so special that
• 56:45
  that and that's The thing is like those are the moments when
• 56:48
  you're thinking the least and life is just happening and it's
• 56:53
  really validating as an artist, it's.
• 56:55
  Super validating. My yeah, like I just love.
• 56:57
  I think just growing up and performing forever, I'm like, I
• 57:00
  want to be able to look in every single audience member's eyes
• 57:03
  and like sing to. Them that's super nice 'cause
• 57:05
  you know, I, I haven't put out any music yet at this point, but
• 57:08
  like, for example, like Grayson, you met him earlier.
• 57:11
  We were listening to music. He was in my session yesterday
• 57:14
  and after the session he was like, can you send me like that
• 57:16
  song? I want to listen to it And then
• 57:17
  also like he was talking about the lyrics a lot and I was like,
• 57:20
  that's really cool that you're like listening and also when I
• 57:22
  sent you boys cry and then you're like the second verse is
• 57:25
  so emotional. I was like, yes.
• 57:27
  Thank you, you're so detailed with your reviews, like
• 57:29
  literally I like the song hasn't even finished I can tell.
• 57:32
  And you're already just like sending me like lyrics.
• 57:34
  Oh my. God, yes, no, I'm live reacting.
• 57:37
  No, I'm a I'm a true listener, y'all.
• 57:39
  I listen like so like I think I texted you.
• 57:42
  That's like literally if you send me anything, I will click
• 57:44
  play and not only will I just click play, I will sit there and
• 57:46
  be like, I'll analyze. The first thing I do is lyrics.
• 57:48
  So I always listen for lyrics. I always listen to the that's I
• 57:51
  think that's why I texted you too.
• 57:52
  I was like, you're clever. You're a clever writer.
• 57:55
  A lot of people are. I'm a lot of producers I work
• 57:57
  with for Melody is King, which yes, melody is king.
• 57:59
  But for me, I that's what I want.
• 58:03
  That's what that's the most important thing for me 'cause I
• 58:05
  always tell every session I go into every producer I work, I'm
• 58:08
  like listen at the end of the day, I'm cool with like being
• 58:11
  flexible of like wherever the song goes.
• 58:12
  But what I'm like insistent on is the lyric like and also I
• 58:16
  have to write it like we can Co write but I need to write the
• 58:18
  majority of it. And you might need to sing it
• 58:20
  for the rest of your life. Yeah, it needs to.
• 58:22
  Fit at least the version who 100.
• 58:24
  Percent and it needs to say my story and it.
• 58:27
  Is very picky with lyrics. There are certain words.
• 58:29
  That I'm like this word is off limits.
• 58:31
  I don't know why, it just sounds.
• 58:33
  You know what I mean? Like it's too overdone.
• 58:34
  Yeah, 100% yes. Like the whole thing with the
• 58:37
  unique titles, I like that shit too.
• 58:38
  And then also like for me, it's like I will go into a session.
• 58:41
  Like just, I usually write a lot of it before I start the
• 58:43
  session. I like to come in prepared to
• 58:45
  have a concept, have it mostly written.
• 58:46
  I'll come in and be like, OK guys, I'm just going to say it
• 58:48
  from the get go. I am married to these lyrics.
• 58:50
  So like we're going to work on melody's production and then
• 58:52
  writing more. But what I wrote is I'm married
• 58:55
  to it just so we know, just so we don't end up fighting about
• 58:58
  it. We don't.
• 58:58
  And. You can always try to beat it.
• 58:59
  And if we beat it, love, love that.
• 59:01
  We shout out to my producer yesterday, Tim, for the song
• 59:05
  that we're working on, Vicious. He wrote this lyric that I'm
• 59:09
  obsessed with. It's had me in between your
• 59:12
  teeth and I was like, that's so clever.
• 59:14
  It's going into the pre, going into the chorus, and the chorus
• 59:17
  is like loving you is vicious. And it's like this idea of like
• 59:20
  being ripped apart. So I'm like, that's such a good
• 59:21
  lyric and I'm like, then if it's great, I'll take it.
• 59:24
  I love, like, love that. I texted him on the way driving
• 59:27
  here. I was like, Tim, thank you so
• 59:29
  much for that lyric. I love that lyric.
• 59:30
  That's so smart. Like I wouldn't have a lot of
• 59:32
  that. You know what I mean?
• 59:33
  It's so funny. I feel like some of the best
• 59:34
  writers too. Like whenever I'm in the room
• 59:36
  with like some of my favorites, they'll say something a little
• 59:38
  bit timidly and I'm like. That's I'll write it down with.
• 59:42
  Your chest? Yeah, I'm like that.
• 59:44
  Go track that vocal for it now. Yes, absolutely.
• 59:46
  Exactly, Yeah. 'Cause then I think people have
• 59:49
  this, like we should just be confident with good ideas, bad
• 59:51
  ideas, whatever. We should be like, OK, this is
• 59:53
  what I think. Everything has to come out to
• 59:55
  get to the good stuff. You have to write all the stupid
• 59:57
  lyrics down 'cause who cares? It's not gonna make the song if
• 1:00:00
  it's actually stupid. Literally, I completely agree.
• 1:00:02
  Shout out to him, Tim Zak on that all the time.
• 1:00:04
  He's like, yes, let's get the bad ideas out and I'm like, OK,
• 1:00:07
  fuck you. But yeah, we get them out.
• 1:00:09
  I will say like my other favorite I, I literally am like
• 1:00:13
  this is my guilty pleasure, but it's not even guilty 'cause I
• 1:00:15
  love doing it. But just like listening to the
• 1:00:18
  first me Too bounce in my car. The demo Me too.
• 1:00:23
  Yes, yes, same. I love.
• 1:00:25
  That even if it's happy, I'm like, I can just cry, 'cause I'm
• 1:00:27
  so excited. About it, me too and.
• 1:00:28
  Then I listen 15 times over and. Oh, a million times over.
• 1:00:31
  Like I'm, I have my all my musics on untitled.
• 1:00:35
  It's my work in progress thing. But basically, like, I was
• 1:00:38
  talking about Taylor and I was like, oh, I've listened to my
• 1:00:40
  own album 2000 times. She shows me her, she's listened
• 1:00:42
  to hers 2000 times. And I was like, yeah, we're like
• 1:00:44
  sick. Yeah, sick in the head.
• 1:00:46
  No, but you have to. Oh don't even get me started on
• 1:00:48
  like mixes. When it goes to mixing that's
• 1:00:49
  hell. But I also am like so picky.
• 1:00:52
  I'm even have I have a mixed note for talk later
• 1:00:53
  unfortunately. How do you, how do you, how do
• 1:00:55
  you deal with that after the song's done, mastered, put out?
• 1:00:58
  You 'cause. That's a fear I have.
• 1:00:59
  That is a. Fear.
• 1:01:00
  I have, yeah. There's one note that I have
• 1:01:02
  that I'm like, hmm, I mean on the low you can like swap out
• 1:01:05
  masters. Yeah, low key you can.
• 1:01:07
  Ray did that on her literal album she just released.
• 1:01:09
  She added horns to the husband song shit, like way after the
• 1:01:13
  fact of the release and fans clocked it and I was like, oh
• 1:01:15
  cool, that's reassuring. Yeah, 'cause I'm gonna do that
• 1:01:17
  if I need to. I'm a tweaker.
• 1:01:18
  Yeah, me too. I don't.
• 1:01:19
  Yeah, there's a note that I have on Talk Later and I can't unhear
• 1:01:22
  it but also go fix it. Even other musicians who have
• 1:01:25
  asked don't hear it. So I'm like, oh, so I am insane.
• 1:01:28
  But sometimes, you know what, Honestly, that's how I feel
• 1:01:31
  sometimes 'cause like even on like, you know, the song I
• 1:01:33
  played, you boys cry. Like I was telling my producer I
• 1:01:35
  was like, yeah, you're going to hate me.
• 1:01:36
  But we do need to spend an hour figuring out the decibel on the
• 1:01:40
  pre chorus, like the volume. And we did thank you Tim.
• 1:01:43
  But like it's exactly that. Like I'm so picky about that.
• 1:01:47
  I told him I was like, I was like, maybe we could do .25.
• 1:01:50
  And it's like that didn't feel right .5.
• 1:01:52
  Like, let's keep going and so. Weird about like going back to
• 1:01:55
  stuff that was on the original because I'm like no, it needs to
• 1:01:59
  match identically. I'm like it can't be near it it.
• 1:02:02
  Has to be. It has to match the magic, yeah.
• 1:02:05
  OK, Kings, like, honestly, with your upbringing, everything that
• 1:02:07
  you talked about, your entire music career, the audacity that
• 1:02:10
  you have, which I'm eating and I love, you're obviously very
• 1:02:13
  delulu. You're at the perfect show.
• 1:02:16
  But we're wondering what your most delulu take is.
• 1:02:19
  What's the most delusional thing that you think it could be?
• 1:02:21
  Controversial, funny, silly, serious.
• 1:02:23
  This is good. Yes, you got some.
• 1:02:25
  Yes. Can I go really deep with it?
• 1:02:28
  I want you to go deep with it like.
• 1:02:31
  OK, my delusional take is I think everyone should like
• 1:02:34
  Pickles. I'm right there with you.
• 1:02:37
  Pickles are so controversial I. Love Pickles, people.
• 1:02:39
  Either love or they hate them, and I think we all just need to
• 1:02:41
  love them. That's kind of how.
• 1:02:42
  We that's like us and our music. It's like polarizing.
• 1:02:46
  I it's yeah. Kind of poetic.
• 1:02:47
  That is deep, that is deep, that is deep.
• 1:02:50
  We should all be Pickles. Low key Pickles.
• 1:02:52
  Everyone should love us. That's what I'm saying.
• 1:02:53
  Well literally my entire like pages are like I'll send my well
• 1:02:57
  this is actually really right. Ironic because my boyfriend
• 1:02:59
  hates Pickles but I'll always send him reels of like an IV
• 1:03:02
  drip but it's pickle juice and it's like bake cookies with me
• 1:03:05
  but with Pickles. And he's like, can you please
• 1:03:07
  send me anything? Else, Oh my God, he's like,
• 1:03:09
  wait, what did I sign up for? And.
• 1:03:10
  Now I'm going to start sending them to you.
• 1:03:12
  Send them to me and you know what I'm going to be.
• 1:03:13
  Like I just think everyone should like Pickles.
• 1:03:15
  I love Pickles. I love pickle juice.
• 1:03:17
  I could drink pickle juice like I would be OK, sorry.
• 1:03:20
  No, you're right. Pickle juice.
• 1:03:22
  You could put pickle. Juice in here and I'd be like.
• 1:03:24
  In the cookies too, we just talked about.
• 1:03:25
  It martinis. OK, well.
• 1:03:28
  Juice and martinis. My whole thing is like with
• 1:03:30
  alcohol type shit like that one. Such a hard wait.
• 1:03:33
  So you don't like a dirty martini?
• 1:03:35
  No. You don't like olive juice?
• 1:03:36
  No, no, no I don't. I love a sweet little girly
• 1:03:41
  cocktail. If it's pink, if it's sparkly,
• 1:03:44
  yeah. I think it just makes me feel
• 1:03:46
  cool, but I actually do. I'm kind of a psychotic, like
• 1:03:49
  olive juice, pickle juice. I mean, I like, I like olive
• 1:03:52
  juice too. I like pickle juice.
• 1:03:53
  I don't think I like with my alkies, but.
• 1:03:55
  Yeah, 'cause it's like almost too intense.
• 1:03:56
  It is. Are you also?
• 1:03:57
  Espresso, Espresso. Martini no hey, hey, 'cause like
• 1:04:00
  coffee is my favorite thing ever, so why should we ruin it
• 1:04:02
  with poison and by the way, I love the poison, but I don't
• 1:04:05
  think we should make. Make it a tequila sunrise like.
• 1:04:08
  Don't yeah, give me something cutesy, give me something
• 1:04:10
  fruity. Give me something girly, give me
• 1:04:11
  something be like, yay, I don't have a problem Sip.
• 1:04:14
  That's what I want. Me as I'm like chugging my 500
• 1:04:16
  milligrams caffeine literally I feel like every day.
• 1:04:18
  What's funny y'all is I feel like as this episode progress,
• 1:04:21
  we have more drinks on our side of it.
• 1:04:23
  Always quadruple fisting in sessions.
• 1:04:26
  Girl, we were. We need hydrating fun.
• 1:04:28
  Yes, caffeine and. Productive.
• 1:04:30
  All of it. Like pickle juice.
• 1:04:32
  Pickle juice, something to stimulate the fashion back to
• 1:04:35
  what we're saying. Yeah, I agree everyone should
• 1:04:36
  love Pickles. So I don't think that's not the
• 1:04:38
  Lulu. Long story long, everyone should
• 1:04:40
  like Pickles and if you don't you should work on that.
• 1:04:42
  We need you, need therapy, and I hate that for you.
• 1:04:45
  Yeah, yeah, we all need therapy, but especially people who don't
• 1:04:48
  like Pickles. Especially people who don't like
• 1:04:50
  Pickles. I like Pickles so no therapy for
• 1:04:52
  me. OK so this was so much fucking
• 1:04:56
  fun. I know we were really yap or
• 1:04:57
  Chino. I love yapping with.
• 1:04:59
  You. No, because honestly.
• 1:05:00
  Ever since we met it's just been a yap and I love it.
• 1:05:02
  Can I, I'm going to tell everyone, basically I met her
• 1:05:05
  and we're at Taylor Feld's birthday party and she we're
• 1:05:08
  just hanging out and she literally just asked me a bunch
• 1:05:09
  of questions. I'm asking her a bunch of
• 1:05:10
  questions and it's like, wait, I was like, I have a platform for
• 1:05:13
  this exact kind of conversation. Answer.
• 1:05:15
  I don't want to know where you're from.
• 1:05:16
  You're like, it was quite literally like this.
• 1:05:18
  It was just like, so why'd you come out to LA?
• 1:05:19
  And I was like, Oh well, I was like, wait.
• 1:05:20
  And we were taking photos of Taylor for her birthday.
• 1:05:22
  I was digital. You had iPhone person?
• 1:05:24
  You were. You were there.
• 1:05:25
  You remember there because, yeah, you.
• 1:05:27
  Were this was before the shots? Pre shot got it yes we were
• 1:05:30
  literally multitasking, taking pictures of Taylor for her
• 1:05:32
  birthday on her Instagram yeah and we were chit chatting yeah I
• 1:05:36
  was like. Wait a minute, Let me get the
• 1:05:38
  camera. Yeah, I was like.
• 1:05:39
  We should be on a mic and I was like and I have those you.
• 1:05:42
  Know and I have. Those and now here we are.
• 1:05:44
  And you know what's actually really funny?
• 1:05:45
  I was telling you prior to the show, I had spoken to your
• 1:05:48
  manager Russell a few months prior and he was talking about
• 1:05:51
  his talent and you were one of them.
• 1:05:52
  And I remember the the the yellow hair and I'll that's
• 1:05:55
  crazy. Yes.
• 1:05:56
  It's crazy. I dyed it myself yesterday.
• 1:05:59
  You. Didn't look OK.
• 1:06:00
  No, it's great. It was.
• 1:06:02
  I had no. It's cartoon blonde.
• 1:06:03
  Yeah, I love. It I had no time to book an
• 1:06:05
  appointment. So no, it looks good.
• 1:06:06
  I wouldn't have known that you've done it yourself.
• 1:06:09
  OK, this was super, super fun. And we close out every show by
• 1:06:13
  manifesting together. Is there anything you want to
• 1:06:15
  speak into existence here on Delulu?
• 1:06:16
  Oh. My gosh, yes.
• 1:06:20
  Spell Lulu. Yes, I want to manifest art that
• 1:06:25
  feels like nobody has ever heard it before.
• 1:06:27
  Oh, you know what, actually, I think you're kind of doing that
• 1:06:29
  right now. Like genuinely, I think with
• 1:06:31
  your lyric, your titles, the Sonic direction, you do all of
• 1:06:33
  it's very unique. Even like Talk Later, which is
• 1:06:35
  like a lighter song for you, right?
• 1:06:37
  It really feels like a novel new thing.
• 1:06:39
  I'm really drawn to new concepts.
• 1:06:41
  Like for my own project, I want everything to be a very unique
• 1:06:44
  thing to me. And that's what I like about
• 1:06:46
  your artistry is I really feel that way.
• 1:06:47
  I don't feel like I can see another artist doing like a
• 1:06:50
  detox, right? I mean, probably like their own
• 1:06:52
  way of it, but like, it's so specific to you, which is so
• 1:06:53
  special. So I think you're in Manifest
• 1:06:55
  like. Genuinely and the hotline, you
• 1:06:58
  know, talk later hotline. Talk Later hotline on this exact
• 1:07:00
  phone. I actually need to like just.
• 1:07:03
  You know, like. You know what I mean?
• 1:07:05
  I also like that you gave Jeffrey a crop top on the shirt.
• 1:07:08
  Yeah, Jeffrey has a crop top. Oh wait, did I do that?
• 1:07:10
  I feel like you did that. Wait, did I do?
• 1:07:12
  This. That's so hot, I.
• 1:07:13
  Just feel like everything needs to be cropped.
• 1:07:16
  That's my second delusional take.
• 1:07:18
  Everything needs to be cropped. I kind.
• 1:07:19
  Of agree with that too. I agree fuck it yeah, not
• 1:07:23
  delusional. Everything comes very line.
• 1:07:24
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Your manifestation you're you're
• 1:07:26
  kind of have that manifested. What else do you want to
• 1:07:28
  manifest? Anything else you want to speak
• 1:07:29
  into existence? I feel like you're doing exactly
• 1:07:31
  that so. Just a hit song.
• 1:07:33
  Period. Same claim.
• 1:07:34
  I think people shouldn't be fearful of admitting they want a
• 1:07:37
  big song. Yeah, and I hate the discourse.
• 1:07:39
  That's like, hell y'all, all of it.
• 1:07:42
  I want to hit album. Like I think I'd rather have.
• 1:07:44
  Would you rather have like, chaperone moment?
• 1:07:46
  Yeah, yes. Like, would you rather have like
• 1:07:48
  a number one album or a number one song?
• 1:07:51
  Definitely number one album. Number one album but no songs
• 1:07:53
  chart. Not that charts matter but like
• 1:07:55
  let's say no no songs chart but the album goes #1.
• 1:07:58
  I feel like that might serve artistry better because I feel
• 1:08:00
  like when you have a song that is bigger than you than you,
• 1:08:04
  it's hard to beat that. I feel like albums serve the
• 1:08:08
  longevity of your project. I would rather have a number one
• 1:08:11
  album. I would rather have a big album
• 1:08:12
  than and have nothing ever chart.
• 1:08:15
  But the album does well. Like I think that's what I want
• 1:08:17
  because I'm mostly I want a world build, so I want that
• 1:08:20
  project to do well. I want the music I make is meant
• 1:08:24
  to exist within each other. The songs are meant to be next
• 1:08:27
  to each other. Like I haven't even said this,
• 1:08:28
  I'll say it's now, but the album from top to bottom on the track
• 1:08:32
  listing, they transition into each other.
• 1:08:34
  The songs are meant to exist with each other.
• 1:08:36
  You know what I mean? I love transitions.
• 1:08:38
  It's like my bread and. Butter, you're gonna like my
• 1:08:40
  album. I'm.
• 1:08:41
  Really. I know I've only heard but.
• 1:08:43
  You have. I'll play you more, yeah.
• 1:08:44
  Send me the whole. OK.
• 1:08:46
  It's kind of a lot right now. We're going.
• 1:08:48
  Let's go in the studio right now.
• 1:08:49
  I want to, I literally is. I wish people weren't in there
• 1:08:52
  because I was like, I want to listen to more of yours too.
• 1:08:55
  No, that's OK. No, we'll figure it out.
• 1:08:56
  Tomorrow. Yes, Yes.
• 1:08:57
  Or whenever. Whenever, whenever, whatever.
• 1:08:59
  We're always here. OK.
• 1:09:00
  I'm manifesting all that too, if I'm being completely honest.
• 1:09:02
  Yeah, I would love. Thanks.
• 1:09:03
  Just success with the music. For you, for me, for all of us,
• 1:09:06
  yes. You too, I'm so excited for your
• 1:09:08
  stuff. Thank you.
• 1:09:09
  Are not y'all are not ready. That's so sweet.
• 1:09:12
  I'm not ready. Jeffrey, they are not ready.
• 1:09:14
  I'm not ready, OK, I'm claiming all of that.
• 1:09:17
  Thank you so much. And besties, thank you so much
• 1:09:20
  for watching this episode of the Lulu.
• 1:09:21
  This was your healthy dose of the Lulu.
• 1:09:23
  So now you can go live your true Lulu bestie Kings.
• 1:09:26
  Where can the besties all find you?
• 1:09:27
  Oh. My gosh, you can find me on
• 1:09:30
  Instagram, Tiktok, YouTube, all the socials at She is kings or
• 1:09:34
  music, Spotify, Apple Music, it's just kings on all music
• 1:09:37
  platforms. So if you want to stream the
• 1:09:38
  album and the new stuff. We're listening to talk later,
• 1:09:43
  Yeah. Don't make the rules.
• 1:09:45
  Everything that's coming afterwards, the next World
• 1:09:47
  that's being built actively. You're in your healed era, your
• 1:09:50
  happy era, Yes. And we here at your confidence
• 1:09:52
  era. Yes, Oh my God, thank you.
• 1:09:54
  Yes, I'm claiming it. Claiming I'm claiming that too
• 1:09:56
  girl I need that shit period. And guys, please stream the
• 1:10:00
  music, it's out now. And you could also call Kings
• 1:10:02
  and talk to her on her. You can call me.
• 1:10:04
  Oh my gosh, I brought the business cards.
• 1:10:05
  Should I show them? Show them.
• 1:10:07
  Oh my gosh, you brought the business cards?
• 1:10:08
  I didn't even have business cards.
• 1:10:09
  Well, it's not that I brought them actively, it's that I have
• 1:10:11
  you have them with me at all times.
• 1:10:13
  Yup, you're strapped. Yup, Yup, Yup.
• 1:10:15
  Should I Should we zoom? In Oh, you're ready.
• 1:10:17
  That's pretty zoom in, that's pretty call.
• 1:10:21
  Now oh, can we get a preview? Should we call?
• 1:10:24
  Yes. OK I don't have my phone but
• 1:10:26
  ring ring hey. We're going to overdub.
• 1:10:29
  OK, we'll do a little thing. Hey guys, here's my next single.
• 1:10:34
  There's a little, there's a little voicemail that you just
• 1:10:37
  have to call. So.
• 1:10:39
  It's always of the next song, so.
• 1:10:41
  Shut up. Is it always going to be two?
• 1:10:43
  Oh, we're going to be calling ring ring bitch period.
• 1:10:45
  OK besties, if you love this episode, please be sure to
• 1:10:48
  follow the podcast on Spotify and click the bell button to be
• 1:10:51
  notified of every new episode, every Duluth Thursday.
• 1:10:54
  And if you'd also rate the podcast, 5 stars Kings and I
• 1:10:57
  will personally call your X for you.
• 1:11:00
  Yeah, we'll give you a virtual hug and we will call their call
• 1:11:04
  your X. Called X and and let them know.
• 1:11:07
  Let them know, let them know what's up period and besties.
• 1:11:10
  If you want more of this podcast, please check out my
• 1:11:12
  passes besties at the top of my page and you can find me at
• 1:11:15
  emotions E period MO period TIONS and the exclusive podcast
• 1:11:20
  account at the Lulu BFF across all platforms.
• 1:11:22
  Stay to Lulu besties. Bye.