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From Trauma to Triumph: Breaking Through Self-Imposed Barriers · Is Your Way In Your Way?

0:26
Cassandra: Good day everyone.
0:27
Cassandra: I'd like to welcome you to Is your Way In your way podcast and my name is Cassandra Crawley-Mayo as your host, and I'm so thankful that you all are here today.
0:38
Cassandra: And, for those new listeners, I just want to share a little bit about what this podcast is about.
0:43
Cassandra: It's actually a podcast for women but men are certainly welcome because you have women in your life but this is about individuals who are stuck, individuals who know that there's something calling their soul to do something different, maybe to forgive somebody, or maybe you want to be an entrepreneur, maybe you want to be promoted, maybe you want to open your own business, maybe you want to get out of a relationship that's toxic, maybe you just want to do something different and you're stuck with and you're not quite sure how to get out of it.
1:18
Cassandra: So this podcast actually talks to special guests.
1:22
Cassandra: I call all my guests very special and we talk about topics related to what I say personal improvement, even some business improvement, and it also will enable you to have some self-reflection based on some of the things that you've heard, and I always am hopeful that whatever you hear it'll do something in your belly.
1:42
Cassandra: I call it like a fire in your belly and say you know what, if she can do that, I can too.
1:46
Cassandra: So my special guest today is Denise Lee, and I'd like to introduce you to Denise.
1:53
Cassandra: Well, hello, denise.
1:55
Denise: How are you?
1:56
Denise: I'm doing good, I'm blessed and I'm so happy to just wherever we're going to go.
2:03
Denise: We're just going to have God's way in this conversation.
2:06
Cassandra: Absolutely, absolutely.
2:08
Cassandra: I concur with that.
2:09
Cassandra: Now, before I get started, I'm going to read a little bit about Denise, just so you guys can get a little not real deep understanding yet.
2:20
Cassandra: I think the questions are going to enable you to do this, but just so you can have a little background on her.
2:24
Cassandra: Denise is a transformation coach dedicated to helping business owners and leaders overcome internal and external challenges.
2:34
Cassandra: Drawing from her own experience of facing fears and uncertainties while growing her business, denise discovered her true calling.
2:43
Cassandra: That's phenomenal when we discover our true calling, because a lot of us want to know what our purpose is and everything.
2:50
Cassandra: But anyway, her true calling is empowering others to break through these barriers.
2:55
Cassandra: With over a decade of experience, denise now guides leaders in making strategic, growth-oriented choices by simplifying complex decisions, complex decisions.
3:11
Cassandra: Her empathetic, actionable approach combines real life examples and straightforward advice, helping clients shift their mindset and unlock clarity and success.
3:17
Cassandra: Her journey of resilience and growth will resonate with you guys on Is your Way In your Way?
3:23
Cassandra: She's going to offer them some practical tools to turn obstacles into opportunities.
3:29
Cassandra: Wow, that's.
3:30
Cassandra: That's good, denise.
3:31
Cassandra: Let me ask you before you I'm going to say you struggled to to grow your own business a bit Tell us what life was like prior to that.
3:45
Cassandra: What was like your, your, your backstory a little bit prior to that, what was it like?
3:55
Denise: your backstory?
3:56
Denise: A little bit oh boy, oh boy.
3:56
Denise: So I'm I'm assuming everybody here is 18 years and up.
3:58
Denise: So I have some user discretion, as advised, when I'm about to say this, because when I explain that I am an incest survivor, rape survivor, I'm an alcoholic, recovering alcoholic.
4:11
Denise: I have all these these things that have happened to me and they look at me like are you, are you OK, are you functional?
4:18
Denise: And I'm like, yes, but it took a long, long road to get here.
4:25
Denise: Two West African immigrants was raised in the middle-class household.
4:28
Denise: Unfortunately, behind all the white picket fence and the little poodle named Buster, there was a lot of turmoil.
4:37
Denise: My father, though he was an investment banker.
4:39
Denise: He truly mismanaged his money and he was also a philanderer, there's no other way of putting it.
4:48
Denise: My mother I didn't feel connected at all towards any, her husband and, frankly, anybody, and she used me as a play thing, emotionally, verbally, sexually, any way you can.
5:01
Denise: And that happened from zero, as long as I can remember, till 11 years old.
5:06
Denise: So the foster care system took me away briefly, had a lot of turbulent situations from then, was raped by school counselor.
5:17
Denise: I mean, I had just so much things going along.
5:19
Denise: I turned to alcohol, I turned to all sorts of stuff and, remarkably, I went to college.
5:25
Denise: Remarkably, I got a corporate job.
5:27
Denise: Remarkably, I was able to leave that environment that was literally enabling me to be a vile, disgusting person that was only about chasing fame and prestige and not connecting with the people I was truly trying to serve, and it didn't really come through service as a business owner that I realized I had to reconcile.
5:53
Denise: Who I was as a result of who I really was to become because of God, and so there's a lot of other stuff in between, cassandra, but the whole journey was an evolution of breaking past what I thought I was and not not realizing who God designed me to become.
6:17
Denise: So it's been quite a journey, but I'm so grateful to be here yeah, it sounds like it.
6:22
Cassandra: So tell me, who did you think you were?
6:25
Cassandra: Well, based on your background.
6:28
Cassandra: Who did you think you were?
6:30
Denise: I thought I was a whore, I thought I was a drunk.
6:33
Denise: I thought I was useless, I thought I could not, I was inept, I was unqualified.
6:43
Cassandra: Okay, wow, those are all what I call those self-imposed barriers, but based on what you have experienced the culture would say, those things you know, based on what you've done Now, what now?
6:59
Cassandra: So tell my listeners, what was it about you that made you pivot?
7:06
Cassandra: And, like you said, it was a long journey, but you don't see yourself as that anymore.
7:12
Cassandra: Who do you see yourself as now?
7:16
Denise: See myself as the child of God, I see myself as worthy, I see myself as redeemed, I see myself as a instrument for good.
7:27
Denise: But the process of how I got there was not easy for sure, but it actually came in a in a curious kind of way.
7:38
Denise: It came through surrender.
7:39
Denise: Every time I felt that I couldn't take certain people turn situations and I said I don't know what to do.
7:47
Denise: I had to surrender.
7:48
Denise: I had to surrender to God, I had to surrender to ideas that conflicted to the self-limiting thoughts that I gave on myself.
7:59
Denise: Right, and the concern for me, the way I went out, was literally stop trying to carry it on my own means.
8:09
Denise: My own strength, my like, my, my guilt was too heavy.
8:12
Denise: I couldn't.
8:13
Denise: It wasn't designed for me to hold on to it anyway all right, okay, now, how did you realize that?
8:22
Cassandra: like, like, what happened that you know?
8:24
Cassandra: Um, because many of my listeners have similarities and many of them are thinking I'm no good.
8:32
Cassandra: You know, my family didn't love me.
8:35
Cassandra: They gave me away, you know.
8:37
Cassandra: So your story to me is is phenomenal because in retrospect, you're going to share what it was with you that got you out of feeling, and you mentioned your relationship with God.
8:54
Cassandra: Or did somebody turn you on to God?
8:58
Cassandra: Like, how did that happen?
9:00
Cassandra: How did that relationship start?
9:02
Denise: It's funny because I was just sharing this story to my son, cassandra, the other day.
9:08
Denise: I said you know, my mother sat me down and read Psalm 91 and Psalm 23.
9:14
Denise: And I just did not believe in a God that would have me around someone who would did vile things to me, and I went to church, but I didn't have a relationship with church, so I'm not going to sit here and say that it was.
9:29
Denise: I always had a relationship with faith.
9:31
Denise: God was always 5 000 miles away from me and I think cassandra to answer your question I would have these little moments where he would save me from, from things that I self-inflicted damage and stuff like that, and I didn't understand Holy spirit at the time.
9:51
Denise: I didn't understand it, but I would always just feel comforted and saying like, and some of the people would say to me like God's watching over you, and I would have these moments of quiet moments where I would just think and reflect and I would feel comforted and I knew it was something spiritual.
10:09
Denise: That's my journey, sure.
10:11
Cassandra: Like everybody who's listening.
10:13
Denise: They have their own journey, but that was me, oh, and for me it was being more attuned to that little voice, that comforting spirit, that was my journey.
10:44
Cassandra: Mm, hmm, mm, hmm.
10:45
Cassandra: That's that's good, that's good, that's that's good, that's good.
10:58
Cassandra: You talked about things that occurred, that it confirmed something, confirmed your calling.
11:00
Cassandra: What specifically was that?
11:00
Cassandra: Was that?
11:01
Cassandra: And to share with the listeners what your calling is now.
11:05
Denise: So there is a.
11:06
Denise: There's a pastor that I absolutely love.
11:08
Denise: His name is Pastor Paul Sherbert.
11:09
Denise: If you ever had a chance to go to the Bay area, san Francisco Bay area, check that, check his ministry out.
11:14
Denise: But one of the things he said, and I truly believe, is the ABCs.
11:18
Denise: And so the first one is ask.
11:21
Denise: I wanted to be curious.
11:24
Denise: I just love asking questions from people who modeled what I wanted to become.
11:30
Cassandra: That was number one.
11:31
Denise: That's A B.
11:33
Denise: I believe there was something better.
11:35
Denise: So you ask, you believe.
11:39
Denise: You don't have to have everything kind of wrapped up, but I believed in that.
11:44
Denise: And then C, looking for conferral Like what does that look like?
11:48
Denise: You're asking people that know like and trust you, the people who see you in the good, the bad and the ugly, like do you see these traits Like?
11:57
Denise: Do you see the fact that I can be communicative?
12:00
Denise: Or I'm good with numbers?
12:01
Denise: I'm not good with numbers.
12:03
Cassandra: You have to find commercial.
12:05
Denise: My husband laughs at me all the time.
12:07
Denise: You can't do any kind of calculator.
12:10
Denise: Anyway but I digress, looking commercial conferral like look, I literally had people saying denise, you're really good with being able to break down complicated things and make it simple.
12:20
Denise: Denise, you're really good with, like, talking with different types of people.
12:23
Denise: That was confirmed and it's just making sure that I deliver what was inside of me, because that's the thing a lot of people think is like I need to receive, receive, receive, receive, receive, receive.
12:39
Denise: But I needed to deliver out what was already placed in me and you get more in return.
12:45
Denise: So I think it was my ABCDs that allowed me to really walk more and confident with what I knew was true within me Okay.
12:58
Cassandra: So once you left your corporate job, was it difficult?
13:02
Denise: to leave.
13:02
Denise: First of all the money, of course.
13:05
Denise: The money, the healthcare, the steady paycheck, right, the steady paycheck.
13:08
Denise: Oh my gosh.
13:10
Cassandra: Right.
13:10
Cassandra: So Something was really strong enough for you to do that.
13:18
Cassandra: What was that?
13:28
Cassandra: That?
13:28
Cassandra: And I say that because our listeners, many of them, want to leave and do something different, but of course I was the same way.
13:31
Cassandra: I get a paycheck every two weeks.
13:32
Cassandra: I get benefits.
13:34
Cassandra: I'm like you know that's crazy if I would leave something without something else.
13:38
Cassandra: Tell my listeners how that happened.
13:41
Cassandra: How did all that come about?
13:43
Denise: Okay, I really want to preface what I have to say for everyone who's listening to understand that, just because you hate your boss and you don't like the work, it's time for you to spring off and do something different.
13:55
Denise: Right, denise is not saying that, and I want everyone else to know that my situation was because I was literally in a toxic work environment and at the time, my husband was full on and I had ample savings from my career that I could be able to invest in my business.
14:13
Denise: So I just want to say that very clear that everybody may not have the means, opportunity to support, the resources to be a business owner and, that being said, I already had a clientele that I had, part time, ok, so it wasn't like I was starting from zero.
14:33
Denise: So, for those of you guys who are listening and you say I want to just be a business owner, I really want to ask you are you ready to be an unpaid servant for three to five years, because that's really what it is?
14:46
Denise: Are you ready to be able to understand your client better than may perhaps even know yourself, their wants, their needs, those desires, their, their hesitations?
14:55
Denise: That's something that you need to consider too.
14:58
Denise: So, and also are you?
15:00
Denise: Are you willing to invest in your own personal development?
15:03
Denise: A lot of business owners they fail in the first 90.
15:07
Denise: 90 of them fail within the first five years.
15:09
Denise: Aside from the financial stuff is because they fail to understand the stressors that come that of being a business owner.
15:16
Denise: That's not for everyone.
15:18
Cassandra: Absolutely.
15:20
Cassandra: You're exactly right.
15:21
Cassandra: I can.
15:21
Cassandra: I'll attest to that as a as a business owner myself first time business owner like I could, I could manage the corporation I was working for.
15:31
Cassandra: I did really good for them.
15:33
Cassandra: But then it came a time it wasn't really good for me and that's when I made a decision that I'm going to do what I felt I was called to do.
15:44
Cassandra: And that was a process and it took time.
15:47
Cassandra: And as I wrote my book, one of the things I always wanted to do was write a book.
15:53
Cassandra: After I wrote my book I was like OK, I'm done, that's it, you know.
15:58
Cassandra: And something that I said no, you're not, you're just getting started, you have to.
16:03
Cassandra: It's kind of like you have to when much is given, much is required, so you have to give back.
16:09
Cassandra: That book is not for you, it's for everybody who receives it.
16:13
Cassandra: So you're right, a business owner is tough.
16:17
Cassandra: But for me and it sounds like for you I just have a knowing that.
16:22
Cassandra: I know that.
16:23
Cassandra: I know this is something that I should be doing and that's what drives me.
16:27
Cassandra: And, in addition to that, God drives me too, you know, because he's the one that that says look, I have the strong conviction Like this is what you should be doing, and trust me and I'll see you through all that.
16:43
Cassandra: So you're right about that.
16:47
Cassandra: For those who want to make money in the first year, you're a very fortunate person if you do, or the second year, or the third year, you know.
16:57
Cassandra: So it's right.
16:58
Cassandra: So I am so with you on that.
17:00
Cassandra: I'm like, wow, that's amazing.
17:05
Cassandra: Let's talk a little bit about the trauma you experienced.
17:10
Cassandra: Yeah, and I say that again because of my audience Everything is for my listeners and it's so much trauma that's going on out there and just being able to not actually let it go, but put it aside or get the support or whatever you need in order to overcome that, because it stops a lot of people and then some people, it drives them like I'm going to be this and I'm going to do this.
17:42
Cassandra: So what happens if a person doesn't get healed from it?
17:50
Cassandra: Do you consider yourself being healed from the trauma you've gone through?
17:53
Denise: Okay, so, if you'll indulge me, I want to make sure that we're all clear about trauma, okay, yes, so there's a couple things I want to make sure everybody understands.
18:06
Denise: Okay, so every the a trauma is a situation or event that you lack either the emotional, the physical or the psychological tools to either understand or to adapt to, meaning that you may see something that other people may be able to easily overcome, either because of their age, their experience or their proximity.
18:32
Denise: And the best way I've always explained it to people was imagine you see a horrific car crash Right now.
18:58
Denise: You're the person that's 500 feet away, who has never seen a car crash, may have a completely different reaction from someone who's a first responder, a firefighter, a doctor, who sees this stuff almost every week, all the time.
19:01
Denise: Right, exactly the kid in the car may have a completely different perspective than the 40-year-old man who's also had a previous car crash.
19:06
Denise: So it depends on your age, your experience, your proximity, right?
19:13
Denise: And then one other thing I just really want to mention trauma's coming to theity, part of traumas Everyone thinks of traumas as I was abused or hit, or for a lot of us who came out of corporate America, that was traumatic within itself.
19:32
Denise: That's a whole different story as a problem, and so everyone thinks that trauma is that you got hit or something else, but so it comes in different varieties.
19:41
Denise: It could be chronic work right, that's traumatic, right, it could be you are in a family where money is mismanaged that's trauma.
19:52
Denise: So I really want to validate for everybody who thinks like, well, it wasn't trauma.
19:55
Denise: Well, what if your father always left every night and he never explained to you what was happening?
20:01
Denise: That is trauma.
20:04
Denise: So, that being said, everybody, 90% of us in the course of our life, will experience a form of either some form of trauma, either a little t, like those little moments, chronic stressful moments or something big that just rocks your world, and so to sit here and say that I am completely healed from every single trauma that I've ever experienced is folly.
20:28
Denise: That's not.
20:29
Denise: That's not the case now, and have I been able to adapt and understand what had happened, to be able to respond appropriately and be able to tell my story?
20:39
Denise: That's how you know when you're healed.
20:43
Cassandra: Okay, good, good, because you're very open with it.
20:47
Cassandra: Yeah, right, yeah, and so that's one of the things that individuals can do.
20:54
Cassandra: And you're right on, denise, and I'm so glad that you defined what trauma was, because I'm thinking of a time in my life and even when I wrote my book.
21:09
Cassandra: The book is love letters written to women and they're like, for example, dear women who have scars and resentment, and they're like, for example, dear women who have scars and resentment, you know, or dear women that compare yourselves to others.
21:23
Cassandra: And I just kind of want to talk about those scars and resentment and how I had to.
21:37
Cassandra: Well, first of all, the reason it took me a long time to write the book because I didn't want to be exposed OK, I don't want people to know my stuff, and I didn't know what people would say and all of that.
21:44
Cassandra: But then eventually I got over that, because what I've been through, so many other people have been through, may not be the same exact thing, but just something different and based on the scars that I had.
21:56
Cassandra: That was trauma for me.
21:57
Cassandra: But just something different and based on the scars that I had.
21:58
Cassandra: That was trauma for me.
21:59
Cassandra: You know, it was trauma for me, for my for me to find out that I had a sister that everybody knew about and I didn't you know, so I dealt with that for years.
22:06
Cassandra: So I saw that as a form of trauma for me growing up.
22:11
Cassandra: So that's why I'm really really glad that you you brought that up, really glad that you um, you brought that up.
22:22
Cassandra: Um, you also talked about there were different types of what you call them.
22:24
Cassandra: Um, was it people?
22:25
Cassandra: You talked about there?
22:26
Cassandra: Different types of people, and one was stable.
22:30
Cassandra: You talked about ancient.
22:32
Denise: Oh right, yeah, so we didn't talk about it, but I can definitely talk about that.
22:39
Denise: But to your, to your point earlier, I want to say I know that you talked about in your book external and internal storms and I really wanted to amplify that, if I may.
22:51
Denise: You know for a lot of us that when we're going through something traumatic, right we have.
22:57
Denise: Our world is rocked, our way of how we relate to ourselves and how we view people has changed and we have feelings that are unprocessed anger, guilt, shame, resentment, all that.
23:09
Denise: That storm is brewing inside of us, right.
23:11
Denise: And then we've also got the storms are brewing out around us, the people who are unable or unwilling to be able to comfort or relate or understand with you, right okay, I got you.
23:25
Denise: That's good yeah that's good all right, so so, um, there are three, four different types of people in the world.
23:36
Denise: Okay, if you're lucky, one of the lucky 20, 30 percent of us, you're considered a stable person.
23:43
Denise: Emotionally stable person, meaning that you're able to understand, relate, process, communicate in a way that shows love and concern shows love and concern for yourself as well as other people.
23:57
Denise: Right, that's the ideal happy case.
23:59
Denise: Stable, confident person.
24:00
Denise: Unfortunately, if you have gone through any type of chronic stress or traumatic incidents, you fall into one of these other categories you are an anxious person.
24:13
Denise: And that's in clinical terms, it's called neurotic.
24:16
Denise: And so what that's in clinical terms is called neurotic.
24:18
Denise: And so what that is is you're constantly fearing what had happened or what will happen, and you're constantly time traveling in the past or the present.
24:30
Denise: And you're and those kind of personalities are, the ones that are people pleasers, the ones that will never, ever say no, even despite the fact that they've got 10 other things that they got going on simultaneously.
24:42
Denise: I'll drop everything, sweetheart, and I'll come and help you.
24:45
Denise: They're the ones who have the full workload and they'll do everything.
24:49
Denise: That's it.
24:50
Denise: Or you may fall into the bin of the avoid it, where you believe you're incompetent or unworthy.
24:56
Denise: You don't want any criticism whatsoever and you will.
25:01
Denise: You're the one who will procrastinate or avoid, or you're the ones who are quick to be sarcastic or say snippy things, all to keep people away from you.
25:15
Denise: And then there's the last one is away from you, and then there's the last one is disorganized, where you have this push pull situation where I love you, come close.
25:23
Denise: No, don't come too close.
25:23
Denise: No, I want to spend time with you.
25:24
Denise: No, not, not really.
25:25
Denise: These are the people that we call wishy-washy, and anyone who's anxious, avoiding or disorganized has gone through unprocessed trauma.
25:37
Cassandra: Okay, that's good.
25:38
Cassandra: Say that again If anybody's what Anxious.
25:42
Denise: Say it again Anxious, avoided or disorganized.
25:46
Denise: You have unprocessed trauma.
25:49
Cassandra: Okay, all right.
25:50
Cassandra: So individuals listening to that was like wow, so it's enabling them to think about really Like.
25:57
Cassandra: Some people are like so did I go through any trauma?
25:59
Cassandra: You know they're not.
26:01
Cassandra: They're not quite sure whether they went through trauma or not, but those are some types of some behaviors that will articulate whether they've gone through trauma.
26:16
Cassandra: Is that what you're saying?
26:17
Denise: Yeah, I mean there's a lot of characteristics for someone who has've gone through trauma.
26:21
Denise: Is that what you're saying?
26:22
Denise: Yeah, I mean there's a lot of characteristics for someone who has unhealed trauma.
26:26
Denise: They're suspicious, they blame, they externalize, they use magical thinking.
26:30
Denise: Magical thinking and saying if I was there in this certain time, this certain place, then maybe I could have changed events.
26:32
Denise: In these sequences, they are the ones who minimize their interactions with people.
26:38
Denise: No, it was.
26:38
Denise: I wasn't that part of that problem, it was really their problem.
26:41
Denise: Or they magnify If everyone wouldn't do things my way, everything would be perfect, and so they.
26:48
Denise: There's more cognitive.
26:50
Denise: It's called cognitive distortion.
26:51
Denise: The fancy way for how you think is not in line with reality.
26:55
Denise: Right?
26:56
Cassandra: Okay, you think is not in line with reality, right, okay, and you also what I've read and did some reading about you.
27:05
Cassandra: Let's talk about the mindsets.
27:06
Cassandra: Yeah, how do you, what do you do with your clients to shift their mindset?
27:11
Cassandra: Give us some examples about that.
27:13
Denise: Well, this is making the assumption, cassandra, they actually want to heal, because not everyone who's thirsty wants to drink, ok, ok.
27:22
Denise: So we're making this assumption, sure, and we're also making the assumption that they're not addicted to being a victim of.
27:38
Denise: People love sharing their stories about their woes and how everybody mistreated them, and glorifying all the pain that they experienced so they can make themselves feel special right I'm not saying we're not special, for sure everyone's special special.
27:47
Denise: We all are right, we're all special but.
27:49
Denise: If you're doing it at the expense of ignoring your part, your culpability or what the what was really happening.
27:57
Denise: You're mistaking, you're mistaken about who you really are.
28:01
Denise: So when we're making the shift into our mindset, we're actually saying to ourselves I am aware and I am ready to be able to see truths about myself and others, which may feel uncomfortable and may be downright painful, and I'm willing to be able to be responsible and how I choose to move forward despite what had happened.
28:27
Denise: So, it's the choice, with eyes, open, feet on the ground, open heart, to understand like why am I really and what part did I play and what can I do now?
28:41
Cassandra: Right.
28:41
Cassandra: Okay, so you are a coach to helping business owners and leaders.
28:50
Cassandra: Could you give an example in regards to a business owner or a leader who said I'm ready, I'm open to what you're going to do.
29:01
Cassandra: I know I need to shift my mindset.
29:03
Cassandra: I'm all open to what you say, denise or Ms Lee.
29:06
Cassandra: So what process would you use after that with individuals?
29:13
Denise: For me, this is the way my practice.
29:16
Denise: Everybody's practice is a little bit different, but my practice is literally going reverse engineering, meaning I'd love to know if you want to shift shift to what?
29:26
Denise: What person do you want to become and why do you want to become it?
29:31
Denise: Because we can't be able to move forward without a map in mind.
29:37
Denise: Like, think about it, when you want to go somewhere new, where you're traveling, you do just say, hey, I want to go to to chuck your cheese.
29:45
Denise: And then what's the machine gonna say, well, where?
29:47
Denise: yeah, right, exactly, yeah, yeah and so and so I always like to ask, like why is this important?
29:58
Denise: So that we actually have some clarity, Because some people they have an idea of I just want to be able to make the comments.
30:06
Denise: I want to make lots of money.
30:07
Denise: Well, why do you want to make money?
30:09
Cassandra: That's right, that's right.
30:12
Denise: Right, like I want to feed my kids, everybody wants to feed their kids.
30:16
Denise: I got to get out of here real wide, like really, and how is this going to be of use?
30:22
Denise: So once we understand that, then the next thing is what traits within you that you find that is getting in the way of your success.
30:33
Denise: And then we come to action items to be able to say, okay, we're going to work on this.
30:39
Denise: Okay, we're going to work on your anger.
30:41
Denise: Your anger is really behind the desire to control.
30:45
Denise: Why are you seeking control?
30:47
Denise: I don't feel comfortable uncertainty.
30:49
Denise: Why are you seeking uncomfortable?
30:51
Denise: Why are you feeling comfortable uncertainty?
30:52
Denise: So it all goes back to reverse engineering, to figure out exactly little daily things to help you move to the person that you want to become.
31:04
Cassandra: Yeah, that's good because in my business, my mentoring business, you know, I'm all about mitigating barriers or self-imposed barriers that's preventing you from from living your best life.
31:15
Cassandra: And it's interesting because I usually ask individuals from a scale of one to ten, and ten being the highest, where are you on that scale and living your best life?
31:26
Cassandra: And you know that's like what are you talking about?
31:30
Cassandra: You know, some people immediately say I'm an eight, you know, or I'm a, I'm like.
31:35
Cassandra: They haven't even really thought about what their best life looks like.
31:40
Cassandra: So you have to find from them what it is that is your best life and why is it the same thing that you do?
31:47
Cassandra: You know, as you indicated, all coaches are different.
31:50
Cassandra: You know, this is the way I do my process.
31:52
Cassandra: The center will probably do the process a little different, but still, that's the first thing and it's kind of like are you ready to be, are you ready for this?
32:05
Cassandra: Because you have to do some tough love.
32:07
Cassandra: If this is what they want to do, you have to say the why.
32:10
Cassandra: Like people like I just want to feed my kids, just like you said.
32:14
Cassandra: Well, okay, we all want to do.
32:15
Cassandra: That's the survival mode.
32:16
Cassandra: Okay, but what's the real why so?
32:19
Denise: you're right, you're right on on that one, I appreciate that you know, ms Cassandra, I know that you talk a lot about being present, right, and I know people are listening and they're trying to multitask right now, and so I would like I just want to call it out right now If you want to take that shift, you need to be present and engaged in what you want to get out of this conversation.
32:41
Cassandra: Exactly, exactly.
32:43
Cassandra: You get out what you put in.
32:44
Cassandra: It's just like in school a test or a speech or whatever.
32:49
Cassandra: A training, right, exactly right.
32:51
Cassandra: Denise, you have a podcast called Learn to Be the Real you, unapologetically, is that right?
33:08
Cassandra: Yes, your podcast name, the introverted entrepreneur podcast, right, okay, um, and you're usually not on others podcasts, why are you choosing to be on podcast now as a guest?
33:20
Denise: I did a really good job of steering people.
33:24
Denise: Obviously, I'm a coach, right, so I do that professionally, right, right, but service comes in lots of different angles, right, and I know that if I am not in control of the show, it might bring out some ideas or things that I never considered to talk about.
33:42
Denise: So I love to be in service in different angles and this is a different way to be of service.
33:51
Cassandra: Okay, Okay, now, how long have you been a guest?
33:57
Denise: I have.
33:58
Denise: I mean, I got invited to be a guest a few times last year, but this year I was thinking like I really want to be challenged, I really want to be on my toes right and when you're a host, obviously, cassandra, you get.
34:14
Denise: This is your, your sandbox, you get control or deviate but when you're when you're a guest like you've relinquished control right and I want to be able to be comfortable in who I am and the power that has been bestowed upon me, to be like I'm okay that I don't know what's going to happen next.
34:34
Denise: I can still be, at peace that's.
34:37
Cassandra: That's awesome, because we were talking about before we came on about.
34:42
Cassandra: I saw that you said you were an introvert and then I said, well, so am I.
34:47
Cassandra: And then you said, well, I can.
34:49
Cassandra: Well, let me, let me talk a little bit about that.
34:52
Cassandra: You know so, when people are surprised, many people are surprised, and probably with you, that you are an introvert.
35:00
Cassandra: Do you find that, or change the dynamic, that you're not an introvert, you're both?
35:08
Denise: Well, it's funny because I've actually had the privilege of talking with some very, very well-renowned therapists about childhood trauma talking with some very, very well-renowned therapists about childhood trauma and I have talked about this idea in some of my articles on my website, denisegleecom, about faux or fake introvert versus fake extrovert, and what what I'm talking about is in our, it's a response, adaptation to stressful situations.
35:35
Denise: So in order to me, for me, make peace like not to make peace, rather, but to understand the world around me I needed to go as inward as I could, to de-stress, to calm down, to analyzing.
35:49
Denise: I didn't want to speak out loud, but I noticed that when I'm at calm and at ease, I can easily converse, I can easily get my energy from other people.
35:59
Denise: So, when people think about introvert versus extrovert, it was this is a psychological term dubbed by Carl Jung where, where does your source of energy?
36:07
Denise: From inside yourself or from outside?
36:09
Denise: And I realized, when I am engaged in topics that have really thrilled me, yes, I'm totally, topics have really thrilled me.
36:22
Denise: Yes, I'm totally effervescent, yes, I'm extroverted, but when I'm around people in situations that are scary, unknown or I don't feel comfortable, my sin I want to retreat inward right, okay, that's good, because I'm an introvert and you know I always say what, when I share that with people, no, you're, you're not.
36:38
Cassandra: Then they're going to tell me what I'm not and I'm a processor.
36:42
Cassandra: You know we could be in a meeting and you know I'll just sit there and try to get everything in.
36:47
Cassandra: You know, and at one time I used to have this barrier that says, oh, they feel like I'm not with it because I'm not contributing, you know, and so I had to get away with that, you know.
37:00
Cassandra: And then there are times that I retreat and I feel good about that, and then it's like, okay, it's time to speak up because I'm hearing what's going on.
37:07
Cassandra: Now it's my turn.
37:08
Cassandra: And then it's like EF Hutton, whenever she speaks, you know, people listen.
37:13
Cassandra: So it's not and we're not saying my, my listeners, that extroverts are a bad thing.
37:18
Cassandra: We're not saying trauma is a bad thing.
37:21
Cassandra: You know we're not saying that.
37:24
Cassandra: And we're not saying that barriers are a bad thing, because we all have these things.
37:36
Cassandra: We all have barriers and and and, particularly when we say, well, I should have done this, yeah, I'm a bad person.
37:44
Cassandra: And when you say I should, that's shame, you don't should on me.
37:49
Cassandra: You know, that's kind of what I tell people I should, I should have done this, I should have done that, so, um.
37:54
Cassandra: So I'm with you on the introvert extrovert and I'm happy to say that I'm an introvert and I'm happy to say I'm extrovert when I have to be.
38:02
Cassandra: So we're not saying all of this for people to start feeling bad.
38:06
Cassandra: We're just kind of talking about this is the real deal, this is the real you.
38:10
Cassandra: It's kind of like your podcast and you're unapologetically about it.
38:14
Cassandra: You know, learn to be the real.
38:16
Cassandra: You, I think, is critical about it.
38:22
Cassandra: You know, learn to be the real.
38:23
Cassandra: You, I think, is critical.
38:23
Cassandra: And one thing that I usually say is I had read an article about a hospice nurse, individuals who are transitioning and before they pass, you wanted to know do they have any regrets?
38:32
Cassandra: And it was like unbelievable the regrets that they said they have.
38:36
Cassandra: Times are changing now, so perhaps one of the regrets that really bothered me is they said they wish they would have been more true to themselves and I'm like, wow, oh, wow, is that a regret?
38:49
Cassandra: And you talked about choice earlier and we all have a choice and a choice to me is a know.
38:57
Cassandra: So for that individual it was probably a common denominator to say I wish I had been true to myself.
39:05
Cassandra: More people said that, rather than I wish I didn't work so hard, that's, you know, I wish I would have spent more time with family.
39:11
Cassandra: So that, right there, I thought was real interesting.
39:15
Cassandra: So I really liked your podcast and I am going to start listening to it so I can make sure that I'm learning to be the real you, that I'm actually the real person, because I'm still a work in progress.
39:28
Denise: Oh well, thank you.
39:29
Denise: I definitely talk about being the real you, but my podcast name is the Introverted Entrepreneur Podcast.
39:35
Cassandra: Okay, all right Now.
39:36
Cassandra: I don't know where the real you came from.
39:38
Cassandra: I saw it somewhere that that was the name of your podcast, so I apologize for that, but that's probably talking about being the real you.
39:47
Denise: That's probably where it came from, word Association.
39:49
Cassandra: Yeah, exactly For my listeners.
39:54
Cassandra: What are the practical tools to turn your obstacles into opportunities?
40:04
Denise: For a lot of us who have gone through situations that were confusing, bewildering, uncomfortable and we didn't have the tools to either understand nor be able to influence.
40:21
Denise: We feel a sense of helplessness, sense of hopelessness.
40:25
Denise: We have a myopic vision of the fact that we're crowded in and we can't break free out of the box or wherever we feel like we're constrained.
40:33
Denise: And the best tip?
40:35
Denise: I have a few tips.
40:36
Denise: The best tip is I want you to ask why.
40:39
Denise: For a lot of us, the reason why we feel like we have obstacles is because we never ask the why.
40:47
Denise: Why is that?
40:48
Denise: Who told you that We've done such a great job as human beings and giving reasons why we can't?
40:57
Denise: We don't put enough of that energy into why we can't.
41:03
Denise: The next thing is I would love people to understand is to explore your creativity.
41:10
Denise: It's a god-given thing.
41:12
Denise: Remember when we were kids and we found scrap the paper and somehow turn that into a trunk, a donkey or whatever.
41:19
Denise: We we can just figure some stuff together and we let our imaginations run wild.
41:25
Denise: That that little girl, that little boy, is still within you right now.
41:30
Denise: What can you transform?
41:34
Denise: I don't care what you have.
41:35
Denise: Don't tell me you can't start becoming a hairdresser, I don't have a cosmetology lesson.
41:41
Denise: Who said you couldn't go to the cosmetology school down the street and do a barter arrangement and get some hours in?
41:47
Denise: Oh, I don't want anybody saying no.
41:50
Denise: I'm going to say I don't want anybody rejecting me.
41:53
Denise: Well sweetheart, you have to understand that they're not a no.
41:58
Denise: No, no's are fine, and maybe it's a not right now, or maybe it's banging on more doors.
42:04
Denise: Right Another thing is I really mentioned right now was persistence.
42:09
Denise: And then the other last thing I want to share is faith in something beyond just you.
42:18
Denise: The reason why we think as an obstacle is that we think that it's all in our power, all on our strength we have to come up with without anybody input, because we believe that we have to do it our way.
42:29
Denise: Sweetheart, maybe there's ways that other people have done right that you haven't even considered.
42:38
Denise: Perhaps there are books, perhaps there's obviously podcasts like this you're listening to.
42:41
Denise: Maybe you need to tap into somebody else as well to get some well needed refreshment.
42:50
Cassandra: Right, exactly, that's good, exactly, I like those tools.
42:56
Cassandra: And made me think of I have the ABCs too.
43:03
Cassandra: I have an ABC formula and I call it a secret formula.
43:07
Cassandra: It's kind of like, you know, when I'm talking about self-imposed barriers, like, like you indicated, like why do you think that you can't be this, or why why not?
43:21
Cassandra: You know, acknowledge that barrier.
43:23
Cassandra: I mean what, what?
43:24
Cassandra: Acknowledge it, and then and then kind of think, well, where did you get it from?
43:27
Cassandra: What was your belief?
43:28
Cassandra: I mean, where did that belief come from?
43:30
Cassandra: You know, like, like for me, I was a perfectionist.
43:34
Cassandra: I still am, you know, but I'm getting better with it.
43:36
Cassandra: So that means I've been through some trauma, right, but I'm OK with that.
43:40
Cassandra: And so then you know, once you know and understand where that belief came from, that perhaps you're not good enough to do this, then it's time to change the narrative.
43:51
Cassandra: You know, because, if you like, for me the perfectionist came from my mom.
43:55
Cassandra: You know, do this, why aren't you doing that?
43:58
Cassandra: Why do you look like that?
43:59
Cassandra: Why do you have that dress on?
44:00
Cassandra: You know, it's like eggshells stepping on eggshells going to her because I wanted to make sure I was just right, you know.
44:07
Cassandra: So, when I understood where it came from and I acknowledged it.
44:11
Cassandra: Then I was able to change the narrative about being being perfect, so to speak, with no perfect person out there.
44:18
Cassandra: Being perfect, so to speak, where there's no perfect person out there but God.
44:22
Cassandra: That's the way that I see that.
44:23
Cassandra: So any last words because this is the journey from survival to success is the topic of our podcast today and, as you indicated, denise, based on what you've been through and you're not the only one that's been through stuff but you got beyond that and you see yourself as successful because we talked about what you thought you were.
44:47
Cassandra: So now tell the listeners what you are now, as you indicated a child of God, you know.
44:53
Cassandra: I'm confident, so just think about where you were and where you are now.
44:58
Cassandra: I think it's great, yeah, yeah.
45:02
Denise: You know, as we've been talking, cassandra, one of the things that it's been really apparent to me is that we only box ourselves based on all our own narrative our own narrative, and if we are to really become the way we're designed to become right, it's from a place of humility and surrender, right and curiosity.
45:31
Cassandra: Right, exactly, and you will be amazed if you surrender.
45:37
Cassandra: If you surrender, so, denise, tell my listeners how they can get in touch with you yeah, I've made it super, super easy.
45:46
Denise: You literally just take my name, denise g lee, and put it in google, or just take that whole name and then add a dot com, and then you'll be able to reach me okay, great.
45:58
Cassandra: And for those who are listening, like looking at the MP4 version, not just the audio, I'm telling you guys that I'm moving around because it just so happened that, for some reason, the sun will not go to my right or to my left, it just wants to stay right, right in my face and and I decided that it is what it is.
46:22
Cassandra: You know, I'm like, well, maybe you know I could reschedule this podcast because it's not right, it's not perfect, so that's just a demonstration.
46:31
Cassandra: Hey, that's what it is, and I am confident that you got something out of this podcast today and I also want you to share it with individuals that you know this will be just right on for those individuals.
46:48
Cassandra: You know how to get in touch with Denise to thank her for her insight and her experience and her openness.
47:04
Cassandra: That has been a blessing for so many of you and for me as well.
47:06
Cassandra: So, my listeners, this podcast will be on all podcast platforms.
47:09
Cassandra: So this is what I always say to everybody Bye for now, and God bless you all.
47:15
Cassandra: And again, denise, thank you so much.
47:19
Denise: Thank you for having me.
47:19
Denise: I'm blessed.
47:20
Denise: Thank you.
47:34
Cassandra: Oh, that's so funny Because as soon as I turned off, the sun got out, isn't?
47:40
Denise: that amazing.
47:41
Denise: What can I say?
47:42
Denise: Yeah, well, I really had a fun time.
47:45
Denise: Cassandra, thank you so much for allowing me the time to talk with your audience.
47:49
Denise: Yeah, thank you.
47:51
Cassandra: Are you in California?
47:53
Denise: No, ma'am, I'm in Texas, okay.
47:56
Cassandra: Because I know Shepard.
47:57
Cassandra: He comes to my church a lot.
48:02
Cassandra: I know him Well.
48:03
Cassandra: I don't know him personally, but I've heard him because he's a visitor.
48:10
Denise: He comes to our church all the time and speaks oh wow, I didn't know that.
48:16
Cassandra: I'm glad I mentioned that.
48:17
Cassandra: I am too.
48:18
Cassandra: That's the ABC guy.
48:19
Cassandra: Glad I mentioned that I am too.
48:21
Cassandra: That's the ABC guy for you.
48:30
Denise: Yes, Right, right.
48:30
Denise: And when I, when he comes to our church again, I'm going to mention that and tell him how that that message really blessed someone that I've spoken with.
48:33
Denise: I listen to him all the time.
48:37
Cassandra: Yes, yeah, and I've never met him in person, so that's awesome.
48:39
Cassandra: Yeah, well, look, god bless you.
48:40
Cassandra: Thank you, continue to do what you do and, as I say to everybody, bye for now.
48:47
Cassandra: Yes, okay, all right, all right, okay.