Latest / The Shed Organics Show / #38 - Rare Dragonfruit & How To Grow Them | Yana [Rare Dragonfruit]

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#38 - Rare Dragonfruit & How To Grow Them | Yana [Rare Dragonfruit] · The Shed Organics Show

0:00
Hello everybody, and welcome back to another episode of the
0:04
Shed Organics Show. Today we have a really fun
0:08
episode. We are talking to Jana from Rare
0:11
Dragon Fruit and these guys are up in Agnes Water.
0:16
I call it North Queensland, but as you'll find out, it's not
0:19
really North North QLD, but it's north of me and that's enough
0:23
for me. So these guys have a dragon
0:26
fruit farm. They have over 150 different
0:30
varieties of dragon fruit growing on their farm.
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And I think you'll agree with me in knowing that dragon fruits
0:38
are one of these weird and wonderful fruits that they've
0:41
got such vibrant colour, such incredible taste and they're
0:44
also such a cool thing to grow. They kind of look really fun and
0:48
you know, everybody loves the cactus.
0:49
So it's just this really unique fruit and having such rare
0:53
varieties and the work that they've done to track down these
0:56
varieties and grow them and provide them for us.
0:59
I just had to highlight them. And as you would have heard from
1:03
last week, I had the wonderful key landscapes guys next to me
1:06
at the Queensland Garden Show. But on the other side of me was
1:10
the red dragon fruit family. And I'm I was stoked to be in
1:14
between both of them and just to get to know these guys over the
1:17
last couple of garden shows has been super fun.
1:19
So without further ado, we're going to be jumping into all
1:22
things dragon fruit today, how to grow them, how to support
1:25
them, all the trials and tribulations of growing dragon
1:28
fruit and what you might need to know.
1:29
So strap in if you're a dragon fruit fan, this one's going to
1:33
be very sweet and delicious. So without further ado, here is
1:37
Jana from Rare Dragon Fruit. With something like dragon
1:57
Fruit, like what is the motivation to start going down
2:01
the Dragon Fruit Rd. There's so many things that you
2:04
could have picked and like, I'm not, you know, throwing any
2:07
shade on dragon fruit because I think it's a blooming awesome
2:10
fruit. But why the choice?
2:13
Yeah, why dragon fruit? The the just purely because
2:18
they're not like a mango or a fruit where you get a mass
2:21
amount of fruit at once. Yeah, we can get fruit over a
2:26
season, like 6 months. We can have buds, flowers and
2:31
fruit developing and eating fruit all at one time.
2:34
So there's like this nice succession.
2:36
So you've always kind of got something that week.
2:39
Yeah. I mean, not obviously not over
2:41
winter, but yeah, it's just not a massive fruit all at once.
2:45
You're not dealing with oranges and oranges and oranges.
2:48
There's enough to maintain us, and for a backyard that's
2:51
perfect. It is like.
2:53
You're getting a good good like you're getting kilos of fruit
2:57
over a three to six month period depending where you're located,
3:00
so. And was that the motivation
3:04
initially just because you liked eating it and you're like, I
3:06
just want to, let's just get into it?
3:08
Or how did it eventuate into a business?
3:10
Absolutely. Purely flute.
3:13
You're right. Because so I was.
3:16
I can't throw anything out. Hover parenting is that dog
3:20
really annoying. I can't hear the dog.
3:21
No, no, no, no. Oh, good, 'cause she really
3:24
annoys me. No, well, all the.
3:25
Time. OK, so that's what that's what
3:28
our pets are there for sometimes, isn't it?
3:30
Yeah, yeah, This is like a third child.
3:33
It's the worst child here. So I I can't throw things out.
3:39
I was just trimming back the Mulberry tree, did a heap of
3:42
cuttings, like, all right, I've got to sell these now.
3:44
Like I can't have them here. So then I started selling on Gum
3:47
tree eBay and then it just developed from there and then I
3:50
was doing a range of permaculture plants.
3:53
OK. Yeah, and natives and all this
3:55
stuff and sourcing everything and have this huge range because
3:58
we lived in town so I could source from different places.
4:02
But then dragon fruit sort of just stuck with me is like, this
4:05
is a really cool crop and wow, there's so much more variety and
4:09
it's like a niche kind of thing as well.
4:13
So when we lived on a 600 square metre house block, I had about
4:16
60 varieties growing amongst all these different coconut trees,
4:21
jackfruit, like just people would walk out into the backyard
4:27
and not know what to do 'cause I mean the kids cubby house was
4:30
covered in choco and it was, we had the full, we had in that
4:36
space a bunch of bananas almost for each month ripening.
4:40
Like we sort of just got it working perfectly.
4:43
So it's tended now to focus on dragon fruit now that we're on a
4:47
farm. But prior to that we did a lot
4:49
of permaculture based stuff. And for us here, they're a
4:55
better crop to grow because Agnes can be really, really wet
4:57
or really, really dry. Yeah, Let's talk about that
5:00
then, where you are, Agnes Water, for those who are not
5:05
familiar. And I've got a couple of
5:07
listeners like in the US and things like this, yeah.
5:11
Can you describe the type of climate?
5:13
It's North Queensland, so it's similar.
5:15
To technical. Climate, But what do you call
5:18
it? We're sort of middle of North
5:20
Queensland, like we're not quite north north and we're not quite.
5:24
Yeah, we're six hours from Brisbane, Yeah.
5:28
And it's still about, I think, what is it, 17 hours from
5:32
Brisbane to Cairns. So we're still about 12 hours
5:34
from Cairns. Right.
5:35
Yes, OK. So we're at the start of the
5:37
Great Barrier Reef. We're the last spot we've
5:40
surfed. That's why we live here, because
5:41
of Mick lacking surfing and it's as far north as we could go.
5:46
So we're an hour from Bundaberg, which is really interesting
5:50
because that's a major growing food bowl, Yes.
5:54
And then we're an hour South of Gladstone, which is a major
5:57
mining town. So we're in the in this weird
6:01
mix, but Agnes has got such bad soil that no one's actually
6:05
really grown here before. A lot.
6:07
Oh. Yeah, you're right.
6:07
OK. But we see that as a positive.
6:10
OK to pave the way this. Is not contaminated.
6:13
Yeah, true. It's virgin like it had, it's
6:16
had forests, it's got really bad clay soil.
6:19
But what we're adding is our control.
6:21
Otherwise it was just a. Yeah.
6:24
So instead of like if you look at other places like Cairns and
6:28
other areas in as well where they're doing aerial spraying of
6:31
banana crops and things. I've visited a few farms only a
6:35
few months ago and they didn't even have insects to pollinate
6:38
their dragon fruit because of the overspray from the bananas
6:41
being aerial sprayed. So yeah.
6:44
And then prior to that they were probably cane farm and things
6:47
like that. So we haven't had generations of
6:50
abuse of our land, we're just regeneratively farming it now.
6:55
We're improving the soil. We had no worms when we moved in
7:00
and now we have worms. Wonderful.
7:03
I know that you guys are following very similar growing
7:07
styles to those that I promote as well and we share that
7:10
similar vision and hopefully we're trying to encourage more
7:15
people to do that as well. Yeah.
7:17
I, I love to that point about thinking about North Queensland,
7:20
you, you often think about mangoes, bananas, cane sugar
7:23
cane and things like this. It's a big part of the world for
7:26
where this sort of stuff comes from.
7:28
And if if you've ever been up there for people that are
7:31
listening, it's there are fields and fields and rows and rows of
7:35
bananas and sugar cane and all of this.
7:37
And if there is acres throwing acres, yeah, hectares.
7:40
And if we're spraying then it's it's literally contaminating
7:46
majority of the land or the run off all of this type of thing.
7:50
Like the roof of your house will go white.
7:53
Really. And.
7:54
If you're on tank water, like when you get talking to people,
7:58
it's a spin out and like we were driving through and I was
8:01
Googling like how many bananas do we consume a day?
8:04
It's like, OK, so we need to do this, 'cause if you're not
8:07
growing a banana crawl, you're eating, you're one of those,
8:11
you're eating one of those 5 million bananas that are
8:14
consumed in Australia day 5 million.
8:17
A day. Yeah.
8:18
So that's you can sit. We need that.
8:20
Yeah. So if you've got a backyard and
8:23
you plant a banana tree and you're producing 50 to 100
8:27
bananas, we're all reducing that impact.
8:30
It's all those small things that's such an important.
8:33
Point I hadn't I hadn't really thought about the well I mean I
8:37
understand the sheer volume of fruit that is required, but 5
8:41
million a you know a day is quite insane and you know
8:46
bananas aren't fruiting every 5 seconds to enough to.
8:50
Keep up, it's 18 months to get a bunch.
8:53
Exactly. So we're, we're having to be
8:55
really, really patient. Maybe we could encourage people
8:59
to turn to dragon fruits instead of buying bananas.
9:04
Tell tell me about dragon fruits growing up there then.
9:08
So how do you find growing it? Is it?
9:11
It's a tropical fruit for the most part.
9:15
Is it or? Yeah, so tropical to
9:18
subtropical, weirdly enough. So they respond on daylight
9:22
hours. Cool.
9:24
So I was up North Queensland about this time of year a few
9:27
years ago and NSW, I was getting fruit 1st and I, I thought I'd
9:32
go to, you know, it's mango season.
9:34
You go to Darwin, you're going to get the first mangoes.
9:36
I'm like, I'm going to the Dane tree, I'm going to get the first
9:39
dragon fruit. This is going to be awesome.
9:41
But it wasn't that the southern states were getting flowers
9:44
first all. Right.
9:45
Why? Purely I think because the
9:48
extreme changes in temperature where North Queensland, it's a
9:52
gradual like daylight hours slowly increase where if you're
9:55
in a southern state you get more of like the lights are on at six
10:00
now. They're not, it's not 7 or 8.
10:03
So yeah. There's a bigger swing, I guess
10:06
in daylight hours, isn't there? Like up in Queensland.
10:09
It's, it's especially with the daylight saving, we've only got
10:12
a movement between say 910 hours of daylight up to sort of 13.
10:18
And it's, that's not a huge swing as you might see somewhere
10:21
like in the UK where they have a 17 to, you know, 6 hour swing,
10:26
which is crazy. Yeah, it's very consistent,
10:29
isn't it? Isn't it?
10:30
Yeah, that's it. So I think that shock of more of
10:33
a sudden warmth increase and a sudden daylight hour makes a
10:37
huge difference. Yeah, OK.
10:39
OK, so then you started selling these cuttings of the dragon
10:46
fruit, and you're starting to cultivate your own, learn how to
10:51
grow them effectively and then share that with other people.
10:55
What what led into the vast amount of varieties of dragon
11:01
fruits that you have and then the focus on rare varieties?
11:07
It's just always, you can always do better, I think.
11:10
So some of some of the varieties people have in their backyard
11:14
for instance are self sterile so.
11:17
Right. Yeah.
11:18
Trying to get that variety that ticks all the boxes.
11:21
It's the right size, it's got the right skin thickness so it
11:23
can last, it's disease resistant, self fertile.
11:28
So I think it's just I, it's almost chasing a little bit of a
11:31
Holy Grail in some respect because it's that that flavour
11:35
that ticks everyone's boxes as well, because there are so many
11:38
different flavours. That's so that's somewhat like
11:45
confusing to me because in the same well, I haven't tasted all
11:51
these varieties. So you'll have to help me with a
11:53
little bit of the the tasting side of it, the experience
11:56
itself. But say, for example, a banana,
11:59
like we were talking about before, there are quite a few
12:01
different varieties of banana. But if you gave me a blind taste
12:06
test of all these bananas, I'm not sure how well I would do
12:10
telling the difference of especially if it was like mashed
12:14
or something. I would do a little bit.
12:15
But you know and see even. Bananas.
12:18
I've got like 21 different varieties.
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Can you tell the? Difference.
12:22
Change your mind on that. Could really do you reckon you
12:24
could taste the difference if you like, I know there's.
12:28
Definitely. There's definitely some that are
12:30
quite obvious and like the say for example a sweeter variety or
12:35
whatever, but it also depends on how they're grown and and the
12:39
love and care that's put into it, their ripeness.
12:43
Can be the texture of the banana.
12:44
Do you know what I mean? Like the starch level and things
12:47
like that. So even with your dragon fruit,
12:49
you've got the textural side of things where some you get like a
12:52
crunchy seed yeah and then some you're like I didn't even notice
12:56
that seed so you've got like the Kiwi fruit kind of seed or some
12:59
even have like a bit of an you even get a taste of the seed
13:02
where it's like a bit sesame or nutty.
13:05
Wow. So that's that's the difference
13:06
as well. And then you've got some that
13:08
are really firm flesh and then some are more like Jelly.
13:11
So yeah, and we use brought this in bricks measurer.
13:19
Oh, cool. So that measures the sugar
13:21
content. So that's the straight away sort
13:23
of levels out. OK, 13 it's pretty acidy.
13:27
It doesn't have much sugar in it.
13:30
And then we've got ones that are 23 where it's like, wow, that's
13:33
a lolly. So straight away I said visual.
13:36
That's clever. Where'd you get that little
13:39
machine? That one's cool.
13:40
I've I've only. Well, hang on, I've got one in
13:42
it in it's case here, but the refractometer version where?
13:47
Did you get that little? Yeah, this one.
13:49
I'm on our website. Oh well, there you go that
13:51
everybody should check out the link in the description,
13:54
including myself cause. Yeah, the little I ones are
13:57
really hard to use just to get that level right.
14:01
But those ones are awesome 'cause you just get the digital.
14:04
That's right. And I've heard, well, I what I,
14:07
I do like about this one, I don't know whether you can do it
14:10
on your particular 1 is that it helps measure the calcium
14:13
content in it as well by the difference between, I think it's
14:17
calcium, the difference between the the line.
14:19
So if you get a clear straight line, then you know that you're
14:23
probably calcium deficient. But if it's nice and hazy
14:26
between the two sections, like it's sort of gradual movement,
14:30
then you know that your calcium levels are fine.
14:32
But that's yeah, cool. That's just a side thing that
14:35
you can use that for. But you're right, testing the
14:38
bricks levels and finding out the sugar content helps you to
14:40
understand which ones are sort of the the more desirable in
14:45
terms of maybe sweetness or if that's what they're after.
14:49
Can you tell me about how there came to be so many of these
14:55
varieties? Is it something that they lack
14:58
with other things, with genetics?
14:59
You kind of, you might have an open pollinated variety that
15:03
then it turns out to be slightly different and you go, I like
15:07
that one, let's try and keep cuttings of that and then it
15:10
gets re breeded with something else and it sort of, yeah,
15:13
narrows down to these different versions.
15:15
Is that right? Yeah, yeah.
15:17
So every seed in your dragon fruit has a potential to be a
15:20
different variety. A different variety.
15:23
What? Essentially because it's like
15:26
brothers and sisters. Oh, like a different expression
15:29
of the same variety? Yeah, that's it.
15:31
So it will be a different type. It may carry white traits, self
15:36
fertile, some protective skin layers, thorn characteristics
15:42
that may all change. So that's where it's been
15:44
hybridized by growing out seeds. I had no idea that one.
15:50
I would, you know, like you, you have an apple, a Red Delicious.
15:53
Let's go with that. You plant all those apple seeds,
15:57
you're going to get very similar Red Delicious apples coming out.
16:01
Why do dragon fruits then throw out so much variety in their
16:05
offspring? Do you know, or is it like why?
16:08
How do we know this? Because when when a lot of the
16:14
hybridizers grow them out, they'll do like S1 Sugar Dragon
16:17
for example, and then they'll do S2S3 or G1G2.
16:22
And then that's how you can see the differences and get the
16:25
flavour from keeping a handful of those seeds, growing them out
16:30
to then see what their characteristics are like.
16:32
One lady a few years ago at the garden show got a store, bought
16:35
1, grew out the seeds and got one of each colour, and she said
16:40
they all tasted like crap after growing them out for five years.
16:43
So that's another thing, that's why we do cutting, is because
16:48
they've already been hybridized, they've already been tested.
16:51
We know they're good. I do dabbling seedlings, yeah,
16:55
just for the fun of it, because I'm like, well, that was a good
16:57
fruit. Wonder what that's like.
16:59
But when they do do the hybridizing, they'll bag the
17:03
flowers and only use particular pollens.
17:05
So for example that Lady who got all different flavours that
17:10
could have been pollinated with a range of different pollens as
17:15
well. OK.
17:17
So different variety. So for instance, for when we
17:19
pollinate, we'll bag our flowers if it's going to rain and also
17:24
the bees still all about pollen. Mick will go around in the
17:27
morning with a little pollen vacuum, vacuum all the pollen
17:30
off and then go back and apply it.
17:32
So all of our flowers are getting this mixed bag of
17:37
pollens where it could be 50 different pollens pollinating 1
17:42
flower. Does that then change the fruit
17:45
because it's been cross pollinated?
17:48
It doesn't change the flavour, it does change the size.
17:52
So in particular for like Isis golds like this big commercial
17:56
yellow and if you want to get it to 1.5 kilos, you cross
18:01
pollinate it with a commercial Y.
18:04
So you're basically you're, you're getting two of the bigger
18:08
well, you're crossing the two big parts of the gene and hoping
18:11
that they coincide. Yeah, yeah.
18:14
And that that's what commercial farmers like to do with that
18:16
particular fruit because it's more cost effective for them
18:20
because they might need 8 fruit per box instead of 40 small duck
18:24
egg sized fruit. Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally.
18:27
And you can, you can breed desirable traits presumably like
18:32
the disease resistant size of the fruit.
18:35
Yeah. And then obviously taste and
18:37
flavor and all this kind of thing.
18:39
Yeah, yeah, I've, I've heard similar things in I guess like
18:44
in terms of picking flavours or traits or things like this.
18:50
You hear it in fruit and vegetable production, more so
18:53
fruit I would say. But then the the variety of
18:57
differences that you can get from the offspring is kind of
19:00
blowing my mind. I've heard something similar to
19:02
to this in the cannabis world where you can kind of they've
19:05
got certain different whatever it is, the expressions of it and
19:10
it comes out as a different terpene or something, a
19:12
different flavour. Yeah, this variety in the seeds,
19:18
like if I had a store bought dragon fruit and I planted every
19:21
single one of those seeds, that one of them might come up a
19:23
different color or a different size or have thorns and self
19:27
pollinating. They seem like the basic traits
19:30
that wouldn't change in a like if I planted the seeds of
19:35
virtually most other things. Yes, you're going to get a bit
19:39
of varied expression in those things where some might be
19:42
bigger, some might be more disease resistant, faster
19:45
growers, whatever, but they're all within this same kind of
19:50
wheelhouse of being the same, you know, whether they are the
19:54
colonies or not. But that variety's blowing my
19:57
mind with the dragon fruit, I didn't realize it did.
19:59
You could just have a different colour completely and flavour.
20:02
Yeah, yeah, or yeah, definitely. And even, well, even you think
20:07
it might be just it might only be one in that one in 100 seeds
20:10
it does that weird variation. I see.
20:13
As well. Or throw out a variegated branch
20:16
or something like that. So I've got even varieties with
20:18
red variegations and yellow variegations.
20:22
I've got a papaya tree that I've grown from seed that's got
20:24
variegated leaves. Really.
20:26
Wow. So you know how it's like, it
20:27
might be just one in that hundred or one in that 300 seeds
20:31
that are inside that fruit that produces that one different
20:35
thing. You might have triplets, but one
20:38
looks different. Yeah.
20:40
Yeah. You know what I mean?
20:41
Totally. And one of the hardest things is
20:44
I looked at doing genetic testing with them.
20:46
Yeah. OK.
20:47
To really nail what's what in Australia, cause a lot of things
20:50
are being smuggled in by seed and things from people overseas.
20:54
And we could spend $80,000 on genetic testing and end up with
21:01
two fruit that look completely different, still being
21:03
genetically so similar you can't tell the difference.
21:07
So that's where we sort of went nuts.
21:10
Not worth. That.
21:11
Oh well. We're looking for a grant with
21:15
the university, so you know how even that it's like, yeah, it's.
21:18
That's big you're. Not gonna Yeah, I think we'll
21:20
just let that one go, yeah. So are you?
21:26
Tell me about the varieties themselves that you've come
21:28
across and that you've now sell and and grow and blah blah blah.
21:34
Are they ones that you've cultivated yourself?
21:36
Have you haunted them down from different places?
21:40
I, I do travel a lot to rare fruit growers places and I
21:45
knock, knock on people's doors and things like that.
21:48
And I've managed to source them that way.
21:52
There's Facebook pages of trading and things like that.
21:55
There's, I've traced them back to where some of these first
21:59
varieties were smuggling and how they were smuggling and things
22:02
like that as well. So it's, it's kind of been a bit
22:06
of fun detective work tracing the history.
22:09
Yeah, of them. For instance, I was up North
22:12
Queensland getting a permaculture tour of someone's
22:16
house garden and there auntie was a rare fruit importer for
22:22
North Queensland DPI back in the 70s and I got some of her
22:26
varieties. Oh, cool.
22:28
So it really is. Yeah, just sort of.
22:31
And then at the same trip I was visiting a farm who had a
22:36
Filipino start it all and she had her own variety and that was
22:39
meant to be the sweetest 1 a guy up on the Dane tree it ever
22:42
tasted. So it is a little bit of fun.
22:45
And I do collect from beside the road in weird places.
22:49
Yeah, as well. If it's growing, you don't know,
22:52
like, was that an old heritage farm that was there or was that
22:56
drop by a bird? Was it seed grown?
22:59
And like it's surviving really well.
23:01
What characteristics is it going to have?
23:03
So that's also part of it. And then, yeah, we sort of name
23:07
it after that, like I've got 1 Raglan Tavern because it was
23:10
outside of Tavern on the way to Rockhampton, so just to see how
23:15
things grow. But a lot of the time those ones
23:17
are really ordinary white varieties that just talk taste
23:21
like anything you'd buy from a shop.
23:22
Yeah, OK. They're more so Hardy versions
23:24
that you've figured out how to grow in.
23:26
Whatever, Larry. Yeah.
23:29
And just don't have the flavour or yeah.
23:32
Yeah, OK. And are these all varieties that
23:35
you find or have found here in Australia?
23:38
And what part of the world are dragon fruits originally from?
23:42
And like that sort of thing, Where where are?
23:44
They South America, so South America, and then they made
23:48
their way over to Asia and then that's where they've really
23:51
taken off. So a lot of people think they're
23:53
Asian. Yeah, but yeah.
23:56
South America, OK. And so, yeah, obviously, again,
23:59
tropical fruit, so tropical areas and.
24:03
And, and like a rainforest cactus, you've got to think that
24:07
get your mind away from normal cactus.
24:09
So rainforest cactus, it's a vine.
24:11
It's designed to climb to that top of that canopy and take
24:14
over. So when you see dragon fruit
24:16
post, if you think of it like that, it's like a mini
24:20
rainforest we're creating. It's going to the top and then
24:23
branching over from there. So it can't turn into that
24:26
canopy. Yeah, covering vinyl type of,
24:31
you know, you can relate it to other vines you see in a
24:33
rainforest environment. It's not a yeah, it's definitely
24:36
not that acting in a similar way to a cactus.
24:41
Well, it is in some regards, but obviously not in that regard.
24:45
And the idea about the post and them sort of hanging over I've,
24:49
I've made the mistake because I saw on my travels, I saw a, a
24:57
tree, I think it was a pine tree actually from memory that had
25:01
been completely taken over by dragon fruit.
25:04
Yeah. The entire pine was just, you
25:08
know, it would have been a multi story pine tree, huge.
25:12
And the whole thing was swamped. You could barely see this pine
25:15
tree and I, I was just thought this was the best.
25:19
That was the bee's knee. So when I had some had some
25:22
cuttings of dragon fruit, I threw them all at the base of
25:25
the tree. And I've been waiting a while
25:28
now, a couple years, for it to work its way up the street.
25:31
It worked up one of the branches all the way up the side, and it
25:34
was kind of hanging down. And then we got a huge gust of
25:37
wind in that whole branch and lost all of that.
25:41
But yeah, I've, it's been in there three years now and I've
25:46
not seen a single flower on it. Yeah, the the the myth that I
25:51
was, well, not myth, I don't know.
25:52
The the story I was told is that the dragon fruit has to go and
25:57
hang down for it to send the signal to start flowering and
26:02
producing fruit. Is that true?
26:05
Yeah, they sometimes, like you get an occasional flower fruit
26:08
as it's growing up, Yeah, but most of the time it's hanging
26:11
over and you'll get, yeah, lots of lots of fruit and flowers
26:16
hanging over because. I haven't got that yet.
26:19
And it's, yeah, somewhat taking it.
26:21
It is hanging over in places, but I'm, I'm thinking that, you
26:25
know, we might potentially have some.
26:27
It's also it's also competing for food with that tree it is as
26:31
well. So because they are a heavy
26:33
feeder, it's got that extra competition so.
26:37
Do you think that might have contributed to the fact that the
26:40
tree wasn't doing so well and was snapped in the wind?
26:45
Maybe. Do they, do they, do they tend
26:49
to take if they're from a host, So in the, in the natural
26:52
environment when they're climbing trees to get up into
26:56
the canopy and things like this, I presume they don't want to
26:59
consume or damage the host that they're on because that's what
27:03
they're using to get up to that canopy.
27:05
But then they love that rotting bark.
27:09
As in. Aerial roots and things as well.
27:11
So that's kind of like it's a hard one.
27:13
It's like if it but it as it's growing, if it's newly
27:17
establishing and it doesn't have that root, do you know what I
27:19
mean? The root base to support it,
27:21
it's getting and it's already that your tree's already taking
27:25
food and you're not fertilizing it and mulching it and doing all
27:28
the right things then yeah and it's not hanging over.
27:32
Do you know what I mean? It's and then also sun like is
27:35
it in full sun or does it get full shade?
27:37
Because that's gonna it's got back to that daylight hours.
27:40
We had our one of our first ones common red, we had growing on
27:44
our triangle palm. OK, and so the sun trapped this
27:49
way where the shade was got no fruit and that was growing
27:54
beautifully. And this side with all the sun
27:57
got loads of fruit, but that side might get one each season.
28:02
That's really interesting. Now that I think about it, if
28:04
I'm looking at the tree, the branch that it chose to go up is
28:08
the one that faces the sun the most.
28:11
Yeah. And that so it's reaching out
28:12
for the sun, yeah. Yeah, it's really cool to think
28:15
about what it wants and what it needs and then seeing it on that
28:19
journey and kind of snapshotting it over time.
28:22
Yeah. And it knows what it needs.
28:23
It can find find it itself. And then once you do get it, say
28:27
if you did get it established up that tree and it could be a 20m
28:31
tree and you cut it off around the base, it becomes a complete
28:35
epiphy because it's got that massive aerial roots that it can
28:39
support itself then from there. Off the the host, right yeah,
28:44
yeah. That it's, that's amazing.
28:46
It really, really is cool. And you then obviously help
28:51
people to grow dragon fruit properly rather than the way
28:56
that I've just done it. So if you were to to, to help
29:01
somebody set up a dragon fruit trellis and and things like
29:05
this, I know you've shared with me some cool DIY versions and
29:08
you're, you're starting to share more of those and in some of the
29:11
like the workshops and things that you do and all of this.
29:14
Can you talk to me about a couple of things that we need to
29:17
be considerate of with Dragon Fruit Trellis?
29:22
So longevity, that's the biggest thing.
29:25
And weight. OK.
29:27
So if you think of how heavy that plant is because it's
29:32
always full of water. So your top of your dragon fruit
29:35
trellis may in five years time weigh 2 to 300 kilos, or if not
29:40
more. If you if you're not, if you
29:42
don't want to manicure it head on your dragon fruit trellis,
29:45
yeah, that's what you're realistically looking for.
29:47
So that little piece of stick or branch you found that was easy
29:54
to install at that time, I'm like, I'm completely at fault of
29:57
this. I'll show you when you come to
29:59
the farm. Mick goes fishing and I think I
30:01
can do things myself. And I put in like the crappiest
30:05
branches down in our forestry rows.
30:08
I'm like, oh, Yep, he's gone. I can do this.
30:11
I don't need him. And they're all laying on the
30:14
ground. Yeah, it's it's I, I, I'm.
30:20
Yeah, You do it properly to start with.
30:22
So you don't want to do it properly.
30:24
Yeah, that's right. Do it, do it properly and you
30:28
don't have to buy and build and install fancy ones though, do
30:32
you? You can kind.
30:33
Of no, you're not going to see it.
30:35
There's no. Point doing all these beautiful
30:38
Marta joins and you know all these fancy stuff on top because
30:42
you want a head of dragon fruit on there.
30:45
There's you could use an old tire and at the end of the day,
30:49
where's the tire? You can't see it.
30:53
So that's our simple way of doing it.
30:55
At the farm is where you put in posts, drilled holes through
31:00
either side. So you've got two holes that
31:01
crossover, 2 pieces of Rio and a tire on top done dirty.
31:08
The ties were recycled from the still mower place.
31:13
They're happy to give them away because they make more money
31:15
that way. Exactly and.
31:17
Yeah, and it's done and it's sturdy and it's going to last a
31:20
long time. Plus all the old posts we've got
31:23
have got all little holes in them as well.
31:25
So then you get all the leaf cutter bees and things like that
31:28
living in them. So they end up being insect
31:30
hotels at the same time as being dragon fruit posts.
31:34
I've noticed that ants love dragon fruit in terms of sitting
31:39
in and around it and like in the gaps in between where it's sort
31:44
of sitting flush up against the post or or whatever.
31:46
Is this or can it be a problem? Depends on the ants.
31:53
So we've got some ants that kind of care for them and we'll
31:56
notice the buds. Some mornings will have tiny
31:58
droplets when we haven't had dew and if we go and lick them,
32:02
they're sweet. So sometimes you'll get the
32:06
little ants just feeding on that, no dramas.
32:08
And then sometimes you'll get the annoying ants, it'll have a
32:11
nibble or try and farm scale and do things like that.
32:14
So, and we've even had when it was really, really dry here, the
32:18
termites made their way into the dragon fruit plants really the
32:22
same way they'd make their way into your bathroom because they
32:26
like moisture. Yeah, yeah, because.
32:28
MC being a Carpenter by trade, I had a few people go, oh, that's,
32:31
you know, they don't attack, attack more like living stuff.
32:35
But it's like they attack moist bathrooms and they wanted they
32:38
needed moisture from somewhere so they actually ate lines
32:42
through growing dragon fruit plants.
32:45
Isn't that crazy? Yeah, yeah, you're right.
32:48
They. OK.
32:50
So then then we've got basically you can use recycled stuff, make
32:55
sure it's sturdy, it's got some longevity.
32:58
If you do want to do like a a really good quality one that's
33:01
going to last a long time, a concrete post.
33:04
OK. But you're looking at sort of
33:06
more $50 a, your price goes up, but it's never going to fall
33:09
over. Well, that's it.
33:11
And like, you know, a $50 investment for years and years
33:15
of dragon fruit, right? Especially like when cuttings
33:19
start at 10 to $15 and you look at the price of some citrus
33:24
trees or a, and on that post, you can have four different
33:28
varieties. So it's like getting a fruit
33:30
salad tree. So you can have a yellow fruit,
33:33
it tastes like lemonade. You can have a pink flowering 1,
33:36
you have a small sweet one for the kids lunch boxes.
33:39
And you're really only spending what, $120.00 maximum on doing
33:44
that. So it's still quite an
33:45
affordable, effective way of gardening and cropping in your
33:51
backyard. It is, isn't it?
33:54
Hey guys, really quickly jumping in.
33:55
I just want to remind you if you are not subscribed to this show,
33:59
that is the number one thing that you can do to show me your
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to hit the follow or subscribe button.
34:09
All right, back to the show. I just was thinking about that.
34:12
You got me thinking of the fruit salad type thing with the
34:15
different varieties on the same one.
34:16
Is it? Yeah.
34:18
Are you able to graft as well for?
34:19
Different. Varieties onto the onto 1 host.
34:23
Yeah, they're so easy to graft. Yeah.
34:25
And you just sort of, yeah. So you can do a clean slice.
34:29
Yeah, you just basically where a thorn is, you cut AV into the
34:33
plant and you cut AV into the like, I mean jigsaw puzzle VS
34:37
what are you talking about? So into the plant that's your
34:40
rootstock and then into the top. So you essentially can grow more
34:43
than that with a simple V graft. It's not something I tend to do.
34:49
I'm messing with it for a book that I'm doing on commercial
34:52
farms. Cool.
34:53
Just all the different owl graphs and things like that.
34:56
But I don't have the time for doing that when we've just got
35:02
so much room. But in in a backyard situation
35:05
you could obviously do that to help you.
35:08
Out, yeah, but if you've also got the space to plant one
35:13
dragon fruit that has four different varieties of it,
35:15
presumably you could throw them all in the same pot or the same
35:19
in the ground by that same post, right?
35:21
And have them all sort of going over the same thing.
35:24
You can also curate which ones grow, so you're not having one
35:27
that takes over and one that doesn't.
35:30
Yeah, and even the best way. So say you're in your backyard,
35:34
you've got this awesome one growing up a tree, it's self
35:37
sterile that all and the fruit tastes like crap and you don't
35:40
want it there. That's the one to graft a good
35:43
variety onto because you've got the root base if it's been
35:45
growing there for five years. So a farm at Yeppoon, I've
35:49
visited hers, blew over in storms and she's like, I don't
35:53
really like that variety anyway. I'm just going to cut it off.
35:55
Yeah, raft onto it because I've got the root base there to get
35:59
things going and start restart it that way because you you're
36:04
speeding up that process. You are, you're kind of skipping
36:07
ahead, aren't you with all that root growth.
36:09
So it's already got the root stock, it's well established and
36:11
connected in the soil food web and it can, Yep, just kick start
36:15
and and go crazy. Yeah, that's, that's really
36:19
cool. I want to just finish the point
36:21
on the, I guess growing them at home and that kind of thing on
36:26
the trellis. Is there a specific height or a
36:29
specific I guess yeah, like way of keeping them off the ground
36:37
so that the when the fruit are coming down, they're not hanging
36:40
on the ground or conversely too high for you to go and reach
36:44
obviously can because they they sort of hangover and they'll
36:48
just will they keep going and hit the ground or do you have to
36:51
keep trimming them back and this.
36:53
Time. Some will, yeah, some will.
36:55
You'll have to trim them back if it's too low.
36:58
I don't mind the lower post because you get pretty quick.
37:00
Quicker because it doesn't take as long to get to the top.
37:04
Right, so the post. Yeah, my, my ideal height is
37:08
sort of eye level because you've got it at eye level and then
37:12
when it grows over you're getting probably an extra 3050
37:15
meters, 50cm high. And you can still manage that
37:19
with reaching. We've done some that are a lot.
37:22
We've got all different heights at our farm and the really tall
37:26
ones are so painful. They took twice as long to get
37:29
to the top to fruit. Then you need a ladder to
37:33
pollinate them. Yeah, pick the fruit.
37:36
You're getting spiked. It's just not as much fun as
37:40
something you can just look at. Yeah, totally.
37:42
So that's more practical thing for sure.
37:45
Yeah, they're gonna get chainsawed.
37:47
Yeah, well exactly. They'll they'll be coming down
37:50
and then you'll be replacing them with shorter ones.
37:52
Can you, can you talk about the growing like procedure or, or
37:58
practices? So if I'm starting with a
38:02
wonderful cutting of yours, which I highly encourage
38:05
everybody to go and check out if they're in the postable regions
38:09
for you to send out cuttings. I don't know how far and wide
38:11
you can send them, but what do they do with that cutting when
38:15
it comes home to then if they've got a, they've sorted out their
38:19
trellis, they've got a cutting. What do you do with your cutting
38:22
and your trellis? So OK so you've got open opening
38:27
up your box and you want to it's already hot, like dry it out and
38:33
calloused in the post. We express posts every Monday.
38:37
So from there you can let it callous longer.
38:41
Some people like doing it for two weeks.
38:42
For me, being time poor, I will stick it in a dry potting mix.
38:48
Yes, yeah, yeah. Because I'm idiot proofing it.
38:50
So I don't go a month later and go, oh wow, that's looking
38:53
really dry. Or I've stuck it in a sunny spot
38:56
and I should have done that. So and just I won't give it
39:00
water for maybe two weeks. So it's sort of still doing the
39:04
callousing effect, but more of an idiot proof way of doing it.
39:08
In a slightly more natural way, I suppose, maybe.
39:11
Yeah, and I like also using good quality potting mix with it
39:17
depends if you make your own. I've, I find it really hard to
39:20
tell people what to do because you might be a composter, have
39:23
the best sandy soil, be able to just create something from
39:27
nothing or you might have a mushroom farm down the road.
39:31
So I try and yeah, good quality soil with organic stuff in it,
39:37
rainforests, more mycelium the better, all of that kind of
39:41
stuff. But if you you're time poor and
39:44
you don't have that a propagating mix from Bunnings I
39:47
I hate pigeonholing things. You're.
39:49
Saying you have to do it this way because if you're North
39:53
Queensland, more sand will be better, pearlite, things like
39:56
that, where if you're down South and it's dry, you're going to
39:59
want to add more moisture. I see what you mean.
40:04
Box and you know, like there's it's gardening's not pigeon
40:07
holing. It's what works for you.
40:09
And I can't stand all the YouTube dragon fruiters who you
40:12
have to do it this way where it's like, no, you can't.
40:15
You've got to find your own way and use your intuition.
40:19
To do it totally in these. So what works for you?
40:23
Sprouting other things as well. Yeah, you do need to adapt to
40:28
your environment and work with what you've got, don't you?
40:32
And then there are varieties that are better suited to those
40:36
certain situations. Yeah.
40:39
So then you've. So you've got it in your pot.
40:43
Yeah, what's next? So you you, what you want to do
40:46
is let it grow so that you've got roots coming out the bottom
40:50
and you've got growth on the top.
40:51
Then it's ready to go onto your dragon fruit post.
40:54
So even. Sorry, one thing to just
40:56
interject. How important is it to know
40:58
which end is up? We put arrows on them and.
41:02
Right up. Well, there you go.
41:03
See. That if you're helpful, if you
41:04
do plant it the wrong way up, the roots will be coming out the
41:07
wrong end. So you will see them start
41:10
coming out the top and you know, whoops, I need to flip that.
41:13
Or yeah, there's a gentleman who's left us our only one bad
41:16
Google review and they're all upside down because the arrows
41:19
are the wrong way. He was lovely, included a photo
41:21
so we could solve that one straight away.
41:24
That's amazing. Yeah, because I've done that.
41:26
I've done that with cuttings of my cacti or like, you know,
41:29
different varieties of cacti and I'll, I'll take a big piece of
41:33
it and then slice the top. So that's really easy to see
41:37
because that's like a, you know, the top of the Dome of the.
41:40
Cactus. But all of the other pieces I
41:43
have to make sure I keep them in upright if they're little
41:46
sections like this to see, you know, where, which way is up
41:49
because I have planted ones upside down before and then
41:52
wondered what's going on. And then you see little like
41:55
roots trying to poke out the top and you go, whoops, I need to
41:58
flip that round. So that is a really important
42:01
consideration. So sorry I just wanted to double
42:03
click on that. Yeah, I know.
42:05
So we've got the arrow placing up so you know where to plant
42:08
it. Also staking it up so it doesn't
42:10
wobble around. And the biggest.
42:12
No, no, I have people e-mail me. Hey, I bought this.
42:15
And two weeks later, there's no roots.
42:17
And it's like, how are you telling you're pulling it out of
42:19
the soil to check for roots? Yeah.
42:23
And because there's different varieties like American Beauty
42:27
will root in like 2 weeks generally.
42:29
But we're in Queensland, you might be in Victoria, it might
42:31
be a little bit different but pylora and sugar dragon take can
42:36
take 3 months to set roots. So don't pull it out.
42:39
Wait till you see the growth underneath and on top.
42:42
You can use rooting hormones as well.
42:45
Aloe Vera as a natural one or. Else.
42:48
That kind of thing. But OK, so you've got the roots,
42:51
you've got the growth, it's ready to go.
42:53
Onto your post. You want to harden a little bit
42:55
in the sun. Yeah, gradually move it out to
42:58
where it's sort of going to be. Yeah, and pick a day to tie it
43:01
onto your poster, a week where it's nice and overcast.
43:03
Yeah. OK.
43:04
Don't put it out. And when you're tying it up, tie
43:06
it up really straight. Don't do it like on an angle,
43:09
OK, Because that's like a solar panel and you end up with
43:13
sunburn. So Mick and I have done that so
43:16
many times where we just rush and we just want to get it out
43:18
there. You know, today's day, you've
43:20
got time. The weather's completely wrong.
43:22
And you just regret it. Yeah, even Mick did.
43:25
Some that had travelled with us from North Queensland in the
43:29
back of the car, got home. Can't wait to get these
43:32
ginormous cuttings onto a post. All the ones that face that sun
43:36
thing we're talking about. Yeah, complete.
43:39
Completely yellowed off and rusted and sunburnt and scarred
43:43
and everything. The one that was hidden around
43:45
the back that didn't get the sun perfect.
43:47
Oh wow. Because.
43:49
It's. Slowly adapted, yeah.
43:50
Yeah, and that's another trick. So if you are in that rush, go
43:54
for the other side of the post, don't go for the sunny side.
43:57
True, you can just, yeah, flip it around the back.
43:59
Yeah, yeah. That's.
44:01
It is there a certain size that you're looking to then
44:04
transplant into the thing because like presumably like
44:08
your cuttings are 30 centimetres, right, 20-30?
44:11
Something around 30 centimetres, yeah.
44:13
And are you just waiting till they've got roots and then they
44:16
can go in at 30 centimeters into the?
44:19
Ground most of the time. So if we do the same variety and
44:23
we take 20 to 30cm cuttings and put them all in a box, yeah,
44:28
they're all individual as well. Some will send out branches a
44:32
meter straight away, some will wait three or four months and
44:35
send out all roots. True, it's.
44:38
All Yeah, even though they're off the same plant, you think
44:43
that all have the same growth rate.
44:45
They've got their own personality once you've taken
44:47
that cutting so. It seems to be common across
44:50
dragon fruit with all of these, just it just does so many
44:53
different things. What they want, yeah.
44:56
That's really cool. And then how of how often, how
45:00
long until you're expecting to see flowers and fruiting if
45:05
you've got a somewhat eye level thing?
45:07
And now, yeah, I'll preface that by saying I know what you mean.
45:10
So many different varieties and cuttings are going to be a
45:13
different speed but. Yeah, on.
45:15
Average in the ballpark? How long are we expecting before
45:18
we start to see flowers? So when we send cuttings in
45:22
summer, you can sometimes get a flower straight away.
45:25
Oh wow. So, but it doesn't have the root
45:28
base to develop the flower further into a fruit.
45:31
Even if you do get a fruit, it's normally undersized and
45:34
underdeveloped. It's but it's, we still can't
45:36
sometimes leave them on 'cause it's kind of fun and you're
45:40
like, yeah, we're going straight away.
45:41
But generally, so for us it's a year to get to the top of the
45:46
post and then grow over. So it's three years for a good
45:52
crop, 2 years to start getting some a few fruit.
45:56
Does that make sense? Did I say that in the right
45:58
order or? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
46:00
I know exactly what you mean. And that's at a eye level post
46:04
high. So yeah, if you're sending it up
46:06
a tree, you might be in in for a long wait.
46:09
Yeah, the longer it's got to grow the and if you even want to
46:12
speed that up, you can do like a raised pot on a fence post or
46:18
something above the ground. Oh, the gabion basket that was
46:22
at the garden show. Yes, that's right.
46:24
So it hangs straight over. So it has more potential to get
46:27
fruit within a year because it's just got a root develop and it's
46:31
already hanging over and it's very space efficient.
46:34
If you're renting that type of thing, you can have a pillar
46:37
with just your pot on it. You'll have to fertilize it and
46:40
thin it a bit more, but it that's a nice fast way of
46:44
getting fruit or really large hanging baskets.
46:48
Yeah, because the amount of soil obviously might dictate the the
46:51
yield. So if you're someone that's
46:54
after just a a few of them every every year or every season,
46:57
whatever, you, you're going to get something if you just want
47:01
to have it in a hanging basket. Because the, the, the
47:04
misconception maybe is that you have to have space to grow up
47:08
these dragon fruits and things, but you obviously you don't have
47:12
to. And I'll, I'll point to the the
47:14
vlog from the garden show because I did highlight a couple
47:18
of the dragon fruit installations you had out there
47:20
in the kitchen garden, which are cool.
47:22
Yeah, so, and they were portable, right.
47:25
So it shows. Yeah, we.
47:27
Move them around. Yeah, yeah, they did get a good
47:30
haircut to come home. I wasn't gonna baby them too
47:33
much on the way, but even it's amazing.
47:35
Like I cut those back. How long ago was that?
47:37
Two months. Yeah, three months.
47:39
Yeah. All the new shoots, like, it's
47:41
incredible. How?
47:42
Send your photo they're they're growing a whole new head of hair
47:46
after cutting them back to nothing.
47:48
Wow. And that's like presumably the
47:51
spring is where you see the majority of their vegetative
47:55
growth and shooting and and things like.
47:57
That that's when you know it's, it's that it's nature signs that
48:00
weather's changing. Because you'll notice like your
48:02
dragon fruit, don't grow it like a centimetre a week.
48:06
They're growing a centimetre a day.
48:08
Wow, that's quite fast. Yeah.
48:09
And I, I was filming earlier this morning that like my cover
48:14
crops started to bolt some of the bassacres and things.
48:17
So you can just tell. And then the occasions the
48:19
waddles were all flowering. So you know that the, the season
48:23
has changed. So yeah, just continuing on from
48:27
that, you're going to see flowers and fruiting.
48:30
What's the main fruiting season? Is it the spring summer for for
48:33
dragon fruits? Yeah.
48:35
So we should have fruits sort of around Christmas time.
48:38
And so you're looking at 60 days prior to that.
48:42
So obviously everything's different.
48:45
Some bend the rules a bit, but 30 days from bud to flower, 30
48:49
days from flower to fruit, OK. So about two months for a fruit
48:53
to develop. Wow.
48:55
And then can we touch on the pollination?
48:59
Yeah. What are some of the techniques
49:02
that you use and the different ways of pollinating and what
49:05
might someone need to do at home to make sure that they're
49:09
correctly pollinated? Yeah, OK, so inside the flowers
49:14
you'll have the. I wish I had a picture to show
49:17
you the filament so where you can see all the yellow stuff.
49:21
And then you'll have the stigma in the middle.
49:23
The pollen has to get from the filament onto the stigma.
49:28
So with a paintbrush, you can just lightly steal some of the
49:34
pollen into a Tupperware container or something and then
49:37
apply that onto the stigma. Yeah, stigma.
49:40
The more pollen the fruit, the flower receives, the better the
49:45
quality of the fruit as well. So yeah, it's yeah.
49:52
You want to just sort of tap it on.
49:53
You're not dassing clumps onto it.
49:56
You sort of you got to put yourself in the bees perspective
50:00
if you think like how they're doing it and things like that.
50:04
So. That's true.
50:05
They're just being very kind of delicate with it, aren't they?
50:07
You don't want to be coming in and just beating they're.
50:09
Just getting little bits falling on there, they're not getting
50:12
like running up to it and throwing a clump of pollen
50:14
straight in the middle. So and that's where your cross
50:17
pollination works. Now we've got farms where you go
50:21
to who have lots of highly self sterile varieties that are
50:25
hybridized with purple flowers. They don't hand pollinate a
50:28
thing, the bees do it for them because they have a mass of
50:32
flowers opening each night. So there always is that
50:34
potential if you're doing your four different varieties on one
50:38
post that they will eventually do it.
50:41
A lot of people are scared of self sterile varieties.
50:45
Yeah. Because they don't want to do
50:47
any pollination. But if you've been growing
50:50
something for three years and you've been watching these buds
50:53
develop for the last 30 days, are you really not going to be
50:57
out there staring at it anyway? Yeah, realistically, yeah,
51:01
you're going to be hovering around that like the bee waiting
51:03
for Poland. So.
51:05
And I mean if you're putting 4 different varieties on it, make
51:09
oneself sterile because the flavour of some of those
51:12
hybridized varieties that are self sterile trump any of the
51:16
others so. It's worth it in the end if you
51:19
can. Yeah, really do that.
51:21
And presumably with how many trees do you have on your?
51:25
Property 150 plus AI. Think I've collected about 10 in
51:29
the last few weeks. So pollinating time is busy for
51:34
you and it lasts a long time, doesn't it?
51:35
It's not just like one week where everything pops out at
51:38
once. It kind of is gradual.
51:39
As you said earlier, you can kind of have some that go
51:42
throughout the year. Is that right?
51:43
So, so in terms of routine of a dragon fruit farmer, so I'll go
51:48
through that 'cause that'll explain everything if you want,
51:50
please. Yeah.
51:51
So we'll go. We're just coming out of winter,
51:54
so we have a break. We go for a holiday.
51:57
Nice. And we mulch a heat.
51:59
So we, we, we don't poison our rose with anything.
52:03
We hand weed all the grass out, cool and mulch and then replant
52:07
companion plants getting ready for for creating the B flat
52:11
parts cause of those flowers only opening for one night.
52:14
We want the bees to already be going down there.
52:17
That's really clever. Yeah, so we use a lot of tulsi
52:20
basil. Oh, sun hemp is one of my
52:24
favourites. Pigeon pea, basically whatever I
52:29
can plant. Or even if it's on like the
52:32
specials try at Bunnings, I'll buy nasturtiums just as much
52:38
diversity. Cornflours I think we've got at
52:39
the moment that are flowering. Yeah, just everything well done.
52:44
And then so right now we're noticing that rapid growth.
52:50
So to us it's like, OK, feed me time.
52:52
Yeah, so and then also in that feed me time with that mulch
52:57
we've put down, we're inoculating it.
52:59
So our mulch is from the tip. So then we're inoculating it
53:02
with all these home brew mixes, little bit of red, red soil
53:07
organics, a little bit of honey when I washed out out our
53:10
beekeeping gear. And Rock Dust, which you just
53:14
got a whole bunch of recently. Yes, that's that's our new one
53:18
is that's our new trial is rock dust because OK, so this is
53:22
going to go off topic again. No, no, go for.
53:24
It but so we had a problem with our chickens free ranging
53:28
digging up all of our fruit trees.
53:30
You know, the best part is where you've put all that mulch and
53:33
all the worms and good stuff is so I found some basalt rocks
53:37
beside the road and I brought them home to put around the
53:39
bottom of the fruit trees. And something just happened to
53:43
those fruit trees. They just took off.
53:46
And then in turn with that we were, I was watching Landline
53:51
and there was an episode on Bundaberg farmers using rock
53:56
dust as well because it's full of calcium and all trace, trace
53:59
elements and things like that. Then we went to North Queensland
54:03
and a tropical fruit farm was using it as well.
54:06
And he gave us a bag to bring back.
54:07
Now we've thrown that on our lime tree and Oh my God, you
54:12
cannot see the leaves almost for the amount of flowers there he
54:16
is. So it's just incredible what
54:19
we've noticed happened with our normal routine.
54:21
But throwing that rock dust in on top, well.
54:25
It's it's just especially for fruit because obviously rock
54:29
dust is a, is a massive form of phosphorus.
54:32
So if you're bringing in phosphorus that's amazing for
54:34
flowering and fruiting, then you're going to have such a
54:38
benefit to the result. And then depending on where you
54:41
get it from, you can have the paramagnetism in there as well,
54:45
which is such another, well, that's a whole other topic, but
54:48
it's such another added boost. Yeah.
54:51
And just that conversion like you need the calcium to uptake
54:54
the nitrogen. So it's it's just getting as
54:57
much naturally from our environment that we can and
55:00
using that. So all right, so we've done the
55:03
we've yeah invigorated our tip mulch now.
55:07
Yes, yeah. So yeah, rocked us.
55:09
And then we're next step is to do our potassium.
55:15
OK, so potash. So we will, we just use a small
55:20
handheld pump where in control there's not as much overspray
55:24
and to stimulate flowering. Yeah, and budding well.
55:29
That's so that's another big part of it, isn't it?
55:31
The potassium phosphorus for those those fruits and flowers
55:34
'cause that does really dictate the size of the fruit and the
55:39
viability. Sweetness.
55:40
Sweetness. Exactly.
55:41
Yep, Yep, all of it. There's.
55:43
Commercial farms that will throw spray potassium before they the
55:47
day before they pick, which is not the best for our
55:50
consumption. And obviously being commercial
55:53
farms, it's not not so dragon fruit aren't regulated
56:00
commercially with what you spray on them.
56:01
They're just going through the testing now.
56:03
Oh, really? OK.
56:04
Yeah. So there's farms that do do
56:08
things like that to get more money for their fruit because
56:10
they're slightly sweeter, but it's not necessarily in the best
56:14
consumable way for us. No.
56:17
OK, the more you dive into the commercial world of agriculture,
56:22
the more you want to grow your own stuff at home.
56:25
I think it's highlighting with bananas and even your own dragon
56:29
fruit so. Yeah, absolutely.
56:31
But there are some great farms that do do amazing stuff, like
56:34
do do their chillage radish down their rows and cool mulch things
56:39
back in. So yeah, we'll talk off air if
56:41
you do want to get good fruit, where to get it from and where
56:44
to avoid. Yeah.
56:45
Well, well, from definitely from you guys at least.
56:48
Yeah, that's all. So then you've just fed
56:53
everything and you're going on holiday.
56:55
What are you expecting? When's the next bout of work
56:58
that you're due to do after that?
57:01
Oh, we won't go on holiday after the garden shows.
57:04
We're back in full swing of swing of anything.
57:06
We just take the middle of winter and yeah, kids get 3
57:09
weeks school holidays. We head up North Queensland and
57:12
when I say holiday, it's like our holidays always involve a
57:18
lot of visiting other farms. Yeah.
57:20
So it's like a tour. Yeah.
57:23
Yeah. But it's really awesome.
57:24
Like we, yeah, just collect all different seeds and jackfruit
57:28
seed. Yeah.
57:29
It's, I don't know. It's I think that's what our job
57:34
is, our passion. And that's what makes it cool,
57:37
because we wake up excited to go spread rock dust each morning.
57:43
Yeah, that's that's beautiful and it's a family thing for you
57:46
guys. I noticed when, when you guys
57:48
rocked up to the show and you just, you know, the kids are
57:51
involved and everyone's getting everything out and, and setting
57:54
it all up and you know, your girls are involved.
57:56
And it's I, I love seeing families doing stuff together
58:01
and getting everyone involved. And I know like, it's always
58:03
difficult to encourage the kids to do what the parents, you
58:06
know, are doing and get them involved.
58:08
But what's that been like for you guys doing it as a family
58:13
and getting stuck in and how much involvement, how much of
58:16
your lives revolve around this as a family?
58:21
A lot of it, not all of it the kids enjoy, but you probably saw
58:26
their best working efforts. But.
58:30
The plus the bribery was it's like I will pay you like an
58:33
adult if you work like an adult. Well, that's.
58:35
Great they earn, they earn really good money when they
58:38
were. Yeah.
58:39
That's great though. But why shouldn't you at the
58:43
same time? Like when they were telling us
58:46
what to do in the end, they're not as hands on on the farm.
58:50
Like it's because it's repetitive and boring.
58:52
But but the best thing is like, if our kids are sick, they're at
58:57
work with us. Yeah, There's there's no, yeah.
59:03
Even if they're having a bad mood day or you know yourself,
59:06
you just can't face that job today.
59:09
Yeah, it's OK. Yeah.
59:11
And we're there for them. We're there at pick up.
59:13
We drop them off at school, we go to work and then we come home
59:17
we've got so the other thing is a farm is separate to out where
59:20
we live. OK, cool.
59:22
Yeah. So it's 3.7 acres where the farm
59:24
is, and we live on five acres. Oh, wow.
59:28
Yeah. So we'll drop the kids off at
59:29
school and go to that dragon fruit farm and do our jobs until
59:33
about lunchtime. Then we'll go home, have a rest,
59:37
whatever, and eat lunch, then pick the kids up.
59:39
It's 2:40. And then come home and work at
59:42
home. OK, Yeah.
59:43
Because here we've got more of the tropical fruit we'll want to
59:48
keep if we ever sold the other property.
59:51
I see. Like we've got heaps of
59:53
jackfruit, mammy sapote's, we're putting in about 150 different
59:58
dragon fruit posts of our favourites and just yeah,
1:00:02
forward planning for retirement wonder.
1:00:05
I love it at the same time but or handing passing something on
1:00:09
to the kids. So.
1:00:11
That's it. And they're seeing you.
1:00:13
They're having that exposure of seeing you work on something and
1:00:15
cultivate land and yeah, being around home and sharing that
1:00:19
with them. And whether or not they take
1:00:21
that and run with it, it doesn't really matter.
1:00:23
You're setting them up for it with just by setting the
1:00:27
example, aren't you? But if you take a if, even if
1:00:31
our kids gave you a tour of our garden like.
1:00:34
They probably do an amazing job. Yeah, even when they used to
1:00:37
walk around the school ground pulling out Lamandra and chewing
1:00:40
on it and eating stuff and people like you can't eat that
1:00:42
and they're like, yeah, mum and dad said we could.
1:00:45
But the biggest highlight from the Garden Show, it wasn't, it
1:00:49
was seeing how they worked. But so we got home, we're
1:00:52
exhausted. Like it's a four hour drive,
1:00:54
we've packed up. Sick of talking to people for
1:00:57
four days, that kind of thing. The kids had been going around
1:01:01
and collecting all the coffee cups out of the bins and getting
1:01:04
the, you know how if you at the gardening.
1:01:06
So if you got a coffee cup, you could get a plant in it.
1:01:08
Yes. So they came home with a tray of
1:01:10
all these different pansies in particular, and parsley.
1:01:14
Yeah. So they came home within 5
1:01:16
minutes. They were mulching their own
1:01:18
gardens and planting and they keep going out and watering and
1:01:23
things like for me that was a highlight.
1:01:26
It's like, OK, we've gone and done this and that's what they
1:01:29
are choosing to do now. They're not looking themselves
1:01:31
in their room. They're they're building what
1:01:34
Tom's garden was in their own little patches.
1:01:38
It's so beautiful. That must be.
1:01:40
Yeah. That must feel really fulfilling
1:01:42
for you to to see that, to see them make that choice on their
1:01:45
own. And you know, like so many kids
1:01:47
are just wanting to go and you slam the door and get the iPad
1:01:51
or something, just like. Yeah, and instead my 14 year
1:01:55
old's biggest problem, she's like, Oh my God, mum, I haven't
1:01:57
watered my panties in like 4 days.
1:01:59
Like is that's a cool problem to have?
1:02:02
Not like I can't connect my device.
1:02:04
Why can't I? Yeah, it's it's really cool.
1:02:07
Yeah, it really is. It really is.
1:02:09
Well, that's a testament to you and the way that you guys are.
1:02:12
And I know you know, both yourself and Michael are such
1:02:15
wonderful people. Can you tell me a bit about what
1:02:20
you see in the future? I guess now for what you're
1:02:23
thinking about Top of mind. Yeah.
1:02:25
For rare dragon fruit moving forward.
1:02:28
Oh, that's a hard one, because there's so many little secrets
1:02:31
that I've got. Yeah.
1:02:32
So what are you willing to share with us and give us a little
1:02:34
sneak peek? We want to get our fruit out
1:02:40
there more for tasting some things, so that's one big thing
1:02:43
this next year we'll be working on.
1:02:45
Like we're going to come down to Yandina markets one time and do
1:02:49
a tasting because all the garden shows are in winter, so we never
1:02:52
have fruit. We've got workshops coming up at
1:02:58
Norfly St. Garden where there's there'll be
1:03:01
tastings in summer. We did one last year too and
1:03:04
then Yandina Permaculture Garden will do some more there but I
1:03:08
want to get some chefs into. It.
1:03:11
Because yeah, I really want to get some development of some
1:03:16
really good recipes 'cause I make lots of things with them,
1:03:20
but I'm no chef. Like if I bake a cake, the kids
1:03:25
will eat it warm, but they won't eat it after that.
1:03:26
I don't know why, but maybe it's the chef.
1:03:32
I can cook good meals like, but not bake it.
1:03:35
Yeah. Where if I want to give some of
1:03:38
these ingredients and given all the different flavours like the
1:03:43
lachi flavours and things like that, just.
1:03:45
Yeah, I mentioned the desserts would just be so crazy cool with
1:03:49
all the different versions that you can have for those flavours.
1:03:53
Barrett House on the Sunny Coast did the best I had to I I was
1:03:58
down there for a Dragon Fruit Australia meeting and I was like
1:04:03
what restaurant? So I'm like somewhere here has
1:04:05
got to be fancy enough to have some really good stuff.
1:04:08
They had dragon fruit panna cotta and he was insane.
1:04:12
I So I was driving back from the meeting I had like 2 hours to
1:04:15
kill but I'm like I have to try the dragon fruit.
1:04:18
I think it was a Margarita and the panna cotta.
1:04:21
So they don't open till 12. I'm like sitting in the car park
1:04:25
answering emails, doing what I've got to do.
1:04:27
But I'm like, I really just want to drive home, but I need to
1:04:29
have this and try this. So the doors opened and I'm the
1:04:32
first person in there and dressed like a farmer, not
1:04:35
someone going out for a fancy lunch.
1:04:38
And I'm just like, can I please have the cocktail and the dragon
1:04:42
fruit patter, Potter. And it was all awesome.
1:04:44
But it. Yeah, honestly, more of that.
1:04:48
Yeah, seeing what you can do with these ingredients when
1:04:52
you're given, you know, a good quality ingredient and then
1:04:55
somebody with a creative outlook on how to turn it into something
1:04:58
delicious can use it. That's it.
1:05:01
Yeah. And and also just getting on
1:05:02
board with more farms. I've got a few more farms
1:05:06
getting ready to start planting. Yeah, OK.
1:05:08
Locally. So getting a bit of a Co-op
1:05:11
going and bringing a bit of Agnes food to your areas.
1:05:15
Yeah, that's. Right.
1:05:17
Nutrient dense, grown amazingly. Yeah, just good quality.
1:05:22
Yeah, good quality. Fresh and picked ripe because
1:05:25
that's what we haven't talked about.
1:05:26
Dragon fruit don't ripen once they're picked.
1:05:29
Very good point to mention. So you need.
1:05:31
To. Pick Ripe.
1:05:33
Yeah, so that's where you're going walking to Coles.
1:05:36
You're picking up one of those nice dragon fruit that look
1:05:39
quite attractive with a Vietnamese sticker on it, and
1:05:43
it's being picked too early. Yeah.
1:05:46
And it's troubled about 40 days to get to us, so it's going to
1:05:49
taste like cactus water. Plain boring.
1:05:53
We pick our fruit. It's actually really hard to
1:05:56
know because there are too many varieties that we've got.
1:05:59
Yeah. OK.
1:06:00
Because some won't blush completely red.
1:06:03
They might stay pink with green things, and then some will have
1:06:07
bright red fins and things like that.
1:06:09
So you've got your 30 day count. You can sort of mix good at
1:06:13
doing this. OK, so and then you've got your
1:06:17
squeeze test where it feels soft like an avocado, but still, you
1:06:20
know what I mean that. Yeah, I know what you.
1:06:21
Mean, yeah, but it's got that give and then the wiggle test.
1:06:26
The wiggle test. Yeah, so it's not the fruit's
1:06:29
not firm, Like I'm not gonna move on the plant itself, right.
1:06:33
It wiggles a bit like, Oh yeah, I'm, I'm a bit more relaxed now.
1:06:36
I'm ready to go. Yeah, I'm nearly ready to drop
1:06:39
off. Yeah.
1:06:40
Yeah. That's it.
1:06:42
Like if it does drop naturally, is that probably you know most
1:06:45
around the optimum time to eat it like or has that gone too
1:06:48
far? So they naturally probably don't
1:06:51
drop. It's such a hot hard stem
1:06:53
holding them on, they split. Yeah.
1:06:55
OK. So that is hard.
1:06:56
To know so that yeah so but in saying that when they split
1:07:00
that's actually my favorite time to eat them.
1:07:02
You'd never walk into a shop and bought us buy like a split
1:07:05
fruit. But if it's split, it's ready.
1:07:08
If you think of a plant's natural ability to reproduce,
1:07:14
it's splitting open to say, hey, birds, come and eat my seeds and
1:07:17
spread my. Internet exactly right, so it's
1:07:19
offering. A that's, that's yeah, yeah.
1:07:22
And especially when, I don't know, this is off topic again.
1:07:25
I've been talking to a lot of people who are looking at autism
1:07:28
and that type of thing and our consumption of underwrite fruit
1:07:33
being a linkage. Because if you give a bat won't
1:07:36
come to or think of animals, they will eat your ripe
1:07:40
tomatoes. The crab will come in and eat
1:07:42
your ripe tomatoes. It won't eat your green ones.
1:07:43
No they won't. And then we've we've adapted to
1:07:47
eating a lot more unripe. Not to mention unripe and
1:07:52
sprayed with chemicals like glyphosate and all of these
1:07:54
things. So you're right that I that's an
1:07:57
interesting one to be looking into, I think all.
1:07:59
Of these things are just into. Yeah, just, I don't know, I just
1:08:03
like observing. And.
1:08:07
Listening to these things and then it just, I think anything
1:08:10
that sways you to grow your own is good as well.
1:08:13
Like it, it, it puts everything into perspective because it's
1:08:17
too easy to just go and get things.
1:08:21
It's too easy like to go buy that dragon fruit to go buy that
1:08:25
banana where it's so much more rewarding and better for you to
1:08:32
source or share and create those communities where you can share
1:08:37
that produce as well. So.
1:08:39
The care that's taken into that fruit growing and sharing and
1:08:42
the community and then the meaning, the significance of
1:08:46
growing something, the perseverance, the, you know, all
1:08:49
of this comes in. Benefits to the environment
1:08:51
straight away you're not having run off and things like that.
1:08:55
Transport costs of food. Food, Miles.
1:08:58
Yeah. Yeah, where it's it's just
1:09:01
there. It's just five steps away from
1:09:04
your back door and you're picking parsley or dragon fruit
1:09:07
or Yeah, it's easy. And that's how it should be,
1:09:10
shouldn't it? Yeah.
1:09:11
Yep, grazing. Beautiful ladies and gentlemen,
1:09:31
thank you for joining us in that conversation.
1:09:34
Again, Yana and I could have talked for ages on dragon fruits
1:09:37
and all the things surrounding it.
1:09:38
We do share similar passions in the way that we want to nurture
1:09:41
our land and and share things. And, and that's a common thread
1:09:44
that runs through this podcast. I want to bring people on here
1:09:47
that are sharing that passion and helping us to understand
1:09:51
from so many different perspectives how we can nurture
1:09:54
and care for our land. And these guys are no different,
1:09:57
cultivating so many different varieties as you heard about of
1:09:59
dragon fruit, the weird and wonderful plant that is dragon
1:10:02
fruit. So I'm very grateful to those
1:10:04
guys. As always, check out the links.
1:10:07
They'll be LinkedIn the description.
1:10:08
You can go and follow what they're doing, get yourselves a
1:10:10
cutting and then maybe jump into one of their workshops or
1:10:14
speaking events with garden shows, which we didn't touch on
1:10:16
too much, but they're they're all over the place.
1:10:19
So I really encourage you to go and follow along on their
1:10:21
journey as well. Lastly from me, please, a review
1:10:25
is always helpful and I'm super grateful.
1:10:28
And then if you're not subscribed to this show, that is
1:10:31
definitely the one thing that you can do to help me out.
1:10:33
It is so easy for you to do. All you have to do is hit that
1:10:36
button once and we are connected forever.
1:10:40
So it helps me, helps people find this show and we can get
1:10:43
more people growing wonderful things like dragon fruit.
1:10:47
So thank you. Thank you very much for watching
1:10:48
and listening. And as always, I will see you
1:10:51
again next week on the very next episode.
1:10:53
Take care and bye for now.