Latest / Besties Do Verticals / Episode 29 - Interview with Evan Gambardella Part 2

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Episode 29 - Interview with Evan Gambardella Part 2 · Besties Do Verticals

• Lucy: Well, since he was talking about writing, I really wanna know the next Evanooshka: No. Lucy: yes, we gotta know. Aleta: Ha ha Lucy: You gotta ask him, Alita. Aleta: So we know that you've written a vertical with your friend Olivia. Can you tell us Evanooshka: Yes. Aleta: a little bit about that process and the premise? Evanooshka: Yes. Sort of, a little bit. Can't tell you much. Aleta: Little bit. What you can share. No no. Evanooshka: I can tell you that we have a co star signed on that everybody in the BL fandom knows. Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: I can tell you that we have A really funny script. That is kind of meta. And Definitely comedy first. but a a rum a romantic comedy and it's still a lot of spice. We're still selling the sizzle. Okay? Aleta: Ha ha ha Evanooshka: But it is it is a comedy first, and we're leaning into that. And we're really excited about making it happen. There's been a lot of progress in the last few weeks. I will also say that there are certain apps that are interested. How we get on those apps is SilTBD. And that's why I can't talk about it publicly because we don't want to mess with those negotiations and and Aleta: Mm. Evanooshka: all these things are very political. All these things are Aleta: Yeah. Evanooshka: very take a they take a lot of tender love and care. Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: But I will just say I'm very excited about it. And speaking you know, about Denai Gurira and you know, other creators that I look up to and admire that are writing their own shit and putting it out there. Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: You know, I was really dismayed by what AI has done to the Verdiverse and creating a a dearth of working opportunities for actors. just less. It's like a lot more competitive now. which is fine. Like it's always competitive in the acting world, but unfortunately if you disagree with any of these companies using AI in any capacity, especially if they're robbing artists for their eye movements and the way their eyebrows raise and lower, and the way that their mouths move and how they emote. That is not IP, everybody. That Is not something the company owns. The company owns the character and the story, but not my behavior. And Lucy: Mm. Evanooshka: if they're taking our behavior and they're using it to create puppets to take our jobs away, Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: that's a robbery. And unfortunately, when I word it like that, that limits the amount of companies that I can work for. So people Aleta: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: don't like when when artists speak out like that. So then that Lucy: Mm. Evanooshka: means I have to create my own shit and you know, shit or get off the pot, as my grandma likes to say. So I can't complain. I have to put my Head down and and work hard. And that's what I've been doing these last few months is been writing with with Olivia, who's a much more talented writer than me. and she's been writing a lot longer than I have professionally and is showrunning this amazing new show that I'm really excited to talk about as well. and I j just could not have done this without her in the in in the room together. I could could not do this. kind of work without Olivia. And yeah, I I I I guess what I'm trying to say is There will be a lot more stories hopefully coming for me that I'm I have my hand in the story itself, not just acting in it. Because I w learned a lot from my times doing verticals the last year and realized that a lot of the stories were not what I wanted and also not what fans wanted. And now that the goal is can I create stories that I can tell? Prove the algorithm doesn't know everything. because everything's data driven. Like, the data says we can't have a black person get cast because people are gonna watch black people in a vertical. Well, guess what, real short? Unless you cast a black person as the lead in a vertical, you're not gonna have data that shows you that people will watch a black person as the lead in a vertical. Sorry. So data Lucy: Exactly. Evanooshka: does not have the answers for everything. People have to to like actually listen. To what the fans want. Lucy: Yep. Evanooshka: and and also look at what's going on in the world and respond to that. Let's make stories that are of the times and speak to people's deepest insecurities and passions and worries about the world, and hopefully give them a path forward on how to navigate that. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: That's that's why we're doing this. That's why I'm doing this at least. There might be people that are doing this because they want to get famous and they wanna, you know, make a buck. that's fine. You know, whatever. I'm not gonna I'll I'll judge it a little bit, but I'm not gonna like let's not from it's not my MO. You know what I Lucy: Ha ha. Evanooshka: mean? But but but I we we gotta we gotta get back to the root of what it is to storytell. Why are you why do stories exist in the first place? They exist because there was a need To teach something, to connect Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: with somebody else. That's why cavemen started telling stories in the first place. If we need to know that saber toothed tiger is bad, stay Aleta: Ha ha Evanooshka: away from saber toothed tiger. He came over and ate my wife. Don't pet the saber toothed tiger. That's why stories exist. Lucy: I love it. It's true. It is why they exist. Aleta: Ha ha ha. Lucy: I'm gonna that was really profound. I am gonna make a tiny joke because Aleta: Ha ha. Lucy: I have to. But Evanooshka: Please. Lucy: this goes to show how well you know your fans. Is you looked at that camera dead in the eye and you said, Don't worry, there will still be spice. Like just Aleta: Ha ha ha ha. Lucy: know us and the fans fairly well to just at least keep that We love romantic comedy. Evanooshka: this is this is also something I've had to because I when I first got into the the vertical world I was like wow there's a lot of spice in these scripts and I don't know how I feel about this. A lot of it's a little bit like Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: over a lot of the a lot of the auditions I got were like a little bit too much. some of the content I was seeing was was very spicy. And I was a little bit nervous about that. It's like, like Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: is this gonna make me look like a soft porn actor? Type of deal. Like I'm a classically trained doctor, I want to be taken seriously. And then I was in a a a scene study class and did Basic Instinct, scene from Basic Instinct. I watched that movie and I was like, holy shit. Yeah, Fatal Attraction, Basic Instinct, these movies that came around at the same time. And the amount of spice in those movies is high. Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: And I mean, for fuck's sake, you got one of the most iconic scenes in the movie where she separates her legs and you're seeing her pubic hair. It's most like frozen f frame of and movie history that people are like, my god! god Lucy: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: Jared Stone And then y y you get yeah there's there's name any movie that was made at a time when like sex was li wake way more way more taboo. There's Aleta: Mm. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: a lot of spice in it too. So I don't think this is anything new. I've I've star I've really come around on like Spice is okay as long as it's earned. It has to be earned. If it's thrown in there people Lucy: Yep. Exactly. Exactly. You could Evanooshka: feel it and it's it's a turn off. But if it's earned, it's hot as hell. Lucy: You could still be taken seriously. You can win an Oscar. You Aleta: Mm-hmm. Lucy: know, if you're in a spicy movie. You know, you can't say we're eating Evanooshka: Absolutely. Listen, if if you can win an Oscar for eating people Lucy: chicken. Aleta: Ha ha ha ha ha. Evanooshka: You can win an Oscar for eating somebody out. Am I right or am I right? Aleta: Ha ha ha ha! Lucy: This is the best episode. There's so much craziness. my gosh. Okay. We are going to start. we're gonna start kind of coming near the end. I there is a question about a vertical I'm dying to ask you. Evanooshka: Yeah. Lucy: I know. Well, no, I think this one will be good. Tutoring my rival boy is still one of the highest viewed BLs of all time. that I know of, right? At least by the numbers. Why do you think that story hold on, I got a plane. I'll cut this out. Why do you think that story in particular and you and Sky together resonated so much with fans? Evanooshka: First of all, thank you everyone who's watched Tutoring My Rival Boy, especially the repeat watchers. Aleta: Ha ha. Evanooshka: I don't know. I don't know how to answer that question. I I I know that I felt like Sky was like a dream scene partner to work with because of how well trained he is as an actor and how generous he is with protecting people on set. That man goes out of his way to make sure that people are being treated the way that they deserve to be treated on a film set, whether that is crew, whether that is me. Doesn't matter. And I think because I felt so safe around Sky, I was able to do my best work. That I could in the circumstances, right? Like it's a vertical. We have usually one shot to get things done, maybe two if we're lucky. If my god, if it's like a A paywall scene in the first couple episodes, maybe we get three. Wow. And and oftentimes Lucy: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: there's something technical that happens that's wrong. And then we have to do it again. So it's it's not i once they get the shot, they get the shot, they move on. so it's again, I'm doing the best I can with the circumstances that that are given to us as vertical actors, but when I feel safe and secure with my scene partner. I can relax. And like I said earlier, if I can't relax, I can't do good work. So I I was able to do the best work that I could do in those circumstances because of Sky making me feel safe. So I think hopefully he feels the same way about me. And maybe that's what fans were able to resonate with, that we were able to like be present with each other, especially when it came down to scenes that we had to film in one take because we ran out of time. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: it was truly like trusting each other to carry each other sometimes literally you know to like really like to make the the the scene happen because we have we've got one shot. We got we gotta get it right. it takes a lot of trust. And I and I don't know the dynamics of other film sets. I know what Greg and I had, and I know what Skye and I had, and I know that in both cases, I felt really, really safe and protected and like we were on a team together. And I can say that about both men, that that they really they r they went out of their way to make me feel okay. And that I I and I would hope they Lucy: wait. Evanooshka: feel the same way about me. Again, I can't Aleta: Hm. Evanooshka: speak for them, but that was also my intention as well. So I'm thinking maybe that's a part of why. Aleta: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: You know, I think that goes a long way with intimacy. I think it goes a long way with with with with chemistry. You don't feel safe with the person you're like making out with on the first day meeting them, you know what I mean? Like you got you gotta you gotta like Aleta: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: you gotta be you you gotta know that they're not they're not gonna do something that puts your health, safety or sanity at risk. Or in peril. It's Lucy: Absolutely. Evanooshka: just not not cool. There are lots of things that were asked of like I remember one time for Strange Till He Kissed Me, Greg was asked to wear a giant schlong that the camera would get like a a blurry view of as it looks through his legs at me. So it'd Lucy: Whoa. Evanooshka: be like a very yeah. And Aleta: yeah, Evanooshka: 'Cause that's that's this moment I'm like, you're really big. That's Aleta: we know which scene it is. Yeah. Evanooshka: and and they wanted an actual dingling there that he would wear. and both of us were like, absolutely not. Absolutely Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: fucking not. Number one, out of principle. And number two, if anybody knows anything about Shakespeare, it's that the imagination is more powerful than what you can see. That's why all the violence happens off stage. See anything on stage. You don't want you don't need to see it. Totally unnecessary. Aleta: That would have been so unnecessary. Yeah. Like Lucy: It would have been. Evanooshka: Totally unnecessary. that's why, like, if if we're getting into that torture, then it is soft porn. Then it is like, Aleta: Mm. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: you know, is this merited? Is this like a is this a moment that like we need, like in Fetal Attraction where Sharon Stone shows the the the the pubic hair there? Which in that moment is about, look at her effect. On putting all of these men into a trance that which she could be a killer and yet they are totally distracted by her beauty and sexuality. And their their sexism and their desire to womanize her is actually getting in the way of them doing their job. So it's this whole conversation happening. Greg show and a big ding a ling. Through his life what does that do? What is that Lucy: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: adding to the story at at that moment? Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: Not much. So we we had each other's backs there and it didn't happen because of that. Sky and I, same thing. There were there were moments where the condom that's in that's in the the sex scene that we have, or the the preemptive sex scene, right? It's not we don't actually have sex in Lucy: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: it. We're we're leading up to it. And The condom was something like, you know, we don't have like safe sex really talked about in B the BL world. What an amazing opportunity for us to just throw this in there and make it sexy. And like, Lucy: Yep. Evanooshka: who cares? Like let's let's it it's we're not making porn. We're teaching people that are, especially young people, that might this might be the first queer content they're ever seeing in their lives. We want to be good role models for them. So Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: how do we do that? We do that by showing people that this is possible and that you can have safe sex and have it still be sexy. It's possible, everybody. So that Lucy: Yeah. It is. Evanooshka: was something we felt passionate about. We got pushback for it. They didn't want to do it. And then we were like, We're not gonna do it unless we have the condom in there. And Sky was like, You c you cool with with having that attitude? I was like, Absolutely, we're doing this together. And because we stood together. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: We had that artistic choice made. So that that that solidarity with my scene partner, that is necessary to do a good job with with the vertical. If I don't have that because at the end at the end of the day, the actors and the director, I think, Essential during crunch time to make those decisions to tell the story the best it possibly can, because they're the ones who know the story the best. They're the ones who understand Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: the the the fragile nuances of what's going on in the script and how the it's gonna be how what kind of impact it's gonna have on the audience. and that needs to be taken seriously, especially when a producer, while they're providing the money and they and they absolutely deserve a say in how the story is told, oftentimes a producer can be distracted by what is necessary to get views and likes and what is data driven, which is important. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: I'm not saying it's not important, but it's not the only Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: thing that's important. And oftentimes a lot of producers can get s sucked down that rabbit hole of like, it's either what the data says or not. And if the data says Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: it's it it's not possible, we can't do it. Lucy: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: Well, the data said a condom wouldn't be as sexy as without a condom, and now tutoring my rival boy is the most watched BL on real short, which is the arguably the b the most watched platform of verticals out there right now. So I have to disagree that that data and AI know everything. Data Lucy: Mm. Evanooshka: is based on what has come before us, and it's collected on what's currently happening and what's come before us. AI is expert, an expert at collecting all the data that has come before us that is online and that is allowed to be taken. Because Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: there's a lot of companies that aren't allowing their data to be taken, but the ones that are, are giving it over to AI usually unwillingly. It's just kind happening. And AI can collect this data and go, This is what I see on the internet. So it's no wonder that a lot of AI's recommendations are racist or sexist, Aleta: Mm. Evanooshka: because that's Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: most of the data that we have For human history, right? Like, there's Lucy: That's true. Evanooshka: no mystery as to why that is the case. But data Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: does not reflect the trends that are currently happening. It can only look at what's come before us. So that Lucy: That's true. Evanooshka: that that that we have to marry what data shows us with the intuition of artists and creatives that are telling stories. They have to they have to coexist together. They can coexist together. I'm not somebody who's like, by the way, but you know, just to put this on the record here, I'm not anti-AI. I don't think AI shouldn't exist. Lucy: Mm. Evanooshka: AI is going to exist. I'm not an old primudy man about it. Of course it's going to exist. Of course Lucy: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: we got to learn how to use AI in society and have it work with us rather than taking Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: over our livelihoods. But right now it's on a path of no regulation, robbing us without compensation and without credit. And that's wrong. But there is a way to do it. morally and ethically. That's above my pay grade, but I would love to be part of those conversations. And I think we deserve to have a seat at the table of those conversations, especially if they're going to take our work without our consent. I personally think that everybody should have the right to their own data. I think everybody should be able to consent to whether or not any company is taking their data on their phone. And if they want to consent to giving away your data, you get compensated for it. Because that's information for them Lucy: That'd be nice. Evanooshka: to use. That'd be a nice way for people to make money, especially in an economy that's going to be taken over by robots and AI. And then we might we Aleta: Mm-hmm. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: might not have the ability to make the same amount of money that we used to in the past. Lucy: Yeah, absolutely. Evanooshka: I don't know. That's a that's a tangent, but I anyway. I love these boys and I c I I Aleta: Ha ha ha. Lucy: Ha ha Evanooshka: can't I can't I don't know how to answer your question, but I I would have to guess it's because of the actual trust and admiration we have for each other. Because it's real. We actually do respect each other all entirely and that that I think that matters to do good work. Lucy: I believe it. I believe all of it. It translated well on screen. And it's funny because I think you and I have talked about this before. Alita and I definitely have. Rewatchability is what the fans see as a a successful BL vertical or a GL. So Straight Until He Kiss Me is one of the most rewatched. It's the most edited. So is Tuting My Rival Boy. And we've we spoke to an actor a few weeks back telling him, look, weave you just as the fans. You can tell what's most successful by what's being edited. You can tell what's being Evanooshka: Mm. Lucy: successful by like fans promoting for no cost, no nothing. They just want to do it for the love of it. Not all verticals get that. And they're the ones for me, like I've done it for quite a few, but for mine most heavily have been yours and hearing the effort that you've put into it. And what it means to you and the trust that you and Greg and you and Skye have, that explains everything. And it's funny because what is the most bitched about scene in Waterboy? It's the fact that Skye and Declan's characters did not use a condom and it's still talked about, but Aleta: Mm. Lucy: it's praised in Tutoring My Rivel Boy. Like we're like, my god, thank you. You know what I mean? Evanooshka: And T on that that I I I know is is that Sky wanted it Aleta: Mm. Evanooshka: in that scene. He di he did fight for it. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: but Lucy: didn't happen. Aleta: That just shows how out of touch they are though, because that is a as Lucy said, it's one of the things that fans have said that they should be seeing in in in a an intimate scene. They should be seeing protection Evanooshka: Yes. And JP Aleta: and Evanooshka: a thought for that as well, by the way. That I sh I should mention that too, to my knowledge. Aleta: Yeah. And Olivia, we Lucy: I believe it. Aleta: we talked to Olivia and about that too. Yeah. Evanooshka: port, yeah. I love Olivia. Lucy: Amazing. She's amazing. She loves you. She's Aleta: She is such a sweetheart. my gosh. Lucy: an Evan fan, a huge Evan fan. Evanooshka: me too. Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: I know Olivia from working on Straight Until He Kissed Me with her. She's amazing. And also Jen. who they they both did the intimacy for Straight Until He Kissed Me. And Jen also was responsible for the stunts. the a lot of the iconic stunts in Straight Until He Kissed Me, where Johnny also did stunts as well. Johnny was a stunt co the official stunt coordinator, but Jen was responsible for me like doing this dance with my legs where I was able to trip on myself Aleta: Mm. Evanooshka: and fall over and the salad goes up in the air and falls on that's that's Jen. And Jen also did Lucy: Wow. Evanooshka: the the really intense intimacy scene in Straight Until they kissed me where we're locked Aleta: Mm. Evanooshka: in that warehouse. So Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: and Jen, by the way, also did the intimacy for obsession. Fun little fun little fact there. so yeah, Jen and Olivia Aleta: Ha ha ha. Lucy: Beautiful. Evanooshka: Olivia also is like my gosh, what a kind They're both they're both incredibly kind. They just I I I I hope I get to work with them both again. Aleta: we we spoke with Olivia a couple of weeks ago. And you know, we really care about you guys, and it means so much to us that you have someone like that looking out for you and protecting you on set. Evanooshka: It's vital. Olivia and Jen, they both did intimacy for Straight Until He Kissed Me. Both Essential for the success of that vertical. Both made Greg and I feel incredibly taken care of. They're responsible for the choreography of the intimacy. not only feeling safe for us, but again, if we don't feel safe with each other and Greg and I had just met and just got on set Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: and were asked to do these really intimate moments. I mean, one of the first scenes we did intimate-wise was when we were locked in that warehouse together. And I had to have like a seizure, because I'm claustrophobic. It's really intense shit that you're asked to do with somebody Aleta: Mm. Evanooshka: you just met the day before. So and there's no rehearsal for that. So obviously Greg and and Skye, easy guys to to to work with and to trust, and we were able to click really quickly. But Jen and Olivia without them They they not only set the tone for how things were gonna go, but they also like gave us a vocabulary for how to explain to each other and communicate what we're comfortable with, what we're not. And setting those boundaries it gave us the freedom to actually feel safe and to and to do the choreography the right way. shout out to Jen who also like did a lot of the stunt stuff in Straight Until He Kissed Me. She choreographed the salad moment where it like flies into the air and like falls on top Aleta: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: of me and the salad dressing goes everywhere on me and Greg. Like that twist, Lucy: Ha. Evanooshka: I was having a hard time figuring out and Jen was like, I'm a stunt intimacy coordinator. Here let just let me just choreograph this for you. So the two of them working together And they weren't there necessarily on the same day, I think. They oftentimes would like like traded back and forth with each other. they made that vertical the success that it is. I I attribute their work to the success of Strange League gives me. Absolutely. A hundred percent. Lucy: beautiful. That's amazing. Evanooshka: I love them both. I think I I want to work with them again and on my vertical that I'm working on now. I want I want them. I'm like I'm gonna make sure the producer and directors know who they are. Like, okay, I want them. Yeah. Lucy: Crossing our fingers, let's make it happen. Yeah. Aleta: Mm. Evanooshka: If they're available and they're you don't want to, but that's that's essential. And I think what's also great about them is they want a full day of intimacy. before actually going to set. And I think, you know, if heated rivalry is any indication of how that would go. Or Obsession, right? Jen was the Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: intimacy coordinator for obsession. Clearly, those that series and that movie did very well. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: Intimacy, choreography, and coordination matters. You can't just dive in and like it's amazing. Like, Aleta: Yeah. Evanooshka: you guys just you guys are like actually making out with each other? Like, no, we're not. We're not. It's Lucy: Ha ha ha. Aleta: Ha ha ha ha. Evanooshka: choreography, and Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: we're not just like filming a porno going like, let's just see what happens. We're not we're we're we're not doing Aleta: Ha ha ha Evanooshka: that. It takes a fuck ton of of conversations and work and experience from these folks who know what they're doing as intimacy coordinators. A lot of folks that are intimacy coordinators I've realized that aren't actually trained. Similar to hypnotists. Similar to Lucy: Livia talked about that. Yep. Aleta: Yeah. Evanooshka: hypnotists as well. They're not trained. They just kind of learn from YouTube or whatever and they're like, let me just throw this title on and get hired. That's dangerous. Really, really bad. Aleta: Yeah. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: Really, really, really, really bad. Olivia and Jen are not that at all. They are extremely well trained and know exactly what they're doing. Highly recommend them to everyone who's watching Lucy: Yeah. I never got Evanooshka: this, whoever's trying to Lucy: watching the skill. Evanooshka: to find an intimacy coordinator. Work with work with them. Please. Give them more work. Aleta: Yeah, Olivia explained Lucy: Yeah. Aleta: how much how much and she has a great website too with the information about becoming an intimacy coordinator. Because that was something I thought like it's it's so wonderful that this position now exists, but also that must open it up to, as you say, people who are not trained and people who have maybe not the best motivations in wanting to be involved in that kind of work, shall we say. like creepy people. So that's well, for sure. Evanooshka: Correct. But that's the case with any industry. You get people that go into acting 'cause they want to be famous or make money, you get people that wanna go into politics 'cause they wanna get, you know, wealthy and famous and make yeah, it's always it's this it's the Aleta: Make money. Evanooshka: same it's the s tale as old as time. It's always gonna exist. Lucy: Yeah. Alright, Alita, let's let's hit the environmental question. Aleta: Okay, so yeah, we know that you and your family are environmental activists and that your father Evanooshka: Yes. Aleta: is working on an amazing idea called A B Eco Park. Can you tell us about that Evanooshka: Yes. Aleta: and your hopes for it? Evanooshka: Yes, so A B Eco Park is addressing our I'll speak at a statewide level for Connecticut where it's currently being proposed, but it would have national or worldwide implications. So right now the national recycling rate hovers on average around thirty percent of what we put out to recycle. So that means 70% of what we try to recycle gets thrown in the landfill. A hundred percent of what goes in the landfill stays there. Or even worse. It gets burned to generate power in an incinerator. All those emissions go up into the atmosphere, people around it breathe it in, and then the that incinerated air goes towards other communities that are far away, because air moves and people breathe that in, it creates cancer and asthma and all sorts of other horrible things. That is considered renewable energy, everyone. When you burn trash Lucy: Wow. Evanooshka: because you're always gonna have trash, that is renewable energy. So and sometimes companies that say they're investing in renewable energy, it just means they're investing in an incinerator to burn your trash. So that is a real problem that we have. And not only that, the state of Connecticut and many other states are like this too. They're exporting their trash because MIMBY, not in my backyardism, Aleta: Yeah. Evanooshka: says that I don't want trash being burned in my backyard because I don't want that bad. Incinerated trash beginning breathed in. Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: And rightly so. People don't want that. So what does that mean? Well, that means we gotta truck our trash out of state with 120 diesel trucks a day. That's what the state of Connecticut's currently doing on average. Of trash. 120 trucks, diesel-fueled trucks that are burning diesel to truck this garbage to Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Texas. So Lucy: Whoa. Evanooshka: we're burning fossil fuels to truck. this shit to get Lucy: My god. Evanooshka: burned an incineration plant or even worse, they don't want it there and they ship it off to Southeast Asia Aleta: Mm. Lucy: my Evanooshka: Where they oftentimes Aleta: Yeah. Evanooshka: sort through whatever they can recycle and use, and then they dump it in the ocean. So we're just paying Lucy: Hmm. Aleta: Yeah. Evanooshka: people to either burn it, to put in our air, or to dump it in our ocean. We are paying people to do that. Because we don't want to say that we did it. That's our current waste system, everybody. It's Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: not great. So that I and I'm again I'm I'm conflating things, I'm making I'm simplifying it for for storytelling purposes, but that Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: is what's happening. So the the the the problem is that the s and there's also other problems too that AB Eco Park addresses, but that's the main one. AB Eco Park would take all of the trash, whether it's recycled or waste, doesn't matter. And it would take all of it and change the recycling rate from thirty percent on average to a hundred percent. Hundred percent of what you want to recycle would be recycled. Lucy: Whoa. Evanooshka: And eighty percent of what's thrown in your trash would also be recycled. And that last twenty percent, which is considered like ceramics and stuff that can't really be recycled, would be repurposed and would be used as landfill cover or could be used in cement. so it wouldn't be Piled up necessarily. It could be repurposed into something else. longer conversation with that. But essentially you're changing the waste stream recycling rate from zero percent to eighty percent and the recycling rate from thirty percent to a hundred percent. That is extraordinary. And not only that, but the plant would take this stuff and melt it down And create energy with it without burning it, without creating any Lucy: That's amazing. Evanooshka: exhaust whatsoever. There's a chemical process that I will not go into the nitty-gritty details of. It uses hydroionic acid and it essentially melts this stuff down. And the byproduct is not any kind of shit that goes into the atmosphere, no toxic chemicals, no PCBs, no methane or carbon dioxide that would go into the atmosphere. No, it's car it's baking soda. And baking powder, Aleta: Mm. Evanooshka: which if you didn't know, all that stuff typically is derived from fossil fuels. Baking soda and baking powder. Yeah. So that would Lucy: I know. Evanooshka: then be created from trash instead. Any extra carbon would be captured and put into carbon cartridges that would be used for drinks and beverages, which right now come from fossil fuels. If you have any kind of carbonated soda or carbonated water, it's coming from a dead dinosaur. Lucy: my gosh. Evanooshka: And this process not only would would not create any emissions, it would take all these things like rubber tires and coal that's too dirty to burn. And since it's melting it down and not creating emissions, a lot of these things like rubber tires, for example, they just sit in a landfill because they can't be burned. They're gonna create too much toxic shit in the air. Sometimes they are burned, that's a different conversation, but a lot of times they aren't. And when they're not burned, even just sitting there. In the hot sun, it emits methane. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: So it would take these things that are currently emitting methane doing nothing, just sitting there, and melt it down, create baking soda and baking powder, and it would also create power. One A B Eco Park would generate about a quarter of the power needed to power the entire state of Connecticut. That means four Lucy: my gosh. Evanooshka: of them would be needed to power the entire state with renewable energy with no exhaust whatsoever. And on top of that, it would create 30,000 gallons of distilled clean water every day because when you're taking in all this trash, you have to evaporate the water in the chamber in order to create heat to turn a turbine. And that process of capturing the water means that we're taking the water out of the trash that would ordinarily just get evaporated into the atmosphere, and we're able to create 30,000 gallons of clean, distilled, fresh water that could be. You know, imagine building a plant like this in Texas where they have a lot of water shortage problems, or California or anywhere in the southwest, for example. Or think about any of the places in the world that are currently dealing with water shortages, right? We're gonna be dealing with water wars in in a matter of decades, because there's gonna Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: be a shortage of water. We can create thirty thousand gallons of this shit with one park every day. That's a lot of water. And on top of Lucy: That is. Evanooshka: that, the extra carbon that's captured could be used in a greenhouse to grow crops. without pesticides, because it would be in a greenhouse, you don't have to worry about bugs. And you could have organic produce that's fertilized by fish, which fish are also right now currently being the fish populations are dwindling because of climate change and what's happening to our oceans. And there it's a high possibility that we might not have fish in a matter of fifty years. So if we can start to use an aquaponic system to help fertilize a greenhouse to create crops And the fish can also be harvested there rather than going into our oceans to to get fish there, which obviously I love ocean-caught fish, but if it means saving our oceans to do it little bit less, we gotta do it, right? So Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: all this stuff is helping the environment in in exponential ways and in tiny little ways like that that make this entire plant carbon negative, which means it's taking carbon carbon dioxide and methane out of the atmosphere. And in a state like Connecticut that wants to be carbon neutral by 2050, but nobody in leadership actually wants to do that because that means they have to make really difficult choices to get Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: us down to that level. It's really difficult to do that. this is this is an option. This is a really viable, good, ethical option. There's no waste. The waste is baking soda, for fuck's sake. It's pretty great. So it it and it's Lucy: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: American-owned and made technology. It's currently being tested in Utah. This is good shit. and the the great part about it is how it will power the grid in a time where data centers are being built and destroying our water supply and destroying our electric rates. Right. Like like people Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: aren't gonna have cheaper electric rates anytime soon because how we're generating power is pretty antiquated. And unfortunately we're not building power plants fast enough because of NIMBYism. People don't want this shit in their backyard. People don't even want Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: windmills in their backyards because it's gonna ruin their view. They don't want solar Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: panels because, you know, they're the solar panels, a lot of them aren't th the mining is isn't ethical. Aleta: Hm. Evanooshka: And also when they are broken, how do you recycle them? You can't. They just make waste. So all Aleta: Mm. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: these things have problems, right? And I'm not saying A B Eco Park doesn't have problems, I'm sure there will be problems that come up. I'm not saying it's perfect by any stretch of the imagination, but my god, it's damn near perfect. I'm proud of my dad for what he's able to have accomplished. And I think that the the at a time where we have to do something to save this planet. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: I think this is our best shot. I really do. Or one of one of many things we have to do. I don't think it's the only thing we have to do. It's one of many. And as I Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: have discussed earlier, not on this podcast, but Aleta: Yeah. Evanooshka: with you both separately, Lucy: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: there is such a thing now as big green energy that are similar to big oil and gas. Insofar as They care about profits more than they care about the environment. So just because something is green energy doesn't necessarily make it ethical or good. In fact, a lot of these big green energy owners or investors rather, it's really the investors, are profiting off of the downfall of other green energy systems. Which is why this is taking so long to be built, because it directly competes with a lot of other or they see it as competition. I don't see it as competition because it's like we're all gonna help save the planet. And we'll all be able to We're all gonna benefit from this. more is more, in my opinion, but that's not how they see it. They see it as it's all or nothing. And if they don't win, then they lose. Very binary mindset. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: So it's funny, like my my dad, one of the first things that happened when the project was being proposed. the first selectment came to I why don't just build solar panels? Why don't you just do that? And I was like, Well, why not do it this way? Well it's because somebody at the head of D E P has connections with solar panel companies and they wanted to invest in that. So th th there's there's political shit that that slows this stuff down at every turn because of greed and because Lucy: Yeah. Yep. Evanooshka: people that are scared. They don't want to rock the boat too much because affecting the status quo could ultimately affect how much money they make or their power. I mean they're political people, right? It could be s slanted in a way that makes them look like they're you know, you're you're you're bringing you all the trash that was going out of Connecticut's now coming in. my goodness, this terrible person is bringing in trash to Connecticut and we're we're Melting it down. my god, that's terrible and and it's i you don't want trash being trucked into your backyard. That's terrible. Vote this person out of office. See how easily I spun that to make it sound like it's a terrible thing? And do a great job, you know. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: Like but there's a way to make it really convincing and compelling. And if people are like, my god, there's trash being trucked into my backyard, I don't want that. Vote this guy out. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: That's a scary thing too for politicians. So all this stuff's really complicated. And it's why doing the right thing takes a long time. Lucy: Absolutely. Evanooshka: And patience because what's that that triangle? You can do something only two of the three things can coexist. It's good, cheap, and fast. You can't have all three existing at the same time. And so if you want something good and you want it done cheap, or I guess the A B Eco Park's not gonna be cheap, but it's gonna be the least amount of money we need to possible to make it happen, it's gonna take more time. Can't do it fast. Lucy: Yeah. Absolutely. That's Yeah. Well, I have high hopes for that. That sounds amazing. Yeah. Evanooshka: I do too. Yeah, I do too. I think it's gonna happen. It's just a matter of time and bravery from wealthy people who want to invest. Because it it's Lucy: There you go. Evanooshka: we need we need really wealthy folks to step up and go, This is gonna work. The proof's in the pudding. I mean we're gonna have a a a test pilot of this on a smaller scale out in Utah running in October, hopefully, crossing our fingers. And that will be able to be something we could point to to go to look, investors, this is working. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: I understand that investors don't want to invest until they know it's gonna work. That makes sense. So hopefully the test pilot will be able to show, hey, this works. Lucy: Absolutely. my gosh. We're gonna have to stay tuned. Yes, stay tuned for this. Evanooshka: people will be able to come on board. Yeah. I don't sta don't don't hold your breath, okay? This is a long it's a Aleta: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Evanooshka: long slog. But Lucy: Just just keep us just keep us in the know. Keep us in the know. Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: I will. Thank you. Lucy: All right, listeners, we are gonna jump to some of our last two important questions. If you're alright with that, Evan. And Evanooshka: Ugh God, how dare you? Aleta: Ha ha ha. Lucy: Okay. bear with me. I am so sorry my computer decided to go to sleep. Okay. Here we go. Alright, kinda kinda serious but kinda sweet. If you could give ten year old Evan any advice or encouragement about his future, knowing what you know now, what would it be? Aleta: Yeah. Evanooshka: Oof where to even begin? It's a lot of things I would say. I would say be kinder to your parents and more patient with them. They're not the perfect people that you see them as. They're imperfect and you need to expect imperfection from them. And ultimately expect imperfection from yourself. I would say be more Don't don't be Don't be scared that all is lost when You speak out against injustice and nobody comes to back you up. I spoke out against bullies. I got a principal fired in middle school for denying kids lunch. Lucy: Guys. Evanooshka: And I lost a lot of friends and had really awful things happen to me as a result of that. I was punished. I mean, the same thing happened with when I came out against this guy that sexually assaulted me. I mean called a liar and weak and that I'm not a man because of it. I was So I think I would tell ten year old Evan, like, You are the playwright of your own life. You don't get to let other people make you feel icky without your consent to paraphrase Eleanor Roosevelt there. Nobody gets to make me feel inferior without my consent. Lucy: Right. Evanooshka: And and and I would also say don't quit piano too. Aleta: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: 'Cause I quit piano because I I I wanted to fit in and play video games more. And I would say just get a different piano teacher. The two games are great, don't get me wrong, but I would have preferred to have been very proficient in piano playing by now. Lucy: Can help the vocals. Evanooshka: learn Spanish. Lucy: You sound pretty good when you do speak. Yeah. Aleta: Never too late. You did s you did so well in Ecuador. Wow. Yeah, you were good. Evanooshka: I'm pretty good, I'm alright. I'm proficient. I'm proficient. Yeah, I was proficient. not great, but like you know, I got by, I was alright. Not I'm not Greg level yet, but you know, I'll get there. Aleta: But you could be. Evanooshka: Yeah, I gotta work on it. But if I was ten, would've happened a lot faster. Aleta: Well yeah. Lucy: Ha ha ha ha. Aleta: I was eight when I started learning Spanish, so it's a lot easier at that age. Evanooshka: so n I know, I know, that's why it's yeah. Would have been a lot easier. yeah. Patience and kindness to myself, I think, generally speaking. Aleta: We all should do that. Evanooshka: And that yeah, like, hey buddy, you're gay. It's okay. Like like Lucy: Yeah. Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: like I think I think that would have been a lot like that's there was no queer content for me to watch growing up. I knew very few gay people. I remember thinking that I was gay at ten and people were calling me gay all the time in school. So I like, Maybe I am gay and like all my friends are girls, but I think maybe there's a point to that or something. Like I I'm I'm around more girls than any other guy that I know, and like that must mean I'm straight, right? That's like Aleta: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: that's not a Lucy: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: lot. and I remember my mom taking me to the one of the only gay guys that we knew. just moved into the neighborhood. And she's like, Well tell tell the man what you want to ask. And I was like, Well, I think I might be gay. And he's like, Well, do you have crushes on girls? And I said, Yeah. Not knowing like what a crush really means or like what Aleta: Mm. Evanooshka: that what Lucy: Right. Evanooshka: what do I feel excited? like that around a girl? Or do I think I like her because I'm like her best friend and I want to marry her? That's a d that's a different feeling there. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: there was no like s like chemistry. Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: and that was not asked of me. It like, do you have a crush on a girl? And I yes, then you're not gay. And that's how I left it and I was like, Great, then I'm not and I wrote it off forever. I was like, then I am straight as they come until I was sexually assaulted. It was my first sexual experience before I even started to masturbate. So that that then sculpted like, this man made me gay. Which is also not how it works. But understandable why I thought that and I even had friends that you know, young, didn't know any better, not not punishing them for saying this. but they said like, you just need to have sex with a woman and get it out of your system and you'll you'll you'll you'll be straight, don't worry. You know, you just gotta like you gotta like exercise that exercise that muscle. As if we'd say that to a straight person, like, just just like get it out of your system, just like fuck a dude and you're not gonna be gay anymore. Like, what? Lucy: My gosh, stop. Evanooshka: But that's not how it works. So I would tell little Evan too, like Be safe you don't gotta tell anybody that you're gay, but like you are, and that there's nothing wrong with it at all and that you're you're gonna be just fine. You're gonna be just fine. Lucy: And he is. He is amazing. Aleta: Ha ha ha. Lucy: I love that. Thank you for sharing that. Evanooshka: Anytime. Lucy: One last one, Alita. One of our faves. Aleta: We ask this of everyone. You and the rest of the BL Boys, our little our little core group of BL Boys, have created a wonderful community of people who show up and support you and each other and you know how much it means to Lucy and to to me. What does having that kind of supportive fan base mean to you? Evanooshka: Extraordinary. I don't know how else to word it. That if you told me at this time last year, even when Straight Until He Kissed Me was just starting to go viral and like take off, because it it was like the weekend after it came out that it started really taking off. And I wasn't even like aware of it. I just noticed like, why am I getting all these notifications on my phone? And why Aleta: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: Are all my friends starting to say they're seeing me? It's like, it must be because you're my friend and it knows that I like you. It's like, like what's happening here? And then people starting like recognize me out in Aleta: Yeah. Evanooshka: public. And I was like, they're they staring at me funny, and I'm like, something in my teeth, like, what the fuck is wrong? So the if you told me last year that there would have been a fan base for me. Aleta: Ha ha ha. Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: Never would have believed you in a million years. Not when my last vertical experience was Aleta: Mm. Evanooshka: Sneak Me in Your Closet My Prince season two, where a fan came at me for being the teamwers of the character and they insulted my looks. So like that Lucy: Mm. Evanooshka: was my context of like, I'm not good looking enough to have a fan base. I'm not well liked Aleta: Lucy Evanooshka: in the vertical world enough to get a fan base. So like that Lucy: I was so enraged. Evanooshka: but that that was where I was coming. I was like wow I don't think that's gonna be my life. Like I yeah I was I was shocked when I saw edits of myself and I will admit that it felt a little bit weird. Like I I got a little bit nervous to like repost them at first because I was like, is this okay to share? Like I it's like me like making out with a guy in a bed, like with my shirt off. Aleta: Ha ha ha ha. Evanooshka: Like nobody knows the context of this. And like I want to be nice to the person editing it, but also this is gonna make me Like it's like basically I was outed by the show. You know, like that's kind of how it felt Lucy: Yeah, I remember you remember you saying this. Evanooshka: for me. And I was out to my friends and family and totally comfortable with it, but to social media, absolutely not. Absolutely not. I was performing and still perform primarily in places in the US that you don't talk about the three Gs, God, gays, and guns. You mentioned any of those things, you're kind of fucked because you're gonna be on one side or the other and people are gonna potentially judge you differently because of that and not hire you as a result. You never wanna talk politics when you're when you're doing work in different parts of the country, because again that could also affect your your standing with that venue. So I was pretty private with my personal life. And then when that came out, I was like, whoops, there we go. And there was a big assault on DEI initiatives for colleges and universities. I lost about fifteen thousand dollars of work when that show came out. Because then all of a sudden I was like, Well, can't hide it anymore. Let me share with this amazing fan content that people are making, like painting me and and drawing me and making b amazing edits, you know, and like holy shit, this love that I'm experiencing is amazing. I can't There was a p point where I was like, I have to share this now. This is just extraordinary. and I can't be afraid of it like outing me. And it did affect my work and I lost a lot of money. And then in that process, while I was like starting to connect with fans and doing lives and telling this part of my story, I felt so supported. And I felt like These folks actually like cared about me even though we've never met. sometimes in ways that were, you know, the the parasocial thing, that's a different conversation. That's like that's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about like actual Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: love and kindness, Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: and respect. That was just Like, wow, that's a beautiful thing about the internet. That that it can happen because of the internet. And especially from you both, from a lot of other core fans in the community. just feeling so supported, like that no matter what happens with the political world that's attacking educational institutions for hiring people like me. I'm gonna be okay. So the fandom and the fans and the support that I got is more than just making me feel like I've had an impact. It's also making me feel like crazy motivation to do better. Because I had no idea what kind of impact the shows that I'd have done would have on the world. That was like, that's a dream come true for me. The fact that I got messages from people in Ukraine that were like, I'm watching your show while I'm getting bombed. Thank you. Lucy: God. Evanooshka: th the show helped me to come out to my parents and to my community. I mean, the the the the the DMs were extraordinary and made me feel like, wow, I can like die tomorrow and feel like I made an impact on the world. But like that's that's like all I want in life. I just want to feel like I'm I'm making a difference. If I can make a difference, you know, you can get yeah I I can get by on on on losing some money here and there. I'll I'll be fine. But if I feel like I'm not contributing to society So the fans give me meaning and make me want to do better and be better and make better art. And what it's meant to me is like, wow, at a time where I could have just, and don't get me wrong, I have done this, stalked in my bedroom and been like, shit. I spoke out, I thought I did what was right. I defended my friends against what was going on in the industry with AI. Because they couldn't speak about it, because they signed NDAs. I was like, Well fuck, now I'm fucked and I can't work and I'm gonna lose money. Aleta: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: Woe is me. Play my little violin. Lucy: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: And then all of a sudden remember the fans and go, wait a second. I have a community that's a lot more important than whatever's going on with me to serve. That's what this is. It's service above myself. And thinking about the fans in that way gives me meaning and motivation to then write a BL script. Then taking into account what fans want to see. and see me doing. and marry that with what I also want to do. And I don't think I would have the same motivation to create that I do now without the fans being present, reminding me that I've made an impact to them. And as long as that continues, I feel like I'm always gonna have this. flame in me Aleta: Mm-hmm. Evanooshka: to keep making shit. It's it's it's powerful. It's po Lucy: We can't wait to see it. Evanooshka: it's a powerful thing that y'all have have given me and given us. and it's it's beyond words. I'm trying to like find the right word other than gratitude. but it's like power. It's like you're you're you're giving me so much power, which then means I'm responsible to use it in a way that is Effective. And I just am I'm grateful as fuck that you trust me with that. 'Cause there's a real trust there with the fans of like, wow, please Tell more stories like this. It's like I don't want to disappoint. Lucy: You will not disappoint the fans. Aleta: Ha ha ha. Lucy: You have not yet. You ha Evanooshka: I hope not I hope not. Lucy: you have not. You just being you, just the kind words that you've given everyone just in that, you know, response alone. Like that's It's gonna make everyone emotional because you have Aleta: Ha ha ha. Lucy: not let any of us down. Evanooshka: It makes me emotional. I'm I'm teary eyed. Aleta: Yeah. Evanooshka: I I was go I was Aleta: And I mean Evanooshka: I was going through hell and back again when I wasn't getting hired. Aleta: Ha ha. Evanooshka: I like, how am I gonna pay my bills? And fans were like, you know, I was out at a restaurant, like, god, like I'm so sad and like somebody'd sent Ven Momi money for a dessert or like Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: send me a a a funny thing of like, Hey, like you changed my life, thanks so I was like, Wow, like this is like you guys are fucking great and nice and kind and And coming to my defense, there's been a lot of shit out there about what's going on with AI and I feel very blessed to have people like defending my character when it's under Lucy: Absolutely. Evanooshka: attack from from from folks and like that that means a lot to me. Lucy: Yeah. Evanooshka: Thank you for believing in me and trusting me. Lucy: Boys. That'll never stop. You are very, Aleta: Ha ha ha. Lucy: very adored. Evanooshka: As are you both. By me, I'll speak for myself. Lucy: We try. Aleta: Well, you know, without without you and Greg, Lucy and I would never have met. And Lucy: Mm-hmm. Aleta: you know, we're we're really, you know, we're not just besties for the for the sort of sh podcast gimmick. We've really become s best friends and we we owe that all to you. That's Lucy: Lucky. Aleta: a huge thing. Lucy: Yeah. Little decisions Aleta: We appreciate that. Evanooshka: I feel like the who you Lucy: that you guys made. Evanooshka: owe that to is above my pay grade, to be honest. There's some Aleta: Ha ha ha Evanooshka: there's something else at work there, but I I'm grateful for your kindness. Aleta: Ha ha ha. Evanooshka: Thank you. Lucy: Aw Well, Evan, you don't know what it means to Alita and I that you joined us today. You have inspired us to do so many things this past year, but the decisions you made over the last year and a half of getting involved in verticals have impacted so many of us in the most positive of ways, as we spoke about earlier. So many of us have made lifelong friends and have been given safe spaces by you and the other BL Boys. We are so grateful to you. So thank you again for agreeing to come on to Besties Do Verticals and speak with us. Evanooshka: Thank you both. Aleta: Yeah, we have loved having you on today and we look forward to following your career for many, many years. We're not going anywhere, both in the vertical space and beyond. And Evanooshka: Thank you. Aleta: our listeners, thank you for being with us for this very special episode. We hope that you will join us next time. Evanooshka: Thanks for listening. Aleta: Yeah, thank you for listening. Bye besties. Evanooshka: Enduring my antics. Lucy: Bye besties. Evanooshka: Bye, Besties. Aleta: Ha ha ha Lucy: Ha ha. Aleta: ha.