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Rex Heuerman Finds Out His Fate · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:00
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace Bob Sheell. Tonight, the so
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Speaker 1: called Gilgo Beach serial killer aka the Long Island serial killer,
0:17
Speaker 1: Rex Heureman, is sentenced for a string of grizzly murders.
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Speaker 1: I'm Nancy Grece, this is Crime Stories. I want to
0:27
Speaker 1: thank you for being with us. That's right. In the
0:30
Speaker 1: last hours, sentencing goes down in a court of law.
0:34
Speaker 1: Rex Hureman, the Long Island serial killer, is sentenced. Hureman
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Speaker 1: confessing to killing eight women. That much we know. We
0:44
Speaker 1: know of at least eight dead bodies that remains lined
0:50
Speaker 1: up like a row at the cemetery there on Gilgo
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Speaker 1: Beach and Long Island. He would drive by those hand
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Speaker 1: Doug Graves every single day. A Hureman, a New York architect,
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Speaker 1: pleads guilty to murdering seven women and the eighth a
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Speaker 1: thirty four year old woman, Karen for Gotta. The guilty
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Speaker 1: plea a stunning reversal for Hueman, who for years denied,
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Speaker 1: tearfully denied being responsible. He's now sentenced to three consecutive
1:23
Speaker 1: terms of life. In that jurisdiction, there is no death penalty.
1:28
Speaker 1: He can kill as many people as he wants to
1:30
Speaker 1: and still get life behind bars, and we the taxpayers
1:35
Speaker 1: have the joy of feeding him and housing him three
1:38
Speaker 1: hots and a cot every single day for the rest
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Speaker 1: of his natural life. And then I can tell you
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Speaker 1: right now where he's going there, where he's going afterwards,
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Speaker 1: Straight to hell? What do we know about the case?
1:51
Speaker 1: Sightings of the victims' phone calls are from the victims,
1:54
Speaker 1: Train rides by the victims, victims that left and never
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Speaker 1: came back, keeping a victim alive for days on and
2:05
Speaker 1: so he could play with him. There are going to
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Speaker 1: be more victims uncovered of the Long Island serial killer
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Speaker 1: Rex Humormen.
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Speaker 2: The cam serene, almost grandfatherly image that Rex Human portrayed
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Speaker 2: since his arrest was a lie and quite frankly, an
2:23
Speaker 2: insult to both law enforcement but more importantly the families
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Speaker 2: that had to endure that during every court appearance over
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Speaker 2: the last two and a half years. Today he was
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Speaker 2: exposed for exactly what he is. A sadistic, soulless, murderous monster.
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Speaker 3: This case closes and another one opens. You know, there
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Speaker 3: are still you know, bodies on that beach, There are
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Speaker 3: still bodies in Suffolk County. There's no rest for the weary.
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Speaker 3: We are going to continue to work with our partners
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Speaker 3: and to try to obtain closure for as many families
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Speaker 3: as we can.
3:00
Speaker 1: That the police commissioner and the Suffolk County District Attorney
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Speaker 1: speaking unmasked finally in court in lieu of a long trial,
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Speaker 1: a guilty plea. But just as we saw in the
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Speaker 1: Idaho case, the Idaho for four Beautiful University Idaho students
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Speaker 1: murdered generally speaking in their sleep by one person, Brian Coburger.
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Speaker 1: Once again, like in Coburger, we will never really know
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Speaker 1: the facts because there is no trial now, unlike Idaho,
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Speaker 1: where the death penalty does exist, and Rex human is
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Speaker 1: jurisdiction you can kill as many people as you want
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Speaker 1: and there is no death penalty. What does this mean
3:52
Speaker 1: for his wife's reality show? That's certainly something to ponder
3:56
Speaker 1: Straight out to Crime Stories investigative reporter Dave Matck Dave
4:00
Speaker 1: Mack a Long Island serial killer. The Long Island serial
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Speaker 1: killer Rex Hureman finally sneered in court.
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Speaker 4: What happened once this all hit court with the announcement
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Speaker 4: that he was changing his plea. A lot of people
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Speaker 4: were looking at Asa Elerp, as you just mentioned, and
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Speaker 4: her reality show. It was a three part series that
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Speaker 4: included interviews with the couple's daughter, Victoria. And it looks
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Speaker 4: like now the cameras are going to continue to roll
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Speaker 4: and add additional episodes to the show called The g
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Speaker 4: Go Beach Killer House of Secrets. So it looks like
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Speaker 4: that show will continue.
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Speaker 1: Okay, I'm a little more interested tonight. Dave Mack in
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Speaker 1: the Guilty Please, a sudden change of plea throws the
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Speaker 1: courtroom in an uproar. Rex Heureman, the admitted Long Island
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Speaker 1: serial killer, pleads guilty. In addition to Dave Man, Crime
5:00
Speaker 1: Stories investigative reporter joining us also tonight, Josh Zeemann, investigative journalist,
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Speaker 1: documentary film director. He's been on the case from the
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Speaker 1: very beginning and he is the director of The Killing Season.
5:13
Speaker 1: It's a docuseries that helped shed new light on the
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Speaker 1: Gilgo Beach murders. Josh, thank you for being with us.
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Speaker 1: Describe what happened in court.
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Speaker 5: Well, Nancy, it was a tense moment for sure, everybody
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Speaker 5: waiting to see if Rex would actually plead, and he
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Speaker 5: did eight separate times to these women. The question is,
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Speaker 5: while he was admitting these crimes, he never once turned
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Speaker 5: back to look at the families, he was smirking.
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Speaker 6: And the question is why was he smirking.
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Speaker 5: Was he smirking because he was forced to admit what
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Speaker 5: he'd done, or because he knew there were other victims
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Speaker 5: out there that he was getting away with.
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Speaker 1: You know, Josh, that is certainly a scary thought, scaring
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Speaker 1: even me who have actually prosecuted serial killers. Before smirking,
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Speaker 1: you know, I thought he was smirking at the victims'
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Speaker 1: families or at the justice system itself. But you again
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Speaker 1: have shed a whole new light on this. Is he
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Speaker 1: smirking because he knows there are other murder victims, other
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Speaker 1: defenseless women that he's stripped, tortured and murdered, keeping them
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Speaker 1: alive in his dungeon basement for days and days on
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Speaker 1: end when his wife would be out of town, we
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Speaker 1: think days. And you believe there is a chance that
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Speaker 1: he's smirking because he knows there are other victims out
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Speaker 1: there that haven't been found.
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Speaker 6: Absolutely, for sure, it's the tragic.
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Speaker 1: I'm curious, why do you say.
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Speaker 5: That, Because we know the remains that were deposited in
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Speaker 5: Ocean Parkway, there's other folks, there's Asian Doe Carmen Vargas,
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Speaker 5: there's numerous folks out there who and have you heard the.
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Speaker 6: District attorney say it himself?
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Speaker 5: You know there are other bodies on that beach, and
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Speaker 5: I was there at the press conference. He says, sometimes
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Speaker 5: it doesn't matter what I think, it matters what I
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Speaker 5: can prove. And so his next goal is to try
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Speaker 5: and prove it, to try and find these other victims,
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Speaker 5: identify some of them, and again bring Rex to justice
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Speaker 5: for these victims.
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Speaker 6: Tragic.
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Speaker 1: Mike Gougle joining US. Former Nasau County lieutenant, founding member
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Speaker 1: of the NYPD K nine unit. He's led multiple investigations
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Speaker 1: into serial killers, including the Gilgo Beach killer on Long Island,
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Speaker 1: also Secret Service to Presidents. Mike, thank you for being
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Speaker 1: with us. That has got to put a shiver down
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Speaker 1: your spine thinking that there are other victims. Mean the
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Speaker 1: guy who's just in court in the last hours pleading
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Speaker 1: guilty to multiple murders. And these women weren't just bam,
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Speaker 1: you're dead. They were kidnapped, they were stripped, they were bound,
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Speaker 1: they were tortured for days on end while his wife
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Speaker 1: was away in his underground basement dungeon. And then ultimately murdered.
8:05
Speaker 1: They went through hell, and I wonder, I wonder, Mike,
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Speaker 1: were they thinking of their children they would never see again.
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Speaker 1: It's excruciating for me. I hate to even imagine what
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Speaker 1: they went through. And now the specter brought up by
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Speaker 1: Josh Zeeman, and he's not wrong of other women out
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Speaker 1: there somewhere under the sand.
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Speaker 7: Yeah, Nancy, no doubt about it.
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Speaker 8: Unfortunately, though, Rex Youureman is not the only serial killer.
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Speaker 8: This is a very unique areas I'm intimately familiar with.
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Speaker 8: I patrolled the area for almost seven years with police dogs.
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Speaker 8: I trained police dogs by tate daytime. It's a beautiful
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Speaker 8: recreational area. At night, it's a haunting, haunting, dark, desolate area.
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Speaker 7: And it's proximity to JFK Airport.
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Speaker 8: Rex Youwerman literally lived fifteen minute drive from here from
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Speaker 8: the locates where the bodies were, So it's a haunting place.
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Speaker 7: There's no doubt there's other bodies out there.
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Speaker 8: The bodies have been being dispersed out there since the
9:09
Speaker 8: eighties during the mafia gang wars, so it's just a
9:14
Speaker 8: question of actually locating and of course, frankly, this is
9:17
Speaker 8: a very desolate area.
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Speaker 7: It's finding bodies is like finding a needle in a haystack.
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Speaker 1: Okay, this is something I don't understand. You are a
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Speaker 1: founding member of NYPD, and I speak very highly of
9:29
Speaker 1: the NYPD. Like every LA law enforcement agency, it's got
9:33
Speaker 1: its problems and it's bad apples, but you are the
9:37
Speaker 1: pinnacle NYPD. That's who all the other pds look up to. Right,
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Speaker 1: It's very hard for me to believe that a K
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Speaker 1: nine or a team of canines cannot find all the
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Speaker 1: dead bodies. Cadaver dogs, that's what I'm talking about, one
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Speaker 1: hundred percent.
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Speaker 7: This is what cracked this case.
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Speaker 8: A Suffolk Police Department cadabit dog found the first victim.
10:03
Speaker 8: Without that, there would be no DNA evidence. Without that,
10:06
Speaker 8: obviously there was great work by all the DNA invest
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Speaker 8: all of those things, but without the bodies, you have
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Speaker 8: a very difficult case to prove. So dogs are considered
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Speaker 8: in court as scientific instruments to overcome warrantless searches. So
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Speaker 8: there's nothing like a dog to find odorless microscopic skin
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Speaker 8: cells that are dispersed. But again, this is a big area, Nancy.
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Speaker 8: It's different terrain, there's sand, there's a lot of vegetation,
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Speaker 8: so again, it's not a question of if other bodies
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Speaker 8: will be found in.
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Speaker 7: I think the DA spoke to this.
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Speaker 8: It's just a matter of when it's nothing new to
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Speaker 8: us New Yorkers that this has been. You go from
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Speaker 8: a high congested, highly trafficked, illuminated areas, you drive ten
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Speaker 8: minutes fifteen minutes from Kennedy Airport or Rex Huberman's house,
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Speaker 8: and it's creepy. It's creepy. I used to park my
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Speaker 8: police car to turn the lights out and you could
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Speaker 8: see five miles in either direction of any cars coming
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Speaker 8: or going. So guess what if the police can do that,
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Speaker 8: the bad guys can do the exact same thing. There's
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Speaker 8: no curves and there's a lot of places to sneak
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Speaker 8: and hide. So yet it's a creepy, haunting place, and
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Speaker 8: it's been that way from.
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Speaker 1: Many crime stories. With Nancy Grace repeat in the last hours,
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Speaker 1: the Long Island serial killer on the loose for decades
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Speaker 1: gets three consecutive life sentences behind BARSMENI arguing there ain't
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Speaker 1: no justice what happened to these victims. It's very clear
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Speaker 1: from what the Suffolk County District Attorney Right Tierney said
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Speaker 1: that he believes there are other bodies on this beach,
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Speaker 1: why can't the cadaver dogs find them?
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Speaker 7: They can, they have the capability of doing.
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Speaker 8: First of all, there's not a lot of Cadavid dogs
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Speaker 8: because there's not a great need for them, so there's
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Speaker 8: not a lot of them, but they certainly could. And
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Speaker 8: there's volunteer organizations that train Cadavid dogs all over the country.
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Speaker 8: So yeah, it's just right. And they are continuing searching.
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Speaker 8: There was police activity out there the other night. I
12:20
Speaker 8: don't know specifically for what reason.
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Speaker 7: So yeah, the search is on. It's never going to end.
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Speaker 7: And as I said, it's nothing new.
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Speaker 8: You can, as I said, Rex lived fifteen to twenty minutes,
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Speaker 8: you drive over a bridge and you go from Long
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Speaker 8: Island to a desolate You don't have to drive a
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Speaker 8: body upstate New York. You don't have to drive two
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Speaker 8: or three hours like in Goodfellows to dump a body.
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Speaker 7: Upstate New York.
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Speaker 8: When you can literally drive ten minutes from Queens Brooklyn
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Speaker 8: and you're in this it's like an alternate universe out there,
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Speaker 8: no lights, no stores, very little police activity. Police don't
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Speaker 8: patrol there because there's nothing out there in the winter. Again,
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Speaker 8: it's a beautiful recreational there by night, there's nothing out there,
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Speaker 8: and it's continued.
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Speaker 7: That way today. I was just down there the other.
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Speaker 8: Night at one o'clock in the morning, and it's eerie.
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Speaker 7: There's nothing. There's no rescue workers.
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Speaker 8: I mean, if you call nine one one, you know
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Speaker 8: there's a fifteen or twenty minute response time minimally because
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Speaker 8: they got to go over bridges, three miles of bridges
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Speaker 8: to get to this barren beach area control room.
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Speaker 1: I want to see the victims' faces, and I want
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Speaker 1: to see them close up, not a distant shot of
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Speaker 1: all of them in a group. I want to see
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Speaker 1: their faces, one by one, look at them. They begged
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Speaker 1: for their lives. They begged to go back to their children.
13:48
Speaker 1: They promised they wouldn't tell, They promised they wouldn't call police. Instead,
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Speaker 1: they were stripped, bound, tortured, raped, murdered, and their bodies
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Speaker 1: buried along a lonely stretch of beach at rex Hueman
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Speaker 1: stands in court smirking, why why Because they died and
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Speaker 1: he lives Because he's now going to be treated like
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Speaker 1: the teacher's pet by the FBI profilers. Yeah, that's right.
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Speaker 1: There are going to be many many interviews by the
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Speaker 1: FBI profiling him this piece of crap, and I guarantee
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Speaker 1: you one day he'll take part in his own documentary
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Speaker 1: and there will be money made off of it. It's happening.
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Speaker 1: Put money on it. Joe Scott Morgan joining me. Professor Forensics,
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Speaker 1: Jacksonville State University, author of bestseller Blood Beneath My Feet
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Speaker 1: on Amazon. He is the star of a hit podcast,
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Speaker 1: bodyb The Joseph Scott Morgan. But for my purposes tonight.
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Speaker 1: He is a death investigator, a very experienced veteran death
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Speaker 1: investigator with over ten thousand death scenes of all sorts
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Speaker 1: under his belt, over ten thousand. I first met him
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Speaker 1: when I was a prosecutor in intercity in Atlanta and
15:24
Speaker 1: he was working for the Medical Examiner's Office at that time.
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Speaker 1: That's a long time ago, Joe Scott, and you haven't
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Speaker 1: let up. You like me, like Gould, like Zeeman, have
15:37
Speaker 1: walked the beach. Do you concur with Gould's comments?
15:43
Speaker 9: Explain absolutely, and let me tell you why. You know,
15:46
Speaker 9: obviously you can hear my voice. I'm from the South,
15:49
Speaker 9: and you know we think about the rural areas down here.
15:53
Speaker 9: You get up into this region and you leave what
15:56
Speaker 9: they refer to as the city. When you leave the
15:59
Speaker 9: city and you're heading out, you know, as mister Gould
16:02
Speaker 9: had mentioned just a moment ago, you get there, this
16:04
Speaker 9: is rule. This is what they consider going to the country.
16:07
Speaker 9: And it's not it's not an unfair description because it
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Speaker 9: does go dark really, really quickly. And here's the thing,
16:14
Speaker 9: my good buddy, Sergeant Joe Jack Loan, he took me
16:19
Speaker 9: to the location where the Gilgo bodies were actually found.
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Speaker 9: And one of the things that I came away from
16:26
Speaker 9: from that visit to that location was the fact that
16:30
Speaker 9: one side of the roadway you've got this marshy area.
16:35
Speaker 9: It is prohibitive for anybody to go into there. You've
16:39
Speaker 9: got briars and brambles and everything else on that side,
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Speaker 9: and the other side you can hear the waves crashing
16:45
Speaker 9: and you can't see your hand in front of your
16:47
Speaker 9: face out there at night. It would not surprise me
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Speaker 9: at all if there were more He's saying at the
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Speaker 9: beach Tierney is I'm thinking probably along the sound side
16:58
Speaker 9: over there, where you can quickly deposit the bodies in
17:01
Speaker 9: that location and nobody's going to be any the wiser
17:05
Speaker 9: out there. I think that probably when he did this,
17:08
Speaker 9: he was hoping for something maybe like title changes that
17:11
Speaker 9: are going to sweep the bodies out. It's an easy
17:14
Speaker 9: dump to do this. He can pull them out of
17:16
Speaker 9: this avalanche, which by the way, they had recovered down
17:19
Speaker 9: in South Carolina, and they would just be gone. They
17:24
Speaker 9: would vanish, and right he was to a certain degree,
17:27
Speaker 9: but that yet there they remained. And to mister Goule's comment,
17:31
Speaker 9: those dogs are heroes, you know, because they went out there.
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Speaker 9: They took those dogs out there and they actually found
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Speaker 9: these remains. Is it possible they could go out there
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Speaker 9: and find more. Yeah, I think that there can. Because
17:42
Speaker 9: this is an extensive area, Nancy. It would take so
17:47
Speaker 9: much manpower to get out there and cover every square
17:50
Speaker 9: inch of this area or every square mile. They haven't
17:54
Speaker 9: even scratched the surface yet. And you have to be purpose.
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Speaker 8: Look.
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Speaker 1: Look, look, look, this is video obtained by ABC seven.
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Speaker 1: Look at him. I just want the viewers to know
18:03
Speaker 1: what they're seeing. Joe Scott. There he is, and I
18:07
Speaker 1: know exactly where he is. Nobody needs to tell me.
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Speaker 1: He's leaving his office. See he's got his messenger bag
18:14
Speaker 1: over his shoulder. He's leaving his office. Which was a
18:17
Speaker 1: stone's throw to Penn Station, and there he would catch
18:22
Speaker 1: the pen I've been there many many times. To imagine
18:29
Speaker 1: this demon walking amongst all the ladies catching trains at
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Speaker 1: Penn Station, going straight out to Long Island to commit
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Speaker 1: murders there he goes. He truly is a demon walking
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Speaker 1: among us. That is what the DA said. Sorry to interrupt,
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Speaker 1: Jo Scott, keep going. I just wanted the viewers to
18:48
Speaker 1: know what they were seeing.
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Speaker 9: Yeah, and when I think about who else he could
18:55
Speaker 9: have victimized, how many more are there? I think there's
18:58
Speaker 9: a high probability that there are. The spider. But Nancy,
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Speaker 9: if we could just return to the victims specifically, just
19:03
Speaker 9: for a second, this allocution, let me just put it
19:07
Speaker 9: to you, this way is lacking, okay, because you know
19:10
Speaker 9: what we got out of him, and yeah, I mean
19:13
Speaker 9: it confirms some things we got him saying, strangulation, strangulation, strangulation, strangulation,
19:20
Speaker 9: but there's no more detail there. I'm very disappointed that
19:25
Speaker 9: his feet were not held to the fire. You know,
19:27
Speaker 9: you had mentioned his torture chamber, which I think that
19:30
Speaker 9: this location was. Josh has talked about how these people,
19:34
Speaker 9: these poor victims, were kept alive down there, and yet
19:37
Speaker 9: there's no more detail about what he did. I don't
19:40
Speaker 9: know that people fully appreciate the depth and breadth of
19:44
Speaker 9: how evil he is. He is demonic in my opinion,
19:49
Speaker 9: with what he did to these poor souls, and we
19:51
Speaker 9: will never know that information. All I have to do
19:54
Speaker 9: I look back at the template of the way Kansas
19:57
Speaker 9: handled BTK. We don't have that here. It's left wanting
20:03
Speaker 9: to say the very least. And I think the families
20:06
Speaker 9: need to understand that. I think the courts need to
20:08
Speaker 9: understand that. But yet here he is. He's going to
20:11
Speaker 9: get three hots and a cot and oh, by the way, yeah,
20:14
Speaker 9: the boys from the FBI are going to come down.
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Speaker 9: They're going to sit with him, and they're going to
20:18
Speaker 9: interview him extensively, right, and he is going to hold
20:23
Speaker 9: a level of celebrity. And that is probably one of
20:27
Speaker 9: the most vomit inducing things I can think of relative
20:32
Speaker 9: to this monster Nancy.
20:34
Speaker 3: This defendant walked among us play acting as a normal
20:38
Speaker 3: suburban dad, when in reality, all along he was obsessively
20:42
Speaker 3: targeting innocent women for death. He identified these women, lured
20:48
Speaker 3: them into Nassau County, murdered them, and left their bodies
20:52
Speaker 3: in Suffolk County. He thought that by killing them he
20:55
Speaker 3: could silence them forever and get away with murder.
21:00
Speaker 7: But he was wrong.
21:01
Speaker 3: Because it was these victims, these women, who refused to
21:05
Speaker 3: stay styling.
21:09
Speaker 1: In the last days. The Long Island serial killer in court, snared, admitting, yes,
21:16
Speaker 1: he is the Long Island serial killer, but he's not
21:21
Speaker 1: the only one on the hot seat tonight. The question
21:26
Speaker 1: everyone keeps asking is, how could you not know?
21:39
Speaker 2: The Gilgo form was one of America's longest serial killer
21:43
Speaker 2: cold cases.
21:45
Speaker 6: After thirteen years, this bombshell drops.
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Speaker 3: Rex Huerman, architect, father, husband.
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Speaker 7: Who basically was the person that lived next door.
21:56
Speaker 5: He was a monster living a double life.
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Speaker 10: One person is saying this, One person saying that, but
22:03
Speaker 10: my memory says this.
22:05
Speaker 6: There's so much evidence against you. I don't even believe you,
22:07
Speaker 6: and you're my best friend.
22:09
Speaker 9: Convince me give me something.
22:11
Speaker 6: Did you do it?
22:13
Speaker 4: Rex Huerman insists through his lawyer that he is innocent.
22:17
Speaker 2: Is it possible that you know family ever suspected that
22:21
Speaker 2: something was off about this guy?
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Speaker 8: The most mysterious figure is Rex's wife.
22:28
Speaker 1: The investigator says to me, have you heard about the
22:31
Speaker 1: murders on Gilgo Beach. I've heard of them.
22:36
Speaker 9: The idea that the wife didn't know anything was hard
22:39
Speaker 9: to believe.
22:40
Speaker 1: Does everybody really believe everything they hear?
22:48
Speaker 8: Hell?
22:49
Speaker 1: Are you doing?
22:52
Speaker 11: I'm doing great now that I've got you on the phone.
22:58
Speaker 1: How ironic, as Elera, the wife of the Long Island
23:04
Speaker 1: serial killer, says, does everybody believe everything they hear? Woman?
23:09
Speaker 1: What were you deaf? Dumb and blind? You couldn't see,
23:13
Speaker 1: you couldn't hear, You couldn't speak of the evil happening
23:16
Speaker 1: in your basement often while you're at home? Bs on it,
23:22
Speaker 1: bs on you woman. That's from the Gilgo Beach Killer
23:27
Speaker 1: House of Secrets. Their official trailer, the family of Rex
23:32
Speaker 1: Huerman getting a purported one million dollars to participate in
23:39
Speaker 1: that special documentary Blood Money, Blood Money. How do you
23:47
Speaker 1: think that makes the families of these dead women feel?
23:52
Speaker 1: These women kidnapped, tortured, raped, murdered, their bodies sometimes dismembered
23:59
Speaker 1: and disposed of. How did they feel about his wife
24:03
Speaker 1: getting a cool million? It schevs me out totally. I
24:10
Speaker 1: feel filthy and nauseous all at the same time just
24:14
Speaker 1: watching the trailer, Dave Matt What Nancy.
24:18
Speaker 4: It's one of those shocking things that just pushes you
24:22
Speaker 4: over the edge that Asa Eleup is the ex wife
24:26
Speaker 4: of Rex Chureman, being featured and getting paid for this
24:31
Speaker 4: multi part documentary. Now, Nancy, they're adding adding new episodes
24:37
Speaker 4: to this This show, the docu series is called you know,
24:43
Speaker 4: the Gilgo Beach Killer House of Secrets, But now that
24:47
Speaker 4: the secrets are out, Asa Ellerp is going to be
24:50
Speaker 4: adding episodes. But Nancy claiming all along the family knew nothing.
24:55
Speaker 4: In court, Asa Ellerup is sitting behind Rex and she's
25:01
Speaker 4: seemingly shocked. She's sitting on the edge of the seat.
25:05
Speaker 4: She's gripping the seat with her hands. You can see
25:08
Speaker 4: the knuckles, and it's like she's acting like she just
25:10
Speaker 4: can't believe what she's hearing. And there's a suggestion that
25:13
Speaker 4: she didn't believe any of it until he said he
25:16
Speaker 4: did it. But Nancy, I'm with you, like many how
25:20
Speaker 4: can you live in this house? Which, by the way,
25:23
Speaker 4: when you look at the home that Rex Huerman and
25:27
Speaker 4: his family lived in his home from his childhood, it
25:30
Speaker 4: looks like the monster's home compared to the other houses
25:33
Speaker 4: on the street. It looks like evil exists in this house.
25:38
Speaker 4: She's living there with this man, Well, you know a decade.
25:42
Speaker 1: You know what, Dave Mack. If it looks like a
25:44
Speaker 1: duck and walks like a duck and quacks like a duck,
25:47
Speaker 1: it is a duck. So yes, it is the home
25:51
Speaker 1: of the monsters, including Asa Ellerp and Rex Huerman. This
25:55
Speaker 1: from our friends at ABC seven joining us in addition
25:59
Speaker 1: to Dave Matt Josh Zeeman, investigative journalist and director of
26:05
Speaker 1: the Killing season, shining in a new light on the
26:07
Speaker 1: Gilgo Beach murders. Tell me about Asa Ellurope in court
26:13
Speaker 1: and what if anything you know about her documentary here? Okay,
26:19
Speaker 1: that's total BS documentary series, my rear end. What can
26:24
Speaker 1: you tell us about her show where she's getting a
26:29
Speaker 1: purported million dollars and now additional episodes? I mean, come on, Josh,
26:34
Speaker 1: don't you know she wanted this thing to go to trial,
26:37
Speaker 1: so in between every break where the jurors got a
26:40
Speaker 1: diet coke or a cup of coffee, she could go
26:43
Speaker 1: out and cry and carry on with her histrionics for
26:47
Speaker 1: the cameras to aff for her reality show. Maybe make
26:50
Speaker 1: another million dollars, Josh Zemon.
26:53
Speaker 5: Look, I heard that she wasn't getting paid until the
26:54
Speaker 5: final episode air. You know it is a shock about it.
26:59
Speaker 5: I agree with you if you completely bled money. I
27:01
Speaker 5: will tell you this. I was in the courtroom and
27:04
Speaker 5: right when Rex admitted to it, I looked back and
27:07
Speaker 5: I saw his daughter, and his daughter was she was crushed.
27:13
Speaker 5: I feel bad for the daughter. I don't feel bad
27:16
Speaker 5: for the wife. I feel bad for the daughter, who
27:18
Speaker 5: I think is crushed that this man that she loved
27:22
Speaker 5: is now a terrifying serial killer.
27:25
Speaker 6: That's one thing I will tell.
27:26
Speaker 1: You, Okay, I get that. What I'm asking about is
27:31
Speaker 1: Asa Ellerup and her reality show. I don't care that
27:36
Speaker 1: she may not get all the money till the last episode.
27:40
Speaker 1: Is from what I can tell, there may not ever
27:43
Speaker 1: be a last episode in our lifetime because they're still
27:46
Speaker 1: digging up bodies.
27:47
Speaker 6: It's great, it's great.
27:49
Speaker 1: Think you know what.
27:50
Speaker 5: Look, I'll tell you something. You know what the lawyer said.
27:53
Speaker 5: The lawyer said when asked about it, her lawyer said,
27:56
Speaker 5: this is what America wants, And that's the real question.
28:00
Speaker 5: Do we want this or not?
28:01
Speaker 1: My little question is why don't they have the death penalty?
28:04
Speaker 1: But that's a whole other can of worms. Yeah, what
28:06
Speaker 1: America wants is justice. But is that justice him smirking
28:10
Speaker 1: in court? And you and I were talking earlier with
28:14
Speaker 1: Joe Scott Morgan about him being treated like the little darling,
28:17
Speaker 1: the teacher's pet, the bear behind the cage getting fed
28:24
Speaker 1: Filet mignon. Nobody wants to get that close to him,
28:27
Speaker 1: but they will feed him with a long handlespoon. That said,
28:31
Speaker 1: he's going to be studied and questioned. The FBI Behavioral
28:36
Speaker 1: Analysis Unit is going to have a field day with him.
28:39
Speaker 1: He may get to travel to them. I mean, I
28:43
Speaker 1: guarantee you, Josh, that there will be a day like
28:47
Speaker 1: Brian Coburger, that he will take part in some sort
28:50
Speaker 1: of documentary and he won't make any money, but there
28:54
Speaker 1: will be a way for money to be funneled to him,
28:58
Speaker 1: through his wife, through his family. I don't know how,
29:01
Speaker 1: but he will find a way. He lived quite the
29:04
Speaker 1: dual life, did he not.
29:06
Speaker 5: Look This was a guy who created these two separate personas,
29:10
Speaker 5: that of a father, a commuter working in New York City,
29:14
Speaker 5: and that of a monster. And I think that was
29:16
Speaker 5: really important to him to create these dual personalities, one
29:20
Speaker 5: allowing him to work on the other who was a
29:23
Speaker 5: hero to his family, theoretically so that he could kill
29:27
Speaker 5: at night.
29:27
Speaker 6: He's terrified.
29:29
Speaker 1: It's life for Rex Huerman, the Long Island serial killer.
29:33
Speaker 1: I firmly believe he's responsible for more than eight dead bodies.
29:38
Speaker 1: Will that ever be investigated now that he has life
29:41
Speaker 1: behind bars? This is what we know. You know Karen
29:44
Speaker 1: Stark joining me, forensic psychologist. She's a renowned TV and
29:48
Speaker 1: radio trauma expert consultant. She's at Karenstark dot com. That's
29:53
Speaker 1: Karen with a city. You will tell me? As Ella
29:57
Speaker 1: asked the question, the rhetorical question to people, believe everything
30:01
Speaker 1: they hear. Woman, you're the one that plugged your ears,
30:05
Speaker 1: closed your eyes, and taped over your mouth while your
30:11
Speaker 1: husband was raping and murdering people in your basement. Please.
30:17
Speaker 11: What I wanted to say about her, and about this
30:21
Speaker 11: ex wife and serial killers in general, is that they
30:25
Speaker 11: tend to pick women like this. They pick women who
30:30
Speaker 11: they know will ignore red flags, will not pay attention
30:35
Speaker 11: to all the little details that everyone else we know
30:38
Speaker 11: would pay attention to that basement, the horrors that were there,
30:43
Speaker 11: all the little suspicions. So I think that that's an
30:46
Speaker 11: important thing to notice. That this really fits a pattern
30:51
Speaker 11: of what serial killers do they want this kind of woman.
30:55
Speaker 1: Hey, Karen, Also, Karen, Karen, you know my husband David
30:59
Speaker 1: very well, Okay. I occasionally he will break down and
31:04
Speaker 1: make the bed up in the morning. And we went
31:08
Speaker 1: to go see Vango's sunflower exhibit. Can go with me
31:11
Speaker 1: on this. I'm going somewhere and there's a pillow of
31:14
Speaker 1: a sunflower from a Vango painting. And unless you really
31:19
Speaker 1: look at it, you can't tell which way is what.
31:21
Speaker 1: But I can tell because the vase is at the
31:24
Speaker 1: bottom and there's a little tag on the right side
31:27
Speaker 1: of the pillow. When I walked through going back and
31:31
Speaker 1: forth doing laundry or whatever I'm doing, I noticed that
31:34
Speaker 1: the pillow is upside down, and I fix it. Okay,
31:38
Speaker 1: So if I notice the Vang pillow is upside down, A,
31:45
Speaker 1: I'm grateful he made the bed up, but B I
31:47
Speaker 1: fix it. You want to tell me a saint al
31:50
Speaker 1: never noticed anything in the basement where women were tripped, raped, tortured,
31:55
Speaker 1: and murdered. No way, I'm not saying.
32:00
Speaker 11: She didn't notice it, Nancy. The important thing that I'm
32:02
Speaker 11: pointing out is that she's the kind of person who
32:06
Speaker 11: would ignore what she notices. That she's able to find
32:10
Speaker 11: a way inside of her mind to absolutely put it
32:15
Speaker 11: aside and say in some way without saying to you,
32:20
Speaker 11: but to herself, I'm not going to pay attention to
32:23
Speaker 11: this in order to keep the life that she has.
32:26
Speaker 11: And there's no doubt in my mind, just like you,
32:30
Speaker 11: that there were hints, there were red flags all the time.
32:34
Speaker 11: But this is somebody who would not pay attention to them.
32:38
Speaker 11: And that happens a lot with the kind of women
32:40
Speaker 11: that serial killers pick. Think Ted Bundy, think Dennis Rader.
32:45
Speaker 11: They pick women who live with them and somehow can't
32:50
Speaker 11: see what everyone else can see. In addition to which
32:54
Speaker 11: look at their personalities, they are able to switch. It's
32:58
Speaker 11: like turning on a light right. They could switch between
33:02
Speaker 11: the life that they're living with their family, with the
33:05
Speaker 11: community and turn into these demonic killers that torture and
33:10
Speaker 11: great they are able to do that. People can't do that,
33:15
Speaker 11: but serial killers can't.
33:17
Speaker 12: The fourth witness, she was a sex worker for many years.
33:21
Speaker 12: She said that she would service rex Huomen over twenty
33:24
Speaker 12: times and that he would he was a serial user
33:28
Speaker 12: of sex workers. He would sometimes have him come two
33:31
Speaker 12: at a time to his house and his wife was
33:34
Speaker 12: home upstairs, and in one instance got very angry at
33:39
Speaker 12: one of the sex workers because the wife believed that
33:42
Speaker 12: the worker had stolen an iron from you know, for
33:45
Speaker 12: ironing clothes, and had had it in the car with
33:48
Speaker 12: the driver. So the driver had to get out, everybody
33:51
Speaker 12: had to search the car. There was no iron, but
33:54
Speaker 12: the wife knew about it and knew about obviously what
33:56
Speaker 12: was going on in order for that to happen.
34:01
Speaker 9: You know, they're saying specifically that there's the evidence of
34:04
Speaker 9: torture that's different than post mortal mutilation Nancy.
34:08
Speaker 11: And it's clear how much he was obsessed with his
34:11
Speaker 11: own doing what he did following the Rudolph Mars He.
34:16
Speaker 1: Can never erase anything on your computer. Snared in court,
34:24
Speaker 1: Long Island serial killer Rex Huerman pleads guilty to multiple murders.
34:29
Speaker 1: But I'm not done with you yet. Asa ellerup the
34:32
Speaker 1: wife a million dollars at least for a reality show
34:37
Speaker 1: and now a lawsuit. Dave matt who is suing.
34:41
Speaker 4: Ellerp Benjamin Torres. He is the thirty two year old
34:47
Speaker 4: son of victim Valerie Mack. He is naming Rex Hureman, obviously,
34:52
Speaker 4: but in this million dollar lawsuit he names Asa Elerap
34:57
Speaker 4: and daughter Victoria Huerman as defendants. Torres alleges that he
35:02
Speaker 4: was deprived of his mother's care and protection, claims Mack
35:06
Speaker 4: was tortured before her death, and the suit seeks damages
35:10
Speaker 4: and targets. The prophets allegedly earned bi Eller of in
35:14
Speaker 4: Victoria human from the Peacock documentary that we've been talking about.
35:18
Speaker 1: I'm saying that human's.
35:20
Speaker 4: Life being shown like this is a callous disregard to
35:26
Speaker 4: the victims' families.
35:28
Speaker 1: You know, I'm just imagining what the victims' families have
35:33
Speaker 1: gone through. They went for years thinking maybe their mothers
35:38
Speaker 1: just left them, abandoned them. How do you like to
35:42
Speaker 1: grow up thinking that mom just left. I don't know
35:45
Speaker 1: where she is. She didn't love me enough to stay
35:48
Speaker 1: with me or even stay in touch with me. I
35:51
Speaker 1: grew up without a mother. And then they find out
35:54
Speaker 1: for all those years that they blamed their mom, that
35:57
Speaker 1: their mom had been torturing and raped and murdered, and
36:03
Speaker 1: their remains buried on a desolate beach. Just growing up
36:10
Speaker 1: in itself has all sorts of trauma and issues pile
36:14
Speaker 1: that on top. I don't know how these people even
36:16
Speaker 1: get out of bed in the morning to Joseph Scott
36:20
Speaker 1: Morgan explain what was done to these victims? And you
36:28
Speaker 1: know what, when we show their faces, Joe Scott, it's
36:31
Speaker 1: easy to go, oh, there's a Long Island serial killer victims.
36:35
Speaker 1: I would have to make yourrrs and I didn't like
36:38
Speaker 1: it any more than they did. Make them confront what
36:44
Speaker 1: really happened to these ladies, what they endured before their deaths.
36:52
Speaker 1: What happened to them, Joe Scott.
36:56
Speaker 9: The worst possible torture that you can imagine. Can we
36:59
Speaker 9: reflect back just for a second to think about this list.
37:03
Speaker 9: Do you remember the list, Nancy, this kind of assignment
37:07
Speaker 9: of task that.
37:09
Speaker 1: He had created.
37:10
Speaker 9: Nancy. There's there's one part in this list that he
37:13
Speaker 9: had created where it says, by the bye, don't don't
37:18
Speaker 9: forget to remove the hands and the head and to
37:22
Speaker 9: wash the bodies. Just let's just meditate on that, just
37:26
Speaker 9: for a second, of how dark this whole thing is.
37:30
Speaker 9: And if it happened once, it happened multiple times. And
37:35
Speaker 9: that's that's in death. Lord only knows what had happened
37:39
Speaker 9: in life down in that dark, dark space as he
37:45
Speaker 9: is torturing these poor victims. And here's the here's the
37:50
Speaker 9: real shame. Just like Ted Bundy, we will hear his
37:55
Speaker 9: name over and over and over and over again. Guess what.
38:00
Speaker 9: Guess what. There are very few people that can go
38:04
Speaker 9: down the list of Ted Bundy's victims and name them.
38:08
Speaker 9: I submit to you that the names of these victims
38:12
Speaker 9: will be forgotten. And I hate to say that it's
38:14
Speaker 9: very callous, but his name will trump everything else. He'll
38:18
Speaker 9: be mentioned over and over and over again, and people
38:21
Speaker 9: need to remember this. This is why, when I think
38:24
Speaker 9: about the allocution, why he should be compelled to talk
38:28
Speaker 9: about what these are individuals. They had lives, they had families,
38:32
Speaker 9: and the torture that they were subjected to is stuff
38:35
Speaker 9: that you can't even imagine in your wildest dreams. It's
38:39
Speaker 9: stuff that you think about war crimes. People that commit
38:42
Speaker 9: war crimes didn't do stuff like this. You know, one
38:46
Speaker 9: thing that I reflectively think back to in this list,
38:50
Speaker 9: there's at one point where he actually uses the term
38:53
Speaker 9: hard point, and that really stuck with me. And the
38:56
Speaker 9: hard point was a location commonly where you secure something like,
39:02
Speaker 9: for instance, an eye an eye hook in the ceiling,
39:06
Speaker 9: where you can tie somebody up, you can hang them
39:08
Speaker 9: almost like a piece of beef, or if you're feel
39:11
Speaker 9: dressing a deer and talking about the context of that,
39:15
Speaker 9: you know, what's your purpose for doing that? Rex? You know,
39:18
Speaker 9: why would you need a hard point? I know he's
39:20
Speaker 9: an architect. He probably uses that term from the descriptor
39:24
Speaker 9: of building something out, but that's not what he used
39:27
Speaker 9: that for, Nancy. He used that to secure these individuals
39:31
Speaker 9: so he could work out these sick fantasies. And you know,
39:34
Speaker 9: they're paying the price. They're paying the price to satiate
39:38
Speaker 9: these evil desires that he has, and they are not
39:41
Speaker 9: going to be memorialized. I am truly hoping. I am
39:44
Speaker 9: so glad you brought up this gentleman who is suing,
39:49
Speaker 9: because maybe there will be relief in civil court where
39:53
Speaker 9: they will have to talk about this stuff. They will
39:55
Speaker 9: have to talk about what happened in her domicile that
39:59
Speaker 9: she was living in with her kids. This was all
40:02
Speaker 9: going on under her nose in that basement she inhabited
40:06
Speaker 9: the space. Let's hear it, you know, let the hide
40:09
Speaker 9: come with a hair and let's hear what they have
40:11
Speaker 9: to say about this and what went on in that house.
40:14
Speaker 9: You're not going to get in civil court. I mean
40:15
Speaker 9: in criminal court because he's not gonna be forced testified
40:18
Speaker 9: at this point. But in the civil court, maybe these
40:21
Speaker 9: families will get some relief and they will be able
40:24
Speaker 9: to see what he had done, and you can parade
40:27
Speaker 9: all of the experts across the stand. In civil court,
40:30
Speaker 9: you can get transcripts, you can do depositions, and they're
40:33
Speaker 9: going to talk about it, and I hope, I hope
40:35
Speaker 9: they go forward with it. I hope every family member
40:38
Speaker 9: out there that suffered at his hands will file suit,
40:42
Speaker 9: and we're gonna find out what actually happened down there
40:45
Speaker 9: in that basement.
40:46
Speaker 1: And recall, Jo Scott that asa Ellerp's hair was actually
40:50
Speaker 1: found on Valerie Max's body, which opens up a whole
40:54
Speaker 1: nother can of worms. I'd like to go back to
40:58
Speaker 1: what the control room was showing while you were talking,
41:01
Speaker 1: Joe Scott. I guess in your world, as do. I
41:05
Speaker 1: make lists all the time so I can't forget what
41:08
Speaker 1: all I have to do. Don't hunt too long in
41:11
Speaker 1: one area because you'll be seen. Don't charge for your gas,
41:17
Speaker 1: check for video cameras in the pickup area. The next
41:20
Speaker 1: time you kidnap your victim, hit the victim harder, Make
41:27
Speaker 1: it easier to quote take them down a hit to
41:30
Speaker 1: the face or the neck next time, which means he
41:33
Speaker 1: didn't hit the victim in the right place for him
41:35
Speaker 1: the first time, and she fought back. You need more
41:38
Speaker 1: sleep before the murders. You need to control the noise
41:42
Speaker 1: and more quote playtime. In other words, torture hang drop
41:47
Speaker 1: claws from the ceiling with pushpins, not tape, because the
41:52
Speaker 1: drop claws become loose during the rapes and the torture.
41:58
Speaker 1: Use heavy rope for the neck. Light rope broke under
42:02
Speaker 1: the stress of being tightened. Now that sun and all
42:07
Speaker 1: the victims' families have to think about how tightly ropes
42:12
Speaker 1: were cinched around their mother's neck. Props, toys, wood items,
42:18
Speaker 1: wood items for what, destroy books, computer files, anything that
42:25
Speaker 1: touched t one, I guess the victim. Dispose of plastic bags.
42:34
Speaker 1: Remove marks from the torture. What does that mean when
42:38
Speaker 1: he cut out portions of their skin, remove head and hands.
42:43
Speaker 9: Yeah, you're talking about excision there, Nancy. Excision is say,
42:47
Speaker 9: for instance, you have a sharp instrument and you have
42:50
Speaker 9: an insult to the skin. For instance, you have a mark,
42:53
Speaker 9: an abrasion, a contusion. Whatever it is he's talking about
42:57
Speaker 9: excizing that area, actually cutting.
43:00
Speaker 1: Out, cutting and out, cutting out of the tattoo from
43:03
Speaker 1: the skin. That's what Joe Scott is saying. And he's
43:06
Speaker 1: right now here are his problems to the panel DNA
43:10
Speaker 1: that's a problem. Tire marks for him, that's a problem. Bloodstains, fingerprints,
43:15
Speaker 1: plastic bag he had cat litter to get rid of
43:20
Speaker 1: the smell. This guy, look at this. All the supplies booties, acid, lie,
43:30
Speaker 1: a police scanner, cutting tools, hair and nets, burn can
43:34
Speaker 1: drain cleaner tarps, electric clips, large electric clips for what
43:43
Speaker 1: Joe Scott to put on the victims' bodies and electric
43:47
Speaker 1: cute them as torture. Why would he need electric clips?
43:51
Speaker 9: Yeah, to send voltage to their bodies because he's he
43:54
Speaker 9: is experiencing this. He wants to see the pain. He
43:58
Speaker 9: wants to see the resistance. He wants to see their
44:01
Speaker 9: reaction to the terror that he's inflicting upon them. Okay,
44:06
Speaker 9: they know that something horrible is coming, that horror being
44:09
Speaker 9: their end. But what's happening before they get to that death,
44:14
Speaker 9: which probably at the end of the day many of
44:17
Speaker 9: them were probably begging for Nancy at that point. I
44:21
Speaker 9: think the big question is, we know these eight victims
44:25
Speaker 9: that he has admitted to. I want to know how
44:28
Speaker 9: many more women were brought down there and subjected to
44:31
Speaker 9: the same torture in this environment. You know, Lord only knows,
44:37
Speaker 9: you know. One of the things I think about is
44:40
Speaker 9: the DNA recovery down there in that area. I really
44:43
Speaker 9: wonder how many unknown bits of DNA may have been recovered,
44:48
Speaker 9: What was the opportunity, how much had it degraded. There's
44:50
Speaker 9: so many unanswered questions.
44:56
Speaker 1: Crime stories with.
44:57
Speaker 10: Nancy Gray rex Huerman, the Gilgo Beach Killer, the Long
45:05
Speaker 10: Island serial Killer, Life behind Bars, the Monster is Jailed.
45:11
Speaker 1: I noticed on the list to Josh Zeeman joining us,
45:16
Speaker 1: director of The Killing Season, an entire docuseriies that profiled
45:22
Speaker 1: and shed light on the Long Island serial killings. I
45:26
Speaker 1: noticed on his list he wanted more photo film his words,
45:30
Speaker 1: So obviously he took pictures during the torture or after.
45:37
Speaker 5: In fact, Nancy, there are believed to be one hundred
45:40
Speaker 5: thousand pictures that the disc attorney has had to go
45:45
Speaker 5: through that the FBI helped to even organize one hundred thousand.
45:49
Speaker 5: What's amazing is this guy took all these precautions to
45:53
Speaker 5: try not to get caught. Yet still this was all
45:56
Speaker 5: sitting on his computer, this document, this planning document, it's
45:59
Speaker 5: called the HK planning document Hunt and Kill Planning document.
46:04
Speaker 5: It was sitting in this edge, in the bites of
46:06
Speaker 5: his computer that he could not erase. So despite all
46:10
Speaker 5: these things that he had done, it was still there,
46:13
Speaker 5: and thank god they were able to get this. He
46:16
Speaker 5: was actually you talk about this house looking so ramshackle.
46:20
Speaker 6: He's a hoarder. He hoarded all these old items, old
46:24
Speaker 6: pom pilots. There were palm pilots that.
46:25
Speaker 5: They found that basically gave the dates of what he
46:28
Speaker 5: was doing and going that actually mentioned his wife being
46:33
Speaker 5: away at times and he would go.
46:35
Speaker 6: And find a victim. So he hoarded everything, including all
46:39
Speaker 6: these pieces of evidence.
46:41
Speaker 5: He also had the most shocking thing is he had
46:44
Speaker 5: newspaper articles, thirty year old newspaper articles in his bedroom,
46:49
Speaker 5: in his office, in his basement of all his crimes.
46:52
Speaker 5: So for some guy who's such an architect and such
46:55
Speaker 5: a great planner, he still kept all these mementos that
46:59
Speaker 5: basically nailed them to a wall for these killings.
47:02
Speaker 1: To Mike Gould, special guest, former Nasau County Lieutenant, founding
47:07
Speaker 1: member of The NYPD K nine unit led multiple investigations
47:13
Speaker 1: into serial killers, including this case. Mike, after all your work,
47:19
Speaker 1: all your time, literally, blood, sweat and tears, how does
47:23
Speaker 1: it make you feel that this guy he might be
47:28
Speaker 1: sentenced consecutively, one after the next, half the next. But
47:30
Speaker 1: bottom line, he gets one life sentence for everything he did.
47:37
Speaker 8: Yeah, Nancy, it's sickening. This is a true animal, monster,
47:40
Speaker 8: whatever you want to call it. But what's most disturbing.
47:43
Speaker 8: He could be at your next dinner party. He was
47:45
Speaker 8: an architect, He's very well respected in the community. You
47:48
Speaker 8: know what I think about. As I said, I patrolled
47:50
Speaker 8: this Areosion Parkway from nineteen ninety two to nineteen ninety
47:54
Speaker 8: nine when frankly these bodies were disposed of. But here's
47:59
Speaker 8: the sad reality. I could have pulled him over. He
48:02
Speaker 8: has a license registration and he could have had a
48:05
Speaker 8: body in his trunk. He's a duck hunter and he's
48:08
Speaker 8: a member of the community. I would have probably let
48:11
Speaker 8: him go. There would be no reason for me to
48:13
Speaker 8: suspect because sociopaths are very manipulative. As I said, he
48:17
Speaker 8: could be He's just somebody's next door neighbor. He could
48:19
Speaker 8: be at so That's what's the most troubling to me
48:24
Speaker 8: is you never know the evil at lurks in anybody's mind. Frankly, so, yeah,
48:29
Speaker 8: I could have stopped him to checked his license registration.
48:32
Speaker 7: I could have said, what are you doing down here
48:33
Speaker 7: at two o'clock in the morning. You said, I'm going
48:35
Speaker 7: duck hunting, I'm doing this.
48:36
Speaker 8: And I would have let him go. And that's the
48:38
Speaker 8: facts of life. And there could have been a mutilated
48:41
Speaker 8: body in his trunk.
48:42
Speaker 1: Mike Gold a special guest tonight. He worked the Long
48:47
Speaker 1: Island serial killer case. Mike, what you said is chilling, eerie,
48:56
Speaker 1: and I know it to be true. I remember one
48:59
Speaker 1: serial killer I prosecuted was a chef and everybody loved him.
49:05
Speaker 1: He was a serial killer. So what you're saying, it's
49:08
Speaker 1: and I would not in front of the jury. I
49:10
Speaker 1: would look over at him and just try to take
49:13
Speaker 1: it in. And it's very hard to evaluate, to understand,
49:23
Speaker 1: to reconcile that that guy sitting there in a gorgeous suit,
49:29
Speaker 1: flanked by lawyers is a cold blooded killer. And when
49:35
Speaker 1: I think of what Josh Zieman just said about over
49:39
Speaker 1: one hundred thousand photos of these dead women during torture
49:48
Speaker 1: during rapes, and their families have to live with that
49:52
Speaker 1: the rest of their lives. I mean, I feel, I
49:56
Speaker 1: don't know, robbed by this guilty plea and I don't
49:59
Speaker 1: know what why.
50:02
Speaker 7: Yes, so this is a heinous crime. We can't you
50:05
Speaker 7: can't fathom insanity.
50:06
Speaker 8: How can a normal functioning person, As I said, this
50:10
Speaker 8: could be anyone.
50:11
Speaker 7: Nobody's immune to this.
50:13
Speaker 8: This could be a priest, it could be any member
50:16
Speaker 8: of your community, family member.
50:18
Speaker 7: They're devious and they live double lives.
50:21
Speaker 8: If you look at all his notes, those are the
50:23
Speaker 8: notes of an architecture. Right. Architects are very meticulous and
50:27
Speaker 8: they have to learn from their last architectural drawings.
50:31
Speaker 7: So when you look at that, this is a checklist
50:33
Speaker 7: police scanners. He had probably.
50:36
Speaker 8: Thought about how what he was going to say if
50:38
Speaker 8: somebody like myself pulled him over in the middle of
50:41
Speaker 8: the night on Ocean Park, where I'm sure he had
50:43
Speaker 8: a very well reasoned excuse.
50:45
Speaker 7: So this is this is a sadistic maniac. And we
50:49
Speaker 7: can scratch our head from now to eternity trying.
50:52
Speaker 8: To figure out what how a sociopath thinks, how they
50:55
Speaker 8: get some side of type of enjoyment from mutilating people.
50:59
Speaker 8: It's not on our radar screens. It's certainly not on
51:01
Speaker 8: my radar screen. So yeah, I Fortunately for me, I've
51:04
Speaker 8: been doing this stuff so long, I have a way
51:07
Speaker 8: of just isolating those thoughts and the emotions. I'm kind
51:12
Speaker 8: of emotionally detached from a lot of this, so a
51:15
Speaker 8: lot of it I frankly don't even listen to as
51:18
Speaker 8: I just kind of avoid it, stick with the facts
51:21
Speaker 8: of the case.
51:22
Speaker 7: But yeah, he's a monster, period.
51:25
Speaker 1: Karen Stark, what advice, what words of consolation or hope
51:33
Speaker 1: can you give the victims' families?
51:37
Speaker 11: Well, the best you could do in a case like this, Nancy,
51:40
Speaker 11: is to actually talk to them, advise them to get help,
51:45
Speaker 11: to keep talking it out, because it really makes a difference.
51:49
Speaker 11: And it's really hard because they're aware of the torture.
51:53
Speaker 11: They just like you, right, they can't fathom it, and
51:56
Speaker 11: they can put themselves in the place of the victim,
52:00
Speaker 11: which is terrible to imagine what they went through. And
52:04
Speaker 11: here he does this because he gets a charge out
52:08
Speaker 11: of him. That smirk is showing you how much he
52:12
Speaker 11: enjoys this. And there is no doubt in my mind
52:15
Speaker 11: that he pleaded guilty because he didn't want to go
52:18
Speaker 11: over the details. He has very specific details that he
52:23
Speaker 11: wants to keep to himself and maybe share with the
52:26
Speaker 11: FBI so he can get the fame that he's been
52:29
Speaker 11: looking for. But this is a monster, and so what
52:34
Speaker 11: do you say to the family is except be with
52:38
Speaker 11: each other, keep talking about it. You must go on
52:42
Speaker 11: with your lives for the sake of the.
52:44
Speaker 4: Victims, confess Long Island serial killer Rex Chuerman finally broke
52:47
Speaker 4: his silence as the family members of his victims gave
52:50
Speaker 4: victim impact statements at the long awaited sentencing of the
52:53
Speaker 4: man who terrorized the Giggle Becheria for decades. In April,
52:57
Speaker 4: he pleaded guilty to killing seven women, Jessica to Tailor,
53:00
Speaker 4: Melissa Bartholemy Megan Waterman, Maureen brainer Barnes, Amber Lind Costello,
53:05
Speaker 4: Valerie Mack and Sandra Castillo. He also admitted to killing
53:08
Speaker 4: an eighth woman, Karen Brigatta, though he was not formally
53:11
Speaker 4: charged in her death. Hureman admitted strangling all of the
53:14
Speaker 4: victims to death during a seventeen year span beginning in
53:17
Speaker 4: nineteen ninety three, before the judge sentenced him to three
53:20
Speaker 4: life terms without the possibility of parole in an additional
53:23
Speaker 4: twenty five years to life for each of the murders
53:25
Speaker 4: of the seven women. He asked Hureman if he wished
53:27
Speaker 4: to address the court. Hureman said, there are no words
53:31
Speaker 4: I could say. I was responsible for what was said
53:33
Speaker 4: in this courtroom today. The words I would say have
53:36
Speaker 4: no meaning, and I'm going to leave it there. After
53:39
Speaker 4: questioning if Hureman was even a man at all, the
53:42
Speaker 4: judge said, you're a coward. Get him out of here,
53:45
Speaker 4: which brought cheers from victims' families, who chanted ogre as
53:49
Speaker 4: the killer was led away.
53:50
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace Crime Stories, signing off goodbye friend,