Latest / Wired To Hunt Podcast / Ep. 691: Foundations - Go Where You Shouldn't

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Ep. 691: Foundations - Go Where You Shouldn't · Wired To Hunt Podcast

0:01
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt Foundations podcast, your guide
0:05
Speaker 1: to the fundamentals of better deer hunting, presented by first Light,
0:09
Speaker 1: creating proven versatile hunting apparel for the stand, saddle or blind.
0:14
Speaker 1: First Light Go Farther, Stay Longer, and now your host,
0:19
Speaker 1: Tony Peterson.
0:20
Speaker 2: Hey, everyone, welcome to the Wire to Hunt Foundation's podcast,
0:23
Speaker 2: which is brought to you by first Light. I'm your
0:25
Speaker 2: house Tony Peterson, and today I'm going to talk about
0:27
Speaker 2: going where you shouldn't, whether that's in the White Tail
0:30
Speaker 2: Woods or the Elk Mountains or wherever. I know I've
0:41
Speaker 2: mentioned this many many times, but it's worth bringing up
0:44
Speaker 2: again that hunting content that you've been consuming for much
0:47
Speaker 2: of your life came from people who don't operate in
0:50
Speaker 2: the same world as you. They hunt unbelievable spots and
0:54
Speaker 2: they either have control over them or they pay for
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Speaker 2: the opportunity to hunt where someone else controls the pressure.
1:00
Speaker 2: In a lot of content, the narrative that comes out
1:02
Speaker 2: of these folks is pretty much an echo chamber of
1:04
Speaker 2: do this, don't do that. But the truth is I
1:08
Speaker 2: kind of have to do things differently from them. One
1:11
Speaker 2: of those things, but I think will make you a
1:13
Speaker 2: better hunter is to go where you normally wouldn't go,
1:16
Speaker 2: which is what this episode is all about. Earlier this summer,
1:30
Speaker 2: I filmed a fishing show with the one and only
1:32
Speaker 2: Andy May. During our shoot, I happen to catch a
1:35
Speaker 2: personal best smally in a spot that has just kind
1:39
Speaker 2: of come on a radar, on a lake that I
1:41
Speaker 2: fish more than anybody of water ever except for maybe
1:44
Speaker 2: the Mississippi River. I honestly don't know really why the
1:48
Speaker 2: spot holds big fish, but I have some ideas. Depth
1:52
Speaker 2: definitely plays a role in it. I find differences in
1:55
Speaker 2: small mouth concentrations and quality of fish, often in places
1:58
Speaker 2: that are a foot or two deeper than the surrounding areas.
2:02
Speaker 2: Food is another one. I know that the minos end
2:04
Speaker 2: up getting pushed up against the shore there when the
2:07
Speaker 2: wind is blown just right, but you know that happens
2:10
Speaker 2: in a lot of spots on big lakes. So it's
2:12
Speaker 2: kind of still a mystery I'm trying to figure out.
2:14
Speaker 2: But it's also a good reminder that on a specific
2:16
Speaker 2: lake where I'm real confident in my knowledge, I still
2:19
Speaker 2: miss things all the time, and things are always changing,
2:23
Speaker 2: So maybe that spot wasn't good five or ten years ago,
2:26
Speaker 2: or maybe I just missed it, maybe something changed and
2:29
Speaker 2: made it better. I think this is possible because some
2:32
Speaker 2: of the normal rock piles that usually host schools of
2:34
Speaker 2: Brownies are getting a lot more pressure than they used to.
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Speaker 2: Now are bast smart enough to move somewhere where they
2:40
Speaker 2: get harass less. Probably maybe I don't know. I know
2:45
Speaker 2: deer moved to places where they get harrass less. In fact,
2:48
Speaker 2: that's one of the biggest drivers in their daily habits.
2:51
Speaker 2: It's something that's super relevant right now too, considering how
2:55
Speaker 2: many states are opening up their white Tail season over
2:57
Speaker 2: the next few weeks, if they haven't already. Let me
3:01
Speaker 2: lay this out in an orderly fashion so you understand
3:03
Speaker 2: where I'm going with this episode. As the season opens up,
3:07
Speaker 2: we all dive into our opening week or early season
3:10
Speaker 2: plan on an individual level. Great, that's great, how do
3:15
Speaker 2: your best field edge stands and try to arrow that
3:17
Speaker 2: dumb buck that just hasn't caught onto the pressure yet.
3:20
Speaker 2: But understand this, the pressure that shows up opening weekend
3:24
Speaker 2: and honestly the weeks before, as hunters get the itch
3:27
Speaker 2: to hang stands and check cameras and just get in
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Speaker 2: the woods, is going to change the deer right as
3:32
Speaker 2: you think they should be most predictable. Now you've put
3:36
Speaker 2: in all this work, at least I hope you have
3:38
Speaker 2: to get yourself ready for filling an early season tag,
3:41
Speaker 2: and now you're going to read the conditions and act
3:44
Speaker 2: on that plan. But the wild cards are many. If
3:47
Speaker 2: you don't have a sweet, tightly controlled place to hunt,
3:51
Speaker 2: some plans will work out for hunters, but mostly they won't.
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Speaker 2: That means the fervor of opening week will come and
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Speaker 2: go and the reality of the season will set in.
4:00
Speaker 2: This is just like when you go on your first
4:02
Speaker 2: day of rutcation, say on November first, and you're so
4:06
Speaker 2: excited you peech just a little bit on the front
4:09
Speaker 2: of your cameo boxer's Mark Kenyan style. But after that
4:13
Speaker 2: first all day sit reality kicks you right upside the
4:16
Speaker 2: head like a drunk muytai fighter at a dive bar.
4:19
Speaker 2: As soon as you're done counting tweetybirds, your job is
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Speaker 2: to figure out the deer, and that isn't something you
4:25
Speaker 2: can do by listening to advice from people who don't
4:27
Speaker 2: have to worry about a hunting pressure or limited hunting
4:30
Speaker 2: time or not having very much hunting skill. So how
4:34
Speaker 2: do you do this. One of the ways is you
4:37
Speaker 2: go where you aren't supposed to. You're going to have
4:40
Speaker 2: to go find the fresh sign somewhere. You're going to
4:42
Speaker 2: have to look around and accept the fact that the
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Speaker 2: spot you thought was the spot of all spots, the
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Speaker 2: one you just knew you'd kill your number one hitlister
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Speaker 2: in has gone the way of the old dinosaur. Now,
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Speaker 2: this is so much easier to preach than it is
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Speaker 2: to practice. I deal with this in my life all
5:00
Speaker 2: the time, and I'm constantly fighting the patterns of my behavior.
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Speaker 2: I do have one benefit in all of this. It's
5:08
Speaker 2: that I've been wrong about deer a lot, and fish
5:11
Speaker 2: and turkeys and elk and squirrels and marriage and all
5:14
Speaker 2: sorts of fun stuff. If you haunt enough to be
5:16
Speaker 2: wrong a lot, you realize that you have less to
5:19
Speaker 2: lose than you think, and more to gain from breaking
5:22
Speaker 2: some of the hard and fast rules that most hunters follow.
5:26
Speaker 2: But you have to acknowledge two things. The first is
5:30
Speaker 2: that you're going to do things you think you probably shouldn't.
5:33
Speaker 2: The second is that it's not going to happen quickly.
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Speaker 2: Let's start with the first part. What do I mean
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Speaker 2: by going where you shouldn't. Well, isn't that self explanatory?
5:44
Speaker 2: You have to go walk that swamp edge, You have
5:46
Speaker 2: to go into what you think is the primo betting area.
5:49
Speaker 2: Sometimes you have to go where you can learn something.
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Speaker 2: If you're thinking, man, this guy's an idiot, I'm not
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Speaker 2: walking into the best spot on the thirty acres I
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Speaker 2: hunt only a few days after the season opener. Let
6:00
Speaker 2: me remind you of something. I've been begging you to
6:03
Speaker 2: find more spots to hunt. Why didn't you? Huh wouldn't
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Speaker 2: one more spot make a world of difference? So you
6:09
Speaker 2: wouldn't be so scared to go? Figure out why you're
6:11
Speaker 2: listening to just another moron. It's spout hunting advice instead
6:14
Speaker 2: of taking your freshly killed and kate buckhead to the taxidermist.
6:19
Speaker 2: Even you, mister, I only hunt thirty acres. Guy can
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Speaker 2: go where you think you shouldn't. The way I do
6:26
Speaker 2: it for those small properties is this, I wait until
6:29
Speaker 2: I have the conditions working in my favor. The first
6:33
Speaker 2: is that I know I won't be able to hunt
6:35
Speaker 2: that property for at least a few days. I want
6:37
Speaker 2: to go in when I know I'm going to be
6:39
Speaker 2: somewhere else for a little while, you know, right before
6:42
Speaker 2: a trip or a long stretch of dumb work where
6:44
Speaker 2: there won't be any hunting to do. The second is
6:48
Speaker 2: I want to go in there in the midday, preferably
6:50
Speaker 2: in the rain. The midday part is easy enough to do,
6:53
Speaker 2: especially if I plan to do a morning hunt on
6:55
Speaker 2: one of those small properties. The rain isn't as easy
6:58
Speaker 2: to come by, but it helped if you can get it.
7:01
Speaker 2: I'll also just take a good steady wind to at
7:03
Speaker 2: least cover up some of the sound and some of
7:05
Speaker 2: my movement. Then it's just a matter of guessing on
7:09
Speaker 2: where the deer probably went if they weren't where I
7:13
Speaker 2: expected them to be. I see this a lot in
7:16
Speaker 2: my neck of the woods, where the deer starts really
7:18
Speaker 2: tuck into the edges of the wetlands once the season opens.
7:21
Speaker 2: They are often a mix of soft and hard edges
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Speaker 2: close together, and it's consistently some of the best betting
7:27
Speaker 2: cover also functions as staging cover, where those early season
7:31
Speaker 2: bucks will often leave their first rubs of the year.
7:34
Speaker 2: The overall goal is just take a quick look around
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Speaker 2: while causing as minimal damage as I can, yet still
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Speaker 2: trying to learn something if you are interested in this
7:44
Speaker 2: and are a small property hunter, or hell, if you
7:47
Speaker 2: hunt huge properties, this works too. You should think small
7:51
Speaker 2: when it comes to hunting spots. Don't think of a
7:53
Speaker 2: whole ridge or the whole edge of the cattail. SIU
7:57
Speaker 2: think about the exact spot the bucks should want to
8:00
Speaker 2: be the most. Then go find it. Take that walk. Yeah,
8:05
Speaker 2: you'll leave scent, you'll probably spook some deer, but you
8:08
Speaker 2: should learn something. And I'm going to get into this later,
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Speaker 2: but remember this isn't a short game. Even though you
8:14
Speaker 2: might find some sign worth going mobile on right now,
8:18
Speaker 2: you're also building up some knowledge on what the deer
8:20
Speaker 2: do as soon as they know they are getting bow
8:22
Speaker 2: hunted again. That knowledge comes into play for the rest
8:26
Speaker 2: of your hunting life on that property you hunt right
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Speaker 2: now and others you'll hunt in the future. Look at
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Speaker 2: it this way. Even if you've been hunting the same
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Speaker 2: spot for fifty years, there are things you don't know.
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Speaker 2: There are deer spots you've never understood in those five decades,
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Speaker 2: and there are countless things that are different this year
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Speaker 2: from twenty five years ago, as well as one season ago.
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Speaker 2: There's always something to learn. I feel this every time
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Speaker 2: I start setting up for the new season, and then
9:03
Speaker 2: really understand it once I start hunting. But it's also
9:06
Speaker 2: a motivator to get out figure some new things out.
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Speaker 2: Sometimes I have a hard time with that though, for
9:13
Speaker 2: a couple of reasons. One is that I get scared
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Speaker 2: and lazy. I don't want to spook dear, and sometimes
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Speaker 2: I just don't want to go do extra work for
9:20
Speaker 2: something that should be fun, so I trick myself into
9:24
Speaker 2: doing it. This often means I pick up a shotgun,
9:27
Speaker 2: a round up my dogs. Maybe I'm gonna go jump
9:28
Speaker 2: shoot a few woodies. Maybe I grab my twenty two
9:31
Speaker 2: and I'm gonna go hunt squirrels for a little bit.
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Speaker 2: If there is something else to hunt, I find it
9:36
Speaker 2: easier to go where I think I shouldn't. Now I
9:39
Speaker 2: know this is sort of a contradiction because I told
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Speaker 2: you not to make an impact, but again, you got
9:46
Speaker 2: to figure out how to do this. It's more important
9:48
Speaker 2: than not doing it. So if that's what it takes,
9:50
Speaker 2: go do it. It's kind of like how it's easier
9:53
Speaker 2: to go winter scouting if you have the possibility to
9:55
Speaker 2: find a shed antler or two, or how it's not
9:58
Speaker 2: so bad to hike a couple of miles deep into
10:00
Speaker 2: an elk drainage if you know you have a couple
10:02
Speaker 2: of blunt tip arrows in your quiver and really high
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Speaker 2: odds of bumping into those delicious and oh so stupid
10:08
Speaker 2: mountain dwelling grouse. You know, the lowly woodcock, the worst
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Speaker 2: eating and easiest to hit game bird I've ever encountered.
10:15
Speaker 2: And yes, I know you'll send me some nasty emails
10:17
Speaker 2: on how tasty they are and how they are the
10:19
Speaker 2: supreme challenge for real wingshooters, even though you're wrong, has
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Speaker 2: probably led to more accidental big woods deer hotspots for
10:27
Speaker 2: me than any other activity, aside probably from winter scouting,
10:32
Speaker 2: which I think is a big woods hunter's best friend.
10:35
Speaker 2: The thing is, woodcock hunting is fun, especially if you've
10:38
Speaker 2: got a puppy and you want them to learn the
10:40
Speaker 2: ways of game birds without dealing with roosters that will
10:42
Speaker 2: run them to death or the randomness of rough grouse
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Speaker 2: In the early thick woods. Woodcock are predictable. They feed
10:49
Speaker 2: in low wet areas, the kind of areas that bucks
10:52
Speaker 2: on public land often retreat to when the masses show
10:55
Speaker 2: up with their bows and crossbows ready to roll the
10:59
Speaker 2: routes I take through the woods to shoot a few
11:00
Speaker 2: of those warner meters as the routes I need to
11:03
Speaker 2: take to often figure out where the bucks are living.
11:06
Speaker 2: This is one of my favorite things to do when
11:08
Speaker 2: I have time and several thousand acres of national forest
11:11
Speaker 2: to hunt, although I will do it on a smaller
11:14
Speaker 2: private parcel too. The truth is it's just something I
11:17
Speaker 2: enjoy doing enough that I'll sand bag a little bit
11:20
Speaker 2: of potential deer success now to do it. But even
11:23
Speaker 2: that's not entirely true, because walking where I think woodcock
11:27
Speaker 2: might be has led to an awful lot of deer.
11:30
Speaker 2: Like I said a few years ago, I spent quite
11:33
Speaker 2: a bit of time on a large parcel of land
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Speaker 2: in northern Wisconsin hunting deer, grouse, woodcock, and catch it
11:38
Speaker 2: a few brook trout throughout September and October. I pretty
11:42
Speaker 2: much target all those animals and fish. At some point,
11:45
Speaker 2: and as the rut drew closer, I switched mostly to deer,
11:48
Speaker 2: but I hunted spots I found four weeks earlier while
11:51
Speaker 2: woodcock hunting, because that took me into places I needed
11:54
Speaker 2: to see to have a better deer plan throughout the season.
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Speaker 2: Some of the spots I've found this way have become
12:00
Speaker 2: season after season places that I always check and more
12:04
Speaker 2: often than not hunt at some point. Now, this is
12:07
Speaker 2: a different strategy than the low impact style so many
12:10
Speaker 2: people preach. But the truth is, if you hunt pressure ground,
12:14
Speaker 2: the deer used to some impact. They are used to
12:17
Speaker 2: people going into areas and leaving scent all around and
12:19
Speaker 2: generally making their lives more stressful. Now, you might think
12:22
Speaker 2: you can shortcut this whole thing and be real smart
12:25
Speaker 2: by running trail cameras, but that's a tall order. Sure,
12:29
Speaker 2: if you have one trail or one tight spot that
12:31
Speaker 2: you can run a camera on and figure something out, great.
12:34
Speaker 2: Think about it this way. What if the property you
12:36
Speaker 2: hunt has just one ten acre swamp on it. There
12:40
Speaker 2: might be dozens of trails leading into and out of it.
12:43
Speaker 2: There are hundreds of yards of inside and outside edges
12:47
Speaker 2: to hunt on that little swamp. How many cameras would
12:50
Speaker 2: you have to run to get a pattern on the
12:51
Speaker 2: deer going in and out of it? Probably more than
12:54
Speaker 2: you own. Now, what can you learn by taking one
12:57
Speaker 2: or two laps around and through it will be quite
13:00
Speaker 2: a bit. Some of it will be actionable in the
13:03
Speaker 2: short term, but a lot of it will be actionable
13:05
Speaker 2: in the long term. Now, of course, running cameras around
13:08
Speaker 2: it all season long might give you a hell of
13:10
Speaker 2: a glimpse into what you should do next season, So
13:12
Speaker 2: there is that. But I still think there is such
13:15
Speaker 2: a benefit to finding sign in person and taking note
13:18
Speaker 2: of the deer that you jump and really looking at
13:20
Speaker 2: the land and how the deer use it or how
13:22
Speaker 2: they heloc use it or whatever. The main takeaway to
13:26
Speaker 2: this is that you can't be afraid to break the
13:28
Speaker 2: rules a little bit. I mean the rules of the
13:31
Speaker 2: hunting industry, not your state rigs. Just to be clear,
13:34
Speaker 2: the rules that others follow apply to their hunting situation,
13:37
Speaker 2: not yours. And honestly, if the generally accepted hunting rules
13:41
Speaker 2: that came from the hunting industry worked so well, it
13:45
Speaker 2: wouldn't be so damn hard for so many of us
13:47
Speaker 2: to consistently fill our tags. Yet it is think about that.
13:51
Speaker 2: I want you to think about this as well. As
13:53
Speaker 2: you're opening week, plan unravels and you see how it's
13:56
Speaker 2: really going to take shape. Maybe that bachelor group you've
13:59
Speaker 2: been glassing all summer sticks to the pattern and you're
14:01
Speaker 2: good to go. That's great, But if not, what's next.
14:04
Speaker 2: Maybe the best way to learn this is by going
14:06
Speaker 2: elk hunting, which is a topic I covered a few
14:09
Speaker 2: weeks ago. Elk will teach you things about how quickly
14:12
Speaker 2: gain can be here today and gone tomorrow, to force
14:15
Speaker 2: you to keep an eye on the clock because you'll
14:17
Speaker 2: be on limited time. They'll remind you pretty much daily.
14:21
Speaker 2: But how if you're not really right around them, you're
14:24
Speaker 2: in for long, slow, frustrating, boring days. White tails will
14:28
Speaker 2: teach you the same thing if you learn to ignore
14:31
Speaker 2: the reality that you do have a long ish season
14:34
Speaker 2: in which to encounter them. They'll teach you that lesson
14:37
Speaker 2: if you're willing to be honest about the gaps in
14:39
Speaker 2: your knowledge on any given property, and your willingness, often
14:42
Speaker 2: too your own detriment to keep slapping the ass of
14:45
Speaker 2: that dead horse you're trying to ride when it's clear
14:47
Speaker 2: that things have changed and then deer have left you behind.
14:51
Speaker 2: You don't have to buy a well bred lab puppy
14:53
Speaker 2: in a little twenty eight gage to woodcock hunt to
14:56
Speaker 2: do this. You don't have to go hunt squirrels in
14:58
Speaker 2: the same oaks that you're dear feet under you don't
15:01
Speaker 2: have to trick yourself into jump shooting some teal on
15:03
Speaker 2: a series of ponds hidden deep in a national force.
15:06
Speaker 2: But you should look at what it takes to get
15:08
Speaker 2: yourself out there, learning and looking around as that season progresses.
15:14
Speaker 2: This is the best way to stay proactive in my opinion.
15:17
Speaker 2: And if you need to pair this strategy with some
15:19
Speaker 2: fresh trail camera sets, great. It's hard to gather too
15:24
Speaker 2: much deer intel, at least in my experience, But my
15:27
Speaker 2: main point is this, don't be like other folks. Don't
15:32
Speaker 2: put all your faith into your early season plan without
15:35
Speaker 2: acknowledging that if it doesn't work well, you need to
15:38
Speaker 2: do some work. Don't just say to yourself, well, things
15:41
Speaker 2: will get back to normal as soon as the wreck
15:43
Speaker 2: gets closer, because then you'll sit out so much of
15:46
Speaker 2: the season on a long odds bet instead of getting
15:49
Speaker 2: out there and adding to your baseline of property knowledge
15:52
Speaker 2: and your overall understanding of just what deer might do
15:56
Speaker 2: at any given point of the season. And don't forget
16:00
Speaker 2: to come back next week because I'm going to talk
16:02
Speaker 2: about shot angles, dear body language, and how to mostly
16:06
Speaker 2: deflate lungs or puncture dear hearts when you draw your bow.
16:12
Speaker 2: That's it. I'm Tony Peterson. This has been the Wire
16:14
Speaker 2: to Hunt Foundation's podcast, which is brought to you by
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16:19
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