Latest / Adventures in the Heart of Children's Book Authors Podcast / How Children's Books Teach Kindess (A Powerful Storytelling Approach)

Transcript

How Children's Books Teach Kindess (A Powerful Storytelling Approach) · Adventures in the Heart of Children's Book Authors Podcast

4:11
Yeah.
4:12
My
4:12
name
4:12
is
4:12
Chris
4:12
McKenna,
4:13
and
4:13
my
4:14
children's
4:14
books
4:15
are
4:15
Olivia
4:15
May
4:16
and
4:16
Her
4:16
Scuba
4:16
Diving
4:17
Day
4:17
and
4:18
Captain
4:18
Olivia
4:19
and
4:19
the
4:19
Treasure
4:19
of
4:20
Kindness.
4:21
Thanks,
4:21
Chris,
4:22
for
4:22
appearing
4:22
on
4:22
the
4:22
Adventures
4:23
in
4:23
the
4:23
Heart
4:23
of
4:24
Children's
4:24
Book
4:24
Authors
4:25
podcast.
4:26
Oh,
4:26
my
4:26
pleasure.
4:27
Thank
4:27
you,
4:27
Rick.
4:28
Chris
4:28
has
4:28
mentioned
4:29
he
4:29
has
4:29
written
4:29
several
4:30
children's
4:31
books,
4:31
and
4:31
today
4:32
we're
4:32
going
4:32
to
4:32
focus
4:33
on
4:33
his
4:33
book,
4:34
Captain
4:34
Olivia
4:36
and
4:36
the
4:36
Treasure
4:37
of
4:37
Kindness.
4:37
And
4:38
I
4:38
look
4:38
forward
4:38
to
4:38
our
4:39
conversation.
4:40
Chris,
4:41
before
4:41
we
4:41
get
4:41
into
4:42
the
4:42
details
4:42
of
4:43
your
4:43
book,
4:43
can
4:43
you
4:44
tell
4:44
us
4:45
what
4:45
being
4:45
a
4:45
children's
4:46
book
4:46
author
4:47
means
4:47
to
4:47
you?
4:49
What
4:49
it
4:49
means
4:49
to
4:49
me,
4:50
it
4:50
will
4:50
be
4:51
a
4:51
connection
4:51
to
4:52
my
4:52
grandchildren.
4:53
I'm
4:53
writing
4:53
these
4:54
to
4:55
my
4:55
grandchildren
4:56
and
4:56
as
4:56
something
4:57
that
4:57
I
4:57
can
4:57
leave
4:58
them
4:58
when
4:58
I've
4:59
passed
5:00
from
5:00
this
5:00
world
5:01
that
5:01
they
5:01
can
5:01
look
5:02
back
5:02
on
5:02
and
5:02
say,
5:03
oh,
5:03
my
5:03
grandfather
5:04
did
5:04
this
5:04
for
5:05
me
5:05
and
5:05
this
5:05
is
5:06
me.
5:06
And
5:06
I'm
5:07
hoping
5:07
that
5:07
those
5:07
stories
5:08
can
5:08
then
5:08
weave
5:09
into
5:09
reality
5:10
somehow
5:11
as
5:11
they
5:11
grow
5:12
and
5:12
get
5:12
older.
5:13
How
5:13
many
5:14
grandchildren
5:14
do
5:15
you
5:15
have,
5:15
Chris?
5:15
Just
5:16
have
5:16
the
5:16
one
5:16
right
5:16
now.
5:17
We're
5:17
keeping
5:17
our
5:18
fingers
5:18
crossed
5:18
for
5:19
a
5:19
few
5:19
more
5:19
here
5:20
pretty
5:20
soon,
5:21
so
5:21
we'll
5:22
see.
5:22
And
5:22
is
5:22
it
5:23
a
5:23
granddaughter?
5:24
It's
5:24
granddaughter,
5:25
yeah.
5:25
Is
5:25
her
5:25
name
5:26
Olivia?
5:26
Her
5:27
name
5:27
is
5:27
Olivia
5:27
May.
5:28
So
5:28
she
5:29
is
5:29
the
5:29
star
5:29
of
5:30
these
5:30
two
5:30
books.
5:30
That's
5:30
terrific.
5:31
Besides
5:31
myself,
5:33
I've
5:33
talked
5:33
to
5:33
a
5:34
few
5:34
grandfathers,
5:35
but
5:35
it's.
5:36
It's
5:36
fun
5:36
because
5:37
I
5:37
don't
5:38
know
5:38
if
5:38
it's
5:38
a
5:38
grandfather
5:39
thing
5:39
or
5:39
whatever,
5:40
but
5:41
we
5:41
tend
5:41
to
5:41
get
5:41
engaged
5:42
with
5:42
our
5:43
grandchildren
5:43
more.
5:44
I
5:45
came
5:45
to
5:45
children's
5:46
book
5:46
writing
5:46
because
5:47
of
5:47
my
5:47
oldest
5:47
granddaughter,
5:49
and
5:50
similar
5:50
to
5:50
what's
5:51
going
5:51
on
5:51
in
5:52
your
5:52
life,
5:52
I
5:53
know
5:53
we're
5:53
going
5:53
to
5:53
have
5:53
fun
5:54
talking
5:54
about
5:55
this
5:55
because
5:55
we're
5:56
cut
5:56
from
5:56
the
5:56
same
5:57
children's
5:58
book
5:58
author
5:58
cloth.
5:59
Chris,
6:00
our
6:00
oldest
6:00
granddaughter,
6:01
came
6:02
and
6:02
she
6:03
was
6:03
the
6:03
only
6:03
one
6:04
for
6:04
five
6:04
years.
6:04
And
6:05
we
6:05
thought,
6:05
oh,
6:05
my
6:06
God,
6:07
we're
6:07
never
6:07
going
6:07
to
6:07
get
6:08
any
6:08
more
6:08
grandchildren.
6:09
And
6:09
I
6:10
think
6:10
that's
6:10
why
6:10
Kira
6:11
and
6:11
I
6:11
bonded
6:11
so
6:12
much.
6:12
And
6:13
then
6:13
all
6:13
of
6:13
a
6:13
sudden,
6:14
we
6:14
had
6:14
four
6:15
more
6:15
within
6:15
a
6:15
short
6:16
period
6:16
of
6:16
time.
6:17
Oh,
6:17
wow.
6:18
So,
6:18
yeah,
6:19
just
6:19
get
6:19
ready.
6:20
Yeah,
6:20
I
6:20
have
6:20
a
6:21
plan
6:21
B
6:21
in
6:21
case
6:22
that
6:22
happens
6:22
for
6:22
me.
6:23
Curious
6:24
about
6:24
what's
6:25
the
6:25
inspiration
6:25
behind
6:26
your
6:26
books?
6:27
The
6:27
inspiration
6:28
is
6:28
the
6:29
birth
6:29
of
6:29
my
6:29
granddaughter
6:30
and
6:30
wanting
6:31
to
6:31
find,
6:32
as
6:32
I
6:32
mentioned
6:33
before,
6:33
some
6:34
way
6:34
to.
6:35
To
6:35
leave
6:36
something
6:36
for
6:36
her
6:36
and
6:37
hopefully
6:38
foreshadow
6:39
something
6:39
in
6:39
the
6:40
future.
6:40
You
6:40
just
6:41
could
6:41
have
6:41
set
6:41
up
6:41
a
6:42
educational
6:43
fund
6:43
or
6:43
something.
6:44
Seriously,
6:45
Most
6:45
grandparents
6:46
don't
6:46
go
6:46
running
6:47
out
6:47
and
6:47
writing
6:48
a
6:48
children's
6:48
book.
6:49
What
6:49
was
6:49
the
6:49
motivation
6:50
here
6:51
to
6:52
put
6:52
it
6:52
into
6:52
action?
6:53
Yeah,
6:53
so
6:54
I
6:54
think
6:54
most
6:54
People
6:55
fall
6:55
into
6:56
one
6:56
of
6:56
two
6:56
categories,
6:57
Rick.
6:57
I
6:58
think
6:58
they,
6:58
they
6:58
fall
6:58
into
6:59
more
6:59
of
6:59
the
7:00
analytical.
7:00
Is
7:01
it
7:01
the
7:01
left
7:01
brain
7:02
side
7:03
and
7:03
then
7:03
there's
7:04
the
7:04
creative
7:04
types
7:05
and
7:05
the
7:05
right
7:05
brain
7:06
side?
7:06
I
7:06
may
7:06
have
7:07
that
7:07
backwards,
7:08
I
7:08
don't
7:08
know.
7:08
But
7:09
I'm
7:09
one
7:09
of
7:09
those
7:10
unique
7:10
individuals
7:11
that
7:11
falls
7:12
into
7:12
the
7:12
middle.
7:14
So
7:14
while
7:14
my
7:15
9
7:15
to
7:15
5
7:15
job
7:16
is
7:16
very
7:16
analytical
7:17
and
7:18
it's
7:18
that,
7:18
that
7:19
type
7:19
of
7:19
work,
7:20
there's
7:20
a
7:20
big
7:21
side
7:21
of
7:21
me
7:21
that
7:22
is
7:22
into
7:23
the
7:23
creative
7:24
world,
7:25
whether
7:26
that's
7:26
photography
7:27
or
7:27
video
7:28
or
7:29
I've
7:29
dabbled
7:30
in
7:30
some
7:30
painting
7:30
and
7:30
things
7:31
of
7:31
that
7:31
sort.
7:32
This
7:32
gets
7:33
me
7:33
into
7:34
more,
7:34
more
7:34
of
7:34
a
7:34
creative
7:35
side
7:35
and
7:35
it
7:36
scratches
7:36
that
7:36
itch
7:36
for
7:37
myself
7:37
as
7:38
well
7:38
as
7:38
leaving
7:39
something
7:39
for
7:40
the
7:41
grandkids
7:41
later
7:41
on.
7:42
Was
7:42
this
7:42
something
7:43
that
7:43
you
7:43
had
7:44
in
7:45
the
7:45
back
7:45
of
7:45
your
7:45
mind
7:46
for
7:46
a
7:46
while
7:47
or
7:47
did
7:47
it
7:47
need
7:48
that
7:48
birth
7:49
of
7:49
your
7:49
first
7:49
grandchild
7:50
to
7:50
get
7:51
you
7:51
started?
7:52
Yeah,
7:52
so
7:52
can
7:52
I
7:52
say
7:53
both?
7:53
I
7:53
actually
7:54
wrote
7:54
my
7:54
first
7:54
short
7:55
story
7:55
when
7:55
I
7:55
was
7:55
like
7:56
9
7:56
years
7:56
old,
7:57
way
7:57
back
7:58
in
7:58
elementary
7:58
school.
7:59
It
7:59
died
8:00
in
8:00
elementary
8:00
school
8:01
for
8:01
a
8:01
couple
8:01
of
8:01
different
8:02
reasons.
8:02
But
8:03
over
8:03
my
8:03
adult
8:04
life
8:04
I'd
8:04
started
8:05
and
8:05
stopped
8:05
writing
8:06
a
8:06
couple
8:07
of
8:07
stories
8:07
a
8:08
few
8:08
times
8:08
and
8:08
just
8:09
never
8:09
moved
8:10
them
8:10
past
8:11
maybe
8:11
10
8:11
or
8:12
15%
8:12
of
8:12
completion.
8:14
When
8:14
my
8:15
daughter
8:15
announced
8:15
that
8:15
she
8:16
was
8:16
pregnant
8:16
in,
8:17
I
8:17
think
8:17
that
8:17
was
8:17
the
8:18
summer
8:18
of
8:18
24,
8:19
I
8:20
think
8:20
it
8:20
would
8:20
be
8:20
okay.
8:21
It's.
8:21
Something
8:21
hit.
8:22
It
8:22
was
8:23
like
8:23
being
8:23
struck
8:23
by
8:24
a
8:24
lightning
8:24
bolt.
8:24
It
8:25
was
8:25
like,
8:25
oh,
8:26
I
8:27
have
8:27
to
8:27
do
8:27
something.
8:27
I
8:28
have
8:28
to
8:28
write
8:28
something
8:29
for
8:30
this
8:30
grandbaby.
8:31
And
8:32
that
8:32
was
8:32
the,
8:32
the
8:32
start
8:33
of
8:33
that
8:34
and
8:34
that
8:34
was
8:34
the
8:34
motivation
8:35
behind
8:35
that.
8:36
It
8:36
was
8:36
like,
8:36
okay,
8:36
I
8:36
can
8:36
write
8:37
a
8:37
children's
8:37
story.
8:38
I
8:38
had
8:38
two
8:38
kids
8:38
and
8:39
I
8:39
have
8:40
some
8:40
history
8:41
with
8:42
young
8:42
kids.
8:42
Let's,
8:43
let's
8:43
try
8:43
to
8:43
put
8:44
something
8:44
on
8:44
paper
8:45
then
8:45
that
8:46
they
8:46
can
8:46
grow
8:46
into,
8:47
grow
8:47
up
8:47
with
8:47
and
8:48
have
8:48
with
8:48
them
8:48
for
8:48
the
8:49
rest
8:49
of
8:49
their
8:49
lives.
8:50
The
8:50
beautiful
8:50
thing
8:51
about
8:51
it
8:51
too,
8:51
Olivia
8:52
is
8:52
still
8:53
quite
8:53
young.
8:54
Yes,
8:54
turned
8:55
one
8:55
last
8:55
week.
8:56
For
8:57
myself
8:57
it
8:57
was
8:59
similar
8:59
story
9:00
except
9:00
that
9:01
I
9:02
was
9:02
lucky.
9:02
I
9:02
was
9:03
at
9:03
that
9:03
point
9:03
in
9:04
my
9:04
career
9:04
where
9:04
I
9:05
had
9:05
more
9:05
weeks
9:05
holidays
9:06
than
9:06
my
9:07
wife
9:07
and
9:07
my
9:08
daughter
9:09
and
9:09
my
9:09
oldest
9:10
granddaughter
9:11
is
9:11
my
9:11
daughter's
9:12
daughter.
9:13
I
9:13
ended
9:14
up
9:14
getting
9:14
this
9:15
time
9:15
and
9:16
so
9:17
I
9:17
would
9:18
end
9:18
up
9:18
taking
9:18
her
9:19
down
9:19
to
9:19
the
9:19
Rocky
9:20
Mountains
9:21
and
9:21
we
9:21
would
9:22
do
9:22
things
9:23
that
9:24
I
9:24
hadn't
9:24
done
9:24
before.
9:25
So
9:25
we
9:25
would
9:26
go
9:26
horse
9:27
back
9:27
riding
9:27
in
9:28
the
9:28
snow.
9:28
We
9:28
learned
9:29
how
9:29
to
9:29
ski
9:29
together,
9:30
we
9:31
did
9:31
dog
9:31
sledding.
9:32
So
9:32
many
9:33
adventures.
9:34
I
9:34
call
9:35
Kira
9:35
our
9:35
first
9:36
digital
9:36
baby
9:37
because
9:37
every
9:38
moment
9:39
has
9:39
been
9:40
captured
9:40
on
9:40
a
9:40
smartphone.
9:41
The
9:41
neat
9:42
thing
9:42
about
9:42
it
9:42
is
9:43
that
9:43
ultimately
9:44
my
9:44
granddaughter
9:45
is
9:45
the
9:45
one
9:45
who
9:45
convinced
9:46
me,
9:46
because
9:46
she
9:46
said,
9:47
papa,
9:47
we've
9:48
taken
9:48
so
9:49
many
9:49
pictures
9:49
and
9:49
gone
9:50
on
9:50
so
9:50
many
9:50
adventures.
9:51
Can
9:52
we
9:52
write
9:52
a
9:52
story
9:52
about
9:53
these
9:53
adventures?
9:54
And.
9:55
Oh,
9:55
very
9:55
cool.
9:55
That's
9:56
what.
9:56
Yeah.
9:56
I
9:56
can
9:56
see
9:57
with
9:57
you,
9:58
Chris,
9:58
is
9:59
like,
9:59
wow,
10:00
you've
10:00
primed
10:01
the
10:01
pump
10:01
ahead.
10:02
Once
10:02
you
10:02
start
10:02
having
10:03
those
10:03
adventures
10:03
with
10:04
your
10:04
granddaughter.
10:05
Oh,
10:05
yeah.
10:06
It's
10:06
going
10:06
to
10:06
be
10:06
pretty
10:07
incredible.
10:08
Oh,
10:08
yeah.
10:08
And
10:08
it's
10:09
also
10:09
incredible
10:09
that
10:10
you've
10:10
actually
10:10
started
10:11
this
10:11
children's
10:12
book
10:12
series.
10:12
And
10:13
she'll
10:13
grow
10:14
up
10:14
on
10:14
that.
10:15
And
10:16
when
10:16
she
10:16
gets
10:16
to
10:17
that
10:17
age
10:18
where
10:18
you're
10:18
out
10:18
doing
10:19
things
10:19
with
10:19
her,
10:19
you
10:20
know
10:20
that
10:20
4,
10:21
5,
10:21
6,
10:22
before
10:22
she
10:23
starts
10:23
elementary
10:24
school,
10:25
you'll
10:25
be
10:25
going
10:26
out
10:26
on
10:26
these
10:26
adventures.
10:27
And
10:27
then
10:27
all
10:27
of
10:27
a
10:27
sudden,
10:28
watch
10:28
out,
10:28
Chris,
10:29
you're
10:29
going
10:29
to
10:29
get
10:30
hauled
10:31
into
10:31
this
10:31
treasure
10:32
of
10:32
children.
10:32
Oh,
10:33
yeah.
10:33
Yeah.
10:33
And
10:33
I
10:33
think
10:33
to
10:34
kind
10:34
of
10:34
lead
10:34
into
10:34
what
10:34
you
10:35
were
10:35
saying
10:35
with
10:35
your
10:35
granddaughter.
10:36
There
10:36
is
10:36
then
10:38
the
10:38
child,
10:39
your
10:39
grandchild,
10:40
can
10:40
help
10:40
you
10:41
write
10:41
that
10:41
story.
10:42
They
10:43
can
10:43
be
10:43
right
10:44
alongside
10:44
you
10:45
as
10:45
you
10:45
build
10:45
that
10:46
and
10:46
you
10:46
develop
10:46
it
10:47
together.
10:47
And.
10:48
And
10:48
that's
10:48
a.
10:48
That's
10:49
of
10:49
itself
10:50
a
10:50
special
10:50
memory
10:51
that
10:51
you'll
10:51
have
10:51
with
10:51
them
10:51
and
10:52
that
10:52
they'll
10:52
always
10:52
have
10:52
then
10:53
as
10:53
well.
10:54
It's
10:54
true.
10:54
And
10:55
I
10:55
have
10:55
to
10:55
tell
10:55
you,
10:56
we're
10:57
now
10:57
up
10:57
to
10:57
38
10:58
stories
10:58
in
10:58
the
10:58
Adventures
10:59
of
10:59
Caboose,
11:00
the
11:00
Rocky
11:00
Mountain
11:01
Bear,
11:01
which
11:01
is
11:02
our
11:02
first
11:02
book
11:03
right
11:03
here.
11:04
Caboose
11:04
is
11:05
spelled
11:05
with
11:05
a
11:05
K.
11:05
And
11:06
that's
11:06
because
11:07
my
11:08
first
11:08
granddaughter,
11:09
her
11:09
name
11:09
is
11:09
Kira,
11:10
which
11:10
starts
11:10
with
11:11
a
11:11
K.
11:11
That
11:12
triggered
11:12
the
11:12
whole
11:12
thing.
11:13
But
11:13
to
11:13
your
11:13
point,
11:14
very
11:14
insightful,
11:15
because
11:16
with
11:17
my
11:17
other
11:18
four
11:18
grandchildren,
11:19
they've
11:19
helped
11:19
me
11:19
also
11:20
write
11:21
stories.
11:21
And
11:22
the
11:22
neat
11:22
thing
11:22
about
11:23
it,
11:23
and
11:23
I
11:23
throw
11:24
this
11:24
out
11:24
to
11:24
you
11:24
as
11:25
maybe
11:26
some
11:26
advice
11:26
for
11:27
the
11:27
future
11:28
about
11:28
half
11:28
of
11:28
those
11:29
stories
11:29
because
11:30
it's
11:30
costly
11:30
to
11:31
bring
11:31
them
11:31
to
11:32
market,
11:32
because
11:32
you
11:33
have
11:33
to.
11:33
We're
11:33
not
11:34
an
11:34
illustrator,
11:34
so
11:35
we
11:35
have
11:35
to
11:35
pay
11:35
for
11:35
all
11:36
that.
11:36
But
11:36
what
11:37
we
11:37
did
11:37
is
11:38
about
11:38
half
11:39
our
11:39
stories
11:40
we
11:40
recorded
11:41
with
11:41
their
11:42
young
11:42
voices.
11:43
We
11:43
have
11:43
the
11:44
audio
11:44
books
11:44
to
11:45
support
11:45
the
11:45
story.
11:46
Something
11:46
for
11:46
you
11:46
to
11:47
think
11:47
about
11:47
in
11:47
the
11:47
future.
11:48
That
11:48
is
11:48
a
11:49
great
11:49
idea.
11:49
I
11:49
like
11:50
that
11:50
idea.
11:51
I
11:51
think
11:51
I'm
11:51
going
11:52
to
11:52
take
11:52
that
11:52
and
11:52
do
11:52
it.
11:52
Yeah,
11:53
you're
11:53
more
11:53
than
11:53
welcome.
11:54
To
11:54
your
11:54
point,
11:54
they
11:55
all
11:55
helped
11:56
write
11:57
part
11:57
of
11:57
the
11:57
books
11:58
because
11:58
our
11:58
second
11:58
book
11:59
is
11:59
called
11:59
Hijinks
12:00
from
12:00
the
12:00
Big
12:01
Head
12:01
Folk
12:01
Music
12:02
Festival.
12:02
My
12:03
middle
12:03
granddaughter
12:04
was
12:04
a
12:04
co
12:04
author.
12:05
Bailey.
12:06
That
12:06
is
12:06
great.
12:06
And
12:07
that's
12:07
going
12:07
to
12:07
be
12:07
a
12:07
great
12:07
memory
12:08
for
12:08
them
12:08
long
12:09
after
12:09
we're
12:09
all
12:09
gone
12:10
that
12:10
they'll
12:10
be
12:10
able
12:10
to
12:11
look
12:11
back
12:11
on
12:11
and
12:11
just
12:12
say,
12:12
I
12:12
did
12:13
something
12:13
really
12:13
special
12:14
with
12:14
my
12:14
grandpa.
12:15
Pretty
12:15
exciting.
12:15
Chris,
12:16
now
12:16
that
12:16
you've
12:17
got
12:17
two
12:17
books
12:18
and
12:18
I'm
12:18
curious
12:19
about
12:19
this,
12:19
and
12:20
now
12:20
that
12:20
I
12:20
know
12:21
and
12:21
the
12:21
audience
12:22
knows
12:22
that
12:22
your
12:22
granddaughter
12:23
is
12:23
relatively
12:24
young,
12:24
even
12:24
though
12:25
she's
12:25
influenced
12:26
you,
12:27
there's
12:27
much
12:27
more
12:27
to
12:28
come.
12:28
This
12:29
question
12:29
will
12:30
even
12:30
seem
12:30
more
12:31
appropriate.
12:32
I'd
12:33
like
12:33
to
12:33
talk
12:33
to
12:33
you
12:33
about
12:34
your
12:34
children's
12:35
book
12:35
business,
12:36
because
12:36
now
12:36
with
12:36
two
12:37
titles,
12:37
do
12:37
you
12:38
have
12:38
a
12:38
children's
12:38
book
12:39
business
12:39
plan
12:39
or
12:40
what's
12:40
the
12:40
future
12:41
of
12:41
your
12:42
writing
12:43
look
12:43
like?
12:44
Yeah,
12:44
so
12:44
I
12:45
think
12:45
that's
12:45
where
12:45
I'm
12:45
falling
12:46
down
12:46
a
12:46
little
12:46
bit,
12:46
Rick,
12:47
and
12:47
I'm
12:48
trying
12:48
to
12:48
reach
12:49
out
12:49
to
12:49
other
12:49
people
12:50
to
12:50
find
12:50
out
12:50
what's
12:51
worked
12:51
for
12:51
them.
12:52
I've
12:52
run
12:52
my
12:53
own
12:53
small
12:53
business
12:54
in
12:54
the
12:54
past,
12:54
and
12:55
of
12:55
course,
12:56
things
12:56
have
12:56
changed
12:56
a
12:57
lot
12:57
since
12:57
2012
12:59
and
12:59
earlier
12:59
when
13:00
we
13:00
were
13:00
running
13:00
our
13:00
business.
13:01
But
13:01
this
13:01
is
13:01
a
13:01
hard
13:02
business,
13:02
the
13:03
book
13:04
business.
13:05
And
13:05
selling
13:06
books
13:06
is
13:06
very
13:06
difficult.
13:08
And
13:08
things
13:09
that
13:09
may
13:10
have
13:10
worked
13:10
for
13:10
me
13:10
in
13:11
the
13:11
past
13:11
in
13:12
terms
13:12
of
13:12
marketing
13:13
and
13:13
such
13:14
just
13:14
fall
13:15
short.
13:15
They
13:16
just
13:16
fall
13:16
flat
13:17
when
13:17
it
13:17
comes
13:17
to
13:17
the
13:18
books.
13:18
I'm
13:18
searching
13:19
for
13:19
that,
13:20
that
13:21
avenue
13:21
that's
13:21
going
13:21
to
13:22
work
13:22
for
13:22
me,
13:22
that
13:23
little
13:23
piece
13:23
that
13:24
seems
13:24
to
13:25
help
13:25
generate
13:25
it,
13:26
because
13:26
as
13:27
you
13:27
said,
13:27
the
13:27
economics
13:28
are
13:28
hard
13:28
in
13:29
this
13:29
business,
13:29
or
13:30
especially
13:30
if
13:30
we're
13:31
self
13:31
publishing.
13:31
It
13:32
gets
13:32
very
13:32
expensive
13:33
very
13:33
quickly.
13:34
I
13:34
never
13:34
intended
13:35
to
13:36
really
13:37
make
13:37
any
13:37
money
13:37
if
13:37
I
13:38
can
13:38
talk
13:38
business
13:38
for
13:38
a
13:39
second
13:39
with
13:40
the
13:40
books,
13:40
but
13:40
it
13:41
would
13:41
be
13:41
nice
13:41
to
13:41
break
13:41
even.
13:42
Chris,
13:43
you've
13:43
hit
13:43
it
13:43
right
13:43
on
13:44
the
13:44
button.
13:44
When
13:45
I
13:45
started
13:45
this
13:45
podcast
13:46
show,
13:46
one
13:47
of
13:47
the
13:47
things
13:47
I
13:47
thought
13:48
was,
13:48
and
13:48
maybe
13:49
it
13:49
was
13:49
because
13:49
I
13:50
was
13:50
naive,
13:51
but
13:51
one
13:52
of
13:52
the
13:52
things
13:52
I
13:52
thought,
13:53
what
13:53
better
13:53
to
13:54
learn
13:54
about,
13:55
to
13:55
your
13:55
point,
13:56
about
13:56
the
13:56
children's
13:57
book
13:57
business
13:58
than
13:58
to
13:58
have
13:59
published
13:59
children's
14:00
book
14:00
authors
14:01
on
14:01
his
14:01
guests.
14:02
And
14:02
perhaps
14:03
I
14:03
could
14:03
sell
14:03
some
14:04
extra
14:04
books
14:05
because
14:05
their
14:06
audience
14:06
or
14:07
their
14:07
paid
14:07
readers
14:08
would
14:08
be
14:08
listening
14:09
to
14:09
me
14:09
and
14:10
hopefully
14:10
they
14:11
like
14:11
me,
14:11
so
14:11
they
14:12
would
14:12
go
14:12
and
14:12
purchase
14:13
our
14:13
books.
14:13
That
14:14
hasn't
14:14
quite
14:14
worked
14:15
out
14:15
the
14:16
way
14:16
I
14:16
had
14:16
anticipated
14:18
and
14:19
which
14:19
is
14:20
fine.
14:20
It
14:21
just
14:21
has
14:21
given
14:21
me
14:22
some
14:23
insight
14:23
into.
14:24
To
14:24
what
14:24
you
14:24
just
14:25
said.
14:25
This
14:25
is
14:26
a.
14:26
It's
14:27
a
14:27
business
14:28
or
14:28
it
14:28
can
14:28
be
14:28
a
14:29
business.
14:29
Some
14:29
people
14:30
do
14:30
it
14:30
as
14:30
a
14:31
legacy
14:32
or
14:32
as
14:32
a
14:32
passion.
14:33
And
14:33
if
14:33
they
14:33
don't
14:34
ever
14:34
make
14:34
any
14:34
money,
14:35
and
14:35
I'm
14:36
certainly
14:36
not
14:36
being
14:37
critical
14:37
of
14:37
anyone,
14:38
if
14:38
that's
14:38
what
14:38
you
14:38
truly
14:39
want
14:39
to
14:39
do,
14:40
then
14:40
I
14:41
think
14:41
that's
14:41
fantastic.
14:42
I
14:42
just
14:42
had
14:42
a
14:43
guest,
14:43
Marley
14:43
Costner,
14:44
episode
14:44
85,
14:45
and
14:46
she's
14:46
a
14:47
children's
14:47
book
14:47
author,
14:49
and
14:49
her
14:49
children's
14:50
book
14:50
took
14:51
her
14:51
in
14:51
a
14:51
totally
14:52
different
14:52
direction.
14:53
What
14:54
she
14:54
was
14:54
finding
14:55
is
14:55
when
14:55
she
14:55
was
14:55
working
14:56
all
14:56
these
14:56
book
14:57
fairs
14:57
and
14:58
going
14:58
to
14:58
markets
14:59
and
14:59
selling
15:00
her
15:00
book,
15:01
a
15:01
lot
15:01
of
15:02
people
15:02
were
15:02
coming
15:02
up
15:02
to
15:03
her
15:03
and
15:03
saying,
15:04
oh,
15:04
Marley,
15:05
how
15:05
do
15:05
I
15:05
become
15:07
a
15:07
children's
15:08
book
15:08
author
15:08
like
15:09
you?
15:09
Like,
15:09
how
15:09
do
15:10
I
15:10
go
15:10
about
15:10
doing
15:11
that?
15:12
She
15:12
turned
15:13
around,
15:13
and
15:13
then
15:13
because
15:14
it
15:14
was
15:14
so
15:14
frequent,
15:15
she
15:15
ended
15:15
up
15:15
setting
15:16
up
15:16
her
15:16
own
15:17
publishing
15:18
firm,
15:19
and
15:19
she
15:19
now
15:20
helps
15:21
people
15:22
publish
15:22
their
15:23
own
15:23
children's
15:24
book.
15:24
Yeah.
15:25
But
15:25
the
15:25
interesting
15:25
thing
15:26
is
15:26
she
15:27
carved
15:27
out
15:27
a
15:27
niche.
15:29
And
15:29
so
15:29
she
15:30
helps
15:31
professional
15:31
psychologists
15:33
and
15:34
people
15:34
in
15:35
that
15:35
type
15:35
of
15:35
mental
15:36
health
15:36
industry
15:38
write
15:38
a
15:38
children's
15:39
book
15:39
to
15:40
support
15:40
their
15:41
business.
15:42
Very
15:42
good.
15:42
You
15:43
can
15:43
see
15:43
that's
15:43
just
15:44
a
15:44
small
15:44
niche,
15:44
but
15:45
she's
15:45
carved
15:45
out
15:46
something
15:46
special.
15:47
And
15:47
these
15:47
professionals
15:48
are
15:48
taking
15:48
their
15:49
children's
15:49
book
15:50
and
15:50
they're
15:50
carving
15:51
out
15:51
something
15:51
special.
15:52
The
15:52
trick
15:52
is
15:53
to
15:53
find
15:53
out,
15:53
okay,
15:54
what's
15:54
Chris's
15:55
niche?
15:55
Niche.
15:56
Yeah,
15:56
exactly.
15:57
Because
15:57
you
15:57
know
15:57
What,
15:58
Chris,
15:58
about
15:59
90%
16:00
of
16:00
my
16:00
guests
16:01
are
16:01
either
16:02
elementary
16:02
teachers
16:03
or
16:03
retired
16:04
elementary
16:04
teachers
16:05
or
16:05
early
16:06
childhood
16:06
development
16:07
professionals.
16:08
Sure.
16:09
And
16:09
because
16:10
they're
16:10
so
16:10
close
16:10
to
16:11
children
16:11
and
16:11
they
16:11
got
16:12
all
16:12
these
16:12
stories,
16:13
they
16:13
tend
16:13
to
16:14
write
16:14
children's
16:15
books.
16:15
Yeah,
16:15
and
16:16
that
16:16
would
16:16
make
16:16
sense.
16:17
That
16:17
would
16:17
make
16:17
sense.
16:18
They
16:18
have
16:18
that
16:19
background,
16:19
they
16:19
have
16:19
that
16:20
knowledge.
16:20
They
16:21
know
16:21
what's
16:21
going
16:21
to
16:22
resonate
16:23
with
16:23
those
16:23
kids
16:23
that
16:24
they're
16:24
working
16:24
with.
16:25
I've
16:25
got
16:25
a
16:25
lot
16:26
of
16:26
them
16:26
now
16:26
telling
16:27
me
16:27
they
16:27
do
16:27
a
16:28
lesson
16:28
plan
16:29
to
16:29
go
16:29
along
16:30
with
16:30
the
16:30
book,
16:30
and
16:31
that
16:31
gets
16:32
them
16:32
a
16:32
bigger
16:33
foot
16:33
in
16:33
the
16:33
door
16:34
when
16:34
they
16:34
approach
16:35
school
16:35
boards
16:36
in
16:36
schools,
16:37
because
16:37
all
16:38
teachers
16:38
and
16:39
principals
16:40
are
16:40
familiar
16:41
with
16:41
lesson
16:41
plans.
16:42
So
16:43
I
16:43
thought,
16:43
wow.
16:43
And
16:44
you
16:44
know
16:44
what?
16:44
I'm
16:44
trying
16:45
to
16:45
bring
16:45
on
16:45
other
16:46
guests
16:46
that
16:47
we
16:47
have.
16:47
We've
16:48
had
16:48
website
16:49
designers
16:49
on.
16:50
We've
16:50
had
16:50
book
16:50
formatters
16:51
on
16:51
the
16:52
show.
16:52
And
16:53
now
16:53
I'm
16:53
thinking
16:54
I've
16:54
got
16:54
to
16:54
bring
16:55
on
16:55
someone
16:55
who
16:56
is
16:56
an
16:56
expert
16:57
in
16:57
lesson
16:57
plans.
16:58
So
16:59
that
16:59
if
16:59
that's
16:59
something
17:00
that
17:00
interests
17:01
aspiring
17:02
book
17:02
authors
17:03
or
17:03
even
17:04
someone
17:04
who's
17:04
a
17:04
book
17:05
author
17:05
and
17:05
saying,
17:06
oh,
17:06
my
17:06
goodness,
17:07
how
17:07
do
17:07
I
17:07
market
17:08
my
17:08
book?
17:09
Well,
17:09
yeah,
17:09
it
17:10
might
17:10
come
17:10
through.
17:10
Supporting
17:11
it
17:11
through
17:11
a
17:12
lesson
17:12
plan.
17:12
I
17:13
think
17:13
there's
17:13
definite
17:13
lessons
17:14
that
17:14
can
17:14
be
17:14
found
17:15
in
17:15
my
17:15
books.
17:15
But
17:16
whether
17:17
they're
17:17
appropriate
17:18
or
17:19
as
17:19
formal
17:20
as
17:20
a
17:20
lesson
17:20
plan
17:21
that
17:21
a
17:22
professional
17:22
educator
17:23
would
17:23
use,
17:23
I'm
17:23
not
17:24
quite
17:24
so
17:24
sure
17:24
yet.
17:25
I
17:25
have
17:25
talked
17:26
to
17:27
organizations.
17:28
I'm
17:29
having
17:29
a
17:29
guest,
17:29
Sherry
17:30
Serino.
17:30
She
17:31
started
17:31
a.
17:32
A
17:32
charitable
17:33
foundation
17:34
called
17:34
Ella's
17:35
Way,
17:36
and
17:36
she
17:37
has
17:37
about
17:38
30
17:38
or
17:38
35
17:39
children's
17:40
book
17:40
authors
17:41
who,
17:41
through
17:42
her
17:42
organization,
17:44
focus
17:44
on
17:45
things
17:45
like
17:45
kindness.
17:46
When
17:47
I
17:47
look
17:47
at
17:47
your
17:47
book
17:48
The
17:48
Treasure
17:48
of
17:48
Kindness.
17:49
Ella's
17:49
Way
17:49
might
17:50
be
17:50
a
17:50
great
17:50
organization
17:51
for
17:51
you
17:52
to
17:52
look
17:52
at
17:52
joining.
17:53
We'll
17:53
put
17:53
links
17:54
to
17:54
Alice
17:54
Way
17:55
in
17:55
our
17:55
show
17:55
notes.
17:56
That
17:56
might
17:56
be
17:56
something
17:57
that
17:58
you
17:58
get
17:58
involved
17:58
with
17:59
those.
17:59
Those
17:59
authors
18:00
because
18:00
I
18:00
think
18:01
they
18:01
meet
18:01
through
18:01
a
18:02
Facebook
18:02
group
18:02
and
18:03
then
18:03
you
18:03
get
18:03
talking
18:04
about
18:04
it.
18:04
But
18:04
it
18:04
triggers
18:05
IDE
18:06
to
18:06
help
18:07
you
18:07
maybe
18:07
have
18:08
your
18:08
book
18:08
flourish.
18:09
And
18:09
a
18:09
prime
18:10
example
18:10
is
18:11
kindness
18:11
is
18:12
definitely
18:12
a
18:13
big
18:13
topic.
18:14
I
18:14
think
18:14
that
18:15
is
18:15
a
18:15
value
18:15
that
18:16
I
18:16
think
18:16
is
18:16
being
18:16
lost
18:17
on
18:17
a
18:17
lot
18:17
of
18:17
people
18:18
these
18:18
days.
18:18
No
18:19
doubt
18:19
about
18:19
it.
18:19
Any
18:20
way
18:20
that
18:20
you
18:20
can
18:20
bring
18:20
it
18:21
in
18:21
and
18:21
introduce
18:21
it
18:22
to
18:22
somebody
18:22
early
18:23
on
18:23
in
18:23
their
18:23
life,
18:24
I
18:24
think
18:24
the
18:24
better.
18:25
I
18:25
couldn't
18:25
agree
18:26
with
18:26
you
18:26
more.
18:26
I
18:27
wanted
18:27
and
18:28
sorry
18:28
to
18:28
get
18:28
you
18:28
sidetracked
18:29
here
18:29
a
18:29
bit,
18:29
but
18:30
that's
18:30
right
18:31
now
18:31
on
18:31
your
18:31
books
18:32
and
18:32
I'd
18:33
like
18:33
to
18:33
talk
18:33
to
18:33
you
18:33
about
18:34
first
18:34
of
18:34
all,
18:34
your
18:35
book
18:35
formats.
18:36
I
18:36
noticed
18:36
you're
18:37
on
18:37
Amazon.
18:37
You
18:38
have
18:38
them
18:38
on
18:38
your
18:38
website.
18:39
You
18:40
have
18:40
in
18:40
a
18:40
soft
18:41
cover
18:41
or
18:41
paperback
18:42
form
18:42
and
18:43
an
18:43
E
18:43
book
18:43
on
18:44
my
18:44
iPad.
18:45
I
18:45
got
18:45
to
18:46
tell
18:46
you,
18:46
hopefully
18:47
you
18:47
can
18:47
see
18:47
this.
18:48
Your
18:48
color
18:49
on
18:50
the
18:50
iPad
18:51
is
18:51
spectacular.
18:52
Yeah,
18:53
that
18:53
looks
18:53
good.
18:53
It's
18:54
beautiful.
18:55
Just
18:55
absolutely
18:56
beautiful.
18:57
I
18:57
got
18:57
to
18:57
give
18:57
credit
18:58
to
18:58
my
18:58
illustrator
18:59
for
18:59
all
19:00
that.
19:00
She
19:00
just
19:01
knocked
19:01
it
19:01
out
19:01
of
19:01
the
19:02
park
19:02
with
19:02
these.
19:03
With
19:03
your
19:03
book,
19:04
your
19:04
softcover
19:05
and
19:05
your
19:05
ebook.
19:06
So
19:06
why
19:06
no
19:07
hardcover?
19:08
There
19:09
is
19:09
a
19:09
plan
19:09
for
19:09
hardcover
19:10
downline,
19:11
but
19:11
with
19:12
Amazon
19:13
there's
19:13
a
19:14
certain
19:14
number
19:14
of
19:15
pages.
19:15
Yeah,
19:16
72.
19:17
Yeah.
19:17
You
19:17
have
19:17
to
19:17
get
19:18
over
19:18
before
19:18
you
19:19
move
19:19
to
19:20
a
19:20
hardcover.
19:21
That's
19:21
why
19:22
the
19:22
paperback
19:23
right
19:23
now.
19:24
Without
19:24
having
19:25
gone
19:26
the
19:26
traditional
19:26
publishing
19:27
route
19:27
and
19:28
having
19:28
their
19:28
resources
19:29
behind
19:29
me,
19:30
it's
19:30
very
19:31
difficult
19:31
to
19:31
get
19:32
into
19:32
the
19:32
hardcover
19:33
without
19:33
meeting
19:33
those
19:34
requirements.
19:34
I
19:35
was
19:35
talking
19:35
to
19:36
a
19:36
children's
19:37
book
19:37
author,
19:37
Charlotte
19:38
Glaze,
19:38
episode
19:39
23
19:39
out
19:39
of
19:40
Oklahoma.
19:41
And
19:42
she's
19:42
got
19:42
two
19:43
great
19:43
skills.
19:43
She's
19:44
not
19:44
only
19:44
the
19:44
writer,
19:45
but
19:45
she's
19:46
also
19:46
an
19:46
illustrator.
19:47
You
19:47
and
19:47
I
19:47
both
19:48
know
19:48
if
19:48
you
19:49
have
19:49
that
19:49
illustration
19:50
skill,
19:50
it
19:50
can
19:51
certainly
19:51
make.
19:51
Oh
19:52
yeah,
19:52
a
19:52
big
19:53
difference.
19:53
I
19:53
talked
19:53
to
19:54
Charlotte
19:54
about
19:54
her
19:55
hardcover
19:56
and
19:56
she
19:56
used
19:57
a
19:57
company
19:58
called
19:58
madeinchina.com
20:00
and
20:01
she
20:01
actually
20:02
went
20:03
offshore
20:04
and
20:05
purchased
20:06
her
20:06
hardcover
20:07
books.
20:07
And
20:07
I
20:07
said,
20:08
oh.
20:08
And
20:09
she
20:09
said,
20:09
rick,
20:10
really,
20:10
the
20:11
quality.
20:11
I
20:11
picked
20:12
two
20:12
companies.
20:13
I
20:13
paid
20:14
for
20:14
samples
20:14
to
20:15
be
20:15
sent
20:15
to
20:15
me.
20:16
I
20:16
found
20:16
the
20:17
one
20:17
that
20:17
I
20:17
really
20:17
liked.
20:18
Then
20:19
I
20:19
ordered
20:19
and
20:19
she
20:20
said,
20:20
including
20:20
shipping
20:22
and
20:23
and
20:23
printing,
20:24
she
20:24
said,
20:25
I
20:25
got
20:25
a
20:25
high
20:25
quality
20:26
hard
20:27
covered
20:27
book
20:28
and
20:29
it's
20:29
cheaper
20:30
than
20:30
I
20:30
was
20:30
able
20:31
to
20:31
buy
20:31
my
20:32
soft
20:32
covered
20:33
books
20:33
through
20:33
Amazon.
20:34
And
20:34
really,
20:35
that's
20:36
what
20:36
I
20:36
said.
20:36
Really?
20:37
She
20:37
uses
20:38
those
20:39
when
20:39
she
20:39
does
20:40
live
20:40
events
20:41
because
20:41
she's
20:41
able
20:41
to
20:42
get
20:42
a
20:42
premium
20:42
price
20:43
for
20:43
them.
20:44
As
20:44
you
20:44
and
20:45
I
20:45
were
20:45
just
20:45
talking
20:45
about.
20:46
It's
20:46
tough
20:46
enough
20:47
trying
20:47
to
20:47
get
20:47
a
20:47
return
20:48
on
20:48
your
20:48
investment,
20:49
but
20:49
if
20:50
you
20:50
can
20:50
turn
20:50
around
20:51
and
20:52
make
20:52
a
20:52
higher
20:52
margin
20:53
on
20:53
a
20:53
hardcover
20:54
book
20:54
that
20:54
looks
20:55
beautiful,
20:56
why
20:56
not?
20:57
And
20:58
she
20:58
said
20:58
she
20:59
had
20:59
to
20:59
order
20:59
500
21:00
copies.
21:00
That's
21:01
good
21:01
to
21:01
know.
21:01
So
21:02
that's
21:02
something
21:02
that
21:02
definitely
21:03
can
21:03
look
21:03
at
21:03
because
21:04
that's
21:04
something
21:04
that's
21:04
always
21:04
in
21:05
the
21:05
back
21:05
of
21:05
my
21:05
mind
21:05
mentioned
21:06
plans
21:06
for
21:07
the
21:07
future.
21:07
So
21:07
I
21:08
have
21:08
one
21:08
more
21:08
book
21:09
with
21:09
Olivia
21:10
on
21:10
the
21:11
horizon
21:11
for
21:11
sometime
21:12
in
21:12
2026.
21:14
And
21:14
with
21:15
these
21:15
three
21:16
books,
21:16
my
21:17
intent
21:18
is
21:18
to
21:18
put
21:18
them
21:18
all
21:19
together
21:19
into
21:19
a
21:20
three
21:20
book
21:20
volume
21:22
and
21:22
market
21:22
it
21:23
that
21:23
way
21:23
as
21:24
all
21:24
three
21:24
books
21:24
in
21:24
a
21:24
hardcover.
21:25
That's
21:25
fantastic.
21:26
I've
21:26
interviewed
21:27
a
21:27
gal
21:28
and
21:29
her
21:29
name
21:29
is
21:29
Brittany
21:30
Pettish,
21:30
episode
21:31
67.
21:32
And
21:32
she
21:33
did
21:33
exactly
21:34
what
21:34
you
21:34
just
21:35
said.
21:35
She
21:36
made
21:36
a
21:36
compilation.
21:38
And
21:38
so
21:38
that
21:38
allowed
21:39
her
21:40
to
21:40
get
21:40
over
21:40
that
21:41
72
21:42
page
21:42
number
21:43
and
21:44
she
21:44
has
21:44
a
21:45
compilation
21:46
of
21:46
three
21:46
of
21:46
her
21:46
books.
21:47
I
21:47
think
21:47
she's
21:47
published
21:48
five,
21:48
but
21:49
she's
21:49
got
21:49
three
21:49
of
21:49
them
21:50
together
21:50
in
21:50
a
21:51
compilation
21:52
and
21:53
now
21:53
she's
21:53
printing
21:54
it
21:54
through
21:54
Amazon.
21:55
Hats
21:55
off
21:55
to
21:55
you.
21:56
That's
21:56
phenomenal.
21:57
Yeah,
21:58
yeah.
21:58
So
21:58
hopefully,
21:59
fingers
22:00
crossed,
22:00
if
22:00
everything
22:01
lines
22:01
up
22:01
correctly
22:02
that
22:02
we'll
22:02
have
22:02
that
22:03
done
22:03
by
22:03
the
22:03
end
22:03
of
22:04
2026.
22:05
And
22:05
have
22:05
you
22:05
used
22:06
Ingram
22:06
Sparks?
22:07
I
22:07
do.
22:07
I
22:07
have.
22:08
The
22:08
books
22:08
are
22:09
listed
22:09
on
22:09
there.
22:09
So
22:10
all
22:10
of
22:10
the
22:10
little
22:11
independent
22:11
bookstores
22:12
and
22:12
all
22:12
that
22:12
can
22:12
find
22:13
can
22:13
find
22:13
the
22:14
books
22:14
if
22:14
they
22:14
want
22:14
to.
22:15
Okay.
22:15
In
22:15
fact,
22:16
I
22:16
have
22:16
a
22:16
small
22:16
bookstore
22:17
in
22:17
town
22:17
that
22:18
I
22:18
walked
22:18
into,
22:19
I
22:19
don't
22:19
know,
22:19
maybe
22:20
six
22:20
weeks
22:20
ago
22:20
and
22:21
showed
22:21
them
22:22
the
22:22
book
22:22
and
22:22
was
22:23
trying
22:23
to
22:23
ARR
22:24
a
22:24
tabletop
22:25
sometime
22:25
on
22:26
a
22:26
Saturday
22:26
afternoon
22:27
with
22:27
them
22:27
and
22:28
they
22:28
were
22:28
able
22:28
to
22:29
just
22:29
take
22:29
the
22:29
ISBN
22:30
number,
22:30
look
22:30
it
22:30
right
22:30
up
22:30
and
22:30
they're
22:31
like,
22:31
oh,
22:31
yep,
22:31
there
22:31
it
22:32
is,
22:32
there's
22:32
your
22:32
book.
22:33
So
22:33
IngramSpark
22:34
is
22:34
good
22:34
for
22:34
that.
22:36
Trying
22:36
to
22:36
help
22:36
other
22:37
people
22:37
is
22:37
that
22:38
using
22:39
third
22:39
party
22:41
does
22:41
come
22:42
in
22:42
at
22:42
a
22:42
price
22:42
because
22:43
you
22:43
don't
22:43
make
22:43
the
22:43
same
22:43
type
22:44
of
22:44
margin
22:45
with
22:45
some
22:45
of
22:45
the
22:45
independent
22:46
book
22:46
retailers.
22:47
If
22:47
you
22:47
can
22:47
make
22:48
up
22:48
your
22:48
own
22:48
wholesale
22:49
price
22:50
and
22:50
sell
22:50
it
22:51
to
22:51
them
22:51
directly,
22:52
definitely
22:53
more
22:53
margin
22:54
in
22:54
it
22:54
for
22:54
you
22:55
as
22:55
a
22:55
children's
22:55
book
22:56
author.
22:57
Yeah,
22:57
yeah,
22:57
absolutely.
22:58
I've
22:58
done
22:58
that
22:59
with
22:59
a
22:59
couple
23:00
of
23:00
community
23:00
fairs
23:01
that
23:02
that
23:02
we've
23:02
had
23:02
here
23:03
before
23:03
the
23:03
holidays
23:04
where
23:04
I've
23:04
been
23:04
able
23:05
to
23:05
print
23:05
a
23:05
number
23:05
of
23:06
copies
23:06
and
23:06
bring
23:07
them
23:07
and
23:08
been
23:08
able
23:08
to
23:09
increase
23:09
the
23:09
margin
23:09
just
23:10
a
23:10
little
23:10
bit
23:10
by
23:10
doing
23:10
that.
23:11
Don't
23:11
have
23:11
to
23:11
pay
23:12
the
23:12
Amazon
23:12
royalty.
23:13
Right.
23:13
I
23:14
Want
23:14
to
23:14
jump
23:14
into
23:15
your
23:15
publishing
23:16
approach
23:17
because
23:17
you
23:17
know
23:17
what
23:18
I
23:18
talk
23:18
about.
23:19
Primarily
23:20
for
23:21
children's
23:21
book
23:21
authors,
23:22
there's
23:22
three
23:22
routes
23:23
you
23:23
can
23:23
go.
23:24
There's
23:24
independent
23:25
publishing,
23:26
which
23:27
means
23:27
you
23:28
create
23:28
your
23:28
own
23:28
publishing
23:29
company,
23:30
you
23:30
do
23:30
all
23:30
the
23:31
work,
23:31
you
23:31
hire
23:32
all
23:32
the
23:32
resources
23:32
and
23:33
all
23:33
the
23:33
professionals.
23:34
And
23:34
then
23:35
there's
23:35
what
23:35
I
23:36
call
23:36
self
23:36
publishing,
23:37
or
23:37
hybrid
23:38
publishing,
23:39
where
23:39
you
23:39
actually
23:40
hire
23:41
a
23:41
third
23:41
party
23:43
company
23:43
to
23:43
do
23:44
most
23:44
of
23:44
the
23:44
work
23:44
for
23:45
you.
23:45
They
23:45
become
23:46
like
23:46
the
23:46
general
23:46
manager.
23:47
You
23:48
pay
23:48
them
23:48
a
23:48
fee,
23:49
but
23:49
at
23:49
the
23:49
end
23:49
of
23:49
the
23:49
day
23:50
you
23:50
get
23:50
to
23:51
keep
23:51
all
23:51
the
23:51
rights,
23:52
but
23:52
it
23:52
costs
23:53
you
23:53
a
23:53
fee
23:54
to
23:54
get
23:54
them
23:54
to
23:54
bring
23:55
your
23:56
book
23:56
to
23:56
market.
23:57
And
23:57
then
23:57
there's
23:57
what's
23:58
called
23:58
the
23:58
traditional,
23:59
which
24:00
a
24:00
lot
24:00
of
24:00
people
24:00
are
24:01
familiar
24:01
with
24:01
the
24:02
traditional
24:02
publishing
24:03
route,
24:03
where
24:03
a
24:04
publisher
24:04
takes
24:05
on
24:05
all
24:05
the
24:05
work,
24:06
pays
24:06
you
24:07
a
24:07
book
24:07
advanced,
24:08
and
24:08
they
24:09
publish
24:09
your
24:09
book.
24:10
The
24:10
one
24:11
thing
24:11
I
24:11
found
24:12
in
24:12
talking
24:12
to
24:13
as
24:13
many
24:14
children's
24:14
book
24:15
authors
24:15
as
24:15
I
24:15
have
24:16
is
24:16
whether
24:17
you're
24:17
independently
24:18
published,
24:19
where
24:19
you
24:19
do
24:19
all
24:20
the
24:20
work,
24:20
or
24:21
you're
24:21
traditionally
24:22
published,
24:22
where
24:22
someone
24:23
pays
24:23
you
24:23
for
24:23
the
24:23
rights
24:24
of
24:24
your
24:24
book
24:24
and
24:24
they
24:25
do
24:25
all
24:25
the
24:25
work.
24:26
They
24:27
do
24:27
all
24:27
the
24:27
work
24:27
in
24:28
terms
24:28
of
24:29
publishing
24:30
it,
24:30
but
24:30
they
24:31
expect
24:31
you
24:32
to
24:32
do
24:33
the
24:34
sales
24:34
and
24:34
marketing
24:35
that
24:35
book,
24:36
whether
24:36
you're
24:36
independently
24:37
or
24:38
traditionally
24:38
published.
24:40
Tell
24:40
us
24:40
about
24:40
your
24:41
publishing
24:42
process.
24:44
My
24:44
process
24:45
is.
24:46
So
24:47
I'm
24:47
doing
24:47
it
24:47
all
24:47
myself
24:48
now.
24:48
Okay.
24:49
Do
24:49
you
24:49
have
24:49
your
24:49
own
24:50
publishing
24:50
company
24:50
name?
24:51
Yeah,
24:51
it's
24:51
just
24:51
Chris
24:52
McKenna.
24:52
Okay.
24:53
Yes.
24:54
So
24:54
if
24:54
you
24:54
were
24:54
to
24:54
look
24:54
it
24:54
up,
24:55
you
24:55
would
24:55
just
24:55
see
24:55
my
24:55
name
24:56
in
24:56
there
24:56
as
24:56
the
24:56
publisher.
24:57
When
24:57
I
24:58
first
24:58
wrote
24:58
Olivia
24:59
May
24:59
and
24:59
Her
24:59
Scuba
25:00
Diving
25:00
Day,
25:00
I
25:01
had
25:01
actually
25:01
shopped
25:01
it
25:02
to
25:02
a
25:02
couple
25:02
of
25:03
publishers
25:03
that
25:04
I
25:04
could
25:04
find.
25:05
And
25:05
it
25:05
turns
25:06
out
25:06
they
25:06
were
25:07
of
25:07
the
25:08
hybrid
25:08
type
25:09
that
25:09
you
25:09
mentioned.
25:11
And
25:11
yeah,
25:12
it
25:12
was
25:12
really
25:12
nice
25:12
to
25:12
be
25:13
able
25:13
to
25:13
just
25:13
turn
25:13
over
25:13
a
25:14
manuscript
25:14
and
25:14
give
25:15
them
25:15
my
25:15
vision.
25:16
But
25:17
for
25:17
me
25:17
personally,
25:18
what
25:18
I
25:18
found
25:18
was
25:19
they
25:19
were
25:20
just
25:20
doing
25:20
a
25:21
very
25:21
bad
25:21
job.
25:22
So
25:22
the
25:23
illustrations
25:23
that
25:25
they
25:25
were
25:25
providing
25:26
me
25:26
were
25:26
absolutely
25:27
terrible.
25:27
They
25:28
were
25:28
AI
25:28
generated
25:30
with
25:30
different
25:31
styles.
25:31
And
25:32
the
25:32
different
25:32
styles
25:32
was
25:33
the
25:33
result
25:33
of
25:33
them
25:33
cutting
25:34
and
25:34
pasting
25:34
different
25:34
things.
25:36
So
25:36
if
25:37
you
25:37
were
25:37
to
25:38
look
25:38
at,
25:39
say,
25:39
page
25:39
one
25:40
of
25:41
the
25:41
Scuba
25:42
Diving
25:42
Day
25:42
book,
25:42
there's
25:43
a
25:43
picture
25:43
of
25:44
Olivia,
25:45
there's
25:45
a
25:45
picture
25:46
of
25:46
Pop
25:46
Pop,
25:47
and
25:47
then
25:47
there's
25:48
Adelaide
25:48
the
25:48
dog.
25:49
And
25:50
what
25:50
they
25:50
were
25:50
doing
25:51
was
25:51
they'd
25:52
AI
25:52
generate
25:53
the
25:53
background
25:53
and
25:54
all
25:54
that,
25:54
and
25:54
I
25:54
presume
25:55
they
25:55
were
25:55
AI
25:55
generating
25:56
all
25:56
the
25:56
other
25:56
characters,
25:57
but
25:57
then
25:57
they
25:58
were
25:58
cutting
25:58
them
25:58
out
25:59
of
26:00
whatever
26:00
picture
26:01
that
26:01
they
26:01
had
26:02
and
26:02
then
26:02
pasting
26:02
them
26:03
into
26:03
the
26:03
background.
26:05
You're
26:05
looking
26:05
at
26:05
this
26:05
and
26:06
you're
26:06
Seeing
26:07
very
26:08
different
26:08
styles
26:09
of
26:10
drawings,
26:11
if
26:11
you
26:11
will,
26:11
of
26:11
illustrations.
26:12
So
26:13
you
26:13
got.
26:13
I
26:13
had
26:13
a
26:13
crab
26:14
that
26:14
was
26:14
very
26:15
cartoony.
26:16
And
26:16
then
26:16
I
26:16
would
26:16
have
26:17
Adelaide,
26:17
which
26:18
was
26:18
more
26:19
of
26:19
a
26:20
traditional
26:21
type
26:21
of
26:21
painted
26:22
illustration.
26:23
And
26:23
then
26:23
you'd
26:23
have
26:23
the
26:24
pop
26:24
and
26:24
the
26:24
Olivia
26:25
characters
26:25
being
26:26
something
26:26
completely
26:27
different.
26:27
I
26:28
was
26:28
dealing
26:28
with
26:28
that.
26:29
And
26:29
then
26:29
as
26:30
we
26:30
got
26:30
down
26:30
line
26:30
and
26:31
a
26:31
couple
26:31
of
26:31
the
26:31
other
26:31
pages,
26:32
it
26:33
just
26:33
became
26:34
really
26:34
unbearable.
26:34
They
26:35
kept
26:35
assuring
26:35
me
26:35
they
26:36
weren't
26:36
doing
26:36
it.
26:37
They
26:37
weren't
26:37
doing
26:38
it.
26:38
When
26:38
you
26:38
get
26:38
a
26:38
drawing
26:39
with
26:39
six
26:39
fingers
26:40
and
26:40
six
26:40
toes,
26:42
it's
26:42
pretty
26:43
obvious
26:43
you
26:43
can't
26:43
deny
26:44
it
26:44
anymore.
26:44
I
26:45
took
26:45
it
26:45
back
26:45
and
26:46
ended
26:46
up
26:46
just
26:46
going
26:47
the
26:47
self
26:47
publishing
26:47
route.
26:48
Yeah.
26:48
Do
26:48
you
26:49
mean
26:49
you're
26:49
more
26:49
independently
26:50
published?
26:51
More.
26:51
More
26:51
independent,
26:52
yeah.
26:52
Yeah.
26:52
So
26:53
I
26:53
went
26:53
out
26:53
in
26:54
that
26:54
time.
26:54
They
26:54
hadn't
26:55
done
26:55
any
26:55
editing
26:56
or
26:56
anything.
26:56
They
26:57
were
26:57
just
26:57
strictly
26:58
focused
26:58
on
26:58
getting
26:58
some
26:59
illustrations
26:59
drawn.
27:00
So
27:00
I
27:00
went
27:01
out
27:01
and
27:01
found
27:01
my
27:02
own
27:02
editor
27:02
to
27:03
do
27:03
some
27:03
editing
27:03
for
27:03
me.
27:04
I
27:04
interviewed
27:05
a
27:05
number
27:05
illustrators
27:06
before
27:06
selecting
27:07
one.
27:07
And
27:08
then
27:08
my
27:08
illustrator
27:09
actually
27:10
had
27:10
some
27:10
background
27:11
in
27:11
getting
27:12
things
27:12
on
27:13
Amazon
27:14
and
27:14
IngramSpark.
27:15
We
27:15
worked
27:15
that
27:16
together
27:16
to
27:17
get
27:17
the
27:17
first
27:17
one
27:17
done.
27:18
Yeah.
27:18
So
27:18
the
27:18
nice
27:18
thing
27:19
about
27:19
it,
27:19
you
27:19
created
27:20
your
27:20
own
27:20
dream
27:20
team
27:21
of
27:22
professionals.
27:23
Yeah,
27:23
yeah,
27:23
absolutely.
27:24
Okay.
27:25
And
27:25
you
27:25
know
27:25
what,
27:25
Chris?
27:26
The
27:26
reason
27:26
I
27:26
always
27:26
ask
27:27
this
27:27
question
27:27
is
27:28
that
27:29
for
27:29
us,
27:29
because
27:30
I
27:30
had
27:30
written
27:31
two.
27:32
I
27:32
had
27:32
mentioned
27:32
this
27:33
off
27:33
air,
27:34
I
27:34
had
27:34
written
27:34
two
27:35
books
27:36
that
27:36
were
27:37
business
27:37
books
27:37
on
27:38
investment
27:38
real
27:38
estate.
27:39
And
27:39
I
27:39
ended
27:40
up
27:40
being
27:40
an
27:40
independent
27:41
publisher.
27:42
That's
27:43
the
27:43
route
27:43
I
27:43
took.
27:43
And
27:44
so
27:44
we
27:44
created
27:44
our
27:45
own.
27:45
Like
27:45
on
27:46
the
27:46
back
27:46
of
27:46
our
27:46
book,
27:46
you'll
27:47
see
27:47
that
27:47
it's
27:47
called
27:48
Caboose,
27:48
the
27:49
Rocky
27:49
Mountain
27:49
Bear
27:50
Publishing
27:51
Den.
27:51
And
27:52
we
27:52
create
27:52
our
27:52
own
27:53
publishing
27:53
company.
27:54
I
27:54
look
27:54
at
27:55
it
27:55
as
27:55
being
27:55
fortunate
27:56
because
27:57
I
27:58
just
27:58
knew
27:58
how
27:58
to
27:58
do
27:59
it.
27:59
Now,
28:00
I
28:00
didn't
28:00
have
28:00
an
28:01
illustrator.
28:02
But
28:02
before
28:02
we
28:03
talk
28:03
about
28:03
illustrations,
28:04
because
28:04
you
28:05
brought
28:05
up
28:05
some
28:05
great
28:06
points,
28:06
I
28:06
want
28:07
to
28:07
help
28:07
people
28:08
understand
28:08
when
28:08
they're
28:09
trying
28:09
to
28:09
make
28:09
a
28:10
decision
28:10
on
28:11
do
28:11
I
28:11
independently
28:12
publish,
28:13
do
28:13
I
28:13
use
28:13
a
28:14
hybrid
28:14
self
28:15
publishing
28:16
firm,
28:16
or
28:17
do
28:17
I
28:17
try
28:17
and
28:18
get
28:18
a
28:18
traditional
28:19
publisher?
28:19
I
28:20
like
28:20
to
28:21
get
28:21
people
28:21
to
28:21
tell
28:22
their
28:22
stories.
28:22
I
28:22
don't
28:23
want
28:23
to
28:23
make
28:23
it
28:23
seem
28:23
easy,
28:24
and
28:24
I'm
28:24
sure
28:24
you
28:25
don't
28:25
want
28:25
to
28:25
make
28:25
it
28:25
seem
28:25
easy
28:26
either.
28:27
But
28:27
when
28:27
it
28:28
came
28:28
to
28:28
publishing
28:29
your
28:29
children's
28:29
book,
28:30
what
28:30
do
28:30
you
28:30
think
28:31
your
28:31
biggest
28:31
challenge
28:32
was
28:32
or
28:33
your
28:33
biggest
28:33
frustration.
28:35
Right
28:35
off
28:35
the
28:35
bat?
28:36
It
28:36
was
28:36
with
28:36
the
28:36
actual
28:37
publishing
28:37
company
28:38
that
28:38
I
28:38
was
28:38
using
28:39
the
28:39
assurances
28:40
that
28:40
they
28:40
were
28:40
giving
28:41
me.
28:41
I
28:42
had
28:42
a
28:42
vision
28:43
and
28:43
I
28:43
actually
28:44
had
28:44
put
28:45
a
28:45
mock
28:45
up
28:45
together
28:46
of
28:46
the
28:47
book
28:47
for
28:47
them
28:48
to
28:48
follow.
28:49
And
28:49
it
28:49
wasn't
28:50
being
28:50
followed.
28:51
And
28:52
it
28:52
became
28:52
obvious
28:53
to
28:53
me
28:53
that
28:54
they
28:54
weren't
28:55
being
28:55
completely
28:56
upfront
28:57
and
28:57
honest
28:57
with
28:58
me.
28:58
And
28:58
that
28:59
was
28:59
very
28:59
frustrating.
29:00
I'd
29:00
like
29:00
to
29:00
say
29:01
I'm
29:01
not
29:01
a
29:01
control
29:01
freak,
29:02
but
29:02
I'm
29:02
a
29:03
little
29:03
bit
29:03
of.
29:03
A
29:04
little
29:04
bit
29:04
of
29:04
control
29:04
issues.
29:05
And
29:05
especially
29:05
when
29:06
my
29:06
name
29:06
is
29:06
attached
29:07
to
29:07
something,
29:07
Rick,
29:07
I
29:08
want
29:08
it
29:08
to
29:08
be
29:08
the
29:08
best
29:09
it
29:09
can
29:09
be.
29:10
And
29:10
if
29:10
I
29:11
were
29:11
to
29:11
have
29:11
just
29:11
let
29:12
them
29:13
progress
29:13
forward
29:14
without
29:15
taking
29:15
back
29:15
the
29:16
control
29:16
myself,
29:17
we
29:17
wouldn't
29:17
be
29:17
having
29:17
this
29:18
conversation
29:18
today.
29:19
Because
29:19
at
29:19
the
29:19
pace
29:20
they
29:20
were
29:20
going,
29:20
it
29:20
was
29:21
going
29:21
to
29:21
take
29:21
two
29:21
years
29:21
to
29:22
get
29:22
this
29:22
book
29:22
illustrated.
29:23
But
29:23
it's
29:23
interesting.
29:24
There's
29:24
certainly
29:25
self
29:26
hybrid
29:26
publishers
29:27
that
29:28
are
29:28
exactly
29:29
as
29:29
you
29:29
describe.
29:30
But
29:31
so
29:31
far
29:31
from
29:32
my
29:32
experience,
29:33
there's
29:33
also
29:34
been
29:34
some
29:35
really
29:35
good
29:35
ones.
29:36
And
29:36
anyone
29:37
who's
29:37
listened
29:37
to
29:37
our
29:38
podcast
29:38
show
29:39
knows
29:39
that
29:40
I've
29:40
had
29:41
guests
29:41
on
29:42
and
29:42
that's
29:42
the
29:43
way
29:43
they
29:43
go.
29:43
They
29:44
found
29:44
a
29:44
reputable
29:45
company
29:46
who
29:47
guarantees
29:47
them
29:48
that
29:48
they
29:48
will
29:48
have
29:48
a
29:48
published
29:49
children's
29:49
book
29:50
within
29:50
a
29:50
year.
29:51
And
29:51
they've
29:51
delivered
29:52
and
29:52
they've
29:52
delivered
29:53
a
29:53
beautiful
29:54
book.
29:55
So
29:56
it's
29:56
possible.
29:56
But
29:57
you
29:57
certainly
29:57
have.
29:57
Oh,
29:58
absolutely.
29:58
And
29:59
all
29:59
I
29:59
can
29:59
do
29:59
is
29:59
speak
30:00
about
30:00
my
30:00
experience.
30:01
Yeah.
30:01
So
30:02
if
30:02
somebody's
30:02
found
30:02
a
30:03
good
30:03
one
30:03
and
30:04
they
30:04
trust
30:04
them,
30:05
congratulations.
30:07
Stick
30:07
with
30:07
them.
30:08
Okay.
30:09
Yeah.
30:09
I
30:09
don't
30:09
want
30:09
to
30:10
take
30:10
anything
30:10
away,
30:11
but
30:11
you
30:12
just
30:12
need
30:13
to
30:13
be
30:13
aware
30:13
that
30:14
you
30:14
may
30:14
not
30:14
get
30:15
the
30:15
finished
30:15
product
30:16
that
30:16
that
30:16
aligns
30:17
with
30:17
your
30:17
own
30:17
vision.
30:18
Be
30:18
very
30:19
careful.
30:19
Make
30:19
sure
30:19
you
30:20
get
30:20
everything
30:21
written
30:21
out,
30:21
spelled
30:21
out
30:22
in
30:22
a
30:22
contract.
30:23
Make
30:23
sure
30:23
that
30:24
you
30:24
have
30:24
milestones
30:25
in
30:25
place.
30:26
I
30:26
think
30:26
milestones
30:27
are
30:27
very
30:27
important
30:28
because
30:28
without
30:28
them.
30:29
Yeah.
30:29
You
30:29
could
30:30
blow
30:31
through
30:31
any
30:32
deadline
30:32
that
30:32
you
30:32
may
30:33
have
30:33
for
30:34
when
30:34
you
30:34
want
30:34
to
30:34
get
30:34
it
30:35
published.
30:35
I
30:35
think
30:35
milestones
30:36
are
30:37
very
30:37
important
30:37
to
30:37
have
30:38
if
30:38
you're
30:38
working
30:38
well.
30:39
And
30:39
that
30:39
that
30:40
goes
30:40
even
30:40
completely
30:41
independently
30:42
published,
30:42
too.
30:43
I
30:43
have
30:43
milestones
30:44
with
30:44
my
30:44
people
30:45
as
30:45
well.
30:46
And
30:46
it's
30:46
interesting
30:46
you
30:47
should
30:47
say
30:47
that
30:47
because
30:47
I
30:48
always,
30:48
when
30:48
I
30:49
talk
30:49
on
30:49
the
30:49
show.
30:50
And
30:50
the
30:50
nice
30:50
thing
30:51
about
30:51
it,
30:51
because
30:52
we've
30:52
independently
30:53
published
30:53
two
30:53
children's
30:54
books,
30:54
I
30:55
can
30:55
speak
30:55
from
30:55
experience
30:56
and
30:56
interviewing
30:57
over
30:57
75
30:58
children's
30:59
book
30:59
authors.
31:00
I'm
31:01
gaining
31:01
knowledge
31:02
that
31:02
way
31:02
also.
31:02
And
31:03
I'm
31:03
like
31:03
a
31:04
sponge
31:04
when
31:04
it
31:04
comes
31:05
to
31:05
talking
31:05
to
31:05
children's
31:06
book
31:06
authors.
31:06
What
31:07
I
31:07
tell
31:07
people
31:08
is
31:08
that
31:08
if
31:09
they
31:09
take
31:09
the
31:09
independent
31:10
route,
31:11
it's
31:11
very
31:12
interesting
31:12
too,
31:13
because
31:13
I'll
31:14
give
31:14
you
31:14
a
31:14
prime
31:14
example.
31:15
I
31:15
had
31:15
a
31:15
guest
31:16
on
31:16
Con
31:16
Livery
31:17
episode
31:17
29.
31:18
He's
31:18
our
31:19
book
31:19
formatter.
31:20
So
31:20
he's
31:21
not
31:21
the
31:21
illustrator,
31:22
but
31:22
he's
31:23
a
31:23
graphic
31:23
designer.
31:24
Who
31:25
does
31:25
book
31:26
formatting
31:27
and
31:27
he
31:27
also
31:28
is
31:28
a
31:28
website
31:29
designer.
31:30
The
31:30
beautiful
31:31
thing
31:31
about
31:31
having
31:32
Kahn
31:33
is
31:33
that
31:34
he
31:35
also
31:35
is
31:35
an
31:36
expert
31:36
in
31:37
formatting
31:39
a
31:39
soft
31:40
cover
31:40
book,
31:40
a
31:40
hardcover
31:41
book
31:41
and
31:42
an
31:42
ebook.
31:43
What
31:43
happens
31:43
is
31:44
a
31:44
lot
31:44
of
31:44
times
31:45
you'll
31:45
find
31:46
someone
31:47
can
31:47
only
31:47
format
31:49
a
31:49
soft
31:50
cover
31:50
book.
31:50
So
31:51
they'll
31:51
get
31:51
your
31:51
book
31:52
on
31:53
Amazon
31:53
and
31:54
ingramsparks.
31:55
But
31:55
if
31:55
you
31:55
said
31:56
to
31:56
them,
31:56
can
31:56
you
31:56
format
31:57
my
31:57
ebook
31:58
or
31:58
my
31:59
hardcover
32:00
book?
32:00
They
32:00
don't
32:00
know
32:01
how
32:01
to
32:01
do
32:01
that.
32:01
It's
32:02
really
32:02
doing
32:02
your
32:03
homework
32:03
as
32:04
you're
32:04
talking
32:04
about
32:05
and
32:05
making
32:05
sure
32:06
the
32:06
professionals
32:07
that
32:07
you
32:07
need
32:08
can
32:09
do
32:09
the
32:09
job
32:09
that
32:09
you're
32:10
looking
32:10
for
32:10
them
32:11
to
32:11
do.
32:12
Absolutely,
32:13
yeah.
32:13
Interview,
32:14
ask
32:14
a
32:14
ton
32:14
of
32:15
questions.
32:16
If
32:16
you
32:16
don't
32:16
know
32:16
what
32:17
questions
32:17
to
32:17
ask,
32:17
you
32:18
can
32:18
use
32:19
AI,
32:19
go
32:20
out
32:20
to
32:21
ChatGPT
32:22
and
32:22
have
32:23
them
32:23
develop
32:23
a
32:24
list
32:24
of
32:24
questions
32:25
for
32:25
you.
32:25
Appropriate
32:26
questions
32:26
to
32:26
ask.
32:26
We
32:27
got
32:27
these
32:27
tools
32:28
available
32:28
to
32:28
us.
32:29
Use
32:29
them,
32:30
no
32:30
question.
32:31
You
32:31
found
32:31
your
32:32
editor,
32:32
you
32:32
found
32:33
someone.
32:33
Now,
32:34
in
32:34
your
32:34
case,
32:35
it's
32:36
interesting
32:36
and
32:37
I
32:37
want
32:37
to
32:37
pick
32:37
up
32:38
on
32:38
this
32:38
a
32:38
bit.
32:38
Okay.
32:39
Is
32:39
that
32:39
your
32:39
illustrator
32:40
knew
32:41
how
32:41
to
32:41
do
32:41
the
32:41
formatting
32:43
for
32:43
Amazon
32:43
and
32:44
ingramsparks.
32:45
Did
32:45
she
32:45
do
32:45
the
32:45
complete
32:46
book?
32:46
So
32:46
she
32:46
did
32:47
the
32:47
illustration
32:47
and
32:48
she
32:48
also
32:48
added
32:49
the
32:49
copy
32:50
to
32:50
each
32:51
page?
32:52
Yeah,
32:52
we
32:52
worked
32:53
that
32:53
together
32:54
as
32:54
she
32:54
would
32:55
send
32:55
me
32:55
illustrations
32:56
to
32:57
look
32:57
at.
32:57
That
32:57
was
32:58
one
32:58
of
32:58
the
32:58
things
32:58
that
32:58
was
32:59
always
32:59
in
32:59
my
32:59
mind.
33:00
Okay,
33:00
where
33:01
are
33:01
we
33:01
going
33:01
to
33:01
put
33:01
the
33:01
text
33:02
on
33:02
this
33:03
page?
33:03
How's
33:04
that
33:04
going
33:04
to
33:04
look
33:04
actually
33:05
working
33:05
backwards,
33:06
Rick?
33:07
I
33:08
have
33:08
done
33:08
a
33:08
mock
33:09
up
33:10
for
33:10
both
33:10
of
33:10
my
33:11
books
33:11
prior
33:12
to
33:12
ever
33:12
turning
33:13
it
33:13
over
33:13
to
33:13
the
33:13
illustrator.
33:15
So
33:15
they
33:15
already
33:16
had
33:16
an
33:16
idea
33:17
in
33:17
their
33:18
mind
33:18
of
33:18
kind
33:19
of
33:19
what
33:19
I
33:19
was
33:19
looking
33:19
at
33:20
and
33:20
how
33:20
I
33:20
envisioned
33:21
things
33:22
to
33:22
look.
33:23
In
33:23
the
33:23
end,
33:24
they
33:24
were
33:24
able
33:24
to
33:24
then
33:24
take
33:25
that
33:26
and
33:26
incorporate
33:27
that
33:27
into
33:28
their
33:28
drawings.
33:29
Let's
33:30
talk
33:30
a
33:30
little
33:31
bit
33:31
deeper
33:31
about
33:31
your
33:32
illustrator,
33:32
because
33:33
in
33:33
our
33:33
case
33:33
it's
33:34
interesting,
33:34
Chris,
33:35
is
33:35
that
33:37
I
33:37
tried
33:37
to
33:37
find
33:38
a
33:39
local
33:39
illustrator
33:40
and
33:41
I
33:42
didn't
33:42
have
33:42
much
33:43
success
33:43
and
33:43
I
33:43
ended
33:44
up
33:44
going.
33:45
I
33:45
ended
33:45
up
33:46
going,
33:46
as
33:46
you
33:47
said,
33:47
online
33:48
Googling,
33:50
or
33:50
at
33:50
that
33:51
time
33:51
it
33:51
was
33:51
Google.
33:52
AI
33:52
was
33:52
just
33:53
coming
33:53
onto
33:54
the
33:54
scene.
33:54
I
33:55
found
33:55
an
33:56
illustrator
33:56
who
33:57
was
33:57
in
33:57
the
33:57
UK
33:59
and
34:00
was
34:00
amazed
34:02
because
34:02
with
34:02
today's
34:03
technology,
34:04
I
34:05
never
34:05
met
34:05
the
34:05
gentleman,
34:06
but
34:07
because
34:08
with
34:08
all
34:08
my
34:08
grandchildren,
34:09
we've
34:10
actually
34:10
taken
34:11
photographs.
34:12
We
34:12
usually
34:12
have
34:12
a
34:13
four
34:13
to
34:13
eight
34:14
photographs
34:14
that
34:15
go
34:15
with
34:15
whatever
34:16
event
34:16
we
34:16
were
34:17
at.
34:17
We
34:18
ended
34:18
up
34:19
using
34:19
those
34:20
photographs
34:20
and
34:21
send
34:21
to
34:22
the
34:22
illustrator
34:23
to
34:23
help
34:23
us
34:24
because
34:24
we
34:25
wrote
34:25
the
34:25
story
34:25
and
34:26
then
34:26
we'd
34:26
send
34:26
the
34:26
pictures
34:27
just
34:27
to
34:28
give
34:28
the
34:28
person
34:29
a
34:29
feel.
34:29
And
34:29
this
34:30
person's
34:30
never
34:30
Been
34:31
to
34:31
the
34:31
Rocky
34:31
Mountains,
34:32
needing
34:32
those
34:33
pictures
34:33
were.
34:33
Yeah.
34:34
What's
34:34
incredible
34:35
is
34:36
that
34:36
my
34:37
oldest
34:37
granddaughter
34:38
and
34:38
I
34:38
had
34:38
this
34:38
vision
34:39
of
34:39
what
34:40
Caboose,
34:41
the
34:41
Rocky
34:41
Mountain
34:42
bear,
34:42
would
34:42
look
34:42
like,
34:42
our
34:43
main
34:43
character.
34:44
We
34:44
knew
34:44
it
34:45
was
34:45
going
34:45
to
34:45
be
34:45
a
34:45
bear,
34:46
and
34:46
we
34:47
knew
34:47
we
34:47
wanted
34:47
it
34:48
to
34:48
have.
34:48
Because
34:48
it
34:49
was
34:49
named
34:49
Caboose.
34:50
We
34:50
wanted
34:51
it
34:51
to
34:51
have
34:51
that
34:52
train
34:52
feel.
34:53
My
34:53
wife
34:53
and
34:54
I
34:54
were
34:54
in
34:54
San
34:54
Francisco
34:55
on
34:55
holidays,
34:56
and
34:56
we
34:56
went
34:57
into
34:57
one
34:57
of
34:57
those
34:57
plushie
34:58
stores,
34:59
and
35:00
we
35:00
saw
35:00
this
35:00
bear,
35:01
and
35:02
then
35:02
we
35:02
saw
35:02
this
35:02
outfit,
35:03
and
35:04
the
35:04
gal
35:04
helped
35:04
us
35:05
put
35:05
together
35:06
Caboose.
35:07
And
35:07
when
35:07
we
35:07
brought
35:07
the
35:08
plushie
35:09
home,
35:09
the
35:09
moment
35:10
my
35:10
granddaughter
35:11
Kira
35:11
saw
35:12
it,
35:12
she
35:12
went,
35:13
caboose.
35:13
Caboose.
35:14
She
35:14
knew
35:14
right
35:14
away
35:15
her
35:15
vision,
35:15
and
35:15
our
35:16
vision
35:16
was
35:16
exactly
35:17
the
35:17
same.
35:18
And
35:18
so
35:19
what
35:19
happened
35:19
was
35:20
we
35:20
sent
35:20
a
35:21
picture
35:21
of
35:21
Caboose
35:22
to
35:23
the
35:23
illustrator,
35:24
and
35:25
he
35:25
came
35:26
back
35:26
with
35:26
the
35:27
front
35:27
cover
35:27
of
35:27
our
35:27
book,
35:28
which
35:28
I
35:28
showed
35:28
you.
35:29
It
35:30
was
35:30
incredible.
35:30
And
35:31
the
35:31
beautiful
35:31
thing
35:32
about
35:32
it,
35:32
and
35:32
I
35:32
want
35:33
to
35:33
come.
35:33
I
35:33
want
35:33
to
35:33
pick
35:33
up
35:34
on
35:34
your
35:34
point
35:34
to
35:35
share
35:35
with
35:35
the
35:35
audience,
35:36
is
35:38
he
35:38
then
35:39
developed
35:40
the
35:40
feel
35:41
for
35:41
all
35:41
of
35:41
our
35:42
characters
35:42
around
35:43
how
35:44
he
35:44
had
35:44
put
35:44
Caboose
35:45
together.
35:46
All
35:46
of
35:46
our
35:46
characters
35:47
have
35:47
that
35:49
feel.
35:49
And
35:50
I
35:50
think
35:50
you
35:50
know
35:50
what
35:50
I'm
35:50
talking
35:51
about,
35:51
is
35:51
that
35:52
there's
35:52
continuity.
35:54
Yeah.
35:54
They
35:54
all
35:55
belong
35:55
in
35:55
that
35:55
world.
35:56
So
35:56
in
35:56
our
35:57
world,
35:57
it's
35:57
the
35:58
Adventures
35:58
of
35:58
Caboose,
35:59
and
35:59
all
36:00
of
36:00
our
36:00
characters
36:00
fit
36:01
into
36:01
that
36:01
world.
36:02
And
36:02
in
36:02
your
36:03
case,
36:03
you.
36:04
That's
36:04
what
36:04
you
36:04
wanted.
36:05
You
36:05
wanted
36:05
all
36:06
your
36:06
characters,
36:07
and
36:07
that's
36:08
what
36:08
the
36:08
illustrator's
36:09
done
36:09
for
36:09
you,
36:09
Chris.
36:10
Vision
36:10
and
36:11
needed
36:11
an
36:12
illustrator
36:12
to
36:14
complete
36:14
that
36:15
entire
36:15
vision.
36:15
Talk
36:16
to
36:16
us
36:16
about
36:16
how
36:16
you
36:17
found
36:17
your
36:17
illustrator
36:18
and
36:18
how
36:18
did
36:18
you
36:18
work
36:18
with
36:19
them.
36:19
Working
36:19
with
36:20
the
36:20
other
36:20
company,
36:20
I
36:21
knew
36:21
what
36:21
I
36:21
didn't
36:22
want,
36:23
and
36:23
so
36:23
that
36:23
was
36:24
top
36:24
of
36:24
the
36:24
list.
36:25
But
36:25
pastor
36:26
of
36:26
my
36:26
church
36:27
had
36:27
published
36:27
a
36:28
number
36:28
of
36:28
books.
36:29
Now,
36:29
they
36:29
weren't
36:30
children's
36:30
books
36:30
or
36:30
anything.
36:31
And
36:31
so
36:31
I
36:31
reached
36:32
out
36:32
to
36:32
him
36:32
and
36:32
I
36:32
said,
36:33
as
36:33
far
36:33
as.
36:34
How
36:34
are
36:34
you
36:35
putting
36:35
your
36:35
books
36:35
together?
36:35
What
36:36
are
36:36
you
36:36
doing?
36:36
And
36:37
he
36:37
turned
36:37
me
36:37
on
36:38
to.
36:38
Have
36:38
you
36:38
ever
36:39
heard
36:39
of
36:39
Upwork?
36:41
Yes.
36:41
Yeah,
36:41
he
36:42
turned
36:42
me
36:42
on.
36:42
I
36:42
didn't
36:42
know
36:43
about
36:43
that.
36:43
The
36:43
only
36:43
thing
36:43
I
36:43
knew
36:44
about
36:44
was.
36:44
Fiverr,
36:45
in
36:45
a
36:45
way.
36:45
Yeah.
36:46
Yeah.
36:46
The
36:46
only
36:46
thing
36:46
I
36:46
knew
36:47
about
36:47
was
36:47
Fiverr.
36:47
And
36:48
I
36:48
had
36:48
actually
36:48
started
36:49
looking
36:50
through
36:50
there,
36:50
and
36:51
I
36:52
can't
36:52
remember
36:53
if
36:53
I
36:53
actually
36:53
posted
36:54
anything
36:54
on
36:54
there
36:55
or
36:55
not,
36:56
but
36:56
started
36:57
looking
36:57
at
36:57
different
36:57
things,
36:58
and
36:58
I
36:59
don't
36:59
know,
36:59
nothing
37:00
was
37:00
really
37:00
resonating
37:01
with
37:01
me
37:01
out
37:01
of
37:01
Fiverr.
37:02
But
37:02
anyway,
37:02
he
37:03
turned
37:03
me
37:03
on
37:03
to
37:04
Upwork,
37:04
and
37:04
so
37:05
I
37:05
went
37:05
out
37:05
there,
37:06
looked
37:06
at
37:06
it,
37:06
and
37:08
as
37:08
far
37:08
as
37:08
the
37:09
site
37:09
goes,
37:09
it
37:10
seemed
37:12
to
37:12
me.
37:13
So
37:13
I
37:13
posted
37:14
an
37:14
ad
37:15
for
37:15
an
37:15
illustrator
37:16
for
37:16
three
37:17
children's
37:17
books.
37:18
One
37:18
of
37:19
my
37:19
requirements
37:20
was
37:21
image
37:22
likeness,
37:23
like
37:23
real
37:23
people.
37:25
And
37:25
Olivia
37:26
is
37:26
modeled
37:27
after
37:27
my
37:27
daughter.
37:29
So
37:29
one
37:29
of
37:29
the
37:29
criteria
37:30
was
37:31
that
37:31
that
37:32
we
37:32
can
37:32
create
37:33
an
37:33
image,
37:34
a
37:34
character
37:34
that
37:35
looks
37:35
similar
37:36
to,
37:36
say,
37:37
how
37:37
my
37:37
daughter
37:37
looked.
37:38
And
37:38
the
37:38
pop.
37:38
Pop
37:39
character
37:39
was
37:39
modeled
37:40
after
37:40
me
37:40
a
37:41
little
37:41
bit.
37:42
And
37:43
making
37:43
sure
37:43
that
37:44
whoever
37:44
we
37:44
selected
37:45
and
37:46
I
37:46
say
37:46
we,
37:46
it
37:46
was
37:46
me
37:47
and
37:47
my
37:47
wife
37:48
could
37:48
do
37:48
that.
37:49
I
37:49
put
37:49
the
37:49
ad
37:50
up.
37:50
I
37:50
got
37:51
two
37:51
or
37:51
three
37:51
dozen
37:52
responses
37:52
in,
37:53
started
37:53
working
37:53
my
37:54
way
37:54
through
37:54
people's
37:54
portfolios
37:55
and
37:55
looking
37:56
and
37:56
down
37:56
selected
37:57
to
37:57
about
37:57
six
37:58
people
37:59
and
37:59
then
37:59
just
37:59
started
38:00
having
38:00
informal
38:01
interviews
38:02
with
38:02
some
38:03
of
38:03
them
38:03
via
38:03
the
38:03
platform
38:04
upwork,
38:05
and
38:05
then
38:06
ended
38:06
up
38:06
talking
38:06
with
38:07
a
38:07
number
38:07
of
38:07
them
38:07
in
38:07
person.
38:08
So
38:08
we'd
38:08
set
38:08
up
38:09
some
38:09
time
38:09
and
38:10
I
38:10
threw
38:11
out.
38:11
My
38:11
criteria
38:12
was,
38:12
okay,
38:13
I
38:13
need
38:13
you
38:13
to
38:13
be
38:14
able
38:14
to
38:14
model
38:15
the
38:15
characters
38:16
after
38:17
real
38:18
life
38:18
people,
38:18
if
38:19
you
38:19
have
38:19
any
38:19
experience
38:19
in
38:20
doing
38:20
that.
38:21
And
38:22
are
38:22
you
38:22
up
38:22
for
38:22
three
38:23
books
38:23
and
38:24
taking
38:24
those
38:25
same
38:25
characters,
38:25
bringing
38:26
them
38:26
through
38:26
three
38:27
books.
38:28
So
38:28
I
38:29
down
38:29
selected
38:29
then
38:30
to
38:30
two.
38:31
And
38:32
one
38:32
of
38:32
them
38:32
was
38:33
actually
38:33
in
38:33
the
38:33
uk,
38:34
like
38:34
yours.
38:35
The
38:36
other
38:36
one
38:36
was
38:36
in
38:36
Canada.
38:37
It
38:38
would
38:38
have
38:38
been
38:38
nice
38:38
to
38:38
have
38:38
somebody
38:39
local,
38:39
but
38:40
it
38:40
just
38:40
wasn't
38:41
in
38:41
the
38:41
cards.
38:42
We
38:42
interviewed
38:43
both
38:43
of
38:43
them,
38:43
and
38:44
my
38:44
wife
38:45
make
38:45
the
38:45
final
38:45
decision
38:46
who
38:47
she
38:47
liked
38:47
the
38:47
most.
38:48
Both
38:48
of
38:48
them
38:49
were
38:49
incredible.
38:50
The
38:50
lady
38:50
in
38:51
UK
38:51
I'm
38:51
actually
38:52
considering
38:52
for
38:53
another
38:53
project
38:53
I'm
38:54
working
38:54
on.
38:54
I
38:54
didn't
38:55
discard
38:55
her
38:55
completely,
38:56
but
38:57
Lynette,
38:58
my
38:58
wife,
38:58
says,
38:58
I
38:58
like
38:59
Farheen
38:59
and
39:00
let's
39:00
go
39:00
with
39:00
her.
39:01
And
39:01
that's
39:01
what
39:01
we
39:01
did.
39:02
We
39:02
liked
39:02
her
39:03
style
39:04
and
39:04
she's
39:04
done
39:05
both
39:05
your
39:05
books.
39:06
She's
39:07
done.
39:07
Yeah.
39:07
The
39:07
same
39:07
illustrator
39:08
on
39:08
both
39:08
of
39:08
them.
39:08
She'll
39:08
do
39:09
the
39:09
third
39:09
one.
39:09
She
39:10
will
39:10
do
39:10
the
39:10
third
39:10
one.
39:10
Yeah,
39:11
I
39:11
noticed.
39:11
And
39:12
just
39:12
a
39:12
kind
39:12
of
39:13
a
39:13
quick
39:13
aside.
39:14
In
39:14
your
39:14
first
39:15
book,
39:15
you
39:16
didn't
39:16
really
39:16
mention
39:17
the
39:17
illustrator
39:19
second
39:19
book.
39:20
You
39:20
definitely
39:21
gave
39:21
the
39:21
illustrator
39:22
a
39:22
lot
39:22
more
39:23
credit.
39:24
So
39:24
tell
39:24
us
39:25
the
39:25
reason
39:25
you
39:25
did
39:25
that.
39:26
That
39:26
was
39:26
her
39:27
decision.
39:27
Okay.
39:28
For
39:28
whatever
39:28
reason,
39:29
I
39:29
think
39:29
it
39:29
was
39:30
because
39:30
she
39:30
was
39:31
in
39:31
the
39:31
process
39:32
of
39:33
moving
39:34
from
39:34
her
39:35
name
39:35
to
39:35
a
39:36
business
39:36
name
39:37
and
39:37
she
39:38
was
39:38
playing
39:38
around
39:39
with
39:39
several
39:39
different
39:40
variations
39:40
of
39:40
that
39:41
business
39:41
name
39:41
and
39:42
not
39:42
sure
39:42
exactly
39:43
how
39:44
to.
39:44
How
39:45
to
39:45
portray
39:45
herself
39:46
on
39:46
the
39:46
initial
39:46
cover.
39:47
Now
39:47
the
39:47
subsequent
39:48
cover
39:48
that
39:48
I
39:48
have
39:48
out
39:49
there
39:49
now,
39:50
it
39:50
actually
39:50
does
39:50
have
39:50
her
39:51
name
39:51
on
39:51
it.
39:51
So
39:52
we've
39:52
changed
39:52
the
39:52
COVID
39:53
a
39:53
little
39:53
bit
39:54
to
39:54
add
39:55
her
39:55
on
39:55
there.
39:56
But
39:56
in
39:56
between
39:57
book
39:57
one
39:57
and
39:57
she's.
39:58
Going
39:58
with
39:58
her
39:58
name
39:59
versus,
40:00
like,
40:00
on
40:00
the
40:01
ebook
40:01
that
40:01
I've
40:02
got,
40:02
it
40:02
shows
40:03
a
40:03
company
40:04
name.
40:05
Yeah.
40:05
On
40:06
the
40:06
Treasure
40:06
of
40:06
Kindness,
40:07
it's
40:07
actually
40:07
her
40:07
company
40:08
name
40:08
that's
40:09
on
40:09
there.
40:09
Is
40:09
that
40:10
how
40:10
she's
40:10
going
40:10
to
40:10
do
40:10
it
40:11
from
40:11
now
40:11
on?
40:11
That
40:11
was
40:11
her
40:12
choice.
40:12
That
40:12
was
40:12
her
40:12
decision.
40:13
No,
40:13
no.
40:13
And
40:13
I
40:14
just
40:14
want
40:14
people
40:14
to
40:14
understand
40:15
that
40:15
because
40:15
a
40:16
lot
40:16
of
40:16
times
40:17
when
40:17
people
40:18
see
40:18
a
40:18
company
40:19
name,
40:20
the
40:20
first
40:20
thing
40:20
they
40:21
go
40:21
to
40:21
is
40:22
they
40:22
think,
40:22
oh,
40:22
it's
40:22
AI.
40:23
Yeah.
40:24
So,
40:25
yeah,
40:25
no,
40:25
I
40:25
get
40:25
that.
40:26
But
40:26
if
40:26
you
40:26
look
40:26
through
40:26
the
40:27
book,
40:27
at
40:27
the
40:27
very
40:27
end,
40:28
we
40:28
got
40:28
her
40:28
to
40:28
add
40:29
an.
40:29
About
40:29
the
40:29
Illustrator
40:30
page
40:30
on
40:30
there.
40:31
Yeah,
40:31
I
40:31
love.
40:32
Yeah.
40:32
So
40:32
she
40:32
could
40:32
talk
40:32
about
40:33
herself
40:33
and
40:34
give
40:34
herself
40:35
the
40:35
credit.
40:35
Yes.
40:36
For
40:36
doing
40:36
this.
40:37
I
40:37
want
40:37
to
40:37
talk
40:37
to
40:37
you
40:37
about
40:37
your
40:38
website
40:38
development.
40:39
Is
40:39
it
40:40
the
40:40
chicken
40:40
or
40:41
the
40:41
egg
40:41
story?
40:42
When
40:42
it
40:42
came
40:43
to
40:43
developing
40:43
your
40:44
website,
40:44
did
40:45
you
40:45
have
40:45
your
40:45
website
40:46
before
40:46
you
40:47
launched
40:47
your
40:47
books
40:48
or
40:48
after
40:49
you
40:49
launched
40:49
your
40:49
book?
40:50
It
40:50
was
40:50
definitely
40:50
after.
40:51
I'll
40:51
be
40:51
honest
40:51
with
40:51
you,
40:52
Rick,
40:52
I
40:52
mentioned
40:52
it
40:52
earlier.
40:53
I've
40:53
run
40:53
a
40:53
small
40:54
business
40:54
for
40:55
many
40:55
years
40:56
and
40:56
I've
40:57
had
40:57
my
40:57
own
40:57
websites
40:58
and
40:59
trying
40:59
to
40:59
maintain
41:00
them
41:00
and
41:01
keep
41:01
the
41:01
content.
41:01
In
41:02
fact,
41:02
I
41:02
still
41:02
have
41:02
my
41:02
photography
41:04
up
41:04
and
41:04
going
41:05
and
41:05
trying
41:05
to
41:06
keep
41:06
current
41:06
with
41:07
content.
41:08
It's
41:08
just,
41:09
it's.
41:09
It's
41:09
difficult
41:10
for
41:10
me.
41:10
I
41:10
just,
41:11
I'm
41:11
a
41:11
super
41:11
busy
41:12
individual.
41:12
I
41:12
have
41:13
a
41:13
lot
41:13
going
41:13
on.
41:13
To
41:14
keep
41:14
it
41:14
updated
41:15
has
41:15
been
41:15
a
41:15
challenge
41:16
over
41:16
the
41:16
last
41:16
few
41:16
years.
41:17
Okay.
41:17
In
41:18
fact,
41:18
I
41:18
think
41:18
if
41:18
you
41:18
look,
41:19
my
41:19
last
41:19
blog
41:19
post
41:20
may
41:20
have
41:20
been.
41:20
It
41:20
might
41:20
be
41:21
two
41:21
years
41:21
old
41:22
on
41:22
that.
41:23
So
41:23
it
41:24
was
41:24
never
41:24
really
41:24
my
41:24
intention
41:25
to
41:25
do
41:26
an
41:26
author
41:26
website.
41:28
I
41:28
just
41:29
wanted
41:29
to
41:29
get
41:29
the
41:29
books
41:30
out
41:30
there
41:30
and
41:31
get
41:31
them
41:31
selling,
41:32
get
41:32
them
41:32
listed.
41:32
You
41:33
know
41:33
what,
41:33
Chris?
41:33
We
41:34
were
41:34
the
41:34
same
41:34
way
41:34
when
41:35
we
41:35
launched.
41:35
Somebody
41:36
said
41:36
all
41:36
you
41:36
need
41:37
to
41:37
do
41:38
is
41:38
have
41:38
a
41:39
QR
41:39
code,
41:40
link
41:40
it
41:41
to
41:41
Amazon
41:42
and
41:43
you're
41:43
golden.
41:44
Yeah.
41:44
And
41:45
that's
41:45
not
41:45
quite
41:46
the
41:46
truth.
41:47
It's
41:47
not
41:47
quite
41:47
the
41:48
truth,
41:48
yeah.
41:48
Now,
41:49
how
41:49
many
41:49
sales
41:49
have
41:50
I
41:50
generated
41:50
from
41:51
my
41:51
website,
41:51
from
41:51
my
41:52
book
41:52
website,
41:52
My
41:52
author
41:53
website?
41:53
I
41:53
have
41:53
no
41:54
idea.
41:54
There's
41:54
no
41:54
way
41:55
to
41:55
tell.
41:55
But
41:56
at
41:56
least
41:56
I
41:56
can
41:56
point
41:57
to.
41:57
To
41:58
a
41:58
place
41:58
that
41:58
people
41:59
can
41:59
go
41:59
and
42:00
they
42:00
can
42:00
look
42:00
at
42:01
the
42:01
books
42:02
probably
42:02
in
42:02
a
42:02
little
42:02
bit
42:03
more
42:03
detail
42:03
than
42:04
if
42:04
you
42:04
start
42:04
looking
42:04
at
42:05
some
42:05
of
42:05
the
42:05
blog
42:05
posts
42:06
I
42:06
put
42:06
on
42:06
there.
42:07
A
42:07
little
42:07
bit
42:07
more
42:07
detail
42:08
than
42:08
you
42:08
would
42:08
get
42:08
on
42:08
Amazon.
42:09
I
42:09
do
42:09
have
42:10
some
42:10
reviews
42:10
on
42:10
there.
42:11
It's
42:11
a
42:11
nice.
42:11
And
42:11
then
42:12
of
42:12
course,
42:12
with
42:12
some
42:12
of
42:12
the
42:13
other
42:13
books
42:13
I'm
42:13
writing,
42:14
I'm
42:14
trying
42:14
to
42:14
get
42:14
some
42:15
announcements
42:16
and
42:16
some
42:16
news
42:17
about
42:17
them
42:17
out
42:18
there
42:18
as
42:18
well.
42:18
If
42:19
Anybody's
42:19
interested
42:19
in
42:19
keeping
42:20
track
42:20
of
42:20
me
42:20
as
42:20
an
42:21
author,
42:21
that
42:21
would
42:22
be
42:22
the
42:22
place
42:22
to
42:22
go.
42:23
I
42:23
noticed
42:24
on
42:25
the
42:25
social
42:26
media
42:26
that
42:27
you
42:27
have
42:27
Facebook,
42:28
Instagram,
42:29
YouTube
42:30
and
42:31
Goodreads,
42:32
and
42:32
most
42:33
people
42:33
are
42:33
very
42:33
familiar
42:34
with
42:35
Facebook
42:35
and
42:36
Instagram.
42:37
Tell
42:37
us
42:37
a
42:37
little
42:37
bit
42:38
about
42:39
how
42:39
you're
42:39
using
42:40
YouTube
42:40
and
42:41
how
42:41
you're
42:41
using
42:41
Goodreads.
42:43
YouTube
42:43
comes
42:44
with
42:44
me
42:44
from
42:45
my
42:45
video
42:46
business,
42:47
my
42:47
video
42:47
days.
42:49
And
42:49
so
42:49
I
42:49
was
42:50
using
42:50
that
42:51
initially
42:52
to
42:52
introduce
42:53
some
42:53
of
42:53
the
42:54
characters
42:54
in
42:55
Scuba
42:55
Diving
42:56
Day.
42:56
So
42:56
there
42:57
was
42:57
an
42:57
introduction.
42:58
I
42:58
did
42:58
some
42:58
little
42:59
videos,
42:59
a
42:59
little
43:00
introduction
43:00
of
43:00
Olivia,
43:01
an
43:02
introduction
43:02
for
43:03
Ozzy
43:04
the
43:04
Octopus
43:05
and
43:05
Simon
43:06
the
43:06
Seahorse.
43:06
I
43:07
did
43:07
a
43:07
couple
43:07
little
43:08
videos
43:08
on
43:08
there
43:09
for
43:09
that.
43:10
Mr.
43:10
Mantish,
43:11
I
43:11
think,
43:11
showed
43:11
up
43:11
on
43:11
there.
43:12
I
43:12
did
43:13
a.
43:14
An
43:14
introduction.
43:16
It
43:16
was
43:16
a
43:17
voiceover.
43:17
I
43:18
can't
43:18
remember
43:18
the
43:19
site
43:19
that
43:19
I
43:19
used
43:19
to
43:20
create
43:20
the
43:20
voiceover,
43:21
but
43:21
I
43:21
started
43:21
doing
43:22
a
43:22
flip
43:22
through.
43:23
It
43:23
wasn't
43:24
an
43:24
author
43:24
reading,
43:25
but
43:25
it
43:25
was
43:26
one
43:26
of
43:26
those
43:26
sorts
43:26
of
43:26
things.
43:27
I
43:27
did
43:27
an
43:27
introduction
43:28
for
43:28
that,
43:28
got
43:28
that
43:28
out
43:29
there.
43:29
And
43:29
that's
43:30
how
43:30
I
43:30
was
43:30
using
43:31
YouTube.
43:32
Now,
43:32
did
43:32
I
43:32
do
43:33
that
43:33
for
43:34
the
43:34
Treasure
43:34
of
43:34
Kindness?
43:35
I
43:35
did
43:35
not.
43:37
And
43:37
it
43:37
was
43:37
only
43:38
because
43:38
of
43:38
time.
43:39
It
43:39
wasn't
43:39
anything
43:40
else.
43:40
We
43:40
had
43:41
some
43:41
family
43:42
thing.
43:42
Unfortunately,
43:43
my
43:43
mother
43:44
passed
43:44
in
43:45
October,
43:46
the
43:46
month
43:47
before
43:47
Captain
43:48
Olivia
43:48
was
43:49
scheduled
43:49
to
43:49
be
43:49
published.
43:50
And
43:50
so
43:51
marketing
43:52
was
43:52
the
43:53
last
43:53
thing.
43:53
And
43:54
trying
43:54
to.
43:54
Trying
43:54
to
43:54
get
43:55
this
43:55
story
43:55
out
43:55
there
43:56
was
43:56
the
43:56
last
43:56
thing
43:57
on
43:57
my
43:57
mind
43:58
during
43:58
that
43:59
time.
43:59
So
43:59
I
44:00
fell
44:00
off
44:00
a
44:01
little
44:01
bit
44:01
with
44:01
marketing.
44:02
The
44:02
second
44:03
book,
44:03
talk
44:03
to
44:04
us
44:04
about
44:04
Goodreads,
44:05
using
44:05
that,
44:06
I'm
44:06
learning
44:06
that
44:07
Goodreads
44:07
I
44:08
didn't
44:08
even
44:09
know
44:09
was
44:09
a
44:09
site
44:10
until
44:11
later
44:11
on.
44:11
I
44:12
think
44:12
I
44:12
had
44:12
already
44:12
published
44:13
Scuba
44:14
Diving
44:14
Day.
44:15
And
44:15
one
44:16
of
44:16
the
44:16
influencers,
44:17
and
44:17
I
44:17
use
44:17
that
44:18
term
44:18
lightly
44:19
from
44:19
Instagram,
44:21
approached
44:21
me
44:21
about
44:22
doing
44:22
a
44:22
book
44:23
review
44:24
and
44:24
they
44:25
said,
44:25
we'll
44:26
put
44:26
the
44:26
review
44:26
on
44:27
Goodreads.
44:28
And
44:29
I
44:29
was,
44:30
what
44:30
is
44:30
Goodreads?
44:31
So
44:31
I
44:31
had
44:31
to
44:31
go
44:31
out
44:32
and
44:32
look
44:32
at
44:32
that
44:32
and
44:33
see
44:33
what
44:33
that
44:33
was
44:34
all
44:34
about.
44:34
I
44:34
don't
44:35
really
44:35
use
44:35
it.
44:35
I
44:36
haven't
44:36
used
44:36
it
44:36
yet
44:37
as
44:37
a
44:37
marketing
44:38
tool
44:38
for
44:38
the
44:38
book.
44:39
Obviously
44:40
I
44:40
have
44:41
my
44:41
author
44:42
profile
44:42
on
44:42
there
44:42
now.
44:43
I
44:43
have
44:44
my
44:44
books
44:44
linked.
44:45
Books
44:45
that
44:45
I'm
44:45
reading,
44:46
I'm
44:46
now
44:46
putting
44:47
on
44:47
there.
44:47
So
44:48
if
44:48
anybody's
44:48
interested
44:48
in
44:49
following
44:49
me,
44:49
they
44:49
can
44:50
see
44:50
what
44:50
I'm
44:50
looking
44:50
at.
44:51
And
44:51
maybe
44:51
when
44:52
things
44:52
slow
44:52
down
44:52
a
44:52
little
44:53
bit,
44:53
I'll
44:53
put.
44:54
Probably
44:54
look
44:54
into
44:55
that
44:55
as
44:55
more
44:55
of
44:56
a
44:56
marketing
44:56
vehicle.
44:57
Are
44:57
you
44:57
able
44:58
to
44:58
put
44:58
any
44:58
reviews
44:59
that
44:59
you've
44:59
gotten
45:00
from
45:00
other
45:01
people
45:01
on
45:02
that
45:02
site?
45:02
They
45:03
actually
45:03
will
45:03
put
45:03
them
45:04
on
45:04
there
45:04
themselves.
45:04
They
45:05
have
45:05
to
45:05
have
45:05
their
45:06
own,
45:06
their
45:06
own
45:07
profiles
45:07
to,
45:08
to
45:08
put
45:08
on
45:08
there
45:09
and
45:09
then
45:09
they
45:09
link
45:09
it
45:09
back
45:10
to
45:10
that
45:11
book.
45:11
I've
45:11
had
45:11
a
45:12
couple
45:12
of
45:12
really
45:12
nice
45:12
reviews
45:13
for
45:14
both
45:14
books
45:14
on
45:15
there.
45:15
There's
45:16
one
45:16
gal
45:18
that
45:18
has
45:19
done
45:19
both
45:19
of
45:19
my
45:20
books.
45:20
She's
45:20
been
45:21
really
45:21
nice
45:21
and
45:21
I've
45:22
actually
45:22
been
45:22
able
45:22
to
45:22
take
45:22
her
45:23
review
45:23
and
45:24
use
45:24
that
45:24
as
45:24
an
45:25
ed
45:25
review
45:26
on
45:26
Amazon.
45:27
Been
45:27
able
45:28
to
45:28
post
45:28
that
45:28
in
45:28
there.
45:29
So
45:29
that
45:29
was
45:29
really
45:29
nice.
45:30
And
45:30
then
45:31
a
45:31
few
45:31
other
45:31
people
45:31
have
45:32
posted
45:33
their
45:33
reviews
45:33
of
45:33
the
45:34
books
45:34
on
45:34
there
45:34
and
45:35
they've
45:35
all
45:35
been
45:35
incredibly
45:36
nice.
45:36
Very
45:37
generous,
45:37
I
45:37
would
45:38
say,
45:38
which
45:39
is
45:39
nice.
45:39
Makes
45:39
me
45:40
feel
45:40
good.
45:40
Yeah,
45:41
no,
45:41
no
45:41
doubt
45:41
about
45:42
it.
45:42
And
45:42
have
45:42
you
45:43
added
45:43
those
45:43
reviews
45:44
to
45:44
your
45:44
website
45:44
to
45:44
also.
45:45
Yep.
45:45
So
45:46
you
45:46
can
45:46
go
45:46
back
45:46
on
45:47
my
45:47
website.
45:47
There's
45:48
a
45:48
page
45:48
there
45:49
that
45:49
says
45:49
reviews
45:50
and
45:51
a
45:51
couple
45:51
of
45:51
them,
45:52
I
45:52
just
45:52
copied
45:52
the
45:53
text
45:53
in
45:53
there.
45:54
Some
45:54
of
45:54
the
45:55
other
45:55
ones,
45:55
I
45:55
think
45:55
it's
45:55
the
45:56
ones
45:56
on
45:56
Amazon
45:57
are
45:57
links
45:57
back
45:57
to
45:58
Amazon
45:59
so
45:59
you
45:59
can
45:59
just
46:00
click
46:00
on
46:00
them
46:00
and
46:00
it'll
46:01
bring
46:01
you
46:01
right
46:01
over
46:01
to
46:01
the
46:01
page.
46:02
Right
46:02
over
46:02
to
46:02
those
46:02
reviews.
46:03
Yeah,
46:03
yeah,
46:04
yeah.
46:04
It's
46:04
pretty
46:04
amazing.
46:05
And
46:05
I
46:05
don't
46:06
know
46:06
if
46:06
you
46:06
ever
46:07
watch
46:07
prime,
46:08
which
46:08
is
46:08
owned
46:09
by
46:09
Amazon,
46:10
but
46:10
now
46:10
that
46:10
they've
46:11
got
46:11
commercials,
46:12
a
46:12
lot
46:12
of
46:13
times
46:13
it'll
46:14
pop
46:14
up
46:14
with
46:15
available
46:16
on
46:16
Amazon.
46:17
They'll
46:17
put
46:17
the
46:17
QR
46:17
codes.
46:18
Yeah.
46:18
I'm
46:19
thinking,
46:19
you
46:19
know
46:19
what,
46:20
that's
46:21
the
46:21
next
46:21
evolution
46:22
of
46:22
your
46:22
website
46:24
is
46:24
you
46:24
got
46:24
to
46:24
start
46:24
adding
46:25
these
46:25
QR
46:25
codes
46:26
to
46:26
your.
46:26
Oh
46:27
my
46:27
gosh.
46:28
I
46:28
couldn't
46:29
imagine.
46:29
I
46:29
don't
46:29
know
46:29
what
46:29
their
46:30
click
46:30
through
46:30
rate
46:30
is
46:30
on
46:31
that
46:31
stuff,
46:31
but
46:32
I
46:32
could
46:32
only
46:32
imagine
46:33
how
46:33
much
46:33
that
46:33
would
46:34
cost
46:35
a
46:35
show
46:36
like
46:36
Rings
46:36
of
46:37
Power
46:37
or
46:37
something
46:37
like
46:38
that
46:38
to
46:38
have
46:38
your
46:38
QR
46:39
code
46:40
pop
46:40
up.
46:40
It's
46:40
probably
46:41
going
46:41
to
46:41
cost
46:41
you
46:41
a.
46:41
Pretty
46:42
penny,
46:43
no
46:43
doubt
46:44
about
46:44
it.
46:45
Yeah.
46:45
I
46:45
want
46:46
to
46:46
jump
46:46
into
46:46
character
46:47
development
46:48
because
46:48
the
46:48
nice
46:49
thing
46:49
about
46:49
it
46:50
is
46:51
because
46:51
this
46:52
is
46:52
the
46:52
first
46:52
time
46:52
we're
46:52
meeting,
46:53
I
46:54
thought
46:54
that
46:54
your
46:55
granddaughter,
46:56
I
46:56
know
46:56
she
46:56
was
46:56
the
46:57
inspiration
46:57
behind
46:58
your
46:58
books.
46:59
Yeah.
46:59
But
46:59
I
47:00
had
47:00
envisioned
47:01
that
47:01
she
47:01
was
47:01
older.
47:02
I
47:02
didn't
47:02
realize
47:03
that
47:03
was
47:03
actually
47:04
your
47:04
daughter
47:05
who
47:06
you
47:06
used
47:06
your
47:07
daughter's
47:07
likeness
47:08
as
47:08
Olivia.
47:09
Yeah,
47:10
I
47:10
had
47:11
to
47:11
do
47:11
that
47:11
because.
47:12
Newborn
47:12
baby.
47:13
Yeah.
47:14
A
47:15
little
47:15
too
47:15
soon.
47:15
I
47:16
suppose
47:16
you
47:16
could
47:16
use
47:16
some,
47:17
some
47:17
aging
47:17
software
47:18
to
47:18
see
47:18
what
47:19
they
47:19
might
47:19
look.
47:19
Yeah.
47:20
But
47:21
yeah,
47:21
Olivia,
47:22
the
47:22
character
47:23
is
47:23
more
47:24
modeled
47:25
both
47:25
in
47:25
likeness
47:26
and
47:26
in
47:27
her
47:28
expression,
47:29
her
47:29
attitude,
47:30
her
47:30
adventurousness
47:31
is
47:31
more
47:32
modeled
47:32
after
47:32
my
47:32
daughter.
47:33
I
47:33
would
47:33
envision
47:34
that
47:35
Olivia
47:35
is
47:36
going
47:36
to
47:36
be
47:36
exactly
47:37
like
47:37
her
47:37
mom.
47:38
She's
47:38
already
47:38
showing
47:39
that
47:39
it's
47:40
probably
47:40
not
47:40
too
47:40
much
47:40
of
47:40
A
47:41
stretch.
47:41
Chris
47:41
has
47:42
written
47:42
these
47:42
two
47:42
books.
47:43
Of
47:43
course,
47:43
Olivia
47:44
is
47:45
the
47:45
main
47:45
character,
47:46
except
47:47
the
47:47
circumstances
47:48
for
47:49
each
47:49
book
47:49
is
47:50
different.
47:51
The
47:51
role
47:52
that
47:52
Olivia
47:53
plays
47:53
is
47:54
different.
47:55
The
47:55
one
47:55
common
47:56
element
47:57
is
47:58
water.
47:59
Water
48:00
plays
48:00
a
48:00
big
48:00
role
48:01
in
48:01
both
48:02
your
48:02
books,
48:02
Chris.
48:03
So
48:03
tell
48:03
us,
48:04
why
48:04
does
48:04
water
48:05
play
48:05
a
48:05
big
48:05
role
48:06
in
48:06
both
48:06
your
48:06
books?
48:06
And
48:07
in
48:07
essence,
48:07
it's
48:08
a
48:08
character.
48:08
Oh,
48:08
absolutely.
48:09
It's
48:09
a
48:09
character.
48:10
I
48:10
grew
48:11
up
48:11
in
48:11
the
48:11
Seattle
48:12
area,
48:13
and
48:13
so
48:13
we've
48:13
always
48:14
been
48:14
around
48:15
water.
48:15
Even
48:16
taking
48:16
that
48:16
aside,
48:17
one
48:17
of
48:17
the
48:18
many
48:18
things
48:18
that
48:18
I
48:19
do
48:19
is
48:20
I
48:20
teach
48:20
people
48:21
how
48:21
to
48:21
scuba
48:21
dive
48:22
on
48:23
the
48:23
weekends,
48:23
and
48:24
I
48:24
wouldn't
48:25
do
48:25
that
48:25
if
48:26
the
48:27
water
48:27
wasn't
48:27
important
48:28
to
48:28
me.
48:29
So
48:29
the
48:29
water
48:30
for
48:30
me
48:31
is.
48:31
It's
48:32
very
48:32
calming.
48:33
It's
48:33
a
48:34
place
48:34
to
48:34
just
48:34
reset
48:35
myself
48:36
when
48:37
I'm
48:37
not
48:37
teaching.
48:38
That's
48:38
a
48:38
whole
48:39
nother
48:39
animal.
48:40
But
48:40
just
48:40
to
48:41
reset,
48:41
set
48:42
myself
48:42
from
48:43
a
48:43
mental
48:43
standpoint,
48:44
a
48:44
hard
48:44
week.
48:45
I'll
48:45
just
48:45
go
48:46
sit
48:46
in
48:46
the
48:46
water
48:47
and
48:47
at
48:48
whatever
48:48
depth
48:48
I'm
48:49
at
48:49
and
48:49
just
48:49
watch
48:49
fish.
48:50
I
48:50
love
48:50
it.
48:51
It's
48:52
very
48:52
calming.
48:53
I
48:53
call
48:53
it
48:53
Zen
48:55
now,
48:55
being
48:56
that
48:56
I'm
48:57
an
48:57
avid
48:57
scuba
48:58
diver,
48:58
I
48:58
got
48:59
both
48:59
of
48:59
my
48:59
kids
48:59
into
48:59
scuba
49:00
diving
49:00
at
49:01
different
49:01
points
49:02
in
49:02
their
49:02
lives.
49:03
I
49:03
would
49:04
envision
49:04
that
49:04
if
49:05
I'm
49:05
still
49:05
doing
49:05
this
49:06
in
49:06
10
49:06
years,
49:07
which
49:07
there's
49:08
no
49:08
reason
49:08
to
49:08
believe,
49:08
I
49:09
wouldn't
49:09
be
49:09
that
49:10
Olivia
49:10
is
49:10
going
49:11
to
49:11
want
49:11
to
49:11
do
49:11
it
49:11
too.
49:12
I
49:12
have
49:13
these
49:13
adventures
49:13
underwater.
49:15
Why
49:15
not
49:15
take
49:16
my
49:16
daughter
49:16
or
49:16
my
49:16
granddaughter
49:17
along
49:17
with
49:17
me
49:18
so
49:18
she
49:18
can
49:18
experience
49:19
this
49:20
as
49:20
well?
49:21
Yeah.
49:21
And
49:22
spend
49:22
time
49:22
with
49:23
her
49:23
Pop
49:23
Pop.
49:24
So
49:24
for
49:24
sure.
49:25
Yeah,
49:25
absolutely.
49:26
The
49:26
other
49:27
thing
49:27
I
49:27
wanted
49:27
to
49:27
talk
49:28
to
49:28
you
49:28
about
49:28
is
49:28
that
49:29
the
49:29
parrot
49:30
plays
49:30
a
49:30
big
49:31
role
49:31
in
49:32
your
49:32
second
49:32
book.
49:33
Talk
49:33
to
49:33
us
49:33
about
49:34
that
49:34
whole
49:35
development,
49:35
because
49:36
I
49:36
know
49:36
there's
49:36
all
49:37
these
49:37
characters.
49:38
Most
49:38
of
49:38
them
49:38
are
49:39
the
49:39
crew,
49:39
the
49:40
parrot,
49:40
Jojo.
49:41
So
49:41
I've
49:42
never
49:42
owned
49:42
a
49:42
parrot.
49:43
I
49:44
don't
49:44
know
49:45
how
49:45
they
49:45
behave
49:46
or
49:46
how
49:46
they
49:46
act,
49:46
except
49:47
for
49:47
on
49:48
TV
49:48
and
49:49
in
49:49
the
49:49
movies.
49:50
Originally,
49:51
when
49:51
I
49:52
was
49:52
fleshing
49:53
out
49:53
the
49:53
idea
49:54
for
49:54
the
49:54
Treasure
49:55
of
49:55
Kindness,
49:56
it
49:56
wasn't
49:57
Olivia.
49:57
It
49:57
was
49:57
a
49:58
completely
49:58
new
49:58
character.
50:00
And
50:00
it
50:00
was
50:01
more
50:01
of
50:01
the
50:02
swashbuckling
50:03
pirate
50:04
type.
50:05
And
50:05
of
50:06
course,
50:07
in
50:08
most
50:09
books
50:09
and
50:10
movies
50:10
and
50:11
that
50:11
kind
50:11
of
50:11
stuff,
50:12
pop
50:12
culture
50:12
type
50:12
things
50:13
that
50:13
you
50:13
see.
50:13
Every
50:14
pirate
50:14
has
50:14
a
50:14
parrot.
50:15
Jojo.
50:16
The
50:16
parrot
50:17
was
50:17
introduced
50:18
into
50:18
the
50:19
book
50:19
as
50:20
just
50:20
more
50:20
of
50:21
that's
50:21
what
50:21
pirates
50:22
have.
50:22
That's
50:22
what
50:22
they
50:23
do.
50:24
And
50:24
of
50:24
course,
50:24
then
50:25
it.
50:25
The
50:25
book
50:26
morphed
50:26
into
50:27
Captain
50:27
Olivia,
50:28
but
50:28
I
50:28
still
50:28
had
50:28
to
50:29
keep
50:29
the
50:29
parrot.
50:30
Now,
50:30
the
50:30
parrot
50:31
does
50:31
play
50:31
a
50:32
pivotal
50:32
role
50:33
in
50:33
the
50:34
plot
50:34
of
50:34
the
50:34
book,
50:35
in
50:36
what
50:36
it
50:37
does,
50:37
right
50:37
off
50:38
the
50:38
bat.
50:38
I
50:38
don't
50:38
know
50:38
if
50:39
you
50:39
want
50:39
me
50:39
to
50:39
get
50:39
into
50:39
those
50:40
kinds
50:40
of
50:40
details.
50:41
I'm
50:41
interested
50:42
in
50:42
with
50:42
the
50:43
character
50:43
development,
50:44
relationship
50:45
between
50:46
Captain
50:46
Olivia
50:47
and
50:47
JoJo.
50:48
Certainly
50:50
talk
50:50
to
50:51
us
50:51
about
50:51
that.
50:52
Like
50:52
I
50:52
said,
50:52
the
50:52
parrot
50:53
is
50:54
always
50:55
part
50:55
of
50:55
the
50:55
pirate
50:56
lore,
50:56
so
50:57
it
50:57
made
50:57
sense
50:58
to
50:58
have
50:59
a
50:59
parrot
51:00
in
51:00
the
51:00
book
51:02
also
51:02
providing
51:03
those
51:03
pivotal
51:04
plot
51:04
points
51:05
in
51:05
the
51:05
book.
51:06
Because
51:06
how
51:07
do
51:07
you
51:07
bring
51:07
something
51:08
in
51:09
into
51:09
the
51:10
book?
51:10
Oh,
51:10
the
51:10
parrot
51:11
can
51:11
find
51:11
it
51:11
and
51:11
can
51:12
bring
51:12
it
51:12
in.
51:12
Look
51:12
what
51:13
it
51:13
ran
51:13
across.
51:13
And
51:14
here.
51:14
Now
51:14
you've
51:14
brought
51:15
that
51:15
element
51:15
into
51:16
the
51:16
book
51:16
without
51:17
having
51:17
to
51:17
go
51:17
off
51:17
in
51:18
some
51:18
arc
51:19
that
51:19
may
51:20
not
51:20
be
51:20
appropriate
51:21
for
51:21
a
51:22
children's
51:22
book.
51:23
Okay.
51:24
But
51:24
when
51:24
you
51:25
get
51:25
to
51:25
the
51:26
end
51:26
of
51:26
the
51:26
book,
51:26
there's
51:27
a
51:27
twist.
51:27
I
51:27
don't
51:27
know
51:28
if
51:28
you've
51:28
read
51:28
it
51:28
or
51:28
not.
51:28
Yes,
51:29
I
51:29
did.
51:29
I
51:29
read
51:29
the
51:29
whole
51:29
couple
51:30
of
51:30
times.
51:30
That
51:31
twist
51:31
at
51:31
the
51:31
end
51:32
where
51:33
Olivia
51:33
then
51:33
comes
51:34
back
51:34
to
51:35
reality
51:36
a
51:36
little
51:36
bit
51:36
and
51:37
the
51:38
parrot
51:38
ends
51:39
up
51:39
being
51:39
one
51:40
of
51:40
her
51:40
toys.
51:41
The
51:41
nice
51:41
thing
51:42
about
51:42
it
51:42
is,
51:42
like
51:43
you
51:43
said,
51:43
and
51:43
I
51:44
just
51:44
want
51:44
the
51:44
audience
51:44
to
51:44
understand
51:45
without
51:45
giving
51:45
this
51:46
too
51:46
much
51:46
of
51:46
the
51:47
story
51:47
away,
51:47
but
51:48
there
51:48
is,
51:49
like
51:49
all
51:49
good
51:50
treasure
51:51
stories,
51:51
there
51:51
is
51:52
a
51:52
treasure
51:52
map
51:54
and
51:54
how
51:54
it.
51:55
On
51:55
how
51:56
it
51:56
unveils
51:56
itself.
51:57
And
51:58
thanks
51:58
to
51:58
the
51:59
JoJo.
51:59
Yes,
52:00
thanks
52:00
to
52:00
JoJo.
52:01
That
52:01
was
52:01
the
52:01
piece.
52:01
I
52:02
was
52:02
saying
52:02
the
52:02
parrot
52:03
brings
52:03
that
52:04
plot
52:04
point
52:04
in,
52:05
brings
52:05
the
52:05
map
52:06
into
52:06
the
52:07
story.
52:07
It
52:07
finds
52:08
the
52:08
map,
52:09
and,
52:09
you
52:10
know,
52:10
rather
52:10
than
52:10
having
52:11
to
52:11
write
52:11
something
52:11
where
52:12
Olivia
52:12
and
52:13
her
52:13
crew
52:13
find
52:14
it
52:14
doing
52:14
something
52:15
else,
52:15
JoJo
52:16
brings
52:17
it
52:17
into
52:17
the
52:17
story.
52:18
I
52:18
think
52:19
that's.
52:19
People
52:20
love
52:20
that.
52:21
I
52:21
think
52:21
most
52:21
people
52:22
envision
52:22
a
52:22
parrot
52:23
as
52:23
being
52:23
playful
52:24
and
52:25
curious.
52:26
And
52:26
that's
52:26
what
52:26
you've
52:27
done
52:27
with
52:27
JoJo.
52:28
Yeah,
52:28
definitely
52:29
play.
52:29
He's,
52:30
I
52:30
think,
52:30
on
52:30
every
52:30
page
52:31
in
52:31
the
52:31
book,
52:32
if
52:32
not
52:32
in
52:33
the
52:33
forefront,
52:33
at
52:33
least
52:34
in
52:34
the
52:34
background.
52:34
He
52:35
obviously
52:35
plays
52:36
a
52:37
very
52:37
important
52:38
part
52:38
of
52:39
Olivia's
52:39
life.
52:40
When
52:41
we
52:41
start
52:41
getting
52:41
into
52:42
the
52:42
acts
52:42
of
52:42
kindness,
52:43
then
52:43
as
52:44
well,
52:44
even
52:45
JoJo
52:45
takes
52:46
part
52:46
in
52:47
those
52:47
acts.
52:48
So
52:48
he's
52:49
not
52:49
just
52:49
a
52:49
passive
52:50
observer
52:50
of
52:51
that.
52:51
He
52:51
actually
52:51
gets
52:52
in.
52:52
Let's
52:52
pick
52:53
up
52:53
on
52:53
that
52:53
theme
52:54
of
52:54
kindness.
52:55
Because
52:55
when
52:55
I
52:56
first
52:56
read
52:56
the
52:56
title
52:57
of
52:57
your
52:57
book,
52:57
and
52:57
I
52:57
thought,
52:58
wow,
52:59
what
52:59
triggered
53:00
this?
53:02
When
53:02
you
53:02
think
53:02
of
53:02
treasure,
53:04
I
53:04
don't
53:04
think
53:04
most
53:05
people
53:05
think
53:06
of
53:06
kindness.
53:07
Yeah.
53:08
And
53:08
so
53:08
it's
53:09
really
53:09
a
53:09
nice
53:09
twist
53:10
because
53:10
it's.
53:10
Yeah,
53:11
it's
53:11
a
53:11
positive
53:12
thing.
53:13
But
53:13
explain
53:13
to
53:14
us
53:14
how
53:14
that
53:15
whole
53:15
idea
53:16
of
53:16
treasure,
53:17
of
53:17
kindness
53:18
came
53:18
to
53:19
you.
53:20
I
53:20
think
53:20
most
53:21
treasure
53:22
pirate
53:22
stories,
53:23
they're
53:23
looking
53:23
for
53:24
a
53:24
chest
53:25
of
53:25
gold
53:26
and
53:26
silver
53:26
and
53:27
jewels
53:27
and
53:27
all
53:27
that
53:28
and
53:29
as
53:29
the
53:30
story
53:30
morphed
53:31
out
53:31
of
53:31
some
53:32
renegade
53:32
pirate
53:33
who's
53:34
nice
53:35
into
53:35
Olivia,
53:36
I
53:37
started
53:37
thinking,
53:38
what
53:38
good
53:38
is
53:38
a
53:39
bunch
53:39
of
53:39
gold
53:39
and
53:39
silver
53:41
and
53:41
jewel's
53:41
going
53:42
to
53:42
be
53:42
for
53:42
10
53:43
year
53:43
old
53:43
child?
53:44
There's
53:45
just
53:45
no
53:45
value
53:46
in
53:46
it.
53:47
And
53:48
one
53:48
of
53:48
the
53:49
things
53:49
that
53:49
I
53:49
wanted
53:49
to
53:49
do
53:49
with
53:50
all
53:50
of
53:50
my
53:50
books,
53:50
Rick,
53:51
was
53:51
make
53:51
sure
53:52
that
53:52
there's
53:52
some
53:52
sort
53:53
of
53:53
value
53:53
lesson
53:54
in
53:54
it.
53:55
So
53:56
Scuba
53:56
Diving
53:56
Day
53:57
had
53:57
its
53:57
own
53:57
set
53:58
and
53:59
the
53:59
Treasure
53:59
of
53:59
Kindness
54:01
has
54:01
its
54:01
own.
54:01
And
54:02
obviously
54:02
it's
54:02
right
54:02
in
54:03
the
54:03
title
54:03
there.
54:04
But
54:04
when
54:04
you
54:04
think
54:04
of
54:05
pirates
54:05
and
54:06
buccaneers
54:06
and
54:07
all
54:07
that,
54:07
you
54:07
generally
54:08
don't
54:08
think
54:08
of
54:09
them
54:10
being
54:10
very
54:10
kind.
54:11
There's
54:11
all
54:12
kinds
54:12
of
54:12
pirate
54:12
stories.
54:17
Yeah,
54:17
sharks.
54:18
Yeah,
54:18
exactly.
54:19
Anyway,
54:20
I
54:20
wanted
54:21
to
54:22
instill
54:23
some
54:23
sort
54:23
of
54:23
value
54:24
message
54:24
into
54:25
the
54:25
book
54:25
and
54:26
how
54:27
can
54:27
I
54:27
do
54:27
that?
54:28
And
54:28
whether
54:28
originally.
54:29
Okay.
54:30
She's
54:30
searching
54:30
for
54:31
a
54:31
treasure,
54:32
but
54:32
along
54:32
the
54:33
way
54:33
she
54:34
sees
54:35
opportunities
54:36
to
54:36
help
54:37
others
54:37
along
54:37
the
54:38
way
54:38
to
54:39
be
54:39
kind,
54:40
to
54:40
show
54:40
acts
54:41
of
54:41
compassion,
54:42
to
54:42
help
54:42
out.
54:43
And
54:43
it
54:44
just.
54:44
Just
54:44
morphed
54:45
itself
54:45
into
54:46
that.
54:46
That
54:46
could
54:46
be
54:47
why.
54:48
That
54:48
could
54:48
be
54:48
what
54:49
she's
54:49
after.
54:49
It's
54:50
not
54:50
a
54:50
treasure.
54:50
And
54:51
these
54:52
opportunities
54:53
to
54:53
help
54:53
others
54:54
doesn't
54:56
get
54:56
her
54:56
closer
54:57
to
54:57
a
54:57
treasure
54:58
per
54:58
se.
54:58
A
54:58
treasure
54:59
of
54:59
gold
54:59
and
54:59
silver
55:00
and
55:00
jewels,
55:00
but
55:01
some
55:01
other
55:01
sort
55:01
of
55:02
treasure.
55:02
What
55:02
can
55:02
that
55:03
be?
55:03
Okay.
55:03
And
55:04
that's
55:04
that.
55:04
And
55:04
that
55:04
was
55:05
the
55:05
progression
55:05
of.
55:05
So
55:06
did
55:06
you.
55:07
Was
55:08
it
55:08
the
55:08
storyline
55:09
first
55:09
or
55:10
was
55:10
it
55:10
the
55:11
title
55:12
of
55:12
the
55:12
book
55:12
first?
55:14
It
55:14
was
55:14
more
55:14
of
55:14
the
55:14
storyline.
55:16
So
55:16
it's
55:16
an
55:17
evolution.
55:17
No,
55:18
Very
55:18
important.
55:19
Yeah,
55:19
yeah,
55:20
yeah.
55:21
It
55:21
was
55:21
very
55:21
much
55:21
about
55:22
gold
55:22
and
55:22
silver.
55:23
Okay.
55:24
At
55:24
the
55:24
beginning.
55:24
And
55:24
like
55:25
I
55:25
said,
55:25
it
55:25
just
55:25
didn't
55:25
really
55:25
make
55:26
sense
55:26
the
55:26
more
55:26
you
55:27
start
55:27
going
55:28
through
55:28
this.
55:28
And
55:28
I'm
55:29
the
55:29
type
55:29
of
55:29
individual,
55:29
individual
55:30
that
55:30
I
55:30
work
55:31
from
55:31
an
55:31
outline.
55:32
Okay,
55:32
let's
55:32
pick
55:33
up
55:33
on
55:33
your
55:33
writing
55:34
process.
55:34
Okay.
55:35
Based
55:35
on
55:35
what
55:36
you're
55:36
saying,
55:36
can
55:37
you
55:37
share
55:37
some
55:38
insights
55:38
into
55:39
your
55:40
development
55:40
process
55:41
for
55:41
the
55:41
storyline
55:42
and
55:43
then
55:43
your
55:43
writing
55:44
process?
55:44
Because
55:45
you
55:45
came
55:46
to
55:46
the
55:46
party
55:47
with
55:47
three
55:47
books
55:48
in
55:48
a
55:48
series
55:48
in
55:49
your
55:49
head.
55:50
Yeah.
55:50
That
55:51
wasn't
55:51
originally
55:52
what
55:52
it
55:52
was.
55:52
It
55:52
was
55:53
just
55:53
gonna
55:53
be.
55:53
It
55:53
was
55:54
originally.
55:54
It
55:54
was
55:54
going
55:54
to
55:54
be
55:54
a
55:54
one
55:55
off.
55:55
Okay.
55:56
Yeah,
55:57
it
55:57
was.
55:57
So
55:58
take
55:58
us
55:58
through
55:58
this.
55:58
Give
55:59
us
55:59
some
55:59
insights
56:00
into
56:00
your
56:00
whole.
56:01
The
56:01
development
56:02
and
56:02
then
56:02
your
56:02
writing
56:03
process.
56:04
I'm
56:04
gonna
56:04
go
56:04
back
56:05
to
56:05
that
56:05
hybrid
56:06
company
56:06
that
56:07
I
56:07
was
56:07
working
56:07
with
56:07
at
56:08
the
56:08
very
56:08
start.
56:09
So
56:09
it
56:09
was
56:09
just
56:10
the
56:10
one
56:10
book
56:11
and
56:12
they
56:12
liked
56:12
the
56:12
story.
56:13
I
56:13
won't
56:13
lie
56:14
about
56:14
that.
56:14
They
56:15
love
56:15
the
56:15
story
56:15
and
56:16
they
56:16
love
56:16
the
56:16
character
56:17
and
56:18
they
56:18
said
56:18
you
56:18
really
56:19
need
56:19
to
56:19
think
56:20
about
56:21
turning
56:21
this
56:21
into
56:23
more
56:23
than
56:23
just
56:24
one
56:24
book.
56:25
Now,
56:25
they
56:25
may
56:26
have
56:26
their
56:26
motivation
56:27
for
56:27
that
56:27
and
56:27
we
56:28
won't
56:28
get
56:28
into
56:28
that,
56:29
but
56:29
they
56:29
convinced
56:30
me
56:30
to
56:31
do
56:31
a
56:31
three
56:32
story
56:32
book
56:33
with
56:33
Olivia.
56:34
And
56:35
three
56:35
stories
56:35
make
56:36
sense
56:36
for
56:36
the
56:36
character.
56:37
And
56:37
Olivia
56:38
will
56:38
only
56:38
get
56:38
three
56:39
stories
56:40
before
56:40
I
56:40
move
56:40
to
56:41
something
56:41
else.
56:42
But
56:42
they
56:42
convinced
56:43
me
56:43
to
56:44
write
56:45
three
56:45
books.
56:46
And
56:46
so
56:47
it
56:47
was
56:47
like,
56:48
okay,
56:48
I
56:49
could
56:49
do
56:49
that.
56:50
I
56:50
think
56:50
I
56:50
can
56:51
do
56:51
that.
56:51
What's
56:52
amazing
56:52
to
56:52
me
56:53
is
56:53
that
56:55
it's
56:55
cool
56:55
what
56:56
you
56:56
did
56:56
because
56:57
like
56:57
I
56:57
said
56:58
to
56:58
you,
56:58
even
56:59
though
56:59
Olivia
57:00
is
57:00
the
57:01
main
57:01
character,
57:02
the
57:03
circumstances
57:04
of
57:04
both
57:05
your
57:05
books,
57:05
it's
57:06
totally
57:06
different
57:07
in
57:08
terms
57:08
of
57:08
this.
57:09
Of
57:09
the
57:10
setting.
57:10
Assuming
57:11
the
57:11
third
57:12
one
57:12
will
57:12
be
57:12
different.
57:13
Again,
57:13
the
57:14
third
57:14
one
57:14
is
57:14
going
57:14
to
57:14
be
57:15
completely
57:15
different
57:16
than
57:16
these
57:16
two.
57:16
So
57:17
you
57:17
touched
57:17
on
57:17
it
57:17
a
57:18
little
57:18
earlier
57:18
with
57:19
both
57:19
of
57:19
these
57:19
have
57:20
ocean
57:20
themes
57:21
in
57:21
them.
57:22
The
57:22
third
57:22
book
57:23
does
57:23
not.
57:24
It
57:24
does
57:24
not.
57:25
We
57:25
are
57:25
in
57:26
terra
57:26
firma,
57:27
if
57:27
you
57:27
will.
57:29
Yeah.
57:30
And
57:30
I
57:30
can
57:30
talk
57:31
a
57:31
little
57:31
bit
57:31
more
57:31
about
57:31
that
57:31
if
57:32
you
57:32
want.
57:32
As
57:32
far
57:32
as
57:32
the
57:33
process,
57:33
getting
57:33
back
57:33
to
57:34
your
57:34
question
57:34
about
57:34
the
57:35
process
57:35
of
57:35
writing.
57:35
So
57:35
they
57:36
convinced
57:36
me
57:36
to
57:37
do
57:37
three
57:37
books,
57:39
which
57:39
I
57:39
said
57:39
I
57:39
would
57:40
do.
57:40
The
57:41
treasure
57:42
book
57:43
was
57:43
already
57:44
floating
57:44
around
57:44
in
57:44
the
57:45
back
57:45
of
57:45
my
57:45
mind.
57:46
I
57:46
want
57:46
to
57:46
flush
57:47
this
57:47
out
57:47
a
57:47
little
57:47
bit
57:48
more
57:48
and
57:48
start
57:48
working
57:49
on
57:49
that.
57:49
The
57:49
third
57:50
one
57:50
I
57:50
had
57:50
a
57:50
little
57:50
bit
57:51
harder
57:52
time
57:52
trying
57:53
to
57:53
come
57:53
up
57:53
with
57:54
on
57:54
that.
57:54
Oh,
57:55
did
57:55
you
57:55
actually
57:56
have
57:56
the
57:56
idea
57:57
because
57:57
you
57:57
said
57:58
you
57:58
moved
57:58
from
57:59
the
57:59
ocean,
57:59
the
58:00
water
58:00
setting
58:01
to
58:01
terra
58:02
firma,
58:02
as
58:02
you
58:02
put
58:03
it.
58:03
You're
58:03
coming
58:04
inland
58:04
or
58:04
something.
58:05
I
58:05
was
58:05
already
58:05
there.
58:07
Well,
58:07
that
58:08
idea.
58:08
No,
58:09
I
58:09
didn't
58:09
have
58:09
any
58:10
idea.
58:10
For
58:10
book
58:10
three,
58:11
I
58:11
started
58:11
talking
58:11
with
58:12
my
58:12
wife
58:12
and
58:13
she
58:13
was
58:14
thinking,
58:14
what
58:15
about
58:15
me?
58:15
You
58:15
have
58:15
to
58:15
put
58:15
me
58:16
in
58:16
one
58:16
of
58:16
these
58:16
books.
58:17
I
58:17
thought,
58:17
what
58:18
can
58:18
I
58:18
do
58:18
with
58:19
Olivia
58:20
and
58:20
Grandma?
58:21
And
58:21
what
58:21
does
58:21
Grandma
58:22
want
58:22
to
58:22
do
58:23
with
58:23
Olivia?
58:24
And
58:25
I
58:25
started
58:25
playing
58:25
around
58:26
with
58:26
that
58:26
a
58:26
little
58:26
bit.
58:27
And
58:27
my
58:27
wife
58:28
loves
58:28
to
58:28
garden.
58:29
She
58:29
loves
58:29
to
58:30
spend
58:30
time
58:31
out
58:31
there
58:31
with
58:31
her
58:31
vegetables
58:32
and
58:32
her
58:33
flowers
58:33
and
58:33
all
58:33
that
58:33
stuff.
58:34
And
58:34
I
58:34
thought,
58:35
there's
58:35
the
58:35
story
58:35
right
58:36
there.
58:37
It's
58:37
Olivia
58:38
and
58:38
Grandma's
58:39
Garden
58:39
of
58:39
Wonders.
58:40
Oh,
58:41
nice.
58:41
Yeah.
58:42
So
58:42
I
58:42
wrote
58:42
a
58:42
story
58:43
around
58:43
that,
58:44
and
58:44
that's
58:45
down
58:45
the
58:45
line.
58:45
I
58:46
don't
58:46
have
58:46
a
58:46
date
58:46
or
58:46
anything
58:47
for
58:47
publishing
58:47
on
58:47
that.
58:48
The
58:48
story
58:48
is
58:48
written.
58:49
It's
58:49
not
58:49
illustrated
58:50
or
58:50
edited
58:50
yet,
58:51
but
58:51
at
58:51
least
58:51
the
58:51
story
58:52
is
58:52
done.
58:52
And
58:52
it's
58:53
funny
58:53
you
58:54
should
58:54
mention
58:54
that
58:55
because
58:55
one
58:56
of
58:56
our
58:56
stories,
58:57
and
58:57
I
58:57
wrote
58:57
it
58:58
with
58:58
my
58:58
wife
58:58
in
58:59
mind,
58:59
with
59:00
her
59:00
youngest
59:01
granddaughter,
59:02
and
59:03
with
59:03
my
59:03
youngest
59:04
granddaughter
59:04
and
59:04
my
59:04
wife,
59:05
we
59:05
put
59:05
this
59:06
story
59:06
together
59:07
and
59:08
my
59:08
wife
59:08
did
59:09
the
59:09
narration.
59:10
The
59:10
audiobook
59:11
oh,
59:12
very
59:12
good.
59:12
We've
59:12
got
59:12
it
59:13
that
59:13
far.
59:13
And.
59:14
Yeah,
59:14
that's
59:14
a
59:15
great
59:15
idea.
59:15
Yeah.
59:16
So
59:16
that's
59:16
the
59:17
whole
59:17
thing.
59:17
It's
59:18
interesting
59:18
because
59:19
I
59:19
was
59:19
talking
59:19
to
59:20
an
59:20
author
59:20
who
59:21
wrote
59:22
a
59:22
book
59:22
about
59:23
a
59:23
dog.
59:24
She
59:24
didn't
59:24
even
59:24
own
59:25
a
59:25
dog,
59:25
but
59:26
she
59:26
wrote
59:26
this
59:27
story
59:27
about
59:27
a
59:28
dog.
59:28
And
59:28
then
59:29
all
59:29
of
59:29
her
59:29
friends
59:30
said,
59:30
oh,
59:31
what
59:31
about
59:31
my
59:31
dog?
59:32
Can
59:32
my
59:32
dog
59:33
be
59:33
in
59:33
your
59:33
book?
59:34
Oh,
59:34
my
59:34
gosh.
59:35
I'm
59:35
sure.
59:36
Just
59:36
wait,
59:36
Chris.
59:37
Oh,
59:37
yeah,
59:38
I'm
59:38
sure.
59:38
I'm
59:38
sure
59:38
Every
59:39
author
59:39
has
59:39
a
59:39
story
59:40
like
59:40
that.
59:40
Everybody
59:41
wants
59:41
to
59:41
be
59:41
a
59:41
character.
59:42
To
59:43
be
59:43
a
59:43
character.
59:43
Everyone
59:44
has
59:44
their
59:44
thoughts
59:45
on
59:45
that,
59:45
and
59:45
they
59:46
want
59:46
to
59:46
be
59:46
in
59:46
the
59:46
book
59:46
in
59:47
some
59:47
form
59:47
or
59:47
fashion.
59:48
Now,
59:48
I
59:49
want
59:49
to
59:49
take
59:49
you
59:49
on
59:49
a
59:49
journey.
59:50
Okay.
59:51
When
59:51
I
59:52
get
59:52
someone
59:52
who's
59:53
not
59:53
only
59:53
published
59:54
one
59:54
book,
59:55
but
59:55
who's
59:55
published
59:56
two
59:56
books,
59:57
then
59:58
this
59:58
even
59:59
takes
59:59
on
1:00:00
a
1:00:00
more
1:00:00
important
1:00:00
role.
1:00:01
And
1:00:01
I
1:00:02
want
1:00:02
to
1:00:02
talk
1:00:02
to
1:00:02
you
1:00:02
about
1:00:02
success
1:00:03
measurement.
1:00:03
I
1:00:04
want
1:00:04
you
1:00:04
to
1:00:04
think
1:00:04
back
1:00:05
to
1:00:05
your
1:00:05
very
1:00:06
first
1:00:06
book
1:00:07
and
1:00:07
what
1:00:07
you
1:00:08
envision
1:00:08
success
1:00:09
to
1:00:09
be,
1:00:10
and
1:00:10
then
1:00:11
pull
1:00:11
us
1:00:12
forward
1:00:12
to
1:00:12
now.
1:00:13
And
1:00:13
what
1:00:14
does
1:00:14
success
1:00:15
look
1:00:15
like
1:00:15
to
1:00:16
you
1:00:16
now?
1:00:17
I'll
1:00:17
be
1:00:17
perfectly
1:00:18
honest
1:00:18
with
1:00:18
you.
1:00:19
So
1:00:20
success
1:00:21
for
1:00:21
me
1:00:21
was
1:00:22
selling
1:00:22
a
1:00:22
ton
1:00:23
of
1:00:23
books
1:00:23
right
1:00:23
off
1:00:24
the
1:00:24
bat.
1:00:25
That's
1:00:25
what
1:00:25
success
1:00:26
was
1:00:26
going
1:00:26
to
1:00:26
be.
1:00:27
It
1:00:27
hasn't
1:00:28
turned
1:00:28
out
1:00:28
that
1:00:28
way.
1:00:29
I'm
1:00:29
finding,
1:00:29
as
1:00:29
we've
1:00:30
talked
1:00:30
about
1:00:30
earlier,
1:00:30
this
1:00:31
is
1:00:31
a
1:00:31
business
1:00:31
and
1:00:32
you
1:00:32
have
1:00:32
have
1:00:32
to
1:00:33
market
1:00:33
it,
1:00:34
and
1:00:34
that's
1:00:34
difficult
1:00:35
to
1:00:35
do
1:00:35
and
1:00:36
it's
1:00:36
difficult
1:00:36
to
1:00:37
get
1:00:37
that
1:00:37
word
1:00:38
out
1:00:38
and
1:00:38
get
1:00:38
it
1:00:38
in
1:00:39
front
1:00:39
of
1:00:39
people.
1:00:39
But
1:00:40
having
1:00:40
said
1:00:41
that,
1:00:41
yes,
1:00:41
success
1:00:42
to
1:00:42
me
1:00:42
now
1:00:43
is
1:00:43
something
1:00:43
completely
1:00:43
different.
1:00:45
So
1:00:45
while
1:00:46
it
1:00:46
would
1:00:46
be
1:00:46
nice
1:00:47
to
1:00:47
reach
1:00:47
a
1:00:47
point
1:00:48
where
1:00:48
I'm
1:00:49
breaking
1:00:49
even
1:00:50
on
1:00:50
all
1:00:50
this,
1:00:51
success
1:00:52
is
1:00:53
people
1:00:54
will
1:00:54
send
1:00:54
me
1:00:54
pictures
1:00:55
or
1:00:55
I'll
1:00:55
see
1:00:56
them
1:00:56
on
1:00:56
the
1:00:56
Amazon
1:00:57
review
1:00:57
of
1:00:57
them
1:00:58
reading,
1:00:59
reading
1:00:59
the
1:01:00
book
1:01:00
to
1:01:00
their
1:01:00
child
1:01:00
or
1:01:00
their
1:01:01
grandchild.
1:01:02
That's
1:01:02
success.
1:01:03
Success
1:01:03
is
1:01:04
a
1:01:04
nice,
1:01:05
positive
1:01:05
review.
1:01:07
Success
1:01:07
is.
1:01:08
I
1:01:08
mentioned
1:01:09
I
1:01:09
was
1:01:10
at
1:01:10
a
1:01:10
community
1:01:10
fair
1:01:11
in
1:01:11
October
1:01:12
and
1:01:12
I
1:01:12
did
1:01:13
three
1:01:13
story
1:01:14
times
1:01:15
with
1:01:15
some
1:01:15
of
1:01:15
the
1:01:15
kids,
1:01:16
and
1:01:17
I
1:01:17
think
1:01:17
I
1:01:17
had,
1:01:18
I
1:01:18
think
1:01:18
the
1:01:18
lowest
1:01:18
attended
1:01:19
one.
1:01:19
There
1:01:19
was
1:01:20
maybe
1:01:20
six
1:01:21
or
1:01:21
eight
1:01:21
kids
1:01:21
there.
1:01:23
And
1:01:24
they
1:01:24
all
1:01:24
loved
1:01:24
the
1:01:24
book.
1:01:25
They
1:01:25
all
1:01:26
loved
1:01:26
the
1:01:26
book.
1:01:26
They
1:01:27
loved
1:01:27
the
1:01:27
pictures,
1:01:28
they
1:01:28
loved
1:01:28
the
1:01:28
story.
1:01:29
Except
1:01:30
for
1:01:30
the
1:01:30
really
1:01:31
young
1:01:31
kids.
1:01:31
They
1:01:32
were
1:01:32
all
1:01:32
really
1:01:32
engaged
1:01:33
in
1:01:33
it.
1:01:33
And
1:01:34
that
1:01:34
was
1:01:35
success
1:01:36
for
1:01:36
me.
1:01:37
So
1:01:38
that
1:01:38
really
1:01:38
charged
1:01:39
my
1:01:39
batteries.
1:01:39
Yeah.
1:01:40
Leaving
1:01:41
that
1:01:41
event,
1:01:42
I
1:01:42
didn't
1:01:42
sell
1:01:42
too
1:01:43
many
1:01:43
books
1:01:43
that
1:01:43
day,
1:01:44
but.
1:01:44
And
1:01:45
that
1:01:45
was
1:01:45
fine.
1:01:46
But
1:01:46
it
1:01:46
was
1:01:47
the
1:01:47
kids
1:01:48
that
1:01:48
loved
1:01:48
the
1:01:48
story
1:01:49
and
1:01:49
wanted
1:01:50
to
1:01:50
look
1:01:50
at
1:01:50
the
1:01:50
pictures.
1:01:51
And
1:01:51
I
1:01:51
had
1:01:52
made
1:01:52
some
1:01:52
stickers
1:01:53
of
1:01:53
a
1:01:54
couple
1:01:54
of
1:01:54
the
1:01:54
characters.
1:01:55
And
1:01:56
I
1:01:56
ran
1:01:56
out
1:01:56
of
1:01:56
them.
1:01:57
That
1:01:57
was
1:01:57
nice.
1:01:58
So
1:01:58
terrific.
1:02:00
Now
1:02:00
that
1:02:00
you
1:02:01
have
1:02:01
got
1:02:01
this
1:02:02
third
1:02:02
book
1:02:02
in
1:02:03
mind,
1:02:03
I
1:02:04
can
1:02:04
see
1:02:04
you're
1:02:04
thinking,
1:02:05
like
1:02:05
you
1:02:06
said,
1:02:07
finish
1:02:07
the
1:02:08
third
1:02:08
book
1:02:08
in
1:02:08
the
1:02:09
series
1:02:09
and
1:02:09
then
1:02:10
you
1:02:10
can
1:02:11
see
1:02:11
yourself
1:02:11
going
1:02:13
elsewhere
1:02:14
in
1:02:14
terms
1:02:14
of
1:02:15
your
1:02:15
children's
1:02:15
book
1:02:16
writing
1:02:16
career.
1:02:16
Talk
1:02:17
to
1:02:17
us
1:02:17
about
1:02:17
how
1:02:17
you
1:02:18
see
1:02:18
this
1:02:18
role
1:02:18
of
1:02:19
writing
1:02:20
developing
1:02:21
as
1:02:21
you
1:02:21
go
1:02:21
through
1:02:22
this
1:02:22
whole
1:02:23
journey.
1:02:23
With
1:02:23
children's
1:02:24
books
1:02:24
or
1:02:24
just
1:02:24
writing
1:02:25
in
1:02:25
general.
1:02:26
You
1:02:26
don't
1:02:26
have
1:02:26
to
1:02:27
be
1:02:27
mutually
1:02:27
exclusive.
1:02:28
Okay.
1:02:30
How
1:02:30
do
1:02:30
you
1:02:30
see
1:02:30
the
1:02:30
role
1:02:31
of
1:02:31
writing
1:02:31
taking
1:02:32
on
1:02:32
more
1:02:32
form
1:02:33
in
1:02:33
your
1:02:33
life?
1:02:34
Yeah,
1:02:34
since
1:02:35
last
1:02:35
summer,
1:02:35
it's
1:02:36
taken
1:02:36
on
1:02:36
a
1:02:36
much,
1:02:37
much
1:02:37
bigger
1:02:37
role
1:02:38
in
1:02:38
my
1:02:38
life
1:02:39
that
1:02:39
I
1:02:40
enjoy.
1:02:40
The
1:02:40
process
1:02:41
I
1:02:41
mentioned
1:02:42
right
1:02:42
at
1:02:42
the
1:02:42
onset
1:02:43
here,
1:02:43
that
1:02:43
creative
1:02:44
side
1:02:44
of
1:02:44
my
1:02:44
brain
1:02:45
is
1:02:45
engaged
1:02:46
and
1:02:47
I'm
1:02:47
not
1:02:47
doing
1:02:48
a
1:02:48
whole
1:02:48
lot
1:02:48
of
1:02:49
photography
1:02:50
at
1:02:50
the
1:02:50
moment.
1:02:50
I
1:02:51
think
1:02:51
we're
1:02:51
in
1:02:51
a
1:02:51
mini
1:02:51
recession
1:02:52
here.
1:02:52
So
1:02:53
I'm
1:02:53
not
1:02:53
getting
1:02:54
out
1:02:54
and
1:02:54
shooting
1:02:55
weddings
1:02:55
or
1:02:56
portraits.
1:02:57
I
1:02:58
like
1:02:58
to
1:02:58
do
1:02:58
a
1:02:58
lot
1:02:58
of
1:02:58
landscape
1:02:59
photography
1:02:59
too,
1:02:59
and
1:03:00
things
1:03:00
of
1:03:00
that
1:03:00
sort.
1:03:00
And
1:03:01
I
1:03:01
just
1:03:01
haven't
1:03:01
really
1:03:02
had
1:03:02
the
1:03:02
opportunity
1:03:03
in
1:03:03
the
1:03:03
last
1:03:03
few
1:03:03
years
1:03:04
to
1:03:04
get
1:03:04
out
1:03:04
and
1:03:04
do
1:03:04
a
1:03:04
lot
1:03:05
of
1:03:05
that.
1:03:05
So
1:03:06
that
1:03:06
side
1:03:07
of
1:03:07
my
1:03:07
brain
1:03:07
has
1:03:08
not
1:03:09
been
1:03:09
exercised
1:03:10
too
1:03:10
much.
1:03:11
But
1:03:12
now
1:03:12
I've
1:03:12
started
1:03:12
writing
1:03:13
these
1:03:13
books
1:03:14
and
1:03:14
all
1:03:14
of
1:03:14
a
1:03:15
sudden
1:03:15
something
1:03:16
has
1:03:16
reignited.
1:03:17
So
1:03:18
the
1:03:19
stories
1:03:19
are
1:03:19
coming.
1:03:20
They're
1:03:20
there
1:03:21
since
1:03:22
last
1:03:22
summer,
1:03:22
since
1:03:22
I
1:03:23
engaged
1:03:23
with
1:03:23
the
1:03:24
Scuba
1:03:24
Diving
1:03:24
Day
1:03:25
book,
1:03:25
since
1:03:25
I
1:03:25
started
1:03:26
working
1:03:26
on
1:03:26
that
1:03:26
one.
1:03:27
I've
1:03:27
written
1:03:28
a
1:03:28
number
1:03:28
of
1:03:28
other
1:03:29
book
1:03:29
books
1:03:29
already,
1:03:31
so
1:03:31
I
1:03:31
have
1:03:31
a
1:03:31
foundation.
1:03:32
So
1:03:32
being
1:03:32
a
1:03:33
scuba
1:03:33
diver,
1:03:33
is
1:03:33
that.
1:03:34
Children'S
1:03:34
books
1:03:34
or
1:03:35
is
1:03:35
that
1:03:35
just
1:03:35
so.
1:03:36
I've
1:03:36
written
1:03:36
one
1:03:36
other
1:03:36
children's
1:03:37
book.
1:03:37
I've
1:03:38
written
1:03:38
Olivia,
1:03:39
the
1:03:39
third
1:03:39
one
1:03:39
in
1:03:39
the
1:03:40
Olivia
1:03:40
series.
1:03:40
So
1:03:41
Olivia
1:03:41
and
1:03:41
Grandma's
1:03:42
Garden
1:03:42
of
1:03:42
Wonders
1:03:43
is
1:03:43
written.
1:03:44
I
1:03:44
have
1:03:45
outlines
1:03:45
for
1:03:46
two
1:03:47
more
1:03:47
children's
1:03:48
books.
1:03:48
I
1:03:49
think
1:03:49
they
1:03:50
are
1:03:50
not.
1:03:51
The
1:03:52
Adelaide
1:03:52
character
1:03:53
in
1:03:53
the
1:03:53
first
1:03:53
book
1:03:54
was
1:03:54
an
1:03:54
offshoot
1:03:55
and
1:03:55
the
1:03:56
Ozzie
1:03:56
and
1:03:56
Simon
1:03:57
characters
1:03:58
are
1:03:58
an
1:03:58
offshoot
1:03:59
of
1:04:00
that.
1:04:00
As
1:04:01
far
1:04:01
the
1:04:01
Adelaide
1:04:02
character
1:04:02
goes,
1:04:03
I
1:04:03
think
1:04:03
I'm
1:04:03
going
1:04:03
to
1:04:03
change
1:04:04
that
1:04:04
a
1:04:04
little
1:04:04
bit.
1:04:04
But
1:04:05
I
1:04:05
have
1:04:05
an
1:04:05
outline
1:04:06
written
1:04:06
for
1:04:06
it.
1:04:07
So
1:04:07
at
1:04:07
least
1:04:07
I
1:04:08
have
1:04:08
the
1:04:08
idea.
1:04:09
And
1:04:09
I
1:04:09
have
1:04:09
an
1:04:09
idea
1:04:10
for.
1:04:10
And
1:04:11
I
1:04:11
have
1:04:11
an
1:04:11
outline
1:04:11
actually
1:04:12
for
1:04:12
an
1:04:12
Ozzie
1:04:13
and
1:04:13
Simon
1:04:13
book.
1:04:14
The
1:04:15
problem
1:04:15
I'm
1:04:15
having
1:04:15
with
1:04:15
that
1:04:16
one
1:04:16
is
1:04:16
it's
1:04:17
a
1:04:17
very
1:04:17
elementary
1:04:18
book.
1:04:19
It's
1:04:19
2,
1:04:19
3,
1:04:20
4
1:04:20
year
1:04:20
olds.
1:04:21
It's
1:04:21
kids
1:04:21
learning
1:04:22
colors,
1:04:22
it's
1:04:23
counting,
1:04:24
it's
1:04:24
that
1:04:24
sort
1:04:25
of
1:04:25
thing.
1:04:26
Whether
1:04:26
I
1:04:26
do
1:04:26
anything
1:04:27
with
1:04:27
that
1:04:27
one
1:04:28
or
1:04:28
not,
1:04:28
I'm
1:04:28
not
1:04:29
sure
1:04:29
yet.
1:04:29
I'm
1:04:29
not
1:04:30
sure
1:04:30
how
1:04:30
to
1:04:30
self
1:04:31
publish
1:04:31
a
1:04:32
small
1:04:33
book
1:04:34
yet.
1:04:34
A
1:04:35
small
1:04:35
cardboard
1:04:36
type
1:04:36
Book
1:04:36
that
1:04:37
you
1:04:37
might
1:04:37
see
1:04:38
for
1:04:38
that.
1:04:38
Yeah,
1:04:39
for
1:04:39
those.
1:04:39
I'm
1:04:39
not
1:04:40
sure
1:04:40
how
1:04:40
to
1:04:40
do
1:04:40
that
1:04:40
yet.
1:04:40
I
1:04:40
need
1:04:41
to
1:04:41
look
1:04:41
into
1:04:41
that.
1:04:42
And
1:04:42
if
1:04:42
I
1:04:42
find
1:04:42
a
1:04:42
way
1:04:43
to
1:04:43
do
1:04:43
that,
1:04:43
then
1:04:43
I'll
1:04:44
probably
1:04:44
move
1:04:44
forward
1:04:45
with
1:04:45
those
1:04:45
characters
1:04:46
in
1:04:46
that
1:04:46
book.
1:04:47
In
1:04:47
terms
1:04:48
of
1:04:48
other
1:04:48
things,
1:04:48
I've
1:04:49
written
1:04:49
a
1:04:49
foundations
1:04:49
and
1:04:50
underwater
1:04:50
photography
1:04:51
book,
1:04:51
being
1:04:51
a
1:04:51
scuba
1:04:52
diver,
1:04:52
being
1:04:52
an
1:04:53
instructor
1:04:53
and
1:04:53
a
1:04:54
professional
1:04:54
photographer.
1:04:56
So
1:04:56
I've
1:04:56
written.
1:04:56
That
1:04:56
one's
1:04:56
in
1:04:57
editing
1:04:57
right
1:04:57
now.
1:04:58
I
1:04:58
have
1:04:58
a
1:04:58
nonfiction
1:04:59
book
1:04:59
coming
1:04:59
out
1:04:59
in
1:05:00
two
1:05:00
weeks,
1:05:01
my
1:05:01
first
1:05:01
adult
1:05:02
fiction
1:05:03
book.
1:05:03
Okay.
1:05:04
And
1:05:05
I'm
1:05:05
writing
1:05:05
two
1:05:05
more
1:05:06
books,
1:05:06
adult
1:05:07
fiction.
1:05:07
So
1:05:08
I'm
1:05:08
busy
1:05:08
writing.
1:05:09
I'm
1:05:09
busy
1:05:10
writing.
1:05:10
And
1:05:11
that
1:05:11
they're
1:05:11
all
1:05:11
independently
1:05:12
published.
1:05:13
I
1:05:13
will
1:05:13
do
1:05:14
them
1:05:14
all
1:05:14
myself.
1:05:14
Yeah,
1:05:15
okay.
1:05:15
Yeah.
1:05:15
So
1:05:16
the
1:05:16
foundations
1:05:17
in
1:05:17
underwater
1:05:17
photography.
1:05:18
I've
1:05:18
been
1:05:18
shopping
1:05:19
around
1:05:19
to
1:05:19
a
1:05:20
couple
1:05:20
of
1:05:20
the
1:05:20
more
1:05:20
traditional
1:05:21
publishers.
1:05:22
The
1:05:22
layout
1:05:23
in
1:05:23
that
1:05:23
book
1:05:23
is
1:05:24
going
1:05:24
to
1:05:24
be
1:05:24
really
1:05:25
extensive,
1:05:26
as
1:05:26
you
1:05:26
can
1:05:26
imagine.
1:05:26
A
1:05:27
how
1:05:27
to
1:05:27
photography
1:05:28
book.
1:05:28
I'm
1:05:29
not
1:05:29
sure
1:05:29
I'm
1:05:29
ready
1:05:30
to
1:05:30
turn
1:05:30
that
1:05:30
over
1:05:31
to
1:05:31
somebody
1:05:32
that
1:05:33
is
1:05:33
not
1:05:33
affiliated
1:05:34
with
1:05:34
a
1:05:34
traditional
1:05:35
publishing
1:05:35
house
1:05:36
just
1:05:36
yet.
1:05:36
I
1:05:37
may
1:05:37
get
1:05:37
there
1:05:37
real
1:05:38
quick,
1:05:38
but
1:05:39
we'll
1:05:39
see.
1:05:39
We'll
1:05:39
see.
1:05:40
Okay.
1:05:40
I'm
1:05:41
just
1:05:41
curious.
1:05:42
I've
1:05:42
only
1:05:43
scuba
1:05:43
dived
1:05:44
a
1:05:44
couple
1:05:44
of
1:05:44
times,
1:05:44
and
1:05:46
I'm
1:05:46
not
1:05:46
sure
1:05:46
of
1:05:47
the
1:05:47
main
1:05:47
manufacturers
1:05:48
of
1:05:48
scuba
1:05:49
gear.
1:05:49
Maybe
1:05:49
there's
1:05:50
somebody
1:05:50
there
1:05:51
that
1:05:51
might
1:05:51
sponsor
1:05:52
your
1:05:52
book
1:05:53
that's.
1:05:53
That
1:05:54
you're
1:05:54
using
1:05:54
their
1:05:55
equipment
1:05:56
Anyways,
1:05:56
I
1:05:56
just
1:05:56
throw
1:05:57
that
1:05:57
out
1:05:57
at
1:05:57
you.
1:05:57
I've
1:05:57
already
1:05:58
talked
1:05:58
with.
1:05:58
I
1:05:58
got
1:05:59
a
1:05:59
number
1:05:59
of
1:05:59
photos
1:06:00
for
1:06:00
some
1:06:00
camera
1:06:00
housings.
1:06:01
I
1:06:01
know
1:06:01
we're
1:06:01
going
1:06:01
off
1:06:02
topic
1:06:02
here,
1:06:02
but
1:06:02
camera
1:06:03
housings
1:06:03
from
1:06:03
one
1:06:04
of
1:06:04
the
1:06:04
manufacturers.
1:06:05
So,
1:06:05
yeah,
1:06:06
I'll
1:06:06
probably
1:06:06
approach
1:06:07
them
1:06:07
again
1:06:07
and
1:06:07
say,
1:06:08
hey,
1:06:08
you
1:06:08
want
1:06:08
to
1:06:08
do
1:06:08
something
1:06:09
else?
1:06:09
Right.
1:06:10
Advice
1:06:10
for
1:06:11
aspiring
1:06:12
children's
1:06:12
book
1:06:13
authors.
1:06:14
Chris,
1:06:14
tell
1:06:15
us,
1:06:15
what
1:06:16
kind
1:06:16
of
1:06:16
advice
1:06:16
would
1:06:17
you
1:06:17
give
1:06:17
someone
1:06:18
who's
1:06:18
an
1:06:18
aspiring
1:06:19
children's
1:06:19
book
1:06:20
author
1:06:20
but
1:06:20
just
1:06:21
doesn't
1:06:21
know
1:06:21
how
1:06:21
to
1:06:21
get
1:06:22
going?
1:06:22
What
1:06:22
would
1:06:22
you
1:06:22
say
1:06:23
to
1:06:23
them?
1:06:23
Them?
1:06:24
I'd
1:06:24
say,
1:06:25
sharpen
1:06:25
your
1:06:25
pencil,
1:06:26
get
1:06:27
out
1:06:27
a
1:06:27
piece
1:06:27
of
1:06:27
paper
1:06:27
and
1:06:28
just
1:06:28
start,
1:06:30
I
1:06:30
think.
1:06:30
And
1:06:30
whatever
1:06:31
that
1:06:31
is,
1:06:31
whether
1:06:31
it's
1:06:32
the
1:06:32
title,
1:06:33
maybe
1:06:33
it's
1:06:33
the
1:06:33
ending.
1:06:34
I
1:06:34
was
1:06:34
talking
1:06:34
to
1:06:34
somebody
1:06:35
a
1:06:35
couple
1:06:35
of
1:06:35
weeks
1:06:35
ago,
1:06:36
and
1:06:36
they
1:06:36
were.
1:06:37
They
1:06:37
were
1:06:37
talking
1:06:37
about
1:06:38
getting
1:06:38
started
1:06:39
and
1:06:39
how
1:06:39
do
1:06:39
you
1:06:39
know?
1:06:39
And
1:06:40
maybe
1:06:40
you
1:06:40
start
1:06:41
at
1:06:41
the
1:06:41
end
1:06:41
of
1:06:41
the
1:06:41
book
1:06:41
and
1:06:42
work
1:06:42
backwards.
1:06:43
With
1:06:43
the
1:06:43
children's
1:06:44
books,
1:06:45
I
1:06:45
definitely
1:06:45
think
1:06:46
that
1:06:47
having
1:06:47
a
1:06:48
message,
1:06:48
if
1:06:48
you're
1:06:49
trying
1:06:49
to
1:06:49
convey
1:06:49
a
1:06:49
message,
1:06:50
know
1:06:50
what
1:06:50
that
1:06:51
message
1:06:51
is.
1:06:52
I
1:06:53
work
1:06:53
from
1:06:53
outlines,
1:06:55
so
1:06:55
it's
1:06:56
not
1:06:56
just
1:06:57
write
1:06:58
the
1:06:58
verbiage
1:06:58
and
1:06:58
it's
1:06:59
done.
1:06:59
It's
1:07:00
okay.
1:07:01
Part
1:07:01
one,
1:07:01
part
1:07:01
two,
1:07:02
part
1:07:02
Three,
1:07:03
here's
1:07:03
the
1:07:03
beginning,
1:07:04
whatever
1:07:05
it
1:07:05
is,
1:07:05
the
1:07:06
character
1:07:06
introduction,
1:07:07
the
1:07:08
ending.
1:07:08
What
1:07:09
does
1:07:09
that
1:07:09
look
1:07:09
like?
1:07:09
And
1:07:10
then
1:07:10
just
1:07:10
start
1:07:10
filling
1:07:11
in
1:07:11
the
1:07:11
pieces.
1:07:12
It's
1:07:12
interesting
1:07:12
you
1:07:13
say
1:07:13
that
1:07:13
a
1:07:13
lot
1:07:13
of
1:07:13
times.
1:07:14
I
1:07:14
know
1:07:14
with
1:07:14
myself,
1:07:16
I've
1:07:16
started
1:07:16
with
1:07:17
the
1:07:17
end
1:07:17
in
1:07:17
mind.
1:07:17
Mind.
1:07:18
I
1:07:18
think
1:07:18
that's
1:07:19
great
1:07:19
advice.
1:07:20
Now
1:07:20
that
1:07:20
we've
1:07:21
heard
1:07:21
a
1:07:21
lot
1:07:22
about
1:07:22
what's
1:07:22
going
1:07:23
on
1:07:23
in
1:07:23
your
1:07:23
life
1:07:24
as
1:07:24
a
1:07:24
children's
1:07:25
book
1:07:25
author,
1:07:26
what
1:07:27
keeps
1:07:27
you
1:07:27
going
1:07:28
as
1:07:28
a
1:07:28
children's
1:07:29
book
1:07:29
author?
1:07:31
I
1:07:31
think
1:07:31
it's
1:07:31
that
1:07:31
success
1:07:32
that
1:07:32
we
1:07:32
talked
1:07:33
about
1:07:33
just
1:07:33
a
1:07:34
few
1:07:34
minutes
1:07:34
ago.
1:07:35
Getting
1:07:35
those
1:07:36
pictures,
1:07:36
those
1:07:37
reviews,
1:07:37
those
1:07:37
comments
1:07:38
from
1:07:38
people
1:07:39
and
1:07:40
the
1:07:40
events
1:07:41
that
1:07:42
the
1:07:42
kids
1:07:42
come
1:07:42
in
1:07:43
and
1:07:43
you
1:07:43
read
1:07:43
to
1:07:43
them
1:07:44
and
1:07:44
seeing
1:07:44
how
1:07:44
engaged
1:07:45
they
1:07:45
get.
1:07:46
That'll
1:07:46
keep
1:07:46
me
1:07:47
going.
1:07:47
That'll
1:07:48
keep
1:07:48
me
1:07:48
going.
1:07:49
There's
1:07:49
just
1:07:49
something
1:07:50
non
1:07:50
tangible
1:07:51
there,
1:07:51
I
1:07:52
think,
1:07:52
at
1:07:52
least
1:07:53
for
1:07:53
myself,
1:07:53
that
1:07:54
recharges
1:07:55
those
1:07:55
batteries
1:07:55
and
1:07:56
says,
1:07:56
yeah,
1:07:57
I
1:07:57
need
1:07:57
to
1:07:58
keep
1:07:58
doing
1:07:58
this.
1:07:58
There's
1:07:59
some
1:07:59
value
1:07:59
here,
1:08:00
right?
1:08:01
Encouragement
1:08:02
for
1:08:02
readers.
1:08:03
Why
1:08:03
should
1:08:04
children's
1:08:04
book
1:08:05
readers
1:08:05
purchase
1:08:06
your
1:08:06
books?
1:08:07
I
1:08:07
think
1:08:07
the
1:08:07
message
1:08:08
that's
1:08:08
in
1:08:08
both
1:08:08
of
1:08:09
them,
1:08:09
I
1:08:09
think
1:08:09
is
1:08:10
very
1:08:10
important,
1:08:11
that
1:08:11
I
1:08:12
don't
1:08:12
see
1:08:13
a
1:08:13
lot
1:08:13
of
1:08:13
places,
1:08:14
especially
1:08:14
with
1:08:14
the
1:08:14
first
1:08:14
one,
1:08:15
that
1:08:15
whole
1:08:15
intergenerational
1:08:17
connection,
1:08:18
the
1:08:18
connection
1:08:19
from
1:08:19
a
1:08:19
kid's
1:08:19
perspective
1:08:20
to,
1:08:21
say,
1:08:21
older
1:08:22
generation
1:08:22
and
1:08:23
what
1:08:23
they
1:08:23
can
1:08:23
offer
1:08:24
and
1:08:25
teach
1:08:25
and
1:08:26
convey
1:08:27
to
1:08:27
the
1:08:27
younger
1:08:28
generation
1:08:28
and
1:08:29
vice
1:08:29
versa.
1:08:30
I
1:08:30
think,
1:08:30
too,
1:08:30
it's
1:08:31
people
1:08:31
of
1:08:31
my
1:08:32
age,
1:08:33
hey,
1:08:33
get
1:08:33
involved
1:08:34
with
1:08:34
your
1:08:35
grandkids.
1:08:36
They
1:08:36
may
1:08:36
be
1:08:36
more
1:08:38
into
1:08:38
what
1:08:39
you
1:08:39
do
1:08:39
and
1:08:39
what
1:08:40
you
1:08:40
have
1:08:40
to
1:08:40
say
1:08:40
than
1:08:41
you
1:08:41
might
1:08:42
think.
1:08:42
To
1:08:43
your
1:08:43
point,
1:08:43
the
1:08:43
nice
1:08:44
thing
1:08:44
about
1:08:44
it,
1:08:44
when
1:08:44
I
1:08:44
had
1:08:45
my
1:08:45
grandchildren
1:08:46
help
1:08:46
me
1:08:46
write,
1:08:46
write,
1:08:47
and
1:08:47
then
1:08:48
do
1:08:48
the
1:08:48
audiobooks,
1:08:49
the
1:08:50
beautiful
1:08:50
thing
1:08:50
about
1:08:51
it,
1:08:51
they
1:08:51
ended
1:08:51
up
1:08:51
being
1:08:52
the
1:08:52
editors.
1:08:53
And
1:08:53
who
1:08:53
better
1:08:54
to
1:08:54
be
1:08:54
your
1:08:55
children's
1:08:55
book
1:08:55
editor
1:08:56
than
1:08:57
the
1:08:57
people
1:08:58
reading
1:08:58
your
1:08:58
books?
1:08:59
Oh,
1:08:59
absolutely.
1:09:00
Absolutely.
1:09:01
You
1:09:01
can
1:09:01
read
1:09:01
on
1:09:02
their
1:09:02
face
1:09:02
if
1:09:02
a
1:09:03
point
1:09:03
is
1:09:03
being
1:09:03
made
1:09:04
or
1:09:04
not.
1:09:04
Final
1:09:05
thoughts.
1:09:05
Chris,
1:09:06
is
1:09:06
there
1:09:06
something
1:09:07
that
1:09:07
you'd
1:09:08
like
1:09:08
to
1:09:08
share
1:09:09
or
1:09:09
a
1:09:09
question
1:09:10
that
1:09:10
I
1:09:10
didn't
1:09:11
ask
1:09:11
you?
1:09:12
You
1:09:12
don't
1:09:13
really
1:09:13
have
1:09:13
a
1:09:13
final
1:09:14
thought,
1:09:14
per
1:09:14
se.
1:09:15
I
1:09:15
think
1:09:16
your
1:09:16
last
1:09:17
question
1:09:17
about
1:09:18
what
1:09:18
to
1:09:18
give
1:09:18
aspiring
1:09:19
writers,
1:09:20
I
1:09:20
think
1:09:20
that's
1:09:20
a
1:09:20
great
1:09:21
way
1:09:21
to
1:09:21
end
1:09:21
it.
1:09:22
You
1:09:22
know,
1:09:22
if
1:09:22
you
1:09:23
have
1:09:23
an
1:09:23
idea,
1:09:25
explore
1:09:25
it,
1:09:26
pencil
1:09:27
it
1:09:27
out,
1:09:27
reach
1:09:28
out.
1:09:28
Especially
1:09:28
in
1:09:28
today's
1:09:29
age,
1:09:30
there's
1:09:30
lots
1:09:30
of
1:09:31
different
1:09:31
resources
1:09:32
out
1:09:32
there
1:09:33
that
1:09:33
you
1:09:33
can
1:09:33
bounce
1:09:34
things
1:09:34
off
1:09:35
of.
1:09:35
There's
1:09:35
a
1:09:35
couple
1:09:36
groups
1:09:36
on
1:09:36
Instagram
1:09:37
that
1:09:37
I'm
1:09:38
part
1:09:38
of.
1:09:38
There's
1:09:39
lots
1:09:39
of
1:09:39
Facebook,
1:09:39
Facebook
1:09:40
groups
1:09:41
out
1:09:41
there,
1:09:42
and
1:09:42
there's.
1:09:43
People
1:09:43
are
1:09:44
more
1:09:44
than
1:09:45
willing
1:09:45
in
1:09:45
a
1:09:46
lot
1:09:46
of
1:09:46
cases
1:09:46
to.
1:09:47
To
1:09:47
help
1:09:47
you
1:09:48
out.
1:09:48
So
1:09:48
reach
1:09:49
out
1:09:50
if
1:09:50
you
1:09:50
have
1:09:50
an
1:09:51
idea
1:09:51
and
1:09:51
you
1:09:51
want
1:09:51
to
1:09:52
see
1:09:52
how
1:09:52
that
1:09:52
develops.
1:09:53
That's
1:09:53
what
1:09:53
I
1:09:54
found.
1:09:54
It's
1:09:55
amazing
1:09:55
how
1:09:56
giving
1:09:56
this
1:09:57
children's
1:09:57
book
1:09:58
author
1:09:59
community
1:09:59
is
1:10:00
very.
1:10:00
Oh
1:10:00
absolutely.
1:10:01
I
1:10:01
think
1:10:01
even
1:10:01
though
1:10:02
we're
1:10:02
all
1:10:03
competing
1:10:03
for
1:10:03
the
1:10:04
same
1:10:04
sale,
1:10:04
perhaps
1:10:05
people
1:10:05
are
1:10:05
more
1:10:06
than
1:10:06
willing
1:10:06
to
1:10:06
help
1:10:06
each
1:10:07
other
1:10:07
out
1:10:07
last
1:10:08
month
1:10:08
or
1:10:08
over
1:10:09
Christmas.
1:10:10
Reading
1:10:10
a
1:10:10
couple
1:10:10
other
1:10:10
authors
1:10:11
book
1:10:11
and
1:10:12
providing
1:10:12
some
1:10:12
feedback
1:10:13
and
1:10:13
having
1:10:14
them
1:10:14
do
1:10:14
the
1:10:14
same
1:10:14
for
1:10:15
me.
1:10:15
Invaluable.
1:10:16
Invaluable.
1:10:17
Chris,
1:10:17
thank
1:10:17
you
1:10:18
so
1:10:18
much
1:10:18
for
1:10:18
being
1:10:18
a
1:10:19
guest
1:10:19
on
1:10:19
the
1:10:20
Adventures
1:10:20
in
1:10:20
the
1:10:20
Heart
1:10:20
of
1:10:21
Children's
1:10:21
Book
1:10:21
Authors
1:10:22
Podcast.
1:10:22
Your
1:10:23
generosity
1:10:23
of
1:10:24
time
1:10:24
and
1:10:24
your
1:10:25
insights
1:10:25
will
1:10:26
significantly
1:10:26
benefit
1:10:27
aspiring
1:10:29
authors
1:10:29
and
1:10:29
readers.
1:10:30
And
1:10:31
we
1:10:31
promise
1:10:31
to
1:10:31
provide
1:10:32
links
1:10:32
to
1:10:32
Chris's
1:10:33
social
1:10:33
media
1:10:34
and
1:10:34
his
1:10:35
book
1:10:35
and
1:10:36
website.
1:10:37
And
1:10:37
if
1:10:37
you've
1:10:37
enjoyed
1:10:38
this
1:10:38
episode,
1:10:39
please
1:10:39
hit
1:10:39
the
1:10:39
subscribe
1:10:40
Button
1:10:40
button
1:10:40
to
1:10:41
listen
1:10:41
to
1:10:41
our
1:10:42
future
1:10:42
episodes.
1:10:43
And
1:10:43
feel
1:10:43
free
1:10:44
to
1:10:44
share
1:10:44
this
1:10:44
episode
1:10:45
with
1:10:45
anyone
1:10:46
inspired
1:10:47
by
1:10:47
or
1:10:48
who
1:10:48
enjoys
1:10:49
hearing
1:10:49
about
1:10:49
Chris
1:10:50
and
1:10:50
his
1:10:50
children's
1:10:51
book,
1:10:52
Captain
1:10:52
Olivia
1:10:53
and
1:10:53
the
1:10:53
Treasure
1:10:54
of
1:10:54
Kindness.
1:10:55
Thank
1:10:55
you,
1:10:55
Chris.
1:10:56
Thank
1:10:56
you,
1:10:56
Rick.
1:10:57
I
1:10:57
appreciate
1:10:57
your
1:10:57
time
1:10:57
today.