Latest / Foul Territory / Tyler Kepner examines the quest by some clubs to copy the Brewers

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Tyler Kepner examines the quest by some clubs to copy the Brewers · Foul Territory

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: Hey, let's talk to Tyler Kapner from the Athletic. It's
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: great to see you, Tyler. And yeah, what an article.
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: And the timeliness of that article really pops up right now.
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: So I'm going to read it and then I'll get
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: you to give us the summary, and then we've got
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: a bunch of follow up questions for you. So he wrote,
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: and I encourage everyone to check it out. The Mets
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: wanted Milwaukee with money. It is not as easy as
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: it sounds. So how is this one to put together?
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: Well, David starts, to his credit, he doesn't you know,
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: he doesn't hide, and he doesn't get defensive or make excuses.
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: I mean he was there the other day just doing
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: a sort of state of the Mets press conference, and
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: with the Cubs in town, I thought it was a
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: good contrast because or a good setting to write about
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: them and the Brewers background, because you know, the Cubs
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: hire the Brewers manager too, and Craig Council and the
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: Mets hire the Brewers GM and in sterns because people
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: want to imitate the successful teams and they feel like, well,
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: if the Brewers can win with a low budget, we
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: can bring in their leadership, give them some more money
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: and it'll be even better. And that comes with its
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: own set of challenges too. You know, when you're in
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: a market like Milwaukee, I think it's a little bit
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: easier to have a set philosophy and kind of a
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: as Craig Council is saying optionality, where you can send
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: guys up and down, and you can you know, move
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: guys in and out. Whereas if you commit to older
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: guys who make a ton of money, it looks good
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: because they've done a lot in their careers, but they're
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: maybe not positioned as well to keep doing it for
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: the long run. And we've seen that with the Mets.
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: They made some big, splashy moves last winter, but not
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: up you know there the team's gotten worse.
• 1:48
  Speaker 3: So who's that Who's that fault? Is it the money's problem?
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: Is it the owner's problem? Who's who's getting in the
• 1:54
  Speaker 3: way when you hire away at Craig Council, who's getting
• 1:58
  Speaker 3: in the way in Chicago or what is getting in
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: the way? And the same thing with New York if
• 2:02
  Speaker 3: they hired away Stern's is it Cohen getting in the way?
• 2:05
  Speaker 3: Is it all the money? Is it the pressure all
• 2:08
  Speaker 3: that stuff.
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I actually, I actually think the Cubs will probably
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: be fine. And if they're not, it's sort of like, well,
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: they lost, They've lost an entire rotation and it's hard
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: for any team to overcome that. You know, I give
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: them a little bit of a pass, but they you know,
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: they they do. They did spend a ton of money
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: on Bregman and Swanson and Swanson's been the hottest hitter
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: in the world the last few days. But you know,
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: how how good are they going to be going forward
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: for the value they're paying. It's the whole thing with
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: free agency, right, Like you've got to pick the right
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: guys and you've got to win early. Like if you
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: don't win early in these contracts, you like when I
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: covered the Yankees and they got Sabbathia and and to
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: Shaa and Burnett and they won the first year and
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: that that paid for it all right there. And we
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: see that sometimes. But it's a risk, you know, because
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: if it doesn't work out right away, you're stuck with
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: a big bill later. So who's to blame? I mean,
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: money is a good thing, right And like Stens didn't
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: apologize because he's like, look, we have access to every
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: player in the universe, in the whole player universe with
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: the Mets, and that's a good thing, but you got
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: to choose wisely. And I don't know if they chose
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: wisely with a lot of guys who had previous injury
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: history and declining stats already, like in the case of
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: a Marcus Semeon.
• 3:28
  Speaker 3: But you said, you said, okay, with the cub specifically,
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: you said, I don't know if they're going to be
• 3:33
  Speaker 3: able to do well here because of how much their
• 3:35
  Speaker 3: injuries to their pictures have decimated their rotation. The Brewers
• 3:39
  Speaker 3: go through the same thing. Is it because the Brewers
• 3:42
  Speaker 3: are not afraid to call it? They get rid of pictures,
• 3:45
  Speaker 3: so they don't even hurt the pictures they get rid
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: of them. Is it because the Brewers aren't afraid to
• 3:50
  Speaker 3: call somebody up and in New York or in Chicago
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: we call that triple a guy up. I'm afraid to
• 3:57
  Speaker 3: do this or do that?
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Eric, I mean that's a great point. You know,
• 4:03
  Speaker 2: we saw the other day, like Brandon Sproke, Brandon s
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: Borro has not had a good year, but he maybe
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: he's rounding it to form me had an amazing night
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: the other night, best night of his career against the Reds.
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: The Brewers can and smaller market teams with smaller payroll
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: teams like that tend to give guys a little more
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: longer leash, you know, let him figure things out.
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: Now.
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: The Brewers have a standard, right like they they don't
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: come up there and tolerate, you know, much losing. But
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: they also don't have as many options, so they'll give
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: Brandon Sprode a chance really that he maybe wouldn't have
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: gotten with the Mets. And if you unlock something, then
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: you have a guy for five six years and in
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: the Brewers case, probably four or five, and then you
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: trade him at a peak like they did with Freddy
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: Peralta to get Brandon sprot and Jet Williams. You know,
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: they will trade guys at their value rather than buy
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: them at peak value. You know. It's it's the old
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: thing like if you're not afraid to deal guys when
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: when it's gonna hurt, know, then you tend to benefit
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: from that, like case of Boyd. The Giants, right, giants
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: are a big mess. They say they're not going anybody's
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: available to trade except for Logan web Well, who's the
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: one guy? People would most want would be Logan Web
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: and now they could reset the most and take some
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: short term pain and maybe make an incredible deal that
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: can reset the team. But they don't want to trade
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: their best guy. That would be really unpopular. They're a
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: big market team that he's a great pitcher. So sometimes
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: those small market teams are well, actually all the time,
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: they're willing to make those tough moves that feel awful
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: in the moment but feel great down the road.
• 5:40
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• 6:40
  Speaker 6: All right, Tyler, let me ask you a question. Here,
• 6:43
  Speaker 6: are we looking at this all wrong? If you were
• 6:46
  Speaker 6: a small market team, We're a big market team and
• 6:48
  Speaker 6: you're trying to copy a small market team, like you
• 6:51
  Speaker 6: wrote about the Mets trying to copy Milwaukee's model. Why
• 6:55
  Speaker 6: wouldn't the Mets just go copy the Dodgers model, because
• 6:57
  Speaker 6: clearly they know how to spend money, they get the
• 6:59
  Speaker 6: right players. They also draft and develop players. Isn't it
• 7:03
  Speaker 6: probably more beneficial for another mid market team to copy
• 7:06
  Speaker 6: another mid market team.
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: Well, that's a great point, Kevin, and I think the
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: Dodgers are the model because they do everything so well.
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: I mean when they invest in the free agents, they'll
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: make some misses, but they Also they get those guys
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: in the thirties who are still productive rights that's rare,
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: you know, those the guys are tend to go to
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: the Hall of Fame, Freddy Freeman. You know, Otani is
• 7:33
  Speaker 2: thirty two, the next month, Mooki is in his thirties.
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: And a lot of times those guys aren't aren't good bets.
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: But if they're all time great players, maybe they are.
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: And the Dodgers have been able to access those guys
• 7:47
  Speaker 2: while also doing really well with the Milwaukee kind of stuff,
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: like around the margins. Like they bring in a Robeleski
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: and you know, they he takes his lumps last year,
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: but by Game seven of the World Series he's one
• 8:01
  Speaker 2: of the guys they trust. They put him in the
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: rotation and now he's doing great. You know they have
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: something there, right, They they bring guys along, they develop
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: enough guys like with a smaller market mentality. That's the thing.
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: The Dodgers really are the envy of everybody because they
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: have all the money to access all those players, but
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: they also will find guys going back, you know eight
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: ten years when they found Max Munsey off the scraft
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: heat from Oakland and turned him into something long lasting.
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: Will Smith was the best player in his draft, and
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: he was like a lower round pick, or not a
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: lower round pick, but lower first round pick in that draft.
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: So they draft and develop and have that sort of
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: eye on all the details like a small market team,
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: but they can go out and spend it for the best.
• 8:48
  Speaker 3: This is the question that AJ always brings up when
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: he's on and I just am so because I played
• 8:53
  Speaker 3: with all these small market teams and the large market teams.
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: What's the difference between the Brewers and the Dodgers or
• 8:59
  Speaker 3: the Rays and the Dodgers. What is the difference At
• 9:02
  Speaker 3: the end of the day, what are you trying to
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: do as a team?
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: Win what I'm trying to win the World Series? And
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: the Dodgers and the Brewers and the Rays get to
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: a certain level and the Dodgers have that extra payroll
• 9:14
  Speaker 2: that puts them over the top.
• 9:16
  Speaker 3: Again, I disagree. The payroll doesn't put them over the top.
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: They've figured out how to win World Series. It's not
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: the payroll. But it's not the payroll in my opinion.
• 9:24
  Speaker 3: It's not the payroll that puts them over the top.
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: In my opinion, you push to win a World Series
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: and I think teams that emulate small markets are not
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: pushing to win a World Series. They're pushing to be
• 9:35
  Speaker 3: successful and hope they win a World Series.
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I think you're right. But what's the I mean,
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: you were in Milwaukee, you got to Game seven, You
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: were on the same field with the Dodgers. If Taylor
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: doesn't make that catch at the wall, you know, if
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: a couple of things go different, you're in the World Series.
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: The Dodgers are not. So like, is that hope or
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: is that like a legitimate chance? The Brewers had a
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: legitimate chance all the time last year. Yeah, they got
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: smoked in the LCS, but they were on the same
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: field though a bunch of those games were close. I mean,
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: what what are they doing wrong? In your mind?
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: Well? I mean, to me, it's that final move. So here,
• 10:12
  Speaker 3: here's the example I go to all the time. That year.
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: They came and asked me, would you trade Brandon Woodriff.
• 10:19
  Speaker 3: This is twenty eighteen, for anybody's to know, Brandon Woodriff
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: and Corbyn Burns for Jacob de Grom would you do that?
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: And I and in the moment I said, I really
• 10:30
  Speaker 3: don't know, because they were not staples in our rotation,
• 10:32
  Speaker 3: but they were huge peaches to our bullpen. Obviously, looking forward,
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: that would have been a massive trade. That would have
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: been like, oh, you don't know what those guys are
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: going to become the next year Corbyn Burns was in
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: the minor leagues. But in the future it would have
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: turned out bad. Does Jacob de Grom win US a
• 10:50
  Speaker 3: World Series that year? If that's the case and we
• 10:52
  Speaker 3: don't have to start, you know, Wade Miley twice, Yeah,
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: Jolie's chasin twice? Does that win US a World Series?
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: It might? It might not, though. I mean last year
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: I covered the Mariners Detroit Division Series and Detroit lost
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: both games that schooball started, and he pitched really well,
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: but he pitched like six innings, and you know, the
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: games are decided in the seventh, eight and ninth. You
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: give de ground the ball. Maybe he goes out and
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: has the game of his life. But maybe he goes
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: out and gives just six great innings and then you
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: still lose in the seventh eighth. I mean he didn't
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: you know twenty thirteen ELSI, yes, right. I always go
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: back to the Tigers of that era, Like, what did
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: Dobrowski do wrong in trying to build that team into
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: a winner, like he had one year he had Price
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: who he traded for Shurez or who he traded for
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: in Verland, or who they drafted, and they lose to
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: Bud Norris and Way and Chen and I think Miguel
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: Gonzalez somebody. So it was like stuff happens in the playoffs. Man,
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: Like the last two years he had tapped the Dodger way.
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: But you guys know, a bunch of years before that,
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: the Dodgers could never win the big one. The only
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: one they won was was twenty twenty and they got
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: knocked out in twenty one, twenty two, twenty three. It
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: turned right for them the last couple of years. But
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: if they don't win that bullpen game in San Diego
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: in Game four, Game four, twenty four, they're out in
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: the first round again. Dave Roberts probably loses his job.
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: And if twenty things don't happen in Game seven that
• 12:21
  Speaker 2: go their way. Last year, they don't win in Toronto either,
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: So all these things can That's why the beauty of
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: the postseason is because it gives all these teams that hope, right, Like,
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: I think that's a function or what do they say,
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: a feature, not a bug. Like you get to the postseason,
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: that's where you can have a chance to slay the Dodgers.
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: You're not going to keep the Dodgers or the Yankees
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: out of the playoffs almost almost every time.
• 12:44
  Speaker 5: But in the.
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: Postseason you get a chance for wacky things to happen.
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: And it almost did for your Brewers despite having to
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: start waiting Miley for one batter in Game five and
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: then Chessinez youer ace and all this stuff, it almost happened.
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: Didn't happen, but it almost did. You're right there.
• 13:05
  Speaker 3: When my puppy Bella has something wrong, I'm not going
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: to go around googling what to do.
• 13:10
  Speaker 5: Yeah, Kratz, let's have a better plan.
• 13:11
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• 14:02
  Speaker 1: not engaged in the business of insurance. This is playing
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: right into my wheelhouse because I covered that series. I
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: don't know, you might have been there too, right that
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: that Tiger's team that you were talking about, So, well.
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, not that one, but I've been another one. Yeah.
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: That was the most awkward team and clubhouse I've ever
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: been in a room for, and I confirmed with multiple
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: big name players on that team that they felt the
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: same way. From the way it was managed to the
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: collection of talent. It was super weird. I could do
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: an hour on that alone. It was a wild experience.
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: Brad Ostmas was the manager, yes, and the entire situation was.
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: It was I've been in what hundreds of variations of
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: the clubhouses if you go year by year, that was
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: number one, weirdest one ever. With these little clicks and
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: only Tory Hunter talking half the time, and some guys
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: not allowed to talk.
• 14:54
  Speaker 7: It was a mess. It was an absolute mess. So
• 14:56
  Speaker 7: this plays into my question.
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: You can compile all these stars and all of these
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: high winds above replacement players together, that might not be
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: the right mix. So for the Mets, what's the real
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: identity here?
• 15:08
  Speaker 7: That's what I'm lacking.
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: They talked all off season about the run prevention, right,
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden you're gathering a collection
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: of players that are out of position. So what does
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: that have to do with run prevention? And a highlight
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: was yesterday the infield was a joke yesterday for the
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: Mets in the second loss there. And then number two
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: is the obsession with these shorter term deals. And some
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: of that has to do with the Dodgers, but that's
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: not working for them right now with Kyle Tucker Tyler.
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: You know this, Often the first year of a player
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: in a new place doesn't produce the best results. And
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: there's even numbers to show that. So if you're obsessed
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: with these one or two year deals with certain players,
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: right like a Boba Shad or Jorge Polanco, are you
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: really getting.
• 15:48
  Speaker 7: The best return for your investment? Is there a line?
• 15:50
  Speaker 7: Should you be giving a ten to twelve year deal
• 15:52
  Speaker 7: to a Trey Turner? No?
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: But why does it need to be. Hey, let's pay
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: like double if we can get two years instead of
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: four years out of this. I just I don't get
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: those two things that were put together in the off season.
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: And curious to get your take on that, because the
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: Brewers certainly value run prevention much more than the Mets
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: did this past offseason, right.
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: Right, And Council was saying that that is something that
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: the Cubs really do well too, and he's right. But yeah,
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: I mean that was a very curious thing, Like they say,
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: all right, we're gonna focus on run prevention. Then we
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: have all these guys out of position. You know, opening
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: day for a baseman was Horie Polanco, never played, never
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: fielded a ball for at base his whole career. So
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: they got rid of Pete Alonzo, who plays literally every
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: single day as of his day in three years. You know,
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: they don't need to reltigate that whole thing. But I
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: didn't agree with that because I think Alonso is one
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: of those special players who you know, can maybe defy
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: some of the agent curve. Maybe I'd be wrong, but
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: I thought they really miscalculate the value in a guy
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: who's always going to post and you know what you're
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: going to get from him. So yeah, I mean, you know, defense,
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: that's a huge thing that the Brewers do. I mean,
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: I saw Cooper Pratt a few weeks ago when I
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: was down to Nashville for a story, and they were like,
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: this guy can field right now with the big leagues.
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: You know he'll he'll hit in time, he'll grow as
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: a hitter, but he is a big league fielder right now.
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: And you saw a couple of weeks later they brought
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: him right up. He turned a double play end in
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: the game last night. You know he's going to be
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: a special one. So they value and prioritize those things,
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: and they and they stick with them, and they find
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: enough of a balance. Like I think sometimes you you
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: you err the other way. You know, Cleveland, does Cleveland
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: have enough offense? You know, they got a good defense
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: in a lot of spaces but do they they hit enough. No,
• 17:37
  Speaker 2: So you know you've got to be able to do both.
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: And I think the Mets, you know, they said one thing,
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: but their actions said something different.
• 17:48
  Speaker 7: So so my last question, there's a fan.
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: I missed who it was because there's a lot going
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: on in our live chat on YouTube right now, but
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: there's a fan that said, well, the Mets should just
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: go back to the Brewers' front office for the GM
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: or somebody else, because clearly the answer is still there,
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: And so I'll go double down even further. Do you
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: think we ever see a situation where an owner like
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: Steve con goes hold up, hold up for the cost
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: of Jorge Polanco's salary or Luis roberts salary This year,
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: I could just make an offer to like thirty staff
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: members from another team and be like, all of you
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: are getting thirty percent raises, come over to me and
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: most and you know, most of the people on staffs
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: in general are on these one year contracts, right. It's
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: a crazy part of our game where a lot of
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: people don't have really any job security besides the general
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: managers to people at the top. So do you think
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: there's ever a world where someone goes scorched to earth.
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: That says, I'm just going to take all of those
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: people and see what happens.
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: Just rate an entire run office yet. But you know what, though,
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: it all comes down to what the players do, and
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: it's all a guessing game, right, It's all just percentages.
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: I asked Steve Cohen earlier this year about, like, you know,
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: being in the financial world and being able to predict
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: those markets and becoming so crazy rich, and he's like, well,
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: like I was successful like fifty three percent of the time,
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: fifty four percent of the time. It was just that
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: you put down so many bets that you made so
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: much money. If you're successful fifty four percent of the
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: time baseball fifty four percent of the time, you're right
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: on the border of the playoffs. So it's it's really
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: hard to predict these things. Then you could bring in
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: the smartest minds in the world, but all of these things,
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: you know, Theoepsteine mentioned to me once. He's like, you
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: could build these teams and everybody has a range of
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: possible outcomes, right, you're just predicting. You're trying to get
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: the right card out of ten thousand cards, and it
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: might be that all these guys have great years there.
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: It might be that this guy gets injured, that guy
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: gets injured, and you wind up with eighty three wins
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: you're looking for, and it's just such a it blows
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: your mind. It must frustrate the hell out of these
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: guys because the smartest minds in the world can put
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: together the best looking team, but all these variables can
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: still happen to ruin those plans. So you know, it's
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: it's there's there's no one great answer. But I think
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: when you look at an organization top to bottom right now,
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: the Dodgers with a standard obviously, but Milwaukee does the
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: best job. I again, being in Nashville, can we go
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: seeing their Triple A operation. They've had the same Triple
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: A manager, Rick Sweet since twenty thirteen. He's about the
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: next year he is going to set the record for
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: most wins in the minor league as a minor league manager.
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: He's incredible as a conduit between what they want in
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: Triple A and what they want in the big leagues
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: and keeping that consistent, keeping that pipeline going. He's kind
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: of an overlooked guy in what Milwaukee does. And that's
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: just one way of saying that this is a team
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: that's really smart analytically, but they also value a guy
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: who's been the minor league manager for thirty six years
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: as the main, you know, pathway to the big leagues.
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: That's their last stop on the way to the big leagues.
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: Is this guy who has all the old school wisdom too.
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: So the Brewers do a lot of stuff right that
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: you know, you wouldn't even think of Tyler.
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: Just in case Rick, sweet sweetie is listening to this,
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: please don't give him any credit. Do not give that
• 21:07
  Speaker 3: old geezer. Don't give him any that old geezer any credit.
• 21:12
  Speaker 3: But my question to you is the last one. Do
• 21:16
  Speaker 3: you just wait a little bit longer with the Mets,
• 21:18
  Speaker 3: this didn't happen overnight. With the Brewers, do you wait?
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: Or is David Stern's Because all of the moves that
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: David Sterns has been making that I feel like has
• 21:27
  Speaker 3: crippled this team is setting up for the future, not
• 21:31
  Speaker 3: ham stringing this team with seven eight year contracts. Whether
• 21:34
  Speaker 3: I agree with that or not. He's setting things up
• 21:37
  Speaker 3: for the future. So do you give David Sterns more time?
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: Or is the market of New York not allowed to
• 21:43
  Speaker 3: give him more time.
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: No, you do give him more time. And I have
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: never suggested that David's a really smart guy. He's a
• 21:50
  Speaker 2: good communicator. I've known him a long time, and a
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: lot of his moves, do you know, do make some
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: do make a lot of sense. I don't think that
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: the short term contract thing for pitchers is necessarily bad.
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: I don't think most pitchers, again, unless your Hall of Famer,
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: have more than five to seven really highly productive years,
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: and a lot of them are before free agency. So
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: it's just a matter of picking the right guys, you know.
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: So I think David does a lot of stuff right.
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: It hasn't worked out this year. There were things I
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: wouldn't have done. But I do think he has a
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: grasp on what is going to make the team a
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: consistent winner, and I think they're in the right hands.
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: But it's just like I said, it's just not as
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: easy to say, take a small market winner, bring him,
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: give him more of a payroll, and all of your
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: problems will go away, because money comes with its own
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: set of problems. Look, the Brewers might make more mistakes too,
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: if they had access to as many players as a
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: big market team, right, like, you have more access to
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: more players, there's more possibilities you can make mistakes and
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: then hamstring the rest of your roster. So they do
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: have a little bit of an advantage that way.
• 23:04
  Speaker 7: Yeah.
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: Also, Tyler, you know, there was a world where the
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: Dodgers weren't that good, right they. I mean, they were
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: a mess during the Frank McCourt era many times, and
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: then eventually they got bought and they weren't racking championships.
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: You had like the platoon era where you know, as
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: far Anxiety and Andrew Friedman and they platooned everything to death,
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: and then they started to get away with that and really, ultimately,
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: I mean they made some better decisions than it took
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: some time to grow this powerhouse that they created. But
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: also like they have the best player of all time.
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: That was really the icing on the cake. They weren't
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: this juggernaut until they had the best player of all time.
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, the best thing the Dodgers, I mean, the
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: most impressive thing probably that this Dodgers run up, this
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: Dodgers run, is how they went from a court to
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: this juggernaut without seemingly, you know, without like having a lull.
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: You know, they spent their way to it, but like
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: they threw a lot of money at it and kept winning,
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: not winning world series, but they kept winning divisions, kept
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: you know, keeping keeping the train moving there and keeping
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: fans into it and excited while having to dig out
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: behind the scenes from all that stuff in the the
• 24:14
  Speaker 2: court era. So that was that was part of the
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: genius of what Freedman was able to do and stand
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: casting and the whole group when they got in there.
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: Well, we really enjoyed the combo. We love when you're
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: able to join us. Thanks for doing that, Tyler, and
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: great article. Check out his work there and many many
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: more awesome articles in The Athletic from Tyler Kepner. Tyler,
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: great to catch up man, Good to see you all right.
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: Bells can stand you too,