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Nicola Willis: Finance Minister unveils plan to bring down deficit in 2025 Budget · Best of Business

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  Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from News Talks Be follow
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  Speaker 2: With us as the Finance Minister, Nikola Will this evening, Nicolab.
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  Speaker 3: Good evening, Heather.
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  Speaker 2: Now I see that you're talking about starting to pay
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  Speaker 2: down our debt. Are you going to start paying down
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  Speaker 2: the debt this budget?
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  Speaker 3: Well, the first step to paying down debt is getting
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  Speaker 3: the budget back in balance. Because New Zealand has been
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  Speaker 3: a deficit, spending more than we earn since twenty nineteen,
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  Speaker 3: and we've previously said that we want to consolidate gradually.
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  Speaker 3: Our goal is to get back into surplus by the
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  Speaker 3: twenty seven twenty eight financial year. That goal remains the same.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, So we get back to surplus twenty seven twenty
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  Speaker 2: eight and then we start hammering the debt. Is that right?
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  Speaker 3: That's right, because once you're in surplus, of course you're
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  Speaker 3: no longer borrowing to pay for the groceries and you've
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  Speaker 3: got the ability to pay down debt. Of course, we're
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  Speaker 3: borrowing every day right now to keep our hospitals, schools
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  Speaker 3: and police going. But we can't do that forever as
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  Speaker 3: a country. We need to get the books back in balance.
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  Speaker 2: So what do you reckon is a good level for
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  Speaker 2: debt to sit at?
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  Speaker 3: Well, percent is where I would like to get it too.
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  Speaker 3: I want it tracking down to there. Between twenty and
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  Speaker 3: forty percent is where the government has said is what
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  Speaker 3: we're comfortable with. It's now up over that level, Treasury say,
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  Speaker 3: beyond fifty percent, it becomes a bit of a problem
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  Speaker 3: if we get an earthquake or a climate shock or
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  Speaker 3: any kind of big economic event.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, hold on, So are you saying that when you
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  Speaker 2: leave the role as Finance minister one day, forty percent
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  Speaker 2: will be a good good spot to get it too?
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I want it tracking down to forty percent.
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  Speaker 2: Isn't it only twenty two and a half at the moment.
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  Speaker 3: Yes, that's right, But it's forecast to keep growing while
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  Speaker 3: we're still in deficit. To what my first goal is
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  Speaker 3: to get it bending back down to forty and then
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  Speaker 3: we think it should comfortably sit between twenty and forty.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, And so what is it going to track it?
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  Speaker 2: What is it going to reach? It its height according
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  Speaker 2: to forecasts?
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  Speaker 3: Well, that's what I'm going to tell you at the
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  Speaker 3: budget okay, very budget sensitive figure. And it needs to
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  Speaker 3: be forwarded to dating.
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  Speaker 2: Then you've got to have a stretch goal, right. You
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  Speaker 2: can't be doing like forty three percent down to forty percent.
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  Speaker 2: That's not impressive.
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  Speaker 3: Well, as I say, the first thing is get your
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  Speaker 3: books back in balance, and New Zealand is listening to
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  Speaker 3: this will understand that the first thing to start being
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  Speaker 3: able to pay down your credit card debt is to
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  Speaker 3: actually not be spending more than you earn each week.
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  Speaker 3: And right now New Zealand is spending more every year
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  Speaker 3: than we are earning, and so we have to get
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  Speaker 3: that right. And that's the prerequisite of being able to
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  Speaker 3: pay down debt. And of course labor at every instance
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  Speaker 3: say the answer to every problem is to spend more,
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  Speaker 3: and they forget the fact that right now it's all
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  Speaker 3: on the credit card and that credit card needs to
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  Speaker 3: be repaid by your kids and my kids.
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  Speaker 2: Nicholas is the received bank currently independent of view it is, well,
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  Speaker 2: how did you get them to change their mind about
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  Speaker 2: the capital funding? Once Adrian all left because he was like, no,
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  Speaker 2: I don't want to know, I don't want to do
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  Speaker 2: what you want. He's out the door. Christian and Neil
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  Speaker 2: quickly decide to do what you want, Well, they took.
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  Speaker 3: That decision independent of me. You'll know that there's been
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  Speaker 3: a Select Committee inquiry occurring at Parliament and to the
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  Speaker 3: banking sector, and one of the issues that's been raised
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  Speaker 3: by Omitta after submitter is the impact the changes in
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  Speaker 3: the Reserve Bank's capital adequacy ratios have had on lending.
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  Speaker 3: I think the Reserve Bank has observed that public debate
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  Speaker 3: and in their own words, they've decided it's an appropriate
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  Speaker 3: time to check in and see whether the decisions they
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  Speaker 3: made back in twenty nineteen still stack.
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  Speaker 2: I would agree with you on this, and I think
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  Speaker 2: that they're doing the right thing. But you've got a
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  Speaker 2: problem here, haven't you, Because what's being suggested in the
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  Speaker 2: media today is that Neil Quigley is not independent as
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  Speaker 2: the as the chair because he is with White Cutter University.
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  Speaker 2: He wants you to give him a medical school. Christian
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  Speaker 2: Hawksby is not independent is the acting governor because he
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  Speaker 2: wants the job full time. So he's going to do
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  Speaker 2: what Both of them have interests in doing what you want.
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  Speaker 2: There's the perception problem, isn't that.
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  Speaker 3: Well, I just reject that completely and I think it
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  Speaker 3: impugnes the integrity of both of those people. Well, does
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  Speaker 3: it not lead you to they take their roles more seriously?
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  Speaker 2: But does it not lead you to the point where
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  Speaker 2: it has become obvious that neither of them can hold
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  Speaker 2: those positions?
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  Speaker 3: Well, no, I continue to have confidence in the Reserve Bank,
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  Speaker 3: both the Acting Governor and in the chair of the
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  Speaker 3: Reserve Bank Board.
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  Speaker 2: But even outside of this, do they actually deserve those
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  Speaker 2: positions Because Neil Quigley was there, while Adrian All was
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  Speaker 2: there and that thing was just a complete hot mess,
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  Speaker 2: and so was Christian hawksby right, So they are all
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  Speaker 2: part of the same kabal. Don't you need a proper
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  Speaker 2: clean out?
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  Speaker 3: Well, I'm very pleased that we've started by getting the
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  Speaker 3: funding situation under control and stopping this business of massive
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  Speaker 3: increases and how much the Reserve Bank is spens. Yeah,
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  Speaker 3: I think that will go a significant way to changing culture.
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  Speaker 3: I've also refreshed some of the membership of both the
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  Speaker 3: Monetary Policy Committee and the Board, and I have further
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  Speaker 3: opportunities to do more of that in the next few months.
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  Speaker 3: All of those things are relevant, and I share your
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  Speaker 3: concerns about some of the decisions that the Reserve Bank
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  Speaker 3: made when it was in Cohertz with Grant Robertson and
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  Speaker 3: they printed too much money. Yes, and I have said
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  Speaker 3: previously that I do think is a country we need
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  Speaker 3: to review some of that decision.
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  Speaker 2: But both of these there at the same time, Nichola,
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  Speaker 2: can they continue to hold their jobs if they were
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  Speaker 2: part of that administration?
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  Speaker 3: Well, look, I'm satisfied that the Reserve Bank Board recommended
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  Speaker 3: to me that Christian Hawksby was the best person for
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  Speaker 3: that temporary role while they search for a permanent governor,
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  Speaker 3: and he meets all of the criteria needed.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, now listen, have you caught up on the fact
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  Speaker 2: that you guys are still doing co governance? Are you
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  Speaker 2: aware of this?
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  Speaker 3: Well, I don't think that's quite fair. I think you're
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  Speaker 3: referring to the situation in the way takes Yukland Council
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  Speaker 3: is currently consulting on a proposed interpretation of a deed
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  Speaker 3: and look, that's out for consultation. People will have their say.
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  Speaker 3: None of it, as I understand it would override existing governance.
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  Speaker 2: What have I got wrong?
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  Speaker 3: Statutory?
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  Speaker 2: What have I got wrong? Calling this co governance?
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  Speaker 3: Well, as I understand it, the proposal being consulted on
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  Speaker 3: is not final. First second, I understand it's not intended
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  Speaker 3: to override the existing governance structure or the statutory powers.
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  Speaker 2: What government structures and strategory powers are you talking about.
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  Speaker 3: Well, I'm talking about the fact that the Council is
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  Speaker 3: still the democratically elected Council, that the Crown is still
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  Speaker 3: the democratically elective crown. Well, so that will ensure that
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  Speaker 3: the positions of the Crown and the Council continue to
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  Speaker 3: be represented effectively. Whooped to do?
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  Speaker 2: It's co governance. It's a committee that makes decisions. Fifty
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  Speaker 2: percent of it is tongue's if you know, with fifty
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  Speaker 2: percent is Crown and Council. That is co governance.
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  Speaker 3: Well, look to anyone listening, it's out for consultation right now.
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  Speaker 3: So why are you doing this?
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  Speaker 2: When you guys are elected. You came out against three Waters,
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  Speaker 2: you came out against the new RMA, and it was
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  Speaker 2: implicit in that that you guys were going to stop
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  Speaker 2: the co governance. So why is the same stuff happening
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  Speaker 2: under you guys.
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  Speaker 3: Well, this relates to an Act of Parliament from two
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  Speaker 3: thousand and eight which already sets up a deed and
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  Speaker 3: Auckland Council are currently consulting on how they want to
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  Speaker 3: give effect to that deed. No decisions have been made.
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  Speaker 3: People should have their say.
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  Speaker 2: Are you cool with us?
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  Speaker 3: Well? To be honest, hither, the first I heard of
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  Speaker 3: it was about half an hour ago when my press
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  Speaker 3: team said, heither wants to ask you about this, so
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  Speaker 3: I will be seeking to get more information about it.
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  Speaker 2: In that case, I feel slightly bad coming as hard
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  Speaker 2: at you as I have, But can you go away,
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  Speaker 2: have a look at it, take some advice, come back
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  Speaker 2: to me and let me know if your government is
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  Speaker 2: chill about this, because it would be a huge disappointment
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  Speaker 2: to me if you were. But while we're on the
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  Speaker 2: subject of things that we are discovering now, it seems
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  Speaker 2: to me that what you've given Winston is a picture
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  Speaker 2: of a train? Is that what's happened?
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  Speaker 3: As I said, look, I respect Winston's desire for privacy.
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  Speaker 3: When I gave he told me that birthday, oh he
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  Speaker 3: told you? Okay, yeah, well, then that's absolutely fine. If
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  Speaker 3: he's revealed that information. Then I gave him a vintage
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  Speaker 3: poster from the railways from the seventh and it's pretty cool.
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  Speaker 2: From his heyday. So the thing is, do you realize
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  Speaker 2: he hasn't even looked at it yet.
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  Speaker 3: Well, he looked at it with me in front of him,
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  Speaker 3: but I don't think it's on display or anything.
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  Speaker 2: I don't think it's soaked in, because he said to me, oh,
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  Speaker 2: I was really busy and I was going to go
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  Speaker 2: out the door, and I haven't actually looked at it.
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  Speaker 2: So you might have to get him, might have to
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  Speaker 2: get him back there and looking at it again. Do
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  Speaker 2: you know what I mean?
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  Speaker 3: Anyway, Well, I'm glad that he's got more important things
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  Speaker 3: to do than look at train posters. Hey, can it
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  Speaker 3: be with the world as it is? Right?
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  Speaker 2: No, listen on Winston though, Are you guys going to
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  Speaker 2: support this definition of a woman that he's putting into
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  Speaker 2: a member's bill.
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  Speaker 3: Well, look, we haven't taken that bill to caucus yet.
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  Speaker 3: Our practices that we decide our positions on bills as
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  Speaker 3: a team when bills are pulled from the ballot. For
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  Speaker 3: my part, what is a woman? Well, a woman is
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  Speaker 3: an adult human female. That's pretty clear to me. Let
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  Speaker 3: live person. So how people then choose to self identify,
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  Speaker 3: that's over to them. But the law often needs to
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  Speaker 3: be a bit more black and white than that. So
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  Speaker 3: we just a matter of how does this axually apply
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  Speaker 3: to the law what I'm peple I.
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  Speaker 2: Have Nicholas, thank you for your time. As always, we'll
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  Speaker 2: talk next week about co governance. That's Nicola Willi's Finance Minister.
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