Latest / Financial Planner Life Podcast / How to Build a Referral-Driven Financial Planning Business with Rosie Hooper

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How to Build a Referral-Driven Financial Planning Business with Rosie Hooper · Financial Planner Life Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_02: And today's guest on the Financial Planner Live podcast is Rosie Hooper from Quilter Chevia.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_02: She is a chartered fellow financial planner.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_02: And today we talk about her transition from a corporate employee benefits role and moved into private client.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_02: We talk about how to maximize referrals from your clients, why you should give them a top-level client experience, double down on that, and how the referrals will flow back to you.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_02: We also talk about her coaching and development of other individuals within Quilters Chivia, where she has helped three people become financial planners.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_02: We talk about all things financial planning, past, present, and future.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_02: I think you're going to love this episode.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_02: So, Rosie, thank you so much for joining me today on the Financial Planner Life podcast.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_02: How are you?
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_02: Really well, thank you, Sam.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_02: Good.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_02: Well, thank you very much for for joining me.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_02: So a short notice as well.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_02: You know, as I was just saying, I'm kind of in between doing online episodes and face-to-face episodes for 2026.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_02: So there's a few slots we hadn't filled.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_02: So you came to the rescue.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you so much.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_02: No, it's my pleasure.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_02: So you are a chartered financial planner, and you're not a financial advisor.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_02: Let's just start there.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_02: Why don't you want to be called a chartered financial advisor?
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_02: You'd rather be called a chartered financial planner.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_02: Let me let me know.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I guess the devil's in the detail, but I think because I'm so ready to giving my clients proper financial planning, I think it's only right to sort of carry the right title.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_00: No offense against people that are calling themselves advisors.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: Of course, we want to give advice, but it's not transactional.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's very much about being on the journey with clients.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_00: And I think for that, you do need to have a plan.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: I think the other reason why a plan is really important is it gives the client something tangible to hold on to, and dare I say, makes me accountable as well.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: So it's been absolutely brilliant over the last few years, as you can imagine, with stock market performance, where we've gone back to 2023 and said, where did we need to be to be on track for 2025?
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_00: We've gone back two years, had a look at the plan, and we're like, wow, we're actually ahead of the game here.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_00: We're actually on track for where we needed to be in 2027 because markets have been kind to us, but clients can then really see the progression.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's important as an advisor or a planner that you have that accountability, regardless of what title you use.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: I think it is all about the plan.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: Fantastic.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_01: So, how did you get into financial planning then?
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, you were going to make me go back a long way.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_00: So, about 26 years ago, back in 1999, um, I knew that I wanted to work with people and I wanted to work close with money.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, there wasn't a great deal of money growing up, so money was quite important to me, and I knew that I loved being around people.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: So I kind of hustled my way in, dare I say, uh, to the poor chap that was at the local swimming club.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_00: I used to swim all the time as a kid, absolutely loved swimming.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: And um, he basically promised me a job even before my A levels were delivered.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: He said, You know what, Rosie, you've worn me down and you've you've got the job.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_00: And so then after that, it was all about just proving myself.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_02: So, what job was that you actually got then when you went into the bank?
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_00: This is a great story.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: So, my dad, bless his heart, he's not with me anymore, but he told me through all the years when I was growing up, the most prestigious job anyone could have was a bank manager, to be a branch manager.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_00: So I kind of followed really his advice, and that's what I worked to do.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: So when I was the age of 23, I was a branch manager over at Barclays, um, looking after a team of about 20 people.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: It was a lot of responsibility for a young person.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I quickly worked out that is not what I wanted to do.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_00: Branch managers are not with the clients.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_00: You're in the back office, you've got the responsibility.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: I thought I'm not shy scared of responsibility, but I always knew I wanted to be out at the front with client facing.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_00: And that's when I started to switch, and then I got into financial planning.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_02: Love it.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_02: So growing up then, you must have been around money all the time, people talking about money, maybe talking about financial planning for you to end up in a career within financial services.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_02: Am I right?
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, well, we were talking about money, but not because it was in abundance, it's because there was the lack of it.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um from quite a young age, I quickly worked out that money was going to be important, not because of what money bought you in material objects, but because of the freedom that it gave you.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_00: It gave you options, and I think I've kept that really close to my heart when I look after clients' money as well.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_00: I realised it's not just the money they trust me with.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_00: They're practically putting their lives in my hands, and it's very fragile, and therefore I take a great amount of responsibility to make sure I look after clients' lives, i.e., their money.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_00: But I always like numbers.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_00: I always done really well at school when it comes to crunching figures, and I still absolutely love to this day to run calculations in my head.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously, they get checked with all the right appropriate tools, but I still get a thrill out of adding up the numbers.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_02: So you worked for the bank.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yep.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_02: Bank management, not for you.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_02: Decided to take a different route looking over your LinkedIn profile conversations that we've had.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you also work with one of the clients I work with.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_02: You know, you worked with um Second Sight, which is part of Foster De novo.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_02: So, how long were you there for and what were you doing there?
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_00: I was there for just over 12 years.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_00: I was a really happy member of the Foster De Novo family, and I've still got great relations with a lot of the people I still keep in regular contact, go for lunches.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I'd say they really gave me uh a catalyst within my career.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_00: I worked with some really good people, too many to sort of name drop, but they know who they are if they're listening.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_00: And they taught me a lot.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_00: They taught me a lot about the people element.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_00: They were very good at giving us good training.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_00: So we wouldn't just like be on the road working, where they would actually take the time to take us off-road, train us, upskill us, or as they used to call it, sharpen your ax and then get you back onto the client facing, not with an axe in hand.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_00: It was our kind of analogy for you know, you've got to keep yourself sharp.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that has actually stayed with me throughout all of my career, in the sense that I never always wanted, I never wanted to do just the bare minimums with qualifications.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_00: If I was doing qualifications, I wanted to get to chartered.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: From chartered, I wanted to get to fellowship.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: I was always obsessed with just a real thirst for knowledge and wanting to know more.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_00: And that's because if I'm sitting in front of the client, I want to do everything for them.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_00: When I sort of think about how I appreciate service, and if I'm calling up one department, I want them to take care of my three or four jobs.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_00: We know what it's like, Sam, when someone says, I'm just gonna pass you on for this, and then you're just gonna speak to the next person.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: It feels very fragmented.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_00: I want to I want to own that, I want to be responsible, and therefore I've sort of continued with my qualifications and my thirst for knowledge.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_02: I like it.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_02: So often people say, look, you know, level four qualification, that's what you need to become a financial planner.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_02: Often people think, do I really need to go on to be a chartered?
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_02: Do I need to go on to be chartered fellow?
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_02: What would you say to those, those, those individuals?
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_02: What can they, what can they stand to gain from those extracurricular qualifications?
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_00: So personally, for me, I know I needed to have that knowledge because one, I needed to build that confidence.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_00: I think confidence is a really important um, it's a really important quality when you're sitting in front of a client.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: You need confidence, but you also need credibility, and that's what the qualifications do give you.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_00: Remember, we're working within a profession that is constantly changing rules, allowances, there's so much information you have to stay on top of.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_00: It just doesn't seem fair to think that you would get one set of qualifications and then over time not keep training yourself.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's obviously, you know, if you don't use things, you lose it.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that is very much the case with knowledge.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_00: So I would encourage people if you're one exam away from getting the charter or one exam away from getting the fellowship, sometimes it's the last one which needs the real oomph to get you over the line.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_00: Don't have to do it solo.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_00: Where I work currently at Quilt Achievia, we have so many people buddying up for study times.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it's quite good to find someone else that's in the same boat as you and have that accountability and work together.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_02: Love it.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_02: So tell us a little bit, a little bit about that quilt achievia then, because I know that you are really passionate about helping the next generation of advisor come through and get the right training, get the right coaching, get the right mentorship.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_02: So just tell us a little bit about some of the things Quilt Achievia actually are doing and what you are doing specifically to coach and guide and to help the next generation of financial planners there.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, perfect.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I've got a real thirst to give back in the sense that my time at Foster De Novo was really happy and everyone really put a lot into me and I've really benefited.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_00: So, really to sort of pay that one forward, I've identified different people that work within Cruit Achievia.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_00: I've also introduced people into the company as well, and I've taken them on literally from an administration point of view, moved them through to the paraplanning, moved them through to be advisors, and I've stayed with them on that journey.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_00: Couple of things I would say on there, Sam, is it's really important not to just move people through the ranks, but to actually stick by their side as well.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: More often than not, it can be deemed that, you know, once somebody's ticked these boxes and they're then the advisor, they're off and they're flying.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_00: It's really hard to be an advisor or a financial planner straight away overnight.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_00: You really need to sort of slowly take the stabilizers off the bike when it comes to come to becoming a financial advisor.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_00: Because I think sticking with the people that you're working close to and actually giving them that guidance that you said coaching, I'll lead on to that in a moment.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_00: The mentorship, that's what's really important to create a successful financial planner.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_00: More often than not, people think they can get the qualifications, get the job, get the grad scheme.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_00: I've got the job, I'm off.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: Getting the job and doing the job are two different things.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: And I found that when I was working really close, there's a handful of people that will know who they are that I've you know helped them succeed at quilt achievier.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: I found that the one thing that I wasn't great at at the beginning was actually coaching.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_00: I love to talk, I love to advise, I love to tell.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I obviously I do love to listen, but you need to do a lot more listening and a lot more questioning skills when it comes to coaching.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I took myself off of my own accord.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_00: I went to Henley, I did the executive coaching qualification.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: It took a year to do it.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_00: I met some fabulous people in the cohort, loved every minute of it.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: And then I realized that I could actually coach my colleagues as well as be a role model and advise them what to do.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: I sometimes struggle with coaching, if I'm still honest, because I'm very chatty and I love to tell.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_00: So we've been jokingly call it mention in the background.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if you've heard the term mention.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_00: No?
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_00: No, I haven't.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_00: Explain that.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: So it's mentoring.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_00: So you can still do the tell mode, you can mentor your colleagues, and it's a bit of mentoring with a bit of coaching.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_00: It's not full-on coaching, because with coaching, you have to kind of sit back and allow the coachy to arrive to the own conclusion.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_00: But with a bit of mention, you can mentor and coach at the same time.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: And that's worked out really well.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I love it.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_02: Great stuff.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_02: Is there any examples of people that you can talk about that you've helped on the journey, you know, along along the way on their journey?
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna well, uh, do you want me to name a colleague that I'm really close to that I'm sure she'll be happy?
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I'm really close to a colleague called Sarah who's ended up being a great friend, and she was a fantastic paraplanner for me.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_00: She was so conscientious, her thirst and attention to detail was second to none.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_00: And more often than not, I found that when I was paraplanning with Sarah by my side, I was actually going out, completing the fact find with the clients, bringing back the case study.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_00: And instead of, which most financial planners tell the power planners what the advice is, me and Sarah would craft the advice together in the background.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_00: And it took a long time for me saying to her, You could become a financial planner, you'd be a great advisor.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_00: Why don't you give it a go?
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_00: Because remember, we need to kind of have our confidence.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_00: Our confidence is just as important as our credibility and our and our experience.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: And it's taken some time to give Sarah that confidence, but now she is flourishing.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_00: She is a financial planner, she's got her own clients, she gets lots of lovely referrals because everyone knows how she works.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_00: She's a superstar when it comes to cash flow planning, which is really dear to my heart as well.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and it's been a complete joy, if I'm being honest with you, to be able to watch her flourish.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_00: It's great for the business.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_00: Crutachivia, obviously, nothing better than a homegrown financial planner.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's come from our soil.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we've got she's got our set of values.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and there's something really nice for me because as I'm starting to get older, and you know, there'll be a day when I will hang up my boots and I won't be advising clients anymore.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_00: I want to leave a legacy.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_00: And that legacy isn't just to come to work for a paycheck and go home.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_00: I want to be able to look at a group of people and say I've made an impact on their careers.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I think Sarah's probably an example of that.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_02: How long did it take Sarah to kind of recognize that she was at the skill sketch, ready to actually become a financial planner?
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_02: How long did that journey actually take?
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_00: So I would say it was a year for her to recognize it, but not for her to obtain it.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_00: And that's why I was saying confidence earlier on is really important because she was in my mind when I was talking to you.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_00: Some people, dare I say it, Sam, have just got so much confidence.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: And dare I say it, sometimes they haven't got the qualifications or the credibility or even like the knowledge to be able to do the job.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I haven't got an example of that in mind.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_00: But if I was to work with somebody like that, you need to keep a good set of reins on people like that and pull them back a little bit so that they're not out making mistakes.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_00: Because obviously, we need to get it right every time.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's essential to the client that we're getting it right.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: In Sarah's example, and I've got a couple of people like Sarah where they're they've got the credibility, they've got the knowledge, but they haven't yet got the confidence.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_00: We used to joke, we used to call it the rucksack of confidence, and I know that sounds a bit sad, but you get me walking to the office, you know, and I come all confident, been to see a client, rushing off to see another client, I can do that job.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_00: And Sarah would come in and she'd be like, I need to prep, I need longer to prep.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, the most important thing is that you feel prepped and you feel ready and you have the confidence so it doesn't show in front of clients because her knowledge was there from day one, even from when she was power planning, she was spot on.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: So I think being able to spend time with your colleagues and be able to recognise what they need, sometimes it's knowledge, sometimes it's confidence.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_00: That's how you grow people from inside a company and make them go on to succeed.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, cool.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_02: So if we are identifying or a financial planner on the call on this podcast now listening, might identify they've got somebody who lacks confidence.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_02: What can they do to help build that confidence?
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_02: Is it role-playing?
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_02: Is it getting them face to face with clients?
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_02: What worked for you?
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so I think it's a mixture of things.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_00: I think the first thing is you need to be able to demonstrate what good looks like.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: So I would always um say to Sarah, you're more than welcome to come out with me, but I'm not stupid enough to think that I'm doing everything perfect in every scenario.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I'm trying to, but what I used to say to Sarah is go view another three or four other financial planners as well, get the best of breeds, go and look at four or five different um meetings, and then come back to base and tell me what you found.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_00: So it's always really good to do the debrief as well.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_00: That often gets missed.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes you go out and you get observe a meeting, but you don't get to debrief.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: The learning is in the debrief 100%.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_00: The next thing I'd say is you don't want to be saying the words for the first time live to the client.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_00: That you need to have done it for two or three times.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_00: And do you know where I was used to practice?
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_00: I used to practice in the bathroom mirror.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_00: I know that makes me sound quite sad, but I would literally look at myself in the bathroom mirror as I could hold my eye contact, and I would say, This is what I want to say.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_00: How does this sound?
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: And you polish it up on your own.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_00: So by the time you've seen what good looks like, you've practiced in the bathroom mirror, however, you want to practice, you're you're not doing it for the first time in front of the client.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_00: And the client recognises that.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_00: They pick up on the fact that actually you're comfortable with what you're saying and how you're presenting and it goes well.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_00: Not what I would also say to add that is when things don't go well, expect that every now and again they won't go perfectly.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_00: Because if you're holding yourself to such high standards all the time, it's just not possible to hit that high standard each and every time.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: Every now and again, there'll be a uh piece of paperwork that you should have brought along to a meeting.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, there'll be you're running 15 minutes late because a tube has let you down.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_00: There's gonna be things that happen.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_00: Be able to sort of say to yourself, okay, shake it off.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I know that sounds funny, but there's a few people, me and Megan do this at work.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_00: We're like, shake it off.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_00: Shake it off.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_00: Literally change your physical and move yourself around and let it go.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: Because if you go into that meeting and you're up tired and you're, you know, I'm so sorry, I'm late because of the tube, it it does have that knock-on effect.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's better just to acknowledge it, shake it off, and then give them the meeting they deserve.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_02: No, I love that.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_02: My wife's doing this trauma cancelling course at the moment, and it's all about releasing trauma within your body.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_02: And one of the things that I've been learning is when I get into a state of say stress or overwhelm, or um, maybe I feel like I've held myself to a high expectation, I haven't hit what I hope hope to hit.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I can often I can often hold that feeling within me.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_02: And so she's taught me a few techniques, and I'm I'll share them today because you might do them yourself, or someone might might like them.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_02: One of them is like tapping the sternum.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you saw me.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: Did you put my hand up there?
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, Foster De novo taught me that.
• 18:26
  unknown: Yeah.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: The guy there taught me about doing the tapping.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, the tapping is really, really good.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_02: So tapping that chest bit there as well, that where your heart, where your heart, you know, breath into that heart space, but give it a little tap as well.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_02: And the other one was releasing the jaw, which I found incredible.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_02: So you release the jaw, and then you place your tongue on the the bottom of your mouth, and you really let the jaw just relax because we hold so much of the tension.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you know, I can feel that.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and what you'll find is the tongue will drop down, start to breathe in, breathe out, and you'll start to pick up like saliva and all of that, and you'll even start to yawn.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_02: And these are all signs that your sort of vagus nervous system and your sympathetic nervous system is starting to relax.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_02: And I had a really stressed-out moment about a month and a half ago.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_02: I was in the car with my wife, and she just went, right, do these.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_02: And I did it, and I felt so like released of stress that I had to go back and get into bed because I was so kind of like exhausted from it.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_02: It was like that something that's what your wife wanted you to do.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna go for sleep.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: You don't mind, do you?
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_02: And another one she did, which I found quite quite incredible, was you put your hands on the back of your head like that, yeah, and you rock yourself.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_00: I've not done that one either.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_02: And then you you look up to the left, to the right, and all of that.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_02: Apparently, it's it it it's it's what you it reminds you of being a baby.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I can imagine a lot of them staying back to that.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it reminds you of being secure.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_02: So often when we have these moments of utter stress and we feel like we can't let it go, yeah, it's as simple as like those little breathing exercises and the tapping and I know I just thought at this moment in time I think you know, we can often hold on to it.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_02: And it's something that I've been kind of classed at as woo-woo, really.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_02: And then all of a sudden I was like, no, I'm into this, this is really good.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I've always I've always loved anything like that.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_00: I've always really focused on the well-being.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and it's interesting because as you're talking, it's starting to make me think of other things actually that when I'm sitting with clients, that it's really not all about the numbers when you really boil down to it.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um, there's something really simple that I do when I'm talking to clients about the health and wealth seesaw.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_00: And I often say to clients that, you know, as they're working and they're earning and they're building their wealth and they're building their wealth and the, you know, the wealth is building up and up, they don't see it.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_00: But like a seesaw, what happens naturally is health normally tips the other end.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_00: And we talk about this quite a lot to the point of clients actually sometimes come to the second or third meeting and they go, Yeah, about the seesaw again, about the health and the wealth.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_00: And it's really interesting because you know you've had impact on them when they start doing the health and the wealth.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, I've had clients say to me, I can see now how I've not been for my checkup, or I've not followed through on a toothache, and I can see how my health is tipping.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_00: And what's really important, well, for me, is getting that right, getting the balance right.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_00: I know they've got to keep working until they've earned enough money to pay for that lifestyle and the cash flow's worked it out for the next 30 years, and we've got a number, there's our target.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_00: But actually, if you hit your target and you're still working, working and working and working, you've made this marginal extra that's buying you nothing marginal back in lifestyle, what it's cost you for the extra money is probably your health.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_00: And once it tips so far out of balance, how much harder is it when you're trying to push down on that CSO and you're trying to get that balance back?
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_00: That weight of pushing back becomes really, really hard.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_00: So it's interesting you're talking like this because actually, even though clients might come to me as the financial planner, it's amazing as as the conversations go on and the trust builds, and you've become that trusted planner to the family.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_00: That the conversations on meeting four and five is hardly ever about performance, charges, percentage terms.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_00: It really just falls away.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_00: It becomes even a little bit irrelevant because what they're really trying to drive is they're really trying to drive the best lifestyle for them and getting the balance right.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's actually what I'm addicted to.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's that part, that of the comp them conversations.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: I feel so privileged, Sam, that people will trust me in that way.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I can see myself sometimes sort of like I've woven myself into the fabric of their family.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm fully and emotional saying this to you, but I think that's what I need in return.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's what I what crave I crave.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_00: I I like feeling um really needed, I guess, if I'm being honest.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_02: It's that connection, isn't it?
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I I hear what you were saying.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_02: On I'm the same.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_02: It's seldom when I talk to people, I seldom talk about the problem or the solution.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_02: And we talk about that for a bit, obviously, because you have to get past the barrier and you want to solve a problem that they that they have.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_02: And I can imagine most people when they come and sit down with you, the problem they have is oh my god, have I got enough money to live on for the rest of my life, how much money do I need?
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_02: But you have to kind of you have to break through that barrier, don't you?
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_02: And then you build the connection.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_02: And it's the meaningful, deeper connection, the purpose that stuff that makes you feel good inside.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_02: It fills back up again.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm I'm I'm very much the same.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_02: I love be having a deeper connection with people.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_02: It is we crave connection.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_02: You you're quite an emotional individual, right?
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_02: You your your cup gets filled up when you feel like you're doing good for somebody else above and beyond what it is that you are perceived to do, which is to make people money or save people money, right?
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_02: That's fundamentally part of what it is.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_02: But what your actual driver really is, your higher purpose driver, is to make people healthy and happy.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, absolutely.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_00: I love I love looking after the families as well.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I've been very fortunate that I've got some fantastic clients that have that have really sort of referred me their fantastic friends and their family members.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like a bit of a spider's web, really.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_00: Like you start off with what one client and I make them my focus, and I I I try to give them like above and beyond so that if I just put all of my energies into that particular client, then I kind of kind of can afford to sit back a little bit.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_00: And instead of having to go to networking events and, you know, like push your business cards across the table to try and win new clients, I just put all my energy into my actual client and then watch them refer me out, and then they sort of refer me to their neighbours and then their friends and then their business colleagues, and then that referral then sends me to their friends and their business colleagues.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_00: And it's been amazing.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's like a spider's web.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm I'm not quite sure how far I've gone out, but I know I've definitely gone through five different friends, and I I've got definitely gone through a golf course.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_00: I know, I know friends that are golfing members.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_00: I've definitely gone through about four or five at a golf course.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I love that, Sam, because it kind of validates that's the word I'm looking for.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_00: It validates the work I do.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: It makes me feel um, it makes my cup feel full.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to work with nice people.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_00: So if you've got a great client, they're gonna know great people.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_00: That's where my focus is.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_02: Let's give some people some hints and some tips then around referrals because everyone thinks the holy grail of generating clients is going to be social media, right?
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_02: That's the way to do it.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_02: You know, you put a load of posts out, everyone's gonna come running to you.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_02: You know, spoiler alert, it takes a long, long time to build a brand enough for people to actually reach out to you directly and start using your services, right?
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_02: And one of the most effective ways of generating clients is is through referrals.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_02: Have you got a tried and tested process that you follow?
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_02: And can you put a realistic time scale on how long it takes to actually generate a referral?
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_02: You mentioned you've had sometimes five referrals through one client.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_02: Over how long is there a tried and tested way of doing it?
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_02: What works for you?
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_02: And can we teach some of our listeners some of the tried and tested ways of doing it?
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, let me let me take you back.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm gonna mention my dad again because he's been a very prominent person in my life.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_00: Um, when we were really young, we used to drive for about 45 minutes to go to a carvery on a Sunday.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: And then we used to go to this carvery.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: I said, Dad, why do we drive past like six or seven places for roast dinner?
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_00: We're driving all this way out to this particular carvery, and he always used to say, because it cost two pounds more, and they put all of the two pound food on the plate.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_00: So I get it now.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't quite get it as a child because we're sitting back in a car for an hour and a half just to go and get a roast dinner.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_00: But I do understand what my dad was saying, and I've kind of sort of taken the same sort of ethos to my work as well, which is you don't have to be the cheapest.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_00: It isn't always the cheapest, it's always the best.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_00: But whatever that marginal extra is, I give all of that in the service.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_00: So, like my dad, I was saying, yeah, you know, it's two pounds extra for the carvery, but that was two pounds, that full two pounds full of the meat, potatoes, Yorkshire.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_00: He used to, he had a big old plate, trust me, Sam.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_00: He was a happy man, happy man when he had his various dinners.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I've kind of taken that to my work, which is obviously the pricing structure is done by both of my employees, you know, when I was working at Foster Geneva, who when I work at Culture Chevia, but I can control what service I give, and I want to give the maximum service, so I don't have to waste my time doing networking events and evenings and stuff like that.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_00: And like you say, my social media is it's pretty light, if I'm honest.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_00: If I just give everything to the client and the client's getting that great service, they'll want to refer you.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I've really noticed actually since post-COVID how much it's you know, advice has become a luxury item, dare I say.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, people are actually turning around saying, Well, you know, my financial planner does this, well, my financial planner does this.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to be able to put my clients in a position where they can boast that, oh, I'm doing my my Rosie's been doing this, this, and this for me.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_00: And before you know it, their colleagues and their friends are saying, Well, we don't get that.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we want we want a slice of that.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_00: So the referral sort of tips that I would give to the listeners is don't chase your towel trying to follow up like 15 different referrals and pushing your business cards everywhere.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_00: Just focus on the clients that are paying your fees.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: Make them into your raving fans, if so to speak.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_00: Make them absolutely love you.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_00: But then also don't be afraid to mention that you're looking for referrals.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I would always do that, to be honest, right at the very, very beginning.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_00: I would always say to a client, this is why I'm gonna give you great service, because I want you so confident that you're gonna be able to refer me later on.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_00: And the client will be like, Yeah, great, I'm gonna get great service, and I probably am gonna refer you.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_00: And that's uh that's the outcome that happens.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_02: Love it.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_02: Great concierge service, kind of like a first-class service on a plane, not economy.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_02: You're giving somebody that little bit of extra.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_02: So they do go away and they talk about it because the experience that they've had, that's it.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_02: That's it.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_02: They want to share it.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_02: So it's almost like prestige as well.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_02: But I think it's the byproduct again.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_02: If you make them feel good and there's something internally clicks and they go, Oh god, I feel like a weight off my shoulders.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_02: We we we all want to tell everybody, don't we?
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_02: We all want to tell everybody that wonderful thing that we've had that made us feel so good.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_02: And you should definitely go and see that person because they're gonna make you feel good.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_00: That's it, that's it.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_00: You're you're you're spot on.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_00: Think of me as the pointy end of the plane, the first class end of the plane.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_00: But what I was saying there as well, it's a bit like if you sit eat in an amazing Italian restaurant or you've watched an amazing film.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_00: How many times have you come back to sit people?
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_00: You've got to go, you've got to go, you've gotta go.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_00: You're practically pushing people to that restaurant or watching that film because you've had a great experience.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_00: They're your friend, they're your work colleague, you want them to have a great experience.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_00: So, can you see where I get to sit back a little bit?
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_00: in that process.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_00: Uh but the effort I've put in was giving them that extra two pounds worth of uh meat and roast potatoes in Yorkshire is in my head.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_02: One of the most amazing things you can do in the social media or what I would like to call social proof age is like if you're in a situation where you've got say ten standout clients and they love you and they love your service and they get on with you really well, you should be happy to be able to do a video testimonial for you.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_02: And those 10 video testimonials say from a hundred clients that you actually have, if you then put that out on YouTube or that on your company page and that on your LinkedIn, it's worth so much.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_02: Because if someone's going to quickly look you up, let's say for example, your best client goes, look, you've got to go and speak to her, okay, I'll go check her out first.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_02: And then they go and check you out, type the name in, which they probably will do, most people do.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_02: And if there is five to ten great testimonials linked to your name when they search it, again, it just delivers that deeper level of social proof that people are willing to do that.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_02: So I would say like when people think about video and they think about marketing, if you've got the stories, bring the stories to life because that will give you your social proof.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_02: And then at the same time you can just say, you know, I'd love to work with you, but just go and check out some of the reviews on my review page first of all, and you'll hear from people that I've helped.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't even have to be you know three camera setup, 4K, some kind of cinematic thing.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_02: I gone to some fantastic sites in the US with financial planners and they've just got simple Zoom or you know Microsoft reviews and they're really powerful and they're really good and they're really authentic.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_02: And someone goes, I like the sound of that in the AI age as well, they're just going to go Yeah that's a real person.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_02: Of course I'm gonna now I definitely know that I need to speak to Rosie about financial planning.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_00: No, I agree with you actually I've been very fortunate because I get the opportunity to uh do a lot of media work um and actually I've had about half a dozen of my clients put bring themselves forward and say we'll be your case study.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_00: We've been printed in the Financial Times the Daily Mail and I think remember that when you've got clients that do have wealth, the one thing they lack is time, not money.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_00: And they're giving up their time and that's what I really appreciate.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_00: When someone's giving up their time for me, I really respect that because they're busy people.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't matter that people are retired.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_00: Often my clients will tell me I'm retired Rosie but I don't know how I ever fit the job in you know we're always so busy.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that's a really good shout what you're saying.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_00: I haven't actually done the video testimonials although I did have a potential new client two weeks ago and they said that when they heard my name they googled it and apparently it popped up author at the independent news because I've got a weekly column and they said they were really impressed.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_00: They said oh we're so impressed that you've got the weekly column in the independent news and they said um how do you find the time how do you find the time and I I think it links back to what I said a moment ago about a vice being a luxury item although I can see that is the case at the moment I don't wholeheartedly believe that that should be the case Sam and if there is an opportunity where readers can you know send questions in and I can actually answer them questions if you can just get a little bit of a further reach to people that might not be able to afford to pay for vice, that again feels good for my soul.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: So I really enjoy doing that work.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_02: 100% another thing on this one as well is if you've got the authority there from a media perspective that you are you know but your your columns are being publicized in a newspaper or whatever.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_02: Plus say let's say you've got YouTube from an AI perspective again AI will look at that and start going this person is actually trusted and start to actually you'll start to rank quite highly within AI search as well.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_02: Put in there things like vouch for reviews and then you've got some videos on YouTube.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe you've appeared on the Financial Platinum Life podcast as well which has a huge amount of following all of a sudden AI is thinking this person's actually good at their job and starts ranking you a lot higher and you'll start to pick up leads as well through through AI.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_02: So some good examples there that we can use around the referral side just to reinforce the great work that you're actually doing with people is to tell those stories, isn't it?
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it is the most important thing is you want to be seen as the real deal because like you said earlier on it's not just about what we give out it's actually what we receive from the clients as well.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_00: I mean there's so much stuff I've learned from clients that have to they've taught me so much about bringing up teenage boys.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_00: So I've actually sitting at client meetings I say make sure you don't make the same mistake Rosie don't forget that.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I kind of feel like I owe the clients a big thank you because I have learned a lot on the journey both ways.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_02: Love it.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_02: So when you were at um Foster De novo second site that was um employee benefits and that's corporate financial planning.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_02: Europe, which is very much private client advice.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_02: So how did the two marry together?
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_02: So if someone was to go off on a career journey of say into employee benefits corporate, it's taken you on to private client work.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_02: Tell us a little bit of how it all fits together and you know how one side benefits the other.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_00: So the key thing is don't see it as a huge change because if you build things up in your head as a huge change, you're going to take longer to make that step over I didn't see it as a huge change at all because remember if it's corporate world or private client world, it's people and it's finance.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_00: What you might need to do is you might need to brush up on some of the private aspects like estate planning which you wouldn't necessarily do for corporates.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_00: But remember as long as you've got the knowledge you're using it and you know how to take care of people it's an easy step to make.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_00: I think the reason why I made that transition about nine years ago is mainly because I was doing so much education and reading and qualifications.
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_00: I just was so excited to get started on the estate plan and I had all of these great ideas I had all this knowledge but I needed the client in order to be able to make that happen.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_00: I think the other thing is as well is that I wasn't just doing the employee benefits I was also doing private client work focusing around mortgages protection there was lots I was also doing pensions as well so I felt like it was quite an easy step.
• 36:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um so it I didn't I again I think the main thing is I didn't see it as being too difficult in my head.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_00: My favourite saying Sam I say it to all of the people that I do my coaching to is how hard can it be?
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_00: How hard can it be?
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like it just can't be that hard and if you think like that surprisingly it's not no I agree 100% you've got to get stuck in here at the end of the day.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_02: You'll soon learn when you get stuck in yeah um all right let's just talk about the future of financial planning um you know I don't know how old you are I'm not gonna ask you let's say you've got I don't know 10 15 years 20 years left in your career I don't know you're close what's your view of the future of financial planning you know how do you feel about this career?
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_02: Is there a huge abundance of opportunity?
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_02: Are you nervous about technology, AI?
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_02: What does the next five to 10 look like look like to you?
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_00: I'm excited about the technology I'm excited for AI.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um again like if you fear these things you're going to be fearful where I I'm not fearful at all.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_00: Court Achievia are so ahead of the game where the way we've adopted AI is brilliant.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_00: We're using it so that we can spend more time with the clients less time typing up all the notes we can you know transcribe meetings as long as the client's happy we've got some real good time saving qualities there.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_00: What I would turn in and say is I think we've got a big the government have got a big mission ahead of them if they're trying to do like the targeted support.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_00: So more advice more you know expertise for people to save their money in the right places to catch a wider audience um I still think there is the mindset of a group of people out there where they probably feel that they don't need advice they don't know how to access advice they don't know who to trust to who to go to for advice and more often than not they sometimes think doing nothing is the right answer.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_00: What I've always said to the people that I coach and I look after is remember even doing nothing is a decision.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_00: Even if you say to a client okay there's no changes to your portfolio that is still advice no change equals we're not making any changes here.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_00: That is still the advice I give and I would say that to uh to the public as well by doing nothing you've chosen to do nothing and actually in itself that might be leading you down the wrong path speak to colleagues speak to trusted people like you've mentioned Fouched for is a great website that you can go on to but make sure that you're accessing the right type of advice with the right type of advisors and financial planner because the difference you make today in 2025 is like the compound effect.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's like imagine if I had a snowball and I was standing at the top of Hampstead Heath with you and we were about to roll that roll that snowball down that mountain.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_00: Literally by the time we're going to get to the bottom we're gonna have this massive great big boulder and that's what I think the difference that good financial planning does is it grows over time.
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I'd also say you you want to marry yourself up to a financial planner that you also really get along with because I feel like the relationships I've got with my clients I don't kind of know how it's happened but they are like my friends and I think that's really great for them.
• 39:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's a great experience for them it's a great experience for me.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_00: I'm thinking of one particular client I'm sure she won't mind me sharing this she calls me um Mary Poppins she calls me Rosie P.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_00: She writes dear Rosie P, how are you?
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_00: And she said it's because at a time when they felt like they had like no options to make any kind of decisions or choices apparently I came down with my Broly and I met them and I basically re literally reshuffled everything around to give them the lifestyle that they quite frankly deserve and for that she's always said you've just been like Mary Poppins.
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_00: So I think get them kind of relationships with you know I'm talking to the Joe Public here get the relationship where you enjoy working with your advisor and your planner because it's so much more it's rewarding for them as as well as us.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_02: Do you feel like being a female advisor I know you saw you've ever been right but being a female advisor when I was a man advisor.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_02: But do you feel like you have those deeper meaningful conversations where there is a level of empathy which might be higher than say a guy?
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_02: I I'm quite an empathic person.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_02: I get quite deep and personal with people quite quite quickly.
• 40:35
  SPEAKER_00: Okay so I I'm very pro-female but then I'm I obviously I've helped three females come through the ranks and go on to get qualifications and you know then come become advisors.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_00: But I don't think necessarily you have to be female to be to have the empathy I agree with you I know some fabulous male advisors that do the job just the way the same way I do and have fantastic client experiences and outcomes.
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_00: So I think if you're naturally born to that skill set this is not a job this is not a career it's a hobby and quite frankly I get paid for it sound so I'm laughing.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_00: I absolutely love what I do but if you haven't naturally got that skill set take your time take yourself off the road like I said before sharpen your axe go and learn about it and then get good at it because one the clients will benefit but two you're going to feel that reward it does make you feel like you say your cup is full when you're doing it that way.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_02: One final question before we wrap this one up if you had a magic wand and could change anything about the financial planning profession right now what would it be?
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's funny you didn't give me a heads up on that question because I haven't had time to think about it.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_00: The first thing is you can never offer Rosie just one thing.
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_00: I'm greedy I'd always go for more than one right now give me two okay now you've really put me on the spot okay so a magic wand okay I'm gonna go I'm gonna go big so I really believe that everyone out there can value from a vice.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_00: I would love to be able to see people that can't access a vice be able to guess to be able to get true good financial planning.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_00: And I know that wouldn't be on an ongoing basis and I know the importance of regular reviews but just to be able to sort of like parachute into their lives and to be able to move things around and help them.
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_00: Like in my head I tell you what I see Sam do you remember that little puzzle that used to sometimes be in your Christmas stocking it's like a plastic it's a picture there you have to move the shapes around to create the picture okay now you're with me.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_00: If anyone else is not with me I apologise but I do sometimes see that is my job people will come to me and sometimes they've got all the right pieces but they're not in the right place and I need to shuffle it around and give them a pretty picture and I would really love if everybody had that opportunity just once to do that.
• 43:03
  SPEAKER_00: The second magic wand is I would love to see more young people enter the profession and my worry and I've not said about having a worry but my worry is what that the AI will take away some of them kind of like entry point jobs you know where people would come in they would do the AI sorry they would do the notes now AI are going to do it.
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_00: In my day they used to do the faxing but obviously we don't need to do that anymore.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_00: But I do worry that there's going to be some like entry jobs taken away with AI and I would still like to see the new blood come into the profession.
• 43:37
  SPEAKER_02: Do you think then when they come in and they look at AI, they're just being able to deliver more fact finds, more reports, um, looking over more client notes.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_02: So it'd be like one person would be responsible for say more clients but they become like AI engineers and know how to do that better.
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_02: So maybe it was they would just be able to service more clients.
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_02: I think most AI companies and you talking to a few like Saturn they reckon they could add an extra 50 clients onto a an advisor's book through AI.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_02: And if that's the case then you're going to need somebody to be able to manage those clients it's just that person has come then to be able to manage those clients on those entry type roles about the power planning etc they just could be looking after more clients.
• 44:16
  SPEAKER_00: The way you describe it sounds brilliant and if that was the case I streamlined and each advisor could take more clients on that kind of answers my first wish which is for more people to have that advice contact.
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_00: So if that's the case should we keep our fingers crossed and we can dream big and that that'd be brilliant.
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_02: That's the that's the aim of the game and this is what they're trying to fix.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_02: But Rosie listen absolute pleasure talking to you I'm really glad we actually got the chance to sit down because I've spoken to you on and off over over the years.
• 44:44
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you so much for sharing your journey your financial plan of life and um we wish you all the best.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks Sam thanks for having me.
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_02: Cheers.
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_00: Bye