Latest / LAUNCH: Parenting Tips for Raising Adult Children & Building Better Relationships / #94: Understanding Your Adult Child’s ADHD | Practical Tips for Managing It

Transcript

#94: Understanding Your Adult Child’s ADHD | Practical Tips for Managing It · LAUNCH: Parenting Tips for Raising Adult Children & Building Better Relationships

0:00
SPEAKER_02: I'm Sherry Jonas, and this is Launch, the podcast for parents with older kids in their 20s and 30s who are struggling.
0:08
SPEAKER_02: What makes Launch so unique is that we focus every episode on helping you understand what's keeping your adult child from moving forward and what you can do to guide them through this challenging phase.
0:22
SPEAKER_02: Because that's all it will be if you're prepared to do the work.
0:27
SPEAKER_02: There are so many parents who want to learn how they can help their son or daughter become confident, responsible, and independent.
0:35
SPEAKER_02: So each week, our goal is to provide you with new information, actionable steps, and the confidence you need to parent your adult child.
0:45
SPEAKER_02: I'm grateful not only to my guests who join me along this journey, but to you for having the courage to do the work and see it through, even when it feels impossible.
0:57
SPEAKER_02: My guest today is Thomas Miller, a licensed clinical therapist with over 20 years of experience working with teens, tweens, young adults, and their parents.
1:08
SPEAKER_02: He's the founder of many things, most notably Thomas Miller Coaching and the Four Peaks Parents Program.
1:16
SPEAKER_02: Thomas focuses on navigating anxiety, addiction, neurodiversity, and failure launch by resetting boundaries, reducing enabling, and rebuilding accountability.
1:28
SPEAKER_02: He's also the host of the Four Peaks Parents Podcast.
1:33
SPEAKER_02: Today we're talking about ADHD in young adults, specifically how to create urgency and what to do when they procrastinate.
1:42
SPEAKER_02: In other words, how to get your adult child to do something they don't care about.
1:48
SPEAKER_02: The last time I had a guest talking about ADHD was back in episode 13, where we focused more on the symptoms.
1:54
SPEAKER_02: So if you're unsure, then give that a listen as well.
1:58
SPEAKER_02: Thomas has a lot to say on this topic, and I love the suggestions he offers.
2:03
SPEAKER_02: So let's begin.
2:05
SPEAKER_02: Hi, Thomas.
2:06
SPEAKER_00: How are you doing?
2:08
SPEAKER_02: Good, thank you.
2:08
SPEAKER_02: I'm so so excited for today's conversation.
2:11
SPEAKER_00: Likewise.
2:12
SPEAKER_02: We are going to be addressing one of the most common issues for parents with struggling adult children.
2:19
SPEAKER_02: Because without fail, when parents talk to me about their challenges, I so often hear my kid has ADHD.
2:27
SPEAKER_02: Or others will say, I don't understand why they won't do anything that I ask.
2:32
SPEAKER_02: They stay in their room for hours gaming, watching YouTube, or sitting on their phone, but nothing ever gets done.
2:40
SPEAKER_02: And since you've been working with parents of adult children with ADHD for many years, I'd love for you to help us to understand it, to give parents some practical strategies, specifically around breaking the procrastination cycle and creating more urgency with their young adults.
3:01
SPEAKER_02: And then we're going to pile it on.
3:05
SPEAKER_02: Okay, we're going to go one step further because for many families, ADHD isn't just happening in isolation.
3:11
SPEAKER_02: There's also anxiety, there's weed, there's online gaming and/or a combination of all these.
3:18
SPEAKER_02: But before we get into all that, I would love to hear what brought you to working with parents and their older kids.
3:26
SPEAKER_02: So if you can, tell us about your journey.
3:29
SPEAKER_00: So my my I graduated um from NYU in 2002, and my whole career was always immediately with teens and young adults.
3:39
SPEAKER_00: So I was working in a school system that had a school mental health program.
3:44
SPEAKER_00: And then I was actually working with LGBTQU, LGBTQ youth, not you, um, and uh LGBTQ youth, and always working with teens, and of course, by extension, the families, right?
4:01
SPEAKER_01: Right.
4:01
SPEAKER_00: And then I was a clinical director of wilderness therapy program for teens.
4:06
SPEAKER_00: So teens, teens, teens, but guess what?
4:08
SPEAKER_00: Behind the teens is a family, right?
4:10
SPEAKER_00: And as you know, every single issue, disease, challenge, whatever you want to call it, whether it's addiction, whether it's mental health, is a family disease, right?
4:20
SPEAKER_00: It affects everybody.
4:21
SPEAKER_00: So what got me into this work is that I realized having worked um always in different levels of care throughout my entire career, wilderness therapy, um, inpatient uh co-occurring treatment, you know, every level of care that the family was not getting served.
4:40
SPEAKER_00: And what happens always, no matter how good the program is for teens or young adults, is when the teen andor young adult re-merges um with the family, guess what?
4:52
SPEAKER_00: Everybody falls back into some of the old patterns, right?
4:56
SPEAKER_00: Because I always say that when the young adult returns home or the teen returns home, they're asked to run a triple marathon every single day, as is that family.
5:06
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
5:07
SPEAKER_00: And if the family doesn't find new tools, new strategies, new uh coping skills, news, new communication, conflict resolution, just a new culture in essence, it's just going to kind of go back.
5:21
SPEAKER_00: And then all those gains in treatment or all those gains potentially go by the wayside.
5:27
SPEAKER_00: So that is why I built the Four Peaks Parents program because I am backing up my 20, I don't even know what it is now, 25, 26 year career uh into uh people's back doors or into their houses, if you will, um, to help them figure out how to not right fall back into old patterns and how to step on a clear roadmap toward change so that we can clear out the fog and we can look at what are we looking at first and foremost, and then we can begin to change that culture, which is going to create a positive ROI for the future of that young adult and that family.
6:01
SPEAKER_02: Got it.
6:02
SPEAKER_02: So any particular connection to ADHD?
6:07
SPEAKER_00: Oh, yes, I I don't think that I don't think do I have a particular uh connection?
6:12
SPEAKER_00: I I absolutely ADHD 100%.
6:16
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
6:16
SPEAKER_00: Um it is one definitely a superpower.
6:19
SPEAKER_00: Um, I believe, um, I believe, I don't, you know, I don't believe that ADHD is still here uh without sort of some positive benefit.
6:29
SPEAKER_00: So if you think of you know back in the day, right, in evolution and if we believe in you know right Darwinian theories, hopefully we do, um, there's gotta be some reason it's still around, right?
6:40
SPEAKER_00: And so in the right context, ADHD 100% is a superpower, right?
6:45
SPEAKER_00: You think of business, um, most businesses are disruptive, right?
6:49
SPEAKER_00: AI is very disruptive right now to many things.
6:52
SPEAKER_00: And so Netflix was disruptive to Blockbuster and Uber and right and Lyft or disruptive to the taxicab industry.
7:00
SPEAKER_00: So that word disruption goes hand in hand with ADHD.
7:05
SPEAKER_00: And you what you see with a lot of you know ADHD teens is comorbidity, right?
7:10
SPEAKER_00: They have a diagnosis more often than not of oppositional defiant disorder.
7:14
SPEAKER_00: So very rarely does ADHD travel alone, but in the right context, when someone can be disruptive in business or in sales or as an entrepreneur, it is a superpower.
7:26
SPEAKER_00: The problem is just when you're housing a teen in an environment where they're supposed to be complicit, right, with a lot of rules for seven and a half hours a day, that's where things can become problematic.
7:39
SPEAKER_00: So I love helping families and young adults view it as a superpower and figure out what purpose can it serve, and obviously how is it not serving you?
7:49
SPEAKER_00: And then we just have to figure out right how to work with versus work against ourselves.
7:54
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I want to get into that a little bit more, but first, sure.
7:57
SPEAKER_02: I I think it's really important that you know, a lot of people when they hear ADHD, um, they think of that little kid, the little boy in the back of the classroom who can't sit still, right?
8:10
SPEAKER_02: But the young adults that we're talking about today, I mean, they're in fact sitting perfectly still.
8:17
SPEAKER_00: Oh, absolutely.
8:19
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, in their rooms for hours.
8:21
SPEAKER_02: So for those who aren't sure, what is ADHD and what are the signs, especially in the 20-something or even 30-something year old, that parents need to realize are actually ADHD related.
8:36
SPEAKER_02: You know, and I'm talking about like the everyday behaviors that might surprise parents.
8:41
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's a great question.
8:43
SPEAKER_00: So when someone uh is diagnosed with ADHD, they can be diagnosed with one of the three subtypes of ADHD.
8:50
SPEAKER_00: There's ADHD impulsive type, which is that traditional hyperactive uh, you know, some of those patterns that you were just talking about.
8:58
SPEAKER_00: There's the inattentive type, and then there's a combined presentation.
9:02
SPEAKER_00: One of the things I think that's important for families to realize is that ADHD very rarely is an intentional issue.
9:09
SPEAKER_00: It's really more a regulation issue.
9:12
SPEAKER_00: And regulation shows up again and again as more often than not, the Achilles heel of a lot of the young adults that you and I are working with, or the families that we're working with.
9:22
SPEAKER_00: And that could be anything from time management, emotional regulation, even just understanding time.
9:28
SPEAKER_00: A lot of uh, you know, families they're so frustrated, understandably, because their teen or their young adult, right?
9:36
SPEAKER_00: Their connection to time is is almost magical.
9:40
SPEAKER_00: It's almost like magical thinking in a way.
9:42
SPEAKER_00: Um, whereas they could be playing a video game or doing something that has that hook and has that interest for hours and hours and hours.
9:51
SPEAKER_00: But when they then think about something that is banal or boring, even though it might be 20 minutes, they're gonna tell themselves, right, it's gonna take four or five hours, right?
10:02
SPEAKER_00: So one kind of hack is to help uh young adults.
10:06
SPEAKER_00: I always say, identify is this a task that you want to put in the now or not now bucket?
10:13
SPEAKER_00: And if you're putting it in the not now bucket, it's really because it doesn't have a hook.
10:18
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't have anything interesting to you, right?
10:20
SPEAKER_00: It's boring, it's banal.
10:22
SPEAKER_00: And that's fine.
10:23
SPEAKER_00: And at least even that activity allows them to understand that they're doing this unconsciously and they're going to keep right going toward the things that are have a hook that are in the now bucket that are interesting and dopamine rich.
10:39
SPEAKER_00: You mentioned earlier about cannabis.
10:41
SPEAKER_00: The problem there is that, right, when you're now smoking cannabis to boot to let's say uh porn gaming, um, gambling, whatever that is, just scrolling mindlessly, doom scrolling on Instagram or TikTok or YouTube, you you are robbing tomorrow's dopamine today, right?
11:00
SPEAKER_00: You are you are basically ostensibly asking for more dopamine today, leaving yourself with less sort of a of a reserve for later.
11:10
SPEAKER_00: And regulation is the big one.
11:12
SPEAKER_00: So that's just a very um kind of broad brush uh uh kind of way of describing ADHD, but it really is someone's gonna struggle again with time management, time regulation, gonna struggle with you know um attentional regulation.
11:28
SPEAKER_00: They're gonna struggle with emotional regulation.
11:30
SPEAKER_00: Yes, you're gonna see someone go offline ostensibly, right?
11:35
SPEAKER_00: Um, and potentially continue to be offline and it will take time to come back online, right?
11:42
SPEAKER_00: We know that um if we're talking an attentive uh type, someone could be offline and then they're gonna need to find strategies to be interested in the thing that is rather banal, right?
11:56
SPEAKER_00: I call that eat the frog, right?
11:58
SPEAKER_00: So with a lot of families, it's like let's figure out what is the frog they have to eat, and how do we then schedule eat the frog time, or how do you schedule not now time, right?
12:10
SPEAKER_00: Whereas if you're at least going to purposefully and intentionally put all of these tasks in the not now, i.e.
12:17
SPEAKER_00: procrastinate on them, and then let's say an alarm goes off where you have to at least pull one or two things from the not now bucket, that at least is a more intentional process than just being offline and having a hard time coming back online.
12:34
SPEAKER_00: Um and that's obviously where all the power struggles ensue, right?
12:38
SPEAKER_00: Is the families are seeing this young adult ostensibly punt so many objectives, so many uh opportunities for mastery, so many capabilities and competencies.
12:49
SPEAKER_00: And then you mentioned anxiety, and I can shut up in a second, as I want to I want you to jump in here, of course.
12:54
SPEAKER_00: But if someone's anxious, we just know from the research they're offline, right?
12:59
SPEAKER_00: They're not gonna be online.
13:00
SPEAKER_00: And now we have this pattern of just avoidance, avoidance, avoidance, making that pile of the not now that much bigger and that much more stress-inducing.
13:10
SPEAKER_02: So, in that podcast, which is where I heard that you mentioned that um ADHD can be a superpower or a kryptonite, which I'm gonna leave in the show notes because I think parents are gonna want to listen to that one.
13:23
SPEAKER_02: You make the point there that I believe that kid that these kids aren't lazy, that they're that they're just wired differently and they need a different approach.
13:32
SPEAKER_02: And this is where I want parents to really understand what is that different approach that they can take.
13:38
SPEAKER_02: Because I also agree with you as a as an EDHD person myself, diagnosed later in life.
13:43
SPEAKER_02: I think it's fantastic.
13:45
SPEAKER_02: We joked the other day, you and I, when I said, How many tabs do you have open?
13:48
SPEAKER_00: A hundred.
13:49
SPEAKER_02: Right?
13:50
SPEAKER_02: But it's how you use it, how do you use that superpower?
13:53
SPEAKER_02: But all the time we get that lazy, my kid is lazy, my kid is lazy at the same time that they're not lazy when it comes to doing what they want to do.
14:00
SPEAKER_02: Of course.
14:01
SPEAKER_02: Okay, and also before I get too far into that, I want I want you to sort of say, because you just use terms like offline, online.
14:08
SPEAKER_02: I don't think you mean literally.
14:11
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yes, just a that's just a term, thank you, for in terms of the focus, right?
14:16
SPEAKER_00: And and you already you just nailed it, which is that again, if someone is impassioned about something, it's kind of like Alice in Wonderland, right?
14:24
SPEAKER_00: They can follow the rabbit hole down and be in that thing for hours and hours and hours.
14:28
SPEAKER_00: And and that there's a gift there, right?
14:31
SPEAKER_00: There's a gift.
14:31
SPEAKER_00: You think of, you know, uh most founders of companies were working, you know, 18 hours.
14:37
SPEAKER_00: You know, how many companies were start started in a garage or a basement because you had a group of obsessional people, right?
14:44
SPEAKER_00: That had no perspective on time.
14:46
SPEAKER_00: Uh I mean, Trevor Noah talks about uh uh his he has ADHD and talks about his connection to time too, where he's telling a story.
14:55
SPEAKER_00: I'm probably butchering this, but his wife said, like, oh, we got to get ready for the Emmys or something.
15:00
SPEAKER_00: And it was like two hours from now.
15:01
SPEAKER_00: And he was like in his head, like getting ready for the Emmys for you know, two hours.
15:08
SPEAKER_00: He was thinking, you know, that's like two days.
15:10
SPEAKER_00: Like he has so much time.
15:12
SPEAKER_00: And in his head, he starts, you know, thinking of all the things he could do.
15:15
SPEAKER_00: And then, you know, whereas a non-ADHD person is gonna start getting ready probably for the Emmys, it's kind of like a big event, you know, and it might take, you know, maybe not two hours, but you know, and he left it to the end.
15:27
SPEAKER_00: And that just speaks a lot to the sense of urgency.
15:30
SPEAKER_00: ADHD people need urgency.
15:33
SPEAKER_00: We don't need pressure, we need urgency.
15:36
SPEAKER_00: And every house in the Miller family should work for this company, has a visual timer, um, which I don't know if you could hear it, but it ticks and it shows the picture.
15:46
SPEAKER_00: So when my teens, I have two boys walk in the door and they're like, I have four hours of homework, you know.
15:53
SPEAKER_00: It's like first off, they don't, and the brain is telling them that because again, it's boring, it's in the not now bucket, it doesn't have the hook.
16:01
SPEAKER_00: And so work expands to the time we give it.
16:03
SPEAKER_00: So I'll always say, like, hey, just go set the freaking thing for 18 minutes, 19 minutes, right?
16:08
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
16:09
SPEAKER_00: Let's see, let's see, let's see where you get to, right?
16:13
SPEAKER_00: And you can gamify it.
16:14
SPEAKER_00: You know, can I can I get you know X percentage done, or can I, you know, be this deep into that thing?
16:23
SPEAKER_00: Can I even do it maybe in 16 minutes, right?
16:26
SPEAKER_00: There's ways to hack that.
16:29
SPEAKER_00: Now, if you're dealing with a 28-year-old classic, stalled out, stuck young adult that has promulgated out from 14, 15, 16, right?
16:39
SPEAKER_00: Now you throw on top of that video gaming and now living in a very VL world, virtual life world, not in RL, not in real life.
16:50
SPEAKER_00: And there's a lot of, you know, let's say cannabis use or avoidance strategies, heck of a lot harder.
16:56
SPEAKER_00: That's where obviously I come in.
16:58
SPEAKER_00: That's where I built this program is to build a clear roadmap for families so we could figure out where are we, what's the system creating these symptoms, and then how immediately do we create a shift today.
17:10
SPEAKER_00: But for families listening, simple urgencies are really helpful because you have a hundred tabs open, so do I.
17:19
SPEAKER_00: And the cool thing about our brains is we know a lot of those balls that we're gonna drop today are actually made of rubber, but there's a few that are glass.
17:26
SPEAKER_00: And we're gonna choose that.
17:28
SPEAKER_00: As entrepreneurs, we get to be kind of determine, right, which is kind of the priority.
17:34
SPEAKER_00: And if you think of the Eisenhower matrix of like important and urgent, every family, when they look at what's important and urgent for their young adult, it's getting the job, it's right, launching, it's it's uh maybe exercise, it's maybe getting the sleep, it's regulation, it's it's you know, being more integrated in the community.
17:55
SPEAKER_00: The young adult's version of important and urgent is going to be very different.
17:59
SPEAKER_00: So a lot of the families, the work I do is not waiting for some upheaval where they're yelling, screaming, saying things that they regret, lacking now the tenacity to hold their young adult accountable toward a plan that's co-authored and co-written by all of us that helps them launch.
18:18
SPEAKER_00: So we need to create some urgencies and some KPIs, if you will, key performance indicators or deliverables as if they are working in a corporation, because left to their own devices, again, they're offline as a not focused, andor not feeling the compounding effect of that avoidance and of that those, the proclivity, right, to go toward the now, if that makes sense.
18:42
SPEAKER_00: So families have a huge role in helping, again, not creating yelling, screaming, pressure, shaming, judging, but just clearing out the fog and helping the young adults realize that there's two vectors and they're moving farther and farther away, right, from a launch pathway.
19:01
SPEAKER_00: And that's also creating a lot of that shame and anxiety.
19:04
SPEAKER_02: You know, many of these young adults were never diagnosed when they were younger.
19:10
SPEAKER_02: So why does it often surface after high school or even through college?
19:15
SPEAKER_02: And I'm thinking, is it because of the structure that was in place when they were in high school?
19:22
SPEAKER_02: The scheduling, the deep the deadlines, someone, usually the parent, always checking in.
19:27
SPEAKER_02: And when that structure now disappears, what happens?
19:31
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I think you're spot on.
19:33
SPEAKER_00: I think also, number one, the schools are stressed.
19:36
SPEAKER_00: And so there's so many families that I've worked with that have had um, unfortunately, to even lawyer up to have an IEP or 504 in place for their young adult, other teen, right, in high school.
19:49
SPEAKER_00: And there's also students that of their own volition do not really put their hand up and come forward and ask for help, whether because of their own shame or because of their own internal dialogue that they are like a piece of crap or they're, you know, a moron, or you have families that are not as educated.
20:08
SPEAKER_00: And it's all of the above.
20:09
SPEAKER_00: You're right.
20:09
SPEAKER_00: When the scaffolding is removed, that's really where you see the lifestyle.
20:14
SPEAKER_00: Is it is it internally right held?
20:18
SPEAKER_00: And that's our job as families is to help our young adult begin to write, have that intrinsic motivation so that everything isn't externalized.
20:28
SPEAKER_00: And you're right, there are many families, unfortunately, that are now paying that cost now, hence the reason I'm working with them, right, to undo some of those rescuing, enabling, some of those compensating, right, overdoing, over overmanaging patterns that this child now doesn't have that internalized executive functioning skills, right?
20:52
SPEAKER_00: Um, because that ability to have executive functioning is what really allows them to launch, right?
21:00
SPEAKER_00: You think of even something as simple.
21:02
SPEAKER_00: I was saying this the other day to a young adult.
21:04
SPEAKER_00: I'm working with this family, and I was, I always, always uh get to engage with the young adult so it can just remove any sense of you know us versus them, and I'm not some weird, you know, man behind the curtain like in in the Wizard of Oz.
21:19
SPEAKER_00: Um, and it allows them to also realize there's there's a change process that's ensuing.
21:24
SPEAKER_00: And believe it or not, as much as that immediately spikes anxiety for the young adult because they know change is on the horizon, there's also a massive sense of relief because this avatar that they built of either the cannabis or the avoidant or the whatever it is, or if they are actually on the spectrum and have been masking, whatever it is, can finally now be discussed and talked about, and they could take the mask off.
21:51
SPEAKER_00: And so I was talking to this young adult about he was saying he was going to get a virtual job.
21:56
SPEAKER_00: And on one level, great, like any job for this young adult.
22:00
SPEAKER_00: Adult is amazing.
22:01
SPEAKER_00: But I said, to be honest, dude, if you really think about it, I don't think anyone should have a virtual job from 22 to probably 28, particularly males, you know, maybe 25, 26, because that's where we've learned how to be a part of a team.
22:14
SPEAKER_01: Right.
22:15
SPEAKER_00: That's where we learn how to have conflict, how to negotiate, how to avoid groupthink.
22:20
SPEAKER_00: Um, and obviously, you know, everything went virtual with COVID and everything is sort of somewhere in the middle now.
22:28
SPEAKER_00: But it it just really speaks to what you said is if you don't have something that's proximal, i.e., you know, a can uh meeting um deadlines, why why would it stay in front of you, especially when it doesn't have a hook?
22:44
SPEAKER_00: Because the things that you want are much more dopamine rich andor pleasure pleasure principle based.
22:51
SPEAKER_00: And if you're not in a position where you can own your own company, which very few 22-year-olds can, right, but they're spoon-fed a world that's so preferential that it is very hard for their brain to have the staying power of being again online or connected or hooked in around things that don't really have a heart or mission focused to them.
23:15
SPEAKER_02: Right.
23:15
SPEAKER_02: So I just want to go back to this for parents who I speak to, where the the young adult is sort of just doing their own thing because they feel like they can't sort of uh put the guardrails on.
23:26
SPEAKER_02: How important is having structure in the home?
23:30
SPEAKER_00: It's so important.
23:31
SPEAKER_00: And again, there's there it is the like most important thing in the world.
23:35
SPEAKER_00: I always say structure is the is the purest form of love, if you really think about it.
23:40
SPEAKER_00: Brene, yeah.
23:42
SPEAKER_00: Brene Brown, I think I made it up.
23:44
SPEAKER_00: I could be wrong.
23:45
SPEAKER_00: I cannot take credit for this next Brene Brown quote, which is love without boundaries isn't love.
23:50
SPEAKER_00: I think that's a Brene Brown quote.
23:52
SPEAKER_00: Um, so I can't take uh credit for that one, but it's it's sort of the same thing.
23:56
SPEAKER_00: I really do think structure is the highest form of love because what you're saying is I believe in you.
24:03
SPEAKER_00: And I was just saying to a family yesterday, I said you keep saying you believe in your young adult.
24:08
SPEAKER_00: I said this in front of the young adult, but they're watching your every move.
24:12
SPEAKER_00: And every time they fail, or not even failing, like beginnings of failing, you swoop in.
24:19
SPEAKER_00: So you are clearly sending a message you don't believe in them.
24:23
SPEAKER_00: You could say all day long you believe in them, but they are watching and learning that you don't believe in them because if you did believe in them, you would stay back, right?
24:33
SPEAKER_00: You would hold your own, you know, anxiety, worries, shame, whatever that is, guilt.
24:38
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, manage that, right?
24:40
SPEAKER_00: Become the master of that and allow your loved one to become unflappable, which is why the second peak of the four peaks um program is called emotional mastery, so that everybody can become much more self-contained, self-regulated.
24:56
SPEAKER_00: Because I always say two halves, you know, make a hole in math, but not in relationships.
25:01
SPEAKER_00: You know, two halves don't make a hole.
25:03
SPEAKER_00: They tend to render both actually less than.
25:08
SPEAKER_00: And so that ability to provide structure and again help the young adult, not in a top-down this is what's happening to you, but hey, this is what we can build together.
25:20
SPEAKER_00: And obviously giving them tons of voice and choice in the process.
25:25
SPEAKER_00: But yes, they do need to hear things like not we're kicking you out tomorrow, but we can't stay here.
25:31
SPEAKER_00: It's like we're on an island, there's a tsunami coming, and this is not sustainable.
25:36
SPEAKER_00: And every day you're here in our household, you know, I'm talking 24, 25, 6, 8.
25:42
SPEAKER_02: That's the market I'm talking to.
25:44
SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
25:44
SPEAKER_00: Um, it's gestating more and more shame, and it's again those vectors, you're moving farther and farther away from the capacities and capabilities that you need.
25:54
SPEAKER_00: And so ADHD again can be a superpower left to its own devices, kryptonite out the wazoo.
26:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
26:02
SPEAKER_00: And again, if it's the hyperactivity, you know, um side, it's gonna be a Ferrari with the brakes of a children's bicycle, and problems can happen there, right?
26:12
SPEAKER_00: If it's the inattentive coupled with some mental health, repression or anxiety, well, now we have a very low drive.
26:19
SPEAKER_00: We think of depression, is low drive, low motivation, right?
26:24
SPEAKER_00: Sense of blah, life is blah, right?
26:27
SPEAKER_00: It's almost like the world is in black and white and food is tasteless and odorless.
26:33
SPEAKER_00: How is that person supposed to get titillated if they're already disorganized?
26:38
SPEAKER_00: So there's a whole host of things families can do to, again, create that roadmap, and that's where I come in.
26:45
SPEAKER_00: And of course, you come in, is to help families say, there's actually a process.
26:50
SPEAKER_00: Like this is not even like rocket science, and it's just so uh immediately assuring for families to say, no, we can get out of this.
26:59
SPEAKER_00: And it is gonna start with dialogue where you're gonna have a conversation where you're going to avoid all of the old trappings and dysfunctionality, because if you try to set a new expectation in anger, your young adult is going to resist and fight back because you're giving them something to hit at.
27:19
SPEAKER_00: And I always say to families that in addition to structure being the highest form of love, if we truly love our young adult, then it's really about creating a new, immovable reality.
27:33
SPEAKER_00: Not necessarily we don't get to take a, you know, uh reach into their circle of control and determine what their reality will be, but we're gonna create our own new reality.
27:44
SPEAKER_00: And they're gonna start using words like we can endorse this or I can endorse this, I can't endorse that.
27:50
SPEAKER_00: And meaning that I can endorse you living here, but you can't be smoking pot, right?
27:56
SPEAKER_00: And you do need to have a job, and you do need to contribute some form of rent that I'll put aside for you and maybe give you back 100%, right?
28:05
SPEAKER_00: For first, last months and one month security to help you launch, whatever that is.
28:09
SPEAKER_00: And there's just a way to do that that again is not adversarial, is not draconian, is not emotionally dysregulated, and honors again their ADHD, how it is different for them than the neurotypical person who you know has no ADHD features.
28:27
SPEAKER_00: Um, I can't remember where my keys are and my my wallet, like every day, if I don't put them on the hook.
28:36
SPEAKER_00: There's one hook that is is that is my AI, that is my whole system, right?
28:42
SPEAKER_00: I miss the hook when I walk in the door putting my keys and my wallet in that same spot.
28:47
SPEAKER_00: No idea, right?
28:48
SPEAKER_01: Right.
28:48
SPEAKER_00: Because that at the end of the day is not earth-shattering and it's not the right difficult for me.
28:54
SPEAKER_00: So that's why that doesn't stay here.
28:56
SPEAKER_01: Right.
28:56
SPEAKER_00: You know, but you throw me back in the day, and even now, you know, you throw me in front of a high conflict family with um, you know, mental health addiction and high conflict divorce, and you know, maybe there's uh some serious risk there on the mental health side or the or the addiction side.
29:14
SPEAKER_00: I'm in, you know, I'm like whoop, I'm totally locked in.
29:17
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
29:17
SPEAKER_00: And so even that, like understanding that your young adult is in fact, possibly, most likely, very bored, very bored of their pot, very bored of their video games, and they're just haven't found the right difficult yet.
29:33
SPEAKER_00: And so the idea of Target working at Target, well, again, any job is is fantastic and is an enhancement from no job.
29:42
SPEAKER_00: But through this process, we get to be almost like strength finders, right?
29:46
SPEAKER_00: And help the young adult connect with their superpower and figure that out and wipe away so much crud, not saying there's not potentially true organic mental health there, but as you know, so much of mental health is lifestyle-based.
30:02
SPEAKER_02: I do like giving parents like strategies, but be but sometimes I think it's almost easy to tell them what to avoid.
30:09
SPEAKER_02: Okay, so you know that we see so much of what you just mentioned, you talk about rescuing, reminding.
30:15
SPEAKER_02: What can you suggest to parents to stop doing?
30:18
SPEAKER_02: And then what strategies would work better instead?
30:22
SPEAKER_02: Like straight up, parents, stop doing this and try doing this instead.
30:27
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
30:28
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
30:28
SPEAKER_00: So the first thing I would do is grab a piece of paper and uh you can you can think of this a couple of ways.
30:33
SPEAKER_00: You could draw a circle and just write all the things that you currently are managing for your young adult, and that will immediately smack you in the face because that weight that you're carrying is probably weight that should be in their quote unquote metaphoric backpack, right?
30:48
SPEAKER_00: So we can stop carrying all the weight if we're paying for the Ubers and the Grubhubs and the cell phone bill and the whatever.
30:56
SPEAKER_00: What again, we talk about urgency, and you know, this is a visual reminder.
31:01
SPEAKER_00: So we know from you know the Tom McCabicks, uh, you know, James Clear, that you gotta make things visible, attractive, and frictionless, right?
31:09
SPEAKER_00: If you want them to be interested, if you want them to stop something, you got to make it frictionful, right?
31:15
SPEAKER_00: Less attractive and less visible.
31:18
SPEAKER_00: So is this visible, but guess what?
31:21
SPEAKER_00: It's not visible that you are compensating wildly for them financially.
31:26
SPEAKER_00: So let's shift that.
31:27
SPEAKER_00: And again, it doesn't have to be in a yelling, screaming match.
31:30
SPEAKER_00: It's a clear, calm.
31:33
SPEAKER_00: Happy to jump on a call with folks and help you role play this out and rehearse it.
31:38
SPEAKER_00: But hey, things are gonna change.
31:40
SPEAKER_00: We own, we have to own that we've created a culture that hasn't asked too much of you and has allowed you to slink into the ether of this super comfortable and actually very boring place that's actually just stating shame.
31:54
SPEAKER_00: So we're gonna shift that.
31:55
SPEAKER_00: And usually it's about 90 days, and I help families figure out what are the things that we're gonna begin to step off of.
32:01
SPEAKER_00: Um and so again, I would look at immediately financial, right?
32:06
SPEAKER_00: And I would have this conversation and come up again, urgencies, right, creates actions.
32:12
SPEAKER_00: We know 60% of all entrepreneurs have ADHD.
32:17
SPEAKER_00: Um, the percentage of salespeople is also through the roof.
32:21
SPEAKER_00: They hit all their quotas at the end of the month because there's urgency.
32:25
SPEAKER_00: They were offline, right?
32:26
SPEAKER_00: And they're actually amazing under fire.
32:28
SPEAKER_00: So your young adult, believe it or not, will surprise you.
32:31
SPEAKER_00: So let's stop right taking on every little thing for them financially.
32:36
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
32:36
SPEAKER_00: Um, because if there is cannabis use, why would you want them to have that much more money to go deeper into an abuse or dependency pattern?
32:45
SPEAKER_00: Um, the other thing is again to offer opportunities for a role for you to wear, but to not just inherently wear that role or wear that hat.
32:55
SPEAKER_00: I always say to families, take the hats off.
32:58
SPEAKER_00: I would write down all the lists in addition to all the things you're managing.
33:02
SPEAKER_00: Think of all the hats you currently wear.
33:04
SPEAKER_00: You don't have to wear all those hats.
33:06
SPEAKER_00: However, there's nothing wrong with saying, I'm happy to meet with you every Saturday or every Thursday to review, you know, look at resumes.
33:14
SPEAKER_00: Maybe you're an AI expert, build some AI bot, even that will scrape, you know, Indeed or LinkedIn or whatever that is and help you.
33:22
SPEAKER_00: That's a role that's helpful.
33:24
SPEAKER_00: That's a role that's you're not working harder than them.
33:27
SPEAKER_00: You're not right compensating if that's a role that's helpful.
33:31
SPEAKER_00: Hey, I'm happy to sit down and help you build a budget.
33:35
SPEAKER_00: Happy to help you go and look at, you know, the credit card debt situation, whatever that is.
33:40
SPEAKER_00: So we could be helpful for sure without right enabling going into a compensatory way.
33:47
SPEAKER_00: So there's a lot of don'ts there in terms of let's just stop immediately compensating.
33:52
SPEAKER_00: Um don't just think, again, they're lazy.
33:55
SPEAKER_00: Don't just think they this is you know some attitude problem.
33:59
SPEAKER_00: Um, don't think that they're not hurting.
34:02
SPEAKER_00: Um, it's really important, I think, to always be relational, right?
34:06
SPEAKER_00: Not just transactional, even though we are, yes, going to create structure and things are gonna change.
34:12
SPEAKER_00: And I say to families, we're not gonna change everything overnight.
34:16
SPEAKER_00: We're gonna do it one condition at a time and take some power back and ask them, right, to get their dignity back through this process.
34:23
SPEAKER_00: A couple of do's um, do talk about not forcing, but the power of a really good medication avow.
34:31
SPEAKER_00: And there's a million different options, right, on the ADHD side or mental health side, of course, but from stimulants to non-stimulants, um, empower your young adult to have agency in that process.
34:42
SPEAKER_00: It's amazing how many young adults have organic mental health or learning challenges, and they're still carrying that inner bitch or inner critic dialogue that they're dumb or stupid.
34:54
SPEAKER_00: I have so many young adults who I'll ask the family for earlier testing and they'll have 137 IQ or 132 IQ, and they're talking about themselves like they're dumb because they were dyslexic and they didn't meet, right?
35:08
SPEAKER_00: They didn't do great in the traditional learning environment.
35:11
SPEAKER_00: Helping young adults, so do's would be help them, right, to understand they have many superpowers, help them realize they've been living in the wrong difficult, hence the reason they were offline and boring and constantly seeking, right?
35:26
SPEAKER_00: I would empower them like crazy, right?
35:29
SPEAKER_00: To see that this is an opportunity to be in alignment with their best self.
35:33
SPEAKER_00: Do talk to them honestly and openly vis-a-vis open-ended questions about where is their mood at, where's their mental health at, right?
35:41
SPEAKER_00: How do they feel?
35:42
SPEAKER_00: Ask a lot of questions about how they are hearing all of this.
35:46
SPEAKER_00: Perfect example is the other day, it was like the third session, and I was with working with a family and the young adult, and I said, just for shits and giggles, um, you know, you've seen maybe a few changes already with your family.
35:58
SPEAKER_00: They're using a couple of different languaging, they're approaching you differently, they're not as like right, you know, kind of um reactive or the extreme of the other extreme of being detached.
36:08
SPEAKER_00: But I was like, what's the overunder you think that they're actually gonna hold, you know, hold on to some of these gains that I'm helping them with and actually follow through because we built a plan where the young adult has to be out by I think it's January 15th out of the house and moving on.
36:23
SPEAKER_00: And he's like 50-50.
36:25
SPEAKER_00: So I was like, well, that's cool.
36:26
SPEAKER_00: So I was like, you know your family better than I do, obviously, right?
36:30
SPEAKER_00: And so I at least appreciate your honesty.
36:32
SPEAKER_00: I was like, so that's interesting.
36:33
SPEAKER_00: So you can continue to allow some of the manipulation and some of the unhealthy parts of you that are kind of pause to just hope and pray and lean into that 50%.
36:44
SPEAKER_00: Or maybe there's a new voice, maybe maybe there's a new part of you that's actually in a weird way, again, anxious, nervous, but kind of relieved that this whole thing might be coming to an end.
36:54
SPEAKER_00: And he said, Yeah, I'm trying to lean into that side.
36:56
SPEAKER_00: I was like, that's cool.
36:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
36:58
SPEAKER_00: So there's a part of every young adult that does not want, even if they push back like crazy and resist, and um, you're gonna see some heightened, you know, uh amplification of whatever that oppositionality or resistance or pushback has been.
37:15
SPEAKER_00: You'll definitely see it.
37:16
SPEAKER_00: But we have to also understand.
37:18
SPEAKER_00: So on the do side, I always try to help families understand it's a J curve.
37:22
SPEAKER_00: So if you think of the top of a J is like the apex of the behavior, it's gonna get exhausted and then it's gonna spike back up.
37:30
SPEAKER_00: And how high it spikes back up sometimes depends on the individual.
37:33
SPEAKER_00: It might be feeling like it's back to the original baseline, but then it's gonna get exhausted again.
37:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
37:39
SPEAKER_00: And then it's gonna spike back up.
37:40
SPEAKER_00: It's so important that families stay the course and don't atrophy and the spike back up.
37:45
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
37:45
SPEAKER_00: And that again, they have clarity of this is there's a reason for this, right?
37:50
SPEAKER_00: There's an ROI here.
37:52
SPEAKER_00: It's about looking yourself in the mirror 20 years from now and saying, I actually can hang my coat on having really tried, right, to launch my young adult to set him or her up for success.
38:03
SPEAKER_02: Right, right.
38:04
SPEAKER_02: I want to touch on a couple of things.
38:06
SPEAKER_02: Um we think the cannabis issue.
38:09
SPEAKER_02: I I want parents to understand uh the potential impact on motivation and the executive functioning skills when there's cannabis, because I I so often say hear parents say, Yes, they're smoking weed, but it's more like yes, they're smoking weed and like it's almost like right, they don't really see the connection.
38:29
SPEAKER_02: They just go, yeah, they're smoking weed.
38:31
SPEAKER_02: One family said to me, Oh, I'm never gonna get them to stop.
38:34
SPEAKER_02: What do you what do you mean?
38:35
SPEAKER_02: So let's I really want parents to hear this from you.
38:38
SPEAKER_00: What yeah, yeah.
38:39
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I would say to that family, I'd say you may not get them to stop because that's outside your circle.
38:44
SPEAKER_00: But what is inside your circle you are abdicating into the ether, which is ridiculous.
38:49
SPEAKER_00: So if your young adult is smoking in your house, why would you be okay with that, right?
38:54
SPEAKER_00: Right.
38:54
SPEAKER_00: We can't if our young adult, if your young adult is in their own apartment and they are faking it until they make it and they have a job and they're smoking uh five to nine, right?
39:04
SPEAKER_00: So I always I always think of it this way, right?
39:07
SPEAKER_00: So there's a nine to five space, there's a five to nine space.
39:10
SPEAKER_00: If you have a stalled young adult, they're not growing in the nine to five or the five to nine.
39:15
SPEAKER_00: I have tons of families that reach out to me that their young adult has uh maybe it's not a true nine to five, it might be like a 30-hour week, 28-hour week job, maybe 25.
39:26
SPEAKER_00: So they're like, they got something going, not super growth-oriented, it's existence, right?
39:32
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
39:32
SPEAKER_00: Um, and in their five to nine, that young adult is white knuckling it all day long.
39:36
SPEAKER_00: And when they get home, they're ripping bong hits or hitting the vape pen or whatever.
39:40
SPEAKER_00: So they're stalled out in their five to nine.
39:42
SPEAKER_00: They might be on the spectrum and be neurodivergent or just be neurodivergent because if you have ADHD, you're neurodivergent.
39:50
SPEAKER_00: And they might have some social anxiety.
39:52
SPEAKER_00: So they're not joining on the way home from work the CrossFit group or the ultimate frisbee thing or the softball league, or even thinking about that certificate in project management.
40:03
SPEAKER_00: Okay, but that young adult at least has a leg to stand upon.
40:06
SPEAKER_00: So that family that says I'll never get them to stop.
40:10
SPEAKER_00: Well, they really are saying I'm never gonna continue to create the conditions that make it easy and comfortable for them to continue, right?
40:17
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
40:17
SPEAKER_00: So there's always a role we play.
40:19
SPEAKER_00: We didn't cause it, we can't cure it, and we can't control it, but we definitely can take a look at the culture to which we're creating, particularly if the young adult lives in our house.
40:28
SPEAKER_00: And to answer your perspective, I'm sure you could have some way smarter um addiction, you know, pharmacologists on here talking about all the unfortunate stuff we're seeing now about spikes and schizophrenia associated with the heavy, heavy, heavy THC accounts, right?
40:46
SPEAKER_00: Um, you can someone can fact check me on this, but I believe the average um uh parts right now have about 35% THC in them, open to fact-checking.
40:57
SPEAKER_00: Love being the dumbest in the room, by the way, anyone listening.
41:00
SPEAKER_00: Whereas I believe uh the stuff that I know I smoked in in high school had like seven to ten percent.
41:08
SPEAKER_00: And then the stuff that you know my mom uh and dad smoked uh had four to seven, right?
41:13
SPEAKER_00: So we're dealing with, we're not dealing with your grandma or your mom's or whatever your generation's weed is, right?
41:19
SPEAKER_00: So we have to just first understand that this is incredibly potent stuff.
41:23
SPEAKER_00: And there is, I mean, there are clients I've come across that are doing THC wax that's in the 90s, you know, 92%, 95%, right?
41:33
SPEAKER_00: THC.
41:34
SPEAKER_00: This person is bombed out of their mind, right?
41:37
SPEAKER_00: And again, if someone is taking one toke, I mean, at night, or two tokes, let's say, after now having been present in their nine to five space and was growth-oriented in the five to nine, because they coach Little League, let's say, or they're again a young adult and they're a part of some um, you know, rock climbing gym or something, that is a very different situation.
42:01
SPEAKER_00: So we know that uh weed absolutely decreases motivation and drive.
42:07
SPEAKER_00: And if you are have a young adult, the most obvious thing in the world I always say to families is to the extent you can get this young adult bought in, let's go get them in front of a doctor.
42:18
SPEAKER_00: When was the last time blood was drawn?
42:20
SPEAKER_00: Because sometimes people have thyroid issues, and hypothyroidism looks like depression.
42:25
SPEAKER_00: So imagine now you have hypothyroidism or low, you know, B12 or low D vitamin D or uh autoimmune, and you have clinical depression and you are smoking weed and you have ADHD inattentive type and are uh doom scrolling on TikTok.
42:42
SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, so that's that's a lot of amotivation going on there.
42:47
SPEAKER_00: So of course uh weed is a huge issue.
42:51
SPEAKER_00: And it's not like someone just smokes for two, three hours.
42:54
SPEAKER_00: Is I mean, when they smoke, it's not like they're impacted two or three hours.
42:59
SPEAKER_00: We know that that person is globally, again, robbing dopamine from tomorrow today.
43:06
SPEAKER_00: They are dopamine deprived, starting their day off if they smoke, stealing from the dopamine that could have been provided for them vis-a-vis inactivity.
43:17
SPEAKER_00: Now, granted, we have a finite amount, right?
43:20
SPEAKER_00: We can't even replenish dopamine, arepinephrine, and serotonin unless we're sleeping.
43:27
SPEAKER_00: So if sleep is dysregulated, now I'm smoking pot, right?
43:31
SPEAKER_00: So of course the impact is massive.
43:34
SPEAKER_00: And again, what I would ask that family is let's first start looking at your circle of control.
43:38
SPEAKER_00: What do you control?
43:40
SPEAKER_00: Let's change your languaging.
43:42
SPEAKER_00: You absolutely, the basic expectation is if a young adult is living in your house, my basic standards are they cannot be using drugs in your house.
43:51
SPEAKER_00: They have to have a job and be contributing financially.
43:54
SPEAKER_00: Because if they're not doing, if those two things are not happen or happening or not happening, what what What are you incubating?
44:01
SPEAKER_00: You're incubating an avoidant lifestyle, right?
44:03
SPEAKER_00: That is only propagating shame and anxiety.
44:07
SPEAKER_00: And think about when you put things off, it already was put off because it was deemed banal by your brain.
44:14
SPEAKER_00: You don't have any more chutzpah, right?
44:17
SPEAKER_00: Desire oomph to go and attack it.
44:19
SPEAKER_00: And if you're smoking weed, which is giving you the psychological back door again and again and again, it makes it that much harder, right?
44:27
SPEAKER_00: Um, so it is, it is a math, they are, they are, they go hand in hand, literally, because we know when you smoke, you have tunnel vision.
44:36
SPEAKER_00: And so if I'm all over the place and I have every tab open and I can't deselect, on some level, I could feel like I'm actually hyper-focused.
44:47
SPEAKER_00: And unless you're like Wiz Khalifa or like, you know, some rapper who's like sitting there and like having tunnel vision while writing and then going and spitting rhymes, you're probably not being productive while you're high.
45:00
SPEAKER_00: Let's be honest, right?
45:01
SPEAKER_02: No, definitely.
45:02
SPEAKER_02: Anxiety.
45:03
SPEAKER_02: How does a parent know if their behavior is caused by their anxiety?
45:07
SPEAKER_02: So it's avoidance behavior, or is it because they're struggling with their ADHD?
45:11
SPEAKER_02: How do they know the difference?
45:13
SPEAKER_00: Well, they go hand in hand.
45:14
SPEAKER_00: So again, one of the things I love doing like is just helping young adults understand how their brains work.
45:20
SPEAKER_00: And the term neurodivergent is still, we have a long way to go.
45:23
SPEAKER_00: I always say that every person, you, me, and the next person are of a diverse neurotype, meaning we're of our own neurotype.
45:30
SPEAKER_00: And we need to learn that.
45:31
SPEAKER_00: And so if I have um social phobia, which really is means that I'm I have performance anxiety, um, social phobia has nothing to do with my inability to have good social skills.
45:43
SPEAKER_00: It has to do with the fear of being negatively evaluated by others.
45:46
SPEAKER_00: And so many young adults who are stuck, stalled out, failing to launch have social phobia.
45:52
SPEAKER_00: And let's say I'm called on in school and I have ADHD and I was offline and I didn't even really know, I didn't retain what was just going on.
46:02
SPEAKER_00: Well, I have a couple options there.
46:04
SPEAKER_00: I could fall on my sword, I can own that I just did that, I could quickly act out and get in trouble, right?
46:10
SPEAKER_00: And do something.
46:11
SPEAKER_00: I could shut down, I could freeze, I could, all of these things.
46:14
SPEAKER_00: So those coping skills or lack thereof coping skills, right?
46:19
SPEAKER_00: Those adaptive and maladaptive strategies that were learned to abate or manage or dodge and you know, duck the anxiety absolutely continues to play out.
46:31
SPEAKER_00: And so we know that if someone has anxiety, they are not going to do a good job with executive functioning.
46:38
SPEAKER_00: And when they are looping, let's say in an obsessional if they have OCD or they are having generalized anxiety where they're anxious and their baseline is up here, there's a million things they can do from, of course, exercise, sleep, food, med management, acupuncture.
46:56
SPEAKER_00: Are those things going to make them not have ADHD?
47:00
SPEAKER_00: No.
47:00
SPEAKER_00: But is that going to bring down the baseline?
47:03
SPEAKER_00: Something even as simple as like an Epsom salt bath, which the Miller household like should have stock in because we go through Epsom salt, like it's going out of style.
47:12
SPEAKER_00: Just even having an Epsom salt bath, having a good sleep hygiene ritual, all of that is going to set you up, journaling, right?
47:19
SPEAKER_00: Waking up and having asking your priming your brain, what are the three most important things I need to do this morning to help me right kickstart my day?
47:28
SPEAKER_00: I always have young adults ask themselves how and what questions about a topic.
47:33
SPEAKER_00: What can I do this morning to avoid getting sucked into, let's say, TikTok?
47:38
SPEAKER_00: How can I make sure I get out of the house by 11 o'clock today?
47:42
SPEAKER_00: What can I do?
47:43
SPEAKER_00: Right.
47:44
SPEAKER_00: Now you start again gamifying things, which is killing two birds at one stone.
47:48
SPEAKER_00: If I have social anxiety and I go and I walk my dog and I actually make eye contact with somebody, and then I go and sit in a cafe, I'm desensitizing myself against the anxiety while I'm applying for jobs and Indeed and LinkedIn, I am so far ahead of my old self who still would have been in the PJs, maybe had really poor self-care and activities of daily living.
48:13
SPEAKER_00: And that would keep incubating the anxiety, which would only further decrease my ability to be functional and productive.
48:22
SPEAKER_02: I always like to leave on a positive note.
48:24
SPEAKER_02: So for the parents listening who are feeling this frustration, what do you want them to understand about what is possible for their adult child with ADHD?
48:33
SPEAKER_00: The reason I started this work, like I said earlier, is having worked with the identified client, the teen and the young adult for you know decades, I said, you know what?
48:42
SPEAKER_00: It's really the culture.
48:43
SPEAKER_00: The culture wins championships.
48:45
SPEAKER_00: And the coolest thing about my families, they're all my heroes because rather than also, and maybe they were for a little while, right?
48:54
SPEAKER_00: Turning a blind eye and avoidance creates more avoidance.
48:57
SPEAKER_00: And they, through their own shame, maybe uh and apathy, right, further promulgated some unhealthy patterns and behaviors.
49:05
SPEAKER_00: But now they're turning toward it with love and they're holding their posture.
49:10
SPEAKER_00: They're being unflappable amidst whatever storm is being thrown their way because they have a higher purpose.
49:15
SPEAKER_00: They have a clear North Star.
49:17
SPEAKER_00: And together we build hills that we're gonna die on together because we know why we're doing what we're doing.
49:23
SPEAKER_00: I call it the big why.
49:24
SPEAKER_00: And those families go, I call it from cardboard cutouts, if you will, to 3D, to see a father who was maybe struggled to be relational with his daughter or his son, was very top-down, now become incredibly heart-centered, to see a father or mother, it doesn't matter, or both these examples could be whoever, you know, see someone who was caught up in a measurement, guilt, not holding the line, allowing his son or daughter to get away with murder.
49:52
SPEAKER_00: Now being able to say no in a way that says, I love you, I know this is hard, and still, despite all that, the answer is no, and we're gonna ask you to do this, this, and this.
50:02
SPEAKER_00: To see that shift is is what makes me keep going and will make me keep going for the next 20 years.
50:09
SPEAKER_00: Um, it is possible.
50:10
SPEAKER_00: And there's a clear process and methodology, and that's what the Four Peaks Parents program is all about.
50:16
SPEAKER_00: And I hope anyone listening who's curious should go to fourpeaksparents.com and you can sign up for the free newsletter.
50:23
SPEAKER_00: And if you have a young adult that's struggling because of neurodivergence, whether that's just ADHD, which I'd be shocked.
50:30
SPEAKER_00: I've never just seen just ADHD.
50:32
SPEAKER_00: Um, but if it's ADHD and anxiety andor cannabis andor neurodivergence andor whatever, I'm so happy to take a deep dive with you.
50:42
SPEAKER_00: You could book a free discovery call on the site, and we can learn whether or not the program's the right opportunity for you and your family.
50:48
SPEAKER_02: I want to finish on something that you said when we last spoke.
50:52
SPEAKER_02: It was a statement that I and I wrote it down.
50:55
SPEAKER_02: You said your purpose is to help families have more courage to help them wipe away the shame and stigma.
51:03
SPEAKER_02: And the families that can do it are heroes.
51:06
SPEAKER_00: They are.
51:07
SPEAKER_02: And I love that so much, Thomas, and I think it's such a beautiful way for us to end this episode.
51:12
SPEAKER_00: I love it.
51:13
SPEAKER_02: So let's do this again.
51:15
SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much.
51:15
SPEAKER_02: Your suggestions were amazing.
51:17
SPEAKER_02: I will leave all your information, rather, in the show notes, but thank you so much for everything.
51:21
SPEAKER_02: And uh, we'll talk again soon.
51:24
SPEAKER_00: Sounds great.
51:24
SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
51:25
SPEAKER_02: Bye.
51:26
SPEAKER_02: If you want your adult child to become more responsible, productive, and independent, I invite you to join my free launch masterclass where I talk about what's actually holding them back and what you can start doing differently to help create change.
51:43
SPEAKER_02: Registration is currently open and space is limited.
51:47
SPEAKER_02: I do leave the link in the show notes.
51:49
SPEAKER_02: Or if you want, grab a pen and write this down.
51:52
SPEAKER_02: I'll just wait.
51:54
SPEAKER_02: I'm kidding.
51:55
SPEAKER_02: It's parentingfx.com forward slash register.
52:02
SPEAKER_02: If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with another parent who could benefit from it.
52:06
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52:10
SPEAKER_02: And one last thing leaving a five star review or a comment helps other parents just like you discover launch.
52:19
SPEAKER_02: As always, thank you for being here from wherever that may be.