Latest / Stuff You Should Know / What is Collective Hysteria?

Transcript

What is Collective Hysteria? · Stuff You Should Know

0:01
Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you Should Know from House Stuff Works
0:04
Speaker 1: dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh
0:13
Speaker 1: Clark with me as always as Charles W. Chuck Bryant,
0:16
Speaker 1: and Jerry's over there to the left, and that makes
0:20
Speaker 1: the Stuff you Should Know got the eighteen. Yeah, in
0:23
Speaker 1: the hissy, I call face what I'm face? Of course
0:29
Speaker 1: your face, look at you. I would be a combination
0:32
Speaker 1: of Murdoch and Mr Tak Yeah. Oh, your hair is
0:36
Speaker 1: kind of spiky in the middle today. Yeah, Jerry, I
0:38
Speaker 1: don't know what she'd be. I guess she'd be the leader.
0:42
Speaker 1: She'd be Hannibal. Oh yeah, you know she's smoking a
0:45
Speaker 1: cigar right now, wearing a black glove. When did you
0:47
Speaker 1: start the sucking cigars? Jerry? That's weird, very timely. I
0:52
Speaker 1: said a team. I don't want to slag off guests
0:55
Speaker 1: produce a knoll. He's not exactly be team. We'll just
0:58
Speaker 1: call ourself the O G S. Okay, now that we
1:02
Speaker 1: have that established, we are the O G S. We
1:04
Speaker 1: need bowling shirts that say as much. On the bad
1:08
Speaker 1: you're feeling good, I'm feeling uh nauseous and dizzy. Oh well, Chuck,
1:14
Speaker 1: did you happen to see somebody else who is nauseous
1:17
Speaker 1: and dizzy. Well, Jerry was last week, and then a
1:19
Speaker 1: few more people in the office, so I just figured
1:21
Speaker 1: we all had the same thing. All right, I'm gonna
1:23
Speaker 1: diagnose this, Okay. It's called collective hysteria, also known, I
1:29
Speaker 1: think more appropriately is mass psychogenic disorder. I think when
1:34
Speaker 1: you add the word hysteria to this, it ticks on
1:36
Speaker 1: certain dimensions that a lot of people could find very objectionable.
1:41
Speaker 1: You know, hysterics, hysteria. It's like um dogs and cats
1:46
Speaker 1: living together. Yeah, but I think it has it has
1:49
Speaker 1: a definite um gender specific connotation to it from over
1:55
Speaker 1: the years, like women were supposedly very hysterical. So the
1:59
Speaker 1: the idea of diagnosing somebody as hysterical under any circumstances,
2:04
Speaker 1: it's kind of it's had him out to panning him,
2:06
Speaker 1: patting him on the head. Yeah here, nice lady, you're
2:09
Speaker 1: you're just a little hysterical. Do you just go calm
2:11
Speaker 1: down and bake something right? Stop being crazy? Uh? No.
2:15
Speaker 1: Mass psychogenic disorder instead is just kind of like whoa,
2:18
Speaker 1: your brain just did something pretty neat. And that is
2:22
Speaker 1: the case for mass psychogenic disorder. If you ask me um.
2:26
Speaker 1: In this article Chuck written by Jacob Silverman, Jeopardy Champion.
2:31
Speaker 1: Yeah well yeah, yeah you won on Jeopardy. That makes
2:34
Speaker 1: him a champion? Or yeah, I think so. He wasn't
2:35
Speaker 1: like the ultimate Champion, but he won a couple of episodes, right,
2:39
Speaker 1: which is why they should have a word for I
2:42
Speaker 1: guess like the champion is like the one who won
2:45
Speaker 1: at all Ken Jennings, Yeah, or um Watson, who's that
2:50
Speaker 1: the IBM computer? Yeah, so Jeopardy winner. Jacob Silverman wrote
2:55
Speaker 1: this article years back, and he did a pretty great
2:58
Speaker 1: job of citing a contemporary outbreak of mass psychogenic disorder
3:05
Speaker 1: that had been going on around that time down in Mexico,
3:08
Speaker 1: down Mexico, way in Chalco, Mexico, at a boarding school.
3:12
Speaker 1: There apparently was a girls boarding school and the girls
3:16
Speaker 1: that went to school they were just twelve to seventeen,
3:19
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden they started, well, there was
3:22
Speaker 1: an outbreak, a weird outbreak. There was vomiting, I believe,
3:27
Speaker 1: trouble walking. Um, there was fever that's weird, nausea and
3:34
Speaker 1: so the the people running this boarding school like, um,
3:38
Speaker 1: what's going on? This is not good? Uh? And they
3:41
Speaker 1: had no idea. The girls went on Christmas break for
3:45
Speaker 1: ten days, came back, and the thing just took off
3:48
Speaker 1: again like wildfire. Yeah, six d girls, um showed these
3:52
Speaker 1: symptoms and nobody could figure it out. Um. They did
3:56
Speaker 1: a lot of tests, they brought in people to like
3:58
Speaker 1: check out the facilities, and because as you'll see, there's
4:01
Speaker 1: a trend there. Um, you know here in the West,
4:05
Speaker 1: they start to blame it, usually on um, like environmental
4:09
Speaker 1: poisoning of some kind. Right, Um, you know there's some
4:12
Speaker 1: sort of toxins that is poisoned everybody. But they didn't
4:15
Speaker 1: find anything there, and eventually, um, they said, this is uh,
4:21
Speaker 1: what do you call it? Psychosomatic mass psychogenic disorder? Okay,
4:25
Speaker 1: mass psychogenic disorder, but no, that is one of the
4:27
Speaker 1: one of the names that it's mass psychogenic disorder, collective hysteria,
4:31
Speaker 1: mass hysteria, or mass psychosomatic reaction. They're all saying the
4:36
Speaker 1: same thing they are, which is you're not well. Was
4:39
Speaker 1: about so you're not really sick, But that is not
4:41
Speaker 1: exactly true, because that's one thing that differentiates this from
4:45
Speaker 1: something that's just in your head is you actually do
4:47
Speaker 1: manifest physical symptoms. Right. Yeah, there's this article written by
4:50
Speaker 1: a m d. Named Timothy F. Jones from the Tennessee
4:53
Speaker 1: Department of Health way back in the heavy days of
4:56
Speaker 1: two thousand, your two thousand in the future. Um, and
5:00
Speaker 1: he writes that you if you are experiencing mass psychogenic disorder,
5:07
Speaker 1: it is not just in your head. That the symptoms
5:09
Speaker 1: that you have are actually very real. Even though there's
5:12
Speaker 1: no toxic cause that they couldn't find some sort of
5:16
Speaker 1: environmental poison or anything like that, the symptoms are extremely real. Yeah,
5:20
Speaker 1: it's just psycho somatic. It's just basically the brain has
5:24
Speaker 1: been tricked into causing this response. Yeah, and this has happened. Um,
5:30
Speaker 1: They've documented about eighty cases throughout history and apparently the
5:33
Speaker 1: National Institutes of Health gets about two cases per week reported.
5:38
Speaker 1: But um, which is I mean, like that's that's way
5:41
Speaker 1: more common than than you would think, you know, yeah,
5:45
Speaker 1: I would think there'd be more than eight, because I mean,
5:47
Speaker 1: these have happened. If you go back and look at
5:49
Speaker 1: I mean, there's all sorts of crazy lists on the
5:51
Speaker 1: internet about these cases that date back to like the
5:54
Speaker 1: fourteenth century. Medieval dancing mania was one of them. Yeah,
5:58
Speaker 1: the dancing plague. Yeah, yeah, that's in there. The Salem
6:02
Speaker 1: Witchcraft trials or the Salem witchcraft I guess what led
6:06
Speaker 1: to the trials was UM supposedly attributed to this kind
6:10
Speaker 1: of thing. Uh. One weird thing about this condition is
6:17
Speaker 1: more times than not, it is affects females, Yeah, and
6:21
Speaker 1: young females even more specifically teenagers or even younger, which
6:25
Speaker 1: is as far as it goes right now, inexplicable UM.
6:30
Speaker 1: And it's kind of a prickly issue, you know, like
6:32
Speaker 1: again you kind of come back to the idea of
6:35
Speaker 1: calling it hysteria. You know, the fact that it does
6:38
Speaker 1: tend to afflict women or girls more than them boys.
6:44
Speaker 1: UM is apparently one means of diagnosing psychogenic disordered mass psychogogical.
6:49
Speaker 1: That's like one of the first things we'll say is like,
6:51
Speaker 1: all this the sickness is happening in this place, the
6:54
Speaker 1: school wherever, and the doctor will say, is it a
6:57
Speaker 1: bunch of girls? And then that will clue them in
7:00
Speaker 1: that hey, this might be what we're dealing with here.
7:02
Speaker 1: And but the problem is no one has any idea why,
7:05
Speaker 1: and there have been explanations of things like um, Uh,
7:11
Speaker 1: I guess girls, this is this is girls culturally acceptable
7:16
Speaker 1: outlet for raging against the patriarchy. Sure, even if they
7:20
Speaker 1: don't necessarily feel that that's what they're doing. This is
7:24
Speaker 1: there there, Uh, this is the symptoms of that. That's one. Yeah,
7:28
Speaker 1: I thought this was a pretty interesting part. What article
7:31
Speaker 1: was that from Slate? Uh? There was uh yeah, one
7:34
Speaker 1: called mass Asteria and Upstate New York by Ruth Graham
7:37
Speaker 1: was on Slate. That was a good one. It was
7:39
Speaker 1: a really good one. And we'll get to that case
7:40
Speaker 1: in a sect. But um, I thought it was pretty interesting.
7:43
Speaker 1: In one part, it says, um, and this is a
7:45
Speaker 1: quote from someone writing about something and said inform, if
7:48
Speaker 1: not unconscious intent, it is to protest the sexual repressiveness,
7:53
Speaker 1: rigid double standard of female team culture. Um. But they
7:56
Speaker 1: were writing about Beatlemania, Yeah, which is interesting because it's
8:00
Speaker 1: sort of has a similar vibe of uh, young ladies
8:05
Speaker 1: being repressed, um, not having an outlet, and so they
8:09
Speaker 1: see the Beatles and they go berserk and faint and
8:12
Speaker 1: cry and scream collectively. Whereas boys they're more prone to
8:16
Speaker 1: just act out if they're not feeling good. Girls are
8:19
Speaker 1: trained to keep things inward. And they also point out
8:21
Speaker 1: that ladies and young ladies are more prone to seek
8:25
Speaker 1: a doctor's help for something. Uh, they say that may
8:28
Speaker 1: account for the bias right there, like guys just won't
8:31
Speaker 1: go to the doctor exactly. You have to be careful though,
8:34
Speaker 1: and in just diagnosing MATHS psychogenital disorder, you physicians out
8:38
Speaker 1: there who are listening to encounter a case like this
8:41
Speaker 1: UM it just by basing it on the fact that
8:44
Speaker 1: it is affecting more girls than boys. Because there's at
8:47
Speaker 1: least one case in Great Britain where I think girls
8:51
Speaker 1: were afflicted by more than half more than double the
8:55
Speaker 1: number of girls were afflicted by this, and it turned
8:57
Speaker 1: out that they were retaining cucumbers being served in the
9:00
Speaker 1: lunch room. Yeah, and everyone knows boys hate cucumbers, and
9:04
Speaker 1: so I mean they didn't need anyone, right. But this
9:06
Speaker 1: is one of the issues with dealing with UM MATHS
9:09
Speaker 1: psychogenic disorder, and that it looks and acts a lot
9:14
Speaker 1: like some sort of weird epidemic. That basically it looks
9:19
Speaker 1: like either a UM something like bioterrorism, uh, rapidly spreading
9:25
Speaker 1: affection infection or affection if lemania and then acute toxic exposure.
9:31
Speaker 1: That's what it looks like. It's like one person gets sick.
9:35
Speaker 1: This is your index case and all of a sudden,
9:38
Speaker 1: everyone around them suddenly has the same symptoms. Yeah, and
9:42
Speaker 1: it's like you said, it's super dangerous to just dismiss
9:45
Speaker 1: that as oh it's all in your head, silly little ladies.
9:48
Speaker 1: You can't do that because what if it is something
9:51
Speaker 1: for real? But it's also a double edged sword, is
9:54
Speaker 1: that doctor pointed out, Um, you start ordering batteries of
9:58
Speaker 1: tests and it it It can go both ways. It
10:01
Speaker 1: can Um. What the old saying is, if you order
10:04
Speaker 1: enough tests, you're gonna find something, so it can fuel
10:07
Speaker 1: that fire. But you also can't not run any tests
10:10
Speaker 1: and just dismiss it. Uh. So it's a very fine
10:13
Speaker 1: line that physicians walk when dealing with stuff like this,
10:16
Speaker 1: for sure. Indeed, apparently UM study of mass psychogenic disorder
10:22
Speaker 1: has found that it's more prevalent in isolated communities and
10:27
Speaker 1: in situations where um, they are highly rigid, formalized, structured rules,
10:34
Speaker 1: like a Catholic school in Mexico exactly, um or again
10:38
Speaker 1: um Salem, Massachusetts in the seventeenth century, you know. Um.
10:44
Speaker 1: And apparently, between nineteen seventy three and half of all
10:49
Speaker 1: the outbreaks of psychogenetic or psychogenic illness took place in schools,
10:55
Speaker 1: so that that's possibly in part by due to kids
11:02
Speaker 1: being susceptible to it more um, but also because of
11:06
Speaker 1: that that rigid, formalized structure. Yeah. And there's also usually
11:10
Speaker 1: a top down effect, like it'll start with a teacher
11:12
Speaker 1: or an older student, and then the younger students follow suit,
11:17
Speaker 1: which if you're talking influence, would make sense for sure.
11:22
Speaker 1: There was one very famous case. Um. Apparently there's not
11:25
Speaker 1: very many actual academic studies on this, but there's one
11:28
Speaker 1: that came out of the New England Journal of Medicine
11:33
Speaker 1: UM that that described a case in Tennessee where a
11:38
Speaker 1: teacher noticed, um, some weird gas odor, a gassy odor, uh,
11:45
Speaker 1: like the chemical kind. Yeah, not like the guy on
11:48
Speaker 1: the front road to right exactly, um, and she apparently
11:52
Speaker 1: started suffering symptoms uh, And all of a sudden, like
11:57
Speaker 1: a hundred and eighties students and teachers had to go
12:00
Speaker 1: to the emergency room. The school was shut down for
12:03
Speaker 1: two weeks. They did all this environmental testing, couldn't find anything,
12:07
Speaker 1: and finally traced it back to UM psychogenic a mass
12:13
Speaker 1: psychogenic disorder, if that's what it didn't and then everyone
12:16
Speaker 1: In most of these cases we should point out everyone
12:19
Speaker 1: it starts feeling better. Yes, like in Mexico and then
12:22
Speaker 1: the school in Tennessee. It's it's not like they went
12:25
Speaker 1: on to die or anything. Yeah. So in the school
12:28
Speaker 1: in Mexico, the these girls were at a boarding school.
12:32
Speaker 1: They were only allowed to see their parents, I think
12:34
Speaker 1: like three times a year. Yeah, they couldn't even call.
12:37
Speaker 1: It's like it sounds more like a prison. They were
12:40
Speaker 1: allowed letters when they went home. Immediately their symptoms cleared up.
12:45
Speaker 1: The problem is that doesn't automatically say oh, well, it's
12:47
Speaker 1: obviously mass psychogenic distorder. It could be an environmental toxin
12:51
Speaker 1: that they were being exposed to still uh at the
12:54
Speaker 1: school and we're removed from But I think the the
12:59
Speaker 1: definite problem osis is mass psychogenic disorder in this case.
13:04
Speaker 1: That's right. What we're talking about is a sort of
13:06
Speaker 1: version of the no Seebo effect, which we've talked about before,
13:09
Speaker 1: and we will get into that right up to this break.
13:14
Speaker 1: So the no cebo effect, we talked about that, and
13:18
Speaker 1: what the placebo effect. Well, that makes sense. Yeah, I
13:23
Speaker 1: was trying to be more clever. I thought we were
13:25
Speaker 1: more clever than that. Uh no cebo. I think we
13:28
Speaker 1: said in that other podcast he was Latin for eyeshall harm.
13:31
Speaker 1: And that's basically whereas you take a placebo thinking it's
13:34
Speaker 1: gonna help you out, and it does help you out
13:37
Speaker 1: because the mind is powerful. The no cebo effect is
13:40
Speaker 1: thinking something bad will result, like my teachers getting sick.
13:44
Speaker 1: I think I feel a little sick too, and then oh, hey,
13:47
Speaker 1: my neighbor is feeling a little sick. I think I'm
13:48
Speaker 1: feeling a little sick too. Or this this drug trial
13:51
Speaker 1: that I'm on, I was told that I could possibly
13:54
Speaker 1: get some sort of gastro intestin old distress. Yeah, and
13:59
Speaker 1: even I've been given a sugar pill. I'm now going
14:04
Speaker 1: yeah because in my mind because of the Noebo effect.
14:08
Speaker 1: There was a famous experiment or case from eight six
14:11
Speaker 1: where there was a woman who had a rose allergy
14:15
Speaker 1: and they showed her an artificial rose and she began
14:18
Speaker 1: to I guess it was convincing, and she began to
14:20
Speaker 1: have her allergic reaction and they said, ah, ha, it's
14:25
Speaker 1: fake and you're faking, and uh she said, oh, well,
14:30
Speaker 1: I think I'm feeling better now, and supposedly that cured
14:34
Speaker 1: or of her real allergy to real roses. I couldn't
14:38
Speaker 1: find a lot to back that up. But is it
14:40
Speaker 1: it is a story. Yeah, well no, that's a I
14:42
Speaker 1: mean it was in I can't remember the journal, but
14:45
Speaker 1: it was really well yeah, it was a real deal thing.
14:47
Speaker 1: And um, I don't I didn't get to the bottom
14:50
Speaker 1: of why they presented this woman with a fake rose
14:55
Speaker 1: or whatever, but they definitely didn't. This definitely happened. And um,
15:00
Speaker 1: the even the author of the study was saying, like
15:03
Speaker 1: this woman, she wasn't faking. It was like she she
15:07
Speaker 1: had real symptoms hives or hives exactly. I can see those. Um.
15:12
Speaker 1: I think they call it like a rose cold or
15:14
Speaker 1: something like that. You can get you know, stuffy, your
15:18
Speaker 1: eyes are watering, your your nose is running, that kind
15:21
Speaker 1: of thing. And what's interesting is some researchers have studied
15:26
Speaker 1: the no sebo effect and they basically have isolated this
15:30
Speaker 1: this chemical that gets released when the no cebo effects
15:35
Speaker 1: going on. And again we should say it's not just
15:38
Speaker 1: um making your nose running or releasing histamines or anything
15:41
Speaker 1: like that is pain too, Like you can you can
15:44
Speaker 1: experience pain even though nothing's there to give you pain,
15:49
Speaker 1: just because of the noebo effect. What they found was
15:52
Speaker 1: a um A, I guess, uh hormone, I believe. Are
15:57
Speaker 1: you ready? I'm gonna try this one? Uh, coli cisto kinon.
16:02
Speaker 1: That sounds great, thanks man. I haven't looked at the word,
16:05
Speaker 1: but it sounds right. Coli cisto kinon. Um. Do you
16:10
Speaker 1: see it now? That's totally right. I totally did. So.
16:12
Speaker 1: It's a hormone, right, and it gets released and it actually, um,
16:17
Speaker 1: it helps you experience pain. So it's a nasty little hormone.
16:21
Speaker 1: But they found in testing with the no cebo effect
16:25
Speaker 1: that if you block this, you can also block the
16:27
Speaker 1: no cebo effect. So that proves two things. Does that
16:30
Speaker 1: block pain though, like your pain receptors? So does that
16:33
Speaker 1: mean if you slam your pand in the door you
16:34
Speaker 1: won't feel it if you can block this? Yes? So um,
16:39
Speaker 1: if you can block coli cisto canon, yes, it will
16:43
Speaker 1: keep you from um hypersensitivity to pain. I believe. And
16:47
Speaker 1: this guy named Fabrizio Benedetti I think was also in
16:51
Speaker 1: the Strokes back. He uh, he was testing out the
16:58
Speaker 1: nocebo effect and found that if he told people that
17:01
Speaker 1: he was giving them an injection, which is it's a
17:03
Speaker 1: pretty cruel test. But effective. These post stop people who
17:08
Speaker 1: had just come out of surgery. Uh, We're given an
17:12
Speaker 1: injection and told this injection is going to increase your
17:15
Speaker 1: pain in thirty minutes. I'm sorry, we have to give
17:17
Speaker 1: it to it's part of the procedure. He gave some
17:20
Speaker 1: people an injection of saline and they reported an increase
17:24
Speaker 1: in pain, and they all went behind the two way
17:26
Speaker 1: mirror and laughed right there like yeah. And then they
17:32
Speaker 1: gave somebody, like the other group, the control group, uh,
17:36
Speaker 1: a chemical an injection that blocks that pain. But they
17:39
Speaker 1: were told that it was going to increase their pain.
17:43
Speaker 1: But they were given a chemical that blocks uh cola
17:46
Speaker 1: sister kinon and the effect didn't take place. They didn't
17:50
Speaker 1: report an increase in pain even though they were told
17:52
Speaker 1: they would. Yes, so they So this guy is saying,
17:55
Speaker 1: like the no cebo effect is real. Like when when
17:59
Speaker 1: they say it's not just in your head, it's you're
18:02
Speaker 1: experiencing the same thing as if you were experiencing somebody's
18:07
Speaker 1: stabbing you. You know, that's when you have to start
18:11
Speaker 1: asking yourself those deep philosophical questions. Interesting, Um, there's another
18:16
Speaker 1: case that's have you ever seen the movie Safe The
18:20
Speaker 1: Todd Haynes movie with Julianne Moore. No, it's from like
18:25
Speaker 1: the mid nineties, and she played a lady that um
18:28
Speaker 1: started to have environmental sickness. UM just in the air,
18:33
Speaker 1: and she's got sort of like increasingly UM crazy as
18:37
Speaker 1: the movie went on, as far as scrubbing things and
18:40
Speaker 1: locking herself in her house and making her house a
18:41
Speaker 1: clean environment. It was good and UM there's there's a
18:46
Speaker 1: true story though of a lady in London, UM named
18:49
Speaker 1: Debbie Bird. She's a health spot manager that says that
18:54
Speaker 1: she's allergic to e m F electromagnetic fields. And it's
18:59
Speaker 1: an actual thing now you know, there's more than her claiming.
19:01
Speaker 1: It's called e S electro magnetic sensitivity. Where she has
19:07
Speaker 1: basically transformed her house. She painted it black. She said
19:11
Speaker 1: she's allergic to computers, cell phones, microwaves. She had her
19:14
Speaker 1: house rewired, uh to make it basically e m F free. Uh.
19:20
Speaker 1: She and her husband's sleep under a silver plated mosquito
19:23
Speaker 1: net to keep out radio waves and covered all her
19:26
Speaker 1: windows with protective films. And she said she feel a
19:29
Speaker 1: lot better now. So I saw that, yes, electromagnetic sensitivity
19:34
Speaker 1: that if you expose somebody to a an electromagnetic field
19:39
Speaker 1: and then just tell them that you are, and don't
19:42
Speaker 1: they have the same reaction, which would suggest that it's
19:45
Speaker 1: it's no c bow. Well, it's super fascinating because you
19:49
Speaker 1: see cases like this from that to like gluten sensitivity
19:53
Speaker 1: becoming a big thing now and people some people contend that, well,
19:57
Speaker 1: it's maybe a collective hysteria going on. If you think
20:00
Speaker 1: you're going to be sensitive to gluten, then you're gonna
20:03
Speaker 1: be sensitive to things that contain gluten. And I'm not
20:05
Speaker 1: saying that people because that's a very hot topic it is,
20:08
Speaker 1: but um, some people have claimed that, well, we'll talk
20:12
Speaker 1: a little bit more about things that exacerbate the mass
20:16
Speaker 1: psychogenic disorder and the no cebo effect right after this,
20:29
Speaker 1: so chuck back in two thousand seven, in New Zealand,
20:33
Speaker 1: UH a drug called el trokes in. It was a
20:37
Speaker 1: pretty widespread drug in New Zealand. It's a hormone replacement
20:41
Speaker 1: drug and it was the only one that the government
20:43
Speaker 1: would pay for. So most people who were on this
20:45
Speaker 1: hormone replacement therapy, we're using l trokes in. And it
20:48
Speaker 1: had been that way for like decades. It was just
20:51
Speaker 1: an established trug Glaxo Smith client hormone replacement Glaxo Smith Klein.
20:58
Speaker 1: I think just those there's no welcome involved. UM changed,
21:03
Speaker 1: just the like the outer the inert qualities of it,
21:07
Speaker 1: like the shape of the pill, the color um, and
21:10
Speaker 1: I think that's about it. But the the active ingredient
21:14
Speaker 1: was exactly the same in two thousand seven. Uh. And
21:19
Speaker 1: when they released it, all of a sudden, some reports
21:22
Speaker 1: of bad side effects were starting to trickle in, and
21:26
Speaker 1: the government was like, wait, what's going on here. It
21:29
Speaker 1: got a little bit of media attention and more reports
21:33
Speaker 1: started trickling in, and then the media attention grew, and
21:36
Speaker 1: the reports grew and grew, and apparently the reporting of
21:40
Speaker 1: adverse effects of el trucks in increased two thousandfold in
21:46
Speaker 1: a year and a half because of the look of
21:48
Speaker 1: the bill, because of the look of the pill. They
21:51
Speaker 1: went back and studied this and they found that in
21:53
Speaker 1: areas where there was more reporting about these adverse effects
21:58
Speaker 1: being reported for all trucks in the more adverse effects
22:01
Speaker 1: were being reported in that area. And that kind of
22:04
Speaker 1: reveals one of the um risk factors for mass psychogenic
22:08
Speaker 1: disorder is the media. It's actually spread through the media.
22:13
Speaker 1: Most easily. Yeah, they have a point though, I mean, um,
22:16
Speaker 1: I know. In this article too, it points out that
22:18
Speaker 1: pills that are blue and green are usually associated with drowsiness,
22:23
Speaker 1: pills that are orange or yellow are not. And I
22:27
Speaker 1: don't know if that's why they market it that way
22:29
Speaker 1: or if it's the opposite, as we just see it
22:31
Speaker 1: that way because of products like niquil and day quill.
22:34
Speaker 1: But the one that makes you sleepy is green and blue,
22:36
Speaker 1: and the one that keeps you awake or keep you
22:38
Speaker 1: awake but doesn't make you drowsy orange. I thought about it.
22:42
Speaker 1: I think, I mean, what do you associate with like
22:44
Speaker 1: daytime sunrise? Yellow? Orange? What do you associate with night time?
22:49
Speaker 1: Like something tranquil like blue? Yeah, Scotch scotch amber. Uh yeah,
22:56
Speaker 1: I mean you think of That's what I think it
22:59
Speaker 1: came from. I think the pills came after the association
23:02
Speaker 1: rather than the other way around. Yeah, I think I even,
23:07
Speaker 1: like when I get a prescription for something, when I
23:09
Speaker 1: see the pill, I make a judgment on it before
23:12
Speaker 1: I've even had it, just by saying, well, don't look
23:14
Speaker 1: at that thing that Yeah, that's a horse pill or
23:17
Speaker 1: that's a capsule with you know, powdery stuff inside that's
23:21
Speaker 1: different than the chalky one. It's you. I think you
23:24
Speaker 1: just make an association. I don't think I have any
23:27
Speaker 1: preconceived notions on what a larger pill will do to
23:29
Speaker 1: me or a capsule will do to me other than
23:32
Speaker 1: a tablet. But I think it's interesting, though, how you
23:35
Speaker 1: make these judgment calls but without even thinking about totally.
23:39
Speaker 1: You know, I mean, like you're you're you probably don't
23:42
Speaker 1: sit there and look at a pill in your hand.
23:44
Speaker 1: You just take it and just make some sort of um,
23:48
Speaker 1: almost unconscious judgments about it. Yeah, it may remind you
23:52
Speaker 1: another pill that helps you that you're not even remembering exactly,
23:54
Speaker 1: so that would be placebo. Yeah that's great effect, not great, No,
24:00
Speaker 1: and it pusses a lot of problems. For instance, there
24:04
Speaker 1: was a study I think in the nineties that found
24:07
Speaker 1: that women who believed that they were prone to heart
24:10
Speaker 1: disease were four times likelier to die of heart disease
24:15
Speaker 1: than women who didn't believe they are prone to it,
24:17
Speaker 1: even though they had all the exact same risk factors,
24:20
Speaker 1: basically the same risk risk factors. There was nothing differentiating
24:24
Speaker 1: these women aside from a belief that they were going
24:26
Speaker 1: to die from heart disease or a belief that they weren't,
24:30
Speaker 1: and that led to a four time fourfold increase in
24:34
Speaker 1: deaths from that just basically from a belief, is what
24:38
Speaker 1: it suggests. Yeah, we well, it's sort of like the
24:41
Speaker 1: I know it's kind of cheesy, but the p M
24:43
Speaker 1: A the positive mental attitude. I think we've all know
24:46
Speaker 1: someone who walks around so and so sick. Oh, I
24:49
Speaker 1: know I'm gonna get it. I just know I'm gonna
24:51
Speaker 1: get sick, or you know, I just know I'm gonna
24:53
Speaker 1: get cancer because it runs in my family. That I
24:56
Speaker 1: think that has an effect on things. I have to agree.
24:58
Speaker 1: I know some of our more skeptical listeners will are
25:01
Speaker 1: pulling their hair out right now, but I totally agree
25:04
Speaker 1: with you. When we did our show in Toronto, on
25:07
Speaker 1: the way back, you me and I flow out of
25:09
Speaker 1: Buffalo and I was feeling a little down, but like
25:13
Speaker 1: at the point where I feel like you can talk
25:16
Speaker 1: yourself into staying healthy. Positive mental attitude. I guess that's
25:20
Speaker 1: what you call it. But we were leaving right at
25:23
Speaker 1: about dusk and the sun was just beaming through the
25:26
Speaker 1: windows and illuminating every single microbe visible microbe in the air.
25:33
Speaker 1: I could see them like just going into my nose
25:36
Speaker 1: in my mouth, and I'm like, I couldn't stop, Like
25:39
Speaker 1: I couldn't. I was like, I'm not gonna get sick.
25:41
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna get sick. And man, did I ever
25:43
Speaker 1: get sick. But I noticed that right when we took off,
25:48
Speaker 1: and no, you know what it was. Somebody shut one
25:50
Speaker 1: of their um their window covers shade exactly is the
25:56
Speaker 1: word that I was looking for. Somebody shut their shade
25:59
Speaker 1: and I couldn't see anymore, and I immediately started to
26:01
Speaker 1: feel less symptomatic. Immediately. It was like turning off a light.
26:06
Speaker 1: And I still got sick, but I was just drowning.
26:09
Speaker 1: And basically what my brain was interpreting is like being
26:12
Speaker 1: assaulted by foreign invaders, which I am all the time,
26:15
Speaker 1: but I normally can't see them. Yeah, well I've done
26:18
Speaker 1: I do that all the time. When I opened my
26:20
Speaker 1: uh the curtains in the bedroom and I'll see you
26:23
Speaker 1: in the morning, I'll see that stuff in the air,
26:24
Speaker 1: and I'm just thinking, oh, man, that's what I'm walking
26:26
Speaker 1: around breathing in everything dog hair and cat hair and
26:31
Speaker 1: Emily hair. So your lungs are just chocked full of it.
26:36
Speaker 1: So one of the one of the problems this poses
26:39
Speaker 1: chuck for physicians is that we expect doctors, or we
26:44
Speaker 1: want doctors to be transparent, to not lie to us. Yeah,
26:48
Speaker 1: we talked a lot about this lately. I feel like, yeah,
26:50
Speaker 1: we've talked a lot about diseases. Some of our um
26:53
Speaker 1: hypochondria listeners have been like, police, stop that talking about
26:57
Speaker 1: diseason because now I've got more orgal on, I'm gonna
27:01
Speaker 1: have like some sort of toxic exposure um and then
27:07
Speaker 1: very soon leprosy spoiler. So, uh, the problem is if
27:13
Speaker 1: you tell somebody that's going into surgery, hey, by the way, um,
27:19
Speaker 1: you know you you might have trouble walking, you might
27:23
Speaker 1: feel nauseous for the next six months, you like, all
27:27
Speaker 1: this stuff that could be associated with which we demand
27:29
Speaker 1: from our doctors. It's been shown that if you are
27:32
Speaker 1: fearful or in despair going into surgery, that's associated with
27:37
Speaker 1: longer healing times and a higher risk of post operative infection. Right,
27:42
Speaker 1: So if you have the no cebo effect where doctors
27:45
Speaker 1: are saying, okay, if I tell somebody, and it's been
27:48
Speaker 1: proven time after time that in drug trials, people who
27:52
Speaker 1: are still are given placebo will drop out of drug
27:55
Speaker 1: trials because they're experiencing these negative side effects even though
28:01
Speaker 1: they're given the sugar pill. So if you're a doctor
28:04
Speaker 1: and you you know that you are telling somebody something
28:07
Speaker 1: that ultimately may end up harming them, and you've sworn
28:10
Speaker 1: an oath to do no harm, you've got a conundrum
28:13
Speaker 1: going on right now. And that's what the no cebo
28:15
Speaker 1: effect poses. It's the problem the no cebo effect poses
28:19
Speaker 1: for modern physicians, like how much should they tell you
28:22
Speaker 1: if you're gonna tell somebody that they're gonna feel nauseous
28:25
Speaker 1: for six months even though they probably won't, should you
28:29
Speaker 1: tell them and give them a chance to to basically
28:32
Speaker 1: have the psychosomatic symptom, or tell them they're going to
28:35
Speaker 1: feel great. Well, that's another one. Somebody says the solution
28:38
Speaker 1: to this is just frame it differently, Like, don't say
28:41
Speaker 1: there's a chance you're gonna have um nausea for six months.
28:46
Speaker 1: Say half of a percent of patients who go through
28:49
Speaker 1: the same procedure that you're about to go through have
28:52
Speaker 1: nausea for six months five percent. Don't you're giving them
28:56
Speaker 1: the same information. It's just framework positively, Yeah, and uh
29:01
Speaker 1: that one doctor who wrote the article on collective hysteria said, Um,
29:04
Speaker 1: what he recommends is not naming the illness, said that
29:09
Speaker 1: can help out. Um, because as soon as you give
29:12
Speaker 1: something a name, then it just instantly you know you
29:17
Speaker 1: have something you can call it, and everyone's calling it that,
29:18
Speaker 1: or the media picks up on it and it's a thing. Yeah,
29:21
Speaker 1: And that's actually again one of the one of the
29:23
Speaker 1: risk factors in the spread of mass psychogenic illness is
29:27
Speaker 1: the larger the response, the emergency medical response to it,
29:31
Speaker 1: and then hence the larger the media response to it,
29:34
Speaker 1: the larger the outbreak tends to be. It's called line
29:37
Speaker 1: of sight exposure. Just knowing somebody is sick or seeing
29:42
Speaker 1: somebody sick can give you the same symptoms. I'm sure
29:45
Speaker 1: if you see a news story that all the other
29:47
Speaker 1: news agencies are running that says, uh, there's been some
29:50
Speaker 1: weird chemical leak in the air in Atlanta. Uh, people
29:54
Speaker 1: are gonna start walking around and coughing and saying, I'm
29:58
Speaker 1: not feeling so good. I have a bitter taste in
30:00
Speaker 1: my mouth. There's microbes everywhere. Well, here's a case from
30:05
Speaker 1: that article you sent that I think is super fascinating
30:08
Speaker 1: the one in upstate New York because it is not
30:11
Speaker 1: a rash or um a call for nausea, It is
30:15
Speaker 1: Tourette syndrome. Uh. Sixteen year old UM, young lady named
30:19
Speaker 1: Laurie Brounwell, Uh what year was this? A couple of
30:22
Speaker 1: years ago? Yeah, not too long ago, I think um
30:25
Speaker 1: and Corinth, New York. Um was at her school's homecoming
30:29
Speaker 1: dance and lost consciousness. Um, this is after she banged
30:33
Speaker 1: at a concert. Sorry, man, I thought, yeah, she was
30:37
Speaker 1: head banging at a concert. I wish I knew a
30:39
Speaker 1: concert that was so me too. I didn't find it anywhere.
30:42
Speaker 1: Apparently passed out there and had passing outfits. Uh, involuntary
30:46
Speaker 1: twitching and clapping, started twisting her hair, fluttering her fingers, Hey, hey, hey,
30:52
Speaker 1: starting stuff like that, and the doctor said, you know
30:55
Speaker 1: what You've got, Turette syndrome. So Tourette's syndrome is is.
30:59
Speaker 1: We've had a podcast on It's real and it's not psychosomatic. Um.
31:03
Speaker 1: But uh, since that time, fourteen other students along with her,
31:08
Speaker 1: thirteen girls and one boy started exhibiting at Leroy Junior
31:12
Speaker 1: High School. I'm sorry, Junior Senior High School. Started coming
31:15
Speaker 1: down with threats, right, which is not contagious, and it
31:18
Speaker 1: is not contagious at all. Um. Aaron Brockovitch got on
31:21
Speaker 1: the case, um, famous environmental activists, and she said, now,
31:26
Speaker 1: I think this has got to do with this train
31:28
Speaker 1: derailment from nineteen seventy that dumped cyanide all over this town. Um,
31:33
Speaker 1: and I didn't see where they found any uh legitimate effects. Right. Again,
31:39
Speaker 1: that's the confounding thing about mass psychogenetic disorders, that it
31:43
Speaker 1: is still possible that there is some weird toxin in
31:48
Speaker 1: the environment that is causing this. Like maybe there was
31:52
Speaker 1: exposure to cyanide that gotten these people's brains and all
31:56
Speaker 1: gave them to it. And if you stand back and
31:58
Speaker 1: look at it, you're like, to Turette syndrome isn't contagious.
32:03
Speaker 1: That doesn't mean that you can't all come down with
32:05
Speaker 1: Thurette syndrome from exposure to a toxin. It's just still
32:09
Speaker 1: it's this X factor that's out there that you can't
32:11
Speaker 1: just necessarily rule out. Yeah, and I believe in that
32:14
Speaker 1: case too, the UM those fourteen students didn't end up
32:17
Speaker 1: with Thurette syndrome. That was a good episode Man, I
32:21
Speaker 1: love Turette syndrome one. Yeah, it's an oldie, oldie, but
32:24
Speaker 1: a goody and it all came from head banging. That's
32:28
Speaker 1: how it started at a Nickelback show. Yeah, because Corinth
32:34
Speaker 1: is near Canada. Canada isn't let nickel Back out any longer?
32:39
Speaker 1: Are they caged in there? Nice? Uh? There's another case
32:42
Speaker 1: of the Toxic Lady. Did you hear this one? In Riverside, California,
32:46
Speaker 1: woman named Gloria Ramirez. Um. Yeah, she was dubbed the
32:49
Speaker 1: toxic Lady in n She had cervical cancer and was
32:53
Speaker 1: being treated and all the medical staff started to get
32:56
Speaker 1: sick that was treating her. Um. This sounds gross, but
32:59
Speaker 1: they say her body exuded a garlicky fruity smell and
33:03
Speaker 1: her blood had flecks of what looked like paper um,
33:07
Speaker 1: which sounds called Morglon's actually nice, you like that um.
33:12
Speaker 1: And they said that most of the people that got
33:15
Speaker 1: sick while treating her were women, more women than men,
33:19
Speaker 1: and they all took blood test and came back normal
33:22
Speaker 1: and the health department said mass hysteria. So that's funny.
33:25
Speaker 1: Because I looked, I remembered that story and I was like,
33:27
Speaker 1: I wonder if that was mass hysteria, and I looked
33:30
Speaker 1: it up and I found that No, it was an
33:31
Speaker 1: environmental toxic O it was. That's what I found. So
33:34
Speaker 1: they called it mass hysteria the time, and then later
33:36
Speaker 1: found out, I think like a year or two later,
33:38
Speaker 1: she was using some sort of salve or something on
33:41
Speaker 1: her skin and they think that in interactive with her
33:44
Speaker 1: biochemistry and really did produce toxic toxic gas. She said
33:49
Speaker 1: it maybe this fruit garlic salv exactly. That's interacting badly
33:53
Speaker 1: with my pancreas. Oh well, uh, this list needs to
33:57
Speaker 1: be updated. That that That is a fascinating in case
34:01
Speaker 1: people got really sick from that. I think I remember
34:04
Speaker 1: hearing about that too. Yeah. Well, I'm glad they found
34:06
Speaker 1: a real cause in that case from what I understand.
34:07
Speaker 1: But that's that's that's the point. Like you can say, well,
34:11
Speaker 1: obviously there's women were more affective than men, right, Well,
34:14
Speaker 1: is that because there's more women in the nursing profession
34:18
Speaker 1: and there were more nurses in the room. There's a
34:20
Speaker 1: lot of different things you have to take into account
34:23
Speaker 1: before you just write it off. Sometimes it is reel
34:25
Speaker 1: like sick building syndrome. Yeah, that's a tough one because
34:30
Speaker 1: after the Opeque oil embargo, apparently people started designing buildings
34:36
Speaker 1: to be more air tight, so your ventilation ventilation system
34:39
Speaker 1: was really important, and these buildings have an age necessarily
34:44
Speaker 1: very well, so the ventilation system is not doing what
34:46
Speaker 1: it's supposed to any longer, and so they think possibly
34:50
Speaker 1: that's leading to what we know as sick building syndrome,
34:52
Speaker 1: which is malaise when you don't feel good when you
34:55
Speaker 1: go to work. But some studies have found like, no,
34:59
Speaker 1: that is the better predictor of sick building syndrome is
35:02
Speaker 1: job stress or job dissatisfaction. Um, if you have a
35:07
Speaker 1: building full of people who don't like their jobs, you're
35:09
Speaker 1: gonna have a building full of people with sick building syndrome.
35:11
Speaker 1: But if you go on to say like a local
35:14
Speaker 1: government's website or whatever, and you look at sick building syndrome,
35:18
Speaker 1: it's a it's treated as a real thing. Yeah, well,
35:20
Speaker 1: it definitely affects your gastro intestinal like stress does. We
35:23
Speaker 1: also apparently you can set off bouts of asthma um,
35:27
Speaker 1: which is another reason why they think you might have
35:29
Speaker 1: something to do with like volatile organic compounds in the
35:32
Speaker 1: ventilation system or new carpeting, that kind of stuff offcasting. Man,
35:36
Speaker 1: you you smell that stuff when you open up a
35:38
Speaker 1: new product. Right. There's also the dancing plague, which we
35:41
Speaker 1: mentioned briefly. Tell me about it. Uh, Fraul Trophia July
35:47
Speaker 1: fourteen eighteen, went out on the streets of Strasbourg, France
35:50
Speaker 1: and started dancing even though there was no music, and
35:54
Speaker 1: dancing like a maniac for three straight days, and all
35:57
Speaker 1: these people started dancing with her, saying this is a
35:59
Speaker 1: good time. Um said, within a month, a hundred people
36:03
Speaker 1: were dancing with her and couldn't stop and hyperventilating, hallucinating.
36:09
Speaker 1: Some drop dead of heart attack and stroke and exhaustion.
36:12
Speaker 1: And the authority said, let's just hire a band and
36:16
Speaker 1: let him dance it out, because they've got the hot blood,
36:18
Speaker 1: is what they called it. And so they did, and UM,
36:24
Speaker 1: a lot of people died as a result, and it
36:26
Speaker 1: said four hundred people in the end were struck. Uh.
36:29
Speaker 1: I don't think they died, but we're dancers. And then
36:32
Speaker 1: it just stopped. And that's when they blame a lot
36:34
Speaker 1: of people blame on ergot poisoning, which we've mentioned before.
36:39
Speaker 1: Got poisoning. Those people were clearly tripping on something, they
36:42
Speaker 1: got the hot blood. But what it sounds like you
36:44
Speaker 1: just described is basically how Tom Hanks invented jogging in
36:47
Speaker 1: the seventies. Yogging. Yeah, they just started running and people
36:52
Speaker 1: started following. I wish that part had been cut out
36:55
Speaker 1: of that movie. Yeah, I thought that it was a
36:59
Speaker 1: weird thing that should have been on the editing room floor.
37:02
Speaker 1: They really kind of derailed things for a while for me.
37:05
Speaker 1: I don't think that movie's age well though. Uh. Other
37:08
Speaker 1: people say though that it was Sydenham's Korea disorder linked
37:15
Speaker 1: to strep throughout in rheumatic fever that causes dance like
37:17
Speaker 1: twitches um. And then of course modern medical historians say
37:21
Speaker 1: it was mass psychosis. I would go with that one, yeah,
37:24
Speaker 1: I mean back then it made more sense though, when
37:27
Speaker 1: during the Salem witch trials and before they knew anything
37:30
Speaker 1: about medicine, and you could just say you got the
37:32
Speaker 1: hot blood or you're having the fits, like yeah, exactly.
37:38
Speaker 1: These modern cases the ones that really freaked me out
37:41
Speaker 1: because so much as explainable. Now here's the thing that chuck.
37:45
Speaker 1: We've always explained. It was something that comes easily to mind.
37:49
Speaker 1: So back in the day before science and medicine. It
37:53
Speaker 1: was the devil possessing you. And don't think that people
37:55
Speaker 1: weren't freaked out when they thought that the devil was
37:58
Speaker 1: there and possessing people in the same way that you know,
38:01
Speaker 1: you're freaked out by the idea that it's cyanide in
38:04
Speaker 1: the soil from a train derailment, from just exactly, which
38:09
Speaker 1: is the deadliest of all the manias. But it's just
38:12
Speaker 1: as real to the experiencer. And it all comes down
38:17
Speaker 1: to people just basically being stick of the establishment and
38:20
Speaker 1: letting loose for a while. I don't want to go
38:22
Speaker 1: to work nice, so I'll dance. Have you got anything else? Uh?
38:28
Speaker 1: If you want to know more about collective hysteria, which
38:32
Speaker 1: is the name of this article, type those words in
38:34
Speaker 1: the search bar at how stuff works dot com and
38:36
Speaker 1: it will bring it up. And I said, search bars
38:39
Speaker 1: means it's time for listener mail. I'm gonna call this
38:43
Speaker 1: UM episode on grief. We've got a lot of great
38:47
Speaker 1: feedback and that continue. Uh, they continue to roll in. Hey, guys,
38:51
Speaker 1: just dumbled upon your podcast through my tune in radio app.
38:55
Speaker 1: I guess that's a mini plug We're available there now. Um,
38:59
Speaker 1: I've devoured all all of the six hundred plus shows
39:02
Speaker 1: and maybe a new listener. But I'm already a lifelong fan.
39:05
Speaker 1: So why I'm writing in guys is I lost my
39:07
Speaker 1: twin sister back in two thousand ten. It was a
39:10
Speaker 1: rough time because as a fraternal twin me being the boy,
39:13
Speaker 1: I looked at her not only as a sister, but
39:15
Speaker 1: as a mother and friend. Too, long story short, I
39:17
Speaker 1: wanted to comment on the Grief show some time ago.
39:21
Speaker 1: I've dealt with my grief through my artwork. I'm a
39:23
Speaker 1: small town artist from Johnson City, Tennessee, and I rarely
39:27
Speaker 1: can get noticed or any attention with my art. I
39:29
Speaker 1: wanted to share my new piece I've just finished after
39:32
Speaker 1: listening to how comic books work. I'm a huge fan
39:35
Speaker 1: of Marvel comics and I hope you both enjoy this.
39:37
Speaker 1: And he sent this really cool. I think it was
39:39
Speaker 1: like every member of the Marvel universe had to be
39:41
Speaker 1: in this picture that he did. I didn't see that.
39:44
Speaker 1: It's really really neat, just jam packed full of Marvel
39:47
Speaker 1: comic heroes and villains. Um So, Josh and Chuck, thanks
39:50
Speaker 1: for the inspiration, laughs and getting through every day at
39:52
Speaker 1: the office. PS. My twin Jessica passed away from epilepsy
39:56
Speaker 1: actually a condition called sue dep sudden unexplained death of epilepsy.
40:02
Speaker 1: My mother is trying to raise awareness because November is
40:05
Speaker 1: Epilepsy Awareness Month. So if you guys wouldn't mind mentioning
40:08
Speaker 1: this on the show, she would be so happy for that. Also,
40:11
Speaker 1: an epilepsy show would be cool too. Um. Not a
40:14
Speaker 1: lot is discussed about it, and that is Jason Flack.
40:17
Speaker 1: And Jason wrote you back that is heartbreaking about your
40:20
Speaker 1: twin sister. Very sorry to hear that, um, And we
40:24
Speaker 1: will definitely do a show on epilepsy. And since this
40:27
Speaker 1: is November though, people should go out and find out
40:30
Speaker 1: what they can during National Epilepsy Month. We'll follow up
40:34
Speaker 1: with the show. I don't know if it'll be in November,
40:36
Speaker 1: but we'll get to that one for sure. And thanks
40:38
Speaker 1: for that piece of art. And if anyone is interested
40:40
Speaker 1: in a great comic book artist from Johnson City, Tennessee,
40:44
Speaker 1: if a lot worse than Jason Flack. Jason, thank you
40:47
Speaker 1: very much for sharing that with everybody. That means a
40:49
Speaker 1: lot to us. If you want to share with us
40:53
Speaker 1: and all of our listeners out there, you can tweet
40:56
Speaker 1: to us at s y s K podcast. You can
40:59
Speaker 1: join us on Facebook dot com slash stuff you Should Know.
41:02
Speaker 1: You can send us an email with attached artwork to
41:05
Speaker 1: stuff podcast at how stuff works dot com and has
41:08
Speaker 1: always joined us at our home on the web, stuff
41:10
Speaker 1: you Should Know dot com. For more on this and
41:18
Speaker 1: thousands of other topics, visit how stuff works dot com