Latest / WHAT I'VE LEARNT / What I've Learnt - Nicki Gostin

Transcript

What I've Learnt - Nicki Gostin · WHAT I'VE LEARNT

• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: Well, Nikki has interviewed hundreds of celebrities about touchy topics and even took the now infamous video of an agast Anna Winter being asked for her ID at an event.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: Nikki attended college in Melbourne, Australia, and has worked for many newspapers over the years.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_01: When she's not stalking celebs on the red carpet, Nikki loves to watch the great British British Bake Off and True Crime Murder Mysteries and nag her children.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_01: You can follow her red carpet escapades on Instagram at Nikki Goston.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_01: So, Nikki, welcome to the What I've Learned podcast.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_01: So good to have a fellow journo on board, and we can talk about all things uh journalism.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: Great, thank you.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for having me.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_01: So you're uh based in New York and have been there for a long time.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_01: Tell us a little bit about how your journey started and what it is that drives you to interview and engage in the celebrity world, but not just celebrities, but predominantly celebrities.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_01: Talk to me about that.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_01: I love I love your story.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_00: I came to New York with friends on a holiday and just stayed, so it wasn't really a very thought-out plan.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I kind of fell into it.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: I was working at Newsweek, and uh they used to have a page at the back, which was kind of like a fun celebrity page, and they used to have a column that was for an interview, and they never could get anyone to do it, and no one on staff, no one wanted to do it.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, I'll do it.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: And um, it was Newsweek at the time was a really big deal.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_00: We could get anyone on the phone.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_00: I started, I just I didn't care interview.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_00: I just thought it was funny to annoy people and not be.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_00: I there's nothing that's more boring to me when an actor will talk about what it was like working with a director, because of course they're gonna rave and say something nice.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_00: I'd much rather hear what they had for breakfast.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: That to me is infinitely more interesting.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: I'm with you on that.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we love, yeah.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_01: So, in other words, I mean, Newsweek was pretty hard-hitting and certainly not well, you wouldn't associate it with sort of celebrities, and that's you know, it was very predominantly news.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's interesting that you grab that column.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I had a column in the age called What I've Learned, which is where this podcast really was born from.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_01: So I relate to that idea of wanting to do a bit of a deep dive and get an insight into how that person ticks.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_01: It's really just a fascination with humanity, isn't it?
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_01: That's what drives.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_00: I think that there's nothing.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: The best advice I ever got in the beginning, I was trying to be funny and quippy.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember my editor saying to me, You're not listening.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, Oh, a penny dropped.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, he's right, I wasn't listening.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_00: I was just like rat a tat tat-ta-ta.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: And um, and I am interested in hearing about, but like it doesn't matter, famous or not, I love hearing about people's stories and where they came from and what motivates them.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: And it's all just so interesting to me.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I love hearing people talk.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_01: Me too.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_01: I'm and that's why I do this, because there's nothing, it fills you up, doesn't it?
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_01: Because also you learn a lot.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_01: Like I've learned so much from all these interviews, like I'm learning from you now.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_01: And I think I actually consider it a privilege, and I'm sure you're the same, that somebody's prepared to trust me with their story and to give their version of the world and their lens on the world.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_01: That's actually quite a privilege to share that with someone and for someone to trust us and to trust you.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_01: So, in the in the sense of your your, I suppose, journey, who's some of the people that have really rocked you or moved you or challenged you?
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_01: Any any just a few that come to mind?
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I've had some, I've got some favorites that I like speaking to.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, I've been told off by people, so that has stayed in my mind too.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like what?
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like, who's told you off?
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_00: Like, but it's Jerry Lewis, who was famously just a grump and a nasty person, and he screamed at me on the phone, and I literally screamed with laughter.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: I was just like, I loved it that Jerry Lewis was telling me off.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_00: I just loved it.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: Why was he telling you off?
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_00: Why did you do it?
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: Because I he he, I mean, if you read about him, if you just go to his Wikipedia page, he was like one of the nastiest people.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: So it wasn't even grumpy, it was like worse than that.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: So I it was something silly that set him off, like it wasn't even anything, and he just went off to the races and it was fabulous.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_00: I loved it.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_00: I'm trying to think.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I've just interviewed so many people and it's just been fun along the way.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: I love I love it when also when I do these red carpets and I'm the oldest there by decades.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I say and I act like the rabbi for the kids, I call them the kids, and I say to them, treat it like it should be like a tennis match or any type of game.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna throw the ball to you, hit the ball to you, and you want the celebrity to hit it back to you, and then you're gonna have fun.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: Like they've got to realize that, and most do, that I'm coming from a place of fun and lightness, and because you've only got two minutes.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_01: So the red carpet is your focus.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_01: So you're that's actually quite hard, like very different to what I do, which is deep dive for an hour.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_01: You have to, in that, you have to grab that that nutshell or that nugget very quickly while they're walking on the red carpet.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_01: And that's quite a skill, I reckon to get that.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I can imagine that it would be quite challenging because you're jostling with other journalists, like I get this sort of space and I get to control and create it.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_01: You are really having to fly by the seat of your pants, make it work and engage them.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: How challenging is that?
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: And and obviously you're known because you've been doing it for years, but is it getting harder?
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: And also, what are some of your tips about how to ensure that you get that nugget?
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: Well, like I said, the to me, the number one is uh hopefully they'll realize that it's it takes two.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm gonna be light and playful with you, and so hopefully you're gonna be light and playful with me, and then we'll have some fun and we'll get something quippy, and it's not gonna be any big anything that you're gonna be embarrassed about.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_00: I work for the New York Post, which uh and page six, which is kind of this infamous gossip page, which is fun to read, but uh celebrities are terrified of.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: So a lot of times I I still have this now.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: I can't get on car, I have to beg to get on carpets, and people, publicists don't want to, they'll not, they don't want their clients to speak, and then they see it's me and they okay, we'll do it for Nikki because they know I'm not gonna, I don't want to do anything snarky, I don't like being mean, I like having fun, but I'm just not here to especially the last couple of years, there's too much negativity in the world.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not gonna add more to it.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_01: And that that in itself is testimony to what you've, you know, you've created a bridge there for people that they know they can trust.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_01: And it's interesting that that notion of the gossip page, the page six.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um, do you think it's changed?
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think it's become, especially as social media is now driving this whole other um agenda and also platform?
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_01: It's massive.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think it's as powerful as it was, or do you think it's it's losing some of its bite?
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: Well, the things have changed, like we used to do a lot of like magazine editors, that was a big deal.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_00: Like it just doesn't, that world doesn't exist anymore.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_00: Nightclubs was a big thing, which uh it's starting to come back, but you know, because of COVID, that just disappeared.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: And um, so the landscape of Manhattan has changed a lot uh in that way.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_00: And reality stars, they just you know, they didn't exist.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: So fascinating, isn't it?
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's a really different world from when you started, when you and I started.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but particularly in that space, you're actually right.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, New York has transformed in that sense, as has the world.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_01: So what are you finding?
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, like nobody really cares, you know.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_01: As you I mean, we talk about Anna Winter and she's still got a you know, a strong power base, obviously, but it is a it is a different time.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_01: And so who are you finding that when it goes?
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I was just looking, I mean, Sarah Snook and Margot Rovy, seeing them.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I was so excited, as I'm sure you were, to see Australians thriving and and doing so well.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um, what what are you seeing in terms of the who people want to read about?
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um, for our audience for page six, right now it's uh Taylor Swift obsessed.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_00: They love Taylor Swift, they love housewives, big on housewives, um, and they also love reading about the royal family and particularly Meghan Markle, and it's like a love-hate thing.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_00: They a lot of the audience hates her, but they love reading about her.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_01: So, for you drawing that line in that space, first of all, that must be quite difficult because you obviously want to capture the the snapshot that you need for page six, but you also come from a base where you also don't sound like you're on the gossip trail in the in the old sense of the word.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_01: You sound like you're somebody who actually just, you know, wants to have a relationship, have a bit of banter and capture that person.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_01: How difficult is that?
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: Is that hard?
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_00: When I'm if they are like I have to do a lot of write-ups.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_00: So that's just, you know, where you write from the source and you have to click, you know, link to them, and that's a whole different story.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_00: But when I'm doing original interviews, um, I, you know, obviously I want to get something newsy, but I don't want to get something that is gonna, you know, embarrass someone, or I just want it to be fun and interesting.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_00: So I have had it a couple of times where someone said something to me and I knew it was gonna get them into a heap of trouble.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I just thought I talked about it with my boss, and I thought it's just not worth ruining their life over a day of me having a big story for one day, and I just didn't feel comfortable with it.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_00: Having said that though, if someone, you know, confesses to murdering someone, I'm not gonna be nice about it, I'm gonna run it.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, some silly thing that they said that in this day and age where you get cancelled so quickly, it's just not worth it.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_01: And I I respect that.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_01: And I think hence lies the responsibility issue because we are very responsible.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: We are responsible when somebody confides or or or gives us something of that nature.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_01: It it takes um, it's very important to be discerning.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what you've said.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think that's why you've lasted in that role so long?
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's actually quite challenging to keep that afloat, to make sure that you have relationships that don't, as you say, snap.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think that's part of is because you've come from a place of authenticity and you've actually made sure that you don't take advantage of people from what you're outlining and from what I've read?
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_00: Uh uh for the red carpet, 100%.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_00: There's I I would never get, they would just skip over me if I was nasty.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_00: And it's just and the point, like it's another thing where someone said to me the other day on a carpet, another reporter was like, Why don't you uh something to ask something where you shouldn't have?
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_00: And I was just like, Why would you do that?
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: They're not going to answer the question.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's number one.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_00: You're gonna piss them off, you're gonna piss off their publicist who reps God knows how many other people, so you never work with all their clients again for what?
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's not really about relationships, isn't it?
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, relationships with every relationships with your editor, relationships with the people that you're interviewing.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_01: And and how do you find clearly how long have you been at the post now?
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I started uh uh January 2020, just before COVID hit, and I sold myself as a red carpet reporter.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_00: So I had to pivot very quickly.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: That was I am sure.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: That would have been an interesting and how did you pivot?
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: And what I mean, because there was no red carpet at the period.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_00: And it's I literally sold myself as I'm your red carpet queen.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um God.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_00: So do you guys know what Cameo is?
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, yes, but for our listeners, maybe you can elaborate.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: The Cameo is this website where you can there's like hundreds of different celebrities on there, and you can, it's kind of cute if you're interested.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_00: You can get them to record a message like a happy birthday for someone, or and it's a lot of times it's some celebrity that you grew up with or that your your friend grew up with.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: So it's fun, like I don't know who is on there.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_00: There's so many, and sporting figures and reality stars and musicians, and so you know, it was because it was page six, it was hard getting people, and so I would comb through the pages and pages of cameo looking for people.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, who can I interview?
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_00: That I knew it was going to be easy because they're, you know, not A-grade celebrities on there.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: So I would getting, I was getting the B listers and the D listers, which is actually I much prefer because they're much more open and interesting, much more willing to have fun and not so guarded, and you're gonna get something great.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I started doing uh interviews with these what you would call, you know, uh B listers and D-listers.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: I loved it.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_00: I'm all for it.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_00: I love hearing stories about old Hollywood and you know, working in the 70s in Hollywood, it's great.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: And so who who coming back to that question about who are some of the people that have really moved you, or somebody you've interviewed?
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I don't know, Taylor Swift is clearly, you know, universally and globally revered.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_01: And right, kudos to her because she's written these incredible songs and she's a super talent, and no one can really deny that.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_01: And I love it because you know, with all that Kanye drama, that's all just literally, she has just risen up and just stayed strong, and she's young.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, go girl.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: I think we're all there going, go girl, you know.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I I have never interviewed her.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: She was already by the time she was already, I remember seeing her at a carpet, and it was this was God, years ago, and she was already still a big star.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_00: So it was just like she wasn't doing any red carpet interviews.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: Actually, I I thought of this recently because um David Sol just died from Statsky and Hatch, and I interviewed yeah, and I interviewed um a couple of years ago, um, poor Michael Glazer, who I don't know if you know his first wife died of AIDS.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_00: I did know that, yeah.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and his daughter died of AIDS.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_01: It's and he's a big fundraiser too, isn't he?
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_01: Huge foundation.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_00: They set up a fundraiser, pediatric um AIDS foundation.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_00: And um and his son is HIV positive, who's now a grown man.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_00: But we had a really serious talk about, you know, how do you get through that?
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: How do you how do you survive that?
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so that was a really uh that was a real honor to speak to him.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: And and did what did you learn from that interview in terms of did he obviously, I mean, he that's an incredible story that he's had, he's been so affected by the AIDS issue.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_01: And also I know they've raised a ridiculous amount of money, haven't they?
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_01: It's been very big, and they've got a lot of celebrities involved and a lot of Hollywood stepped up.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_01: And obviously, there's a lot of change in that too, over that decade or two, in terms of how it's treated, how it's managed.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_01: Was that something that you know you learned a lot from him about that?
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: But just I just his grace that he worked through that.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I just that sounds like something the biblical, right?
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_00: That your entire family.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: It's just crazy.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_00: And then I also I love interviewing what I call the older gals, like actresses who were big in the 70s.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: Before that, even the uh for I interviewed um Margaret O'Brien, who was a big MGM star when she was a kid, she was in Meet Me in St.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: Louis with um Judy Garland.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_00: And I love hearing stories about being on the mod and of MGM, and I also love like Jackie Bassett from the 70s.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_00: I love hearing stories of yeah, of what these women went through and the well, the because of me too, like you know, what they went through was crazy.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_01: Well, in that sense, you're sort of in the hub of you know, that whole Me Too movement and what happened to Hollywood and how it's being, you know, slowly but surely transformed.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um, have you gained an insight into whether that is moving forward?
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, other than obviously Weinstein and all of those Hollywood, well, not all of them, but some of those Hollywood people being taken to task and being, you know, um, well, imprisoned as he is.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think things are changing?
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_01: What have you noticed in that Hollywood sphere that's changing?
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um, well, there's definite changes in terms of just there's intimacy coaches on set.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: Correct, absolutely.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: That wasn't even a thing.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_00: So that's huge.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_00: And it feels like there's a lot more.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sure it's listen, it's not like, oh, you know, we fixed it, but it's definitely there's more checks and balances for sure.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I think also the diversity you must be observing.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, God, it's transformed in the last 20 years, hasn't it?
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: Are you saying that?
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: Because even you look at the the Emmys, you look at the I I love the fact that not only is it diversity issues in terms of culturally, but also in terms of women's representation.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like I'll never forget when I saw, was it last year or the year before?
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and Natalie Portman wore that that gown with all the names of the female directors embroidered on her gown that had not been represented as which was really powerful, I thought, and they had not been nominated.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_01: I think there were no female directors nominated that year, and I think slowly but surely, I think maybe one or two the next year, but it wasn't groundbreaking change.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_01: Have you have you seen that?
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um yeah, I that uh there's a a group here called GLAD, which is um uh a gay rights group that works to get representation on screen and behind this, and you know, and uh casting and behind the camera.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_00: And um, I've been covering their big gala for years, and I just remember it being very white for years and years.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_00: And then it's always in Pride Month, June, just before it's in May.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: Sorry, the end of May.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_00: And last year I did it, and the carpet was just very it was everyone was there black, white, Hispanic, and it just and I said to the people who have been working on it for years, I said it's so different this year.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, and that was also there's a famous drag king in New York called Murray Hill.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: Murray told me that he had never been invited ever.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: This that was the first year um that he'd been invited, but they just ignored him.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so yeah, so that was that to me is a huge difference.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_00: Was never uh was super wide, it's not anymore.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_01: And so for you, in your position, um, are you still finding you have plenty of access and that that you're not in other words, you know, obviously the younger generation comes up and there's a whole and the social media formula.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_01: Is that affecting you in any form?
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_00: No, I feel like I mean, in terms of my like competition, like the what I call the kids on the carpet, I I know that's one thing, like I'm old, I don't care, I can run circles around them.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_00: I really I can.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you you've been doing it.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I know what I'm doing, and they're just I it's it I feel very secure in what I can do.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_01: And clearly you're doing it really well.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_01: Are there uh is there somebody you'd really like to interview that you haven't?
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_00: I'm trying to think.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, Jacob Alaudi would be fun to do now.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, he'd be great.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_01: Saltburn.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, what did you like?
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: That Saltburn movie was just amazing.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_01: And the fact that he's a Melbourne boy who went to St.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_01: Kevin's.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: No, I think he's a St.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_01: Kevin's.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, that's what someone told me, but we can check our facts.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_01: You and I can check.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_01: But that's what I understand is that he's a Aussie.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, you know, and wow, wasn't he so impressive in that very disturbing movie?
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_00: Amazing.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm really annoyed because I there was a special screening here and he wasn't going.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: So I was like, and I want to go.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_00: And it was Barry Keog.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_00: And now I'm like, why didn't I go?
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_00: I would have loved to have spoken to him.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_00: But anyway, next time.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: So who was your most recent?
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you're at the Emmys, were you?
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_00: Or were you did you do uh just last night I did a cut, but um Ruth Wilson, she's a uh British actress, and hold on, I'm just looking at my oh last week was a Sopranos 25th anniversary.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_00: I saw that, yeah.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, that would have been incredible.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, quite incredible.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_00: And Nick, I'm really excited because I just got confirmed there's a carpet for feud, the new season, which is about Truman Capote and his uh celebrity, uh not celebrity, society gal powers, and it's got an amazing cast, Naomi Watts, Molly Ringwald, Demi Moore, um, Chloe Sevigny, incredible.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_00: And so you're doing the carpet for that.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm very excited for that.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_01: That's exciting.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_01: We haven't heard about Feud yet over here, but it sounds like a good one.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, actually, what's really big here is uh Boy Swallow's Universe on Netflix, which is also had great response globally.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_01: I interviewed Drent Dalton on the on the podcast, who's superb, absolutely superb.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_01: And to see this Aussi series thrive and get incredible traction globally.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like he he, I think he's in shock that his story, which is very semi-autobiographical, has had such traction.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_01: How I mean, really, in terms of our percentage globally, look at the impact that the Aussies are having over there.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_01: Amazing.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: I just spoke to Brian Brown last week, actually.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, well, he's in there.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: He's in Voice Hollywood.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_01: I interviewed him for it.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I look, he was brilliant in it.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm really glad that you've actually because I think seeing these Australian actors who are so good getting this incredible traction overseas.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_01: What what about do you like Naomi?
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_01: What's Obviously, who's now, of course, married to my my heartthrob, who I think is so gorgeous.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think that Aussies, I mean, they really have had to work pretty hard because they're on the other side of the world, but they're getting really good responses, aren't they?
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_01: From Naomi Watts through to Margot, to so have you noticed a change in the Australian representation over there since you started?
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_00: Uh yeah, it's huge.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_00: It's amazing how many Australians are here.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: And I all the time on carpets, I'll just there's someone who's like been working but not hasn't hit it big yet, and they're Australian.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_00: Like, there's just so many Australians working in the film industry here.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_01: It is pretty incredible and pretty exciting because, and also then we've also got the film industry that's really growing here.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_01: Up on the Gold Coast, they're shooting, you've got Matt Damon, you've got all these people coming from the US.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_01: So I think we really from the time in the last 20 years, it used to be sort of neighbors, neighbors, neighbors.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_01: Now it's a which is nothing wrong with neighbors, because I actually think neighbors has actually launched.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_01: I think Simon Baker, all these people started.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_01: And so kudos to neighbors and to the, you know, but what I'm seeing is incredible growth and impact of Aussies, which you are too, clearly.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: Any Aussies that you've interviewed that like I interviewed Eric Banner, who I actually adore and love, and is so about to come out with a third The Dry film.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, any that you love or think, you know, are about to fly, other than who doesn't.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, he's so sweet.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I do remember speaking, this is a few years ago, interviewing Simon Baker, and I loved it because he he grew up working class and he told me that he grew up reading the trading post and that he still, when he I don't know if it was Sydney or Melbourne, when he goes driving, and you know, people put their stuff on the nature strip on the nature strip to get picked up, that he can't help it, he just slows down to have a look what it is.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_00: Oh I just loved that, that image of him, like, oh, maybe I know like oh that jousting stick, like something from the castle.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_00: I just love that.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_01: Brilliant.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it is such a unique um world that we come from, the Aussies.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_01: We we have a really unique slate and a really unique lens on life.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that comes out, that rawness, that authenticity, like Boy Swallow's universe, that that absolute grit.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's probably what is very appealing because we're not like everyone else.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so who do you think you'd like to interview next?
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_01: Who would you if you had your dream pick?
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um gosh.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, whether it's someone uh for a like a two-minute interview versus you know, my dream interview, there's a big difference.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, I would love to speak to Leonardo DiCaprio, but it's not gonna happen.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_00: But you know what?
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_01: You gotta start with a dream, and I hear you.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's that's not gonna happen.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's just you know, well, not happening.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_01: I think we can all dream because you never know what's around the corner.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: You're not coming back to Melbourne or Australia for a while, you're happy in New York.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, I come back every year, so but to live, you wouldn't, yeah.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, well, I mean, you know, who knows with Donald Trump, but yes, right now we're here interesting time in history, and in terms of the the broader world and what is going on and the power of journalist journalism and the I suppose uh shall we say the social media hijacking and things that are going on, how are you finding as a person, a Jewish woman in New York, along with so many others, how are you finding what you're saying in the broader world?
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_01: And are you finding it scary?
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_00: Very scary.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_00: I actually ran into Juliana Margali's last week.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, she's amazing.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: Very yeah, and I said to her, this is you know, I said just person to person, just thank you.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_00: And she told me that she uh had been speaking out about anti-Semitism before October 7th and was getting death threats.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_00: This was months before I mean death threats over speaking about anti-Semitism.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's just insane.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's I it's I find it so frightening what's going on.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_01: I think we all do, and I think it's a little dystopian that after a horrible massacre like October 7, that the world seems to turn and turn on the people who are the victims.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_01: I understand it's complex.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_01: I think we all do, but I think we're in a really surreal time, and I think that we have to just keep telling the stories, as I'm sure you agree, make sure that we don't um in any way stop shining the light.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, I went to um actually she's also been very active, um, Jenny Moland, and she organized uh an event at her house where she had family members of hostages speak and um survivors from NOVA.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_00: Uh was I don't say amazing, that's I don't know what word to use, but disturbing.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_01: Very emotional.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_01: We've we've had it here too, and it's been very emotional.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_01: And I've interviewed the mother of one of the hostages who was amazing, who you'd know, Rachel Goldberg, who's spoken out a lot at the United Nations, and it was gut-wrenching, and it's been very, and we just have to keep telling those stories.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's why it's important you and I touch on this because I think while obviously the world keeps spinning, the s the films keep getting made, the celebrities keep walking the red carpet, I think there's something, and we have to keep living our lives.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_01: I think at the same time, there's another universe that neither you or I can possibly ignore.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, for sure.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I hope that there's a lot of change um around the way things are reported, because I think, as you and I would both recognize, it's near impossible to change a hijacked narrative.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's just surreal.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_01: And and narrative is very important, I think, which is what you and well, I certainly try to honor.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_01: And I think you're the same.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I feel very lucky that um the New York Post is very um pro making sure that hostages' stories come out and talking about it.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_01: And have have you had an opportunity to run any of those stories?
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not familiar whether you have or not, but I think not me per I mean I've told like alert when I went to this uh talk, I alerted the news editors to and actually, well, I shouldn't say that.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: I interviewed Jay Lazarus, the hairdresser, who I'm sure that was the big story there last week, um, who from Perth, who's uh was going to be a sperm donor for a for a lesbian couple in Queensland.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_00: And then they said after October 7th, they said that they didn't want to use the sperm.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_00: It's just unreal.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's surreal.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_00: Because he was Jewish.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_00: I interviewed him, and uh that ran in the news section.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_00: So that was I was very happy with that.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that got a lot of traction, that story.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and yeah, then there's also, you know, the under 19 soccer player that was told not they could no longer be captain.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, there is a lot happening, and therefore the role of journalists to either capture stories, drive stories, or tell them, however, like what you've just done and getting that in the news in the news New York Post is a really important thing because if we're not there on the ground, or then we have to find other ways to tell the story and make sure that it's not distorted.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_01: And it's I don't know about you, but I find it quite confronting when I see stories that I know are completely untrue, that other people are writing or telling, and the only thing we can do is tell the story that is true.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_01: And what else can we do?
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_01: Are you seeing that?
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_00: And are you finding there's much anti-Semitism that you're I mean, New York, America's gone crazy, but are you seeing, what are you are you seeing anything on the ground that's that other than well, I have a friend who works at Columbia, which is a univers, very prestigious university that's uptown, and um she's she's Israeli and she's just in shock about what's going on there.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_00: There's protests very divisive and bitter, and um she's in shock.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_00: She just can't believe it.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_00: She's worked there for years and years, and it's very upsetting for her.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I think a lot of the academics, the students, I mean, Harvard, we all know the Harvard story, which I think everybody is just, which is clearly being unpicked almost like a, it's like a this toxic element that has infiltrated so many of the US universities.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_01: And your your friend in is a case in point.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_01: Do you see that stuff?
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_01: Because I'm saying they're pulling funding and they're trying to unravel it and they're trying to, obviously, Claudine Gay got finally resigned, etc., etc.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_01: Are you seeing that changing?
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think it's going to take a long time?
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, there's my God, there are so many protests here.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, they were protesting outside a hospital because it had accepted funding from a big-time donor who had pulled his funding from Harvard.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, they're protesting the hospital where they treat kids with cancer.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I don't know.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_00: Closing down bridges and tunnels.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean, I know that there's big protests too in Melbourne every week.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_00: Every week.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_01: That's settled a little bit, but it's still very actually, it's the councils and things that are being impacted.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_01: But it's a it's a complex story, and we've got a lot of things going on here where people are trying to challenge the status quo that seems to have become quite acceptable to be anti-Semitic.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's almost like it's it's become quite quite strange.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_01: So, but but I think as as we all need, we need entertainment to also ensure that we stay a bit sane and we need to tell stories both serious and not so serious, so that we have a good idea.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_00: And by the way, having said that also, I I think it's important to I don't like it when they try and take our humanity.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it's important to remember that Palestinians, there's they're humans with humanity, and absolutely at some point, I'm a big lefty.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_00: At some point, this can't continue this cycle.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_00: I just that's I just I don't see how this is possible.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_00: And I that really I just I it upsets me so much that we can't talk, that both sides are like, we're gonna have to share this.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_01: That's how I feel.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, on that note, thank you so much, Nikki, for joining us all the way from New York.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, I really appreciate your time and nice to see a fellow traveler um on your journey through the stories of life, which is what we do.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: So um take care and keep telling the stories, they're great.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for having me.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_01: Pleasure.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks so much for listening.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_01: The What I've Learned podcast will now be coming to you weekly, with new episodes released every Tuesday.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_01: I'm blessed to have so many wonderful guests coming on the show.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_01: So check out my What I've Learned Instagram for updates.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_01: Meanwhile, stay tuned, kind, and curious.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_01: Love Deb.