Latest / SEA of Startups / The Ecosystem Builder Running APAC's Startup Bridge Solo: Chi Chi Wong's Cross-Cultural Playbook

Transcript

The Ecosystem Builder Running APAC's Startup Bridge Solo: Chi Chi Wong's Cross-Cultural Playbook · SEA of Startups

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Now, most ecosystem builders chase headlines.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_00: Qiqi Wang chases handshakes.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_00: While everyone else is talking about building bridges between markets,
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_00: he's actually living on them.
• 0:10
  From NYU to Singapore Military Service to Tsinghua University
• 0:14
  to corporate China.
• 0:15
  And now he's running Huawei's startup program across APAC as a
• 0:20
  one-man cultural
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_00: translation service.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_00: So here's what caught my attention.
• 0:24
  This isn't someone optimizing for the highest paying job or the
• 0:28
  sexiest startup story.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_00: Now, this is someone who genuinely believes that showing up at 2 a.m.
• 0:34
  when founders need help matters more than having the right
• 0:37
  LinkedIn headline.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm not on this one,
• 0:41
  but Kim sat down with Chi Chi to unpack what it actually takes
• 0:46
  to build trust
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_00: across cultures,
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: languages,
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_00: and time zones.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_00: No frameworks,
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: no buzzwords,
• 0:52
  just the messy reality of doing work that doesn't trend but
• 0:55
  moves founders forward.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_00: This is Sea of Startups.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Kevin Brocklin.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_00: Kim's your host today,
• 1:02
  and this conversation will make you rethink what ecosystem
• 1:05
  building actually means.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome back to The Sea of Startups,
• 1:15
  the show where Southeast Asia's startup reality gets the
• 1:18
  airtime it deserves.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Kim Yeo,
• 1:20
  and today we're sitting down with someone who isn't here for
• 1:23
  the headlines,
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: but rather for the heavy lifting.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_01: Chi Chi Wong,
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: ecosystem builder,
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: startup bridge maker,
• 1:31
  and maybe unintentionally one of the most well-rounded humans
• 1:36
  I've met so far in
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_01: the Asian tech space.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_01: So we met through one of BackScoop's events with Amanda Chua.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_01: I think everyone would know her at this point in Singapore.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_01: From what he's done so far,
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_01: he's helped a lot of founders scale across Hong Kong,
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_01: Singapore,
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: and other regional ecosystems.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_01: He's worked inside Huawei.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_01: I think this is a lot of dips that maybe you can get from.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_01: And he's got the best of both worlds.
• 2:04
  I mean,
• 2:05
  one of the biggest countries in the world,
• 2:07
  studied at NYU and followed by Xinhua.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_01: And he speaks multiple languages and is learning more.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, what else can this guy not do?
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_01: And yet, he's also into red light therapy and ice baths.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_01: So Chi-Chi, welcome to the show.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_01: And for those wondering, your Chinese name is Qi-Zhi, right?
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_01: And so you go with Qi-Chi because... Right.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_03: First, thanks so much for inviting me into your podcast.
• 2:32
  And,
• 2:33
  you know,
• 2:33
  I do not have a podcast,
• 2:34
  so,
• 2:34
  you know,
• 2:35
  so I think you're one up on me.
• 2:37
  But the name Qi-Chi really came from when I was studying in the
• 2:42
  US back then,
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_03: people couldn't pronounce Qi-Zhi.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_03: They always call me cheesy or queasy.
• 2:47
  and so you know that's how the name came about absolutely
• 2:50
  absolutely an honor uh to
• 2:52
  be with you today to maybe discuss some of the things that i
• 2:55
  think you're also very
• 2:56
  equally passionate about yeah i mean that's the pain with
• 2:59
  sometimes having asian
• 3:00
  names right like mine is away and then people call me away is
• 3:02
  like are you calling
• 3:03
  me saying hi or what so i can totally emphasize with that one
• 3:07
  and um so let's start
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_01: with something interesting about you
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_01: In our last catch-up,
• 3:12
  you told me your job at Huawei started off because you
• 3:15
  interviewed them for your
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_01: thesis.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_01: And most people interview companies to avoid working for them.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_01: And you somehow reverse-engineered your way into the building,
• 3:26
  walking through that moment of academic curiosity turning into
• 3:29
  corporate reality.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_03: For me, it was something that I did not expect at all.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_03: I did my master's at Tsinghua University,
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_03: and as a Singaporean studying in a Chinese university,
• 3:46
  you definitely don't want to write a thesis on how to lecture
• 3:49
  Chinese on how to run
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_03: China.
• 3:51
  I wanted to write on something that I knew a lot about,
• 3:53
  which was Singapore.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_03: But at the same time, also write about something that
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_03: probably pertains to China.
• 4:00
  And back then,
• 4:01
  my topic was actually how Chinese tech companies can succeed in
• 4:05
  Singapore.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_03: During that time, which was around 2021, 2022, there was a huge influx.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_03: I think back then it was during COVID as well.
• 4:14
  And there was actually a lot of Chinese tech companies that
• 4:18
  were expanding into
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_03: Singapore at the time.
• 4:22
  So during my interviews,
• 4:25
  I was very fortunate to be able to interview a lot of
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_03: executives at Chinese tech companies,
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_03: as well as some prominent local business people in Singapore.
• 4:36
  And one of the interviewees that I interviewed was actually the
• 4:39
  then chief digital officer,
• 4:41
  Leo.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_03: He was also the Spark startup founder program person.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_03: So I interviewed him and he shared with me a little bit of his program.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_03: And then he felt that I was a good fit.
• 4:58
  Because he himself,
• 5:00
  even though he's a Chinese,
• 5:01
  he spent many years in the West.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_03: And so he felt that I had both the Eastern and Western culture.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_03: he offered me a position at Huawei.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, that's interesting.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you get the best of both worlds, literally.
• 5:19
  One thing leads to another,
• 5:20
  and I think most of the time things happen when it's least
• 5:23
  expected.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: So that's a classic case of,
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_01: I was just asking for a friend,
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_01: turning into,
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_01: well,
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_01: somehow I'm the friend now.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_01: But OK, let's dial it back a bit.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_01: Before we get to a Huawei era, you started at NYU, right?
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_01: Like you said earlier.
• 5:39
  And I remember you mentioning this whole liberal arts college
• 5:43
  application phase.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 5:45
  why I'm getting into it is also like people are interested in
• 5:49
  the States or
• 5:50
  startups and they're curious about how they can bridge that
• 5:53
  liberal arts to the
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_01: startup world.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe you can shed some light on that.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: Like what was the teenage teaching thinking at that point in time?
• 6:00
  It was a very interesting conversation the last time we talked
• 6:02
  about that.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_03: So actually NYU was not even my first choice.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_03: NYU is not a liberal arts school.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_03: When I was a teenager, I was very idealistic.
• 6:16
  I wanted to have the best possible education and I didn't care
• 6:20
  so much about reputation.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_03: I thought that if you look at a liberal arts college,
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_03: typically what you have is a very good professor to student ratio.
• 6:31
  You have a wide range of subjects,
• 6:33
  which means that you're not specializing in any one track.
• 6:36
  You're learning about history,
• 6:37
  philosophy,
• 6:39
  economics,
• 6:39
  you know,
• 6:41
  music and whatnot.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_03: And normally in the US,
• 6:44
  liberal arts colleges tend to be a much smaller campus or much
• 6:48
  smaller student
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_03: body,
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_03: which also means that it's more tight-knit.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_03: And that to me was...
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_03: for me, the ideal situation.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_03: So I applied to all the liberal arts colleges.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_03: My top choice was actually Carlton College,
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_03: but I got rejected because,
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_03: obviously being a tight knit community,
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_03: having to also serve military
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_03: For two years,
• 7:11
  I think most liberal arts colleges wouldn't give out one spot
• 7:14
  to a student incoming
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_03: in three years,
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_03: right?
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_03: But that turned out to be a blessing in disguise, right?
• 7:19
  Because I think,
• 7:20
  you know,
• 7:21
  my opportunities in Asia,
• 7:23
  people always ask me,
• 7:24
  where do you study?
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_03: Or where do you go to school?
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_03: And honestly,
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_03: I felt that,
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 7:29
  one of the major factors of why I was able to study or get into
• 7:34
  the interview round
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_03: at Tsinghua was because of NYU.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_03: Everyone knows about NYU.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_03: And I think one of the reasons
• 7:40
  why I got into Huawei was because I went to Tsinghua again,
• 7:43
  which is well-known.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_03: So I think perhaps in Asia, people tend to look at other factors.
• 7:49
  And in this case would be the ranking or how well-known the
• 7:53
  university is.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_03: However, I must say that, you know, even though I was rejected from
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_03: the liberal arts colleges that I applied to,
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_03: uh,
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_03: I did,
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_03: I was placed into a liberal arts program at NYU for the first two years.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_03: So NYU has, has, uh, has, has a program called, uh, LSP.
• 8:12
  So essentially it's a liberal arts program because normally
• 8:16
  from what I gathered
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_03: from my friends,
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_03: everybody who,
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_03: when applying to NYU would apply to the business school.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_03: And so, right.
• 8:23
  If you have a,
• 8:24
  and the business school is probably the best school within NYU.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_03: And so,
• 8:28
  When you have so many students applying to one school and you
• 8:31
  have other colleges
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_03: like the College of Arts and Science and Engineering and whatnot,
• 8:36
  typically what the university would do is to have you have a
• 8:39
  huge number of
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_03: students enter a liberal arts program,
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_03: which is two years.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_03: You learn the basics,
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_03: but at the same time,
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_03: you can take some classes of the school you think you want to go to.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_03: At the same time, many students would also change.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_03: So I knew for a fact that a lot of the people applying to
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_03: business school,
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_03: in those two years,
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_03: they felt that actually I have other interests,
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_03: I actually have a huge liking for engineering or chemistry,
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_03: right?
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_03: And so they will change it.
• 9:13
  Those two years in NYU doing the Liberals program also gave me
• 9:17
  a very good
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_03: foundation of looking at the world.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_03: And many of the views that I hold today came from those two years.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_01: And it kind of worked out.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_01: Although you didn't get into those liberal arts college that you won,
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_01: you still got into this one,
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: which gave you so much more opportunities.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's a bit off tangent,
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_01: but I'm just genuinely curious,
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_01: like,
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_01: what would mean standout course that you thought that,
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_01: damn,
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: this is it.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: Like,
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so glad this happened,
• 9:40
  that you learned so much from one of the classes that was the
• 9:43
  best takeaway from
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_01: NYU.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_03: To be very honest, this only hit me maybe
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_03: in this one or two years.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_03: So back then, I think it was a class on philosophy and history.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_03: And history is all the way going back to the European history.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_03: And so back in Singapore,
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_03: we only studied Singapore history and some maybe Southeast Asian history,
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_03: but you know,
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_03: the world is so big.
• 10:07
  And so when you're learning history from the lens of the people
• 10:11
  in Mesopotamia,
• 10:13
  right?
• 10:14
  And when you're learning about philosophers from the Greek
• 10:17
  culture and different
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_03: cultures,
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_03: you start to realize that the world is really very big.
• 10:21
  And I think that actually led to me becoming very interested in
• 10:26
  philosophy.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_03: During my time in Huala,
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_03: that's when I actually picked up philosophy,
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_03: taking a class,
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_03: which we'll talk about later,
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_03: about Chinese history and philosophy.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_03: And I think it's amazing.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, okay, that's nice.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_01: So one thing led to another, and then plot twist.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_01: Xinhua for your masters.
• 10:45
  And,
• 10:45
  you know,
• 10:45
  hang on,
• 10:46
  you also did military service in Singapore,
• 10:48
  right?
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_01: So we're talking NYU with an NS, then China for grad school.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_03: It was NS.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_01: and then NYU, and then grad school.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, that's still a bit of a geographic ping-pong here and there, right?
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_01: West, East, West again, and East again.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: And what was the thinking behind Xinhua after that?
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_01: So you got into NYU, then Xinhua, what's the thinking behind?
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_01: We also thought about, you even considered India at one point.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_01: And correct me if you're wrong,
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_01: you're learning Hindi now as well,
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_01: or now that you're looking at Vietnamese too.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_01: Man,
• 11:21
  your whole decision starts reads like someone who is genuinely
• 11:24
  curious about the
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_01: world,
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_01: rather than just optimizing for the highest paying internship,
• 11:28
  just like how you were deciding you wanted quality education
• 11:31
  than anything else.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's why you chose liberal arts at first.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_01: So any regrets or is this all part of the 10 year plan to become the most
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_01: culturally fluent person in Asian tech?
• 11:41
  You know,
• 11:42
  I think I'm not trying to be the most culturally fluent person.
• 11:46
  I want to be more well-educated on things and people around me
• 11:50
  because I think
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_03: Singapore is a small country and often you are the minority,
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_03: if not the only person.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_03: And so it's always about that,
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_03: trying to understand how other cultures think,
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_03: how other people think.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_03: So after I finished NS, I had a four or five months window.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_03: I had two...
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_03: uh, two ideas, right?
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_03: One was to go to Thailand to do Muay Thai.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_03: And the second was to go to China to learn Mandarin.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_03: So I did a proposal, uh, for my parents and being my sponsor.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 12:22
  And I think for them,
• 12:24
  they obviously wanted me to go to China to learn Chinese.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_03: And so I went to China for four months,
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_03: five months,
• 12:31
  and I couldn't really speak Mandarin because I grew up speaking
• 12:33
  English and I did
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_03: my high school in the U S as well.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_03: But that was probably the best time of my life, looking back.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_03: Because,
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 12:41
  you go from the army where it's a regimentation and discipline
• 12:46
  to going to China
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_03: where,
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_03: obviously in the north,
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_03: in Beijing,
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_03: people are more,
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_03: the way they speak as well,
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_03: everything is meishi.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_03: Meishi in English means not a problem.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_03: So everything I did was not a problem.
• 12:59
  And so I said,
• 12:59
  wow,
• 12:59
  you know,
• 13:00
  so much freedom and,
• 13:02
  you know,
• 13:02
  not having to report to anyone.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_03: And that actually inspired me to...
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_03: to go back to China.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_03: After those four or five months,
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_03: I was going to NYU to start my undergraduate,
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_03: but at the back of my mind,
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_03: I wanted to potentially return to China one day.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_03: I wasn't sure back then,
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_03: for masters or to work,
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_03: but I felt that,
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_03: there was something more I had to explore.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_03: So fast forward two years, I'm about to graduate from NYU.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I had three options really.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_03: One was to stay in New York and work at Wall Street, right?
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_03: where, you know, it's 95% or 90% of my peers would be doing that.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_03: And then the second option was to actually go to India to do a master's.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_03: Or the third option was something radical again.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_03: Well,
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_03: not radical,
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_03: but something more extreme,
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_03: which was to,
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_03: outside my comfort zone,
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_03: was to go to India to do a master's because I was like,
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_03: You know,
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_03: most of the two biggest countries in the world,
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_03: the most populous country is China and India,
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_03: right?
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_03: And obviously,
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_03: I maybe understand China a little bit back then,
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_03: much more than I understand India.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_03: So that was something I wanted to explore.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_03: Then I had to go again to my parents for advice.
• 14:17
  And I think they wanted me to really double down on building
• 14:21
  upon my Chinese
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_03: understanding because they felt that China,
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_03: China is...
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_03: growing probably the fastest of any major country.
• 14:29
  And as you can see today,
• 14:30
  me working in Huawei,
• 14:31
  you know,
• 14:32
  just reinforced the China story.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_03: And,
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_03: being a 5,000-year culture,
• 14:40
  you can't really learn or understand China in just four months
• 14:43
  or five months or
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_03: maybe even one or two years.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_03: It would have to be a long journey.
• 14:48
  And so they wanted me to expand or to reinforce,
• 14:53
  to learn more about China.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_01: So understanding your roots as well as a Chinese descendant.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_01: That does help.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_01: There's a sense of attachment there.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_01: So it's to that extent.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_01: Somehow,
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: I can identify with that as well because when I was 14,
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_01: that was my first time when I went to China.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, oh my gosh, wow.
• 15:11
  China is such a big country and there's so much more to learn
• 15:13
  within my own heritage as well.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_01: And that kind of left a very good impression.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: But for you, I can't imagine what the experience must have been.
• 15:27
  So you've gone from liberal arts dreamer to NYU realist to
• 15:32
  China insider.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_01: And Huawei, it's your first proper job.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_01: Whatever they have said so far that you have shared rather,
• 15:40
  it has been quite unconventional and into one of the planet's
• 15:45
  most scrutinized tech
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_01: companies.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_01: What was the adjustment like?
• 15:49
  Because from what I understand,
• 15:50
  Chinese corporate culture makes Singapore's
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_01: Kiaso environment,
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_01: a bit more relaxed,
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_01: I think,
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_01: because from what you said as well,
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_01: there was a huge adjustment and you were there.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: That was one thing that stuck with me.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_01: Like last conversation, you said that I wasn't there to compete.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_01: I was here to connect and be your friend.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_01: You know, that really hit me.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_01: So what was that like in Huawei?
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_01: Or what is that like still?
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_03: Chinese corporate culture takes on a whole different level.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_03: You're talking about a population that is...
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_03: humongous, just to give you some numbers.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_03: For every Singaporean, there are 240 Chinese.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_03: So if you were to work in a company of 10 people,
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_03: for example,
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_03: 10 Singaporeans,
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_03: if you convert that,
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_03: it would be 2,400 Chinese.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_03: So it's a much bigger scale.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_03: And when you have such an enormous amount of people in an organization,
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_03: it becomes a lot more complicated, right?
• 16:49
  Add on the fact that everything is communicated,
• 16:52
  all communications are done in Mandarin.
• 16:55
  And Mandarin itself is a very difficult language because if you
• 16:59
  were to learn it,
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_03: like how we learned Mandarin in school,
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_03: back in elementary and middle school,
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_03: just touching the surface,
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_03: you're just understanding the surface level of what Mandarin is.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_03: But there are so many layers to the...
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_03: to the language itself.
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_03: And for me,
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_03: one of the things that I have learned is that the more I learn,
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_03: the more I realize I don't know,
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_03: which is actually quite scary because we realize that,
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_03: oh,
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_03: if I didn't even enter Huawei or Qinhua,
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_03: then how I view China and how I view
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_03: probably the second most powerful country in the world,
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_03: would be very limited or almost complete misunderstanding.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_03: I wasn't there to compete.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_03: I was there to connect.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_03: Actually, that came from my Tsinghua days.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_03: That was the mindset that I had because I knew I couldn't compete.
• 17:50
  All my classmates were rank one,
• 17:53
  rank two in their province,
• 17:55
  in their universities.
• 17:57
  And I remember very clearly one of my classmates saying that
• 18:00
  they've never gotten
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_03: second in their life.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_03: and now you're in a classroom where everyone's number one, number two.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_03: So how are you going to compete?
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_03: I told them,
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_03: I remember telling them,
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_03: don't worry guys,
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_03: I will be last position for you guys.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_03: I will sacrifice myself.
• 18:16
  But,
• 18:17
  you know,
• 18:17
  I think that mindset of not competing and trying to
• 18:20
  collaborate,
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_03: It would also bring a lot of value because in today's day,
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_03: even in the startup world,
• 18:27
  it's better to collaborate with other startups rather than try
• 18:30
  and compete and beat
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_03: every single startup.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_03: Because as an individual, how many battles can you fight?
• 18:37
  You only want to fight important battles,
• 18:41
  not try and fight every single battle.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_03: Your bandwidth is limited.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_03: And my brother once told me that the number of calories you can spend
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_03: you can expand a day, it's limited.
• 18:51
  So if you go beyond that,
• 18:53
  you go beyond the limit,
• 18:54
  you physically would die.
• 18:55
  So it's always good to have a different mindset and not try and
• 19:00
  see everyone as a
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_03: competitor,
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_03: try and see everyone as a friend,
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_03: as a friend.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_03: And one of the learnings from philosophy that I've also,
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_03: that has impacted me a lot is actually,
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_03: it's called 乘归乘土归土,
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_03: which actually means dust returns to dust and earth returns to earth,
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_03: which means that we will all
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_03: return back to dust one day.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_03: So,
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_03: keep the ego in...
• 19:26
  You're just part of the bigger picture and you don't have to
• 19:30
  think that everything
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_03: is about you.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_01: Kind of humbles you, eh?
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_01: Correct.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: And also,
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: I think in any context,
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_01: whether it's...
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: Anywhere for the matter,
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: even in relationships,
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_01: you also got to pick up battles.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: You don't want to be burning the house down and then nothing comes to...
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_01: Nothing comes to fruition.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_01: It just doesn't help anyone.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_01: At the end of the day,
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: you want mutuality,
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_01: a lot of win-win situations rather than I beat you,
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_01: you beat me or a tit for tat.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_01: That's not going to help anyone for that matter.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_01: It's going to just increase the tension.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_01: Life's too short for that, you know?
• 20:05
  And in terms of like in a culture where everyone's trying to be
• 20:08
  a protagonist of
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_01: their own corporate thriller,
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_01: what did it mean to you to be the person focused on connection?
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_01: Because when you're seeking for alignment,
• 20:17
  I'm sure more connections will have to be made to work towards
• 20:21
  that bigger picture,
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: right?
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_03: So for me, it was just really to try and be a friend.
• 20:27
  Like I've always tried to define myself because when you learn
• 20:31
  about history,
• 20:32
  You see how people compete and normally people would write
• 20:37
  about battles and
• 20:38
  killings and backstabbing and make the entire process very
• 20:43
  gloom and doom.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_03: But at the same time,
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_03: there are also a lot of good things that you can learn,
• 20:48
  where people really team up together and try and accomplish an
• 20:52
  impossible mission
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_03: to fight through many battles together.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_03: And all that couldn't have been done without trust, without
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_03: friendship and without good communication, right?
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_03: And so I think for me, I really wanted to just connect.
• 21:08
  It's really to,
• 21:09
  the deeper meaning would be to be of value to others and to try
• 21:13
  and help others.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_03: And humans being reciprocal creatures,
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_03: and obviously there'd be some people that don't return the favor,
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_03: but,
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_03: and I'm not expecting anything,
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_03: but I do think that when you help others,
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_03: you feel happy.
• 21:26
  And that's actually something that,
• 21:28
  that is rooted in our DNA,
• 21:29
  because when you help someone,
• 21:32
  you know,
• 21:33
  back in the day,
• 21:34
  in the Stone Age,
• 21:36
  oftentimes you will need help as well.
• 21:37
  And so the people that are able to survive are people that get
• 21:42
  helped and help others.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_03: And so I think this kind of,
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_03: a lot of people say,
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_03: oh,
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_03: when you help others,
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_03: you feel good.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_03: I think that's actually rooted in our DNA.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_03: For thousands of years,
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_03: the ones that don't help,
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_03: they get eliminated whenever there's an opportunity.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm not trying to say that
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_03: I'm trying to get help as well.
• 22:02
  But my definition of whether how I see myself has always been
• 22:07
  to help others and
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_03: without expecting much in return.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_01: And it's also taking,
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_01: in a way,
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_01: not a high road,
• 22:14
  but more like being a very good person because it's more
• 22:19
  fulfilling to give rather
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_01: than to take.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_01: There's more joy in that, in giving.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_01: I see that as well.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_01: And I totally resonate with that.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm with you on that.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: I'm curious,
• 22:28
  what surprised you most about the Chinese corporate culture
• 22:32
  that no one really
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: talks about?
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_01: After being in Huawei for this amount of time,
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_01: you've been in NYU,
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: then you got a taste in China at Xinhua,
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: and now being in corporate China,
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_01: how is that like?
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_03: I would say that there are two main things that stand out.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_03: One is that it's not as simple as everyone thinks.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_03: It's very, very different.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_03: So when people talk about China, it's as if it's just one idea.
• 22:58
  But,
• 22:58
  you know,
• 22:59
  it's 1.4 billion people,
• 23:01
  and you have so many different cultures,
• 23:03
  right?
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_03: If you do business,
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_03: for example,
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_03: with a company in Dongbei,
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_03: it's in the north side of China,
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_03: versus you do a business with a company in Shenzhen,
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_03: for example,
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_03: which is in the south of China,
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_03: completely different culture,
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_03: completely different way of doing business,
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_03: right?
• 23:20
  And I think the second biggest thing is that average Chinese is
• 23:25
  a lot hungrier and
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_03: a lot more hardworking.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_03: And it makes sense because when you're such a big population with limited
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_03: resources,
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_03: people would have to compete for the same amount of resources.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_03: For example,
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_03: in Singapore,
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_03: if I were to get a position at Huawei,
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_03: maybe I have to outspeak two or three applicants.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_03: But in China, that might be thousands of applicants.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_03: for that one spot, which leads me to my second point.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_03: We only see the Chinese that succeed.
• 23:53
  There are also a lot of Chinese that may not have as much
• 23:58
  visibility from what we see.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_03: And so I think this also helps me to better understand China.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_03: It's not that they are
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_03: better than us because they were born better than us,
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_03: but rather you only see the top,
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_03: the cream of the crop.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_03: Same for Singapore as well.
• 24:15
  People tend to assume Singapore to be a very rich country and
• 24:19
  everyone is like
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_03: crazy rich Asians,
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_03: right?
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_03: But I don't think that's the case.
• 24:23
  I think that we only tend to see the richest Singaporeans and
• 24:26
  there are actually a
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_03: lot of Singaporeans as well that are struggling.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_03: So those are the two things that really stood out for me.
• 24:35
  And it's always easier to see the good side without diving
• 24:39
  deeper,
• 24:39
  right?
• 24:39
  So I guess being there kind of gives you a different insight as
• 24:44
  to not just China,
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_01: but generally life itself.
• 24:47
  Because more often than not,
• 24:49
  you always look at the surface rather than going deep.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_01: And now you run Huawei's cloud startup program across APEC.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_01: And in our chats, we kept coming back to this one truth.
• 25:00
  We talked about it quite a bit,
• 25:01
  actually,
• 25:02
  just that it was not as explicit.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_01: And you can't copy paste GTM across cultures.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: And you've got to go human.
• 25:09
  Throughout our conversation so far,
• 25:11
  it's been pretty much based on being a better person.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_01: What do you want?
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_01: You give more than you take.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_01: It's not a tagline, but it's stuck.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_01: But what have you learned about the trust gaps in this region?
• 25:25
  I think this is something that I'm still trying to learn every
• 25:27
  single day.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_03: When you have 1,000 plus languages,
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_03: six,
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_03: seven major religions across 690 million people,
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_03: it is really tough to sync everything up.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_03: But I think trust typically happens over a period of time.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_03: And there will be opportunities for trust to be tested.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_03: And that often means when people need help, are you there?
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_03: Or do you only celebrate when people succeed?
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_03: Can you be there when people are going through difficulties?
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_03: I think that's where a lot of the time,
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_03: there'll be a clear difference of,
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_03: can you trust someone?
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_01: And also them showing up.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_01: That kind of builds trust.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_01: And not just being sometimes lip service,
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_01: but literally just coming up and just say,
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_01: look,
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_01: I'm here.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_01: Let me help you.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_01: Rather than just, can I help you with anything?
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_01: So this is a bit of a tangent.
• 26:27
  So we've seen a search of cross-border VC between Hong Kong and
• 26:33
  Southeast Asia lately.
• 26:34
  in through our chats as well and suddenly everyone's claiming
• 26:38
  to be regional first
• 26:40
  but you've been doing this groundwork long enough before it was
• 26:43
  trendy i mean
• 26:44
  you're one you're you're literally the huawei startup guy right
• 26:47
  so you're the sole
• 26:48
  person who's doing this what does everyone seem to miss when
• 26:52
  they try to replicate
• 26:53
  it i think again it goes back to being there and you know and
• 26:57
  showing up i think
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_03: vcs claiming to be a regional first and
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_03: I think that's normal because for their KPIs,
• 27:06
  they have to raise the next fund and showing that you have a
• 27:10
  wide connection,
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_03: not just in one country would often lead LPs to want to invest.
• 27:17
  But I think that it is not fun or it's not fun when you're
• 27:23
  trying to build the bridges.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_03: It's a lot of communication, a lot of late night meetings.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_03: It's about doing the heavy lifting.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_03: It's about assuring the other side that what you are offering,
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_03: can add value to them,
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_03: right?
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_03: For example,
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_03: when you want to bridge Hong Kong and Southeast Asia,
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 27:45
  I think even your own interpretation of what Southeast Asia and
• 27:49
  what Hong Kong mean
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_03: will be very different.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_03: Once you start to work on it,
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_03: you start to realize Hong Kong is actually ABC,
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_03: as compared to your preconcepted,
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_03: you know,
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_03: chat GPT answer,
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_03: which is
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_03: which is sometimes very, very different.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah,
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_03: so I would say that sometimes people can just talk,
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_03: but it's really about implementation,
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_03: really about putting in the work,
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_03: then you start to see,
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_03: oh,
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_03: wow,
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_03: okay,
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_03: it's quite interesting.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_01: And also I think context matters, right?
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_01: Everyone has different context.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_01: Everyone has different reality.
• 28:25
  So it's more of having that curiosity to lead you through that
• 28:28
  context and to
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_01: understand better,
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_01: to want to understand better,
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_01: the willingness to want to learn more.
• 28:34
  That helps out a lot,
• 28:35
  especially when you're working in different regions.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_01: That curiosity has to be,
• 28:39
  you kind of have to put on that curiosity 98% of the time than
• 28:43
  anything else.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_01: And we're seeing this play out in real time.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_01: There's also a bit of a broader soft power moving here,
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_01: like Hong Kong Science Park is expanding to sea.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_01: And let's talk about this trust layer.
• 28:59
  And especially I think why I'm trying to talk about trust is
• 29:02
  that it matters a lot,
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_01: especially in startup ecosystems,
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_01: that is quite
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_01: not lacking,
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_01: but I think it's worth reminding,
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_01: a soft reminder that trust has to be built over time.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_01: And now that you're in Huawei as well,
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_01: especially when Hong Kong startups try to scale into Southeast Asia,
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_01: like you said earlier,
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_01: you have worked closely with universities,
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_01: like you told me,
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_01: you have signed MOUs and whatnot,
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_01: VC arms and founders.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_01: What breaks first?
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_01: What are people underestimating beyond and apart from trust?
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_03: I think that from a Hong Kong perspective,
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_03: I think they are,
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_03: I won't say underestimating,
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_03: but maybe they don't understand how complex Southeast Asia is,
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_03: really is.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_03: And most people in Hong Kong,
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_03: they always think of Southeast Asia as one unit,
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_03: just like how people would think as China as one unit,
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_03: When there are so many different moving parts.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, it's, you know, you know,
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_03: China is a huge machine, and so is Southeast Asia.
• 30:04
  But when you go into the nitty-gritty details of each of the
• 30:08
  moving parts that make
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_03: up Southeast Asia,
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_03: then you realize that it's actually a lot of work.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_03: Very difficult, very complex, and it takes a lot of time.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_03: You know, one MOU, you know, signing an MOU is just a start, right?
• 30:22
  It's just showing your intent to want to collaborate more and
• 30:25
  expand into Southeast Asia.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_03: But Singapore is not Southeast Asia.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_03: Malaysia is not Southeast Asia.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_03: Thailand is not Southeast Asia.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_03: It's a combination of,
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_03: as I mentioned before,
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_03: thousands of languages,
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_03: different people,
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_03: different mindset.
• 30:40
  And the way of doing business in each of the countries would
• 30:43
  also be very different.
• 30:45
  And that's something that perhaps people in Hong Kong might not
• 30:49
  fully understand.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_03: They tend to see that, oh,
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_03: Singapore is a gateway.
• 30:55
  And to Singapore's credit,
• 30:56
  we have positioned ourselves as the gateway to Southeast Asia.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_03: But again, being the gateway means that it's only the first step, right?
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_03: It's a long process.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_03: And so I'm very honored to have opened that door.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_03: But I think what is probably needed will be a lot of resources,
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_03: not just from a capital perspective,
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_03: but also from a
• 31:19
  from a from a human perspective like they have to actually go
• 31:24
  right yeah to those
• 31:26
  countries to Southeast Asia the different Southeast Asian
• 31:28
  countries right to
• 31:29
  actually live if possible before you can you know really even
• 31:33
  think of doing
• 31:34
  business right yeah yeah it's very nuanced like you said like
• 31:38
  you just gotta be
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_01: there and really get your hands dirty and just
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_01: you know, just get into the works of it, really.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_01: And you've been in this ecosystem for three plus years now, right?
• 31:51
  And what advice gets repeated constantly that you think is
• 31:55
  completely wrong?
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think that any advice is completely wrong.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 32:05
  I won't say completely wrong,
• 32:06
  but I would say that,
• 32:07
  you know,
• 32:07
  misguided,
• 32:08
  right?
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, misguided.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_03: Let's move that.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_03: Most advice would be from the perspective of the person.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_01: I need time to really let that sit for a bit.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: I'm going to come back at some point on that one.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, Kim here again.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_01: So quick heads up,
• 32:41
  we've kind of did a glitch with our recording platform and the
• 32:46
  final 20 minutes of
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_01: this episode didn't save properly.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_01: But here's what you missed.
• 32:54
  Chi-Chi spoke about why founder support isn't a job title,
• 32:59
  but its mindset.
• 33:01
  He unpacked the difference showing up for founders versus
• 33:04
  simply being around them.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_01: We talked about emotional infrastructure,
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_01: personal operating systems,
• 33:12
  and what it really means to lead with trust across time zones
• 33:17
  and cultures.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_01: It's definitely one of the most grounding parts of our chat.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_01: But the good news is,
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_01: we'll be doing a part 2 with Chi Chi soon to go even deeper,
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_01: so stay tuned.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_01: And now, back to Kevin to close this out.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_00: what real ecosystem building looks like.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_00: Less networking events,
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_00: more late night problem solving,
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_00: less regional first messaging,
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_00: more showing up when it counts.
• 33:49
  Chi Chi's approach reminds me when why I started this podcast
• 33:52
  in the first place.
• 33:53
  The most important work in Southeast Asia startup scene isn't
• 33:57
  happening on
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_00: conference stages or in press releases.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's happening in the quiet moments when someone picks up the phone,
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_00: answers the tough questions,
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_00: and helps founders navigate the complexity of building across borders.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_00: The trust layer he talks about, that's not just startup philosophy.
• 34:14
  That's how sustainable ecosystems actually get built,
• 34:18
  one authentic relationship at a time.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_00: If this resonated with you, here's what you can do.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_00: Follow Sea of Startups on Spotify,
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_00: subscribe to us on Apple Podcasts,
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_00: and connect with us on LinkedIn.
• 34:31
  Share this episode with someone trying to do similar
• 34:34
  bridge-building work.
• 34:35
  They'll need to hear Chi-Chi's perspective on not competing but
• 34:38
  connecting.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_00: Want to join the conversation?
• 34:41
  Subscribe to our Substack at cfstartups.substack.com and leave
• 34:45
  us a comment.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_00: We read everything and your insights help shape future episodes.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_00: Now,
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_00: next week,
• 34:52
  we're unpacking research that reveals why 95% of enterprises
• 34:56
  are getting zero
• 34:57
  return on their Gen AI investments and what the 5% who are
• 35:01
  succeeding are doing
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_00: differently.
• 35:04
  It's a story about Gen AI divide that's reshaping how business
• 35:07
  actually gets done.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_00: So until then, this is CEO of Startups.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_00: Keep building.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_00: Remember,
• 35:14
  all views shared are personal opinions and do not represent any
• 35:17
  organizations
• 35:19
  mentioned.